Linguistic DNA - Concept Modelling Demonstrator

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
cause_n	authority_n	pope_n	power_n	1,442	5	4.9516	4	false

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A20660	A disproufe of M. Novvelles reproufe. By Thomas Dorman Bachiler of Diuinitie	Dorman, Thomas, d. 1577?	1565 (1565)	STC 7061; ESTC S116516	309,456	442

quod iudicio iungit laude non diuidit That is to saie Let these wranglers knowe that they obiect superfluously that there is no speciall nor seuerall testimonie giuen to these bookes the rule and doctrine whereof is praised in all bookes * Note For the Apostolicall See alloweth with those bookes that it knewe before those that differ not from theÌ„ and those which it ioyneth together in iudgement it seperateth not in praise Nowe to conclude M. Nowell are you no otherwise a schismatike thinke yow then S. Augustine and Prosper I woulde to God ye were not Then woulde you acknowledge with S. Augustine a preeminence in the B. of Rome aboue other bishoppes the seate of Rome to be suche as hell gates shall not preuaile against it Then woulde you submit to the pope your doinges to be alowed as bothe S. Augustine and the whole councell of Afrike did then woulde you extende the iurisdiction of that See to England Scotland Fraunce and to the Easte churches Then woulde you confesse that the B. of Rome for the time being is the mouthe to speake to all the worlde and beareth the sworde of Peter to cut of wicked men to helpe and arme the good For all these thinges doe S. Austen as hathe bene declared and Prosper acknowledge Whereby appeareth howe shamefully you haue sclaundered them with the maintenauÌ„ce of your schismaticall and erroniouse opinions concerning the See of Rome To S. Augustine Orosius and Prosper you ioyne the patriarkes of Alexandria and Constantinople Cirillus and Atticus But why them I praie you M. Nowell Because in those canons that they sent there was no mentioÌ„ of that which the B. of Rome alleaged I graunte you for they were burned by the Arrians as by the reporte of Athanasius yowe hearde before And must they nedes be schismatikes with yowe because the Arrians burned the true copies of the councell of Nice and they sent suche as they had Howe holdeth that argument I praie yow Well yow thought euerie thing woulde helpe and therefore yow iumbled all together let it speede as it might * The answere to the obiection made of the African councell Nowe to returne to the African councell and to conclude in fewe wordes all that hathe bene or maie hereafter by me be saide therein I first saie that the African councell made no suche decree as yow saie it did nexte that at this time when S. Austen and the other bishoppes of Africa were assembled about the time of Bonifacius the pope the firste the controuersie was not about the vniuersall auctoritie of the B. of Rome but touching the moderation and limiting thereof in certeine causes of appellation The like whereunto as it hathe bene attempted and done in this realme of England in the daies of that noble prince Edward E. 3. anno 25. 27. the thirde by restreining the popes power in conferring of ecclesiasticall promotions and barring the triall of certeine sutes out of the realme without breache of vnitie or renouncing due obedience to that See so was it at the beginning in Afrike although after it brake out in to an open schisme Thirdly I answere that if there had bene suche a decree made as is pretended yeat this considered that it had but the auctoritie of one prouince it ought to giue place to that councell at the which there were present bishoppes not of Africa only who were also there but off all the partes of the worlde beside I meane the councell of Sardica in the third and 7. canon whereof the bishoppes of Africa consenting thereto 300. if you go to nombring M. Nowell for your 217. and chosen men all of purpose to matche with the Arrians agreed vpon this which the Africanes denied to wit that it should be laufull for any bishop condemned to appeale to the bishop of Rome Last of all iff you thinke M. Nowell that it maie be laufull for you to obiect against vs the facte of the Africanes who vpon suche beginning as hathe bene declared came at the last to open rebellion against their laufull heade I doubte not but to all that be learned or wise it will seme as reasonable that we obiect to yow againe the perfecte reconciliation and humble submission of the saide Africanes made after a hundred Epistol Bonifacij 2. ad Eulalium Alexand Tom. 2. Concil yeares wandring a straie after greate plagues by loÌ„gue captiuitie vnder the moste barbarouse and cruell Wandales by Eulalius the Archebishop of Carthage in the name of that whole prouince to Bonifacius then pope the seconde off that name Thus muche touching the African councell It foloweth After this Zozimus his successour Bonifacius the firste Celestine the first with all others allmoste folowing Zozimus steppes and Nowell b. â—4 ambition haue with toothe and naile striuen for this supremacie and for that purpose did sticke still to the falsified Nicene canon and haue likewise falsified other councelles in sundrie places and haue forged a greate many of the epistles nowe abrode in the names of the olde popes Clement Anacletus Euaristus Telesphorus and other their predecessours Suerlye M. Nowell if there had bene that sinceritie in Dorman yow and vprightnes that shoulde be in a diuine yff that grauitie and poise that shoulde be in a writer yff that common honestie that shoulde be in euerie Christian man yow woulde either for the one respect or the other haue so tempered youre stile that there shoulde neuer haue slipped from youre pen into the viewe of the worlde suche cancred and rancorouse slaunders against suche learned and vertuouse fathers so sclendrelie yea by no meanes at all proued Bring furthe the canons therefore that yow saye haue bene falsified name the popes that haue forged these epistles Name them not onelie but proue it otherwise yow wil be taken for a maliciouse Lier Thinke yow that it maye be sufficient for yow to borowe this oute off Caluins Institutions and without anie farder proufe bid Lib. 4. Inst. cap. 8. Sect. 11. all the worlde beleue you Yow be not Caluin M. Nowell nor England is not Geneua God be praised therefore But yow proue it thus Whereas euer those godlye olde fathers euer subiect to persecution Nowell fo 48. a. 3. and deathe neuer thought of anie suche matters neither had lust or leisour to occupie their heades and pennes aboute such ambitiouse matters You are foulie deceauid M. Nowel for the greater the Dorman persecution was the more necessarie must it nedes be to teache that ordre which Christe left in his churche of the necessitie of one heade that so the membres acknowleging the same might be out of the feare of all schismaticall discorde Neither made they so often mention thereof for ambition sake as youre spiders nature sucketh out hauing learned at their Maisters handes before that the greatest emongest them shoulde belike the least Who seeth not that Lucae 22. by suche foolishe collections as

Rome as it is manifest by these wordes as though the truthe coulde not saile after them c seing that this whole epistle was chiefely written to Cornelius to exhorte him to giue no credite to those schismatikes as by this amongest other may appeare that he saith to Cornelius Non attendas numerum c. CoÌ„sider not their nombre seing that the wordes rei certae probatione conuincere to ouercome by euident proufe againe Ita enim scelera festinant quasi contra innocentiam festinatione praeualeant for so do wicked deedes hasten as though they shoulde by haste preuaile against innocency be wordes of iudgement for where be prouffes offred where doe men preuaile in sutes but in iudgement finallie seing men that thinke them selues wronged neuer vse to complaine but to such as they are persuaded haue auctorite to helpe them of al these thinges it foloweth that in Africa where S. CypriaÌ„ gouerned the Pope was taken to be no foriner Nowe from Africa to Fraunce Of Arles a towne in Fraunce was bishop in S. Cyprians Fraunce time one Martianus a folower and professour of the heresie of Nouatus Of him S. Cyprian writeth to Stephanus the Pope in this wise Dirigantur in prouinciam ad plebem Lib. 3. epist 13. Arelate consistentem a te literae quibus abstento Martiano alius in locum eius substituatur grex Christi qui in hodiernum ab illo dissipatus vulneratus contemnitur colligatur that is to saye Addresse youre lettres to the prouince and people of Arles by the which Martianus being excommunicate an other maie be put in his place and the flocke of Christe which to this daye being scattred and wounded is contemned may be gathered together Now coÌ„sidre I pray yow that haue learning and wisdome to iudge whether it be likely that S. Cyprian if he had taken the B. of Rome to be a forriner in other countries woulde haue euer willed him to haue sent suche lettres as whereby he shoulde excoÌ„municate and depriue of his bishoprike a stubborne or wilful heretike when with as good right as M Nowell dother here the heretike bishop might haue bidden him go shake his eares foreine vsurper as he was and meddle in his owne diocesse with excommunicating depriuing and placing of his owne subiectes and let Arles in Fraunce where he had nothing to doe alone Considre whether these wordes and the flocke of Christe scattred c. maye be gathered together doe not argue as muche as that when peculier pastours doe not their duties recourse ought to be had to the bishop of Rome the heade and chiefe shepherd of all Finally Let M. Nowell considre whether he would him selfe hauing that opinion that the B. of Orleance for example in Fraunce were as he is a forriner in England write vnto him to sende his lettres to the citie and people of London to excommunicate and depriue M. Grindal because he is an heretike If he woulde not as that is to be iudged trulie he shoulde doe S. Cyprian wrong to make men beleue that he woulde playe suche a foolishe parte as he woulde not him selfe It foloweth therfore that in Fraunce by the iudgment of S. Cyprian the B. off Rome was taken for no foriner Spaine Of Spaine whether there the B. of Rome were a foriner let the restoring of Basilides by Stephanus the Pope to his bishoprike be a witnesse Against which sentence when S. Cyprian with the other bishoppes of Africa gathered to gather defendid Sabinus the newe made bishop they had no other thing to obiect but that Basilides the heretike had Cyprian Lib. 1. Epist 4. deceiued Steuin the bishop of Rome longÃ¨ positum rei gestae ac veritatis ignarum dwelling far of and being ignorant of the case and truthe by wrong information If Steuin the Pope had bene taken by S. Cyprian to be a forriner in Spaine woulde he not rather haue taken against his sentence that peremptory exception then haue vsed that which confirmeth his auctoritie in Spaine For seing the sentence was vniust for no other cause but because the suggestion was vntrue it foloweth that if it had bene true the sentence had bene good and the iudge not forreine but laufull Otherwise shoulde S. Cyprian neuer haue saide Neque enim tam culpandus est ille cui negligeÌ„ter obreptuÌ„ quÃ¡m hic execrandus qui fraudulenter obrepsit For he is not so muche to be blamed that was stollen vpon by negligence as he is to be abhorred that guilefully did steale vpon him But he shoulde contrary wise haue saide rather He is not so much to be blamed that to helpe his own matter tolde a false tale as he is to be abhorred that would presume being a forriner to meddle in strange countries where he had nothing to doe But S. Cyprian saide not so and therefore vppon this place and also the vertue and holines of Steuin considered who dieng after for Christes faithe a blessed and constant martyr woulde not it is like doe willingly suche wrong as to inuade an other mannes iurisdiction I maye be bolde to conclude that as in Africa and Fraunce so in Spaine also the B. of Rome was by S â–ª Cyprian taken for no foriner To come nowe to S. Basil Let his epistle written to Epist. 52. How the Pope was estemed of S. Basill Athanasius wherein he sheweth his aduise to be that the bishop of Rome be written vnto to sende his legates in to the Easte where they were to condemne the false councell of AriminuÌ„ be a sufficient testimony whether at that time his power were couÌ„ted forrain or vsurped For if they had iudged his auctoritie there to be none neuer woulde they haue vsed this word vt ipse auctoritatem rei conciliet that he may get auctoritie to the matter or deuised betwene theÌ„ selues to haue suche men sent froÌ„ Rome as might be meete to gouerne and admonishe those that shoulde be founde frowarde and peruerse emongest them to vndoe and ouerthrow the actes of the heretical councell holden at Ariminum before If S. Basile had taken the bishop of Rome for a foriner neuer woulde he haue sent to Rome for visitours Epist 57. to be sent from Italy to visite theÌ„ in the Easte parte of the worlde Finally if the B. of Rome had bene a foriner neuer durst he haue bene so bolde as to haue sent to Caesaria so farre from Rome his legates Lucifer and Eusebius to appease the strife that was there betwene S. Basil and Eusebius Grego Nazianz in Monodia By this that hath bene alleaged yowe haue hearde M. Nowel inough and more perhappes then you woulde toe to showe that S. Cyprian and S. Basile toke not the B. of Rome his auctoritie for forreine or vsurped So that I maie nowe be bolde to conclude that this first answere of youres being proued to be false there is no let in that but that my simple collection as you

by and by to be confounded as one in truthe and nature the names whereof be confounded Otherwise because the Apostles are in the gospell called disciples an Apostle and a disciple are all one which is well knowen not to be so Likewise though the termes of prieste and bishop were common yeat the thinges were neuer one in so muche that S. Austen making mention of the heresie of Aerius saieth Dicebat etiam praesbiterum ab episcopo nulla differentia secerni debere He saide Ad quod vult Deum haeres 57. also that a prieste ought to be distinguished from a bishop by no difference But what meane you here M. Nowell to talcke so much of the equalitie of bishoppes and priestes being a matter in this place nothing to oure purpose Or if it were seing it might be saide that euen as the olde canons as I declared before in that equalitie which is in priestehode vsed yeat In the 6. chapitre fol. 33. b. the worde Archipraesbiter chiefe prieste and ordeined suche a dignitie in the churche so there is nothing that letteth why in the equalitie of bishoppes and priestes while no one is more bishop or prieste then an other there maie How one bishop is equall to an other not be degrees notwithstanding of superioritie allthough not in the sacrament of ordres which is common to them all yeat in the execution of that power that is conferred thereby But perhappes you be of the opinion youre selfe that there ought to be no difference betwene a bishop and a prieste and therefore are the gladder to snatche occasion by all meanes direct or indirect to vtter youre minde therin Nowe foloweth vpon this grounde laied that bishoppes and priestes be by the first institution and the lawe of God one youre conclusion whereby you will make it appeare that you haue not without cause made mention of this equalitie of bishoppes and priestes So that all bishoppes which be the successours of the Apostles Nowell b. 24. be also praesbiteri that is to saie elders or priestes Whereof it foloweth also that there is an equalitie emongest all bishoppes by goddes lawe as the equall successours of the Apostles And that this is S. Hieromes minde in that place all learned men who haue reade the saide epistle doe well knowe This was not the minde of S. Hierome but is an idle Dorman phantasy of youre owne The learned knowe and to their iudgement I appeale that his minde was here to compare together the state of a prieste and a bishop in the sacrament of holie ordres common aswell to the one as to the other that so he might refell the better the errour of those who helde that deacons ought to be equall to priestes as appeareth by these wordes of his in the beginning of the epistle In this epistle ad Euagriâ— Nam quum Apostolus c. For whereas the Apostle teacheth manifestly that priestes and bishoppes be one what eyleth the seruauÌ„t * He meaneth deacons of widowes and tables arrogaÌ„tly to extoll him selfe aboue them at whose praiers the bodie and bloud of Christe is made Doth not this example put in the consecrating of the bodie and bloude off Christe the whiche the poorest prieste that is hathe as good auctoritie to doe giuen hym in the sacrament of holie ordres as the pope him selfe declare that S. Hieromes minde was no otherwise to make priestes equall to bishoppes but in the only ordre of priestehode common to bothe Yea but yow will saie that the Apostles were equall in all respectes for if you saie not so you can not conclude absolutely as yow doe that all bishoppes their successours be so equall If yow saie so that is but your bare Lib. 1. contra Iouinianum saing only not by the auctoritie of S. Hierome confirmed but most plainly by the same impugned Who in one place saieth that emongest the twelue there was a heade chosen Peter by name and in an other place that Christ made Peter In cap. Marci 14. Note the cause of appointing one heade the maister of his house THAT VNDER ONE SHEPHERD THERE MAY BE ONE FAITH Which is directly against the equalitie that you build vpoÌ„ But let it be graunted vnto you that the apostles were equal yeat shall not your coÌ„clusion folow for all that For it is to be considered that in the Apostles there is a double respect which is to be weighed nowe of vs. Either we considre them as they were all Apostles or as they were bishoppes As they were Apostles they How the Apostles were all equall were all equall they had all like power to preache and teache thorough out the whole worlde As they were bishoppes and rulers of particuler churches they were all subiect to Petre the chiefe bishop of all As they were Apostles that is to saye generall legates to plante Christes faithe thorough out all the world to founde churchs to preach the word of God finally to gouerne vniuersally in all places where their should come they traÌ„smitted this right none of theÌ„ to their successours but only Peter who was the generall shepherd of all Which is the cause that some of the fathers namely S. AusteÌ„ saie that the power giuen to Peter was giueÌ„ to him In psalm 208. in the persone of the church because it was not giueÌ„ to him alone but to all his successours to coÌ„tinue for euer As the Apostles were bishops of particuler places their auctoritie ended not with them but weÌ„t further to the whole church to coÌ„tinue for euer Now to applye this to our purpose howe doe the bishoppes that now are succede the Apostles They succede them as bishoppes not as Apostles For if they succeded them so who seeth not that as the Apostles made lawes absolued excommunicated and ruled thorough out all How bisshoppes be the successours of the Apostles the worlde where so euer they came so might the bishoppes that nowe succede theÌ„ doe the like The which thing seing we finde by no recordes sith the apostles time that euer it was practised in the church and if it should it were the nexte waie to disquiet al the worlde and to fill the churche full of schismes and heresies reason it selfe dothe conuince that the ordre taken emongest the Apostles was but by speciall priuileage not appointed to continue for euer or to derogate anie thing from the generall ordre begonne in Peter and appointed to be perpetuall as long as the church shoulde endure To conclude therfore I graunte to you M. Nowell that the Apostles were equall as they were all the generall legates of Christe but not as they had their speciall bishoprikes and charges limited vnto them In which latter sense because the bishoppes that are nowe succede the Apostles in which pointe they were not equall it foloweth against you that all bishoppes be not equall Iff yow will saye that the Apostles were also equall euen in that that

leane vnto so notable a lie The first exception against this testimonie of Leo is this Nowell b. 13. No man maie be witnesse in his owne cause nor iudge Therefore Leo his testimonie brought furthe for the preeminence of his own See is not to be admitted c. This exception of youres yow proue by reason by scripture by lawe First to answere youre reason if reason theire maie be in Dorman anie so vncharitable a iudgement I saie it is false that the holiest and best men be lightly partiall in their owne matters He is neither holie nor good much lesse to be accounted amongest the holiest and best that for the bettring off his owne cause will swarue from the truthe Youre testimonie alleaged out of the ghospell is not to the purpose Ioan. 5. For that place proueth not that allwaies the testimonie that a man giueth of himselfe is false but that when a man hath to doe with aduersaries that will not otherwise beleue him as the Phariseis woulde not Christ then he must vse the testimonie of other theÌ„ him selfe Which as Leo in such case you maie be suer did so wheÌ„ the matter was so farre froÌ„ being by anie aduersarie gainesaide that he made his commission B. 25. to the bishop of Thessalonica to be in his steade thorough out Grecia and other countries adioning as he did here what nede had he there to bring anie proufes where there was at all no doubte If yow will saie that I defending the auctoritie of the pope bring Leo against yow which are the aduersaries and that therefore nowe becawse you are against Christes vicair as the Phariseis were against Christe him selfe for so doe yow confesse that you M. Nowell confesseth him selfe to reason against Leo as the phariseis dyd against Christ reason as they did although perhappes yow woulde haue bene angrie with an other that should haue saide so much so I must bring other witnesse then him except I will take the foile To that I answere that you come nowe to late with that exception if it had no other faulte For to answere you who dispute so depely oute of the lawe like one that is not alltogether ignorant therein conclusum est in causa M. Nowell sententia transijt in rem iudicataÌ„ I nede not to expounde these termes vnto you who haue the marow of the glose euen at youre fingres endes For other men who haue not atteined to such knowledge I saie that seing in Leo his time when he appointed in this epistle the bishop of Thessalonica in his steade thorough out Grecia and other countries adioining in an other place the B. of Orleance or some other thorough out Fraunce Hormisdas bishop of Hispalis to be his vicair in Spaine the churches that theÌ„ were and in to whose power the churches of this time succede excepted nothing against these doinges of his in his owne cause as you surmise but suffered theÌ„ to passe till our time the space of 1100. yeares and odde I answere I saye for replie to youre exception that had this testimonie bene being vrged by the rigour of the lawe insufficient that yeat forasmoche as the churche from that time hetherto accepted it for sufficient you come now to late to propose matter against it To make the matter by example more plaine if my auncestor a hundred yeares past in a contention betwene him and some other aboute a piece of landes woulde vpon trust of the vpright conscience of some neare kinsman of his aduersaries admit him to be a witnesse or iudge in the matter whome he might laufullie repell might I if sentence were giuen against my auncestor by the meanes of this iudge or witnesse come after the 100. yeares and excepte against the witnesse or iudge Leo speaketh not nowe M. Nowell he gaue this testimonie that the giueth 1100. yeares agoe The whole churche iustified his persone then to be bothe holie and blessed It is to late and to muche shame also for yow to starte vp now and saye the contrary Thus muche might be saied if it were true that Leo had bene witnesse or iudge in his own cause But the truthe is it is not his cause it is the cause of Christes church and of the whole ordre of priesthod For he pronouÌ„ceth for that seate vnde vnitas sacerdotalis exorta est froÌ„ whence priestly vnitie Cipr. li. 4. Epis 9. â—libi came Neither is Leo in this place more to be reiected for mainteining the supremacie of Peters seate wherein he theÌ„ sate then are the testimonies of S. CipriaÌ„ mainteining the iurisdiction of his owne bishoprike against stubborne rebelles Shall S. Hieromes auctoritie against deacons who woulde be equall with priestes be of no auctoritie because him selfe was a prieste This is not the meaning M. Nowell of the glose as greate a gloser as you be The glose meaneth that in priuate matters that concerne the pope as he is likewise How the glose brought by M. Nowell is to be vnderstande a priuate maÌ„ he shal not him selfe be iudge but in those thinges which concerne the whole bodie of the church and beloÌ„g to the ordre therof and haue no other iudge in earth it taketh not away the power of being witnesse or iudge Pighius you saye alleaged beside the decree of the pope the councell Nowell fol. 46. a. 1 of Vienna lest anie man might estemethe auctoritie the lesse as proceding from the pope in his owne case And by this yow saye it maye seeme that he thinketh the popes onelie testimonie in his owne cause not to be sufficient Pighius was neuer of that minde that you would haue him seme to be When he spake these wordes he touched Dorman the humour and noted the fashion of heretikes and therfore ex abundanti he cast in the mention of the councell of Vienna which I coulde doe also if that woulde helpe the matter and for Vienna giue yow Calcedon for 300. bringe yow 630. bishoppes that called Leo the kepar of Christes vineyard vniuersal bishop with other termes to that effect I forbare to alleage I confesse so muche in one place off a 28. my boke the notable testimonies of Clemens Anacletus Euaristus Alexander Xistus Telesphorus Pius Victor Fabianus and suche other onely because the gainesaiers might happelie haue excepted against them that because they were bishoppes of Rome they were not in that cause which was there owne indifferent witnesses How saye you M. Nowell what gather you hereof That you might laufullye take exception to them as not indifferent If you gather so you wrangle with me My wordes that went before in whiche to iustifie their persones and to shewe how vnlaufullie you shoulde doe it I called them martirs and in the whole course of their liues verie apostles doe witnesse with me the contrarie Yeat saide I that you might doe it de facto not de iure as you maie kill a man in dede but

venerable memorie suerlie you haue with the better sorte not a little empaired youre estimation to vse suche cancred wordes and father them falselie vpon the councell But not staing here nor contentid onelie to haue saide this yow charge him further with the mainteining of one Apiarius against his fo 46. b. 19. bishop called Vrbanus This is a maliciouse surmise of youres M. Nowell and hath no grounde Yow saie that Zozimus pretended that it was decreed at Nowell fol. 46. b. 12. Nice that the B. of Rome shoulde be the chiefe iudge aboue all other bishoppes and that it shoulde be laufull for anie man vnder anie other bishop to appeale to the B. of Rome as to the highest iudge ouer all ecclesiasticall persones Yow haue made two lyes at once For first whereas Dorman to make men beleue that the Africanes acknowledged no maner of iurisdiction in the B. of Rome yow feine the state of the cawse betwene the pope and the bishoppes of Africa to haue bene that he pretended a decree of the councell of Nice to be chiefe iudge aboue all other bishoppes as though the Africanes had denied that and not stoode rather vpon this pointe to limite and restreine his auctoritie in matters criminall and causes of correction that is one spitefull lie As to them that considre howe in matters concerning A lye 41. faithe the Africanes submitted their doinges against August epist 90. Prosper lib. contra Collator cap. 41. Pelagius and Celestius the heretikes to Innocentius and this verie councell to Zozimus the popes by them to be approued how they required Innocentius to cite to Rome Pelagius the heretike being then in the Easte so farre from Rome it is a thing moste euident So that to alleage this facte of the Africanes truly helpeth nothing youre cause at all as by a familier example of oure owne countrie maie be proued vnto you It is not vnknowen that there be some places in Englande so priuileaged that for contractes made within those places they can be called froÌ„ thence to none of the kinges courtes yeat ceasse they not therefore to be the kinges subiectes Nowe if the Africanes pretended that they were not to be called out of their owne countrie to Rome for suche causes as seemed to them reasonable namely as they them selues alleaged because it was a combrouse thing to call witnesses for euerie thing by daunger of sea to Rome yeat woulde they not hereby take awaye his auctoritie and withdrawe their whole obedience The seconde lye is that the B. of Rome shoulde pretende that it Concil African cap. 105. A lie 42. shoulde be laufull for anie man vnder any other bishop to appeale c. That this is a lye the epistle written by the bishoppes of Africa to Bonifacius the pope dothe manifestly shewe in the which they making mention them selues of such pointes as were conteined in the popes lettres saie that the thirde was de tractandis praesbiterorum diaconorum causis apud finitimos episcopos si a suis excommunicati perperaÌ„ fuerint of pleading the causes of priestes and deacons before the nexte bishoppes if they were vniustly excommunicate by their owne Is this nowe sincere dealing M. Nowell to saie that the pope pretended that any man vnder any other bisshop might appeale to him whereas here appointing the priestes and deacons to the bishoppes of their owne countrie he releaseth all suche right But hereoff I shall haue anon more occasion to speake when I come to that place where you charge the councell of Africa with making a decree against sailing ouer the sea with controuersies or appellations to the B. of Rome In the meane season I will returne to the accusation put in by you against Zosimus Seing M. Nowell you haue for your parte done what you are hable to proue Zozimus a falsefier and can not I will for the iustifieng of his innocencie proue by suche meanes as a negatiue maie be proued the contrarie that he is no falsefier First I saie therefore that this canon of the councell of Nice was not onelie alleaged by Zozimus but if not before Zozimus was borne yeat surelie almost 100. yeares before he was euer pope by Athanasius B. of Alexandria by all the bishoppes of Aegipt Thebais and Lybia Who writing to Felix the pope make expresse mention thereof not by heare saye but of their owne certeine knowledge as they that were present at the making thereof Their wordes are these Nam scimus in Nicaena magna Synodo c. For Epist Athanasij et Aegipt pontific ad Felicem de in festat ArianoruÌ„ we knowe that in the greate Synode of Nice where were 318 bisshoppes it was of them all by one consent confirmed that neither councelles shoulde be holden nor bishoppes condemned without the B. of Rome his sentence that these and many other verie necessarie synodicall chapitres are burned and taken from vs * The heretikes burned the canons of the councell of Nice by heretikes which dailie molest vs and seke oure destruction that they maie thereby the easelier entrappe vs. VVhereupon hauing founde occasion all canonicall and Apostolicall auctoritie indifferently contemned they driue vs vnlaufullie * An absurditie to depriue bisshoppes vvithout making the pope priuey therto without making you priuey thereto from oure owne bishoprikes inuade the shepe committed vnto vs from Christe * The apostolicall seate maketh bisshoppes by the Apostolical grace and depriue vs of oure degrees To Marcus who was bishop of Rome before Felix they write for the true copie of the councel they make expresse mention of 70. canons that were there by their owne knowledge agreed vpon Marcus writeth againe his epistle is to besene that he hath not onelie enquired out the truthe of those canons of suche aboute him as were also present at the saide couÌ„cell but by searching the recordes of Rome had founde all things to be as they had written in their lettres Nowe ioine these two lettres of Athanasius together M. Nowell with the answere made by Marcus and crie shame to youre selfe that haue so iniuriouslie diffamed this blessed bishop as with the crime of forging a decree which Athanasius and all the bishoppes of Aegipt Thebais and Libia testifie by their lettres to haue bene trulie made almost a hundred yeares before his time in the couÌ„cel of Nice where they were present CoÌ„ferre now the testimonie of the bishops of Africa with the witnesse that Athanasius and the other bishoppes of the easte giue to this matter The one parte saieth they could finde no such canon in the copies that were sent from Constantinople and Hierusalem and no maruell the canons being burned as Athanasius saieth so long before The othersaieth it was in the copie sent from Nice to Rome The one parte denieth not but such a canon might be elles where The other saith there was suche a one and sheweth that it with other were burned by the Arrians

Dorman vaine or euill thing neither because the Arrians and Anabaptistes vsed it neither for any other cause you haue therfore beelied me once more I acknowledge it to be bothe A lye 80. proffitable and necessarie only I saie that to ende all controuersies it is an insufficient meanes Because reiecting the determination of the churche you take vpon you as the Arrians did and the Anabaptistes doe to mainteine youre heresies by this pretensed conference of scripture not regarding that suche iudgement belongeth to the churche therefore I call yow and iustly terme you heretikes And as I doe reiect this conference that you talcke of because you vse it to that ende that these heretikes did so doe I refuse all suche scripture toe as is falsely wrested as was that whiche the diuell alleaged In whiche sense because Christe and his Apostles neuer alleaged anie I can not finde faulte with them I can not you saye deuise a waye that shoulde satisfye Nowell a. 20. all heretikes withoute all contradiction or exception on their parte I can deuise no waie in dede M. Nowell to satisfie al heretikes Dorman it passeth my power I coÌ„fesse But God hathe deuised a waye to ouerthrowe all heresies if suche as you are woulde The way to ouerthrowe heresies be no let to his working And that is the thinge that ought to suffice vs. Will you knowe what waye it is Forsothe if this principle and grounde the which I labour to proue that Christes churche here in earthe being but one and visible hathe also one chiefe visible heade to rule and gouerne the same were thoroughly as it ought to be persuaded to all men then the heretike which nowe by coloured argumentes triumpheth ouer not onely the meaner sorte but also oftentimes many of the wiser and better learned the thinge called into question being either suche as is the question of baptising of infantes as whereof we haue no expresse scripture but onelye a tradition continued in the churche from the Apostles time and deliuered from hande to hande to vs either elles so perplexe and doubteful as the aduersarie will for his heresie bring not onely as many but mo textes also that shall seme to make for his purpose then shall the catholike as did the Arrian then shoulde I saye the heretike in al mens iudgemeÌ„t although neuer in his owne easely be discomfited and ouerthrowen For then let the Anabaptiste crie as muche as he woulde that the baptisme of infantes hathe no grounde of scripture the meanest man in a parishe woulde be able to tell him Sir the churche whiche I am bidden to giue eare to by the scripture vseth it and hathe done from the beginning this suffiseth me Againe let the Arrian bringe and heape together all the scripture that he hathe let him vse all his shiftes distinctions and gloses when he hathe all done the true catholike seketh after the interpretation of the churche that interpretation to witte that the membres agreing with the heade obserue and haue obserued vniuersally thoroughe out the whole worlde Thus if the more parte of men woulde doe as they ought neither woulde heretikes haue any list to publishe heresies their starting holes being by this wholesome remedie taken awaye neither shoulde they being brought furthe into the light be hable anie while to continue And this call I the ouerthrowing of heretikes and heresies For to persuade an indurat heretike by anye meanes I confesse it to be a thing impossible seing that not euerye man that is a true Christian can by conference of the scripture be by and by persuaded in all doubtes as you here vntruly saye he maye When partes be taken in opinions emongest learned men eache parte forcing the scriptures by conference and otherwise to make for that sense which he hathe conceiued is no man a true Christian but he that caÌ„ be satisfied in this case by the scripture Hath it not bene sene that the mainteiners of suche contrary opinions beinge for vertue and learning estemed of the worlde haue made also right good Christians to doubte And what case had Christe lefte vs in if in this perplexitie there were not a churche to directe vs if that churche had not a heade to speake to vs which being in S. Augustine and Prospers tyme Prosper lib. contra Collator cap. 10. Zozimus the Pope as you hearde before shewe vs nowe if you can why Pius the pope shoulde not be the lyke And thus you see M. Nowell I truste that you haue to muche abused bothe the Readers and me in labouring firste to persuade that I mislike the Scriptures whiche I doe in no sense or the conference thereof whiche I doe not simply but in this respecte that you contende that that waye alone is sufficient to ende all controuersies nexte in this that you altre my reason whiche is that because by this pretensed conference of youres heresies can neuer be ouerthrowen while by the subtilitye of heretikes alleaging scripture conferring scripture and that so probably that euen the best learned maye be shaken in their faithe and so heresie mainteined you make the same reason to be because there can no waye possibly be founde able to satisfie all frowarde heretikes Vppon this supposall of youres that I reiect this conference of scripture as no sufficient meane to ende all controuersies because it can not satisfie al men you aske this question And thinketh he that Popes of Rome men of suche lyfe suche Nowell b. 6. Holde the man a bowle for he will vomite partialitie suche ignorance such vntruthe such falsehode such bribery Simoniakes poisonners murtherers shal satisfie all men in all iudgementes of all causes and controuersies yea in their owne verye causes wherein they be parties and that without all exception The diuell they shall and that I may saye truly Non loqueris sed latras you speake not here M. Nowell Dorman but you barcke you reason not but you raile If all these faultes that you here heape together were in one pope at one time yeat shoulde they not be all any let why the same might not and shoulde not giue true iudgement and satisfie all good men To this I haue answered before where Cap. 3. fol. 8. b. 10 fol. 39. b. yow gaue me like occasion thither I remit the reader Yeat this I woulde faine knowe of yowe by the waie and desire yow when yow wright nexte to resolue me therein whether if these popes had the contraries to these vices that is so manie vertues yowe thinke they might giue true iudgement and satisfie all men If yow saie they could not what neded then this odiouse rehersall of so manie grieuouse faultes seing by no meanes they coulde If yowe saie that being good men they might then shewe scripture or bring reason to proue that this auctoritie is lost by euill manners In controuersies rising vpon the scripture the popes cause is not handled but gods and

that to deceiue the simple vseth here these wordes Yealde vp the honour and glorie of gouerning the whole world and church to god as though any man so claimed the gouernement of the churche as that he woulde displace Christe thereof Also you see that in this treatie hetherto as M. Dorman hathe Nowell not one worde out of the newe testament so hath he alleaged but only two textes out of the olde testament one oute of Deuteron cap. 17. c. an other of Numeri 16. which bothe make directly against him c. You see and knowe I doubte not that one texte of holye Dorman scripture is as good as a hundred You see that M. Nowell goeth guilefully aboute to abuse the simple by this terme nation as thoughe because the Iues whiche were but one nation had their chiefe prieste and high bishoppe therefore there shoulde folowe thereof naught elles but that euerye nation countrye diocesse or churche shoulde haue also their chiefe bishoppe withoute anye one heade ouer the whole whereas the Iues althoughe they were but one nation were yeat the chosen people and churche of God and emongest diuerse heades of seuerall tribues there was ouer all those heades one chiefe heade You haue seene that of S. Cyprians applieng of this texte to inferiour magistrates can be gathered no necessary argument that it maie not be otherwise applyed that is to the higher You haue seene as many as haue readen my first booke fol. 33. 34. 35. that Moises was a prieste that yeat there foloweth no absurditie of being two high priestes at once because as S. Augustine Lu quaest super Leuitic lib. 3. cap. 23. saieth they were bothe high priestes in diuerse respectes the one in commaunding to be done the other in executing thinges commaunded And withall you see that we are here by M. Nowell vntruly burdened of disobedience to oure Souereigne as not acknowledging suche auctoritye in the same ouer spirituall matters as was in Moises and Aaron VVherefore you maye well vnderstande that were it either Nowell proffitable or necessary c to haue such an one heade God woulde haue certified vs of a thing so proffitable and necessarie more plainely and exprossely then by two olde shadowes of the Iuishe churche which doe teache vs also the contrary God hath certified vs by building his church vpon one Dorman by making one generall pastour ouer all the rest that his Matth 16. Ioan. vlt. pleasure was to appointe this maner of gouernement in his churche But what meane yow to finde faulte with the testimonies of the olde testament calling them shadowes and to demaunde other of the newe hauing brought for youre opinion not so muche as one piece of a sentence out of either the olde testament or the newe Yow see howe blindely he going aboute to proue that there Nowell fo 120. a. 1 ought to be one onelye heade ouer all the church bringeth in for proufe thereof the regiment of seuerall countries kingdomes cities c. by seuerall princes seuerall magistrates and heades whiche maketh moste directly with vs that seuerall churches should in likewise haue their seuerall heades Yow see that oure question being whether the catholike Dorman churche of Christe whiche is but one ought to be ruled by one heade or manie M. Nowell here like the blinde bayard that he speakethe of saieth that my example proueth for them that it ought to be ruled by manye because many kingdomes haue many kinges wherein yow see that diuiding the church which is but one he goeth against the faithe of the churche Yow see that he dissembleth my reason which is that as a kingdom because it is one is best ruled by one heade so the church which is but one is best ruled by one heade Yow see that to this reason hetherto he neuer answered Yow see how often S. Cyprian is by him alleaged for the pope Nowell of Rome his supremacy in those places where he speaketh of Rogatian and of him selfe being bothe bishoppes c. Yow see howe the places of S. Cyprian and S. Hierom Dormna expressely mainteining the superioritie of one aboue the rest in euerye diocesse with the cause added for the auoiding of schismes brought by me to proue by more forcible reason the necessitie of one heade ouer the whole M. Nowell wresteth to the directe prouing of the B. of Rome his supremacy wherof in that place as it was not my purpose to intreate so if I had I had done preposterously and confounded my appointed ordre of writing Yow see howe the place of S. Basile brought to declare the maner off heretikes in contemning the auctoritie of their bishoppes he laieth to my charge vntruly to haue bene brought as spoken of the pope of Rome Yow see that the comparison made betwene Nouatus and oure protestantes of England holdeth in this that either of them laboureth to withdrawe the subiectes from their laufull obedience Yow haue heard good Readers the sory melodie of M. Nowelles harpe whereupon twanging on a false string he made a shamefull lye in saing that Vrsitius and Valens offred vp their recantation as well to Athanasius as to Iulius the pope Yow see that he hath oftentimes beelied S. Cyprian and S. Hierome feining them to make all bishoppes equall in auctoritie and no one to be aboue the other Yowe see his owne inconstancie and disagrement withe him selfe one while affirming all bishoppes to be equall and none to be aboue the other an other while denieng and making chiefe prelates in euerie prouince yow see him reiecting pope Leo as witnesse in his owne cause and bringing in the African to esbeare witnesse to them selues Yow see to deface pope Leo howe shamefully he sclaundreth Zosimus of whome the whole Africane councell wrote so reuerently Yow see howe he burdeneth without all maner of proufe Celestinus of whome Prosper writeth so honorably with other his successours to haue forged a greate many of the epistles nowe abrode in the names of Clement Anacletus c. yowe see howe he spareth no iniuriouse wordes to Leo calling him theefe noting him of ambition whome the councell of Calcedon called thrise blessed and God honoured withe miracles Yow see that he chalengeth vntrulie the copies of Leo to be contrarye one to an other Yow see that he is a plaine makebate and to mende his cause by setting the doctours at variance betwene them selues how he heweth mangleth and cutteth awaie from the auctors that he alleageth wordes yea sentences to serue his purpose You see in defence of schismes howe he laboureth to finde vnquietnesse emongest the Apostles and disciples of Christe you see that to deface vnitie as he taketh it from the Apostles so he attributeth it to the Phariseis and enemies of Christe You see for lacke of weightier matter he chargeth vs with the disputable opinions of scholemen and logiciners with diuersitie of apparell of diete and meates which maners as

iniuriously without auctoritie of speciall commission As for youre promise that yow make in place conuenient fol. 11. b. to bring good proufe that the B. of Rome hath wickedly exacted most vnlaufull othes both of subiectes and of princes c. when you doe so yow shall heare what I will answere in the meane season I count it but an ordinary brag Of the place of S. Basile epist 70. that it was trulye applied to the heretikes of oure time cae The. 5. Chapter M. Nowell woulde induce the reader to thinke that this place of S. Basile shoulde be brought by me to persuade that he and his companions were Arrians And therfore purging him self and his mates of this crime he concludeth thus Wherfore his sainges in that Epistle apperteine nothing to Nowell fol. 12. b. 18 vs who are nothing guiltie of those crimes and heresies but they are brought in by dreaming M. Dorman without anie cause and beside all purpose What nede this affected ignorance M. Nowell Yow Dorman knowe well inough that I neuer charged you with the Arrian heresie But thus it pleaseth yow to handle me as though yow might by this meanes bringe me in to an euill conceite with the reader by persuading that I alleage no place to the purpose The Arrians yow wote well for it is a thing incident to heresies had beside their errours in doctrine manie foule deformities in maners Now what a newe kinde of reason is this I praie yow that yow vse I am not like Dauus or Syrus in one or two properties that they haue Ergo in no propertie at all Doe you agree with the Arrians in no pointe of their maners because yow beleue you saye well concerning the doctrine of the Trinitie If you beleue well God continue you therein at the least some of your pewe felowes preteÌ„ding once as good affection therto as you do nowe haue come so farre that they not only haue blasphemed it in open sermons but protested See Staphylus in Englishe fol. 113. a. also to be readier to returne to their Cloisters then to beleue thereoff as the catholike churche dothe But let that be their faulte I saye not here that you be yeat come so farre which notwithstanding youre conclusion that you infer wherefore his sainges in that epistle apperteigne b. 18. nothing to vs is false For you ouerthrowe churches you pull downe altars you contemne the traditions of the fathers the diligent obseruation whereof S. Basile saieth in this place was condemned by the Arrians as a greate faulte beside other thinges as maie to them that reade the histories more plainely appeare So that when you called me dreaming for bringing this as not to the purpose you were belike youre selfe nodding Yow aske why these bisshoppes of the Easte whose epistle Nowell b. 25. I alleaged here wrote not to the pope as head of all the church but indifferently to all the bishoppes of Fraunce and Italy without any mention of the B. of Rome at all whereoff yow gather a folishe fonde coniecture and of that that S. Basile placed the bishoppes off Fraunce before the Italian bisshoppes which I you saie craftely dissembled that the B. of Rome shoulde not be head of the churche Trulye M. Nowell I neuer brought it to proue the bisshop of Romes supremacie I brought it to proue that the face of oure time was not muche vnlike to that of the Arrians and to that it is not impertinent For youre demaunde I aske you againe what if he wrote to the pope speciall lettres for his aide in these difficultyes And if he did how that should not make greately for his supremacie to whome he woulde not write as to a common bishop emongest other but seuerally to him selfe alone as being the head of his other brethern Trulye there is an epistle of his not many before this written by him to Athanasius wherein conferring with him about the withstanding of the Arrians heresie he telleth him that his counsell is that they sende lettres to the B. of Rome that he may considre the matter and Epist 52. giue his sentence that bicause it woulde be verye harde to haue first a common councell called and then so to sende from thence he him selfe chosing mete men for the purpose suche as shoulde aswell be hable to beare out the paines of the iourney as for their gentlenes and sinceritie off manners to warne and reproue suche peruerse men as troubled them should giue auctoritie to the matter c. Why might not this epistle M. Nowell be touching the same matter whereof he wrote to the bishoppes of Fraunce and Italie why might it not be that knowing the honour of that see of Rome to be so greate as it is he woulde by no meanes wright vnto the bishop thereof alone but ioyntly together with bishop Athanasius whose fame he knewe to be in the churche suche that he could aske no reasonable petition whiche shoulde not be graunted or what can you saye why the epistle written to Meletius that they two shoulde sende to Rome for visitours to visite their countrie whiche was in the Easte might not be concerning Epist 57. this matter How euer it be these two places argue that the omitting of the B. of Rome his name here was not as you suppose for contempte of his auctoritie And thus is this fonde coniecture of youres showed to be vaine and of no force Now for dissembling as you saie the ordre of the bishoppes named in the epistle truly you shewe youre selfe to be made euen of the paringes of malice who iudge so maliciously where no cause is For to what purpose shoulde I conceale that which no man coulde suspect that anie woulde euer haue bene so foolishe as to haue brought for an argument against the popes supremacy It foloweth S. Basile with the other bishoppes of the Easte Nowell fol. 13. a. 3. called the bishoppes alltogether brethern and felowes in the ministerie which they would neuer haue done had they had this opinion of his supremacy that M. Dorman and other papistes do nowe defende and maintaine But in the saide 70. epistle the saide bishops of the East which do not once speake of the pope do pray the Frenche and Italian bisshoppes to make humble sute to the Emperoure that he by his auctoritie woulde represse their ennemies the Arrians and relieue their miseries which maketh rather for the Emperours supremacy in the churche then for the bishoppes of Rome I tolde you a litle before of S. Basile his counsell to Dorman Athanasius to sende to the bishop of Rome for helpe against Epist. 52. the Arrians Wherby as it appeareth to be more then probable that these latter lettres were written to the other bishoppes of Italie and fraunce only not to the pope so is it euident also that the mention of the emperour and silence of the pope came not of lacke of acknowledging his auctoritie to

miserably shaken notwithstaÌ„ding the labour of the chiefe prelates of euery prouince Now to come to princes and teÌ„porall gouernours if they haue as many seueral or contrary lawes as their be seuerall countries or nations coÌ„cerning the keping of their people in ciuile ordre and peace what breache off vnitie What hurte What disordre in the worlde will folowe hereof I praye you So that to haue made this reason of youres probable you shoulde thus haue reasoned As in the whole worlde there is no disordre because seuerall princes haue seuerall and contrary lawes so in the churche will there be also none if diuerse bishoppes teache diuerse and contrary faithes But as no man is so blinde but he seeth the falsehode of this comparison so is no man I truste so voide of wit but that he seeth this to be as true as that which you made before Thus by reason we finde that schismes can not be appeased without one heade in the churche to whome the greater causes ought to be referred whome the rest ought to credite and obeye To the which heade because he is by Christes owne mouthe so priuileaged in Peters faithe that as he neuer yeat deliuered to the churche any erroniouse doctrine to be beleued but hathe allwaies continued the faith receiued from the Apostles so are we suer that he neuer shall we ought and maye in matters of faithe giue full and assured credite As by S. Austen we be counceled who to this purpose bringeth this saing of the ghospell Quae dicunt Epist 165 Matth. 23. facite c. Doe what they bidde you doe and addeth for the reason that in so doing oure faithe being moste certaine as being grounded not vpon man but vpon goddes promise can neuer be scattred by the tempest of anie schisme This being most true we maie boldely conclude that this state of Monarchie that is of gouerning the churche by one heade as it is moste necessarie so because we are suer that this one heade can not giue wrong iudgement in matters of faithe it is of all other for the churche the moste conuenient as being the verie best For in this pointe doe all men agree euen the moste aduersaries to this state that if one Monarche were suer allwaies to gouerne well that then that state off gouernement were to be preferred before all other To all this that hathe bene saide maye be added that iff you will nedes haue the seuerall diocesses and churches off euerie bishoprike to be like seueral kingdomes then as there is no only kingdome in earthe so by you it shoulde folowe that there is no one only churche in earthe Or if it may be enough for the church in earthe to be one body because Christe in heauen is the one heade thereof why maie not then the kingdomes of the earthe be in earthe one because Christe in heauen is the king of them also This being not I thinke vnknowen vnto you howe vneuen this comparison of youres was made yow will nowe leauing youre reason trie the matter by auctoritie S. Cyprian yow saie dothe most plainely teache that Nowell fo 32. a. 30 it is right and reason that seuerall bishoppes haue the gouernement of seuerall diocesses euen for the same cause for the which I yow saye doe vntruly alleage the necessitie of one heade To the place of S. Cyprian beginning Cum statutum sit Dorman Lib. 1. Epist 3. omnibus nobis c. I answere that it is right and reason that seuerall bishoppes haue the gouernement of seuerall diocesses and that to appease schismes and correcte vices as often as these thinges maie be in suche seueral diocesses commodiously done But that this maie be allwaies perfourmed in particuler bishoprikes and that if it can not recourse maie not be had to higher power that yow shoulde haue proued and that S. Cyprian hathe not Therefore this place maketh not against the auctoritie of one heade But you force it further and saie S. Cyprian affirmeth all suche appellations from a bishop off Nowell one countrie to a bishop of an other countrey to be vnlaufull for that that all bishoppes of all countreys be of like auctoritie and that none but naughtie and desperate men doe thinke the auctoritie of some bishoppes to be inferiour to the auctoritie of other S Cyprian affirmeth not here that all appellations from Dorman one bishop to an other be vnlaufull He saieth that it is reason and hathe bene ordeined emongest them that the subiectes of euery bishop haue their causes hearde there where the faulte was committed And maye not the B. of Rome doe this by sending his legates in all such cases of appeale to the places where the offences were committed there to examine the processe to receiue witnes to determine the matter Beside this if S. Cyprian had in this place vttrely forbidden all maner of appeales to Rome yeat by the phrase of his wordes it appeareth that it was decreed emongest them by a locall statute of their owne for the better maintenaunce of brothrely concorde Which as it exteÌ„ded no fardre then to that place so if anie of them that once agreed to that ordre refuse at anie time to obey it although it ought to be a barre to him that once gaue his consent to the coÌ„trary yeat is it none to the pope why he maie not procede in the cause who neuer renounced his right if it be appealed to him The like to this is to be seene in the colleages of oure vniuersities where the founders in most places haue ordeined by their statutes that the membres of such colleages for the better reteining and vpholding of quiet and brotherly agrement emongest them shall propose suche quarelles and contentions as happen emongest them to the seuerall heades of suche colleages This ordre thus taken right and reason woulde haue kepte but if some frowarde body not contented with this will complaine furder to the chauncelor of the vniuersitie or chiefe patron of his colleage he may at their handes haue iustice That this was the case that S. Cyprian speaketh of manie thinges may persuade First that he saieth CÃ¹m statutuÌ„ sit omnibus nobis wheras an ordre is taken emoÌ„gest vs all he giueth vs two thinges to vnderstande that whereas they toke suche an ordre emoÌ„gest S. Cyprians place expoundyd theÌ„ it was not ordinarily so before but accustomed rather to be otherwise or elles what neded a statute to be made to for bid a thing neuer any otherwise practised Nexte that it was but for theÌ„ only for he saieth omnibus nobis emoÌ„gest all vs. So that in other places he denieth not yea by these words he coÌ„fesseth rather that it was otherwise And therfore you haue done lewdly and made alowde lie M. Nowel to gather of this place this generall propositioÌ„ that all appellations from the bishop of one countrie to the bishop of an other be vnlaufull Whereas this ordre being taken

folowe that euerie diocesse hath not now one chiefe ruler but manie If you will not so saye then muste you yealde to this that Rogatianus complaining to the Archebishop graunted that notwithstanding that superioritie whiche he had ouer all that were of his diocesse there was yeat the archebishop aboue him And if these two maie stande together Euerie bishop is the heade and chiefe priest of his owne diocesse and yeat there is one archebishop aboue all then why may not these propositions stande together Euerie Archebishop is chiefe of the prouince where he is Archebishop and yeat there is one pope chiefe of theÌ„ all Rogatianus did here more then he neded who denieth that If the B. of London haue in his diocesse a stubborne and vnruly prieste who doubteth but he maie first punishe him by his owne auctoritie if he list And yeat if he refer the matter to the Archebishop of Cauntorburie he dothe the Archebishop more honour and sheweth him selfe to be the more humble The Archebishop is an eye to ouersee the bishop that he doe his dutie as the pope is to ouersee all So long as the bishop is hable to take sufficieÌ„t ordre for all occurreÌ„tes in his diocesse him selfe if he vse not this power but referre it to the Archebishop he dothe more then he nedeth but yeat honorablie for the Archebishoppes parte and humbly for his owne Where you saye that suche by S. Cyprian transgresse the Nowell fo 61. a. 1. lawe of God in the Deuteronomie that make them selues bishoppes ouer other bishoppes c. It is true in S. Cyprians meaning that is in suche as Pupianus Dorman was who being an inferiour membre no primate no patriarche no pope woulde take vpon him to iudge S. Cyprian the archebishoppe and iudge appointed of God This place includeth no more the pope who is heade bisshop ouer all other bishops and heade iudge ouer al iudges then it dothe note the bishoppes of euery diocesse for taking vppon them to be the iudges of the curates that be vnder them who in their seuerall cures be iudges in Christes steede it can not be denied For they haue power giuen them of God to loose and binde to iudge inter lepram lepram betwene syn and syn It perteineth I saye no more to the pope then it dothe to the Archebishop who iudging and ouerloking the bishoppes doinges falleth not I trust by youre owne iudgement into this faulte that S. Cyprian noted in Pupianus If then the bishop maye iudge ouer suche priestes as be vnder him Goddes iudges in their particuler cures and the Archebishoppes againe ouer the bishoppes without anye offence why may noâ— I praye you the pope be iudge of the doinges of the Archebishops and all other Youre argument which is this Pupianus the bisshoppe might not be iudge ouer the doinges off Saint Cyprian An absurde reason who was an Archebishoppe Ergo the pope maye not be the iudge off all other bisshoppes is like to this M. Nowell maye not make him selfe iudge ouer the bishop of London ergo the Archeb of Cauntorbury dothe not well and is a false vsurper in making him selfe heade bishop ouer all the bisshoppes and chiefe iudge ouer all the iudges in his prouince For such a one as is M. Nowell was Pupianus that proude arrogant man a priuate persone for anye thinge that appeareth to the contrarye as he is This propertie whiche you falselye note to be in the pope is the propertie of your good Lorde M. Grindall with his felowes who occupye the places of other laufull bishoppes yeat liuing and therefore make themselues as S. Cyprian noteth of Pupianus bishoppes ouer bishoppes and iudges ouer the iudges off God for the time appointed That the place of Gregorie Nazianzen was applyed aptly and to the purpose The 19. Chapitre BECAVSE I saye that I remembre a sayng off Gregorye Nowell fol. 61. b. 3. Nazianzene yow infer thereuppon M. Nowell that men maye note that I haue a good memorie c which notwithstanding had I yow saie enlarged to a fewe wordes going before it had appeared that these wordes being spoken of one god gouerning the whole worlde had bene impertinent to proue that there ought to be one pope to gouerne the whole churche You maye note good readers that M. Nowell hath more Dorman wit then honestie that can cauill at a phrase of speache pleasantly when the matter it selfe he can not reproue trulye For yow saye M. Nowell full clerckely that this place b. 29 is alltogether impertinent to the purpose Yeat in the verye nexte wordes folowing youre shrewde wit put yow in remembraunce that there was a waie how I might bring it to make yeat at the least some shewe to the purpose And therefore you saye Nowe if M. Dorman list to transfer the sentence from God gouerning Nowell b. 29. all the worlde to men ruling in the worlde after this sorte Nazianzene saieth there is one onely God who gouerneth all Ergo there must be one onely pope or heade bishoppe to gouerne all the churche I denie the argument and affirme that it foloweth no more then that there must be one only Emperour to gouerne all the worlde I reason not M. Nowell altogether so barelye as yow Dorman surmise that there is but one God and that therefore there must be but one heade to gouerne the churche The force of my conclusion dependeth vpon the reason why there is but one God which is this where many rule there is sedition This argument of myne I so little repent me of that I will here presse you with one other comming from the same moulde S. Austen labouring to proue the certeintie of one God emongest other reasons vseth this for one Sicut enim in ipsa rerum naturamaior est auctoritas vnius ad vnum omnia Lib. de vera religio cap. 25. redigentis c. For euen as in naturall thinges the auctoritye off one bringing all thinges to one is greater neither hath any multitude in the kinde of man any power but such as consentith that is thinketh one thing so in religion the auctority of them ought to be greater and of more credite who call vs to one Of the place of Gregorie Nazianzene as before I reasoned that as there was but one god in the worlde to auoide confusion so there must be in the churche but one heade for the same cause Euen so from this faing of S. Augustine I reason in lyke maner that as the auctoritye of them is greater in religion who call vs to one God because their opinion maketh moste for the conseruation of vnitye so ought their auctoritye and credite to accounted greatest who call vs in the churche to one heade Now what haue yow to saie against this maner of reasoning M. Nowell Yow denie the argument and saie that it foloweth no more then that there must fo 62. a. 3. be one onely Emperour to

That whiche foloweth is but a common place of railing wherein because you talke but in youre facultie I can the lesse blame you And to reason sadlye with an outragious rayler were but you wot well to preache to frantike Tom of Bedlem The foundation you saye of altars belles banners candels Nowell fol. 67. a. 3. c. leaneth to this reason of mine It was so in the shaddowe therfore it must be so now in the body in the truth in our church This reason you thinke you saie that I like as well as the former reason of one heade and that reason it is that so I shoulde thinke No M. Nowell you are fouly deceaued if you write as Dorman you thinke But what It semeth to me that you foregtte yourselfe Will you I praye you on high dayes when you distribute those holye misteries of youres weare no cope Or if you doe muste the foundation of the wearing thereof be grounded vppon the Iuish ceremonies No you will answere I weare it because the Quenes Maiesties iniunctions will haue me doe so And oure priestes weare them because the lawes of the churche will haue them doe so Iff of youre doinges the Princes lawe maye be the grownde Whie maye not the churche be the same of oures Now if the Prince may commaunde the ministre to weare a cope Why maye not the same commaunde the bishop to weare a mitre albes and tunicles Whye maye not by the same commaundement altars belles banners candels plentie of golde and siluer be brought into the churche And then if the Prince maye commaunde it why maye not the churche of Christe doe as muche Thus reteine we these thinges as commaunded by the church not as vsed by the Iues. Who euer vseth them so is a Iue who so vseth them so sinneth deadly Neither is the reason like why I should reason from ceremonies in the lawe appointed but for the while as you woulde haue me to that by whiche I argue from thinges foreshadowed in the Synagoge to continue in the church for euer You procede and after my maner of reasoning you aske Nowell a. 13. why you maye not also reason for the scriptures to be had in a language that the people do the vnderstande For priestes to haue wiues for images to be taken awaye seing that in the Iuish churche all the people men women and children had the scripture in a language that they did well vnderstand the Leuites and priestes had wiues and children seing that in that church there were no Images especiallie when reason beside the lawe proueth that it ought to be so Who can denie suche a frende his requeste Will yow Dorman gladlye learne why my argumente shoulde holde and not youres Listen a while and you shall knowe Firste for the Scriptures I take not here vpon me to resolue that question whether it be expedient that they shoulde be in the vulgare tonge or no. For I knowe it is impertinent to oure matter But to youre question I answere that whereas you saie that women and children had the scripture in a language that they did well vnderstand that is once false for firste that Hebrue tongue wherein the scriptures were written was not the common tongue that the people vsed emongest them selfes but suche as being peculier to the learned coulde not beinge vttred by the prieste be vnderstande excepte he did firste expounde and interprete it Nexte beinge writen without pointes that is without anye vowell at all noted in the texte as we haue it nowe pointed when or by whom it is not certeinlie knowen but by the learned Iues them selues as it is thought beinge gathered together in a councell at a towne called Tiberia it foloweth that the vnlearned coulde as euill reade it as vnderstande it beinge readen till it were expounded And for this cause the 72. elders had onelie power and auctoritie to interprete the scripture and to reade it to the people as here in the Chapiter by yow alleaged Moyses dyd This beinge Exod. 24. most true as for the first point we haue the testimonie of that learned bishop Theodoretus the B. of Cyrus for the nexte that of longe time the hebrue tongue remained vnpointed the consent of the beste stories howe had then the people of the Iuishe church men women and children the scripture in a language that they did well vnderstande being readen by other The wordes of Theodoretus are these Vocem Hebraicam arbitroresse sacram Quemadmodum enim In quaest in Gen. q. 60 in templis Graecorum quidam sunt literarum characteres peculiares quos sacros appellarunt Sic deus omnium per Moysen donauit hanc linguam non naturalem sed ad docendum aptam Siquidem cum reliqui omnes loquantur lingua gentis suae in qua nati fuerint nati in Italia ItaloruÌ„ vtantur vÃ²ce qui in Graecia voce Graecorum qui in Perside Persarum qui in Egipto lingua Aegiptiorum loquantur nihilominus nulli pueri Hebraeorum reperiuntur qui statim hebraica lingua vtuntur sed eorum apud quos nati sunt Deinde cum parum adoleuerint docentur literarum characteres discunt literis scripturam diuinam hebraica voce scriptam That is to saie The hebrue tonge I thinke to be holie for as in the Greke temples there be certeine peculier characters of lettres whiche they call holie euen so the God of all by Moyses hathe geuen this tongue not naturall but apte to teache for whereas all other do speake the tonge of theire owne nation wherein they were borne and they whiche be borne in Italie vse the Italian tongue being borne in Grece speake the greke tongue in Persia the Persian and in Egipte the Egiptian tongue yet notwithstandinge none of the children of the Hebrues be founde whiche from the beginninge vse the hebrue tongue but their language emongest whom they be borne Afterwarde when they waxe somewhat bigge they be taughte the caracters and letters and learne in lettres holie scripture writen in the Hebrue tongue Yowe here M. Nowell that the hebrewe tongue wherin the old lawe was written was no naturall tongue that the characters and letters were peculiar that is to saie not to be vnderstande of euery man and for that cause called holy as those were that the Grekes had in their temples Yow here that it was not learned by nature as are the Englishe french Italian and other vulgare tongues but by arte as are the latine Greke and Hebrue with vs. So that as the readinge of scripture in latine helpethe nothinge the vnlearned Englishman no more did the reading of the lawe in the Hebrewe tongue proffit the vnlearned till the reader did expounde it For whiche cause by the lawe the people was commaunded to Malach. 2. demaunde the lawe at the priestes mowthe who kepte it And thus much for the lawe for your reason that they that are bounde to obey goddes lawe ought to vnderstande it

or perhappes the solemne cuppe councell in Martin Luthers house at Wittemberg as I am to defend the couÌ„cel of Nice Ephesus or LateranuÌ„ Well M. Nowell neither shall you at this tyme bring furthe youre Confession of Augspurg or the solemne conclusion agreed vpon at Martin Luthers house nor I wil alleage Howe S. AusteÌ„ renounced the auctoritie of the Nicene councell either the councell of Nice Ephesus or Lateranum but the scriptures c. then I saie you coulde proue hereby that I who trusting vppon the goodnesse of the cause quit for the tyme the alleaging of the councelles were of the minde that the auctoritye of the councelles made nothing for the decision of controuersies And that this was the meaning of S. Augustine to relinquishe onelye for that present tyme the auctoritie of the councell off Nice that the heretike might forsake his schismaticall councell not that he estemed either the councell of Nice or anie other laufull generall councell so lightly as yow suppose bothe this aduerbe nunc nowe whose nature is to limite and restreine whiche yowe fearing lest it woulde marre all the marcket and perceiuing that it woulde be harde to deceiue the learnedersorte with this place alleaged trulie in A lie by omission 65. the latine but left owt in the englishe thinking that youre parte shoulde be well enough plaied if yowe were able to blinde the ignorant and vnlearned bothe dothe this I saie argue the meaning of S. Austen to be as I saie and not as yow pretende and also that he dothe euerie where against the Donatistes alleage Concilium plaenarium totius orbis the Lib. 1. de baptis contra Donat. cap. 18. Epist 118. ad Ianuar. fo 72. a. 3. S. Austen beelied â—â— Howe the scripture is iudge and howe it is not iudge of aâ— controuersies full councell of all the world and saieth of councelles quorum est in ecclesia saluberima auctoritas whose auctoritie is in the churche moste wholesome It is not to be forgotten in this place that where S. Austen calleth the scripture by the name of a witnes yowe conclude that he calleth the scripture iudge Which if he had done might easelie haue bene answered to be true also when the churche hathe declared what the scripture ment As the lawes of all countries are the iudges of suche controuersies as rise there but not the iudges alone because they be subiecte to wrangling interpretations and therefore requier an other iudge to iudge their meaning But seing S. Austen calleth not the scripture iudge but witnes yowe haue delt vntrulie by concluding more vpon his wordes then is in them To the places brought here by yowe owt of Chrisostome Fol. 72. â— â–ª I answere that we saie as muche in the commendation of holie scripture as he doeth For none of those places make holie scripture the onelie sufficient triall of all controuersies Therefore where as they saie we muste beleue scripture rather then men that if we woulde beleue them we shoulde fall in to no errours we graunte it to be true in scripture as it is deliuered by the fathers and expounded by the church For the first place of S. Hierom he there reiected an allegation of vncerteine auctoritie commonly called ApocriphuÌ„ about the person of that Zachary which was slaine betwene Matth. 23. the teÌ„ple and the altar which because he knewe was not receiued by vniuersall tradition there remained no other grounde of prouing it but by scripture where sith it was not he might well saie it is as easely contemned as proued M. Nowelles ignorance in the writâ—nges off the fathers The laste place non adferamus stateras dolosas c. is not S. Hieromes as yow trusting ouer much Gratianus to whom belike yow haue recourse for youre auctorities owt of the doctours to auoide either furder paine either elles because yow delight not muche in suche companie reporte it here Lib. 2. de baptis cap. 6. to be It is taken owt of S. Austin M. Nowell a token that manie a man speaketh to vse the olde Englishe prouerbe of Robin hood that neuer shot in his bow and maketh nothing against me who wishe you would in dede way thinges with lesse deceitefull waightes of scripture theÌ„ you doe The places here noted owt of S. Austen and Chrisostom B. 14. touching the conference of one place of scripture with an other of the darcke and obscure with the clere and light are brought to proue conference to be good and proffitable which we denie not But that which we denie and therfore yow shoulde haue proued neither those places nor anie other that yow haue alleaged doe proue First that allwaies suche conference can assure vs of the true meaning of the scripture secondarily that in this conferring of places there is no difficultie varietie or vncerteintie which we affirme and proue to be because to one man to the Lutheran it semeth that hoc est corpus meum this is my bodie and verbum caro factum est the word is made flesh are places of like phrase and speache to yow M. Nowell it semeth that Ego sum vitis vera I am a true vyne is like to this This is my bodie Why yow will saie I haue proued this by Chrisostome who saieth Ad ipsum diuinae scripturae scopum accedamus quae Chrisost in 2. cap. Gen. Homil 13. seipsam interpretatur and againe Sacra scriptura seipsam exponit auditorem errare non sinit Let vs come to the marcke of the holie scripture whiche expoundeth it selfe The holie scripture expouÌ„deth it selfe and suffereth not the hearer to erre I knowe that these be Chrisostomes wordes I knowe that they make nothing for your purpose I knowe and be it knowen to all men that they are most shamefully by yowe abused and mangled For whereas Chrisostome confuting the errour of those that grounding them selues vpon this place of Genesis inspirauit in faciem eius Gen. 2. spiraculum vitae and he breathed vpon his face the breathe of life mainteined that the soule of man was off the same essence withe God where I saie Chrisostome specially in this pointe saieth that the scripture expoundeth it selfe you make him generally to saye that the scripture dothe so in all doubtes The whiche to persuade the better whereas the laste of those two sentences of Chrisostome by yowe alleaged hathe thus quamuis sacra scriptura quum nos tale Chrisostomes wordes mangled by M. Nowell quiddam docere vult seipsam exponit auditorem errare non sinit Allthough the holye scripture when it wyll teache vs anye suche thinge expoundeth it selfe and suffereth not the hearer to erre yowe mangling the sentence cutt awaie the middle wordes quum nos tale quiddam docere vult when it will teache vs anie such thing lest by those wordes the reader might vnderstande that Chrisostome gaue there no general rule but spake onely of that special pointe

or some other like vnto it If this were not youre meaning M. Nowell why cut you of the worde quaÌ„uis at the beginning and these other in the middest Tell vs some other cause if you can Next after these auctorities you alleage a treatie of one fo 73. a. Borowed of the coÌ„fession of wittenberge Tit. de Eccles that you set furth Rhetorically calling him an auncient auctor printed withe Chrisostome and of long time taken for him to proue that the churche must be tried by the scriptures To this place I answere that whether it be Chrisostomes owne worcke from whence it is taken or no this is a thing moste certeine that it is to be warily readen as the boke which hath thrust into it if it be Chrisostomes owne or anie other catholike mannes by some false Arrian heretike manie poisoned and perniciouse sentences for the maintenaunce of the Arrians heresie Emongest other to note to you one or two euen in the. 48. homilie whiche is the verie nexte before this that you alleage here the Catholikes for mainteining the equalitie of Christe with God the father are nombred emongest heretikes and in the. 45. they are called heretikes that holde that the blessed trinitie is equall of like substance and auctoritie And therefore in suche places as this auctor who so euer it be dissenteth from the common faithe of Christes churche we haue iust cause to suspect that there this heretike who hath it appeareth ouerronne the whole hath dipped in his fingres and therefore that we reiect As in this place it is likely that he thought to make a waie for his heresies by chalenging to be tried by the scripture onelie the common request of the Arrian heretikes because the worde they saide Homousion was not to be founde in the scriptures But nowe if these wordes were Chrisostomes owne and not put in by the heretike yeat foloweth it not that because the churche is to be tried by the scriptures onelie that therefore all other questions maie be decided by the same alone For God whose wisedome diuised whose holie spirite brethed whose finger wrote the scriptures as for heretikes that coÌ„temne the auctoritie of the churche he hath so disposed them as Tertullian writeth that they might ministre them Lib. de praescript aduers haeres matter so hathe he againe for them that shal be content humblie to rest in the lappe of the same made that matter by the scriptures so clere that a catholike man maie be bolde to prouoke an heretike yea all the heretikes in the worlde to dispute by scripture onelie of that question whiche and where is the true churche And suerlie so was it expedient that it shoulde be that the churche whiche shoulde iudge of the true sense and meaning of the scriptures shoulde by the scriptures be so euidentlie proued that about that their might be no wrangling As it is not to be merueiled therefore if anie catholike man giue councell to proue the church by the scriptures the scriptures speaking of the churche as hath S. Austen more plainelie then they â—narrat in psal 30 doe of Christe him selfe and therto being writteÌ„ so euideÌ„tly that the textes making for the trial therof nede no interpretatioÌ„ Lib. de vnitate ecdes ca. 16 so can you not reason that all other controuersies in semblable wise must be tried by the scripture because the scripture is more ambiguouse in other maters and because the church is proued so plainelie that it might afterwarde hauing the continuall assistence of Goddes holie spirite and being the piller of truthe assuer vs being in doubte of the true meaning of scripture And thus muche for answere to your long place alleaged to so little purpose out of that auncient auctor printed withe Chrisostome and of long time takeÌ„ for him By whose auctoritie lest the worekes of S. Clement making so muche against youre newe A sleight of M. nowells doctrine might get anie credite being here alleaged by this auncient auctor printed with Chrisostome and of long time taken for him you toke youre pen in to youre hande and cut that sentence clene awaie Hauing nowe spent youre store of testimonies brought fo 74. b. 9 by you to proue that the scripture alone ought to be the iudge of all controuersies you returne to youre olde plea so often auouched and neuer proued that we be the phariseis and therfore can not be the true churche of god that you alleage scriptures against vs as the Apostles did against the phariseis of whom and vs you saye furder as foloweth And I am suer that the high prieste withe his Iuishe churche Nowell b. 29. was able to saye as muche for the ordinarie succession of the highe priestes his predecessours euen from Aaron vntill his time for antiquitie for consent and for vniuersality against Christe and his Apostles so fewe in comparison and as it semed latelye start vp as yowe are able to saye for youre churche or againste vs. But yeat we doe thinke that the worde of God as it was alleaged by Christe and hys Apostles againste the saide high prieste and his churche so maye it and ought it allso to be alleaged by vs againste youre highe prieste and youre churche cet What so euer the Phariseis had to saye againste the Apostles Dorman for them selues they had not this to saye whiche we haue againste you that theire churche was by the testimonies of the Scriptures promised to continue for euer The Apostles proued to them the contrary oute of the scriptures if you can doe the lyke to vs and shewe by euident scriptures that the churche of Christe shoulde for the space of fiftene hundred or nine hundred yeares either be ouerthrowen and at the length restored by a newe Messias we renounce the benefite off succession we giue ouer antiquitie consent vniuersalitye and what so euer elles Thus alleaged the Apostles the worde of God against the Phariseis Thus must you alleage it against vs if you will alleage it at all And whether you be so or no the true church of god seing it Nowell fol. 75. a. 23. is in question and a greater doubte and controuersie emongest men I am suer then can be aboute the sense of anye place off the scripture yow shall neuer be hable to make anie exception to the scripture as no competent iudge in controuersies but we shall be able ten tymes more to make exception to youre Pope and his churche as no indifferent nor meete iudge We make no exception nor euer did againste the scripture Dorman as of it selfe an incompetent iudge to determine controuersies This we saye that the frowardenes of men addicted to mainteine their once receiued opinions maketh that the scripture is not alone sufficient to decide the same till the church haue giuen sentence betwene those that shall thus contende which is the true meaning of the scripture How the scripture decideth controuet

present when he saide Qui minor est Lucae 9. inter vos omnes hic maior est He that is the leaste emongeste you all is the greatest Belike you woulde haue asked hym how one could be the greater and the lesse But do you not youre selfe confesse that euerye bishop is the heade of hys diocesse And howe then M. Nowell doth that agree I vse youre owne wordes with the humble ecclesiastical ministery Is your heade the bishop a headye seruant and a seruile heade Kinges and Princes are they not the heades of the people whome they gouerne and yeat in that verie respecte that they be heades ministres notwithstanding as S. Paule witnesseth Rom. 13. and seruantes M. Dorman harpeth to muche vpon one string oute of tune Nowell b. 16. for his purpose I meane the example off the Iuish high prieste cet Who twangeth moste vppon one string that let the learned Dorman reader iudge Once this is suer that the string that you shoulde strike here you touche not so muche as once For I bringe not in this example of the high prieste off the Iues at this tyme as because I once did you dreame that I doe still to proue that there ought to be one onelye heade in Christes churche as there was emongest the Iues but to detecte the vanitie of this reason of youres Christe is heade of the churche and able to rule the same him selfe alone ergo there nedeth no other To this answered I so was M. Nowell dissembleth my reasoÌ„ and twaÌ„geth vpoÌ„ a false string he being God heade of the Iuish Synagoge also and as wel hable to rule the same without anye helpe or meanes as he is nowe to rule his churche Yeat was his pleasure to appointe a highe prieste c. And therefore that ought to be no reason to persuade vs that he dothe not or maye not do the lyke nowe To this because yow were not hable to replye you dissembled my meaning as a little before in this verye place you doe when you saye that my examples make rather against me then with me The whiche practise you vse also hereafter as in place shal be declared For this matter I haue no more to saye but to aduise you that you take youre harpe into youre hande and twang once vpon the right string In prosecuting the confutation of that naughtie argument fol. 80. a. 24. 1. Reg. 15. of youre Apologie I vse the examples of Saule called in the scripture the heade ouer the tribues of Israel of the husbande called by Paule the heade of his wife off the 1. Cor. 11. Archebishoppe heade ouer the other bishoppes of his prouince and conclude thereupon that as it is no good reason to saye God was heade of the tribues of Israel therefore Saule was not Christe is heade of vs all men and wemen therefore the husbande is not heade of the wife The Arche bishoppe is heade of the other bishoppes of his prouince Therefore the bishoppes be not hedes euen so that the argument of youre Apologie Christe is heade of his churche therfore there is no other head is a faulty argument because if it were good it shoulde exclude also whiche it dothe not the other heades that I named confessed to be true heades in earthe For quae ratio partis ad partem eadem totius ad totum the same proportion that is of the parte to the parte the same is the proportion of the whole to the whole that is if their maie be a heade of one diocesse in earthe which is parte of the whole notwithstanding that God is heade of the whole there is no let by this argument but there maie be an other heade also vnder him ouer the whole And so I proue the reason of the Apologie naught in the whole quia non valet in partibus because it is not good in the partes To this reason of mine you neuer make answere but dissembling it as you did the other before you saie that I bring these examples to proue that there be diuerse seuerall b. 13. heades in earthe vnder Christe So I did in dede But why woulde I proue that To proue that there ought to be one heade ouer the whole Why saye you so for shame M. Nowell Why dissemble you that whiche anye man that hathe his common sense can not but see to be otherwise I bringe it to shewe howe absurde it is for you to graunte that ouer the tribues off Israel there maye be a heade ouer seuerall churches there maye be heades withoute derogation to Christes honour who is the chiefe and yeat you will not graunte so muche to the whole churche for the impediment of that pretended reason because Christe is the heade which letteth not in particuler churches And therfore neither Hosius nor I care whether Saul were head of the tribue of Leui or no this example prouing how euer it were sufficiently our intent whiche is to disproue your folishe reason that because Christ is heade of his church there nedeth no other When Hosius or I alleage this place to gather thereby that there ought to be one head in earth vnder Christ ouer all churches then we will folowe your minde in coÌ„cluding In the meane season we take youre argument that because Christe is the onelie heade ouer the vniuersall churche therefore there nedeth no other generall heade vnder him to be by this example sufficiently confuted as before I shewed Yeat because your desire is that it maie be considered whether when the scripture saieth that Saul was made heade of the tribues of IsraeÌ„l he were appointed heade ouer the tribue of Leui also that is ouer the cleargie considre it I praie yow and spare not and when yow haue all considered and done yow shall perceiue howe muche this exemption of the cleargie from the auctoritie of king Saul maketh against yow and youre companions that will make kinges to rule the cleargie in causes ecclesiasticall I doubte not but some of youre side that haue more staied heades then yowe and that are lesse passionat will saie that yowe might haue kepte this consideration to youre selfe still And where yow mingle kinges and bishoppes together whose Nowell b. 30. fo 81. a. 1. offices are distinct and vse the examples of the Archebishop off Cauntorbury and the bishop of London what titles so euer your bishoppes when they were in those roumes vsed or abused I am suer they who be nowe in place take it for their chiefe honour to be and to be called also gods ministers in his churche What a worlde is this when protestantes complaine of Dorman mingling kinges and bishoppes together As though the worlde knewe not who confoundeth and iumbleth together these two offices they or we But the faulte is founde with me for reasoning from their offices whiche be distincte Why yow knowe M. Nowell if you haue not forgotten youre logicke that it

is not necessarie that thinges compared should be one in all pointes They agree in this that kinges and bishoppes are bothe heades and gouernours the pointe where in the comparison was made Nowe whereas to this that I saie that the B. of Cauntorbury is heade off the bishoprike and diocesse of London as he is of all the bishoprikes within his prouince and that yeat a man can not infer vpon this that therefore the bishopp of London is not heade of that his diocesse as yow doe in saing that because Christe is heade of the whole churche therfore there is no other vnder him whereas I saie to this yow answere that youre bishoppes take it for theire chiefe honour to be and to be called gods ministres in his churche so doe oure bishoppes to M. Nowell and vsed no other titles then those whiche your false bishoppes hauing falsely vsurped vse and abuse at this daie but what is that to the matter that we entreate of Well be bolde man and blushe not coffe owt that tuffe fleaume that lieth in youre throte and saie that the archebishop is of no more power then the bishop If yow had saide thus then had yow answered yeat some thing whereas nowe yowe haue answered nothinge Except this maie stande for youre answere when yow proue it that neither Archebishop nor bishop maie be called heades of the churches fo 81. a. 6. that they gouerne but rather kinges and princes Whiche opinion because yowe see that it is contrarie to all M. Nowell laboureth to helpe his owne contradiction by a folishe shift that yow saied before touching the places of S. Cyprian and S. Hierome where yowe confessed so often that euerie bishop was heade of his owne diocesse to salue that sore yow saie Yeat I denie not but that bishoppes maie be and haue bene Nowell a. 17. though improprely named heades euen by good writers as the scholemaister of a prince in that the prince is his scholer is his heade c. Surely bishoppes are muche beholden vnto yowe that Dorman yow graunte them so muche auctoritie ouer their flocke as yow had ouer your scholers when yow were scholemaister of Westminstre But I praie you M. Nowell cal to your remeÌ„braunce that S. Ciprian saieth of the bishop that he is in the diocesse where he ruleth the iudge in Christes stede that S. Hierom calleth him the high prieste that he must he saieth haue pearelesse auctoritie aboue all other that schismes rise by not obeing him and iudge with your selfe what a handsome comparison you haue made But admitting euen youre owne similitude you shall see how muche you haue saide for the auctoritie of bishoppes against that vnlaufull othe which you exact of all men EueÌ„ as the scholemaistre is in his schole the heade of his scholers allthough they be princes so be bishoppes the heades of suche as be in their seuerall bishoprikes all though they be princes but the scholemaister in his schoole is the supreme gouernour in all thinges and causes belonging to the schole his scholers allthough princes hauing in those thinges no power to commaunde Ergo the bishoppes are euery one in his churche the supreme gouernours in all thinges ecclesiasticall and princes haue no auctoritie to entremedle therein The which conclusion deduced M. nowell from your comparison as youre selfe with honestie can not mislike so I trust it shall displease no prince considering that as S. Ambrose saieth there can be nothing more honorable for Epist 32. ad Valent. the Emperour then to be called the sonne of the churche For a good Emperour saieth he is within the churche not aboue the churche But because this sentence is become nowe in Englande by the meanes of certeine clawbackes to be odioufe I will in defence of M. Nowell if anie perhappes woulde quarell with him for giuing to bishoppes so greate auctoritie adde out of Chrisostome of huÌ„dreds of places that might be brought to that effect only one which is this QuanquaÌ„ nobis admirandus videtur thronus regius ob geÌ„mas affixas Homil. 5. de Esaiae verbis vidi DominuÌ„ The power of the prince and of the priest auruÌ„ quo obcinctus est tamen rerum terrenaruÌ„ administrationeÌ„ sortitus est nec vltra potestatem hanc preterea quicquaÌ„ habet auctoritatis verum sacerdoti thronus in coelis collocatus est de coelestibus negotijs pronunciandi habet auctoritatem That is to saye Allthough the kinges throne seme to vs merueilouse for the pretiouse stones and golde wherewith it is garnished yeat hath he only the administration of earthly thinges and aboue this power he hathe no auctoritie but the priest hathe his throne in heauen and auctoritie to pronounce of heauenly affaires And thus muche by occasion of the auctoritie that you giue to bishoppes as greate ouer their diocesse as schoolemaisters haue ouer their schooles I woulde furder if it were not for troubling you haue desired you to haue named some good auctor to iustifie this saing of youres that bishoppes when they be called heades are so called improperly But I refer that to youre good discretion and to your better laisour Whether Christe nede to haue one to gouerne his churche vnder him and howe The 23. Chapitre IT IS true the Apologie and we all likewise saye that neither Nowell a. 30. b. 1. hathe Christe nede of anie suche one only heade vicair ouer all his churche which M. Dorman a little before dothe confesse him selfe neither is it Christes will to haue any suche heade vicair For though M. Dorman affirme that he so woulde yeat shall he neuer by the holie scripture wherein Christes will is declared be able to prome it Thirdly it is impossible for anie earthely man to haue and to execute anie suche office c. For the proufe of the first of these thre pointes yow Dorman bring my selfe for a witnes in my boke fo 9. b. Where I haue no such thing but onelie this that Christe had as little nede to gouerne his churche in the olde lawe by the helpe of one heade as he hath nowe I denied not then but he had nede nowe Therefore you continue youre accustomed wont of beelieng me If you aske me how he hath nede A lye 69. which is God I answere that as he neded the witnesse of men as appeareth by this There was a man sent from God Ioan. 1. whose name was Iohn to beare witnes of the light And againe Ioan. 15. Yow shall beare witnes of me because yow haue ben withe me from the beginning for the infirmities sake of men not for him selfe so for vs which can not commodiously be gouerned Howe God nedeth a heade to gouerne his churche nor well kept in orde without one heade a man as we are oureselues to whome in all controuersies we might haue recourse God hath nede of suche a heade Thus take I neede now taking it in youre

there is no nede to write or saye anye thinge because I haue no ennemie at all And therefore he addeth For M. Dorman can not be ignorant that we in all oure Sermones Nowell fol. 123. a. 25. and writinges of suche matters doe make a moste cleere and euident difference betwene the functions and offices of princes ciuile magistrates and priestes ecclesiasticall ministres and neither did we euer teache that princes ought neither did they euer desire to execute the offices ecclesiasticall off ministring the Sacramentes preaching excommunicating absoluing and suche like I am not ignorant in deede of this qualification of youres Dorman inuented the rather to intice some seely soules to the taking of youre othe Whome in deede I maye well call seely that will therby any thing the soner be moued For youreselfe are not ignoraunt I trowe M. Nowell that the causes why we stande with you in this matter are not onelye for ministring the Sacramentes for preaching excommunicating absoluing but as I tolde yow and you here guilefully conceale this power extendeth farder to the giuing and making of lawes for the churche to auctoritie to iudge of doctrine wherewith the meÌ„bres must be fedde whether it be souÌ„de or otherwise for these be offices that beloÌ„g to the heade not to the membres excepte you will saie that the sheepe ought to iudge what meate is conuenient for them not the shepherde Againe to appease schismes is the office not of inferiour meÌ„bres but of the heade it selfe and yeat belongeth as youre selfe haue graunted to the chiefe prelaces of euery prouince Finally to be heade of the churche is to haue the gouernement of so manye soules as be in that churche whiche because no laye man c. can haue in Note this reason particuler bishoprickes it foloweth that none can haue ouer the whole churches of a realme vnited Of the whiche matter Chrisostome saieth At quum de ecclesiae praefectura Lib. 2. de Sacerdotio de credenda huit vel illi tam multarum animarum cura agitur vniuersa quidem muliebris natura functionis istius moli ac magnitudini coedat oportet itemque bona viroruÌ„ pars But when the question is of the gouernement of the churche of the committing to this man or that the charge of so many soules then must all the kinde of women giue place to the burden and greatenes of this office yea and a greate parte of men also You bring the examples of king Dauid Salomon c. who you saye had auctoritie in gouerning of the cleargie and churche matters though they might not execute all ecclesiasticall functions and offices This matter is answered in my first booke fol. 31. sequ Thither I referre the Reader What though oure moste graciouse souereigne ladye being a Nowell woman haue not so greate skill in feates of warre as haue her capitaines haue not so good knowledge in the lawes of her realme as her Iustices and other learned men in the lawes haue thoughe she haue in al good learning and in the scriptures toe more knowledge then had anie of youre popes these seuen hundred yeares I beleue and therfore no lette in that pointe but she maie be heade of the whole churche aswell and rather then the pope What if she fitte not in publike iudgement nor determine controuersies as doe her Iustices c. what I saie if she can not execute all ciuile offices in her owne persone woulde yow therfore take from her her ciuile principalitie c Surely yow maie with as good reason doe it as yow would take awaie her superioritie ouer her cleargie from her for that she can not maie not nor will not execute ecclesiasticall functions Your comparison is false M. Nowell For there is no lawe Dorman neither of goddes nor mannes that forbiddeth a Quene although a woman to sitte in iudgemeÌ„t or to be present with her armye in battaile as Delbora did both So that the not Iudic. cap. 5. doing herof procedeth not of lacke of habilitie or power as contrarywise it doth that the prince meddleth not with ecclesiasticall matters whose condition in that that he is a laie man maketh him vnhable for that function Wheras M. Nowell noteth the Quenes maiestie to haue more knowledge in all good learning and in the scriptures toe then had anye pope these seuen hundred yeares as I am not he that would abase those her maiesties rare giftes of excellent learning and princely qualities farre more plentifully by the goodnesse of God bestowed vpon her then anie other so noble prince man or woman that this daie liueth but as my bounden dutie is rendre moste humble thanckes to almighty God therefore so can I in no wise but abhorre this moste impudent parasite good Reader who vpon his beelefe as though he had made neuer a lye in all this booke before A lye 82. addeth this of all other the moste shamefull Whiche I nothing doubte but her graces moste rare modestie can so euill abide to here that longe ere this she hathe iudged him in her princely harte to be as he is a vaine lyer and shamelesse parasite Whome if her grace shoulde commaunde to An Emperours rewarde for a flatterer be rewarded for his labour as Sigismunde the emperour rewarded one of the same profession whome praising him aboue measure he buffeted as fast answering him when he asked why beatest thow me Emperour why bitest thow me flatterer as the rewarde were princely for suche a gift so were the facte worthy so mightie a prince But nowe AEneas Siluius li. 2. Com. de reb gest Alphonsi to the good Reader what cause haste thowe to trust hereafter this mans beliefe in anie matter touching the pope the learning considered of Innocentius the thirde Aeneas Siluius called Pius the 2. Adrianus 6. Marcelâ—us 2. Paulus 4. and Pius 4. that nowe is and diuerse other within that compasse as to the Learned is not vnknowen This parasite staieth not here but going farder sayeth Though the Quenes maiestie haue not that vnderstanding of Nowell fol. 124. a. 1. all the affaires of her realme that experience in all thinges that actiuitie in executing them that hathe the whole bodye of her moste honorable councel yeat dothe the whole bodye of her councell though moste honorable humbly acknowledge her to be their heade only proude priestes because some thinges are incideÌ„t to their office which the prince maye not * VVhat if the prince listed nor list not to doe refuse their Souereigne to be their supreme gouernour You beely all priestes M. Nowell and maye be ashamed to make the bishoppes only councellors in religion whom Dorman before you confessed by S. Cyprians minde to be iudges in earthe in Christes steede whereas you would here make them no iudges or iudges in the princes steede You deale vntruly to sclaundre the cleargie as you doe In whose defence I wil saye as S. Ambrose

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