Selected quad for the lemma: cause_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
cause_n	believe_v	great_a	see_v	1,615	5	3.0323	3	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A93884	The second part of the duply to M.S. alias Two brethren. Wherein are maintained the Kings, Parliaments, and all civil magistrates authority about the Church. Subordination of ecclesiasticall judicatories. Refuted the independency of particular congregations. Licentiousnesse of wicked conscience, and toleration of all sorts of most detestable schismes, heresies and religions; as, idolatry, paganisme, turcisme, Judaisme, Arrianisme, Brownisme, anabaptisme, &c. which M.S. maintain in their book. With a brief epitome and refutation of all the whole independent-government. Most humbly submitted to the Kings most excellent Majestie. To the most Honorable Houses of Parliament. The most Reverend and learned Divines of the Assembly. And all the Protestant churches in this island and abroad. By Adam Steuart. Octob. 3. 1644. Imprimatur Ja: Cranford.; Duply to M.S. alias Two brethren. Part 2.	Steuart, Adam.	1644 (1644)	Wing S5491; Thomason E20_7; ESTC R2880	197,557	205

heretical_a and_o go_v to_o the_o devil_n but_o i_o answer_v 1._o the_o assumption_n be_v false_a for_o the_o externall_n coactive_a power_n that_o a._n s._n grant_v unto_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n be_v only_o to_o repress_v heretic_n and_o schismatic_n after_o that_o they_o be_v sufficient_o convict_v by_o the_o church_n in_o a_o ordinary_a way_n or_o by_o other_o in_o a_o extraordinary_a way_n when_o the_o church_n be_v negligent_a in_o her_o duty_n 2._o neither_o do_v m._n s._n his_o confirmation_n or_o case_n of_o conscience_n conclude_v any_o thing_n against_o that_o which_o a._n s._n say_v and_o as_o for_o his_o supposition_n either_o that_o conscience_n whereof_o he_o speak_v be_v right_a or_o erroneous_a if_o it_o be_v right_a the_o civil_a magistrate_n shall_v not_o press_v it_o against_o its_o light_n or_o if_o he_o happen_v to_o do_v so_o it_o be_v not_o by_o power_n but_o by_o abuse_n of_o power_n and_o in_o such_o a_o case_n he_o who_o have_v his_o conscience_n well_o inform_v must_v resolve_v himself_o to_o be_v quiet_a in_o case_n the_o civil_a magistrate_n oblige_v he_o not_o to_o be_v actor_n in_o any_o thing_n against_o it_o but_o if_o such_o a_o man_n any_o other_o or_o other_o with_o he_o will_v rise_v up_o within_o the_o kingdom_n or_o come_v from_o foreign_a country_n and_o urge_v their_o religion_n upon_o the_o state_n and_o establish_v it_o without_o permission_n of_o the_o magistrate_n or_o against_o his_o law_n than_o their_o conscience_n can_v be_v right_o for_o wherefore_o shall_v the_o king_n parliament_z and_o state_n be_v rather_o bind_v to_o admit_v such_o man_n religion_n without_o sufficient_a conviction_n than_o they_o to_o admit_v his_o religion_n and_o in_o such_o a_o case_n the_o civil_a magistrate_n so_o long_o as_o such_o person_n as_o urge_v their_o religion_n upon_o he_o convict_v not_o sufficient_o his_o conscience_n may_v with_o a_o good_a conscience_n punish_v they_o severe_o yea_o with_o good_a conscience_n cut_v off_o their_o head_n if_o such_o a_o man_n conscience_n be_v erroneous_a the_o civil_a magistrate_n do_v he_o no_o wrong_n to_o endeavour_v that_o he_o who_o have_v it_o be_v sufficient_o convict_v and_o if_o after_o sufficient_a conviction_n he_o will_v not_o be_v quiet_a especial_o when_o he_o be_v not_o oblige_v to_o be_v actor_n in_o any_o thing_n against_o his_o pretend_a conscience_n but_o will_v still_o trouble_v both_o church_n and_o state_n wherefore_o on_o god_n name_n shall_v he_o not_o be_v punish_v 2._o be_v it_o not_o better_o that_o such_o a_o man_n shall_v perish_v then_o that_o he_o shall_v make_v thousand_o to_o perish_v 3._o ravalliack_n in_o france_n and_o the_o monk_n and_o friar_n that_o kill_v king_n pretend_v evermore_o conscience_n as_o the_o independent_o do_v and_o yet_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n put_v they_o to_o death_n 4._o if_o any_o man_n conscience_n which_o god_n forbid_v shall_v dictate_v he_o to_o kill_v the_o king_n and_o blow_v up_o the_o parliament_n shall_v such_o a_o man_n be_v tolerate_v under_o pretext_n of_o his_o tender_a conscience_n 5._o be_v it_o not_o a_o sin_n to_o have_v a_o erroneous_a conscience_n and_o be_v not_o he_o that_o have_v it_o bind_v to_o reform_v it_o and_o to_o suffer_v for_o it_o in_o case_n he_o reform_v it_o not_o when_o he_o have_v sufficient_a mean_n to_o do_v it_o 6._o but_o must_v every_o man_n that_o do_v ill_a be_v present_o believe_v when_o he_o say_v that_o he_o have_v such_o a_o conscience_n 7._o all_o this_o long_a sermon_n of_o m._n s._n prove_v not_o that_o the_o magistrate_n direct_o and_o per_fw-la se_fw-la but_o rather_o that_o the_o man_n himself_o harden_v his_o own_o conscience_n for_o there_o be_v no_o create_a power_n that_o direct_o per_fw-la se_fw-la and_o physical_o can_v work_v upon_o a_o man_n conscience_n it_o can_v only_o move_v it_o moral_o in_o propound_v of_o object_n to_o it_o or_o in_o reason_v and_o yet_o every_o true_a christian_a have_v a_o sufficient_a power_n to_o resist_v such_o motion_n which_o be_v sufficient_a to_o make_v he_o in-excusable_a 8._o neither_o can_v his_o erroneous_a conscience_n excuse_v he_o unless_o that_o its_o error_n be_v invincible_a antecedent_n and_o he_o no_o way_n the_o cause_n of_o it_o but_o if_o it_o be_v vincible_a concomitant_a or_o subsequent_a and_o he_o himself_o the_o cause_n of_o it_o than_o it_o excuse_v he_o not_o but_o be_v a_o sin_n and_o aggravate_v the_o sin_n that_o proceed_v of_o it_o at_o least_o extensiuè_a if_o not_o intensiuè_v for_o in_o such_o a_o case_n it_o be_v not_o his_o erroneous_a conscience_n that_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o the_o sinful_a action_n of_o his_o will_n but_o his_o sinful_a will_n that_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o his_o erroneous_a conscience_n 9_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n threaten_v per_fw-la se_fw-la and_o direct_o make_v not_o his_o conscience_n erroneous_a but_o find_v it_o such_o 10._o neither_o be_v it_o the_o cause_n that_o he_o go_v against_o it_o for_o whether_o you_o consider_v the_o civil_a magistrate_n intention_n his_o judgement_n or_o the_o execution_n of_o it_o in_o such_o a_o case_n they_o cause_v no_o ill_a but_o good_a for_o his_o intention_n be_v only_o that_o they_o be_v gain_v to_o christ_n and_o that_o they_o seduce_v not_o other_o his_o judgement_n condemn_v only_o their_o opinion_n and_o command_v a_o punishment_n answerable_a to_o their_o sin_n whereby_o only_o they_o be_v hinder_v to_o continue_v in_o their_o heresy_n or_o schism_n or_o to_o seduce_v other_o no_o more_o do_v the_o execution_n of_o his_o judgement_n ergo._n 11._o and_o i_o pray_v this_o new_a casuist_n to_o tell_v i_o whether_o in_o some_o case_n it_o be_v not_o a_o lesser_a sin_n for_o a_o man_n to_o go_v against_o his_o erroneous_a conscience_n then_o to_o follow_v its_o dictate_v whether_o it_o be_v not_o better_o for_o he_o to_o sit_v at_o home_n against_o the_o dictate_v of_o his_o conscience_n then_o to_o go_v to_o a_o pagan_a church_n and_o there_o to_o adore_v a_o crocodile_n or_o a_o toad_n according_a to_o the_o dictate_v of_o it_o so_o we_o see_v how_o licentious_a and_o detestable_a this_o conscience_n be_v that_o independent_o plead_v so_o much_o for_o that_o think_v that_o it_o can_v sufficient_o enjoy_v its_o liberty_n unless_o that_o all_o schismatic_n heretic_n jew_n mahometans_n and_o idolater_n have_v a_o free_a liberty_n of_o their_o erroneous_a conscience_n to_o adore_v a_o thousand_o god_n yea_o a_o thousand_o devil_n a_o jupiter_n a_o bacchus_n a_o venus_n a_o blind_a fortuna_fw-la and_o to_o preach_v such_o abomination_n and_o that_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n power_n be_v ever_o curtale_v or_o rather_o altogether_o take_v away_o in_o matter_n in_o religion_n i_o will_v not_o call_v this_o a_o madness_n but_o i_o be_o well_o assure_v that_o many_o be_v recommend_v to_o the_o church_n prayer_n that_o be_v not_o half_a so_o sick_a either_o in_o soul_n or_o body_n as_o these_o man_n be_v in_o their_o conscience_n wherefore_o all_o that_o i_o have_v more_o to_o say_v unto_o they_o shall_v be_v only_o this_o the_o lord_n have_v mercy_n upon_o they_o christian_n reader_n have_v be_v desire_v by_o some_o friend_n to_o give_v a_o short_a discourse_n of_o the_o independent_a government_n i_o be_o resolve_v to_o present_v thou_o with_o this_o follow_a epitome_n which_o sundry_a have_v oftentimes_o require_v of_o i_o the_o independent_a church_n be_v so_o call_v because_o that_o no_o particular_a congregation_n among_o they_o how_o small_a how_o heretical_a and_o vicious_a soever_o it_o be_v will_v depend_v upon_o or_o submit_v to_o the_o judgement_n of_o any_o other_o church_n yea_o not_o to_o that_o of_o all_o the_o church_n of_o the_o world_n how_o orthodox_n and_o holy_a and_o how_o true_a and_o just_a soever_o their_o judgement_n be_v they_o define_v it_o coetus_fw-la fidelium_fw-la a_o company_n of_o believer_n meet_v in_o one_o place_n every_o lord_n day_n for_o the_o administration_n of_o the_o holy_a ordinance_n of_o god_n to_o public_a edification_n so_o according_a to_o this_o definition_n neither_o the_o catholic_a church_n which_o we_o believe_v in_o the_o creed_n nor_o any_o nationall_n church_n can_v be_v a_o true_a church_n since_o they_o can_v meet_v together_o every_o lord_n day_n in_o one_o place_n in_o the_o efficient_a cause_n of_o the_o church_n i_o see_v no_o great_a difference_n betwixt_o we_o and_o they_o save_v only_o this_o that_o they_o hold_v it_o necessary_a to_o the_o constitution_n of_o a_o church_n and_o of_o every_o member_n thereof_o that_o they_o all_o join_v in_o a_o particular_a church-covenant_n as_o they_o call_v it_o different_a from_o that_o of_o grace_n reveal_v in_o scripture_n wherein_o they_o all_o swear_v to_o live_v in_o the_o faith_n and_o in_o subjection_n to_o all_o the_o ordinance_n of_o god_n cleave_v one_o to_o another_o as_o member_n

a.s._n answ_n the_o parliament_n have_v power_n and_o a_o call_n to_o judge_n politicè_fw-la about_o the_o church_n and_o church_n matter_n what_o decision_n and_o constitution_n of_o the_o church_n assembly_n they_o will_v approve_v or_o disapprove_v what_o religion_n doctrine_n and_o discipline_n they_o will_v admit_v or_o tolerate_v in_o the_o state_n but_o they_o have_v no_o call_n or_o directive_n authoritative_a power_n in_o the_o church_n to_o judge_v this_o or_o that_o to_o be_v the_o true_a doctrine_n or_o discipline_n this_o belong_v to_o church-officer_n yet_o they_o have_v a_o private_a judgement_n of_o discretion_n about_o such_o matter_n as_o other_o christian_n and_o a_o public_a political_a authoritative_a judgement_n and_o a_o coactive_a political_a power_n to_o compel_v the_o subject_n to_o admit_v in_o the_o state_n such_o or_o such_o a_o true_a doctrine_n or_o discipline_n of_o the_o church_n howbeit_o not_o to_o believe_v it_o or_o to_o love_n or_o approve_v it_o in_o their_o judgement_n or_o will_n m._n s._n ob._n 14._o ask_v whether_o it_o be_v reasonable_a that_o the_o apologist_n matter_n yet_o remain_v undecided_a and_o unjudge_v between_o they_o and_o their_o brethren_n shall_v suffer_v as_o man_n convict_v only_o because_o their_o adversary_n and_o accuser_n the_o brethren_n you_o know_v of_o be_v more_o in_o number_n than_o they_o and_o will_v needs_o continue_v adversary_n to_o they_o a.s._n answ_n 1._o though_o you_o vaunt_v evermore_o of_o your_o suffering_n we_o have_v never_o see_v they_o 2._o these_o who_o you_o unjust_o call_v your_o adversary_n have_v suffer_v much_o more_o than_o you_o and_o yet_o publish_v it_o not_o unto_o the_o world_n 3._o it_o be_v absolute_o false_a that_o you_o suffer_v 4._o and_o yet_o much_o false_a that_o you_o suffer_v as_o man_n convict_v 5._o and_o yet_o false_a that_o you_o suffer_v because_o your_o adversary_n be_v more_o in_o number_n and_o 6._o false_a of_o all_o that_o only_o you_o suffer_v for_o that_o 7._o man_n that_o suffer_v be_v not_o honour_v as_o you_o be_v neither_o receive_v they_o so_o great_a favour_n present_n and_o benefice_n as_o you_o do_v 8._o it_o be_v a_o great_a sufferance_n to_o the_o church_n of_o god_n to_o be_v calumniate_v and_o upbraid_v by_o so_o contemptible_a a_o number_n of_o minister_n and_o to_o see_v so_o many_o libel_n print_v against_o she_o by_o those_o of_o your_o sect._n 9_o it_o be_v false_a that_o you_o be_v not_o condemn_v for_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o all_o other_o protestant_a church_n in_o approve_v the_o presbyterian_a government_n as_o we_o say_v heretofore_o can_v not_o but_o disprove_v and_o condemn_v you_o all_o who_o condemn_v it_o 10._o neither_o do_v all_o this_o prove_v a_o directive_n ecclesiastical_a power_n belong_v to_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n 11._o you_o have_v no_o adversary_n here_o but_o your_o false_a opinion_n 12._o neither_o be_v your_o brethren_n adversary_n to_o you_o but_o to_o your_o erronion_n opinion_n which_o be_v a_o thousand_o time_n more_o your_o adversary_n than_o they_o 13._o and_o both_o you_o and_o any_o of_o we_o must_v legal_o suffer_v according_a to_o our_o demerit_n when_o we_o be_v sufficient_o convict_v and_o condemn_v by_o plurality_n of_o vote_n in_o foro_fw-la externo_fw-la as_o you_o be_v already_o in_o very_a many_o thing_n for_o this_o be_v the_o way_n of_o all_o civil_a and_o ecclesiastical_a judicatories_n neither_o can_v independent_o change_v it_o 15._o ibid._n m.s._n reason_v thus_o if_o our_o saviour_n testimony_n concern_v himself_o in_o his_o own_o cause_n be_v not_o valid_a how_o much_o less_o the_o testimony_n of_o any_o other_o yea_o of_o a_o thousand_o in_o any_o matter_n that_o concern_v themselves_o and_o consequent_o that_o of_o our_o brethren_n in_o the_o synod_n but_o the_o first_o be_v true_a joh._n 5.31_o if_o i_o bear_v witness_n of_o myself_o my_o witness_n be_v not_o true_a i._n e._n it_o be_v not_o in_o a_o formal_a and_o legal_a interpretation_n true_a but_o you_o may_v reasonable_o wave_v it_o a.s._n ans_fw-fr 1._o either_o christ_n here_o speak_v of_o his_o own_o testimony_n speak_v of_o himself_o according_a to_o his_o divine_a to_o his_o humane_a or_o according_a to_o both_o his_o nature_n item_n 2._o either_o he_o speak_v of_o its_o validity_n in_o itself_o or_o in_o respect_n of_o the_o jew_n to_o who_o he_o do_v speak_v and_o who_o shall_v have_v admit_v of_o it_o item_n 3._o either_o of_o his_o public_a and_o judicial_a or_o of_o his_o private_a testimony_n 1._o if_o in_o the_o first_o proposition_n we_o take_v our_o saviour_n according_a to_o his_o divine_a nature_n or_o according_a to_o both_o viz._n as_o mediator_n the_o assumption_n be_v false_a for_o there_o christ_n speak_v not_o of_o himself_o according_a to_o his_o divine_a nature_n or_o to_o both_o or_o as_o mediator_n for_o under_o that_o notion_n he_o be_v judge_n of_o quick_a and_o dead_a and_o christ_n say_v joh._n 8.14_o that_o if_o he_o testify_v of_o himself_o his_o testimony_n be_v true_a 2._o or_o if_o he_o speak_v of_o himself_o under_o this_o notion_n than_o he_o speak_v not_o of_o his_o testimony_n as_o it_o be_v in_o itself_o but_o as_o it_o be_v in_o respect_n of_o they_o who_o receive_v it_o not_o viz_o the_o jew_n and_o unbeliever_n who_o receive_v it_o not_o as_o the_o testimony_n of_o god_n or_o of_o the_o mediator_n however_o it_o be_v such_o for_o they_o know_v he_o not_o joh._n 8.15.19_o but_o they_o judge_v according_a to_o the_o flesh_n neither_o know_v they_o he_o nor_o his_o father_n and_o if_o they_o have_v know_v the_o king_n of_o glory_n they_o have_v never_o crucify_v he_o and_o then_o the_o proposition_n be_v false_a for_o it_o follow_v not_o that_o if_o christ_n testimony_n who_o be_v god_n be_v not_o acknowledge_v as_o valid_a by_o those_o who_o know_v it_o not_o ergo_fw-la the_o testimony_n of_o a_o presbytery_n or_o synod_n shall_v not_o be_v acknowledge_v by_o such_o as_o be_v subject_a thereunto_o and_o know_v it_o for_o by_o the_o same_o reason_n two_o or_o three_o idle_a fellow_n shall_v not_o believe_v the_o testimony_n of_o your_o presbytery_n or_o assembly_n 3._o i_o retort_v then_o the_o argument_n if_o christ_n testimony_n be_v not_o legal_o valid_a in_o his_o own_o cause_n ergo_fw-la you_o in_o your_o presbytery_n and_o assembly_n be_v not_o legal_o true_a or_o valid_a in_o your_o own_o cause_n when_o you_o judge_v in_o matter_n of_o faith_n and_o and_o discipline_n but_o the_o first_o be_v true_a ergo_fw-la the_o second_o also_o 4._o if_o christ_n be_v here_o take_v according_a to_o his_o humane_a nature_n then_o either_o he_o be_v take_v according_a to_o his_o humane_a nature_n as_o it_o be_v in_o itself_o without_o sin_n or_o as_o it_o be_v in_o the_o pharise_n estimation_n if_o in_o the_o first_o way_n the_o assumption_n be_v false_a for_o there_o the_o pharise_n take_v christ_n for_o a_o sinful_a man_n and_o who_o can_v deny_v but_o that_o the_o testimony_n of_o a_o man_n in_o the_o state_n of_o integrity_n be_v valid_a 5._o if_o it_o be_v take_v in_o the_o second_o way_n i_o deny_v the_o first_o proposition_n for_o the_o testimony_n of_o judge_n in_o judge_v according_a to_o law_n in_o thing_n that_o concern_v not_o so_o much_o their_o person_n as_o the_o society_n that_o they_o represent_v in_o judgement_n as_o the_o assembly_n and_o all_o ecclesiastical_a judge_n do_v be_v to_o be_v prefer_v before_o the_o testimony_n of_o any_o particular_a man_n 6._o and_o if_o this_o maxim_n of_o the_o independent_o hold_v the_o judgement_n of_o no_o civil_a magistrate_n yea_o not_o of_o the_o parliament_n itself_o sh●ll_v hold_v if_o any_o of_o they_o or_o any_o delinquent_n take_v the_o parliament_n to_o party_n in_o any_o business_n the_o parliament_n will_v do_v well_o to_o take_v notice_n of_o such_o independent_a maxim_n 7._o but_o this_o be_v the_o arminian_o way_n at_o the_o synod_n of_o dort_n to_o the_o end_n they_o may_v decline_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o synod_n and_o he_o be_v a_o arminian_n who_o propound_v this_o argument_n who_o of_o late_o be_v become_v a_o independent_a i_o ●eare_z they_o mean_v to_o unite_v the_o two_o sect_n in_o one_o 8._o christ_n be_v not_o here_o speak_v of_o himself_o how_o far_o forth_o his_o testimony_n and_o judgement_n may_v hold_v in_o a_o judicial_a way_n whereof_o we_o speak_v here_o but_o in_o a_o private_a way_n for_o this_o action_n be_v not_o judicial_a but_o a_o particular_a discourse_n 9_o neither_o be_v the_o business_n now_o in_o hand_n at_o the_o synod_n of_o particular_a but_o of_o public_a concernment_n viz._n the_o church_n wherein_o the_o church_n that_o be_v judge_n can_v be_v take_v to_o party_n however_o you_o call_v she_o a_o crowd_n wherein_o many_o particular_a person_n be_v concern_v m._n s._n ob._n 16._o p._n 37._o

there_o be_v no_o other_o way_n in_o the_o old_a or_o in_o the_o new_a testament_n there_o be_v no_o other_o in_o civil_a judicatories_n there_o can_v be_v no_o other_o find_v in_o this_o world_n and_o to_o end_v this_o argument_n i_o ask_v you_o what_o if_o a_o man_n be_v oppress_v in_o one_o of_o your_o church_n as_o it_o be_v possible_a a_o man_n may_v be_v as_o well_o as_o in_o one_o of_o we_o unless_o you_o have_v the_o power_n of_o piety_n in_o a_o more_o independent_a degree_n yea_o beyond_o all_o flesh_n and_o blood_n in_o any_o juncture_n of_o time_n to_o come_v and_o afterward_o he_o complain_v to_o neighbour_n church_n and_o they_o oppress_v he_o by_o their_o judgement_n what_o other_o remedy_n can_v he_o have_v but_o patience_n and_o to_o appeal_v to_o the_o judge_n of_o quick_a and_o dead_a or_o else_o acquiesce_v to_o the_o sentence_n or_o at_o least_o suffer_v it_o for_o a_o man_n can_v sin_v in_o mere_a sufferance_n for_o actual_a sin_n material_o be_v ever_o more_o a_o action_n of_o the_o will_n or_o a_o voluntary_a omission_n of_o some_o action_n m._n s._n ob._n 30._o p._n 46._o sect_n 2._o what_o power_n be_v intrinsical_v to_o religion_n it_o be_v intrinsical_v to_o the_o church_n but_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n power_n be_v intrinsical_v to_o religion_n for_o a._n s._n say_v that_o the_o parliament_n pretend_v no_o directive_n power_n in_o matter_n of_o religion_n but_o a_o executive_a power_n only_o viz._n in_o matter_n of_o religion_n ergo_fw-la the_o civil_a magistrate_n power_n be_v intrinsical_v to_o the_o church_n a._n s._n answ_n what_o ever_o may_v be_v say_v of_o the_o proposition_n i_o deny_v the_o assumption_n and_o to_o the_o confirmation_n thereof_o i_o answer_v 1._o that_o when_o i_o say_v the_o civil_a magistrate_n have_v power_n in_o religion_n the_o word_n in_o signify_v about_o for_o religion_n signify_v the_o object_n of_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n and_o so_o we_o speak_v ordinary_o as_o when_o we_o say_v a_o rich_a man_n heart_n be_v in_o his_o money_n and_o riches_n so_o in_o here_o signify_v not_o a_o intrinsical_n but_o a_o extrinsecall_a denomination_n as_o when_o i_o say_v the_o sun_n be_v see_v the_o attribute_n in_o this_o affirmative_a proposition_n be_v say_v to_o be_v in_o the_o subject_a not_o by_o any_o intrinsical_a inherence_n or_o denomination_n but_o by_o a_o extrinsecall_a adherence_n attribution_n or_o denomination_n this_o little_a childish_a sophistication_n be_v more_o worthy_a of_o some_o young_a smatterer_n in_o logic_n then_o of_o a_o divine_a or_o any_o conscientious_a man_n it_o be_v not_o possible_a that_o m._n s._n can_v be_v ignorant_a of_o this_o and_o therefore_o in_o this_o dispute_n if_o he_o have_v any_o power_n of_o piety_n i_o desire_v more_o conscience_n and_o sincerity_n in_o he_o i_o may_v also_o say_v that_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n have_v a_o extrinsecall_a power_n in_o the_o church_n if_o the_o word_n in_o there_o signify_v a_o bare_a attribution_n or_o extrinsecall_v denomination_n as_o it_o be_v ordinary_a among_o divine_n philosopher_n and_o common_a people_n and_o yet_o i_o confess_v it_o be_v more_o proper_o say_v about_o religion_n and_o about_o the_o church_n as_o apollonius_n observe_v and_o as_o i_o have_v express_v myself_o but_o then_o there_o shall_v have_v be_v a_o concurrence_n of_o in_o his_o which_o will_v have_v make_v my_o expression_n obscure_a for_o than_o i_o must_v have_v say_v the_o civil_a magistrate_n about_o matter_n of_o religion_n have_v a_o extrinsecall_a power_n as_o also_o about_o the_o church_n as_o this_o professor_n of_o eloquence_n will_v have_v i_o to_o speak_v which_o kind_n of_o expression_n i_o believe_v few_o or_o none_o can_v have_v understand_v if_o the_o independent_a cause_n depend_v upon_o such_o ridiculous_a puntillio_n and_o be_v so_o independent_a upon_o good_a reason_n i_o know_v not_o of_o the_o two_o which_o be_v better_o dependency_n or_o independency_n m._n s._n ob._n 31._o p._n 46._o sect_n 11._o the_o power_n of_o citation_n be_v extrinsecall_v to_o the_o church_n the_o power_n of_o citation_n be_v ecclesiastical_a ergo_fw-la some_o ecclesiastical_a power_n be_v extrinsecall_v to_o the_o church_n a._n s._n i_o distinguish_v the_o word_n power_n of_o citation_n for_o it_o be_v either_o ecclesiastical_a which_o be_v proper_a unto_o the_o church_n viz._n in_o church_n officer_n gather_v together_o in_o a_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n and_o this_o be_v both_o in_o and_o about_o the_o church_n or_o civil_a which_o be_v proper_a to_o the_o christian_a and_o in_o some_o way_n to_o a_o non-christian_a magistrate_n where_o by_o his_o civil_a power_n he_o maintain_v the_o church_n and_o this_o be_v out_o of_o the_o church_n in_o the_o magistrate_n and_o yet_o about_o the_o church_n which_o be_v its_o object_n and_o so_o i_o answer_v to_o this_o silly_a argument_n that_o it_o be_v captious_a and_o ground_v on_o a_o equivocation_n for_o it_o take_v the_o power_n of_o citation_n in_o one_o signification_n in_o the_o major_n viz._n for_o a_o political_a power_n of_o citation_n and_o in_o a_o other_o in_o the_o minor_a viz._n for_o a_o ecclesiastical_a power_n of_o citation_n 2._o or_o if_o it_o be_v take_v in_o both_o for_o a_o ecclesiastical_a power_n than_o the_o major_n be_v false_a for_o christ_n give_v it_o to_o the_o church_n to_o which_o it_o be_v intrinsical_v and_o not_o to_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n 3._o or_o if_o it_o be_v take_v in_o both_o for_o a_o civil_a power_n than_o the_o minor_a be_v false_a for_o the_o civil_a power_n of_o citation_n be_v not_o in_o the_o church_n but_o in_o the_o magistrate_n neither_o ever_o give_v christ_n it_n as_o mediator_n either_o to_o the_o church_n or_o to_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n but_o god_n by_o christ_n as_o god_n give_v it_o only_o to_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n and_o the_o piece_n whereof_o the_o press_n as_o m._n s._n say_v have_v be_v late_o deliver_v say_v no_o other_o thing_n than_o i_o say_v if_o m._n s._n his_o diana_n of_o ephesus_n can_v permit_v he_o to_o understand_v it_o or_o he_o do_v not_o willing_o dissemble_v his_o understanding_n of_o it_o m._n s._n if_o a_o classis_fw-la shall_v cite_v or_o excommunicate_v a_o member_n of_o a_o church_n against_o the_o judgement_n and_o consent_n of_o the_o elder_n of_o that_o church_n let_v all_o the_o world_n judge_n whether_o that_o be_v not_o a_o act_n of_o externall_n power_n without_o the_o church_n a._n s._n this_o argument_n be_v ridiculous_a 1._o for_o it_o prove_v not_o that_o which_o be_v in_o question_n viz._n that_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n have_v a_o ecclesiastical_a or_o intrinsical_a power_n in_o the_o church_n 2._o only_o it_o prove_v that_o the_o church_n have_v a_o authority_n that_o in_o some_o respect_n may_v be_v call_v extrinsecall_n 3._o but_o to_o take_v away_o this_o equivocation_n and_o many_o other_o and_o to_o explain_v more_o full_o this_o question_n note_v again_o 1._o that_o the_o church_n may_v be_v consider_v either_o according_a to_o its_o real_a and_o natural_a or_o according_a to_o its_o moral_a be_v 2._o that_o the_o church_n according_a to_o its_o moral_a be_v i_o speak_v of_o the_o representative_a be_v either_o particular_a of_o one_o parish_n or_o congregation_n or_o more_o general_n as_o a_o classical_a or_o synodall_n assembly_n 3._o note_v that_o the_o particular_a church_n may_v be_v consider_v either_o absolute_o and_o in_o itself_o alone_o without_o any_o reference_n to_o a_o class_n or_o a_o synod_n whereof_o it_o be_v a_o part_n or_o relative_o with_o a_o reference_n to_o the_o more_o general_n church_n viz._n a_o classis_fw-la or_o synod_n whereof_o it_o be_v a_o part_n or_o in_o quality_n and_o under_o the_o notion_n of_o a_o part_n in_o so_o far_o forth_o as_o by_o some_o formal_a or_o virtual_a assent_n it_o have_v once_o covenant_v to_o be_v a_o part_n of_o such_o a_o classis_fw-la or_o synod_n and_o stipulate_v to_o send_v its_o commissioner_n to_o such_o classical_a or_o synodall_n meeting_n 1._o if_o then_o we_o consider_v citation_n or_o excommunication_n with_o reference_n to_o the_o church_n either_o more_o general_n or_o particular_a according_a to_o its_o natural_a be_v it_o may_v be_v extrinsecall_v to_o they_o both_o for_o the_o act_n of_o citation_n or_o excommunication_n be_v not_o real_o produce_v or_o pronounce_v according_a to_o its_o natural_a be_v by_o the_o church_n consider_v under_o the_o notion_n of_o its_o real_a be_v but_o by_o one_o man_n as_o all_o wise_a man_n will_v grant_v 2._o if_o they_o be_v take_v moral_o according_a to_o their_o moral_a be_v ground_v on_o some_o covenant_n than_o the_o act_n of_o excommunication_n and_o citation_n be_v not_o extrinsecall_v to_o the_o more_o general_n church_n since_o they_o be_v exercise_v by_o her_o power_n and_o consent_n 3._o if_o they_o be_v consider_v with_o

church_n be_v schismatical_a for_o some_o diversity_n of_o opinion_n for_o that_o belong_v rather_o to_o heresy_n then_o to_o schism_n nor_o 2._o that_o it_o be_v a_o schism_n because_o that_o it_o be_v tolerate_v or_o not_o tolerate_v for_o toleration_n be_v a_o consequent_a of_o schism_n and_o extrinsecall_v to_o it_o the_o true_a reason_n wherefore_o it_o be_v a_o schism_n and_o they_o schismatical_a be_v because_o it_o be_v a_o breach_n of_o charity_n in_o that_o they_o separate_v themselves_o from_o the_o communion_n of_o the_o true_a church_n yea_o and_o from_o all_o the_o true_a church_n in_o the_o world_n both_o in_o sacramental_a communion_n and_o that_o of_o discipline_n neither_o be_v it_o a_o schism_n because_o that_o it_o be_v a_o separation_n from_o presbyterial_a church_n precise_o under_o the_o notion_n of_o presbyterial_a but_o of_o true_a and_o orthodox_n church_n which_o press_v they_o no_o way_n to_o be_v actor_n in_o any_o thing_n against_o their_o conscience_n but_o m._n s._n in_o despite_n of_o all_o reason_n will_v prove_v that_o i_o can_v convict_v the_o independent_o of_o schism_n and_o that_o by_o this_o his_o most_o seriall_a argument_n which_o here_o i_o put_v in_o form_n with_o all_o the_o force_n it_o can_v have_v he_o that_o know_v not_o what_o be_v schism_n can_v convict_v the_o independent_o of_o schism_n but_o a._n s._n know_v not_o what_o be_v schism_n ergo_fw-la a._n s._n can_v convict_v the_o independent_o of_o schism_n the_o major_n be_v certain_a the_o minor_a he_o prove_v thus_o he_o that_o know_v not_o what_o be_v the_o church_n know_v not_o what_o be_v schism_n or_o a_o rent_n of_o the_o church_n for_o rectum_fw-la est_fw-la index_n svi_fw-la et_fw-la obliqui_fw-la and_o entia_fw-la privativa_fw-la cognoscuntur_fw-la ex_fw-la suis_fw-la positivis_fw-la etc._n etc._n but_o a._n s._n know_v not_o what_o be_v the_o church_n for_o he_o say_v we_o know_v not_o wherein_o consist_v its_o essence_n p._n 21._o ergo_fw-la a._n s._n i_o answer_v to_o the_o first_o argument_n that_o the_o minor_a be_v false_a as_o appeareth_z by_o the_o definition_n that_o i_o have_v give_v of_o it_o both_o in_o my_o annotation_n upon_o the_o apologetical_a narration_n in_o my_o answer_n unto_o a_o libel_n of_o c._n c._n and_o he_o retofore_o somewhere_o in_o this_o book_n against_o the_o which_o m._n s._n have_v nothing_o to_o reply_v to_o the_o confirmation_n of_o the_o minor_a i_o answer_v that_o if_o by_o the_o word_n know_v m._n s._n mean_v a_o distinct_a knowledge_n of_o the_o essential_a part_n of_o the_o church_n the_o major_n be_v false_a for_o schism_n be_v not_o a_o rent_v of_o the_o essential_a part_n of_o the_o church_n or_o of_o its_o transcendentall_a or_o metaphysical_a unity_n but_o of_o its_o integrant_fw-la part_n and_o integrant_fw-la unity_n for_o the_o first_o can_v be_v destroy_v so_o long_o as_o it_o be_v a_o true_a church_n and_o schismatical_a church_n may_v have_v their_o transcendent_a unity_n verity_n and_o goodness_n howsoever_o they_o lose_v their_o integrant_fw-la unity_n verity_n and_o goodness_n if_o by_o the_o word_n know_v he_o mean_v any_o knowledge_n of_o the_o church_n either_o confuse_a or_o distinct_a whereby_o we_o may_v know_v the_o church_n by_o her_o external_a cause_n her_o integrant_fw-la part_n her_o accident_n etc._n etc._n the_o minor_a be_v false_a for_o not_o only_a a._n s._n but_o little_a child_n at_o school_n have_v such_o a_o knowledge_n of_o the_o church_n which_o they_o learn_v in_o their_o catechism_n and_o by_o any_o such_o confuse_v or_o distinct_a knowledge_n of_o the_o church_n by_o her_o cause_n accident_n or_o effect_n etc._n etc._n we_o may_v confuse_o or_o distinct_o know_v what_o be_v schism_n howbeit_o not_o essential_o as_o for_o the_o confirmation_n of_o the_o minor_a by_o my_o word_n i_o say_v not_o there_o that_o i_o know_v not_o what_o the_o church_n be_v confuse_o or_o distinct_o by_o her_o cause_n integrant_fw-la part_n her_o accident_n etc._n etc._n but_o that_o we_o know_v not_o distinct_o the_o essence_n of_o thing_n as_o distinguish_v from_o their_o accident_n as_o the_o reader_n may_v see_v if_o he_o look_v in_o my_o book_n for_o there_o in_o that_o page_n 21._o i_o speak_v in_o formal_a term_n of_o that_o which_o be_v essential_a to_o the_o church_n now_o if_o m._n s._n pretend_v to_o any_o such_o profound_a knowledge_n of_o thing_n we_o must_v confess_v he_o to_o be_v a_o other_o epistemon_n doctor_n du_fw-fr molin_n professor_n in_o divinity_n at_o sedan_n hold_v the_o same_o tenet_n in_o his_o thesis_n de_fw-fr summo_fw-la bono_n so_o do_v the_o other_o professor_n of_o divinity_n there_o for_o they_o say_v that_o no_o creature_n neither_o in_o this_o life_n nor_o in_o the_o life_n to_o come_v yea_o not_o the_o very_a angel_n know_v the_o essence_n of_o any_o thing_n and_o from_o thence_o they_o conclude_v that_o we_o shall_v not_o see_v the_o essence_n of_o god_n in_o the_o life_n to_o come_v the_o which_o assertion_n howsoever_o i_o confess_v it_o to_o be_v true_a de_fw-la hominibus_fw-la viatoribus_fw-la yet_o can_v i_o not_o believe_v it_o to_o be_v true_a de_fw-fr angelis_n viatoribus_fw-la and_o much_o less_o de_fw-fr angelis_n aut_fw-la hominibus_fw-la comprehensoribus_fw-la m._n s._n shall_v have_v do_v better_a to_o have_v answer_v my_o reason_n that_o i_o bring_v there_o pag._n 21._o then_o so_o against_o the_o light_n of_o his_o conscience_n to_o scratch_v at_o a_o know_a truth_n neither_o can_v i_o believe_v he_o to_o be_v so_o ignorant_a as_o not_o to_o know_v and_o acknowledge_v the_o truth_n of_o it_o in_o himself_o however_o out_o of_o desire_n of_o contestation_n he_o manifest_v the_o contrary_a but_o m._n s._n to_o the_o end_n he_o seem_v not_o altogether_o impertinent_a prove_v it_o by_o a_o argument_n take_v ab_fw-la exemplo_fw-la or_o by_o a_o imperfect_a induction_n if_o it_o be_v not_o a_o pari_fw-la or_o from_o they_o altogether_o i_o can_v believe_v say_v he_o that_o he_o shall_v perfect_o know_v the_o nature_n of_o darkness_n that_o be_v ignorant_a of_o what_o belong_v to_o the_o nature_n of_o light_n nor_o that_o he_o shall_v know_v what_o a_o schism_n or_o rend_a mean_n that_o know_v not_o what_o belong_v to_o the_o nature_n of_o unity_n and_o entireness_n of_o the_o body_n for_o rectum_fw-la est_fw-la index_n svi_fw-la &_o obliqui_fw-la and_o entia_fw-la privativa_fw-la cognoscuntur_fw-la ex_fw-la suis_fw-la positivis_fw-la a.s._n we_o know_v not_o perfect_o the_o nature_n of_o light_n and_o consequent_o we_o know_v not_o perfect_o the_o nature_n of_o darkness_n if_o to_o know_v perfect_o be_v take_v for_o a_o distinct_a knowledge_n of_o its_o essence_n as_o distingnish_v from_o its_o accident_n only_o we_o know_v light_v imperfect_o by_o its_o external_a cause_n by_o its_o effect_n by_o its_o subject_n adjunct_n etc._n etc._n and_o not_o essential_o and_o as_o for_o your_o first_o maxim_n rectum_fw-la est_fw-la index_n svi_fw-la &_o obliqui_fw-la it_o be_v true_a sed_fw-la non_fw-la per_fw-la distinctum_fw-la aliquem_fw-la conceptum_fw-la svi_fw-la essentialem_fw-la as_o philosopher_n say_v your_o second_o maxim_n whosoever_o you_o imitate_v in_o that_o expression_n be_v improper_a for_o privation_n be_v not_o proper_o entia_fw-la privativa_fw-la but_o entium_fw-la privationes_fw-la not_o essence_n or_o being_n but_o negation_n of_o be_v neither_o be_v darkness_n any_o thing_n but_o a_o negation_n of_o something_o viz._n of_o light_n so_o poverty_n be_v not_o a_o thing_n but_o a_o want_n of_o some_o thing_n viz._n of_o riches_n 2._o but_o i_o will_v pardon_v he_o this_o mistake_n howbeit_o it_o be_v true_a yet_o follow_v it_o not_o that_o if_o i_o know_v a_o privation_n by_o the_o positive_a form_n which_o it_o destroy_v that_o i_o know_v that_o form_n essential_o by_o its_o essence_n and_o in_o itself_o i_o know_v the_o form_n only_o accidental_o or_o by_o its_o extrinsecall_a cause_n or_o by_o its_o existence_n 3._o item_n so_o we_o conceive_v privation_n under_o the_o notion_n of_o negation_n or_o destruction_n of_o the_o existence_n rather_o than_o of_o the_o essence_n of_o thing_n or_o at_o most_o as_o destruction_n of_o the_o existence_n primario_fw-la and_o of_o the_o essence_n secundariò_fw-la if_o they_o be_v destroy_v by_o privation_n neither_o can_v i_o believe_v that_o the_o fire_n burn_v and_o destroy_v immediate_o the_o essence_n of_o a_o man_n or_o any_o part_n thereof_o for_o the_o reasonable_a soul_n be_v spiritual_a and_o can_v be_v burn_v so_o be_v the_o other_o part_n of_o his_o essence_n viz._n his_o materia_fw-la prima_fw-la incombustible_a yea_o natural_o incorruptible_a and_o as_o for_o the_o physical_a essence_n of_o the_o whole_a man_n when_o m._n s._n shall_v declare_v wherein_o it_o consist_v i_o shall_v dispute_v with_o he_o but_o silly_a man_n with_o this_o babble_a logic_n know_v he_o not_o that_o accident_n be_v never_o define_v by_o their_o essential_a