Selected quad for the lemma: cause_n

Word A Word B Word C Word D Occurrence Frequency Band MI MI Band Prominent
cause_n authority_n faith_n formal_a 1,922 5 12.2586 5 false
View all documents for the selected quad

Text snippets containing the quad

ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A59916 The infallibility of the Holy Scripture asserted, and the pretended infallibility of the Church of Rome refuted in answer to two papers and two treatises of Father Johnson, a Romanist, about the ground thereof / by John Sherman. Sherman, John, d. 1663. 1664 (1664) Wing S3386; ESTC R24161 665,157 994

There are 36 snippets containing the selected quad. | View original text

as_o to_o his_o own_o person_n but_o not_o in_o matter_n of_o faith_n as_o to_o the_o church_n i_o believe_v that_o the_o church_n be_v the_o spouse_n of_o christ_n and_o that_o she_o be_v without_o spot_n or_o wrinkle_n or_o any_o such_o thing_n as_o to_o that_o part_n which_o be_v in_o heaven_n and_o that_o the_o other_o part_n of_o the_o church_n as_o invisible_a which_o be_v not_o yet_o in_o heaven_n shall_v be_v without_o spot_n or_o wrinkle_n or_o any_o such_o thing_n when_o it_o come_v up_o to_o heaven_n but_o i_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o that_o text_n be_v mean_v of_o the_o church_n visible_a for_o all_o here_o glorious_a or_o none_o not_o all_o glorious_a here_o therefore_o none_o for_o you_o find_v it_o in_o the_o text_n that_o it_o be_v to_o be_v present_v as_o a_o glorious_a church_n namely_o as_o in_o the_o whole_a but_o you_o will_v not_o say_v that_o every_o member_n of_o the_o visible_a church_n be_v here_o glorious_a without_o spot_n without_o wrinkle_n or_o any_o such_o thing_n if_o you_o do_v say_v so_o you_o contradict_v bellarmin_n in_o his_o three_o book_n of_o the_o militant_a church_n the_o second_o chapter_n who_o there_o include_v in_o his_o definition_n of_o the_o church_n visible_a even_o reprobate_n wicked_a and_o ungodly_a man_n and_o require_v there_o no_o internal_a virtue_n for_o the_o constitution_n of_o a_o member_n of_o the_o church_n but_o only_o a_o external_a profession_n of_o faith_n and_o communion_n of_o sacrament_n and_o beside_o you_o know_v glory_n which_o be_v a_o perfection_n of_o grace_n do_v not_o belong_v to_o the_o way_n but_o the_o country_n in_o heaven_n and_o beside_o if_o you_o will_v not_o believe_v i_o in_o such_o a_o exposition_n believe_v your_o estius_n who_o with_o he_o with_o in_o his_o retractation_n p._n 9_o ed._n frob._n but_o this_o quotation_n not_o add_v in_o my_o copy_n to_o he_o saint_n austin_n understand_v it_o upon_o good_a reason_n of_o the_o church_n invisible_a as_o you_o may_v see_v in_o estius_n comment_n upon_o the_o place_n and_o here_o by_o the_o way_n we_o have_v another_o testimony_n of_o your_o own_o against_o you_o if_o you_o account_v your_o argument_n from_o this_o text_n sufficient_a to_o your_o cause_n and_o we_o have_v st._n augustine_n authority_n to_o boot_v as_o estius_n quote_v he_o and_o moreover_o holiness_n be_v no_o formal_a principle_n of_o our_o direction_n especial_o in_o point_n of_o faith_n it_o be_v holy_a because_o it_o follow_v and_o as_o it_o follow_v the_o rule_n and_o so_o shall_v we_o in_o faith_n and_o manner_n and_o therefore_o if_o it_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v of_o the_o visible_a church_n as_o it_o be_v not_o yet_o you_o conclude_v nothing_o for_o your_o turn_n upon_o this_o consideration_n to_o hasten_v the_o next_o text_n be_v former_o urge_v the_o church_n the_o pillar_n and_o ground_n of_o truth_n yet_o squeeze_v it_o and_o press_v it_o and_o make_v the_o best_a use_n of_o it_o you_o can_v it_o will_v not_o afford_v your_o inference_n you_o will_v make_v from_o it_o for_o first_o some_z and_o also_o very_o reasonable_o will_v refer_v this_o expression_n not_o to_o the_o church_n but_o to_o the_o mystery_n of_o godliness_n which_o follow_v and_o so_o they_o make_v it_o as_o a_o hebrew_n form_n of_o set_v out_o some_o high_a point_n and_o grand_a doctrine_n and_o than_o it_o go_v thus_o a_o pillar_n and_o ground_n of_o truth_n and_o without_o controversy_n a_o great_a mystery_n of_o godliness_n be_v this_o namely_o god_n manifest_v in_o the_o flesh_n etc._n etc._n if_o so_o your_o interest_n in_o it_o be_v sink_v and_o indeed_o the_o copulative_a and_o and_o without_o controversy_n do_v not_o seem_v so_o well_o and_o so_o close_o to_o knit_v else_o but_o it_o be_v give_v not_o grant_v that_o that_o criticism_n be_v not_o sufficient_a what_o of_o all_o that_o for_o saint_n irenaeus_n as_o before_o give_v this_o eulogy_n to_o the_o scripture_n the_o scripture_n give_v it_o to_o the_o church_n now_o to_o which_o do_v this_o property_n belong_v first_o and_o absolute_o to_o the_o scripture_n or_o to_o the_o church_n not_o to_o the_o church_n for_o the_o church_n have_v it_o from_o the_o scripture_n now_o that_o which_o have_v it_o first_o have_v its_o absolute_o and_o independent_o upon_o that_o which_o follow_v therefore_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o absolute_a pillar_n and_o ground_n of_o truth_n then_o there_o faith_n have_v sure_a foot_n there_o it_o sit_v down_o there_o it_o rest_v on_o that_o ground_n upon_o that_o pillar_n the_o church_n than_o have_v this_o title_n but_o subordinate_o and_o what_o it_o say_v can_v bind_v but_o conditionate_o to_o that_o which_o be_v the_o absolute_a ground_n and_o pillar_n of_o truth_n for_o the_o truth_n be_v the_o pillar_n and_o ground_n of_o the_o church_n as_o saint_n chysostome_n say_v upon_o the_o place_n take_v it_o then_o of_o the_o catholic_n church_n not_o roman_n the_o text_n do_v more_o set_v out_o the_o office_n of_o the_o church_n than_o the_o authority_n it_o do_v hold_v it_o do_v propose_v it_o do_v uphold_v the_o truth_n but_o this_o do_v not_o convince_v or_o evince_v that_o whatsoever_o the_o church_n do_v hold_v we_o shall_v also_o hold_v and_o upon_o that_o account_n also_o as_o if_o god_n have_v appoint_v the_o church_n infallible_o to_o convey_v to_o we_o whatsoever_o truth_n and_o nothing_o but_o truth_n and_o therefore_o may_v we_o an_o ought_v we_o to_o search_v the_o scripture_n as_o our_o saviour_n speak_v john_n 5.39_o and_o by_o they_o examine_v whatsoever_o the_o church_n say_v as_o those_o of_o beraea_n do_v that_o which_o be_v say_v by_o saint_n paul_n and_o they_o commend_v for_o it_o and_o therefore_o we_o can_v believe_v the_o definition_n of_o the_o church_n upon_o its_o own_o word_n nay_o can_v we_o also_o say_v that_o god_n do_v now_o give_v unto_o the_o church_n such_o assistance_n as_o then_o which_o be_v note_v before_o and_o therefore_o we_o distinguish_v time_n not_o think_v there_o shall_v be_v as_o much_o say_v of_o the_o church_n now_o as_o when_o it_o include_v the_o apostle_n and_o therefore_o suppose_v that_o the_o church_n then_o do_v hold_v all_o that_o be_v true_a and_o nothing_o contrary_a yet_o we_o can_v say_v it_o of_o the_o church_n now_o and_o therefore_o be_v not_o the_o cause_n of_o faith_n under_o who_o authority_n it_o must_v also_o pass_v beside_o the_o divine_a revelation_n to_o make_v it_o catholic_a for_o the_o church_n be_v conserve_v by_o the_o truth_n as_o estius_n also_o upon_o the_o place_n than_o thus_o where_o the_o ground_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v there_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o catholic_a faith_n the_o scripture_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n unless_o it_o be_v conserve_v by_o some_o other_o principle_n then_o by_o which_o it_o be_v constitute_v and_o it_o be_v conserve_v by_o the_o truth_n say_v he_o and_o thy_o word_n be_v truth_n say_v our_o saviour_n john_n 17.17_o and_o whereas_o he_o say_v that_o the_o truth_n sustain_v the_o church_n and_o the_o church_n sustain_v the_o truth_n and_o so_o one_o be_v the_o cause_n of_o the_o other_o we_o answer_v this_o be_v not_o available_a for_o you_o for_o in_o the_o same_o kind_n of_o cause_n it_o can_v be_v for_o than_o we_o be_v in_o a_o circle_n but_o the_o truth_n sustain_v the_o church_n so_o as_o to_o continue_v it_o in_o its_o principle_n the_o church_n sustain_v the_o truth_n but_o by_o way_n of_o ministry_n which_o do_v not_o make_v it_o to_o be_v a_o principle_n of_o faith_n no_o not_o to_o we_o neither_o do_v the_o other_o text_n speak_v for_o you_o as_o you_o will_v have_v they_o if_o the_o gate_n of_o hell_n shall_v not_o prevail_v against_o the_o church_n it_o do_v not_o follow_v that_o than_o catholic_a faith_n must_v be_v build_v upon_o the_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n nothing_o shall_v prevail_v to_o the_o condemnation_n of_o those_o who_o belong_v to_o the_o church_n of_o god_n as_o invisible_a and_o nothing_o shall_v prevail_v not_o the_o gate_n of_o hell_n against_o the_o church_n visible_a so_o as_o somewhere_o or_o other_o there_o shall_v not_o be_v some_o who_o shall_v profess_v the_o christian_a doctrine_n and_o worship_n sufficient_o to_o salvation_n the_o next_o text_n speak_v towards_o excommunication_n which_o come_v little_a into_o the_o question_n for_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n may_v proceed_v to_o censure_n although_o we_o be_v not_o bind_v upon_o peril_n of_o want_n of_o faith_n to_o submit_v our_o understanding_n to_o the_o definition_n of_o the_o church_n as_o to_o the_o authority_n we_o may_v submit_v so_o as_o to_o endure_v the_o censure_n though_o we_o do_v not_o submit_v our_o judgement_n as_o to_o believe_v the_o definition_n as_o to_o the_o next_o place_n of_o scripture_n
yourself_o see_v how_o you_o now_o differ_v from_o yourself_o before_o the_o ground_n of_o believe_v be_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n now_o the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v the_o cause_n of_o their_o belief_n before_o you_o conclude_v faith_n consist_v in_o submit_v the_o understanding_n and_o adhere_v to_o the_o church_n and_o in_o believe_v every_o thing_n because_o she_o propose_v it_o now_o it_o be_v the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v which_o cause_v their_o faith_n to_o be_v divine_a as_o for_o the_o term_n thus_o the_o formal_a object_n be_v such_o under_o which_o and_o in_o respect_n whereunto_o any_o thing_n proceed_v if_o then_o god_n revelation_n come_v not_o to_o we_o under_o the_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n or_o as_o propose_v by_o the_o church_n than_o the_o cause_n be_v lose_v if_o it_o do_v then_o grant_v i_o my_o term_n and_o affirm_v with_o i_o that_o the_o pontifician_n hold_v so_o if_o not_o they_o be_v better_o than_o you_o and_o what_o mean_v else_o their_o implicit_a faith_n unless_o we_o be_v to_o believe_v every_o thing_n as_o the_o church_n believe_v it_o and_o because_o the_o church_n propose_v it_o as_o you_o say_v and_o if_o we_o be_v to_o believe_v every_o thing_n as_o the_o church_n believe_v it_o then_o be_v the_o church_n the_o formal_a object_n of_o their_o faith_n since_o they_o be_v also_o bind_v not_o to_o doubt_v but_o simple_o to_o obey_v as_o bellarmine_n tell_v we_o in_o his_o four_o book_n of_o the_o roman_a bishop_n 5._o chap._n the_o other_o term_v you_o find_v fault_n with_o be_v excess_n of_o faith_n you_o tax_v it_o as_o improper_o speak_v but_o sure_o it_o will_v pass_v without_o any_o grain_n of_o salt_n or_o of_o allowance_n if_o we_o consider_v that_o faith_n may_v be_v compare_v as_o to_o a_o particular_a object_n and_o so_o there_o be_v not_o a_o excess_n of_o faith_n as_o to_o that_o but_o than_o it_o may_v be_v compare_v as_o to_o many_o object_n and_o so_o though_o we_o do_v not_o more_o believe_v one_o thing_n than_o we_o shall_v if_o we_o shall_v indeed_o believe_v it_o yet_o may_v we_o believe_v more_o than_o we_o shall_v if_o we_o believe_v those_o thing_n which_o be_v not_o at_o all_o to_o be_v believe_v and_o thus_o if_o we_o shall_v believe_v whatsoever_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n propose_v we_o may_v be_v destroy_v for_o excess_n of_o faith_n the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v peccant_a in_o excess_n of_o faith_n by_o believe_v more_o point_n than_o it_o shall_v believe_v and_o this_o be_v the_o reason_n why_o our_o divinity_n be_v in_o negative_n as_o to_o difference_n with_o they_o because_o their_o divinity_n in_o difference_n to_o we_o be_v in_o addition_n sir_n if_o you_o will_v excuse_v i_o for_o be_v so_o long_o i_o shall_v now_o conclude_v with_o the_o whole_a conclusion_n of_o saint_n austin_n whereof_o you_o give_v i_o but_o part_n against_o reason_n no_o sober_a man_n will_v go_v against_o scripture_n not_o christian_a than_o christian_n shall_v go_v by_o scripture_n against_o the_o church_n no_o peacemaker_n the_o roman_a catholick_n first_o treatise_n how_o in_o these_o time_n in_o which_o there_o be_v so_o many_o religious_a the_o true_a religion_n may_v certain_o be_v find_v out_o the_o preface_n the_o roman_a catholic_n have_v often_o foretell_v that_o by_o permit_v free_o to_o all_o sort_n of_o people_n whatsoever_o the_o read_n of_o the_o scripture_n in_o their_o mother_n tongue_n multitude_n of_o new_a sect_n and_o heresy_n will_v not_o fail_v to_o grow_v up_o in_o numberless_a number_n and_o as_o for_o the_o people_n manner_n they_o will_v daily_o grow_v worse_a and_o worse_o how_o true_a this_o be_v let_v the_o world_n judge_n that_o than_o which_o now_o main_o import_v be_v to_o distinguish_v the_o true_a religion_n from_o so_o many_o false_a one_o this_o be_v my_o aim_n to_o effect_v this_o i_o do_v write_v a_o short_a paper_n show_v the_o catholic_n church_n so_o to_o teach_v the_o infallible_a way_n to_o salvation_n which_o be_v to_o be_v obtain_v only_o in_o the_o true_a faith_n that_o we_o can_v have_v as_o thing_n stand_v any_o other_o assurance_n to_o ground_v our_o faith_n upon_o secure_o i_o do_v never_o deny_v that_o when_o by_o the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n we_o be_v secure_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n we_o can_v believe_v such_o thing_n as_o be_v clear_o contain_v in_o the_o scripture_n for_o so_o i_o shall_v deny_v that_o i_o can_v not_o believe_v that_o to_o be_v infallible_o true_a which_o upon_o a_o infallible_a ground_n i_o believe_v to_o be_v god_n own_o word_n but_o i_o do_v and_o still_o do_v maintain_v that_o no_o man_n can_v have_v infallible_a ground_n to_o believe_v the_o scripture_n now_o but_o he_o who_o first_o believe_v that_o which_o the_o church_n teach_v to_o be_v infallible_o true_a whence_o it_o will_v follow_v that_o his_o faith_n must_v needs_o now_o at_o the_o first_o be_v ground_v upon_o the_o revelation_n of_o god_n truth_n make_v by_o god_n to_o we_o by_o his_o church_n and_o not_o by_o his_o write_a word_n the_o paper_n i_o do_v write_v to_o this_o effect_n have_v be_v answer_v by_o some_o true_o learned_a scholar_n so_o that_o i_o hope_v so_o worthy_a a_o man_n will_v not_o reject_v such_o a_o reply_n as_o may_v seem_v to_o be_v as_o clear_v a_o demonstration_n as_o any_o wise_a man_n can_v hope_v for_o in_o this_o matter_n and_o such_o a_o demonstration_n i_o hope_v by_o god_n grace_n to_o make_v whilst_o i_o endeavour_v to_o make_v good_a the_o title_n prefix_v to_o this_o paper_n which_o title_n i_o now_o add_v to_o show_v that_o my_o chief_a drift_n be_v to_o guide_v a_o soul_n redeem_v by_o christ_n blood_n to_o that_o happy_a eternity_n to_o which_o we_o can_v attain_v unless_o in_o all_o doubtful_a controversy_n of_o faith_n we_o follow_v the_o catholic_n church_n as_o a_o infallible_a judge_n in_o all_o those_o controversy_n we_o be_v oblige_v under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n not_o to_o disbelieve_v this_o judge_n and_o whilst_o i_o demonstrate_v this_o i_o do_v demonstrate_v my_o former_a position_n that_o the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n and_o also_o go_v on_o with_o this_o demonstration_n i_o will_v leave_v nothing_o of_o concernment_n unanswered_a in_o the_o reply_n make_v and_o thus_o i_o will_v conclude_v contradictory_o to_o the_o say_a reply_n which_o a_o little_a after_o the_o beginning_n deny_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n to_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o faith_n and_o that_o whereby_o we_o be_v infallible_o ascertain_v of_o the_o mind_n of_o god_n i_o answer_v not_o the_o reply_n just_a in_o the_o order_n that_o my_o answer_n be_v return_v for_o so_o i_o shall_v be_v overlong_a i_o use_v this_o way_n of_o a_o little_a treatise_n to_o prove_v my_o title_n for_o thus_o all_o will_v be_v more_o clear_a and_o less_o tedious_a in_o the_o conclusion_n i_o show_v all_o the_o part_n of_o the_o reply_n to_o have_v be_v full_o answer_v in_o this_o discourse_n the_o proof_n of_o the_o title_n st._n anselme_n have_v a_o very_a fit_a similitude_n to_o express_v how_o much_o a_o contentious_a spirit_n in_o dispute_v do_v blind_a the_o understanding_n from_o see_v the_o manifest_a truth_n he_o say_v that_o a_o little_a before_o sunrising_n two_o man_n in_o the_o field_n do_v fall_v into_o a_o hot_a debate_n concern_v that_o place_n of_o the_o heaven_n in_o which_o the_o sun_n be_v that_o day_n to_o rise_v the_o one_o point_v out_o one_o part_n of_o the_o heaven_n the_o other_o another_o they_o pass_v so_o far_o in_o their_o contention_n that_o fall_v together_o by_o the_o ear_n they_o both_o pull_v out_o one_o another_o eye_n and_o so_o when_o the_o sun_n by_o and_o by_o after_o do_v rise_v neither_o of_o they_o both_o can_v see_v a_o thing_n so_o clear_a as_o be_v the_o place_n of_o the_o sun_n rise_v to_o our_o purpose_n because_o zeal_n in_o religion_n be_v account_v laudable_a and_o also_o because_o prejudice_v cause_v by_o education_n in_o such_o or_o such_o a_o religion_n be_v a_o thing_n exceed_o sway_v we_o to_o our_o own_o side_n we_o be_v common_o apt_a to_o grow_v into_o so_o hot_a a_o debate_n in_o disputation_n about_o religion_n that_o i_o may_v free_o say_v this_o passion_n hinder_v many_o thousand_o from_o see_v that_o clear_a sunshine_n of_o truth_n which_o man_n of_o mean_a capacity_n will_v clear_o behold_v if_o set_v all_o passion_n and_o prejudice_n aside_o they_o do_v with_o a_o calm_a and_o humble_a mind_n beg_v of_o god_n to_o give_v they_o this_o grace_n of_o seek_v truth_n with_o all_o sincerity_n for_o than_o he_o who_o shall_v seek_v shall_v find_v this_o be_v prove_v manifest_o
either_o abstract_o from_o the_o speaker_n or_o complexe_o with_o the_o speaker_n in_o the_o former_a it_o be_v consider_v with_o respect_n to_o the_o matter_n and_o so_o he_o say_v well_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d we_o be_v not_o to_o look_v at_o so_o much_o the_o author_n as_o the_o matter_n in_o the_o latter_a respect_n it_o be_v respective_a to_o the_o motive_n and_o so_o i_o be_o more_o induce_v by_o the_o church_n though_o not_o determine_v and_o therefore_o as_o to_o those_o term_n to_o who_o say_v you_o will_v give_v a_o infallible_a assent_n when_o you_o see_v that_o which_o he_o say_v to_o be_v conformable_a to_o scripture_n we_o say_v that_o the_o term●_n saying_n be_v distinguishable_a into_o the_o object_n pure_o or_o into_o the_o object_n with_o the_o act_n and_o author_n in_o the_o former_a there_o be_v no_o difference_n in_o the_o latter_a there_o be_v we_o may_v believe_v that_o which_o be_v say_v when_o we_o do_v not_o believe_v he_o that_o say_v it_o and_o so_o may_v we_o believe_v rather_o the_o church_n who_o office_n it_o be_v to_o propose_v truth_n as_o he_o confess_v it_o be_v not_o the_o devil_n neither_o do_v we_o by_o these_o answer_n smother_v up_o any_o thing_n which_o clear_o overthrow_v our_o reply_n who_o say_v we_o must_v follow_v the_o church_n only_o so_o far_o as_o we_o see_v she_o follow_v scripture_n that_o which_o he_o say_v here_o do_v no_o way_n weaken_v our_o reply_n it_o have_v be_v answer_v before_o and_o the_o strength_n of_o it_o break_v for_o first_o though_o they_o can_v not_o see_v at_o all_o how_o far_o the_o church_n follow_v the_o scripture_n for_o the_o first_o two_o thousand_o year_n and_o the_o barbarous_a nation_n never_o have_v see_v the_o scripture_n do_v true_o believe_v do_v this_o hinder_v we_o from_o hold_v now_o that_o we_o be_v to_o believe_v the_o church_n in_o point_n of_o faith_n no_o further_o than_o we_o see_v ground_n for_o what_o they_o say_v out_o of_o scripture_n take_v it_o of_o faith_n divine_a and_o in_o thing_n of_o faith_n it_o be_v yet_o good_a and_o their_o instance_n do_v not_o evacuate_v it_o distingue_n tempora_fw-la distinguish_v the_o time_n god_n may_v in_o that_o time_n and_o season_n of_o immediate_a revelation_n work_v then_o a_o faith_n immediate_o which_o now_o be_v not_o reasonable_a to_o expect_v ordinary_o as_o appear_v by_o the_o first_o chap._n of_o the_o ep._n to_o the_o hebrew_n the_o first_o ver_fw-la privilegia_fw-la pauc●rum_fw-la non_fw-la faciunt_fw-la regulam_fw-la communem_fw-la second_o the_o faith_n of_o the_o barbarous_a nation_n be_v not_o terminate_v in_o the_o church_n as_o if_o they_o have_v believe_v the_o church_n and_o therefore_o believe_v that_o which_o be_v say_v by_o they_o but_o be_v terminate_v in_o the_o matter_n which_o be_v say_v by_o the_o church_n the_o church_n be_v instrumental_a to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o matter_n and_o may_v be_v instrumental_a as_o to_o dispose_v they_o for_o faith_n but_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o the_o formal_a cause_n of_o the_o act_n of_o faith_n and_o knot_n himself_o be_v loath_a to_o assert_v it_o and_o this_o be_v that_o which_o tertullian_n have_v say_v non_fw-la ex_fw-la persona_fw-la fides_fw-la sed_fw-la ex_fw-la fide_fw-la persona_fw-la aestimanda_fw-la est_fw-la we_o be_v not_o to_o esteem_v the_o doctrine_n by_o the_o person_n but_o the_o person_n by_o the_o doctrine_n and_o the_o tradition_n which_o st._n irenaeus_n speak_v of_o be_v the_o sum_n of_o the_o christian_a faith_n which_o be_v in_o scripture_n so_o he_o as_o before_o and_o so_o st._n cyril_n of_o jerusalem_n understand_v it_o as_o may_v appear_v by_o that_o of_o cyril_n in_o his_o four_o catech._n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d we_o must_v not_o deliver_v any_o thing_n in_o the_o divine_a and_o holy_a mystery_n of_o faith_n without_o the_o divine_a scripture_n this_o be_v the_o epilogue_n of_o the_o chap._n and_o be_v of_o use_n only_o to_o tell_v i_o what_o he_o have_v do_v i_o think_v not_o do_v before_o 38._o n._n 38._o and_o this_o be_v all_o the_o answer_n he_o give_v i_o for_o take_v away_o what_o he_o have_v say_v out_o of_o two_o place_n of_o scripture_n foremention_v towards_o infallibility_n before_o he_o refer_v i_o for_o satisfaction_n to_o the_o due_a place_n here_o he_o refer_v i_o back_o again_o and_o as_o for_o any_o reply_n to_o my_o answer_n out_o of_o the_o father_n or_o my_o use_n of_o they_o he_o say_v to_o i_o you_o know_v why_o i_o resolve_v to_o pass_v they_o yes_o &_o particular_o why_o he_o say_v nothing_o more_o to_o what_o i_o say_v about_o st._n augustine_n testimony_n in_o his_o epistle_n against_o the_o manichee_n if_o i_o may_v be_v interpreter_n it_o be_v thus_o resolve_v he_o have_v good_a reason_n to_o pass_v they_o because_o they_o pass_v he_o and_o so_o we_o have_v make_v a_o end_n of_o his_o long_a but_o not_o hard_a chapter_n chap._n v._n no_o church_n be_v our_o judge_n infallible_a than_o not_o the_o roman_a this_o chapter_n which_o concern_v the_o hypothesis_n shall_v injustice_n have_v be_v long_o but_o he_o reduce_v the_o proof_n of_o it_o to_o a_o small_a pittance_n and_o if_o all_o the_o church_n which_o submit_v not_o themselves_o to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n as_o their_o supreme_a pastor_n be_v of_o no_o better_a proportion_n it_o will_v be_v catholic_n for_o all_o that_o do_v submit_v but_o not_o for_o all_o but_o since_o he_o be_v so_o short_a in_o this_o we_o will_v be_v even_o with_o he_o and_o bring_v all_o he_o say_v in_o this_o second_o treatise_n for_o so_o some_o time_n he_o call_v it_o into_o one_o syllogism_n the_o church_n be_v the_o judge_n infallible_a appoint_v in_o business_n of_o religion_n no_o other_o but_o the_o roman_a be_v this_o church_n therefore_o to_o the_o proposition_n we_o have_v say_v enough_o before_o he_o will_v now_o make_v good_a the_o assumption_n or_o presumption_n as_o we_o may_v speak_v suppose_v the_o proposition_n to_o be_v demonstrate_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o therefore_o he_o quarrel_v with_o i_o because_o we_o except_v against_o his_o supposition_n of_o it_o it_o be_v true_a have_v the_o major_a be_v a_o maxim_n irrefragable_a then_o there_o have_v be_v more_o reason_n to_o blame_v we_o for_o exception_n against_o it_o and_o for_o not_o apply_v ourselves_o in_o present_a address_n to_o the_o minor_a but_o since_o we_o see_v no_o cause_n nor_o the_o church_n of_o god_n why_o the_o proposition_n shall_v be_v swallow_v we_o call_v upon_o he_o to_o make_v good_a the_o thesis_fw-la that_o there_o be_v a_o church_n appoint_v as_o infallible_a judge_n in_o business_n of_o religion_n and_o therefore_o we_o tell_v he_o that_o he_o may_v as_o well_o prove_v he_o have_v right_o to_o utopia_n because_o he_o only_o claim_v it_o whereas_o he_o shall_v first_o prove_v the_o a_o sit_v whether_o there_o be_v such_o a_o place_n and_o therefore_o if_o he_o will_v have_v have_v we_o say_v nothing_o to_o the_o question_n of_o the_o supposition_n he_o shall_v have_v make_v it_o strong_a first_o and_o then_o shall_v not_o have_v conclude_v braving_o that_o therefore_o all_o he_o have_v say_v of_o the_o church_n be_v to_o be_v apply_v to_o the_o roman_a no_o other_o be_v infallible_a as_o in_o the_o former_a treatise_n num_fw-la 28_o well_o but_o he_o must_v prove_v his_o minor_a 2._o n._n 2._o because_o all_o other_o church_n do_v not_o lay_v claim_n to_o this_o infallibility_n and_o be_v demonstrate_v to_o be_v fallible_a we_o grant_v the_o antecedent_n without_o any_o proof_n and_o his_o proof_n be_v not_o so_o good_a as_o his_o proposition_n but_o therefore_o it_o belong_v to_o they_o to_o be_v infallible_a we_o deny_v the_o consequence_n we_o deny_v the_o title_n upon_o the_o claim_n and_o he_o be_v angry_a because_o we_o make_v his_o plea_n from_o the_o claim_n to_o be_v weak_a and_o the_o weakness_n of_o it_o appear_v in_o that_o it_o be_v weak_a ground_v upon_o a_o true_a supposition_n nor_o be_v it_o very_o sound_a in_o the_o proceed_n of_o the_o consequence_n in_o the_o first_o regard_n we_o say_v debile_a fundamentum_fw-la fallit_fw-la opus_fw-la and_o therefore_o since_o that_o be_v one_o of_o his_o principle_n his_o conclusion_n must_v be_v naught_o as_o before_o his_o consequence_n he_o prove_v thus_o the_o protestant_a chucrh_n and_o all_o other_o church_n different_a from_o the_o roman_a do_v judge_n themselves_o acknowledge_v themselves_o declare_v and_o profess_v themselves_o to_o be_v fallible_a and_o that_o according_a to_o infallible_a scripture_n if_o then_o any_o of_o these_o church_n be_v infallible_a in_o what_o they_o judge_v and_o declare_v for_o truth_n ground_v in_o scripture_n they_o be_v infallible_a in_o this_o their_o judge_a and_o declare_v themselves_o to_o be_v fallible_a therefore_o infallible_o they_o
faith_n but_o only_a opinion_n or_o humane_a belief_n answer_n the_o paper_n may_v be_v resolve_v into_o a_o supposition_n and_o a_o reason_n and_o a_o conclusion_n to_o these_o in_o order_n first_o the_o supposition_n it_o be_v not_o sufficient_a to_o make_v one_o a_o catholic_n that_o he_o believe_v the_o same_o thing_n that_o a_o catholic_n do_v believe_v unless_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v the_o ground_n also_o of_o his_o belief_n etc._n etc._n as_o in_o the_o amplification_n of_o it_o this_o supposition_n be_v indeed_o the_o main_a position_n of_o the_o pontifician_n and_o that_o which_o be_v formal_o constitutive_a of_o they_o in_o that_o denomination_n so_o that_o the_o answer_n to_o it_o be_v not_o make_v as_o to_o a_o private_a opinion_n or_o the_o opinion_n of_o a_o private_a man_n but_o as_o to_o the_o general_n tenet_n of_o their_o church_n in_o the_o matter_n of_o it_o in_o the_o term_n the_o word_n catholic_n be_v to_o be_v distinguish_v for_o if_o they_o mean_v thereby_o such_o a_o one_o as_o they_o account_v a_o catholic_n viz._n one_o subject_n to_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n upon_o its_o own_o authority_n it_o be_v very_o true_a that_o none_o be_v such_o a_o catholic_n but_o he_o that_o shall_v render_v his_o belief_n to_o they_o in_o all_o thing_n upon_o this_o their_o proposal_n and_o so_o whatsoever_o be_v the_o material_a object_n of_o their_o faith_n yet_o the_o formal_a object_n be_v the_o definition_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n but_o if_o there_o be_v a_o true_a sense_n upon_o ancient_a account_n also_o of_o a_o catholic_n who_o do_v not_o believe_v article_n of_o faith_n upon_o the_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n then_o there_o may_v be_v in_o a_o true_a sense_n a_o catholic_n now_o who_o do_v not_o make_v the_o church_n the_o last_o resolutive_a of_o faith_n for_o where_o the_o scripture_n be_v acknowledge_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n also_o there_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o the_o determinative_a thereof_o and_o that_o it_o be_v will_v be_v make_v good_a if_o it_o be_v desire_v by_o several_a testimony_n but_o second_o give_v it_o suppose_v it_o that_o none_o be_v a_o catholic_n in_o a_o right_a sense_n but_o he_o that_o believe_v what_o the_o church_n believe_v because_o the_o church_n believe_v it_o yet_o the_o roman_a will_n not_o gain_v his_o purpose_n thereby_o unless_o we_o will_v grant_v this_o supposition_n also_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n which_o indeed_o be_v mean_v in_o the_o paper_n though_o wise_o not_o express_v but_o this_o supposition_n that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o catholic_n church_n be_v not_o to_o be_v yield_v neither_o in_o regard_n of_o comprehension_n for_o that_o make_v a_o contradiction_n nor_o in_o regard_n of_o dominion_n neither_o for_o other_o church_n have_v not_o submit_v themselves_o to_o their_o authority_n this_o need_v no_o disproof_n from_o we_o till_o it_o have_v a_o proof_n from_o they_o and_o three_o if_o we_o shall_v stand_v up_o to_o all_o that_o their_o church_n in_o particular_a do_v propose_v and_o if_o we_o shall_v assent_v to_o it_o upon_o their_o account_n we_o may_v be_v damn_v not_o for_o our_o want_n of_o faith_n but_o for_o excess_n of_o faith_n in_o the_o object_n material_a and_o for_o the_o error_n of_o faith_n in_o the_o formal_a object_n for_o we_o shall_v believe_v more_o than_o be_v true_a if_o we_o shall_v believe_v whatsoever_o they_o believe_v and_o somewhat_o also_o destructive_a of_o article_n in_o the_o apostle_n creed_n and_o we_o shall_v also_o believe_v upon_o the_o wrong_n inductive_a which_o be_v not_o the_o authority_n of_o their_o church_n as_o we_o may_v see_v now_o in_o the_o answer_n to_o the_o reason_n the_o reason_n have_v in_o it_o somewhat_o true_a somewhat_o false_a true_a that_o faith_n be_v to_o believe_v a_o thing_n because_o god_n reveal_v it_o false_a that_o there_o be_v no_o infallible_a way_n without_o a_o miracle_n of_o his_o revelation_n come_v to_o we_o but_o by_o their_o church_n which_o they_o suppose_v to_o be_v the_o church_n its_o proposition_n for_o if_o the_o question_n be_v this_o how_o shall_v we_o come_v to_o know_v whether_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o right_a church_n upon_o the_o authority_n whereof_o we_o must_v ground_v our_o faith_n wherein_o shall_v we_o terminate_v our_o belief_n hereof_o in_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n or_o not_o we_o be_v to_o believe_v that_o they_o say_v which_o god_n have_v reveal_v but_o the_o cause_n of_o our_o belief_n must_v be_v because_o the_o church_n propose_v it_o so_o then_o we_o must_v believe_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n upon_o her_o own_o testimony_n and_o we_o must_v resolve_v all_o into_o this_o that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v the_o right_a church_n although_o it_o be_v neither_o a_o revelation_n nor_o a_o natural_a principle_n such_o as_o this_o that_o the_o whole_a be_v great_a than_o the_o part_n which_o indeed_o give_v the_o occasion_n of_o that_o check_n which_o be_v give_v to_o rome_n greater_n be_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o world_n then_o of_o a_o city_n orbis_n quam_fw-la vrbis_fw-la s._n jerom._n in_o ep._n ad_fw-la evagrium_fw-la wherefore_o if_o the_o faith_n of_o a_o catholic_n must_v consist_v in_o submit_v his_o understanding_n and_o adhere_v to_o the_o church_n and_o in_o believe_v every_o thing_n because_o she_o propose_v it_o as_o be_v say_v in_o the_o conclusion_n yet_o it_o be_v not_o necessary_a that_o this_o church_n shall_v be_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n for_o this_o in_o proportion_n will_v be_v to_o resolve_v our_o persuasion_n into_o the_o judgement_n of_o particular_a man_n because_o a_o particular_a church_n which_o according_a to_o the_o paper_n make_v no_o catholic_n faith_n but_o a_o opinion_n or_o humane_a belief_n reply_n in_o the_o paper_n receive_v the_o position_n which_o i_o give_v it_o be_v not_o sufficient_a etc._n etc._n be_v dislike_v because_o it_o make_v the_o catholic_n church_n the_o ground_n of_o our_o belief_n but_o in_o truth_n i_o find_v no_o reason_n give_v for_o such_o dislike_n or_o any_o thing_n say_v against_o it_o but_o what_o to_o i_o seem_v very_o strange_a and_o be_v this_o if_o there_o be_v a_o true_a sense_n upon_o ancient_a account_n also_o of_o a_o catholic_n who_o do_v not_o believe_v article_n of_o faith_n upon_o the_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n etc._n etc._n to_o which_o i_o answer_v that_o i_o will_v fain_o know_v what_o catholic_n upon_o ancient_a account_n do_v not_o believe_v article_n of_o faith_n upon_o the_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n or_o indeed_o how_o can_v i_o account_v he_o a_o catholic_n without_o a_o palpable_a contradiction_n that_o do_v not_o believe_v the_o catholic_n church_n s._n iren._n l._n 3._o c._n 4._o say_v we_o ought_v not_o to_o seek_v among_o other_o the_o truth_n which_o we_o may_v easy_o take_v and_o receive_v from_o the_o church_n see_v that_o the_o apostle_n have_v most_o full_o lay_v up_o in_o she_o as_o into_o a_o rich_a treasure-house_n or_o place_n where_o the_o depositum_fw-la of_o the_o church_n be_v keep_v all_o thing_n which_o be_v of_o truth_n that_o every_o man_n that_o will_v may_v take_v out_o of_o her_o the_o drink_n of_o life_n for_o this_o be_v the_o entrance_n of_o life_n but_o all_o the_o rest_n be_v thief_n and_o robber_n for_o which_o cause_n they_o be_v very_o to_o be_v avoid_v but_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v of_o the_o church_n be_v with_o great_a diligence_n to_o be_v love_v and_o the_o tradition_n of_o truth_n be_v to_o be_v receive_v and_o the_o say_v iren._n l._n 1._o c._n 3._o tell_v we_o that_o the_o church_n keep_v with_o most_o sincere_a diligence_n the_o apostle_n faith_n and_o that_o which_o they_o preach_v s._n cypr._n ep._n ad_fw-la cornel._n avouch_v that_o the_o church_n always_o hold_v that_o which_o she_o first_o know_v see_v also_o his_o ep._n 69._o ad_fw-la florentium_fw-la and_o s._n aug._n have_v so_o great_a a_o estimation_n of_o the_o church_n that_o he_o stick_v not_o to_o say_v cont_n ep._n manich._n quam_fw-la vocant_fw-la fundamentum_fw-la c._n 5._o i_o will_v not_o believe_v the_o gospel_n except_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n do_v move_v i_o thereunto_o moreover_o dispute_v against_o cresconius_n concern_v the_o baptism_n of_o heretic_n l._n 1._o cont_n cresc_n he_o use_v this_o discourse_n although_o of_o this_o that_o the_o baptism_n of_o heretic_n be_v true_a baptism_n there_o be_v no_o certain_a example_n bring_v forth_o out_o of_o the_o canonical_a scripture_n yet_o also_o in_o this_o we_o keep_v the_o truth_n of_o the_o say_a scripture_n when_o as_o we_o do_v that_o which_o now_o have_v please_v the_o whole_a church_n which_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n themselves_o do_v commend_v that_o
and_o not_o private_a spirit_n which_o i_o can_v esteem_v no_o better_o than_o a_o fantastical_a if_o not_o a_o fanatical_a opinion_n and_o be_v diametrical_o opposite_a to_o the_o word_n of_o the_o second_o of_o st._n peter_n 1.20_o no_o prophecy_n of_o scripture_n be_v make_v by_o private_a interpretation_n and_o all_o this_o speak_v here_o and_o in_o the_o position_n etc._n etc._n of_o the_o church_n be_v mean_v of_o such_o a_o church_n as_o do_v true_o deserve_v the_o name_n of_o catholic_n and_o so_o it_o will_v appear_v that_o all_o the_o discourse_n in_o this_o paper_n i_o receive_v of_o the_o roman_a church_n consider_v as_o a_o particular_a church_n or_o any_o other_o particular_a church_n be_v but_o impertinent_a and_o extravagant_a now_o also_o i_o must_v assure_v the_o answerer_n that_o the_o pontifician_n do_v not_o make_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n the_o formal_a object_n of_o their_o faith_n as_o he_o do_v impose_v upon_o they_o for_o they_o acknowledge_v that_o to_o be_v the_o revelation_n of_o god_n or_o the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v which_o cause_v their_o belief_n to_o the_o supernatural_a and_o divine_a and_o not_o only_a natural_a and_o humane_a as_o be_v the_o belief_n that_o there_o be_v such_o a_o city_n as_o rome_n or_o that_o there_o be_v a_o william_n the_o conqueror_n etc._n etc._n which_o kind_n of_o faith_n be_v all_o that_o heretic_n have_v and_o all_o such_o as_o do_v not_o ground_v their_o belief_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n i_o can_v also_o but_o observe_v in_o the_o receive_a paper_n that_o it_o be_v improper_o enough_o call_v excess_n of_o faith_n as_o it_o be_v there_o oppose_v to_o want_v of_o faith_n to_o believe_v more_o than_o necessary_a for_o the_o number_n of_o thing_n believe_v do_v not_o alter_v the_o nature_n of_o faith_n itself_o and_o last_o i_o must_v tax_v he_o of_o false_a allege_v the_o word_n in_o the_o reason_n thus_o there_o be_v no_o infallible_a way_n without_o a_o miracle_n of_o his_o god_n revelation_n come_v to_o we_o but_o by_o their_o church_n whereas_o in_o the_o paper_n deliver_v it_o be_v the_o church_n abstract_v from_o all_o particular_a church_n and_o mean_v the_o true_a church_n which_o soever_o it_o be_v and_o this_o be_v do_v but_o to_o make_v way_n for_o that_o needless_a excursion_n which_o there_o follow_v the_o rejoynder_n sir_n there_o be_v no_o great_a reason_n for_o i_o to_o rejoin_v first_o because_o you_o wave_v the_o application_n of_o your_o discourse_n as_o to_o the_o roman_a church_n which_o be_v not_o ordinary_a for_o those_o of_o your_o profession_n when_o they_o speak_v high_o of_o the_o catholic_a church_n second_o because_o i_o may_v let_v you_o alone_o to_o answer_v the_o first_o paper_n with_o your_o second_o as_o to_o the_o main_a of_o it_o three_o because_o the_o great_a part_n of_o it_o have_v one_o fault_n not_o to_o conclude_v contradictory_o yet_o in_o christian_a respect_n to_o truth_n and_o you_o i_o shall_v endeavour_v meek_o some_o return_n to_o your_o reply_n and_o to_o differ_v as_o little_a as_o may_v be_v from_o you_o i_o shall_v most_o follow_v your_o own_o order_n in_o the_o beginning_n you_o dislike_v my_o dislike_n of_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n without_o give_v you_o any_o reason_n answer_v i_o intend_v my_o answer_n as_o near_o as_o i_o can_v guess_v to_o the_o design_n of_o your_o paper_n for_o the_o roman_a church_n by_o obedience_n to_o the_o bishop_n whereof_o bellarmine_n in_o his_o catechism_n english_v p._n 65._o 6_o 7._o do_v describe_v the_o catholic_a church_n you_o will_v excuse_v i_o then_o if_o i_o take_v the_o course_n to_o make_v my_o answer_n compendious_o sufficient_a to_o that_o drift_n if_o you_o will_v hold_v with_o papist_n herein_o and_o if_o you_o will_v confess_v you_o mean_v the_o roman_a church_n by_o the_o catholic_a than_o i_o have_v give_v you_o such_o a_o reason_n against_o your_o position_n as_o you_o will_v say_v nothing_o to_o and_o you_o may_v consider_v that_o you_o direct_v your_o paper_n as_o to_o a_o protestant_n who_o be_v not_o contradistinguish_v to_o a_o catholic_a but_o to_o a_o papist_n if_o you_o be_v a_o papist_n why_o do_v you_o dissemble_v it_o to_o i_o if_o you_o be_v not_o why_o do_v we_o dispute_v and_o this_o apology_n may_v be_v enough_o also_o to_o refute_v all_o your_o objection_n against_o i_o of_o impertinency_n and_o excursion_n and_o untrue_a allegation_n if_o you_o will_v take_v notice_n also_o of_o my_o parenthesis_n and_o now_o my_o reason_n intimate_v in_o a_o promise_n shall_v be_v make_v good_a in_o performance_n and_o since_o you_o will_v in_o the_o question_n about_o the_o catholic_a church_n abstract_a from_o the_o roman_a and_o all_o other_o particular_n i_o shall_v give_v some_o account_n of_o catholic_n who_o do_v not_o make_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n the_o ground_n and_o cause_n of_o their_o belief_n whereby_o only_o god_n his_o revelation_n come_v to_o we_o infallible_o as_o you_o express_v yourself_o in_o your_o first_o paper_n but_o this_o prerogative_n they_o ascribe_v to_o the_o holy_a scripture_n to_o be_v it_o wherein_o and_o whereby_o we_o be_v infallible_o assure_v of_o god_n will_n as_o to_o what_o we_o shall_v believe_v and_o do_v in_o order_n to_o salvation_n that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v of_o use_n towards_o faith_n we_o deny_v not_o but_o the_o cause_n and_o ground_n of_o faith_n and_o that_o whereby_o we_o be_v infallible_o ascertaind_v of_o the_o mind_n of_o god_n be_v not_o the_o proposition_n of_o the_o church_n but_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o such_o be_v the_o state_n of_o the_o question_n betwixt_o we_o i_o shall_v for_o your_o shower_n of_o authority_n you_o say_v you_o can_v power_n out_o against_o i_o give_v you_o or_o show_v you_o a_o cloud_n of_o witness_n as_o the_o apostle_n speak_v hebr._n 12.1_o against_o you_o your_o shower_n can_v not_o wet_v i_o through_o but_o this_o cloud_n may_v direct_v you_o home_o this_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n concern_v the_o church_n and_o scripture_n as_o you_o may_v see_v by_o the_o 8.19_o 20_o 21._o article_n and_o therefore_o it_o be_v not_o my_o opinion_n will_v appear_v not_o to_o be_v new_a but_o agreeable_a to_o ancient_a catholic_n in_o your_o own_o esteem_n the_o first_o shall_v be_v saint_n irenaeus_n have_v you_o appeal_v to_o saint_n irenaeus_n unto_o saint_n irenaeus_n shall_v you_o go_v he_o in_o his_o three_o book_n first_o chapter_n first_o word_v thus_o we_o have_v not_o know_v the_o dispose_n of_o our_o salvation_n by_o any_o other_o than_o those_o by_o who_o the_o gospel_n come_v to_o we_o which_o then_o indeed_o they_o preach_v afterward_o deliver_v it_o to_o we_o in_o the_o scripture_n by_o the_o will_n of_o god_n to_o be_v the_o foundation_n and_o pillar_n of_o our_o faith_n so_o he_o now_o that_o which_o be_v deliver_v in_o scripture_n by_o the_o will_n of_o god_n to_o be_v the_o foundation_n and_o pillar_n of_o faith_n be_v the_o ground_n and_o cause_n of_o our_o faith_n and_o such_o be_v the_o gospel_n according_a to_o this_o testimony_n the_o next_o for_o we_o be_v clemens_n alexandrinus_n in_o the_o seven_o of_o his_o stromata_n towards_o the_o end_n in_o the_o 757._o p._n of_o the_o greek_a and_o latin_a edition_n he_o which_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v by_o himself_o reasonable_o be_v worthy_a to_o be_v believe_v by_o the_o lord_n scripture_n and_o voice_n work_v by_o the_o lord_n inward_o to_o the_o benefit_n of_o man_n so_o he_o then_o according_a to_o he_o the_o holy_a scripture_n be_v not_o worthy_a to_o be_v believe_v by_o man_n but_o man_n be_v worthy_a of_o belief_n by_o it_o and_o therefore_o that_o must_v ground_v our_o faith_n because_o it_o be_v it_o whereby_o we_o believe_v other_o and_o therefore_o he_o say_v in_o the_o follow_a word_n sure_o we_o use_v it_o as_o the_o criterium_fw-la for_o find_v out_o of_o thing_n and_o therefore_o point_n be_v to_o be_v decide_v and_o determine_v by_o authority_n of_o it_o which_o be_v his_o chief_a discourse_n against_o heretic_n even_o to_o the_o end_n of_o that_o book_n and_o if_o you_o please_v to_o peruse_v and_o consider_v it_o you_o shall_v find_v there_o that_o in_o his_o judgement_n the_o catholic_a church_n which_o he_o also_o there_o commend_v do_v not_o conserve_v itself_o in_o that_o denomination_n by_o its_o own_o authority_n but_o by_o the_o rule_n of_o scripture_n now_o that_o which_o rule_v the_o whole_a rule_v the_o part_n the_o scripture_n rule_v the_o whole_a then_o we_o so_o origen_n upon_o saint_n matthew_n hom._n 25._o we_o ought_v not_o therefore_o for_o confirmation_n of_o doctrine_n to_o swear_v our_o own_o apprehension_n and_o to_o bring_v into_o witness_n those_o which_o every_o one_o of_o we_o do_v
here_o be_v one_o place_n where_o the_o father_n use_v the_o word_n not_o in_o the_o roman_a sense_n which_o may_v be_v make_v use_n of_o to_o another_o pupose_v about_o your_o opinion_n of_o merit_n and_o also_o if_o you_o will_v not_o mean_v it_o here_o of_o deserve_v this_o make_v some_o diminution_n of_o respect_n to_o the_o book_n and_o some_o advantage_n more_o i_o shall_v make_v of_o this_o chapter_n in_o its_o place_n many_o line_n in_o your_o fourteen_o page_n you_o have_v afterward_o wherein_o we_o have_v nothing_o but_o vaunt_n or_o repetition_n i_o will_v not_o trouble_v you_o with_o the_o latter_a nor_o myself_o with_o the_o former_a but_o towards_o the_o end_n of_o that_o page_n you_o will_v order_v the_o matter_n so_o as_o to_o hold_v your_o own_o and_o yet_o to_o give_v scripture_n its_o due_a respect_n and_o you_o seem_v to_o bring_v it_o to_o this_o determination_n that_o when_o there_o be_v a_o acknowledgement_n make_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v in_o themselves_o the_o word_n of_o god_n it_o do_v not_o derogate_v from_o scripture_n to_o hold_v that_o yet_o they_o be_v not_o know_v to_o we_o by_o a_o infallible_a ground_n that_o they_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n but_o by_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o church_n which_o in_o short_a term_n be_v express_v by_o other_o of_o your_o church_n that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n do_v depend_v upon_o the_o church_n but_o this_o will_v not_o serve_v the_o cover_n be_v too_o short_a for_o first_o this_o distinction_n be_v too_o narrow_a to_o extend_v to_o the_o difference_n betwixt_o we_o in_o particular_a point_n of_o faith_n therefore_o if_o you_o will_v yield_v that_o point_n of_o religion_n be_v to_o be_v examine_v and_o end_v infallible_o by_o scripture_n when_o we_o know_v it_o to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n than_o we_o will_v only_o stick_v to_o this_o question_n but_o if_o you_o will_v still_o maintain_v the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n in_o all_o her_o definition_n than_o your_o composition_n will_v not_o be_v sufficient_a although_o it_o can_v satisfy_v as_o to_o that_o particular_a but_o second_o it_o will_v not_o satisfy_v because_o you_o do_v not_o sufficient_o provide_v for_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o scripture_n authority_n and_o therefore_o you_o derogate_v from_o scripture_n in_o this_o although_o you_o do_v take_v away_o no_o honour_n from_o scripture_n as_o in_o regard_n of_o its_o truth_n do_v you_o lay_v it_o to_o heart_n that_o the_o many_o question_n betwixt_o we_o be_v about_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n the_o formal_a reason_n of_o credibilitie_n be_v the_o authority_n that_o which_o make_v i_o to_o believe_v it_o to_o be_v the_o truth_n of_o god_n as_o be_v his_o word_n be_v the_o authority_n for_o if_o the_o credibilitie_n do_v rise_v from_o the_o truth_n of_o it_o in_o itself_o you_o destroy_v your_o own_o cause_n for_o that_o you_o confess_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o infallible_a word_n of_o god_n then_o betwixt_o we_o simple_o about_o the_o truth_n of_o the_o scripture_n there_o be_v no_o contest_v and_o do_v not_o you_o affirm_v that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o faith_n because_o you_o think_v that_o the_o church_n by_o its_o authority_n be_v worthy_a to_o be_v believe_v since_o it_o be_v infallible_a but_o why_o then_o do_v you_o not_o grant_v this_o authority_n to_o the_o scripture_n since_o you_o confess_v it_o to_o be_v infallible_a if_o the_o reason_n of_o believe_v the_o church_n be_v the_o infallibility_n of_o it_o according_a to_o you_o why_o be_v not_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o scripture_n the_o reason_n of_o believe_v it_o since_o it_o be_v confess_v infallible_a and_o if_o you_o say_v you_o do_v believe_v it_o to_o be_v so_o by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n than_o the_o formal_a reason_n of_o believe_v it_o be_v not_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o scripture_n but_o of_o the_o church_n and_o yet_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n shall_v be_v the_o formal_a reason_n of_o believe_v it_o but_o you_o say_v you_o must_v know_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v infallible_a that_o i_o can_v do_v but_o by_o the_o church_n well_o but_o do_v not_o you_o then_o see_v that_o you_o prefer_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n before_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n for_o the_o church_n with_o you_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v for_o itself_o for_o so_o it_o must_v be_v or_o else_o the_o scripture_n must_v be_v believe_v for_o itself_o or_o else_o we_o shall_v have_v in_o divinity_n no_o principium_fw-la primo_fw-la primum_fw-la wherein_o to_o rest_v now_o if_o the_o scripture_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v for_o itself_o than_o we_o have_v end_v the_o business_n if_o the_o church_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v for_o itself_o than_o we_o prefer_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n before_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n than_o you_o derogate_v from_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n three_o the_o church_n have_v authority_n or_o not_o it_o have_v you_o say_v then_o of_o itself_o or_o not_o what_o will_v you_o say_v if_o of_o itself_o what_o have_v a_o company_n of_o christian_n more_o to_o say_v for_o themselves_o then_o other_o if_o you_o say_v the_o authority_n come_v from_o succession_n other_o also_o have_v have_v a_o constant_a succession_n and_o it_o must_v come_v to_o one_o first_o society_n well_o where_o have_v that_o society_n its_o authority_n of_o itself_o or_o not_o if_o of_o itself_o what_o by_o revelation_n beside_o scripture_n or_o not_o if_o beside_o than_o the_o charge_n of_o anabaptisticalness_n be_v fall_v upon_o you_o what_o then_o from_o scripture_n well_o then_o the_o scripture_n in_o regard_n of_o those_o text_n which_o concern_v the_o church_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v for_o itself_o and_o then_o why_o not_o in_o other_o four_o the_o word_n of_o god_n in_o the_o substance_n and_o matter_n of_o it_o be_v before_o the_o church_n therefore_o because_o the_o church_n be_v beget_v by_o it_o and_o therefore_o it_o must_v be_v know_v before_o the_o church_n yea_o reconcile_v your_o opinion_n with_o that_o of_o bellarmine_n in_o his_o first_o book_n de_fw-fr verbo_fw-la dei_fw-la cap._n 20._o the_o rule_n of_o catholic_a faith_n must_v be_v certain_a and_o know_v for_o if_o it_o be_v not_o know_v than_o it_o will_v not_o be_v a_o rule_n to_o we_o if_o it_o be_v not_o certain_a it_o can_v be_v a_o rule_n if_o it_o be_v a_o know_a rule_n against_o anabaptist_n why_o not_o also_o a_o know_a rule_n against_o papist_n and_o therefore_o that_o it_o must_v be_v make_v manifest_a by_o the_o church_n be_v not_o necessary_a for_o how_o be_v it_o make_v manifest_a to_o the_o first_o church_n to_o be_v the_o rule_n as_o for_o the_o instance_n of_o you_o that_o christ_n be_v make_v manifest_a to_o many_o by_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o baptist_n and_o of_o the_o apostle_n before_o the_o scripture_n be_v write_v and_o yet_o this_o derogate_a not_o from_o scripture_n we_o answer_v soon_o first_o it_o be_v yet_o to_o be_v prove_v whether_o the_o church_n have_v that_o inspiration_n as_o john_n baptist_n and_o the_o apostle_n have_v for_o the_o first_o plant_n of_o the_o church_n until_o that_o be_v make_v good_a your_o argumentation_n be_v not_o second_o although_o the_o new_a testament_n be_v not_o write_v the_o old_a be_v and_o john_n the_o baptist_n and_o the_o apostle_n preach_v no_o other_o doctrine_n than_o be_v contain_v in_o the_o old_a so_o our_o saviour_n if_o you_o have_v believe_v moses_n you_o will_v have_v believe_v i_o for_o he_o write_v of_o i_o in_o the_o 5._o of_o saint_n john_n the_o 46._o verse_n three_o if_o john_n the_o baptist_n and_o the_o apostle_n be_v believe_v by_o a_o divine_a faith_n without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n as_o the_o first_o disciple_n do_v why_o may_v not_o the_o scripture_n be_v believe_v by_o a_o divine_a faith_n without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n if_o the_o apostle_n be_v believe_v immediate_o without_o the_o church_n in_o what_o they_o say_v why_o may_v they_o not_o be_v believe_v also_o in_o what_o they_o write_v and_o sure_o to_o go_v a_o little_a more_o close_a and_o deep_a if_o we_o speak_v proper_o there_o be_v not_o so_o much_o a_o ground_n of_o faith_n as_o a_o cause_n if_o with_o the_o schoolman_n we_o grant_v as_o we_o may_v that_o faith_n be_v a_o supernatural_a habit_n infuse_v by_o god_n which_o dispose_v the_o understanding_n to_o assert_v that_o which_o be_v say_v by_o god_n be_v true_a because_o he_o say_v it_o not_o because_o the_o church_n say_v it_o and_o if_o you_o say_v that_o the_o scripture_n and_o the_o church_n be_v not_o opposite_a true_a when_o the_o church_n rule_v itself_o by_o scripture_n but_o if_o the_o question_n be_v which_o proposal_n be_v
be_v intend_v to_o that_o purpose_n since_o also_o the_o word_n do_v in_o short_a full_o represent_v the_o office_n of_o the_o church_n the_o intention_n of_o the_o passage_n must_v be_v gather_v by_o the_o scope_n according_a to_o the_o rule_n of_o the_o schoolman_n intelligentia_fw-la dicti_fw-la colligitur_fw-la ex_fw-la scopo_fw-la loquendi_fw-la now_o the_o drift_n of_o saint_n paul_n be_v to_o instruct_v he_o how_o he_o shall_v carry_v himself_o in_o the_o church_n be_v it_o reasonable_a than_o he_o shall_v have_v account_n of_o the_o church_n in_o the_o privilege_n of_o it_o or_o in_o the_o duty_n thereof_o which_o be_v to_o hold_v forth_o and_o uphold_v truth_n for_o if_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n be_v here_o affirm_v then_o need_v he_o not_o to_o have_v such_o instruction_n to_o take_v care_n how_o he_o behave_v himself_o in_o the_o church_n since_o infallible_a assistance_n be_v immediate_a and_o that_o which_o be_v immediate_a include_v no_o time_n for_o the_o inspiration_n nor_o mean_n of_o instruction_n therefore_o have_v your_o roman_a church_n be_v real_a in_o the_o assert_v of_o infallibility_n it_o have_v not_o need_v eighteen_o year_n for_o the_o sit_v of_o the_o trent_n council_n with_o intermission_n nor_o more_o for_o the_o consultation_n whether_o there_o shall_v be_v any_o as_o for_o that_o which_o come_v next_o of_o athanasius_n it_o be_v in_o part_n answer_v before_o the_o argument_n be_v this_o the_o consubstantiality_n of_o the_o son_n be_v by_o athanasius_n after_o the_o determination_n of_o the_o nicene_n council_n call_v that_o word_n of_o god_n by_o the_o nicene_n council_n which_o remain_v for_o ever_o and_o ever_o and_o this_o be_v no_o where_o clear_o say_v in_o scripture_n therefore_o somewhat_o which_o be_v not_o clear_o say_v in_o scripture_n may_v by_o a_o council_n be_v determine_v to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n to_o this_o we_o answer_v we_o may_v grant_v you_o all_o of_o the_o syllogism_n and_o yet_o nothing_o accrue_v to_o you_o if_o the_o word_n by_o the_o nicene_n council_n be_v understand_v ministerial_o to_o scripture_n which_o they_o be_v bind_v to_o declare_v the_o sense_n of_o as_o to_o that_o point_n and_o so_o it_o do_v not_o bind_v with_o relation_n to_o their_o authority_n but_o by_o authority_n of_o scripture_n which_o they_o declare_v the_o mind_n of_o in_o that_o case_n and_o therefore_o though_o so_o we_o grant_v the_o argument_n yet_o do_v we_o deny_v your_o consequence_n which_o you_o will_v make_v of_o it_o in_o your_o sense_n that_o the_o church_n be_v infallible_a in_o the_o definition_n of_o it_o since_o that_o which_o be_v define_v be_v indeed_o infallible_a and_o yet_o be_v not_o infallible_o define_v for_o though_o the_o council_n do_v not_o err_v in_o that_o definition_n yet_o it_o may_v have_v err_v and_o if_o it_o do_v not_o err_v in_o that_o yet_o it_o may_v err_v in_o other_o definition_n and_o therefore_o can_v we_o not_o without_o suspense_n intuitive_o receive_v what_o they_o propose_v as_o the_o word_n of_o god_n which_o be_v by_o you_o yet_o to_o be_v prove_v for_o second_o that_o which_o they_o have_v the_o principle_n and_o ground_n of_o scripture_n for_o it_o be_v more_o easy_a for_o they_o right_o to_o define_v in_o the_o application_n of_o those_o principle_n unto_o particular_a case_n as_o they_o have_v for_o that_o question_n about_o the_o consubstantiality_n of_o the_o son_n as_o saint_z john_n the_o 10.30_o i_o and_o my_o father_n be_v one_o not_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d but_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d not_o one_o person_n but_o one_o in_o nature_n but_o as_o for_o those_o question_n whereof_o the_o solution_n be_v not_o so_o principled_a in_o scripture_n as_o be_v not_o so_o necessary_a to_o be_v hold_v on_o either_o part_n we_o can_v expect_v so_o likely_a a_o determination_n and_o yet_o if_o probable_a we_o can_v from_o thence_o urge_v it_o as_o a_o object_n of_o faith_n that_o which_o be_v in_o scripture_n according_a to_o equivalence_n of_o sense_n as_o that_o point_n be_v we_o may_v better_o credit_v upon_o account_n of_o scripture_n then_o that_o which_o the_o ignorance_n of_o do_v not_o damn_v since_o the_o scripture_n give_v we_o no_o moment_n of_o knowledge_n how_o to_o order_v our_o assent_n affirmative_o or_o negative_o in_o that_o but_o three_o saint_n athanasius_n do_v not_o ground_n his_o faith_n in_o the_o affirmative_a of_o that_o question_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o nicene_n council_n because_o he_o hold_v it_o before_o the_o council_n have_v determine_v it_o and_o therefore_o the_o cause_n of_o his_o faith_n herein_o be_v not_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o council_n and_o if_o that_o council_n of_o nice_a be_v to_o be_v believe_v for_o itself_o without_o respect_n to_o the_o matter_n as_o depend_v upon_o scripture_n why_o not_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n to_o the_o contrary_a and_o therefore_o saint_n s._n austin_n will_v refer_v it_o to_o scripture_n betwixt_o he_o &_o maximinus_n a_o bishop_n of_o the_o arrian_n since_o the_o council_n be_v contrary_a and_o if_o any_o exception_n can_v have_v be_v make_v against_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n as_o towards_o the_o denial_n of_o such_o authority_n of_o it_o as_o be_v due_a to_o other_o council_n have_v it_o not_o be_v easy_a for_o the_o father_n to_o have_v hold_v the_o doctrine_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a though_o the_o other_o have_v be_v reject_v in_o your_o 23._o number_n you_o do_v not_o fair_o render_v my_o answer_n i_o do_v not_o say_v that_o christ_n will_v not_o be_v at_o all_o with_o his_o church_n to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n but_o it_o be_v not_o necessary_o there_o mean_v that_o he_o will_v be_v with_o they_o unto_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n as_o he_o be_v with_o the_o apostle_n by_o infallible_a assistance_n so_o he_o do_v not_o promise_v he_o will_v be_v with_o the_o successor_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o therefore_o if_o this_o be_v a_o simple_a mistake_n it_o be_v a_o fallacy_n a_o dicto_fw-la secundum_fw-la quid_fw-la if_o you_o intend_v a_o slander_n it_o be_v worse_o infallible_a assistance_n be_v not_o there_o promise_v and_o therefore_o the_o promise_n may_v be_v make_v good_a without_o it_o neither_o be_v there_o such_o need_n of_o infallible_a assistance_n whatsoever_o you_o say_v because_o the_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n be_v to_o be_v determine_v in_o the_o scripture_n which_o be_v the_o infallible_a word_n of_o god_n so_o that_o although_o they_o who_o follow_v the_o apostle_n in_o the_o governance_n of_o the_o church_n have_v be_v so_o dispose_v for_o infallible_a assistance_n as_o the_o apostle_n yet_o have_v there_o not_o be_v that_o use_n of_o the_o assistance_n infallible_a but_o have_v not_o that_o disposition_n thereunto_o they_o want_v a_o condition_n and_o qualification_n for_o such_o assistance_n and_o god_n do_v not_o give_v a_o infallible_a assistance_n to_o the_o apostle_n because_o they_o be_v dispose_v for_o that_o gift_n of_o infallibility_n but_o rather_o give_v they_o that_o disposition_n that_o so_o they_o may_v be_v fit_v for_o that_o infallibility_n and_o so_o if_o he_o have_v intend_v such_o a_o measure_n of_o the_o spirit_n to_o the_o successor_n of_o the_o apostle_n as_o to_o they_o he_o can_v have_v make_v they_o as_o capable_a thereof_o as_o for_o your_o reason_n which_o you_o mention_v of_o leave_v as_o secure_v direction_n for_o they_o who_o follow_v because_o the_o further_o we_o go_v from_o christ_n time_n the_o more_o we_o be_v subject_a to_o uncertainty_n about_o his_o doctrine_n therefore_o there_o be_v as_o much_o yea_o far_o more_o reason_n of_o this_o secure_a direction_n i_o answer_v you_o do_v not_o well_o consider_v what_o you_o say_v for_o if_o we_o be_v more_o subject_n to_o uncertainty_n the_o further_o we_o go_v from_o christ_n his_o time_n then_o can_v you_o urge_v the_o credit_n of_o those_o tradition_n now_o equal_o to_o the_o certainty_n of_o they_o then_o suppose_v that_o there_o be_v any_o of_o faith_n not_o write_v second_o this_o reason_n will_v be_v none_o if_o man_n will_v be_v guide_v by_o scripture_n which_o have_v now_o the_o same_o certainty_n as_o ever_o this_o be_v a_o rule_n which_o will_v with_o equal_a infallibility_n hold_v at_o all_o time_n and_o unto_o which_o we_o be_v all_o equal_o oblige_v again_o you_o will_v argue_v that_o the_o church_n be_v secure_a from_o damnable_a error_n because_o christ_n promise_v to_o be_v with_o it_o to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o world_n and_o he_o be_v not_o with_o those_o who_o live_v in_o damnable_a error_n but_o what_o be_v this_o to_o i_o you_o may_v conclude_v thus_o and_o yet_o not_o against_o i_o if_o you_o speak_v of_o damnable_a error_n specificative_o for_o if_o you_o mean_v it_o reduplicative_o that_o all_o error_n be_v damnable_a
that_o the_o invisible_a church_n shall_v not_o perish_v which_o be_v true_a although_o the_o visible_a church_n be_v under_o a_o possibility_n to_o err_v since_o every_o error_n be_v not_o destructive_a of_o salvation_n in_o the_o 25._o number_n you_o tell_v i_o what_o you_o have_v say_v before_o but_o that_o you_o have_v give_v i_o some_o additional_a testimony_n in_o the_o supplement_n of_o the_o last_o which_o have_v their_o answer_n without_o repetition_n only_o you_o no_o where_o i_o think_v find_v that_o saint_n jerome_n do_v receive_v all_o those_o book_n which_o you_o receive_v for_o canonical_a and_o for_o those_o author_n which_o hold_v the_o consubstantiality_n of_o the_o son_n and_o those_o several_a property_n of_o the_o holy_a trinity_n you_o will_v give_v i_o leave_v with_o judicious_a man_n to_o suspect_v eusebius_n believe_v your_o cardinal_n herein_o bellarmin_n in_o his_o de_fw-fr scriptoribus_fw-la ecclesiasticis_fw-la p._n 94.5_o 6._o where_o he_o bring_v the_o attestation_n of_o saint_n athanasius_n and_o saint_n jerome_n to_o the_o same_o purpose_n and_o saint_n jerome_n call_v he_o not_o only_o a_o arrian_n but_o the_o prince_n of_o the_o arrian_n sometime_o sometime_o the_o ensign-bearer_n yea_o the_o 7._o synod_n he_o say_v and_o the_o apostolical_a legate_n reject_v his_o authority_n as_o be_v a_o arrian_n heretic_n as_o he_o say_v and_o as_o for_o augustine_n expression_n that_o the_o rely_v on_o the_o church_n authority_n be_v the_o most_o true_a and_o inviolable_a rule_n of_o faith_n you_o refer_v it_o to_o your_o 16._o number_n and_o there_o refer_v i_o to_o the_o 13._o chapter_n of_o the_o first_o book_n contra_fw-la cresconium_fw-la which_o i_o can_v see_v there_o if_o it_o shall_v be_v so_o disert_o yet_o this_o must_v be_v understand_v respective_o to_o those_o case_n wherein_o the_o scripture_n do_v not_o clear_o pass_v the_o verdict_n in_o which_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v the_o best_a rule_n we_o can_v then_o have_v as_o towards_o practice_n but_o this_o in_o his_o opinion_n do_v not_o absolute_o leave_v we_o to_o follow_v tradition_n of_o the_o church_n in_o point_n of_o faith_n unless_o he_o contradict_v himself_o as_o you_o shall_v see_v at_o the_o end_n but_o you_o be_v afraid_a of_o want_n of_o number_n to_o make_v noise_n because_o you_o say_v i_o say_v you_o have_v no_o other_o testimony_n but_o saint_n augustine_n i_o do_v not_o say_v that_o you_o have_v none_o but_o he_o absolute_o but_o you_o have_v none_o but_o his_o that_o i_o can_v see_v of_o those_o you_o produce_v neither_o him_z indeed_o if_o you_o please_v to_o tell_v we_o what_o you_o see_v therefore_o we_o shall_v look_v over_o your_o reinforcing_a his_n and_o the_o main_a testimony_n for_o your_o cause_n in_o my_o answer_n whereunto_o i_o see_v yet_o no_o place_n for_o amendment_n or_o abatement_n i_o say_v if_o you_o consider_v the_o whole_a ten●●r_n of_o the_o chapter_n you_o may_v be_v incline_v to_o think_v that_o it_o come_v from_o he_o in_o some_o heat_n of_o dispute_n and_o methinks_v i_o may_v think_v so_o still_o your_o man_n be_v wont_a to_o answer_v evidence_n of_o the_o father_n which_o be_v against_o they_o when_o they_o please_v that_o such_o passage_n come_v from_o they_o not_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d but_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o sure_o we_o may_v have_v that_o liberty_n when_o there_o be_v such_o occasion_n give_v for_o we_o to_o interpret_v they_o as_o here_o if_o we_o consider_v how_o he_o be_v displease_v with_o himself_o for_o a_o former_a respect_n to_o that_o epistle_n and_o also_o if_o we_o take_v notice_n of_o his_o short_a return_n of_o discourse_n in_o this_o epistle_n and_o also_o if_o we_o mark_v his_o check_n and_o correct_v and_o take_v up_o himself_o towards_o the_o end_n of_o the_o chapter_n with_o a_o absit_fw-la sed_fw-la absit_fw-la ut_fw-la ego_fw-la evangelio_n non_fw-la credam_fw-la and_o if_o this_o answer_n do_v not_o weigh_v with_o you_o than_o i_o give_v you_o another_o that_o this_o may_v be_v speak_v of_o himself_o not_o in_o sensu_fw-la composito_fw-la as_o then_o but_o in_o sensu_fw-la diviso_fw-la as_o in_o order_n to_o that_o time_n when_o he_o be_v a_o manichee_n himself_o to_o which_o purpose_n i_o tell_v you_o it_o be_v familiar_a to_o he_o and_o other_o writer_n of_o that_o part_n of_o the_o world_n to_o express_v a_o tense_n more_o than_o past_a by_o the_o imperfect_a and_o the_o sense_n be_v that_o when_o he_o be_v a_o manichee_n he_o will_v not_o have_v believe_v the_o gospel_n but_o that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n have_v move_v he_o to_o it_o one_o place_n of_o this_o usage_n i_o find_v to_o be_v in_o a_o chapter_n you_o quote_v in_o his_o de_fw-fr predestinatione_fw-la sanct._n lib._n 2._o cap._n 1._o s_o 14._o qui_fw-la igitur_fw-la opus_fw-la est_fw-la ut_fw-la eorum_fw-la ferutemur_fw-la opuscula_fw-la qui_fw-la priusquam_fw-la ista_fw-la haresis_fw-la ●riretur_fw-la non_fw-la habuerunt_fw-la necessitatem_fw-la in_o hâc_fw-la difficili_fw-la ad_fw-la solvendum_fw-la quastione_fw-la versari_fw-la quod_fw-la procul_fw-la dubio_fw-la facerem_fw-la si_fw-la respondere_fw-la talibus_fw-la cogerentur_fw-la where_o you_o have_v the_o imperfect_a tense_n for_o the_o tense_n more_o past_a facerent_fw-la for_o fecissent_fw-la and_o so_o the_o other_o so_o in_o his_o first_o book_n of_o retract_v cap._n 51._o profecto_fw-la non_fw-la dixissem_fw-la si_fw-la jam_fw-la ●uns_fw-la essem_fw-la literis_fw-la sucris_n ita_fw-la eruditus_fw-la ut_fw-la recolerem_fw-la where_o you_o have_v essem_fw-la for_o fuissem_fw-la and_o so_o the_o other_o and_o also_o by_o the_o way_n let_v i_o observe_v somewhat_o from_o those_o two_o place_n towards_o the_o main_a question_n beside_o the_o use_n of_o they_o in_o the_o way_n of_o criticism_n for_o by_o the_o former_a you_o have_v the_o reason_n why_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o church_n in_o doctrine_n receive_v will_v not_o make_v a_o end_n of_o our_o difference_n since_o the_o question_n be_v not_o then_o start_v and_o also_o by_o the_o second_o you_o may_v observe_v that_o we_o can_v swallow_v all_o that_o be_v say_v by_o saint_n austin_n without_o chew_v since_o he_o say_v himself_o that_o have_v he_o be_v so_o well_o instruct_v he_o will_v not_o have_v say_v this_o and_o that_o and_o indeed_o his_o book_n of_o retractation_n be_v book_n against_o you_o and_o do_v conclude_v whole_o that_o we_o be_v not_o to_o take_v whatsoever_o the_o father_n write_v to_o be_v as_o true_a as_o gospel_n yea_o some_o such_o book_n of_o retractation_n all_o of_o they_o may_v have_v make_v as_o some_o think_v origen_n do_v although_o they_o be_v perish_v as_o to_o we_o but_o the_o answer_n which_o i_o give_v you_o to_o that_o passage_n of_o saint_n austin_n will_v not_o content_v you_o therefore_o you_o endeavour_v to_o show_v at_o large_a that_o they_o will_v not_o serve_v you_o say_v unless_o he_o will_v stand_v to_o that_o ground_n he_o must_v needs_o seem_v to_o say_v nothing_o against_o his_o adversary_n what_o ground_n do_v you_o mean_v what_o that_o he_o be_v move_v by_o the_o church_n infallible_a authority_n as_o you_o will_v conclude_v at_o every_o turn_n no_o suppose_v he_o not_o to_o speak_v in_o aestu_fw-la sermonis_fw-la yet_o what_o he_o say_v against_o his_o adversary_n be_v reasonable_a without_o urge_v the_o infallible_a authority_n for_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o church_n may_v be_v consider_v by_o he_o as_o a_o condition_n towards_o the_o reception_n of_o any_o doctrine_n and_o yet_o not_o to_o be_v that_o which_o he_o build_v his_o faith_n upon_o as_o upon_o a_o infallible_a ground_n you_o may_v know_v the_o causa_fw-la sine_fw-la qua_fw-la non_fw-la be_v not_o a_o cause_n although_o such_o a_o thing_n be_v not_o without_o it_o yet_o be_v not_o this_o the_o cause_n thereof_o and_o therefore_o make_v what_o you_o can_v of_o the_o place_n it_o will_v not_o afford_v you_o a_o firm_a foundation_n if_o his_o authority_n can_v do_v it_o you_o say_v that_o this_o be_v his_o first_o argument_n to_o show_v that_o his_o adversary_n by_o cite_v text_n out_o of_o the_o gospel_n to_o prove_v manichaeus_n a_o true_a apostle_n can_v prove_v nothing_o against_o those_o who_o as_o yet_o have_v not_o believe_v the_o gospel_n so_o you_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o what_o then_o because_o the_o adversary_n can_v prove_v nothing_o by_o scripture_n to_o those_o that_o deny_v it_o therefore_o saint_n austin_n must_v infer_v that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v infallible_a and_o he_o must_v believe_v the_o gospel_n upon_o no_o other_o ground_n what_o consequence_n be_v this_o as_o if_o because_o saint_n augustine_n adversary_n care_v not_o for_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n therefore_o we_o must_v be_v guilty_a of_o that_o which_o be_v call_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d which_o have_v so_o much_o wrong_v the_o church_n as_o nothing_o more_o this_o
be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d you_o go_v on_o in_o your_o paraphrastical_a discourse_n but_o because_o i_o be_o not_o one_o who_o have_v not_o yet_o believe_v the_o gospel_n and_o so_o this_o answer_n can_v serve_v i_o notwithstanding_o i_o must_v tell_v you_o that_o i_o be_o such_o a_o one_o that_o i_o will_v not_o believe_v the_o gospel_n without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n do_v move_v i_o so_o you_o out_o of_o which_o word_n of_o your_o own_o you_o may_v learn_v how_o to_o understand_v the_o sense_n and_o tense_n of_o the_o father_n in_o the_o place_n but_o because_o i_o be_o not_o one_o who_o have_v not_o yet_o believe_v the_o gospel_n then_o he_o have_v believe_v the_o gospel_n before_o and_o be_v not_o to_o believe_v it_o now_o and_o therefore_o his_o word_n must_v be_v refer_v in_o the_o african_a idiotism_n unto_o the_o time_n more_o than_o imperfect_a otherwise_o what_o he_o have_v believe_v he_o be_v to_o believe_v now_o which_o can_v stand_v with_o your_o infallibility_n and_o yet_o you_o say_v afterward_o mark_v if_o his_o ground_n be_v not_o so_o as_o i_o tell_v you_o because_o say_v he_o i_o have_v believe_v the_o gospel_n itself_o upon_o the_o preach_n of_o the_o catholic_n therefore_o if_o his_o adversary_n shall_v say_v do_v not_o believe_v the_o catholic_n he_o do_v not_o go_v consequent_o to_o force_v he_o by_o the_o gospel_n to_o any_o faith_n to_o manichaeus_n and_o hereupon_o you_o break_v out_o in_o these_o word_n can_v he_o more_o clear_o ground_n upon_o the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o their_o teach_v then_o upon_o this_o to_o believe_v the_o gospel_n itself_o answ_n again_o these_o word_n do_v not_o include_v a_o divine_a faith_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n which_o you_o must_v have_v or_o else_o your_o cause_n be_v starve_v because_o those_o word_n i_o will_v not_o believe_v the_o gospel_n unless_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n do_v move_v i_o which_o must_v be_v the_o principal_a ground_n do_v not_o include_v his_o faith_n of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n he_o may_v be_v move_v by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n though_o not_o resolve_v in_o his_o faith_n by_o the_o infallibility_n pretend_v &_o according_a to_o this_o proportion_n must_v all_o his_o discourse_n be_v understand_v which_o proceed_v from_o his_o belief_n of_o the_o gospel_n by_o they_o to_o his_o be_v persuade_v by_o they_o to_o manichaeism_n if_o any_o thing_n shall_v be_v find_v in_o the_o gospel_n towards_o it_o or_o else_o proceed_v to_o his_o not_o believe_v of_o manichaeus_n upon_o his_o belief_n of_o the_o catholic_n who_o bid_v he_o believe_v the_o gospel_n and_o not_o manichaus_fw-la these_o must_v be_v the_o hinge_n upon_o which_o the_o whole_a disputation_n must_v turn_v and_o therefore_o if_o those_o word_n be_v not_o understand_v of_o a_o ultimate_a determination_n of_o his_o faith_n by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n but_o of_o a_o instrumental_a move_n nothing_o will_v be_v conclude_v sufficient_a and_o sufficient_o for_o you_o but_o this_o answer_n you_o give_v not_o i_o any_o return_n to_o ponder_v it_o very_o well_o for_o its_o importance_n in_o this_o debate_n for_o if_o the_o whole_a chapter_n be_v sober_o speak_v and_o if_o that_o he_o do_v not_o speak_v of_o himself_o as_o when_o he_o be_v a_o manichaeu_n yet_o if_o he_o here_o intend_v to_o signify_v no_o more_o then_o only_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v a_o impulsive_a to_o the_o belief_n of_o the_o gospel_n you_o will_v evince_v no_o more_o than_o what_o you_o need_v not_o contend_v for_o because_o we_o do_v not_o contend_v against_o it_o as_o be_v not_o the_o state_n of_o the_o question_n therefore_o it_o remain_v for_o you_o to_o prove_v your_o supposition_n or_o your_o proof_n of_o a_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n which_o indeed_o you_o will_v put_v in_o in_o your_o conclusion_n but_o be_v want_v in_o the_o premise_n and_o if_o it_o do_v belong_v to_o i_o to_o dispute_v it_o be_v not_o difficult_a to_o show_v the_o contrary_n and_o since_o they_o may_v come_v in_o upon_o account_n of_o the_o reason_n of_o my_o denial_n they_o shall_v be_v there_o two_o moment_n from_o the_o chapter_n first_o because_o he_o say_v he_o do_v believe_v the_o gospel_n per_fw-la illos_fw-la not_o propter_fw-la now_o what_o we_o do_v proper_o believe_v any_o one_o in_o we_o must_v believe_v for_o he_o not_o by_o he_o for_o he_o as_o a_o cause_n not_o by_o he_o as_o a_o instrument_n and_o therefore_o we_o believe_v what_o god_n say_v to_o be_v true_a not_o by_o he_o but_o for_o he_o and_o if_o the_o apostle_n as_o he_o say_v be_v not_o 〈◊〉_d of_o their_o faith_n 2_o cor._n 1●_n 14_o then_o be_v not_o those_o catholic_n he_o speak_v of_o such_o as_o he_o ought_v for_o themselves_o to_o believe_v second_o because_o in_o several_a place_n of_o the_o chapter_n he_o do_v signify_v that_o if_o any_o reason_n can_v be_v give_v or_o any_o thing_n whereby_o it_o may_v be_v manifest_o know_v that_o his_o adversary_n be_v in_o the_o right_a he_o will_v leave_v his_o catholic_n now_o this_o be_v not_o speak_v consistent_o to_o the_o nature_n of_o faith_n upon_o infallible_a authority_n for_o what_o we_o do_v believe_v in_o way_n of_o faith_n we_o do_v so_o believe_v as_o there_o can_v be_v a_o falsity_n in_o it_o as_o aquinas_n do_v confess_v and_o i_o suppose_v you_o too_o for_o you_o will_v conclude_v no_o falsity_n or_o error_n can_v be_v in_o any_o thing_n which_o the_o church_n do_v define_v because_o it_o be_v infallible_a and_o therefore_o all_o the_o reason_n and_o all_o the_o science_n in_o the_o world_n be_v not_o able_a to_o shake_v faith_n whereunto_o the_o contrary_a be_v intimate_v in_o the_o father_n nay_o if_o there_o be_v no_o argue_v to_o the_o principle_n of_o faith_n from_o other_o principle_n but_o from_o the_o principle_n of_o scripture_n there_o be_v argue_v to_o divine_a conclusion_n then_o assure_o faith_n in_o principle_n of_o theology_n as_o this_o be_v one_o the_o verity_n of_o the_o gospel_n be_v not_o obnoxious_a to_o any_o decay_n by_o any_o reason_n and_o it_o seem_v his_o faith_n then_o in_o the_o gospel_n be_v not_o divine_a upon_o the_o consideration_n of_o their_o authority_n since_o reason_n may_v be_v valid_a against_o humane_a authority_n but_o not_o divine_a so_o that_o have_v he_o mean_v he_o build_v his_o faith_n of_o the_o gospel_n upon_o the_o authority_n infallible_a of_o the_o church_n there_o have_v be_v no_o place_n for_o reason_n to_o have_v any_o power_n of_o assent_n on_o the_o behalf_n of_o the_o manichee_n again_o if_o you_o hold_v to_o the_o gospel_n my_o hold_n shall_v still_o be_v to_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n upon_o who_o authority_n i_o believe_v the_o gospel_n i_o say_v he_o will_v hold_v myself_o to_o those_o by_o who_o teach_v i_o have_v believe_v the_o gospel_n and_o there_o command_v i_o i_o will_v not_o believe_v thou_o so_o you_o think_v that_o this_o be_v also_o available_a for_o you_o sure_o nothing_o less_o for_o beside_o that_o you_o omit_v much_o of_o his_o connexion_n that_o make_v for_o my_o former_a argument_n and_o also_o that_o ●●●kes_n against_o your_o rash_a and_o blind_a believe_v beside_o that_o you_o may_v understand_v that_o here_o he_o do_v not_o compare_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n with_o the_o autopisty_a of_o scripture_n which_o be_v the_o 〈◊〉_d of_o the_o controversy_n but_o he_o do_v compare_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n as_o towards_o the_o belief_n of_o the_o gospel_n with_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o manichee_n as_o to_o believe_v their_o false_a gospel_n of_o manichaeus_n indeed_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v more_o urge_v and_o be_v more_o useful_a to_o prevail_v abo●●e_n or_o against_o the_o authority_n of_o private_a opposite_n but_o w●●_n that_o it_o have_v the_o moment_n of_o credibility_n above_o or_o equal_o to_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n itself_o be_v that_o which_o be_v a_o question_n and_o be_v not_o here_o determine_v for_o you_o but_o you_o go_v on_o and_o saint_n austin_n go_v on_o so_o far_o upon_o this_o ground_n as_o a_o ground_n infallible_a what_o of_o faith_n it_o be_v again_o deny_v not_o only_o simple_o but_o it_o be_v deny_v to_o be_v hold_v so_o by_o he_o in_o this_o discourse_n if_o you_o may_v have_v your_o supposition_n we_o must_v needs_o soon_o have_v do_v well_o go_v on_o that_o he_o say_v if_o perhaps_o you_o manicha●us_o can_v find_v i_o any_o clear_a place_n in_o the_o gospel_n to_o prove_v the_o apostleship_n of_o manichaeus_n that_o then_o indeed_o they_o shall_v weaken_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n so_o he_o ●aith_o and_o what_o can_v you_o make_v of_o this_o
for_o your_o use_n take_v it_o by_o itself_o and_o it_o will_v come_v to_o this_o that_o a_o clear_a place_n in_o the_o gospel_n will_v persuade_v he_o to_o lessen_v his_o opinion_n of_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n then_o he_o will_v hold_v clear_a scripture_n above_o or_o against_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n than_o their_o authority_n be_v not_o in_o his_o judgement_n infallible_a or_o else_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n may_v be_v opposite_a to_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o one_o in_o his_o opinion_n of_o they_o the_o scripture_n be_v more_o infallible_a than_o the_o other_o the_o church_n which_o be_v incongruous_a for_o in_o infallibility_n there_o be_v no_o degree_n no_o more_o then_o in_o truth_n and_o if_o you_o say_v that_o the_o scripture_n yet_o may_v be_v more_o infallible_a to_o he_o this_o spoil_v all_o your_o cause_n for_o you_o say_v you_o go_v to_o faith_n by_o the_o church_n because_o that_o way_n be_v more_o plain_a &c_n &c_n manifest●_n therefore_o you_o hasten_v i_o from_o this_o passage_n to_o show_v i_o what_o will_v follow_v but_o what_o do_v you_o think_v will_v follow_v i_o pray_v note_v it_o well_o their_o authority_n be_v weaken_v and_o show_v once_o fallible_a now_o neither_o can_v i_o so_o much_o as_o believe_v the_o gospel_n and_o why_o so_o because_o upon_o the_o authority_n of_o these_o catholic_n i_o have_v believe_v the_o gospel_n so_o you_o but_o do_v you_o see_v how_o you_o interpose_v your_o gloss_n in_o your_o parenthesis_n thus_o their_o authority_n be_v once_o weaken_v and_o show_v once_o fallible_a do_v you_o imagine_v that_o we_o can_v neglect_v or_o overlook_v this_o your_o glossall_n inference_n or_o opposition_n and_o show_v once_o fallible_a as_o if_o there_o be_v no_o authority_n but_o that_o which_o be_v infallible_a and_o there_o be_v no_o weaken_n of_o authority_n but_o to_o make_v it_o fallible_a authority_n may_v stand_v with_o fallibility_n for_o we_o grant_v authority_n to_o the_o church_n distinguish_v it_o from_o infallibility_n and_o if_o you_o have_v do_v so_o you_o have_v save_v many_o a_o wound_n which_o your_o church_n have_v get_v by_o that_o unfortunate_a word_n infallibility_n as_o one_o of_o your_o own_o man_n happy_o confess_v neither_o therefore_o do_v it_o follow_v that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n be_v weaken_v and_o show_v once_o fallible_a he_o can_v not_o at_o all_o believe_v the_o gospel_n because_o by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n he_o have_v believe_v the_o gospel_n but_o he_o can_v not_o then_o believe_v the_o gospel_n by_o that_o inductive_a and_o motive_n of_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n for_o the_o first_o christian_n believe_v the_o apostle_n several_o without_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n yea_o if_o upon_o that_o consideration_n he_o can_v not_o have_v believe_v the_o gospel_n their_o authority_n by_o who_o he_o do_v believe_v it_o be_v weaken_v yet_o do_v it_o not_o from_o hence_o flow_v necessary_o that_o when_o he_o do_v believe_v the_o gospel_n he_o do_v believe_v it_o upon_o a_o infallible_a authority_n because_o although_o he_o can_v not_o believe_v the_o gospel_n without_o it_o yet_o may_v he_o account_v it_o as_o towards_o belief_n but_o a_o condition_n not_o a_o cause_n of_o his_o faith_n and_o this_o you_o must_v have_v or_o else_o you_o do_v not_o contradict_v whatsoever_o be_v necessary_a to_o a_o effect_n be_v not_o the_o cause_n of_o it_o although_o whatsoever_o be_v a_o cause_n thereof_o be_v necessary_a to_o it_o therefore_o that_o be_v not_o so_o which_o again_o you_o say_v that_o the_o ground_n of_o his_o belief_n in_o the_o gospel_n be_v their_o infallible_a authority_n as_o not_o only_o these_o but_o also_o the_o next_o word_n show_v manifest_o when_o will_v you_o by_o your_o proof_n put_v the_o infallible_a proposal_n of_o the_o church_n out_o of_o question_n when_o shall_v we_o have_v any_o more_o than_o supposal_n of_o it_o let_v we_o see_v your_o next_o word_n wherefore_o if_o in_o the_o gospel_n there_o be_v nothing_o find_v that_o be_v evident_a to_o prove_v the_o apostleship_n of_o manichaeus_n than_o i_o will_v believe_v the_o catholic_n rather_o then_o you_o but_o if_o you_o shall_v read_v i_o out_o of_o the_o gospel_n something_o that_o be_v evident_a to_o prove_v manichaeus_n a_o apostle_n then_o neither_o will_v i_o believe_v the_o catholic_n nor_o thou_o why_o so_o i_o will_v not_o believe_v the_o catholic_n because_o they_o who_o doctrine_n i_o think_v infallible_a have_v lie_v to_o i_o concern_v the_o manichaeau_n but_o i_o will_v not_o believe_v thou_o even_o when_o thou_o cite_v clear_a scripture_n for_o of_o this_o case_n he_o speak_v and_o why_o so_o because_o thou_o do_v cite_v i_o that_o scripture_n to_o which_o scripture_n i_o have_v now_o believe_v upon_o their_o authority_n who_o have_v lie_v to_o i_o so_o you_o and_o what_o now_o from_o hence_o can_v you_o gather_v more_o then_o from_o the_o former_a passage_n of_o the_o same_o nature_n unless_o you_o do_v make_v good_a another_o parenthetical_a supposition_n who_o doctrine_n i_o think_v infallible_a this_o be_v not_o in_o saint_n austin_n but_o come_v from_o your_o own_o private_a spirit_n and_o therefore_o if_o you_o will_v not_o be_v rule_v by_o our_o spirit_n because_o of_o the_o former_a exception_n to_o the_o contrary_a sure_o we_o have_v no_o cause_n to_o be_v overperswade_v by_o your_o judgement_n without_o any_o reason_n for_o it_o second_o may_v you_o not_o from_o hence_o take_v notice_n that_o what_o i_o say_v of_o saint_n ●ustin_a that_o in_o the_o testimony_n here_o he_o may_v speak_v as_o in_o some_o heat_n of_o dispute_n for_o can_v we_o think_v that_o saint_n austin_n have_v such_o a_o soul_n as_o to_o say_v sober_o and_o categorical_o that_o he_o will_v not_o believe_v clear_a scripture_n which_o be_v cite_v by_o any_o one_o because_o catholic_n have_v tell_v he_o otherwise_o do_v saint_n austin_n in_o your_o conceit_n differ_v in_o judgement_n from_o your_o aquinas_n or_o do_v your_o aquinas_n differ_v from_o saint_n austin_n consider_v then_o what_o your_o aquinas_n say_v in_o his_o sum_n the_o first_o part_n the_o first_o question_n and_o the_o eight_o art_n innititur_fw-la enim_fw-la fides_fw-la nostra_fw-la revelationi_fw-la apostolis_n &_o prophetis_fw-la facta_fw-la qui_fw-la canonicos_fw-la libros_fw-la scripserunt_fw-la for_o our_o faith_n do_v rely_v upon_o the_o revelation_n make_v to_o the_o apostle_n and_o prophet_n who_o write_v the_o canonical_a book_n but_o not_o upon_o the_o revelation_n if_o any_o other_o be_v make_v to_o other_o doctor_n nay_o he_o confirm_v it_o by_o saint_n austin_n out_o of_o his_o 19_o epist_n a_o little_a after_o the_o beginning_n solis_fw-la enim_fw-la scripturarum_fw-la libris_fw-la etc._n etc._n for_o i_o have_v learned_a to_o give_v this_o honour_n only_o to_o the_o book_n of_o scripture_n which_o be_v call_v canonical_a as_o to_o believe_v most_o firm_o that_o none_o of_o the_o author_n thereof_o do_v err_v in_o write_v any_o thing_n but_o other_o i_o so_o read_v that_o whatsoever_o holiness_n or_o learning_n they_o be_v excellent_a in_o i_o do_v not_o think_v true_a therefore_o because_o they_o think_v so_o or_o write_v so_o compare_v then_o this_o passage_n with_o the_o other_o or_o the_o other_o with_o this_o and_o then_o judge_v whither_o either_o he_o do_v not_o differ_v from_o himself_o in_o his_o principle_n or_o do_v not_o speak_v the_o former_a as_o a_o disputant_n three_o let_v i_o note_v whereas_o you_o do_v right_o translate_v saint_n austin_n as_o speak_v of_o his_o belief_n by_o the_o catholic_n in_o the_o tense_n more_o than_o past_a you_o give_v yourself_o occasion_n to_o think_v that_o he_o mean_v the_o main_a passage_n non_fw-la crederem_fw-la not_o of_o himself_o then_o but_o as_o before_o a_o manichee_n and_o your_o argument_n which_o you_o produce_v a_o little_a after_o against_o this_o last_o answer_n because_o he_o speak_v here_o of_o believe_v the_o act_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o believe_v it_o by_o a_o necessary_a consequence_n because_o he_o have_v already_o believe_v the_o other_o canonical_a book_n upon_o the_o same_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n do_v not_o overthrow_v my_o answer_n because_o you_o say_v yourself_o that_o this_o book_n of_o the_o act_n he_o do_v believe_v by_o consequence_n by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n he_o be_v at_o first_o move_v to_o believe_v the_o other_o book_n and_o therefore_o by_o consequence_n he_o do_v believe_v the_o book_n of_o the_o act_n because_o the_o catholic_n authority_n do_v in_o like_a manner_n commend_v both_o scripture_n the_o speak_v here_o in_o the_o present_n do_v not_o derogate_v from_o my_o answer_n because_o the_o believe_a by_o consequence_n suppose_v a_o act_n of_o believe_a antecedent_n also_o four_o note_v that_o here_o he_o say_v the_o
the_o not_o be_v a_o rule_n upon_o this_o account_n the_o tradition_n and_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o father_n can_v be_v a_o rule_n because_o they_o have_v be_v abuse_v three_o we_o do_v not_o intend_v the_o use_n of_o the_o judgement_n of_o discretion_n to_o rest_v in_o that_o upon_o a_o interpretation_n nor_o do_v we_o oppose_v it_o to_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n but_o we_o say_v this_o must_v be_v satisfy_v in_o article_n and_o matter_n of_o faith_n notwithstanding_o the_o decision_n of_o the_o church_n by_o consonance_n thereof_o to_o scripture_n otherwise_o it_o can_v give_v the_o assent_n of_o divine_a faith_n every_o one_o must_v be_v persuade_v in_o his_o own_o mind_n although_o he_o do_v not_o make_v his_o own_o sense_n this_o private_a judgement_n shall_v neither_o be_v blind_a nor_o heady_a it_o respect_v authority_n but_o join_v only_o with_o appearance_n of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n that_o which_o you_o say_v to_o the_o seven_o answer_n be_v examine_v before_o that_o which_o you_o say_v to_o the_o eight_o answer_n will_v not_o serve_v to_o save_v you_o from_o differ_v from_o yourself_o which_o indeed_o if_o it_o be_v in_o way_n of_o retractation_n will_v not_o be_v reprehensible_a as_o saint_n austin_n speak_v in_o the_o preface_n of_o his_o retractation_n neque_fw-la enim_fw-la nisi_fw-la imprudens_fw-la etc._n etc._n for_o neither_o will_v any_o but_o a_o unwise_a man_n reprehend_v i_o because_o i_o reprehend_v my_o error_n but_o if_o you_o have_v a_o mind_n to_o see_v the_o difference_n betwixt_o you_o and_o you_o you_o may_v thus_o before_o you_o say_v that_o the_o ground_n of_o believe_v be_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n since_o you_o have_v say_v in_o your_o second_o paper_n that_o it_o be_v the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v if_o there_o be_v no_o difference_n why_o do_v you_o not_o keep_v your_o term_n as_o a_o disputant_n shall_v do_v but_o you_o say_v your_o reply_n be_v exceed_o easy_a the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n be_v god_n reveal_v and_o god_n reveal_v by_o his_o church_n as_o he_o first_o cause_v our_o first_o belief_n when_o he_o tell_v we_o by_o his_o church_n such_o and_o such_o book_n be_v infallible_o his_o word_n so_o you_o now_o then_o if_o you_o make_v the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v to_o be_v the_o ground_n and_o cause_n of_o faith_n than_o it_o be_v not_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n because_o although_o god_n do_v reveal_v by_o his_o church_n yet_o be_v not_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n the_o ground_n of_o faith_n but_o god_n authority_n for_o the_o church_n be_v but_o as_o a_o messenger_n or_o ambassador_n which_o we_o do_v not_o believe_v for_o himself_o but_o for_o his_o letter_n of_o credence_n from_o his_o master_n and_o so_o be_v it_o the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v which_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o faith_n and_o this_o be_v make_v out_o by_o that_o you_o say_v to_o compound_v your_o variance_n you_o say_v the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n be_v god_n reveal_v and_o god_n reveal_v by_o his_o church_n as_o he_o first_o cause_v our_o first_o belief_n when_o he_o tell_v we_o by_o his_o church_n such_o and_o such_o book_n be_v infallible_o his_o word_n then_o the_o authority_n be_v he_o whereby_o we_o believe_v and_o not_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n which_o be_v but_o ministerial_a and_o by_o your_o own_o argument_n be_v you_o undo_v for_o if_o the_o church_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o faith_n and_o not_o the_o scripture_n because_o by_o the_o church_n we_o believe_v such_o and_o such_o book_n to_o be_v canonical_a as_o you_o have_v say_v before_o and_o also_o here_o below_o in_o this_o reply_n to_o my_o eight_o answer_n then_o also_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n because_o we_o must_v first_o believe_v god_n authority_n reveal_v it_o to_o his_o church_n before_o we_o believe_v the_o church_n but_o also_o to_o take_v notice_n of_o that_o argument_n of_o you_o here_o it_o be_v false_a for_o we_o must_v first_o believe_v the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n before_o we_o can_v believe_v any_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n for_o the_o church_n as_o such_o have_v all_o from_o scripture_n as_o i_o have_v show_v and_o therefore_o by_o your_o own_o argument_n be_v you_o undo_v again_o for_o if_o that_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o faith_n which_o be_v first_o than_o the_o scripture_n not_o the_o church_n and_o therefore_o the_o church_n may_v be_v dispute_v not_o the_o scripture_n which_o we_o do_v understand_v by_o way_n of_o intelligence_n through_o a_o supernatural_a light_n and_o can_v demonstrate_v as_o we_o may_v the_o church_n by_o principle_n of_o scripture_n again_o you_o seem_v to_o differ_v from_o yourself_o because_o now_o you_o hold_v that_o the_o church_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n in_o all_o particular_n causal_o because_o by_o it_o we_o believe_v the_o scripture_n but_o before_o the_o faith_n of_o a_o catholic_n which_o you_o mean_v general_o must_v consist_v in_o submit_v his_o understanding_n and_o adhere_v to_o the_o church_n and_o in_o believe_v every_o thing_n because_o she_o propose_v it_o so_o your_o first_o paper_n in_o terminis_fw-la terminantibus_fw-la but_o now_o when_o we_o believe_v the_o scripture_n by_o the_o church_n we_o may_v believe_v that_o which_o be_v plain_a in_o it_o by_o itself_o because_o it_o say_v it_o not_o because_o the_o church_n say_v it_o do_v not_o you_o now_o somewhat_o yield_v not_o to_o i_o but_o to_o truth_n truth_n will_v be_v too_o hard_a for_o any_o one_o that_o have_v not_o commit_v the_o sin_n against_o the_o holy_a ghost_n and_o yet_o also_o will_v it_o be_v too_o hard_a for_o he_o though_o he_o deny_v it_o consider_v then_o what_o you_o have_v say_v and_o what_o you_o think_v and_o judge_v how_o the_o master_n of_o your_o church_n will_v answer_v it_o at_o god_n tribunal_n for_o that_o everlasting_a cheat_v of_o simple_a soul_n with_o the_o mystery_n of_o implicit_a faith_n and_o that_o also_o which_o you_o so_o much_o repeat_v that_o we_o must_v receive_v canonical_a book_n by_o the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o yet_o grow_v beyond_o the_o height_n of_o a_o postulate_v it_o have_v be_v often_o deny_v you_o upon_o necessity_n and_o it_o do_v not_o obtain_v it_o seem_v universal_o in_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n or_o else_o some_o of_o your_o apocryphal_a book_n be_v not_o account_v canonical_a for_o cyrill_n of_o jerusalem_n in_o his_o four_o catechese_n where_o he_o speak_v in_o part_n of_o the_o scripture_n he_o account_v not_o in_o the_o number_n the_o maccabee_n you_o speak_v of_o nor_o some_o other_o yea_o for_o the_o reception_n of_o book_n canonical_a saint_n jerome_n give_v another_o reason_n of_o embrace_v but_o four_o gospel_n in_o his_o preface_n upon_o the_o comment_n upon_o saint_n matthew_n not_o because_o the_o church_n own_v no_o more_o as_o you_o will_v have_v saint_n austin_n to_o be_v understand_v but_o he_o do_v prove_v that_o there_o be_v but_o four_o by_o compare_n of_o that_o of_o ezekiel_n with_o that_o of_o the_o apocalypse_n about_o the_o four_o beast_n which_o do_v represent_v as_o he_o interpret_v their_o meaning_n the_o four_o evangelist_n you_o go_v on_o and_o say_v god_n reveal_v be_v always_o the_o formal_a object_n of_o faith_n before_o every_o thing_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v as_o propose_v by_o the_o church_n because_o she_o propose_v it_o so_o that_o the_o formal_a object_n of_o thing_n to_o be_v believe_v be_v as_o propose_v by_o the_o church_n under_o that_o consideration_n but_o sometime_o god_n reveal_v his_o mind_n by_o scripture_n sometime_o by_o the_o church_n as_o he_o do_v two_o thousand_o year_n and_o more_o before_o the_o scripture_n be_v write_v so_o you_o well_o then_o now_o he_o reveal_v himself_o by_o scripture_n contradistinct_o to_o the_o church_n as_o well_o as_o by_o the_o church_n contradistinct_o to_o scripture_n which_o you_o put_v in_o one_o behalf_n of_o your_o unwritten_a word_n so_o then_o we_o may_v believe_v he_o immediate_o by_o scripture_n but_o whether_o we_o can_v believe_v he_o immediate_o by_o tradition_n without_o scripture_n want_v conviction_n neither_o do_v you_o exhibit_v a_o reason_n of_o this_o opinion_n by_o that_o which_o follow_v that_o for_o two_o thousand_o year_n and_o upward_o before_o the_o scripture_n be_v write_v he_o reveal_v himself_o by_o the_o church_n this_o as_o before_o be_v not_o enough_o to_o sustain_v traditional_a doctrine_n because_o the_o scripture_n in_o the_o substance_n of_o it_o be_v before_o it_o be_v write_v but_o you_o can_v evince_v that_o the_o word_n not_o write_v be_v as_o certain_a to_o we_o as_o the_o word_n before_o it_o be_v write_v be_v unto_o they_o and_o the_o reason_n may_v be_v take_v from_o
god_n wise_a dispensation_n to_o his_o church_n then_o when_o there_o be_v no_o word_n write_v he_o will_v provide_v that_o that_o whereby_o the_o church_n shall_v be_v rule_v shall_v be_v extraordinary_o convey_v and_o preserve_v but_o now_o when_o there_o be_v a_o word_n write_v which_o be_v a_o most_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o faith_n as_o you_o confess_v there_o be_v no_o such_o cause_n of_o any_o word_n beside_o it_o if_o the_o scripture_n be_v a_o rule_n of_o faith_n as_o you_o do_v liberal_o grant_v than_o this_o be_v now_o a_o rule_n not_o only_o inclusive_o but_o exclusive_o for_o otherwise_o it_o be_v not_o as_o large_a as_o that_o which_o be_v to_o be_v rule_v and_o then_o they_o will_v not_o agree_v in_o the_o nature_n of_o relative_n and_o so_o it_o will_v not_o be_v a_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n for_o indeed_o the_o property_n of_o a_o rule_n do_v not_o only_o exclude_v less_o but_o also_o more_o it_o speak_v against_o add_v to_o it_o as_o a_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n necessary_a in_o themselves_o as_o well_o as_o against_o the_o negative_a of_o not_o order_v they_o by_o it_o but_o then_o again_o your_o former_a reason_n be_v inconcludent_a because_o god_n reveal_v himself_o to_o his_o church_n several_o before_o he_o reveal_v himself_o by_o his_o church_n and_o therefore_o this_o be_v not_o the_o way_n universal_o hold_v namely_o by_o the_o church_n even_o before_o the_o scripture_n be_v write_v and_o therefore_o much_o less_o do_v it_o now_o bound_v when_o the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v write_v show_v the_o like_a inspiration_n to_o the_o church_n as_o the_o prophet_n have_v by_o some_o infallible_a way_n and_o then_o we_o shall_v say_v that_o thus_o say_v the_o lord_n absolute_o undisputed_o without_o possibility_n of_o contradiction_n by_o the_o mouth_n of_o the_o church_n in_o whatsoever_o it_o please_v to_o assert_v for_o the_o truth_n of_o god_n to_o be_v believe_v equal_o to_o scripture_n and_o then_o a_o council_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v without_o scripture_n as_o the_o nicene_n you_o mean_v be_v not_o believe_v or_o to_o be_v believe_v without_o for_o it_o do_v determine_v by_o it_o and_o by_o that_o text_n i_o name_v i_o and_o my_o father_n be_v one_o which_o saint_n athanasius_n do_v apply_v to_o that_o question_n four_o time_n in_o that_o epistle_n you_o name_v and_o if_o you_o can_v prove_v that_o saint_n peter_n successor_n as_o you_o imagine_v have_v that_o transient_a gift_n of_o immediate_a revelation_n as_o saint_n peter_n have_v than_o you_o may_v say_v peter_n speak_v by_o the_o mouth_n of_o leo_n as_o infallible_o as_o god_n speak_v by_o he_o then_o the_o arrian_n have_v as_o good_a a_o plea_n for_o their_o opinion_n as_o athanasius_n have_v for_o they_o urge_v the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n and_o more_o council_n as_o athanasius_n mention_n in_o the_o same_o epistle_n if_o what_o be_v say_v by_o the_o church_n must_v be_v true_a than_o athanasius_n must_v have_v change_v his_o opinion_n or_o if_o you_o will_v have_v always_o the_o pope_n to_o be_v put_v into_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n for_o a_o infallible_a definition_n bind_v the_o conscience_n of_o all_o christian_n to_o believe_v it_o as_o gospel_n then_o must_v we_o believe_v that_o what_o he_o define_v be_v infallible_o true_a what_o because_o he_o can_v err_v no_o more_o than_o those_o forty_o pope_n which_o bellarmin_n speak_v of_o in_o his_o four_o book_n de_fw-fr rom._n pontif._n from_o the_o 8._o chapter_n to_o the_o 15._o who_o have_v be_v as_o he_o say_v accuse_v of_o error_n and_o some_o whereof_z none_o can_v say_v that_o all_o the_o distinction_n and_o provision_n which_o have_v be_v devise_v for_o this_o purpose_n can_v possible_o justify_v pope_n zephyrine_n a_o montanist_n than_o he_o err_v if_o not_o a_o montanist_n than_o tertullian_n be_v not_o to_o be_v believe_v liberius_n as_o before_o a_o arrian_n so_o athanasius_n so_o jerome_n so_o damasus_n of_o he_o and_o damasus_n can_v not_o err_v as_o you_o hold_v yet_o a_o arrian_n be_v sure_o in_o error_n be_v he_o not_o honorius_n be_v erroneous_a too_o and_o he_o speak_v of_o in_o a_o former_a paper_n he_o a_o monothelite_n as_o melchior_n canus_n say_v some_o catholic_n hold_v and_o he_o prove_v it_o by_o synod_n the_o six_o the_o seven_o the_o eight_o and_o he_o prove_v it_o by_o epistle_n of_o pope_n if_o all_o there_o be_v deceive_v how_o shall_v we_o believe_v authority_n of_o man_n as_o for_o gregory_n the_o three_o bellarmin_n in_o the_o 12._o chapter_n of_o that_o book_n do_v open_o say_v well_fw-mi certe_fw-la pontificem_fw-la ex_fw-la ignorantia_fw-la lapsum_fw-la esse_fw-la quod_fw-la posse_fw-la pontificibus_fw-la accidere_fw-la non_fw-la negamus_fw-la so_o he_o then_o do_v you_o reconcile_v error_n by_o ignorance_n with_o infallibility_n how_o be_v he_o like_v to_o be_v infallible_a in_o all_o his_o definition_n when_o he_o be_v ignorant_a in_o the_o gospel_n and_o therefore_o give_v a_o dispensation_n to_o a_o man_n to_o take_v another_o wife_n if_o the_o former_a have_v a_o disease_n that_o make_v she_o not_o able_a for_o the_o conjugal_a debt_n and_o alphonsus_n de_fw-fr castro_n in_o his_o 1._o book_n 4._o chapter_n have_v this_o passage_n omnis_fw-la enim_fw-la homo_fw-la errare_fw-la potest_fw-la in_o fide_fw-la etiam_fw-la si_fw-la papa_n sit_fw-la nam_fw-la de_fw-la liberio_fw-la à_fw-fr papa_n constat_fw-la fuisse_fw-la arrianum_n et_fw-la anasterium_fw-la papam_fw-la fuvisse_fw-la nestorianis_fw-la qui_fw-la historias_fw-la legerit_fw-la non_fw-la dubitat_fw-la and_o a_o little_a after_o nam_fw-la cum_fw-la constet_fw-la plures_fw-la eorum_fw-la adeo_fw-la illiteratos_fw-la esse_fw-la ut_fw-la grammaticam_fw-la penitus_fw-la ignorent_fw-la qui_fw-la fit_a ut_fw-la sacras_fw-la literas_fw-la interpretari_fw-la possent_fw-la and_o how_o then_o shall_v we_o by_o your_o head_n of_o the_o church_n or_o any_o other_o several_o or_o together_o know_v the_o undoubted_a sense_n of_o scripture_n infallible_o but_o many_o necessary_a place_n of_o scripture_n do_v not_o as_o you_o imagine_v need_v a_o judge_n or_o not_o infallible_a all_o thing_n also_o necessary_a to_o be_v believe_v be_v set_v down_o in_o scripture_n and_o the_o contrary_a you_o have_v not_o show_v and_o therefore_o be_v there_o no_o need_n of_o a_o infallible_a judge_n for_o the_o former_a or_o tradition_n for_o the_o latter_a as_o i_o have_v show_v nevertheless_o you_o proceed_v thus_o the_o revelation_n of_o god_n come_v to_o we_o in_o all_o these_o case_n by_o the_o church_n you_o by_o your_o own_o word_n in_o this_o place_n must_v grant_v her_o authority_n to_o be_v our_o ordinary_a cause_n of_o faith_n so_o you_o answer_n as_o you_o suppose_v much_o for_o your_o advantage_n without_o colour_n of_o reason_n so_o you_o confound_v much_o without_o distinction_n first_o the_o term_n revelation_n have_v two_o respect_n one_o to_o the_o agent_n and_o so_o it_o refer_v to_o the_o act_n and_o manner_n thereof_o another_o to_o the_o matter_n of_o that_o which_o be_v reveal_v that_o be_v the_o object_n the_o revelation_n of_o god_n take_v it_o passive_o for_o the_o object_n the_o matter_n which_o be_v reveal_v come_v to_o we_o by_o the_o church_n because_o the_o word_n write_v ordinary_o come_v to_o we_o by_o the_o church_n but_o take_v revelation_n of_o god_n active_o with_o respect_n to_o the_o manner_n to_o bear_v your_o sense_n that_o god_n do_v reveal_v himself_o infallible_o by_o the_o church_n either_o in_o the_o case_n of_o canonical_a book_n or_o of_o doubt_n about_o the_o sense_n of_o scripture_n so_o it_o do_v not_o come_v by_o the_o church_n and_o therefore_o be_v it_o not_o the_o ordinary_a cause_n of_o faith_n which_o must_v rely_v upon_o infallible_a verity_n as_o aquinas_n speak_v in_o his_o first_o part_n first_o question_n eight_o answer_n and_o therefore_o as_o before_o do_v rely_v upon_o the_o revelation_n make_v to_o the_o apostle_n and_o prophet_n which_o write_v the_o canonical_a book_n and_o not_o then_o upon_o the_o church_n who_o be_v bind_v to_o receive_v these_o book_n and_o to_o communicate_v they_o so_o that_o the_o church_n be_v conclude_v to_o be_v as_o a_o instrument_n only_o or_o a_o motive_n of_o this_o faith_n a_o instrument_n by_o its_o office_n and_o a_o motive_n by_o its_o authority_n and_o as_o for_o declare_v undoubted_o the_o sense_n of_o scripture_n so_o be_v there_o not_o any_o necessity_n of_o a_o judge_n infallible_a which_o you_o will_v have_v the_o church_n to_o be_v second_o you_o suppose_v that_o which_o be_v not_o to_o be_v suppose_v that_o by_o my_o word_n since_o in_o those_o case_n the_o revelation_n of_o god_n come_v to_o we_o by_o the_o church_n i_o must_v grant_v her_o authority_n to_o be_v the_o ordinary_a cause_n of_o faith_n and_o you_o say_v also_o that_o by_o my_o word_n in_o this_o place_n i_o must_v grant_v so_o sure_o you_o here_o do_v commit_v
crimen_fw-la falsi_fw-la for_o i_o do_v not_o see_v upon_o the_o place_n any_o half_a syllable_n out_o of_o which_o you_o may_v draw_v any_o such_o interpretative_a confession_n i_o have_v often_o upon_o your_o occasion_n say_v the_o contrary_a that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n can_v be_v the_o cause_n of_o faith_n and_o therefore_o whether_o you_o have_v any_o faith_n of_o the_o article_n of_o religion_n or_o of_o scripture_n in_o all_o your_o church_n be_v more_o easy_a to_o be_v find_v then_o say_v and_o assure_o though_o we_o talk_v of_o faith_n in_o the_o world_n the_o great_a part_n of_o it_o be_v but_o opinion_n which_o take_v religion_n upon_o the_o credit_n of_o man_n and_o not_o of_o scripture_n and_o as_o for_o we_o we_o have_v also_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n catholic_n to_o move_v our_o judgement_n and_o scripture_n to_o settle_v our_o faith_n and_o we_o be_v more_o relate_v to_o the_o four_o general_a council_n in_o consanguinity_n of_o doctrine_n as_o he_o say_v than_o your_o church_n now_o and_o now_o at_o the_o end_n of_o all_o you_o do_v fair_o rebate_v the_o edge_n of_o your_o censure_n of_o my_o expression_n namely_o excess_n of_o faith_n but_o you_o say_v my_o distinction_n do_v no_o way_n salve_v the_o improprietie_n of_o my_o speech_n for_o there_o be_v still_o a_o difference_n in_o more_o believe_a object_n and_o believe_v more_o object_n but_o grant_v that_o it_o may_v be_v improper_o speak_v yet_o even_o in_o that_o sense_n it_o be_v not_o true_o say_v because_o there_o can_v be_v no_o excess_n of_o faith_n in_o believe_v that_o which_o god_n have_v say_v so_o then_o by_o my_o distinction_n which_o be_v your_o school_n of_o fides_n subjectiva_n &_o fides_fw-la objectiva_fw-la fides_fw-la qua_fw-la &_o fides_fw-la quae_fw-la there_o may_v be_v a_o excess_n of_o faith_n in_o the_o object_n if_o we_o believe_v more_o than_o god_n have_v say_v suppose_v we_o can_v believe_v what_o god_n have_v not_o say_v although_o there_o be_v not_o a_o excess_n of_o faith_n in_o the_o subject_a for_o we_o can_v have_v too_o much_o faith_n in_o that_o which_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v but_o the_o quarrel_n against_o the_o speech_n be_v not_o becacause_v it_o be_v not_o proper_a enough_o and_o congruous_a in_o this_o discourse_n but_o because_o of_o the_o application_n of_o it_o to_o you_o as_o it_o now_o appear_v and_o therefore_o here_o will_v you_o vindicate_v the_o church_n in_o this_o upon_o the_o same_o ground_n of_o infallibility_n and_o therefore_o for_o your_o faith_n in_o whatsoever_o you_o believe_v you_o have_v this_o warrant_n thus_o say_v the_o lord_n but_o since_o this_o infallibility_n of_o you_o you_o can_v have_v without_o beg_v of_o the_o question_n even_o to_o the_o last_o nor_o shall_v have_v it_o sure_o by_o beg_v you_o be_v yet_o to_o find_v out_o some_o expedience_n of_o mean_n or_o argument_n how_o to_o preserve_v yourselves_o from_o that_o just_a charge_n of_o excess_n of_o faith_n and_o the_o chief_a of_o that_o kind_n be_v that_o you_o speak_v of_o your_o infallibility_n for_o which_o you_o have_v not_o thus_o say_v the_o lord_n how_o then_o do_v you_o prove_v it_o by_o tradition_n and_o how_o do_v you_o prove_v tradition_n by_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n therefore_o go_v not_o to_o faith_n about_o by_o a_o circumference_n if_o you_o have_v a_o desire_n to_o rest_v your_o judgement_n and_o your_o soul_n in_o certain_a infallibility_n by_o your_o own_o word_n then_o centre_n in_o scripture_n from_o which_o all_o line_n of_o truth_n be_v draw_v and_o dismiss_v tradition_n as_o your_o man_n state_n it_o for_o which_o this_o infallibility_n be_v devise_v and_o yet_o can_v be_v maintain_v for_o it_o can_v maintain_v itself_o you_o close_o with_o a_o passage_n of_o saint_n austin_n if_o so_o the_o word_n you_o intend_v it_o to_o set_v out_o your_o charity_n to_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n not_o to_o persuade_v my_o faith_n in_o its_o infallibility_n i_o may_v love_v the_o church_n without_o infallibility_n because_o though_o i_o do_v not_o love_v error_n yet_o must_v i_o love_v the_o church_n when_o it_o be_v in_o error_n and_o this_o give_v you_o occasion_n to_o think_v well_o of_o this_o respective_a and_o full_a answer_n to_o your_o last_o paper_n excuse_v i_o that_o it_o be_v so_o long_o ere_o it_o come_v and_o yet_o not_o much_o above_o the_o space_n of_o you_o and_o also_o so_o long_o now_o it_o be_v come_v only_o let_v i_o leave_v you_o with_o a_o father_n or_o two_o in_o who_o company_n you_o be_v delight_v tertullian_n in_o his_o prescript_n cap._n 8._o we_o have_v no_o need_n of_o curiosity_n after_o christ_n nor_o further_a inquisition_n after_o the_o gospel_n when_o we_o believe_v we_o desire_v to_o believe_v nothing_o beyond_o for_o this_o we_o first_o believe_v that_o there_o be_v not_o any_o thing_n beyond_o which_o we_o ought_v to_o believe_v again_o against_o hermog_n cap._n 22._o i_o adore_v the_o plenitude_n of_o scripture_n and_o a_o little_a after_o scriptum_n esse_fw-la doceat_fw-la hermogenis_n officina_fw-la if_o it_o be_v not_o write_v let_v he_o fear_v that_o woe_n appoint_v for_o those_o who_o add_v or_o take_v away_o and_o saint_n austin_n in_o his_o 2._o book_n de_fw-fr doc._n christiana_n cap._n 9_o in_o iis_fw-la enim_fw-la quae_fw-la aperte_fw-la in_o scriptura_fw-la posita_fw-la sunt_fw-la among_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v plain_o lay_v down_o in_o scripture_n be_v find_v all_o those_o thing_n which_o contain_v faith_n and_o manner_n of_o live_v to_o wit_n hope_n and_o charity_n for_o the_o excellent_a modification_n of_o scripture_n in_o the_o 6._o chapter_n magnifice_fw-la igitur_fw-la &_o salubriter_fw-la sp._n sanctus_n ita_fw-la scripturas_fw-la sanitas_fw-la modificavit_fw-la ut_fw-la locis_fw-la apertioribus_fw-la fami_fw-la occurreret_fw-la obscurioribus_fw-la autem_fw-la fastidia_fw-la detergeret_fw-la nihil_fw-la enim_fw-la fere_n de_fw-la illis_fw-la obscuritatibus_fw-la eruitur_fw-la quod_fw-la non_fw-la planissime_fw-la dictum_fw-la alibi_fw-la reperiatur_fw-la and_o the_o same_o in_o the_o 7._o chapter_n for_o the_o second_o degree_n or_o step_n to_o wisdom_n he_o say_v deinde_fw-la opus_fw-la est_fw-la mitescere_fw-la pielate_fw-la neque_fw-la contradicere_fw-la divinae_fw-la scripturae_fw-la sive_fw-la intellectae_fw-la si_fw-la aliqua_fw-la vitia_fw-la nostra_fw-la percutit_fw-la sive_fw-la non_fw-la intellectae_fw-la quasi_fw-la nos_fw-la melius_fw-la sapere_fw-la meliusque_fw-la percipere_fw-la possimus_fw-la sed_fw-la cogitare_fw-la potius_fw-la &_o credere_fw-la id_fw-la esse_fw-la melius_fw-la &_o verius_fw-la quod_fw-la ibi_fw-la scriptum_fw-la est_fw-la etiamsi_fw-la lateat_fw-la quam_fw-la id_fw-la quod_fw-la nos_fw-la per_fw-la nos_fw-la metipsos_a sapere_fw-la possumus_fw-la and_o again_o saint_n austin_n contra_fw-la literas_fw-la petit._n lib._n 3._o cap._n 6._o proinde_fw-la sive_fw-la de_fw-la christo_fw-la sive_fw-la de_fw-la ejus_fw-la ecclesia_fw-la sive_fw-la de_fw-la quacunque_fw-la alia_fw-la re_fw-la quae_fw-la pertinet_fw-la ad_fw-la fidem_fw-la vitamque_fw-la nostram_fw-la non_fw-la dicam_fw-la nos_fw-la nequaquam_fw-la comparandi_fw-la ei_fw-la qui_fw-la dixit_fw-la licet_fw-la si_fw-la nos_fw-la sed_fw-la omnino_fw-la quod_fw-la secutus_fw-la adjecit_fw-la si_fw-mi angelus_n de_fw-la coelo_fw-la vobis_fw-la annuntiaverit_fw-la praeterquam_fw-la quod_fw-la in_o scripture_n legalibus_fw-la &_o evangelicis_fw-la accepistis_fw-la anathema_n sit_v consider_v what_o be_v say_v and_o the_o lord_n give_v you_o understanding_n in_o all_o thing_n to_o the_o reader_n how_o in_o these_o time_n in_o which_o there_o be_v so_o many_o religion_n the_o true_a religion_n may_v certain_o be_v find_v out_o 1._o a_o satisfactory_a answer_n to_o this_o title_n will_v alone_o put_v a_o end_n to_o the_o endless_a controversy_n of_o these_o day_n this_o make_v i_o think_v my_o labour_n well_o bestow_v in_o treat_v this_o point_n somewhat_o large_o and_o because_o that_o treatise_n have_v receive_v a_o very_a large_a answer_n the_o examine_n of_o this_o answer_n will_v make_v the_o truth_n yet_o more_o apparent_a that_o this_o may_v be_v do_v more_o clear_o i_o will_v brief_o tell_v you_o the_o order_n i_o intend_v to_o observe_v in_o the_o examination_n of_o the_o say_a answer_n and_o because_o this_o answer_n direct_o follow_v the_o same_o order_n which_o i_o observe_v in_o treat_v the_o question_n prefix_v in_o my_o title_n therefore_o when_o i_o have_v show_v you_o the_o order_n of_o that_o treatise_n you_o will_v clear_o see_v that_o i_o shall_v most_o orderly_o answer_v the_o reply_n against_o it_o 2._o that_o treatise_n have_v a_o short_a preface_n to_o tell_v the_o intent_n of_o it_o my_o first_o chapter_n must_v then_o be_v the_o examination_n of_o what_o be_v say_v against_o this_o preface_n again_o that_o treatise_n do_v show_v five_o thing_n first_o it_o do_v show_v the_o necessity_n of_o a_o judge_n to_o who_o all_o be_v bind_v to_o submit_v second_o that_o scripture_n alone_o do_v not_o suffice_v to_o decide_v all_o necessary_a controversy_n without_o a_o live_a judge_n to_o
know_v that_o de_fw-fr officio_fw-la this_o be_v the_o way_n of_o constitute_v and_o so_o of_o distinguish_v the_o church_n and_o de_fw-la facto_fw-la this_o be_v the_o way_n that_o s._n austin_n and_o also_o some_o of_o their_o own_o divine_n do_v prove_v the_o church_n by_o yea_o this_o be_v the_o way_n which_o my_o adversary_n must_v take_v and_o do_v and_o three_o neither_o do_v we_o say_v that_o we_o believe_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n by_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o spirit_n but_o to_o those_o who_o do_v profess_v the_o belief_n of_o the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o therefore_o be_v we_o even_o with_o they_o in_o this_o kind_n for_o as_o they_o deal_v with_o heathen_n as_o to_o the_o proof_n of_o scripture_n by_o the_o church_n so_o do_v we_o also_o as_o the_o father_n be_v wont_v by_o the_o church_n universal_a and_o i_o can_v use_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n as_o a_o inducement_n unto_o the_o heathen_a although_o the_o pontifician_n can_v use_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n to_o i_o as_o the_o determinative_a of_o faith_n so_o than_o if_o they_o can_v prove_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n infallible_o to_o be_v infallible_a without_o dependence_n upon_o the_o scripture_n they_o shall_v indeed_o speak_v to_o the_o purpose_n otherwise_o they_o be_v shut_v up_o in_o a_o circle_n out_o of_o which_o they_o can_v never_o move_v their_o foot_n the_o thirty_o second_o number_n have_v in_o it_o much_o and_o little_a longae_fw-la 32._o num._n 32._o ambages_fw-la sed_fw-la summa_fw-la sequor_fw-la fastigia_fw-la rerum_fw-la the_o intendment_n of_o it_o be_v to_o fix_v the_o wheel_n by_o assure_v the_o church_n to_o be_v infallible_a without_o run_v to_o the_o scripture_n in_o the_o begin_n of_o it_o it_o will_v prove_v their_o faith_n good_a because_o they_o believe_v those_o who_o deliver_v it_o have_v commission_n from_o god_n but_o this_o satisfi_v not_o because_o the_o question_n rebound_v upon_o they_o why_o they_o believe_v that_o those_o who_o deliver_v it_o have_v commission_n from_o god_n if_o they_o say_v they_o have_v assurance_n thereof_o by_o the_o spirit_n than_o they_o come_v to_o our_o kind_n of_o assurance_n therefore_o they_o determine_v this_o belief_n upon_o two_o motive_n one_o come_v from_o the_o doctrine_n in_o order_n to_o god_n change_n of_o life_n the_o other_o from_o god_n in_o order_n to_o the_o doctrine_n in_o miracle_n and_o there_o he_o amplify_v in_o two_o leaf_n which_o may_v have_v be_v dispatch_v in_o three_o word_n indeed_o the_o first_o he_o say_v not_o much_o of_o for_o it_o be_v no_o conclude_a argument_n for_o first_o it_o do_v not_o distinguish_v doctrine_n for_o thus_o the_o jew_n the_o arrian_n the_o socinian_n the_o sectary_n may_v prove_v his_o doctrine_n infallible_a second_o the_o good_a life_n if_o it_o be_v a_o result_n of_o doctrine_n yet_o not_o from_o the_o point_n of_o difference_n but_o the_o general_a fundamental_n of_o christian_a faith_n wherein_o the_o controversy_n lie_v not_o yea_o three_o if_o this_o new_a life_n do_v proceed_v by_o way_n of_o emanation_n or_o absolute_a connexion_n from_o the_o point_n of_o difference_n we_o may_v join_v issue_n with_o they_o and_o have_v the_o better_a yea_o fourthly_a judas_n have_v a_o right_a commission_n and_o yet_o no_o good_a life_n yea_o five_o the_o manner_n be_v rather_o to_o be_v prove_v good_a by_o the_o practical_a doctrine_n than_o speculative_a doctrine_n if_o any_o doctrine_n ultimate_o be_v such_o prove_v good_a by_o manner_n therefore_o good_a life_n be_v no_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d of_o divine_a doctrine_n nor_o yet_o of_o a_o divine_a commission_n yea_o sixthly_a dato_n non_fw-la concesso_fw-la that_o we_o mighr_fw-mi know_v the_o church_n and_o doctrine_n of_o it_o to_o be_v infallible_a by_o good_a life_n yet_o this_o be_v not_o conformable_a to_o their_o postulate_v that_o god_n shall_v teach_v we_o all_o verity_n by_o the_o mouth_n of_o the_o church_n as_o stapleton_n speak_v then_o as_o to_o the_o other_o motive_n of_o faith_n in_o the_o true_a church_n namely_o miracle_n we_o can_v say_v several_a thing_n first_o in_o thesi_fw-la miracle_n be_v no_o certain_a distinctive_a of_o a_o divine_a commission_n because_o the_o man_n of_o sin_n may_v deceive_v by_o lie_a wonder_n as_o st._n paul_n speak_v 2_o thes_n 2.9_o and_o also_o moses_n deut._n 13.1_o 2._o then_o this_o be_v no_o infallible_a motive_n for_o the_o believe_v of_o a_o commission_n from_o god_n because_o we_o may_v be_v deceive_v in_o it_o and_o although_o upon_o supposition_n of_o a_o true_a miracle_n we_o may_v conclude_v a_o commission_n from_o god_n yet_o this_o be_v not_o the_o way_n infallible_a because_o we_o may_v be_v deceive_v in_o the_o truth_n of_o the_o miracle_n whether_o it_o be_v such_o or_o not_o since_o the_o miracle_n can_v fidem_fw-la facere_fw-la de_fw-la se_fw-la as_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o spirit_n can_v second_o the_o gift_n of_o miracle_n be_v a_o gift_n common_a to_o those_o who_o be_v not_o all_o prophet_n as_o to_o pen_v of_o the_o scripture_n and_o also_o not_o common_a for_o aught_o we_o know_v to_o some_o who_o do_v as_o st._n mark_n and_o s._n luke_n therefore_o this_o be_v not_o sufficient_a to_o resolve_v our_o faith_n in_o their_o commission_n because_o not_o give_v omni_fw-la nor_o soli_fw-la for_o whatsoever_o do_v distinguish_v must_v have_v itself_o per_fw-la modum_fw-la differentiae_fw-la three_o therefore_o since_o we_o must_v have_v faith_n to_o believe_v the_o miracle_n to_o be_v true_a we_o ask_v how_o we_o come_v to_o this_o faith_n if_o by_o the_o operation_n of_o the_o spirit_n then_o faith_n ultimate_o be_v fix_v upon_o our_o foundation_n namely_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o spirit_n by_o which_o we_o may_v as_o well_o be_v assure_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o true_a word_n of_o god_n as_o that_o miracle_n be_v true_a four_o the_o gift_n of_o miracle_n be_v temporary_a and_o accommodate_v for_o that_o season_n of_o the_o church_n and_o therefore_o can_v we_o prove_v by_o miracle_n new_a doctrine_n as_o invocation_n of_o saint_n worship_v of_o image_n communion_n in_o one_o kind_n transubstantiation_n supremacy_n of_o the_o roman_a bishop_n therefore_o if_o miracle_n do_v infallible_o ascertain_v the_o divine_a commission_n of_o the_o prophet_n and_o apostle_n to_o speak_v and_o write_v yet_o be_v not_o we_o satisfy_v by_o they_o in_o the_o question_n of_o new_a doctrine_n which_o the_o scripture_n give_v we_o no_o account_n of_o but_o therefore_o he_o come_v to_o oral_a tradition_n for_o as_o for_o his_o reason_n in_o form_n thus_o in_o hypothesi_fw-la the_o preacher_n preach_v the_o doctrine_n of_o our_o church_n god_n confirm_v their_o doctrine_n by_o miracle_n therefore_o the_o doctrine_n of_o our_o church_n be_v confirm_v by_o miracle_n it_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d for_o first_o not_o to_o carp_v at_o the_o form_n of_o his_o syllogism_n we_o say_v to_o the_o proposition_n that_o if_o they_o preach_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n as_o different_o from_o the_o whole_a church_n they_o preach_v what_o they_o ought_v not_o to_o preach_v and_o so_o the_o minor_a proposition_n be_v false_a if_o they_o do_v preach_v the_o same_o doctrine_n which_o the_o whole_a church_n receive_v in_o scripture_n from_o the_o apostle_n than_o we_o grant_v the_o minor_a and_o the_o conclusion_n too_o as_o much_o as_o doctrine_n can_v be_v confirm_v by_o miracle_n but_o we_o distinguish_v of_o the_o time_n when_o the_o miracle_n be_v wrought_v namely_o in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o by_o they_o for_o as_o for_o miracle_n do_v by_o s._n austin_n to_o confirm_v the_o same_o faith_n which_o we_o abolish_v in_o our_o reformation_n we_o say_v that_o bede_n and_o gregory_n and_o brierly_n who_o he_o quote_v for_o testimony_n hereof_o be_v not_o to_o we_o sure_o of_o sufficient_a authority_n in_o their_o own_o cause_n nay_o second_o they_o have_v best_a not_o add_v the_o testimony_n of_o the_o learned_a magdeburgian_o lest_o they_o be_v ashamed_a to_o slight_v they_o in_o other_o matter_n but_o also_o chief_o upon_o this_o consideration_n because_o if_o the_o point_n of_o difference_n be_v confirm_v by_o many_o miracle_n which_o he_o refer_v we_o to_o brierly_n in_o his_o index_n for_o then_o by_o the_o argument_n before_o those_o point_n of_o difference_n be_v new_a for_o as_o miracle_n have_v themselves_o to_o faith_n so_o new_a miracle_n to_o new_a faith_n and_o if_o it_o be_v a_o new_a faith_n than_o it_o be_v not_o receive_v by_o oral_a tradition_n from_o the_o apostle_n successive_o and_o then_o they_o be_v undo_v therefore_o let_v they_o speak_v no_o more_o to_o we_o of_o the_o miracle_n of_o s._n austin_n the_o monk_n who_o show_v nothing_o so_o much_o wonderful_a as_o his_o pride_n in_o
understand_v and_o think_v to_o be_v according_a to_o truth_n unless_o he_o shall_v show_v they_o to_o be_v holy_a out_o of_o that_o which_o be_v contain_v in_o the_o divine_a scripture_n as_o in_o the_o certain_a temple_n of_o god_n what_o can_v be_v more_o to_o our_o purpose_n then_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o doctrine_n then_o of_o faith_n as_o for_o athanasius_n we_o need_v not_o his_o word_n know_v his_o practice_n of_o hold_v the_o equality_n of_o the_o divine_a nature_n in_o the_o second_o person_n the_o son_n of_o god_n against_o all_o the_o world_n yet_o he_o speak_v as_o he_o do_v if_o you_o will_v look_v upon_o he_o about_o the_o incarnation_n of_o the_o word_n at_o the_o latter_a end_n but_o then_o have_v take_v occasion_n by_o these_o if_o thou_o will_v read_v the_o divine_a book_n and_o will_v apply_v thy_o mind_n to_o they_o shall_v learn_v out_o of_o they_o more_o plain_o and_o more_o perfect_o the_o truth_n of_o what_o we_o have_v say_v so_o he_o now_o where_o the_o truth_n be_v learn_v more_o plain_o and_o perfect_o there_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o truth_n in_o the_o divine_a writing_n be_v the_o truth_n of_o those_o thing_n more_o plain_o and_o more_o perfect_o learn_v after_o the_o same_o manner_n do_v tertullian_n bring_v in_o his_o suffrage_n in_o his_o book_n of_o prescription_n a_o little_a after_o the_o begin_n of_o it_o thus_o do_v we_o prove_v the_o faith_n by_o the_o person_n or_o prove_v the_o person_n by_o the_o faith_n and_o again_o faith_n consist_v in_o the_o rule_n you_o have_v the_o law_n and_o salvation_n by_o the_o observation_n of_o it_o and_o soon_o after_o to_o know_v nothing_o against_o the_o rule_n be_v to_o know_v all_o thing_n and_o again_o that_o which_o we_o be_v the_o scripture_n be_v from_o the_o beginning_n we_o be_v of_o they_o before_o it_o be_v otherwise_o before_o they_o be_v corrupt_v by_o you_o so_o he_o beside_o other_o passage_n wherein_o he_o witness_v for_o we_o saint_n ambrose_n give_v we_o also_o his_o voice_n in_o his_o first_o book_n to_o gratian_n chap._n 4._o in_o the_o beginning_n thus_o but_o i_o will_v not_o that_o you_o believe_v a_o argument_n o_o holy_a emperor_n and_o our_o disputation_n let_v we_o ask_v the_o scripture_n let_v we_o ask_v the_o apostle_n let_v we_o ask_v the_o prophet_n then_o we_o be_v to_o be_v determine_v in_o our_o belief_n by_o the_o scripture_n saint_n cyprian_n also_o who_o for_o order_n of_o time_n shall_v have_v be_v put_v before_o give_v his_o verdict_n for_o we_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o his_o six_o sermon_n concern_v the_o lord_n prayer_n thus_o the_o evangelical_n precept_n most_o belove_a brethren_n be_v nothing_o else_o but_o the_o divine_a magistery_n the_o foundation_n of_o building_n our_o hope_n the_o firmament_n of_o corroborate_n our_o faith_n the_o nutriment_n of_o cheer_v our_o heart_n the_o gubernacle_n of_o direct_v our_o journey_n the_o safegard_v of_o obtain_v salvation_n which_o while_o they_o do_v instruct_v the_o docile_a mind_n of_o believer_n upon_o earth_n bring_v they_o to_o the_o kingdom_n of_o heaven_n so_o the_o father_n where_o you_o see_v the_o scripture_n be_v assert_v immediate_o to_o be_v the_o ground_n and_o firmament_n of_o faith_n yea_o neither_o do_v saint_n austin_n seem_v to_o speak_v only_o for_o your_o cause_n in_o the_o seven_o tome_n in_o the_o three_o chapter_n of_o the_o unity_n of_o the_o church_n against_o the_o epistle_n of_o petilianus_n in_o the_o beginning_n he_o have_v these_o word_n but_o as_o i_o begin_v to_o say_v let_v we_o not_o hear_v these_o thing_n i_o say_v these_o thing_n thou_o say_v but_o let_v we_o hear_v these_o thing_n the_o lord_n say_v there_o be_v certain_o the_o book_n of_o the_o lord_n who_o authority_n we_o both_o consent_n unto_o we_o both_o believe_v we_o both_o be_v obedient_a to_o there_o let_v we_o seek_v our_o church_n there_o let_v we_o discuss_v our_o cause_n and_o soon_o after_o let_v those_o thing_n be_v take_v out_o of_o your_o way_n which_o against_o one_o another_o we_o recite_v not_o out_o of_o the_o divine_a canonical_a book_n but_o otherwise_o and_o soon_o after_o some_o may_v ask_v why_o i_o will_v have_v these_o thing_n take_v out_o of_o the_o way_n since_o if_o they_o bring_v forth_o your_o communion_n be_v invincible_a he_o answer_v because_o i_o will_v not_o have_v the_o church_n demonstrate_v by_o humane_a document_n but_o by_o divine_a oracle_n and_o so_o to_o the_o end_n of_o the_o chapter_n which_o he_o conclude_v thus_o therefore_o let_v we_o seek_v it_o the_o church_n in_o the_o holy_a canonical_a scripture_n i_o have_v now_o make_v good_a my_o word_n to_o give_v you_o catholic_n testimony_n on_o our_o side_n among_o which_o saint_n augustine_n authority_n give_v advantage_n to_o plant_v argument_n upon_o thus_o if_o in_o business_n of_o dispute_n we_o must_v hear_v what_o the_o lord_n say_v not_o what_o man_n say_v than_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o ground_n not_o humane_a authority_n but_o let_v we_o not_o hear_v what_o i_o say_v or_o thou_o say_v say_v the_o father_n but_o what_o the_o lord_n say_v again_o where_o we_o must_v seek_v the_o church_n there_o we_o must_v resolve_v our_o faith_n but_o we_o must_v seek_v the_o church_n in_o the_o scripture_n as_o the_o father_n say_v if_o the_o church_n be_v to_o be_v prove_v by_o the_o scripture_n than_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o faith_n because_o they_o be_v the_o ground_n of_o the_o church_n there_o be_v no_o resolution_n of_o faith_n but_o in_o that_o which_o be_v indemonstrable_a therefore_o not_o in_o the_o church_n because_o that_o be_v demonstrate_v by_o the_o scripture_n as_o he_o say_v again_o divine_a oracle_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o faith_n the_o scripture_n be_v the_o divine_a oracle_n as_o he_o say_v as_o the_o scripture_n say_v as_o saint_n ignatius_n say_v in_o his_o epistle_n to_o the_o church_n of_o s●●yrna_n indeed_o the_o proper_a object_n of_o faith_n catholic_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n not_o the_o word_n of_o man._n and_o proportionable_a the_o cause_n of_o this_o faith_n must_v be_v divine_a authority_n not_o any_o authority_n of_o man._n as_o demonstrative_a reason_n make_v science_n so_o humane_a authority_n make_v opinion_n but_o faith_n be_v a_o assent_n to_o that_o which_o be_v speak_v by_o god_n as_o true_a because_o he_o speak_v it_o therefore_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o a_o mean_a apt_a to_o beget_v faith_n because_o it_o be_v of_o another_o kind_n and_o can_v exceed_v the_o nature_n of_o humane_a authority_n although_o it_o be_v the_o high_a in_o the_o kind_n if_o it_o be_v represent_v in_o a_o lawful_a general_n council_n yet_o even_o general_a council_n have_v err_v and_o therefore_o they_o can_v he_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n this_o be_v the_o prerogative_n of_o the_o canonical_a book_n as_o the_o father_n and_o all_o antiquity_n call_v they_o but_o never_o do_v we_o hear_v of_o a_o canonical_a church_n the_o scripture_n be_v the_o canon_n be_v the_o rule_n not_o the_o church_n the_o church_n witness_v truth_n the_o church_n keep_v truth_n the_o church_n defend_v truth_n the_o church_n representative_a in_o a_o council_n determine_v controversy_n authoritative_o not_o infallible_o and_o therefore_o bind_v not_o unto_o faith_n but_o to_o peace_n not_o to_o faith_n in_o the_o conscience_n but_o to_o peace_n in_o the_o church_n not_o affirmative_o that_o we_o shall_v say_v it_o be_v true_a because_o they_o say_v it_o but_o negative_o that_o we_o shall_v not_o rash_o oppose_v it_o as_o false_a because_o they_o define_v it_o as_o true_a hitherto_o we_o go_v for_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o church_n catholic_n not_o roman_n and_o now_o i_o have_v give_v you_o some_o reason_n of_o our_o faith_n it_o follow_v now_o in_o your_o reply_n or_o indeed_o how_o can_v i_o account_v he_o a_o catholic_n without_o a_o palpable_a contradiction_n that_o do_v not_o believe_v the_o catholic_n curch_n answ_n i_o say_v so_o too_o but_o what_o from_o thence_o to_o profess_v a_o belief_n that_o there_o be_v a_o catholic_a church_n whereof_o part_n be_v triumphant_a in_o heaven_n part_n on_o earth_n expectant_a and_o to_o profess_v myself_o to_o belong_v to_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v not_o inclusive_a of_o your_o sense_n that_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o our_o belief_n we_o believe_v the_o catholic_a church_n ground_v in_o the_o scripture_n or_o build_v upon_o the_o foundation_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o prophet_n jesus_n christ_n himself_o be_v the_o chief_a corner_n stone_n as_o saint_n paul_n speak_v ephes_n 2.20_o second_o this_o be_v not_o to_o your_o purpose_n because_o the_o catholic_a church_n as_o it_o be_v a_o object_n of_o belief_n must_v be_v consider_v as_o invisible_a whereas_o you_o intend_v the_o
find_v in_o my_o heart_n not_o to_o say_v a_o word_n to_o they_o that_o you_o may_v see_v i_o do_v not_o give_v they_o that_o respect_n as_o to_o the_o father_n and_o yet_o take_v the_o strength_n of_o all_o their_o authority_n together_o and_o make_v of_o they_o a_o accumulative_a argument_n as_o we_o may_v speak_v yet_o they_o do_v not_o conclude_v your_o cause_n calvin_n and_o his_o scholar_n in_o their_o say_n affirm_v no_o more_o than_o that_o which_o we_o acknowledge_v not_o from_o they_o that_o the_o church_n shall_v by_o the_o assistance_n of_o the_o spirit_n be_v sufficient_o furnish_v with_o necessary_a doctrine_n unto_o salvation_n but_o those_o of_o the_o church_n invisible_a may_v be_v save_v though_o the_o church_n visible_a be_v not_o infallible_a and_o by_o consequence_n not_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n as_o for_o doctor_n saravia_n passage_n i_o answer_v it_o do_v not_o come_v up_o close_o to_o your_o purpose_n the_o h._n g._n which_o bear_v rule_n in_o the_o church_n objective_o be_v the_o true_a interpreter_n of_o scripture_n and_o thus_o it_o be_v not_o for_o you_o and_o if_o you_o understand_v the_o church_n objective_o yet_o first_o the_o matter_n he_o seem_v to_o speak_v to_o be_v of_o discipline_n about_o government_n of_o the_o church_n depend_v upon_o primitive_a example_n but_o we_o be_v upon_o point_n of_o faith_n second_o he_o can_v be_v contrary_a to_o himself_o when_o he_o act_v as_o he_o do_v former_o in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o apostle_n but_o whether_o he_o do_v so_o act_v now_o be_v a_o question_n yea_o no_o question_n three_o if_o you_o will_v with_o he_o and_o from_o he_o draw_v the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n to_o be_v proportionable_o episcopal_a with_o all_o my_o heart_n i_o reject_v they_o that_o reject_v it_o and_o your_o adversary_n of_o wittenberg_n confess_v nothing_o for_o you_o the_o rule_n they_o speak_v of_o namely_o prophetical_a and_o apostolical_a preach_n etc._n etc._n it_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n write_v according_a to_o which_o she_o be_v bind_v to_o interpret_v those_o place_n which_o be_v obscure_a and_o to_o judge_v of_o doctrine_n according_a to_o the_o rule_n which_o she_o have_v receive_v so_o as_o her_o interpretation_n be_v to_o be_v agreeable_a to_o the_o analogy_n of_o faith_n and_o her_o judgement_n of_o doctrine_n to_o be_v make_v according_a to_o the_o law_n of_o the_o word_n namely_o hard_a place_n be_v to_o be_v expound_v by_o those_o which_o be_v more_o plain_a and_o controversy_n to_o be_v decide_v by_o that_o rule_n and_o all_o this_o make_v nothing_o for_o you_o for_o thus_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o rule_n rule_v and_o the_o church_n be_v but_o the_o rule_n rule_v and_o thus_o we_o follow_v the_o church_n as_o the_o church_n follow_v the_o rule_n as_o saint_n paul_n say_v be_v you_o follower_n of_o i_o as_o i_o be_o of_o christ_n in_o the_o first_o epistle_n to_o the_o corinthian_n c._n 11._o v._n 1._o or_o if_o those_o lutheran_n mean_v by_o a_o certain_a rule_n any_o rule_n distinguish_v from_o scripture_n it_o be_v to_o be_v understand_v of_o some_o general_a head_n of_o christian_a doctrine_n in_o proportion_n whereunto_o doubtful_a place_n and_o doctrine_n be_v to_o be_v judge_v but_o those_o head_n be_v to_o be_v gather_v out_o of_o scripture_n and_o so_o all_o be_v resolve_v towards_o belief_n in_o scripture_n but_o i_o think_v no_o man_n can_v see_v how_o they_o shall_v say_v such_o a_o rule_n which_o be_v not_o scripture_n be_v confirm_v by_o miracle_n so_o for_o they_o and_o for_o doctor_n field_n if_o you_o will_v go_v through_o the_o twenty_o chapter_n of_o the_o four_o book_n you_o shall_v find_v nothing_o in_o he_o contrary_a to_o this_o doctrine_n for_o he_o say_v plain_o that_o though_o the_o canonical_a book_n be_v receive_v by_o way_n of_o tradition_n yet_o the_o scripture_n have_v not_o their_o authority_n from_o the_o approbation_n of_o the_o church_n but_o they_o win_v credit_n of_o themselves_o and_o yield_v satisfaction_n to_o all_o man_n of_o their_o divine_a truth_n whence_o we_o judge_v that_o the_o church_n which_o receive_v they_o be_v lead_v by_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n observe_v not_o because_o the_o church_n be_v lead_v by_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n therefore_o do_v he_o say_v she_o receive_v they_o but_o because_o she_o receive_v they_o therefore_o we_o judge_v she_o be_v lead_v by_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n and_o as_o for_o his_o rule_n of_o faith_n descend_v by_o tradition_n from_o the_o apostle_n what_o be_v he_o like_v to_o mean_v but_o the_o apostle_n creed_n which_o he_o say_v there_o be_v deliver_v in_o the_o church_n as_o a_o rule_n of_o her_o faith_n but_o even_o this_o bind_v not_o by_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n or_o upon_o virtue_n of_o tradition_n but_o by_o proportion_n to_o scripture_n where_o it_o be_v find_v in_o particular_n of_o matter_n though_o not_o in_o form_n of_o a_o creed_n we_o confess_v also_o that_o we_o shall_v search_v out_o the_o true_a church_n as_o the_o same_o doctor_n say_v we_o confess_v that_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v the_o household_n of_o faith_n the_o spouse_n of_o christ_n the_o church_n of_o the_o live_a god_n and_o that_o we_o shall_v embrace_v her_o communion_n and_o rest_n in_o her_o judgement_n yes_o but_o how_o not_o ultimate_o not_o absolute_o not_o in_o what_o so_o ever_o she_o say_v because_o she_o say_v it_o but_o in_o what_o so_o ever_o she_o say_v from_o the_o lord_n for_o although_o she_o do_v go_v by_o a_o infallible_a rule_n yet_o be_v we_o not_o sure_a she_o go_v by_o it_o infallible_o therefore_o though_o we_o rest_v in_o her_o judgement_n as_o to_o peace_n yet_o can_v we_o not_o rest_v in_o her_o judgement_n as_o to_o truth_n because_o our_o understanding_n be_v not_o free_a to_o assent_v to_o what_o man_n will_v as_o be_v bind_v to_o assent_v to_o that_o only_a which_o be_v ground_v in_o the_o word_n of_o god_n in_o matter_n of_o faith_n and_o now_o may_v i_o vie_v with_o you_o in_o number_n of_o pontifician_n against_o you_o see_v durand_n in_o his_o prologue_n upon_o the_o sentence_n where_o he_o have_v more_o to_o our_o purpose_n then_o be_v necessary_a to_o be_v transcribe_v read_v he_o yourself_o gerson_n also_o in_o his_o sermon_n concern_v error_n against_o faith_n and_o manner_n about_o the_o precept_n thou_o shall_v not_o kill_v say_v thus_o more_o free_o more_o pure_o more_o true_o more_o speedy_o be_v truth_n find_v out_o and_o error_n reprove_v if_o the_o divine_a law_n alone_o be_v constitute_v as_o judge_n according_a to_o the_o consideration_n of_o aristotle_n he_o which_o make_v the_o law_n the_o judge_n make_v god_n but_o he_o that_o add_v man_n add_v a_o beast_n panormitanus_fw-la also_o upon_o the_o 5._o of_o the_o decret_a concern_v alm_n in_o chap._n qualiter_fw-la &_o quando_fw-la the_o say_n of_o any_o saint_n establish_v with_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o new_a or_o old_a testament_n be_v prefer_v before_o a_o papal_a constitution_n even_o in_o decision_n of_o cause_n also_o ferus_fw-la upon_o the_o 1_o epistle_n of_o saint_n john_n 2._o chapter_n in_o the_o 52.3_o page_n of_o the_o antuerpe_n edition_n thus_o the_o holy_a ghost_n do_v teach_v it_o be_v by_o the_o mean_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n and_o word_n again_o the_o holy_a scripture_n be_v give_v to_o we_o as_o a_o certain_a sure_a rule_n of_o christian_a doctrine_n and_o again_o in_o the_o same_o page_n for_o if_o have_v the_o holy_a scripture_n as_o a_o most_o certain_a rule_n of_o christian_a doctrine_n set_v before_o our_o eye_n we_o notwithstanding_o teach_v thing_n so_o unlike_a what_o will_v be_v do_v if_o the_o scripture_n be_v take_v away_o and_o if_o you_o say_v now_o that_o there_o be_v add_v to_o those_o place_n tradition_n in_o the_o roman_a edition_n after_o the_o trent_n council_n as_o be_v note_v you_o will_v get_v nothing_o by_o that_o but_o shame_n to_o the_o pontifician_n and_o now_o i_o think_v i_o be_o not_o much_o behind_o hand_n with_o you_o in_o testimony_n about_o the_o question_n but_o then_o afterward_o you_o press_v hard_o upon_o i_o so_o you_o say_v but_o i_o do_v not_o yet_o feel_v the_o weight_n of_o any_o thing_n you_o say_v i_o believe_v the_o creed_n and_o that_o the_o church_n be_v holy_a and_o i_o do_v not_o believe_v but_o know_v that_o from_o hence_o nothing_o be_v come_v to_o your_o cause_n the_o catholic_n church_n make_v not_o itself_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n but_o be_v ground_v in_o it_o as_o before_o and_o how_o be_v the_o first_o member_n of_o the_o catholic_n church_n make_v christian_n but_o by_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o from_o the_o holiness_n of_o it_o do_v not_o follow_v infallibility_n by_o the_o roman_a distinction_n which_o say_v that_o the_o pope_n may_v err_v
you_o charge_v i_o in_o differ_v from_o myself_o because_o before_o i_o teach_v the_o ground_n of_o believe_v to_o be_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n and_o now_o i_o say_v it_o be_v the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v my_o reply_n be_v exceed_o easy_a the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n be_v god_n reveal_v and_o god_n reveal_v by_o his_o church_n as_o he_o first_o cause_v our_o first_o belief_n when_o he_o tell_v we_o by_o his_o church_n such_o and_o such_o book_n be_v infallible_o his_o word_n god_n reveal_v be_v always_o the_o formal_a object_n of_o faith_n but_o sometime_o god_n reveal_v his_o mind_n by_o scripture_n and_o sometime_o by_o the_o church_n as_o he_o do_v for_o two_o thousand_o year_n and_o more_o before_o the_o scripture_n be_v write_v the_o prophet_n before_o they_o do_v write_v do_v say_v this_o say_v the_o lord_n to_o wit_n this_o he_o say_v by_o their_o mouth_n so_o say_v i_o this_o and_o this_o say_v our_o lord_n by_o the_o mouth_n of_o his_o church_n as_o i_o have_v show_v numb_a 22._o saint_n athanasius_n to_o speak_v and_o i_o have_v show_v numb_a 28._o the_o general_a council_n of_o chalcedon_n to_o have_v say_v peter_n have_v speak_v by_o the_o mouth_n of_o leo_n pope_n of_o rome_n and_o thus_o god_n revelation_n come_v to_o we_o by_o the_o church_n she_o and_o only_o she_o teach_v we_o these_o and_o these_o scripture_n to_o be_v god_n word_n we_o must_v first_o believe_v she_o before_o we_o can_v come_v to_o have_v infallible_a ground_n to_o believe_v scripture_n as_o i_o have_v full_o show_v after_o we_o have_v believe_v scripture_n we_o can_v by_o scripture_n only_o know_v the_o undoubted_a sense_n of_o many_o necessary_a place_n in_o scripture_n as_o have_v be_v show_v again_o all_o thing_n necessary_a to_o be_v believe_v be_v not_o set_v down_o in_o scripture_n as_o have_v also_o be_v show_v full_o the_o revelation_n of_o god_n come_v to_o we_o in_o all_o these_o case_n by_o the_o church_n you_o by_o your_o own_o word_n in_o this_o place_n must_v grant_v her_o authority_n to_o be_v our_o ordinary_a cause_n of_o faith_n at_o the_o end_n of_o these_o your_o answer_n you_o will_v fain_o seem_v to_o have_v speak_v proper_o in_o accuse_v we_o of_o excess_n of_o faith_n but_o your_o distinction_n do_v no_o way_n salve_v the_o impropriety_n of_o the_o speech_n for_o there_o be_v still_o a_o difference_n in_o more_o believe_a object_n and_o believe_v more_o object_n but_o grant_v that_o it_o may_v be_v improper_o speak_v yet_o even_o in_o that_o sense_n it_o be_v not_o true_o say_v because_o there_o can_v be_v no_o excess_n of_o faith_n in_o believe_v what_o god_n say_v for_o believe_v upon_o a_o infallible_a authority_n all_o that_o we_o believe_v we_o can_v believe_v more_o than_o we_o shall_v if_o we_o believe_v no_o more_o thing_n then_o be_v ground_v upon_o that_o infallible_a authority_n as_o we_o do_v not_o and_o consequent_o we_o do_v no_o more_o then_o believe_v such_o thing_n as_o have_v for_o their_o warrant_n this_o faith_n the_o lord_n have_v now_o answer_v your_o paper_n from_o the_o begin_n to_o the_o end_n i_o be_o most_o willing_a to_o take_v your_o own_o close_a out_o of_o saint_n austin_n against_o reason_n no_o sober_a man_n will_v go_v against_o scripture_n not_o christian_a against_o the_o church_n no_o peacemaker_n add_v his_o other_o word_n tr._n 32._o in_o joan._n let_v we_o believe_v my_o brethren_n so_o much_o as_o a_o man_n love_v the_o church_n just_o so_o much_o he_o have_v of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n sir_n i_o can_v answer_v it_o to_o god_n nor_o to_o his_o church_n with_o we_o if_o i_o let_v you_o seem_v to_o yourself_o or_o to_o other_o of_o your_o persuasion_n that_o you_o have_v the_o victory_n until_o you_o have_v overcome_v your_o error_n therefore_o you_o will_v excuse_v i_o if_o i_o still_o follow_v you_o to_o your_o preface_n then_o if_o the_o roman_a catholic_n have_v often_o foretell_v that_o by_o permit_v free_o to_o all_o sort_n of_o people_n the_o read_n of_o the_o scripture_n in_o their_o mother-tongue_n multitude_n of_o new_a sect_n and_o heresy_n will_v not_o fail_v to_o grow_v up_o in_o numberless_a number_n and_o as_o for_o the_o people_n manner_n they_o will_v grow_v worse_o and_o worse_o as_o you_o say_v in_o the_o beginning_n then_o be_v your_o roman_a catholic_n in_o this_o false_a prophet_n because_o they_o seem_v by_o you_o to_o make_v that_o the_o cause_n of_o heresy_n and_o bad_a manner_n this_o be_v plain_o fallacia_fw-la non_fw-la causa_fw-la or_o the_o fallacy_n of_o accident_n and_o second_o it_o be_v contrary_a to_o that_o of_o our_o saviour_n christ_n saint_n mark_v the_o 12.24_o do_v you_o not_o therefore_o err_v not_o know_v the_o scripture_n and_o the_o power_n of_o god_n by_o our_o saviour_n the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o scripture_n be_v not_o the_o cause_n of_o err_a but_o the_o not_o know_v of_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o cause_n of_o err_a you_o do_v therefore_o err_v not_o know_v the_o scripture_n which_o be_v able_a to_o make_v we_o wise_a unto_o salvation_n as_o saint_n paul_n to_o timothy_n 2_o tim._n 3.15_o and_o three_o you_o confess_v in_o this_o paper_n that_o when_o we_o be_v by_o the_o church_n assure_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n we_o may_v ground_n our_o faith_n in_o it_o for_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v plain_o deliver_v and_o fourthly_a how_o come_v it_o to_o pass_v then_o that_o some_o of_o those_o in_o who_o infallibility_n as_o you_o think_v be_v vest_v have_v be_v heretic_n and_o lewd_a the_o former_a of_o which_o indeed_o you_o do_v much_o deny_v but_o be_v exemplify_v in_o liberius_n subscribe_v against_o athanasius_n as_o you_o may_v see_v full_o prove_v by_o our_o reinolds_n against_o your_o hart._n and_o sure_o be_v that_o also_o a_o action_n of_o bad_a manner_n therefore_o if_o your_o church_n be_v the_o true_a church_n yet_o do_v it_o not_o you_o see_v teach_v the_o way_n of_o salvation_n infallible_o and_o therefore_o can_v we_o not_o by_o it_o infallible_o discern_v the_o true_a religion_n from_o the_o false_a indeed_o the_o catholic_n church_n have_v teach_v the_o infallible_a way_n of_o salvation_n but_o that_o be_v the_o scripture_n as_o i_o prove_v by_o many_o testimony_n and_o this_o be_v a_o teach_v the_o infallible_a way_n by_o consequence_n because_o it_o do_v teach_v the_o scripture_n which_o be_v the_o infallible_a way_n yet_o have_v it_o not_o in_o particular_a point_n teach_v the_o infallible_a way_n infallible_o neither_o be_v we_o by_o the_o church_n infallible_o resolve_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n although_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o true_a church_n be_v a_o motive_n herein_o yet_o be_v it_o not_o that_o wherein_o ultimate_o we_o ground_n our_o faith_n of_o the_o scripture_n as_o i_o have_v show_v whereas_o then_o you_o say_v that_o we_o can_v have_v as_o thing_n stand_v any_o other_o assurance_n to_o ground_v our_o faith_n upon_o secure_o namely_o then_o the_o church_n you_o do_v still_o but_o fortiter_fw-la supponere_fw-la for_o we_o can_v ground_v our_o assurance_n secure_o upon_o the_o church_n and_o second_o whereas_o you_o say_v that_o as_o thing_n stand_v we_o have_v no_o other_o assurance_n etc._n etc._n you_o do_v not_o well_o consider_v what_o you_o say_v or_o i_o do_v not_o understand_v what_o you_o mean_v for_o hereby_o you_o do_v intimate_v that_o the_o church_n be_v not_o the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d but_o that_o which_o be_v indeed_o the_o ground_n of_o our_o faith_n must_v be_v so_o absolute_o and_o universal_o as_o far_o as_o be_v necessary_a the_o church_n security_n be_v but_o the_o best_a of_o the_o kind_n among_o those_o which_o be_v humane_a but_o we_o must_v have_v a_o divine_a indefectible_a ground_n for_o our_o divine_a faith_n in_o which_o there_o can_v be_v falsity_n neither_o three_o be_v the_o church_n the_o first_o ground_n because_o by_o it_o we_o believe_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n because_o if_o we_o do_v by_o it_o believe_v the_o scripture_n than_o we_o be_v not_o first_o to_o believe_v it_o by_o the_o scripture_n and_o if_o whatsoever_o credence_n we_o do_v give_v to_o it_o we_o do_v give_v by_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n then_o be_v we_o first_o to_o believe_v the_o scripture_n and_o then_o that_o be_v the_o first_o ground_n four_o in_o that_o you_o say_v you_o do_v never_o deny_v that_o when_o we_o be_v by_o the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n assure_v of_o the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n we_o may_v believe_v such_o thing_n as_o be_v clear_o contain_v in_o scripture_n etc._n etc._n you_o say_v that_o which_o conclude_v against_o the_o practice_n of_o
which_o by_o the_o trent_n council_n be_v christen_v authentic_a before_o it_o be_v bear_v you_o make_v that_o to_o be_v the_o scripture_n by_o which_o you_o must_v decide_v controversy_n than_o you_o decide_v controversy_n by_o scripture_n and_o have_v that_o no_o fault_n in_o it_o be_v it_o every_o word_n infallible_o do_v if_o infallible_o do_v at_o first_o why_o do_v clement_n the_o eight_o vary_v from_o sixtus_n quintus_fw-la and_o why_o do_v isidor_n clarius_n vary_v from_o he_o in_o thousand_o of_o place_n and_o do_v you_o any_o where_fw-mi find_v in_o scripture_n that_o this_o interpretation_n be_v make_v canonical_a and_o be_v there_o none_o that_o find_v great_a fault_n with_o this_o latin_a one_o if_o you_o will_v look_v into_o your_o bellarmine_n in_o his_o three_o book_n de_fw-fr verbo_fw-la dei_fw-la 10._o chapter_n you_o may_v find_v the_o contrary_a and_o although_o it_o go_v under_o the_o account_n of_o a_o ancient_a edition_n and_o hieronis_fw-la yet_o in_o the_o chapter_n before_o you_o may_v see_v he_o find_v adversary_n objection_n and_o you_o may_v find_v by_o his_o confession_n that_o all_o be_v not_o he_o what_o need_v then_o sixtus_n quintus_fw-la have_v make_v it_o up_o and_o be_v not_o your_o rhemish_n testament_n very_o faulty_a will_v you_o undertake_v to_o make_v it_o all_o good_a against_o fulk_n and_o if_o you_o say_v that_o you_o may_v be_v certain_a of_o your_o latin_n by_o the_o church_n which_o you_o will_v prove_v to_o be_v infallible_a until_o you_o do_v prove_v it_o you_o do_v again_o commit_v the_o fallacy_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d this_o shall_v have_v be_v make_v irrefragable_o sure_a at_o first_o by_o achillean_a invincible_a argument_n and_o then_o we_o shall_v have_v fall_v down_o before_o you_o but_o again_o you_o tell_v we_o you_o will_v do_v it_o and_o present_o fly_v at_o we_o for_o our_o opinion_n be_v there_o not_o one_o of_o you_o who_o be_v pretty_o in_o his_o opposition_n against_o bishop_n andrew_n about_o the_o pope_n temporal_a power_n compare_v to_o the_o pulex_fw-la qui_fw-la cessim_fw-la fugit_fw-la &_o fugit_fw-la recessìm_fw-la et_fw-la subsultibus_fw-la hinc_fw-la &_o hinc_fw-la citatis_fw-la vibrat_fw-la cruscula_fw-la and_o be_v there_o no_o more_o do_v so_o in_o some_o line_n follow_v of_o your_o treatise_n we_o have_v nothing_o but_o petition_n or_o repetition_n and_o we_o answer_v no_o more_o till_o you_o prove_v more_o than_o this_o no_o man_n ever_o err_v by_o follow_a scripture_n sincere_o which_o you_o grant_v to_o be_v the_o infallible_a word_n of_o god_n if_o they_o err_v they_o err_v from_o scripture_n not_o by_o it_o but_o fool_n may_v be_v make_v wise_a by_o scripture_n and_o wise_a man_n may_v err_v by_o your_o church_n until_o you_o make_v it_o infallible_a nullibi_fw-la pronior_fw-la fidei_fw-la lapsus_fw-la quam_fw-la ubi_fw-la rei_fw-la falsae_fw-la gravis_fw-la author_n extitit_fw-la as_o he_o say_v if_o they_o may_v teach_v that_o which_o be_v false_a wise_a man_n may_v also_o be_v deceive_v if_o they_o be_v not_o infallible_a they_o may_v teach_v that_o which_o be_v false_a but_o in_o the_o eight_o line_n of_o the_o nine_o page_n you_o oppose_v to_o i_o saint_n augustine_n authority_n and_o of_o all_o the_o great_a doctor_n which_o ever_o the_o church_n have_v that_o they_o profess_v themselves_o unable_a to_o understand_v the_o scripture_n and_o that_o after_o many_o year_n study_v and_o how_o then_o etc._n etc._n we_o easy_o answer_v saint_n austin_n do_v not_o say_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v absolute_o and_o universal_o in_o all_o place_n so_o difficult_a that_o we_o may_v not_o get_v out_o from_o thence_o that_o which_o will_v direct_v we_o to_o heaven_n for_o than_o he_o shall_v contradict_v himself_o do_v he_o not_o say_v in_o his_o 4_o the_o chapter_n of_o the_o 2._o book_n dê_fw-la doct._n christ_n that_o there_o be_v some_o thing_n indeed_o difficult_a but_o the_o obscurity_n be_v profitable_a to_o tame_v our_o pride_n by_o labour_n and_o to_o bring_v back_o our_o understanding_n from_o loathe_v cvi_fw-la facile_fw-la investigata_fw-la plerumque_fw-la vilescum_fw-la as_o he_o say_v and_o full_o again_o in_o in_o his_o 10_o the_o tom_n de_fw-fr verbis_fw-la apostoli_fw-la serm._n the_o 13_o the_o verbi_fw-la dei_fw-la altitudo_fw-la etc._n etc._n the_o sublimity_n of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n do_v exercise_v our_o study_n do_v not_o deny_v to_o be_v understand_v if_o all_o be_v shut_v up_o there_o will_v be_v nothing_o whereby_o that_o which_o be_v obscure_a will_v be_v reveal_v again_o if_o all_o be_v cover_v there_o will_v not_o be_v from_o whence_o the_o soul_n shall_v receive_v nourishment_n and_o may_v have_v strength_n to_o knock_v at_o that_o which_o be_v shut_v therefore_o your_o fallacy_n be_v à_fw-la dicto_fw-la secundum_fw-la quid_fw-la if_o from_o hence_o you_o will_v conclude_v all_o to_o be_v difficult_a yea_o so_o you_o will_v contradict_v saint_n peter_n who_o say_v of_o saint_n paul_n epistle_n that_o something_n of_o they_o be_v hard_a to_o be_v understand_v not_o all_o exceptio_fw-la in_o non_fw-la exceptis_fw-la firmat_n regulam_fw-la as_o the_o rule_n be_v yea_o you_o will_v contradict_v yourself_o who_o say_v more_o than_o once_o that_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v plain_a in_o scripture_n you_o believe_v by_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n but_o if_o from_o the_o assert_v of_o some_o thing_n difficult_a you_o will_v only_o conclude_v that_o this_o can_v be_v the_o judge_n in_o controversy_n as_o you_o seem_v to_o intend_v in_o your_o conclusion_n we_o say_v plain_o this_o difficulty_n in_o some_o thing_n of_o scripture_n do_v not_o infer_v the_o necessity_n of_o a_o infallible_a judge_n on_o earth_n your_o premise_n do_v not_o conclude_v this_o and_o we_o allow_v unto_o you_o the_o use_n of_o judge_n on_o earth_n although_o they_o be_v not_o infallible_a as_o judge_n in_o civil_a cause_n may_v and_o do_v sometime_o err_v yet_o be_v there_o use_v of_o they_o so_o also_o be_v there_o of_o ecclesiastical_a judge_n though_o not_o incapable_a of_o error_n and_o again_o there_o be_v no_o peril_n of_o damnation_n on_o either_o side_n sober_o hold_v in_o point_n of_o question_n and_o therefore_o the_o scripture_n yet_o may_v be_v the_o way_n so_o direct_v that_o fool_n can_v err_v in_o matter_n of_o necessary_a faith_n and_o practice_n and_o fourthly_a a_o general_n council_n be_v the_o high_a you_o can_v go_v in_o humane_a authority_n and_o yet_o this_o do_v not_o bind_v unto_o faith_n because_o it_o be_v not_o free_a from_o error_n to_o which_o purpose_n believe_v saint_n austin_n if_o you_o will_v stand_v to_o his_o judgement_n in_o his_o three_o book_n against_o maximinus_n bish_n of_o the_o arrian_n the_o fourteen_o chapter_n sed_fw-la nunc_fw-la nac_n ego_fw-la nicenum_n etc._n etc._n but_o now_o neither_o aught_o i_o produce_v the_o nicene_n council_n nor_o you_o that_o of_o ariminum_n as_o boast_v thereof_o neither_o be_o i_o hold_v under_o the_o authority_n of_o this_o nor_o you_o of_o the_o other_o let_v matter_n with_o matter_n cause_n with_o cause_n reason_n with_o reason_n be_v debate_v by_o authority_n of_o scripture_n not_o proper_a witness_n to_o any_o but_o common_a to_o both_o so_o he_o where_o you_o see_v he_o prefer_v the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n before_o council_n which_o be_v prove_v not_o infallible_a even_o here_o because_o one_o be_v for_o the_o arrian_n here_o be_v council_n against_o council_n as_o there_o have_v be_v pope_n against_o pope_n in_o this_o case_n what_o will_v you_o do_v which_o must_v you_o submit_v to_o be_v one_o infallible_a contrary_n to_o another_o infallible_a if_o you_o must_v submit_v to_o both_o you_o submit_v to_o error_n if_o to_o one_o why_o not_o to_o the_o other_o if_o that_o be_v infallible_a and_o this_o also_o will_v include_v uncertainty_n of_o all_o humane_a definition_n about_o the_o canon_n of_o scripture_n which_o have_v be_v speak_v to_o before_o we_o come_v now_o to_o your_o second_o reason_n in_o your_o eight_o number_n that_o you_o say_v come_v into_o this_o enthymene_n many_o controversy_n there_o be_v and_o may_v be_v yet_o very_a many_o more_o most_o near_o concern_v the_o necessary_a mean_n to_o salvation_n which_o can_v never_o be_v end_v and_o undoubted_o decide_v by_o judgement_n and_o sentence_n of_o the_o scripture_n therefore_o the_o scripture_n be_v not_o the_o judge_n we_o answer_v to_o the_o antecedent_n in_o those_o term_n i_o deny_v it_o in_o both_o the_o branch_n if_o you_o mean_v by_o those_o thing_n near_o concern_v the_o necessary_a mean_n to_o salvation_n such_o thing_n as_o be_v indeed_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n otherwise_o you_o go_v upon_o a_o false_a supposition_n that_o there_o be_v a_o necessity_n of_o a_o judge_n on_o earth_n undoubted_o to_o decide_v that_o which_o be_v not_o necessary_a therefore_o choose_v you_o which_o you_o will_v hold_v to_o if_o you_o mean_v those_o
it_o to_o be_v note_v that_o herein_o he_o follow_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n notwithstanding_o which_o saint_n jerome_n as_o before_o do_v not_o receive_v they_o which_o make_v a_o sufficient_a reason_n to_o hold_v that_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o a_o sufficient_a ground_n of_o faith_n in_o the_o belief_n of_o canonical_a book_n or_o else_o st._n jerome_n who_o in_o this_o may_v be_v compare_v with_o st._n austin_n for_o his_o judgement_n be_v in_o the_o same_o condemnation_n with_o we_o afterward_o you_o plead_v that_o since_o the_o gospel_n of_o s._n matthew_n be_v write_v in_o hebrew_n whereof_o there_o be_v not_o extant_a any_o one_o copy_n in_o the_o world_n and_o it_o be_v not_o certain_a who_o or_o how_o faithful_o he_o do_v translate_v it_o we_o can_v be_v certain_a by_o the_o scripture_n that_o this_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n therefore_o by_o the_o church_n this_o i_o think_v be_v the_o sum_n of_o your_o plea._n we_o answer_v first_o again_o we_o do_v not_o disclaim_v the_o use_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n in_o the_o credence_n of_o the_o word_n of_o god_n but_o this_o do_v not_o certify_v we_o second_o you_o catholic_n as_o you_o will_v be_v call_v speak_v large_o that_o not_o one_o of_o the_o ancient_n conceive_v it_o to_o be_v write_v in_o greek_a sure_o all_o the_o ancient_n do_v not_o write_v sure_o all_o that_o do_v write_v be_v not_o now_o have_v but_o take_v it_o of_o all_o that_o do_v write_v and_o be_v now_o extant_a and_o put_v it_o to_o be_v so_o that_o all_o be_v of_o saint_n jeromes_n opinion_n in_o his_o preface_n upon_o saint_n matthew_n yet_o all_o that_o you_o say_v be_v not_o certain_o true_a that_o there_o be_v not_o a_o copy_n of_o the_o hebrew_n gospel_n extant_a in_o all_o the_o world_n for_o not_o to_o speak_v of_o the_o hebrew_n gospel_n set_v out_o by_o munster_n and_o mercer_n which_o ludovicus_n de_fw-fr dieu_fw-fr take_v notice_n of_o in_o the_o preface_n to_o his_o note_n upon_o the_o gospel_n if_o you_o will_v give_v any_o heed_n to_o your_o isidor_n clarius_n he_o will_v tell_v you_o i_o suppose_v otherwise_o when_o he_o say_v in_o a_o little_a preface_n which_o be_v a_o testimony_n out_o of_o saint_n jerome_n in_o his_o catalogue_n of_o ecclesiastic_a writer_n that_o st._n jerome_n there_o affirm_v ipsum_fw-la hebraicum_fw-la habetur_fw-la usque_fw-la hodiè_fw-la in_o casariensi_fw-la bibliotheca_fw-la which_o pamphilus_n the_o martyr_n studiosissimè_fw-la confecit_fw-la and_o that_o he_o have_v the_o liberty_n by_o the_o nazaraean_n who_o in_o beroea_n city_n of_o syria_n do_v use_v this_o volume_n to_o describe_v it_o so_o he_o now_o it_o may_v be_v that_o remain_v there_o and_o therefore_o you_o can_v be_v certain_a of_o what_o you_o say_v and_o this_o be_v more_o than_o a_o ordinary_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n in_o a_o interpretation_n again_o how_o come_v your_o latin_a interpretation_n of_o this_o gospel_n to_o be_v authentic_a if_o it_o be_v not_o take_v out_o of_o a_o authentic_a copy_n for_o the_o church_n can_v do_v no_o more_o than_o declare_v that_o which_o be_v authentic_a then_o must_v it_o be_v authentic_a otherwise_o they_o make_v scripture_n again_o let_v i_o give_v you_o one_o intimation_n that_o possible_o so_o may_v yet_o at_o first_o be_v write_v in_o greek_a my_o reason_n be_v this_o in_o the_o first_o of_o saint_n matthew_n 23._o verse_n it_o be_v say_v of_o christ_n they_o shall_v call_v his_o name_n emmanuel_n which_o be_v interpret_v be_v god_n with_o we_o if_o it_o be_v write_v in_o hebrew_n what_o need_v of_o any_o interpretation_n in_o the_o same_o language_n since_o the_o letter_n of_o the_o word_n put_v together_o without_o any_o variation_n do_v make_v that_o signification_n again_o if_o the_o church_n have_v make_v the_o greek_a translation_n authentic_a why_o be_v your_o latin_a make_v authentic_a be_v there_o two_o authentiques_n if_o it_o be_v not_o authentic_a by_o the_o church_n what_o will_v you_o infer_v again_o the_o harmony_n of_o it_o with_o other_o gospel_n have_v more_o in_o it_o to_o persuade_v faith_n than_o the_o credit_n of_o the_o church_n again_o if_o it_o be_v a_o interpretation_n yet_o unless_o you_o do_v evince_v it_o that_o we_o do_v build_v our_o faith_n upon_o the_o interpretation_n you_o do_v nothing_o now_o then_o as_o your_o people_n do_v fix_v their_o faith_n upon_o that_o which_o be_v interpret_v not_o up-upon_a the_o interpretation_n so_o may_v we_o build_v our_o belief_n upon_o this_o gospel_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n by_o the_o illumination_n of_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n and_o yet_o not_o upon_o the_o translation_n the_o translation_n do_v but_o convey_v unto_o our_o knowledge_n the_o word_n but_o it_o be_v the_o spirit_n of_o god_n that_o do_v work_v in_o we_o belief_n thereof_o that_o it_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n the_o translation_n attend_v the_o notification_n of_o the_o object_n what_o that_o be_v which_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v but_o it_o be_v the_o divine_a persuasion_n which_o attend_v the_o act_n and_o be_v the_o cause_n why_o it_o be_v believe_v the_o interpretation_n be_v but_o the_o instrument_n of_o faith_n the_o ground_n of_o it_o be_v the_o persuasion_n of_o god_n that_o it_o be_v the_o truth_n and_o word_n of_o god_n and_o therefore_o your_o argumentation_n go_v upon_o a_o wrong_a supposition_n as_o if_o we_o resolve_v our_o faith_n in_o the_o translation_n as_o such_o and_o what_o you_o except_v afterward_o against_o the_o certainty_n of_o our_o faith_n upon_o the_o account_n of_o the_o greek_a translation_n do_v also_o return_v easy_o upon_o you_o for_o the_o same_o possibility_n of_o error_n be_v urge_v against_o your_o latin_a either_o by_o ignorance_n or_o negligence_n or_o on_o purpose_n for_o the_o uphold_v of_o your_o new_a opinion_n and_o let_v i_o ask_v you_o why_o you_o account_v your_o latin_a to_o be_v authentic_a you_o will_v say_v because_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v infallible_o assist_v in_o it_o be_v it_o then_o infallible_o assist_v when_o it_o render_v the_o hebrew_n in_o genesis_n ipsa_fw-la for_o ipsum_fw-la that_o it_o may_v be_v for_o the_o honour_n of_o the_o virgin_n well_o but_o give_v it_o that_o the_o latin_a be_v infallible_o make_v by_o the_o church_n why_o not_o the_o greek_a also_o infallible_o make_v by_o the_o church_n and_o more_o confirm_v by_o the_o church_n then_o your_o latin_a one_o you_o get_v nothing_o then_o by_o this_o exception_n and_o this_o may_v satisfy_v you_o how_o a_o manichaan_n may_v believe_v the_o gospel_n of_o saint_n matthew_n which_o you_o put_v to_o the_o question_n a_o opinion_n thereof_o he_o may_v have_v by_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o church_n some_o knowledge_n of_o it_o to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n he_o may_v gather_v by_o the_o agreement_n with_o the_o other_o gospel_n but_o the_o faith_n of_o it_o to_o be_v such_o be_v to_o be_v wrought_v by_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n whereby_o those_o who_o hear_v the_o apostle_n be_v cause_v to_o believe_v that_o which_o they_o preach_v to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n without_o persuasion_n of_o the_o church_n which_o be_v not_o then_o in_o a_o body_n when_o some_o first_o believe_v as_o for_o the_o father_n hold_v book_n to_o be_v canonical_a by_o the_o church_n we_o have_v speak_v to_o already_o in_o this_o paper_n and_o we_o shall_v meet_v with_o it_o again_o you_o speak_v indeed_o of_o they_o as_o in_o general_a upon_o design_n ad_fw-la faciendum_fw-la populum_fw-la but_o you_o do_v not_o name_v the_o place_n only_a saint_n athanasius_n you_o be_v please_v to_o quote_v we_o answer_v if_o you_o mean_v that_o he_o receive_v the_o gospel_n and_o reject_v the_o gospel_n of_o st._n thomas_n upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n as_o the_o cause_n of_o his_o faith_n of_o they_o you_o do_v not_o prove_v it_o by_o what_o he_o say_v if_o you_o mean_v that_o he_o be_v induce_v to_o think_v well_o of_o they_o by_o the_o reception_n of_o the_o church_n and_o to_o refuse_v the_o other_o by_o their_o refusal_n this_o do_v not_o come_v home_o to_o the_o question_n and_o suppose_v the_o church_n its_o refusal_n of_o the_o gospel_n of_o saint_n thomas_n be_v sufficient_a for_o he_o to_o refuse_v it_o too_o yet_o do_v it_o not_o follow_v that_o because_o the_o church_n do_v receive_v the_o other_o gospel_n he_o receive_v they_o not_o otherwise_o then_o because_o they_o do_v for_o this_o make_v the_o reception_n of_o the_o church_n to_o be_v but_o as_o a_o necessary_a condition_n not_o the_o formal_a cause_n of_o his_o faith_n as_o for_o tertullia_n and_o saint_n jerom_n and_o st._n augustine_n authority_n in_o this_o case_n we_o shall_v find_v a_o answer_n when_o you_o quote_v the_o place_n the_o testimony_n of_o eusebius_n which_o you_o produce_v
whereas_o there_o be_v but_o one_o sense_n of_o scripture_n principal_o intend_v which_o be_v express_v sometime_o proper_o sometime_o improper_o as_o for_o the_o mystical_a divinity_n you_o know_v it_o be_v not_o argumentative_a but_o where_o it_o be_v declare_v in_o scripture_n and_o as_o for_o the_o set_n out_o of_o thing_n spiritual_a in_o way_n of_o translation_n from_o thing_n temporal_a you_o may_v consider_v it_o be_v necessary_a if_o you_o will_v believe_v your_o angelical_a doctor_n because_o since_o our_o knowledge_n come_v here_o by_o sense_n we_o can_v for_o this_o state_n understand_v they_o but_o by_o compare_n to_o thing_n of_o sense_n so_o that_o there_o must_v upon_o this_o account_n be_v metaphor_n and_o what_o be_v allegory_n but_o metaphor_n continue_v and_o as_o for_o the_o tropological_a sense_n which_o respect_v institution_n of_o life_n that_o be_v not_o difficult_o find_v in_o more_o clear_a precept_n again_o if_o by_o impropriety_n of_o speech_n we_o shall_v conclude_v a_o absolute_a need_n of_o a_o infallible_a judge_n then_o how_o shall_v we_o infallible_o be_v guide_v by_o the_o opinion_n of_o the_o father_n since_o so_o many_o of_o they_o especial_o clemens_n alexandrinus_n and_o origen_n who_o be_v of_o the_o ancient_a of_o they_o be_v so_o full_a of_o this_o obscurity_n and_o as_o for_o your_o objection_n that_o both_o precept_n and_o council_n be_v deliver_v in_o the_o mood_n imperative_a you_o can_v reasonable_o conceive_v that_o we_o shall_v be_v so_o ignorant_a and_o credulous_a as_o to_o think_v that_o we_o shall_v swallow_v down_o without_o chew_v this_o your_o supposition_n that_o there_o be_v counsel_n of_o perfection_n above_o thing_n of_o command_n for_o when_o we_o have_v do_v all_o we_o must_v say_v that_o we_o be_v unprofitable_a servant_n we_o have_v do_v what_o we_o ought_v to_o do_v st._n luke_n the_o 17._o and_o 10._o unprofitable_a not_o only_o to_o god_n as_o your_o man_n distinguish_v but_o also_o unprofitable_a to_o ourselves_o because_o we_o have_v do_v but_o our_o duty_n if_o we_o do_v as_o much_o as_o we_o can_v which_o none_o do_v and_o yet_o if_o we_o do_v as_o much_o as_o we_o can_v we_o shall_v not_o do_v so_o much_o as_o we_o shall_v since_o the_o command_n of_o god_n be_v give_v to_o we_o according_a to_o the_o tenor_n of_o our_o ability_n in_o adam_n which_o we_o lose_v by_o our_o own_o fault_n our_o obedience_n therefore_o by_o itself_o can_v be_v profitable_a another_o default_n you_o will_v find_v or_o make_v in_o scripture_n that_o it_o do_v no_o where_o set_v down_o a_o catalogue_n of_o fundamental_o but_o do_v you_o think_v in_o earnest_n that_o this_o be_v a_o cogent_a argument_n for_o your_o cause_n the_o scripture_n do_v not_o set_v down_o a_o catalogue_n of_o fundamental_o therefore_o it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v the_o judge_n of_o controversy_n to_o your_o antecedent_n we_o say_v that_o the_o scripture_n do_v give_v we_o every_o particular_a point_n which_o be_v necessary_a to_o be_v believe_v although_o it_o do_v not_o give_v out_o the_o number_n thereof_o formal_a and_o material_a how_o many_o and_o which_o they_o be_v second_o it_o do_v not_o only_o afford_v that_o which_o be_v simple_o necessary_a but_o do_v furnish_v we_o with_o many_o other_o particular_n so_o that_o it_o be_v a_o abundant_a directory_n for_o our_o use_n and_o therefore_o be_v there_o no_o defect_n of_o wisdom_n in_o this_o lawmaker_n when_o he_o give_v we_o such_o a_o law_n that_o infallible_o contain_v all_o necessary_n and_o more_o and_o when_o those_o necessary_n be_v not_o only_o plain_o deliver_v but_o also_o what_o be_v not_o plain_o deliver_v be_v thereby_o signify_v not_o to_o be_v necessary_a three_o again_o we_o admit_v humane_a dijudication_n of_o doubt_n emergent_a in_o some_o point_n and_o they_o have_v their_o use_n with_o we_o without_o infallibility_n four_o either_o the_o scripture_n yet_o notwithstanding_o this_o be_v it_o whereby_o we_o must_v be_v determine_v in_o point_n of_o religion_n or_o else_o the_o church_n but_o the_o church_n by_o the_o same_o argument_n be_v not_o the_o judge_n because_o it_o do_v not_o define_v whatsoever_o may_v be_v necessary_a to_o be_v hold_v by_o a_o full_a catholic_n in_o your_o sense_n whether_o the_o pope_n have_v temporal_a power_n or_o not_o be_v not_o this_o necessary_a to_o be_v determine_v if_o it_o be_v determine_v how_o come_v your_o heart_n to_o deny_v it_o then_o whether_o he_o have_v power_n temporal_a direct_o as_o the_o canonist_n or_o indirect_o as_o other_o be_v this_o determine_v then_o how_o come_v bellarmin_n to_o go_v against_o his_o conscience_n on_o one_o side_n or_o other_o for_o he_o vary_v herein_o as_o your_o widdrington_n speak_v of_o he_o and_o widdrington_n he_o be_v another_o against_o his_o power_n in_o his_o apology_n for_o the_o right_n and_o sovereignty_n of_o temporal_a prince_n and_o why_o be_v not_o the_o question_n decide_v whether_o the_o pope_n be_v superior_a to_o a_o council_n in_o thing_n ecclesiastical_a which_o the_o sorbonist_n deny_v be_v not_o there_o high_a point_n which_o be_v of_o weight_n to_o move_v a_o infallible_a conclusion_n not_o to_o speak_v of_o god_n predetermination_n or_o whether_o the_o virgin_n mary_n be_v conceive_v without_o original_a sin_n how_o be_v then_o the_o church_n the_o infallible_a judge_n of_o controversy_n if_o you_o say_v that_o the_o church_n determine_v as_o much_o as_o be_v necessary_a well_o then_o and_o so_o have_v the_o scripture_n which_o you_o acknowledge_v be_v infallible_a but_o be_v not_o the_o former_a point_n necessary_a what_o can_v you_o instance_n in_o which_o be_v more_o necessary_a and_o not_o determine_v in_o scripture_n if_o our_o salvation_n as_o you_o hold_v be_v in_o jeopardy_n for_o not_o submit_v to_o the_o infallible_a judge_n what_o can_v be_v of_o more_o concernment_n then_o to_o know_v infallible_o who_o he_o be_v and_o what_o power_n he_o have_v which_o yet_o your_o prudent_a religion_n will_v never_o make_v a_o determination_n of_o after_o this_o you_o tax_v our_o doctrine_n to_o be_v contrary_a to_o scripture_n and_o first_o in_o the_o matter_n of_o extreme_a unction_n by_o saint_n james_n we_o say_v if_o you_o say_v right_a that_o it_o be_v clear_a against_o we_o by_o scripture_n than_o the_o scripture_n have_v decide_v this_o question_n than_o the_o scripture_n can_v judge_v and_o end_v controversy_n and_o yet_o at_o the_o beginning_n hereof_o you_o speak_v very_o wary_o and_o discreet_o it_o seem_v if_o by_o this_o term_n you_o will_v have_v we_o believe_v that_o it_o be_v not_o evident_o declare_v against_o we_o in_o scripture_n than_o we_o need_v say_v no_o more_o as_o to_o this_o case_n if_o it_o be_v manifest_a by_o scripture_n against_o we_o and_o you_o mean_v your_o word_n seem_v as_o aristotle_n and_o other_o use_v it_o in_o way_n of_o elegance_n or_o of_o course_n than_o it_o do_v not_o abate_v the_o tenure_n of_o the_o affirmative_a and_o then_o what_o need_v we_o any_o other_o judge_n so_o be_v you_o hold_v by_o this_o dilemma_n second_o that_o command_n of_o saint_n james_n import_v no_o sacrament_n as_o you_o will_v have_v it_o but_o do_v relate_v to_o the_o gift_n of_o heal_v in_o those_o time_n another_o example_n of_o our_o difference_n from_o scripture_n you_o press_v the_o sacrament_n of_o the_o lord_n supper_n to_o be_v in_o our_o sense_n we_o answer_v first_o you_o say_v the_o word_n of_o institution_n be_v clear_a in_o this_o sacrament_n in_o which_o any_o wise_a man_n will_v speak_v clear_o and_o yet_o afterward_o you_o say_v this_o controversy_n the_o scripture_n do_v not_o decide_v how_o far_o be_v these_o from_o a_o contradiction_n if_o clear_a than_o either_o be_v decide_v or_o needs_o none_o but_o it_o be_v for_o your_o turn_n that_o it_o shall_v be_v clear_a and_o not_o decide_v clear_a against_o we_o not_o decide_v for_o you_o well_o here_o again_o you_o incur_v the_o former_a inconvenience_n which_o i_o will_v let_v pass_v second_o the_o word_n indeed_o be_v clear_a for_o the_o nature_n of_o a_o sacrament_n which_o under_o a_o visible_a sign_n represent_v a_o spiritual_a thing_n and_o so_o therefore_o for_o the_o condition_n of_o a_o sacrament_n any_o wise_a man_n can_v not_o speak_v more_o convenient_o then_o in_o a_o figurative_a sense_n because_o it_o be_v symbolical_a to_o the_o sacrament_n for_o if_o the_o real_a presence_n as_o you_o mean_v be_v corporal_a then_o be_v the_o property_n of_o the_o sacrament_n destroy_v because_o the_o sign_n be_v turn_v into_o that_o which_o be_v signify_v and_o you_o be_v in_o more_o capacity_n to_o yield_v a_o figurative_a sense_n here_o because_o elsewhere_o you_o do_v object_n too_o much_o of_o it_o and_o here_o too_o little_a indeed_o if_o scripture_n have_v no_o other_o handle_n but_o you_o it_o will_v after_o it_o more_o need_n a_o infallible_a
need_v then_o of_o a_o infallible_a judge_n since_o in_o point_n of_o question_n simple_a error_n be_v not_o damnative_a and_o where_o indeed_o shall_v we_o have_v a_o infallible_a judge_n if_o there_o be_v fallibility_n in_o any_o particular_a if_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n speak_v in_o the_o church_n by_o infallible_a assistance_n can_v the_o spirit_n of_o god_n infallible_o determine_v all_o point_n or_o if_o it_o assist_v infallible_o only_a to_o material_a article_n which_o be_v necessary_a then_o do_v you_o give_v we_o a_o list_n of_o your_o fundamental_o and_o also_o for_o fundamental_o we_o need_v not_o such_o a_o judge_n have_v they_o with_o sufficient_a plainness_n in_o scripture_n which_o be_v infallible_a upon_o the_o whole_a matter_n then_o there_o be_v a_o possibility_n of_o their_o err_a without_o infallibility_n and_o of_o our_o err_a without_o damnation_n so_o that_o your_o first_o error_n be_v a_o infallibility_n of_o a_o judge_n the_o second_o the_o necessity_n of_o such_o a_o judge_n and_o a_o three_o be_v this_o that_o no_o church_n can_v prudent_o be_v hold_v to_o be_v the_o catholic_n church_n but_o the_o roman_a but_o ought_v we_o not_o to_o disturb_v your_o delight_n you_o take_v in_o hold_v a_o religion_n prudent_o prudent_o as_o if_o we_o be_v to_o choose_v a_o religion_n by_o interest_n which_o prudence_n do_v rather_o direct_v to_o not_o by_o sapience_n of_o the_o high_a speculative_a principle_n which_o direct_v the_o understanding_n but_o to_o let_v that_o pass_v we_o only_o note_v hereby_o your_o pronounce_v this_o main_a text_n for_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n that_o what_o authority_n it_o have_v must_v be_v resolve_v into_o scripture_n then_o be_v that_o the_o first_o and_o high_a principle_n that_o the_o centre_n of_o truth_n wherein_o we_o must_v rest_v and_o the_o further_o we_o go_v from_o that_o the_o further_a from_o truth_n and_o the_o great_a circumference_n we_o draw_v the_o line_n be_v the_o remote_a from_o that_o wherein_o we_o must_v acquiesce_v as_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n yet_o you_o say_v here_o we_o see_v the_o judge_n which_o christ_n have_v warrant_v from_o bring_v in_o any_o damnable_a error_n therefore_o may_v we_o secure_o obey_v so_o you_o but_o where_o be_v your_o connexion_n in_o this_o argumentation_n either_o you_o distinguish_v damnative_a error_n against_o that_o which_o be_v not_o damnative_a or_o not_o if_o not_o then_o in_o your_o opinion_n all_o error_n be_v damnative_a then_o take_v you_o heed_n of_o this_o for_o this_o be_v one_o or_o if_o you_o do_v distinguish_v it_o against_o error_n damnative_n yet_o may_v we_o not_o secure_o obey_v this_o judge_n because_o than_o we_o may_v be_v bind_v to_o obey_v he_o in_o a_o 〈◊〉_d and_o so_o shall_v the_o understanding_n be_v oblige_v to_o assent_v to_o error_n which_o be_v impossible_a and_o he_o must_v act_v against_o his_o conscience_n even_o in_o his_o assent_n which_o be_v a_o contradiction_n and_o that_o none_o may_v disobey_v this_o judge_n secure_o the_o text_n you_o bring_v matth._n 18.17_o will_v not_o evince_v to_o your_o p●●pose_n for_o first_o it_o concern_v matter_n of_o trespass_n betwixt_o brother_n and_o brother_n not_o matter_n of_o faith_n and_o thus_o it_o be_v eccentrical_a to_o your_o resign_n second_o it_o concern_v refractoriness_n of_o the_o person_n not_o unbelief_n of_o the_o understanding_n and_o so_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n may_v bind_v against_o the_o former_a though_o not_o against_o the_o latter_a three_o it_o respect_v excommunication_n by_o censure_n not_o determination_n of_o a_o point_n by_o infallibility_n and_o so_o also_o be_v not_o proper_a to_o your_o cause_n and_o fourthly_a it_o may_v err_v in_o the_o censure_n and_o therefore_o excommunication_n eo_fw-la ipso_fw-la do_v not_o damn_v as_o unbelief_n may_v neither_o be_o i_o bind_v to_o believe_v the_o censure_n be_v just_a unless_o it_o appear_v to_o be_v so_o five_o this_o power_n belong_v to_o every_o particular_a church_n and_o to_o the_o several_a prelate_n thereof_o as_o you_o speak_v also_o in_o the_o number_n of_o multitude_n and_o therefore_o be_v not_o appropriate_v to_o your_o church_n six_o it_o do_v not_o follow_v a_o fortieri_fw-la as_o you_o will_v have_v it_o nor_o yet_o at_o all_o that_o because_o the_o church_n be_v to_o judge_v of_o private_a complaint_n therefore_o it_o can_v judge_v infallible_o in_o cause_n of_o great_a importance_n by_o its_o authority_n it_o do_v the_o former_a without_o infallibility_n it_o do_v not_o the_o latter_a the_o former_a of_o they_o do_v not_o conclude_v against_o i_o and_o the_o latter_a can_v be_v from_o hence_o collect_v as_o for_o that_o which_o follow_v whatsoever_o you_o shall_v bind_v on_o earth_n shall_v be_v bind_v in_o heaven_n as_o far_o as_o it_o regard_v excommunication_n must_v be_v also_o take_v specificative_o &_o cleave_v non_fw-la errante_fw-la as_o they_o speak_v and_o this_o touch_v the_o person_n unto_o the_o submission_n not_o the_o conscience_n as_o to_o renounce_v that_o which_o it_o apprehend_v as_o true_a for_o than_o shall_v athanasius_n have_v be_v bind_v in_o conscience_n by_o the_o censure_n of_o the_o church_n to_o have_v be_v a_o arrian_n then_o from_o the_o peril_n of_o disobedience_n to_o this_o judge_n you_o gather_v that_o this_o must_v supposse_v the_o judge_n not_o to_o be_v fall●ble_a in_o such_o prime_a cause_n as_o must_v concern_v the_o church_n and_o all_o such_o cause_n be_v those_o which_o may_v bring_v 〈◊〉_d damnable_a error_n so_o you_o in_o the_o ●nd_n of_o that_o number_n but_o your_o premise_n be_v destroy_v your_o conclusion_n be_v ruinous_a and_o yet_o also_o you_o do_v not_o conclude_v punctual_o according_a to_o a_o elench_n for_o you_o conclude_v it_o not_o fallible_a in_o prime_a cause_n of_o main_a importance_n but_o you_o shall_v in_o your_o proof_n conclude_v it_o not_o fallible_a in_o any_o thing_n for_o if_o it_o be_v fallible_a in_o any_o thing_n wherein_o the_o error_n be_v not_o damnative_a than_o you_o do_v not_o conclude_v it_o infallible_a yea_o though_o it_o shall_v not_o err_v actual_o in_o any_o decision_n you_o follow_v not_o from_o hence_o that_o it_o be_v infallible_a for_o infallibility_n exclude_v all_o error_n in_o whatsoever_o i●_n do_v propose_v or_o decree_n and_o also_o the_o possibility_n of_o error_n therefore_o prove_v it_o thus_o and_o then_o a_o infallibility_n of_o our_o knowledge_n of_o it_o and_o infallible_o what_o be_v the_o subject_n of_o this_o infallibility_n and_o then_o i_o shall_v stand_v up_o to_o your_o creed_n and_o if_o you_o will_v go_v the_o right_a way_n in_o this_o dispute_n you_o shall_v use_v another_o method_n for_o whereas_o you_o will_v argue_v the_o church_n to_o be_v the_o judge_n which_o we_o can_v safe_o disobey_v if_o you_o can_v make_v this_o sure_a which_o yet_o be_v not_o do_v yet_o you_o shall_v rather_o go_v this_o way_n synthetical_o the_o church_n be_v infallible_a in_o whatsoever_o it_o do_v define_v therefore_o it_o be_v the_o judge_n which_o we_o ought_v to_o obey_v in_o all_o thing_n whatsoever_o it_o 〈◊〉_d out_o but_o your_o discourse_n from_o uncertain_a decision_n and_o inconvenience_n do_v not_o bespeak_v any_o credence_n of_o your_o infallibility_n much_o less_o of_o our_o knowledge_n thereof_o now_o we_o follow_v you_o into_o your_o eighteen_o paragraph_n and_o here_o we_o meet_v with_o st_n augustine_n suffrage_n in_o his_o 20._o the_o ●in_a cap._n 9_o where_o he_o comment_v upon_o these_o word_n of_o rev._n ●●_o 4_o i_o fan●_n thro●●_n and_o they_o sit_v upon_o they_o and_o judgement_n be_v give_v they_o so_o the_o testimony_n and_o what_o from_o hence_o because_o the_o praeposits_n judge_v on_o earth_n therefore_o infallible_o than_o every_o church_n which_o have_v praeposits_n shall_v be_v infallible_a do_v this_o follow_v we_o deny_v not_o their_o judicature_n but_o their_o infallibility_n conclude_v thus_o or_o you_o agree_v with_o we_o then_o you_o ●●y_v to_o the_o old_a testament_n mal._n 2.7_o for_o the_o priest_n lip_n shall_v keep_v knowledge_n and_o they_o shall_v require_v the_o law_n from_o his_o mouth_n so_o you_o and_o you_o note_v beside_o a_o great_a corruption_n in_o our_o english_a which_o render_v the_o word_n the_o priest_n lip_n shall_v keep_v knowledge_n and_o they_o shall_v seek_v the_o law_n we_o need_v not_o answer_v that_o this_o text_n have_v nothing_o for_o you_o be_v it_o mean_v of_o the_o priest_n at_o rome_n if_o not_o how_o belong_v it_o to_o you_o but_o to_o the_o priest_n of_o the_o church_n ●_o what_o a_o general_a what_o then_o do_v you_o get_v by_o this_o second_o they_o keep_v knowledge_n sufficient_o for_o the_o people_n do_v they_o keep_v it_o infallible_o if_o not_o we_o be_v agree_v if_o infallible_o how_o be_v the_o priest_n tax_v in_o the_o follow_a word_n for_o not_o do_v so_o and_o if_o the_o
ut_fw-la sic_fw-la quatenus_fw-la errer_n it_o be_v false_a all_o simple_a error_n be_v not_o damnative_a to_o the_o person_n and_o therefore_o christ_n may_v be_v with_o some_o who_o live_v in_o some_o error_n indeed_o otherwise_o with_o who_o be_v he_o for_o who_o be_v there_o that_o live_v not_o in_o some_o error_n though_o he_o know_v it_o not_o if_o you_o mean_v then_o damnable_a error_n distinctive_o i_o grant_v you_o all_o and_o yet_o you_o have_v nothing_o thereby_o for_o your_o cause_n for_o this_o do_v not_o prove_v infallibility_n to_o your_o church_n security_n from_o damnable_a error_n distinctive_o take_v do_v not_o infer_v absolute_a infallibility_n the_o former_a be_v promise_v as_o also_o in_o that_o of_o saint_n john_n 14.16_o which_o you_o will_v reinforce_v here_o but_o absolute_a infallibility_n be_v not_o intend_v and_o this_o you_o must_v have_v or_o else_o you_o be_v utter_o lose_v for_o if_o the_o church_n be_v not_o infallible_a in_o all_o that_o be_v propose_v by_o it_o how_o shall_v i_o be_v assure_v of_o any_o particular_a thing_n which_o it_o propose_v if_o i_o be_v not_o assure_v of_o this_o particular_a how_o be_o i_o bind_v to_o believe_v it_o if_o i_o be_v not_o bind_v to_o believe_v it_o upon_o its_o proposal_n how_o be_v it_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n divine_a if_o it_o be_v not_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n divine_a than_o you_o be_v go_v and_o beside_o those_o promise_n in_o saint_n matthew_n and_o saint_n john_n you_o may_v know_v be_v make_v as_o to_o the_o apostle_n equal_o and_o therefore_o to_o their_o successor_n equal_o and_o to_o the_o church_n universal_a equal_o by_o consequent_a and_o therefore_o can_v you_o appropriate_v it_o to_o your_o bishop_n and_o to_o your_o church_n saint_n augustine_n authority_n in_o a_o passage_n of_o he_o wherein_o you_o say_v he_o speak_v admirable_o in_o this_o de_fw-fr utilitate_fw-la credendi_fw-la cap_n 6._o you_o have_v better_o have_v omit_v it_o strengthen_v your_o cause_n nothing_o if_o you_o quote_v it_o as_o you_o shall_v first_o it_o be_v misquote_v for_o the_o chapter_n for_o it_o be_v not_o in_o the_o 6._o chapter_n but_o in_o the_o 16._o second_o you_o may_v see_v in_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o chapter_n that_o the_o scope_n of_o it_o be_v to_o show_v how_o authority_n may_v first_o move_v to_o faith_n and_o three_o this_o scope_n may_v discover_v your_o corrupt_v of_o his_o text_n for_o it_o be_v not_o as_o you_o give_v it_o a_o certain_a step_n but_o contrary_a a_o uncertain_a step_n velut_fw-la gradu_fw-la incerto_fw-la innitentes_fw-la as_o in_o the_o froben_n edition_n ●n_n m._n d._n lxix_o whereby_o you_o may_v perceive_v how_o little_a reason_n we_o have_v to_o credit_v your_o infallibility_n and_o then_o four_o part_n of_o his_o authority_n in_o that_o chapter_n be_v by_o miracle_n of_o christ_n which_o he_o do_v himself_o on_o earth_n the_o sum_n of_o your_o four_o number_n be_v this_o to_o persuade_v not_o only_o that_o the_o church_n authority_n be_v infallible_a if_o it_o judge_v conformable_o to_o scripture_n for_o so_o even_o the_o devil_n himself_o be_v infallible_a so_o long_o as_o he_o teach_v conformable_o to_o scripture_n but_o that_o the_o church_n shall_v at_o no_o time_n teach_v any_o thing_n that_o in_o any_o damnable_a error_n shall_v be_v against_o scripture_n so_o that_o when_o we_o know_v this_o be_v her_o doctrine_n we_o be_v sure_a that_o this_o be_v conformable_a to_o the_o scripture_n right_o understand_v and_o this_o you_o will_v prove_v by_o two_o testimony_n of_o scripture_n we_o answer_v distinct_o and_o first_o to_o that_o you_o say_v about_o the_o devil_n first_o we_o be_v not_o command_v but_o forbid_v to_o consult_v with_o the_o devil_n but_o we_o be_v enjoin_v to_o consult_v with_o the_o church_n of_o god_n second_o we_o have_v cause_n always_o to_o suspect_v the_o devil_n because_o either_o he_o do_v not_o give_v we_o all_o the_o scripture_n unto_o a_o particular_a or_o do_v pervert_v it_o or_o do_v speak_v the_o truth_n with_o a_o intention_n of_o deceive_v the_o more_o but_o we_o have_v more_o charity_n towards_o the_o church_n we_o have_v none_o towards_o the_o devil_n three_o yet_o though_o we_o do_v not_o believe_v the_o devil_n in_o point_n of_o truth_n upon_o his_o authority_n nevertheless_o can_v we_o not_o believe_v the_o church_n in_o whatsoever_o it_o say_v to_o be_v true_a upon_o its_o authority_n neither_o do_v it_o follow_v that_o the_o devil_n shall_v hereupon_o be_v the_o pillar_n and_o ground_n of_o truth_n when_o he_o say_v that_o which_o be_v conformable_a to_o scripture_n as_o well_o as_o the_o church_n because_o the_o church_n do_v hold_v and_o uphold_v truth_n so_o do_v not_o the_o devil_n but_o when_o he_o use_v it_o he_o do_v it_o to_o destroy_v it_o and_o again_o we_o be_v move_v to_o think_v that_o which_o be_v propose_v by_o the_o church_n to_o be_v true_a so_o be_v we_o not_o move_v by_o the_o devil_n to_o conceive_v it_o to_o be_v true_a upon_o his_o say_n so_o and_o therefore_o if_o i_o do_v believe_v that_o which_o the_o devil_n say_v conformable_a to_o scripture_n to_o be_v true_a and_o do_v not_o believe_v that_o every_o thing_n which_o be_v say_v by_o the_o church_n to_o be_v conformable_a to_o scripture_n i_o do_v not_o make_v the_o same_o account_n of_o what_o be_v say_v by_o one_o and_o by_o the_o other_o for_o that_o which_o be_v true_a i_o do_v believe_v because_o it_o be_v se●_n though_o the_o devil_n say_v it_o i_o do_v believe_v it_o in_o respect_n to_o the_o matter_n without_o any_o respect_n to_o the_o author_n and_o that_o which_o be_v not_o true_a according_a to_o scripture_n i_o can_v believe_v though_o the_o church_n say_v it_o yet_o be_o i_o move_v by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n to_o consider_v the_o point_n more_o because_o it_o be_v propose_v by_o they_o and_o what_o be_v by_o they_o propose_v according_a to_o scripture_n i_o be_o move_v to_o believe_v of_o with_o respect_n of_o the_o author_n of_o the_o proposal_n but_o can_v be_v resolve_v in_o my_o faith_n of_o but_o by_o the_o authority_n of_o scripture_n and_o therefore_o i_o can_v believe_v that_o whatsoever_o be_v say_v by_o the_o church_n be_v agreeable_a to_o scripture_n because_o the_o church_n faith_n it_o for_o this_o proposition_n for_o aught_o as_o yet_o prove_v be_v not_o agreeable_a to_o scripture_n right_o understand_v and_o if_o you_o say_v that_o your_o church_n must_v judge_v the_o sense_n let_v it_o first_o judge_n whether_o it_o do_v not_o beg_v the_o principle_n neither_o have_v your_o text_n allege_v any_o thing_n for_o you_o not_o that_o of_o daniel_n the_o 2._o chapter_n the_o 44._o verse_n it_o respect_v indeed_o the_o kingdom_n of_o christ_n in_o general_a and_o therefore_o be_v not_o proper_a to_o any_o church_n of_o his_o signanter_n for_o any_o thing_n can_v be_v show_v by_o the_o text._n second_o the_o kingdom_n of_o christ_n principal_o respect_v the_o church_n invisible_a which_o as_o such_o be_v not_o our_o guide_n three_o it_o may_v certain_o come_v to_o its_o everlasting_a reign_n in_o heaven_n notwithstanding_o some_o error_n on_o earth_n by_o the_o church_n visible_a four_o whereas_o you_o say_v it_o shall_v destroy_v all_o idolatrous_a kingdom_n you_o do_v very_o well_o add_v in_o your_o parenthesis_n idolatrous_a kingdom_n to_o save_v yourselves_o from_o suspicion_n but_o it_o all_o idolatrous_a kingdom_n then_o have_v you_o reason_n to_o make_v your_o infallibility_n more_o strong_o infallible_a otherwise_o you_o will_v be_v include_v in_o this_o distraction_n so_o also_o that_o of_o esay_n 59.21_o profit_v you_o nothing_o some_o of_o the_o former_a answer_n may_v serve_v it_o principal_o be_v intend_v for_o the_o church_n invisible_a which_o by_o the_o church_n visible_a may_v sufficient_o be_v direct_v through_o the_o mean_n of_o grace_n to_o salvation_n infallible_o without_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n as_o the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v certain_a before_o it_o be_v write_v and_o the_o church_n then_o be_v by_o it_o direct_v because_o it_o be_v then_o in_o substance_n of_o it_o though_o not_o write_v as_o we_o have_v say_v before_o but_o you_o compel_v we_o to_o repeat_v so_o by_o the_o word_n write_v infallible_o though_o not_o infallible_o expound_v and_o apply_v by_o the_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n shall_v the_o church_n be_v bring_v to_o life_n for_o if_o every_o evil_a action_n do_v not_o destroy_v the_o state_n of_o salvation_n as_o you_o will_v confess_v then_o sure_o every_o simple_a error_n can_v because_o it_o be_v not_o voluntary_a and_o this_o be_v full_o able_a to_o answer_v your_o appendix_n to_o this_o number_n at_o the_o end_n of_o your_o paper_n those_o testimony_n if_o they_o be_v right_o cite_v yet_o in_o those_o term_n affirm_v no_o more_o than_o
catholic_n authority_n do_v commend_v both_o which_o may_v be_v do_v without_o infallibility_n for_o the_o commendation_n do_v not_o engage_v the_o judgement_n in_o assent_n necessary_a but_o the_o authority_n may_v engage_v the_o mind_n to_o have_v a_o good_a opinion_n thereof_o and_o so_o may_v move_v dispositive_o to_o faith_n five_o prepend_v it_o well_o that_o it_o be_v say_v by_o st._n austin_n that_o he_o be_v move_v by_o the_o catholic_n church_n be_v authority_n and_o that_o the_o catholic_n authority_n do_v commend_v both_o not_o the_o roman_a authority_n which_o now_o be_v include_v or_o to_o be_v include_v and_o therefore_o if_o you_o can_v prove_v that_o saint_n austin_n intend_v as_o much_o as_o you_o will_v have_v and_o also_o that_o his_o authority_n be_v sufficient_a to_o carry_v the_o cause_n for_o the_o catholic_n church_n yet_o you_o can_v have_v from_o hence_o no_o more_o than_o your_o part_n come_v to_o of_o a_o particular_a catholic_n church_n if_o indeed_o you_o be_v such_o and_o therefore_o have_v you_o upon_o your_o shoulder_n such_o a_o labour_n as_o all_o discern_a catholic_n will_v detract_v or_o retract_v namely_o to_o make_v good_a that_o whatsoever_o be_v say_v of_o the_o catholic_n church_n in_o the_o respect_n of_o it_o shall_v be_v singular_o appropriate_v to_o the_o roman_a but_o of_o this_o in_o your_o 27_o number_n whereas_o you_o seem_v to_o vaunt_v upon_o your_o paraphrase_n can_v he_o more_o clear_o say_v that_o if_o once_o in_o one_o single_a lie_n he_o shall_v find_v the_o church_n authority_n to_o be_v fallible_a he_o shall_v then_o have_v leave_v unto_o he_o no_o infallible_a ground_n at_o all_o upon_o which_o he_o be_v to_o believe_v scripture_n so_o you_o first_o i_o deny_v your_o consequence_n this_o do_v not_o follow_v from_o what_o you_o have_v urge_v that_o saint_n austin_n drive_v this_o discourse_n that_o if_o he_o shall_v find_v they_o in_o a_o lie_n he_o can_v have_v no_o infallible_a ground_n to_o believe_v scripture_n it_o follow_v well_o that_o he_o can_v not_o believe_v scripture_n by_o their_o authority_n because_o they_o have_v lead_v unto_o he_o but_o though_o they_o do_v not_o lie_v to_o he_o they_o may_v be_v fallible_a for_o they_o may_v purpose_v that_o which_o they_o think_v to_o be_v true_a for_o error_n and_o therefore_o for_o their_o not_o lie_v can_v we_o not_o infer_v their_o infallibility_n and_o for_o aught_o i_o see_v he_o do_v not_o here_o any_o way_n give_v we_o to_o understand_v that_o he_o do_v think_v they_o can_v not_o lie_v to_o he_o and_o therefore_o he_o can_v not_o conceive_v they_o upon_o this_o impossibility_n to_o be_v infallible_a as_o for_o that_o which_o you_o think_v a_o argument_n against_o i_o that_o he_o can_v not_o speak_v any_o thing_n in_o heat_n or_o by_o slip_v which_o he_o so_o much_o inculcate_n this_o be_v nothing_o effectual_a for_o how_o often_o do_v we_o with_o fervour_n endeavour_v to_o maintain_v that_o which_o once_o have_v by_o incogitance_n or_o passion_n go_v from_o we_o yea_o it_o may_v seem_v more_o likely_a because_o he_o do_v so_o much_o inculcate_v it_o because_o we_o be_v so_o eager_a to_o cover_v our_o imperfection_n and_o especial_o when_o we_o be_v like_a to_o make_v good_a use_n of_o it_o against_o a_o adversary_n second_o what_o do_v he_o inculcate_v that_o which_o you_o will_v have_v but_o this_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d as_o they_o say_v this_o be_v under_o question_n and_o therefore_o his_o inculcation_n be_v nothing_o to_o you_o if_o he_o speak_v it_o assertive_o until_o you_o fortify_v your_o supposition_n but_o one_o marginal_a note_n of_o you_o more_o at_o the_o sign_n of_o the_o cross_n i_o find_v and_o that_o be_v this_o have_v he_o say_v that_o he_o believe_v this_o or_o any_o other_o scripture_n for_o the_o light_n he_o receive_v by_o the_o read_n of_o it_o by_o which_o he_o discover_v it_o to_o be_v canonical_a than_o the_o manichaean_o may_v as_o easy_o have_v say_v that_o by_o the_o like_a light_n we_o clear_o discover_v the_o gospel_n of_o manichaeus_n to_o be_v canonical_a so_o you_o this_o be_v no_o way_n move_v much_o less_o cogent_a for_o first_o it_o proceed_v from_o a_o negative_a which_o in_o the_o kind_n of_o it_o unless_o from_o scripture_n which_o be_v the_o adequate_a rule_n be_v of_o no_o validity_n because_o he_o do_v not_o say_v so_o therefore_o he_o do_v not_o hold_v so_o no_o connexion_n second_o by_o the_o same_o reason_n i_o may_v say_v he_o do_v not_o hold_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n to_o be_v infallible_a for_o than_o he_o will_v have_v tell_v they_o so_o plain_o he_o will_v have_v make_v a_o end_n of_o the_o dispute_n without_o any_o need_n of_o use_v scripture_n three_o they_o be_v not_o prepare_v for_o this_o theological_a argument_n because_o they_o do_v not_o own_o the_o church_n and_o now_o all_o thing_n be_v due_o consider_v i_o think_v you_o have_v no_o cause_n to_o say_v that_o i_o have_v not_o sincere_o and_o full_o answer_v what_o you_o have_v have_v to_o say_v for_o yourself_o out_o of_o that_o supreme_a testimony_n of_o saint_n austin_n and_o if_o you_o compare_v that_o chapter_n with_o the_o chapter_n you_o mention_v in_o the_o same_o number_n below_o namely_o the_o five_o against_o the_o epistle_n of_o the_o manichee_n with_o the_o 14._o de_fw-fr util_fw-la cred._n against_o the_o manichee_n too_o you_o will_v not_o or_o can_v hearty_o dislike_v my_o answer_n and_o therefore_o need_v i_o not_o distinct_o to_o answer_v this_o last_o since_o here_o also_o he_o do_v not_o compare_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n with_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n which_o be_v our_o main_a question_n but_o he_o compare_v with_o the_o authority_n of_o those_o few_o those_o turbulent_a those_o new_a man_n as_o he_o speak_v who_o be_v not_o like_a to_o bring_v forth_o any_o thing_n which_o any_o without_o doubt_n may_v not_o think_v not_o worthy_a of_o authority_n the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n as_o to_o the_o believe_a of_o christ_n where_o also_o he_o say_v that_o he_o be_v move_v by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o catholic_n quorum_fw-la autoritate_fw-la commotus_fw-la christum_fw-la aliquid_fw-la utile_fw-la praecepisse_fw-la jam_fw-la credidi_fw-la whereby_o you_o shall_v if_o you_o will_v see_v the_o reasonableness_n of_o the_o former_a criticism_n because_o here_o he_o say_v jam_fw-la credidi_fw-la so_o that_o it_o must_v refer_v to_o to_o he_o as_o a_o manichee_n and_o therefore_o can_v you_o not_o with_o saint_n austin_n believe_v the_o whole_a scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n from_o the_o begin_n to_o the_o end_n as_o upon_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n because_o if_o he_o do_v yet_o can_v you_o do_v it_o which_o be_v not_o to_o be_v do_v and_o if_o it_o be_v to_o be_v do_v because_o he_o do_v it_o than_o it_o be_v not_o to_o be_v do_v because_o he_o do_v it_o not_o and_o i_o hope_v those_o strange_a story_n and_o those_o several_a point_n which_o you_o speak_v to_o be_v in_o scripture_n may_v be_v more_o like_a to_o be_v believe_v upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o scripture_n then_o upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n since_o the_o church_n have_v no_o authority_n but_o from_o scripture_n not_o as_o a_o church_n and_o therefore_o if_o you_o have_v no_o other_o infallible_a ground_n for_o prayer_n to_o saint_n and_o prayer_n for_o the_o dead_a in_o your_o sense_n and_o other_o like_a point_n than_o you_o have_v prove_v he_o go_v upon_o as_o towards_o the_o believe_a of_o scripture_n you_o have_v none_o nay_o you_o have_v not_o so_o good_a authority_n for_o those_o and_o such_o like_a point_n as_o he_o have_v for_o the_o belief_n of_o the_o scripture_n for_o beside_o the_o difference_n of_o the_o matter_n he_o have_v catholic_n authority_n for_o his_o belief_n though_o the_o authority_n be_v not_o infallible_a but_o you_o have_v not_o catholic_n authority_n for_o your_o point_n though_o fallible_a but_o i_o observe_v your_o wisdom_n you_o will_v justify_v your_o point_n here_o by_o infallibility_n which_o you_o think_v may_v be_v more_o likely_a then_o to_o justify_v your_o infallibility_n by_o your_o point_n of_o difference_n therefore_o your_o conditional_a postulate_v may_v have_v be_v spare_v until_o the_o condition_n be_v prove_v if_o saint_n austin_n have_v do_v so_o as_o you_o suppose_v than_o you_o or_o your_o church_n will_v have_v be_v more_o excuse_v from_o singularity_n because_o you_o have_v follow_v he_o as_o for_o you_o you_o need_v not_o fear_v singularity_n you_o provide_v against_o that_o in_o your_o opinion_n or_o your_o master_n for_o you_o for_o you_o must_v follow_v the_o church_n without_o examination_n of_o what_o they_o say_v their_o word_n must_v be_v take_v but_o yet_o your_o church_n may_v be_v accuse_v
may_v gain_v more_o credit_n to_o their_o error_n by_o holiness_n of_o life_n as_o socinus_n and_o other_o you_o come_v then_o to_o refute_v my_o argument_n first_o it_o be_v so_o far_o from_o be_v contrary_a from_o that_o text_n you_o err_v not_o know_v the_o scripture_n that_o it_o be_v most_o agreeable_a to_o it_o for_o a_o most_o fit_a way_n to_o err_v against_o the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o scripture_n be_v to_o permit_v such_o and_o a_o great_a number_n of_o such_o man_n to_o interpret_v scripture_n as_o be_v most_o fit_a to_o err_v in_o the_o interpretation_n of_o they_o and_o be_v this_o a_o good_a refutation_n and_o therefore_o the_o meaning_n of_o our_o saviour_n must_v be_v according_a to_o your_o use_n they_o err_v because_o they_o have_v the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o scripture_n which_o they_o misinterpret_v shift_v you_o how_o you_o will_v you_o can_v evade_v be_v the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o scripture_n the_o cause_n of_o their_o error_n no_o that_o be_v contrary_a to_o our_o saviour_n who_o say_v you_o err_v not_o know_v the_o scripture_n be_v it_o necessary_a that_o those_o who_o do_v know_v the_o scripture_n shall_v misinterpret_v they_o no_o for_o then_o that_o will_n by_o a_o recideration_n come_v into_o the_o same_o inconvenience_n for_o then_o the_o knowledge_n will_v be_v a_o certain_a mean_v at_o least_o in_o a_o large_a sense_n of_o this_o misinterpretation_n and_o so_o it_o will_v be_v our_o best_a way_n to_o know_v nothing_o of_o scripture_n that_o so_o we_o may_v not_o err_v 3._o can_v we_o imagine_v that_o our_o saviour_n christ_n discourse_v as_o you_o do_v that_o because_o by_o our_o fault_n the_o scripture_n be_v a_o occasion_n of_o misinterpretation_n therefore_o the_o people_n shall_v not_o common_o use_v they_o be_v this_o symbolical_a to_o the_o sense_n of_o our_o saviour_n word_n you_o err_v not_o know_v the_o scripture_n 4._o our_o saviour_n then_o by_o you_o rebuke_n their_o misinterpretation_n then_o he_o will_v have_v they_o know_v the_o scripture_n better_o not_o have_v the_o people_n deprive_v of_o they_o 5._o there_o be_v a_o double_a knowledge_n as_o to_o this_o purpose_n 1._o a_o habitual_a knowledge_n which_o be_v chief_o of_o the_o principle_n in_o scripture_n this_o they_o have_v in_o their_o mind_n then_o there_o be_v a_o actual_a knowledge_n which_o consist_v in_o a_o application_n of_o those_o principle_n to_o particular_a conclusion_n of_o belief_n and_o practice_n they_o be_v want_v it_o seem_v in_o the_o late_a in_o that_o they_o do_v not_o so_o as_o they_o shall_v consider_v that_o text_n in_o moses_n which_o our_o saviour_n make_v use_v of_o for_o the_o resurrection_n they_o may_v have_v infer_v the_o resurrection_n from_o that_o text_n and_o so_o not_o have_v err_v therefore_o have_v they_o more_o need_v to_o look_v over_o the_o scripture_n again_o and_o consider_v they_o better_o the_o say_n of_o the_o jew_n be_v good_a he_o that_o read_v a_o book_n a_o hundred_o time_n be_v not_o like_o he_o that_o read_v it_o a_o hundred_o time_n and_o one_o the_o often_o we_o read_v it_o especial_o the_o bible_n the_o more_o we_o see_v in_o it_o but_o you_o bring_v a_o corroboration_n of_o your_o answer_n special_o be_v license_v to_o cross_v all_o antiquity_n and_o all_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n if_o they_o stand_v in_o their_o way_n sir_n this_o will_v not_o do_v 1._o we_o licence_v they_o not_o to_o cross_v all_o antiquity_n &_o we_o need_v not_o give_v they_o such_o a_o direction_n and_o sure_o if_o they_o shall_v you_o will_v have_v no_o cause_n to_o blame_v they_o we_o have_v liberty_n to_o use_v that_o of_o the_o philosopher_n in_o his_o rhet._n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d do_v you_o look_v to_o that_o who_o contradict_v god_n and_o father_n and_o doctor_n 2._o they_o can_v intend_v sure_o the_o cross_n of_o all_o antiquity_n for_o certain_o they_o do_v not_o know_v all_o antiquity_n yea_o if_o you_o speak_v all_o antiquity_n with_o a_o full_a universality_n there_o be_v few_o of_o your_o own_o learned_a man_n that_o know_v it_o and_o therefore_o if_o any_o of_o their_o interpretation_n do_v cross_v antiquity_n it_o do_v but_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d it_o be_v but_o by_o accident_n and_o in_o thing_n necessary_a they_o be_v not_o so_o like_a to_o do_v so_o 3._o who_o be_v there_o of_o all_o your_o man_n that_o have_v prove_v this_o proposition_n that_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o father_n suppose_v make_v a_o argument_n of_o divine_a faith_n therefore_o though_o we_o love_v their_o company_n yet_o we_o desire_v to_o see_v our_o way_n but_o object_n to_o we_o nothing_o but_o that_o which_o be_v proper_a how_o shall_v your_o man_n know_v that_o what_o they_o hold_v do_v not_o cross_v all_o antiquity_n the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n give_v they_o neither_o faith_n of_o it_o nor_o knowledge_n yea_o some_o of_o you_o say_v omnes_fw-la patres_fw-la sic_fw-la ego_fw-la autem_fw-la non_fw-la sic_fw-la you_o go_v on_o and_o i_o wonder_v why_o you_o call_v this_o your_o manner_n of_o proceed_v the_o knowledge_n of_o the_o scripture_n etc._n etc._n unto_o second_o ans_fw-fr you_o make_v yourself_o sport_n with_o the_o ambiguity_n of_o the_o word_n knowledge_n you_o mean_v it_o by_o way_n of_o a_o science_n as_o physic_n we_o do_v not_o say_v that_o tradesman_n make_v any_o knowledge_n of_o divinity_n so_o as_o to_o give_v a_o account_n of_o the_o principle_n of_o divinity_n in_o the_o body_n of_o it_o no_o but_o they_o may_v have_v a_o knowledge_n of_o scripture_n sufficient_a for_o their_o use_n although_o they_o do_v not_o teach_v other_o as_o if_o there_o be_v plain_a principle_n of_o physic_n in_o our_o language_n we_o may_v make_v use_v they_o for_o ourselves_o as_o tiberius_n say_v after_o thirty_o year_n of_o age_n he_o will_v laugh_v at_o those_o who_o do_v need_v a_o physician_n you_o be_v deceive_v then_o or_o will_v deceive_v in_o the_o fallacy_n of_o consequent_a though_o all_o science_n be_v knowledge_n all_o knowledge_n be_v not_o science_n for_o knowledge_n be_v more_o general_a and_o therefore_o sure_o of_o itself_o do_v not_o infer_v the_o most_o perfect_a species_n you_o say_v second_o you_o in_o vain_a object_n that_o of_o st._n paul_n that_o the_o scripture_n be_v able_a to_o make_v we_o wise_a unto_o salvation_n etc._n etc._n unto_o three_o wherein_o you_o allow_v the_o truth_n of_o the_o text_n with_o your_o gloss_n namely_o not_o as_o they_o be_v interpret_v by_o every_o giddy_a fancy_n but_o by_o tim._n who_o do_v continue_v in_o the_o thing_n which_o he_o learned_a and_o have_v be_v assure_v of_o by_o oral_a tradition_n ans_fw-fr 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d what_o will_v you_o get_v by_o this_o answer_n if_o you_o understand_v by_o oral_a tradition_n such_o doctrine_n of_o the_o gospel_n which_o be_v first_o preach_v afterward_o write_v we_o grant_v you_o the_o use_n of_o such_o oral_a tradition_n but_o this_o boot_v you_o not_o for_o you_o must_v have_v tradition_n in_o point_n of_o faith_n beside_o what_o be_v write_v and_o such_o we_o deny_v unto_o you_o that_o timothy_n have_v and_o i_o prove_v my_o denial_n by_o your_o own_o word_n for_o how_o can_v timothy_n understand_v scripture_n by_o what_o be_v beside_o scripture_n you_o speak_v of_o his_o understanding_n the_o scripture_n by_o tradition_n tradition_n of_o proper_a name_n be_v that_o which_o be_v beside_o scripture_n in_o the_o matter_n of_o it_o and_o how_o can_v he_o by_o that_o which_o be_v different_a in_o matter_n understand_v the_o scripture_n if_o you_o mean_v by_o oral_a tradition_n some_o traditive_a interpretation_n as_o learned_a man_n call_v they_o of_o the_o more_o difficult_a passage_n of_o scripture_n this_o indeed_o be_v more_o reasonable_a in_o the_o hypothesis_n as_o to_o timothy_n but_o this_o be_v nothing_o to_o we_o unless_o you_o can_v tell_v we_o certain_o how_o many_o and_o what_o they_o be_v if_o there_o be_v such_o and_o lose_v than_o your_o church_n be_v lose_v 2._o again_o we_o allow_v no_o giddy_a fancy_n to_o define_v the_o sense_n of_o scripture_n but_o in_o thing_n necessary_a and_o plain_a their_o own_o knowledge_n may_v be_v sufficient_a and_o their_o private_a judgement_n may_v be_v as_o safe_o exercise_v in_o the_o sense_n thereof_o as_o in_o the_o choice_n of_o your_o religion_n but_o three_o by_o your_o own_o word_n i_o will_v conclude_v against_o you_o a_o fortiori_fw-la for_o if_o the_o scripture_n be_v able_a to_o make_v timothy_n wise_a who_o be_v a_o teacher_n much_o more_o other_o since_o as_o mr._n cressy_n and_o you_o afterward_o affirm_v there_o be_v more_o requisite_a to_o a_o minister_n to_o be_v believe_v than_o other_o if_o then_o they_o be_v able_a to_o make_v a_o minister_n wise_a unto_o salvation_n than_o one_o of_o the_o people_n much_o more_o who_o according_a
put_v in_o such_o word_n as_o i_o know_v how_o to_o answer_v and_o leave_v out_o his_o true_a word_n i_o alter_v no_o word_n but_o expound_v he_o in_o they_o as_o i_o have_v reason_n for_o if_o every_o one_o may_v be_v leave_v free_a without_o such_o a_o judge_n to_o what_o he_o judge_v best_a this_o freedom_n will_v be_v simple_a or_o moral_a if_o simple_a than_o it_o will_v be_v without_o a_o fault_n and_o if_o moral_a it_o will_v be_v without_o a_o fault_n but_o now_o he_o deny_v that_o he_o mean_v a_o moral_a freedom_n yet_o be_v it_o best_o for_o he_o to_o understand_v such_o a_o freedom_n according_a to_o his_o principle_n for_o if_o we_o have_v not_o a_o moral_a freedom_n without_o a_o fault_n to_o believe_v what_o we_o judge_v best_a then_o have_v we_o less_o reason_n of_o give_v undisputed_a assent_n to_o a_o external_a judge_n since_o we_o be_v awe_v and_o command_v under_o peril_n of_o a_o fault_n to_o take_v heed_n what_o we_o do_v believe_v and_o therefore_o can_v we_o believe_v this_o judge_n with_o blind_a obedience_n because_o it_o seem_v now_o we_o may_v not_o believe_v what_o we_o will_v but_o we_o must_v see_v good_a reason_n for_o what_o we_o do_v believe_v and_o good_a reason_n it_o be_v that_o good_a reason_n shall_v exclude_v blind_a obedience_n and_o indeed_o his_o consequence_n be_v false_a in_o terminis_fw-la for_o we_o have_v not_o a_o simple_a freedom_n to_o believe_v what_o we_o will_v as_o i_o say_v because_o the_o understanding_n natural_o assent_v to_o truth_n apparent_a but_o this_o he_o take_v no_o notice_n of_o as_o if_o i_o have_v say_v no_o such_o thing_n how_o much_o of_o my_o word_n he_o take_v away_o privative_o which_o must_v infer_v a_o variation_n of_o my_o sense_n may_v be_v gather_v by_o compare_n of_o my_o copy_n with_o his_o rehearsal_n and_o it_o appear_v that_o negative_o he_o have_v take_v away_o a_o great_a part_n of_o my_o word_n for_o he_o say_v to_o they_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o so_o his_o argument_n be_v null_a and_o his_o vindication_n nullify_v only_o i_o must_v also_o note_v that_o he_o do_v not_o well_o weigh_v his_o own_o consequence_n if_o every_o man_n be_v leave_v free_a to_o hold_v what_o he_o judge_v best_a we_o shall_v have_v as_o many_o religion_n as_o private_a judgement_n for_o in_o principle_n of_o religion_n we_o be_v not_o like_a to_o differ_v if_o we_o believe_v the_o scripture_n and_o particular_a controversy_n which_o you_o direct_v your_o discourse_n to_o if_o you_o speak_v ad_fw-la idem_fw-la if_o not_o you_o be_v more_o to_o be_v blame_v do_v not_o make_v different_a religion_n because_o than_o you_o must_v have_v different_a religion_n among_o yourselves_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o this_o number_n my_o adversary_n will_v fain_o take_v i_o trip_v or_o enterfear_v upon_o my_o own_o word_n by_o a_o consequence_n 4._o num._n 4._o because_o as_o he_o think_v i_o take_v away_o all_o mean_n of_o regulate_v our_o judgement_n and_o yet_o say_v we_o shall_v not_o follow_v our_o own_o judgement_n of_o discretion_n without_o mean_n of_o regulate_v our_o judgement_n ans_fw-fr his_o reason_n may_v well_o be_v put_v into_o this_o form_n he_o that_o take_v away_o all_o infallible_a mean_n take_v away_o all_o mean_n able_a to_o produce_v a_o infallible_a assent_n but_o i_o take_v away_o all_o infallible_a mean_n then_o i_o deny_v his_o assumption_n i_o do_v not_o deny_v all_o infallible_a mean_n i_o do_v not_o deny_v all_o mean_n because_o i_o deny_v some_o to_o be_v infallible_a and_o i_o do_v not_o deny_v all_o infallible_a mean_n because_o i_o deny_v some_o that_o he_o think_v infallible_a in_o both_o he_o will_v impose_v upon_o i_o the_o fallacy_n 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d or_o a_o particulari_fw-la all_o mean_n be_v not_o infallible_a and_o there_o may_v be_v and_o be_v other_o infallible_a mean_n beside_o those_o which_o he_o suppose_v and_o i_o deny_v the_o scripture_n be_v a_o infallible_a mean_n to_o hold_v to_o this_o i_o deny_v the_o infallibility_n of_o council_n and_o then_o again_o second_o i_o deny_v a_o necessity_n of_o infallible_a assent_n to_o all_o point_n of_o question_n either_o part_n of_o the_o contradiction_n may_v consist_v with_o salvation_n for_o corroboration_n of_o his_o opinion_n about_o the_o infallibility_n of_o council_n he_o bring_v in_o afterward_o st._n gregory_n the_o great_a be_v say_n i_o do_v profess_v myself_o to_o reverence_v the_o first_o four_o council_n as_o i_o reverence_v the_o four_o book_n of_o the_o gospel_n and_o in_o like_a manner_n i_o do_v receive_v the_o five_o council_n whosoever_o be_v of_o another_o mind_n let_v he_o be_v a_o anathema_n ans_fw-fr first_o we_o do_v not_o think_v the_o judgement_n of_o st._n gregory_n to_o be_v great_a than_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o four_o council_n if_o we_o do_v not_o think_v they_o infallible_a we_o have_v no_o cause_n or_o reason_n to_o be_v urge_v with_o one_o gregory_n second_o we_o also_o reverence_v the_o learning_n of_o that_o gregory_n as_o he_o reverence_v the_o book_n of_o the_o gospel_n if_o the_o as_o be_v take_v in_o similitude_n not_o proportion_n in_o the_o quality_n not_o equality_n three_o if_o the_o opinion_n of_o st._n gregory_n shall_v prevail_v with_o i_o why_o do_v not_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o father_n who_o i_o produce_v for_o our_o cause_n and_o the_o answer_v i_o give_v to_o his_o authority_n before_o prevail_v with_o he_o testem_fw-la quem_fw-la quis_fw-la inducit_fw-la pro_fw-la se_fw-la tenetur_fw-la recipere_fw-la contra_fw-la se_fw-la four_o let_v we_o mark_v his_o own_o word_n and_o i_o also_o receive_v the_o five_o council_n in_o like_a manner_n now_o the_o five_o council_n be_v that_o of_o constantinople_n wherein_o vigilius_n be_v condemn_v in_o his_o defence_n of_o the_o three_o chapter_n and_o the_o council_n proceed_v without_o his_o consent_n yea_o and_o against_o his_o mind_n so_o that_o if_o st._n gregory_n authority_n be_v authentic_a the_o cause_n be_v spoil_v for_o so_o infallibility_n shall_v not_o be_v state_v in_o a_o council_n with_o the_o pope_n confirmation_n five_o oppose_v and_o confront_v gregory_n with_o gregory_n nazianzen_n with_o the_o roman_a and_o which_o of_o they_o shall_v we_o believe_v for_o council_n neither_o do_v the_o whole_a machine_n of_o our_o religion_n tople_n and_o tumble_v to_o the_o ground_n upon_o my_o former_a principle_n as_o he_o imagine_v though_o he_o will_v press_v i_o more_o strong_o to_o show_v upon_o what_o authority_n i_o take_v scripture_n by_o a_o infallible_a assent_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n this_o by_o the_o way_n shall_v not_o have_v be_v bring_v into_o question_n with_o we_o since_o we_o give_v more_o reverence_n to_o the_o scripture_n than_o they_o do_v and_o therefore_o be_v like_a to_o have_v a_o firm_a faith_n in_o it_o to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n than_o they_o the_o main_a design_n of_o my_o adversary_n at_o first_o i_o suppose_v be_v to_o debate_v the_o faith_n of_o particular_a point_n the_o scripture_n be_v suppose_v to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n although_o not_o suppose_v by_o he_o to_o be_v the_o only_a rule_n but_o therefore_o let_v i_o return_v his_o own_o word_n change_v the_o table_n that_o the_o whole_a machine_n of_o his_o religion_n do_v tople_n and_o tumble_v to_o the_o ground_n upon_o his_o ground_n by_o press_v he_o to_o show_v by_o what_o authority_n he_o take_v scripture_n by_o a_o infallible_a assent_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n before_o he_o have_v prove_v the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n his_o reason_n follow_v because_o there_o can_v be_v a_o more_o groundless_a ground_n upon_o which_o you_o by_o reject_v the_o infallible_a authority_n of_o the_o church_n be_v force_v to_o build_v your_o whole_a religion_n to_o wit_n that_o you_o by_o mere_a read_n of_o scripture_n can_v by_o its_o light_n as_o you_o discover_v the_o sun_n by_o its_o light_n discover_v it_o so_o manifest_o to_o be_v the_o undoubted_a word_n of_o god_n that_o this_o discovery_n suffice_v to_o ground_v your_o infallible_a assent_n to_o that_o verity_n ans_fw-fr first_o he_o be_v not_o sure_o right_a in_o this_o that_o i_o be_o force_v by_o reject_v his_o way_n of_o believe_a scripture_n to_o this_o way_n if_o he_o be_v than_o i_o be_o right_a in_o the_o choice_n of_o my_o principle_n upon_o my_o refusal_n of_o he_o but_o mr._n chillingworth_n who_o he_o blame_v i_o for_o differ_v from_o in_o this_o point_n do_v find_v as_o it_o may_v seem_v and_o as_o he_o himself_o profess_v a_o middle_a way_n of_o ground_v faith_n in_o the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n namely_o by_o the_o authority_n of_o universal_a tradition_n which_o as_o any_o can_v distinguish_v from_o this_o way_n so_o he_o do_v distinguish_v from_o the_o pontifician_n
blessing_n may_v be_v like_a to_o pitch_v upon_o that_o true_a sense_n of_o scripture_n which_o may_v determine_v the_o judgement_n unto_o certain_a assent_n as_o by_o the_o conflict_n of_o hard_a thing_n spark_n of_o fire_n do_v break_v out_o so_o by_o the_o industrious_a discussion_n of_o opinion_n truth_n may_v appear_v eminent_o but_o we_o can_v conclude_v the_o definition_n intuitive_o and_o ipso_fw-la facto_fw-la infallible_a and_o why_o shall_v we_o be_v oblige_v to_o stand_v to_o their_o declaration_n of_o truth_n as_o if_o they_o do_v also_o make_v it_o to_o be_v truth_n and_o why_o shall_v we_o stand_v to_o their_o conclusion_n when_o their_o discourse_n be_v fallible_a unless_o they_o go_v by_o scripture_n and_o if_o they_o by_o scripture_n examine_v opinion_n why_o shall_v not_o we_o by_o scripture_n examine_v their_o definition_n as_o to_o ourselves_o which_o shall_v be_v last_o in_o the_o determination_n council_n or_o scripture_n when_o council_n begin_v by_o it_o and_o determine_v with_o it_o therefore_o i_o do_v not_o make_v they_o in_o no_o sense_n final_a or_o none_o that_o which_o follow_v now_o sure_o it_o be_v clear_a etc._n etc._n unto_o the_o end_n of_o the_o number_n how_o little_a strength_n of_o reason_n have_v it_o this_o in_o effect_n be_v answer_v immediate_o before_o my_o adversary_n do_v we_o right_o in_o confess_v our_o acknowledgement_n of_o the_o first_o four_o general_n council_n and_o also_o may_v we_o confess_v that_o we_o think_v they_o think_v they_o have_v all_o plenitude_n of_o power_n and_o authority_n from_o god_n to_o define_v and_o final_o to_o determine_v those_o controversy_n but_o what_o then_o 1._o what_o if_o they_o think_v so_o we_o have_v liberty_n by_o our_o principle_n to_o think_v that_o inconcludent_a because_o we_o hold_v they_o not_o infallible_a in_o their_o judgement_n not_o because_o they_o think_v they_o have_v such_o power_n therefore_o they_o have_v it_o unless_o we_o shall_v hold_v they_o infallible_a as_o we_o do_v not_o neither_o be_v this_o thought_n of_o we_o that_o they_o may_v think_v amiss_o of_o such_o power_n to_o be_v in_o they_o any_o prejudice_n to_o our_o acknowledgement_n of_o those_o first_o four_o general_n council_n because_o this_o opinion_n of_o they_o be_v no_o part_n of_o their_o determination_n second_o we_o distinguish_v all_o plenitude_n of_o power_n be_v take_v either_o reduplicative_o or_o specificative_o for_o all_o that_o power_n which_o belong_v to_o the_o whole_a church_n the_o former_a if_o their_o opinion_n of_o themselves_o be_v infallible_a will_v serve_v his_o turn_n but_o we_o deny_v that_o they_o think_v they_o have_v all_o power_n so_o and_o if_o they_o do_v think_v so_o we_o think_v they_o do_v not_o think_v right_a the_o latter_a power_n they_o may_v think_v they_o have_v and_o not_o think_v amiss_o but_o this_o serve_v not_o the_o turn_n for_o all_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n do_v not_o bind_v we_o to_o receive_v the_o definition_n thereof_o so_o as_o to_o sink_v all_o examination_n of_o the_o truth_n thereof_o by_o scripture_n have_v not_o other_o court_v a_o plenitude_n of_o power_n to_o hear_v and_o determine_v cause_n and_o yet_o be_v sometime_o defective_a in_o point_n of_o law_n their_o fallibility_n do_v not_o proceed_v from_o want_n of_o power_n or_o authority_n but_o from_o want_n of_o judgement_n or_o will_n to_o give_v a_o right_a sentence_n and_o yet_o their_o censure_n also_o proceed_v and_o therefore_o the_o excommunication_n which_o my_o adversary_n object_n to_o i_o may_v neither_o import_v their_o faith_n of_o their_o infallibility_n nor_o yet_o wrong_a to_o all_o such_o as_o shall_v gainsay_v what_o they_o have_v define_v and_o determine_v if_o error_n and_o falsity_n and_o contradiction_n to_o scripture_n can_v be_v find_v in_o their_o definition_n and_o determination_n for_o first_o it_o be_v not_o fallibilitie_n of_o sentence_n that_o do_v the_o wrong_n but_o falsity_n either_o by_o ignorance_n and_o so_o ignorantia_fw-la in_o judice_fw-la reputatur_fw-la pro_fw-la dolo_fw-la or_o else_o by_o wilfulness_n which_o formal_o make_v the_o injury_n because_o intend_v second_o the_o excommunication_n proceed_v against_o the_o person_n for_o a_o outward_a act_n of_o obstinacy_n and_o not_o for_o a_o dissent_n of_o judgement_n for_o cogitationis_fw-la poenam_fw-la in_o nostro_fw-la foro_fw-la nemo_fw-la luit_fw-la so_o then_o there_o be_v no_o wrong_n to_o he_o that_o gainsay_v by_o excommunication_n for_o that_o simple_o he_o may_v keep_v his_o judgement_n and_o also_o three_o the_o judge_n though_o he_o judge_v not_o well_o yet_o may_v do_v well_o if_o he_o judge_v with_o competent_a knowledge_n and_o due_a integrity_n and_o therefore_o be_v it_o no_o injury_n if_o he_o do_v his_o best_a since_o god_n have_v not_o think_v fit_a on_o the_o behalf_n of_o public_a peace_n to_o disannul_v humane_a judicature_n for_o humane_a infirmity_n his_o answer_n to_o my_o instance_n of_o the_o berean_o who_o search_v the_o scripture_n daily_o to_o see_v whether_o that_o which_o st._n paul_n say_v be_v true_a my_o adversary_n do_v refer_v to_o another_o chapter_n we_o stay_v his_o leisure_n whereas_o you_o add_v fourthly_a 6._o num._n 6._o that_o the_o decision_n of_o the_o church_n though_o unprovided_a of_o infallibility_n do_v yet_o oblige_v unto_o peace_n though_o their_o judgement_n can_v claim_v a_o undisputed_a assent_n yet_o the_o power_n they_o have_v from_o christ_n do_v require_v a_o undisturbance_n in_o the_o difference_n you_o teach_v by_o word_n what_o the_o deed_n of_o your_o glorious_a reformer_n have_v notorious_o gainsay_v to_o this_o it_o be_v ready_o answer_v that_o reformer_n may_v be_v glorious_a as_o to_o the_o general_a effect_n though_o it_o be_v possible_a for_o they_o to_o be_v extravagant_a in_o modo_fw-la sober_a business_n may_v be_v manage_v with_o too_o much_o heat_n second_o whereas_o he_o suppose_v that_o our_o glorious_a reformer_n do_v notorious_o gainsay_v the_o whole_a church_n i_o deny_v it_o and_o if_o they_o do_v not_o gainsay_v the_o whole_a church_n it_o do_v not_o come_v home_o to_o his_o purpose_n for_o he_o be_v upon_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n they_o do_v gainsay_v the_o roman_a church_n but_o not_o the_o whole_a church_n that_o which_o st._n jerom_n say_v in_o his_o epistle_n to_o evagrius_n be_v yet_o for_o our_o use_n si_fw-la authoritas_fw-la queritur_fw-la orbis_fw-la major_n est_fw-la urbe_fw-la if_o authority_n be_v look_v after_o the_o world_n be_v great_a than_o a_o city_n which_o be_v also_o speak_v in_o application_n to_o rome_n and_o put_v case_n there_o be_v no_o sort_n of_o christian_n that_o do_v not_o profess_v obedience_n to_o the_o roman_a church_n when_o those_o glorious_a reformer_n do_v first_o appear_v yet_o it_o can_v be_v rational_o say_v by_o the_o romanist_n that_o they_o do_v gainsay_v the_o whole_a church_n because_o the_o romanist_n do_v take_v the_o root_n of_o his_o church_n from_o the_o primitive_a time_n which_o those_o reformer_n do_v not_o gainsay_v so_o then_o as_o we_o deny_v to_o they_o that_o they_o be_v all_o the_o whole_a church_n when_o the_o reformer_n do_v begin_v so_o if_o they_o have_v it_o will_v be_v nothing_o as_o to_o the_o gainsay_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n because_o the_o whole_a church_n in_o their_o sense_n do_v include_v all_o time_n and_o special_o the_o primitive_a which_o they_o do_v not_o contradict_v and_o sure_o if_o the_o romanist_n prove_v his_o church_n by_o conformity_n to_o the_o primitive_a otherwise_o he_o have_v the_o less_o reason_n for_o himself_o then_o must_v he_o interpretative_o grant_v that_o there_o be_v more_o authority_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n than_o of_o that_o present_a roman_a and_o so_o then_o if_o the_o reformer_n gainsay_v not_o the_o primitive_a they_o gainsay_v not_o the_o catholic_n in_o the_o best_a part_n of_o it_o for_o time_n and_o that_o also_o which_o the_o present_a roman_a do_v most_o as_o they_o say_v depend_v upon_o three_o therefore_o we_o do_v not_o take_v our_o religion_n from_o those_o reformer_n as_o be_v wear_v into_o their_o word_n and_o therefore_o we_o do_v not_o impropriate_a christianity_n by_o any_o singular_a person_n we_o may_v take_v hint_n from_o they_o to_o consider_v those_o doctrine_n which_o they_o preach_v and_o confer_v they_o with_o antiquity_n and_o scripture_n we_o believe_v they_o to_o be_v apostolical_a and_o so_o be_v our_o church_n by_o tertullian_n rule_n in_o his_o book_n of_o prescription_n ch_n 32._o in_o eadem_fw-la fide_fw-la conspirantes_fw-la non_fw-la minus_fw-la apostolicae_fw-la deputantur_fw-la pro_fw-la consanguinitate_fw-la doctrinae_fw-la those_o church_n that_o conspire_v in_o the_o faith_n be_v not_o less_o account_v apostolical_a for_o the_o consanguinity_n of_o doctrine_n four_o those_o reformer_n even_o according_a to_o my_o adversary_n principle_n do_v not_o oppose_v themselves_o to_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n because_o according_a to_o
reason_n may_v this_o be_v call_v the_o pontifician_n use_v plenty_n of_o the_o father_n against_o we_o therefore_o he_o will_v not_o answer_v to_o my_o testimony_n from_o they_o nor_o to_o my_o answer_n to_o his_o testimony_n against_o we_o do_v any_o of_o those_o pontifician_n full_o answer_v my_o testimony_n and_o do_v they_o sufficient_o take_v off_o my_o answer_n if_o they_o do_v he_o shall_v have_v tell_v i_o which_o and_o where_o but_o be_v i_o as_o apt_a to_o brag_v as_o the_o roman_n be_v i_o may_v not_o be_v far_o from_o cry_v victoria_fw-la that_o i_o shall_v stand_v to_o answer_v the_o father_n and_o bring_v they_o to_o stand_v for_o we_o though_o my_o adversary_n say_v i_o bring_v they_o to_o less_o than_o nothing_o and_o yet_o he_o that_o make_v so_o much_o of_o they_o in_o show_n shall_v detract_v this_o way_n of_o plea_n by_o they_o whereas_o their_o small_a error_n use_v present_o to_o be_v discover_v and_o cry_v down_o this_o be_v not_o altogether_o true_a for_o how_o many_o of_o their_o error_n continue_v long_o yea_o great_a error_n also_o as_o the_o millenarie_a opinion_n and_o infant_n communion_n be_v not_o present_o decree_v neither_o therefore_o yet_o it_o remain_v to_o be_v prove_v that_o any_o of_o the_o point_n of_o difference_n betwixt_o the_o papist_n and_o we_o be_v a_o stand_a opinion_n of_o the_o primitive_a time_n which_o my_o adversary_n will_v insinuate_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d and_o it_o will_v make_v a_o learned_a man_n amaze_v to_o ask_v as_o you_o do_v how_o few_o of_o they_o have_v touch_v upon_o our_o difference_n ans_fw-fr there_o be_v no_o such_o cause_n of_o amazement_n learned_a man_n in_o general_a wonder_n less_o and_o learned_a man_n can_v wonder_v particular_o at_o this_o as_o know_v the_o reason_n which_o be_v add_v by_o i_o have_v not_o occasion_n by_o adversary_n and_o therefore_o do_v my_o adversary_n wise_o pass_v by_o any_o mention_n of_o the_o reason_n as_o not_o be_v pertinent_a for_o his_o use_n but_o also_o be_v that_o i_o say_v well_o guard_v first_o how_o few_o i_o do_v not_o say_v none_o second_o i_o say_v touch_v namely_o as_o to_o handle_v and_o this_o be_v necessary_a to_o be_v believe_v because_o indeed_o there_o be_v few_o of_o they_o argumentative_a then_o though_o some_o of_o they_o may_v put_v out_o occasional_o some_o expression_n relate_v to_o our_o difference_n yet_o be_v not_o this_o to_o touch_v argumentative_o our_o difference_n for_o aliud_fw-la agentis_fw-la parva_fw-la autoritas_fw-la as_o the_o rule_n be_v and_o then_o three_o if_o many_o of_o they_o at_o least_o do_v not_o touch_v so_o as_o to_o handle_v discursive_o all_o our_o difference_n there_o be_v no_o cause_n of_o admire_v my_o speech_n for_o if_o they_o have_v handle_v some_o not_o all_o how_o shall_v we_o have_v be_v direct_v in_o those_o which_o they_o have_v not_o handle_v now_o then_o let_v all_o be_v consider_v then_o upon_o the_o whole_a matter_n let_v i_o say_v this_o that_o if_o any_o pontifician_n can_v prove_v that_o many_o of_o they_o do_v handle_v argumentative_o all_o the_o point_n of_o debate_n betwixt_o we_o than_o i_o shall_v give_v leave_n for_o the_o amazement_n of_o my_o expression_n therefore_o as_o to_o the_o author_n he_o produce_v of_o his_o side_n who_o give_v account_n of_o the_o father_n in_o our_o difference_n as_o coccius_n gualterus_n the_o author_n of_o the_o progeny_n of_o the_o catholic_n and_o protestant_n or_o any_o other_o name_v by_o any_o other_o i_o say_v this_o that_o he_o shall_v have_v tell_v i_o particulary_a where_o each_o of_o they_o do_v produce_v any_o father_n and_o in_o what_o point_n and_o also_o shall_v have_v show_v in_o they_o that_o many_o father_n have_v all_o conjunctive_o speak_v of_o the_o several_a point_n and_o also_o that_o they_o have_v speak_v of_o they_o direct_o on_o purpose_n where_o the_o seat_n of_o the_o matter_n be_v and_o also_o that_o not_o where_o they_o contradict_v what_o in_o one_o place_n they_o say_v or_o at_o least_o do_v not_o elsewhere_o speak_v doubt_o otherwise_o he_o conclude_v not_o any_o thing_n of_o weight_n against_o i_o and_o then_o second_o i_o can_v return_v my_o adversary_n number_n for_o number_n and_o weight_n for_o weight_n of_o our_o own_o who_o have_v answer_v all_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o father_n which_o their_o learned_a champion_n have_v produce_v as_o bishop_n jewel_n dr._n whitaker_n dr._n reynolds_n beside_o chamier_n of_o france_n who_o have_v refute_v the_o instance_n of_o the_o father_n yea_o the_o challenge_n of_o the_o first_o of_o they_o be_v never_o yet_o well_o answer_v as_o to_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o father_n and_o three_o either_o the_o father_n can_v be_v bring_v in_o with_o their_o suffrage_n for_o they_o or_o they_o can_v if_o they_o can_v why_o do_v campian_n and_o other_o crack_n and_o brag_v of_o the_o father_n and_o then_o also_o my_o adversary_n author_n be_v disannul_v if_o they_o can_v then_o either_o the_o father_n speak_v contradiction_n since_o we_o produce_v they_o as_o well_o for_o we_o and_o therefore_o can_v we_o be_v rule_v by_o they_o or_o else_o my_o adversary_n need_v not_o to_o have_v shift_v the_o answer_v to_o they_o but_o may_v have_v find_v other_o passage_n out_o of_o they_o to_o have_v commodious_o reconcile_v the_o seem_a variance_n yea_o then_o either_o my_o adversary_n have_v not_o such_o cause_n to_o rest_v infallibility_n in_o a_o council_n if_o all_o the_o father_n of_o all_o age_n agree_v or_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o father_n may_v be_v a_o rule_n to_o the_o council_n and_o then_o my_o discourse_n of_o the_o father_n have_v good_a conjunction_n with_o the_o controversy_n about_o council_n as_o for_o the_o author_n of_o the_o progeny_n of_o catholic_n and_o protestant_n who_o he_o bring_v in_o here_o as_o handle_v a_o part_n all_o our_o main_a difference_n and_o do_v in_o all_o these_o point_n give_v we_o the_o very_a word_n of_o our_o own_o chief_a doctor_n clear_o acknowledge_v a_o great_a number_n of_o holy_a father_n direct_o opposite_a to_o we_o in_o each_o one_o of_o these_o point_n to_o this_o i_o answer_v that_o it_o be_v possible_a some_o of_o our_o church_n may_v not_o meet_v with_o right_a edition_n of_o the_o father_n may_v not_o discern_v their_o true_a work_n may_v mistake_v the_o sense_n and_o application_n of_o some_o word_n or_o not_o be_v able_a dexterous_o to_o reconcile_v their_o expression_n to_o some_o other_o passage_n of_o the_o father_n and_o to_o our_o opinion_n may_v conclude_v they_o as_o opposite_a if_o this_o argument_n be_v good_a then_o be_v they_o also_o bind_v to_o conclude_v the_o father_n to_o be_v on_o our_o side_n because_o bellarmin_n produce_v in_o his_o disputation_n testimony_n of_o the_o father_n for_o we_o indeed_o he_o endeavour_v to_o answer_v those_o testimony_n but_o i_o dare_v affirm_v that_o several_a of_o those_o testimony_n which_o the_o author_n have_v produce_v from_o our_o own_o side_n of_o the_o father_n may_v as_o well_o be_v answer_v as_o some_o of_o those_o which_o bellarmin_n answer_v three_o my_o adversary_n may_v have_v know_v also_o that_o there_o be_v a_o book_n write_v by_o none_o of_o we_o which_o be_v a_o confutation_n of_o papist_n by_o papist_n so_o then_o if_o they_o will_v set_v our_o divine_n against_o we_o we_o can_v set_v their_o divine_n against_o they_o yea_o also_o in_o several_a point_n be_v the_o testimony_n of_o the_o primitive_a church_n urge_v against_o some_o of_o their_o point_n in_o the_o trent_n council_n by_o some_o of_o their_o church_n four_o i_o have_v read_v breerley_n through_o it_o be_v commend_v to_o i_o by_o one_o who_o thought_n i_o think_v thereby_o to_o convince_v i_o in_o the_o case_n and_o i_o can_v give_v no_o other_o account_n than_o as_o mr._n chillingworth_n do_v that_o he_o have_v not_o deal_v exact_o with_o the_o confession_n of_o those_o of_o our_o church_n as_o in_o the_o instance_n of_o some_o passage_n out_o of_o mr._n hooker_n as_o may_v be_v see_v in_o mr._n chillingworth_n page_n 62._o as_o also_o in_o a_o passage_n of_o luther_n as_o may_v be_v see_v in_o mr._n chill_a if_o the_o page_n 79_o and_o 92_o be_v compare_v and_o therefore_o have_v we_o no_o reason_n to_o be_v conclude_v against_o upon_o his_o word_n yea_o some_o of_o the_o authority_n he_o bring_v do_v not_o respect_v the_o main_a point_n betwixt_o we_o and_o as_o i_o remember_v some_o authority_n be_v not_o contradictory_n to_o our_o cause_n and_o therefore_o be_v i_o rather_o confirm_v by_o read_v of_o that_o book_n and_o therefore_o groundless_a be_v my_o adversary_n excuse_v for_o not_o meddle_v with_o the_o holy_a father_n in_o this_o controversy_n betwixt_o we_o though_o they_o do_v not_o profess_o discuss_v and_o determine_v our_o question_n and_o
those_o who_o have_v not_o bishop_n some_o of_o they_o will_v have_v they_o if_o it_o be_v in_o their_o power_n as_o bogerman_n say_v in_o the_o council_n of_o dort_n when_o that_o government_n be_v commend_v to_o he_o domine_fw-la nos_fw-la non_fw-la sumus_fw-la adeo_fw-la felices_fw-la and_o as_o for_o those_o who_o be_v ordain_v without_o bishop_n be_v this_o our_o case_n we_o may_v be_v as_o sure_o they_o be_v true_a minister_n as_o the_o papist_n can_v assure_v themselves_o that_o they_o have_v true_a priest_n in_o respect_n of_o the_o uncertainty_n they_o be_v under_o of_o the_o due_a intention_n of_o the_o priest_n in_o baptism_n and_o of_o the_o bishop_n in_o ordination_n as_o to_o deacon_n they_o may_v have_v be_v leave_v out_o of_o the_o rank_n with_o priest_n as_o to_o true_a sacrament_n for_o it_o will_v not_o appear_v that_o deacon_n be_v appoint_v jure_fw-la divino_fw-la to_o assist_v the_o minister_n in_o the_o sacrament_n and_o if_o so_o yet_o not_o to_o be_v necessary_a to_o true_a sacrament_n that_o they_o do_v assist_v otherwise_o no_o true_a sacrament_n what_o shall_v this_o also_o with_o the_o roman_n go_v into_o the_o account_n of_o article_n of_o faith_n and_o shall_v this_o be_v as_o necessary_a to_o be_v believe_v as_o that_o jesus_n be_v the_o christ_n sacrament_n thing_n so_o necessary_a to_o the_o salvation_n of_o all_o man_n this_o we_o have_v speak_v to_o before_o and_o it_o come_v in_o here_o under_o a_o simple_a diction_n and_o not_o positive_o as_o it_o may_v be_v interptete_v affirm_v or_o if_o so_o necessary_a be_v to_o be_v take_v signanter_n then_o be_v it_o more_o easy_o deny_v as_o to_o all_o man_n our_o former_a distinction_n be_v yet_o good_a necessary_a by_o necessity_n of_o precept_n not_o by_o necessity_n of_o mean_v neither_o be_v the_o other_o sacrament_n so_o necessary_a as_o that_o and_o yet_o be_v they_o put_v together_o upon_o equal_a necessity_n the_o sacrament_n bound_v we_o not_o god_n to_o work_v only_o by_o they_o and_o also_o be_v they_o administer_v as_o due_o with_o we_o as_o elsewhere_o then_o he_o bring_v in_o a_o syllogism_n against_o we_o out_o of_o my_o own_o word_n what_o be_v not_o plain_o deliver_v in_o scripture_n be_v thereby_o signify_v not_o to_o be_v necessary_a but_o it_o be_v not_o plain_o deliver_v in_o scripture_n that_o the_o church_n shall_v be_v govern_v by_o bishop_n with_o such_o and_o such_o authority_n thus_o he_o will_v bring_v in_o some_o of_o those_o who_o differ_v from_o they_o and_o we_o in_o this_o point_n dispute_v against_o bishop_n but_o how_o will_v he_o conclude_v therefore_o not_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n unless_o he_o conclude_v thus_o it_o do_v not_o contradict_v we_o in_o our_o debate_n and_o if_o he_o do_v conclude_v so_o he_o conclude_v beside_o their_o intention_n for_o they_o will_v conclude_v no_o more_o than_o that_o they_o be_v not_o necessary_a to_o the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n because_o it_o be_v not_o hold_v by_o other_o that_o this_o government_n with_o such_o and_o such_o authority_n be_v simple_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n but_o to_o the_o assumption_n we_o say_v dato_fw-la that_o the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n by_o bishop_n with_o such_o and_o such_o power_n be_v not_o plain_o set_v down_o in_o scripture_n yet_o let_v they_o show_v as_o much_o out_o of_o scripture_n with_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n for_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n his_o be_v universal_a bishop_n as_o we_o can_v show_v out_o of_o scripture_n for_o bishop_n with_o some_o authority_n superior_a to_o presbyter_n and_o i_o shall_v think_v better_o of_o their_o cause_n and_o therefore_o let_v they_o remember_v parvi_fw-la sunt_fw-la foris_fw-la arma_fw-la nisi_fw-la est_fw-la consilium_fw-la domi_fw-la let_v they_o make_v sure_a at_o home_n before_o they_o combat_v we_o with_o our_o own_o contention_n for_o second_o as_o for_o such_o and_o such_o authority_n if_o he_o take_v it_o for_o the_o mathematical_a point_n and_o indivisible_a degree_n which_o the_o bishop_n must_v have_v of_o authority_n over_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o clergy_n who_o be_v there_o that_o so_o contend_v it_o but_o the_o roman_a some_o superiority_n in_o the_o latitude_n may_v be_v able_a to_o conserve_v the_o form_n and_o this_o be_v more_o easy_o provable_a out_o of_o scripture_n with_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o church_n but_o three_o since_o he_o have_v bring_v the_o antepiscoparians_n upon_o the_o stage_n to_o make_v sport_n for_o they_o what_o will_v the_o pontifician_n say_v if_o this_o argument_n be_v in_o earnest_n bring_v against_o they_o whatsoever_o be_v necessary_a be_v plain_o set_v down_o in_o scripture_n government_n by_o bishop_n with_o such_o and_o such_o authority_n be_v not_o plain_o set_v down_o in_o scripture_n therefore_o not_o necessary_a the_o major_a proposition_n be_v yet_o true_a and_o good_a against_o all_o his_o battery_n the_o minor_a be_v to_o have_v their_o advice_n whether_o they_o will_v affirm_v it_o or_o deny_v it_o let_v they_o speak_v categorical_o be_v it_o plain_o set_v down_o or_o not_o if_o it_o be_v plain_o set_v down_o than_o this_o instance_n be_v against_o they_o if_o it_o be_v not_o plain_o set_v down_o than_o they_o have_v nothing_o plain_o set_v down_o for_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n upon_o the_o former_a rule_n if_o there_o be_v no_o bishop_n plain_o set_v down_o than_o not_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n this_o he_o get_v by_o our_o contention_n as_o for_o the_o form_n of_o ordain_v priest_n or_o presbyter_n it_o be_v sufficient_o set_v down_o and_o we_o have_v it_o practise_v with_o we_o without_o the_o patin_n and_o the_o chalice_n and_o that_o none_o but_o those_o who_o be_v priest_n formal_o or_o eminent_o as_o be_v more_o shall_v bless_v the_o bread_n and_o consecrate_v the_o sacrament_n this_o be_v clear_o enough_o set_v down_o and_o what_o kind_n of_o bread_n for_o the_o sacrament_n as_o much_o as_o be_v necessary_a be_v set_v down_o the_o pontifician_n have_v no_o reason_n if_o he_o consider_v himself_o to_o urge_v all_o particularity_n about_o the_o sacrament_n since_o he_o account_v they_o so_o necessary_a will_v god_n pinch_v that_o which_o be_v necessary_a under_o so_o many_o contingence_n which_o he_o do_v not_o ordinary_o provide_v against_o therefore_o either_o they_o be_v not_o necessary_a and_o then_o why_o be_v they_o insist_v in_o or_o if_o necessary_a yet_o not_o in_o all_o the_o several_a circumstance_n for_o then_o under_o how_o many_o accidentality_n shall_v salvation_n be_v include_v he_o say_v then_o he_o can_v add_v many_o more_o particular_n to_o the_o former_a kind_n no_o less_o necessary_a to_o be_v decide_v if_o no_o more_o necessary_a it_o be_v not_o like_a to_o trouble_v we_o or_o if_o necessary_a they_o shall_v be_v decidable_a by_o plain_a scripture_n yes_o if_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n and_o then_o your_o doctor_n can_v not_o jar_v about_o they_o this_o i_o deny_v and_o he_o have_v better_o have_v take_v our_o grant_n that_o those_o of_o this_o sort_n be_v not_o plain_o set_v down_o in_o scripture_n unless_o he_o have_v prove_v it_o more_o strong_o than_o by_o our_o difference_n it_o be_v possible_a to_o differ_v in_o plain_a thing_n but_o we_o need_v not_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d st._n mark_v the_o 6._o 53._o and_o again_o this_o be_v retort_v many_o thing_n may_v be_v name_v which_o be_v in_o the_o opinion_n of_o some_o pontifician_n no_o less_o necessary_a to_o be_v decide_v than_o the_o point_n of_o original_a sin_n the_o immaculate_a conception_n of_o the_o virgin_n the_o point_n of_o residence_n and_o of_o bishop_n whether_o by_o divine_a right_n and_o yet_o be_v they_o not_o determine_v in_o the_o trent_n council_n no_o nor_o those_o neither_o positive_o but_o it_o may_v be_v they_o be_v not_o necessary_a for_o if_o necessary_a they_o shall_v be_v decidable_a by_o plain_a decree_n of_o council_n and_o then_o the_o doctor_n can_v not_o jar_v about_o they_o but_o to_o give_v a_o further_a check_n to_o this_o unreasonable_a exact_v of_o such_o particularity_n to_o be_v plain_o decide_v by_o scripture_n let_v they_o consider_v general_o how_o little_a be_v affirmative_o define_v and_o clear_o in_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n yea_o for_o further_a instance_n be_v these_o several_n which_o he_o have_v point_v at_o more_o necessary_a to_o be_v decide_v than_o the_o point_n of_o indulgence_n which_o be_v the_o main_a point_n which_o occasion_v the_o division_n of_o the_o council_n consequent_o and_o yet_o be_v not_o this_o sufficient_o handle_v yea_o as_o the_o author_n of_o the_o history_n say_v the_o protestant_n complain_v that_o the_o synod_n have_v pass_v it_o over_o without_o clear_v any_o doubt_n or_o decide_v any_o controversy_n if_o they_o can_v not_o or_o will_v not_o how_o shall_v we_o be_v bind_v under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n to_o take_v
he_o make_v a_o calumny_n because_o he_o think_v it_o as_o impossible_a for_o the_o pope_n to_o say_v that_o vice_n be_v virtue_n as_o if_o god_n the_o father_n shall_v say_v such_o a_o thing_n be_v a_o virtue_n and_o christ_n shall_v preach_v such_o a_o thing_n be_v a_o vice_n ans_fw-fr it_o will_v do_v well_o as_o he_o say_v to_o use_v soft_a word_n and_o hard_a argument_n wave_v therefore_o his_o reflection_n we_o say_v first_o the_o calumny_n be_v not_o in_o say_v of_o he_o what_o he_o say_v not_o but_o in_o the_o misinterpretation_n how_o he_o speak_v it_o and_o to_o this_o we_o say_v it_o be_v not_o necessary_a to_o be_v a_o calumny_n for_o it_o may_v be_v speak_v of_o he_o as_o it_o be_v speak_v by_o he_o in_o way_n of_o supposition_n and_o may_v be_v speak_v of_o he_o to_o be_v speak_v by_o he_o and_o therefore_o if_o it_o be_v no_o calumny_n in_o the_o cardinal_n to_o say_v so_o it_o may_v be_v no_o calumny_n in_o i_o to_o say_v of_o the_o cardinal_n that_o he_o say_v so_o they_o will_v think_v a_o notionall_a supposition_n make_v no_o slander_n whosoever_o be_v the_o subject_n and_o whatsoever_o the_o predicate_a and_o therefore_o if_o he_o think_v that_o i_o must_v speak_v it_o of_o bellarmin_n slanderous_o he_o must_v also_o think_v that_o bellarmin_n may_v speak_v it_o so_o too_o second_o if_o it_o be_v as_o impossible_a to_o suppose_v any_o such_o thing_n of_o the_o pope_n as_o that_o god_n shall_v say_v such_o a_o thing_n be_v a_o virtue_n and_o christ_n shall_v preach_v it_o to_o be_v a_o vice_n then_o why_o have_v the_o pope_n such_o a_o council_n to_o assist_v he_o it_o be_v well_o put_v into_o more_o hand_n for_o fear_n of_o a_o defectibilitie_n in_o one_o and_o if_o it_o be_v say_v that_o this_o be_v speak_v of_o the_o pope_n only_o hypothetical_o to_o his_o say_n so_o as_o be_v assist_v with_o a_o council_n it_o be_v easy_o answer_v that_o this_o be_v not_o the_o jesuit_n opinion_n that_o the_o pope_n be_v infallible_a only_o with_o a_o council_n and_o by_o the_o way_n if_o a_o pope_n be_v infallible_a only_o with_o a_o council_n why_o do_v pope_n clement_n say_v that_o a_o council_n be_v always_o good_a but_o when_o it_o meddle_v with_o the_o pope_n authority_n be_v there_o any_o point_n more_o considerable_a than_o the_o pope_n authority_n and_o be_v he_o only_o infallible_a in_o a_o council_n and_o yet_o be_v he_o afraid_a that_o this_o point_n shall_v be_v meddle_v with_o in_o a_o council_n then_o he_o must_v suspect_v his_o own_o cause_n in_o their_o opinion_n well_o and_o can_v god_n err_v or_o can_v christ_n err_v in_o precept_n and_o particular_a judgement_n as_o bellarmin_n confess_v in_o the_o same_o chap._n it_o be_v not_o absurd_a that_o the_o pope_n shall_v err_v and_o can_v god_n or_o christ_n err_v in_o command_v any_o thing_n unprofitable_a or_o under_o too_o heavy_a a_o punishment_n it_o be_v not_o absurd_a to_o say_v this_o of_o the_o pope_n although_o it_o belong_v not_o to_o subject_n to_o doubt_v of_o this_o but_o simple_o to_o obey_v as_o he_o say_v in_o the_o same_o chap._n nay_o if_o to_o speak_v so_o of_o the_o pope_n as_o bellarmin_n say_v in_o way_n of_o supposition_n be_v a_o slander_n than_o bellarmin_n slander_v the_o pope_n also_o in_o his_o second_n b._n de_fw-fr rom._n pontif._n cap._n 29._o itaque_fw-la sicut_fw-la licet_fw-la resistere_fw-la pontifici_fw-la etc._n etc._n therefore_o as_o it_o be_v lawful_a to_o resist_v the_o pope_n invade_v our_o body_n so_o be_v it_o lawful_a to_o resist_v he_o invade_v soul_n and_o trouble_v a_o commonwealth_n and_o much_o rather_o si_fw-mi ecclesiam_fw-la destruere_fw-la niteretur_fw-la if_o he_o shall_v endeavour_v to_o destroy_v the_o church_n thus_o he_o then_o he_o shall_v defend_v i_o therefore_o may_v i_o be_v clear_a of_o slander_n against_o bellarmin_n or_o he_o guilty_a of_o slander_n against_o the_o pope_n but_o than_o three_o put_v case_n i_o account_v it_o no_o slander_n against_o the_o pope_n to_o affirm_v a_o possibility_n in_o he_o to_o say_v that_o vice_n be_v virtue_n the_o consequence_n i_o hope_v be_v good_a ab_fw-la esse_fw-la ad_fw-la posse_fw-la he_o have_v do_v so_o therefore_o be_v it_o possible_a to_o command_v disobedience_n to_o christ_n under_o colour_n of_o obedience_n to_o he_o be_v to_o say_v real_o that_o vice_n be_v virtue_n and_o this_o the_o pope_n have_v do_v in_o the_o injunction_n of_o his_o dimi-communion_n as_o before_o and_o let_v they_o before_o they_o press_v this_o slander_n any_o further_a first_o help_v bellarmin_n to_o purge_v the_o pope_n of_o all_o those_o error_n in_o faith_n and_o determination_n affirmative_a against_o god_n precept_n negative_a in_o point_n of_o practice_n and_o when_o they_o have_v do_v this_o than_o we_o shall_v be_v afraid_a to_o suppose_v a_o possibility_n if_o we_o can_v find_v further_a instance_n of_o fact_n and_o therefore_o they_o shall_v not_o scare_v we_o with_o a_o charge_n of_o calumny_n until_o they_o have_v strong_o assert_v such_o a_o impossibility_n indeed_o impossibilis_fw-la conditio_fw-la facit_fw-la negativam_fw-la we_o can_v err_v in_o obedience_n if_o we_o can_v err_v in_o command_v but_o that_o he_o can_v err_v in_o command_n be_v yet_o sub_fw-la judice_fw-la and_o not_o himself_o all_o protestant_n do_v say_v as_o i_o note_v that_o the_o scripture_n 19_o num._n 19_o and_o only_o the_o scripture_n be_v leave_v we_o by_o christ_n for_o our_o judge_n to_o end_v all_o controversy_n ans_fw-fr this_o be_v no_o genuine_a account_n of_o our_o opinion_n they_o do_v not_o assert_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v a_o judge_n in_o formality_n they_o say_v there_o be_v no_o need_n of_o such_o a_o judge_n as_o papist_n will_v have_v since_o all_o necessary_n unto_o faith_n and_o hope_n and_o charity_n be_v sufficient_o deliver_v in_o matter_n and_o form_n without_o any_o exigence_n of_o such_o a_o judge_n and_o in_o this_o they_o agree_v with_o all_o right_a catholic_n not_o with_o heretic_n as_o he_o will_v have_v it_o and_o heretic_n he_o may_v know_v as_o before_o have_v urge_v the_o church_n for_o they_o and_o st._n austin_n have_v deal_v with_o heretic_n by_o scripture_n and_o therefore_o if_o heretic_n use_v the_o scripture_n must_v we_o not_o since_o heretic_n urge_v the_o church_n by_o his_o argument_n they_o must_v not_o they_o know_v the_o rule_n duo_o cum_fw-la idem_fw-la faciunt_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la idem_fw-la it_o be_v one_o thing_n to_o use_v scripture_n for_o the_o proof_n of_o some_o point_n and_o another_o thing_n to_o say_v scripture_n and_o only_a scripture_n must_v be_v the_o judge_n for_o all_o controversy_n to_o what_o end_n then_o be_v all_o you_o say_v against_o i_o as_o against_o one_o mislike_v the_o use_n of_o scripture_n ans_fw-fr this_o be_v all_o i_o have_v from_o he_o in_o account_n to_o five_o or_o six_o answer_n i_o give_v he_o to_o the_o charge_n against_o i_o for_o use_v scripture_n as_o heretic_n do_v thus_o easy_o he_o put_v i_o off_o well_o to_o this_o put-off_a we_o say_v first_o that_o this_o distinction_n of_o he_o import_v a_o confession_n of_o he_o to_o use_v scripture_n in_o some_o point_n then_o be_v not_o the_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n necessary_a to_o all_o point_n and_o this_o be_v some_o abatement_n of_o his_o former_a universality_n second_o those_o point_n he_o allow_v the_o use_n of_o scripture_n in_o be_v necessary_a as_o be_v intimate_v before_o since_o bellarmin_n do_v own_o the_o scripture_n for_o a_o rule_n also_o and_o if_o scripture_n do_v deliver_v some_o point_n necessary_a quatenus_fw-la taeles_fw-la then_o all_o necessary_n as_o before_o neither_o need_v these_o necessary_n be_v many_o as_o mr._n chillingworth_n have_v observe_v and_o tertullian_n also_o in_o effect_n certa_fw-la sunt_fw-la in_o paucis_fw-la the_o rule_n of_o faith_n use_v by_o the_o father_n be_v not_o numerous_a in_o particular_n three_o we_o say_v not_o that_o the_o scripture_n be_v a_o proper_a judge_n much_o less_o for_o all_o controversy_n and_o therefore_o if_o they_o will_v stand_v to_o what_o be_v here_o say_v by_o they_o and_o withdraw_v that_o which_o be_v not_o due_o say_v of_o we_o let_v they_o take_v the_o counter_n and_o cast_v up_o the_o difference_n betwixt_o we_o they_o allow_v the_o scripture_n in_o some_o point_n we_o allow_v the_o church_n in_o some_o point_n they_o allow_v the_o scripture_n i_o suppose_v in_o some_o point_v necessary_a we_o allow_v the_o church_n much_o in_o point_n not_o necessary_a if_o they_o will_v extend_v some_o point_n necessary_a to_o all_o point_n necessary_a which_o be_v not_o many_o we_o not_o upon_o condition_n but_o free_o will_v give_v the_o church_n due_a reverence_n in_o point_n of_o question_n and_o thus_o there_o will_v be_v soon_o a_o end_n of_o the_o controversy_n betwixt_o we_o and_o in_o
falsity_n and_o therefore_o probability_n can_v make_v faith_n and_o negative_a prudence_n can_v amount_v no_o high_o than_o probability_n four_o if_o we_o must_v now_o set_v the_o basis_n and_o the_o foundation_n of_o all_o divine_a faith_n in_o universal_a tradition_n than_o mr._n chillingworth_n carry_v the_o victory_n clear_o from_o the_o romanist_n for_o this_o he_o dispute_v for_o in_o opposition_n to_o the_o roman_a five_o all_o good_a people_n can_v make_v a_o demonstration_n or_o faith_n of_o a_o conclusion_n and_o we_o have_v cause_n to_o note_v this_o as_o invalid_a because_o if_o goodness_n of_o manner_n be_v simple_o probative_a of_o true_a faith_n than_o we_o shall_v be_v all_o nought_o in_o the_o roman_a opinion_n because_o we_o differ_v with_o they_o in_o faith_n for_o if_o we_o have_v be_v all_o good_a people_n we_o shall_v have_v accept_v their_o ground_n and_o hence_o we_o see_v their_o pretend_a reason_n of_o uncharitableness_n to_o we_o wherein_o they_o communicate_v with_o sect_n or_o sect_n with_o they_o but_o if_o goodness_n of_o life_n be_v so_o profitable_a for_o proof_n of_o truth_n than_o my_o adversary_n with_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o pontifician_n do_v not_o so_o wise_o distinguish_v betwixt_o morality_n and_o infallibility_n in_o their_o pope_n for_o sure_o than_o gregory_n the_o seven_o have_v be_v no_o good_a head_n of_o the_o church_n nor_o alexander_n the_o six_o who_o sure_o laugh_v in_o his_o sleeve_n when_o he_o say_v to_o a_o ambassador_n quantum_fw-la lucri_fw-la nobis_fw-la peperitilla_fw-la fabula_fw-la de_fw-la christo_fw-la i_o have_v think_v goodness_n have_v not_o belong_v to_o a_o professor_n of_o divinity_n as_o such_o indeed_o it_o become_v all_o scholar_n to_o be_v very_o good_a but_o this_o be_v one_o of_o the_o first_o time_n that_o i_o hear_v of_o this_o argument_n let_v they_o therefore_o put_v in_o some_o formal_a principle_n of_o discern_a truth_n as_o goodness_n be_v not_o unless_o the_o will_n can_v prescribe_v to_o the_o judgement_n as_o the_o judgement_n to_o the_o will_n and_o if_o it_o can_v they_o have_v the_o worse_a cause_n therefore_o may_v we_o conclude_v this_o long_a paragraph_n with_o a_o sober_a denial_n of_o what_o he_o conclude_v it_o with_o the_o ground_n upon_o which_o you_o believe_v scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v think_v to_o be_v chimaerical_a by_o some_o of_o your_o best_a writer_n it_o be_v prove_v otherwise_o and_o that_o it_o be_v not_o account_v foolish_a or_o chimerical_a by_o some_o of_o the_o best_a of_o our_o writer_n we_o have_v see_v before_o neither_o mr._n hooker_n nor_o mr._n chillingworth_n nay_o nor_o by_o some_o of_o their_o best_a writer_n neither_o as_o stapleton_n beside_o some_o other_o quote_v by_o dr._n white_n as_o before_o but_o if_o he_o will_v stand_v to_o st._n austin_n he_o may_v have_v spare_v this_o dispute_n about_o scripture_n for_o we_o be_v not_o to_o dispute_v the_o truth_n of_o scripture_n he_o say_v as_o of_o other_o writing_n to_o conclude_v then_o this_o number_n in_o kind_n we_o may_v as_o well_o take_v the_o boldness_n to_o say_v that_o their_o ground_n upon_o which_o they_o stand_v in_o the_o maintenance_n of_o their_o faith_n as_o different_a from_o we_o be_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d a_o lion_n before_o a_o dragon_n behind_o and_o a_o chimaera_n in_o the_o middle_n in_o this_o number_n he_o urge_v unsecurity_n of_o our_o ground_v faith_n as_o to_o the_o ignorant_a in_o translation_n 34._o num._n 34._o but_o this_o have_v be_v by_o he_o press_v before_o and_o by_o i_o answer_v and_o nothing_o be_v here_o reply_v by_o he_o but_o somewhat_o more_o be_v promise_v ch_n 4._o n._n 9_o and_o therefore_o may_v we_o skip_v it_o but_o it_o may_v be_v he_o will_v interpret_v our_o omission_n to_o his_o advantage_n he_o say_v then_o how_o unsecure_o the_o great_a part_n of_o your_o religion_n do_v ground_v their_o faith_n because_o they_o must_v trust_v the_o translation_n of_o private_a man_n and_o believe_v they_o rather_o and_o use_v they_o rather_o than_o the_o translation_n use_v by_o the_o church_n in_o general_n council_n ecce_fw-la iterum_fw-la crispinus_n but_o we_o answer_v in_o this_o he_o will_v have_v three_o proposition_n grant_v he_o one_o that_o general_n council_n do_v use_v their_o latin_a translation_n second_o that_o our_o translation_n be_v the_o offspring_n of_o private_a man_n three_o that_o most_o of_o we_o must_v ground_v their_o faith_n in_o the_o trust_n of_o private_a man_n translation_n to_o these_o we_o answer_v in_o three_o word_n and_o in_o general_a deny_v all_o of_o they_o as_o to_o the_o first_o we_o say_v that_o the_o general_a council_n which_o be_v celebrate_v in_o greece_n do_v not_o sure_o make_v use_n of_o the_o latin_a translation_n nay_o second_o their_o latin_a translation_n which_o they_o will_v have_v to_o be_v jerom_n for_o antiquity_n be_v not_o at_o first_o receive_v in_o the_o church_n but_o deny_v by_o st._n austin_n yea_o three_o their_o latin_a translation_n which_o now_o they_o use_v can_v be_v st._n jerom_n for_o i_o hope_v it_o be_v mend_v by_o sixtus_n quintus_n and_o again_o refine_v by_o clement_n the_o eight_o and_o sure_o though_o it_o be_v canonize_v by_o the_o trent_n council_n before_o it_o be_v make_v yet_o sure_o it_o be_v not_o make_v currant_n in_o the_o church_n for_o use_v before_o it_o be_v bear_v and_o if_o they_o say_v there_o be_v no_o real_a and_o material_a difference_n betwixt_o their_o latin_a as_n now_o and_o in_o ancient_a time_n we_o say_v first_o absolute_o that_o isider_v clarius_n who_o come_v after_o clement_n will_v then_o find_v fault_n with_o both_o in_o several_a thousand_o place_n but_o then_o also_o we_o say_v in_o compare_n neither_o be_v there_o any_o real_a and_o material_a difference_n in_o our_o english_a from_o the_o original_n but_o fourthly_a do_v the_o general_n council_n use_v the_o latin_a translation_n for_o their_o judge_n in_o scripture_n then_o be_v not_o the_o general_n council_n infallible_a because_o that_o translation_n be_v not_o infallible_o make_v nor_o make_v infallible_a by_o the_o church_n even_o in_o the_o trent_n council_n as_o some_o of_o their_o own_o have_v intimate_v as_o before_o to_o the_o second_o proposition_n we_o give_v also_o a_o denial_n our_o english_a translation_n be_v not_o to_o be_v account_v the_o translation_n of_o private_a man_n because_o it_o be_v authorize_v by_o our_o church_n although_o at_o first_o make_v by_o private_a man_n and_o what_o if_o they_o yet_o make_v good_a to_o hinder_v as_o great_a a_o assistance_n of_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n to_o the_o establishment_n of_o this_o translation_n as_o they_o find_v for_o their_o remish_n testament_n that_o which_o be_v make_v by_o private_a man_n be_v make_v more_o than_o private_a by_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n and_o if_o they_o deny_v this_o distinction_n they_o undo_v all_o their_o council_n and_o if_o they_o say_v our_o church_n have_v itself_o as_o a_o private_a part_n to_o the_o whole_a so_o we_o say_v do_v the_o roman_a 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d three_o as_o to_o the_o three_o proposition_n we_o deny_v it_o also_o the_o most_o do_v not_o trust_v in_o the_o translation_n nay_o none_o do_v trust_v in_o translation_n simple_o because_o they_o be_v not_o scripture_n as_o per_fw-la se_fw-la but_o analogical_o to_o the_o scripture_n in_o the_o original_n so_o that_o ultimate_o they_o be_v assure_v that_o the_o translation_n be_v in_o the_o matter_n agreeable_a to_o scripture_n as_o they_o be_v assure_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n namely_o through_o faith_n infuse_v by_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n so_o they_o do_v not_o believe_v the_o translation_n but_o that_o which_o be_v translate_v the_o translation_n formal_o be_v no_o mean_a to_o assure_v their_o faith_n but_o be_v a_o mean_a of_o conveyance_n of_o it_o to_o their_o knowledge_n and_o sure_o our_o people_n may_v as_o well_o believe_v that_o the_o translation_n be_v as_o free_v from_o all_o damnative_a error_n as_o their_o people_n may_v believe_v what_o their_o church_n propose_v to_o be_v free_a from_o damnative_a error_n first_o because_o they_o rely_v upon_o a_o translation_n that_o teach_v and_o a_o translation_n not_o so_o good_a second_o because_o our_o people_n can_v consult_v the_o translation_n so_o can_v their_o people_n understand_v the_o vulgar_a latin_a and_o therefore_o if_o those_o who_o translate_v it_o be_v not_o deceive_v yet_o those_o who_o propose_v it_o may_v deceive_v the_o people_n and_o three_o because_o the_o authority_n of_o their_o translation_n be_v far_o great_a yet_o be_v it_o make_v by_o those_o priest_n of_o they_o deep_o interest_v in_o this_o cause_n as_o well_o as_o he_o say_v our_o might_n be_v by_o private_a minister_n deep_o interest_v in_o this_o cause_n and_o also_o because_o yet_o be_v
intend_v by_o god_n for_o we_o do_v not_o say_v that_o it_o be_v fomal_o any_o judge_n but_o we_o say_v that_o the_o scripture_n do_v so_o full_o and_o so_o plain_o set_v down_o thing_n necessary_a so_o full_o and_o so_o plain_o that_o there_o be_v no_o necessity_n of_o tradition_n for_o more_o matter_n or_o of_o infallible_a judge_n for_o more_o clear_a proposal_n of_o thing_n necessary_a so_o that_o this_o which_o he_o say_v be_v peccant_a in_o the_o ignorance_n of_o the_o elench_v he_o say_v yet_o be_v it_o not_o manifest_a that_o the_o scripture_n may_v be_v a_o book_n as_o perfect_a as_o can_v be_v for_o the_o intent_n for_o which_o god_n make_v it_o this_o we_o may_v take_v for_o his_o proposition_n then_o bellarmin_n as_o before_o acknowledge_v it_o to_o be_v our_o rule_n against_o the_o aanbaptist_n and_o therefore_o it_o be_v a_o perfect_a rule_n but_o elsewhere_o bellarmin_n will_v have_v it_o to_o be_v but_o our_o commonitory_n then_o why_o do_v he_o dispute_v it_o to_o be_v a_o rule_n against_o the_o aanbaptist_n whereas_o then_o my_o adversary_n will_v return_v the_o disgrace_n to_o scripture_n upon_o i_o he_o do_v not_o or_o will_v not_o understand_v i_o for_o we_o do_v not_o say_v nor_o be_v bind_v to_o say_v that_o all_o necessary_a controversy_n be_v plain_o decide_v by_o scripture_n alone_o and_z that_o god_n intend_v the_o scripture_n for_o the_o plain_a decision_n of_o they_o and_o therefore_o we_o deny_v his_o consequence_n that_o since_o when_o it_o come_v to_o the_o trial_n we_o be_v not_o able_a to_o show_v any_o text_n of_o scripture_n decide_v many_o and_o most_o important_a controversy_n this_o in_o effect_n be_v to_o say_v god_n perform_v very_o insufficient_o what_o he_o intend_v to_o do_v by_o scripture_n first_o we_o do_v not_o say_v that_o all_o necessary_a controversy_n be_v plain_o decide_v by_o scripture_n for_o we_o say_v no_o controversy_n be_v necessary_a in_o point_n of_o necessary_a faith_n he_o put_v in_o necessary_a controversy_n for_o necessary_a truth_n we_o say_v the_o scripture_n plain_o propose_v all_o necessary_a truth_n and_o he_o will_v bring_v we_o in_o say_v that_o the_o scripture_n plain_o decide_v all_o necessary_a contoversy_n and_o therefore_o how_o can_v he_o say_v that_o we_o say_v god_n intend_v the_o scripture_n for_o the_o plain_a decision_n of_o they_o 2._o therefore_o we_o deny_v those_o point_n to_o be_v simple_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n which_o be_v not_o clear_o propose_v in_o scripture_n 3._o whereas_o they_o say_v that_o the_o scripture_n do_v propose_v upon_o god_n intention_n the_o church_n to_o be_v the_o infallible_a judge_n in_o matter_n of_o faith_n and_o yet_o can_v show_v any_o text_n wherein_o this_o be_v clear_o deliver_v they_o do_v dishonour_n god_n and_o scripture_n and_o they_o dishonour_v god_n by_o accuse_v of_o scripture_n as_o nilus_n before_o in_o this_o number_n he_o hold_v the_o conclusion_n that_o expression_n of_o scripture_n be_v obscure_a in_o way_n of_o prophecy_n or_o type_n and_o that_o there_o be_v no_o certain_a mean_n of_o direction_n to_o the_o sense_n and_o than_o that_o therefore_o there_o must_v be_v a_o infallible_a judge_n but_o nothing_o be_v answer_v to_o my_o answer_n about_o it_o and_o do_v he_o think_v that_o the_o jew_n do_v not_o understand_v the_o manner_n of_o expression_n of_o the_o prophet_n in_o their_o own_o language_n or_o that_o david_n do_v not_o bear_v the_o type_n of_o christ_n how_o else_o be_v they_o save_v in_o the_o time_n before_o christ_n and_o be_v the_o exact_a sense_n of_o every_o expression_n or_o type_n necessary_a such_o exception_n do_v not_o weigh_v and_o then_o again_o if_o there_o have_v be_v need_n in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o law_n of_o a_o infallible_a judge_n for_o a_o infallible_a illumination_n of_o dark_a expression_n then_o if_o so_o dato_fw-la non_fw-la concesso_fw-la what_o be_v this_o to_o the_o necessity_n of_o a_o infallible_a judge_n in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o gospel_n which_o be_v the_o old_a testament_n reveal_v 54._o n_o 54._o to_o pass_v by_o any_o slip_n in_o the_o former_a number_n by_o the_o scribe_n or_o otherwise_o we_o come_v to_o this_o paragr_n wherein_o he_o be_v not_o please_v to_o say_v any_o thing_n to_o what_o be_v reply_v about_o the_o several_a sense_n of_o scripture_n but_o he_o will_v here_o corroborate_v his_o argument_n with_o dr._n tailer_n judgement_n in_o his_o discourse_n of_o the_o liberty_n of_o prophesy_v and_o he_o say_v he_o think_v i_o not_o to_o be_v so_o much_o esteem_v among_o our_o own_o clergy_n or_o laity_n as_o he_o i_o confess_v it_o neque_fw-la de_fw-la i_o quisquam_fw-la vilius_fw-la sentit_fw-la quam_fw-la ipse_fw-la as_o one_o say_v but_o though_o this_o be_v very_o true_a that_o my_o authority_n be_v not_o comparable_a to_o he_o yet_o it_o be_v not_o rational_a for_o my_o adversary_n to_o diminish_v i_o because_o it_o make_v a_o prejudice_n to_o his_o cause_n that_o so_o weak_a a_o man_n can_v oppose_v it_o and_o therefore_o i_o can_v spare_v he_o in_o this_o kind_n let_v my_o adversary_n be_v the_o champion_n of_o his_o cause_n and_o yet_o it_o may_v be_v the_o reverend_n and_o learned_a author_n he_o name_v be_v not_o always_o please_v with_o whatsoever_o he_o say_v in_o that_o book_n and_o yet_o also_o we_o can_v grant_v what_o be_v say_v by_o the_o doctor_n who_o do_v not_o say_v that_o no_o argument_n can_v be_v draw_v from_o scripture_n but_o from_o those_o scripture_n which_o have_v many_o sense_n neither_o do_v he_o say_v that_o those_o text_n which_o have_v many_o sense_n do_v contain_v point_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n nor_o do_v he_o say_v that_o if_o they_o do_v contain_v point_n necessary_a they_o be_v not_o elsewhere_o explain_v by_o more_o clear_a text_n or_o may_v be_v explain_v for_o so_o he_o shall_v disagree_v from_o st._n austin_n as_o before_o but_o to_o say_v no_o more_o let_v the_o doctor_n have_v the_o honour_n with_o all_o my_o heart_n of_o the_o umpirage_n of_o the_o controversy_n in_o the_o example_n which_o my_o adversary_n have_v put_v take_v for_o a_o example_n those_o four_o word_n this_o be_v my_o body_n indeed_o some_o there_o be_v which_o will_v have_v five_o word_n hoc_fw-la est_fw-la enim_fw-la corpus_fw-la meum_fw-la and_o also_o it_o may_v be_v say_v that_o he_o may_v exceed_v in_o his_o number_n of_o interpretation_n of_o these_o word_n unless_o he_o take_v in_o their_o own_o many_o difference_n hereabout_o in_o the_o manner_n and_o time_n of_o the_o conversion_n they_o will_v hardly_o come_v up_o to_o two_o hundred_o divers_a interpretation_n and_o whereas_o he_o say_v that_o we_o say_v that_o they_o be_v speak_v in_o a_o figurative_a sense_n and_o not_o in_o their_o natural_a sense_n we_o can_v answer_v that_o we_o do_v deny_v the_o literal_a sense_n and_o do_v not_o deny_v that_o the_o figurative_a sense_n may_v be_v say_v in_o a_o good_a sort_n natural_a to_o the_o sacramental_a use_n by_o reason_n of_o the_o 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d there_o be_v betwixt_o the_o sign_n and_o the_o thing_n signify_v and_o much_o more_o may_v be_v say_v herein_o but_o let_v this_o point_n be_v compromise_v to_o the_o doctor_n in_o that_o excellent_a book_n which_o he_o have_v late_o write_v on_o purpose_n he_o say_v all_o that_o i_o can_v say_v and_o more_o here_o he_o will_v make_v good_a another_o argument_n of_o his_o the_o scripture_n use_v the_o imperative_fw-it mood_n as_o well_o when_o it_o counsel_v as_o when_o it_o command_v he_n ask_v now_o what_o infallible_a mean_n we_o have_v to_o know_v what_o be_v recommend_v to_o we_o as_o a_o counsel_n or_o as_o a_o precept_n to_o be_v keep_v under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n we_o answer_v first_o suppose_v the_o doctrine_n of_o counsel_n to_o be_v right_a and_o sound_a yet_o be_v they_o in_o no_o great_a danger_n by_o the_o uncertainty_n whether_o such_o a_o thing_n be_v propose_v by_o way_n of_o counsel_n or_o precept_n since_o they_o hold_v it_o to_o be_v a_o thing_n of_o great_a perfection_n to_o perform_v a_o counsel_n therefore_o if_o they_o take_v a_o thing_n of_o counsel_n for_o a_o thing_n of_o command_n there_o be_v no_o danger_n sure_o in_o do_v more_o than_o they_o be_v simple_o command_v to_o so_o than_o if_o this_o be_v all_o it_o will_v be_v no_o such_o difficulty_n as_o to_o practice_v because_o if_o they_o do_v whatsoever_o be_v propose_v pro_fw-la imperio_fw-la in_o the_o imperative_fw-it mood_n there_o be_v no_o danger_n if_o it_o be_v command_v it_o be_v necessary_a if_o counsel_v there_o be_v great_a perfection_n and_o a_o accidental_a reward_n above_o the_o essential_a god_n can_v distinguish_v which_o be_v which_o though_o they_o can_v and_o sure_o will_n if_o their_o opinion_n be_v true_a reward_v they_o according_o and_o if_o there_o be_v any_o
determine_v that_o grave_a question_n without_o call_v a_o council_n ans_fw-fr first_o if_o those_o term_n can_v not_o attend_v a_o absolute_a negation_n of_o power_n they_o be_v deny_v for_o they_o that_o be_v infallible_a in_o their_o doctrine_n can_v have_v several_o determine_v that_o controversy_n as_o we_o take_v power_n absolute_o as_o well_o as_o st._n peter_n confirm_v st._n paul_n doctrine_n according_a to_o they_o but_o he_o seem_v to_o mean_v it_o in_o a_o qualify_a sense_n after_o the_o manner_n of_o aquinas_n distinction_n of_o necessity_n therefore_o thus_o he_o for_o this_o be_v necessary_a for_o the_o better_a conviction_n of_o heretic_n full_a satisfaction_n of_o the_o weak_a sort_n and_o further_a comfort_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n this_o end_n of_o call_v a_o council_n upon_o such_o a_o necessity_n i_o suppose_v he_o reflect_v to_o the_o council_n of_o the_o apostle_n as_o if_o the_o sense_n shall_v be_v they_o can_v not_o convenient_o and_o upon_o the_o supposition_n of_o such_o end_n determine_v that_o grave_a question_n without_o call_v a_o council_n but_o then_o we_o be_v not_o under_o a_o absolute_a necessity_n of_o a_o council_n and_o until_o this_o be_v prove_v my_o adversary_n have_v do_v nothing_o for_o a_o necessity_n of_o convenience_n of_o a_o council_n will_v not_o serve_v their_o purpose_n because_o we_o can_v grant_v it_o but_o 2._o we_o say_v this_o example_n be_v not_o for_o his_o turn_n because_o this_o council_n be_v call_v upon_o a_o question_n about_o thing_n in_o their_o nature_n not_o necessary_a but_o we_o be_v upon_o the_o debate_n of_o the_o absolute_a necessity_n of_o council_n in_o and_o for_o thing_n necessary_a not_o thing_n of_o scandal_n only_o and_o yet_o again_o 3._o as_o it_o be_v common_o note_v they_o in_o their_o council_n can_v conclude_v their_o determination_n as_o in_o that_o council_n of_o the_o apostle_n it_o have_v seem_v good_a to_o the_o holy_a ghost_n and_o to_o u●_n because_o those_o apostle_n be_v infallible_a in_o their_o discourse_n as_o well_o a_o in_o their_o conclusion_n but_o those_o who_o be_v now_o member_n of_o council_n be_v confess_v by_o stapleton_n to_o be_v fallible_a in_o their_o discourse_n and_o how_o then_o shall_v we_o be_v sure_a that_o they_o be_v infallible_a in_o the_o conclusion_n unless_o they_o can_v prove_v that_o though_o the_o discourse_n be_v not_o rational_a the_o conclusion_n will_v yet_o be_v prophetical_a and_o yet_o 4._o the_o apostle_n themselves_o proceed_v to_o the_o determination_n of_o this_o question_n by_o principle_n of_o scripture_n therefore_o scripture_n be_v the_o high_a principle_n to_o raise_v faith_n even_o in_o thing_n of_o controversy_n and_o this_o conclude_v against_o they_o who_o make_v the_o church_n in_o business_n of_o faith_n to_o be_v the_o high_a principle_n and_o therefore_o also_o whatsoever_o bind_v the_o christian_a faith_n have_v its_o obligation_n by_o virtue_n of_o scripture_n so_o than_o nothing_o he_o say_v do_v sufficient_o render_v that_o sense_n or_o use_v he_o make_v of_o that_o text_n dic_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la and_o yet_o he_o have_v not_o then_o find_v though_o he_o do_v thrasonical_o say_v so_o a_o judge_n in_o matter_n of_o faith_n a_o live_a judge_n a_o infallible_a judge_n exclude_v all_o possibility_n of_o error_n we_o can_v help_v they_o to_o find_v judge_n dicendo_fw-la pluraliter_fw-la but_o such_o a_o judge_n as_o he_o speak_v of_o here_o he_o have_v no_o more_o hope_n to_o find_v then_o need_v to_o seek_v and_o yet_o such_o a_o judge_n he_o must_v have_v for_o the_o justification_n of_o christ_n law_n in_o the_o former_a text_n otherwise_o christ_n can_v not_o possible_o have_v declare_v it_o to_o be_v so_o heinous_a a_o crime_n not_o to_o hear_v the_o church_n be_v that_o it_o may_v have_v be_v no_o crime_n at_o all_o he_o oblige_v all_o to_o obey_v and_o hear_v she_o therefore_o she_o can_v lead_v we_o into_o a_o error_n ans_fw-fr i_o think_v we_o shall_v not_o have_v have_v so_o many_o word_n about_o such_o assent_n if_o they_o have_v not_o more_o need_v thereof_o then_o the_o text_n or_o christ_n of_o their_o defence_n they_o have_v more_o necessity_n of_o christ_n justification_n than_o he_o of_o they_o his_o word_n above_o have_v two_o form_n one_o in_o a_o hypotheticall_a way_n the_o other_o in_o way_n of_o a_o enthymem_n i_o deny_v the_o consequence_n in_o both_o and_o to_o they_o both_o i_o suppose_v one_o proposition_n and_o that_o be_v this_o christ_n command_n to_o obey_v do_v not_o infer_v impossibility_n of_o error_n in_o the_o church_n simple_o it_o be_v therefore_o false_a what_o he_o will_v have_v to_o be_v consequential_a to_o hear_v the_o church_n therefore_o have_v two_o thing_n in_o it_o one_o act_n which_o be_v internal_a and_o that_o be_v to_o give_v assent_n to_o what_o the_o church_n shall_v order_v the_o other_o a_o external_a act_n of_o submission_n the_o former_a may_v be_v deny_v and_o therefore_o she_o may_v err_v the_o latter_a may_v be_v due_a and_o therefore_o not_o to_o be_v deny_v and_o consequent_o his_o infallibility_n of_o knowledge_n of_o this_o point_n be_v not_o so_o grea●_n as_o of_o those_o point_n which_o be_v deliver_v by_o scripture_n namely_o not_o understand_v it_o de_fw-mi facto_fw-la because_o his_o knowledge_n of_o point_n deliver_v by_o scripture_n be_v de_fw-fr industria_fw-la small_a but_o de_fw-fr posse_fw-mi his_o knowledge_n of_o point_n of_o faith_n deliver_v by_o scripture_n may_v be_v great_a than_o his_o knowledge_n of_o this_o because_o it_o be_v not_o deliver_v by_o scripture_n so_o that_o for_o his_o creed_n i_o say_v as_o the_o frenchman_n proverbial_o be_v wont_v il_fw-fr ne_fw-fr point_fw-fr damn_v qui_fw-fr ne_fw-fr le_fw-fr coit_fw-fr he_o be_v not_o damn_v that_o do_v not_o believe_v it_o there_o be_v difference_n betwixt_o stand_v up_o to_o what_o be_v propose_v and_o stand_v out_o against_o the_o church_n in_o contempt_n absolute_a belief_n will_v then_o be_v rational_a when_o moral_a assurance_n which_o yet_o be_v not_o always_o to_o be_v have_v make_v faith_n and_o when_o he_o have_v prove_v the_o assumption_n that_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v only_o this_o church_n and_o by_o manifest_a consequence_n then_o the_o pope_n shall_v be_v no_o usurper_n and_o yet_o not_o infallible_a neither_o we_o deny_v the_o postulate_v with_o a_o contradiction_n because_o we_o can_v deny_v the_o church_n definition_n without_o a_o contradiction_n then_o in_o the_o seven_o and_o eight_o number_n he_o use_v plain-evasion_n in_o the_o seven_o he_o tell_v i_o that_o he_o do_v not_o use_v that_o method_n which_o i_o tell_v he_o he_o shall_v have_v use_v in_o some_o favour_n to_o i_o when_o i_o come_v to_o use_v this_o very_a method_n i_o do_v foresee_v that_o it_o will_v so_o gall_a you_o and_o he_o say_v i_o will_v have_v the_o burden_n shift_v off_o to_o the_o other_o shoulder_n to_o avoid_v present_a trouble_n ans_fw-fr these_o be_v his_o rhodomontadoe_n be_v not_o the_o method_n a_o priori_fw-la more_o rational_a if_o he_o can_v prove_v the_o church_n infallible_a and_o absolute_a authority_n to_o belong_v to_o it_o our_o obedience_n must_v follow_v but_o since_o obedience_n be_v ambiguous_a and_o distinguishable_a though_o obedience_n in_o some_o respect_n be_v due_a yet_o not_o on_o that_o part_n which_o infer_v infallibility_n but_o on_o that_o part_n which_o respect_v authority_n as_o we_o take_v authority_n for_o power_n 2._o there_o be_v nothing_o say_v by_o he_o former_o which_o i_o have_v not_o full_o answer_v and_o now_o the_o reinforcement_n but_o it_o become_v he_o to_o say_v so_o who_o be_v more_o pinch_v and_o how_o will_v he_o quit_v himself_o in_o this_o method_n we_o be_v to_o see_v in_o th●●2_n numb_a and_o in_o the_o eight_o numb_v here_o he_o tell_v i_o the_o reason_n why_o he_o say_v nothing_o to_o st._n augustine_n authority_n produce_v by_o i_o namely_o lest_o he_o shall_v lose_v his_o labour_n but_o i_o know_v a_o better_a reason_n because_o he_o will_v find_v too_o much_o labour_n to_o answer_v it_o and_o as_o quick_a dispatch_v the_o nine_o paragr_n deserve_v for_o he_o do_v not_o offer_v any_o answer_n to_o any_o reason_n in_o i_o but_o here_o snap_v in_o order_n to_o a_o vindication_n of_o the_o text_n matt._n 20.7_o for_o his_o cause_n he_o take_v exception_n at_o our_o translation_n shall_v keep_v knowledge_n he_o render_v it_o shall_v keep_v i_o defend_v the_o translation_n by_o the_o possibility_n of_o that_o sense_n in_o the_o hebrew_n because_o it_o have_v no_o formal_a subjunctive_a by_o the_o scope_n of_o the_o text_n because_o they_o be_v blame_v for_o their_o default_n he_o persist_v against_o our_o translation_n because_o all_o original_n he_o mean_v all_o copy_n or_o indeed_o all_o translation_n he_o shall_v mean_v because_o of_o what_o follow_v speak_v clear_o in_o the_o future_a
text_n confirm_v the_o certainty_n of_o tradition_n we_o grant_v it_o namely_o of_o those_o tradition_n which_o be_v afterward_o write_v but_o how_o do_v these_o text_n confirm_v the_o certain_a necessity_n of_o those_o that_o be_v not_o write_v and_o therefore_o three_o he_o be_v mighty_o disappoint_v if_o he_o conceive_v those_o text_n shall_v bind_v we_o to_o stand_v upon_o tradition_n now_o more_o than_o ever_o for_o the_o formality_n of_o tradition_n be_v there_o sink_v in_o the_o write_n and_o the_o matter_n of_o tradition_n be_v the_o same_o with_o that_o which_o be_v write_v in_o his_o own_o confession_n unless_o he_o drive_v the_o text_n heterogeneous_o to_o his_o own_o word_n and_o he_o impinge_v upon_o the_o same_o stone_n again_o what_o wise_a man_n will_v put_v ●ut_v one_o light_n cost_v he_o nothing_o because_o it_o will_v be_v shine_v of_o its_o own_o nature_n unless_o you_o will_v needs_o have_v i●_n hide_a because_o he_o have_v now_o another_o light_n but_o so_o that_o even_o with_o both_o those_o light_v many_o of_o his_o household_n will_v still_o remain_v i●_n darkness_n ans_fw-fr he_o suppose_v a_o light_n add_v to_o a_o light_n it_o be_v well_o then_o that_o scripture_n be_v assure_v to_o be_v one_o light_n but_o his_o tradition_n shall_v be_v compare_v to_o a_o light_n when_o there_o be_v no_o other_o light_n namely_o when_o the_o scripture_n be_v defective_a second_o if_o he_o think_v tradition_n be_v a_o light_n cost_v we_o nothing_o he_o may_v be_v deceive_v for_o it_o will_v cost_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o scrutiny_n since_o we_o can_v see_v it_o shine_v of_o its_o own_o nature_n infallible_o and_o three_o if_o some_o be_v still_o in_o darknese_n with_o both_o those_o light_n then_o sure_o they_o may_v be_v more_o in_o darkness_n with_o but_o one_o and_o that_o be_v tradition_n therefore_o they_o shall_v allow_v the_o people_n the_o light_n of_o the_o scripture_n since_o both_o too_o little_a as_o he_o say_v to_o some_o but_o fourthly_a what_o if_o one_o light_n put_v out_o the_o other_o in_o the_o true_a state_n of_o the_o question_n namely_o scripture_n tradition_n superad_v in_o matter_n and_o what_o wise_a man_n will_v light_v a_o straw_n candle_n in_o the_o father_n expression_n when_o the_o sun_n shine_v the_o sun-light_n of_o scripture_n put_v out_o the_o straw-light_n of_o tradition_n condemn_v those_o who_o teach_v for_o doctrine_n tradition_n of_o man_n which_o the_o romanist_n do_v in_o some_o proportion_n and_o five_o what_o wise_a man_n will_v have_v such_o a_o light_n which_o serve_v his_o turn_n best_o when_o it_o shine_v least_o for_o tradition_n if_o we_o believe_v our_o adversary_n be_v a_o cover_a dish_n dainty_n to_o be_v keep_v private_a for_o those_o who_o be_v fit_a to_o receive_v they_o the_o more_o wise_a and_o perfect_a man_n which_o may_v teach_v they_o to_o other_o the_o mystery_n of_o salvation_n that_o be_v make_v common_a by_o writing_n but_o the_o mystery_n of_o tradition_n be_v put_v under_o a_o bushel_n the_o mystery_n of_o the_o trinity_n be_v deliver_v in_o scripture_n but_o the_o mystery_n of_o the_o trent_n tradition_n must_v not_o be_v familiar_o know_v so_o then_o say_v they_o what_o they_o will_v or_o can_v we_o shall_v soon_o find_v a_o extinguisher_n for_o the_o light_n of_o the_o rush_n candle_n than_o they_o for_o the_o light_n of_o the_o sun_n but_o if_o you_o say_v that_o if_o scripture_n have_v not_o be_v give_v we_o we_o shall_v have_v have_v a_o more_o certain_a tradition_n give_v we_o so_o he_o deliver_v my_o word_n which_o be_v not_o so_o but_o thus_o if_o scripture_n have_v not_o be_v leave_v to_o we_o we_o shall_v have_v have_v tradition_n more_o certain_o convey_v to_o we_o as_o the_o gospel_n be_v before_o it_o be_v write_v now_o some_o difference_n there_o be_v betwixt_o give_v we_o and_o leave_v we_o for_o that_o which_o be_v leave_v to_o we_o be_v intend_v for_o our_o constant_a use_n which_o that_o which_o be_v give_v do_v not_o connotate_n so_o some_o pontifician_n will_v say_v the_o scripture_n be_v give_v upon_o particular_a occasion_n but_o be_v not_o leave_v to_o the_o church_n as_o a_o fix_a universal_a rule_n but_o there_o be_v yet_o more_o betwixt_o we_o about_o my_o word_n we_o shall_v have_v have_v tradition_n more_o certain_o convey_v to_o we_o so_o i_o say_v he_o report_v i_o thus_o we_o shall_v have_v have_v a_o more_o certain_a tradition_n give_v unto_o we_o a_o more_o certain_a tradition_n give_v and_o a_o tradition_n more_o certain_o convey_v be_v not_o altogether_o the_o same_o the_o former_a suppose_v the_o matter_n of_o tradition_n as_o not_o certain_a and_o this_o we_o can_v deny_v as_o to_o those_o time_n when_o there_o be_v no_o scripture_n as_o write_v the_o other_o speak_v de_fw-fr modo_fw-la tradendi_fw-la which_o come_v close_o to_o our_o question_n for_o we_o can_v persuade_v ourselves_o that_o god_n who_o be_v gracious_o provident_a for_o his_o church_n wherein_o he_o have_v place_v his_o name_n will_v have_v take_v care_n that_o if_o there_o have_v not_o be_v a_o certain_a direction_n in_o writing_n the_o matter_n of_o necessary_a doctrine_n and_o practice_n shall_v have_v be_v more_o certain_o communicate_v to_o we_o so_o then_o he_o thrive_v very_o little_a by_o compare_n of_o the_o christian_a church_n with_o the_o jewish_a although_o the_o christian_a church_n be_v more_o noble_a for_o first_o the_o compare_n must_v be_v of_o the_o jewish_a with_o the_o whole_a christian_a church_n because_o the_o jewish_a church_n proselyt_n be_v include_v therein_o namely_o proselyt_v of_o the_o covenant_n as_o they_o be_v distinguish_v be_v all_o the_o church_n there_o be_v and_o second_o because_o no_o part_n of_o the_o whole_a church_n can_v compare_v with_o the_o jewish_a church_n as_o to_o privilege_n and_o then_o by_o this_o reckon_n how_o little_a of_o nobility_n will_v fall_v to_o their_o share_n three_o as_o the_o tradition_n which_o be_v it_o whereby_o the_o matter_n of_o scripture_n be_v propose_v be_v for_o the_o time_n necessary_a before_o the_o matter_n of_o scripture_n be_v write_v so_o also_o must_v the_o tradition_n of_o the_o christian_a church_n be_v consider_v as_o in_o relation_n to_o the_o time_n before_o which_o the_o matter_n of_o the_o new_a testament_n be_v write_v therefore_o he_o shall_v have_v plead_v if_o he_o will_v have_v it_o do_v pat_o that_o there_o be_v any_o tradition_n of_o faith_n after_o the_o old_a law_n be_v write_v beside_o what_o be_v write_v which_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v unto_o salvation_n equal_o to_o what_o be_v write_v and_o then_o have_v draw_v down_o a_o parallel_n line_n of_o proportion_n of_o the_o same_o though_o he_o will_v have_v more_o nobility_n for_o the_o christian_a church_n three_o if_o the_o nobleness_n of_o a_o church_n be_v antecedent_n to_o more_o certain_a tradition_n as_o he_o think_v then_o how_o happen_v it_o that_o there_o be_v so_o little_a a_o time_n betwixt_o the_o preach_n of_o the_o gospel_n and_o the_o write_n of_o it_o it_o seem_v then_o if_o god_n provide_v for_o church_n according_a to_o the_o nobleness_n of_o they_o that_o the_o better_a provision_n for_o the_o church_n be_v by_o scripture_n the_o christian_a then_o have_v a_o more_o certain_a way_n of_o faith_n than_o by_o tradition_n and_o as_o for_o mean_n of_o secure_v tradition_n in_o the_o christian_a church_n which_o he_o compare_v with_o the_o jewish_a in_o he_o have_v no_o cause_n to_o brag_v for_o first_o they_o can_v say_v or_o prove_v that_o they_o have_v all_o tradition_n in_o number_n formal_a and_o material_a second_o they_o do_v not_o practise_v all_o how_o many_o be_v there_o which_o st._n basil_n speak_v of_o in_o his_o tract_n de_fw-fr sp._n sanct._n which_o they_o observe_v not_o three_o the_o safety_n of_o they_o be_v in_o the_o whole_a church_n and_o yet_o forsooth_o every_o one_o must_v not_o know_v they_o four_o if_o so_o then_o have_v they_o reason_n to_o blush_v that_o they_o have_v be_v more_o careful_a to_o keep_v tradition_n than_o scripture_n and_o particular_o of_o the_o hebrew_n copy_n of_o st._n matthew_n and_o be_v this_o for_o their_o credit_n five_o be_v the_o scripture_n preserve_v uncorrupt_a or_o not_o if_o not_o how_o have_v they_o be_v faithful_a as_o before_o if_o so_o then_o why_o do_v their_o learned_a man_n obtrude_v the_o authentiqueness_n of_o their_o latin_n upon_o this_o account_n that_o when_o this_o edition_n be_v make_v the_o scripture_n be_v pure_a and_o uncorrupted_a but_o corrupt_v since_o again_o the_o tradition_n of_o christ_n primitive_a church_n before_o the_o scripture_n be_v write_v and_o sufficient_o promulge_v be_v to_o be_v believe_v upon_o her_o sole_a authority_n ans_fw-fr if_o he_o take_v that_o tradition_n inclusive_o to_o the_o apostle_n who_o preach_v that_o which_o they_o do_v write_v
church_n all_o he_o say_v be_v nothing_o against_o so_o much_o use_v of_o it_o as_o i_o make_v for_o i_o do_v not_o argue_v so_o because_o there_o be_v such_o ebraism_n therefore_o this_o be_v to_o be_v so_o expound_v we_o say_v it_o follow_v not_o as_o to_o a_o actual_a necessity_n of_o such_o a_o interpretation_n no_o but_o thus_o it_o will_v follow_v there_o be_v such_o hebrew_n form_n of_o preface_v therefore_o this_o may_v be_v so_o interpret_v now_o the_o possibility_n of_o such_o a_o exposition_n be_v sufficient_a to_o my_o purpose_n for_o possibility_n of_o the_o contrary_a stop_v the_o mouth_n of_o infallibility_n if_o this_o or_o that_o be_v infallible_a it_o be_v not_o possible_a to_o be_v any_o other_o way_n but_o the_o sense_n may_v be_v otherwise_o therefore_o this_o be_v not_o the_o infallible_a sense_n so_o we_o agree_v with_o dr._n taylor_n who_o he_o quote_v because_o the_o doctor_n may_v deny_v the_o argumentation_n as_o quoad_fw-la esse_fw-la we_o intend_v it_o sufficient_o quoad_fw-la posse_fw-la it_o may_v be_v otherwise_o expound_v than_o they_o say_v therefore_o can_v we_o hereby_o infallible_o know_v this_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n suppose_v the_o church_n be_v infallible_a yet_o if_o we_o do_v not_o infallible_o know_v so_o much_o we_o can_v make_v the_o church_n our_o ground_n of_o faith_n nor_o can_v there_o be_v any_o consistence_n of_o their_o implicit_a faith_n if_o they_o do_v not_o know_v infallible_o that_o whatsoever_o the_o church_n propound_v be_v infallible_a and_o a_o exception_n against_o this_o interpretation_n be_v that_o it_o be_v new_a unheard_a of_o to_o all_o antiquity_n and_o unto_o all_o man_n unto_o this_o age_n ans_fw-fr this_o exception_n will_v have_v come_v better_o from_o some_o other_o since_o my_o adversary_n have_v no_o mind_n to_o answer_v i_o to_o some_o authority_n of_o the_o antient._n it_o be_v worth_a the_o while_n to_o quit_v the_o criticism_n upon_o condition_n they_o will_v hold_v to_o antiquity_n but_o who_o say_v be_v that_o omnes_fw-la patres_fw-la sic_fw-la ego_fw-la autem_fw-la non_fw-la sic_fw-la and_o yet_o neither_o be_v this_o a_o sufficient_a answer_n unless_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o father_n can_v make_v a_o conclusion_n to_o be_v of_o faith_n so_o then_o as_o the_o florentine_a say_v of_o virtue_n that_o the_o show_n of_o it_o be_v profitable_a but_o the_o practice_n not_o so_o also_o may_v it_o be_v say_v of_o the_o italian_n that_o the_o show_n of_o antiquity_n be_v of_o use_n to_o they_o but_o the_o thing_n not_o but_o also_o it_o will_v be_v too_o hard_a for_o every_o one_o of_o they_o to_o prove_v a_o negative_a neither_o be_v many_o of_o the_o father_n learned_a in_o the_o hebrew_n tongue_n he_o go_v on_o whether_o this_o infallibility_n be_v equal_a to_o that_o of_o the_o apostle_n or_o not_o make_v not_o to_o our_o purpose_n ans_fw-fr sure_o infallibility_n never_o take_v any_o degree_n with_o their_o doctor_n it_o be_v not_o receptive_a of_o magis_fw-la &_o minus_fw-la therefore_o if_o he_o assert_v not_o a_o equal_a infallibility_n he_o assert_v none_o less_o in_o infallibility_n be_v less_o than_o infallibility_n so_o then_o their_o church_n now_o be_v not_o such_o as_o to_o rely_v upon_o equal_o to_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o apostle_n therefore_o it_o must_v be_v subordinate_a to_o apostolical_a authority_n which_o indeed_o be_v in_o effect_n confess_v before_o in_o that_o he_o grant_v that_o the_o church_n be_v regula_fw-la regulata_fw-la and_o this_o be_v as_o much_o as_o the_o cause_n be_v worth_a he_o say_v i_o note_v he_o in_o a_o parenthesis_n for_o a_o french_a catholic_a for_o allow_v infallibility_n to_o the_o pope_n define_v with_o a_o council_n ans_fw-fr no._n he_o or_o his_o scribe_n be_v much_o mistake_v i_o ask_v he_o whether_o he_o have_v a_o mind_n to_o the_o opinion_n of_o the_o french_a catholic_n because_o he_o in_o one_o place_n speak_v of_o the_o infallible_a assistance_n of_o the_o church_n without_o any_o mention_n of_o the_o pope_n now_o if_o he_o do_v on_o purpose_n leave_v out_o the_o pope_n in_o his_o account_n of_o infallibility_n than_o he_o be_v like_a to_o be_v a_o french_a catholic_n and_o although_o all_o roman_a catholic_n allow_v infallibility_n to_o a_o pope_n define_v with_o a_o council_n cumulative_a yet_o all_o roman_a catholic_n do_v not_o allow_v infallibility_n to_o the_o pope_n only_o then_o when_o he_o define_v with_o a_o council_n as_o some_o catholic_n do_v allow_v full_a authority_n to_o a_o council_n without_o a_o pope_n so_o some_o catholic_n allow_v infallible_a authority_n to_o a_o pope_n without_o a_o council_n and_o this_o be_v more_o than_o i_o need_v to_o have_v say_v to_o he_o that_o sale_n in_o this_o paragraph_n so_o little_a to_o i_o yet_o he_o will_v charge_v i_o with_o charge_v he_o with_o a_o opinion_n which_o bring_v he_o within_o peril_n of_o blasphemy_n his_o opinion_n be_v this_o god_n give_v as_o much_o infallible_a assistance_n to_o the_o church_n in_o a_o council_n as_o he_o give_v to_o he_o who_o do_v deliver_v his_o word_n in_o scripture_n my_o reason_n be_v this_o for_o herein_o it_o appear_v that_o now_o there_o be_v no_o need_n of_o scripture_n since_o god_n speak_v as_o infallible_o by_o his_o church_n as_o in_o his_o word_n he_o deny_v the_o inference_n i_o maintain_v the_o charge_n more_o presse_o thus_o he_o that_o infer_v no_o need_n of_o scripture_n come_v within_o peril_n of_o blasphemy_n he_o that_o say_v such_o word_n as_o before_o infer_v no_o need_n of_o scripture_n therefore_o to_o the_o major_a in_o effect_n he_o have_v say_v nothing_o his_o discourse_n be_v bend_v against_o the_o matter_n of_o the_o minor_a and_o he_o will_v deny_v it_o by_o several_a instance_n which_o come_v not_o up_o to_o the_o case_n in_o hand_n first_o because_o he_o speak_v infallible_o by_o the_o church_n of_o the_o law_n of_o nature_n for_o two_o thousand_o year_n and_o why_o more_o blasphemy_n now_o to_o this_o in_o the_o matter_n of_o it_o we_o have_v speak_v before_o as_o apply_v here_o we_o shall_v answer_v to_o it_o now_o first_o he_o do_v not_o then_o speak_v infallible_o by_o his_o church_n if_o the_o term_n by_o his_o church_n be_n mean_v reduplicative_o to_o whatsoever_o be_v say_v by_o his_o church_n if_o it_o be_v understand_v thus_o that_o whatsoever_o truth_n be_v propose_v by_o god_n be_v propose_v by_o the_o church_n it_o may_v be_v more_o easy_o grant_v in_o the_o former_a sense_n the_o reason_n be_v good_a if_o it_o be_v true_a in_o the_o latter_a it_o may_v be_v suppose_v true_a yet_o it_o be_v not_o sufficient_a to_o his_o use_n who_o urge_v that_o nothing_o be_v propose_v by_o the_o church_n but_o that_o which_o be_v true_a and_o from_o god_n yea_o 2._o it_o can_v be_v absolute_o grant_v in_o the_o second_o sense_n if_o we_o take_v the_o church_n to_o have_v speak_v from_o god_n in_o any_o way_n of_o a_o council_n for_o much_o truth_n of_o what_o be_v propose_v come_v to_o some_o of_o they_o by_o way_n of_o prophecy_n 3._o the_o term_n god_n speak_v infallible_o by_o his_o church_n may_v relate_v more_o strict_o to_o the_o agent_n or_o to_o the_o instrument_n god_n speak_v infallible_o whatsoever_o he_o speak_v by_o they_o but_o god_n do_v not_o speak_v infallible_o by_o they_o whatsoever_o they_o say_v or_o thus_o the_o word_n be_v true_a hypothetical_o if_o god_n speak_v he_o speak_v infallible_o by_o they_o for_o he_o can_v speak_v otherwise_o but_o that_o whatsoever_o they_o say_v be_v speak_v to_o they_o infallible_o by_o god_n be_v a_o question_n yea_o 4._o will_v they_o think_v that_o there_o be_v as_o much_o reason_n for_o infallible_a speak_n by_o the_o church_n when_o the_o scripture_n canon_n be_v complete_v as_o when_o there_o be_v none_o as_o to_o god_n speak_v by_o moses_n we_o have_v speak_v to_o it_o last_o as_o to_o god_n speak_v to_o some_o gentile_n by_o the_o church_n that_o be_v not_o ordinary_a and_o therefore_o it_o fit_v not_o our_o case_n neither_o can_v they_o prove_v that_o the_o faith_n of_o the_o gentile_n be_v not_o wrought_v in_o they_o by_o the_o efficiency_n of_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n notwithstanding_o they_o have_v the_o object_n of_o their_o faith_n from_o the_o church_n neither_o be_v it_o now_o the_o same_o case_n of_o teach_v we_o infallible_o by_o the_o church_n as_o at_o the_o time_n when_o the_o apostle_n do_v write_v because_o the_o christian_a church_n be_v then_o to_o be_v settle_v upon_o the_o foundation_n of_o the_o apostle_n as_o st._n paul_n speak_v and_o now_o the_o building_n can_v stand_v upon_o that_o foundation_n therefore_o be_v they_o extraordinary_a officer_n and_o last_v but_o for_o a_o time_n and_o yet_o if_o they_o can_v prove_v that_o their_o church-doctrine_n be_v no_o other_o than_o that_o which_o be_v
against_o the_o arrian_n but_o it_o may_v be_v the_o arrian_n do_v not_o care_n for_o the_o authority_n of_o a_o council_n and_o therefore_o st._n austin_n wave_v the_o nicene_n council_n yea_o then_o how_o be_v the_o authority_n of_o a_o council_n a_o catholic_n remedy_n and_o than_o it_o seem_v the_o nicene_n father_n determine_v against_o they_o not_o by_o their_o authority_n which_o they_o care_v not_o for_o but_o by_o the_o scripture_n so_o then_o the_o disteem_n of_o that_o council_n of_o ariminum_n be_v upon_o respect_n to_o the_o matter_n of_o the_o definition_n and_o so_o a_o council_n be_v not_o in_o their_o opinion_n ipso_fw-la facto_fw-la infallible_a therefore_o he_o proc_v in_o a_o fallacy_n if_o he_o argue_v thus_o it_o be_v never_o by_o the_o father_n no_o nor_o by_o the_o church_n of_o england_n number_v among_o the_o four_o first_o council_n therefore_o it_o be_v reject_v because_o it_o be_v not_o account_v a_o lawful_a council_n because_o it_o be_v reject_v therefore_o for_o this_o cause_n do_v not_o follow_v because_o the_o genus_fw-la do_v contain_v potential_o more_o species_n it_o be_v refuse_v upon_o dislike_n of_o the_o matter_n it_o seem_v as_o before_o and_o as_o for_o the_o reason_n why_o it_o be_v not_o lawful_a he_o touch_v not_o here_o and_o it_o be_v cashier_v before_o he_o go_v on_o and_o you_o may_v as_o well_o think_v that_o i_o may_v prevail_v against_o you_o by_o only_o cite_v the_o council_n of_o trent_n etc._n etc._n ans_fw-fr sure_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n in_o all_o respect_v considerable_a be_v as_o hopeful_a towards_o infallibility_n as_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n it_o may_v be_v more_o by_o a_o a_o great_a number_n of_o bishop_n and_o this_o with_o my_o adversary_n shall_v have_v bear_v some_o weight_n who_o shall_v think_v that_o multitude_n of_o counselor_n be_v half_a a_o argument_n of_o truth_n because_o he_o will_v not_o place_v infallibility_n in_o a_o singular_a person_n as_o the_o jesuit_n but_o in_o a_o council_n with_o the_o pope_n and_o if_o he_o say_v that_o there_o be_v want_v in_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n the_o presence_n or_o consent_n of_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n we_o can_v easy_o answer_v that_o he_o then_o have_v but_o a_o single_a suffrage_n and_o there_o be_v some_o hundred_o of_o bishop_n more_o in_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n then_o be_v at_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n yea_o also_o some_o decree_n of_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n proceed_v without_o the_o pope_n confirmation_n as_o before_o but_o i_o think_v they_o be_v both_o alike_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n and_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n in_o be_v deceive_v only_o i_o think_v that_o st._n austin_n have_v less_o to_o say_v against_o the_o illegality_n of_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n than_o we_o have_v to_o say_v against_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n and_o therefore_o we_o may_v follow_v st._n austin_n and_o if_o he_o appeal_v from_o the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n to_o scripture_n we_o may_v as_o well_o appeal_v from_o that_o of_o trent_n if_o they_o will_v urge_v it_o he_o say_v st._n austin_n in_o vain_a have_v insist_v upon_o the_o nicene_n council_n against_o one_o who_o scoff_v at_o it_o ans_fw-fr i_o think_v if_o i_o may_v say_v so_o this_o be_v not_o very_o judicious_o speak_v because_o if_o maximinus_n urge_v the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n he_o be_v bind_v by_o equal_a law_n to_o be_v deal_v with_o by_o the_o nicene_n council_n if_o maximinus_n have_v not_o urge_v the_o council_n of_o ariminum_n it_o have_v seem_v that_o the_o arrian_n have_v not_o a_o persuasion_n that_o this_o controversy_n shall_v be_v otherwise_o handle_v then_o by_o scripture_n and_o if_o he_o be_v well_o furnish_v with_o other_o argument_n out_o of_o scripture_n admit_v by_o he_o as_o he_o it_o seem_v suppose_v that_o he_o may_v be_v what_o need_v then_o of_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n in_o council_n and_o it_o seem_v it_o be_v the_o short_a way_n and_o more_o expedite_a against_o heretic_n by_o scripture_n as_o he_o confess_v in_o the_o word_n follow_v that_o st._n austin_n intend_v by_o they_o only_o at_o that_o time_n to_o overthrow_v he_o and_o not_o to_o meddle_v with_o a_o long_a contention_n fit_a to_o fill_v a_o book_n alone_o above_o the_o validity_n of_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a and_o invalidity_n of_o that_o of_o ariminum_n put_v then_o these_o thing_n together_o st._n austin_n it_o seem_v may_v be_v sufficient_o furnish_v with_o argument_n out_o of_o scripture_n against_o the_o arrian_n he_o may_v by_o they_o only_o overthrow_v he_o it_o be_v a_o voluminous_a work_n to_o prove_v the_o legality_n of_o one_o council_n and_o the_o illegality_n of_o another_o the_o arrian_n scoff_v at_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a therefore_o the_o convenient_a and_o easy_a way_n of_o proceed_v with_o and_o against_o heretic_n be_v by_o scripture_n not_o by_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n and_o this_o interpretative_a be_v the_o yield_n of_o the_o cause_n and_o yet_o if_o they_o will_v yet_o think_v council_n as_o such_o to_o be_v infallible_a let_v they_o think_v upon_o that_o canon_n of_o nice_a declare_v equal_a 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d of_o the_o bishop_n of_o alexandria_n to_o rome_n and_o let_v they_o think_v of_o the_o council_n of_o chalcedon_n and_o the_o council_n of_o constantinople_n that_o the_o bishop_n of_o constantinople_n shall_v be_v equal_a in_o his_o limit_n to_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n the_o council_n of_o ephesus_n in_o their_o epistle_n to_o nestorius_n that_o peter_n and_o john_n be_v of_o equal_a dignity_n let_v they_o therefore_o consider_v well_o what_o they_o have_v to_o do_v for_o if_o council_n be_v not_o infallible_a they_o be_v in_o a_o error_n if_o council_n be_v infallible_a they_o be_v not_o because_o they_o have_v declare_v against_o they_o let_v they_o therefore_o stand_v on_o fall_n by_o scripture_n let_v they_o try_v it_o so_o as_o st._n austin_n do_v 29._o n._n 29._o his_o discourse_n herein_o be_v full_o put_v into_o this_o form_n all_o error_n in_o or_o against_o thing_n necessary_a be_v plain_o determine_v by_o scripture_n this_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n be_v not_o plain_o determine_v against_o by_o scripture_n therefore_o but_o therefore_o what_o that_o this_o be_v no_o error_n nay_o that_o be_v not_o right_o conclude_v but_o that_o it_o be_v not_o a_o error_n in_o thing_n necessary_a all_o error_n be_v not_o in_o thing_n necessary_a therefore_o if_o it_o conclude_v as_o it_o shall_v it_o be_v peccant_a in_o the_o ignorance_n of_o the_o elench_v for_o it_o be_v enough_o to_o we_o that_o it_o be_v a_o error_n suppose_v it_o be_v not_o a_o error_n in_o thing_n necessary_a if_o it_o conclude_v that_o therefore_o it_o be_v no_o error_n it_o conclude_v false_o 2._o though_o the_o proposition_n be_v our_o doctrine_n the_o assumption_n suppose_v that_o which_o be_v not_o necessary_a to_o be_v grant_v by_o we_o that_o this_o infallibility_n of_o the_o church_n be_v a_o error_n in_o thing_n necessary_a we_o do_v not_o deny_v it_o to_o be_v so_o but_o we_o be_v not_o by_o any_o argument_n constrain_v to_o say_v so_o for_o though_o we_o shall_v not_o hold_v it_o a_o error_n in_o necessary_n yet_o be_v it_o necessary_a to_o reject_v it_o as_o a_o error_n know_v it_o to_o be_v so_o and_o 3._o we_o say_v to_o the_o assumption_n that_o it_o be_v sufficient_o enough_o determine_v against_o by_o scripture_n namely_o as_o necessary_a to_o be_v in_o the_o church_n because_o in_o the_o scripture_n sufficiency_n to_o salvation_n be_v assert_v without_o it_o as_o before_o and_o 4._o the_o affirmative_a shall_v have_v be_v prove_v by_o they_o who_o assert_v it_o not_o the_o negative_a to_o be_v prove_v by_o we_o and_o as_o towards_o his_o proof_n of_o the_o assumption_n that_o the_o scripture_n be_v not_o so_o clear_a against_o this_o as_o for_o this_o we_o have_v nothing_o to_o say_v because_o he_o have_v nothing_o to_o prove_v it_o scaurus_n negar_n it_o beg_v and_o we_o can_v say_v better_a we_o have_v prove_v the_o contrary_n 29._o n._n 29._o here_o he_o resume_v a_o text_n for_o they_o st._n matthew_n 28._o ult._n i_o make_v answer_v to_o it_o before_o that_o it_o do_v not_o extend_v equal_a assistance_n to_o all_o age_n of_o the_o church_n he_o now_o urge_v i_o to_o show_v a_o text_n wherein_o the_o assistance_n which_o be_v infallible_a in_o the_o first_o age_n shall_v not_o be_v for_o the_o second_o or_o three_o age_n he_o say_v to_o i_o against_o your_o reason_n we_o have_v our_o reason_n ans_fw-fr he_o be_v here_o want_v in_o two_o office_n first_o in_o prove_v that_o that_o text_n do_v extend_v equal_a assistance_n to_o all_o age_n of_o the_o church_n for_o which_o the_o respondent_fw-la be_v to_o wait_v with_o his_o
because_o they_o may_v err_v as_o it_o be_v say_v of_o the_o milesian_n they_o be_v not_o fool_n but_o they_o can_v do_v foolish_a thing_n so_o though_o they_o be_v learn_v man_n though_o great_a divine_n yet_o may_v they_o possible_o propose_v that_o which_o be_v not_o so_o they_o reason_n point_n by_o the_o scripture_n which_o be_v wont_a as_o be_v note_v to_o be_v lay_v in_o the_o middle_n when_o they_o be_v in_o council_n but_o since_o they_o go_v to_o discourse_v from_o scripture_n in_o thing_n doubtful_a and_o do_v not_o see_v all_o conclusion_n in_o principle_n of_o scripture_n by_o way_n of_o intelligence_n it_o be_v possible_a for_o they_o not_o right_o to_o apply_v some_o principle_n of_o scripture_n to_o some_o particular_a case_n therefore_o since_o they_o have_v not_o a_o power_n not_o to_o err_v we_o have_v a_o power_n to_o suspend_v our_o faith_n nay_o we_o can_v give_v it_o without_o evidence_n of_o truth_n yet_o since_o they_o have_v a_o power_n to_o order_v we_o we_o have_v a_o duty_n not_o to_o oppose_v or_o disturb_v and_o thus_o this_o doctrine_n make_v way_n for_o faith_n not_o for_o heresy_n since_o we_o may_v differ_v from_o the_o opinion_n of_o the_o church_n even_o define_v and_o yet_o not_o be_v heretic_n because_o the_o formality_n of_o the_o heretic_n have_v itself_o in_o the_o will_n and_o wilful_a blindness_n be_v more_o apt_a to_o make_v heretic_n then_o a_o sober_a disquisition_n which_o will_v know_v what_o it_o do_v believe_v for_o belief_n be_v not_o divide_v against_o knowledge_n but_o science_n whereas_o you_o say_v afterward_o in_o your_o reply_n that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n and_o the_o church_n the_o ground_n of_o our_o belief_n nevertheless_o i_o answer_v i_o be_o very_o glad_a you_o confess_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n but_o this_o confession_n will_v destroy_v your_o position_n that_o the_o church_n be_v the_o ground_n of_o our_o belief_n in_o your_o sense_n for_o if_o that_o be_v our_o rule_n rule_v than_o our_o belief_n be_v to_o be_v rule_v by_o that_o for_o as_o clemens_n alexandrinus_n in_o the_o 7._o of_o his_o stromata_n say_v in_o this_o matter_n that_o principle_n which_o need_v another_o principle_n be_v not_o a_o principle_n so_o that_o rule_n which_o need_v another_o rule_n how_o be_v it_o a_o rule_n be_v it_o a_o adequate_a rule_n or_o not_o if_o so_o then_o where_o be_v your_o tradition_n if_o not_o how_o a_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n be_v it_o sufficient_a or_o not_o if_o sufficient_a then_o what_o necessity_n of_o your_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n especial_o for_o thing_n necessary_a which_o be_v plain_a if_o not_o sufficient_a then_o how_o a_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o manner_n and_o if_o both_o the_o scripture_n and_o the_o church_n be_v both_o ground_n of_o belief_n than_o either_o coordinate_a or_o subordinate_a not_o coordinate_a for_o then_o the_o voice_n of_o the_o church_n must_v be_v equal_a to_o the_o word_n of_o god_n without_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o who_o then_o will_v be_v guilty_a of_o the_o fanatical_a spirit_n if_o subordinate_a than_o the_o principal_a ground_n make_v the_o rest_n of_o faith_n and_o when_o i_o know_v god_n revelation_n in_o scripture_n what_o need_v i_o go_v to_o the_o church_n for_o authority_n or_o interpretation_n and_o beside_o where_o there_o be_v need_n of_o interpretation_n although_o it_o do_v belong_v to_o the_o church_n to_o interpret_v yet_o can_v we_o ground_v a_o belief_n in_o that_o interpretation_n unless_o it_o do_v appear_v that_o the_o church_n do_v interpret_v infallible_o but_o this_o be_v not_o yet_o prove_v &_o therefore_o your_o reason_n be_v not_o valid_a and_o if_o you_o say_v the_o church_n can_v err_v because_o it_o go_v by_o the_o exposition_n of_o the_o ancient_a father_n do_v but_o consider_v how_o hardly_o we_o can_v settle_v and_o fix_v belief_n therein_o for_o who_o have_v read_v they_o all_o yea_o how_o few_o know_v they_o all_o and_o who_o know_v whether_o he_o that_o do_v know_v they_o and_o have_v read_v they_o all_o do_v give_v we_o a_o right_a account_n of_o they_o who_o can_v exact_o distinguish_v betwixt_o those_o which_o be_v true_a and_o those_o which_o be_v false_a who_o can_v accurate_o discern_v of_o the_o true_a father_n which_o piece_n be_v true_a which_o be_v foist_v in_o who_o can_v perfect_o judge_v all_o their_o idiom_n of_o speech_n who_o can_v reconcile_v the_o difference_n betwixt_o one_o and_o another_o yea_o who_o can_v compose_v the_o difference_n betwixt_o themselves_o and_o that_o text_n which_o you_o produce_v of_o saint_n peter_n will_v do_v you_o no_o good_a for_o we_o do_v not_o magnify_v private_a interpretation_n we_o say_v private_a man_n shall_v advise_v with_o the_o church_n but_o be_v we_o sure_a that_o she_o have_v hit_v the_o right_a sense_n but_o as_o for_o the_o text_n it_o be_v impertinent_o produce_v if_o it_o be_v right_o interpret_v no_o prophecy_n of_o scripture_n be_v of_o private_a declaration_n and_o to_o this_o effect_n the_o syriack_n no_o prophetical_a solution_n be_v of_o private_a writing_n be_v not_o write_v by_o a_o private_a spirit_n for_o so_o it_o best_a agree_v with_o that_o which_o follow_v in_o the_o last_o verse_n for_o prophecy_n be_v not_o bring_v to_o we_o at_o any_o time_n by_o the_o will_n of_o man_n etc._n etc._n and_o after_o the_o same_o manner_n do_v cajetan_a comment_n upon_o the_o place_n he_o touch_v the_o difference_n between_o science_n write_v and_o prophecy_n write_v in_o this_o regard_n that_o a_o learned_a man_n teach_v and_o write_v according_a to_o his_o own_o interpretation_n those_o thing_n which_o do_v appear_v in_o the_o light_n of_o his_o agent_n intellect_n but_o the_o prophet_n do_v say_v and_o write_v those_o thing_n which_o appear_v under_o the_o light_n of_o divine_a revelation_n not_o according_a to_o the_o interpretation_n of_o his_o own_o judgement_n so_o he_o so_o then_o the_o text_n relate_v to_o those_o who_o write_v scripture_n not_o to_o those_o who_o shall_v interpret_v it_o be_v write_v and_o beside_o when_o private_a mendoza_n interpret_v scripture_n for_o themselves_o they_o be_v not_o to_o interpret_v it_o by_o private_a mean_n but_o by_o itself_o compare_v place_n with_o place_n and_o discern_v the_o sense_n of_o that_o which_o be_v obscure_a by_o that_o which_o be_v more_o plain_a and_o if_o it_o be_v a_o passage_n that_o be_v very_o obscure_a and_o there_o be_v no_o other_o passage_n more_o clear_a to_o illustrate_v it_o it_o be_v not_o like_a to_o be_v a_o point_n without_o the_o belief_n whereof_o there_o be_v no_o salvation_n well_o say_v the_o greek_a nilus_n to_o accuse_v the_o scripture_n be_v all_o one_o as_o if_o one_o shall_v accuse_v god_n but_o god_n be_v without_o blame_n it_o follow_v in_o your_o reply_n and_o all_o this_o speak_v here_o and_o in_o the_o position_n etc._n etc._n of_o the_o church_n be_v mean_v of_o such_o a_o church_n as_o do_v true_o deserve_v the_o name_n of_o catholic_a answ_n this_o i_o say_v enough_o to_o at_o the_o beginning_n but_o you_o seem_v to_o be_v very_o loath_a to_o own_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o to_o avouch_v she_o and_o yet_o you_o will_v seem_v to_o manage_v the_o point_n which_o they_o make_v much_o of_o as_o they_o as_o if_o you_o have_v some_o mind_n to_o be_v a_o true_a catholic_a abstract_o from_o rome_n and_o so_o indeed_o you_o may_v be_v in_o the_o ancient_a sense_n as_o they_o use_v it_o for_o those_o who_o be_v orthodoxal_a yet_o for_o what_o church_n you_o reserve_v those_o great_a title_n and_o what_o church_n in_o your_o esteem_n do_v deserve_v the_o name_n of_o catholic_a i_o know_v not_o you_o be_v very_o close_o in_o this_o but_o let_v i_o now_o at_o least_o conclude_v that_o if_o the_o catholic_a church_n be_v not_o the_o ground_n of_o faith_n in_o your_o sense_n sure_o the_o roman_n be_v not_o and_o now_o all_o that_o i_o have_v to_o do_v be_v to_o justify_v two_o expression_n of_o i_o which_o you_o be_v please_v to_o carp_v at_o the_o one_o be_v that_o i_o say_v the_o pontifician_n do_v hold_v the_o proposal_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n to_o be_v the_o formal_a object_n of_o their_o faith_n you_o say_v that_o you_o must_v assure_v the_o answerer_n that_o the_o pontifician_n do_v not_o make_v the_o church_n of_o rome_n in_o its_o proposal_n to_o be_v the_o formal_a object_n of_o their_o faith_n as_o he_o do_v impose_v upon_o they_o for_o that_o they_o acknowledge_v to_o be_v the_o revelation_n of_o god_n or_o the_o authority_n of_o god_n reveal_v which_o cause_v their_o belief_n to_o be_v supernatural_a or_o divine_a etc._n etc._n answ_n i_o be_o glad_a my_o expression_n give_v you_o occasion_n thus_o to_o express_v