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cause_n	authority_n	church_n	see_v	1,737	5	3.7569	3	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A90063	Irenicum; or, An essay towards a brotherly peace & union, between those of the congregational and presbyterian way; shewing out of the most learned and renowned divines of the congregational way, that their positions concerning 1. Church matters and members. 2. Church constitution and form. 3. Church state. 4. Church officers and ordination. 5. Church government and censures. 6. Church combinations and synods. 7. Communion with and separation from churches. are sufficient for the establishing a firme and lasting peace between them and the Presbyterians ... In pursuance of the good design begun at the Savoy, where it was agreed, and declared, that such reforming churches as consist of persons sound in the faith, and of conversation becoming the Gospel, ought not to refuse the communion of each other ... Drawn up and published by Discipulus de Tempore Junior.	Newcomen, Matthew, 1610?-1669.; D. T.	1659 (1659)	Wing N910; Thomason E978_1; ESTC R202985	58,516	89

be preferred before obedience to an affirmative precept that is not fundamental though therefore a hoof of truth is to be preferred before the liberties and lives of the ten thousands of Israel yet when the whole community is more endangered by the want of publick order than by the present not observing of some affirmative command not fundamental we ought to have more regard to publick order than to the present obedience of such a command 5. Therefore the particular Church in this case may and ought to submit it self to such order but yet without sin Mr. Nortons answ to Apollonius pag. 118.119 Quest 18. But how can that been done Answ 1. The truth is not to be dissembled Mr. Norton but the Church is modestly and peaceably to bear witnesse to the truth 2. Effor is never to be approved though for awhile in regard of the iniquity of the time it is to be tolerated 3. Wisely and patiently we must wait in our stations in the due use of means till God in his own proper season shall reveal the truth Mr. Norton against Apollonius page 119. line 30. Quest 19. Have all the Members of a Synod equal power Answ A Synod consisting Mr. Cotton as we have heard it doth of Elders and Brethren their power is not the same but distinct the power which the Brethren have it is a power of liberty the power which the Elders have it is a power of authority The Brethren have first liberty to dispute their doubts modestly and Christianly among the Elders so in that Synod at Jerusalem Acts 15.7 12. Secondly they had liberty to joyne with the Apostles and Elders in determining the same as the common sense of them all Thirdly they had liberty to joyn with the Apostles and Elders in choosing and sending Messengers and in writing Synodal letters in the name of all for the publishing of the sentence of the Synod Acts 13. ver 22 23. to 29. But the authority of the decrees lay chiefly if not only in the Apostles and Elders as appears Acts 16.4 So then it will be most safe to preserve to the Church of Brethren their due liberty and to the Church of the Elders their due authority Mr. Cotton of the Keyes page 26. line 1. Quest 20. Whether may a person or persons wronged by particular Churches appeal to a Synod or no for redress Answ There is a right of appeals in weighty causes from an inferior to a superior sentence Mr. Norton And seeing that in Ecclesiastical causes and among Ecclesiastical persons many differences do arise who can deny but that this right of appeals must be granted there Appeals are of divine and natural right and necessary in all societies because of the ignorance and unrighteousnesse of many who are Judges Mr. Nortons answer to Apoll. 3. pag. 112. line antepenult page 114. Hitherto of the Combination or Consociation of Churches and of Synods and their power Now from these particulars that have been delivered let us draw some positions with their inferences First it is lawful for particular Churches to joyne together in a holy Covenant and communion amongst themselves to administer all Church Affairs of weight and difficulty and common concernment not without common consultation and consent about them See answer to quest 1. Hence it follows 1. That if an expresse consent and Covenant be the formalis ratio and constitutive of a Church then these particular Churches thus joyned together make up one Church not representativè impropriè but truly and properly having the true formale of a Church and that which dat essentiam 2. If they have thus covenanted together to transact things by common consent then every Church of the Consociation hath the same power in all matters that the fraternity of a particular Church hath to wit of consenting or of dissenting 3. If they Covenant to administer all their affairs not without common consent then quere whether every particular Church hath not a negative voice which is more then the Presbyterians contend for 4. If they Covenant to administer all matters of weight and common concernment NOT without common consent then the excommunication of any person being a matter of weight as doubtlesse the delivering up of a soul to Satan is and also a matter of common concernment he that is cast out of one Church being cast out of all will it not from the concession follow that no particular Church can excommunicate a Member without the consent of the associated Churches 2. This Consociation of Churches is safe useful and wholesome and in some case necessary See answ to quest 2.3 5 8. they therefore who refuse to associate with other Churches when it is offered let these consider whether they do not forsake their own mercies 3. Even the strongest and best Churches have need of Association first that they may help the weak for all Churches are not in a like athletick plight and secondly for themselves for the best may soon degenerate and for want of Association may sink and fall into deep Apostasie See answ to quest 4. therefore 1. These Associations ought not to be elective for then the strong and athletick Churches may combine together and exclude the weaker and lesse athletick saying we have no need of you which would frustrate the end of combination and therefore the best way is for Churches that are in vicinity to combine together 2. If the strongest Church may need Consociation to prevent degeneration and Apostasie then the best way is to have these Consociations fixed and stated not occasional only pro re nata Sero med cina paratur Quum mala per long as invaluere moras 4. Combination of Churches is an holy Ordinance of Christ See answ to quest 6. Therefore let them consider how they will answer it to Jesus Christ who not only live without this Ordinance but despise it and speak evil of it and yet have covenanted to walk in all the Ordinances of Christ and would be thought so to do 5. Combination of Churches is no more destructive to the power of particular Churches than the Consociation of the Apostles was to their Apostolical power See answer to quest 6. 6. As the Apostles giving the right hand of fellowship one to another strengthened their hands in the work of the Ministery so the Elders of Churches giving the right hand of fellowship one to another upon any fit occasion cannot but strengthen the heart and hands of one another in the Lords work See answ to quest 7. Therefore for the Elders of Congregational Churches to refuse to associate with their brethren of another judgment and to refuse to give them the right hand of fellowship what doth it declare but this that either they do not think we in our Ministery work the work of the Lord or else that they are resolved to weaken our hands and hinder our work as much as they can because though we do Gods work

IRENICVM OR AN ESSAY Towards a Brotherly PEACE VNION Between those of the Congregational And Presbyterian Way Shewing out of the most Learned and Renowned Divines of the Congregational Way that their Positions Concerning 1. Church Matters and Members 2. Church Constitution and Form 3. Church State 4. Church Officers and Ordination 5. Church Government and Censures 6. Church Combinations and Synods 7. Communion with and Separation from Churches Are sufficient for the establishing a firme and lasting Peace between them and the Presbyterians Drawn up and published by Discipulus De Tempore Junior In pursuance of the good design begun at the Savoy where it was agreed and declared That such Reforming Churches as consist of Persons sound in the Faith and of Conversation becoming the Gospel ought not to refuse the communion of each other so far as may consist With their own principles respectively though they walk not in all things according to the same Rules of Church Order Canon 29. London Printed for Nathanael Webb and William-Grantham at the black Bear in Pauls Church-yard near the little North-door 1659. THE Preface BUt who would write Irenicums seeing they who attempt it reap usually no other fruit then he who running in between two men that are a fighting with an honest intent to part them and make them friends brings both their fists about his own ears or turns both their swords into his own bosome and maketh them both his enemies at least the prevailing party and he that thinks he hath the better of the cause will take it exceedingly ill as the Lutherans do Pareus his Irenicum which some of them call 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the Scotch non Conformists the Irenicum of their Country man Forbes The consideration of this made the Collector of these Papers though often sollicited with thoughts of that he hath now attempted to lay them by till being a little awakened first with the report of some thing towards an accommodation of dissenting parties endeavoured and as they say effected in Cumberland and Westmerland and in other Counties and with an expectation of some thing that was agreed by the Congregational way in their meeting at the Savoy that might conduce to that end he judged it now seasonable to present these Papers to publike view that he might suum conferre symbolum If this may procure a right understanding and composing of the differences between brethren the Collector hath his desire and reward if it fail and miss that end yet he hopes his reward is with the Lord having this testimony in his own conscience that in singleness of heart he hath managed this cause not knowingly or willingly falsifyng and wresting the words of those reverend men whom he cites from which crime if his own protestation be not enough to clear him thou shalt by and by Reader have the deposition of two sufficient witnesses If thou wilt not believe them neither get the Books and trust thine own eyes If any say these authors elsewhere express themselves otherwise all that I answer is that my design and work was not to reconcile them to themselves but if I could to their Presbyterian Brethren which how far it is done read but read with understanding and without prejudice and then judge Thine in the Lord D. T. The Attestation WE have examined all the several Quotations here alledged by the Books out of which they were taken and finde them to be punctually and syllabically true and that there is no falsification nor violation of them and this we being persons no wayes interested in the controversies between the Presbyterian and Congregational Brethren nor engaged to either Party Testifie under our hands L. K. R. N. To the Judicious Reader AMongst the manifold divisions both in Church and State whereby England hath been and still is damnified and endangered the doleful differences betwixt Presbyterians and Independants are not the least nor least lamented by gracious hearts as in other respects so because the loud noise thereof both from the Pulpit and the Press doth cause their adversaries sinfully to rejoyce 2 Sam. 1.20 In this regard the Popish the prophane and Prelatical party do encourage their hopes that the good work of Covenanted Church-Reformation in England Scotland and Ireland will ere long wither and come to nothing True it is that as neither kingdom nor house so no other society divided against it self can stand Mark 3.24 25. for division maketh way for dissipation Gen. 49.7 Upon this account in pursuance of that Machivilian Maxim Divide impera the Jesuited Papist and the self-seeking Statist do vigorously endeavor to maintain and encrease our divisions in matters of Religion at this day errors and contentions which are like tares hindring the growth of grace amongst Christians Mat. 13.23 are sowed by the Divel their implacable enemy And it is an expression of great displeasure from the Lord when the evil spirit is sent or suffered so far to prevail upon them which should be one in mutual amity that they in passion deal treacherously one with another Judg. 9.23 As it cannot be denyed but that animosities causing sad separations may be found amongst good men For the contention between Paul and Barnabas was so sharpe that they departed asunder one from the other so experience amongst our selves confirmeth Act. 15.39 what Solomon long since asserted A brother offended is harder to win than a strong City and their contentions are like the bars of a Palace In the late Assembly of Divines called together by Authority of Parliament many hours yea days were run up in serious debates that the Presbyterians and their dissenting brethren might be reconciled in matters of Church discipline And since that time many books have been publish't by godly Ministers of both perswasions to drive on that good design but the end intended hath not hitherto been accomplisht Now the good hand of the Almighty the God of Peace hath stirred up the heart of a faithful and able Minister of the Gospel whose name would adde authority to this work though he see cause to conceal it in a new way to attempt a brotherly agreement His design is to stitch up our rents and to heal our breaches by discovering the concessions and positions of the chief Patrons of the Congregational way that in reference to Church constitution of members and officers and in reference to Church administrations by Classes and Synods there is not so great opposition betwixt the Presbyterians and them as the Independent Brethren here amongst us do pretend and publish And let the indifferent Reader who is not byassed with prejudice and partiality judge whether there be not much ingenuity with meeknesse of wisdom and solidity of judgement in the Narrative and inferences herein tendred without any unbrotherly reflections or bitter exasperations The whole Treatise both in regard of the matter and manner of managing it speaketh the Author to be a man of

the Presbyterian way for M● Cotton saith the power which the Brethren have it is but a power of liberty but the power of Authority is in the Elders See cap. 5. answ to quest 14 15 16. 1. If you say The brethren In the Presbyterian way have not so much liberty as in the congregational For first they have not the liberty of exercising their gifts in prophecying Answ Master Cotton and Master Hooker both have told us how farre they are from allowing this liberty which some presume to take to themselves See before cap. 4. answer 〈◊〉 question 6. 2. If you say They in the Presbytery have not that liberty of consenting or dissenting in the admission of members as the congregational have but the examination is taken in private by the Elders Answ So it is frequently in the Congregational Churches and for some persons constantly as we have seen above cap. 14. ans to quest 14 15. 3. If you say The brethren in the Presbyterian way have not the same liberty and power in censures that they have in the congregational Answ Yea the same for the brethren in the Congregational way have not power to receive complaints in the first place to hear and examine witnesses but these things are transacted before and among the Elders Secondly The Elders they make reports of matters to the Church of brethren and withall declare what they judge to be the mind of Christ concerning the censuring or not censuring of the person Thirdly The people they upon this relation judge of the whole but with a judgement of discretion not with a judgement of Authority Fourthly They thus judging bind the offender by consent not Authority Fifthly This consent is an act of obedience not of power all these we have seen clearly asserted cap. 5. in answ to quest 14 15 16 17 18. Now all this the brethren may and do enjoy and exercise in the Presbyterian way If you say Brethren in the Presbyterian way cannot excommunicate without their Officers Answ No more may they in the Congregational way as appeared cap. 3. answ to quest 20. If you say The Brethren of the Presbyterian way have not power to choose their own officers as they have in the Congregational Answ According to the Presbyterian principles they have and the practice is so in France Netherlands Geneva Scotland and if it be otherwise in England it is because the laws of the land do yet invest the Patron with a power of nominating and presenting a Minister but the brethren have their vote in choosing the other officers Elders and Deacons and the Presbyterian affirms and they grant they ought to have it in the choosing of their teaching Elders much more besides there are many instances of Presbyterian Congregations in London and elsewhere in England that do chuse their own Officers If you say The brethren of the Presbyterian way cannot depose their Ministers or other officers without the consent of a Classis or Synod Answer No more may the brethren of the congregational way regularly according to their own principles and assertions See cap. 6. quest 1.13 14. If you say These Presbyterian Churches have Ordinances that are not of Christs institution As 1. They examine those whom they admit to the Sacrament although they own them for members Answ Yet they nowhere say that this is an Ordinance of Christ but a prudential practice which the brethren of the Congregational way own and practice as well as they See cap. 4. answ to quest 14 15. 2. If you say The Presbyterian Churches have suspensions of persons not excommunicated as an Ordinance of Christ. Answ They own and use it no otherwise than the brethren of the Congregational way do as appears cap. 3. answer to quest 22 23. If you say They have Classes and Synods as an Ordinance of Christ I answer The Congregational Churches own them for such and ascribe more than a consultative power to them See cap. 6. per totum If you except against the ordination of their Ministers See cap. 7. quest 7. answ to the objection If you say Their-Churches are true Churches but not pure you have purer Churches and purer ordinances I answer These are indeed the devices whereby people are drawn away from them to you but I beseech you tell us particularly what Ordinances have you purer then your brethren Is the Word more purely preached amongst you than amongst them came the Gospel forth from you or came it unto you onely are there purer prayers and purer Sacraments amongst you than amongst them do not they call upon the true Jehovah in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ as you do abhorring and renouncing all other objects and means of worship do not they Baptize with water in the name of the Father Son and Holy Ghost as you do do not they break the same bread and drink the same cup according to Christs institution in memorial of his death as you do Where then or what are these purer Ordinances which you have more than your brethren And for the purity of your Churches I am loth to answer as our Reformed Divines answered the like cavil of the Anabaptists and Brownists by Recrimination Yet I think I may say Are there not with you even with you also sinners against the Lord but I will refer you for answer to your own friends cap. 1. per totum and cap. 7. quest 6 7. And now brethren I beseech you consider the grounds upon which you have made and do yet continue this sad division and if you have no other than these as I think you have not let all the world judge whether they be not destroyed and overthrown by your own concessions And let me be permitted to speak to you once again in the words of Iotham Hearken to me that God may hearken to you you have been studying the purity of Churches to the utmost apex of it and it may be beyond there may be a purity supra statutum as well as a devotion But O that you would study the peace of Churches and that not onely these of your own Idea and Platform but of all the Churches of Christ I have heard some much complain of rigid Presbyterians Do not you derive that title of rigid to your selves The brethren of the Presbyterian way have sufficiently declared their readinesse to peace in their several models of association published by several Countries to which these collections out of the Authors of the Congregational way come so neer that if you refuse to come in and unite especially at such a time as this when we have seen already such ill fruits of our divisions and have cause to fear yet worse the rigidnesse will lie at your door Seeing your Brethren and you agree in faith and worship why should you live like Jews and Samaritans like Protestants and Papist like Lutherans and Calvinists Know you not it will be bitternesse in the end Why seeing your selves are convinced and have declared That Members of reforming Churches ought not to refuse communion one with another so far as may consist with their principles respectively And communion with Presbyterians may consist with your principles at least it doth with the principles of these from whom you professe to have received the principles of your way Why should ye yet abhorre their communion if you do judge whether your own mouths and hands have not condemned you Hearken therefore to me that God may hearken unto you or if you will not hearken unto me yet heark to Irenaeus lib. 4. adv haeres cap. 4. Probatio vera minime contradictioni obnoxia quae etiam ab adversaries ipsis symbola testificationis profert i. e. That 's a true proof and not to be contradicted that brings forth the Testimonies even of the adversaries Hearken to Basil homil in Chr. Nativ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 i.e. The witnesses of adversaries are most worthy of credit Hearken to Chrysostome homil 82 ●n Iohan. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 This is an unrefragable demonstration of Truth if a man call adversaries to witness what he speaks Hearken to Cyprian de Uni Eccles Quomodo possunt duo aut tres in nomine Christi colligi quos constat a Christo ab ejus Evangelio separari non enim nos ab illis sed illi a nobis recesserunt Et cum haereses schismata postmodumnatae sunt dum conventicula sibi diversa constituunt veritatis caput atque originem reliquerunt i. e. How can two or three be gathered together in the name of Christ when t is manifest they are separated from Christ and from his Gospel for we have not departed from them but they from us c. Hearken to Aust Epistola ad orthod Con. Donat. Quicunque de Christo scripturis sanctis consentiunt unitati Ecclesiae non communicant non sunt in Ecclesia Libr. 3. Cont. Donat. Non habet dei charitatem qui Ecclesiae non diligit unitatem i.e. They that agree concerning Christ and the Scriptures and do not communicate in the unity of the Church are not in the Church He hath not the love of God who doth not love the Churches unity Hearken to Paul l Cor. 1.10 Now I beseech you Brethren by the name of our Lord Iesus Christ that ye all speak the same thing and that there be no divisions among you but that ye be perfectly joyned together in the same minde and in the same judgement Phil. 2.1 2 3 4. If there be therefore any consolation in Christ if any comfort of love if any fellowship of the spirit if any bowels and mercies Fulfill ye my joy that ye be like minded having the same love being of one accord of one minde Let nothing be done through strife or vain-glory but in lowllness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves Look not every man on his own things but every man also on the things of others Gal. 5.15 But if ye bite and devour one another take heed ye be not consumed one of another Errata Page 9. line 3. read on p. 22. l. 13. r. endued p. 29. l. 24. r. Governors p. 43. l. 35. r. this p. 46. l. 36. r. or p. 47. l. 32. r. consotiation p. 54. l. 1. r. be FINIS