part which moderation I wish in you all What I reade in the word of God that I beleeue what I do not reade that I doe not beleeue In Gods causes wee maie not easily leaue Gods words and with a new kind of speach make way for a new kinde of faith We must learne from God what to beléeue and not by correcting or inuerting his words teach him how to speake Since therefore redemption and remission of sinnes are euerie where in the scriptures referred to the death and bloud of Christ I dare not so much as thinke the words of the holie ghost in one of the greatest mysteries of our christian faith to be improper or imperfect And that you may the better perceaue how plainelie and fullie this doctrine is deliuered in the propheticall apostolical scriptures I thinke it good to go forwardes with the effects of Christes crosse by which it shall appeare howe sufficient the price of our redemption is in the bloud of Christ without anie supplie of hell paines to be suffered in y e soule of Christ. The effectes of Christs crosse though I might recken manie yet to keep my selfe within some compasse I restraine to fiue chiefe branches the MERITE of his suffering which was INFINITE the MANER of his offering which was BLOVDY The POVVER of his DEATH which was mighty the COMFORT of his CROSSE which was NECESSARIE the GLORY of his RESVRRECTION which was heauenly These fiue will direct vs not onely what to beléeue but what to refuse in the person and passion of our Sauiour I will therefore take them as they lie in order The merite of Christs suffering must be simply infinite that it may worke two things for vs to wit redeeme vs from Sathan and reconcile vs vnto God cleere vs from hell and bring vs to heauen in either respect it must be infinite The wages of sinne is death both of bodie and soule héere and for euer With the Iudge of the world is no vnrighteousnesse He therefore punisheth no man without cause or aboue desert Since the reuenge of each mans sinne is eternall y t is infinite in time the waight of each mans sinne must needs be infinite as being rewarded with euerlasting death It may séeme much to carnal men that God should requite sin with euer during reuenge but if we seriouslie bethinke our selues what it is for earth and ashes to waxe proud against God after so manifold abundant blessings to cast off his yoake readily yea gréedily to prefer euerie vanitie and fansie before his heauenlie truth glory we shall presently perceiue how iust cause God hath infinitely to hate our vncleannes eternally to pursue the pride contempt rebellion of wicked and wilfull men against his diuine maiestie howsoeuer we digest it it is a thing determined with God and no doubt balāced in his vpright and sincere iudgment The soule that sinneth that soule shal die Death life are both eternall y t is infinite in length though not in weight in durance though not in degree and sence of ioy or paine Then in either respect to counteruaile our deliuerance from hell our inheritance in heauen she merit of Christs suffering must be infinite An infinite purchase cannot be made but with an infinite price For this infinite price whither shall we seeke to the paines of hell or to the powers of heauen◠y e paines of hel are neither meritorious nor infinite What thanks with God to be separated from God and the soule being alienated from God what other part of man can merite his fauor If any man fal away my soule shall haue no pleasure in him Hel paines therefore are accursed not accepted of God and hee that suffereth them is hated and no way beloued Depart from me ye cursed into euerlasting fire As they are not meritorious no more are they infinite I meane in waight but they must euerlastingly be suffered before they can be infinite For not only diuels but men of all sorts shal suffer them who cannot endure any infinite sence of paine All creatures are finite both in force to do strength to suffer Infinit is as much as God himself hath therefore God alone is infinite So that neither hel fire is of infinite force to punish nor men nor angels of infinite strength to suffer but the vengeance of sinne continueth for euer by reason no creature is able to beare an infinite waight of punishment Since then the paines of hel haue neither worth nor waight sufficient in themselues to satisfie the anger procure the fauor of God we must séeke to heauen euen to God himselfe for the true ransome for our sinnes and redemption of our soules which we no where find but in the person of Christ Iesus who being true God tooke our nature vnto him and by the infinite price of his bloud bought vs from y e power of hel brought vs vnto God For neither y e vertues of Christs humane soule though they were many nor the sufferings of his flesh though they were painful are simply infinite til we looke to his person then shall we find that God vouchsafed with his own bloud to purchase his Church that we were reconciled to God by the death of his sonne when we were his enemies Bernarde expressing the infinite merite of Christes death and passion saith Incomprehensibilis deus voluit comprehendi summus humiliari potentissimus despici pulcherrimus deformari sapientissimus vt iumentū fieri immortalis mori vt compendio absoluam deus fieri voluit vermiculus quid excelsius deo quid inferius vermiculo The incomprehensible God woulde be comprehended the highest humbled the most mighty despised the most beautifull deformed the most wise bee like a beast the immortall would suffer death to speake all in fewe wordes God would become a Worme what is higher then God what is baser then a Worme If betwéene the Creator and the best of his creatures there be an infinite distance what thinke yee then was there betwixt the throne of God in heauen and the crosse of Christ on earth not an infinite distance and so infinite that neither men nor Angels can comprehend it The ground of our saluation then is the obedience humility and charitie of the sonne of God yeelding himselfe not onelie to serue in our stéed but to die for our sinnes For when he was equall with God in nature power and glory hee refused not to take the shape of a seruant vpon him and to humble himselfe to the death of the crosse not onelie obeying his fathers will which we had despised but abiding his hand for the chastisement of our peace The Apostle noteth these thrée vertues in the person of Christ Let the SAME AFFECTION of loue bee in you which was in Christ Iesus vvho being in the forme of God emptied and humbled himselfe and became
obedient to the death euen to the death of the crosse By his humilitie obedience and charity hee purged the pride rebellion and selfe-loue which our first father shewed when he fell and we all expresse in our sinnes and therefore as wee all died in Adams transgression so we are all iustified that is absolued from our sinnes and receaued into fauour by the obedience of Christ. Yea the obedience of Christ did in farre higher degrée please God the Father then the rebellion of Adam did displease him For there the vassall rebelled here the equall obeied there earth presumed to be like vnto God here God vouchsafed to bee the lowest amongst men there the creature neglected his maker here the creator so loued his enemies euen his persecutors that hee tooke the burthen from their shoulders and laid it on his owne contentedly giuing his life for them who cruellie tooke his life from him to conclude those were the sinnes of men these are the vertues of God which doe infinitelie counteruaile the other and for that cause the iustice of God is farre better satisfied with the obedience of Christ then with the vengeance it might iustlie haue executed on the sinnes of men For God hath no pleasure in the death of the wicked neither doth hee delight in mans destruction but with the obedience of his sonne he is well pleased and therein euen his soule delighteth This is my beloued sonne in whom I am well pleased Loe my chosen my soule taketh pleasure in him In which words God doth not onlie note the naturall loue betwixt his sonne and himselfe but he giueth full approbation of his obedience as being thereby throughlie satisfied for the sinne of man By Christs obedience I doe not meane the holinesse of his life or performance of the lawe but the obedience of the person vnto death euen the death of the Crosse which was voluntarilie offered by him not necessarily imposed on him aboue and besides the lawe and no way required in the lawe For it could be no dutie to God or man but onelie mercie and pitie towardes vs that caused the sonne of God to take our mortall and weake flesh vnto him and therein and therby to pay the ransome of our sinnes and to purchase eternall life for vs. He must be a Sauiour no debter a redéemer no prisoner Lord of all euen when hee humbled himselfe to be the seruant of all his diuine glorie power and maiestie make his sufferings to be of infinite force and value And from this dignitie and vnitie of his person which is the maine pillar of our redemption if we cast our eies on any other cause or deuise any new help to strengthen the merits of Christ wee dishonour and disable his diuinitie as if the sonne of God were not a full and sufficient price to ransome the bodies and soules of all mankind On this foundation doe the scriptures build the whole frame of mans redemption GOD purchased his church saith Paule WITH HIS OVVNE BLOVD GOD noting the dignitie HIS OVVNE the vnitie of his person and both importing a price far worthier then the thing purchased God spared not his owne sonne but gaue him for vs all In that he was the sonne of God al nations are counted vnto him or in ballance with him lesse thē nothing and vanitie in that he was giuen for vs the ransome excelleth the prisoner as much as God doth man We are reconciled to God by the death of his sonne Maruell we to sée Christs death of that power price with God that it appeased his wrath when he was angrie with vs as with his enemies when as his owne son being equall with him in the forme of God humbled himselfe to the death of the crosse for our sakes Fairer or fuller causes of our redemption we neede not aske the holie Ghost doth not expresse God cannot haue If the son of God be not able with his bloud to redeeme vs wee must giue ouer all hope and despaire For heauen cannot yéeld vs a greater value and the earth hath none like Wherfore if any man be disposed to seale his own condemnation with his own heart let him distrust the merits of Christs death but all that will be saued must acknowledge the infinite price of his death and bloud aboue our worth and we must learne being sinfull and wretched creatures not to amend the wordes of God in the mysterie of our redemption but suffer him that is trueth to be the guider of our faith and not by figures to frustrate all that is written in the word of God touching our saluation purchased by the death and bloud of Christ Iesus I am not the first that obserued or vrged this doctrine it is auncient and Catholike Cum super omnes esset Dei verbum merito suum ipsius templum corporale instrumentum pro omniū ammis pretium offerens id quod morti debebatur persoluit Where as the word or sonne of God saith Athanasius was aboue al worthily then by offering his owne temple bodily instrument as a price for the soules of all men did he pay that was due vnto death Cyril Si non esset deus quomodo ipse solus sufficeret ad hoc vt sit pretiū Sed sufficit solus pro omnibus mortuus quia super omnes est deus igitur est morte suae carnis à mundo mortē depellens If Christ were not God how could he alone suffice to be the ransome for al but he alone dead sufficeth for all because he is aboue all he is therefore God by the death of his flesh driuing away death from the worlde And againe Redempti sumus Christo proprium corpus dante pro nobis Sed si vt communis homo intelligeretur Christus quomodo corpus eius ad rependendum omnium vitam sufficeret At si deus fuit in carne qui dignissimus sufficiens ad redemptionem totius mundi per suum sanguinē merito fuit We are redeemed Christ giuing his own body for vs. But if Christ be taken to be no more then a man how should his body be sufficient to restore life to al men but if he were God in our flesh worthily thē did he suffice to redeem the whole world with his bloud Austen Si propter hominē mortuus est deus nō est victurus homo cum deo quomodo mortuus est deus accepit ex te vnde moreretur pro te nōposset mori nisi caro nōposset mori nisi mortale corpus If god died for mā shall not mā liue with god but how died god he took of thine wherin to die for thee There could nothing die but flesh there could die nothing but a mortal body And elsewhere an anciēt writer vnder his name if not himselfe Indubitanter credamus quod totum mundum redemit qui plus dedit quā totus mundus valeret
was God and man As the Sonne of God coulde not bee REIECTED no more could hee bee ACCVRSED He that is ioyned with God must needes bee partaker of Gods goodnesse God is the fountaine of all bliâ—â—e hee therefore filleth with his blessing all that are vnited vnto him And if we when we cleaue vnto him by faith and loue must needs deriue from him ioy and blisse coulde the soule of Christ bee personallie ioyned with him and not be perpetuallie blessed by him Though then it pleased our Sauiour to suffer a cursed kinde of death for our sinnes and by receyuing that curse in his flesh to quench the spirituall and eternall curse that hung ouer our heades yet his souls was neuer accursed since he was alwaies beloued and the curse of God compriseth not onelie the anger and hatred but the intolerable and vnceaseable vengeance of God which pursueth the souls and bodies of the wicked with flaming fire for euer For how could al nations of the earth be blessed in him if he himselfe were accursed but God sent him to blesse vs hee must therefore be stored with fulnes of blessing first for himselfe then for vs all And could we frame our tongues which I hope all Christians with heart detest so much to dishonour the person of Christ as to auouch him to be trulie reiected and accursed of his Father for the time bee it neuer so short yet we must not shew our selues so void of al sense as to say that Christs soule suffered HEL FIRE which is the perpetuall and essentiall punishment of all the damned Let vs not come within that danger of so desperate follie not to knowe or not to care what we defend or affirme It should haue some proofe it should haue some truth whatsoeuer is held for matter of faith That Christes soule was tormented with hell fire I aske not what proofe or truth but what shewe can bee pretended The fire of hell they will say is metaphoricall they that go thither shall find it no metaphore It is no good dallying with Gods eternall and terrible iudgements The Scriptures are so plaine and so full of the parts and effects of fire in hell that I dare not allegorize them Christ maketh the rich mans soule in hell to saie I am tormented in this flame Saint Iohn saith it is a lake burning with fire and brimstone Daniel saith a firie streame issued from before Christ sitting in iudgement Paul saith it is a violent fire which shall deuoure the aduersaries God himselfe saith a fire is kindled in my wrath and shall burne to the bottome of hell and shall enflame the foundations of the hilles If therefore the paines of the damned come in question it is not safe to measure them by our imaginations but to giue eare to the holie ghost who can best expresse them and by him wee learne that if anie man worshippe the beast and his image he shall drinke of the wine of the wrath of God and shall bee tormented in fire and Brimstone before the holie Angels and before the lambe And the smoke of their torment shall ascende euermore and they shall haue no rest night nor daie Into this fire if we cast Christes soule we must take heede our proofes bee sound and sure least our presumption exclude vs from the place where Christ is and leaue vs in the lake where hee neuer was there to learne what it is rashlie to conclude the thinges that are not confirmed by the word of God But I perswade my self few men of learning or religion will venter on this desperate resolution that Christs soule here on earth suffered hell fire and therefore to propose it is inough to confute it The last thing in hell fire is that it is eternal For as there is no remission of paine so thence is no redemption but once adiudged thither is euerlastinglie fastened to that place of torment And this is cause inough to staie all men that bee soberlie minded from defending that Christs soule suffered the paines of hell which the holie Ghost saith are endles They which knowe not God and obey not the gospell shall suffer paines euen euerlasting perdition from the presence of the Lord saith the Apostle to the Thessalonians And so Peter to whom the myst of darkenesse is reserued for euer And Iude Sodome and Gomorrhe are set for an example which suffer the punishment of euerlasting fire Yea Christ himselfe pronounced that fire to be vnquenchable Wherefore vnlesse we can shew a later and better warrant then I yet see we shall do well not to enterprize to quench hell fire but to let it burne eternallie and to confesse with Peter that God raised Christ breaking the paines of death and hell of which it was impossible he should be held For since he was and is the Sauiour of his body the paines of hell which are eternall could not take hold on him He was mightier then hell that saued vs from hell hee could not frée vs from the chaines of darkenesse but he must first breake them in sunder His deliuering vs from the power of Satan proueth him to be stronger then Satan and the stronger could neuer be bound by the weaker but contrariwise he entred into Satans house where his chiefe strength was and bound him and so spoiled him This comparison Christ maketh betwixt Satan himselfe by which he concludeth that he was stronger then Satan and consequentlie could not himselfe bee bound by death or hell but ouercame satan and tooke all his armour from him wherein he trusted and deuided the spoiles And where some men begin to doubt whether eternal continuance be of the nature substance of hell or no they shall doe well to leaue these dangerous and fruitelesse speculations For whether they looke to the persons for vvhom or the crimes for vvhich or the Iudge by vvhom it was prepared they shall euerie waie find it must be eternall It was prepared for the diuell and his Angels and to them coulde no punishment be allotted but euerlasting except we will giue possibilitie of grace and hope of repentance vnto diuels It is the wages of sinne which being an infinite contempt of the diuine maiestie must by the balance of iustice haue infinite vengeance in waight or in length And since no creature is able to beare an infinite burden and sence of paine of force all sinnefull creatures must bee condemned to an infinite length of punishment which is hell fire Lastlie as God is eternall and cannot change no more can his iustice or iudgement alter with time but as his truth abideth for euer so his iudgment being iust and good is irreuocable consequently the vengeance of sinne can neuer cease as proceeding from the righteous iudge of the world in whom is no shadowing nor varying And therefore Paul calleth the iudgement aeternal wherby God shall rewarde
the destruction of all the faythfull Wherefore the wisedome and iustice of God suffered him to shewe his rage on the flesh of Christ and as it were to trample in his bloud which hee spilt like water on the earth and left him that which hee so eagerly pursued and in his malice against Gods glorie preferred before all the worlde as a full payment for all those that shoulde be deliuered by the death of Christ. And for this cause the bloud of Christ is called by y e holie ghost the PRICE of our REDEMPTION Ye were REDEEMED saith Peter WITH THE PRECIOVS BLOVD of Christ as of a lambe vnspotted and vndefiled Yea the song which the Saints in heauen do sing vnto the lambe is this Thou wast killed and HAST REDEEMED VS TO GOD BY THY BLOOD When I say the bloud of Christ was â—he price wherewith God redéemed vs out of Satans power I doe not meane that God made anie contract with Satan or tooke his consent to exchange much lesse that Christ did profer his bloud to the diuell to set vs free it were an iniurie to Christ for vs to thinke his bloud was shed to satisfie the diuell as Gregory Nazianzene wel obserueth in his oration de Paschate but Christ offered his bloud as a sacrifice to god his father to verifie the iudgement pronounced against vs Thou shalt die the death and to satisfie the iustice of God prouoked with our sinnes yet in comming to his death since his life might not be ended neither with his owne hand nor by the hand of his Father the wisedome of God deliuered him into the handes of sinners by whose blinde zeale and bloudie rage the diuell that worketh in the children of disobedience conspired and compassed his death and with all maner of contumelie and crueltie abused his body and spilt his blood insulting at him by the mouthes of the wicked and reioycing in the conquest he gate ouer Christ in bringing him to a reprochfull death But this extreame rage of Satan against the person of Christ turned to the vtter ruine of his owne kingdome For God did not onely raise againe the Lord Iesus from death as dying an innocent without all desert but in recompence of the wrong which he receiued at Satans hands to the which he willingly submitted himselfe God gaue him power to spoyle the kingdome of the diuell and to deliuer all that euer did or should beleeue in his death and passion And in this sort Christ bought vs with his precious bloud from the daunger of sinne and hell not offering but suffering Satan by the hands of the Iewes to take his life from him neither compounding with his aduersarie but repressing him in the middest of his malice who assaulting Christ Iesus our head as he had done all the members was ouerthrowne by him and vanquished with an euerlasting victorie Mortuus est volens vt inuoluntarie mortuos exuscitaret Deuorauit ipsum mors ignorans vbi deuorasset cognouit quem non deuorauit Deuorauit vnum cum omnibus perdidit omnes propter vnum Rapuit vt leo confracti sunt dentes ipsius Christ died willinglie saith Basill that hee might raise those which died against their wils Death ignorantly deuoured him which when hee had done hee knewe whom he had not deuoured Hee swallowed vp one as he did all and for that one hee lost all Hee seased on him as a Lion but his teeth were therwith broken The créed extant vnder the name of Ruffinus Sacramentum carnis susceptae hanc habet causam vt diuina filij dei virtus velut hamus quidam habitu humanae carnis obtectus principem mundi inuitare posset ad Agonem cui ipse carnem suam velut escam tradens hamo eum diuinitatis intrinsecus teneret insertus ex profusione immaculati sanguinis The mysterie of Christes taking flesh was to this end that the diuine power of the Sonne of GOD couered as a hooke vnder the shewe of mans flesh might prouoke the Prince of this worlde to assault him to WHOM CHRIST DELIVERING HIS FLESH AS A BAITE helde fast the diuell with the hooke of his diuinitie sticking in him through the shedding of his immaculate bloud Conditorem omnium Satanae manui traditum quis vel desipiens credat sed tamen edoctus veritate quis nesciat cum se pro nostra redemptione Dominus membrorum Satanae manibus tradidit quod eiusdem Satanae manum in se saeuire permittit vt vnde ipse exterius occumberet inde nos exterius interiusque liberaret That the maker of all was deliuered into the hande of Satan who is so foolish as to beleeue And yet who taught by the trueth is ignorant that when the Lorde for our redemption yeelded himselfe into their handes that were the members of Satan hee suffered the hande of Satan to rage agaynst him that whence he outwardlie dyed in body thence he might both outwardlie and inwardlie deliuer vs And therefore hee concludeth Cum corpus eius ad passionem accipit electos eius à iure suae potestatis amittit When Satan receyued the bodie of Christ to crucifie it hee lost the elect of Christ from subiection to his power Saint Austen shewing howe Christ conquered the Diuell first by iustice and then by power sayeth Placuit Deo vt propter eruendum hominem de Diabolâ— potestate non potentia Diabolus sed iustitia vinceretur It pleased God for the deliuering of man out of the Diuels power that the diuell should be conquered by iustice and not by might Qua est igitur iustitia qua victus est Diabolus Quae nisi iustitia Iesu Christi Et quomodo victus est Quia cum in eo nihil morte dignum inuenit occidit eum tamen utique iustum est vt debitores quos tenebat liberi dimittantur in eum credentes quem sine vllo debito occidit Hoc est quod iustificari dicimur in sanguine Christi What then is the iustice whereby the Diuell was conquered What but the iustice of Iesu Christ And howe Because that when the Diuell founde in Christ nothing woorthie of death hee killed him notwithstanding and surelie iustice requireth that the debtours which Satan helde shoulde bee sette free beleeuing in him whome Satan slue without any debt This is it that wee are sayde to bee iustifyed in the bloud of Christ. Sanguis enim ille quoniam eius erat qui nullum habuit omnino peccatum ad remissionem nostrorum fusus est peccatorum vt quia eos Diabolus merito tenebat quos peccatireos conditione mortis obstrinxit hos per eum meritò dimitteret quem nullius peccati reum immerito poena mortis affecit hac iustitia victus hoc vinculo vinctus est fortis vt vasa eius eriperentur For that bloud because it was his who was vtterlie voyde of sinne was shedde for the remission of
and get you some other profession So then the paines which the damned feele besides the griefe of heauen lost is FLAMING FIER intolerably formenting both bodie and soule and as Cyprian obserueth Omni tormento atrocius desperatio condemnatos affliget Desperation which shall afflict the condemned worse then al their torments To these if you subiect the Sonne of God you know what will follow from these if you frée him as you needes must then is the Question at an end for in euery mans sight Christ did not suffer the paines of hell nor the torments of the damned which the scripture maketh to be these not those which you can neither expresse nor proue FroÌ„ slender reasons you come Sir Refuter to slenderer authorities and though you quote but few and not one of them speaking one word to your purpose yet before you produce them you chalenge them as vnsufficient to testifie in this or any cause against your liking For where they may not be iudges nor with you so much as witnesses of the Scriptures sense you so reieâ—t their expositions euerie where with pride disdaine yet you in your wisedome take vpon you to build vpon the words of the holy Ghost what absurdities and follies you list and your best reason is it were fond to thinke otherwise but be more sober if you will be ruled by me it is the way to hazard your own wits not their credits to entertaine theÌ„ in this maner They speake not plainly nor fully you say because it was neuer in question in their time Touching the redemption of man by the death blood of Christ Iesus they speake as plainly and fully as it is possible for men to speake and kéepe exactly the forme of wholesome doctrine deliuered in the Scriptures touching your hell paines they say nothing in déed because it was neuer heard of in y e Church of Christ in their times but that Christ died NOT THE DEATH OF THE SOVLE and by the ONLY DEATH OF HIS BODY and shedding of his blood sufficiently ransomed redéemed vs this cannot be spoken in plainer and exacter terms then they haue proposed it and proued it And therfore you and others shal doe well not to make al the ancient learned lights of Christs Church so ignorant in their Créed Catechisme as not to know how they were saued by y e Crosse death of Christ before your hellish paines of the damned were of late deuised Your better sifting of this matter is the open wresting and forcing of the scriptures against their true proper and perpetual sense to serue your strange conceits And as you do with the scriptures you must be suffered to do with the Fathers which you produce that is to put theÌ„ quite from their own meaning frame their words to your fancies before any man can tell to what end you cite them The first word you quote out of Ierom you falsifie by putting maledictum to it where Ierom doth not so but simply saith VVHAT VVE should haue suffered for our sinnes that he suffered for vs. The very next words that are his owne for he interposeth a place of Scripture that in his fâ—esh Christ dissolued our enmitie with God and healed vs with his stripes are these Ex quo perspicuum est sicut corpus flagellatum laceratum ita animam verè doluisse pro nobis Whereby it is euident that as his bodie was whipped and torne so his soule truely sorrowed for vs. Here you must be permitted to adde of your owne besides Ieroms meaning that this sorrow was your hellish sorrow or else I cannot sée why you cited Ierom except it were to falsifie him But how and why Christ sorrowed for vs when Ieroms own words were alleaged by me your answer was this is more fond and absurd than the other Cyprians words you neither vnderstand nor like he saith that Christ taking our person and cause vpon him sayd in our names that he was forsaken Quod pro eis voluisti intelligi qui deseri à Deo propter peccata meruerant quorum reconciliationis causam agebas which he would haue to be vnderstoode of vs or for vs who deserued by our sinnes to be forsaken of God whose reconciliation he then vndertooke So S. Austen expounded those words of Christ My God my God why hast thou forsaken me Illa vox membrorum ipsius vox erat non capitis that voyce was the voice of his members and not of the head but you could not endure either Austen or my other father so to say without controlement But Cyprian saith Christ endured like punishment to those that be sinners accursed In part not in all otherwise he must haue suffered eternall death of bodie and soule and therefore expounding himselfe in the next sentence he saith In tantum infirmis compateris vt nec crucifigi nec mori dum illi viuant non pereant nec erubescas nec formides So far didst thou suffer with the weake that thou didst neither shame to be crucified nor feare to dye so they might liue and not perish Ambrose saith With the sorrow of his soule Christ abolished the sorrow of our soules Here you must haue leaue to bring in your hellish sorrowes against Ambroses minde or else this is but lost labour the causes of Christs heauines and sorrow when I repeated out of this very place of Ambrose you reiected them as fond and false and now with the bare name of sorrow you think Ambrose dreamt of your hell paines For shame reade out the chapter and leaue these mistakings But Ambrose saith the man in Christ now readie to die by the separation of the Diuinite cried my God my God why hast thou forsaken me A man dieth when his soule leaueth his body Christ therefore ready to die the death of the body which was left of y e deitie vnto death by withdrawing it selfe for a time vttered these words Death of the soule or dereliction vnto hell paines there are none to be found in Ambrose nor any words sounding that way vnlesse you peruert them at your pleasure The words next going before are these Gloriosa Dei professio vsque ad mortem se pro nostris descendisse peccatis vel euidens manifestatio contestantis Dei secessionem Diuinitatis CORPORIS It was a glorious profession of God that he descended euen vnto death for our sins or an euident manifestation of God witnessing the departure of his Diuinitie from HIS BODIE when it dyed The next words of Ambrose why you alleage I doe not sée but to make vp the number which is very smale and lesse forcible Who doubteth but Christ offered that which he put on He put on his body his body he offered S. Paul will tell what Christ offered We are sanctified by the offering of the bodie of Iesus Christ once made Your own author Saint
The effect of certaine Sermons TOVCHING THE FVLL REDEMPTION of mankind by the death and bloud of CHRIST IESVS WHEREIN Besides the merite of Christs suffering the manner of his offering the power of his death the comfort of his Crosse the glorie of his resurrection Are handled What paines Christ suffered in his soule on the Crosse Together With the place and purpose of his descent to hel after death Preached at Paules Crosse and else where in London by the right Reuerend Father Thomas Bilson Bishop of Winchester With a conclusion to the Reader for the cleering of certaine obiections made against the said doctrine 1. Corinth 3. I esteeme not to knowe any thing saue Christ Iesus and him crucified Athanasius de Incarnatione verbi dei Therefore the sonne of God tooke to him a bodie that might die that enduing it with a reasonable soule it might suffice for a full satisfaction to Death for all Imprinted at London by Peter Short for Walter Burre and are to be sold in Paules Churchyard at the signe of the Flower deluce 1599. To the Christian Reader IT is some time since good Christian Reader that lying in London and preaching at Paules Crosse as the feast of Easter drawing neer did admonish mee I made choice to speake of the redemption of mankinde by the death and bloud of Christ Iesus And because that Citie then had and yet hath as manie learned and religious preachers so some conceited and too much addicted to nouelties who spared not in their Catechisings and readings to vrge the suffering of the verie paines of hell in the soul of Christ on the crosse as the chiefest part and maine ground of our Redemption by Christ I finding how fast that opinion had increased since it was first deuised and doubting where it would end thought it my dutie publikelie to warne them that were forward in defending this fansie to take heed how farre they waded in that late sprong speculation For as these words of Dauid The sorrowes of hell besieged me and these of Ionas Out of the belly of hel I cried thou heardest my voice may be tolerablie applied to Christ if they be metaphorically interpreted of Christ as the scriptures meane them in Dauid and Ionas so if wee grow from the figuratiue vse of the worde HELL to the proper signification thereof and rise from the degrees of sorrowes and feares which pursue the Saints in this life to the highest sense and suffering of ALL and THE VERIE SAME paines and punishments which the damned do and shall endure for euer freeing Christ from nothing but from the place and continuance of hell vve make not a curious and superfluous but an erroneous and daungerous addition to the mysterie of our Saluation The better to slacke their inconsiderate heate I laboured to prooue these foure pointes vnto them First that it was no where recorded in the holie Scriptures nor iustlie to bee concluded by the Scriptures that Christ suffered the true paines of hell and so the Consciences of the faythfull coulde not iustlie bee forced to the necessarie beleeuing of anie such strange assertion Secondlie that as the Scriptures describe to vs the paines of the damned and of hell there are manie terrors and torments which without euident impietie cannot be ascribed to the Sonne of God as namely extreame Darkenesse Desperation Confusion vtter separation reiection and exclusion from the grace fauour and kingdome of God remembrance of sinne gnawing the conscience horrour of Diuels tormented and tormenting and flame of fire intolerablie burning both bodie and soule Thirdlie that the death and bloud of Christ Iesus were euidentlie frequentlie constantlie set downe in the writinges of the Apostles as the sufficient price of our Redemption and true meane of our reconciliation to God and the verie same proposed in the figures resembled in the sacrifices of the Lawe and sealed with the Sacraments of the new Testament as the verie grounde worke of our saluation by Christ and so haue beene receaued and beleeued in the Church of God fourteene hundred yeares before anie man euer made mention of hell paines to bee suffered in the soule of Christ. Lastlie where the Scriptures are plaine and pregnant that Christ DIED for our sinnes and by his DEATH destroied him that had power of death euen the Diuell and reconciled vs when we were strangers and enemies IN THE BODIE OF HIS FLESH THROVGH DEATH for wee are reconciled to God by the DEATH of his sonne and sanctified by THE OFFERING OF THE BODIE of Iesus Christ once who himselfe bare our sinnes in his BODIE on the Tree where hee was put to death concerning the FLESH Besides that the holie Ghost in these places by expresse wordes nameth the bodilie death of Christ as the meane of our redemption and reconciliation to God no considerate diuine might affirme or imagine Christ suffered the Death of the soule for so much as the Death of the soule must exclude Christ from the grace spirit and life of God and leaue in him neither faith hope nor loue sanctitie nor innocencie which God forbid anie Christian man shoulde so much as dreame Wee shoulde therefore do well to reuerence the manifest wordes of Gods Spirit in so high a pointe of Religion and suffer our selues as schollers to bee taught by the leader into all trueth what to beleeue and confesse in the mystery of our redemption and not to controle or correct the doctrine so cleerelie deliuered in the Scriptures so consonantlie retained of all learned and vnlearned in the Church of Christ for so many hundred yeares And if anie man to maintaine his deuise woulde inuent a newe hell and another death of the soule then either scriptures or fathers euer heard or spake of they shoulde keepe their inuentions to themselues it sufficed me to beleeue what I read and consequently not to beleeue what I did not read in the word of God which is and ought to be the foundation of our faith Thus farre I purposed when I first entered by Gods grace to proceede in this cause according to y e simple vnderstanding wherwith god hath endued me for the good of his Church The article of the Creed Christ DESCENDED INTO HELL I meant not to meddle with choosing rather to leaue y t vntouched then to presse any sense as a point of faith for vvhich I had not so full and faire warrant as for the redemption of man by the death and blood of Christ Iesus but the vehemencie of some contradicting that I taught and the importunitie of others requesting to knowe what they might safelie beleeue of that article made mee to alter my minde For whē some vrged others doubted that if Christ did not suffer the paines of hell whiles he hung on the Crosse that part of the Creed was added in vaine and the wordes of Dauid Thou wilt not leaue my soule in hell applied by Peter vnto Christ in
partes yea the chiefest partes and effectes of Gods wrath against sinne This is far from your meaning as you often protest Trulie I beléeue it charitie leades me to thinke though you be somewhat foolish in this cause that yet you are not so diuelish as to fasten these things on the sonne of God But you must also be so wise as to sée that if your antecedent be general these wil follow whether you mean them or no if your antecedent be not general but indefinite as Christ suffered the wrath of God due to sinne that is some partes and effectes of Gods wrath due to sinne you shall neuer make choise in your conclusion which parts he suffered as namelie the true paines of hel of the damned Now choose which you will either the inualiditie of your argument or the impietie of your antecedent the one will proue you to lack learning that you sée not the difference the other that you want christianity if you should not with mouth disclaim and with hart detest that horrible blasphemie You wil pretend I know your conclusion is not general no more indeed is it your words are therfore Christ suffered for vs the wrath of God but this conclusion beeing indefinite and verie doubtfull will do you no good in the fortifieng of your cause For Christ may suffer the wrath of God in his bodie yea in his soule hee maie suffer it and yet not the paines of the damned or of hell but because you make this the maine foundation of your whole matter let vs looke somewhat better into it You labour to proue by a long processe that Christ suffered the wrath of God for sinne First then what meane you by the wrath of God I hope you doe not meane anie inwarde affection or perturbation in God but as you expoâ—nde your selfe the verie effectes of his iust wrath you shoulde saie of his iustice and power punishing sinne And this warning gentle Reader if thou bee simple I must giue thee for the learned knowe it of themselues that when thou readest in the scriptures or hearest me reason of the wrath of God thou doe not imagine that God is mooued with anie inwarde mutation but the punishment ordained for sinne by the iustice of God or inflicted on vs when we haue sinned by the hand of God whatsoeuer mean it please him to vse is called the wrath God Ambrose saieth well Ira est non ei qui iudicat sed illi qui iudicatur It is no wrath to God that iudgeth but to him that is is iudged Quia culpas percutit irasci dicitur saieth Gregorie God is saide to be angrie because he punisheth our sinnes And so Austen Ira deâ—non perturbatio animi eius est sed iudicium quo irrogatur pana peccato The wrath of God is no affection of mind in him but his iudgment whereby punishment is inflicted for sinne The conclusion is nomine irae intelligitur vindicta iniquitatis by the name of Gods wrath is vnderstoode the punishment of iniquitie It is then euident that by the name of Gods wrath throughout the scriptures is vnderstoode the vengeance or punishment prepared or inflicted for the sinnes of men Nowe what particular punishmentes God hath prouided for sinne as well in this life as the next to chastise and reuenge both the bodies and soules of sinners woulde aske long time to rehearse The greatest and foarest are these iudgementes which are executed on the wicked in the worlde to come to witte reiection from the kingdome of God and condemnation to hell fire where not onelie darkenesse amazeth the eies and remembrance of sinne committed afflicteth the conscience but an intolerable flame of fire tormenteth both soule and bodie for euer These terrible iudgementes of GOD against sinne the Scriptures publish and denounce to men in this life that if the loue of heauen doe not winne them to obedience the feare of hell shoulde hold them from resisting and contemning God The greatest torment that in this life canne befall a sinner is desperation when the soule of man conuinced in her selfe by the number of her hainous ofsences loseth all hope of life to come and casteth her eies wholie on the fearefull tormentes of hell prepared for her the continuall thought and fright whereof doe so amaze and afflict the comfortlesse soule that shee sinking vnder the burden feeleth in her selfe the horrour of hell before shee come to it So that the losse of heauen and feare of hell maie torment wicked and desperate persons in this life but the execution thereof after this life shall breede an other manner of astonishment and torment then they canne yet conceaue If the thought of these iudgementes and punishmentes ordayned by Gods power and iustice for sinners so afflict men what shall the sight doe If the feare of hell bee so intolerable what shall the flame bee when therefore you saie Sir Refuter Christ suffered for vs the wrath of God wee must not content our selues with that generall worde you must tell vs in particular what partes and effectes of GODS wrath Christ endured before you canne auouch that which hee suffered to bee equall to hell and all the tormentes thereof Did hee suffer hell fire either in soule or in bodie the damned shall suffer it in both Did hee finde or feare himselfe to be excluded from the kingdome of God the damned doe see themselues shut out for euer If hee neither felt nor feared the MYST the VVORME the FIRE of hell nor so much as DOVBTED the LOSSE of Gods kingdome what tormentes equall to hell canne you name vs The wrath of God you will saie is equall to hell and all the torments thereof The wrath of God is hell and so are all the tormentes of hell yea they are the sharpest effectes of Gods wrath against sinne And therefore neuer plaie with generalities and ambiguities but expresse plainly what other effectes of Gods wrath you meane For since the losse of heauen the darkenesse worme and fire of hell and the feare of both bee the greatest and sorest iudgementes of God against sinne that are decreed by his iustice reuealed by his word and executed by his power in this life or the nexte wee plainelie and truelie saie you can name vs none other effectes of Gods wrath equall to these If then it be haynous impietie to saie Christ suffered these and none other are equall to these take backe your lauishing vntruth that Christ suffered the effects of Gods wrath equal to hel and all the tormentes thereof for my part I see neither sense nor reason in it But it shalbe soundlie and euidently prooued Will you prooue you know not what Tell first what effects of gods wrath you meane and then on with your proofes Your meaning may be such as you shall neuer prooue It may be such as we wil easely graunt For touching your words which you take for the castel of your cause Christ
an other time and place and his wordes import a deliberation of two partes proposed by our Sauiour with his resolution in the ende what shall I saie Father deliuer me from this hower that is shall I saie deliuer me from this hower but therefore came I into this hower Father glorifie thy name Chrysostom thus expoundeth Christes wordes NON DICO libera me ex hac hora sed pater glorifica nomen tuum I SAIE NOT deliuer me from this hower but father glorifie thy name And so doth Epiphanius Quid dicam pater serua me ex hac hora hoc inquit dicam at propterea veni in hanc horam What shall I saie Father saue mee from this hower shall I saie so but therefore came I into this hower But what better expositor canne wee haue then Saint Paul who plainely saith that Christ in making this praier was heard deliuered from that he feared Hee praied not against the knowne will of God whose praiers God heard and performed And where you flie to this hellish confusion to saue Christ from sinne by pretending to cléere him from sinne you charge him rather with sinne For the praier which is not made in faith is sinne Nowe can the heart be assured it shall receaue that it asketh at Gods hands if it bee neither directed to aske according to the will of God nor prepared to aske with that deuotion which is fit for God So that when you make Christ to triple his praiers with vehement teares and cries still repugnant to the will of God you chalenge the sonne of God with open sinne from which you would seeme to excuse him And as for your double relapse into the same astonishment still when Christ was twice cléere from it it is a foolish deuice of your idle braines as if the Lorde no sooner returned to his praiers but your hellish confusion did waite at his heeles to interrupt and ouerwhelm him and within sixe wordes againe to leaue him If your cause be holie iest not thus prophanelie with the sonne of God nor bereaue him of his wits when you thinke good If it were a necessarie effect of Gods wrath then after it lighted on our Sauiour in the garden it must continue till man was redéemed and Gods wrath appeased which was not done but by the death of Christ. And therefore make your choise either let the wrath of God cease in the garden when Christ ended his praiers or if that still continued to â—he death let also this astonishment still continue or at least bee no necessarie effect of Gods wrath One of these you must take take which you wil the rest will serue to subuert your tower of Babell I doe you wrong you will saie to call your opinion the tower of Confusion you do your selfe wrong Sir Refuter in the chiefest point of Christian religion to leaue the faith confessed by the whole Church of Christ for these 1500. yeares and to walke in such ambiguities and absurdities as your selfe doe not vnderstande For I praie you Sir this wonderfull confusion and astonishment in all powers of the soule and senses of the bodie is it a necessarie consequent to the wrath of GOD or no If it bee for you saie Christ coulde not but sinke and bee confounded vnder that burden howe commeth it to passe that the reprobate and desperate feeling the sense of GODS wrath vpon them doe not loose their wits and senses as Christ by your assertion did will you affirme they are astonished and all confounded as Christ was then if you excuse Christ from sinne in disâ—iking and declining his Fathers knowne will because hee was astonished you must likewise excuse all the wicked and Reprobate from their sinnes after they once feele the sense of Gods wrath because they cannot but bee astonished and confounded vnder that burden Againe coulde Christ not sinne whiles hee felte the wrath of God vppon him because he was astonished Ergo neither coulde hee merite all that while and so neither his obedience patience humilitie nor charitie coulde haue anie place or vse so long as the sense of GODS wrath dured Haue you not deuised vs a goodlie sense of Gods wrath that shall exclude Christ Iesus from the exercise of all his graces vertues and merites This palpable absurditie you thinke to skippe Sir Refuter but your wit is too weake or your cause not good it will not bee If a man in distresse fall a sleepe saie you or be astonished with some violent blowe on the heade in such an one there is no decaie of faith nor of obedience nor of patience nor of loue euen so in Christ there was no defect of grace but an infirmitie of nature Was Christ a sléepe or in a swoune astonished you thinke he was Was hee so astonished that his senses were taken from him did hee not walke did he not speake did hee not pray whie then compare you this to a sléep or a swoune wheras in Christ was neither and though you plainelie faile in your comparison yet were it so as you would haue it for your life you cannot auoide my conclusion For a man in a sleepe or a swoune though he loose not the habite of faith and patience obedience and loue yet hath hee no vse of them for that time much lesse doth hee serue God with them But Christ Iesus by all his sufferinges must merite which a man a sleepe or amazed cannot doe And therefore remember Sir Refuter this reason amongst the rest is yet vnanswerd and I thinke wil somwhat trouble your braines before it bee answered All that Christ suffered for our Redemption was and must bee meritorious with God But the suffering of hell paynes which astonish and confounde all the powers of the soule and senses of the bodie neither was nor coulde bee meritorious with God Christ therefore did not suffer such hellish paynes as did confounde and astonish all the powers of his soule and senses of his bodie And thus by your amazed position you haue wholie confounded your owne opinion Thou hast heard good Reader a number of the Refuters speciall follies I haue some fewe more to trouble thee with and so I will leaue him to his holie cause and thee to the mercies of God To shewe himselfe learned as well in the Gréeke tongue as in philosophie hee vndertaketh an other reason that I made and sporteth himselfe somewhat handsomlie with it Out of the fift to the Hebrewes where the Apostle saieth Christ in the daies of his flesh did offer vp prayers and supplications with strong cryes and teares vnto him that was able to saue him from death and was heard in that he feared or deliuered from his feare I collected two things First that Christ in his praiers made in y e garden for to those the Apostle pointeth did but feare and not as then suffer that he feared The nexte he was deliuered from his feare and consequentlie neuer
from the life of God of which death the Diuell is sayde to haue the power and execution Therefore in the former place death signifieth so to euen the death of the soule that is the torments and sorrowes due to the damned and consequently Christ suffered the death of the soule And because this reason will seeme altogether vnreasonable and harsh in the eares of some to saie the least of it let them soberlie consider it and it is most true and euident Or if this will not perswade men to beleeue that Christ died the death of the soule men liuing being surprised with grieuous sorrowes and paines will saie as Terence witnesseth occidi perij interij they die they perish So likewise the death of the soule sometimes maie bee vnderstoode and that most sitlie for the paines and sufferinges of Gods wrath which alwayes accompanie them that are separated from the grace and loue of God And if Terence bee not authoritie sufficient Saint Peter against whome lieth no exception saith that Christ in his suffering for vs was done to death in the flesh but made aliue by the spirite And in the Scripture whensoeuer the fleshe and the spirite are opposed togither the flesh is alwayes Christes whole humanitie I saie not his bodie onelie but his soule also From hence nowe it followeth that Christes soule also died and was crucified according to the death and crucifying which soules are subiect vnto and capable of I haue Christian Reader neither peruerted the reasons nor pared the authorities on which this Confuter groundeth his conclusion that Christ died the death of the soule and that Christs soule was also crucified as well as his bodie I haue onelie sette them togither that thou maiest with one view behold both the deepnes and soundnesse of this vpstart writer and in thy secrete and vpright iudgement is it not patience enough to heare and endure a two legged creature to talke in this sort without all learning religion or discretion controlling all the fathers as fooles for thinking otherwise then hee doth commaunding the Scriptures pretor-like to serue his ignorant and lewd assertions and estéeming none to be sober or considerate except they confesse his shamefull absurdities to bee most true and euident But I haue not learned nor vsed to giue reuiling spéeches the Lorde reprooue his follie Though it bee not worth the answering yet for their sakes that bee simple I will not refuse to speake to it and to let them see what difference there is betwixt truth and errour Your maine reason Sir Refuter is this in these wordes of the Apostle Christ through death abolished the diuell that had power of death This worde DEATH say you hath the same meaning in both places the proofe you make for it is this verie fond it were to take it here otherwise Your assumption is but death in the latter place questionlesse signifieth the death of the soule Therefore Christ died the death of the soule It were as easie for mee to saie it is not so as for you to saie it is so but that course which you holde is but prating of euerie thing it is no proouing of anie thing Howe manie kinds of death there are wee shall better learne by the graue father Saint Austen then by the young louers in Terence Dicitur mors prima dicitur secunda Primae mortis duae sunt partes vna qua peccatrix anima per culpam discessit a creatore suo altera qua indicante Deo exclusa est per poenam à corpore suo Mors autem secunda ipsa est corporis animae punitio sempiterna There is a first death and a second Death Of the first death there be two parts one when the sinfull soule by offending departed from her Creator the other whereby the soule for her punishment was excluded from her bodie by Gods iustice The second death is the euerlasting torment of bodie and soule The same partes and kindes of death are often repeated by him in his 13. booke de ciuitate Dei as namelie Mors animae fit cum eam deserit Deus sicut corporis cum id deserit anima Ergo vtriusque rei id est totius hominis mors est cum anima à Deo deserta deserit corpus Ita enim nec ipsa vixit ex deo nec corpus ex ipsa Huiusmodi autem totius hominis mortem illa sequitur quam secundam mortem diuinorum eloquiorum appellat authoritas Nam illa poena vltima sempiterna recte mors animae dicitur The death of the soule is when God forsaketh her as the death of the bodie is when the soule forsaketh the bodie So y e death of both that is of the whole man is when the soule forsaken of God forsaketh her bodie For so neither she liueth by God nor the bodie by her This death of the whole man that other death followeth which the diuine scriptures call the second death for that last and euerlasting punishment is rightlie called the death of the soule Here are thrée kinds of death sinne which separateth vs from God bodilie death which separateth the soule from the body and eternall damnation which tormenteth body and soule for euer In the Apostles words to the Hebrues that Christ through death abolished y e diuell that had power of death you wil by no meanes haue the death of the bodie intended that is a benefite and gaine to the godlie Then of sinne and eternall damnation the diuell must be said to haue power and indeede so he hath For hee is the perswader and leader to sinne and the executioner and tormentor in damnation And so by your diuinitie Christ must sinne and be euerlastinglie condemned to hell fire before he can abolish the Diuell that hath power of both these For he must abolish him by the same kind of death whereof hee hath power Looke Sir Refuter what an wholsome exposition of the Apostles words you haue made vs which the diuell himselfe durst not aduenture it is so blasphemous God forbid you will say this should be anie part of your meaning But if such bee your ignorant rashnesse that you will so expound scriptures as these consequents shall necessarie followe you must leaue writing and fall to learning an other while till you be able to foresée what may iustly be inferred vpon your positions Deaths of the soule there are none mentioned in anie Scripture or father but sinne and eternall damnation Leaue the patheticall hyperbolicall metaphoricall phrases of Terence to boies in the Grammer schoole speake at least like a diuine though you bee none If your cause bee so holie a truth as you talke of it hath both foundation and approbation in the Scriptures You shall not neede to runne to heathen Poets to prooue that the Sauiour of the worlde died the death of the soule What the death of the soule is what consequentes it hath and what maine
and death Wee saie the sonne of God sustained the Crosse and death in his owne flesh that hee might deliuer vs from death and corruption Hee laide downe his soule for vs not as an alien and straunger to the sonne of God but vnspeakeablie vnited vnto him as himselfe saith I haue power to lay downe my soule and I haue power to take it againe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 It is proper to the soule to bee pensiue to feele paine and griefe to depart from the bodie as it is proper to the flesh to be wearied to be crucified to be raised againe So the violence was offered to the bodie the sense whereof reached vnto the soule and these are the sufferings of the crosse and of death which the Scriptures attribute to the sonne of God for our saluation Insomuch that your long discourse of the proper and immediate suffering of Christes soule for sinne without and besides the bodie maie be hanged on the hedge as discording both from the scriptures and all the Catholike fathers that either haue priuatelie testified the truth by their writings or publiklie confirmed it by their assemblies And as for your hellish paines when your selfe can tell what they are and make some better proofe then yet you haue done that they were or might be in the soule of Christ you shal receiue further answere These are the Refuters exquisite arguments which he calleth his speciall reasons being indeede rather so manie monsters in Christian Religion then matters to perswade anie man were he neuer so simple and but that a straunge faith muste needes haue such straunge groundes as these bee I shoulde thinke hee did rather expose this conceyte of Hell paines to bee derided of the worlde then to bee beleeued hee euerie where so secondeth his badde cause with woorse proofes but where better foode wanteth Akornes are good meate and blacke Moores maie bee beautifull when others bee awaie I woulde heere make an ende of his first parte but that as his manner is when hee hath stumbled absurdlie a long while at hell hee steppeth on the suddaine as vnhandsomelie to heauen Knowe therefore saieth hee hell as we take it is euen in this life founde sometime as heauen is likewise for as touching materiall fire in hell what a toyish fable is that else I praie you how may the soules of the damned suffer by materiall fier seeing they are spirits and therefore with them and fier materiall there can be no communiâ—n But let it bee as it may be the locall hell of the damned we speake not of You slacke your hell paines Sir Resuter towardes the ende as if all this while you had beene too hot in them and heere you giue thrée qualifications to them or rather contradictions to your former spéeches Hell as you take it is SOMETIMES found in this life But two leaues before you tolde vs the paines and sufferings of Gods wrath which are the hell that you saie Christ suffered ALVVAIES accompanie them that are separated from the grace loue of God how commeth ALVVAIES to bee so quicklie changed into SOMTIMES were there fewer wicked when you spake the last wordes then when you spake the first or are you better aduised remembring what a grosse absurditie it woulde bee to cast all infidels and hypocrits wicked and disobedient persons into hel torments all the time of this life before the iudgment of God taketh hold of them Secondlie as there is heauen euen in this life in some measure euen so saie you there may be hell You doe not meane that here on earth are the verie same ioies and blisse that are in heauen nor anie way equall to them if you did it were a lewder absurditie then the former For here we reioice that our names are written in heauen as the Apostle teacheth vs to doe wee reioice vnder the hope of the glorie of God Now hope that is seene is not hope For howe can a man hope for that which hee seeth or possesseth but when we hope for that we see not we doe with patience abide for it In this life wee walke by faith not by sight and whiles we dwell in the bodie we are absent from the Lord. For though we be now the sonnes of God it appeareth not as yet what we shal be our life is hid with Christ in God when Christ who is our life shall appeare then shall wee also appeare with him in glorie If you therefore affirme of heauen as you do of hell that the VERIE SAME ioies which are in heauen or EQVALL with them are here sometime found on earth it is a wicked errour flatlie repugning to the trueth of Gods promises and to the verie nature of our Christian faith and hope For faith is the grounde of thinges hoped for and the euidence of thinges not yet appearing but if you meane that as wee conceaue HOPE of heauenlie blisse so wee must néedes REIOYCE in it this position is verie true but plainelie opposite to your imagination of hell paines For then must there in this life bee no more felte of hell but the FEARE thereof and the griefe arising from that feare euen as the HOPE of heauen maintaineth our ioye Nowe in Christ coulde neither the feare of hell possiblie bee founde nor anie griefe or sorrowe arising from anie such feare since there was in his soule no wante of faith nor hope no not anie the least diminution of either as your selfe confesse but as the Apostle saieth FOR THE IOY THAT VVAS SET BEFORE HIM he endured the paine of the crosse and despised the shame And here you may see by your owne comparison the follie of your owne assertion For if your hellish sorrow be the only true and perfectly accepted sacrifice to God as you saie and without faith it is impossible to please God which alwaies hath hope and consequentlie the ioie of saluation annexed vnto it which you call heauen then can no man please God or offer anie sacrifice to God till hee bee both in hell and heauen at one and the same time and the ioyes of heauen are so coupled with the paines of hell that none of the faithfull can be in the one without the other but in both togither And thus haue you brought heauen and hell not onelie to bee euerie where but by your corrupt conceites to bee alwaies linked together Lastlie â—he fire of hell doeth somewhat trouble you and therefore you labour vtterly to quench it and aske what a toyish fable is that but good Sir if you would bring no more fables then I doe you might haue spared not euerie leafe but euerie line in this your vnaduised pamphlet I spake not in my sermon one word either of materiall or corporall fire in hell but I vrged the fire of hel to be a true created fire and not any metaphoricall flame as you here dreame from which since the bodie