brought for we wil ever do grant so much as any man can in truth wish to bee collected out of them But what is all this to the purpose since neither then nor since they do agree with the polluted doctrine of your Sinagoge and the faith which olde Rome spreade or mainetained is no more consonant to this infidelity which our new Rome maintaineth then an apple is like an oyster Which one answere although it cut of al your cavils which you fetch from antiquity in praise of Rome and we frequētly inculcate it vnto you yet because it so biteth you will in no sort remember It is a tricke in Rhetorike but it is withall but a base shift to slippe by that or to seeme to forget that which woundeth to the hart and vtterly destroyeth T. HILL BUt the Protestants per adventure will grant that the true Church flourished in those dayes but not afterwardes vntill this age in which they haue reformed the same yet is it most manifest that it flourished afterwardes even vntill this our time no lesse then it and before if not more for in Saint Gregory his daies it was spreade all over the worlde as appeareth by his Epistles to the Bishops of the East of Afrike Spaine France England Sicily And by Saint Bede in cap. 6. Cantic as also by Saint Bernard who disputing before Rogerim King of Sicily avouched that in those daies the East all the West Fraunce Germany Englande Spaniardes and many barbarous nations obeyed the Bishoppe of Rome G. ABBOT 8. The Protestāts not fearing that you shal gaine any thing by that which is truth wil refuse to yeeld you nothing that is true In the first Church that is while the Apostles lived the spouse of Christ for doctrine was most glorious for some hundreds of yeares afterwards her honor flourished not a little yet so that some pety superstitions began to creepe in heere and there But about six hundred years after Christ shee for the outward face did more more droupe in doctrine f 1. Ioh. 2. 18 Antichrists began to peepe vp in the Apostles time but then they coulde not properly be called the great Antichrist And that which was thē was not so eminently as that the followers of the Apostles did much obserue it being then more troubled with persecution or heretiks then with superstition In processe of time matters grew to a worse state evil opiniōs creeping in at last the maine g 2. Thes. 2. 3 Apostasie followed But in this Apostasie very great declining there were who yeelded not to the time but kept thēselues vnspotted of the world especially for mainest points of salvation And it being thus whē things were at the worst God in this later age hath suffred that truth which was more hidden to illustrate the Christian world again Yea but you wil proue that since the Primitiue Church faith florished more thē before or at the least it was not diminished vntill our time You can do wonders Sir or els your own reason would informe you that nothing beene added til these lare navigations of the Portingales Spaniards Christianity must needs be exceedingly diminished when the Saracens Turks for so long space haue devored so much of Asia Europa Africa as is or hath bin vnder thē You are but a simple man for story weaker for Cosmography or els you would not so improbably talke at randon But any thing serveth your turne Well the faith was in Gregories times over all the worlde How proue you this Forsooth he wrote Epistles to Bishops of Spaine France England Sicely yea of the East of Afrike Ergo the faith was over all the world A young man of the age of sixteene yeares hath by his diligence learned without booke the Epistle to Philemō that to the Colossians yea the book of Ruth and the Prophecy of Aggeus therefore he can say all the Bible by hart This is Logike for the Seminaries but not currant elsewhere VVhat wrote he into Tartaria or India or Manicongo what to Finland or Iseland or a thousand places more And what saith Bede h In Cantic 6. The summe of the citisens of that celestiall countrey doth exceede the measure of our estimation But this is spoken of all the faithfull that are were or ever shall bee in the world As also that following vpon the texte Adole scentularum non est numerus There are saith hee young maidens vvhereof there is no number because there are sound innumerable cōpantes of Christiā people Which within seaven lines after he maketh most evident The vniversall Church which in the same her faithfull members from the beginning even vnto the ending of the vvorld from the rising of the Sunne vnto the setting from the North and the Sea doe praise the name of the Lorde Doth this shew any extraordinary thing in the time of Beda or any flourishing of the Church or more thē that there were faithfull toward al parts of the world Such is that which was brought touching S. i In vita Bernard L◅ 217 Bernard who vpō a great schisme in the Church of Rome betweene Innocentius and the Antipape Petrus Leonis being sent for to compose this strife and to see whether he could winne over to Innocētius Robert the King of Sicely who stood for Peter in his Oration saith that if Peters side were good they who acknowledged Innocentius for Pope should bee in very ill case And these hee nameth Then the Easterne Church shall perish vvhich at that time coulde comprehend no more but those fewe Christians vvhich were vvarring in or about Palestina for the Greeke Churches did not then acknowledge the Popes Iurisdiction the whole West shall perish Fraunce shallperish Germany shall perish the Spanish and English and the Barbarian kingdomes shall be drowned in the bottome of the Sea Where he doth not adde these special countries over and aboue the VVest but signifieth vvhat was meant by that generall name that is to saye Fraunce Germany Spaine and England vvith some inferiour Kingdomes So that now if S. Bernard doe say any thing heere your all the worlde is vvonderfully shrunke in the vvetting So you strive against the streame and the farther you goe the worse you goe T. HILL AND in these daies it is all over Italie all over Spaine and in Fraunce in most partes of Germany in Poleland Boheme besides England Hungary Greece Syria Aethiopia Aegypt in vvhich Landes are many Catholikes and in the newe world it flourisheth mightily in all the foure partes of the world Eastward in the Indies VVestward in America Northward in Iaponia Southward in Brasilia in the vttermost partes of Afrike G. ABBOT 9 AS many as be disposed to knowe the Popes strength harken now to his muster-maister Al Italie commeth first as being neerest the Popes nose then all Spaine is the second legion But how would it be in these lands if your Inquisitours did
Faith Valent the Emperour with deadlie pravity did send teachers of the Arrian sect The Gothes held the instruction of the first faith which they receaved Ualens had before the rule of the Catholike faith but leaving it hee did intangle himselfe vvith the perverse opinion of the Arrians Therefore by the iust iudgement of God they burned him alive who by reason of him when they are deade are to burne by the fault of their errour And that is the truth your owne conscience D. Hâ—…st telleth you which is manifest by the mincing of your words the greatest part of those Gothes were Catholike Christians before Not all but the greatest part Therefore some which is in truth the whole Nation of the Uese Gothes were first coÌ„verted to Christianity by Arrian Heretikes And so your owne Proposition that Heretikes cannot convert Infidels is made voide by your owne example Nowe wheras you say that such turning is not to make the converted better theÌ„ they were before we must confesse that if you speake of such as be Heretikes indeede and not those whom you onely call Heretikes being Gods good servants that the gaine theÌ„ is but this that formerly they knew not Christ at all and now they know him in some sort although it be not so rightly as they should If this bee to bee accounted but a little then your Indian Converts of whom you boast gaine but a little by you for you mingle to their handes the doctrine of the Gospell with many pollutions of vile Idolatry most horrible superstition like to that of the olde Heathens T. HILL FOR that they having indeede the Scripture in some sorte yet have not the true sence thereof which properly is the sword of the spirite and the wordes are rather the scabard in which the svvord is sheathed And therefore they fighting onely with the scabard vvithout the sword cannot wound the heartes of Infidels And no marveile though they perverte Catholikes for that men are proue to liberty and to loosenesse of life vvhich by such doctrine is permitted So that they are indeede most aptely by Saint Augustine likened vnto Partridges which gather togither Libr 13 cótr Faust cap. 12. youngâ—…ones which they begot not whereas contrarywise the Holy Church is a most fertle Dove which continually bringeth forth new Pigeons G. ABBOT 22 HEretiks you say have the Scripturs in some sort Certainly many of them have the wordes without any difference froÌ„ the Orthodoxe For whereas many of theÌ„ spruÌ„g vp in the Greeke Church they had for the Old Testament the Septuagint in Greeke the Newe Testament word for word in that language wherein it was writen But they want the sence thereof which is the sword of the Spirit for the wordes are but the scabard and the scabard cannot wound the hartes of the Infidels What mischiefe with the letter of the text and their owne perverse interpretation Heretikes may do to theÌ„ who were formerly vnbeleevers may bee gathered by that of the Arrians last named by the Pelagians by the Donatistes and many other But those have not the true sence What is that to vs vnlesse you can prove that we also want it which M. z Ration 〈◊〉 Campian in kindnesse would threape vpon vs. There is not in the world any fit meanes to come to the right sence of Scripture which our men doe not frequeÌ„t They seeke into the Original tonges wherin the booke of God was writen They conferre translations of all sortes they lay one text with another expound the harder by that which is lesse difficult they compare circumstances of Antecedents and Consequents they looke to the Analogy of of faith prescribed in the Creede of the Apostles They search what the first Councels did establish they seeke what was the opinioÌ„s of the Fathers concerning textes in question and refuse not therein to cope with you about the highest points as the Primacy of your Pope Transubstantiation or any other vvhatsoever Yea they looke over the interpretations of your vvriters to knovve if anie thinge there occurre vvorthy observation they conferre one learned man vvith another they praye to the blessed Trinitie to open and lighten their vnderstanding and in a vvorde they omitte no meanes vvhich either Saint a De doctr Chriist l. 3 4 Augustine or anie other good writer doth or can prescribe vnto them Only heere they lay a strawe that they are not perswaded that the Bishop of Rome hath all knowledge iudgment so in b Vide Platin in Paulo 22 Scrinio Pectoris that by his finall sentence all may be resolved no not that he with the c Bellar. de veth Dei li. 3. 3. Councell which he shall like to call is the only determiner of the true meaning of al controversed passages The Poes all of them are men and therefore may be deceived many of them are ignorant men in comparison of any great Clerk-ship and many of them haue entertained vnsound opinions as Liberius and Honorius and divers Councels haue grosly erred as that second Synode of Nice and therefore blame vs not if we pinne not our salvation vpon such weake or partiall mens interpretations 23 When you report that Heretiks pervert Catholiks by your owne second Reason before handled you must meane Papistes by your Catholikes or no body and then you are a right good Proctor to speake in their cause Their matter was bad enough before and in the telling you make it worse Your Catholike men for your words can touch no other are proÌ„e you say to liberty and loosenesse of life Would you haue a fee for this pleading We do not doubt but many of theÌ„ are very licentious great breakers of the Sabaoth swearers and blasphemers and much inclined to other viciousnes whereof if a man would see the spectacle of all spectacles let him but goe to Rome And who would forbeare this lasciviousnes when a pardon from a Pope and absolution from a Priest can make all as cleere as it had never beene But we on the other side teach our people that these your peccatillâ—… doe offend Almighty God and that they yea every d Mat. 12. 36 idle word must be reckoned for and our Church discipline doth bring notorious transgressours to the censure of excommunication and open pennance for their crimes They who haue turned vnto vs are some of the best and gravest of your sect and those which bee most vertuous of life wheras contrarywise many such as among vs haue beene wanton toyish people or deeply touched with suspition of lubricity haue bin observed to retire theÌ„selues to your shores as being the fittest harbour for such rotten vessels It were an easie thing to name many who leading liues as they do a maÌ„ rightly may say of them They are fit to be Papists We doe not envy you such persons although we could wish that even such would come to the truth and not amende their former vice with future
you would haue laid freely at them Dare you strangers and captiues and boyes and vpstart companions set your selfe against a million of wise men Princes and Counselours They should haue had your voice to haue gone to the fiery Furnace Doe you not pity your selfe when you reason in this fashion Among them that be wise pendenda sunt suffragiapetius quà m numeraÌ„da voices are to be weighed rather then to be numbred I can say no more vnto you but that when this is your best Divinity Lorde haue mercy vpon you Saint Austen would haue tolde you for o Epist. 19. all these and aboue all these we haue the Apostle Paule T. HILL NEither may the Protestants now at length glory in their great number as some of them haue done for that their Religion is there in England and in Scotland and some thereof in â—…aland and in the Lowe Countries and in some partes of Germany and a few of them in Fraunce Apol. Eccl. Anglic. for they never yet passed into Asia nor into Africa nor into Greece nor into many places of Europe much lesse into the Indies But indeede if you rightly scanne their doctrine you shall finde that your Religion ProtestaÌ„tine of England is no where in the world else and that English service contained in your booke of Common praier is vnknowne and condemned of all other Nations and people vnder the cope of Heaven So that in very deed the doctrine of your Protestantes is taught or received no vvhere but in England and the Puritant Doctrine of Scotlande the contrariety therof duely considered is no where but in Scotlande the Lutherane Doctrine taught in Denmarke is no where but in Denmarke and in a few places of Germany the Libertine doctrine taught in the Low Countries is no â—…here but in the Low Countries and the like may be said of other sectes G. ABBOT 26 YOV are mis enformed that the Protestants doe glorie in their great number they know that truth is truth be iâ—… in more or few As for M. Iewell whose Apologie you quote in your margent hee hath no such matter Onely where as it is obiected that our Religion overturneth kingdoms and governmentes hee answereth there vnto that there p Apol. Eccl. Anglican doe remaiue in their place and ancient dignitie the Kings of England Denmarke Sweden the Dukes of Saâ—…cony the Cunties Palatine c. This is to answere to an obiection by giving many instances to the contrary and not to glory of any multitude And if any other of our Church do note in breefe that the Gospell hath taken roote in some large nations that is to stop the mouth of the clamorous adversary and to satisfie the weake as also not least of all to praise God who so spreadeth the beames of his compassion but it is not to boast vainely as you ignorantly imagine Yet who doubteth but a good Christian may ioy in his hart exceedingly and thankfully expresse it in his tongue that many who sate in darkenesse may now behold the light and the sheepefold of Christ is more and more filled But if we would be too forward you will plucke vs backe againe Although it be say you in some places of Europe yet in some other it is not As who should say your Popery is generall in all Where I pray you in Greece is your Papistry It is not in Asia and Africa and much lesse in the Indies The East Indies are part of Asia if you could think vpon it By what means your Idolatry came into those Countries I haue shewed before and how plentifully there it is If we would talke idly as you for the most part doe we might say that in every place where the Marchants of Holland trade and haue people residing our religion is accepted But since the English Merchants haue companies houses in Russia in Constantinople in Aleppo in Alexandria sometimes in Barbary in Zacynthus in Venice and Legorne we might say after the fashion of your boasting that our religion is in those parts But we desire to make no more of things then indeede they are Yet we tell you for those remote provinces that as now one hundred and twenty yeeres agone they knewe not one whit of your faith so it may please God before one hundred and twenty yeeres more bee passed if it so seeme good to his most sacred wisedome to plant the truth which we reach in the East Westerne world especially if a passage by the North ende of America or that by Asia beyond Ob may bee opened vvherein our q M. Hacluiâ—… vnges Nation hath much adventured and speng good summes of treasure vvhich also the Hollanders haue done But the issue of this whole matter must bee leste to the divine providence which is to bee magnified therefore if hee adde this blessing to his Church And if he deny it either there or in any other place we must not be caried too farre with griefe or pitty since it doth not please him who is the father of mercie to condescend vnto it Nowe vvhereas you avouch that our doctrine is onelye in England I knovve not vvhither I shoulde put that in your ignoraunces or rather in your malicious cavils Truth it is our common prayer booke is vsed onelye by those who are of Englishe allegeaunce but is there anie pointe of doctrine in it vvherevnto other Churches reformed in Europe doe not condescend The Catechisme of the Councell of Trent doth differ in words from the Catechisme of Canisius and both of them from that of M. Vaux yet you would thinke it a wronge if anye man should tell you that they disagree in pointes of doctrine So the service of the reformed Congregations in Europe as in England Scotland Fraunce Switzerland in the dominion of the Palsgraue in the Regiments and free cities of Germany which are of the Pallsgraues confession as also in a good parte of the low Countries is the same in all pointes of moment not differing one intâ—… their Professions are the same There is no question among these in anie one pointe of religion The Ecclesiasticall policy being different as in some places by Bishops in some other wâ—…thout them doth not alter ought of faith The Apostles in that they were Apostles had a kinde of governement vvhich the Church had not afterward in the very same particular In the auncient Church some cities and Countreyes vvere immediately ruled by a Patriarke Grande Metropolitane some other by an inferiour Bishoppe vvho was subiected to the greater yet they all might agree in the faith The cheefe at Rome immediately is the Pope at Millaine for spirituall thinges the Arch-bishoppe in some places bee but Suffragaines in some other Iurisdictions a Deane or Priour by Privilege hath almost Papall auctoritie vvhich also in times past vvas in the Chauncellours or Vice-chauncellours of our English Vniversities some fewe thinges beeing excepted and reserved Yet will you say that these doe differ in
religion or retaine not the same doctrine Even so it is touching the beleefe of the Protestantes in England of those which you in spite call Puritaines in Scotland and of them whome you tearme maliciously Libertines in Holland and Zeland They teach no other libertie then what the r Galat. 5. 1. Apostle teacheth and biddeth vs to stande fast in it For the shewing of your skill I entreate you to let your scholers heare one pointe of moment or materiall vvherein all those Churches which before I named doe differ Speake it out if you can tell what Touching the Lutheranes in Denmarke and many places of Germany I haue toulde you before that in one pointe of the Eucharist they disagree from the rest of the Churches which the LORD in time may sende to bee reconciled and wee pray vnto him for the same But your comfort vppon that discorde is small For as Anthonie sometimes Kinge of Navatre and father to the most Christian Kinge of Fraunce now raigning s Commentaâ—… Relig. Reip. in Gall. lib. saide to the Embassadour of the Kinge of Denmarke exhorting the reformed French to bee of Luthers doctrine There bee fortie points wherein Luther and Calvine doe differ from the Pope and in nine and thirty of them they agree betweene themselues and in that single one they dissent Their followers therefore should do well to ioyne in the greater number against the Pope till they had ruinated him and vvhen his heart is broken they should fall to compound that last single difference God in his good time may graunt this to bee done although in the meane while hee doe exercise his spouse asseemeth good to himselfe T. HILL LAstly I doe bore consider with my selfe if I should refuse the Catholike Romans religion so vniversally taught ' received and professed throughout all the world so many ages togither and embrace any of these new sillie sects adventuring my soule there-vpon what all my progenitours auncesters of they were here againe and sawe mee die so would say vnto mee I gesse they woulde vse such speeches as thâ—se vvhat doest then condemne all our iudgementes and doings Doest thou maligne that Religion which we so highly esteemed and sought to advance Doest then sende vs all to hell and damnation Wilt thou iudge thy selfe vviser and more in Gods favour then any of vs were And many such like speeches I thinke they would vse G. ABBOT 27 I doubte not but in this Reason you haue borrowed of your neighbours as well as you did in others before although it be not my hap to trace you heere as formerly I haue done But the reckoning vp of those your places in the Easterne parts of the world are by me certainly held not to be your own which I conceiue by the complexion of all the rest of your book For your phrases and appellations bestowed on Luther and Calvin Father Persons is your schoole-master But because you are devoted vnto blinde Bristowes Motiues if you haue beene sparingly with him in all this Chapter before yet heere you conclude with s Motiv 36. him about our Predecessours VVhere you might haue remeÌ„bred that to speake properly neither our auncesters shall iudge vs neither shall we iudge our auncesters but Iesus Christ shall iudge both and hee will not take for good payment that which we follow by imitation of our parents but what wee doe or haue done after his owne commandements How often in the Scripture are men blamed for walking in the waies of t 1. King 15 34. cap. 16. 19. 26. Ieroboam of other their Auncesters How often do the u Psa 106. 6 Dan. 9. 6. 16 godly confesse and deplore their fathers sinnes before God What precepts be there to that purpose as that Salomons wife vvho representeth the spouse of Christ should u Psal 45 â—…1 forgot her owne people and her fathers house What a praise is it to x a Kinâ—… 8â—… 〈◊〉 Hezekiah to y Cap. 21 24 Iosiah and divers other that having idolatrous parents they did rather looke to their father which is in heaven then to flesh and bloud vpon earth If this instruction of yours should haue gone for currant the Iewes should scant haue received the doctrine of Christ but the Gentiles without all question shoulde haue kept them to Iupiter to Apollo to Aesculapius because if they had done otherwise they had condemned the way of their forefathers By this rule our auncesters heere in Englande should not haue received baptisme and the Indians and Iaponians whome you say so fast without booke should haue worshipped their old Idoles The complaint which you here make in the person of our predecessours was made before by Symmachus to the Emperour Valentinian in the daies of Saint Ambrose speaking thus in the name of the city Rome z Ambro Epist lib 5 Most noble Princes you fathers of the Countrey reverence yet my yeares vnto which my rootes of devotion haue brought me I will vse my ceremonies which I received from my grandfathers for I repent not my selfe of them I will liue after mine 〈◊〉 fashion for I am free But Saint a Ibidem Ambrose comming afterward to answere all these obiections teacheth that there is one who in matters of religion is rather to be beleeued then all the world besides Concerning God whom should I rather beleeue then God himselfe But of this argument I may haue occasion to speake more at large 28 Onely now thus much I adde that if any of our parents offended God and dyed in damnable ignorance who woulde say that for their sakes and company we should thrust our selues into hell ' If any of them were right they will not grudge that wee should haue more light opened vnto vs then they in their time saw even as those holy Iewes vnder the law fore-seeing what would be vnder the Messias envyed not to the Apostles and other of that age the more perfect liuely knowledge of Christ. But leaving the definition and determining sentence of all vnto the Lords secret iudgement into which we must not ofter to prease or intrude we do hope that many of those who lived in the time of darkenesse had that mercy shewed vnto them that their soules doe rest in peace Such is Saint Cyprians opinion in the like case b De sacrâ—…mento dominici caliâ—… Epist 68 And see most deare brother if any of our Predecessours either ignorantly or simply did not obserue and holde this which the Lorde taught vs to doe by his owne example and ministery by the favour of the Lorde there may bee pardon given to his simplicitie If any of them did holde the foundation concerning their being iustified by the bloud of Christ alone and besides that did repent of all their errours knowne and vnknown committed by ignorance or wilfulnesse we feare not but that the same God who gaue vnto them some measure of knowledge and would require of theÌ„
that sect ◅hich is ours so that it is apparant that it is augmented even by the helpe of God which is the selfe-same reason that is here vrged for the Papacy But Vives doth make answere The multitude doth not argue goodnesse There were more Gentiles i◅ time past And what can be more true then that in times past even frō the beginning of the world there were more Ethnickes then are Saracens since the daies of Mahomet or true Christians since Christs time So Hierome Savanarola who was a learned man of an excellent spirit as appeareth by his workes howsoever the Romanists afterward tooke his life away from him in his booke s Lib. 4. c. 7. De Triumpho Crucis beeing opposed by a Mahumetane that Mahomets profession is truth because so many doe follow it he answereth first that men are inforced by the sworde so to doe and secondly that if multitude should beare the palme away then the devils religion were the best of all other because he hath possessed incomparablie more then either Christ or Mahomet Such a Reason as this is doth the writer of this Pamphlet heere bring for his Romish doctrine which if it prove any thing is most substantiall fo Sathan the great Antichrists graunde maister For there is not any portion of the habitable world but the Devil hath his crew in it In enquiring thē for verity we should attende what the solide rule of perfection that is Gods Sacred word doth lay out before vs and not what the hugest multitude directed by humane fancy shal prescribe vnto vs. t Exod. 23. 2 Thou shalt not follow a multitude to doe evill The most walke the worst way Sapiendum est cum paucis A wise man as Seneca telleth vs u Lib. in sapientem non cadere iniuriam cap 14. doth not goe that way which the people goeth but as the Planets doe goe a contrary course to the world so he goeth against the opinion of them all Thus wee must doe in Divinity not looke howe many saye but on what ground it is spoken If many agree in that which prooveth to be iust we are to ioy that many give consent to that which is right but the truth is it which must trie them and not they inforce a truth Sounde religion is not the worse when it is but in a fewe and the multitude which doe hould it or the wide spreading thereof cannot make the false to be otherwise THE SIXTE REASON Miracles T. HILL TRUE Miracles were never wrought but by them who were of true religion for that they are done only by the power of God Now it is so manifest that there hath bin almost an infinite number of miracles wrought by those who were of the Catholike Romane Religion and never any by them who were not of that Church-since Christes time as he who shall deny it may be proved no lesse impudent shamelesse thē he vvho shall deny that ever there vvas any Masse saide in times past in England or that ever there were any warres betweene Turkes and Christians or that there be any such countries as the East and UUest Indies which thing if a man should deny would be not of all men bee deemed not onely impudent but madde drunken or a foole And surely the one is no lesse knowne by all approved writers and eie-witnesses than the other For as in the Gospell and in the Actes the holy Scriptures witnesse that miracles were wrought by Christ and his Apostles so doe most approved authours of everie age vntill this daye testifie and record the continuaunce of the working thereof in the Catholike Romane Church the which Authours for the most part were eie-witnesses of the saide miracles as for example G. ABBOT 1 WHen you first beganne this pety tract of yours you vndertooke to doe a miracle and that a strange one too for it were a miracle of all miracles to proove the rotten ragges of Popery to bee sounde and therfore we wonder not that in this your processe you speake of miracles But according to your fashion at your first setting out you stumble for wee may well hold those to be true miracles which are really and verily done although it be to an evil purpose And such as these are wrought by them who are farre of from true religion as by the Devill and by some of his instruments indeed not without Gods permissiō although speaking properly it is not by his immediate power The sorcerers of Pharaodid a Exod 7 1◅ 22 cap. 8. 7 three severall times shew wonders before their maister by turning roddes into serpēts water into blould by producing frogges A false b Deut. 13 1 Prophet or dreamer of dreames may giue a signe or a wōder the signe or wonder may come to passe S. Austen directly c De civit Dei l 10. 16. affirmeth that amōg the old Romans their aūcestors there were miracles verily dōe by the power of the devil as that the pe◅ates or litle images brought frō Troy did off thēselues go frō place to place that Tarquine with a ◅asour did cut a whetstōe in sunder d Liv. lib 1 Livy reporteth it to be done by Accius Mavius the Augur at the cōmandemēt of Tarquine And when among so many probable credible writers strang things are related to have bin done amōg the Ethnickes but most of al among the Romans as the raining of stones bloud the like yea as e Tom 2◅ lib. 4. c 13 Freculphus saith very wooll in Artho◅se vnder Valentinian the Emperour to whom is this to be attributed but to the grand enimy of mākind which the same Freculphus doth not dissēble whē in another f Tom. 1 l 5. cap. 5 place he delivereth it that by the naughtines of the devils it was brought about that a river did flow with bloud the heavē did make a shew to be on fire and such like And this is the opiniō of Bozius a special man of your side g Lib 2 contr Machiavel who telleth vs that Livye reporteth that it hath rained stones bloud flesh Whervpon he saith we beleeue that these wōders in time past were so frequent because devils did procure cause thē whē such things did fall out publike supplicatiōs were made general sacrifices wherby the devils thēselues were worshipped Then real miracles may be wrought by such as be not of true religiō vnles that Sathan may be this religious man no differēce is there for this matter before since Christs time as wil be seene anōe by example of Antichrist And if it should be excepted that diverse of these already specified may bee saide not to be true because they are done to an evil end that is to deceive beguile your late Popish miracles are liable to the same exception being whē they are at their best to winne mē not to Christ but to Antichrist 2 The
the VenetiaÌ„s yet he shold escape with safety only his fault was that by the sword he did not reforme and redresse the abuses of the Clergy at Rome In briefe he stil preached against the Romanists and wrote divers things excellently and learnedly which yet appeare But being such a scourge vnto them the Pope r Guiâ—…iard hist. lib. 3. excommunicated him and forbad him to preach where-vnto when he assented not they caused a tumult to be raised in the City apprehended him and imprisoned him put him to torture and gaue out such a confession of his as they listed but in the ende they burnt him where with singular patience he yeelded his body to the fire and his soule to God Almighty From all these many more I draw this Conclusion contrary to that of my adversary before vrged That if such as haue beene esteemed for Prophets in this last age haue had any such gift indeede and any matter may be built on them then the Church of Rome is a strumpet full of corruptions pollutions abominations as the very denne of Antichrist And so rest they with their Visions and sit they with their Prophecies THE EIGHTH REASON Scriptures T. HILL NEither may heere the Protestant reply and say that the Papists builde vpon Miracles Uisions Prophecies and vpon such like but not vpon the UUorde for all that they alleadge are most agreeable to the word of God Neither doe they teach any doctrine but such as is derived out of the holy Bible G. ABBOT HOw you build vpon the Scriptures and what account you make of the word of God we need no better man to declare then your selfe who do evidently shew to all the worlde in what reverende esteeme you haue the sacred Oracles of the Lords booke when you thinke this to bee a fit place to speake of the Scriptures after your false imputed name of Catholikes your Uanity and Cousening your Perverting of Consciences your lying Miracles and other your not base but most base and refuse stuffe And as you doe place it worthily so you insist vpon it largely in this your whole Pamphlet consisting of an 187. Pages allowing not full out one leafe vnto that which is the a Luk. 10 42 Unum necessarium the sole anker of our hope the foundation of our confidence the ioy of our harts VVherein you do as your graund Captaines do teach you who vse but meane speeches concerning this word of God yea and your Conventicle of b Session 4. Trent wickedly equalling and making of the same authority the traditions of men with the written Scripture which sacrilegious impiety and impure blasphemy while your auditours do not perceiue decline they shew themselues not only blinded but bewitched with the cup of the c Apoc 17 21 whores inchantments And even with the like reverence you do vse it here as it were casting it into an odde corner and naming it no otherwise but as to fill vp your nuÌ„ber so skirting by it or skipping over it as the d Pli l. 8. 40 Solin c 25 dogs in Egypt do by the river Nilus where they dare not stand and drinke but lap as they runne and runne as they lap for feare of a Crocodile So when you come to the Scripture you wil stand to nothing but touch and goe for fear least some thing should here start out which should devour you and your Popery If you had beene a man of mettal if there had beene ought in the Bible assuredly making for you you should from thence haue cleered some question as the sacrifice of your Masse the Supremacy of your Pope the lawfulnes of your Priest-hood or one thing or another questioned and controversed not haue dealt by it as one would handle thornes or take a coale of fire in his hand being glad when he is first rid of it Well we must beare with you for your brevity in this Chapter but for the manner of this your placing I cannot chuse but smile to thinke how you were troubled in this your short consultation whither you should now be beholding to Campian or to your old Master Bristow for borrow needs you must that is your profession Bristow you must not leaue no not for a little moment especially since e Motiv 8â—… somewhere he hath these very matters And yet notwithstanding some variety of stealing would do well not all out of Bristowe The resolution then grew that Campians concisenesse was fitter here for your humour and his very words you would vse But to set them as the f Cam. Rat. 〈◊〉 Iesuit did in the forefront of your booke were to lay your selfe too open for some body might haue taken his booke and first read it out of Latin and then your first Chapter if it had beene your first Chapter and read it in English To satisfie both then you took this honest course that the words should be Campians and the Methode should be Bristowes you placing the treatise of the Scripture behind as worthy Bristow had done before you This sheweth that you haue a prety wit of your own To come now to the matter our reply is in truth as you say that the sandy foundation of all your rotten building doth rest vpon vncertaineties your miracles are most fained your visions are forged your Prophecies false all of them out of date no inforcement of verity to be gathered from them And on the otherside you haue little acquaintance with the word of God neither by your good wils do you desire it That which you doe you are vrged vnto by vs and then you wrest you wring you straine you stretch to make some shew for that which originally is dravvne from your humane inventions And when it is once set vp then you labour to haue some colour to warrant it or at least to make some glose howe simple folke may take it for good payment Your workes of supererogation whereby a man may doe more then deserue heaven for himselfe and haue somewhat to spare for other your dispensatioÌ„ of the treasure of your Church by the Indulgences of your Pope your Canonizing of Saints your creating of Lumbus your forging of Purgatory a multitude more or rable rather of vpstart novelties since the age of the Apostles are derived froÌ„ the tricks of their wit who haue made their purse their belly and their worldly pompous honour to be their God their summuÌ„ solum bonuÌ„ As for the sacred word froÌ„ thence they are not taken vnlesse you meane that they be so derived out of the holy Bible as that they were never in it so we deny not but your superstition may be taken out of it But were these controversed matters but probably to be collected out of the sacred Oracles you would not runne to such beggerly shiftes as in this whole Pamphlet of yours you are driven vnto They must make a shew with Counters cary about theÌ„ a purse
Nabuchodonosor and while the first temple or m Ca 16 20 Sanctuary stood Nay the consultation concerning this warre is reported to be in the n Cap. 2 1â—… eighteenth yeare of Nabuchodonosor we finde in the book of the o 〈◊〉 King 25 〈◊〉 Kings that in the nineteenth yeare of his raigne the same king sent Nabuzaradan his steward to Hierusalem vvho burnt the house of the Lorde the Kinges house and all other of worth in the citty Adde to this that whereas the writers of the bookes of Kings and Chronicles are most exacte in setting downe all great warres and victories of the Iewes from the time of Saul to the ruinating of the first temple there is not one word of any person or circumstance belonging to this warre in them nor in any other vndoubted booke of holy writ Yea Iosephus who was a Iew and with much learning and labour continueth the story of his countreymen from Adam to his own daies hath not the least mention of this Iudith or ought appertaining to her which he being so desirous to coÌ„ceale nothing which might make for the honour of his people would never in such deepe oblivion haue buryed These things may well be questioned 8 The book of Wisdome is by some of the Popish Synagoge not only accounted to be Canonicall Scripture but also reputed to be p Sixt. sent Bibli lib 1. 8 Salomons if not for the compiling yet at least for the matter And the reason therof is yeelded because there is in it a praier in the q Sap. 9. 1. name of Salomon But r Vide Sixt. Senens vbi supra Bellar de verbo Dei li. 1. 13 learned men of our parte rather hold it to be the worke of Philo the Iew which also Bellarmine citeth out of S. Hierome and that not the elder Philo but even the same who with some other of his countrymen was sent in embassage to the s Philo de legat ad caium Emperour Caligula to intreate him that the Iewes might not be forced to accept of and to erect his image or statue at Hierusalem which they held to be contrary to the law of their Moses He therefore compiled that worke insinuating to Kings and great men moderation in their governement terrour of torments after this life and the extreme vanity of Idols matters most fit for their present purpose to Caligula to giue never the lesse credit to all his words he was contented that Salomons name should be vsed in the praier before mentioned because the name of wise king Salomon was famous over al the world And that for this purpose 〈◊〉 the booke of Wisdom was made the whole drift of it may very well purport Now if there were nothing els in this treatise to check it selfe yet that bloudy s Sap 4. 3â—… sentence and censure against all borne in bastardy woulde bewray that it was written with an humane spirite and not by divine authority For although God be pleased sometimes to lay a temporal punishment vpon men so borne as he also doth on other persons yet he who so that we serue him and feare him hath professed of himselfe to be no t Act 10 34 respecter of persons he who blessed Phares being in fornication begotten vpon u Gen 38 18 29. Thâ—…ar so that our Saviour Christs petigree according to the flesh is u Matth. 1 3 derived from him he who forgiveth the parents committing adultery or fornication so that they doe repent which was x 2 Sam 12 13 Davids case adding to his adultery murther also he wil much more pardon the child that is innocent in that behalfe and not accessary to the crime of his nocent parents and will not lay that fearefull iudgement vpon him that neither he nor any who descend froÌ„ him shall long prosper The examples are manifolde how God hath powred various temporall blessings on the issue of such as haue beene borne in fornication as we need look no farther then to William the Conquerour tightly termed y Haillan Histo lib 6 Guillaume le Bastard which notwithstanding ought to incourage none to coÌ„mit that fleshly sinne but rather they are to feare and tremble at it since God may iustly destroy both the bodies and soules of such offen ders But this I haue spoken to shew that the saying of that authour cannot be iustified in Divinity neither may any man goe about to advouch it since albeit all hope well yet few are assured that all things are right in their owne birth Nay Papists theÌ„selues among whom be pretty store of bastards as wel as among other men saw this well enough which caused their z Hugo cardinal Lyra Glo. interl ordinar Dâ—…oni Car thusian Commentatours vpon that place to flie the literall sence and to interpret it of bastards spiritually meant that is heretikes and such like Of the bookes of Ecclesiasticus and the Machabees I haue spoken before and therefore say no more of them but this that S. Austen who thought reasonably well of the bookes of the Machabees yet coulde not tell how to iustifie the a 2. Mach 14. 42 commendation of Razias killing himselfe and therfore is shrewdly b Aug. epist 61. plunged how to salue all by allowing the book and disallowing the fact Since then the matter of these volumes hath such imperfections in it that it cannot keepe coherence with the vn-questioned Oracles of the sacred Scripture and the Spirit of the Almighty is ever vniforme never dissenting from it selfe if the other books do stand as not a c Mat 5. 18 title of them shall perish vnto the worlds end these then must needs fal from that high credit to which Papists would bring them and we are not to blame when we acknowledge not them for divine who haue no such slampe vpon them 9 Secondly we referre our selues to the iudgment of the lewish Church before Christ vvhose the Scriptures then vvere and to whom were commended the d Rom. 3 2 Oracles of God Among them e Luk 24 27 44 Moses and the Prophets and the Psalmes by a generall name comprised all Scripture but otherwise for order and memorie sake they reduced al their books to the two f Sixt Sen Bibli lib 1 and twenty letters of the Hebrew Alphabet and as in them they comprehended al every particle which they and we do receiue so they shut out also from thence al which they we now do expunge No better witnes of this theÌ„ that learned Iosephus who ex g Contr Apion lib. 1 professo haÌ„dleth this sheweth the dignity prerogatiue of the divine inspired writings aboue all other the credit of whom he holdeth doubtful vnsure Now in the nuÌ„ber of those of sacred authority he hath neither Tobias nor Iudith nor any one of their companions h Spec. Aug S. Austen doth witnes that the Iewes do not accepte
In 1. King 14. second place so much hee doth and no more But in a u Homil 34 in quadraâ—… 〈◊〉 third he not only hath these distinctioÌ„s of Angels but he alleageth for it Dionysius also that by the name of Areopagita calliÌ„g him an ancieÌ„t venerable Father But this is a single testimony al other of more antiquity make against him he may be supposed to do it doubtfully since naming the matter thrise he speaketh of Denis but once And moreover Gregory lived 600. yeares after Christ by which time this bastard might be a huÌ„dred or two huÌ„dred yeare old with some might be esteemed authentical which Gregory might take vp froÌ„ theÌ„ without farther examinatioÌ„ He who list to see this Denis farther discovered quite discarded let him look that noble u Lib. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Moâ—…ney writiÌ„g touching the Masse if he be not impudeÌ„tly refractary he shall be sileÌ„ced in this point for ever Thus you are like to make good work with your Fathers when the first of your tale is filâ—… populi a bastard seed which cannot inherite What you say of Ignatius ClemeÌ„s Iustâ—… TertulliaÌ„ Cyprâ—… Irâ—…us all the Fathers is a vain Popish Pilcher-like bragge which is ordinary with such crakers as you are till you cite some particular deserveth no answere but to be denied If you meant truely to your Readers you would cite them somewhat for their mony T. HILL THis is very plaine in that the Cathâ—… are put compelled by the Protestants to defend 〈◊〉 vpâ—…la the â—…dit authority of thâ—… said Fathers for the Protestantes raile as them the Catholikes defend them the Protestants refuse their authority the Catholikes holde iâ—… for 〈◊〉 the Protestants will not be â—…yed by them the Catholikes appealâ—… to their iudgement and to be bâ—…fe the Protestants make no more acâ—…te of them longer then they can wrest them to serue their 〈◊〉 thâ—… they dâ—… of Bevis of Southampton or of Adam Bell. And in 〈◊〉 the Protestantes I include all the Puriâ—…es for I am not ignorâ—… how the sâ—… Protestants are driven by the said Puritanâ—… to defende thâ—… Fathers and also are called Papistes for their labour And â—…re by iâ—… iâ—…â—…fest that the Fathers are with the Catholikes and â—…her 〈◊〉 the Protests â—…r 〈◊〉 And vvhither all thâ—… 〈◊〉 being men of exceâ—… wits of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of â—…rfull lâ—…ing servent in praier holy in conversation greatly in Gods favour mighty in working of miracles and adorned with many such like giftes vvere more like to vnderstands the Scriptures freshlie delivered vnto them from the Apostles theÌ„selues who also no doubt taught their scholors the true sence thereof and they theirs from one age to another or these late foolishe vnstudied vnlearned prophane and arregant fellowes bee iudges your selues G. ABBOT 3 TILL you came to this Period you spake something of your owne peradventure but now you are apparantly become but eveÌ„ a plaine truÌ„ke to cary along what your M. x Motiv 14 Bristow putteth into you froÌ„stealing out of whose booke you cannot coÌ„taine if your hands were bouÌ„d behind you If hee then lash lye you thinke you may do so also as lying safe vnder his shilde But his target is no thicke one as that y â—…vid Meâ—…amorph Lib 13 seveÌ„-folde buckler of Aâ—…ax was but made of thinne browne paper therfore wil not beare out one blowe I pray you where are you forced to vphold the Fathers credite against the Protestants railing at theÌ„ or who of the Protestants be they that give them not the same right which God would haue to be giveÌ„ vnto theÌ„ or which they theÌ„selues desired should be allotted vnto their writiÌ„gs We hold them their labours to be great instruments of the setting forth of Gods glory we esteeme it as a good blessing froÌ„ aboue that the Lord hath left their labors as monuments to his church wherein we not only know what was done taught in the first ages of the christiaÌ„ world but may be helped also many waies in the vnderstaÌ„ding of Scriptures beating downe of divers heresies And our men do study theÌ„ are as copious frequent in theÌ„ as Papists be which if you will you may see in the bookes of Bishop Iewel D. HuÌ„fry D. Folke Peter Martyr CheÌ„nicius yea M. Calvins InstitutioÌ„s to say nothing of divers now liviÌ„g Truth it is that when our men made the true touch-stoÌ„e only absolute Iudge of coÌ„troversies to be the Scripture Harding his coÌ„panions in effect flying froÌ„ that would needes beare the world in hand that if the triall might be by the Fathers the victory was certainly theirs Whervpon in England as also in other places before they who stood for reformation refusing theÌ„ at no weapon ioyned with them there and now as persons of desperate deplorate misery you haue nothing to helpe you but by foisting and iugling in chaungelings vpstarts counterfeits in steed of vndoubted ones by razing and curtolling and clipping the works of those reverend meÌ„ as anone I shal shew you It is therfore a grosse slauÌ„der that we do raile at them or that we do wrest them Where there is iust cause we as men z Horat. l. 11 Apistol 1 Nullius adâ—icti iurare in verba magistri bound to stand to the opinion of none but of the holy Ghost we declining-wise do leave theÌ„ but where they subscribe to the authority of God there we subscribe to them defend them refuse not to be tried by them so farre as we may by any holy learned men of which sort we hold them but yet stil know them to be men As for Bevis of Southampton Adam bell we hold to be but fictions such as were devised in the time of Popery and thought fitte then togither with other Legends to be imparted to the people that when they should rather haue looked into the word of God if they might haue bin suffered they being busied with such toies might not grow to be of such Christian vnderstaÌ„ding as to espy the idolatries collusions of the Clergy When a maÌ„ who speaketh vntruth coÌ„meth to examinatioÌ„ his tongue faltereth in his mouth his tale crosseth it selfe So doth yours who attempting both to soupe and blow at once make no bones to speake as good as flat coÌ„tradictions Simul forbere flare Eraâ—m in Adage In the one sentence the Protestante raile at theÌ„ refuse their authority make no more account of theÌ„ then of Adam Bel in the next the Protestants are driven by the Puritanes to defend the Fathers they are called Papists for their labour So they do defend them not defend them They raile on them yet speake for them This is one of the riddles fit for b Terent. in Andrias Oedipus And yet the Fathers are against both the Protestants the Puritanes And why then I request you do the ProtestaÌ„ts
so maintaine them For such dissolute dawbing of paper you are worthy to be rewarded at least with nothing It may be said of you your maister Bristow c Virgils Eclog. 3 Et vitula tu dignus hic It cannot be denied that some men of learning haue disliked the over-much heaping vp of Sentences out of the Fathers to no purpose or needlessely especially if it haue bin done in Latin or Greeke wheÌ„ SermoÌ„s are made to the ordinary people in the vulgar tongue But the iudgmeÌ„t of the most iudicious such as respect the edificatioÌ„ of the heaters wil warraÌ„t this their opinion while it dislâ—…keth not the vse but the abuse But that any maÌ„ of learning in our church or of true accouÌ„t in our state haue simply coÌ„dcÌ„ned the vsing of theÌ„ you caÌ„not shew Some weaker men in a little humâ—…ur haue seemed to bee no great favourets of theÌ„ paâ—…tly because they know them not as d 〈◊〉 in Adâ—…gijs Knowledge hath none more eger enemy theÌ„ 〈◊〉 persoÌ„ partly because they haue not learning to vnderstaÌ„d theÌ„ Also because they wil not be at cost to buy theÌ„ or if these impedâ—…eÌ„ts were remooved because they wil not take the paines to read theÌ„ But even such do daily more more reforme their iudgmeÌ„t we doubt not but God who hath put the spirit of moderatioÌ„ temperaÌ„te into the greatest wisest most learned of such as in times past were otherwise minded wil loine vs al in one against you the coÌ„mon enemies of the truth who in an Italionated out-landish faction litle care what you do And so I trust every English maÌ„ defiring to keepe himself in spiritual purity e Iacobâ—… 27 Motiv 14. vnspotted of the world Poperty the odious names of Puritans Precisias wherat you haue so triuÌ„phed shall to the greefe of your harts be extirpated al who loue the Gospel ioining in one as ChristiaÌ„s brethreÌ„ shal be dutiful subiects to God our King Your conclusion is ridiculous worthy to be hissed at The Protestants defend the Fathers against the Puritanes Ergo the Fathers be against both the Protestants and the Puritanes This is Logicke of the Popish Seminary 4 The titles which you heere bestow on the ancient Fathers Bristow setteth downe thus f 〈◊〉 14. excellent wits continual study woÌ„derfull learning servent praier holy coÌ„versation favour in Gods sight mighty working of infinite miracles froÌ„ whence froÌ„ the rest the Reader may iudge whether you had not Bristowes booke lying before you wheÌ„ you skuffled togither this Rhapâ—…ody As for these praises we neither envy theÌ„ nor deny theÌ„ to those great laÌ„pes of the first Church vnlesse it be that of working of miracles wherof we make a doubt And by these helps we say that they were wel furnished to vnderstand expound many things in the Scripture as also somewhat by their neerenesse to the time of the Apostles in those places especially where truth was kepte without mingling And yet we will you heere to remember that fewe or scant any one of the Fathers had the Scriptures freshly delivered vnto him from the Apostles themselues you are pitifully out for diverse hundreds of yeeres came betweene Christes disciples and the most of the olde Doctours And againe to call to minde that soone after the Apostles yea as g Eccl. Hist. Lib 3. 26. Eusebius saith immediately after their death heretakes came plentifully in who laboured what they coulde to corrupt the fountaines wheÌ„ce all pure water was to flowe Remember also that for three hundred yeeres by the extremity of persecutioÌ„ the Pastours were few they had little liberty to come togither to conferre about thinges questioned or to follow their studies so much as they would And yet farther remeÌ„ber that some of theÌ„ came late froÌ„ the Gentiles as Cyprian some froÌ„ heretiks as Eusebius froÌ„ the ArriaÌ„s AusteÌ„ the Manichees somefroÌ„ meere secular callings as Ambrose of al these without Gods special grace they might a little participate Then he is bliÌ„d who seeth not that they had not al those helps as these haue whoÌ„ you cal late folish vnstudied vnlearned profane arrogaÌ„t fellowes These words you vse when you Doctour Hill are not worthy to be sorted with the meanest of a thousand among them which speech without amplification or any diminution may be iustifyed onely in the present Church of England For first wee have the writinges of all those Fathers themselves like to which every private man of them had not no nor all the world neither before their times Secondly since their daies there be infinite bookes written which give light to matters in controversy Thirdly our age by meanes of printing hath better facility to come by al bookes theÌ„ those ancient times had Fourthly progres of daies hath made many thiÌ„gs plainer to later ages because they haue bin already fulfilled theÌ„ they could be to former tims wherin meÌ„ did but gesse at theÌ„ Fifthly God hath made the scriptures of such sort as that meÌ„s wits are to be exercised in theÌ„ vntil y e day of iudgmeÌ„t it beloÌ„geth to that industry which God requireth in his servaÌ„ts y e they shold not satisfy theÌ„selues w t the labours of others so growidle bue they shold search farther inventis addâ—…re Sixthly the helpe of the toÌ„gues is more rife now then it was amoÌ„g the ordinary sorte of them as may be seene by Athanasius who was so stuÌ„bled in the h Prov. 8. 22 8. Chap. of the Proverbs the i Athanas. in decret Nicen. Synod ArriaÌ„s to prove Christ a creature vrging thence by the traÌ„slatioÌ„ of the Septuagint that it is in the text k 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Septuag The Lord made mee or created me the beginning of his waies to which without difficulties he might easily haue aunswered if hee had looked into the l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Hebrew where it is rather as Hierome readeth it the Lord possessed mee or as Arias Montanus hath it the Lord got or obtained me Also Austen had no Hebrew and both he Gregory very little Greek as els-where I have shewed Now although it be likely that neerest to the fountaines the waters runne most cleerely the farther of that we are they are the more likly to be polluted yet in spirituall thinges that is not to bee vnderstood of place or time but of keeping close to the original of the writen word and not varying from it And so a man furnished by God as m Exod. 31 〈◊〉 Beseleel was to the framing of the Tabernacle may be by the means aboue named and by praier conference study nothing inferiour to those first lightes even as S. Austen was more excellent in some of his expositions on the Scripture then Origene and some other more ancient then himselfe were Which as both for him S. Hierome especially
bedde-stuffe vvere of a moderate and competent quality neither to neate nor too verie abiect bicause in these for the most parte men doe either vse insoleutlie to boast themselves or to abiecte themselves by both not seeking those thinges vvhich are Iesus CHRISTES but their ovvne But this blessed man as I saye kepte the meane neither declining to the right hand nor to the lefts Thus saith Possidonius wherevpon Erasmus fitly asketh this question n Observat. in margine UUhere was thou the letherne girdle and the blacke coule But besides this they haue forged certaine o Ad fratres in eremo books in the name of S. Augustine as if he the Bishoppe of Hippon had given orders and instructions to his Friers vnder him But this is as like the worke of S. Austen as an Owle is like an Eagle or a Cuckow to a Nightingale as the improbability of many things vvhich are in it the basenesse of the matter the barbarousnesse of the stile the foolish and shamelesse narrations and many other thinges maye demonstrate to every one who hath but halfe an eie or one graine of salt in him Yet so must Popery bee peeced togither with a faire title at the least although the stuffe be rotten 21 Heere looke we backe a little to the ancient Monkes and not any way curiously to trace their originall were there not even almost in the very time of their first institution many absurdities and incongruous superstitions which did creepe in every one by a voluntary will-worship adding what he thought good Was not the great p Sozo 1 13 Anthony who had so many followers a man vtterly vnlearned and did not he thinke even the least knovvledge a hinderance to his speculatiue devotion Did not the Heremits shew great presumption when being but simple persons diverse of them they wilfully refused the society of men the fellowship of cōmunion of Saints by their solitarynesse putting themselues more freely vpō Sathans temptations by debarring their soules of the word preached the Sacrament of the Lordes supper received and the comfort of the Minister or any other Christian brother Did not the too exquisite severity of q Lib 3 13 Eustathius the Monke who is supposed to be the true authour of the book intituled 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 cōmonly reported to be S. Basiles where so much is of the life discipline of Monks grow to absurd observations and such as were quite disagreeing from the laws Ecclesiastical There are reckoned vp many opinions of him his scholers which were condemned in a Councel at Gangrae as that he disliked mariage would not pray in their houses who were wedded despised maryed Priests thought rich men to be shut out frō heaven detested those who eate flesh and other such like monkish imaginations Some women perswaded by him or his leste their husbands put on mens apparrel and fell to adultery These persons lived about the time of the fore-named Fathers who in their bookes cōmended the good parts which were then exercised doubtles gaue those precepts which they did giue to reforme the abuses And as succeeding generations came on did not the superstitious devises of Monks increase as is to be seene in Evagrius Some did shut themselues into little houses r Evagr hist Eccl. l 1 21 which were so low narrow as that they could neither stand vpright in thē nor ly otherwise then double Some both men women living in the wildernes did onely cover their privities for the rest went naked both in the hottest coldest wether Some refusing all foode of men did eate only the grasse of the ground would not endure the presence of any persons but woulde run away and hide them in the rockes Other counterfeyting themselues fooles laboured to bee without all passion These woulde not refuse to goe into tavernes or brothel-houses they would be in bathes with women and as among men they lived as men so among women they were as women Yet did those ages so doate vpon monkery that even these were commended and helde for holy men Thus if wee take these olde lads in their best times they had imperfections inough but of the good qualities which were in any of them those vvho came after embraced but a few Onely the ignorance of Anthony went almost currant through all that was as good as hereditary to them But the olde devoute service of God was of late turned into hypocrisie fasting into perpetuall belly-cheere scarcity and penury into aboundance and lordly possessions of landes charity was converted into hart-burning and envie humility into pride sobriety into Venereous and Sodomitish lust their piety was but formality their idolatry was infinite Thus it grewe forwarde by little and little till it came to the height of vngodlinesse Howe soone this beganne maye bee gathered by him vvho vvrote the treatise commonlye called Cyprians De duplici martyrio There vvee thus read s Cypr. de dupl mart Not anie deserte place sacke-cloath for a garment pulse for meate neither fasting nor lying on the bare grounde doe make a perfect monke Under these covers lyeth hid sometimes a minde verie worldly which is so discovered if they bee called to any Ecclesiasticall office There you shall see some of them most easilie to bee overcome vvith delightes more impatient of iniuries more desirous of vengance then any other of the ordinarie people What is the cause Because they haue more exercised the body then the minde This began betimes but as they grew in yeares so many of them grew in horrible wickednes It is a long while since s Eccl. Hist. Ang l 4 25 Beda lived yet in his Ecclesiasticall story he mencioneth that a Monastery called Colindiurbem was consumed with fire for the lasciviousnes and wantonnes which was there founde in both men and women So did God punish them But in S. Bernards time a carnall kinde of behavior had over-growne almost all which caused him earnestly passionatly to complaine t Bernard in cena Domini cap 3. How many monkes be there in S. Benedicts monastery who do laugh when other men doe mourne who reioice when other are sadde In their bodie they are cloistered in their mindes wanderers and never standing still Slow to their reading tardy to their praying in the Church sleeping in the refectory vvaking For their long watchings grieving but for their long bankets reioicing This was the mortified life of many monkes in that holy mans daies And how this was afterwarde amended in England may bee testified by the survey which by Visitation of the Kings Commissioners was taken vnder King Henry the eight of famous memory when by othes of the religious persons themselues much Sodomitry other vncleannesse was detected and afterwarde was published to the world by a printed booke some notes wherof are to be seene in the French Apology of u Cap. 21 Henry Stephanus made in defence of Herodotus