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cause_n	believe_v	effect_n	faith_n	2,579	5	5.8586	4	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A13773	Positions lately held by the L. Du Perron, Bishop of Eureux, against the sufficiency and perfection of the scriptures maintaning the necessitie and authoritie of vnwritten traditions. Verie learnedly answered and confuted by D. Daniell Tillenus, Professor of Diuinitie in the Vniuersitie of Sedan. VVith a defence of the sufficiency and perfection of the holy scriptures by the same author. Faithfully translated.	Tilenus, Daniel, 1563-1633.; Du Perron, Jacques Davy, 1556-1618. Discours sur l'autorité.; Tilenus, Daniel, 1563-1633. Defence of the sufficiency and perfection of the holy scripture. aut	1606 (1606)	STC 24071; ESTC S101997	143,995	256

The Bishop of Eureux opposeth to the veryficatiō by scripture the attestation of witnesses as if they were thinges incompatible that cannot stand together as if a thing witnessed by them that heard S. Paul speake could not be verified by them that read his wrightings As for the Patterne of wholesome words if he oppose it also to the scripture What wil follow of it but that the wordes of the scripture are not wholesome words and I willingly confesse that they be deadly the sauour of death to all Blasphemers We neede but represēt his enthimenia in forme for to shew the deformitie of it Saint Paul referred Timothie to the wholesome wordes he had heard of him Ergo he referred him not to them he had written Notwithstanding that in another place hee exhorteth him to reading 1. Tim. ● 2. T m. ● 16.17 assuring him that the holy letters that is the written words are able to make him wise to Saluation perfectly instructed vnto euery good worke He answereth to this last place That they may instruct him to saluation not immediatly and by them selues but by meanes of the faith and beleefe they g●ue him in Jesus Christ not by the internall fulnesse of their doctrine but by the direction and sending to an outward supplie namely to Christ and by Christ to his Disciples Or else that they may instruct him in this speciall poin● that saluation is by fayth in Christ Iesus For Saint Paul speaketh but of the Scriptures of the olde Testament c. This is euer the burden of his song That the Scripture hath no other sufficiencie than a Letter of credite To confute these impertinencies as often as he bringeth them were to goe about to make them be founde lesse impertinent We neede but looke into the sixteenth verse following to knowe what sufficiencie the Apostle attributeth vnto it which he doth so particularly so exactly and so clearely that there is no braine so credulous or so blockish that can beleeue the bearer of this fonde distinction seeing how the internall fulnesse of the Scripture is represented therein with the right vse thereof which consisteth in teaching the true doctrine ●●m 3.16 in confuting the false in instructing vs in good workes and in reprouing and correcting the euil That the man of God may be absolute being made perfect vnto all good works Let vs conferre this Text with the Perronian glose The Scripture is giuen onely to serue vs for a memoriall a Letter of credence a direction to outwarde supplies namely to Iesus Christ and by him to his Disciples That is to say euerie one to his Curate And it is but for this onely reason that he maketh mention of Iesus Christ For howe else should it direct men vnto Christ seeing he teacheth no more with his owne mouth as he did when he was conuersant vpō earth And though he should stil immediatly teach on earth should we receiue sufficient instruction from him No truly if we beleeue this Bishop 〈◊〉 48. who boldly maintaineth that the things alone which he did or declared with his owne mouth to his disciples are not sufficient for the instruction of the Church Adde nor free from Error and by consequent of correction as the Councell of Constance could well shew him Con Const Sess 13. tearming it rashnesse and presumption to teach that Christiā people should obserue that which Iesus Christ hath instituted namely to communicate the Lordes Supper in both kindes Now I summon him to shewe how it can be that the Scripture serueth vs for a Letter of credence for a memoriall or direction to direct vs to the pretended Church since that he and all our aduersaries maintaine that it is for that Church to shew vs and to authorise the Scripture which without this testimonie should haue no more authoritie nor credite than Aesops Fables What preposterous Methode is this that giueth the Letter of credence to the bearer that should receyue it of him What can be more ridiculous Can wee haue a more manifest proofe for to shewe that his principall purpose is to make the Scripture vnprofitable and to bring it wholy to nothing Distrusting himselfe to be able to sustaine this same impertinencie hee hath recourse to another shift and sayth That Saint Paul meaneth Fol. 172. that the holie Letters are able to instruct Timothie to this speciall point that saluation is by fayth in Christ Iesus This glose as alreadie hath bin obserued is ouerthrown by the two verses following which represent the inward amplitude and fulnesse of the scripture as well for doctrine as for maners True it is that this point is the substance of the whole gospel seeing that whosoeuer beleeueth hath faith in Iesus Christ hath life eternal shal not come into iudgmēt but hath passed frō death vnto life And if the scripture did but barely propoūd this sentence only Iohn 3.24 without expoūding it without declaring the causes conditions proprieties effects of this faith they would be some apparance to put forth this distinction of Mediate and Immediate which in this case is as receiuable as it is fond and blasphemous in that ample description of the end vse and whole office of the Scripture which this place setteth forth vnto vs. And who will be so senselesse to maintaine that the Scripture is not fit to doe the office nor to attaine to the ende whereunto God who inspired it hath ordained it Is it because it speaketh not of blessed graines and such like trinkets But Saint Paul saith he speaketh here of the Scriptures of the old Testament for it was them that Timothie had learned from his childhoode at which time there was nothing of the new Testament written And these Scriptures of the old Testament could not instruct Timothie immediately and by themselues I answere that the Apostle speaking of the childhood of Timothie excludeth not the rest of his age but sheweth that he speaketh of the whole time of his life vntill then So speaking of the Scriptures of the olde Testament he excludeth not them of the new for this tearme Holy Scriptures is generall And to go about to exclude necessarily a Species after the position of the Genus is but bad arguing To goe about to take away the name of holy Scriptures from these two Epistles which Saint Paul had then written to Timothie and which at the least Timothie had read besides the other writings of the new Testament which perhaps he had also seene is to commit blasphemie But there needeth none other confutation of such Arguments but the representation of their forme Saint Paul maketh mention of the studie that Timothie made in his youth Ergo he speaketh nothing at all of his studies made since Item Saint Paul saith that Timothie learned the holie Sciptures Ergo he meaneth only the writings of the old Testament And by consequent he meaneth not that he should learne any thing of the writings

Moyses from Moyses to Dauid from Dauid to the captiuity of Babylon and from the captiuity of Babylon to Iesus Christ who was the light it selfe For this cause the time of the Iewish Church is called the time of Infancy ours on the contrary the fulnes of time If then the Scripture of the old Testament were a sufficient light to the Iewes though it was not so cleare as ours how much more ought we to content our selues with that light which we haue by the addition of the new Testament The B. of Eureux For as touching the booke of Iob to omitte that the most part of the Iewes and Mercerus with them and the principall Caluinists doe denie that the place that is there is to bee vnderstood of the Resurrection there is no assured testimonie that the booke of Iob was extant then when the Law of Moyses was giuen contrarywise most men thinke it was written since the Transmigration of Babylon which Ezechiell seemeth to confirme saying Noah Daniell Iob. As for Daniell and the other Prophets it is well enough knowne that they were more then seauen or eight hundred yeares since D. Tillenus his answer As for the booke of Iob in which the resurrection of the body and by consequent the immortality of the soule are found in expresse tearmes whatsoeuer Du Perron saith who wrongfully attributeth vnto vs the false exposition of some Anabaptists We learne indeed of the Iewes that Moyses hauing found this booke in the countrye of Madian where his father Law was brought into Egypt to propound it vnto the Iewes as an example of patience in their seruitude But when we say that this history hapned before Moyses wrote the Law wee are grounded on good consequence drawne from the scripture which teacheth vs that after the publishing of the law it was not lawfull to offer sacrifice else where than before the Arke or Tabernacle without speciall commaundement So that if Iob had liued after the law of Moyses neither woulde he haue transgressed the Law in offering sacrifice nor God haue approoued his sacrifice The age also that the scripture giueth to Iob maketh vs beleeue that he was before Moyses ● 10. who witnesseth that those of his time liued not so long Du Perrons coniecture who will haue him to haue liued before the captiuity of Babylon is friuolous he groundeth it on this that Ezechiell nameth together Daniell and Iob ● 14. whence it would follow also that Noah should haue liued in those times for the Prophet nameth him with the other The B. of Eureux And as for our sauiour Christes argument against the Saduces it prooueth indeede the immortality of the soule and not the other points But that argument till his time was vnknowne to the Iewes who for this cause did admire the infinitenesse of his wisedome And therefore it must needs follow that they had receiued the beleefe of it for to holde it for an article of faith by another meanes than by the reading of the bookes of Moyses to wit by Tradition from Abraham Isaack Iacob and other Fathers D. Tillenus his answer He sheweth heere that hee hath as little insight into the bookes of the Euangelists as in those of Moyses he saith that this argument prooueth indeed the immortality of the soule but not the other points that is to say the Resurrection of the body And notwithstanding Saint Matthew saith in expresse tearmes that our Lord cited that place of Moyses Math. 22 Exod. 3. ● for to prooue the Resurrection of the dead and that by this onely argument he stopped his enemies mouthes who chose rather to be silent than to continue to blaspheme Jf vntill then it had beene vnknowne to the Iewes as Du Perron saith Yet that sheweth not any vnsufficiency in the scripture rather indeede the ignoraunce of the Church till those times and the negligence of those that would not vouchsafe to trie and sound the depth of the scriptures Ioh. 5 3● as our Lord Iesus Christ did therein exhort them I know not why he findeth so great obscuritie in this argument of our Sauior For so great a Philosopher as he shold haue better perceiued therein the light of that Philosophicall maxime which saith When the whole is propounded the parts of the same are also propounded Put then that God is the god of Abraham of Isaack and of Iacob as saith Moyses Exod. 3 ● Jt followeth therefore that hee is their god both in soule and Body which are the principall parts of euery man But seeing the Saduces could not find or would not searche the Resurrection of the dead in the bookes of Moyses wherefore then did they beleeue it as little by Tradition VVhy did not our Lord and Sauiour send them thereunto VVherefore did he draw so obscure an argument as Du Perron will haue it from the Scripture if there had bene any manifest reasons in Tradition ● 22.9.29 6.29 to ●d VVherefore doth he attribute the cause of their errour to their ignoraunce of the Scripture And truely Abraham referred the brethren of the wicked rich man to keepe them out of hell not onely to the Prophets but euen to Moyses also 15.1 ●s 12.3 where they might see how God had sayde to Abraham that he would be his buckler and his exceeding great reward that in his seede should all Nations be blessed Which doctrine conteyneth the foundation of the substance of the doctrine of saluation Now put case that the aboue named points could not be found so manifest in the bookes of Moyses yet could not that conclude any thing against the sufficiency and perfection of the Scriptures which we haue in the Christian church For as god reuealed his will to the first Patriarches by word of mouth for to instruct them in his knowledge before there was any Scripture so did he continue the same manner of reuelation in Moyses time speaking to him as familiarly as a man speaketh to his friend instructing him of all maters yet neuer giuing him this liberty to ordayne any thing concerning religion of his owne authority Also Moyses very religiously conteyned himselfe within the limits of obedience not onely in the least Ceremonies but also in the publicke administration or gouernement wherein notwithstanding it seems he might haue vsurped a little more power but we see he wold determine nothing against him that had brokē the Sabbath but caused him to be put in prison till God had declared vnto him 15.34 with what manner of punishment the Transgressor should be punished Contrariwise the Romish Church presumeth to ordayne an infinite number of things as well in Religion as in Policy which they are not onely vnable to prooue by any Scripture but which also euen theyr pretended Apostolike Traditions cannot shew in defence whereof theyr mayntainers set foorth the aucthority of the Church which they say cannot erre Now although the Church of the Iewes had Oracles visions diuine dreams Vrim and Thummim

meant not that the rich mans brethren should rely themselues on that which they might gather thence by their owne particuler reading but that they should heare it from the mouth of the Pastours of the Iewish Church ●atth 23. who knew by Tradition the mysticall and spirituall interpretation thereof of whome it is said they sit in Moses chaire do whatsoeuer they say vnto you We answere that by Moses chaire is meant the doctrine written by Moses so S. Paul vnderstood it when he saith cursed is euery man that abideth not in all the things ●al 3.10 which are written in the Booke of the Law If our Sauiour Christ had meant that men should obey the Priests Scribes Doctors of the Synagogue in all things because they knew the mysteries of Tradition it would follow that they should also beleeue the Saduces who were of the number of these Doctours of the Synagogue and had sometimes the first places in it and by consequēt not to beleeue any of the abouesaid points Also it would follow that they which betrayed and crucified Iesus Christ executed this commaundement of Christ doe whatsoeuer they say For the Scribes and Priests said that he should be crucified so excellent was their knowledge of mysticall Tradition by vertue whereof the Priests of the Romish Church offer him really that is to say crucifie him yet to this day as much as in them lyeth for to shew what goodly Analogie and correspondencie the Romish tradition hath with that of the Synagogue Now let vs dispatch the point of the Creation of Angels and diuels an instance that the bishop of Eureux hath borrowed from Iulian the Apostata And that hee might multiplie with him the number of the defects of the scripture he cuteth it into three Cyril Ale● adu Iul. ● will needes haue it three distinct questions crying ignorance impudencie against me because I said that by this his distinction that he maketh betwene the Creation of Angells and the Creation of Diuills one might thinke that Diuells were not Angels in the beginning or that God created them thus wicked as they are now For to maintaine that these three pointes are three distinct questions he forgetteth or ouerthroweth the point and state of the principall question which is Whether it can be shewed by the writings of Moyses that there be Angells In stead of the Saducie he opposeth Aristotle who holdeth that the inferiour Intelligences which moue the heauens are coeternall with the soueraine Intelligence I answere that if he can obtaine so much of Aristotle as to admit and submit himselfe to the writings of Moyses as the Saducie professeth to doe it shall be verie easily shewed him in Deuteronomie that there is but one Eternall And if he grant me this little word of Moyses he will verie willinglie grant me Deut. 6.4 that there can not be then any other eternall substances with him and that by vertue of his owne Maximes or rather by vertue of the immutable Law of Truthe and of Nature it selfe which cannot suffer that twoe contradictorie propositions be both true together So as this Eternall of Moyses being alone will not suffer for companions the coeternalls of Aristotle But if any yet doubt whether our Bishopp is a Sophister or no let him obserue heere I pray his notable cunning He seeth that this Instance of the Angels cannot be linked with the former instances afore going Act. 23.8 and that the Impudencie of the Saduces who denyed not onely their creation or distinction but also their being is so opēly conuinced by the Writings of Moyses when he speaketh of the Angell that forbad Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaacke 〈◊〉 22 〈◊〉 19 ●● of the Angells that Abraham entertained into his house that tooke Lot out of Sodome that appeared to Iacob c. That no aduocate no not himselfe though all causes be alike vnto him can be able to sustaine it see therefore how he hath bethought himselfe to fit me by giuing me Aristotle for a partie with the Manichees 〈◊〉 64 whereof the one knew not and the others refused the Old Testamēt Let vs make the Analysis or resolution of this shamefull and more than ridiculous Sophistrie Aristotle beleeued that the inferiour Intelligences that mooued the heauēs are coeternall with the soueraine Intelligence the Manichees hold that there is a Beginning of euill coeternall with God and an euill God Neither they nor he receiued the writings of Moses Therefore it can not be shewed by the writings of Moses that there are Angells and and Diuills created If our Bishoppe had done as Carneades who before he wrote against Zeno purged himselfe with white Ellebore 〈◊〉 l 17 ●● he had better distinguished and discerned the Manichees and the Saduces than he doth yet he should doe well to take a dramme of blacke Ellebore since he will treate of Angells and Diuells that is to say of white and blacke Spirits The Christian Reader will conclude quite contrary to the Bishopps intention Namely seeing the Saduces denyed as well Angells as the Immortality of the soule and the other pointes abouesaid though there be made as expresse formall mention of Angells in Moses as of men of beasts of trees and of stones they would haue beleeued no more the other points than this how clearely plainly soeuer Moses had opened thē And therefore the true cause of their Incredulitie and misbeleefe is to be sought in the default of their owne malicious eyes and not in the defect that is pretended in the Writing of Moyses Now since the creation of Angels in the iudgement of our Bishoppe cannot bee found in this scripture let vs see a little what Tradition saith of it The generall Threasorers of the same should bee in my opinion those that are called by a speciall prerogatiue the foure Doctors of the Church which are Saint Ambrose Saint Ierome Saint Augustine and Saint Gregorie Let vs heare them vpon this point The first saith Ambr. h● l. 1. c. 5. Though Angels bee created yet were they alreadie before the world was created Which is a tradition rather of Origen than of the Apostles holden also by the Hereticke Nouatian Lib. de T●● Hier. in 〈◊〉 ad Tit. 〈◊〉 and the most part of the Greekes The seconde writeth thus Before the world was created howe many Eternities there were in which the Angels serued God without any vicissitude or measure of time c. Heere you see them coeternall with the Soueraigne intelligence as well after Saint Ierome as after Aristotle But the third namely Saint Augustine whom I alleadged for witnesse and warrant of my opinion which is that the creation of Angels may bee prooued by Moses contradicteth both the former and reiecting their opinion as most absurde to say that there was any creature before the world hee addeth That the holy scripture which is most true saith that God made heauen and earth