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A16145 The perpetual gouernement of Christes Church Wherein are handled; the fatherly superioritie which God first established in the patriarkes for the guiding of his Church, and after continued in the tribe of Leui and the prophetes; and lastlie confirmed in the New Testament to the Apostles and their successours: as also the points in question at this day; touching the Iewish Synedrion: the true kingdome of Christ: the Apostles commission: the laie presbyterie: the distinction of bishops from presbyters, and their succcssion [sic] from the Apostles times and hands: the calling and moderating of prouinciall synodes by primates and metropolitanes: the alloting of diƓceses, and the popular electing of such as must feed and watch the flocke: and diuers other points concerning the pastorall regiment of the house of God; by Tho. Bilson Warden of Winchester Colledge. Perused and allowed publike authoritie. Bilson, Thomas, 1546 or 7-1616. 1593 (1593) STC 3065; ESTC S101959 380,429 522

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the Presbyters succeeded in order when the place was voyde but that they chaunged by course hee saieth no such thing It was a plaine ouersight I will say no worse in him that first wrested Ambroses wordes to that conceite In the meane time we haue master Bezaes full confession that the going round by course to gouerne the Church doeth maintaine disorder and faction and no whit decrease ambition and the choosing of one to continue chiefe for his life began at Alexandria from Marke the Euangelist sixe yeeres before Peter and Paul were martyred and sixe and thirtie before the death of Saint Iohn in which there is NOTHING THAT can or ought to be misliked Howe truely hee speaketh if he should recall or you refuse his wordes reason and experience wil easily teach vs. for first in this circular change it is not casuall but essentiall that all in their course be they fit or vnfit must haue the ruling of the rest Now if to choose one good amongst many be a matter of difficultie howe impossible then is it that all should be good And yet by your rolling regiment all be they neuer so wicked or vnwoorthie must haue as much time and power to neglect and hurt the Church of God as the well minding and godly Pastours shall haue to assist and helpe the same Againe what good can be done by any when in euerie action one must beginne and another proceede and a third conclude If an euill man light on the beginning middle or ending he may soone marre all And be the men not euill except they be like affected and like instructed when will they agree in iudgement or tread one in anothers steppes If any faction arise I neede not put you in minde what contradicting and reuersing will be offered by your weekely or monethly Gouernours Who shall dare doe anie thing to a Presbyter or Bishop but he must looke for the like measure when their course commeth What can be one weeke made so sure but it may be the next weeke vndone by him that presently followeth This is the right way to make a mockerie of the Church of Christ and to permit it to euerie mans humour and pleasure whiles his time lasteth If you trust not me distrust not your selues It breedeth contempt and openeth the high way to factions As for Ambition which is an other of the mischiefes that you would amend by your changeable gouernement you cure that as he doeth which to coole the heate of one part of the bodie setteth all the rest in a burning feuer To quench the desire of dignitie in one man you inflame all the Pastours of euerie prouince with the same disease for you propose the like honor and power for the time vnto all which we do to one And so you heale ambition by making it common as if patients were the lesse sicke because others are touched with y ● same infection for if one man cannot haue this Metropoliticall preeminence without some note of pride the rest cā neither expect it nor enioy it in their courses but with some taint of the same corruption fruition and expectation of one the same thing are so neere neighbors that if one be vicious the other cannot be vertuous Wherefore either grant the superioritie and dignitie of Bishops and Metropolitanes may be christianly supported by one in euerie Presbytery and prouince as we affirme or else we conclude it can not be expected and enioyed of all euerie where by course as you would haue it but very vnchristianly You giue more to your Bishops and Metropolitanes then we do and that increaseth their pride We giue them no power nor honor by Gods Law but what you must yeeld to your Pastors presidents if you wil haue any And as for Magistrates we may not limite thē on whom they shal lay the execution of their Lawes nor what honor they shal allow to such as they put in trust so no part thereof be contrarie to the doctrine of the Scriptures Agnise first their callings then measure their offices by the ancient canons of Christs Church and if they haue any other or further authoritie then standeth with good reason and the manifest examples of the Primitiue Church we striue not for it reseruing alwaies to christian princes their libertie to vse whose aduise and help they thinke good and to bestow their fauours where they see cause without crossing the voice of the holie Ghost or the wisdome of the Apostolike and Primitiue Church of Christ. for the gouernement of the Church is committed to them not that they should alter and ouerthrow the maine foundations of Ecclesiasticall Discipline at their pleasures but that they should carefully and wisely vse it to the benefite of Gods Church and good of their people for which they must giue account to the dreadfull Iudge It was long after the Apostles times before Prouinces were diuided and Mother Cities appointed and therefore Metropolitanes are not so ancient as you make them as may appeare by the 33. canon called Apostolike where the chiefe dignitie ouer eche Prouince is not attributed to any certaine place or Citie I stand not precisely for the time when Mother Cities were first appointed in euerie Prouince howbeit the general Council of Ephesus saith Euerie Prouince shal keep his rights vntouched and vnuiolated which it hath had 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 from the beginning vpward according to the custome that hath anciently preuailed euery Metropolitan hauing libertie to take a copie of our acts for his owne securitie for so the wordes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 may well be interpreted though some embrace another sense Yet if in this point you presse those Canons called Apostolike I will not reiect them not that I take to haue bin written by the Apostles for then they must be part of the Canonicall Scriptures but that some of them expresse the ancient discipline of the Church which obtained euen from the Apostles times by whomsoeuer they were collected though many things since be inserted and corrupted in them and therfore are iustlie refused further then they agree with the stories of the first times and the decrees of the eldest Councils The Canon which you quote is this The Bishops of euerie Nation must know or acknowledge 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 him that is first or chiefe amongst them and esteeme him as their head and attempt no matter of waight without his opinion and iudgement neither let him doe any thing without al their aduises and consents Hereby you would prooue there was a time after the Apostles deaths when as yet the first place amongst the Bishops of the same Prouince was not affixed to anie certaine Church or Citie Grant it were so though this Canon doe not exactlie prooue so much then yet in euerie nation there was a Primate before there was a Metropolitane and consequently the authoritie of one to be chiefe in a prouince is elder the● the priuiledge
such sort that thereby they should serue euen the meanest of their brethren to doe them good and become all things to all men that they might winne some This he caught them that very time not in wordes onely but by deeds also for hauing washed their feete and wiped them drte he saieth vnto them Vnderstand you what I haue done to you you call me Master and Lord and you say well for I am so Then if I your Lord and Master haue washed your feete you ought to wash one an others feete I haue giuen you an example that as I haue done to you you should also doe the liked They should be so farre from striuing who should be greatest that euen the greatest and chiefest should striue to preuent the lowest and meanest with honour and seruice after the example of their Master These texts then con●●●●e two speciall doctrines vnto vs. The 〈◊〉 that Apostles and Preachers may not chalenge by vertue of their office any compulsiue dominion or violent iurisdiction ouer their brethren but leaue that to Princes The next the greater our calling is in Christes Church the readier we should te to make our selues euen with those of the lowest degree to gaine them thereby but that Christ intended in those places to giue all sortes of Minister and helpers in his Church equall power and authoritie with his Apostles I am not perswaded and that for these causes What Christ had alreadie giuen or after meant to giue to his Apostles he would neuer crosse with any speach of his The sonne of God cannot repent his fact or alter his mind but the same kingdome that was appointed to him he appointed to them and as his father sent him so sent he them into all the world with a larger warrant from his mouth and greater power and wisedome of his holy spirit to teach all nations what he commanded them and to open all the counsell of God vnto them then was giuen to other teachers and helpers in the Church He therefore neuer recalled nor rebated any part of their Apostolike preh●●nnence aboue others but onely taught them to vse it to Gods glory and the edifying of his Church Againe what Christ had prohibited no Apostle guided by his spirite would euer haue vsed or chalenged but Paul in his writings hath chalengeth and vseth an Apostolicall power and preheminence aboue other Pastours and Teachers in the Church as is alreadie declared It was therefore neuer intended by our Sauiour to make all others equall with his Apostles in the direction and regiment of his Church Lastly if those places did conclude any thing for an equalitie that must bee referred to the Apostles amongst themselues to whom Christ gaue equall power and honour as Cyprian noteth of them The Apostles were endued with like fellowship of honour and power And Ierome All the Apostles receiued the keies of the kingdome of heauen and the strength of the Church is equally grounded on them But Paul speaking of himselfe saieth not that wee haue dominion ouer your fayth but are helpers of your ioy and Peter admonisheth all Pastours to feede the flocke of God not as if they were lordes ouer Christes inheritance but as examples to the flocke Qui vocatur ad Episcopatum faieth Origene non ad Principatum vocatur sedad seruitutem totius Ecclesiae Hee that is called to bee a Bishop is called not to the soueraigntie but to the seruice of the whole Church Episcopi sacerdotes se esse nouerinst non Dominos saieth Ierome Let the Bishops vnderstand they are Priestes not Lordes or Masters And Bernard Forma Apostolica haec est Dominatio interdioitur indicitur ministratio The paterne for the Apostles themselues is this dominion is interdicted a ministration is enit●ned These and such like speaches in the Scriptures and fathers doe neither prooue all ministers to haue equall power and honour with the Apostles nor impugne the regiment which the Pastours haue ouer their flocks but as wee 〈◊〉 before by the wordes of our Sauiour they distinguish betweene pastorall and princely regiment and direct both Apostles and Pastours how they shall gouerne The thing so much prohibited by Christ and his Apostles whose wordes the auncient fathers doe follow is that Preachers and Pastours should 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 behaue or thinke themselues to be lords and masters ouer their brethren What word is opposed to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the Scriptures and wherein consisteth the relation betwixt them if we call to mind we shall not be deceiued in the right sense of these wordes Christ saieth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 The seruant is not aboue his lord or Master and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 no seruant can serue two masters The power of lordes masters ouer their seruants is likewise expressed by our Sauiour The seruant that knoweth his masters will and doeth not according to his will shall bee beaten with many stripes And againe I say to my seruant doe this and he doeth it Yee seruants faieth Paul obey the masters of your flesh in all things for know yee not that his seruaunts you are whom you obey whereby as by infinite other places it is euident that opposite to lord and master are neither children nor brethren but seruants and he is a seruant that is vnder the yoke and bound to obey his masters will euen as he is a lord or master that may commaund his seruant to execute his will or thereto compell him with stripes for that is the right of a lord and master to commaund and punish his seruant that disobeieth What maruell then if Christ forbade his Apostles to bee lordes and masters ouer their brethren that is to commaund them and compell them a● their vassals since the beleeuers are no servaunts but brethren and the Pastours no lordes ouer Gods inheritance but fathers vnto the faithfull Whereby the honour 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the 〈◊〉 of Christes flocke is not diminished but augmented and the people not licenced the sooner to 〈◊〉 the● but thereby required the rather to regard them for 〈…〉 honour due to master or father and who loueth most a seruant or a sonne Amare filiorum timere seruorum est A sonne doeth loue a seruant doeth feare which God expresseth by his Prophet when he ●aith If I be a father where is mine honour If I be a Master where is my feare Wherefore to increase the loue of his sheepe towards their shepeheards Christ would not haue his Apostles to be feared as masters but to be honoured as fathers and consequently Pastours not to force but to feede not to chase but to lead the flocke committed to their charge neither toughly to intreat them as seruants but gently to perswade them as coheires of the same kingdome If at any time they require and commaund they doe it in Gods name as messengers sent to declare his will who
part of Christs spiritual kingdom without the which no Church can be Christes no more then it may without the trueth of his doctrine But whether the wordes of Saint Paul 1. Timoth. 5. inferre any such thing or no this is the matter wee haue now in hand Some learned and late writers do so conceiue of that place for my parte I see so many iust and good reasons against their supposall that I can not yeelde to their iudgement The first reason I haue of the weakenes of this place to vpholde the Lay Presbyterie is that many learned and ancient Fathers haue debated and sifted the force of these wordes and not one of them euer so much as surmised any such thing to be contained in this Text. Chrysostome Ierome Ambrose Theodoret Primasius Oecumenius Theophilact and diuers others haue considered and expounded these wordes and neuer dreamed of anie Lay Presbyterie to be mentioned in them If then the wordes of Saint Paul stand faire and cleere without this late deuise as in the iudgement of these learned and ancient Writers they doe What reason after fifteene hundred yeeres to entertaine a newe platforme of gouerning the Church by Lay men vpon a bare conceit that the words of Saint Paul may sound to that effect as some imagine The second reason of my dissenting is for that Saint Paul naming the Presbyterie but once in al his Epistles excludeth al Lay Elders from that Presbyterie Neglect not the grace which is in thee which was giuen thee by Prophesie with the imposition of hands of the Presbyterie This is the onely place in all the Scriptures where the Presbyterie is namely mentioned and Lay Elders are most plainely remooued hence as no parte of this Presbyterie For this Christian Presbyterie gaue imposition of hāds to ordaine Ministers but Lay-Elders had no right to impose hands to that purpose Ergo. Lay men were no part of this Presbyterie That imposition of hands to make Ministers is a kinde of Sacrament and reserued solely to Pastours if Saint Austens authoritie were not sufficient Caluins confession is very euid●nt which I noted before They must be Ministers of the worde and Sacraments and succeede the Apostles in their Pastorall charge and function that must ordaine others by imposing handes and giue them power and grace to dispence both the word and Sacraments This Lay Elders in the Apostles times neither did nor might do they were therefore no part of that Presbyterie which Saint Paul speaketh of in his writings Must we take the worde not for the Colledge of Elders but for the degree and office which Timothie receiued Neither so is the force of my reason auoided For choose which you wil to be the signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 either collectiue for the whole cōpanie of Elders or distributiue for the degree office of euery Elder if collectiue none could be of that Colledge that might not giue imposition of hands if distributiue none might take that function and calling on him but must receiue imposition of handes as Timothie did Then Lay men which neither did giue nor receiue impositiō of hands are barred both from the degree and from the societie of Presbyterie which was in Saint Pauls time Beza thinketh best to take it for a nowne collectiue and addeth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 id est ordinis Presbyterorum quo nomine coetus ille omnis significatur qui in verbo laborabant in ea ecclesia vbi hoc factum est The Presbyterie that is the order or company of Elders by which name the whole company is signified that laboured in the word in that Church where this was done Then the whole Eldership or company of Elders in S. Pauls time labored in the word Where now were the Lay Elders that laboured not in the worde What Presbyterie were they of Had euerie Church two Presbyteries I trust not This whole Presbyterie consisted of Pastours and Teachers An other Colledge of Lay Elders and no Pastours will neuer be found My third reason is for that the Text it selfe doth clearely refuse the sense which they inforce For as they conclude there were ergo some Elders that did not labour in the word and doctrine and yet gouerned well so the wordes are more euident that they all were worthie of double honour whether they laboured or gouerned Which by Saint Paules proofes presently following and by the consent of all old and new Writers is meant of their maintenance at the charges of the Church Honour in this place saith Chry sostome Paul calleth reuerence and allowance of thinges needefull Paul will haue the rest yeelde carnall thinges to them of whome they receiue spirituall because being occupied in teaching they can not prouide thinges needefull for themselues Good faithfull Stewards saith Ambrose ought to be thought worthie not onely of high but of earthly honour that they bee not grieued for lacke of maintenance Paul willeth maintenance to be chiefly yeelded to the Pastours that are occupied in teaching For such is the ingratitude of the world that take small care for nourishing the Ministers of the worde As the poore so the Elders seruing the whole Church are to be mainteined by the goods of the Church Paul mentioning the Church treasure presently exhorteth the Ministers of the Church to be thence maintained By the name of honour is signified al godly duty and reliefe after the vse of the Hebrewe speach Now that Lay Iudges and Censors of maners were in the Apostles time found at the expenses of the Church or by Gods Law ought to haue their maintenance at the peoples hands is a thing to me so strange and vnheard of that vntil I see it iustly proued I can not possibly beleeue it S. Paul hath laied downe this rule They that serue at the Altar should be partakers of the Altar and by Gods ordinance they that preach the Gospell must liue of the Gospell Where shall we finde the like for the Lay Iudges that laboured not in the worde They were if any such were as the sagest so euery way the sufficientest men that were amongest the people for feare of faction contempt and corruption which easily grow when the weaker and baser rule ouer the richer and better sort If the Apostle will not haue the poore widowes so long as they might otherwise be succoured or employed grieue the Church would he then put the burden of the Lay Iudges and Elders in number many in state able to relieue others on the necks of the meaner and poorer brethren there is neither cause nor commandement in the word so to charge the Churches of Christ with maintaining the Lay Senate which yet must be done before this construction can be admitted The fourth reason that holdeth me from receiuing this construction is that I find diuers and sundrie interpretations more agreeable to the Text and more answerable to S. Pauls meaning then this which is
Churches either troubled with contentions or iustly fearing the like euents in time to come did commit eche place to one Pastour leauing the rest to consult and aduise with him for the health and peace of the people and by this example taught the whole Church what perpetuall rule to obserue after their deaths Ierome saieth as much as I can or doe desire I come nowe to the quicke let the Christian Reader marke this issue well in Gods name and what side bringeth soundest and surest proofes there let the verdict go Ierome prooueth by many Scriptures that a Presbyter and Bishop were names indifferent and often vsed to the same persons Paul calling for the Presbyters of Ephesus saide vnto them Take heede to your selues and to all the flocke in which the holie Ghost hath set you 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Ouerseers or Bishops to feede the Church of God Inscribing his Epistle to the Philippians he saieth To all the Saintes which are at Philippi with the Bishops and Deacons And so to Tite I left thee in Creete to ordaine Presbyters in euery Citie if any be vnreprooueable for a Bishop must be vnreprooueable Peter like wise writing to the Iewes dispersed saieth The Presbyters which are amongst you I beseech which am also a Presbyter feede the flocke of God committed to you 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ouerseeing it not constrainedly but willingly All the Presbyters that fed the flocke are in these places called Bishops I grant it fully the words are cleere What hence conclude you ergo the offices were then all one Nay ergo the names then were common Otherwise how thinke you by this argument Peter calleth himselfe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a fellow Presbyter with the rest are therefore the Apostleship and the Presbytership both one office Of Iudas Peter saieth in the Acts 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 his Bishoprike let an other take Will you grant that an Apostle doth not differ from a Bishop Admit you the one and I will receiue the other Names may be common though offices be distinct There were then at Ephesus and amongst the dispersed Iewes no Bishops but such as were Presbyters and they many not one Distinguish the times and the Scriptures will agree There was a time as Ierome telleth you when the Churches were gouerned by the common aduise of the Presbyters In this time spake Paul to the Presbyters of Ephesus in this time wrate Peter to the Presbyters amongst the Iewes After this the factions of the Teachers caused the Apostles to establish an other kinde of gouernement and to commit the chiefe care of eche Church which they had planted to some chosen person that should ouersee the flocke as Pastour of the place the rest being his helpers to disperse the word and aduisers to gouerne the Church If you prooue that you say somewhat to the matter If I prooue it not better then you doe your Laie Elders I am content to renounce the one as I doe the other Will you prooue it by the Scripture I will so prooue it as you shall not refuse it vnlesse you reiect both the Booke and Church of God What will you prooue That the Apostles in their life time did institute one Pastour to take the chiefe care of one Church and consequentlie the change which Ierome speaketh of from the common and equall regiment of Presbyters to the particular and preeminent moderation of the Churches in eche place by Bishoppes was not made after the Apostles were dead but whiles they liued and then of force by their decree for during their times none might interpose themselues to change and alter the fourme of the Church Discipline setled by them without their leaue and allowance If it were euer decreed by them it would bee founde in their writings and that it can not Besides had it beene their doing it might iustly be called Gods disposition and ordinance which Ierome saieth it may not Their doctrine in deede doeth plainelie appeare by their writings their successours doe not For howe should the Apostles declare by their pennes who succeeded them after their deaths Is not the whole Church of Christ a lawful and sufficient witnesse in that case If wee beleeue not the Churches that were directed and ordered by the Apostles preaching and presence nor their Schollers that liued with them and next succeeded in their rouines who that wise is wil beleeue our bare surmises seelie coniectures of things done 1500. yeeres before we were borne Yet if the Scriptures do not signifie so much we wil loose it But before I enter to proue it I wil search out the right cause why the Apostles did not not in euery place where they came presently erect Bishops to gouerne the Churches which they planted The reasons why the Apostles did not at the first preaching of the Gospell commit the Churches to the regiment of Bishops I finde were these three First they reserued the chiefe power of imposing hands and punishing notorious offendors to themselues whom Christ made bishops ouerseers of his Church For though to feede leade and attend the flocke they tooke the Presbyters to be their helpers yet the weightiest matters of the church as giuing the graces of Gods spirite and deliuering vnto Satan they retained in their owne handes so long as they were in those places or parts of the worlde The second is that which Epiphanius noted that although there were many endued with excellent gifts to preach the word yet the Apostles would trust none with the chiefe charge of the Churches till they had fully seene and perfectly tried as wel the soundnes of their mindes as greatnes of their gifts Thirdly lest they should seeme to seeke the aduancing of their followers more then the conuerting of vnbeleeuers they suffered the Churches to take a triall what equalitie of many Gouernours would doe and when the fruites thereof prooued to be dissention and confusion the Apostles were forced to commit the Churches at their departures to certaine tried approoued men to be chiefe Pastours of the seuerall places and the Churches were all as willing to receiue them finding by experience what continuall schismes and heresies grew by the peruersnesse of Teachers and could not be repressed by the confused gouernment of the Presbyters which were many in number and equall in power None of these things are expressed in the Scriptures If the fathers alone did witnesse them say we not much more for Bishops then you do for Lay Elders but you shall see the grounds of their reports testified euen in the Scriptures That the Apostles at the first planting of the Churches kept to themselues the power of imposing hands and deliuering vnto Satan which the Fathers call Episcopall power is no newes in the Scriptures they could not loose that vnlesse they lost their Apostleship withall you must shew by the Scriptures where they committed this power to the Presbyters of euery place or else our assertion
with the Churches at the first erecting thereof is that which Epiphanius remembreth and Paul toucheth in many places I trust to send Timotheus shortly vnto you I haue no man like minded who will faithfully care for your matters For all seeke their owne and not that which is Iesus Christes And to Timothie This thou knowest that all they which are in Asia bee turned from me At my first answering no man assisted mee but all forsooke mee Demas hath forsaken mee and embraced this present worlde Wherefore Epiphanius surmise that the scarcitie of tried and approoued men was some cause why euerie place was not furnished at the first with a Bishop is neither vnlikelie nor vnpertaining to the purpose The third reason I take to be this that as Presbyters to labour in the word and augment the Church were presently needefull the haruest being no lesse then the whole world and Bishops to moderate the number of Teachers and to ouersee as well the feeders as the flocke were not so requisit whiles the Apostles who tooke care of those things themselues preached in or neere the places so the wisedome of God woulde not impose that fourme of gouernement on the Church but after long triall and good experience what neede the Churches should haue of it This course he obserued with the people of Israel not straightway to associate the seuentie Elders vnto Moses but to let them alone vntill Moses was wearied with the burden and the multitude grieued for want of dispatch and Iethro seeing the Iudge afflicted with paines and the people discontented with delayes aduised an other way which the whole assemblie liked God confirmed and Moses executed In like manner Christ suffered his Church to trie whiles his Apostles yet liued what equalitie and plentie of Gouernours would worke in euerie place and when it fell out in proofe vpon the Apostles absence that so many leaders so many followers so many Rulers so many factions out euerie Church in sunder the Apostles were forced the world as Ierom faith decreing it that is the faithful throughout the world being therewith contented and thereof desirous to commit their places and Churches not to Presbyters in common and equall authoritie but to their Disciples and followers whome afterward they called Bishops in a superioritie leauing vnto them as vnto their successors the chiefest honor and power of imposing handes and vsing the keyes and resting specially on their care and paines to ouersee both Teachers and beleeuers though the Presbyters were not excluded from helping and assisting them to feed and guide the flocke of Christ. This you say but Ierome saith It was not the Lords dis●osition by his Apostles but rather a decree and custome of the Church that first made Bishops to differ from Presbyters Ierome saieth it was decreed throughout the world to change the equalitie of Presbyters into the superioritie of Bishops by whome it was so decreed hee doeth not mention in this place but if I prooue as well by the Scriptures as by Ierome himselfe and the rest of the Fathers that this change began in the Apostles times and was both seene and approoued by them I euince it to bee an Apostolike ordinance Then must it also be diuine which Ierome denyeth What Ierom meaneth by the trueth of the Lords ordinance I wil after examine I must prooue in order I shall else but confound both myselfe and the Reader In the meane time I make this reason out of Ierome When the schismes of Presbyters beganne dangerously to teare the Churches in peeces then were the Churches committed to the chiefe and preeminent charge of one but those schismes and factions troubled all the Churches euen in the Apostles times vnder them therefore beganne the change of gouernement which Ierome speaketh of At Corinth indeede there were contentions who were baptized of the greatest men which Ierome doeth exemplifie but the factions must be more generall and deadly that should cause an alteration of gouernement throughout the world So there were euen in the Apostles times To those of Corinth he saith When you come together in the Church I heare there are dissentions amongest you and I beleeue it in part for there must be heresies euen among you that they which are approoued amongst you might beknowen And whē he saith there must be heresies amongst you to manifest the good from the bad he meaneth not only at Corinth but euery where which came to passe accordingly To the Romanes he saith Marke them diligently which cause diuisions and offences contrary to the Doctrine which yee haue learned and auoyde them Amongest the Galathians were some that intended to peruert the Gospel of Christ and to carrie them into an other doctrine bewitching them that they shoulde not obey the trueth To the Philippians Beware of dogges beware of euill workemen many walke of whome I tolde you often and tell you now weeping that are enemies of the crosse of Christ whose ende is damnation whose God is their bellie and glorie to their shame which minde earthly things With the Colossians were some that burdened the Churches with traditions euen with the commaundements and doctrines of men and holding not the head aduanced themselues in those things which they neuer sawe and rashly puft vp with fleshly mindes beguiled the simple with a shew of humblenesse and worshipping of Angels At Thessalonica the resurrection of the dead was impugned and some troubled the people with visions with fained messages and forged letters in the Apostles name as if the day of Christ were at hand It came to passe in euery place which Paul foretolde the Presbyters of Ephesus This I know saith he that after my departure shall grieuous wolues enter in amongst you not sparing the flocke Yea of your owne selues shall rise men speaking peruerse thinges to draw Disciples after them Neither were the Gentiles onelie subiect to this danger but the Iewes also as Peter forewarned them There shalbe false teachers amongst you which priuily shall bring in damnable heresies euen denying the Lord that hath bought them many shal follow their damnable waies through couetousnes with fained wordsshal they make marchandise of you And so Iohn Euen now there are many Antichrists many false prophets and deceiuers are gone out into the world To preuent these deceiuers and represse these peruerse Teachers Paul was forced whiles he liued laboured in other places to send speciall substitutes to the Churches most endangered and by their paines ouersight to cure the soares heale the wounds which these pestilent and vnquiet spirits had made So at Ephesus when the teachers and doctors began to affirme they knewe not what euen prophane and doting fables whose word did fret as a canker and crept into houses leading captiue simple women laden with sinnes and led with diuers lusts and others hauing itching eares gate them teachers after
no cause why some Writers in our dayes should discredite the report and reason which Epiphanius maketh against Aerius that a Presbyter could not be equal with a Bishop for so much as the order of Bishops engendreth Fathers vnto the Church and the order of Presbyters 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 not able to beget Fathers by the regeneration of baptisme begetteth children vnto the church but not fathers or teachers and so no possibilitie to make a Presbyter that hath not receiued power to impose handes equall with a Bishop For what doth Epiphanius auouch in these words which Athanasius Ierom Chrysostome and Ambrose do not like wise auouch or what saieth he more then the Primitiue Church in her generall and Prouinciall Councils decreed against Colluthus Maximus and others and obserued without alteration euer since the Apostles died If wee reiect this assertion of Epiphanius that onely Bishops should impose handes to ordaine and not Presbyters wee reiect the whole church of Christ which interpreted the Scriptures in this behalfe as Epiphanius did and confirmed the verie same resolution with the continual practise of all ages and countries where the Gospell hath bene preached and beleeued for by power to ordaine the christian world hath alwayes distinguished bishops from Presbyters as it is easie to be seene by all the monuments of antiquitie that are extant to this day either of Councils Stories or Fathers And as by imposing o● hāds so by succeeding in the chaire haue Bishops euer since the Apostles times beene seuered from Presbyters in the Church of Christ which to all that doe not eagerlie seeke to captiuate the trueth to their owne desires is an argument vnrefellable that the first placing of Bishops aboue Presbyters was Apostolike Tertullian saith Constabit id esse ab Apostolis traditum quod apud ecclesias Apostolorum fuerit sacrosanctum It is certaine that came from the Apostles which is sacredly obserued in the Churches of the Apostles And Austen Quod vniuersa tenet ecclesia nec concilijs institutum sed semper retentum est non nisi authoritate Apostolica traditū rectissime creditur That which the whole Church keepeth and was not appointed by Councils but always retained that is most rightly beleeued to haue descended from the Apostles Now that in the Churches planted by the Apostles their coadiutors one hath bene seuered from the rest of the Presbyters and placed aboue the rest in the honour of y t Episcopal chaire before there were any general Councils to decree that maner of gouernment so continued euen from the Apostles persons hands to this present age the perpetuall succession of bishops in those principall Churches where the Apostles their helpers preached and gouerned like wise in all other churches of the world following their steps will strongly and fully confirme If the Apostles placed bishops with their own hands if departing ordying they left bishops to succeede them if their Disciples and Schollers embraced vsed that course to set bishops aboue Presbyters for sauing the church from schismes left it to their after-commers I trust there are few men so deepely drowned in their owne conceits or wholy addicted to their fansies but they will acknowledge the first distinction institution of bishops from and aboue Presbyters was if not commanded imposed by the Apostles precepts on the Church yet at least ordained deliuered vnto the faithfull by their example as the best way to maintaine the peace and vnitie of the Church and consequently the custome of y ● church which Austen speaketh of that the bishops office should be greater thē the Presbyters the the decree of the whole world which Ierome mentioneth were deriued from the Apostles and confirmed by them and may not be reuersed and re●ealed after 150. yeers vnlesse we chalenge to be wiser and better able to order and gouerne the Church of Christ then the Apostles were Eusebius the first and best collector of auncient and Ecclesiasticall momunents Egesippus and Clemens being lost deriueth the successions of bishops in the foure principal churches of the world Ierusalem Antioch Rome and Alexandria from the Apostles age vnto his owne time by which as by a line we may be directed to see what maner of Episcopall successions the rest of the Churches had from whom the first originall of bishops descended I wil set them downe as it were in a Table euen from the Apostles their followers vnto the time they met in the great Councill of Nice about 320. yeeres after Christ and then examine more exactly whence they tooke their first beginning In the Church of Ierusalem Iames the Apostle Simeon Iustus Zacheus Tobias Beniamin Iohannes Mathias Philippus S●nnecas Iustus Leui Ephrem Ioseph Iudas Marcus Cassianus Publius Maximus Iulianus Caius Symmachus Caius Iulianus Capito Maximus Antoninus Valens Dolichianus Narcissus Dius Germanion Gordius Narcissus iterum Alexander Mazabanes Hymeneus Zambdas Hermon Macarius Maximus Cyrill●s Iohannes Iuuenalis In the Church of Antioch Peter the Apostle Euodius Ignatius Heros Cornelius Eros Theophilus Maximinus Serapion Asclepiades Philetos Zebinus Babilas Fabius Demetrius Paulus Samosatenus Domnus Timeus Cyrillus Tyrannus Vitalius Philagonius E●stathius Paulinus Miletius Flauianus Porphyrius Alexander Iohannes In the Church of Rome Peter and Paul Linus Anacletus Clemens Euaristus Alexander Sixtus Thelesphorus Higinus Pius An●cetus Soter Eleutherius Victor Zepherinus Calixtus Vrbanus Pontianus Ant●rus Fabianus Cornelius Lucius Stephanus Xistus Dionysius Felix Eutichianus Caius Marcellinus Marcellus Eusebius Meltiades Syluester Marcus Iulius Liberius Damasus Siricius Anastasius In the Church of Alexandria Mark the Euangelist Anianus Abilius Cerdo Primus Iustus Eumenes Marcus Celadion Agrippas Iulianus Demetrius Heraclas Dionysius Maximus Theonas Petrus Achilles Alexander Athanasius Petrus Timothius Theophilus Cyrillus These Catalogues of the Bishops of Ierusalem Antioch Rome and Alexandria Eusebius pursueth vnto the beginning of his owne time leauing off at Hermon Bishop of Ierusalem Tyranous bishop of Antioch Marcellinus bishop of Rome and Peter Bishop of Alexandria the rest are supplied out of others as in the See of Alexandria Achilles Alexander Athanasius and Peter out of Socrates Vitalius Philagonius and Eustathius out of Theodoret as also Macarius for Ierusalem In the See of Rome Marcellus and those that follow out of Optatus and Augustine The foure bishops of these Churches that met and sate in the Councill of Nice were Syluester for Rome by Vitus and Vincentius his Presbyters Sozomene faieth it was Iulius Alexander for Alexandria Macarius for Ierusalem and Eustathius for Antioch as appeareth by their subscriptions vnto the saide Council Now when these successions beganne and who were the first Authors and ordainers of them let vs see what proofe can be brought That Iames the Apostle was the first bishop of Ierusalem Clemens Egefippus Eusebius Ierome Chrysostome Epiphanius Ambrose and Augustine confirme Clemens in his sirt Booke
as if the whole Church ought not to be acquainted with sacred elections and to allowe them but for that a meane therein is to be obserued the prerogatiue being yeelded to assembly of Pastours and the second place to the liking of the godly magistrate and lastly the people to be certified openly of the whole matter and leane giuen thē if they haue any reason of dissenting to propose their causes orderly Which course being hitherto religiously and wisely obserued in this City when one Morellius a fanaticall spirite in fauor of the people presumed to reprehend his writing was worthily condemned both in this church and in many Synodes of France The choise of the seuen in the Acts maketh no perpetual nor essential rule for elections in the Church of God The Council of Laodicea did wel and wisely prohibite the people to haue the choise of such as should be called to the sacred ministery The Pastors elect the magistrates consent open report there of is made to the people and if they haue any iust cause to alleage against the parties chosen they must propose and prooue their exceptions and when Morellius woulde haue challenged more interest then this for the people in the election of their Pastours his opinion was condemned both by the censure of Geneua and by the Synodes of France All this is confessed by Master Bezaes owne testimonie Wee differ you thinke in some pointes from the manner of Geneua wee haue great reason so to doe They liue in a popular state we in a kingdome The people there heare the chiefest rule here the Prince and yet there the people are excluded from electing their Pastors If the multitude haue any cause to dislike their allegation is heard and examined by the Pastours and Magistrates but they haue no free power to frustrate the whole by dissenting much lesse to elect whome they like Nowe that our state hath farre better cause to exclude the multitude from electing their Bishops then theirs hath is soone perceiued The people there maintaine their Pastours our Bishops are not chargeable to the Commons but endowed by the liberalitie of Princes without any cost to the multitude Their Pastours are chosen out of the same Citie and their behauiour knowen to al the Inhabitants our Bishops are taken from other places of gouernement and not so much as by name knowen to the people which they shall guide With vs therefore there is no cause why the people should be parties or priuie to the choosing of their Bishops since they be neither troubled with the maintaining of them nor haue any triall or can giue anie testimonic of their liues and conuersations which were the greatest reasons that inclined the Fathers of the Primitiue Church to yeelde so much vnto the people in the choyce of their Bishops And lastly if Princes were not heades of their people and by Gods and mans law trusted with the direction and moderation of all externall and publike gouernement as well in Religion as in policie afore and aboue al others which are two most sufficient reasons to enforce that they ought to be trusted with elections if they please to vndertake that charge whereof they must yeelde an account to God yet the people of this realine at the making of the Law most apparantly submitted and transferred al their right and interest to the Princes Iudgement and wisedome which lawefully they might and wisely they did rather then to endanger the whole common wealth with such tumulets and vproates as the Primitiue Church tasted of and lay the gappe open againe to the factions and corruptions of the vnsettled and vnbrideled multitude Thinke you all corruptions are cut off by reseruing elections of Bishops to Princes Faceions tumultes I hope you will grant are by that means abolished and vtterly extinguished As for bri●erie howsoeuer ambitious heads and couetous hands may lincke together vnder colour of commendation to deceiue and abuse Princes ●ares yet reason and duetie bindeth mee and all others to thinke and say that Princes persons are of all others farthest from taking money for any such respects The words of Guntchrannus Chlotharius sonne king of France more then a thousand yeeres agoe make me so to suppose of all Christian and godlie Princes who whē Remigius bishop of Bourges was dead and many gifts were offred him by some that sought the place gaue them this answere It is not our princely maner to sel Bishopriks for mony neither is it your part to get them with rewardes lest wee bee infamed for filthie gaine and you compared to Simon Magus In meaner persons more iustly may corruption be feared then in Princes who of all others haue least neede and so least cause to set Churches to sale Their abundance their magnificence their conscience are sureties for the freedome of their choice And therfore I see no reason to distrust their elections as likelier to be more corrupt then the peoples It is farre easier for ambition to preuaile with the people then with the Prince And as for the meetnesse of men in learning and life to supplie such places Princes haue both larger scope to choose and better meanes to knowe who are fit then their people for since Bishops are not and for the most part cannot be chosen out of the fame Church or Citie what course can the people take to be assured of their abilitie or integritie whom they neither liue with nor whose doctrine or maners they are any whit acquainted with This difference betwixt our times and the former ages of the Primitiue Church whiles some marke not they crie importunely for the peoples presence and testimonie in the choice of Pastors neuer remembring the people before there were any Christian Magistrates must needes haue greater interest in the election of their Pastours then afterward they could haue and when godlie Princes beganne to intermeddle with Ecclesiasticall matters the peoples testimonie was still required because the parties chosen conuersed alwaies with them euen in their eies and eares whereby they coulde witnesse the behauiour of the electees to be sincere and blamelesse which in our dayes is cleane otherwise by reason the Uniuersities and other places of the Realme traine vp men meete for Episeopall charge and calling and not the same Churches and Cities where they shall gouerue Requiritur in ordinando Sacerdote etiam pop●li praese●tia v●sciant omnes certisint quod qui praestantior est ●● omni populo qui doctior qui sanctior qui omni virtute em●entio● ille eligitur ad sacerdotium hoc attestante populo The peoples presence saith Ierome is required in ordaining a Priest or Bishop that all may knowe and bee sure that out of the whole people the better the holier the learneder the higher in al vertue euen he is chosen to the Priesthoode the people witnessing as much for that is it which the Apostle commandeth in the ordaining of a Priest saying hee must
this cause all the scruple is what kinde of Presbyters they were Lay Presbyters I reade of none therfore I can admit none to be of that Council Besides such of the seuēty and such other Prophets as assisted Iames in the regiment of the church of Ierusalem are in all reason expressed by that name for since the whole church there is diuided into Apostles Presbyters and Brethren the helpers coadiutors of the Apostles were they Prophets or Euangelists that either came with Paul Barnabas from Antioch or were commorant with Iames the rest at Ierusalem must rather be contained in the name of Presbyters thē sorted with the general multitude for if they were of the many what men of more worthines were there to be honored with the title of Presbyters I hope the next degree to Apostles are not your Lay Elders S. Paul was then fowly ouershot to set first Apostles secondly Prophets thirdly Teachers and to reiect Gouernours which you take for your Lay Presbyters into the 7. place Howbeit vnles you make some fresher and better proofe for them then yet I see your Lay Elders are no where numbred by S. Paul for church gouernors As for Presbyters y ● were beneath Apostles vnderstand by that name prophets euangelists pastors teachers or whom you will so no lay Elders we deny thē neither places nor voices in Synods so long as they haue right to teach or speake in the church for we esteeme Synodes to be but the assemblies conferences of those to whom the Churches of any prouince or nation for the word doctrine are committed And therefore to our Synodes are called as your selues know not only bishops but deanes archdeacons other clerks aswel of the principall cathedrall Presbytery where the episcopall seate church is as of the Diocese at large And though some Romish writers do stifly maintaine that none but bishops haue voices in Councils yet you see the ancient institution of our synodall assembly in this realme ouerthroweth their late new assertion Neither lacke we examples of the course which we keepe euen from the beginning The Synode of Rome called by Cornelius against Nouatus about the yeere of Christ 255 consisted of 60. Bishops and many Presbyters and Deacons as Euseb. noteth From the Synode of Antioch that deposed Paulus Samosatenus about the yere of our Lord 270. wrate not only Bishops but Presbyters Deacons as appeareth by their epistle In the Council of Eliberis about the time of the first Nicene Council sate besides the Bishops 36. Presbyters In the second Councill of Arle about the same time subscribed 12. Presbyters besides Deacons other Clergy mē The like may be seene in the Councils of Rome vnder Hilarius vnder Gregory where 34. Presbyters subscribed after 22. Bishops in y ● first vnder Symmachus where after 72. bishops subscribed 67. Presbyters so in the third fift sixt vnder the same Symmachus Felix also bishop of Rome kept a Councill of 43. bishops 74. Presbyters after the same maner haue diuers other Metropolitanes assembled in their prouincial synods aswel Presbyters is bishops The council of Antisiodorum saith Let al the Presbyters being called come to the Synode in the city The 4. council of Toledo describeth y ● celebrating of aprouinciall council in this wise Let the bishops assembled go to the church togither sit according to the time of their ordination After all the bishops are entred and set let the Presbyters be called and the Bishops sitting in a compas let the Presbyters sit behind them and the Deacons stand before them The Councill of Tarracon 1100. yeeres agoe prescribed almost the verie same order that we obserue at this day Let letters be sent by the Metropolitane vnto his brethren that they bring with them vnto the Synode not only some of the Presbyters of the Cathedral church but also of eche Dioecese And why should this seeme strange euen to the Romish crew when as in the great Council of Lateran as they call it vnder Innocentius the third there were but 482. Bishops and of Abbats and Priors conuentuall almost double the number euen eight hundred If Presbyters haue right to sit in Prouincial Synodes why are they excluded from generall Councils Many things are lawful which are not expedient I make no doubt but all pastours and teachers may sit and deliberate in Councill yet would it breede a sea of absurdities to call all the pastors and preachers of the world into one place as often as neede should require to haue any matter determined or ordered in the Church As therefore in ciuill policie when a whole realme assembleth not al y e persons there liuing are called together but certaine chiefe ouer the rest or chosen by y e rest to represent the state and to consult for the good of the whole common wealth so in the gouernement of the Church it were not only superfluous and tedious but monstrous to send for all the Pastors and Presbyters of the whole worlde into one Citie and there to stay them from their cures and Churches till all things needeful could be agreed and concluded It is more agreeable to reason and as sufficient in right that some of euerie place excelling others in dignitie or elected by generall consent shoulde be sent to supplie the roumes of the rest that are absent and to conferre in common for the directing and ordering of the whole Church And therefore Christian Princes in wisedome and discretion neuer sent for all the Presbyters of the world to anie generall Council but onely for the chiefest of euery principall church and citie or for some to be sent from euery realme far distant as legates in the names of the rest and by that meanes they had the consent of the whole world to the decrees of their Councils though not the personall appearance of all the Pastours and Presbyters that were in the world So to the Council of Nice the first christian Emperor sent for by his letters not all the Preachers Presbyters of the world but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the Bishops of euery place and there came from all the Churches through Europe Asia and Africa 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the best or chiefest of the Ministers of God each countrey sending not all their Bishops for then would they farrc haue exceded the number of 318. but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the most speciall and selected men they had and though there were present an infinite number of Presbyters and Deacons that came with the Bishops yet the Council consisted of 318. Bishops and no more by reason the Emperour sent not for the Presbyters of each place but for the Bishops The like examples are to be seene in the three generall Councils that folowed where onely Bishops determined matters in question and the Presbyters that subscribed in the Councils
other side shunning as much popular tumult and Anarchie preferred a middle course betwixt them of Aristocracie thinking the Church would then bee best guided when neither one for danger of tyrannie nor all for feare of mutinie did beare the swaie but a number of the grauest and sincerest vndertooke the managing of all matters incident to the Ecclesiasticall Regiment And for that there was no possibilitie in euerie Church and parish to finde a full and sufficient companie of Pastours and Teachers to consider and dispose of all causes occurrent and the people as they thought would the better endure the proceedings and censures of their Consistories if some of themselues were admitted to bee Iudges in those cases as well as the Preachers they compounded their Presbyteries partlie of Pastors and partly of Laie Elders whome they named GOVERNING PRESBYTERS and by this meanes they supposed the gouernement of the Church would bee both permanent and indifferent To proclaime this as a fresh deuise of their owne would be some what odious and therefore they sought by all meanes as well with examples as authorities to make it seeme auncient for the better accomplishing of their desire first they tooke hold of the Iewish Synedrion which had Laie Elders mixed with Leuites in euery Citie to determine the peoples causes and that order being established by Moses they enforced it as a perpetuall paterne for the Church of Christ to folow To that end they bring the wordes of our Sauiour Tell it the Church if he heare not the Church let him be to thee as an Ethnike and Publicane Next they perused the Apostles writings to see what mention might bee there found of Elders and Gouernours and lighting on this sentence of Saint Paul The Elders which rule well are woorthie of double honour speciallie they that labour in the worde and doctrine they resolutelie concluded there were some Elders in the Church that gouerned and yet laboured not in the worde and doctrine and those were Laie Presbyters After this place they made no doubt but Laie Elders were Gouernours of the Church in the Apostles times and so setled their iudgements in that behalf that they would heare nothing that might be said to the contrary Thirdlie because it would bee strange that Laie Elders euerie where gouerning the Church vnder the Apostles no Councill storie nor Father did euer so much as name them or remember them or so conceiue the wordes and meaning of Saint Paul vntill our age they thought it needefull to make some shewe of them in the Fathers writings least otherwise playne and simple men should maruell to see a new sort of gouernours wrenched and forced out of S. Pauls wordes whome the Church of Christ in fifteene hundred yeeres neuer heard of before And therefore certaine doubtfull speaches of the Fathers were drawen to that intent as where they saie The Church at first was gouerned by the common aduise of Presbyters and the Church had her Elders without whose counsell nothing was done yea some of them were so forward and willing to heare of their laie Presbyters that wheresoeuer anie Councill or Father mentioned Presbyters they straightway skored vp the place for laie Elders This is the warpe and webbe of the laie Presbyterie that hath so enfolded some mens wits that they cannot vnreaue their cogitations from admiring their newe founde Consistories And in deede the credite of their first deuisers did somewhat amuse mee as I thinke it doeth others till partlie enclined for the causes aforesayd and partlie required where I might not refuse I began more seriouslie to rip vp the whole and then I found both the slendernesse of the stuffe and loosenesse of the worke that had deceiued so many mens eies As first for the Iewish Synedrion I sawe it might by no meanes bee obtruded on the Church of Christ. for the Iudiciall part of Moses law being abolished by the death of Christ as well as the ceremoniall the Tribunals of Moses must no more remaine then the Priesthood doth Moses Iudges were appointed to execute Moses lawe the punishments therefore and iudgements of Moses law ceasing as vnder the Gospel there can be no questiō but they do all such Consistories as Moses erected must needs be therewith ended determined Again they were ciuill Magistrates that Moses placed in euery Citie to iudge the people and had the sword to punish as the lawe did limite Leuites being admixed with them to direct them in the doubts and difficulties of the lawe Such Presbyteries if they frame vs in euery parish without the magistrates power and leaue they make a faire entrie vpon the Princes sword and scepter vnder the colour of their Consistories which I hope they will be well aduised before they aduenture Lastlie that laie Elders in Moses lawe did meddle with discerning or iudging betwixt trueth and falsehood things holy and vnholy persons cleane and vncleane or did intermeddle with the sacrifices or seruices of the Tabernacle I doe not read but rather the execution and superuision of sacred things and dueties belonged to the Prophetes Priests and Leuites So that laie Presbyteries vnder the Gospell can haue no agreement with the Synedricall Courtes of Moses much lesse anie deriuement from them vnlesse they will tye all Christian kingdomes to the Tribunals and Iudicials of Moses lawe and giue their Elders the sworde in steade of the word which God hath assigned to Princes and not to Presbyters The wordes of Christ in the 18. of Mathew Tell it to the Church which they vrge to that ende if they were spoken of such Magistrates as Moses appointed and to whome the Iewes by the prescript of his Lawe were to make their complaints then pertaine they nothing at all to the Church of Christ but were a speciall direction for those times wherein our Sauiour liued and those persons that were vnder the Law If they be taken as a perpetuall rule to strengthen the iudgement of Christes Church then touch they no way the Synedrions of the Iewes or any other Courts established by Moses Let them choose which they will neither hurteth vs nor helpeth them The place of Saint Paul at a glimce seemed to make for them but when I aduisedly looked into it I found the text so little fauouring them that in precise termes it excluded Lay Elders as no Gouernours of the Church for the Apostle there chargeth that all Presbyters which rule well should haue double honor His wordes be plaine The Presbyters that rule well 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Let them bee thought woorthie of double honour Honour in this place is apparantly taken for maintenance as the proofes following doe import Thou shalt not musle the oxe that treadeth out thy corne and the workeman is worthy of his wages Now by no precept nor example will it euer be prooued that Lay Presbyters had in the Apostles times or shoulde haue by the word of God at any time double honour and
substance had euident reason and the Apostles in so doing staied the murmuring of the Disciples and freed themselues from al suspition of neglecting their widowes which was the cause of their dislike by praying them to choose out of themselues such as they best trusted to care for their tables distribute their store By the circumstance of the Text it seemeth that where the beleeuers liued in one place and had al things in common selling their lands possessiōs goods they brought the price thereof and layed it downe at the Apostles feete to be distributed to euery man according as hee had neede the Apostles had put some in trust to bestowe the Churches treasure I meane the Disciples goodes who of like being Iewes regarded the widowes that were Iewes more then the Grecians widowes And hence arose the grudging of the Grecians that their widows were neglected The Apostles then excused themselues for that they might not leaue the preaching of the word and attend for tables to see their widowes indifferently vsed and willed the whole multitude to look out from amongst thēselues such as were replenished with the holy ghost with wisdom best reported of for fidelitie and industrie to take the ouersight of that businesse This is all that can bee pressed out of this storie For answere hereof first by your owne doctrine the parties there chosen receiued not power to preach and baptise but to dispence the goods of the Church for the dayly prouision of the Saints who then liued together and yeelded all their abilitie to be vsed in common at the discretion of these parties appointed by themselues And though Philip did preach and baptise at Samaria and did the like to the Eunuch of Ethiopia yet you auouch he did that not as a Deacon but as an Euangelist both which titles indeede Saint Luke giueth him in the one and twentieth Chapter of the Actes Next if it be true that Epiphanius writeth of them these seauen were all of the number of those seuentie Disciples which Christ himselfe called while she liued on earth and sent to preach aswel as Matthias and Barnabas that were named to succeede in the roome of Iudas the traitor and then by this election they had no ordinarie function in the Church but an extraordinarie charge to prouide for the widowes since none of the 70. Disciples could beginne againe at the lowest degree and become Deacons Chrysostome reasoning what office they had by this imposition of handes saith 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 What dignitie these seauen had and what maner of imposition of hands they receiued it shal not be amisse to learn Was it the office of Deacons This now is not the Churches but this charge to looke to widows belōgeth to Presbyters and as yet there was no bishop but the Apostles onely Wherefore I thinke it was neither the name of Deacons nor Presbyters expressely and plainely which these seuen receiued If these seuen were expresly neither Deacons nor Presbyters as Chrysostome thinketh they were not and the Councel in Trullo ioyneth with him in the same opinion then can their election be no proofe that others ioyned with the Apostles in the choice of Presbyters or Bishops If with Ignatius Cyprian Ierome and others we take these seuen for Deacons such as serued in the Church and attended on the Lords table when the mysteries of Christ were dispenced yet the Apostles made this no perpetuall rule for all elections otherwise neither Paul nor any other Apostle could haue imposed hands but on such as the people named and elected which is euidently repugnant to the Scriptures as in place conuenient shall appeare Againe this singular example concludeth no more for electing by voyces then the choice of Matthias doth for retaining of lots For since two sortes of elections were vsed by the Apostles presently the one vpon the other who can determine which of those twaine was prescribed to the Church as of necessity to be continued Lastly examples are noprecepts and the reasons that mooued the Apostles to referre the choice of those seven to the liking of the multitude admit infinite varieties circumstances which being altered the effect must needes alter according to the cause And therfore no general rule can be drawen from a particular fact without a strong reason to maintaine the coherence much lesse may you leape from the choice of Deacons in the Apostles time to conclude the like of the election of Presbyters and Bishops which then did and now do greatly differ both in giftes and calling from the Deacons That the Ministers and Elders of Lystra and Iconium and of the Churches confining were ordained by Paul and Barnabas can be no question the Text doth cleerely a●ouehit onely the signification of the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 there vsed is forced by some to prooue that those Elders were chosen by the consent of others besides Paul and Barnabas because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 say they is to choose by lifting vp of handes which was the vse amongst the Grecians for the people to doe in their elections The aduantage taken vpon the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is not so sound as they suppose For first if that were the right Etymologie of the word yet as most words in Greeke Hebrew besides the externall action and circumstance which they first importe do signifie the effects and consequents depending on that action and circumstance and are by translation generally and vsually applied to other things so this worde doeth signifie to elect and appoint though no handes bee helde vp because electing and appointing was the effect and consequent of lifting vp the handes To prooue this wee neede go no further then the tenth chapter of this verie Booke where Saint Luke without all contradiction vseth the word in such sorte and sense as I mention This Iesus of Nazareth God raised vp the third day and shewed him openly not to all the people 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but to vs witnesses chosen or appointed before-hand of God It were more then absurde to imagine that God did choose the Apostles to bee witnesses of his sonnes resurrection by lifting vp of handes God hath not hands to lift vp the Apostles neither were nor could be chosen by the peoples hands wherefore 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doth signifie simply to choose and appoint though it ●e not doone with holding vp of hands nor by the people Againe were the word in the 14. of the Acts vsed in that signification which they vrge as namely to consent or elect with holding vp the hands yet the Text doth manifestly restraine it to Paul and Barnabas that they did elect and appoint by stretching out their hands such Elders as the Churches then needed For 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is for a man to holde vp or stretch out his owne hand and not other mens hands and no example will euer be brought
men from amongst themselues to looke into the trueth of euery crime before they would beleeue the accuser or reiect the accused from their company then must your laie Elders claime not from Christ as authorized by him to vse the keyes and dispose of the Sacraments but from the people as their committies to heare and report what they found detected and proued in euery such offence as deserued separation from all Christian societie and their delegation from the people must vtterly cease where he that beareth the sword embraceth the faith For though by the lawes of God and nature where there is no magistrate euery multitude may both order and gouerne themselues as they see cause with their generall consent so they crosse not superiour lawes and powers yet we must beware when God hath placed Christian Princes to defend and preserue Iustice and Iudgement amongst men that we not erect vnder a shew of discipline certaine petit magistrates in euery parish by commission from Christ himselfe in crimes and causes ecclesiastical iudicially to proceed without depending on the princes power I seeke not to charge the fauourers of this new discipline with any dangerous deuise I had rather acknowledge mine owne weakenesse that cannot conceiue how laie Elders should bee Gouernours of Christes Church and yet be neither ministers nor magistrates Christ being the head and fulnesse of the Church which is his body gouerneth the same as a Prophet a Priest and a King and after his example all publike gouernement in the church is either Prophetical Sacerdotal or Regall The Doctors haue a Prophetical the Pastours a Sacerdotal the Magistrates a Regal power and function what fourth regiment can we find for laie Elders Prophets they are not they haue no charge of the word much lesse haue they priestly power which concerneth sinnes and Sacraments If they haue any they must haue Regall and consequently when the magistrate beleeueth laie Elders must ●eli●quish all their authoritie to him or deriue it from him except they will establish an other regiment against him What you gi●e onely to Pastors making them Monarches to rule the Church at their pleasures we impart to laie Elders as Associates with them in the same kinde of gouernement so that laie Elders with vs doe no more prei●dice the Princes power then Pastours do with you Inpreaching the word dispensing the Sacramentes remitting sinnes and imposing hands I trust your laie Elders are not associated vnto Pastours If in these things they be ioint-Agents with Pastours then are they no laie Elders but Pastours You must giue them one name if you giue them one office the same deedes require alwayes the same wordes If you ioyne not laie Elders in those Sacerdotall and sacred actions with Pastours but make them ouerseers and moderators of those things which Pastours doe this power belongeth exactly to Christian magistrates to see that Pastours doe their dueties according to Christes will and not abuse their power to annoy his Church or the members thereof Neither is the case like betwixt Pastours and laie Elders Pastors haue their power and function distinguished from Princes by God himselfe in so much that it were more then presumption for princes to execute those actions by themselues or their substitutes To preach baptize retaine sinnes and impose hands Princes haue no power the Prince of Princes euen the sonne of God hath seuered it from their callings and committed it to his Apostles and they by imposition of hands deriued it to their successors but to cause these actions to be orderly done according to Christes commaundement and to preuent and represse abuses in the doers this is all that is left for laie Elders and this is it that we reserue to the Christian magistrate The power of the sword in crimes and causes ecclesiasticall wee wholie yeeld to the Christian Magistrate and yet laie Elders may censure the Pastours actions by liking and allowing them if they bee good or by disliking and frustrating them if they bee otherwise God hath not giuen Princes the sword in any causes temporall or ecclesiasticall to goe before or without iudgement but to folow after and support iudgement The sword without iudgement is force and furie with iudgement it is iustice and equitie You cannot yeeld the sword to the magistrate and reserue iudgement in these cases to the laie Elders you then binde the Magistrate to maintaine what your laie Iudges shall determine and ●o the sworde is not soueraigne aboue them but subiect vnder them Wherefore in ouerseeing the Pastors doings and redressing their abuses you must leaue the examination determination and execution to the Christian magistrate and not deuide stakes betweene the Prince and the laie Presbyterie Princes haue no skill in such matters and in that respect it is not amisse for them to take their direction from the Presbyterie A noble consideration and woorthie to be registred The Church wardens and Side-men of euery parish are the meetest men that you can finde to direct Princes in iudging of ecclesiasticall crimes and causes A most wretched State of the Church it must needes bee that shall depend on such sillie Gouernours I omit how farre gentlemen and landlords can preuaile in euery parish with their neighbours and tenants both to rule them and ouer-rule them at their pleasures Uiew the villages in England and tell me how farre you shall seeke before you shall finde laie Elders that in any reason ought to be trusted with the gouernement of the Church I will not aduauntage my selfe by the rudenesse and ignorance of most part I hope for very shame you will admit that Princes are farre fitter in their owne persons if they would take the paynes to determine ecclesiasticall matters then husbandmen and Artisants And if they want direction or will giue Commission to that purpose they neede not descend to the plough and carte for helpe or aduise The world will greatly doubt of your discretion and suspect you sauour of popular faction and ambition if by Gods lawe you presse Princes against their wils to accept such counsellers and substitutes in ecclesiasticall gouernement If they bee at libertie to make their choice they haue store of learned and able men of all sortes within their Realmes whom they may trust with the censuring and ouerseeing of Clergie mens actions so as to preferre Ploughmen and Craftesmen to vndertake that weightie charge for Christian Princes were ridiculous if not infamous follie Wherefore the laie Presbyterie must either claime to haue their power and authoritie from Christ without the Prince and before the Prince which is somewhat dangerous if not derogatorie to the Princes right or els they must staie till the Magistrate giue them power in euery place to gouerne the causes of the Church and moderate the actions of the Pastours For since they will needes concurre with the Prince in the same charge and ouersight of Ecclesiasticall crimes and causes they must deriue their warrant either from the
should shew themselues penitent no mā hastilie giue peace to such as did not penitence yet they sacrilegious against God caried headlong with a wicked rage against the Priests of God forsaking the Church and lifting vp particidiall armes against the Church doe all they can to accomplish their intent with a diuelish malice that Gods mercy should not cure in his church such as are wounded And againe What danger is not to bee feared when some of the Presbyters neither remembring their place neither thinking there is a Bishop ouer them with the reproch and contempt of the chiefe chaleng● the whole vnto them The disgraces of my office I can dissemble and beare as I alwayes haue But now is no time to dissemble when our brethren are deceiued by some of you which seeke to be plausible without regard of restoring them to the health of their soules What maruell if Cyprian thus besieged thus impugned and banished from his Church and charge did not onely purpose and professe to doe nothing without the full consent of the Clergie and people but persisted in that course which he sawe to bee safest for himselfe and surest against his maligners to decrease their number and defeate their expectance but whether hee were bound by Gods lawe so to doe and all others tied to the same rule that is the greatest part of this doubt If it were but a priuate moderation and prouision for his owne securitie no man is obliged by his example to doe the like If it bee a generall fourme of gouerning the Church prescribed by the holie Ghost then neither might Cyprian nor any man els swarue from that direction without transgressing the will and worde of God then all Councils both Prouinciall and Generall that assembled and concluded in the Primitiue Church without the liking and agreement of the people did wilfullie breake the commaundement of the liuing God and all Christian Princes that in former Ages by their lawes and Edicts intermedled with matters of the Church without the knowledge and consent of their subiectes presumed without warrant and offered open wrong to the kingdome of Christ yea Cyprian himselfe was the first that cassiered his owne confession and when cause so required yea sometimes without cause excluded and ouer-ruled the peoples iust desires One example may seruc for the present your owne allegations will afterward more at large euince as much Vix plebi persuadeo imo extorqueo vt tales patiantur admitti iusti●r factus est fraternitatis dolor ex eo quòd vnus atque alius obnitente plebe contradicente mea tamen facilitate suscepti peiores extiterunt quàm prius fuerant With much adoe perswade I the people yea rather extort from them to suffer such to bee admitted and the griefe of the brethren is the iuster for that one or two being by my facilitie receyued the people striuing agaynst it and contradicting it waxed worse then they were before Cyprian admitted some to the Church after repentaunce when the people withstoode it and gainesaied it and were iustlie grieued with his ouer much remissenesse Wherein Cyprian did not violate the duetie which hee ought to God nor tyra●nize in the Church with the contempt of his brethren but relented from his purpose to doe nothing without the peoples consent for reasons then moouing him or of his owne iuclination leading him to hope their amendment that were thus admitted with fauour and facilitie to the Church of God See whether your owne examples do not prooue as much The first place you alleage is this In ordinandis Clericis fra●res charissimi solemus vos antè consulere mores ac merita singulorum communi consilio ponderare In ordering of Clerkes most deare brethren our maner is to consult you first and to weigh the behauiour and desertes of euery one with common aduise This vse notwithstanding where iust occasion serued he ordered Clerkes without their consents and so much is expressed in the very next wordes Sed expectanda non sunt testimonia humana eumpraecedant diuina suffragia but the witnesse of men must not be expected when Gods approbation is precedent The conclusion is That where one Aurelius a youth had twise in stockes and torments professed Christ Cyprian his Colleagues that were present with him for hee was not then at Carthage had made the said Aurelius thought yong in yeeres a Reader in the Church and so much he signifieth by his letters to the Presbyters Deacons and people of Carthage not doubting but they would embrace him though they gaue no consent to his ordering Hee deserued a further degree of Clericall ordination but in the meane time it hath pleased vs hee should begin with the office of a Reader Know you therefore most beloued brethren that I and my Colleagues which were here with me haue ordered him a Reader which I know you will gladlie accept and wish many such to be ordered in our Church Cyprian was absent from his owne Church by reason of persecution then raging and without the consent either of his Clergie or people he did order Aurelius and sent him with letters to bee receiued as a Reader in the Church of Carthage The like he did for Optatus Saturus Caelerinus and Numidicus as your owne authorities doe witnesse for as by them you prooue Cyprian was woont to take the good report and testimonie of the people concerning such as should bee admitted to the Clergie and with common aduise to examine their woorthinesse so by the selfe same places I she we that Cyprian brake that custome when hee sawe time and cause require and without the consent of his people or Clergie ordered such as hee found to be meete for that calling Whereby wee collect that the consent of the people and Clergie is no essentiall point in ordering Ministers without the which they may not bee called but a very Christian and commendable course to keepe off all notorious and enormous persons from that function and the surest way to saue the Bishop from communicating with other mens sinnes whiles hee trusted not his owne iudgement or knowledge but vsed the eyes eares and consciences of the whole Church for the better view search and triall of their integritie grauitie and industrie to whome the flocke of Christ was to bee committed This which I say will appeare to bee true euen by your owne authorities Because many of the Clergie of Carthage were wanting and those fewe that remained did skant suffice for the dailie worke of the Ministerie for which cause it was requisite to haue moe Know you saieth Cyprian writing to the Presbyters and Deacons of his Church that I haue made Saturus a Reader and Optatus a Subdeacon whom a good while since by common aduise we appointed to bee next placed in the Clergie I haue then in your absence done no new thing but that which long agoe tooke a beginning with all our aduises
perpetuall ordinance as your selues confesse there must be one chiefe and Pastour of ech Church and Presbyterie to guide aswel the Presbyters that are Teachers as the flocke that are hearers with that power which Gods Law alloweth vnto Pastours Tell me now I pray you what difference betwixt chiefe Pastors established in euery City by Gods law as you are forced to grant and Bishops succeeding the Apostles in their Churches chaires as the Fathers affirme If you mislike the worde Bishop it is Catholike and Apostolike if you mislike the office it is Gods ordinance by your owne assertion We grant the name of a Bishop and regiment of a Pastor are confirmed by the holie Ghost but you yeeld more to your chiefe Pastours and Bishops then the word of God alloweth them as namely you suffer them to continue for life where they should gouerne but for a moneth or a weeke you alotte them Dioeceses which should be but parishes you giue them not onely a distinction from Presbyters but a i●risdiction ouer Presbyters who shoulde bee all one with Presbyters and subiect to the most voyces of the Presbyters all which things wee say are against the Scriptures You frame Churches to your fansies and then you straight way thinke the Scriptures doe answere your deuises If we giue Bishops any thing which the ancient and Catholike Church of Christ did not first giue them in Gods name spare vs not let the world knowe it but if we preferre the vniuersall iudgement of the Primitiue Church in expounding the Scriptures touching the power and function of bishops before your particular and late dreames you must not blame vs. They were neerer the Apostles times and likelier to vnderstand the Apostles meanings then you that come after fifteene hundred yeres with a new plot of Church gouernment neuer heard of before All the churches of Christ throughout the world could not at one time ioyne in one and the selfe same kind of gouernment had it not bene deliuered and setled by the Apostles and their Schollers that conuerted the world So many thousand Martyrs and Saints that liued with the Apostles would neuer consent to alter the Apostles discipline which was once receiued in the Church without the Apostles warrant Wherefore we conster the Apostles writings by their doings you measure the Scriptures after your owne humours Whether of vs twayne is most likelie to hitte the trueth As for your repining at the things which we giue to bishops we greatly regard it not so long as the Scriptures doe not contradict them wee smile rather at your deuises which say that a bishop should gouerne for a weeke and then change and giue place to the next Presbyter for an other weeke and so round by course to all the Presbyters What Scripture confirmeth that circular and weekely regiment of yours By what authoritie do you giue it the name of a diuine institution when it is a meere imagination of yours without proofe or trueth She we one example or authoritie for it in the newe Testament and take the cause Succession by course was ordained by God after the example of the Priests of Aaron Did the sonnes of Aaron loose their Priesthoode when their courses were ended No but they serued in the Temple by course and so were Bishops appointed by Gods ordinance to guide the Presbyterie Is this all the ground you haue vpon this slender and single similitude to make Gods ordinance what please you If such reasons may serue we can sooner conclude the perpetual function of bishops then you can the weekly for not onely the high Priest kept his honour during his life but likewise euery Priest that was chiefe of his order Indeede their courses being ended they departed home but they lost not their dignitie But what rouing is this in matters of weight Will anie wise men be mooued with such ghesses Make vs good proofe out of the Scriptures or leaue tying Gods ordinance to your appetites Ambrose is the man that affirmeth it If you come once to Fathers I hope we haue tenne to one that affirme otherwise If Ambrose did say so wee coulde not beleeue him against all the rest of the Fathers yea and against the Scriptures themselues election of Bishops being prescribed by Paul to Timothie and Tite and not succession in order but I denie that Ambrose saith anie such thing He saieth the next in order succeeded He nameth neither change nor course It is your owne deuise it is no part of Ambroses meaning Anianus the next after Marke that was Bishop of Alexandria sixe yeeres before Peter and Paul were put to death was hee made by order or by election Ierome saith expresly A Marco Euangelista Presbyteri semper vnum ex se electum c. they of Alexandria euer since Marke the Euangelist did alwayes choose their Bishop hee neuer succeeded in order Neither did Anianus gouerne for a weeke or a yeere hee sate Bishop there two and twentie yeeres as Eusebius writeth and Abilius the next that was chosen after his death sate thirtene yeeres more before hee died and then succeeded Cerdo and the rest in their times all chosen and all sitting in the Pastorall chaire so long as they liued The like you may see in the first Bishops of Rome who kept the Episcopall chaire during life and not by course Linus sate twelue yeres Anacletus twelue Clemens nine Saint Iohn the Apostle liuing and ordering the whole Church whiles the three first Bishops of Rome and of Alexandria succeeded by election and gouerned without chaunging for the terme of their liues Wherefore it is euident this vp-start fansie is far from Gods ordinance If you trust not me marke how your owne friends I wil not say your selues do crosse and confute your owne inuentions You say It is Gods disposition that the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or chiefe of your Presbyterie should go by course and that order you call Diuine they say it is accidentall and no part of Gods ordinance Accidentale fuit quod Presbyteri in hac 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 alij alijs per vices initio succedebant It was accidentall that the Presbyters did in this chiefdome at the first beginning succeede one an other by course You tell vs the electing one to continue chiefe of the Presbyterie was an humane order but they assure vs that election in all sacred functions is the commaundement of God and may not be altered Aliud est electionis mandatvm quam immotā non tantùm in Diaconis sed etiam in sacris functionibus omnibus seruatam oportui● aliud electionis modus The commandement of election is one thing which must be obserued not onely in Deacons but in all sacred functions the maner of election is an other thing The precept cannot be immutable vnlesse it be diuine and Apostolike others haue no such power to command Now for my learning I would faine know this ruling by
it voideth the gifts sales and exchanges of ecclesiastical goods made by the Bishop without the subscription of his Clarks The Councill of Hispalis We decree according to the rule of the ancient fathers that none of vs presume to degrade a Presbyter or Deacon without the examination of a Councill for there are many that condemne them without discussing their causes rather by tyrannicall power then by Canonicall authoritie Manie like cases there are in which the bishop might not meddle without his Presbytery or a Synode whereof some are altered by laws some rest in force at this present Against this tyrannicall power which you mention wee repine that Bishops alone should excommunicate and depriue Presbyters at their pleasures Did you acknowledge the Canonicall authoritie of bishops we should soone conclude for the tyrannicall but vnder the shew of the one you impugne the other and when you come to redresse it you establish a plainer tyrannie in steade of it True it is that the frequencie of Synodes did first rebate the credite and decaie the vse of Presbyteries For when the bishops of eche prouince as by the generall Councils of Nice and Chalcedon they were bound met twise euerie yeere to heare and moderate Ecclesiasticall griefes and causes Presbyters were lesse regarded and lesse emploied then before Synodes as superiour Iudges entring into the examination and decision of those things which were wont to be proposed in Presbyteries And when priuat quarrels questions increasing Synodes began to be tired with continuall sitting about such matters and the bishops of most Churches to be detained from their cures and attend the debating deciding of griefs displeasures betwixt man and man the burden grew so intollerable that Synodes were forced to settle an appeale frō the bishop to the Metropolitane commit it to the care of the Primate what causes were fit for Synodall cognition The Council of Sardica If any Bishop in a rage hastily mooued against a Presbyter or Deacon will cast him out of the Church we must prouide that an innocent be not condemned and depriued the Communion All answered Let the partie so eiected haue libertie to flie to the Metropolitane of the same prouince and desire his cause to be more aduisedly heard The great Councill of Affrica finding howe troublesome it was for the bishops of that whole Region to meete and staie the hearing of all matters chose out three of euerie Prouince to end causes vndetermined and by reason they could not assemble twice a yeare for the length of the way they were contented with one full Councill in the yeere and left the causes and complaints of Presbyters Deacons and other Clergie men first to the bishops that were nearest and then to the Primate or Metropolitane of the same prouince We decree that Presbyters Deacons and other inferiour Cleargie men if in any matters they finde themselues agreeued with the iudgements of their own Bishops the Bishops that are neerest shall giue them audience And if they thinke good to appeale from them they shall not appeale to the Tribunals beyond the Seas but to the Primates of their owne Prouince euen as wee haue often decreed of Bishops These Canons did not establish but represse tyrannicall power in bishops if any did assert it and required the bishop before he proceeded against Presbyter or Deacon to take vnto him assessours of the neerest bishops such as the parties conuented should demand and if they coulde not ende the cause with the liking of both sides then the Primate to haue the hearing of it and lastlie the Councill if either parte woulde appeale from the Primate Thus did the Bishops of the Primitiue Church order the hearing of causes within their prouinces neither prowdly nor Antichristianly but in my iudgement soberly and wisely referred them from the Bishop to the Primate thereby to ripen causes and search into the trueth of eche complaint with a great deale lesse trouble and no lesse indifferencie then if it had bene immediatly brought to the Councill And were you as moderate as you be resolute you woulde perceiue what a tedious labour it is and in our State superfluous for a Synode of Bishops to sit all a yeere long hearing priuate griefes complaints and contentions If you be so desirous of it I would you were for a while fast tied to it that you might learne to be wise you would bee the willinger as long as you liued to let courts alone and spend your time better then in examinations depositions and exceptions of witnesses Howbeit in our realme vnlesse you change all your Ecclesiasticall lawes I see not how Synodes or Presbyteries should intermeddle with any such matters for how shal your Presbyters iudge by discretion or by law Your discretions I know no man so foolish that wil trust What greater tyranny iniury can be vrged on a christian realme then instede of Laws to offer the determinations of your Presbyteries Shal ech mans safetie and soule depend on your pleasures But your Presbyteries you meane shall be tied to execute the same Lawes that are alreadie settled Alas good men howe many hundred yeres will you aske before your Presbyteries in cities and villages will be able to reade them and howe many thousand before they vnderstand them Are you well in your wi●●es to claime the execution of those Lawes for your Presbyteries which they neither doe nor euer will conceiue first set them to schoole and when they can reade law send them to the vniuersities and vpon their growing to such perfection that they can heare decide eche mans case by the Lawes of this realme make petition for them to haue them authorized in euerie parish insteade of the Arches If otherwise you will haue them sit Iudges in all mens cases before they can reade either Latin or Law the world will muse at your madnesse Your Bishops are no such great Lawyers And therefore they haue the more neede of Chancellors and Registers that are better acquainted with the Lawes then themselues are and as for appeales vnlesse you looke to treade gouernement vnder your feet and ouer-rule all things by the meere motions of your owne wils though they sometimes aduantage offendours yet were they prouided to protect innocents and are Christian remedies to do euerie man right that thinketh he hath wrong They doe not maintaine the Antichristian pride of bishops there can bee none other nor better waie to represse it then by appeale to bring the iudgements of all their Courts and Officers to bee tried and examined by the princes power and delegates which I trust you take to bee no tyrannie If corruption sometimes creepe in through mens fingers to bolster bad causes the Lawes are farre from allowing and I as farre from defending it What hath bene so sacred that couetousnesse hath not expugned and your Presbyteries except they consist of Angels and not of men will soone shew both what affections and
Clergy and our Nazarites to whom either wholy or chiefly such choices ought to be referred so should the Churches neuer take harme and not to to the richest and mightiest and to the throng and indiscretion of the multitude yea euen to the basest persons amongst them The Emperour at last was forced by publike laws to restraine the people and take the election of bishops from them and giue it to the Clergie and certaine chiefe men of euerie Citie 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 We decree saith Iustinian that as often as neede requireth to ordaine a Bishop the Clergie and principall men of the Citie for which a Bishop must be prouided shal meete together and set downe in writing three persons and taking their oth vpon the holie Euangile shal expresse in their writing that they haue chosen them neither for reward promise fauour or any other cause but knowing the persons to bee of the right and Catholike faith and of honest life c. that of those three so named the best may be ordained at the election and iudgement of the ordainer If any man be ordained a Bishop and this not obserued we command him by all meanes to be remooued from his Bishopricke and likewise the other that presumed to impose hands against this our Lawe If three sufficient persons coulde not be found in the Clergie of that Citie which wanted a bishop the Electours might name two or one so it were d●one within sixe moneths and the men such as the Lawes requires otherwise the Metropolitan● to choose for them A Lay man amongest others the Emperour saith they might name but the Canons did not permit a Lay man to be elected but onely to be desired I do not thinke the peoples presence or testimonie were debarred by this Law for that continued a long time after I take it rather the Electours might offer none without the peoples liking but by this meanes the multitude were excluded from electing whom they would and the power thereof translated to the Clergie and Gouernours of eche Citie to name certaine if the people could like of their choice otherwise within sixe moneths the right to deuolue to the chiefe Bishop of the Prouince Then beganne this rule to be more straitely vrged Docendus est populus non sequendus the people in electing of Bishops must be taught and guided not obeyed and followed For Popes themselues could say though the election belong to Priests yet the consent of Gods people must be had When saith Leo you goe about the election of the chiefe Priest or Bishop let him be aduanced before all whom the consent of the Clergie and people with one accord desireth If their voices be diuided betwixt twaine let him be preferred before the other in the iudgement of the Metropolitane which hath more voices and merites onely let none be ordained against their wils and petitions lest the people despise or hate the Bishop which they neuer affected and they lesse care for religion when their desires are not satisfied The like regard of the peoples desires and petitions was had in Gregories time long after If it be true saith Gregorie to Antonius that the Bishop of Salona be dead hasten to admonish the Clergie and people of that City to choose a Priest with one consent that may be ordained for them And to Magnus about the election of y t bishop of Millan Warde saith he the Clergy people that they dissent ●ot in chusing their Priest but with one accord elect some such as may be consecrated their bishop The order of choosing their bishops in the primitiue Church by the Clergie and people was neuer so much respected but that they might many waies forsake and loose their right as by petition when they had none of their owne by compromise when they could not agree by deuolution when they neglected their time aboue sixe moneths or transgressed the Lawes or Canons either in the fourme of their election or in the person elected specially vpon any corruption disorder or violence the election was vtterly voide and the parties depriued of all power to elect for that turne and when they could not agree they were to send some to the Metropolitane to yeelde him the reasons of their dissenting on both sides and he to strike the stroke betwixt them or else they did referre their consents to two or three that should repaire to the chiefe bishop of the Prouince and there make choice with his aduise and consent for the whole citie If you can find saith Gregorie no fit person amongst yourselues on whome you can agree then chuse three wise and in different men and send them to this city in the name of the whole to whose iudgement the people wil stand And againe Conuēt the Clergy of the church of Naples to chuse 2. or 3. of themselues and not to slacke to send thē hither about the election of their Bishop And in their certificat to vs let thē signifie that those whom they send haue authority to supply al their places in this election So that the peoples right to elect their bishop neuer depēded on Gods expresse cōmandement but on the foundation reason of humane gouernement was subiect both to the Canons of Councils and lawes of Princes might be moderated and restrained by either of them by the peoples consent default or abuse be transferred relinquished or forfeited and without their wils by superior powers and publike Lawes for iust cause be abridged altered or abrogated for the power freedome of the people is not only submitted to the sword which god hath authorized but wholy closed in y t sword neither is any thing lawful for the people setting aside the cōmandements of God which are subiect to no mortall mans wil or power which the laws of their country restraine or prohibite Wherfore there can be no question but the people may willingly forsake and worthily loose the right which they had in the choice of their bishops and the Prince either way bee lawfully possessed of the peoples interest you must rather if you will needes be so inquisitiue examine the causes that induced the lawe whether they were iust or no and so shall you see whether this manner of election be a wise and good preuention of such corrupt factions and fearefull tumultes as our desperate age woulde easely breede or a rigorous encrochment on the peoples right without cause or consent which you can not offer to thinke without euident wrong to the Prince and Realme It cannot be denied but the Prince of right hath and euer had as great interest in the choice of bishops as the people There can no reason be pretended for the multitude but it concludeth more strongly for the Magistrate If the people by Gods Lawe were to chuse their bishop the king as the principall part and head of the people by the same Lawe must be
at first to the ministers of each parish by the lord of y t Soile were matter enough in the iudgement of Christes Church to establish the right of Patrones that they alone should present Clerkes because they alone prouided for them the Princes interest to conferre Bishoprikes hath far more sound and sufficient reason to warrant it for besides the maintenance which the kings of this land yeelded when they first endowed bishoprikes with lands and possessions to vnburden their people of the support and charges of their Bishops in that respect haue as much right as any Patrones can haue the preheminence of the sworde whereby the Prince ruleth the people the people rule not the Prince is no small enforcement that in elections as well as in other points of gouernment the Prince may iustlie chalenge the soueraigntie aboue and without the people Gods law prescribing no certaine rule for the choise of Bishops the people may not chalenge the like without or against the Prince And lastly though the people in former ages by the sufferance of magistrates had somewhat to doe with the elections of their Bishops yet nowe for the auoiding of such tumults and vprores as the Primitiue Church was afflicted with by the lawes of this Realme and their owne consents the peoples interest and liking is wholie submitted and inclosed in the Princes choise so that whome the Prince nameth the people haue bound themselues to acknowledge and accept for their Pastour no lesse then if hee had bene thosen by their owne suffrages And had they not here unto agreed as by Parliament they haue I see no let by Gods lawe but in Christian kingdomes when any difference groweth euen about the elections of Bishops the Prince as head and Ruler of the people hath better right to name and elect then all the rest of their people If they concurre in iudgement there can bee no variance if they dissent the Prince if there were no expresse lawe for that purpose as with vs there is must beare it from the people the people by Gods lawe must not looke to preuaile agaynst their Prince If we might safelie doe it we could obiect against the Princes giuing of Bishoprikes that Athanasius saieth Where is there any such Canon that a Bishop should be sent out of the pallace And the second Councill of Nice alleageth an ancient Canon against it All elections of Bishops Presbyters or Deacons made by the Magistrate are voyde by the Canon which saieth If any Bishop obtaine a Church by the helpe of the secular Magistrate let him bee dep●●● sed and put from the Lordes table and all that communicate with him The Councill of Paris likewise in earnest manner Let none bee ordeined Bishop agaynst the wils of the Citizens but onely whom the election of the people and Clergie shall seeke with full affection Let him not be intruded by the Princes commaundement nor by any other meanes against the consent of the Metropolitane the Bishops of the same Prouince And if any man by ouermuch rashnesse presume to inuade the heigth of this honour by the Princes ordination let him in no wise bee receiued by the Bishops of the same Prouince Rules of discipline be not like rules of doctrine In Christian faith whatsoeuer is once true is alwayes and euery where true but in matters of ecclesiasticall gouernement that at some times and in some places might be receiued and allowed which after and else where was happilie disliked and prohibited If any Father or Councill affirme that by Gods lawe the people haue right to elect their Bishop the Prince hath not the assertion is so false that no man need regard it No proofe can be made that the people haue by the word of God an essentiall interest in the choice of their Pastours If we speake of mans law whatsome Councils decreed other Councils vpon iust cause might change and what some Princes permitted their successours with as great reason might recall or restraine as the varietie of times and places required Of Councils S. Austen saieth Ipsaplenaria Concilia quis nesciat faepe prior aposterioribus emendari Who can be ignorant that generall Councils are often amended the former by the latter when by the experiment of things that is opened which before was hid and seene which before was not perceiued and that without any smoke of sacrilegious pride obstinate arrogance or enuious contention Of Princes edicts I take the case to be so cleare that no man doubteth whether humane lawes may bee altered or no. All Princes haue the sword with like commission from God and heare their scepters with one and the same freedome that their progenitors did As they may with their owne liking abridge themselues of their libertie so may they with the aduise and consent of their state resume the grants of former Princes and enlarge the priuiledges of their roiall dignitie as farre as Gods lawe permitteth For answere then to your authorities I say First Athanasius and the other two Councils might speake of those times when as yet christian Princes had not reuoked elections of Bishops to their owne power but by their publike lawes commanded their Clergie and people to make choise of their Pastors And in that case he that contrary to the positiue lawes of any kingdome or common wealth made secret meanes or procured to be placed by the priuate letters of Princes against the open lawes of the Realme where hee liued was an ambitious violent intruder and not woorthie to beare the name of a Pastor Bishop in Christes Church Next Athanasius and the rest may speake not of election but of examination ordination which by Gods law is committed to Bishops not to Princes and then their meaning is It is not sufficient for a Bishop to haue the Princes consent decree he must be also examined and ordained by such as the holy Ghost hath appointed to impose hands on him which no man may omit though he be neuer so much allowed elected by y e Princes so both their words proofs seem to import Athanasius misliketh that Constantius sent such as should be bishops out of his pallace and forceably inuaded the Churches by his souldiers and captaines none of the comprouincial bishops approuing or admitting them The second council of Nice doth not impugne that princes should elect but that the decree of the magistrate is not enough to make a bishop And why he must be approued ordained by the bishops of the same Prouince by the Metropolitane as the Nicene Canons witnesse Now the 4. Canon of the Nicene Council which they mention speaketh not a word who shal elect name bishops but who shall examine ordaine thē as is euident to be seene And so the council of Paris Non principis imperio ingeratur let him not be imposed by the Princes precept against the Metropolitanes good will And therefore if
any rashlie presumed to inuade that honor per ordinationē regiam as ordained by the king not by the Metropolitane his Comprouincials no man might accept him or acknowledge him for a Bishop Neither hath the ancient Canon any other sense which saith 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. If any Bishop resting on worldly gouernors by their helpe get any Church let him be deposed excommunicated all that ioyne with him They do not exclude Princes frō naming electing of bishops no more then they do the people only they reiect violence forsomuch as a bishop by the rules of the holy Ghost must be throughly examined peaceablie ordained by such as shal impose hands on him and not perēptorilie intruded or imposed by any earthly force or power CHAP. XVI The meeting of Bishops in Synodes and who did call and moderate those assemblies in the Primitiue Church THe necessitie and authoritie of Synodes is not so much in question betwixt vs as the persons that should assemble and moderate those meetings The disciplinarians themselues if I be not deceiued are farre from making their Pastours or Presbyteries in euery parish supreme Iudges of doctrine and maners without all exception or reuocation and wee bee further for what if the Pastours or Presbyters of any place maintaine heresie or offer iniurie which are cases not rarelie incident but euery where occurrent euē in those that beare the names of Christians shall impietie and iniustice so raigne and preuaile in the Church that none may withstand it or redresse it That were to make the house of God worse then a den of theeues for theeues feare the detecting and flie the punishing of their offences which many Presbyters would not if there were no way to restraine and ouer rule their pestilent and wicked purposes Wherefore as in ciuill affaires there are Lawes and Powers to vphold iustice and prohibite violence without the which humane societies could not consist so in the Church of Christ when it is without the helpe and assistance of a Christian magistrate there must bee some externall and iudiciall meanes to discerne errour and redresse wrong in case any particular person or Church be infected or oppressed otherwise there is no possibilitie for trueth and equitie to harbour long amongst the sonnes of men The remedie which the Primitiue Church had and vsed against heresie and iniurie she deriued as well from the promise made by Christes owne wordes as from the example of the Apostles in the like case Christ willing such of his Disciples as were grieued by their brethren after the first and second admonition to toll it to the Church addeth for the direction and confirmation of all religious assemblies and conferences Where two or three are gathered together in my name there am I in the middest of them and whatsoeuer you shall bind on earth shall be bound in heauen and whatsoeuer you shall loose in earth shall bee loosed in heauen Whether the name of the Church in this place hee taken for the assemblie of Elders and Rulers vnder Moses lawe or of Pastours and Teachers vnder the Gospell to me it is indifferent this is euidentlie the order which our Sauiour willeth to be obserued from priuate admonition to goe to witnesses and from witnesses to assemblies So the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doeth most plainelie signifie and so the promise annexed doeth clearelie import where two or three are assembled together in my name I am in the midst of them Neither could any other course bee established in the Church for since an ende of controuersies must bee had amongst men least perpetuall contention bring finall confusion and plucke vp the verie rootes of all charitie and equitie from amongst men when neither priuate perswasion nor friendlie mediation can appease the parties contending what other order could bee prescribed but a Iudiciall hearing and determining of things in question Nowe Iudges must needes bee either single or assembled and single Iudges of force must either be Soueraigne and supreme Iudges or els vnder superiours appointed by the same warrant The Bishop of Rome claimeth a single and sole commission to heare and conclude all causes concerning either faith or right and were his proofe as good as his chalenge is proude it were woorth the discussing but the more he claimeth the more he sinneth by reason he taketh vnto himselfe without commission an infallible and ineuitable iudgement ouer all men and matters vpon the face of the earth that any way touch the trueth or the Church Princes are single and soueraigne Iudges of earthlie things and when they beleeue the defence and maintenance of the Church and fayth is by God himselfe committed to their power and care but Christ did not settle the sword to bee the generall and perpetuall rule to gouerne his Church for then without a Prince there could be no Church and consequentlie neither in the Apostles times nor three hundred yeeres after had Christ anie Church heere on earth since none of the Romane Princes that were lordes of the world publikelie maintained the Christian faith before Constantine Since we find no single nor supreme Iudges on whome the Church of Christ must alwayes depend for the debating and ending of ecclesiasticall strifes and contentions of necessitie there must either be none which were the vtter subuersion of all peace and order amongst the faithfull where there wanteth a Christian Magistrate or els the Pastours and Stewards of Christes Church to whome the care and charge thereof is committed must assemble together and with mutuall conference and consent performe those dueties to the Church in generall which otherwise they doe to each particular place and person for though Pastours be affixed to their places and charges yet that doeth not hinder the common care they should haue of all the members of Christes bodie and therefore when need so requireth they must as well imploy their trauell abroad as bestowe paines at home to direct or pacifie the household of faith This brotherlie kind of succouring and assisting each other in troubles and dangers is sometimes performed by letters but neuer so throughly and effectually as by meeting and assembling together when with deliberate and full aduise they may heare and determine what they thinke meetest for the safetie and quietnesse of the Church of God Their warrant so to doe is builded on the maine grounds of all diuine and humane societies strengthned by the promise of our Sauiour and assured vnto them by the example of the Apostles and perpetuall practise of the Church of Christ. By Gods lawe what obedience and reuerence the father may expect from his children the same or greater must all beleeuers yeeld to the fathers of their faith They are comprised in the same name and in the same commaundement with the fathers of our flesh and consequently must haue the same honour And if the fulnesse of each mans reward must be according to the excellencie
short meetings vnto the hearing and iudgement of the Metropolitane or Primate of the prouince country where y ● strifes arose The Councill in Trullo saith The things which were determined by our sacred Fathers wee will haue to stand good in all points and renue the Canon which commaundeth Synodes of Bishops to be kept euery yeere in euery Prouince where the Metropolitane shall appoint But since by reason of the inuasions of the Barbarians and diuers other occasions the Gouernors of the Church cannot possibly assemble in Synode twise euery yeere wee decree that in any case there shall be a Synode of Bishops once euery yeere for Ecclesisticall questions likelie to arise in euery Prouince at the place where the Metropolitane shal make choice The second Nicene Councill Where the Canon willeth iudiciall inquisition to be made twise euery yeere by the assemblie of Bishops in euery Prouince and yet for the misery and pouertie of such as should trauell the Fathers of the sixt Synode decreed it should be once in the yeere and then things amisse to bee redressed we renue this later Canon insomuch that if any Metropolitane neglect to doe it except he be hindered by necessitie violence or some other reasonable cause he shall be vnder the punishment of the Canons The Council of Affrica The decrees of the Nicene Councill did most plainely leaue both inferiour Clerkes and Bishops TO THEIR OVVNE METROPOLITANES They did wisely and rightly perceiue that all causes ought to be ended in the places where they did first spring for they d●d not thinke any Prouince shoulde bee destitute of the grace of the holy Spirit whereby iustice shoulde bee prudently discerned constantly pursued by the Priests of Christ specially when as euery man hath libertie if he find himselfe grieued with the censure of those that examine his cause to appeale to the Synodes of the same Prouince or to a general Council And againe It hath pleased vs that Presbyters Deacons and other inferiour Clergie men if they complaine of the iudgements of their owne Bishops shall be heard by the Bishops adioyning And if they thinke good to appeale from them let them not appeale but either to the Synodes of Africa OR TO THE PRIMATES of their owne Prouinces So the Council of Sardica If a Bishop in a rage wil by and by cast a Presbyter or Deacon out of the Church we must prouide that being innocent he be not condemned nor depriued the communion Al the Bishops answered Let him that is eiected haue liberty TO FLIE TO THE METROPOLITANE of that Prouince The Emperor confirmed the same If the Bishops of one Synode haue anie matter of variance betwixt themselues either for Ecclesiastical right or any other occasions first the Metropolitane with other Bishops of that Synode shall examine and determine the cause and if either part dislike the iudgement THEN THE PATRIARKE of that Dioecese shall giue them audience ACCORDING TO THE ECCLESIASTICALL CANONS AND OVR LAVVES neither side hauing libertie to contradict his iudgement But if anie of the Cleargie or whosoeuer complaine against his Bishop for anie matter LET THE CAVSE BE IVD●ED BY THE METROPOLITANE answerable to the sacred Rules and our Lawes And if any man appeale from his sentence let the cause be brought TO THE ARCHBISHOP Patriarke of that Dioecese and he according to the Canons and Lawes shall make a finall end So that not Antichrist but ancient Councils and Christian Emperours perceiuing the mightie troubles and intolerable charges that the Bishops of euery prouince were put to by staying at Synodes for the hearing and determining of al priuate matters quarrels occurrent in the same Prouince and seeing no cause to busie and imploy the bishops of the whole world twise euerie yeere to sit in iudgement about petite and particular strifes and brables till al parties were satisfied but finding rather that by that means all matters must either be infinitely delayed or slenderly examined and hastily posted ouer as well the Princes as the Bishops not to increase the pride of Archbishops but to settle an indifferent course both for the parties and the Iudges referred not the making of Lawes and Canons but the execution of them alreadie made to the credite and conscience of the Archbishop And though the Fathers leaue an appeale either to the Councils or to the Primates of euerie Nation and Countrie yet the Emperour seeing howelong causes woulde depend before Councils coulde duelie examine and determine them and that to bring all priuate matters from Prouinciall Synodes to Nationall Councils were to breede a worse confusion then the former was decreed that all appeales should go to the Archbishop If you murmure at this alteration first established by the Romane Emperours and stil continued by the Lawes of this realme now in force remember how vnreasonable and intolerable a matter it were for al the bishops of this realme to assemble and at their owne charges to stay the hearing examining and sentencing of all the doubts wrongs quarrels and contentions which al the Consistories throughout England at this day do handle and determine Did you exclude matters of tithes testaments legacies contracts marriages and such like which the ancient Lawes of all Nations commit to episcopall audience and reserue onely matters of correction for Synodes see you not by experience how long causes by reason of the number and weight of them depend in the Arches in the Audience afore the high Commission though the Iudges thereof sit all the yeere long at the dayes prefixed without intermission were it not a proper peece of work for your pleasures to bring all the pastours of this land to keepe continually in one place and to doe nothing else but attend for appeales that must and woulde bee sent from all the shires and quarters of this realme who shoulde teach and administer the Sacraments to the people in the meane time who shoulde defray the expences of so many hundred pastours as are not able to maintaine their families at home and themselues abroade who shall instruct them in the knowledge of the Lawes without which they shalldoe more wrong then right How long will it be afore so great a number or the most part of them concurre in one minde to conclude euerie cause that is brought vnto them And when all these inconueniences be endured and absurdities digested to what purpose since euerie man may presently appeale from them to the Princes power and delegates If Synodes were supreme Tribunals though it were not worth their paines and expences yet they shoulde ende strifes but now you would haue them waste their time spend their liuings and wearie themselues in loosing their labour whiles euerieman that liketh not their order may foorthwith appeale and frustrate their proceedings We could deuise many ways to preuent al this that you obiect if we might be suffred for we would haue standing Synodes in euery Citie that should