complaint_n and_o appeal_n now_o the_o presbyterian_o in_o that_o give_v the_o magistrate_n a_o power_n about_o the_o use_n and_o abuse_v of_o ecclesiastical_a discipline_n and_o ecclesiastical_a cause_n and_o business_n yea_o and_o definitive_a to_o namely_o a_o political_a objective_n consequent_a power_n which_o may_v be_v diverse_o exercise_v both_o ordinary_o and_o extraordinary_o in_o a_o church_n constitute_v and_o in_o a_o good_a estate_n and_o in_o a_o church_n fall_v and_o corrupt_v voetius_fw-la in_o his_o disputation_n upon_o that_o question_n in_o who_o hand_n the_o ecclesiastical_a 68_o power_n be_v a_o great_a presbyterian_a in_o that_o question_n grant_v and_o give_v to_o the_o magistrate_n a_o public_a judicial_a power_n of_o judge_v not_o only_o with_o the_o judgement_n of_o knowledge_n but_o definitive_a in_o cause_n and_o matter_n ecclesiastical_a which_o judgement_n be_v consequent_a not_o antecedent_n because_o the_o ultimate_a disquisition_n be_v not_o in_o that_o whether_o that_o be_v true_a but_o whether_o they_o will_v by_o public_a authority_n maintain_v and_o execute_v that_o so_o *_o apollonius_n in_o his_o answer_n to_o vedelius_fw-la where_o he_o strong_o plead_v for_o the_o presbyterian_o in_o that_o point_n of_o ecclesiastical_a power_n yet_o give_v much_o to_o the_o magistrate_n ordinary_o in_o a_o church_n constitute_v and_o well_o reform_v in_o the_o point_n of_o this_o part_n of_o power_n and_o extraordinary_o in_o the_o state_n of_o a_o church_n corrupt_v and_o great_o disorder_v when_o the_o doctrine_n be_v corrupt_v and_o the_o sacrament_n contaminate_v with_o idolatrous_a rite_n and_o discipline_n turn_v into_o tyranny_n and_o when_o the_o ministry_n and_o all_o ecclesiastical_a meeting_n both_o inferior_a and_o superior_a conspire_v to_o oppress_v the_o truth_n of_o god_n and_o to_o establish_v tyranny_n in_o the_o church_n in_o such_o case_n the_o magistrate_n may_v do_v many_o thing_n beside_o the_o ordinary_a way_n now_o let_v i_o entreat_v you_o to_o consult_v the_o book_n of_o the_o presbyterian_o and_o especial_o apollonius_n answer_v to_o vedelius_fw-la of_o the_o several_a particular_n of_o the_o power_n of_o magistrate_n about_o the_o use_n and_o abuse_v of_o discipline_n in_o a_o constitute_v church_n beside_o the_o power_n give_v they_o in_o extraordinary_a case_n and_o in_o your_o reply_n to_o this_o answer_n satisfy_v i_o what_o you_o give_v more_o but_o let_v i_o tell_v you_o whatever_o power_n you_o five_o may_v have_v find_v out_o for_o the_o magistrate_n which_o the_o principle_n of_o presbyterial_a government_n will_v not_o suffer_v they_o to_o yield_v some_o new_a power_n may_v be_v like_o that_o devise_n of_o non-communion_n of_o church_n and_o protestation_n to_o all_o church_n that_o they_o may_v do_v the_o like_a yet_o your_o church_n may_v not_o grant_v it_o and_o so_o the_o magistrate_n shall_v be_v never_o the_o near_o the_o power_n you_o give_v the_o magistrate_n in_o the_o 17._o and_o 19_o pag._n be_v not_o yield_v by_o many_o of_o your_o own_o church_n whereof_o you_o be_v minister_n a_o gentleman_n a_o prime_a member_n of_o one_o of_o your_o church_n immediate_o after_o the_o come_n forth_o of_o your_o apologetical_a narration_n disclaim_v and_o renounce_v that_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n express_v by_o you_o in_o the_o hear_n of_o a_o minister_n a_o member_n of_o the_o assembly_n who_o relate_v it_o to_o i_o but_o what_o be_v it_o wherein_o you_o give_v more_o to_o the_o magistrate_n sure_o there_o be_v something_o you_o mean_v and_o aim_v at_o in_o it_o if_o we_o can_v find_v it_o out_o suffer_v i_o to_o guess_v at_o it_o and_o you_o shall_v see_v though_o you_o do_v not_o formal_o express_v so_o much_o yet_o i_o have_v some_o reason_n to_o judge_v so_o first_o do_v you_o not_o mean_v in_o this_o phrase_n the_o magistrate_n power_n to_o which_o we_o give_v as_o much_o and_o as_o we_o think_v more_o than_o the_o principle_n of_o presbyterial_a government_n will_v suffer_v they_o to_o yield_v that_o your_o churchway_n consist_v all_o of_o particular_a congregation_n and_o not_o grow_v into_o great_a body_n by_o combination_n and_o synod_n the_o magistrate_n power_n be_v great_a over_o you_o in_o that_o he_o may_v easy_o deal_v with_o you_o and_o dissolve_v you_o at_o pleasure_n but_o for_o a_o power_n to_o grow_v into_o so_o great_a a_o body_n a_o ecclesiastical_a power_n as_o large_a as_o the_o civil_a so_o combine_v this_o may_v be_v formidable_a and_o dangerous_a to_o the_o state_n and_o too_o great_a for_o the_o magistrate_n hereafter_o to_o rectify_v this_o have_v be_v by_o a_o active_a independent_a upon_o discourse_n of_o these_o point_n suggest_v to_o i_o and_o how_o far_o one_o of_o you_o have_v reason_v thus_o in_o the_o hear_n of_o many_o against_o presbyterial_a government_n and_o for_o congregationall_a you_o can_v remember_v or_o second_o do_v you_o understand_v by_o this_o phrase_n that_o when_o heresy_n schism_n or_o strange_a opinion_n be_v broach_v in_o your_o church_n and_o you_o can_v tell_v what_o to_o do_v with_o they_o nor_o how_o to_o suppress_v they_o nor_o how_o to_o have_v the_o person_n censure_v be_v so_o powerful_a in_o particular_a congregation_n whereof_o they_o be_v member_n in_o such_o a_o case_n you_o give_v the_o civil_a magistrate_n a_o power_n to_o question_v they_o for_o these_o heresy_n schism_n and_o to_o imprison_v banish_v etc._n etc._n if_o they_o do_v not_o revoke_v they_o new-england_n practise_v the_o way_n of_o independency_n and_o not_o have_v class_n synod_n that_o have_v authoritative_a power_n to_o call_v to_o account_v and_o censure_v such_o person_n be_v necessitate_v to_o make_v use_n of_o the_o magistrate_n and_o to_o give_v the_o more_o to_o they_o a_o power_n of_o question_v for_o doctrine_n and_o judge_v of_o error_n and_o punish_v with_o imprisonment_n banishment_n and_o they_o find_v out_o a_o pretty_a fine_a distinction_n to_o deceive_v themselves_o with_o and_o to_o salve_v the_o contrariety_n of_o this_o practice_n to_o some_o other_o principle_n that_o the_o magistrate_n question_v and_o punish_v for_o these_o opinion_n and_o error_n which_o now_o for_o want_n of_o ecclesiastical_a discipline_n and_o censure_n they_o know_v not_o what_o to_o do_v with_o not_o as_o heresy_n and_o such_o opinion_n but_o as_o breach_n of_o the_o civil_a peace_n and_o disturbance_n to_o the_o commonwealth_n which_o distinction_n if_o the_o parliament_n will_v have_v learn_v from_o you_o and_o proceed_v upon_o they_o may_v long_o ago_o have_v put_v down_o all_o your_o church_n and_o congregation_n and_o just_o have_v deal_v with_o you_o as_o the_o magistrate_n in_o new-england_n do_v with_o mr_n williams_n and_o the_o antinomian_o familist_n and_o anabaptist_n there_o and_o yet_o have_v say_v they_o punish_v you_o not_o for_o your_o conscience_n nor_o because_o of_o such_o opinion_n but_o because_o your_o opinion_n way_n and_o practice_n be_v a_o occasion_n of_o much_o hurt_n to_o the_o commonwealth_n a_o breach_n of_o civil_a peace_n a_o great_a cause_n of_o many_o people_n sit_v so_o loose_a from_o the_o parliament_n a_o great_a hindrance_n to_o the_o reformation_n and_o a_o ground_n of_o much_o distraction_n to_o the_o public_a and_o of_o strengthen_v the_o enemy_n whereas_o the_o presbyterian_o give_v the_o power_n in_o case_n of_o heresy_n error_n etc._n etc._n that_o be_v not_o remedy_v in_o the_o particular_a congregation_n to_o class_n synod_n assembly_n to_o question_v convince_v judge_v of_o censure_n and_o to_o apply_v spiritual_a remedy_n proper_a to_o spiritual_a disease_n which_o i_o be_o confident_a of_o have_v such_o be_v in_o new-england_n in_o the_o presbyterial_a way_n there_o have_v never_o be_v so_o many_o imprison_v banish_v for_o error_n nor_o the_o magistrate_n put_v upon_o that_o distinction_n or_o three_o be_v it_o that_o you_o do_v give_v a_o power_n to_o the_o magistrate_n in_o ecclesiastical_a thing_n of_o the_o ultimate_a determination_n of_o matter_n pure_o ecclesiastical_a which_o the_o presbyterian_o principle_n do_v not_o as_o now_o in_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n and_o in_o matter_n of_o scandal_n and_o in_o matter_n of_o censure_n excommunication_n deposition_n etc._n etc._n which_o be_v bring_v before_o and_o have_v pass_v in_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n to_o appeal_v from_o they_o to_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n and_o to_o carry_v cause_n from_o thence_o to_o civil_a court_n to_o repeal_v and_o revoke_v they_o your_o word_n and_o passage_n about_o the_o magistrate_n power_n imply_v this_o and_o i_o find_v that_o many_o quick_a sight_a man_n as_o the_o walachrian_a classis_fw-la nay_o a_o whole_a synod_n after_o they_o in_o their_o late_a letter_n to_o the_o assembly_n apprehend_v you_o so_o and_o therefore_o i_o may_v upon_o good_a ground_n judge_v beside_o the_o two_o former_a that_o you_o aim_v at_o this_o three_o in_o say_v you_o give_v more_o to_o the_o magistrate_n power_n then_o the_o presbyterian_o
as_o they_o see_v just_a ground_n the_o controversy_n be_v at_o a_o end_n 4._o the_o corporation_n that_o be_v those_o in_o place_n and_o power_n if_o they_o proceed_v unjust_o be_v accountable_a to_o the_o state_n they_o live_v in_o that_o be_v to_o a_o high_a civil_a power_n and_o adjudge_v themselves_o in_o case_n of_o wrong_n condemn_v the_o innocent_a suffer_v delinquent_n to_o escape_n but_o your_o corporation_n of_o particular_a congregation_n even_o in_o case_n of_o real_a administration_n be_v against_o all_o judge_a and_o all_o ecclesiastical_a authoritative_a power_n out_o of_o your_o own_o congregation_n to_o the_o five_o reason_n hint_v by_o you_o to_o strengthen_v your_o practice_n that_o it_o be_v safe_a and_o allow_v and_o the_o reform_a church_n more_o questionable_a namely_o appeal_n to_o they_o who_o have_v read_v book_n whether_o much_o have_v be_v write_v with_o strength_n set_o and_o direct_o to_o prove_v that_o government_n but_o rather_o to_o overthrow_v episcopal_a and_o to_o maintain_v those_o several_a officer_n in_o church_n which_o christ_n have_v institute_v and_o therefore_o you_o infer_v you_o may_v have_v more_o ground_n to_o question_v this_o government_n of_o combine_a classical_a presbyterial_a government_n i_o answer_v the_o ground_n of_o that_o be_v full_o lay_v down_o in_o the_o reformation_n of_o the_o church_n of_o scotland_n page_n 17_o and_o 18._o with_o a_o account_n of_o what_o have_v be_v write_v and_o do_v by_o the_o reform_a church_n in_o france_n for_o the_o presbyterial_a way_n and_o against_o the_o popular_a independent_a way_n which_o be_v more_o than_o you_o once_o in_o this_o reason_n hint_v but_o suppose_v that_o in_o former_a write_n of_o calvin_n beza_n zanchius_n peter_n martyr_n danaeus_n junius_n zeppâ—…rus_n gersom_a bucerus_n dr_n reynolds_n parker_n there_o have_v not_o be_v much_o set_o and_o direct_o insist_v on_o and_o with_o strength_n to_o prove_v the_o government_n of_o synod_n and_o class_n though_o in_o some_o of_o these_o more_o especial_o as_o against_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o episcopal_a government_n much_o strength_n be_v bring_v for_o the_o government_n by_o synod_n and_o class_n yet_o that_o which_o those_o divine_n of_o scotland_n holland_n england_n have_v write_v of_o late_a against_o the_o independent_a congregationall_a government_n may_v have_v be_v enough_o to_o have_v satisfy_v you_o and_o that_o be_v not_o material_a that_o no_o more_o have_v write_v see_v out_o of_o the_o mouth_n of_o two_o or_o three_o witness_n every_o word_n shall_v be_v establish_v and_o if_o these_o book_n have_v not_o strength_n to_o satisfy_v you_o why_o have_v not_o you_o all_o this_o while_n answer_v they_o but_o i_o must_v mind_v you_o of_o forget_v one_o of_o your_o own_o divine_n for_o beside_o the_o learned_a licensers_n book_n against_o independency_n another_o book_n be_v write_v call_v reason_n against_o the_o independent_a government_n of_o particular_a congregation_n and_o the_o toleration_n of_o they_o in_o this_o kingdom_n which_o book_n in_o your_o seem_a to_o take_v no_o notice_n of_o i_o believe_v you_o remember_v above_o the_o rest_n and_o in_o the_o 25_o page_n of_o your_o apology_n it_o appear_v you_o remember_v it_o but_o the_o author_n of_o it_o belike_o be_v none_o of_o your_o divine_n and_o in_o the_o close_a now_o of_o this_o answer_n to_o your_o reason_n hint_v about_o the_o government_n and_o discipline_n of_o the_o church_n why_o you_o in_o your_o congregationall_a way_n shall_v be_v in_o the_o truth_n but_o the_o presbyterial_a government_n be_v a_o question_n to_o you_o and_o judge_v a_o additament_n because_o the_o presbyterian_o allow_v you_o what_o you_o practise_v and_o grant_v what_o you_o hold_v but_o themselves_o hold_v and_o practise_v over_o and_o above_o i_o answer_v this_o be_v no_o argument_n at_o all_o for_o by_o the_o same_o reason_n the_o samaritan_n shall_v have_v worship_v god_n true_o but_o the_o jew_n false_o and_o the_o samaritan_n may_v have_v 22._o say_v to_o the_o jew_n as_o you_o do_v to_o the_o presbyteriann_n the_o five_o book_n of_o moses_n which_o we_o own_v to_o be_v sure_a they_o be_v from_o god_n you_o acknowledge_v they_o but_o for_o the_o book_n of_o the_o prophet_n that_o be_v a_o question_n which_o rest_v upon_o you_o that_o allow_v what_o we_o hold_v to_o make_v evident_a and_o demonstrate_v and_o so_o the_o jew_n may_v now_o by_o the_o same_o reason_n speak_v against_o the_o christian_n and_o say_v we_o be_v in_o the_o safe_a way_n to_o be_v sure_a we_o practise_v safe_o for_o you_o christian_n confess_v what_o we_o hold_v namely_o moses_n and_o the_o prophet_n to_o be_v the_o scripture_n but_o for_o the_o new_a testament_n that_o be_v to_o we_o a_o question_n and_o a_o additament_n which_o therefore_o rest_v upon_o you_o christian_n to_o make_v good_a who_o believe_v and_o practice_v over_o and_o above_o we_o and_o whereas_o the_o common_a prejudice_n and_o exception_n lay_v into_o all_o apolog._n man_n thought_n against_o we_o and_o our_o opinion_n be_v that_o in_o such_o a_o congregationall_a government_n thus_o entire_a within_o itself_o there_o be_v no_o allow_v sufficient_a remedy_n for_o miscarriage_n though_o never_o so_o grossâ—…_n no_o relief_n for_o wrongful_a sentence_n or_o person_n injure_v thereby_o no_o room_n for_o complaint_n no_o powerful_a or_o effectual_a mean_n to_o reduce_v a_o church_n or_o church_n that_o fall_v into_o heresy_n schism_n etc._n etc._n but_o every_o one_o be_v leave_v and_o may_v take_v liberty_n without_o control_n to_o do_v what_o be_v good_a in_o their_o own_o eye_n we_o have_v through_o the_o good_a providence_n of_o god_n upon_o we_o from_o the_o avow_a declaration_n of_o our_o judgement_n among_o our_o church_n mutual_o during_o our_o exile_n and_o that_o also_o confirm_v by_o the_o most_o solemn_a instance_n of_o our_o practice_n wherewith_o to_o vindicate_v ourselves_o and_o way_n in_o this_o particular_a which_o upon_o no_o other_o occasion_n we_o shall_v ever_o have_v make_v thus_o public_a god_n so_o order_v it_o that_o a_o scandal_n and_o offence_n fall_v out_o between_o those_o very_a church_n whilst_o live_v in_o this_o banishment_n whereof_o we_o ourselves_o that_o write_v these_o thing_n be_v then_o the_o minister_n one_o of_o our_o church_n have_v unhappy_o depose_v one_o of_o their_o minister_n the_o other_o judge_v it_o not_o only_o as_o too_o sudden_a a_o act_n have_v proceed_v in_o a_o matter_n of_o so_o great_a moment_n without_o â—…nsulting_v their_o sister_n church_n as_o be_v public_o profess_v we_o shall_v have_v do_v in_o such_o case_n of_o concernment_n but_o also_o in_o the_o proceed_n thereof_o as_o too_o severe_a and_o not_o manage_v according_a to_o the_o rule_v lay_v down_o in_o the_o word_n in_o this_o case_n our_o church_n do_v mutual_o and_o universal_o acknowledge_v and_o submit_v to_o this_o as_o a_o sacred_a and_o undoubted_a principle_n and_o supreme_a law_n to_o be_v observe_v among_o all_o church_n that_o as_o by_o virtue_n of_o that_o apostolical_a command_n church_n as_o well_o as_o particular_a man_n be_v bind_v to_o give_v no_o offence_n neither_o to_o jew_n nor_o gentile_a nor_o the_o church_n of_o god_n they_o live_v among_o so_o that_o in_o all_o case_n of_o such_o offence_n or_o difference_n by_o the_o obligation_n of_o the_o common_a law_n of_o communion_n of_o church_n and_o for_o the_o vindication_n of_o the_o glory_n of_o christ_n which_o in_o common_a they_o holdforth_o the_o church_n or_o church_n challenge_v to_o offend_v or_o differ_v be_v to_o submit_v themselves_o upon_o the_o challenge_n of_o the_o offence_n or_o complaint_n of_o the_o person_n wrong_v to_o the_o most_o full_a and_o open_a trial_n and_o examination_n by_o other_o neighbour_n church_n offend_v thereat_o of_o what_o ever_o have_v give_v the_o offence_n and_o further_o that_o by_o virtue_n of_o the_o same_o and_o like_a law_n of_o not_o partake_v in_o other_o man_n sin_n the_o church_n offend_v may_n and_o aught_o upon_o the_o impenitency_n of_o those_o church_n persist_v in_o their_o error_n and_o miscarriage_n to_o pronounce_v that_o heavy_a sentence_n against_o they_o of_o withdraw_a and_o renounce_v all_o christian_a communion_n with_o they_o until_o they_o do_v repent_v and_o further_o to_o declare_v and_o protest_v this_o with_o the_o cause_n thereof_o to_o all_o other_o church_n of_o christ_n that_o they_o may_v do_v the_o like_a and_o what_o further_a authority_n or_o proceed_n pure_o ecclesiastical_a of_o one_o or_o many_o sister_n church_n towards_o another_o whole_a church_n or_o church_n offend_v either_o the_o scripture_n do_v holdforth_o or_o can_v rational_o be_v put_v in_o execution_n without_o the_o magistrate_n interpose_v a_o power_n of_o another_o nature_n unto_o which_o we_o upon_o his_o particular_a cognisance_n and_o examination_n of_o such_o cause_n profess_v ever_o to_o submit_v and_o also_o to_o
right_n and_o as_o magistrate_n have_v no_o power_n over_o family-government_n to_o appoint_v who_o i_o shall_v admit_v into_o my_o family_n etc._n etc._n much_o less_o have_v they_o power_n over_o christ_n family_n this_o union_n of_o a_o church_n be_v a_o spiritual_a right_n which_o be_v transcendent_o out_o of_o the_o sphere_n of_o the_o magistrate_n authority_n and_o the_o apostle_n teach_v the_o saint_n to_o do_v it_o without_o ask_v leave_n of_o the_o magistrate_n yea_o not_o to_o for_o sake_n it_o though_o the_o magistrate_n forbid_v it_o heb._n 10._o 25._o now_o i_o believe_v you_o can_v show_v i_o any_o principle_n in_o presbyterial_a government_n nor_o quote_v i_o the_o judgement_n of_o any_o presbyterian_a that_o cut_v short_a the_o power_n of_o the_o orthodox_n protestant_n magistrate_n about_o congregation_n and_o assembly_n as_o this_o do_v 4._o the_o presbyterian_o do_v grant_v the_o magistrate_n a_o power_n about_o the_o public_a exercise_n of_o the_o ministry_n that_o it_o be_v so_o far_o subject_a to_o the_o direction_n of_o the_o magistrate_n that_o without_o his_o approbative_a authority_n or_o confirm_a authority_n or_o his_o toleration_n of_o it_o it_o ought_v not_o by_o the_o church_n to_o be_v public_o begin_v in_o his_o territory_n nor_o practise_a dâ—…decimae_fw-la apollonius_n of_o zealand_n who_o write_v a_o answer_n to_o vedellius_fw-la by_o the_o command_n of_o the_o waâ—…achrian_a classis_fw-la be_v a_o great_a presbyterian_a and_o in_o that_o answer_n must_v needs_o show_v it_o upon_o occasion_n of_o vedelius_fw-la give_v so_o much_o to_o the_o magistrate_n in_o ecclesiastical_a thing_n yet_o he_o grant_v the_o magistrate_n this_o power_n about_o the_o exercise_n of_o the_o ministry_n now_o whether_o your_o principle_n allow_v this_o to_o the_o magistrate_n let_v your_o practice_n speak_v about_o your_o make_v minister_n and_o exercise_v of_o it_o as_o you_o do_v 5._o the_o presbyterian_o grant_v to_o the_o magistrate_n a_o power_n in_o private_a meeting_n as_o well_o as_o in_o public_a church_n over_o exercise_n there_o as_o well_o as_o those_o in_o the_o public_a place_n so_o 4._o voetius_fw-la we_o reject_v that_o novelty_n of_o the_o remonstrant_n that_o the_o magistrate_n have_v no_o power_n in_o private_a meeting_n but_o only_o in_o public_a temple_n now_o whether_o you_o allow_v the_o magistrate_n a_o power_n concern_v your_o private_a meeting_n or_o only_o over_o the_o public_a meeting_n or_o whether_o you_o do_v not_o with_o the_o arminian_n make_v the_o ground_n of_o this_o power_n in_o the_o magistrate_n the_o grant_n of_o a_o public_a meetingplace_n i_o desire_v to_o be_v satisfy_v from_o you_o but_o by_o all_o this_o the_o reader_n may_v see_v in_o these_o particular_n you_o do_v not_o give_v more_o power_n to_o the_o magistrate_n for_o the_o presbyterian_o give_v what_o you_o give_v and_o not_o only_o so_o but_o they_o give_v that_o which_o you_o deny_v and_o so_o give_v more_o than_o you_o but_o brethren_n wherein_o and_o in_o what_o do_v you_o give_v more_o to_o the_o magistrate_n power_n then_o the_o presbyterian_o have_v you_o express_v wherein_o the_o presbyterian_o give_v too_o little_a to_o the_o magistrate_n power_n and_o in_o what_o their_o principle_n be_v defective_a and_o wherein_o you_o give_v more_o you_o have_v deal_v fair_o and_o ingenious_o and_o a_o man_n may_v have_v know_v where_o to_o have_v have_v you_o and_o how_o to_o have_v answer_v you_o but_o to_o accuse_v thus_o in_o the_o general_a and_o not_o to_o signify_v the_o crime_n be_v not_o just_a but_o as_o you_o do_v throughout_o your_o apology_n under_o the_o figge-leaves_a of_o dark_a doubtful_a general_a speech_n cover_v your_o opinion_n lest_o your_o nakedness_n shall_v appear_v so_o in_o this_o place_n but_o not_o to_o let_v you_o go_v away_o thus_o but_o that_o i_o may_v drive_v you_o out_o of_o your_o hole_n and_o thicket_n and_o divest_v you_o of_o your_o cover_n and_o that_o i_o may_v a_o little_a take_v off_o the_o odium_n and_o suspicion_n that_o presbyterial_a government_n may_v lie_v under_o among_o many_o who_o know_v not_o their_o principle_n by_o reason_n of_o this_o passage_n of_o you_o the_o magistrate_n power_n to_o which_o we_o give_v as_o much_o and_o as_o we_o think_v more_o than_o the_o principle_n of_o the_o presbyterial_a government_n will_v suffer_v they_o to_o yield_v i_o will_v propound_v some_o question_n to_o you_o to_o draw_v out_o what_o you_o hold_v about_o the_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n in_o ecclesiastical_a thing_n and_o to_o give_v some_o further_a light_n for_o the_o present_a of_o the_o presbyterian_a principle_n concern_v the_o power_n of_o magistrate_n referve_v the_o particular_a lay_v down_o what_o the_o presbyterian_o give_v to_o the_o magistrate_n in_o ecclesiastical_a thing_n and_o what_o not_o till_o my_o rejoynder_n shall_v come_v out_o to_o your_o reply_n 1._o whether_o the_o power_n of_o the_o magistrate_n about_o ecclesiastical_a thing_n be_v a_o power_n extrinsecall_v objective_n coercive_a indirect_a mediate_a accidental_a and_o consequent_a or_o spiritual_a intrinsical_n formal_a proper_a and_o antecedent_n now_o concern_v the_o first_o the_o presbyterian_o give_v as_o much_o to_o the_o magistrate_n as_o you_o nay_o more_o as_o have_v be_v partly_o show_v already_o but_o for_o the_o other_o the_o spiritual_a intrinsical_v formal_a etc._n etc._n if_o you_o ascribe_v that_o to_o the_o magistrate_n as_o i_o think_v you_o do_v not_o nor_o your_o principle_n do_v not_o yield_v it_o unless_o according_a to_o your_o second_o great_a principle_n lay_v down_o in_o the_o 10._o and_o 11._o page_n you_o be_v since_o the_o assembly_n to_o please_v the_o parliament_n the_o more_o as_o you_o may_v imagine_v come_v off_o from_o your_o former_a judgement_n and_o practice_n i_o do_v refer_v you_o for_o satisfaction_n to_o the_o three_o most_o learned_a select_a disputation_n of_o ecclesiastica_fw-la voetius_fw-la and_o unto_o debet_fw-la waâ—…us_o excellent_a answer_n to_o the_o tractate_n of_o uttengobardus_fw-la so_o strong_a that_o the_o author_n can_v never_o reply_v again_o though_o in_o a_o book_n publish_v he_o promise_v to_o do_v it_o and_o unto_o circasacra_fw-la apollonius_n learned_a answer_n to_o vedelius_fw-la dissertation_n 2._o i_o ask_v of_o you_o whether_o the_o civil_a power_n do_v contain_v the_o ecclesiastical_a formal_o and_o eminent_o so_o as_o that_o power_n can_v give_v and_o produce_v the_o other_o or_o whether_o there_o be_v a_o intrinsical_a dependence_n of_o the_o ecclesiastical_a upon_o the_o political_a in_o their_o nature_n form_n and_o exercise_v of_o they_o or_o whether_o there_o do_v not_o reside_v in_o the_o church_n all_o ecclesiastical_a power_n absolute_o necessary_a to_o the_o build_n up_o of_o the_o kingdom_n of_o christ_n and_o salvation_n of_o man_n even_o when_o the_o magistrate_n be_v not_o of_o the_o church_n 3._o i_o ask_v of_o you_o whether_o in_o write_v this_o passage_n of_o your_o apology_n you_o consider_v and_o remember_v all_o those_o difference_n and_o distinction_n give_v by_o so_o many_o excellent_a divine_n as_o junius_n zanchius_n amesius_n etc._n etc._n concern_v those_o two_o power_n civil_a and_o ecclesiastical_a and_o their_o administration_n and_o in_o particular_a among_o the_o rest_n that_o difference_n take_v from_o their_o 4._o matter_n and_o the_o subject_n wherein_o they_o make_v the_o subject_n of_o political_a administration_n to_o be_v humane_a thing_n and_o matter_n but_o of_o ecclesiastical_a to_o be_v divine_a and_o sacred_a and_o if_o so_o whether_o do_v not_o presbyterian_o according_a to_o those_o difference_n and_o distinction_n which_o distinction_n be_v acknowledge_v also_o by_o yourselves_o as_o by_o m._n robinson_n and_o by_o some_o of_o you_o in_o your_o print_a book_n as_o i_o remember_v give_v the_o magistrate_n that_o power_n in_o ecclesiastical_n which_o be_v give_v he_o in_o the_o word_n of_o god_n 4._o consider_v all_o ecclesiastical_a power_n and_o right_n be_v common_o by_o divine_n reduce_v to_o a_o threefold_a head_n namely_o potestas_fw-la 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d which_o of_o these_o power_n do_v you_o give_v more_o to_o the_o magistrate_n than_o the_o presbyterian_o or_o in_o all_o of_o they_o do_v you_o give_v more_o or_o do_v you_o not_o for_o the_o present_a that_o power_n you_o seem_v to_o give_v the_o magistrate_n and_o intimate_v it_o that_o you_o give_v more_o than_o the_o presâ—…eriall_a principle_n allow_v as_o may_v be_v gather_v from_o the_o follow_a word_n in_o p._n 19_o &_o from_o those_o word_n in_o p._n 17._o the_o magistrate_n interpose_v a_o power_n of_o a_o other_o nature_n unto_o which_o we_o upon_o his_o particular_a coguizance_n and_o examination_n of_o such_o cause_n profess_v ever_o to_o submit_v and_o also_o to_o be_v most_o willing_a to_o have_v recourse_n unto_o must_v fall_v under_o the_o last_o head_n of_o the_o power_n of_o judge_v and_o determine_v in_o matter_n ecclesiastical_a and_o that_o upon_o
only_o and_o the_o high_a power_n can_v they_o always_o hear_v or_o attend_v unto_o through_o the_o many_o great_a business_n of_o state_n affair_n all_o the_o difference_n scandal_n schism_n that_o both_o in_o particular_a church_n and_o between_o church_n will_v fall_v out_o in_o a_o kingdom_n or_o nation_n in_o this_o way_n of_o non-communion_n and_o protestation_n against_o one_o another_o especial_o in_o independent_a church_n where_o people_n make_v church_n and_o minister_n in_o that_o way_n they_o do_v and_o have_v no_o fix_a rule_n nor_o certain_a way_n i_o warrant_v the_o supreme_a magistrate_n and_o high_a power_n king_n and_o parliament_n shall_v have_v something_o to_o do_v to_o back_o the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n and_o to_o hear_v all_o cause_n and_o difference_n but_o if_o you_o understand_v the_o inferior_n also_o major_n bailiff_n etc._n etc._n i_o represent_v it_o to_o you_o what_o fit_a judge_n most_o of_o they_o be_v to_o judge_v and_o determine_v of_o such_o difficult_a ecclesiastical_a cause_n in_o heresy_n schism_n scandal_n etc._n etc._n which_o fall_v out_o among_o the_o minister_n of_o church_n and_o between_o church_n themselves_o again_o if_o you_o understand_v the_o magistrate_n indefinite_o and_o absolute_o any_o magistrate_n though_o heathen_a popish_a arrian_n as_o mr_n robinson_n do_v in_o his_o apology_n and_o i_o find_v it_o in_o your_o manuscript_n and_o principle_n that_o you_o take_v it_o so_o judge_v then_o in_o yourselves_o if_o the_o church_n have_v not_o remedy_n among_o themselves_o how_o fit_a be_v they_o who_o understand_v not_o christian_a religion_n nor_o the_o doctrine_n according_a to_o godliness_n to_o judge_v of_o the_o great_a difference_n between_o church_n and_o to_o assist_v the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n against_o church_n if_o the_o apostle_n paul_n reprove_v the_o corinthian_n so_o in_o 1_o cor._n 6_o 1_o 2_o 3_o 4_o 5_o 6_o 7._o for_o cariy_a matter_n from_o the_o church_n even_o the_o small_a matter_n the_o thing_n that_o pertain_v to_o this_o life_n unto_o unbeliever_n how_o will_v he_o blame_v the_o carry_n of_o thing_n spiritual_a and_o ecclesiastical_a unto_o heathen_a from_o the_o minister_n of_o the_o church_n or_o do_v you_o understand_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v court_n of_o civil_a judicature_n to_o appeal_v unto_o etc._n etc._n then_o there_o must_v be_v certain_a law_n and_o rule_n agree_v upon_o as_o for_o particular_a church_n so_o between_o the_o church_n according_a to_o which_o they_o must_v proceed_v to_o back_o the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n and_o protestation_n etc._n etc._n which_o yet_o you_o practise_v not_o now_o the_o many_o inconvenience_n that_o will_v come_v of_o such_o court_v you_o may_v easy_o foresee_v so_o that_o this_o be_v not_o like_a to_o be_v a_o effectual_a remedy_n 6._o what_o shall_v be_v do_v in_o case_n there_o be_v no_o magistrate_n at_o all_o to_o take_v any_o notice_n in_o matter_n of_o religion_n and_o church_n government_n but_o leave_v church_n to_o themselves_o in_o that_o as_o it_o be_v with_o you_o in_o holland_n there_o be_v no_o magistrate_n meddle_v with_o the_o government_n and_o order_n of_o your_o church_n nor_o none_o to_o have_v recourse_n unto_o or_o to_o back_o the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n you_o be_v in_o a_o place_n and_o state_n where_o no_o outward_a violence_n or_o any_o other_o external_a authority_n either_o civil_a or_o ecclesiastical_a will_v have_v enforce_v you_o what_o shall_v in_o this_o case_n supply_v the_o defect_n of_o excommunication_n and_o of_o a_o ecclesiastical_a authoritative_a power_n have_v not_o the_o wisdom_n of_o christ_n provide_v remedy_n in_o the_o church_n for_o all_o the_o internal_a necessity_n of_o the_o church_n and_o constitute_v it_o a_o perfect_a body_n within_o itself_o 7._o whether_o can_v it_o be_v rational_o and_o probable_o think_v that_o in_o a_o ordinary_a way_n the_o have_v recourse_n unto_o the_o magistrate_n though_o orthodox_n and_o the_o submit_v to_o his_o particular_a cognizance_n and_o examination_n of_o such_o cause_n with_o his_o back_n the_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n in_o ecclesiastical_a cause_n in_o case_n of_o sin_n error_n difference_n that_o arise_v in_o church_n shall_v be_v as_o effectual_a and_o sufficient_a a_o remedy_n as_o the_o way_n of_o class_n and_o synod_n and_o that_o the_o magistrate_n interpose_v their_o authority_n and_o power_n of_o another_o nature_n will_v be_v as_o good_a as_o the_o authoritative_a presbyterial_a government_n in_o all_o the_o subordination_n and_o proceed_n of_o it_o now_o that_o it_o be_v not_o probable_a it_o shall_v be_v or_o that_o it_o shall_v serve_v in_o stead_n of_o synod_n and_o class_n take_v these_o probable_a and_o rational_a ground_n 1._o all_o wanton_a wit_n and_o erroneous_a spirit_n all_o your_o sectary_n and_o novelist_n be_v rather_o for_o this_o way_n then_o for_o synod_n and_o class_n though_o most_o of_o they_o will_v have_v neither_o to_o meddle_v at_o all_o in_o matter_n of_o religion_n as_o the_o socinian_o anabaptist_n etc._n etc._n thus_o the_o arminian_n be_v against_o class_n and_o synod_n and_o all_o for_o the_o power_n of_o magistrate_n and_o it_o be_v their_o chief_a engine_n by_o which_o in_o those_o sad_a day_n of_o the_o netherlands_o they_o increase_v their_o party_n and_o come_v to_o such_o a_o height_n sectary_n hope_v that_o if_o they_o can_v decline_v the_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n they_o shall_v wat_fw-mi by_o flattery_n and_o what_o by_o delay_n through_o other_o great_a business_n of_o state_n and_o what_o by_o sophism_n and_o fallacy_n and_o what_o from_o principle_n of_o policy_n in_o many_o statesman_n and_o what_o by_o friend_n etc._n etc._n effect_n that_o which_o they_o have_v no_o hope_n at_o all_o by_o ecclesiastical_a assembly_n they_o know_v the_o presbytery_n and_o synod_n be_v able_a to_o discover_v their_o fallacy_n answer_v their_o argument_n will_v mind_v those_o business_n whole_o be_v not_o to_o be_v wrought_v upon_o by_o state_n principle_n etc._n etc._n now_o if_o in_o experience_n and_o reason_n this_o way_n be_v as_o powerful_a to_o reduce_v a_o church_n or_o church_n from_o schism_n and_o heresy_n they_o will_v never_o be_v so_o much_o for_o this_o way_n rather_o than_o presbytery_n 2._o natural_a reason_n dictate_v that_o they_o be_v best_a able_a and_o fit_a to_o judge_v and_o resolve_v of_o thing_n who_o do_v above_o other_o give_v themselves_o to_o the_o study_n and_o profession_n of_o those_o thing_n as_o physician_n can_v best_o judge_v of_o wholesome_a meat_n and_o disease_n and_o lawyer_n of_o the_o law_n and_o difference_n arise_v in_o they_o a_o counsel_n of_o war_n of_o difficult_a case_n and_o point_n in_o war_n and_o therefore_o in_o thing_n that_o belong_v to_o the_o spiritual_a good_a of_o the_o soul_n and_o the_o church_n the_o minister_n of_o the_o church_n be_v most_o likely_a to_o resolve_v and_o to_o remedy_v thing_n can_v it_o ordinary_o be_v expect_v that_o the_o magistrate_n shall_v in_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n and_o opinion_n in_o matter_n of_o schism_n and_o in_o matter_n of_o worthiness_n and_o ability_n of_o minister_n and_o in_o many_o case_n that_o arise_v be_v able_a to_o judge_v and_o determine_v matter_n as_o the_o minister_n and_o pastor_n of_o the_o church_n 3._o those_o who_o have_v most_o time_n and_o leisure_n to_o attend_v a_o work_n and_o business_n to_o sift_v into_o it_o to_o hear_v all_o that_o can_v be_v say_v and_o can_v mind_v it_o they_o be_v able_a and_o understand_a be_v likely_a to_o determine_v best_a and_o bring_v thing_n to_o a_o good_a end_n we_o see_v in_o experience_n that_o able_a and_o honest_a man_n through_o multitude_n of_o business_n delay_v long_o slubber_v over_o business_n and_o can_v do_v thing_n so_o effectual_o as_o they_o ought_v and_o seldom_o prove_v good_a arbitratour_n in_o difficult_a intricate_a case_n now_o magistrate_n through_o many_o great_a and_o necessary_a business_n of_o state_n have_v large_a dominion_n can_v so_o well_o attend_v as_o the_o class_n and_o synod_n to_o hear_v and_o examine_v all_o the_o difference_n scandal_n schism_n etc._n etc._n that_o do_v and_o may_v arise_v both_o in_o church_n and_o between_o church_n especial_o as_o will_v fall_v out_o in_o the_o independent_a way_n and_o particular_o in_o this_o way_n of_o submission_n non-communion_n and_o mutual_a protestation_n but_o matter_n will_v be_v delay_v and_o neglect_v or_o escape_v whole_o or_o be_v huddle_v up_o 4._o to_o these_o i_o may_v add_v as_o follow_v that_o the_o magistrate_n through_o his_o just_a greatness_n will_v not_o know_v the_o spirit_n and_o disposition_n of_o minister_n &_o people_n nor_o of_o other_o matter_n so_o well_o as_o the_o minister_n who_o live_v among_o they_o and_o converse_v with_o one_o another_o frequent_o neither_o will_v there_o be_v that_o easiness_n of_o access_n to_o the_o magistrate_n and_o great_a person_n as_o
their_o desire_n for_o instance_n how_o be_v a_o story_n with_o the_o apologist_n practise_v upon_o it_o pag._n 16_o 17_o 20_o 21._o bring_v to_o prove_v the_o effectual_a success_n of_o submission_n and_o non-communion_n how_o be_v their_o good_a carriage_n since_o their_o return_n into_o england_n and_o their_o exile_n make_v use_v of_o to_o move_v for_o a_o toleration_n how_o be_v all_o that_o narration_n of_o 3_o 4_o 〈◊〉_d page_n of_o their_o enquiry_n into_o the_o word_n of_o christ_n etc._n etc._n lay_v down_o as_o so_o many_o ground_n to_o possess_v the_o reader_n of_o the_o truth_n of_o the_o church_n way_n let_v the_o apologetical_a narration_n be_v analize_v and_o it_o will_v be_v find_v there_o be_v no_o point_n of_o fact_n or_o personal_a thing_n in_o it_o but_o be_v bring_v in_o some_o way_n or_o other_o as_o a_o motive_n or_o argument_n for_o their_o way_n so_o that_o of_o necessity_n i_o can_v not_o avoid_v matter_n of_o fact_n unless_o i_o will_v betray_v the_o truth_n paul_n in_o the_o second_o of_o the_o galatian_n 11_o 12_o 13._o open_o rebuke_n peter_n because_o he_o be_v to_o be_v blame_v for_o his_o withdraw_a and_o separate_v himself_o and_o because_o other_o thereupon_o be_v carry_v away_o with_o it_o and_o so_o because_o the_o apologist_n do_v not_o only_o withdraw_v and_o separate_v themseluâ—…_n but_o by_o their_o apologetical_a narration_n do_v even_o compel_v other_o also_o i_o can_v but_o speak_v 3._o propos._n that_o it_o be_v not_o argumentative_a against_o the_o cause_n that_o false_o call_v independency_n nor_o rational_a or_o conduce_v to_o decide_v any_o or_o this_o controversy_n 1._o that_o the_o apologist_n and_o the_o anatomizers_n way_n be_v not_o false_o but_o true_o call_v independency_n i_o refer_v the_o reader_n to_o these_o page_n in_o this_o present_a answer_n 201_o 202_o 203._o second_o be_v all_o the_o matter_n of_o fact_n and_o the_o narration_n of_o they_o argumentative_a for_o the_o apologist_n cause_n to_o move_v the_o parliament_n and_o to_o draw_v the_o reader_n to_o their_o way_n and_o be_v not_o the_o disprove_v of_o they_o argumentative_a against_o it_o if_o this_o be_v not_o argumentative_a against_o independency_n than_o i_o be_o sure_a the_o great_a part_n of_o the_o apologet._n narration_n be_v nothing_o material_a for_o it_o and_o wherâ—…fore_o then_o be_v that_o story_n of_o a_o minister_n depose_v and_o matter_n of_o fact_n upon_o it_o insert_v in_o the_o narration_n with_o many_o other_o and_o suppose_v that_o to_o be_v true_a that_o there_o be_v no_o reason_n from_o the_o quality_n of_o the_o person_n to_o his_o cause_n why_o then_o do_v you_o so_o much_o do_v it_o in_o your_o apology_n take_v all_o occasion_n to_o magnify_v your_o party_n and_o reason_v from_o your_o person_n to_o your_o cause_n from_o your_o suffering_n patience_n etc._n etc._n but_o whether_o there_o be_v any_o strength_n or_o no_o in_o that_o it_o matter_n not_o it_o be_v strong_o argumentative_a in_o any_o point_n to_o overthrow_v man_n own_a medium_n and_o that_o the_o antapology_n do_v in_o a_o word_n there_o be_v more_o consequence_n than_o the_o anatoâ—…zer_n be_v willing_a to_o see_v in_o that_o main_a assertion_n of_o the_o apology_n that_o one_o church_n may_v non-communion_n but_o not_o excommunicate_v another_o as_o he_o term_v it_o to_o the_o miscarriage_n of_o m._n sympson_n and_o his_o church_n for_o may_v presbyterial_a government_n take_v place_n we_o shall_v not_o have_v man_n so_o easy_o principled_a into_o anabaptism_n nor_o make_v a_o covenant_n with_o separation_n etc._n etc._n as_o in_o this_o answer_n in_o many_o place_n be_v prove_v and_o so_o much_o for_o answer_v to_o mr._n sympson_n book_n as_o far_o as_o it_o concern_v the_o antapology_n and_o may_v be_v a_o block_n in_o the_o way_n of_o it_o now_o beside_o this_o there_o be_v one_o objection_n more_o that_o have_v be_v in_o the_o mouth_n of_o some_o independent_o and_o may_v be_v instill_v into_o many_o more_o to_o hinder_v the_o fruit_n 〈◊〉_d benefit_n of_o this_o answer_n namely_o against_o the_o manner_n of_o the_o answer_n that_o it_o be_v 〈◊〉_d answer_v full_a of_o bitterness_n malice_n reproach_n rail_n and_o that_o it_o be_v a_o book_n write_v against_o god_n people_n and_o good_a man_n for_o consutation_n of_o this_o objection_n i_o present_v to_o the_o reader_n apprehension_n these_o follow_v particular_n 1._o i_o have_v endeavour_v for_o the_o manner_n of_o do_v it_o that_o it_o may_v be_v without_o all_o just_a exception_n in_o regard_n of_o hard_a word_n and_o better_a speech_n and_o i_o can_v true_o say_v i_o have_v decline_v many_o word_n and_o phrase_n more_o proper_a and_o take_v other_o word_n which_o in_o some_o place_n have_v readred_a the_o stile_n more_o rugged_a to_o avoid_v offensive_a phrase_n and_o all_o along_o though_o i_o often_o disprove_v matter_n of_o fact_n yet_o i_o never_o use_v so_o harsh_a a_o word_n to_o my_o remembrance_n as_o false_a much_o less_o a_o lie_n but_o untrue_a and_o this_o be_v not_o so_o whereas_o m._n sympson_n in_o his_o pamphlet_n use_v false_o and_o have_v the_o word_n lie_v 2._o i_o desire_v the_o conscientious_a indisterent_fw-la reader_n to_o consider_v my_o book_n be_v not_o a_o treatise_n or_o tractate_n upon_o what_o subject_n i_o please_v to_o speak_v of_o but_o a_o answer_n and_o so_o must_v follow_v where_o that_o lead_v i_o &_o speak_v to_o that_o 2._o it_o be_v a_o answer_n to_o a_o book_n full_a of_o matter_n of_o fact_n and_o story_n of_o the_o author_n themselves_o so_o that_o i_o can_v answer_v without_o particularising_a the_o truth_n can_v be_v evidence_v to_o the_o reader_n without_o come_v somewhat_o to_o particular_n 〈◊〉_d the_o book_n contain_v matter_n of_o high_a praise_n of_o themselves_o and_o their_o party_n a_o few_o inconsiderable_a person_n comparative_o with_o many_o close_a indirect_a and_o dangerous_a insinuation_n against_o all_o the_o reform_a church_n which_o can_v be_v answer_v particular_o without_o some_o recrimination_n and_o charge_n 4._o there_o be_v many_o particular_n in_o matter_n of_o fact_n i_o prove_v and_o charge_v the_o apologist_n with_o and_o some_o too_o bad_a for_o untruth_n 5._o i_o forbear_v menâ—…oning_v the_o name_n of_o many_o particular_a person_n which_o this_o apology_n lead_v i_o unto_o some_o whole_o other_o i_o speak_v of_o only_a under_o the_o 〈◊〉_d letter_n of_o their_o name_n and_o for_o the_o apologist_n though_o i_o often_o particular_o name_v they_o yet_o in_o some_o place_n of_o my_o book_n and_o in_o some_o grosser_n thing_n i_o forbear_v particularise_v they_o too_o 6._o i_o meddle_v not_o with_o personal_a thing_n and_o matter_n of_o fact_n that_o be_v heterogeneal_a to_o relate_v other_o kind_n of_o fact_n and_o practice_n which_o i_o have_v hear_v on_o know_v of_o any_o the_o apologist_n but_o speak_v only_o of_o such_o as_o be_v proper_a to_o the_o matter_n occasion_v from_o their_o apology_n or_o the_o effect_n and_o fruit_n of_o their_o church_n way_n the_o apologist_n themselves_o give_v the_o occasion_n to_o the_o lay_v open_a so_o many_o particular_n which_o no_o other_o occasion_n but_o such_o a_o one_o as_o this_o can_v have_v draw_v forth_o from_o i_o to_o have_v make_v their_o name_n and_o practice_n thus_o public_a 7._o in_o many_o passage_n of_o this_o answer_n i_o do_v upon_o several_a occasion_n give_v the_o apologist_n a_o just_a testimony_n of_o that_o worth_n for_o part_n and_o piety_n which_o be_v in_o they_o and_o speak_v to_o they_o and_o of_o they_o as_o brethren_n so_o that_o let_v but_o all_o these_o thing_n be_v lay_v together_o consider_v also_o the_o rule_n of_o scripture_n in_o such_o case_n and_o that_o i_o intend_v a_o plain_a particular_a downright_a answer_n and_o this_o answer_n will_v then_o be_v account_v candid_a moderate_a my_o peâ—…dipped_v in_o oil_n and_o not_o in_o vinegar_n 3._o i_o can_v true_o speak_v it_o that_o this_o present_a antapologia_fw-la be_v so_o far_o from_o be_v write_v out_o of_o any_o malice_n or_o ill_a will_n to_o the_o apologist_n that_o i_o love_v their_o person_n and_o value_v they_o as_o brethren_n yea_o some_o of_o they_o above_o brethren_n and_o beside_o that_o love_n i_o bear_v to_o they_o as_o saint_n i_o have_v a_o personal_a love_n and_o a_o particular_a love_n of_o friendship_n to_o some_o of_o they_o and_o i_o can_v true_o speak_v it_o that_o i_o write_v not_o this_o book_n nor_o any_o part_n of_o it_o out_o of_o any_o personal_a quarrel_n old_a grudge_n or_o former_a difference_n for_o to_o this_o day_n there_o never_o be_v any_o such_o difference_n or_o unkindness_n pass_v between_o we_o but_o i_o have_v write_v it_o with_o much_o sorrow_n unwillingness_n and_o some_o kind_n of_o conflict_n in_o respect_n of_o that_o old_a personal_a love_n and_o friendship_n still_o strong_a in_o i_o
shall_v have_v lay_v down_o particular_o as_o wherein_o and_o how_o far_o you_o agree_v with_o the_o reform_a church_n so_o also_o wherein_o you_o depart_v from_o they_o namely_o you_o shall_v have_v show_v in_o what_o you_o practise_v more_o than_o they_o do_v and_o wherein_o you_o practise_v short_a of_o they_o and_o in_o the_o thing_n you_o practise_v with_o they_o yet_o how_o you_o differ_v in_o the_o manner_n of_o they_o but_o to_o return_v to_o that_o of_o censure_n reform_a church_n practice_v beside_o admonition_n and_o before_o they_o come_v to_o excommunication_n that_o which_o be_v call_v by_o divine_n abstentio_fw-la à _fw-la sacracaena_fw-la but_o you_o do_v not_o so_o but_o conceal_v this_o but_o brethren_n why_o shall_v you_o not_o practice_v this_o especial_o consider_v how_o according_a to_o your_o principle_n the_o church_n be_v to_o receive_v the_o lord_n supper_n every_o lord_n day_n now_o suppose_v some_o member_n commit_v a_o great_a sin_n on_o the_o saturday_n which_o though_o come_n it_o be_v know_v to_o the_o minister_n or_o elder_n and_o some_o of_o the_o people_n either_o there_o may_v be_v no_o time_n to_o call_v the_o church_n to_o admonish_v the_o party_n or_o if_o there_o be_v for_o admonition_n yet_o not_o time_n sufficient_a for_o the_o party_n to_o testify_v repentance_n and_o yet_o the_o person_n may_v not_o be_v judge_v obstinate_a and_o impenitent_a as_o to_o be_v excommunicate_v but_o the_o person_n offend_v will_v come_v now_o to_o the_o lord_n table_n in_o the_o interim_n what_o will_v you_o do_v in_o this_o case_n and_o further_o the_o reform_a church_n enjoin_v the_o censure_n of_o open_a confession_n of_o sin_n and_o practice_v deposition_n of_o officer_n from_o their_o place_n which_o may_v just_o arise_v upon_o some_o case_n and_o yet_o not_o think_v it_o fit_a to_o proceed_v unto_o excommunication_n as_o yourselves_o practise_v in_o m._n ward_n case_n never_o proceed_v to_o give_v he_o up_o to_o satan_n but_o how_o lame_a and_o defective_a be_v this_o your_o narration_n about_o the_o government_n of_o the_o church_n only_o relate_v two_o thing_n you_o practise_v in_o common_a with_o the_o reform_a church_n and_o as_o conceal_v other_o thing_n you_o practise_v not_o with_o they_o so_o whole_o pass_v over_o in_o silence_n here_o all_o your_o different_a way_n of_o practise_v from_o all_o church_n in_o the_o way_n of_o ordination_n in_o the_o way_n of_o constitute_a church_n and_o admission_n into_o they_o and_o in_o the_o way_n of_o govern_v by_o the_o vote_n and_o suffrage_n of_o the_o whole_a body_n in_o the_o way_n of_o celebration_n the_o lord_n supper_n receive_v it_o at_o night_n etc._n etc._n in_o the_o sacrament_n of_o baptism_n with_o many_o other_o particular_n which_o whether_o it_o be_v fair_o do_v i_o appeal_v to_o the_o reader_n who_o be_v by_o this_o much_o deceive_v think_v upon_o the_o read_n of_o this_o narration_n that_o you_o have_v agree_v in_o all_o thing_n of_o worship_n officer_n censure_n with_o the_o reform_a church_n but_o to_o return_v to_o that_o censure_n of_o excommunication_n which_o you_o insist_v upon_o lay_v down_o your_o judgement_n about_o the_o subject_n of_o that_o censure_n as_o for_o your_o blessing_n god_n you_o never_o exercise_v it_o there_o may_v be_v but_o little_a ground_n for_o such_o a_o blessing_n but_o cause_n rather_o to_o be_v humble_v for_o not_o use_v it_o seasonable_o i_o judge_v have_v you_o practise_v it_o some_o revile_n evil_a speaking_n between_o many_o member_n of_o your_o church_n with_o some_o other_o offence_n may_v have_v be_v prevent_v but_o there_o be_v no_o such_o great_a cause_n to_o set_v out_o yourselves_o by_o the_o non-exercise_n of_o excommunication_n if_o what_o you_o hold_v for_o the_o matter_n of_o it_o be_v consider_v wherein_o i_o suppose_v you_o differ_v from_o all_o orthodox_n reform_a church_n and_o do_v open_a a_o wide_a gap_n to_o much_o licentiousness_n both_o in_o doctrine_n and_o practice_n what_o do_v you_o judge_v be_v it_o not_o to_o be_v put_v in_o execution_n for_o no_o other_o kind_n of_o sin_n then_o may_v evident_o be_v presume_v to_o be_v perpetrate_v against_o the_o party_n know_v light_n etc._n etc._n what_o if_o man_n practise_v polygamy_n profane_v the_o lord_n day_n by_o use_v it_o as_o they_o do_v any_o other_o day_n what_o if_o they_o do_v hold_v and_o according_o will_v have_v practise_v community_n of_o good_n among_o believer_n what_o if_o they_o maintain_v that_o christian_n ought_v not_o to_o be_v magistrate_n all_o which_o be_v not_o condemn_v in_o all_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n especial_o if_o some_o church_n may_v be_v take_v for_o church_n of_o christ_n and_o we_o have_v reason_n to_o believe_v by_o your_o manner_n of_o expression_n you_o include_v such_o neither_o be_v perpetrate_v against_o the_o party_n know_v light_n but_o rather_o be_v practise_v upon_o new_a light_n and_o as_o new_a truth_n and_o let_v i_o entreat_v you_o in_o your_o reply_n to_o explain_v your_o meaning_n what_o you_o mean_v by_o all_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n and_o by_o the_o common_a receive_v practice_n of_o christianity_n and_o what_o by_o the_o principle_n of_o christianity_n universal_o acknowledge_v in_o all_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o church_n whether_o by_o church_n you_o understand_v the_o church_n only_o of_o your_o own_o communion_n and_o way_n or_o the_o church_n which_o be_v common_o call_v the_o reform_a or_o else_o all_o church_n whatsoever_o that_o be_v so_o call_v as_o beside_o your_o own_o and_o the_o reform_a the_o church_n of_o the_o anabaptist_n antinomian_o and_o such_o like_a and_o i_o have_v reason_n to_o propound_v this_o question_n your_o word_n be_v so_o doubtful_a now_o if_o your_o word_n and_o phrase_n be_v take_v in_o the_o first_o sense_n of_o your_o church_n only_o that_o those_o sin_n and_o no_o other_o be_v to_o be_v the_o subject_n of_o excommunication_n then_o great_a sin_n and_o error_n according_a to_o the_o scripture_n and_o judge_v so_o by_o orthodox_n church_n may_v escape_v excommunication_n and_o on_o the_o contrary_a many_o matter_n which_o according_a to_o scripture_n be_v neither_o sin_n nor_o error_n but_o only_o your_o church_n hold_v they_o so_o may_v have_v that_o dreadful_a sentenee_n pass_v upon_o they_o but_o if_o you_o mean_v it_o in_o the_o large_a sense_n for_o all_o kind_n of_o church_n and_o for_o the_o receive_v principle_n and_o practice_n of_o christianity_n profess_v and_o acknowledge_v in_o all_o the_o church_n then_o more_o sin_n and_o error_n so_o judge_v by_o the_o word_n by_o most_o church_n and_o by_o your_o own_o church_n too_o will_v not_o be_v acknowledge_v for_o such_o in_o all_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o church_n and_o so_o shall_v escape_v that_o censure_n but_o if_o you_o shall_v say_v you_o mean_v only_o the_o reformed-churche_n common_o so_o call_v and_o the_o common_a receive_v practice_n profess_v by_o they_o it_o can_v be_v so_o understand_v as_o be_v evident_a by_o your_o own_o expression_n in_o this_o passage_n about_o excommunication_n so_o that_o here_o be_v strange_a unsafe_a rule_n to_o go_v by_o in_o the_o censure_n of_o excommunication_n and_o i_o judge_v it_o be_v a_o part_n of_o the_o new_a light_n and_o now_o truth_n of_o these_o time_n never_o yet_o give_v by_o any_o learned_a classical_a author_n how_o much_o better_o be_v it_o for_o church_n to_o make_v the_o subject_n of_o excommunication_n such_o sin_n and_o error_n which_o the_o scripture_n have_v make_v so_o and_o those_o sin_n to_o be_v agree_v upon_o by_o common_a consent_n in_o assembly_n and_o synod_n so_o draw_v up_o for_o all_o to_o know_v they_o but_o if_o it_o be_v object_v that_o this_o may_v hinder_v further_a light_n and_o a_o after_o discovery_n i_o answer_v when_o any_o thing_n more_o shall_v come_v to_o be_v find_v out_o this_o need_n be_v no_o hindrance_n unto_o any_o light_n but_o by_o the_o public_a government_n and_o common_a consent_n upon_o good_a ground_n may_v be_v add_v but_o this_o your_o judgement_n about_o the_o censure_n of_o excommunication_n i_o fear_v be_v calculate_v for_o the_o meridian_n of_o pretend_a liberty_n of_o conscience_n now_o this_o position_n of_o hold_v the_o subject_n of_o excommunication_n to_o be_v only_o such_o sin_n and_o error_n as_o be_v against_o the_o party_n know_v light_n and_o the_o common_a receive_v practice_n of_o christianity_n profess_v in_o all_o church_n and_o no_o other_o to_o be_v the_o subject_n of_o it_o tend_v much_o to_o the_o tolerate_n of_o sect_n and_o heresy_n which_o in_o this_o impure_a age_n be_v by_o many_o man_n and_o by_o too_o many_o of_o the_o church_n way_n so_o studious_o promote_v against_o the_o nature_n of_o reformation_n and_o true_a zeal_n but_o if_o one_o of_o the_o great_a end_n of_o excommunication_n be_v to_o preserve_v other_o from_o
matter_n of_o great_a moment_n and_o controversy_n apolog._n we_o still_o choose_v to_o practice_v safe_o and_o so_o as_o we_o have_v reason_n to_o judge_v that_o all_o sort_n or_o the_o most_o of_o all_o the_o church_n do_v acknowledge_v warrantable_a although_o they_o make_v additament_n thereunto_o to_o this_o three_o great_a principle_n of_o you_o i_o answer_v 1._o to_o it_o general_o as_o you_o lay_v it_o down_o here_o general_o and_o afterward_o more_o particular_o to_o the_o instance_n and_o particular_n bring_v by_o you_o to_o make_v it_o good_a in_o this_o principle_n you_o labour_v to_o cast_v a_o odium_fw-la upon_o all_o the_o reform_a church_n who_o differ_v from_o you_o deal_v by_o they_o in_o such_o a_o medium_n and_o way_n as_o the_o protestant_n do_v by_o the_o papist_n whereas_o we_o allege_v against_o the_o papist_n that_o the_o protestant_a religion_n be_v via_fw-la tuta_fw-la and_o what_o we_o practise_v they_o themselves_o can_v but_o allow_v only_o they_o hold_v and_o practice_v over_o and_o above_o as_o namely_o they_o add_v to_o christ_n righteousness_n their_o own_o in_o the_o point_n of_o justification_n to_o christ_n intercession_n the_o intercession_n of_o the_o virgin_n mary_n and_o saint_n to_o prayer_n unto_o god_n prayer_n to_o angel_n and_o saint_n to_o the_o scripture_n the_o tradition_n of_o the_o church_n to_o our_o sacrament_n confess_v by_o themselves_o five_o other_o etc._n etc._n so_o here_o you_o say_v that_o you_o choose_v to_o practice_v safe_o and_o so_o as_o you_o have_v reason_n to_o judge_v other_o church_n do_v acknowledge_v warrantable_a but_o they_o make_v additament_n and_o this_o you_o weave_v in_o all_o along_o in_o the_o particular_a instance_n under_o this_o head_n and_o it_o lie_v upon_o they_o to_o prove_v what_o they_o add_v over_o and_o above_o now_o beside_o the_o great_a dissimilitude_n and_o difference_n of_o additament_n in_o the_o thing_n themselves_o between_o the_o protestant_n and_o papist_n and_o 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divine_n of_o note_n both_o in_o other_o church_n and_o in_o our_o own_o condemn_v as_o unlawful_a by_o calvin_n beza_n peter_n martyr_n zanchius_n bullinger_n junius_n pareus_n morneus_fw-la arnesius_fw-la voetius_fw-la etc._n etc._n with_o whitaker_n brightman_n perkins_n cartwright_n parker_n banes_n hildersham_n ball._n etc._n etc._n i_o can_v fill_v a_o book_n with_o the_o testimony_n of_o these_o and_o many_o other_o and_o i_o do_v challenge_v the_o separatist_n of_o all_o sort_n whether_o they_o of_o the_o head-forme_n the_o anabaptist_n or_o of_o the_o middle-forme_n the_o old_a brownist_n or_o the_o lowest-forme_n the_o semiseparatist_n to_o give_v i_o any_o precept_n or_o allow_v example_n of_o such_o a_o practice_n out_o of_o the_o primitive_a pattern_n show_v it_o i_o and_o i_o will_v yield_v the_o cause_n as_o for_o that_o place_n rev._n 18._o 4._o you_o profess_v against_o that_o in_o your_o 6_o t_o page_z of_o have_v any_o thought_n of_o our_o church_n or_o minister_n to_o be_v antichristian_a and_o babilonish_a i_o can_v allege_v many_o scripture_n against_o this_o practice_n jude_n v._n 19_o etc._n etc._n the_o apostle_n who_o be_v send_v by_o christ_n into_o the_o world_n to_o make_v disciple_n and_o to_o bring_v man_n from_o judaisme_n and_o heathenism_n to_o believe_v in_o christ_n and_o to_o plant_v church_n of_o such_o yet_o they_o never_o teach_v nor_o practise_v to_o gather_v and_o separate_v some_o christian_n from_o the_o rest_n one_o part_n of_o the_o church_n from_o the_o other_o to_o go_v constitute_v a_o pure_a church_n neither_o in_o corinth_n philippi_n etc._n etc._n although_o there_o be_v many_o corruption_n and_o many_o loose_a person_n but_o paul_n teach_v and_o practise_v to_o censure_n and_o cast_v out_o evil_a person_n but_o in_o case_n those_o who_o have_v power_n neglect_v their_o duty_n he_o never_o teach_v the_o godly_a to_o separate_v from_o the_o lord_n supper_n celebrate_v in_o the_o public_a assembly_n much_o less_o for_o a_o few_o to_o withdraw_v from_o their_o pastor_n and_o other_o brethren_n and_o to_o set_v up_o new_a church_n of_o themselves_o you_o be_v scholar_n and_o well_o read_v in_o the_o scripture_n show_v i_o but_o any_o such_o direction_n from_o the_o apostle_n and_o i_o be_o you_o 2._o it_o be_v a_o matter_n of_o moment_n and_o controversy_n the_o right_a make_n and_o call_v of_o the_o minister_n of_o the_o gospel_n now_o all_o the_o reform_a church_n according_a to_o the_o example_n of_o scripture_n hold_v minister_n be_v not_o to_o be_v make_v by_o the_o people_n alone_o and_o that_o the_o people_n have_v not_o power_n of_o ordination_n and_o imposition_n of_o hand_n but_o the_o presbyter_n and_o yet_o you_o have_v practise_v the_o be_v call_v and_o make_v minister_n by_o the_o people_n without_o the_o imposition_n of_o hand_n of_o the_o preach_a presbyter_n 3._o it_o be_v a_o matter_n of_o great_a moment_n and_o controversy_n whether_o private_a christian_n who_o be_v never_o train_v up_o in_o art_n and_o learning_n nor_o intend_v the_o ministry_n may_v in_o the_o public_a congregation_n prophesy_v which_o prophesy_v as_o it_o be_v not_o practise_v by_o the_o reform_a church_n so_o by_o most_o of_o they_o it_o be_v not_o count_v warrantable_a and_o yet_o you_o allow_v it_o in_o your_o church_n to_o which_o i_o may_v add_v more_o instance_n but_o that_o the_o book_n will_v swell_v into_o too_o great_a a_o volume_n to_o the_o second_o head_n it_o be_v evident_a the_o râ—…formed_a church_n practise_v more_o safe_o as_o in_o decline_v your_o way_n in_o the_o last_o mention_v instance_n in_o not_o permit_v such_o as_o be_v layman_n to_o preach_v or_o prophesy_v in_o not_o forsake_v true_a church_n or_o true_a ministry_n for_o the_o mixture_n of_o wicked_a man_n but_o rather_o cast_v out_o such_o who_o after_o admonition_n continue_v impenitent_a so_o in_o other_o practice_n practise_v as_o the_o apostle_n receive_v man_n into_o their_o fellowship_n without_o any_o such_o curious_a inquiry_n and_o long_a detention_n send_v man_n from_o one_o to_o another_o and_o require_v such_o preparative_n and_o condition_n to_o church-fellowship_n as_o your_o church_n have_v do_v the_o way_n and_o practice_n the_o reform_a church_n walk_v in_o be_v the_o good_a old_a way_n know_v and_o beat_v for_o some_o score_n of_o year_n in_o which_o so_o many_o great_a light_n and_o godly_a people_n have_v walk_v and_o so_o more_o safe_a than_o high_a and_o new_a way_n that_o a_o few_o man_n but_o of_o yesterday_o have_v take_v up_o and_o have_v not_o yet_o well_o air_v much_o less_o digest_v and_o in_o the_o name_n of_o other_o reform_a church_n france_n holland_n scotland_n i_o deny_v the_o thing_n you_o charge_v they_o with_o to_o be_v additament_n or_o to_o be_v proper_o so_o call_v for_o if_o the_o particular_n instance_a in_o by_o you_o will_v be_v find_v to_o have_v a_o foot_n in_o the_o scripture_n and_o practise_v
difference_n what_o if_o the_o messenger_n of_o the_o church_n upon_o hear_v and_o examine_v differ_v among_o themselves_o about_o the_o difference_n and_o offence_n in_o the_o church_n â—…ending_v and_o about_o the_o sentence_n to_o be_v agree_v upon_o to_o be_v commend_v to_o the_o offend_a party_n yea_o and_o what_o if_o the_o church_n themselves_o upon_o return_n make_v by_o the_o messenger_n how_o they_o find_v matter_n differ_v also_o one_o of_o the_o church_n offend_v be_v of_o one_o mind_n and_o the_o other_o church_n offend_v of_o another_o mind_n what_o remedy_n be_v there_o now_o for_o miscarriage_n what_o relief_n for_o a_o person_n injure_v or_o what_o effectual_a and_o powerful_a mean_n to_o reduce_v a_o church_n or_o church_n 13._o in_o your_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n against_o church_n and_o in_o your_o declaration_n and_o protestation_n to_o all_o other_o church_n of_o christ_n â—…hat_o they_o may_v do_v the_o like_a what_o shall_v become_v of_o some_o innocent_a godly_a person_n in_o that_o church_n renounce_v and_o protest_v against_o must_v they_o be_v renounce_v communion_n with_o what_o will_v you_o do_v in_o the_o case_n where_o some_o in_o a_o church_n may_v be_v free_a from_o the_o error_n and_o evil_n which_o the_o great_a number_n be_v guilty_a of_o which_o you_o account_v the_o church_n must_v they_o be_v debar_v of_o all_o christian_a communion_n with_o the_o church_n offend_v and_o all_o other_o church_n of_o christ_n protest_v to_o you_o speak_v nothing_o here_o in_o this_o case_n nor_o take_v no_o care_n for_o they_o but_o wrap_v up_o all_o alike_o in_o your_o sentence_n of_o non-communion_n must_v the_o innocent_a party_n now_o in_o this_o church_n offend_v separate_a and_o withdraw_v from_o their_o own_o church_n and_o renounce_v communion_n too_o as_o well_o as_o the_o church_n offend_v what_o if_o all_o their_o maintenance_n and_o livelihood_n depend_v in_o live_v in_o that_o place_n so_o that_o if_o they_o withdraw_v from_o they_o they_o must_v either_o live_v without_o public_a ordinance_n and_o communion_n or_o else_o if_o they_o come_v away_o ruin_n themselves_o and_o family_n what_o also_o if_o in_o this_o church_n offend_v the_o wife_n be_v one_o of_o the_o innocent_a person_n in_o that_o church_n but_o the_o husband_n of_o the_o number_n of_o they_o that_o persist_v in_o their_o error_n and_o miscarriage_n the_o son_n and_o daughter_n among_o the_o innocent_a the_o father_n and_o mother_n among_o the_o offender_n what_o must_v the_o wife_n and_o child_n renounce_v communion_n with_o their_o husband_n and_o parent_n and_o now_o either_o live_v without_o the_o ordinance_n there_o or_o else_o go_v away_o from_o their_o husband_n and_o pareâ—…ts_n to_o some_o other_o church_n 〈◊〉_d and_o in_o your_o draw_v up_o your_o declaration_n and_o protestation_n against_o those_o church_n persist_v in_o their_o error_n and_o miscarriage_n will_v you_o in_o the_o gross_a do_v it_o or_o will_v you_o signify_v and_o declare_v all_o the_o name_n of_o those_o who_o remain_v obstinate_a and_o impenitent_a in_o such_o church_n with_o the_o name_n of_o those_o who_o be_v free_a from_o those_o error_n and_o offence_n lest_o you_o shall_v bring_v all_o the_o church_n of_o christ_n protest_v unto_o into_o sin_n and_o a_o snare_n pray_v resolve_v these_o case_n with_o many_o such_o which_o by_o these_o now_o hint_v you_o may_v foresee_v will_v fall_v out_o in_o your_o principle_n of_o non-communion_n of_o church_n and_o protestation_n three_o for_o the_o success_n and_o effectualnes_n of_o your_o practice_n i_o answer_v 1._o suppose_v the_o particular_a instance_n of_o your_o practice_n according_a to_o the_o principle_n of_o submission_n of_o church_n that_o miscarry_v to_o have_v have_v a_o good_a effect_n as_o you_o relate_v in_o your_o two_o church_n of_o arnheim_n and_o rottendam_fw-la yet_o it_o follow_v not_o it_o be_v a_o powerful_a and_o effectual_a mean_n to_o reduce_v church_n for_o a_o course_n may_v prevail_v in_o one_o and_o take_v with_o one_o and_o yet_o have_v no_o rationality_n to_o carry_v it_o in_o other_o for_o though_o this_o church_n at_o rotterdam_n do_v submit_v to_o they_o of_o arnheim_n who_o be_v of_o note_n for_o part_n quality_n etc._n etc._n yet_o it_o be_v a_o question_n whether_o these_o will_v to_o some_o other_o particular_a church_n who_o have_v challenge_v they_o and_o whether_o these_o man_n will_v also_o at_o all_o time_n have_v there_o not_o be_v something_o cast_v in_o the_o balance_n before_o hint_v 2._o take_v the_o best_a that_o come_v of_o the_o issue_n and_o success_n of_o this_o agitation_n between_o the_o church_n of_o arnheim_n and_o that_o of_o rotterdam_n namely_o that_o church_n which_o have_v offend_v acknowledge_v their_o offence_n in_o depose_v mr_n ward_n and_o restore_v he_o to_o his_o place_n again_o it_o be_v but_o a_o slender_a satisfaction_n for_o the_o loss_n of_o his_o ministry_n and_o maintenance_n for_o so_o long_a a_o time_n and_o for_o all_o the_o suffering_n of_o he_o and_o his_o family_n if_o the_o church_n offend_v have_v be_v enjoin_v or_o have_v order_v themselves_o to_o have_v pay_v he_o the_o profit_n of_o his_o place_n or_o to_o have_v give_v he_o a_o good_a sum_n of_o money_n on_o their_o fast_a day_n this_o have_v be_v some_o relief_n for_o a_o wrongful_a sentence_n and_o a_o person_n injure_v thereby_o and_o may_v have_v be_v a_o mean_n to_o have_v preserve_v they_o from_o do_v the_o like_a for_o time_n to_o come_v but_o for_o a_o minister_n and_o his_o family_n to_o be_v so_o long_o in_o a_o sad_a condition_n without_o all_o maintenance_n in_o a_o strange_a land_n and_o in_o the_o issue_n for_o they_o who_o do_v this_o to_o acknowledge_v only_o their_o sinful_a aberration_n and_o the_o minister_n thus_o suffer_v to_o acknowledge_v his_o sin_n too_o and_o both_o of_o they_o to_o be_v humble_v for_o it_o alike_o here_o be_v a_o poor_a remedy_n â—…ay_o 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