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cause_n bishop_n church_n great_a 2,904 5 3.2705 3 true
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A15091 A defence of the Way to the true Church against A.D. his reply Wherein the motives leading to papistry, and questions, touching the rule of faith, the authoritie of the Church, the succession of the truth, and the beginning of Romish innouations: are handled and fully disputed. By Iohn White Doctor of Diuinity, sometime of Gunwell and Caius Coll. in Cambridge. White, John, 1570-1615. 1614 (1614) STC 25390; ESTC S119892 556,046 600

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scripture_n d._n stapleton_n 462._o stapleton_n relect._n p._n 462._o say_v the_o church_n be_v the_o ground_n and_o pillar_n of_o truth_n in_o a_o high_a kind_n than_o the_o scripture_n namely_o in_o the_o kind_n of_o the_o efficient_a cause_n and_o qu._n and_o pag._n 494._o in_o explicat_fw-la qu._n the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n may_v be_v understand_v to_o be_v great_a than_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n because_o it_o be_v not_o simple_o subject_a or_o bind_v to_o it_o but_o may_v by_o it_o authority_n teach_v &_o decern_v something_o which_o the_o scripture_n have_v neither_o determine_v nor_o teach_v the_o thing_n which_o the_o church_n teach_v do_v as_o much_o bind_v the_o faithful_a as_o those_o thing_n which_o the_o scripture_n teach_v we_o catholic_n affirm_v that_o the_o church_n be_v to_o be_v hear_v more_o certain_o than_o the_o scripture_n because_o the_o doctrine_n thereof_o be_v more_o manifest_a and_o evident_a than_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o 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the_o scripture_n that_o be_v not_o last_o the_o effect_n of_o this_o power_n be_v the_o same_o that_o the_o scripture_n breed_v and_o more_o c._n more_o grets_n defence_n bel._n tom_n 1._o pag._n 1218._o c._n obedience_n in_o all_o that_o will_v be_v save_v so_o that_o the_o world_n be_v bind_v as_o much_o to_o the_o pope_n definitive_a sentence_n as_o to_o the_o scripture_n or_o the_o voice_n of_o god_n himself_o canonist_n himself_o the_o speech_n of_o all_o the_o canonist_n for_o christ_n and_o the_o pope_n make_v but_o one_o tribunal_n 130._o tribunal_n capistran_n de_fw-fr author_n pap._n pag_n 130._o he_o be_v above_o all_o like_v he_o that_o come_v down_o from_o heaven_n ibi_fw-la heaven_n capist_n ibi_fw-la for_o with_o god_n and_o the_o pope_n his_o will_n be_v sufficient_a reason_n and_o that_o which_o please_v he_o have_v the_o vigour_n of_o a_o law_n 9_o law_n palaeot_fw-la de_fw-mi consist_v part_n 5._o q_o 9_o after_o his_o sentence_n pronounce_v no_o man_n must_v doubt_v or_o delay_n to_o yield_v sup_n yield_v petrisedes_o in_o romano_n sol●o_fw-la collocata_fw-la libertate_fw-la plena_fw-la in_fw-la suis_fw-la agendis_fw-la per_fw-la omne_fw-la poteri_fw-la debet_fw-la nec_fw-la ulli_fw-la subesse_fw-la homini_fw-la gl._n ibid._n ubi_fw-la sup_n yea_o all_o the_o counsel_n and_o doctor_n and_o church_n in_o the_o world_n must_v stoop_v to_o his_o determination_n 5_o these_o five_o thing_n thus_o observe_v it_o be_v easy_a to_o see_v that_o our_o adversary_n attribute_n more_o to_o the_o church_n then_o to_o be_v only_o a_o mean_n for_o the_o communicate_v of_o that_o which_o be_v in_o the_o scripture_n to_o we_o expound_v the_o authority_n thereof_o that_o it_o exceed_v the_o latitude_n of_o a_o candlestick_n and_o be_v turn_v into_o the_o candle_n itself_o and_o so_o to_o return_v to_o my_o adversary_n answer_n and_o to_o conclude_v i_o thus_o reason_n the_o ministry_n and_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v require_v either_o
have_v say_v a._n d._n whereas_o i_o object_v that_o sectary_n and_o the_o devil_n himself_o do_v allege_v word_n of_o scripture_n 64._o pag._n 202._o white_a pag._n 64._o m._n white_n grant_v it_o but_o say_v he_o either_o they_o allege_v not_o true_a scripture_n or_o not_o true_o apply_v as_o also_o they_o allege_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n but_o either_o not_o the_o true_a church_n or_o the_o true_a church_n not_o true_o testimonium_fw-la hoc_fw-la verum_fw-la est_fw-la this_o which_o m._n white_a grant_v be_v the_o very_a truth_n and_o want_v nothing_o but_o that_o he_o apply_v it_o to_o his_o private_a man_n luther_n and_o caluin_n and_o to_o his_o own_o self_n partiality_n will_v not_o suffer_v he_o to_o apply_v it_o thus_o but_o there_o be_v no_o reason_n that_o he_o shall_v be_v judge_n it_o be_v more_o fit_a that_o the_o judgement_n of_o this_o matter_n be_v leave_v to_o the_o catholic_a church_n which_o he_o confess_v to_o be_v teach_v of_o god_n 63._o white_a pag._n 63._o 10_o if_o my_o answer_n be_v true_a that_o when_o sectary_n or_o the_o devil_n allege_v scripture_n or_o the_o church_n they_o do_v it_o not_o true_o let_v the_o repliar_a give_v over_o brag_v and_o show_v real_o that_o the_o protestant_n have_v not_o allege_v these_o thing_n true_o and_o if_o it_o be_v no_o reason_n we_o be_v judge_n ourselves_o no_o more_o be_v it_o that_o the_o pope_n and_o papacy_n which_o of_o which_o nomine_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la intelligimus_fw-la eius_fw-la caput_fw-la id_fw-la est_fw-la romanum_fw-la pontificem_fw-la grego_n de_fw-fr valent_n pag._n 24._o tom_n 3._o quod_fw-la autem_fw-la haec_fw-la regula_fw-la animata_fw-la rationalis_fw-la sit_fw-la summus_fw-la pontifex_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la hic_fw-la locus_fw-la proprius_fw-la probandi_fw-la fra._n albertin_n coral_n p._n 251._o c._n no_o marvel_n now_o though_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v so_o fast_o talk_v of_o he_o mean_v by_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v judge_v but_o be_v it_o at_o that_o that_o we_o may_v have_v a_o free_a council_n assemble_v and_o hold_v as_o counsel_n be_v of_o ancient_a time_n where_o the_o pope_n and_o his_o faith_n may_v be_v try_v as_o well_o as_o we_o it_o will_v soon_o appear_v the_o protestant_n have_v not_o be_v partial_a in_o their_o cause_n when_o the_o late_a trent_n council_n itself_o have_v come_v near_o we_o than_o it_o do_v if_o it_o have_v not_o be_v manage_v by_o machiavellisme_n more_o than_o religion_n and_o the_o great_a tyranny_n and_o cozenage_n and_o villainy_n use_v in_o it_o that_o ever_o stir_v in_o any_o public_a business_n chap._n xxxiiii_o 1_o the_o papist_n pretend_v the_o church_n have_v a_o further_a meaning_n than_o the_o vulgar_a know_v 2_o the_o pope_n will_n be_v make_v the_o church_n act_n 3_o base_a tradition_n expound_v to_o be_v divine_a truth_n a._n d._n concern_v the_o ten_o chapter_n both_o my_o adversary_n make_v main_a opposition_n against_o the_o conclusion_n of_o this_o chapter_n 202._o pag._n 202._o one_o reason_n whereof_o be_v that_o they_o do_v not_o or_o will_v not_o right_o understand_v what_o i_o mean_v when_o here_o i_o say_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n be_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n note_v therefore_o first_o whereas_o the_o name_n church_n may_v be_v take_v several_a way_n 3._o intro_fw-la q._n 3._o according_a to_o that_o which_o i_o note_v in_o the_o introduction_n whereas_o also_o in_o every_o one_o of_o these_o sense_n it_o may_v be_v take_v either_o as_o it_o be_v general_o in_o all_o age_n or_o as_o it_o be_v particular_o in_o this_o or_o that_o determinate_a age_n my_o adversary_n omit_v all_o other_o sense_n principal_o understand_v i_o to_o mean_v by_o the_o name_n church_n the_o pope_n or_o pastor_n of_o this_o present_a age_n whereas_o in_o this_o chapter_n i_o do_v not_o at_z least_z ex_fw-la professo_fw-la or_o primary_o intend_v to_o speak_v of_o the_o church_n in_o this_o sense_n but_o rather_o do_v speak_v of_o the_o church_n in_o a_o more_o general_a indefinite_a and_o indeterminate_a sense_n as_o it_o signify_v one_o or_o other_o company_n of_o man_n live_v either_o in_o all_o age_n or_o in_o one_o or_o other_o age_n who_o in_o one_o or_o other_o sense_n may_v be_v call_v the_o church_n the_o doctrine_n whereof_o say_v i_o be_v the_o rule_n and_o mean_v ordain_v by_o god_n to_o instruct_v all_o sort_n of_o man_n in_o all_o matter_n of_o faith_n note_n second_o that_o by_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n i_o do_v not_o understand_v any_o friar_n dream_n 3_o white_a pag._n 3_o as_o m._n white_n dream_v nor_o humane_a tradition_n especial_o opposite_a to_o scripture_n but_o divine_a doctrine_n include_v therein_o both_o the_o write_v divine_a scripture_n and_o the_o unwritten_a divine_a tradition_n and_o the_o true_a divine_a interpretation_n of_o they_o both_o as_o by_o word_n writing_n sign_n or_o otherwise_o it_o be_v or_o may_v be_v propound_v and_o deliver_v to_o we_o by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n all_o which_o although_o it_o may_v worthy_o be_v call_v divine_a doctrine_n as_o be_v first_o reveal_v by_o god_n here_o i_o call_v church-doctrine_n because_o as_o it_o be_v first_o reveal_v and_o commit_v to_o the_o keep_n of_o prophet_n and_o apostle_n who_o in_o their_o time_n be_v chief_a and_o principal_a member_n of_o the_o militant_a church_n so_o by_o god_n ordinance_n it_o be_v to_o be_v propound_v and_o deliver_v to_o other_o man_n by_o the_o same_o prophet_n apostle_n and_o other_o their_o successor_n as_o they_o be_v doctor_n and_o pastor_n of_o the_o same_o church_n note_n three_o that_o by_o the_o rule_n of_o faith_n i_o mean_v such_o a_o rule_n as_o be_v also_o a_o sufficient_a outward_a mean_n ordain_v and_o set_v apart_o by_o god_n to_o instruct_v all_o sort_n of_o man_n in_o all_o point_n of_o faith_n which_o consequent_o must_v have_v those_o three_o condition_n or_o property_n of_o the_o rule_n set_v down_o and_o declare_v in_o the_o sixth_o chapter_n viz_o that_o it_o must_v be_v infallible_a easy_a to_o be_v understand_v of_o all_o sort_n and_o universal_a or_o such_o as_o may_v sufficient_o resolve_v one_o in_o all_o point_n of_o faith_n note_v four_o that_o when_o i_o say_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n be_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n i_o do_v not_o understand_v that_o the_o doctrine_n as_o sever_v from_o the_o church_n or_o the_o church_n as_o divide_v from_o the_o doctrine_n be_v the_o rule_n of_o say_v but_o that_o the_o doctrine_n as_o deliver_v by_o the_o church_n or_o the_o church_n as_o deliver_v doctrine_n be_v that_o rule_n and_o mean_n which_o god_n have_v ordain_v to_o instruct_v man_n in_o faith_n note_v five_o that_o to_o prove_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n to_o be_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n in_o such_o sort_n as_o now_o i_o have_v say_v it_o may_v suffice_v for_o this_o chapter_n that_o it_o be_v show_v that_o at_o lest_o once_o or_o in_o one_o age_n there_o be_v one_o or_o other_o company_n of_o live_a man_n in_o one_o or_o other_o sense_n call_v the_o church_n who_o be_v ordain_v by_o god_n and_o set_v apart_o to_o instruct_v all_o sort_n of_o man_n in_o all_o point_n of_o faith_n be_v for_o that_o purpose_n in_o their_o doctrine_n and_o teach_v furnish_v with_o these_o three_o condition_n which_o be_v requisite_a in_o the_o rule_n of_o faith_n for_o this_o be_v show_v in_o this_o chapter_n i_o shall_v easy_o show_v in_o the_o next_o that_o the_o same_o be_v to_o be_v say_v of_o some_o or_o other_o company_n continue_v in_o all_o age_n in_o this_o chapter_n therefore_o i_o chief_o undertake_v to_o prove_v that_o once_o or_o in_o one_o age_n there_o be_v a_o company_n of_o live_a man_n who_o in_o one_o sense_n may_v be_v call_v the_o church_n who_o god_n special_o appoint_v as_o a_o mean_n sufficient_a quantum_fw-la ex_fw-la se_fw-la to_o instruct_v all_o man_n in_o all_o matter_n of_o faith_n be_v for_o that_o purpose_n furnish_v with_o the_o three_o condition_n or_o property_n of_o the_o rule_n of_o faith_n 1_o the_o conclusion_n of_o this_o chapter_n be_v that_o the_o infallible_a rule_n which_o we_o ought_v obedient_o to_o follow_v in_o all_o point_n of_o faith_n be_v the_o doctrine_n and_o teach_v faith_n and_o belief_n of_o the_o true_a church_n his_o meaning_n wherein_o he_o say_v i_o will_v not_o or_o do_v not_o right_o understand_v let_v we_o therefore_o see_v how_o i_o understand_v it_o my_o answer_n be_v that_o we_o will_v free_o grant_v this_o conclusion_n if_o the_o meaning_n be_v no_o more_o but_o that_o the_o doctrine_n and_o faith_n of_o the_o universal_a church_n be_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n but_o there_o be_v a_o high_a matter_n mean_v first_o that_o the_o church_n word_n and_o authority_n without_o ground_v the_o same_o on_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o rule_n
virtual_o it_o be_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o the_o pope_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n representative_o be_v the_o college_n of_o cardinal_n but_o virtual_o the_o pope_n who_o be_v the_o head_n of_o the_o church_n pelaeottus_n 19_o pelaeottus_n de_fw-fr consist_v part_n 1._o qu._n 3._o pag._n 19_o the_o pope_n alone_o may_v do_v not_o only_o that_o which_o be_v grant_v to_o all_o and_o singular_a prelate_n in_o the_o church_n but_o also_o more_o than_o they_o all_o 4._o all_o respon_n moral_a p._n 44._o n_o 4._o comitol_n the_o power_n of_o ecclesiastical_a jurisdiction_n be_v not_o in_o the_o universality_n of_o the_o church_n as_o in_o the_o true_a subject_n but_o in_o the_o prelate_n thereof_o and_o in_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n as_o in_o the_o fountain_n whence_o it_o flow_v unto_o all_o other_o minister_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n albertine_n 251._o albertine_n coral_n pag._n 251._o say_v the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n into_o which_o rule_n all_o the_o article_n of_o our_o faith_n be_v last_o resolve_v as_o into_o the_o formal_a reason_n whereby_o they_o be_v propound_v to_o us._n gretser_n b._n gretser_n defence_n bell._n to_o 1._o p._n 1450._o b._n say_v when_o we_o affirm_v the_o church_n to_o be_v the_o judge_n of_o all_o controversy_n of_o faith_n by_o the_o church_n we_o understand_v the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n who_o for_o the_o time_n be_v govern_v the_o ship_n of_o the_o militant_a church_n and_o by_o lively_a voice_n do_v clear_o and_o express_o expound_v his_o judgement_n to_o they_o that_o seek_v to_o he_o zumel_n d._n zumel_n disput_fw-la var._n tom_n 3._o p._n 49_o d._n say_v i_o believe_v that_o the_o chief_a priest_n and_o bishop_n of_o the_o church_n the_o pope_n who_o be_v the_o master_n of_o our_o faith_n can_v but_o attain_v the_o truth_n of_o faith_n nor_o can_v be_v deceive_v or_o err_v if_o as_o chief_a bishop_n and_o master_n of_o the_o faith_n he_o set_v down_o his_o determination_n so_o that_o unless_o a_o man_n be_v afraid_a of_o the_o truth_n there_o be_v no_o cause_n why_o he_o shall_v fear_v the_o pope_n determination_n it_o be_v idle_a therefore_o and_o sordid_a that_o the_o repliar_a say_v by_o the_o church_n he_o mean_v the_o pope_n but_o secondary_o as_o it_o be_v ridiculous_a to_o say_v the_o church_n be_v the_o rule_n indefinite_o and_o abstract_v from_o all_o time_n or_o per_fw-la ampliationem_fw-la which_o be_v term_n devise_v only_o to_o besot_v the_o ignorant_a that_o they_o shall_v not_o smell_v his_o heresy_n for_o if_o his_o church_n be_v the_o rule_n he_o must_v needs_o mean_v such_o a_o church_n as_o he_o think_v in_o all_o age_n and_o time_n successive_o to_o have_v be_v invest_v with_o that_o authority_n and_o that_o church_n be_v the_o pope_n alone_o that_o miserable_a judge_n of_o who_o their_o own_o man_n say_v b._n say_v do._n bann_n to_o 3._o p._n 106._o b._n it_o be_v no_o catholic_a faith_n but_o a_o opinion_n very_o probable_a that_o he_o be_v s._n peter_n successor_n and_o the_o most_o judicious_a confess_v 2._o confess_v alph._n l._n 1._o c._n 4._o hadrian_n pag._n 26._o ad_fw-la 2._o he_o may_v err_v inde_fw-la err_v august_n anconit_fw-la sum_fw-la qu._n 5._o art_n 1_o jacobat_fw-la de_fw-fr conc_fw-fr l._n 4._o art_n 1._o occh_n dialog_n 1._o part_n l._n 6._o 2._o part_n c._n 69._o &_o inde_fw-la cusan_a de_fw-fr concord_n cath_z l._n 2._o c._n 17._o panorm_a de_fw-fr elect_a c._n signif_n not_o 7._o zabarell_n tract_n de_fw-fr schismat_fw-la gerson_n de_fw-fr auferibil_n pap._n consid_fw-la 10._o &_o inde_fw-la and_o be_v depose_v for_o heresy_n a.d._n §_o 1._o 205._o pag._n 205._o that_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o apostle_n be_v for_o their_o life_n time_n the_o rule_n and_o mean_n first_o i_o say_v that_o my_o conclusion_n be_v understand_v as_o in_o this_o chapter_n i_o principal_o mean_v can_v be_v deny_v to_o be_v true_a for_o it_o can_v be_v deny_v but_o that_o the_o doctrine_n as_o deliver_v by_o the_o apostle_n themselves_o be_v for_o the_o time_n they_o live_v the_o church_n in_o such_o sense_n as_o here_o i_o take_v the_o name_n church_n be_v such_o a_o rule_n and_o mean_n as_o here_o we_o seek_v for_o for_o first_o it_o be_v know_v to_o be_v infallible_a second_o it_o be_v easy_a to_o be_v understand_v etc._n etc._n three_o it_o be_v universal_a etc._n etc._n since_o therefore_o these_o 3._o condition_n requisite_a in_o the_o rule_n of_o faith_n be_v find_v in_o the_o doctrine_n and_o teach_v of_o the_o apostle_n it_o can_v be_v deny_v but_o that_o the_o divine_a doctrine_n as_o deliver_v by_o they_o in_o their_o life_n time_n either_o by_o word_n or_o writing_n be_v the_o rule_n and_o mean_n which_o god_n ordain_v to_o instruct_v man_n in_o faith_n taking_z therefore_o my_o conclusion_n in_o the_o chief_o intend_a sense_n i_o suppose_v that_o my_o adversary_n will_v neither_o deny_v it_o to_o be_v true_a nor_o the_o reason_n by_o which_o i_o prove_v it_o to_o be_v good_a 2_o this_o discourse_n need_v not_o for_o no_o protestant_a deny_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o apostle_n to_o be_v the_o rule_n either_o for_o their_o time_n or_o the_o time_n succeed_v to_o the_o world_n end_n i_o grant_v therefore_o the_o repliar_a his_o assertion_n and_o infer_v thereupon_o that_o his_o pope_n determination_n and_o the_o doctrine_n of_o his_o romish_a church_n be_v not_o the_o rule_n of_o faith_n because_o they_o agree_v not_o with_o that_o which_o he_o here_o confess_v be_v the_o rule_n in_o the_o apostle_n time_n unless_o he_o will_v maintain_v when_o he_o reply_v again_o that_o the_o rule_n be_v not_o one_o and_o the_o same_o at_o all_o time_n as_o 2.7_o as_o cusan_a ep_v 2.7_o his_o cardinal_n write_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v fit_v to_o the_o time_n and_o variable_o understand_v so_o that_o at_o one_o time_n it_o be_v expound_v according_a to_o the_o fashion_n of_o the_o church_n and_o when_o that_o fashion_n be_v change_v the_o sense_n of_o the_o scripture_n be_v also_o change_v again_o magalian_n a_o jesuite_n i_o think_v yet_o live_v 6._o live_v magal_n open_fw-mi hierarch_n in_o tit_n p._n 61._o n._n 6._o say_v though_o it_o be_v grant_v that_o the_o word_n of_o paul_n tit._n 1.6_o contain_v a_o precept_n to_o marry_v yet_o see_v paul_n give_v it_o by_o his_o own_o authority_n it_o be_v no_o divine_a but_o a_o ecclesiastical_a precept_n which_o the_o church_n may_v change_v yea_o abrogate_v and_o much_o more_o dispense_v with_o mark_v what_o trick_n heretic_n have_v to_o change_v the_o apostle_n doctrine_n when_o it_o fit_v not_o their_o church_n than_o the_o apostle_n give_v it_o by_o their_o own_o authority_n which_o i_o note_v that_o the_o reader_n may_v perceive_v there_o be_v no_o sincerity_n in_o the_o repliars_n word_n for_o albeit_o he_o grant_v here_o the_o apostle_n doctrine_n be_v the_o rule_n yet_o he_o mean_v it_o to_o be_v the_o rule_n but_o for_o their_o own_o time_n because_o the_o pope_n may_v under_o colourable_a pretence_n expound_v it_o that_o be_v in_o plain_a english_a change_v it_o when_o he_o will_v as_o his_o cardinal_n and_o jesuite_n here_o affirm_v a_o d._n §_o 2._o that_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o succeed_a pastor_n of_o the_o church_n 207._o pag._n 207._o be_v the_o rule_n and_o mean_n the_o chief_a controversy_n be_v about_o my_o conclusion_n as_o in_o a_o secondary_a sense_n it_o may_v be_v mean_v of_o the_o succeed_a pastor_n of_o the_o church_n in_o which_o sense_n i_o affirm_v that_o like_o as_o the_o divine_a doctrine_n not_o as_o contain_v in_o only_a scripture_n or_o as_o gather_v thence_o by_o natural_a wit_n or_o private_a spirit_n but_o as_o deliver_v by_o the_o apostle_n or_o the_o apostle_n as_o deliver_v this_o doctrine_n be_v the_o rule_n and_o mean_v ordain_v by_o god_n to_o instruct_v all_o man_n live_v in_o their_o day_n in_o all_o matter_n of_o faith_n so_o the_o same_o doctrine_n not_o as_o contain_v in_o only_a scripture_n nor_o as_o gather_v thence_o by_o 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elect_v be_v pag._n 240._o the_o church_n thus_o consider_v be_v altogether_o invisible_a but_o the_o question_n be_v not_o touch_v this_o church_n and_o therefore_o against_o his_o conclusion_n i_o have_v also_o affirm_v three_o that_o the_o church_n consist_v of_o professor_n sometime_o be_v invisible_a that_o be_v to_o say_v the_o whole_a number_n of_o true_a believer_n and_o professor_n live_v in_o the_o world_n which_o we_o call_v the_o church_n militant_a sometime_o loose_a the_o outward_a conspicuousnes_n of_o apostolic_a doctrine_n and_o government_n free_a from_o abuse_n which_o the_o papist_n say_v they_o always_o hold_v touch_v this_o assertion_n he_o note_v two_o thing_n 7_o first_o the_o reason_n why_o we_o maintain_v it_o that_o when_o he_o forsooth_o shall_v afterward_o urge_v we_o to_o assign_v a_o continual_a profess_v protestant_a company_n as_o he_o can_v show_v a_o continual_a company_n of_o professor_n of_o the_o roman_a faith_n we_o may_v by_o this_o start_a hole_n escape_v without_o answer_n this_o be_v but_o wind_n and_o ostentation_n he_o can_v show_v no_o continual_a company_n successive_o or_o visible_o profess_v the_o roman_a faith_n with_o all_o the_o article_n thereof_o as_o now_o it_o be_v hold_v he_o may_v set_v down_o a_o catalogue_n of_o bishop_n doctor_n counsel_n and_o professor_n that_o in_o all_o age_n have_v be_v in_o the_o world_n but_o that_o they_o believe_v as_o himself_o and_o the_o jesuite_n and_o his_o romish_a church_n now_o do_v otherwise_o then_o in_o the_o substantial_a article_n of_o faith_n wherein_o we_o agree_v with_o they_o or_o that_o there_o be_v none_o among_o they_o that_o mislike_v the_o corruption_n of_o the_o papacy_n as_o they_o grow_v hold_v in_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o protestant_n religion_n he_o can_v never_o show_v as_o will_v appear_v the_o true_a cause_n why_o we_o maintain_v the_o church_n to_o be_v sometime_o invisible_a be_v this_o that_o i_o shall_v lay_v down_o sense_n down_o the_o manner_n how_o the_o question_n touch_v the_o visibility_n of_o the_o church_n first_o begin_v and_o in_o what_o sense_n for_o when_o luther_n and_o the_o first_o reformer_n some_o hundred_o year_n ago_o withdraw_v themselves_o from_o the_o subjection_n of_o the_o pope_n and_o put_v away_o these_o innumerable_a error_n out_o of_o their_o church_n which_o our_o adversary_n now_o maintain_v against_o we_o as_o the_o doctrine_n of_o image_n worship_n invocation_n of_o saint_n purgatory_n the_o mass_n transubstantiation_n and_o the_o rest_n wherein_o our_o adversary_n and_o we_o dissent_v alter_v nothing_o of_o that_o which_o belong_v to_o the_o substance_n of_o true_a faith_n or_o which_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n have_v receive_v from_o the_o apostle_n and_o primitive_a church_n but_o only_o contrary_a to_o the_o custom_n of_o some_o age_n before_o profess_v the_o same_o without_o the_o mixture_n of_o the_o aforesaid_a error_n the_o pope_n with_o his_o crew_n cry_v out_o they_o be_v heretic_n persecute_v they_o with_o fire_n and_o sword_n and_o charge_v they_o to_o have_v forsake_v the_o church_n of_o christ_n wherein_o they_o shall_v be_v save_v and_o among_o other_o argument_n his_o champion_n require_v they_o to_o show_v the_o succession_n of_o their_o doctrine_n and_o pastor_n boast_v that_o unless_o they_o can_v do_v it_o and_o show_v their_o church_n to_o have_v visible_o be_v in_o all_o age_n they_o will_v conclude_v they_o have_v forsake_v the_o church_n and_o be_v the_o first_o author_n of_o the_o protestant_a religion_n the_o reformer_n to_o this_o answer_v that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n itself_o be_v their_o visible_a church_n wherein_o they_o be_v breed_v and_o whence_o they_o proceed_v but_o therein_o be_v two_o kind_n of_o article_n of_o religion_n the_o one_o which_o be_v apostolic_a and_o have_v be_v from_o the_o beginning_n the_o other_o that_o which_o at_o several_a time_n by_o the_o faction_n and_o conveyance_n of_o heretic_n have_v be_v bring_v in_o and_o mingle_v with_o the_o truth_n this_o latter_a they_o have_v renounce_v but_o not_o the_o former_a make_v it_o more_o than_o manifest_a that_o in_o the_o substance_n of_o the_o truth_n and_o rule_v of_o faith_n teach_v by_o the_o apostle_n and_o certain_o hold_v by_o the_o ancient_a church_n they_o have_v alter_v nothing_o but_o only_o separate_v themselves_o from_o intolerable_a corruption_n and_o from_o the_o pope_n tyranny_n that_o maintain_v and_o urge_v they_o who_o by_o his_o tyranny_n and_o pervert_v all_o thing_n have_v declare_v himself_o to_o be_v antichrist_n sit_v in_o the_o church_n of_o god_n and_o when_o the_o papist_n still_o cry_v show_v we_o a_o visible_a church_n in_o all_o the_o world_n profss_v in_o all_o thing_n as_o you_o do_v they_o reply_v it_o be_v not_o necessary_a so_o to_o do_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n itself_o be_v the_o visible_a church_n profess_v as_o they_o do_v in_o all_o thing_n substantial_a but_o if_o they_o require_v such_o a_o 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when_o reformation_n have_v not_o be_v so_o pure_a as_o now_o it_o be_v no_o otherwise_o than_o i_o will_v say_v the_o body_n be_v invisible_a when_o a_o leprosy_n have_v overgrow_v it_o or_o the_o kingdom_n of_o france_n be_v invisible_a when_o tyranny_n and_o new_a custom_n shall_v mingle_v themselves_o therewith_o and_o the_o ancient_a law_n be_v expound_v by_o a_o faction_n of_o rebel_n 8_o by_o this_o his_o second_o exception_n that_o to_o defend_v a_o paradox_n i_o have_v pervert_v the_o state_n of_o the_o question_n be_v answer_v for_o it_o be_v clear_a hereby_o that_o the_o question_n be_v of_o the_o militant_a church_n and_o so_o d._n stapleton_n 2._o stapleton_n relect._n p._n 2._o say_v express_o in_o this_o controversy_n the_o appellation_n of_o the_o church_n principal_o belong_v to_o the_o militant_a company_n and_o the_o two_o thing_n mention_v touch_v it_o that_o it_o may_v consist_v of_o a_o small_a number_n and_o that_o it_o profess_v sometime_o in_o secret_a be_v take_v in_o the_o sense_n deliver_v be_v so_o far_o from_o be_v blind_a shift_n that_o they_o can_v be_v disprove_v by_o brag_v and_o if_o there_o be_v any_o mettle_n or_o truth_n in_o my_o adversary_n here_o i_o spur_v he_o and_o let_v he_o answer_v free_o that_o which_o i_o note_v be_v the_o clear_a confession_n of_o many_o 3._o many_o in_o the_o way_n digr_n 17._o n._n 3._o learned_a papist_n themselves_n alexand._n durand_n turrecremata_fw-la parnormitan_n pererius_n ouandus_fw-la acosta_n the_o rhemist_n dom_fw-la scoto_n gregory_n valence_n but_o these_o be_v principal_a man_n in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n must_v not_o be_v say_v to_o teach_v blind_a shift_n but_o the_o truth_n that_o therefore_o which_o i_o note_v be_v the_o truth_n if_o it_o be_v the_o truth_n that_o the_o church_n militant_a in_o respect_n of_o the_o best_a part_n thereof_o may_v sometime_o consist_v of_o a_o small_a number_n and_o may_v secret_o that_o the_o world_n can_v see_v it_o profess_v the_o faith_n 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affirm_v that_o the_o hatred_n of_o the_o romish_a faith_n bring_v castalion_n or_o nenser_n or_o aleman_n to_o that_o which_o they_o do_v the_o like_a be_v report_v by_o 11._o by_o hasenmull_n hist_o jesuit_n c._n 11._o hasenmuller_n one_o that_o live_v among_o the_o jesuite_n and_o interfui_fw-la and_o historian_n hanc_fw-la quam_fw-la bona_fw-la fide_fw-la recitani_n sicuti_fw-la eam_fw-la &_o audivi_fw-la &_o vidi_fw-la dum_fw-la rebus_fw-la jesuitarum_fw-la interfui_fw-la see_v the_o thing_n that_o he_o report_v of_o diverse_a jesuite_n fall_v into_o the_o like_a terrible_a desperation_n among_o who_o one_o despair_v like_a spira_n because_o he_o have_v renounce_v the_o truth_n to_o become_v a_o papist_n complain_v that_o he_o be_v damn_v for_o the_o same_o call_v upon_o they_o they_o that_o stand_v by_o to_o kill_v he_o because_o he_o feel_v nothing_o in_o himself_o but_o hell_n &_o the_o torture_n of_o devil_n torment_v he_o for_o put_v confidence_n in_o mass_n image_n cross_n bead_n suffrage_n the_o merit_n of_o saint_n and_o such_o like_a the_o dotage_n of_o postellus_fw-la who_o sometime_o be_v so_o famous_a among_o our_o adversary_n and_o his_o impiety_n about_o the_o messiah_n be_v inferior_a to_o none_o of_o these_o but_o because_o acosta_n the_o jesuite_n have_v write_v a_o memorable_a example_n of_o one_o live_v in_o peru_n i_o will_v translate_v the_o history_n and_o so_o let_v the_o repliar_a himself_o say_v if_o his_o own_o religion_n breed_v not_o judaisme_n turkism_n doubt_n and_o desperation_n as_o gross_a as_o ever_o ochin_n or_o any_o other_o fall_v into_o chap_n xli_o a_o narration_n of_o a_o popish_a doctor_n and_o professor_n of_o divinity_n in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n translate_v out_o of_o acosta_n de_fw-fr temp._n noviss_n l._n 2._o c._n 11._o &_o maiol_n dies_fw-la canicul_fw-la tom_fw-mi 2._o pag._n 89._o and_o insert_v for_o answer_v to_o that_o wherewith_o the_o jesuite_n reproach_n our_o church_n in_o the_o last_o word_n of_o his_o precedent_a reply_n there_o be_v in_o the_o kingdom_n of_o peru_n a_o man_n at_o that_o time_n great_o esteem_v a_o learned_a divine_a and_o a_o professor_n of_o divinity_n who_o a_o long_a time_n together_o be_v account_v catholic_n and_o godly_a and_o almost_o the_o oracle_n of_o all_o this_o part_n of_o the_o world_n this_o man_n be_v so_o link_v in_o familiarity_n with_o a_o certain_a woman_n who_o boast_v of_o herself_o that_o she_o be_v teach_v great_a mystery_n by_o a_o angel_n and_o like_o another_o philumena_n or_o maximilla_n who_o montanus_n follow_v be_v rapt_v out_o of_o herself_o or_o at_o least_o seem_v so_o to_o be_v that_o he_o often_o use_v to_o consult_v with_o she_o about_o the_o great_a question_n in_o divinity_n in_o all_o thing_n he_o esteem_v she_o as_o a_o oracle_n report_v she_o to_o be_v full_a of_o great_a revelation_n and_o to_o be_v dear_o belove_v of_o god_n who_o otherwise_o be_v but_o a_o base_a creature_n and_o of_o small_a sense_n unless_o it_o 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to_o be_v the_o redeemer_n of_o the_o world_n in_o regard_n of_o the_o efficacy_n whereas_o christ_n be_v the_o redeemer_n but_o in_o regard_n of_o sufficiency_n that_o all_o ecclesiastical_a state_n shall_v be_v abrogate_a and_o he_o will_v give_v new_a law_n that_o shall_v be_v plain_a and_o easy_a whereby_o the_o single_a life_n of_o the_o clergy_n shall_v be_v take_v away_o and_o many_o wife_n allow_v and_o the_o necessity_n of_o shrift_n be_v abrogate_a these_o and_o many_o such_o like_a thing_n he_o affirm_v with_o such_o confidence_n and_o earnestness_n that_o we_o be_v amaze_v to_o see_v a_o man_n imagine_v these_o thing_n yet_o not_o to_o be_v out_o of_o his_o wit_n at_o the_o last_o when_o we_o have_v a_o long_a time_n consider_v his_o do_n and_o condemn_v above_o 120_o proposition_n of_o his_o that_o be_v heretical_a and_o dissonant_n from_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n we_o be_v command_v to_o dispute_v with_o he_o to_o see_v if_o we_o can_v bring_v he_o back_o to_o 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epist_n de_fw-fr solit_fw-la vit_fw-mi agent_n p._n 647._o graec_fw-la hieron_n cate-log_n script_n in_o fortunat._n say_v that_o for_o fear_n of_o death_n he_o subscribe_v to_o the_o arian_n damasus_n liberij_fw-la damasus_n damas_n vit_fw-mi liberij_fw-la say_v that_o vrsacius_n and_o valence_n two_o arian_n bishop_n be_v send_v to_o he_o by_o the_o emperor_n he_o consent_v to_o he_o diverse_a other_o example_n be_v well_o know_v and_o common_o object_v dominicus_n bannes_n 115._o bannes_n bann_n ubi_fw-la sup_n pag._n 115._o say_v the_o pope_n as_o he_o be_v a_o doctor_n and_o a_o private_a person_n may_v err_v in_o matter_n of_o faith_n even_o with_o pertinacy_n that_o he_o become_v a_o heretic_n and_o this_o conclusion_n he_o affirm_v to_o be_v general_o hold_v by_o all_o the_o ancient_a bishop_n of_o rome_n themselves_o and_o by_o all_o the_o school_n doctor_n before_o albertus_n pighius_fw-la and_o by_o the_o grave_a sort_n of_o doctor_n also_o since_o he_o and_o to_o what_o 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4._o part_n 2._o c._n 16._o give_v this_o for_o one_o the_o seventeenth_o manner_n whereby_o the_o pope_n special_o may_v be_v convince_v of_o pertinacy_n in_o heresy_n be_v if_o he_o solemn_o define_v the_o error_n and_o affirm_v it_o to_o be_v hold_v by_o christian_n as_o catholic_a it_o be_v therefore_o 4._o therefore_o azor._fw-la tom_n 2._o moral_n l._n 5._o c._n 4._o his_o judgement_n that_o the_o pope_n may_v err_v even_o judicious_o è_fw-la cathedra_fw-la waldensis_n 1._o waldensis_n waldens_n doctrinal_a fid_fw-we l._n 2._o c._n 19_o tom_n 1._o affirm_v that_o no_o church_n or_o council_n no_o not_o the_o particular_a church_n of_o rome_n be_v free_a from_o error_n but_o only_o the_o catholic_a church_n disperse_v all_o over_o the_o world_n from_o the_o time_n of_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n to_o this_o day_n if_o only_o the_o catholic_a church_n thus_o consider_v be_v free_a from_o error_n than_o he_o think_v the_o pope_n every_o way_n howsoever_o may_v err_v and_o his_o particular_a church_n and_o college_n be_v allow_v to_o help_v he_o yet_o they_o not_o be_v the_o church_n mention_v in_o the_o creed_n in_o waldens_n the_o innocent_a promote_a the_o faithless_a defame_v catholic_n exalt_v schismatickes_n hate_v good_a man_n oppress_v the_o truth_n with_o all_o their_o power_n and_o by_o all_o mean_v possible_a without_o fear_n advance_v forward_o heretical_a pravitie_n the_o time_n alas_o be_v come_v whereof_o the_o bless_a apostle_n prophesy_v 2._o tim._n 4._o the_o time_n shall_v be_v when_o man_n will_v not_o abide_v wholesome_a doctrine_n but_o with_o itch_a ear_n shall_v heap_v to_o themselves_o teacher_n after_o their_o own_o lust_n and_o turn_v their_o ear_n from_o the_o truth_n shall_v give_v heed_n to_o fable_n which_o prophecy_n indeed_o be_v fulfil_v in_o our_o day_n which_o i_o speak_v with_o grief_n and_o that_o i_o may_v conclude_v in_o few_o word_n with_o a_o whore_n forehead_n and_o execrable_a boldness_n they_o hasten_v to_o subvert_v both_o king_n and_o law_n divine_a and_o humane_a etc._n etc._n 9_o the_o three_o thing_n the_o reply_n say_v be_v that_o the_o pope_n private_a error_n can_v prejudice_n the_o church_n but_o this_o be_v folly_n for_o who_o see_v not_o that_o if_o his_o decree_n be_v admit_v to_o be_v infallible_a truth_n the_o church_n shall_v be_v constrain_v by_o the_o consequence_n of_o this_o principle_n to_o receive_v for_o such_o many_o of_o his_o error_n the_o reason_n be_v because_o he_o can_v possible_o decree_v otherwise_o then_o he_o private_o think_v and_o in_o decree_a he_o be_v not_o bind_v either_o to_o follow_v or_o use_v the_o counsel_n of_o other_o bishop_n in_o which_o case_n what_o have_v he_o to_o lead_v he_o but_o his_o own_o erroneous_a private_a spirit_n they_o will_v say_v possible_a god_n promise_n and_o providence_n be_v to_o preserve_v he_o when_o he_o teach_v the_o church_n è_fw-fr cathedra_fw-la else_o the_o church_n shall_v be_v tie_v to_o a_o inconvenience_n 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we_o where_o be_v there_o among_o all_o the_o text_n that_o can_v be_v allege_v one_o rule_n or_o example_n that_o we_o shall_v pray_v thus_o to_o a_o live_a man_n as_o they_o do_v to_o a_o saint_n save_v i_o o_o saviour_n redeem_v i_o o_o redeemer_n and_o as_o be_v the_o prayer_n that_o i_o allege_v if_o one_o of_o the_o thief_n upon_o the_o cross_n when_o our_o saviour_n die_v shall_v thus_o have_v pray_v to_o 19.25_o to_o joh._n 19.25_o the_o holy_a virgin_n standing_z by_o as_o the_o friar_z late_o do_v in_o france_n when_o he_o be_v to_o be_v execute_v for_o murder_v a_o man_n to_o have_v his_o wife_n 300._o wife_n the_o prayer_n of_o a_o friar_n upon_o the_o scaffold_n when_o he_o die_v for_o a_o murder_n in_o france_n a_o 1609._o boter_fw-mi comment_n l._n 16._o p._n 300._o but_o o_o thou_o the_o solace_n of_o such_o as_o be_v in_o misery_n our_o lodestar_n in_o the_o midst_n of_o this_o rage_a sea_n the_o advocate_n of_o man_n the_o ark_n of_o the_o testament_n the_o altar_n of_o sinner_n by_o thy_o suffrage_n o_o virgin_n effect_n with_o thy_o son_n that_o i_o may_v have_v my_o desire_n will_v the_o jesuit_n i_o marvel_v commend_v his_o devotion_n as_o the_o reporter_n do_v the_o friar_n zeal_n or_o if_o this_o example_n fume_n into_o the_o jesuit_n head_n be_v it_o lawful_a for_o a_o man_n upon_o his_o deathbed_n to_o invocate_v the_o live_a stand_v by_o as_o the_o 242._o the_o fra._n ximenius_n of_o toledo_n gomec_n de_fw-fr reb_n ximen_fw-la l._n 7._o pag._n 242._o great_a archbishop_n do_v the_o dead_a when_o he_o die_v himself_o to_o be_v his_o patroness_n all_o the_o saint_n but_o above_o all_o the_o mother_n of_o god_n michael_n the_o archangel_n peter_n and_o paul_n james_n and_o s._n francis_n or_o if_o at_o a_o open_a session_n at_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n sato_n or_o must_n or_o one_o of_o the_o friar_n shall_v have_v begin_v his_o sermon_n with_o a_o prayer_n to_o cardinal_n barrhomaeo_n sit_v by_o mutatis_fw-la mutandis_fw-la as_o 621._o as_o stephanus_n arch._n patracens_n in_o conc_fw-fr late_a sub_fw-la leo._n p._n 621._o a_o archbishop_n sometime_o begin_v he_o at_o the_o council_n of_o lateran_n with_o his_o terrae_fw-la his_o omnium_fw-la splendot_n decus_fw-la &_o perenne_fw-fr virginum_fw-la lumen_fw-la genetrix_fw-la superni_fw-la gloria_fw-la humani_fw-la generis_fw-la maria_fw-la vnica_fw-la nostri_fw-la sola_fw-la tu_fw-la virgo_fw-la donina●s_fw-la astris_fw-la sola_fw-la tu_fw-la terrae_fw-la maris_fw-la atque_fw-la coeli_fw-la lumen_fw-la inceptis_fw-la faveas_fw-la rogamus_fw-la inclita_fw-la nostris_fw-la ut_fw-la queam_n sacros_fw-la reserare_fw-la sensus_fw-la qui_fw-la latent_fw-la chartis_fw-la nimium_fw-la severis_fw-la ingredi_fw-la &_o celsae_fw-la deuce_fw-la te_fw-la benignae_fw-la maenia_n terrae_fw-la invocation_n of_o the_o bless_a virgin_n o_o bless_a charles_n our_o church_n hope_n and_o glory_n of_o our_o fade_a light_n the_o best_a of_o all_o our_o cardinal_n in_o consistory_n shine_v bright_a thou_o only_o show_v the_o way_n that_o lead_v to_o heaven_n bliss_n &_o virtue_n lore_n thy_o life_n our_o safe_a lodestar_n be_v to_o guide_v we_o to_o the_o heavenly_a shore_n i_o pray_v thou_o give_v i_o of_o thy_o grace_n and_o fill_v i_o with_o thy_o verity_n that_o i_o may_v bold_o speak_v in_o place_n and_o beat_v down_o luther_n heresy_n if_o i_o say_v the_o friar_z shall_v have_v make_v such_o a_o prayer_n to_o he_o will_v not_o his_o fellow_n cardinal_n have_v envy_v his_o deity_n &_o think_v that_o invocation_n will_v have_v come_v soon_o enough_o after_o his_o death_n when_o he_o have_v be_v saint_v the_o live_v therefore_o be_v not_o pray_v unto_o nor_o entreat_v to_o pray_v to_o god_n or_o make_v intercession_n for_o we_o nor_o any_o way_n make_v mediator_n by_o their_o intercession_n and_o merit_n as_o the_o dead_a be_v for_o that_o be_v against_o the_o office_n of_o christ_n but_o only_o as_o feel_a member_n of_o this_o state_n that_o see_v and_o know_v the_o want_v each_o of_o other_o and_o that_o have_v a_o call_n from_o god_n thereto_o they_o join_v their_o prayer_n to_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o body_n no_o man_n merit_n or_o advocation_n be_v interpose_v but_o every_o one_o with_o and_o for_o other_o immediate_o fly_v to_o jesus_n christ_n 6_o a_o three_o reason_n why_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o entreat_v the_o prayer_n of_o the_o living_n rather_o than_o the_o dead_a be_v for_o that_o the_o live_n who_o we_o entreat_v to_o pray_v for_o we_o understand_v and_o see_v our_o particular_a want_n and_o be_v in_o state_n to_o take_v knowledge_n of_o our_o desire_n to_o be_v pray_v for_o as_o when_o saint_n paul_n bid_v the_o people_n pray_v for_o he_o they_o hear_v and_o understand_v he_o what_o he_o desire_v which_o the_o saint_n in_o heaven_n depart_v though_o full_a of_o glory_n and_o great_a endowment_n do_v not_o and_o here_o it_o be_v not_o enough_o to_o bring_v conjecture_n and_o with_o show_n of_o word_n and_o disputation_n to_o lead_v our_o judgement_n as_o in_o this_o cause_n our_o adversary_n have_v take_v great_a pain_n to_o pull_v upon_o themselves_o a_o learned_a error_n but_o afore_o i_o can_v pray_v in_o this_o fashion_n to_o the_o dead_a with_o faith_n if_o all_o other_o difficulty_n be_v clear_v i_o must_v have_v a_o sure_a ground_n in_o my_o conscience_n that_o they_o hear_v i_o and_o he_o that_o will_v persuade_v i_o to_o believe_v they_o do_v must_v not_o come_v with_o if_z and_z and_o be_v and_o metaphysical_a speculation_n and_o the_o seem_a opinion_n of_o man_n but_o with_o that_o which_o may_v bring_v full_a assurance_n and_o may_v support_v faith_n as_o the_o holy_a ghost_n do_v 1.15_o do_v 1._o tim._n 1.15_o this_o be_v a_o true_a say_n and_o worthy_a of_o all_o man_n to_o be_v receive_v 4.22_o receive_v joh._n 4.22_o we_o worship_v that_o we_o know_v 3._o know_v 2._o cor._n 4_o 3._o we_o approve_v ourselves_o to_o every_o man_n conscience_n let_v it_o be_v make_v thus_o sure_a unto_o we_o that_o when_o i_o pray_v the_o saint_n hear_v i_o and_o it_o shall_v willing_o be_v receive_v and_o believe_v this_o reason_n do_v not_o immediate_o proceed_v to_o show_v that_o pray_v to_o the_o dead_a rob_v christ_n of_o his_o office_n but_o only_o that_o it_o be_v against_o faith_n which_o be_v show_v thence_o it_o will_v easy_o be_v conclude_v that_o then_o christ_n be_v rob_v of_o his_o office_n because_o all_o prayer_n against_o faith_n be_v against_o christ_n mediatorship_n in_o some_o part_n of_o the_o latitude_n thereof_o now_o if_o it_o so_o please_v the_o reader_n let_v we_o see_v what_o assurance_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n can_v give_v that_o the_o saint_n know_v our_o prayer_n 7_o first_o it_o be_v clear_a that_o in_o all_o the_o scripture_n there_o be_v nothing_o to_o prove_v it_o but_o the_o contrary_n for_o 22.20_o for_o 2._o reg._n 22.20_o when_o josiah_n shall_v die_v god_n tell_v he_o his_o eye_n shall_v not_o see_v the_o evil_n which_o he_o will_v bring_v upon_o jerusalem_n and_o solomon_n 5._o solomon_n eccl._n 9_o 5._o say_v the_o dead_a know_v nothing_o at_o all_o and_o 16._o and_o es_fw-ge 63_o 16._o the_o prophet_n in_o a_o prayer_n he_o make_v to_o god_n say_v thou_o be_v our_o father_n though_o abraham_n be_v ignorant_a of_o we_o and_o israel_n know_v we_o not_o the_o which_o text_n show_v manifest_o that_o the_o dead_a have_v as_o little_a knowledge_n of_o our_o state_n here_o as_o we_o have_v of_o they_o there_o or_o if_o it_o be_v otherwise_o god_n will_v somewhere_o have_v reveal_v it_o especial_o the_o revelation_n thereof_o be_v so_o necessary_a for_o the_o confirmation_n of_o this_o point_n touch_v invocation_n which_o animae_fw-la which_o superfluum_fw-la videtur_fw-la abeis_n ordinariè_fw-la petere_fw-la we_o pro_fw-la nobis_fw-la oreni_fw-la quia_fw-la non_fw-la possunt_fw-la ordinariè_fw-la cognoscere_fw-la quid_fw-la agamus_fw-la in_o particulari_fw-la bellar._n de_fw-fr purgat_fw-la l._n 2._o c._n 15._o §._o praetere_fw-la a_o animae_fw-la by_o the_o jesuite_n own_o confession_n be_v in_o vain_a where_o they_o do_v not_o ordinary_o as_o in_o purgatory_n hear_v our_o prayer_n the_o which_o for_o the_o most_o part_n be_v seat_v in_o 10._o in_o plerunque_fw-la hoc_fw-la negotium_fw-la plus_fw-la gemitibus_fw-la quam_fw-la sermonibus_fw-la agitur_fw-la plus_fw-la flet●_n quam_fw-la affatu_fw-la august_n epist_n 121._o c._n 10._o the_o heart_n and_o thence_o immediate_o without_o any_o noise_n of_o word_n ascend_v up_o who_o can_v understand_v they_o but_o he_o that_o search_v the_o heart_n which_o philo_n paris_n philo_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d philo_z iudae_fw-la pag._n 328._o paris_n say_v be_v the_o musical_a and_o loud_a instrument_n of_o our_o voice_n and_o be_v hear_v by_o no_o mortal_a creature_n but_o only_o by_o he_o that_o be_v immortal_a and_o unbegotten_a 8_o second_o our_o adversary_n can_v never_o give_v themselves_o satisfaction_n
bad_a under_o pretence_n of_o advance_v the_o gospel_n or_o the_o glory_n of_o god_n especial_o if_o they_o think_v that_o they_o may_v lawful_o maintain_v it_o by_o write_v apparent_a and_o know_v untruth_n the_o better_a to_o defend_v it_o if_o i_o say_v there_o be_v any_o protestant_a writer_n of_o such_o sear_a conscience_n i_o will_v wish_v they_o will_v plain_o tell_v we_o this_o their_o mind_n that_o so_o those_o poor_a soul_n who_o have_v be_v hitherto_o seduce_v may_v the_o better_o see_v how_o unsound_a the_o potestant_a religion_n be_v which_o can_v be_v maintain_v but_o with_o apparent_a untruth_n utter_v by_o their_o writer_n either_o without_o due_a care_n of_o conscience_n or_o against_o their_o knowledge_n and_o conscience_n or_o with_o have_v such_o bad_a conscience_n as_o to_o think_v it_o lawful_a to_o lie_v in_o this_o their_o cause_n pretend_v by_o they_o to_o be_v for_o the_o advancement_n of_o god_n glory_n and_o of_o the_o gospel_n or_o which_o be_v all_o one_o or_o worse_o to_o think_v one_o can_v lie_v too_o much_o in_o defence_n of_o this_o their_o protestant_a cause_n or_o gospel_n 5_o this_o be_v a_o poor_a motion_n and_o proceed_v from_o no_o great_a conceit_n yet_o i_o will_v satisfy_v it_o upon_o condition_n he_o will_v rest_v satisfy_v with_o my_o answer_n let_v this_o content_n you_o and_o bear_v not_o yourselves_o in_o hand_n to_o the_o contrary_a we_o know_v our_o cause_n to_o be_v god_n own_o truth_n which_o you_o have_v corrupt_v with_o innumerable_a heresy_n patch_v thereunto_o and_o we_o not_o only_o defend_v it_o as_o we_o do_v with_o a_o good_a conscience_n against_o you_o but_o we_o will_v think_v it_o our_o great_a happiness_n if_o the_o cause_n shall_v so_o require_v to_o shed_v our_o blood_n in_o defence_n of_o it_o and_o it_o joy_v our_o heart_n to_o see_v the_o weapon_n wherewith_o you_o fight_v against_o we_o lie_v rail_a pride_n rage_n treason_n sedition_n fire_n and_o powder_n which_o be_v a_o sign_n that_o you_o be_v not_o of_o god_n &_o this_o our_o cause_n we_o will_v maintain_v with_o zeal_n and_o sincerity_n which_o shall_v be_v try_v not_o by_o your_o calumny_n but_o by_o the_o thing_n itself_o and_o i_o be_o so_o far_o from_o seduce_v any_o that_o i_o will_v give_v my_o life_n for_o the_o reclaim_n of_o those_o who_o you_o have_v seduce_v and_o bewitch_v with_o mere_a cozenage_n and_o imposture_n and_o as_o i_o hate_v lie_v to_o defend_v god_n truth_n so_o can_v i_o not_o but_o upbraid_v they_o that_o run_v heady_o into_o papistry_n afore_o they_o know_v how_o thing_n stand_v between_o we_o when_o upon_o just_a trial_n it_o will_v fall_v out_o that_o in_o the_o main_a question_n between_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o we_o our_o adversary_n uphold_v themselves_o with_o mere_a imposture_n to_o the_o reader_n hitherto_o reach_v that_o which_o my_o adversary_n have_v write_v against_o the_o epistle_n and_o preface_n of_o my_o book_n now_o in_o the_o next_o place_n before_o he_o fall_v to_o reply_v upon_o the_o book_n itself_o he_o insert_v a_o introduction_n as_o he_o call_v it_o contain_v a_o declaration_n of_o the_o word_n faith_n the_o which_o bebeginne_v pag._n 49._o where_o his_o exception_n to_o the_o say_a preface_n and_o epistle_n end_n and_o forasmuch_o as_o it_o be_v a_o new_a discourse_n intend_v reply_n intend_v since_o i_o see_v m._n a_o wotton_n to_o be_v either_o of_o so_o dull_a capacity_n of_o wit_n that_o he_o can_v conceive_v or_o rather_o of_o so_o captious_a disposition_n of_o will_n that_o he_o will_v needs_o doubt_v and_o make_v a_o question_n what_o i_o mean_v by_o the_o word_n faith_n i_o have_v think_v good_a not_o only_o to_o declare_v what_o i_o mean_v by_o the_o word_n but_o also_o by_o this_o action_n to_o set_v down_o certain_a point_n of_o doctrine_n pertain_v to_o the_o thing_n signify_v by_o the_o word_n pag_n 49._o of_o his_o reply_n as_o it_o shall_v seem_v against_o m._n wotton_n and_o be_v no_o reply_n to_o i_o but_o a_o superfluous_a and_o impertinent_a collection_n rude_o and_o obscure_o peece_v together_o for_o the_o outface_a of_o that_o which_o he_o be_v not_o able_a formal_o to_o answer_v i_o will_v therefore_o cast_v away_o no_o time_n in_o meddle_v with_o it_o but_o only_o defend_v myself_o against_o such_o place_n thereof_o as_o touch_v my_o book_n because_o i_o will_v not_o be_v in_o his_o debt_n for_o a_o word_n those_o place_n only_o i_o have_v here_o set_v down_o in_o order_n as_o they_o lie_v in_o his_o discourse_n with_o my_o answer_n to_o they_o chap._n xvi_o touch_v assurance_n of_o grace_n and_o believe_v a_o man_n own_o salvation_n 1._o perfection_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o necessity_n of_o the_o church_n ministry_n 2._o 3._o how_o the_o justify_v conclude_v their_o salvation_n from_o the_o scripture_n 4._o the_o justify_v have_v the_o assurance_n of_o faith_n this_o be_v declare_v full_a assurance_n void_a of_o doubt_v teach_v by_o the_o most_o in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n 5._o touch_v perseverance_n a._n d._n now_o that_o it_o do_v not_o at_o all_o appertain_v to_o that_o kind_n of_o verity_n 57_o pag._n 57_o which_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v by_o faith_n i_o prove_v out_o of_o the_o protestant_n own_v principle_n to_o wit_n that_o 46_o that_o that_o this_o proof_n must_v be_v by_o necessary_a consequence_n without_o all_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v insinuate_v by_o white_a pag._n 46_o nothing_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v by_o faith_n but_o what_o be_v express_o set_v down_o in_o scripture_n or_o so_o contain_v that_o without_o all_o church_n authority_n it_o may_v be_v evident_o and_o by_o good_a consequence_n prove_v out_o of_o scripture_n but_o the_o promise_n of_o god_n special_a mercy_n apply_v absolute_o and_o in_o particular_a to_o luther_n caluine_n etc._n etc._n be_v neither_o express_v nor_o in_o manner_n aforesaid_a contain_v in_o scripture_n therefore_o it_o be_v not_o a_o verity_n to_o be_v believe_v by_o faith_n by_o the_o protestant_n own_v principle_n 1_o in_o this_o chapter_n where_o these_o word_n lie_v he_o discourse_v of_o the_o object_n of_o faith_n and_o inquire_v what_o the_o thing_n be_v which_o belong_v to_o it_o and_o must_v be_v believe_v to_o no_o purpose_n intrude_a himself_o upon_o a_o impertinent_a question_n touch_v the_o belief_n of_o a_o man_n own_o salvation_n and_o in_o this_o period_n he_o affirm_v that_o it_o be_v against_o the_o protestant_n own_v principle_n to_o believe_v it_o because_o by_o their_o principle_n nothing_o may_v be_v believe_v but_o what_o be_v set_v down_o in_o scripture_n either_o express_o or_o by_o good_a consequence_n which_o the_o salvation_n or_o remission_n of_o sin_n to_o luther_n caluine_n white_n or_o any_o particular_a man_n be_v not_o and_o to_o show_v this_o to_o be_v our_o principle_n he_o say_v in_o the_o margin_n that_o m._n white_a in_o such_o a_o place_n insinuat_n that_o nothing_o may_v be_v receive_v as_o a_o point_n of_o faith_n unless_o it_o can_v be_v prove_v by_o necessary_a consequence_n of_o scripture_n without_o all_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n meaning_n as_o i_o suppose_v that_o i_o require_v no_o church_n authority_n to_o assure_v a_o man_n any_o thing_n but_o intend_v such_o thing_n only_o to_o be_v believe_v as_o may_v be_v prove_v at_o least_o by_o consequence_n of_o scripture_n without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n i_o answer_v 2._o thing_n first_o that_o in_o the_o place_n allege_v i_o deny_v no_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n that_o be_v d●e_v unto_o it_o but_o only_o against_o they_o that_o charge_v the_o scripture_n with_o insufficiency_n as_o if_o they_o want_v many_o thing_n needful_a to_o be_v believe_v which_o must_v be_v supply_v by_o the_o tradition_n and_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n i_o affirm_v that_o whatsoever_o be_v needful_a to_o be_v know_v believe_v or_o do_v be_v contain_v in_o scripture_n and_o by_o the_o same_o alone_a may_v absolute_o be_v determine_v the_o meaning_n whereof_o be_v that_o what_o ministry_n and_o power_n soever_o the_o church_n have_v to_o teach_v and_o rule_v we_o in_o the_o use_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o point_n of_o faith_n which_o authority_n no_o protestant_n will_v deny_v to_o belong_v to_o the_o true_a church_n or_o to_o be_v needful_a yet_o all_o thing_n whatsoever_o belong_v to_o faith_n and_o the_o church_n by_o any_o authority_n may_v propose_v unto_o we_o be_v contain_v in_o the_o scripture_n and_o may_v be_v prove_v thereby_o alone_o the_o say_a church_n authority_n be_v only_o a_o requisite_a condition_n subordinate_a for_o the_o ready_a attain_n to_o the_o sense_n and_o use_v of_o the_o scripture_n but_o no_o rule_n or_o principle_n either_o above_o or_o with_o the_o scripture_n whereinto_o any_o man_n faith_n in_o any_o point_n be_v resolve_v so_o that_o it_o
the_o papist_n must_v show_v by_o some_o certain_a and_o pregnant_a proof_n that_o luther_n and_o we_o that_o refuse_v the_o papacy_n have_v not_o this_o light_n and_o testimony_n which_o be_v not_o do_v by_o say_v it_o be_v a_o private_a spirit_n not_o common_a to_o the_o church_n for_o all_o this_o be_v deny_v the_o spirit_n that_o give_v we_o this_o assurance_n be_v the_o spirit_n of_o god_n the_o same_o which_o be_v common_a to_o the_o true_a church_n the_o spirit_n which_o incline_v to_o humility_n order_n and_o unity_n and_o the_o person_n that_o lay_v claim_v to_o this_o spirit_n do_v neither_o presume_v nor_o rush_v into_o the_o text_n tear_n the_o reformation_n that_o luther_n begin_v be_v seek_v with_o peace_n and_o order_n and_o even_o with_o tear_n nor_o expound_v it_o as_o they_o list_v but_o what_o they_o hold_v they_o learn_v of_o the_o church_n not_o of_o the_o romish_a faction_n and_o contagion_n that_o overspread_v the_o church_n but_o of_o the_o true_a church_n of_o god_n that_o remain_v in_o the_o midst_n of_o the_o papacy_n and_o in_o former_a age_n follow_v the_o scripture_n and_o of_o this_o i_o forewarn_v all_o papist_n that_o when_o they_o please_v to_o leave_v these_o empty_a clamour_n and_o go_v roundly_o to_o the_o point_n inquire_v what_o order_n and_o humility_n luther_n use_v when_o he_o first_o deal_v against_o the_o papacy_n and_o what_o church_n he_o follow_v it_o will_v be_v justify_v against_o he_o that_o the_o pride_n and_o perverseness_n and_o disorder_n that_o be_v be_v on_o their_o own_o side_n and_o themselves_o be_v depart_v from_o the_o true_a church_n these_o private_a man_n who_o the_o reply_o mean_n with_o all_o humility_n and_o good_a order_n by_o supplication_n disputation_n mediation_n both_o to_o the_o pope_n and_o christian_a prince_n seek_v the_o redress_n of_o abuse_n their_o complaint_n be_v lay_v open_a before_o all_o the_o court_n in_o germany_n france_n spain_n england_n italy_n denmark_n and_o the_o 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be_v pope_n only_a that_o we_o may_v reform_v the_o deform_a catholic_a church_n adrian_n 6._o instr_n pro_fw-la fra._n cheregat_n pag_n 173._o fascic_fw-la rer_n exp_n &_o fug_n edit_fw-la colon._n 1535._o the_o abuse_n error_n tyranny_n and_o oppression_n prevail_a in_o this_o church_n of_o rome_n note_v &_o complain_v of_o by_o many_o in_o all_o age_n as_o they_o grow_v bernard_n agobard_fw-mi occam_n marsil_n de_fw-fr rosate_n clemangis_n aluarus_n gerson_n alliaco_fw-it aventine_n etc._n etc._n see_v this_o point_n handle_v by_o d._n field_n l._n 3._o c._n 7._o and_o in_o his_o append._n add_v to_o that_o chapter_n as_o depart_v from_o the_o doctrine_n and_o canon_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n but_o particular_o what_o order_n humility_n and_o respect_n of_o unity_n be_v in_o luther_n when_o he_o oppose_v himself_o shall_v best_o appear_v by_o ●_o by_o tom._n 7._o wittemb_n 22._o pag_n ●_o his_o own_o word_n all_o this_o time_n wherein_o the_o cause_n of_o religion_n have_v be_v 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the_o seat_n of_o antichrist_n and_o the_o nest_n of_o all_o heresy_n and_o abomination_n the_o which_o be_v so_o true_a that_o our_o adversary_n have_v purge_v and_o forbid_v the_o book_n contain_v these_o complaint_n and_o rail_v upon_o we_o when_o we_o produce_v or_o mention_v they_o as_o this_o replier_n do_v upon_o i_o throughout_o his_o book_n and_o most_o impudent_o deny_v they_o and_o use_v other_o the_o most_o dishonest_a shift_n that_o ever_o be_v which_o make_v it_o plain_a that_o they_o dare_v not_o enter_v this_o trial_n but_o with_o noise_n and_o scurrility_n outface_v all_o thing_n that_o lead_v that_o way_n i_o have_v say_v it_o often_o in_o my_o writing_n and_o here_o i_o say_v it_o again_o luth._o again_o nec_fw-la moveor_fw-la clamoribus_fw-la epicureorum_fw-la aut_fw-la hypocritarum_fw-la qui_fw-la aut_fw-la rident_fw-la aut_fw-la damnan●_n manifestam_fw-la veritatem_fw-la sed_fw-la verè_fw-la statuo_fw-la consensum_fw-la perpetuum_fw-la esse_fw-la catholicae_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la dei_fw-la have_v ipsam_fw-la doctrina_fw-la vocem_fw-la qua_fw-la s●na●_n in_fw-la ecclesiis_fw-la nostris_fw-la philip._n melancth_v praef_n in_o 2_o tom_n luth._o the_o abuse_n and_o corruption_n of_o the_o court_n and_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v see_v mislike_v and_o complain_v of_o by_o the_o best_a man_n and_o wise_a state_n that_o be_v both_o before_o and_o after_o luther_n oppose_v himself_o and_o the_o article_n of_o religion_n wherein_o the_o reform_a church_n stand_v against_o the_o jesvite_n be_v the_o manifest_a doctrine_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o ancient_a father_n and_o be_v hold_v by_o divers_a of_o the_o best_a learned_a in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n even_o in_o these_o last_o 700_o year_n the_o doctrine_n late_o determine_v by_o the_o trent_n council_n and_o now_o so_o violent_o defend_v by_o the_o jesvite_n be_v never_o general_o or_o vniformly_n receive_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n but_o broach_v and_o put_v forward_o by_o the_o faction_n of_o some_o therein_o against_o the_o rest._n 7_o and_o whereas_o the_o replier_n say_v we_o have_v no_o ground_n to_o assure_v we_o which_o may_v not_o in_o like_a manner_n and_o with_o as_o good_a colour_n be_v allege_v by_o other_o who_o ourselves_o confess_v to_o be_v deceive_v i_o answer_v that_o we_o do_v not_o only_o allege_v the_o scripture_n the_o spirit_n of_o god_n the_o church_n the_o pastor_n therein_o which_o any_o heretic_n may_v do_v but_o we_o allege_v they_o true_o 1592._o true_o varim_n quidem_fw-la &_o diversus_fw-la ex_fw-la uno_fw-la tamen_fw-la fonto_fw-la haeretic●_n prauttatis_fw-la error_n emersit_fw-la cardo_n pessimus_fw-la &_o origo_fw-la malorum_fw-la quae_fw-la ex_fw-la se_fw-la cunctarum_fw-la imp●etatum_fw-la occasionem_fw-la peperit_fw-la haec_fw-la est●_n dum_fw-la celestium_fw-la dictorum_fw-la virtus_fw-la vitio_fw-la male_a intelligentium_fw-la temerata_fw-la non_fw-la secundùm_fw-la svi_fw-la qualitatem_fw-la sensus_fw-la perpenditur_fw-la sed_fw-la in_o alius_fw-la res_fw-la pro_fw-la