every true beliver that his flesh is his meat indeed c. In which they imply that it cannot be meat to them and so not fed upon by them except nigh to them and explain not themselves in what sence they mean nigh which had been very needfull in such a case when they lay so much stress upon its being nigh especially seeing the expressions are not found in the Scripture that the flesh and blood of Christ is nigh to every true believer much less that its being nigh is the cause of its being meat and drink unto them the Scripture saith that the word of Faith which the Apostles preached the Preaching of the Crosse declaring Christ to be risen from the dead was made nigh to them in and through the Preaching of it even so in their mouth and and in their heart that it might be believed and confessed by them but he saith not that the flesh and blood of Christ was nigh to every true believer yea doubtlesse even that flesh and blood of Christ vertually of which our Saviour speaks was meat and drink indeed Spiritually and by Faith to Abraham and other true believers in Moses and the Prophets times and yet they received not the promises in which they were actually brought forth and manifested but saw them afar off and rejoyced in them We say therefore seeing the expressions are not found in the Scripture there was the more need for them to have explained in what sence they mean that it is so nigh them which though they do not yet the whole question compared with the former yea the following Question more clearly shewes their meaning to be that except the flesh and blood of Christ be nigh them as to time and place in a present sencible being it cannot be meat drink indeed to them By which it appears that that which they mean by the flesh and blood of Christ which is meat and drink to the believer it is something alwayes in a present sencible being nigh to with and in them in which they shew themselves sensual not having the Spirit living by sence and not by Faith which is the evidence of things not seen as also the ground or confidence of things hoped for We shall here therefore for the help of others and that none may be beguiled with inticing words positively assert and shew by the Scriptures 1. What is meant by Christs Flesh and Christs Blood that is meat and drink indeed 2. How or wherein that was actually so made and from what reason it is evidenced to be such meat and drink indeed 3. How and by what means it is brought to us that it may be fed on by us 1. By his flesh and his blood when mentioned together and so by each and either of them when expressed by it self as the Bread or Drink of Life is meant Jesus Christ and him crucified himself as come in the flesh and having finished the the works the Father gave him to do on the Earth in his whole abasement and humiliation in which he once suffered for sins the Just for the unjust that he might bring us to God Our Saviour comprehends both his flesh that is meat indeed and his blood that is drink indeed in those sayings the Bread of God is he which cometh down from Heaven and giveth life unto the World I am the living Bread that came down from Heaven and the Bread which I will give is my flesh which I will give for the life of the World John 6. 33. 48. 50 51. Whence also both the eating and drinking in the Supper of the Lord is appointed to be done in remembrance of him Now remembrance implyes something actually done finished and passed through in and by him as he is the object of remembrance which is therefore alwayes to be remembred because of its infinite and abiding vertue and usefulnesse he being by means thereof made both Lord and Christ and so that which is remembred and shewed forth is the Lords death the whole abasement humiliation and sufferings sustained and finished by him in that body of his flesh the Crosse of Christ with the glorious ends vertues and preciousnesse thereof 1 Cor. 11. 24 25 26. Therefore the whole Gospel of Christ is called the preaching of his Crosse even of Christ crucified 1 Cor. 1. 17. 18. 23. and 2. 2. Yet in the distinct mention of his flesh and his blood there is some distinct considerations of him and him crucified or of the Crosse of Christ as he is so and by means thereof the Bread of God signified to us And that both in his Humiliation and sufferings and in the ends of them and their powerful efficacy with the Father to those ends for us First Distinct things considerable in his Humiliation and sufferings for us and so by his flesh as distinguished from his blood is meant His whole abasement in being made flesh and sufferings in the flesh unto the shedding his blood or laying down his Life even all that sustained and endured by him in the dayes of his flesh or weaknesse for he was crucified through weaknesse of which he was made partaker that therein he might be capable of suffering and dying our death as well as that he might bear our infirmities and sorrowes And so his taking mans Nature or kind in being made flesh of a woman so as in that preparation of his Body he took part of flesh and blood like as the Children of men are partakers of it as the fruit of sin and so was made in the likenesse of sinful flesh subject to all our infirmities that came on us by reason of sin yet without sin in that body of his flesh therefore his flesh so prepared and given him of the Father was meet to be given by him for the Life of the World whereas in our flesh as we are partakers of it in its mortal state there dwells no good thing therefore nothing that can be done or suffered by us in our flesh is in it self clean or meet to be offered in sacrifice to God But his flesh as distinguished from and in some sence opposed to our flesh as we in our particular persons are partakers of it and so his humbling himself to be made flesh in the likenesse of our sinfull flesh and to come as a weak and dispicable man in the form of a Servant and being therein made a man of sorrows and acquainted with griefs and giving his flesh to be broken bruised torn wounded and pierced for our transgressions this is that which God hath accepted and therefore crowned him with this Honour when made flesh and in that body of his flesh lower then the Angels even partaker with us of flesh and blood that his sufferings unto death and so his death in the flesh should be by the Grace of God for every man therefore his flesh is meat indeed for us even his flesh given for the Life of the World his body
life of the natural body preserved by food turned into blood and not of a spiritual and raised body as his Speech was To their Question What is the Body of flesh and bones turned into then We Answer His Body had flesh and Bones in it in the raised changed state as he shewed his Disciples And therefore that they are changed into any other thing or that the bodies of the Saints raised shall not have Flesh and Bones in them as his had follows not What they say in the remainder of page 17. is all spoken to before W. and F. Whereas p. 18. they say That they believe not that when Christ after the Resurrection shewed his Disciples his Hands and his Feet his Body then had no blood in it We will not contend with them about it for neither is it an Article of our Faith though their conceit proves not that it had nor can it be any thing more then a meer guesse though they are so infallibly led they pretend that they must not be thought by their Disciples to guesse at any thing as if they knew it not They alleadge that he eat before them of the broiled Fish and Hony Comb which is nourishment both to flesh and blood Reply T is so to our Natural Bodies follows it that it was so to his raised spiritual Body They say The Blood is the Life of that that hath need of such nourishment yea the life of all flesh is Blood Gen. 9. 4 5. Levit. 17. 14. Reply This is true of mortal flesh in its natural state but that Christ eat because he needed such nourishment after his Resurrection for his raised body we believe not but to demonstrate by infallible proofs that he was truly raised in a real and not a fantastical body And therefore all this is to no purpose As for what they prate of The Body of Christ in Glory and the Bodies of the Saints in the Resurrestion that they shall as far exceed in Glory these our earthly bodies as the Sun Moon and Stars do exceed the bodies of birds beasts and Fishes These are but Visors to hide their uglinesse for what resurrection is there of the Saints if that body that dyed shall never rise Can any thing be said to rise again that never fell or dyed as they say The body that dies shall not But therefore they tell us The mystery of these things is for ever sealed up in Parables from such blind guides as they reproach us to be who have long abused the Truth c. It seems Reader they would have thee know that whatever they seem to say fairly they have another meaning couched under it and so they walk in hidden things of dishonesty and deal deceitfully and would make us believe the Apostles did so too who commended themselves to every mans Conscience in the sight of God and did not hide their meanings but speak openly what Christ spake to them in parables but these have usually another meaning for the Apostles sayings because they believe them not in their own meaning in which they uttered them understand Reader that as Joseph Fisher a Quaker in a Paper to us implies the change of the Body is made by the Babe within here before the separation of the Soul and Body and so that their spiritual bodies are those that excel so in glory above the Bodies of Beasts and Birds that is those that are not in and of the same corrupt mind with them Some such mystery they put upon the Apostles plainest sayings to make them Parables To justifie their corrupt Doctrine that the Scriptures are not the Medium of Faith which we disproved from John 17. 20. Acts 17. 11 12. They alledge That no Scripture sayes the Scriptures are the Medium of Faith Reply Nor say they Christ is the Medium neither though the word Medium be not expressed the sence of it is as through their words They say The Apostles were not Ministers of Letter Reply If by Letter they mean the writing of words as in Epistles and Letters its false for they Ministred the Knowledge of God both by Vocal Preaching and by writing it in Epistles and Letters so as men in reading their writings might see the Truth and acknowledge it and understand their Knowledge in the Mystery of Christ 2 Cor. 1. 13. Ephes 3. 4. 5. and though their words however Ministred by them whether by audible voice or writing our Saviour supposes men should believe for he limits it not to any one way of Ministration Are not the sayings of the Apostles their words because they be written The Letter of which the Apostles sayes they were not Ministers is clearly the Law opposed to the Gospel which is a Ministration of Spirit whether spoken or written Now through their words is all one in sence as to say their words are a Medium of mens believing To that of the Bereans they say That the Bereans first received the Word with all readinesse of mind and then searched the Scriptures But this they say of their own head for the Scriptures say not so but that they received the word with all readinesse of mind and searched the Scripture and that therefore many of them believed which implies their searching the Scriptures and finding them to agree with the Apostles words was a Medium or mean of their readier believing But of those words urged by us they take no notice they could once and again make something of there when it signified nothing but hereof but hereof therefore when it signifies or points to a mediate cause they make nothing Oh perverse and crooked generation nor doth the mentioning their searching the Scriptures after the mention of their receiving the word imply that they first received the word and then searched the Scriptures no more then the mentioning of mens confessing with the mouth the Lord Jesus before the believing him in the heart raised from the dead Rom. 10. 9. implies that the confession must be first in being before believing in the same person Nor doth the Greek mention any and but reads it thus these received the word with all readinesse searching the Scriptures and that manner of phrase usually signifies the latter as a means to the former as may be seen Acts 8. 3. 6. 9. 13. Heb. 12. 1 2. c. their confounding the Author with the Medium is a piece of their confusion though Christ be the Author of Faith and bring to believe that hinders not but the Scriptures and the Doctrine therein declared may be and is the Medium but these are truly Blind guides that are destitute of understanding wo to the people that are led by them Page 19. John Whiteheads witnessing against our charge of him with saying That the Apostles were not bringers of light but onely pointed to what they had before is of no credit with us because we know it to the contrary in his speaking and so do the Auditory if they remember
to be confounded and not to have confounded us with their Sophistry or if they will their dreams and Dominions which all faile them then say W. and F. John Horn added It is not said there that there was no sin in Nathaniell to which they say Iohn Horn here would accuse Nathaniel to have sin in him when as Christ said there was no guile in him Ioh. 1. 47. Rep. 'T is no accusation against a man to observe what is said of him in the Scripture but they further charge Iohn Horn as erring in affirming as much as that all sin is not guile which is Negative not an affirmative and fault his distinstuishing hypocrisie and envy from guile and yet confessing that guile is a deceitfull hiding a mans sin or deceit Rep. Well if guile be a deceitfull hiding a mans sin then all sin is not guile for that implies there is some sin beside guile that guile would hide or lead men to hide but they add as a demonstration of our ignorance What is not hypocrisie a deceitfull hiding a mans sin and is not every sin deceit and deceit guile To this we answer and let all men judge of it that can understand 1. That not we onely but the Apostle Peter distinguishes between guile and envy and hypocrisy c. When he says lay aside all malice and all guile and hypocrisy and envy and evill speaking unless they will make the Apostle Peter to speak Tautologies and multiply words without cause for what need to say all malice and all guile if all malice and all guile are one and the same and what need to adde after all guile and hypocrisy and envies c. If all guile be all hypocrisy and envies and all sins else Judge Reader whether the Apostle would speak idle words and needless Again 2. To their question is not hypocrisy a deceitfull hiding a mans sins Answer nay rather its a deceitfull counterfeiting vertue and goodness as they do though where it is there is also guile to hide a mans sin yet these two are distinct 3. They say is not every sin deceit and deceit guile Answer every sin is not that which is called deceit or fraud nor every deceit guile there is sin of ignorance and mistake without intention to deceive or double heartedness or deceit fulness of heart when a thing is not known to a man a man would do better if he knew as when Paul reviled the high Priest Act. 23. And so that ruler of his people it was not deceit his so doing or out of a mind to do deceitfuly but out of mistake or ignorance nor was it sin that he was deceived in his thoughts about him for it is no sin for a man not to know the Person of another that he knows not but his rashness and reviling him as he did though mistaking him was his sin so that neither was that his sin guile nor was his being deceived about his Person or Office his sin much less guile in him Let the understanding judge of what is said They adde G. W. This being Iohn Horns reason to prove all sin not guile because it is said in 1 Pet. 2. 1 2. Laying eside all malice and all guile Mark all guile and hypocrifie the word and being his distinction he might as well say envy is not malice because there is and between them To which Iohn Horn replies 1. Why say they Mark all guile doth the saying all guile make it to be all sin no sin but guile Why then all malice should be Marked too that that 's all sin and so no sin of ignorance but all sin is malice because it s said all malice and by the same reason because its said Ephes 4. 31. All bitterness bitterness too should be all sin 2. Why Mark all guile rather then Mark and hypocrisy as distinguishing hypocrisy from guile for and uses to couple things distinguished most usually 3. Why say they the word and is my distinction when it was the Apostle Peters too as well as mine 4. I may say that envy is not all malice though it have malice in it yet malice may be without it in some cases I may say my elbow is not my arm though it be in my arm so I may say envy is not malice though malice be in it there is a distinction between them envy is a looking at anothers prosperity with grief at it malice is an evill will towards a Person whence envy proceeds you adde That in that thing many see my folly at the dispute in affirming that all sin is not guile when as all guile doth onely include one sin as I would have it but all sin and any sin makes a man guilty and so he hath guile in him so that he that had no guile in him had no sin in him Rep. Who would not pitty and bewaile the miserable case of those people that are carried about by such silly deceitfull men as these be for in this 1. They say falsly in saying many see my folly at the dispute in saying all sin is not guile for how is that folly that stands against all their deceit some possibly might not understand the truth of what I said through their own folly but that any could see my folly in what it was not to be seen is impossible I am sure divers see their folly in affirming all sin to be guile and the sorry waies they took to prove it and that they may see yet for 2. When as all guile they say doth onely include one sin as I would have it then it is as I would have it it seems and then where is the folly to be seen but in them that charge me with it and then say it is as I would have it but I suppose the word not is omitted in the printing for I will be ingenious though to an adversary they should have said all guile doth not onely include one sin as I would have it but if that be their minde yet they bely me in saying I would have all guile include but one sin I would rather say it is one spring or kind of sin and is included in many or divers sins and yet is not the divers sins in which it is nor is it included in every sin much less includes it all sin no more then all malice or all bitterness includes all sins because they include divers acts of sin 3. When they say any one sin makes a man guilty and so he hath guile in him they speak very ignorantly or very guilefully for I distinguish them ignorantly if they think guile and guilt of one denomination and guilty to come from the word guile and so all that makes guilty to make guily Guilty is said of guilt I trow and not of guile though guile produces guilt yet a man is not denominated guilty from guile but from guilt and guilfull from guile If they know not this they are very ignorant and not
the foundation of the World but now once in the end of the World hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself Heb. 9. 26. Where the Apostle counts it absurd to say Christ hath suffered often since the foundation of the World and behold this new Mystery I suppose the everlasting Gospel so called composed by the Fryers about King Henry 3ds time tells us boldly Acts and Mon. vol. 1. p. 416. and roundly he is yet suffering and suffers daily and reigns daily in every age suffers in some reigns in others And so Christ himselfe was out that said I was dead and am alive and live fox evermore but for that of the Hebrews I suppose if these new but not true prophets and Apostles would speak out they would tell us the foundation and the end of the world are both in them but remember still that they are not the true Apostles and Prophets whatever they say They say This is no Mystery of deceit as we say of it but a Mystery that hath discovered our deceits who know not the seed of the Kingdom nor the power wherein it rises Reply Yes yes this is the Mystery of deceit the strong delusion long since prophesied of that men should be given over to for not receiving the love of the Truth that they might be saved But counting the Preaching of the crosse foolishnesse as in truth this people do and that makes them turn it into a fable or Allegory but we know the end of these men and them that follow them wilfully and pertinaciously too as the Apostle hath foretold For this cause God shall send them strong delusions to believe aly and they believe it indeed that will deny the True Christ and his sufferings and Sacrifice and Gospel for it and run into hazards and sufferings like mad men to promote it that they might be all damned that have not believed the Truth as indeed these heartily have not for had they they would not easily have entertained such deceits and fancies but have pleasure in unrighteousnesse c. 2 Thes 2. 10 11 12. Wo wo to this people and their followers for however they are entered in for this condemnation or contention their damnation slumbereth not Flee from their tents and Teachings their deceits and underhand denyals of the only Lord God and the Lord Jesus Christ that bought them all yea that would escape utter ruine and destruction for here we have the Spirit that confesseth not Christ come in the flesh but making him the figure of a Spirituall wickednesse or Mysterious deceit that works in them that perish For even in that clause last mentioned by them too the seed of the Kingdom is made all one with the Son of man that sows it for both are Christ with them but they ask Have we never known what Christ is without the Camp Surely we know he is a reproach and scorn to such as these are that are not of the Camp of Israel and thither must we follow him bearing his reproach for owning and acknowledging his simplicity But they say That before we who are neglecters of Christ and abusers of his Truth can know the seed of God and what it is in us we must come to the Light which will condemn us for our deceits and lyes wherewith we have abused the Truth and then learn to know what and where the grave is which Christ hath made with the wicked Reply Their reproach we shall bear and shew their evil in it by and by but this we say That by the light that reproves and condemns all neglects and abuses of Truth in us or them we are helped to see the Mystery of their deceits and Spiritual wickednesses in Heavenly things and how they turn his words of truth into a lie not only neglecting but wholly trampling the true Christ under their feet that they might make way for and introduce their own fancies Toward the end of our discourse turning our speech to the people we desired them to take heed of these men as a heavie judgement of God that he hath ordered to us joyning ourselves therein with the people as part of the National Body as the Apostles and Prophets use to do to punish us for our neglect of Christ the Salvation of God and abuse of his Truth And here they think they have gotten a great advantage and their mouths are exceedingly open upon us wresting our words and loading us with reproaches twitting us over and over that we are neglecters of Christ and abusers of Gods Truth by our own confession blessed be God that we are counted worthy to suffer reproach for his Names sake for that 's the thing they are mad at us for though they take occasion from our confession of our own and the peoples sins therein shewing themselves the right brood of evil doers such as David of old grappled with in his age as in Psal 38. 17 18 19. For I am ready to halt said David and my sorrow is continually before me For I said I will declare mine iniquity I will be sorry for my sins but mine enemies are lively as if they had no sin to own and confess or were none of the body of the people that had deserved judgement and they are strong in their delusion and confidence in evil and they that hate me wrongfully are multiplyed so these men thus triumph W. and F. Here have yee made manifest your selves indeed ye Hypocrites what have ye been crying out against the Quakers calling them deceivers warning the people to beware of them writing against them and judging them to be in delusion and errours when you your selves neglect Christ the salvation of God and have long abused the truth as ye are made to confesse consider your own condition you are in great delusion and errour your selves who neglect Christ c. and ye are not like to bring people nor can to Christ the Salvation of God and his Truth who are neglecters of Christ and abusers of his Truth c. Reply To which we say 1. They wrest our sayings as if we spake only of our selves when we speak evidently of the Nation in generall and of our selves as part of them as having our share also too much in their pollutions And is it not evident that the Nation is too full of neglect of Christ and abuse of his Truth nor do we exempt our selves from all faultinesse therein Even as the Prophets of old joyned in themselves with the people whose sins they confessed as knowing should the Lord have been severe to mark their iniquities they could not have stood Therefore they said not as the Hypocrites stand apart we be holier then you as those do that are a smoak in Gods nostrils a fire that burneth all the day Isa 65. 5. For 2. The Hypocrites be those that spy moats in their brothers eye but see not the beam in their own that justifie themselves before men and
their deceits into light that people might be warned of them and so avoid them To their foolish Questions in their Post-script we say First That they begin their questions with a falshood for we are not called Moorians or Manifestarians that we know of nor are so for we call no man our Father or Master after that forbidden manner nor own we any such callings as they do that own themselves Calvinists Lutherans c. nor are we Authors of what they say we hold forth in either the first or second branch of it The first is Pauls flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God nor can corruption inherit incorruption And as to the second that flesh and bones may We say not that flesh and bones as natural in natural bodies may we say that that Body of Christ which had Flesh and Bones after the Resurrection of it is taken up into heaven and is in heaven and the Scripture is clear for it Luke 24. 39 40. 51 52. what change or transmutation further it had in its ascension and Glory we know not but we believe that as the Apostles see him taken up into Heaven and they see him taken up in that Body in which was Flesh and Bones so he shall come again in like manner Acts 1. 11. their reproaching us for that faith shall not drive us from it because they are none of the True Apostles and Prophets nor if they were might we give credit to them bringing a contrary Doctrine to what we have from the Holy Apostles received Gal. 1. 8 9. Quest. 1. THey ask if Eliahs flesh and bones could enter into Gods Kingdom when he was taken up and if his blood could not Then when where and how and by whom was his blood taken and separated from his flesh and bones and what is become of it Ans Secret things belong to God things revealed to us and to our children that we might believe and do them Whether Eliahs body is in Heaven or in what form or manner we neither read it nor can determin nor they neither Quest 2. And what is it that hinders the blood that it cannot enter the Kingdom as well as the flesh and bones which ye say may is the transgression of the blood greater then the transgression of the flesh and bones And shall the flesh and bones be redeemed from corruption and shall not the blood What is the cause For though the Lord doth what he pleaseth yet doth he do any thing without a cause Ans These are prophane Scoffs and Reproaches against Gods Truths that the body which is sown a natural body shall be raised a spiritual body after the pattern of Christ who is the first fruits of them that sleep we believe and that the Body of Christ raised had Flesh and bones in it we read and believe also and that flesh and blood shall not inherit the Kingdom of God we believe too but prophane and vain bablings we are to shun which will increase to more ungodlinesse and eat like a Canker especially the Word and Doctrine of such as Hymeneus and Philetus who erred concerning the Truth and said the Resurrection is past or made already and that 's these mens error as above shewed when they said The coming of Christ spoken of 1 Thes 4. 15 16. in which the dead are to be raised was while the Apostles believers lived and remained Therefore these words and prophane bablings of theirs we and all people are to avoid being wise to sobriety knowing that God hath no cause higher then himself and his own good pleasure in what he doth and that he gives not an account of all his matters and what he keeps secret is not for us to search Quest 3 Whether do you own that Doctrine that when Christ appeared amongst his Disciples after his Resurrection when the doors were shut John 29. 19. that then his body being spiritualized it glided in at the key-hole of the door Which Doctrine Thomas Moore Senior hath formerly preaobed as some hath affirmed who heard him Answ No but we owne that this is a slander raised maliciously against Thomas Moor Senior either of their own heads or by some that render him evil for good and hatred for his love to whom appertains and upon whom will fall Judas his curse and portion if they repent not mentioned Psal 109. 5 6 7. c. Quest 4. And where do the Scriptures say that flesh and bones may inherit the Kingdom Heaven Answ Where do we say so or in any tearms but what the Scriptures own The Scriptures say Christ shall so come even in like manner as his Disciples see him go up and he was taken up in that Body in which was flesh and bones as before which Body is now his Glorious Body further we affirm not or inquire not Quest 5. And whereas you John Horn and Thomas Moor in page 16. say That Sathan doubtlesse may reprove of some sins and presse to some duties now have you not herein shewed your selves to be ministers of Sathan and not of Christ c Answ No no more then Paul was in saying Satan himself is transformed into an Angel of light 2 Cor. 11. 13 14. sure an Angel of light will reprove of sin and presse to duty and if Satan do not so as to form or outside at least he is not in the form of an Angel of Light Whereas they ask further What duties or any things that are duties doth Satan press men to bidding us answer directly or let shame cover our faces which they say will at length come upon us for our deceits We answer To such duties as in which his Ministers may be transformed into Ministers of Righteousnesse which they could not be if not Zealous for some things that are in their place and order in duties 2 Cor. 11. 14. as to be diligent to go up and down and preach Righteous Works or VVorks of Righteousnesse together with their own evil mixtures and to evil unrighteous ends that he might by drawing them from gross evils as the Pharisees their Proselites from Heathenism and gross idolatry make them more Children of hell by spiritual iniquity and wickedness and so more serviceable to his designs and so he presses the Quakers to reprove many fins and evils which indeed is a duty ought to be done in Gods way but as they do it they serve Sathan in it making it a means to beguile unstable souls to their delusion The Lord stop their mouths as he hath promised in Psal 63. 11. A multitude of Questions under 26. Heads sent by George Whitehead and since owned by him and by John Whitehead and George Fox the younger as sent by them all to John Horn and Thomas Moor junior for this they say in their pretended Answer to us subscribed by all the three that they sent queries in Manuscript to John Horn and Thomas Moor see the latter end of their 33. page meaning these they
and 16. 31 32 33. Ephes 3. 6. 9. The truth of which they was also before instructed to witnesse as in this their following Ministrations even in receiving the little Children or Infants that were brought to them in his Name as the price of his Blood and subjects of the gracious Kingdom of God brought to us by him Mark 9. 37. and 10. 13 14. with Luke 18. 15 16. Yet had not they the Light of the knowledge of God in their hearts or capacity to understand or perceive the shinings forth of it in the Face of Christ so that Light and capacity to such understanding in every of them to whom their Preaching came or witnesse reached nor in the real being of the thing witnessed otherwise then by Faith in any But further he faith 2. That as by the Gospels being Preached in Creatures may be meant its being witnessed in by and through them to others so as by Gods making use of them to man-ward as witnesses for him and of him and his things to men in such a sence he grants and asserts that the Gospel is Preached by God through Christ in every Creature under Heaven without exception even in all his works of Creation and Providence as Rom. 1. 20. For so the Gospel of the Grace of God which is his Glory to man-ward is declared and shewed forth to men that it may be seen and understood by them in and by the things that are made and preserved for them and to them by and through Christ as the Heavens the Firmament the Sun Moon and Stars Psal 19. 1. 6. and Psal 8. Yea all his works in and over all which his Mercy and Truth to man-ward is witnessed Psal 145. 9 10. 15. and Psal 136. and 148. His preserving man and other Creatures for his use and so his giving Rain from Heaven and fruitful seasons c His patience and bounty to sinners yea his forbearance and long suffering to rebellious sinners Psal 36. 5 6. and 68. 18 19 20. Acts 14. 16 17. Mat. 5. 45. with Luke 6. 35. Rom. 2. 4. 2 Pet. 3. 9. 15. Though of men his Saints do onely truly blesse him with the Mouth or Tongue and from the Heart where the understanding and knowledge of his Goodnesse is received and precious Yet also all his works do and more Gloriously shall praise him he never left himself without witnesse in them to make known to the Sons of men his mighty Acts and the Glorious Majesty of his Kingdom Yea so wonderful is he in working he knows how to make the wrath of man which of it self works not the Righteousnesse of God yet turn to his Praise But what is this to their purpose What makes this for proving such Spiritual Light as aforesaid in every man more then in every beast or plant Do these men suppose that every thing that may be a witnesse for God unto men hath the understanding of the witnesse they bear or of the thing witnessed or Light and capacity to such understanding in them Surely when God opened the mouth of an Asse she spake more truly and to purpose then these men Yet who will say she had in her the understanding of the warning and reproof God gave to Balaam therein or light and capacity thereto Numb 22. 28. 30. Or that the Pillar of the Stones Gen. 31. 45. 48. 52. had in them the understanding or light of the Covenant of which they were a witnesse or that all the things that are made as the Sun shinning the Rain falling c. have the light or understanding in them of the things witnessed in them to man-ward and that may be clearly seen and understood by them Doubtlesse they are brutish that would so infer But it is no strange thing for men that have no Faith in Christ but are void of Judgement concerning that to be also unreasonable or absurd 2 Thes 3. 2. Nor for such as are seeking after and professing to be wise in themselves to become most foolish Rom. 1. 22 23. 1 Cor. 1. 22 23. Thus have we answered in simplicity and plainnesse and not with hidden things of dishonesty but by a plain manifestation of the Truth in the words of Truth have declared our mind and meaning in our words That others when they read may understand our knowledge in the mysteries of Christ According to our measure as 2 Cor. 1. 2 13. 2. 17. 4. 1 2. Ephs 3. 4. And have been the larger for the helpfulnesse of such as will read and consider our Answers Desiring them to search the Scriptures whether these things be so And so far as any in reading and by searching and comparing the Scriptures may be helped to understand the things that we have written to be contained in and confirmed by the words of Truth let them so receive them as the Word of God and not of man And if in any thing they find we speak not according to that word let them refuse it and shew us in love by evidence of Scripture our mistake and we shall thankfully accept it for we dare not make our selves of the number or compare our selves with some that commend themselves c. See 2 Cor. 10. 12 13. for not he that commendeth himself but whom the Lord commendeth is approved verse 18. But let none be either over-hasty to believe every word before he find it contained and confirmed in the words of our Lord Jesus and in the Doctrine which is according to godlinesse nor yet to speak evil of the things he knows not That is if he cannot yet see it to be according to that word already delivered in the Law and Testimony and yet neither can be thereby satisfied that it is not according to it or that the lip of knowledge is not in it let him suspend his judgement and still wait in the believing mindfulnesse of the great things in the Doctrine of Christ for further understanding for so its meet to be said unto God what I see not teach thou me Nor have we in our answers to these queries or in any of our dealings with these men walked according to any other Rule or done by them otherwise then we would that men should do by us That is we have not declared and protested against any of their corrupt principles as evil and Antichristian further then we have been fully assured by the word of God that they are such as may be seen by our shewing them thereby to be such for so such instructions as have not the lip of knowledge in them but do cause to erre from the words of knowledge they may be by the light of the Lord known and discerned to be such and as such to be avoyded though the depths of Satan in them what their lip is and whitherto it tends their wayes being moveable and their Depths in the bottomlesse pit we cannot know them Pro. 5. 6. And therefore it is not our work to search or enquire into them Rev. 2. 24. 25. But in the holding fast that which we have heard from the beginning of the word of the beginning of Christ So soon as ever we perceive and know by the light thereof that the lip of knowledge is not in any Doctrine or spirit that comes to us That it lifts not up the Son of man by taking of his things and shewing them but tends to render him undesirable in what he hath done is doing and will do and to withdraw from the words of knowledge we are then presently to depart from such to cease to hear them and let them be to us as an accursed thing not further to be considered or pondered by us and so to warn others of them for with good words and fair speeches even such may easily deceive the hearts of the simple that in confidence of their own strength and out of an unstable mind and itching ear will be often tempting God and trying and pondering their moveable paths after they have perceived that the lip of knowledge is not in them but the Preaching of the personal sufferings of Christ foolishnesse to them We have therefore left this for an instruction and warning to others that the Truth of the Gospel may remain with believers and that such as are Ignorant and out of the way may be recovered And further we desire of the Reader if ever he see any reply to this of ours he would distinctly observe if they pervert not or alter our sayings by taking them in pieces and changing expressions to marr the sence if also they give not a go-by to the matters of the greatest weight and importance and onely lie at the catch to get some by-matters or words to strive snarle about which can tend to no profit but to the subverting the Reader from the things chiefly to be minded And in observance of this caution we doubt not but the Reader will be satisfied even from themselves concerning their Antichristian spirit without our adding any more by way of return to theirs Which though we will not bind our selves from yet we do not resolve to do though they should give us occasion by such sorry shifts and pretended answers as hitherto they have returned As for their slanders and revilings that follow we weigh them not but commit our selves to him that judgeth Righteously who will at that his second coming which they scoff at when He the Son of man shall appear in his Glory make their folly manifest to all men and bring to light the hidden things of darknesse Then it shall fully appear who have walked in craftinesse Pride Hypocrisie and hidden things of dishonesty in the mean time we are during his good pleasure in his Name and strength his witnesses against it all JOHN HORN THOMAS MOOR Senior THOMAS MOOR Junior FINIS