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cause_n authority_n church_n matter_n 1,711 5 5.4480 4 false
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A93885 Some observations and annotations upon the Apologeticall narration, humbly submitted to the Honourable Houses of Parliament; the most reverend and learned Divines of the Assembly, and all the Protestant Churches here in this island, and abroad. Steuart, Adam. 1644 (1644) Wing S5492; Thomason E34_23; ESTC R21620 55,133 77

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and_o severe_a tribunal_n and_o most_o sacred_a refuge_n and_o asylum_n of_o mis-judged_n innocence_n require_v not_o of_o you_o by_o thomas_n goodwin_n etc._n etc._n we_o have_v hereupon_o already_o express_v in_o the_o epistle_n and_o in_o our_o seven_o observation_n what_o many_o learned_a and_o good_a man_n desire_v and_o what_o may_v be_v their_o judgement_n hereupon_o about_o you_o five_o pag._n 1._o now_o member_n of_o the_o assembly_n of_o divine_n and_o this_o also_o we_o have_v touch_v in_o our_o epistle_n and_o upon_o humble_o submit_v note_n upon_o the_o first_o page_n sect._n 1_o our_o ear_n etc._n etc._n here_o begin_v this_o apologetical_a narration_n which_o from_o this_o unto_o the_o nine_o section_n page_n the_o five_o have_v little_a or_o nothing_o material_a touch_v the_o question_n in_o controversy_n betwixt_o our_o brethren_n and_o we_o only_o it_o contain_v a_o narration_n of_o their_o godly_a way_n whereupon_o they_o have_v never_o be_v challenge_v by_o their_o brethren_n that_o ever_o i_o can_v hear_v of_o fill_v with_o exclamation_n what_o can_v be_v these_o exclamation_n or_o exclamator_n we_o know_v not_o and_o therefore_o answer_v not_o sect._n 2._o and_o now_o etc._n etc._n it_o may_v seem_v very_o probable_a to_o reasonable_a man_n 1._o that_o it_o shall_v have_v be_v more_o seasonable_a to_o have_v make_v this_o appearance_n into_o public_a light_n before_o your_o entrance_n into_o the_o assembly_n than_o so_o many_o month_n after_o 2._o before_o your_o brethren_n in_o submit_v your_o spirit_n of_o prophet_n unto_o that_o of_o the_o whole_a assembly_n then_o in_o this_o extraordinary_a way_n unparalel_v by_o any_o like_a unto_o it_o in_o the_o world_n 3._o to_o have_v seek_v of_o they_o a_o testimony_n then_o after_o this_o way_n to_o take_v it_o at_o your_o own_o hand_n and_o give_v it_o unto_o yourselves_o lie_v under_o so_o dark_a a_o cloud_n you_o avow_v hereafter_o that_o it_o be_v vanish_v away_o so_o you_o lose_v your_o pain_n 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here_o you_o mistake_v for_o we_o can_v produce_v you_o sundry_a other_o of_o good_a note_n here_o print_v at_o london_n we_o be_v sorry_a you_o have_v not_o see_v they_o or_o disdain_v to_o read_v they_o if_o there_o be_v not_o many_o write_v before_o those_o it_o be_v in_o pity_n of_o your_o affliction_n whereunto_o good_a divine_n will_v not_o add_v new_a affliction_n neither_o thought_n they_o your_o party_n so_o considerable_a neither_o be_v your_o opinion_n much_o know_v or_o publish_v abroad_o be_v only_o write_v in_o english_a and_o not_o in_o latin_a except_o by_o one_o or_o two_o of_o your_o divine_n for_o any_o thing_n i_o know_v neither_o think_v they_o that_o you_o be_v so_o averse_a from_o their_o discipline_n as_o you_o appear_v in_o this_o assembly_n but_o that_o you_o suffer_v only_o for_o not_o conform_v yourselves_o unto_o episcopal_a government_n but_o whatever_o they_o have_v write_v i_o know_v not_o what_o this_o can_v serve_v to_o the_o purpose_n unless_o it_o be_v to_o declare_v that_o whatsoever_o help_v you_o have_v heretofore_o yet_o you_o be_v destitute_a of_o those_o writing_n whereby_o you_o may_v have_v receive_v far_o light_v concern_v presbyterial_a government_n and_o i_o pray_v god_n you_o make_v good_a use_n of_o they_o in_o the_o 16._o §_o at_o the_o end_n of_o the_o 16._o pag._n you_o travel_v to_o remove_v a_o objection_n viz._n that_o in_o congregationall_a government_n such_o as_o be_v among_o you_o there_o be_v no_o allow_v sufficient_a remedy_n for_o miscarriage_n though_o never_o so_o gross_a no_o relief_n for_o wrongful_a sentence_n or_o person_n injure_v thereby_o no_o room_n for_o complaint_n no_o powerful_a or_o effectual_a mean_n to_o reduce_v a_o church_n or_o church_n that_o fall_v into_o heresy_n or_o schism_n etc._n etc._n to_o avoid_v this_o objection_n you_o relate_v we_o a_o history_n §_o 17._o and_o what_o you_o do_v upon_o such_o a_o emergent_a case_n but_o you_o show_v we_o no_o law_n that_o ever_o you_o have_v among_o you_o whereby_o you_o may_v bring_v any_o remedy_n against_o such_o a_o miscarriage_n before_o that_o it_o fall_v out_o 2._o neither_o read_v we_o of_o any_o such_o law_n or_o remedy_n in_o your_o book_n before_o this_o 3._o your_o divine_n and_o the_o member_n of_o your_o church_n with_o who_o we_o converse_v show_v no_o remedy_n among_o you_o for_o such_o inconvenience_n 4._o they_o give_v we_o no_o answer_n unto_o this_o objection_n save_v only_o this_o that_o god_n have_v ordain_v no_o remedy_n in_o such_o case_n yea_o that_o if_o church_n shall_v fall_v away_o from_o christ_n and_o with_o the_o jew_n call_v he_o a_o impostor_n and_o the_o trinity_n with_o servet_fw-la a_o three_o head_a cat_n and_o deny_v the_o incarnation_n of_o the_o son_n of_o god_n they_o shall_v be_v tolerate_v yea_o more_o that_o the_o civil_a magistrate_n shall_v punish_v no_o man_n for_o his_o religion_n be_v it_o never_o so_o bad_a or_o blasphemous_a and_o that_o it_o must_v be_v leave_v to_o god_n and_o this_o give_v we_o reason_n to_o think_v that_o these_o reason_n within_o these_o two_o year_n have_v make_v you_o to_o refine_v your_o opinion_n and_o to_o mould_v some_o new_a solution_n and_o to_o suit_n your_o opinion_n more_o close_o to_o the_o current_n of_o the_o time_n than_o you_o be_v wont_a to_o do_v if_o therefore_o we_o speak_v after_o they_o it_o be_v their_o fault_n and_o not_o we_o it_o may_v be_v that_o your_o opinion_n be_v not_o common_a to_o you_o all_o but_o to_o you_o five_o alone_o the_o sum_n of_o the_o history_n be_v a_o minister_n be_v sudden_o depose_v by_o his_o flock_n whereupon_o some_o church_n do_v take_v offence_n and_o all_o their_o church_n consent_v in_o this_o principle_n that_o church_n 5.22_o 1_o cor._n 10.32_o 1_o tim._n 5.22_o as_o well_o as_o particular_a man_n be_v bind_v to_o give_v no_o offence_n neither_o to_o jew_n nor_o gentile_a nor_o the_o church_n of_o god_n they_o live_v among_o item_n that_o in_o virtue_n of_o the_o same_o or_o like_o law_n of_o not_o partake_v in_o other_o man_n sin_n the_o church_n offend_v may_v and_o aught_o upon_o the_o impenitency_n of_o those_o church_n persist_v in_o their_o error_n and_o miscarriage_n to_o pronounce_v that_o heavy_a sentence_n against_o they_o of_o withdraw_a and_o renounce_v all_o christian_a communion_n with_o they_o until_o they_o do_v repent_v and_o further_o to_o declare_v and_o protest_v this_o with_o the_o cause_n thereof_o to_o all_o christian_a church_n of_o christ_n that_o they_o may_v do_v the_o like_a in_o this_o narration_n it_o appear_v 1._o that_o this_o church_n offend_v before_o this_o emergent_a case_n know_v not_o so_o much_o for_o if_o she_o have_v it_o be_v not_o credible_a that_o she_o will_v against_o all_o charity_n and_o the_o common_a order_n of_o all_o church_n have_v commit_v so_o great_a a_o scandal_n 2._o this_o remedy_n be_v not_o sufficient_a nor_o satisfactory_a 1._o because_o all_o church_n according_a to_o your_o tenet_n be_v equal_a in_o authority_n independent_a one_o of_o another_o and_o par_fw-fr in_o parcm_fw-la non_fw-la habet_fw-la imperium_fw-la none_o have_v power_n or_o authority_n over_o his_o equal_a how_o then_o can_v any_o church_n bind_v another_o to_o any_o such_o account_n but_o out_o of_o its_o freewill_n as_o a_o party_n may_v do_v to_o its_o party_n 3._o because_o since_o other_o church_n be_v or_o pretend_v to_o be_v offend_v in_o such_o a_o proceed_n they_o can_v not_o judge_v in_o it_o for_o than_o they_o shall_v have_v be_v both_o judge_n and_o party_n in_o one_o cause_n which_o can_v be_v grant_v to_o those_o that_o have_v no_o authoritative_a power_n one_o over_o another_o as_o when_o a_o private_a man_n offend_v the_o state_n and_o we_o our_o god_n 4._o what_o if_o many_o church_n yea_o all_o the_o church_n shall_v offend_v one_o shall_v that_o one_o church_n gather_v all_o the_o rest_n together_o judge_v they_o all_o and_o in_o case_n of_o not_o submit_v themselves_o to_o her_o judgement_n separate_v herself_o from_o they_o all_o if_o so_o we_o shall_v have_v separation_n and_o schism_n enough_o which_o shall_v be_v continue_v to_o all_o posterity_n to_o come_v 5._o what_o if_o church_n be_v so_o remote_a one_o from_o another_o that_o they_o can_v not_o easy_o meet_v together_o upon_o every_o occasion_n then_o there_o shall_v be_v no_o remedy_n or_o at_o least_o not_o easy_a remedy_n 6._o what_o if_o the_o offence_n be_v small_a shall_v so_o many_o church_n for_o every_o trifle_n gather_v together_o and_o put_v themselves_o to_o so_o great_a cost_n and_o trouble_v 7._o what_o if_o the_o church_n in_o their_o judgement_n shall_v differ_v one_o from_o another_o in_o such_o a_o case_n shall_v they_o all_o by_o schism_n separate_v themselves_o one_o from_o another_o 8._o this_o sort_n of_o government_n give_v no_o more_o power_n or_o authority_n to_o a_o thousand_o church_n over_o one_o then_o to_o a_o tinker_n yea_o to_o the_o hangman_n over_o a_o thousand_o for_o he_o may_v desire_v they_o all_o out_o of_o charity_n to_o give_v a_o account_n of_o their_o judgement_n in_o case_n he_o be_v offend_v by_o they_o neither_o see_v i_o what_o more_o our_o brethren_n grant_v to_o all_o the_o church_n of_o the_o world_n over_o one_o but_o the_o presbyterial_a government_n be_v subject_a to_o none_o of_o these_o inconvenience_n for_o the_o collective_a or_o combine_a eldership_n have_v a_o authoritative_a power_n all_o man_n and_o church_n thereof_o be_v bind_v by_o law_n and_o covenant_n to_o submit_v themselves_o thereunto_o every_o man_n know_v their_o set_a time_n of_o meeting_n wherein_o sundry_a matter_n be_v dispatch_v and_o all_o thing_n carry_v by_o plurality_n of_o voice_n without_o any_o schism_n or_o separation_n 9_o this_o government_n be_v a_o power_n wherein_o the_o party_n be_v judge_v if_o he_o will_v and_o so_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o judge_n suspend_v upon_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o party_n judge_v which_o be_v most_o ridiculous_a without_o any_o example_n in_o ecclesiastical_a or_o civil_a judicatories_n a_o judgement_n indeed_o not_o very_o unlike_a to_o that_o which_o be_v relate_v of_o a_o merry_a man_n who_o say_v he_o have_v the_o best_a and_o most_o obedient_a wife_n of_o the_o whole_a world_n because_o say_v he_o she_o will_v nothing_o but_o what_o i_o will_v and_o as_o all_o man_n wonder_v at_o it_o know_v she_o to_o be_v the_o most_o disobedient_a yea_o say_v he_o but_o i_o must_v first_o will_v what_o she_o will_v else_o she_o will_v nothing_o that_o i_o will_n 10._o this_o sort_n of_o government_n be_v unjust_a and_o unreasonable_a for_o not_o only_o the_o party_n judge_v its_o party_n but_o also_o it_o inflict_v the_o same_o punishment_n viz._n separation_n upon_o all_o offend_a church_n what_o ever_o be_v the_o offence_n great_a or_o small_a