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A89880 Independencie no schisme. Or, An answer to a scandalous book, entituled, The schismatick sifted: written by Mr. John Vicars. Which may serve also for a reply to Master Edwards his Gangræna. Wherein is discovered the vanity of those unjust slanders cast upon the dissenting brethren, whom they call Independents. With some hints added about gospel-government. / By M.N. med. pr. Nedham, Marchamont, 1620-1678. 1646 (1646) Wing N391; Thomason E344_24; ESTC R200974 10,956 18

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only as the Parliament please I pray read the Ordinance which enabled them to sit and a clause in the late Declaration of the Commons which sayes they were called only to Advise of such things c. To the third concerning Mr. Iohn Goodwin and Mr Walwyn It is not enough to call men Factious and Pharisa●cal without evident demonstrations Let every mans work be proved lest while you endeavour to picture out Independency you draw a model of your own impudence and impiety To the fourth that the Author of the last warning to London is an Independent I observe if there be any thing unsavoury abroad it is presently thrown in the faces forsooth of Independents else think they the people will have too good an opinion of them and we shall lose our reputation Oh this self-interest is the very fountain of all mischief when it stands in competition with mens consciences in matter of Religion and Reformation To the fifth first that Mr. Saltmarsh his Smoke c. is foggy and choaking wherein Mr. Ley hath shewn his failings Indeed Mr. Ley hath striven to render it choaking by his confused and tumultuary Animadversions and to raise a fog in the Readers understanding that they might not discern those divine breathings of the Spirit and beams of the Sun of righteousnesse And all moderate men must needs say Mr. Ley hath shewn no failings but his own their Books are abroad read and pray for understanding so may ye who were once darknesse be light in the Lord. Secondly that his Groans for Liberty are full of misapplied paralels and unsavoury comparisons Why then hath not this been made evident all this while or why do not you do it now I suppose those Groans come so near strike so deep that your consciences cannot dissemble but that they were once your own Remember your old condition do as you would have been done to have the same affections the same meltings you had then and have compassion towards your brethren Put on as the elect of God holy and beloved bowels of Mercy Thirdly that his Treatise of Free-grace is subtile erronious and deceitfull as Mr. Gataker sayes Too subtile indeed are his treatises to old men or those which have the old man in them or have been infected with the old leven of outward dispensations and self conceit Mr. Saltmarsh spins too fine threads in Divinity and is somewhat too sublime and spirituall for those which take all in grosse and have not yet attained the more excellent way wherein my soul speaks by experience that of all writings yet extant in print none layes down the precious doctrine of Free grace with such power plainnesse evidence and demonstration of the Spirit as that small treatise written by Mr. Saltmarsh Happy is he can make a right use of it Fourthly that Mr Saltmarsh his exceptions at Mr. Edwards are injurious because he once spake well of him But if Mr. Saltmarsh have given Mr. Edwards a good report is this fair requitall in M. Edwards to traduce him so unchristianly in print To ramble up heresies errours and unwarrantable opinions upon trust and then to set his name before them was this well done is he now or M. Edwards most injurious Mr. VICARS 1. That the Independents indeavour to make the Covenant a nose of wax by their false Comments for advance of their owne wicked ayms and ends 2 That Dr. Homes will do nothing in his Parish unlesse they will dance after his Independent pipe 3. That Mr. Iohn Bachiler is an Independent brother that Independents come near the Jesuits because they would not joyn in a Petition against Commissioners to judge of sins not enumerated in the Ordinance for the Lords Supper 4. That Independents have a fine back doore of evasion against such as censure them because of their pretence of new-lights which is like the popish Equivocation Answ To the first that the Independents indeavour to make the Covenant a nose of wax c. Produce those false Comments else forbear to charge them upon us but if there were any you needed not to feare them for the house of Commons have assured you in their late excellent Declaration that no forced constructions shall be admitted or put upon the people of this Kingdom and I am confident all Independents as you call them will subscribe to this particular To the second that Dr. Homes will do nothing in his parish unless they dance after his Independent pipe I must confesse you have a large formall Story of the Doctor as if you had compared Notes with reverend Mr. Edwards have you nothing else to do but to print over the second part of Esop's Fables and fill the Presse with tales of a Cock and a Bull Give me leave Sir to stroak your gravity you have the Beard I must confesse though not the Breast plate of Aaron and may passe for a man of discretion by your looks though not by your works for were your cause ever so good it can never be worse defended than by rallying up slanders and accusations against the Brethren To the third that Mr. Bachiler is an Independent brother and that Independents come near the Iesuits And its probable if you go on as you begin the Lawes against Priests and Jesuites may be pleaded against them the great Whore must be arrayed with Crimson and Scarlet the great Dragon also is red If ye are of that Serpentine disposition fill ye up the measure of your Fathers the Bishops that upon you may come all the righteous blood What can we expect lesse when such bitter invectives are daily vented to turn the fury of the unstable multitude against the Brethren As touching Commissioners pray be not angry they are pretty coolers for Ambition the Parliament will have it so and good reason they should have a share till the Divine Right be proved And for Mr. Bachiler he hath better learned Christ then to withhold truth in unrighteousnesse or stifle it at the Presse at the birth as you desire just as Pharaoh would have had the godly Midwives to destroy all the Males of Israel To the fourth that Independents have a fine door of evasion because of their New-lights which are like the popish equivocation Now I perceive you are in the very gall of bitternesse and bond of iniquity who contend against the truth Is there not a passing from grace to grace from glory to glory in Gospel knowledge Doth God reveale all at once have we attained perfection are we so well acquainted already with Gospel-mysteries and Gospel government that we need look after no further discoveries in the hidden things of God We must not like Hercules set up our Pillars with a Nil ultra rather Plus ultra should be a Christians Motto How dare you then call it a Deceitfull trick of impudent Impostors to look after more light we should all be Seekers in this kinde Had former years nuzled themselves in a contentation in that light