of the doubts which may arise in many consciencious men who have been ordained by Bishops since that time which may seem to be likewise declared voyde by this Bill and so at least to discountenance all Acts which have insued by vertue of that Ordination and thereby many Questions may arise in Law concerning Marriages Legitimations and Descents of Inheritance and for many other reasons exprest in our Conference and Debate We conceive that your Lordships may be satisfied that this individuall Bill ought not to passe For the matter then of the said Bill The extirpation of Episcopacy we desire your Lordships to consider That it is evident and we conceive consented to on all parts that it hath continued even from the Apostles times by continuall Succession in the Church of Christ till within these few yeares without intermission or interruption and then how perilous a thing it must be and prejudiciall to the publique peace to remove and destroy a forme of Government so long exercised in this Kingdomâ—â—nd under which we have enjoyed as great a measure of happinesse to say no more as any Nation in Christendome and which your Lordships have not pretended to be unlawfull before wee particularly see the Modell of that Governement and Iurisdiction which is to be established in the place thereof That thereby we may be assured that it be such to which as well those who like as all those who dislike the present Governement will submit Otherwise Peace which is the maine end and pretence for Alterations cannot be established and therefore we very earnestly beseech your Lordships to consider and weigh whether without shaking Foundations it be not much better and more agreeable to Christian Prudence and Charity to remove those particulars from â—he present Government and make such alterations therein as may most probably give satisfaction to all persons seriously disturbed or afflicted in their Consciences Then by destroying the whole to give just Offence and Scandall to very many pious and Religious Persons Vnder these Considerations and for the Vniting and reconciling all Differences between Vs in the matter of Religion and procuring a blessed Peace We are willing That Freedome be left to all Persons of what Opinions soever in matters of Ceremony and that all the penalties of the Lawes and Customes which injoyne those Ceremonies be suspended That the Bishop shall exercise no Act of Iurisdiction or Ordination without the consent and counsell of the Presbyters who shall be chosen by the Clergy of each Diocesse out of the learnedest and gravest Ministers of that Diocesse That the Bishop keep his constant residence in his Diocesse except when he shall be required by His Majesty to attend Him on any occasion and that if he be not hindred by the infirmities of old Age or sicknesse he Preach every Sunday in some Church within his Diocesse That the Ordination of Ministers shall be alwayes in a publique and solemne manner and very strict Rules observed concerning the sufficiency and other Qualifications of those men who shall be received into Holy Orders and the Bishop shall not receive any into Holy Orders without the approbation and consent of the Presbyters or the Major part of them That competent maintenance and provision be established by Act of Parliament to such Vicarages as belong to Bishops Deanes and Chapters out of the Impropriations and according to the value of those Impropriations of the severall Parishes That for the time to come no man shall be capable of two Parsonages or Vicarages with Cure of Soules That towards the setling of the publique Peace one hundred Thousand pounds shall be raised by Act of Parliament out of the Estates of Bishops Deanes and Chapters in such manner as shall be thought fit by the King and two Houses of Parliament without the Alienation of any of the said Lands That the Iurisâ—iction in Causes Testamentary Decimall Matrimoniall be setled in such manner as shall seem most convenient by the King and two Houses of Parliament And likewise that one or more Acts of Parliament be passed for regulating of Visitations and against immoderate Fees in Ecclesiasticall Courts and the aâ—uses by frivolous Excommunications and all other abuses in the Exercise of Ecclesiasticall Iurisdiction in such manner as shall be agreed upon by His Majesty and both Houses of Parliament And if your Lordships shall insist upon any other thing which your Lordships shall think necessary for Reformation We shall very willingly apply our selves to the consideration thereof 13. February FOr the confirmation of the Ordinances concerning the LVII calling and sitting of the Assembly of Divines and the taking the Covenant We conceive neither of them need be insisted on if the alterations of Church-Government be agreed upon between Vs And if it be not it will not be reasonable that We consent to those Ordinances And for the Covenant We cannot advise His Majesty to Sweare and signe the same nor consent that an Act of Parliament should passe for enjoyning the taking thereof by His Majesties Subjects 13. February WEE doe not yet conceive that the Directory for LVIII publicke Worship delivered to Vs by your Lordships ought to be enacted Or that it is so likely to procure and preserve the Peace of this Kingdome as the Liturgy or Common Prayer-Book already established by Law against which we have not yet received from your Lordships any objections which Liturgy as the same was compiled by many learned and Reverend Divines of whom some dyed Martyrs for the Protestant Religion We conceive to be an Excellent Forme for the Worship of God and hath been generally so held throughout this Kingdome till within these two or three yeares at the most And therefore since there are no inconveniences pretended to arise from the Book of Common-Prayer to which we conceive the Directory is not more liable and since there is nothing commendable in the Directory which is not already in the Book of Common-Prayer we conceive it much better and more conducing to the Peace of this Kingdome still to observe the said Forme with such Dispensations as we have expressed in our first Paper now presented to your Lordships and if there shall be any Alterations proposed by your Lordships of such particulars in the Book of Common-Prayer as good men are scrupled at we shall willingly endeavour to give your Lordships satisfaction in those particulars But as yet can make no further or other Answer then we have already done But shall be ready to receive such Objections as your Lordships shall think fit to make against the Book of Common-Prayer and your Reasons for introducing the Directory And for the Proposition concerning Church-Government annexed to your first Paper We have no Information how that Government shall be constituted in particular or what Iurisdiction shall be established or by whom it shall be granted or upon whom it shall depend And therein also we desire further Information from your Lordships 13. February WEE
the great and imminent danger of the true Protestant Religion in regard of the great Forces of Papists Prelates Malignants their Adherents raised imployed against the constant Professors thereof in England and Ireland thought fit to send their Commissioners unto the Kingdom of Scotland to Treat with the Convention of Estates generall Assembly there concerning such things as might tend to the preservation of Religion the mutuall good of both Nations And to that end to desire a more neere and strict union betwixt the Kingdoms And the Assistance of the Kingdom of Scotland by a considerable strength to be raised and sent by them into the Kingdom of England And whereas upon a consultation held betwixt the Commissioners of the Parliament of England the Committees of the Convention of Estates and Generall Assembly No meanes was thought so expedient to Accomplish and strengthen the Vnion as for both Nationâ— to enter into a Solemne League and Covenant and a forme thereof drawn and presented to the two Houses of Parliament of England the Convention of Estates and Generall Assembly of Scotland which hath accordingly been done and received their respective Approbation And whereas the particulars concerning the Assistance desired by the two Houses of the Parliament of England from their Brethren of Scotland were delivered in by the English Commissioners August the 19. to the Convention of Estates who did thereupon give power to their Committee to consider and debate further with the English Commissioners of what other Propositions might be added or concluded Whereby the assistance desired might be made more effectuall and beneficiall And in pursuance thereof these Propositions following were considered of and debated by the Committee and Commissioners aforesaid To be certified with all convenient speed to the two Houses of the Parliament of England and the Convention of Estates of Scotland by their respective Committees and Commissioners to be respectively taken into their consideration and proceeded with as they should finde cause Which being accordingly done and these ensuing Propositions approved agreed and concluded of by the Houses of the Parliament of England and the Committee of the Estates of Scotland respectively and power by them given to their respective Committees and Commissioners formerly to agree and conclude the same as may appeare by the Votes of both Houses dated the first of November and the Order of the Committee bearing date the 17th of November Wee the said Commissioners and Committees according to their Votes and Orders do formally conclude and agree upon these Articles following And in confirmation thereof doe mutually subscribe the same 1. It is agreed and concluded that the Covenant represented to the Convention of Estates and Generall Assembly of Scotland and sent to both Houses of the Parliament of England in the same forme as it is now returned from the two Houses of the Parliament of England to their Brethren of Scotland and allowed by the Committee of Estates and Commissioners of the Generall Assembly be sworne and subscribed by both Kingdomes as a most neer Tye and Conjunction between them for their mutuall defence against the Papists and Prelaticall Faction and their adherents in both Kingdomes and for pursuance of the ends expressed in the said Covenant 2. That an Army to this purpose shall be Levyed forthwith consisting of Eighteen Thousand Foot effective and two Thousand Horse and one Thousand Dragooners effective with a suteable Traine of Artillery To be ready at some Generall Rendezvous neer the Borders of England to March into England for the purposes aforesaid withall convenient speed The said Foot and Horse to be well and compleatly Armed and provided with Victualls and Pay for Forty daies And the said Trayne of Artillery to be fitted in all points ready to March 3. That the Army be commanded by a Generall appoynted by the Estates of Scotland and subject to such Resolutions and directions as are and shall be agreed and concluded on mutually between the two Kingdoms or by Committees appoynted by them in that behalfe for pursuance of the ends above mentioned 4. That the Charge of Levying Arming and bringing the said Forces together Furnished as also the fitting the Traine of Artillery in readinesse to March be computed and set owne according to the same Rates as if the Kingdom of Scotland were to raise the said Army for themselves and their own Affaires All which for the present is to be done by the Kingdom of Scotland upon Accompt And the Accompt to be delivered to the Commissioners of the Kingdom of England and when the Peace of the two Kingdoms is setled the same to be repaid or satisfied to the Kingdom of Scotland 5. That this Army be likewise paid as if the Kingdom of Scotland were to imploy the same for their own occasions and toward the defreying thereof it not amounting to the full months pay shall be Monthly allowed paid the summe of thirty thousand pounds sterling by the Parliament of England out of the Estates and Revenues of the Papists Prelats Malignants and their Adherents or otherwise And in case the said Thirty thousand pounds Monthly or any part thereof be not paid at the time when it shall become due and payable The Kingdom of England shall give the Publique Faith for the paying of the remainder unpaid with all possible speed Allowing the rate of eight pounds per centum for the time of the performance thereof And in case that notwithstanding the said Monthly summe of Thirty Thousand pounds paid as aforesaid the States and Kingdom of Scotland shall have just cause to demand furthar satisfaction of their Brethren of England when the Peace of both Kingdoms is setled for the pains hazard and charges they have undergone in the same They shall by way of brotherly assistance have due recompence made unto them by the Kingdom of England And that out of such Lands and Estates of the Papists Prelats Malignants and their Adherents as the two Houses of the Parliament of England shall think fit And for the assurance thereof the Publique Faith of the Kingdom of England shall be given them 6. And to th' end the said Army in manner aforesaid may be enabled and prepared to march The Kingdom of England is to pay in ready money to their Bâ—ethren of Scotland or such as shall have power from the Estates of that Kingdom the summe of one hundred thousand Pounds sterling at Leith or Edenburgh with all convenient speed by way of advance before hand which is to be discounted back againe unto the Kingdom of England by the Kingdom of Scotland upon the first Monthly allowance which shall grow due to the Scottish Aâ—my from the time they shall make their first entrance into the Kingâ—â—m of England 7. That the Kingdom of Scotland to manifest their willingnesse to their utmost ability to be helpfull to their Brethren of England in this common Cause will give the Publique Faith of the Kingdom of Scotland to be
the performance and observation of all Articles which shall be agreed upon between us in order to a blessed Peace which we are so desirous may be punctually exactly observed That we are willing that His Maiesty be desired to take a most solemne strict Oath for the full observation thereof And likewise that all persons of any immediate trust by office or attendance on His Maiesty and any other whom you shall think fit shall take such Oath for the due observance of the same with such reasonable penalties as shall be proposed by your Lordships and agreed to by us in which we beleive we shall not differ with your Lordships being willing that whosoever shall in the least degree infringe the agreement which shall be made between us may be looked upon and accounted as most pernicious enemies to King and Kingdomes And if it shall be thought necessary to make any additionall settlement of the Militia with a generall reference to the good of the Kingdomes respectively we desire the same may be done after the Peace established by the joynt consent of His Majesty and the two Houses of Parliament in England and His Majesty and the Estates of the Parliament of Scotland respectively And as we shall desire and endeavour to remove all occasions that may interrupt the Peace and Tranquillity of that Kingdom and a perfect amity with them and shall not desire any change off or to intermeddle in their Lawes or Government or give them cause to apprehend any disturbance or violation of them from this Kingdome so are we obliged with all tendernesse to preserve the Honour Dignity and Constitution of this Realme And therefore as we are yet satisfied we cannot consent that any persons authorized by the Estates of the Parliament of Scotland or any advice from thence shall have any influence upon the Militia of this Kingdome or further interpose in the affaires of this Kingdom then is already provided by the Act of Pacification And we offer to your Lordships considerations whether unlesse there could be an union of the Lawes of both Kingdoms such a mixture of power as is now proposed and the influence thereof both upon Martiall and Civill affaires may not prove very inconvenient and prejudiciall to both Kingdoms and give cause of Iealousies to each other to the disturbance of that mutuall Amity so much desired But if this intermingling of power in both Kingdoms shall be further insisted on by your Lordships we propound that the same may be setled as after a Peace established shall be agreed by the joynt consent of His Majestie and both Houses of Parliament of England and of His Majesty and the Estates of the Parliament of Scotland and if your Lordships shall insist on any thing further for necessary security we shall apply our selves to the consideration thereof if we shall have further time so to do according to our desires grounded upon His Majesties Letter Their Paper 17. Febr. WE do conceive that we have in our former Papers punctually CXXIX satisfied your Lordships in all you desired to know concerning the Powers of the Commissioners of both Kingdoms and the other particulars mentioned by your Lordships and what your Lordships now offer concerning the Militia of the Kingdome of Scotland that the like course shalt be taken in it as is expressed in your Lordships Paper of the 6th of Feb. to be observed for the Militia of this Kingdom your Lordships may remember that in our answer to that paper we told your Lordships it was differing from what we had proposed and unsatisfactory to our just and necessary desires for securing the Peace of the Kingdoms and it cannot be expected that what was so then for the Kingdome of England should now be thought other for the Kingdom of Scotland And though both Kingdoms be now united in the same cause and labouring under the same dangers and therefore necessitated to a mutuall and reciprocall assistance of each other had proposed a joynt remedy and security by that Commission desired in our 17th Proposition we find your Lordships say that as yet you are satisfied you cannot consent unto it to which we answer that we believed we had given your Lordships such convincing reasons as might have satisfied you and we doubt not but they may if you will recollect your memoryes concerning them and rightly weigh them This being the last day we are to Treat upon this subject it cannot be expected and as we conceive it is altogether needlesse to use any more Arguments we do therefore desire your Lordships will be pleased now at the last to give us your full and positive answer to our demands as we have often already pressed your Lordships And where as your Lordships do propound that if we shall further insist upon the uniting of the powers of both Kingdoms it may be done after the Peace establisht we desire your Lordships to consider that it is demanded by us in order to a Peace and a chiefe and most necessary meanes for the attaining and establishment of it And we further observe that your Lordships have given us no answer at all to our 15 Proposition which we do likewise insist upon and defire your answer The King's Commissioners Answer 17. February IF your Lordships had punctually or in any degree satisfied CXXX us in what we desired to know concerning the powers of the Commissioners of both Kingdoms the other particulars mentioned by us we had not troubled your Lordships with so many questions to most of which we could receive no other Answers then the referring us to the Propositions themselves upon which we grounded our questions And we concâ—ive that your Lordships Propositions upon the Militia upon which you still insist have in â—ruth appeared upon debate to be most unreasonable in many particulars as that the persons to be entrusted with the Militia should be nominated onely by the two Houses and that His Majesty who is equally to be secured that the Peace should not be broken should name none That the power given to the Commissioners shall be framed and altered as occasion serves by the two Houses onely And that His Majesty who is so much concerned therein shall have no Negative Voyce as to such powers but is absolutely excluded and that the time should be unlimited So that His Majesty for himselfe and his Posterity should for ever part with their peculiar Regall power of being able to resist their Enemies or protect their good Subjects and with that undoubted and never denyed Right of the Crowne to make Warre and Peace And in no time to come His Majesty or His Posterity should have power to assist their Allies with any supplies of Men though Volunteers or ever more to have any Iurisdiction ovâ—r their owne Navy or Fleet at Sea and so consequently must loose all estimation and confidence with Forraigne Princes And many other expressions in the said Propositions doe either signifie what we find
of those who agreed unto them did not at first apprehend They say They marvaile why it should be insisted on that the Commissioners for the Militia should not be nominated by the two Houses onely and that we who were to be equally secured should name * These are their words but seem to be mistaken for our Commâ—ssioners alwayes insisted We should name some of them none since this power was not to be exercised till a Peace concluded upon the Treaty and then we had been secured by the Lawes of the Kingdome and by the duties and affections of Our Subjects We think it farre more matter of wonder since it is confessed that We and such Our Loyall Subjects who have faithfully and constantly adhered to Vs were equally to be secured that they would allow Vs no security at all but to put Our Selves wholly upon them who even afterwards in this paper deny Our Iust Power of the Militia and of making Peace and Warre and might with much more colour hereafter doe so if by Our Consent that power should be once though for a time onely put wholly into their hands It is true the Lawes of the Land and the hearts of the people are the best security for a Prince that he shall enjoy what belongs to Him But it is as tâ—ue that the Lawes of the Land and the Love of the Prince towards His People are likewise their best security that they shall enjoy what belongeth to them It is a mutuall confidence each in other that secures both But this is to be understood in calme and quiet times the present distempers have bred mutuall Iealousies and if they think it not at this time reasonable wholly to trust the Lawes and Vs concerning their security but â—equire the power of the Militia in which they have no Right much lesse is it reasonable that We should wholly trust them concerning Our security who avowedly beare Armes against Vs but if for the love of Peace We are content for a time to part with this great Power which is our knowne Right it is reasonable that We should have the nominating of some of those who should be trusted with it yet on Our part We were well content to repose Our Selves in that security they mention if the two Houses would likewise have relyed upon the same security of the Lawes and affections of the people to which they so much pretend But though it was offered that We should returne to Our two Houses whereby all Armies See Our Commissioners Paper touching Our Returne to the two Houses after Disbanding of Armies no. 191. being Disbanded both they and We might have been restored to the Lawes and guarded by â—hose affections of the people yet that was not admitted They say This power of the Militia was not to be exercised till after a Peace but they doe not remember it is to be agreed on before a Peace and proposed in order to a peace and We might with as much reason and far more Iustice in respect of Our undoubted Right over the Militia of this Kingdom have insisted upon the sole nomination of the Commissioners because their power was not to be exercised till a Peace concluded as they for that cause to have excluded Vs from the nomination of an equall number assumed that power wholly to themselves not affording Vs so much as the Liberty to except against any of them And whereas they say these Commissioners for the Militia have a rule prescribed and being removeable and lyable for any miscarriage to a severe punishment cannot doe any thing to Our prejudice contrary to the trust reposed in them If they had such a Rule which yet by their Propositions and papers We cannot find having by generall and indefinite termes an unlimited power given to them it proves they should not not that they would not breake it He that hath power as these Commissioners would have the greatest that ever Subjects had and will to abuse that power may extend and interpret the Rule prescribed Him as He shall please himselfe and therefore since out of Our ardent desire of Peace We were content to part with this power We had reason to râ—quire that at least some of those who should execute it might be such whom We Our Selves should nominate and could trust For that which is said that if the Commissioners had bin severally chosen the memory of these unnaturall divisions must needs have bin continued and probably being seuerally named they would have acted dividedly according to severall interests and the Warr thereby might be more easily revived It is apparent the memory of the Warre must as much continue where any Commissioners are named at all as where they are named by either party since by putting that power into their hands it is put out of the proper Channell but it is not the memory of a past Warre that is dangerous but such a Remembrance of it as is joyned with a desire or inclination to revive it And if it were probable as is alleadged that if the Commissioners were partly chosen by Vs and partly by them that being severally named they would have acted dividedly according to severall Interests it would be much more probable that being wholly named by them they would have acted only according to their Interest and so on Our part instead of an equall security we must have bin contented with what Lawes and conditions they would have imposed But We shall againe remember that the offer on Our part was to name such against whom there No. 130. could be no just exception if the Persons were named equally betwixt us It was likewise offered That those Commissioners should take an Oath for the true discharge of their trust that We Our Selves were willing to take an Oath to observe the Articles of the Treaty and that all Persons of any immediate trust by offices or attendance upon Vs and all others whom they should nominate should take the like Oath and with such penalties that whosoever should infringe the agreement should be accounted most pernitious enemies to us the Kingdoms And if this way of mutuall nomination were not approved there was another proposed that the Persons should be nominated between our Commissioners and theirs by whose mutuall consent it might well have been hoped such persons might have been named in whom we and they might have confided but to this no answer 〈◊〉 been vouchsafed nor could any thing satisfy concerning the Miâ—â—tia unlesse without knowing who the persons were who should be entrusted we should with an implicite Faith in Persons whâ—m we did not know put that power into their hands They say that though by their Propositions the Commissioners No. 131. were to continue without any limitation of time yet they have since proposed a time of seaven years We know not that they have during the whole Treaty in any one particular receded from insisting on their demands as they are set
downe in their Propositions in terminis And in this poynt though they seem to reduce the time which in their Propositions was indefinite to a certainty to which yet the Scottish Commissioners See no. 132. have not absolutely agreed the alteration is more in shew then indeed and rather to the heightning then abateing their demands for whereas they have limited the time to seaven years yet it is with an additionall clause That after those seven years it was to be executed as We and they should agree and not otherwise so that though the Commissioners should have the power but for seaven years yet we should not have it after those seaven years nor at any time unlesse they and we could agree in it so much would they have gained by this seeming compliance in poynt of limitation of this power to a time though not to that time of three years which we proposed But they justify the reasonablenesse of it for whereas our Commissioners in their Paper to which this of theirs is applied as No. 130. an answer tell them that if the time for this power be unlimited we and our posterity shall for ever part with our peculiar Regall power of being able to resist our Enemies or protect our good Subjects and with that undoubted and never denyed right of the Crowne to make Warre and Peace or ever more to have jurisdiction over our own Navy and Fleet at Sea the command thereof being also a part of this great power to be given to these Commissioners They answer plainly they cannot admit of this peculiar Regall Power which Our Commissioners mention to reside in us concerning the Militia and to make Peace and Warre or that it is otherwise to be exercised then by authority from us and both Houses of Parliament of England and the Estates of the Parliament of Scotland respectively We approve of their ingenuity that now at the breaking off of the Treaty they tell us in plain tearmes what they meane though the Common Law-books and Records of Parliament have mentioned that the sole power of protecting the Subjects belongs to the King and that he alone hath power to make Peace and Warre though it hath been the language of former Parliaments even of the last Parliament and at the beginning of this Parliament that the power of Peace and Warre is in the King but if he will have money from His Subjects to maintain the Warres he must have their consents and though the universall consent and common opinion heretofore hath gone accordingly yet they cannot admit thereof as to have been our right for the answer is made to the assertion concerning our right And not admitting it it seems their oathes of Alleageance and Supremacy to defend our Crowne and Dignity and to assistand defend all Iurisdictions Priviledges and authorities belonging to us oblige them not And as they doe not admit this power in right to have been in us alone for the time past so neither will they admit it for the time to come in Vs or Our successors to be able to resist our Enemies or protect our Subjects or to make Peace or Warre but it must be by authority from Vs and the two Houses and the Estates of the Parliament of Scotland respectively They are to be associated in these Regall Powers and the Scepter and the Sword may in Pictures or Statues but are not indeed to be in the Kings hand alone Vpon these grounds We wonder not that they would have the Navy and Fleet at Sea to be put into the hands of their Commissioners for seaven years as the Militia for the Land and after the seaven years to be commanded in such manner as they and we should agree and not otherwise for they say the reasons are the same for them as for the Militia by land It is a principall meanes they say of their security and We cannot find they think themselves to have any security if We and Our Successors have any Power But if We will part with Our Power wholly unto them We and Our Posterity shall be fully secured by the aflections of Our Subjects that is by the Lords Commons now at Westminster who in their sense represent all the people who by themselves during the Parliament or when they shall please to make any recesses by their Commissioners during the intervalls will free us from the burden of the Militia and of Our Navy and so of protecting Our Subjects and will save Vs the Charge of Our Navy because it is to be principally maintained by the free guift of the Subject out of Tonnage and Poundage and other Impositions upon Merchandise And having taken this care for Our security sutable to all their Actions these three yeares last past They say that for security of those who have been with Vs in the Warre an Act of Oblivion is desired to be passed whereby all Our Subjects would have been put in one and the same condition and under the same protection with some exceptions mentioned in the Propositions We are not willing to mention those exceptions by which not onely most of Our best Subjects who have been with Vs in the Warre according to their duties by expresse or generall termes are excepted but all the Estates of some of them and a great part of the Estates of the rest of them for that very cause because they were with Vs in the Warre are to be forfeited As for securing them by an Act of Oblivion they have lesse cause to desire it then they who propose it as being more secured by the Conscience of doing their duties and the protection of the knowne common Law of the Land if it might take place then any protection under the two Houses or their Commissioners for the Militia yet We were not unwilling for the security of all Our Subjects to have assented to an Act of Oblivion being willing as much as in Vs lies to have made up these breaches and buryed the memory of these unhappy Divisions It was urged by our Commissioners that according to the literall sense of the Propositions in the powers given to the Commissioners for the Militia That Sheriffes and Justices of Peace and other legall Ministers could not raise the Posse Comitatus or Forces to suppresse Riots without being lyable to the interpretation of the Commissioners To this they answer That this is no part of the Militia to be exercised by the Commissioners but in executing of Justice and legall Processe nor can be intended to be any disturbance but for the preservation of the Peace We shall admit that to be their meaning but it being by the Propositions made Treason in any who shall leavy any Forces without authority or consent of the Commissioners to the disturbance of the publique Peace it is apparent that the Sheriffes or Iustices of Peace if they raise any Forces to suppresse any tumultuous Assembly which it is possible some of the Commissioners may countenance or
for executing of other legall Acts may not onely be lyable to the interpretation of being disturbers of the publique Peace but feele the punishment of it And whereas they say That the Power given by the Propositions to the Commissioners for the Militia of both Kingdomes as a joynt Committee for the hearing and determining Civill Actions and differences cannot be extended further then preservation of the Articles of the Peace to be made We conceive that a Court being thereby allowed to them for the hearing and determining of Civill matters for the preservation of the Articles of the Peace they may in order thereunto upon pretence it is for the preservation of the Peace entertaine and determine any cause or difference they please especially their power by the Propositions being not onely to preserve the Peace but to prevent the violation of the Articles of the Peace and having the power of the Sword in their hands and being not tyed up to any certain Law whereby to judge for ought appeares by their answers to the questions proposed by Our Commissioners and the common Law not being the rule in such case because part of them are to be of the Scottish Nation they may without controll exercise what arbitrary power they please And whereas it is insisted upon in this paper That an answer be given to the fifteenth Proposition which is that the Subjects be appointed to be Armed Trayned and Disciplined in such manner as both Houses shall think fit which Our Commissioners thought fit to have deferred till after the Peace established and then to be setled by Vs and the two Houses It is apparent that Proposition concerned not that which was desired as the end of their Propositions the security for the observation of the Articles and We conceive there is already sufficient provision made by the Law in such cases if there were not it were fit that that defect were supplied by Law not to be left at large as the two Houses should think fit without expressing the manner of it but to proceed by a Bill wherein we might see before we consented to it how Our Subjects should be charged we being as much concerned and sensible of the burden to be put upon Our Subjects as the two Houses can be who We are sure since they took upon them the authority of imposing upon their fellow Subjects without Vs have laid the heaviest Impositions that ever were And whereas they say the scope of these their Propositions touching the Militia was to take away occasions of future differences to prevent the raising of Armes and to settle a firme and durable Peace If we look upon the whole frame of their Militia as they have proposed it to us we cannot but conclude those Propositions to be most destructive to those ends For first they have proposed it to us as they have setled it already by their Ordinance That the whole Militia of â—reland as well of Our English Subjects as Scottish shall be Commanded by Lesley Earle of Leven their Scottish Generall and be managed by the joâ—nt advice of the Scottish and English Commissioners and therein the Scottish as well as the English to have a Negative Voyce and so by consequence subjecting the whole Government of that Kingdome to the manage of Our Scottish Subjects And having thus ordered the Militia of Ireland where they will be sure to keep Forces on Foot for that is another part of the Propositions That We shall Assent to whatsoever Acts shall be proposed for monyes for the Warre of Ireland which Forces shall be ready upon all occasions to serve them For the Militia and Navy of England that is likewise to be ordered and Commanded by these Commissioners and though We their Soveraigne are denyed to nominate any to be joynt Commissioners they are content to admit those of Scotland who though Our Subjects yet are strangers to their Government to a nomination of Scottish Commissioners to be joyned with them These Scottish Commissioners in matters wherein both Kingdomes are joyntly concerned and they may easily call and make what they will to be of joynt concernment are to have a Negative Voyce so that the English can doe nothing without them not so much as to raise Force to suppresse a Commotion or prevent an invasion if the Scottish Commissioners though not a third part of the number of the English say it is of joynt concernment And in matters solely concerning England the Scottish Commissioners to a third part of the whole number of the Commissioners are to reside in England and to Vote as single Persons These Commissioners as well Scottish as English as they have the sole power of the Forces by Sea and Land so they must have a Court in a Civill way to hear and determine whatsoever Civill action that shall tend to the preservation of the peace or whatsoever else is for the prevention of the violation of it within which generall words and in order thereunto they may comprehend any cause or thing they please And as these Commissioners as well Scottish as English are to name all Commanders and Officers in Our Forts and Ships so in the intervalls of Parliament lest there should be too much dependance upon us they are to name all the great Officers Iudges of both Our Kingdomes of England and Ireland To these so unreasonable Propositions wherein the Parliament and Subjects of Scotland would have so great an influence and power over the Kingdomes of England and Ireland if as reflecting meerly upon our selves and not entertaining such thoughts of our Scottish Subjects as perhaps some may by the danger of such a power we should have agreed as hoping that the good affections of our Subjects in Scotland might in time have restored us to that power which the two Houses of England would take away yet when we consider that we are in conscience obliged to maintaine the Rights of Our Crowne so farre as to be able to protect Our Subjects and what jealousies and heartburnings it might probably produce betwixt Our Subjects of the two Kingdomes what reluctancy all Our Subjects here may have when they shall see Our Power so shaken and they must have so much dependency upon their fellow subjects both English and Scotch We conceive it so farre from being a remedy to the present distempers as they affirme in their papers that as at present it would alter the whole frame and conditution of the Governement of this Kingdome both Civill and Military so in the conclusion it would occasion the ruine and desolation of all Our Kingdomes HIS MAJESTIES ANSWER See these in the Narative no. 177. 178. to the two Papers concerning Ireland IT hath been one of the chiefest designes of the Authors of the present distractions to insinuate unto our people that We were either privy to the Rebellion in Ireland or assenting to the continuance of it And if it could not be personally fixed upon Our selfe yet