against his wicked doctrine euen as he shoulde be and as these wranglers in the like case must be The place well marked shal serue our turne when so euer we heare them so impudently reiect scriptures because they impugne their heresies which els shoulde be as good scriptures as any booke of the Bible if they either woulde make with them or by any crafty colouring not plainely make against them Thus he sayth Nec ideo liber Sapientiae qui tanta numerositate annorum legi meruit in ecclesia Christi pati debet iniuriam quoniam resistit eis qui pro meritis hominum falluntur rursus omnibus hic liber tractatoribus anteponendus quoniam sibi cum anteposuerunt etiam temporibus Apostolorum proximi egregij tractatores qui eum testem adhibentes nihil se adhibere nisi diuinum testimonium crediderūt in English thus It is no reason that the booke of VVisdom which so many worlde 's together hath bene worthy the reading in the Church of Christ shoulde nowe receiue such wrong at our handes because it plainely resisteth these fellowes that exalt mans merites aboue Gods grace And againe this booke is of more authority then all the expositours in the worlde for the noble writers hard by the Apostles time did much preferre this booke before them selues who alleaging the testimony of that scripture doubted not but they vsed thereby the witnesse of Gods holy word Euen so must we tell our maisters that it were plaine wrong to discredit the history of the Machabees which hath bene in our Bible euer sith Christes time for holy Scripture because it hath an euident testimonie against their false belefe concerning the state of the soules departed which booke is not onely better to be beleued then all Caluins false gloses but of more authority then all holy expositors Out of which booke both S. Augustine others many haue vsed proofe of their matters as of the testimonie of Sacred and holy scripture 2 I will not gaine saye but who so denyeth the authority of the holy Scriptures thereby bewrayeth him selfe to be an heretike as all Papistes doe which I will proue afterwarde But he that admitteth for scripture that which is not proceded from the spirite of God and thereby will auouch for trueth that which is contrary to the vndoubted worde of God is no lesse heretike then he for it is all one sinne to adde to the worde of God and to take from it But M. Allen pretending to proue the booke of Machabees canonicall by authority of the Church when he can not by consent that it hath with the scriptures of God beginneth with the authority of Hieronym in prol Mach. But what he meaneth thereby or what place he noteth I know not But this I knowe that in his Preface vpon the booke of kinges he doth not onely omit it in rehersall of the canonicall bookes but also accompteth it plainely among the Apocryphall Next he alleageth the canons of the Apostles Wise canons I promise you as truely made by the Apostles as the double canons that lie on the tower hyll of London In which are rehersed 3. bookes of Machabees two Epistles of Clemens for canonicall scripture but the Apocalypse of S. Iohn hath no place at all by which it may appeare what Apostles they were that made that canckred canon Then followeth the prouinciall Councell of Carthage the third which nameth the 2. bookes of the Machabees amonge the canonicall scriptures euen as it doth the 5. bookes of Salomon whereas the Church alloweth but 3. namely the Prouerbes the preacher and the Canticles and although you shoulde numbre to these the booke of Wisdome yet can you make but 4. in all that we know of Againe in what sence they did call those bookes canonicall appereth by Augustine that was one of that Councell namely that they maye be reade so it be with iudgement Contra 2. Gaudentij epistolam lib. 2. cap. 23. Et hanc quidem scripturam quae appellatur Machabaeorum non habent Iudaei sicut legem Prophetas Psalmos quibus dominus testimonium perhibet tanquam testibus suis dicens oportet impleri omnia quae scripta sunt in lege prophetis in psalmis de me Sed recepta est ab ecclesia non inutiliter si sobriè legatur audiatur And this scripture of the Machabees the Iewes compte not as the lawe and the prophetes and the Psalmes to whome our Lorde geueth testimony as to his witnesses saying it behoued that all thinges should be fulfilled that were written of me in the lawe and in the Prophetes and in the Psalmes But it is receiued of the Church not vnprofitably if it be soberly reade and harde Here you see that Augustine howsoeuer he alloweth those bookes yet he alloweth them not in full authority with the lawe Prophetes and Psalmes nor with out condition of sobriety in the reader or hearer But Hieronym sayth plainely the Church receiueth them not as canonicall scriptures in his preface vpon the booke of Prouerbes Sicut ergo Iudith Tobiae Machabaeorum libros legit quidem ecclesia sed eos inter canonicas scripturas non recipit Sic haec duo volumina legat ad aedificationem plaebis non ad authoritatem ecclesiasticorum dogmatum confirmandam Therefore euen as the Church readeth in deede the bookes of Iudith Tobias and Machabees but yet receiueth them not among the canonicall scriptures so maye she reade these 2. bookes videlicet Ecclesiasticus and the booke of Wisdome falsely intitled to Salomon for the edification of the people but not to confirme the authority of ecclesiasticall opinions Thus if Augustine doe simply allowe these bookes you haue Hieronym that doth simply refuse them If Augustine saye the Church receiueth them for canonicall Hieronym sayth the Church receiueth them not for canonicall As for Damascene except you woulde stryue with numbre of witnesses I know not why you alleage him being one to whose iudgement as but a late writer in comparison you know we ascribe small credit I might produce against him Athanasius or at leste wise one of elder time then Damascene vnder the name of Athanasius but that I haue alleaged already is sufficient to represse that vaine and vnskilfull insultation that you vse in so many wastfull wordes against vs for refusing the authority of him that abridged Iason the Cyrenians bookes for canonicall scriptures 3 But our aduersary learned not this practise of Pelagius onely for it is an older sore and a common sicknesse to all deuisers of deuilish doctrine as the skillfull in the Churchies affaires may acknowledge For some there were that otherwise coulde not vpholde heresy but by the vtter deniall of all the olde Testament as Carpocrates Ceuerus Manicheus But Marcion and Cerdon reiect all together sauyng Lukes Gospel Now Cerinthus and Ebion make counte of none of all the Euangelicall histories but the Gospell of Matthewe Cerinthus againe and Seuerus
whome the papistes counte no parte of their church but schismatikes conuerted the Moscouites first of all vnto the profession of the name of Christ which yet continue in their religion being neither the true faith nor yet popish religion As for the popish church as it is certeine that it hath peruerted and corrupted all partes of the Latine or Westerne Church with Idolatry and false religion so it shal be harde for the papistes to proue that it hath conuerted any Nation from Gentility to the popish religion except some partes of Germanie and them by force of armes rather than by preaching and reaching as appeareth by the conuersion of Liuonia Anno Domini 1200. of Prussia Anno Domini 1254. and of Lithuania Anno Domini 1386. wherefore I conclude that seeing I haue shewed that our Church holding the true doctrine of the Apostles is that which conuerted all nations to true religion and that the popish church hath not conuerted any people to true religion nor all people to the profession of the name of Christ this chalenger whosoeuer he be do the recant The second article conteyneth 4. demandes 1 I aske of him what Church it was which hath induced the Christian people through the whole worlde to geue most humble credit in all points to the holy bookes of the Byble I Aunswere it was the Church of Christ and not the Popish church which hath commended the bookes of holy Scripture to be beleued of all true Christians where soeuer they be although it be the office of the holy Ghost to open the hartes of men and to forme them that they may beleue the scripture to be true like as it is the office of the scripture or worde of God to trie and examine whether it be the spirite of God that perswadeth vs to beleue any thing so the spirite beareth witnesse to the worde and the worde to the spirite As for the popish church it coulde not induce the Christian people to geue credit to the scripture in all pointes because she is contrarie to the scripture in many pointes and euen in the cheefest pointes of Christian Religion namely in pointes concerning the glorie of God and the saluation of mankinde geuing the glory of God to dead men and dumbe Images and denying the mercy of God pourchased by the onely sacrifice of Christes death to be the onely cause of mans saluation Finally seeing it is manifest by the aunswere to the first article that the popish church did not conuerte all nations to the profession of the Christian faith it is euident thereby that the popish church did not induce all them that are called Christians to geue credit to the bookes of the holy Bible as this chalenger woulde haue it to be thought 2 VVhat Church hath had the discerning seuering of them from other writinges of all sortes THe Church of Christ hath not an absolute authority to allow or refuse bookes of the scripture but a iudgment to discerne true writinge from counterfaicts the word of God of infallible verity from the writing of men which might erre this iudgement she hath not of her selfe but of the holy Ghost as for the popish Church it can not be said to haue this iudgemēt of discerning the scripture of God from other writings not only because she is so blind that she can not discerne betwene the Canonical bookes of the scripture from the Apocrypha writings as appereth by receauing the bookes of the Machabees Ecclesiasticus c. to be of equall authoritie with the bookes of the Law Psalmes c. but also because she is so presumptuous as to compel men to beleue that Customes and traditions writinges of doctors decrees of Popes and Councells are equall with the authoritie of God his worde yea are of force to alter and change the lawe of God and the institution of Christ set forth vnto vs in the scripture And although she boast that she receaueth all the bookes of scripture yet this proueth no more that she is the Church of Christ than was the churches of the Arrians Donatistes Nouatians Euthychans other heretikes which receiued the Bible as well as the Popish church 3 VVhat Church hath had the custodie of them and most safely hath preserued them for the necessary vse of God his people and from the corruption of aduersaries as well of Iewes as heretikes of all sortes THe prouidence of God hath alwayes preserued the Scripture both from the violence of tyrants from the falshoode of heretikes and hath neuer suffred the true Church to be destitute of the necessarie vse thereof But the popish church hath not kept the scripture for the necessary vse of the people which hath so kept it in an vnknowen tongue that the people coulde haue no vse much lesse the necessary vse thereof wherefore if this be a note of the Catholike Church to kepe the worde of God for the necessarie vse of God his people it is plaine that the popish church is not the Catholike Church which hath kept the scripture so that God his people coulde haue no vse thereof And if the only custodie of the scripture from corruption of heretikes be a sure note of the Church why is not the Greeke Church the Catholike Church which vnto this day hath kept the scripture as safely as the popish church why are not other Estern Churches of Asia which neuer acknowledged the Pope or popish religion true Churches which likewise haue preserued the scripture as we haue seen of late that the newe Testament is printed in the Syrian tongue at themperours charges for the encrease of Christian faith among them And finally why are not the Iewes the Catholike Church which haue kept the old Testament in Hebrue more faithfully than euer the Papistes And because they boast of safe preseruing of the scriptures all men that are learned in the tongues can testifie in how corrupt a Latin translation they haue kept the scriptures both of the olde and of the new Testament 4 And let the Protestant declare to me that their Congregation hath had from time to time or euer had right herein or any other Church sauing the Catholike Church and I recant OVr Congregation which is the body of Christ hath euer had both right and possession of the inestimable treasure of the word of Christ her heade as appeareth by this that our Church and Congregation beleueth nothing but that she learneth in it acknowledgeth that all thinges profitable to saluation are sufficiently conteined in it and finally in all thinges submitteth her selfe to the iudgemēt of it But the popish church which beleueth many thinges contrarie to the scripture teacheth many thinges beside the scripture necessary to saluation and refuseth to haue her faith doctrine and ceremonies to be iudged by the scripture neither hath neither euer had any right to the scripture though she haue neuer so many bookes of them in possession Wherefore these thinges considered this chalenger
were approued in S. Augustines and S. Ambroses times abrogated and disanulled either because they were vnprofitable or else hurtful Last of all what superstitious vsages doth the church of Rome still approue euen such as the wiser sort of Papistes are ashamed of 5 Or that she suffereth any man damnably abusing her religion without open reprehension thereof proue any of these thinges and I recant THe true Church of Christ in such places as she is suffereth no man damnably abusing her Religion with out open â—eprehension as in the dayes of VValdo VVickleffe Husse c. whereof sufficient mention is made before but because she is not in all places at all times many men yea whole nations may damnably erre and not be reprehended of her As all the Mahometistes which occupie the greatest part of the world who doth or hath alwaies openly reprehended them And the Romish Church can well enough abide the true Religion of Christ to be damnably abused not onely without reprehension but also with allowing For when the Friars Dominicanes Franciscans had forged a newe Gospell out of the doctrine of Ioaâ—himus and the visions of Cyril which they called the Gospell of the holy Ghost the Gospell that should endure hereafter the euerlasting Gospell which diuilish gospell they affirmed to be so much more perfect then the Gospell of Christ as the Sunne is more perfect then the Moone a kernell of a nut before the shell yet did not the Church of Rome once reprehend it So that it was cultiued 55 yeares and at length set forth to be openly expounded in the Vniuersitie of Paris Anno Dom. 1255. without open reprehension of any but such as were counted heretikes for their labour As Gulielmus de S. Amore Gerardus Sagurellus c. And finally when the matter was brought before the Pope Anno Dom. 1256. by Gulielmus de S. Amore and other sent from the Vniuersitie of Paris the Pope and the Cardinalls tooke oâ—der that it shoulde be priuily burned and not openly reprehended for shaming their orders Mathaeus Paris Whereby it is clearely proued that the Romish Church hath suffered wicked men damnably to abuse Religion without open or priuie reprehension for the space of 55. yeares and at length without open reprehension when there was no remedie but it must needes be reprehended wherefore if there be any grace in you you will recant The 28. article conteyneth 3. demandes 1 If vnitie in Faith austeritie of life sharpe discipline great penance much fasting large almes godly deuotion obedience to higher powers grauitie and constancie in all cases be not the signes of the true Church IF you aske of true Faith repentance discipline c. these might be signes of the true Church but if you meane vnitie in any faith c as it seemeth by your wordes the Mahometistes and Turkes are the true Church for they haue vnitie in their faith austeritie of life sharpe discipline fasting almes deuotion obedience grauitie Constance c. as much or rather more then the popish church 2 Or be not more in our Church then in their Congregation I recant YOu haue not vnitie in true faith for you knowe not what it meaneth but are vtter enemies vnto it and in your owne principles there is no vnitie whether the Pope or the Councell be superior c. you may as all hypocrites pretende austeritie of life when you are most luxurious riotors as the world knoweth your discipline is not so sharpe but money wil make it blunt you haue great penance but no true repentance you haue much abstinence from meates which is the doctrine of diuills but you fast as litle as other men your almes are large but without faith and therefore sinne your deuotion is blinde and not godly but like her mother Ignorance you are disobedient to Christian Magistrates submitting your selues to Antichrist your grauitie and constancie in all cases is better commended of your self then knowne of other men Wherefore being voyde euen of these which you make the signes of the true Church you are none of the true Church except you recant 3 But if discorde in religion licentiousnes in lyuing contempt of Discipline reiecting of penance lothesomnesse of fasting lacke of zeale and deuotion disobedience to Magistrates sacriledge apostacie breach of vowes vnlawfull lustes wantonnesse in all life and maners if these thinges I say agree not better to the Protestants than the Catholikes or if these be not the plaine signes and fructes of a false church and doctrine I recant WE acknowledge that in the outward face of our church be many hypocrites chargeable with these crimes that you speake of and we yelde our selues guiltie before God of greuous offences that our life is not aunswerable vnto our doctrine Neuerthelesse we doubt not but God for Christ his sake will haue mercy vpon vs But if in life and conuersation we be compared with you Papistes euen the cheefest of your church as Popes Cardinalls Byshoppes Monkes c. We dare approue our life to be honester both before God and men You shall neuer be able to charge vs with such ryot whoredome adulterie incest sodomitry bestiality murther poysoning necromancie apostasie blasphemie c. as both the worlde seeth to ouerflowe in your Prelates at this daye and we are able to bring forth of your owne Cronicles and Hystories to haue ben committed in times past wherefore for very shame leaue of this comparison We meinteine no stewes neither of males nor females we set forth no bookes in commendation of Sodomitry we exact no tribute of Courâ—isans to kepe open bawdrie we priuiledge no writinges that teache men to committe vylanie worthy of a thousand deathes Therefore be not so impudent to charge vs with these crimes aboue the Papistes but rather forsake that filthie whore the mother of all fornication and recant The 29. article conteyneth 8. demandes 1 Let any Protestant in the worlde proue vnto me that their church coulde rightly be called Catholike which was so particular that no man aliue coulde name a place where any such church was WHy might not our Church when it was most hidden be as rightly called Catholike as the Church of the Apostles when it was so particular that it was coÌ„teined in the narrow bondes of Iury for it is not called Catholike because it shoulde be euery where for that it neuer was nor shal be But because that where so euer it be in partes it is one body of christ The Popish church is not in euery parte of the worlde For Mahomets sect is in the greatest parte Many cuntries are Idolaters and the most parte of them that professe the name of Christ are not in the felowship of the Popish church And whereas you saye that no man aliue coulde name the place where it was you make an impudent lye For although it were vnknowen to the Papistes and enemies thereof yet was it knowen to the true members therof It was in Italie wheÌ„
to the places of punishment in the next life let them with purgatory rase vp the fathers resting place so plainely set forth by scripture beleued of the whole Church and alwayes taught by the holy fathers Yea let them that will haue no place for sinners finde with blasphemie hell like torments for Gods owne Sonne with the damned spirites My hearte surely will scarse serue me to report it and yet cursed Caluine was not afearde to write it and with arrogant vauntes against the blessed fathers to auouch the same That miserable forsaken man sawe that the onely graunt of the olde fathers punishment by the lacke of euerlasting ioye might of force driue him to acknowledge that God sometimes exerciseth his iustice vpon those which he loueth in the next life and so consequently that Purgatory paynes might be inferred therevppon therefore he fell headelong to this horrible blasphemye that Christ went not to loose any from the paynes of the next life but to be punished in hell with the deadely damned him selfe for to amend the lacke of his passion vppon the Crosse. O our cursed tyme O corrupt conditions this beast writeth thus agaynst our blessed Sauiours death and against the sufficiency of the abundant price of our redemption and yet he liueth in mans memory yea his bookes be greedely redd redde Nay by such as would be counted the chiefe of the cleargy and beare Byshops names they are commaunded to be redde and the very booke wherein this all other detestable doctrine is vttered especially by their authority commended to the simple Curats study that they might there learne closely in deuilish bookes such wicked heresies as the preachers them selues dare not yet in the light of the world vtter nor maintaine But other be not so farre fallen therefore they must of reason confesse that God by iust correction hath before Christes comming visited in the next world many hundred yeares togither the sinnes of those whome he dearly loued Although not onely in all that time the soules of the holy Patriarches felt the lacke of the aboundant fruition of the Maiesty but also for sinne they both then in rest and now in vnspeakeable felicity want till this day the encrease of ioy and blesse that by the receauing of their bodyes yet lying in dust they are vndoubtedly sure of Therfore it is ouer much presumption to limit the maiesty of God in the gouernment of his owne creatures to the borders of our short life and almost it toucheth his very prouidence with iniury to say that he letteth him scape without punishment for his sinnes that repented not till the houre of death as for whom he hath no scourge in the next life as he had here if death had not preuented his purpose These childish cogitations can not stand with the righteousnes of his will that for the first sinne committed doth not onely punish many euerlastingly of the forsaken sorte but also for the same punisheth both his best beloued in earth and for a time abateth the felicity of the blessed Sainctes in heauen But I will not stray after these men My matter is so fruitefull that I may not roue And though the sectes of these dayes haue so infected euery braunch of our christian faith that a man can not well ouerpasse them what so euer he taketh in hand yet I will not medle with them no further then shall concerne the quicke of our cause and the necessary light of our matter 5 Now this lusty gallaunt as though he had fully repayred and fortified the olde ruinous and battered towers of limbus patrum with canuas paynted walls he standeth vpon his bulwarke of browne paper and cryeth defiaunce to all his enemies and especially he vttereth his spite agaynst Caluine as a notorious enemy of his cause quarel Whom because he is to young to encounter withall by any witt learning reason or truth he spitteth out against him most impudent sclaunders raylings and lyes in which faculty he hath striued so much to shew him selfe eloquent that not satisfying him selfe with the voyce of a man he hath borrowed the tongue of the Deuill him selfe or at the least wise for feare he should not lye throughly geuen ouer his shamelesse tongue to be wagged by the father of lyes For what man with any shewe of humane reason would accuse Caluine to deny the sufficiency of the redemptiō of Christ to affirme that Christ went downe into hell after his death to be punished there with the damned him selfe for to amend the lacke of his passion vpon the crosse whose doctrine God him selfe the Angells and all the world doth knowe and testifie to be directly contrary to these sclaunders For who euer more constantly affirmed or more substantially proued the sufficiency of our redemption by Christes death what asse so vnlearned if he can but conster Caluins latine in his catechisme institutions or any part of his workes where he entreateth of that article of Christes descense in to hell may not plainly see that he vtterly denieth his descending into hell after his life affirming the same to be vnderstood of the wrath of God which he sustayned for our sinnes before his death at that time especially when he that was God complained that he was forsaken of God which mystery if M. Allen vnderstand not it is no maruell seeing he abridgeth so much the benefite of Christes redemption as all papistes doe alwayes and he specially in this his defence of purgatory and yet he is not ashamed to say of Caluine this beaste writeth against our blessed Sauiours death If I did not moderate somwhat my corrupt affections I could requite him the like reproches but this much I must needes say Is Caluine a beast for speaking the truth to the glory of Christes redemption Allen an honest man for sclaundering him to the defacing of Gods honour But because he would not be thought to haue spued oute all his poison against Caluine he goulpeth vp an other bowlefull of rayling and sclaundering against our Bishoppes who haue not onely suffered but also commended Caluins bookes to be reade and studied of the simple curates affirming that they doe priuily set forth by books that which they dare not openly preach If euery man that can be a witnesse that M. Allen lyeth in this matter should pull one heare from his heade or bearde they would leaue him neuer an heare of an honest man behinde them But that he maie returne to his gentle aduersaries with whome is lesse daungerous dealing there be some he sayth that graunt the punishment of the fathers after their death of whose liberall concession he doubteth not but to patch vp his Purgatory In which practise he is not vnlike a fonde fellowe of whome I haue hearde men iest in Cambridge who when he was non plus as they terme it in disputation and all his argument spent that he had prouided Now sayth he will I dispute of your concesses
in other places where he was free from contention with the saide sects he euer in expresse termes grounded the doctrine of Purgatory vpō the Apostles wordes Yea euen in the same answere to the aduersary he was so mindefull of Gods iustice in the world to come and ferd lest he might geue any occasion of the contrary error to deny purgatory that in the same talke with the Origenistes he confesseth there might well be some griefe in the next life also which might likewise purge and deliuer a man from the loue of transitory thinges wherwith the best sorte of men be in this our misery often very sore loden Although in dede he doubted whether any such affection and loue of thinges deare vnto vs in this worlde as of wife kinred acquaintance or such like might remaine in man after his departure hense so there in time to be lessened and in fine vtterly remoued or worne away by some griefe and sorow which in the next life might by the lacke of the said things vexe and molest his minde As we see it commonly fall in this present life where mā by diuerse profitable troubles of this world learneth to set light by thinges which in ordre he might well loue being for all that more merite to forsake them And of this point S. Augustine hath these wordes in one place Tale aliquid fieri etiam post hanc vitam incredibile non est vtrum ita sit quaeri potest some such thing may well be after this life and thereof question may be made By which wordes the heretikes of our time either of ignorance or of malice which be euer yoked together in such men haue borne the simple in hande that this holy doctour doubted of Purgatory A litle holde will serue such wringers because he doubted of it they beleue as they thinke by good authority that with out doubt there is none at all If S. Augustine had but saide belike there is no such meane place in the life following mary sir then they might haue picked more matter of their infidelity yet of that speach determining no certeinty there had bene no great cause why they shoulde haue forsaken the iudgement of Gods Church But now he so doubteth that he findeth more cause to thinke there shoulde be one then that any man might gather vpon his words that there shoulde be none at all No nor he neuer went so farre good reader as to make any doubt of Purgatory paines for punishment of sinnes committed in the worlde For in all the same bookes where he hath the like saing and almost in the very same places he holdeth as a matter of faith and to be beleued of all Christian men that the prayers of the lieuing do release some of their paines in the next life And he constantly as all other Catholikes euer did confesseth that the sinnes or vncleane workes of the liuing not duely by penaunce wiped away in this worlde must be mended after our death although it be very doubtefull in deede whether there be any worldely affections left in mans mind vntaken vp by death and resolution of the body and the soule the care and remembraunce whereof might be afterward by sorrow both purged and punished And this to be his meaning and that he termeth here purgatory the griefe which a man hath in losing that which he loued in this mortall life his owne wordes testifie in euery of those workes in which he keepeth this combate with Origenistes In one place thus Quod sine illicienti amore non habuit sine dolore vrente non perdet ex earum rerum amissione tantum necesse est vt vrat dolor quantum haeserat amor That which by ticklinge loue was kept can not be lost with out burning griefe And looke how fast the loue of such thinges did cleane to mans minde so farre must sorow burne So in the like talke with the saide Origenistes in his booke de fide operibus he followeth the same signification of Purgatory Haec igitur sayth he quoniam affectu dilecta carnali non sine dolore amittuntur qui sic ea habent in eorum amissione passi detrimētum per ignem quendam doloris perueniunt ad salutem these thinges being by carnall affection loued be not lightly lost without griefe and therfore those that thus be affectionate feele losse in parting from them and so come to saluation through the fire of sorow such a sadnesse the yonge man that demaunded of our maister the waye to heauen conceiued straight when motion was onely made of distribution of his goods VVho being otherwise in the state of saluation and to be borne withall because he was a iust man and lacked not the foundation of his faith yet the very losse or leauing of his goods was vnto him if he continued in that affection a wonderfull great torment as S. Augustine here calleth it a kinde of purgatory the which perfect men that esteme all the trashe of this worlde as durte and donge to winne Christ feele not at all whome the doctour supposeth therefore to take no domage in the losse of thinges which they so litle loued Now in euery place where this expositiō is founde as I thinke it is neuer in all his workes lightly but in conference with the Origenistes he alwayes addeth that the like fire of sorow may also correct the affections euen of the departed but yet whether it be so or no he counteth it a question of probable disputation rather then any matter of faith as it is in deede very doubtfull whether any such vnordinate affectiō may remaine vntaken vp after mans departure which by griefe and sorow in the other worlde may be in time wholy consumed And further he neuer doubted For in that famous worke of the Citie of God with in two Chapters of that doubt made of this kind of purgation which we now haue declared he vttereth his faith with Gods Church of that greate torment and iust punishment of sinnefull life not sufficiently purged by penaunce in our time which he calleth the Amending fire and thus he sayth there Tales etiam constat ante iudicij diem per poenas temporales quas eorum spiritus patiuntur purgatos receptis corporibus aeterni ignis supplicijs non tradendos c. It is certaine sayth he Constat which is no worde of doubtefullnesse that such men being purged by the temporall paines which their soules do suffer before the day of iudgement shall not after they haue receiued their bodies againe be committed to the torment of the euerlasting fire This he vttereth in the same place where he doubteth of the other kinde of purgation as he confesseth him selfe to be uncertaine of the whole exposition refusing none at all that were agreable to faith and woulde not helpe the falsehood which he thē refuted In his Enchir where he disputeth against the same error
precious stones and so escape both the fires th one of eternall punishment for the wicked and the other which shall correct them that must be saued through fire But now because we reade that he surely shall be saued therefore that fire is not much regarded And yet let them be boulde of this that though they be saued by fire it shall yet be more fearse and greeuous then any thing that man may susteine in this life though both Martyrs and malefactours haue suffered straunge torments Againe in an other place the same holy doctour vttereth the like saying VVhich I will repeate also that the world may behold the vniust dealing of the contrary part that in the booke of their excuse why they departed out of the Church they call it their Apologie be not ashamed to auouch that S. Augustine sometimes denyed and sometimes douted of Purgatory Thus he writeth then against such deceiuers and for the defence of him selfe and the Churches faith Sed si etiam sic conuersus euadat vitam viuat non moriatur non tamē promittimus quod euadet omnem poenam Nam prius purgandus est igne purgationis qui in aliud saeculum distulit fructum conuersionis Hic autem ignis etsi aeternus non sit miro tamen modo est grauis excellit enim omnem poenam quam vnquam passus est aliquis in hac vita Nunquam enim in carne inuenta est tanta poena licet mirabilia passi sunt Martyres multi nequiter iniqui tanta sustinuerunt supplicia Studeat ergo quilibet sic delicta corrigere vt post mortem non oporteat talem poenam tolerare If a sinner sayth he by his conuersion escape death and obtayne life yet for all that I can not promise him that he shall escape all paine or punishment For he that differred the fruites of repentaunce till the next life must be perfited in purgatory fire And this fire I tell you though it be not euerlasting yet it is passing greeuous for it doth fare exceede all payne that man may suffer in this life Neuer griefe in this flesh could be so great as it though Martyrs haue abiden straunge torments and the worst sort of wicked men exceeding great punishments Therefore let euery man so correct his owne faults that after his death he may escape that pitifull payne So farre S. Augustine By whom we see not onely the truth of our Catholike doctrine liuely and vehemently set forth but to the great feare of vs all the weight of Gods sentence and the payne of that vntolerable punishment a◠the Church of his time taught and beleued to passe all mortall transitory woe in the world 3 Concerning Augustine we haue answered before that as that errour of purgatory was somewhat risely budded vp in his time so he seemeth not alwaies to be cleare of it although in some places he is not so certaine of it but that he affirmeth it may be enquired of and peraduenture shall be found to be so peraduenture it shall still remayne hidde or vnknowen 4 VVhereof it hath pleased almighty God sometimes to geue man a tast by calling some one or other aboue the common rase of nature out of this mortall life and speedy restoring him from the state of the departed to the company of the liuing againe VVhich worke though it be straunge in nature thought vnlikely to misbeleuers and contemned of such as would extinguish the spirite of God yet it hath bene the vsuall practise since the beginning of our faith and religion of the holy Ghost so to trade mans frailey in faith feare of Gods Iudgements Sometymes the liuing 〈◊〉 in traunce or sudden chaunge by Gods omnipotency taken vp to the vewe as it were of the vnspeakeable treasures of the prepared ioyes or extreame calamities of the world to come So was the Apostle S. Paule he could not tell howe him selfe called to the beholding of Gods maiesty and mysteries vnspeakeable So was S. Iohn in spirite caused often to behold and presently in a maner to see not onely the affayres of Gods Church till the worldes ende but also the happy Seate of the Lambe the eternall ioy of the elect and the euerlasting lake of the damned with the infinite sorowe of all the forsaken sorte And so haue many one sith that time in the same spirite had a present taste of all those iudgements which by any meanes through the vnsercheable ordinaunce of God be prepared for sinners Sometimes also by the same force of the Spirite the departed haue appeared amongest the liue as Samuel the prophet to king Saul vttering thinges to come Or if that were not Samuel him selfe because that practise of vnlawefull artes may be thought not conuenient for the procuring of the Prophets owne persons apparition yet Moyses was in deede personnaly present with Christ in the Mounte at his transfiguration And as he at Christes cal came from the dead out of the bousom of Abraham so did Elias at the same time come from Paradise as S. Augustine affirmeth and were both conuersaunt and in talke with Christ in the sight of the Apostles at once from whense they departed at Christes appointement to their seuerall abode and rest againe VVhereupon the same holy doctour confesseth that these rare meruelous workes of God though they follow not the common order of nature yet they be neither impossible nor vnpractised in Christes Church Alij sunt sayth he limites humanarum rerum alia diuinarum signa virtutum alia sunt quae naturaliter alia quae mirabiliter fiunt The common course and limites of mans matters be of one sorte and the wonderous signes of Gods power and vertue of an other the workes that naturally be wrought are nothing like such thinges as meruailously and miraculously be done And as Christ in his owne person made many extraordinary workes to beare testimony of his diuinity so he woulde that the glory of God and faith in him should take deepe roote and large encrease through out all nations not onely by preaching and worde but by workes also which the same holy Ghost for the saluation of the beloued flocke disposeth by the eternall wisedome where when with whome and as he listeth Mary as these be the most secret wayes and vnknowen steppes of Gods spirite and therefore most humbly to be reuerenced of the faithfull so because they are so farre from the rase of naturall affaires and much ouerreach flesh and bloude they are often of fooles contemned and of the vnwise wisdome of worldlinges as extreme madnesse improued The expresse signes of Gods spirite wrought by the Sauiour of the worlde in his owne person were with singular blasphemy of the prowde Iewes referred to Beelzebub The tokens and wonders wrought by his Apostles were attributed to vnlawfull artes and misconstrued of most miscreants to false intentes It was euer a speciall note of
in them is learned so hath she perpetuall confirmation in the same and nothing contrary vnto her But heresie as she is inuented in mans head so she seeketh confirmation in the reason and authoritie of man which because they haue not full credit with them that professe religion without the authoritie of Gods word at length whē it is fully shaped in the shop of mans brayne then it is brought to the Scripture to see if it can finde any colour by any phrase of wordes wrested from the meaning or by any vayne collection that hath no force of necessary conclusion being content to haue but onely a colde claime vnto the authoritie of Scripture although it haue the whole scope and purpose of the holy Ghost yea often times also manifest wordes against it which difference as it may be found in all heresies so in none more notably then in this errour of purgatory Consider what textes of holy Scripture are alleged for it and you shall see they can not bring one out of which any necessary argument may be framed to proue their cause or which hath not by learned interpretors of the olde time bene otherwise expounded then of their cause As in the text here alleged out of S. Matt. cap. 12. who so euer shall speake blasphemy against the holy ghost it shall not be forgiuen him neither in this world nor in the world to come If the sense were not plaine of it selfe that he which so sinneth shall not obtayne forgeuenes in this life nor be absolued in the last iudgement yet the other Euangelistes doe plainly expound the meaning S. Luke sayth simply he shal not be forgiuen S. Marke saith he hath no remission for euer but is guilty of euerlasting iudgement Neuertheles behold what a wrangling M. Allen maketh about the interpretation of these wordes But I will offer him fayre play he is an auncient maister of art since he writ this booke he hath added tenne yeares to his study of diuinitie in which space he might haue bene a doctour of the same faculty let him with all the diuinitie that euer he studied or with all the artes that euer he professed make a true syllogisme in forme and matter out of this authority to proue that God forgiueth sinnes after this life which are not remitted in this life and I will confesse the doctrine of purgatory with him which otherwise I would not doe to winne all the patrimony of S. Peter that the Pope claymeth in Italy but vntill such tyme as we may obtayne a good argument let vs consider such as we haue He signifieth sayth M. Allen that a man in some case might perhaps not speede of a pardon in this life yet may obtayne it in the next when the matter goeth by perhaps it is good to beware of after claps why M. Allen what sinnes are those of which a man may perhaps not speede of a pardon in this life and yet obtayne it after this life If they be truely repented in this life we haue a warrant of Gods owne mouth without your perhaps that in the same hower they shall be remitted Ezech. 18. 33. But if they be not repented where is your warrant that euer they shall be remitted But I aske againe what sinnes are those that perhapps maye misse of a pardon in this life and obteine it after this life by all likelyhood they must be some great sinnes that perhapps may not speede of a pardon here and yet finde it afterwarde There is no man would thinke otherwise by these wordes nor by the wordes of Christ if he vnderstood them so that some sinnes might be forgeuen after this life but whē all commeth to all The Maister of the Sentence and Gregory before him and M. Allen him selfe woulde alowe no sinnes to be forgeuen after this life but very small and light offences How be it it is plaine that these wordes neither in the worlde to come are added by waye of amplification for it is the purpose of our Sauiour Christ to set forth to the vttermost the heynousnesse of blasphemy against the holy Ghost so that if he had ment that any sinnes might be remitted after this life that were not pardoned after this life he shoulde haue ment the greater and not the lesser for lesse sinnes be soner pardoned and the pardon of greater more hardely obteined But marke the equitie of M. Allen the horrible blasphemer for all the vehemency of Christes wordes by M. Allens iudgement is but in a manner discharged of hope of remission as though he were not simply and altogether excluded And the light offender is turned ouer to purgatory for his remission yet M. Allen will stand vpon the forme phrase of words not knowing that this worlde is taken for all the time that is vnto the ende thereof and the worlde to come not for the state or time of them that are departed vnto the iudgemēt but for the time of eternitye after the ende of this worlde or els the wordes of Christ in Matthew should not be equiualent with the wordes in Marke he shal be guilty of euerlasting iudgement or condemnation which the olde interpretor calleth eternall offence The like forme or phrase of words is vsed by S. Paule to the Ephesians cap. 1. that Christ is exalted aboue euery name that is named not onely in this worlde but also in the worlde to come by which wordes he meaneth the supreme and euerlasting kingdome of Christ which extendeth vnto all eternitie But if a contentious person like to the Valentiniane heretikes or such like woulde inuent monstruous names as those heretikes did and proue by this place that there are names named in the worlde to come that are not named in this worlde shoulde he not haue as good grounde out of this place as the Papistes haue of the other 2 But because we haue to do with fickle marchauntes that will not sticke to brast boldely the bandes of euident scriptures as anone you shalt see and therefore will as I thinke litle be moued with reasonable and playne gathering out of the scriptures nor much esteeme this likelihood as ouer small a proofe in so greate a doubte therefore I will shew my warraunt for this construction that thereby the studious reader may see whome the aduersaries do so rashly contemne herein and whome we haue as authors in this meaning of Christes wordes now recited that neither they may be beleued with out reason and proofe nor we miscredited after so good authority of the auncient writers as neither they for shame nor we of conscience can deny S. Gregory whose authority I may boldely vse against them because they mislike not his iudgement when it may appeare to make for them as in deede it neuer doth he doubted nothing to gather of this our Sauiours speach that sinnes might be forgeuen in the next worlde And thus he writeth for that point De quibusdam leuibus culpis esse
soules departed which the Church hath customably taken in hande for all men passed in the Christian Catholike society by the way of a generall commemoration their names not particularly expressed that such thinges may be prouided by our common kinde mother to all those which doe lacke parents children kinsfolke or freindes for the due prouision of such necessary dueties By this holy mans wordes we may see the difference betwixt our owne tender naturall mother and the cursed cruell steppe dame The one followeth her children with loue and affection into the next world with full sorowfull sighes many deuout prayers and all holy workes which she vseth to their needefull helpe the other being but an vnnaturall steppemother and all the children of that adoulterous seede hath them no longer in minde then they be in sight whether they sinke or swim she maketh no accompt she hath no blessing of her owne she hindereth the mercy of other CAP. XI 1 THe argumentes of your chapters be like the gates of Lyndum which being but a very litle citie had exceding great gates in so much that Diogenes willed them to shut them vp for feare least their city went out of them Euen so your titles are merueillous large but the matter of your treatise is wonderfull streight In the last chapter we shoulde haue had prayer and sacrifice for the deade with the conuersion of all nations but a lacke we coulde not obteine so much as the same altogether in one poore nation of the Saxons and them as some thinke not so much conuerted from Gentility to Christ as peruerted from pure Christianity to superstition Nowe shall we haue euery order of celebration sence Christes time with solemne supplication for the soules departed but our probation shall not beginne vntill three or fower hundreth yeares after Christes time sauing that for a preamble we shall haue a cople of players come vppon the stage the one to counterfect Clemens the auncient the other to beare the name of Dionysius the Areopagite But such disguised doctors haue bene already to often shifted out of their players garments and shewed to the worlde in their owne apparell that any which hath wit should not be nowe deceiued by them And as concerning the diuerse formes of Liturgies which you saye doe perfectly and wholy agree with your masse as they be corrupt and falsely beare the name of them to whome they be inscribed so notwithstanding being of some antiquity they differ almost as much from your masse as your masse differeth from our forme of celebration of the communion But to follow you at the heeles as farre as you dare goe I will agree with S. Augustins rule that the lawe of beleuing shoulde make a lawe of praying but faith if it be true hath no other grounde but the worde of God therefore prayer if it procede of true faith hath no other rule to frame it by but the worde of god And though Augustine proue against the Pelagians which allowed the prayer of the Church that the Church woulde not so praye except she did so beleue yet it followeth not neither doth he meane to defend that what so euer the visible Church receiueth is true if it be not agreable to the worde of God and therefore all other perswasions set a side he prouoketh onely to the scripture to trye the faith and doctrine of the Church Which rule if he had as diligently followed in examininge the common error of his time of prayer for the deade at that time as he did in beating downe the schisme of the Donatistes or the heresie of the Pelagians he woulde not so blindly haue defended that which by holy Scripture he was not able to mainteine as he doth in that booke de cura pro mortuis agenda and else where And where as you compare our Church to a steppe dame and your Synagoge to a naturall mother we maye more iustly wringe backe that comparison vpon your noses For our Church herein approueth her selfe to be a naturall mother that she neither keepeth backe from her true children that heauenly inheritaunce which their father hath appointed them nor dissembleth the eternall abdication of them that be obstinate and rebellious But your malignant church sheweth her selfe to be a cursed steppe dame both in feeding the wicked with a vaine hope of release of paines after this life and in tormenting the well disposed with a false feare of paines which God hath released to al them that truely turne vnto him So her terror tormenteth the vertous deceiueth the wicked her hope flattereth the vngodly and disquieteth the well affected The Church of God sendeth her childreÌ„ into the euerlasting blessing of their father in heauen the Church of Rome sendeth her bastards out of the blessing of God not into the warme sonne but into whot burning cooles of purgatory to be thence deliuered at leysure as she promiseth but neuer to come out of hell fire as they shall finde 2 But let vs vewe all the orders that we finde extant or vsed through the Christian worlde for the celebration of the blessed Sacrament and sacrifice which nowe commonly in our vulgare speach we call the Masse and see whether as Augustine saide there hath not bene in all ages an especiall supplication of the priest and people for the dead as well as for the lieue First S. Clement the Apostles owne scholar reporteth how they prescribed this solemne prayer in their holy ministery for the departed Pro quiescentibus in Christo fratres nostri rogemus c. Let vs pray sayth the deacon brethern for all thoâ—e that reste in peace that our mercyfull Lorde that hath taken their soules into his hand woulde forgiue them all their offensies whether they were willingly or negligently committed and so hauing compassion vpon them woulde bring them to the lande of the holy ones and happy rest with Abraham Isaac and Iacob and all other that pleased him from the beginning where there is neither sighing sorow nor sadnesse And a litle after in the same holy actioÌ„ the Byshop prayeth him selfe in this forme O Lord looke downe vpon this thy seruaunt whome thou hast receiued into an other life and pitefully pardon him if either willingly or vnweetingly he hath offended Let him be guarded by peaceable Angells and brought to the Patriarches Prophets and Apostles and the rest of all them that haue pleased thee sith the worlde beganne Thus reporteth Clement being one of the Apostles companie and continually present in the celebration of their mysteries 2 S. Hieronyme in his cataloge of Ecclesiasticall writers reherseth all the bookes that either were knowen to be written by Clemens or sayed to be his and were not First a profitable epistle to the Corinthians being like in stile to the Epistle to the Hebrues Also vnder his name wente a second Epistle which was reiected of the auncients like wise the disputatioÌ„ of Peter and Appione written in a large treatise which Eusebius in
the third of his Ecclesiasticall storie reproueth This is all that S. Hieronyme coulde finde concerning his writings Who then hath raysed from hell these other Decretall epistles and constitutions that M. Allen and his companions woulde flappe vs in the mouth with all being nothing else but impudent lyes and foule forgeryes 3 Againe Dionysius Ariopagita of whome mention is made in the Actes so auncient be the recordes of our faith hath not onely left in writinge what he thought in this matter which had bene enough but also what the Church Apostolike in that spring of religion and pure deuotion taught and ordeyned to be vsed and that by the Apostles prescription whome he there tormeth the heauenly gides and capitaines of trueth For in the last chapter of his booke titled of the Ecclesiasticall soueraintie he telleth in ordre howe first the body is placed before the holy altar howe the solemne mysteries with heauenly psalmes and sonets be songe and saide ouer the corps how the holy Bishop geueth thankes to God maketh comfortable exhortation to the assembly to continue in assured hope of the resurrection how he anointeth the body with holy oyle and last of all maketh prayers for him and so committeth him to god The which whole ordre of the sacrifice ceremonies and mysticall prayers exercised as well in burialls as at other times in the reuerent mysteries this author woulde not fully set out in writinge for their sakes that coulde not for the weaknesse of faith atteine to the worthy holynesse of so high matters as he him selfe professeth in these wordes Praecationes quae in misterijs adhibentur nephas est scripto interpretari misticam eorum intelligentiam aut vim quae in eis deo authore efficacitatem habent ex abdito in publicum efferre sed quemadmodum a maioribus nostris traditum accepimus c The prayers which be vsed in the misteries maye not in any wyes be set out to the world in writinge neither may the singular efficacie and grace of them be made common to all men but euen as we haue receiued by the handes of our elders And as longe as this ordre was religiously kept in Gods church the solemne secrets of the blessed sacraments were not so contemptible as our news open communion hath of late made them where there is nothing so holy but it may abide the sight and handeling of who so euer is the worst The holy and heuenly misteries of Christ his spouse were not then prophaned by the presumptuous babling of euery idle heade Then were not the soueraigne weighty matters handeled in alehouses but vsed at the holy altars Then the idle contentious vngodly and vnprofitable quirkes and questions had no other solution but sharpe discipline and worthy correction then were not the Gides of Gods people controwled by euery restlesse fellowe that coulde cracke of Gods worde but it was enough for a faithfull mans contentation to say with Basil the greate Dominus ita docuit apostoli predicauerunt patres obseruauerunt confirmauerunt martyres sufficiat dicere ita doctus sum Our Lorde taught so the Apostles so preached our fathers obserued the same the holy martyrs haue sealed it It is sufficient for me to say so was I taught O Lord that this simple sincere fidelitie might once take place againe in our dayes for the comforte of the poore faithfull flocke that are now so burdened with questions of infidelitie that the sely simples soules can not tell howe to turne them selues nor finde meanes to kepe their faith inuiolated in such a multitude of misbeleuers VVhich I surely hope the earnest and pityfull prayers of so many good men that do bewaile this miserie shall at length after due punishment of our â—innes obteine at Gods gratious handes But what sâ—ifte doe the aduersaries here make with this euident testimonie of this so auncient a writer mary sir they indeuour with all their might to robbe this excellent auncieÌ„t diuine writer of all his workes whiche haue borne the title of his name euer sith they were writen which chalenge their owne author by that graue stile that no other man as the skillfull in that language doe testifie coulde euer lightly atteine vnto which so sauore of the antiquity and the Apostolike spirite that thou woulde deeme them to be indited by some of the continuall hearers of Christ Iesus But it were vaine to stande in contention for this matter for we shoulde neuer haue ende if we should be put to proue that euery man made the bookes which be extant in his name it were to much miscredit of antiquitie and vncertainty of all thinges Although this mans workes haue bene both named and certeine sentences alleaged out of them by most auncient doctors and councells VVith whome the aduersaries if they list be busie shall wrestle for I will seeke out as my purpose was whether in other times and vsages of celebration this kinde memoriall of the deade hath not bene kept 3 If Dionysius the Aeropagite had written any thing or any Dionysius had written any bookes entituled de ecclesiastica Hierarchia before S. Ieronyms time or in his time he would not haue left him out in his Cataloge of Ecclesiasticall writers which he continueth from the passion of Christ vnto the 14. yeare of Theodosius the Emperour or if any such writer or writing had bene knowne in the Church two hundreth yeares after Gennadius which addeth if any were omitted by Ieronym and continueth his cataloge vnto the raigne of Zeno or Anastasius in which time he liued he would not haue passed him in so deepe silence yea the man him selfe euen in the wordes that M. Allen rehearseth plainly declareth that he was not that Areopagite coÌ„uerted by S. Paule for then he would not haue sayd Quemadmodum a maioribus nostris traditum accepimus as we haue receiued it of our auncestors But as we haue receiued of the Apostles them selues of whom Dionysius him selfe was turned to the faith As for Suidas is to late a witnesse to know that Ieronym and Gennadius and before them Eusebius knew not But M. Allen thinketh he hath made a witty defence for these bookes to be written by Dionysius the Areopagite when he sayth we should neuer haue ende if we shoulde be put to proue that euery man made these bookes that be extant in his name But what if we should receiue all bookes to be authenticall that beare the name of some worthy person shoulde we not thinke you haue many goodly treatises in the name not onely of auncient doctors but euen of the Apostles them selues But Origen and Athanasius both name this Dionysius and allege sentences out of him Shew that M. Allen and you haue wonne the fielde for Dionysius credit except it be out of such Origens and Athanasiusses as this Dionysius is or as Damascene and the second Nycene councell alleage to whom what so euer could be counterfected to serue their
left out of our seruice which he tormeth like him self prayers and sacrifice for the deade as though he hath not bene often tolde by the example of Gods Church â–ª whereof wâ— haue sure warrant out of Gods word by example of the eldest Church and nearest to the Apostles tymes as we haue shewed out of Iustinus Martyr and Tertullian before he became an heretike And as for him that affirmed the old Liturgies to make against your masse though he be better able to aunswere for him selfe yet haue I shewed also that there are none so full of blasphemy as your masse is And it is easie to be gathered by Epiphanius that the olde forme of liturgie was but to make mention of the deade to haue them in remembraunce And because they vsed to make memory of all sortes of men that were deade in Christ he expoundeth it according to the errour of his time that this memory was a prayer for the sinners for the iust as Patriarkes Prophets c. a signification that they were inferior to christ A simple cause why they should be remembred but this shift he is driuen vnto because he did not coÌ„sider that the memory and oblation which the olde fathers made for all departed in Christ was a sacrifice of thankes giuing and not of prayers for them The same order errour doe all the later liturgies follow making memory prayers for all them that are departed in the faith In the memory of all departed they follow the olde order in praying for all they follow the latter error which had chaunged the sacrifice of thankes giuing into the sacrifice of prayer But herein they declared that they had not yet generally receiued your newe doctrine of purgatory because they prayed not as you doe for them onely that are in purgatory to whom onely you confesse the prayers to be needefull and profitable but for all that are departed in the fayth of Christ from the beginning of the worlde And now Syr I haue shewed wherein they make against you But where as you taunt at the author of that booke because he setteth not his name vnto it you shew your witte bewray your disease You can neither tell what to speak nor yet how to hold your peace In the margent you gesse it was M. Pilkington of Duresme you would faine haue such a man to be your aduersary that though you tooke the foyle yâ—t you might boast that you were so bold as to fight with him But it is an easyer matter for such a desperate dicke to beginning a fraye then to ende it If I may be as bolde to gesse as you I gesse that he which made that lusty chalenge of the Papist against the Protestant promising to recant at the ende of euery article if he colde be aunswered was such a tryed Thraso as M. Allen if you aske me what is the grounde of my gesse to omit the stile somewhat like I will aunswere as one in Plautus doth Credo te esse ab illo nam ita nugas blattis I take it to be euen you you are so full of bracing and facing But who so euer he was was he ashamed of his name because he set not his name vnto it and was the man of Chester ashamed of his name because he setteth it not to his treatise Finally be all those Papistes ashamed of their names which haue written so many petty pamphlettes to be caried abrode in Popish fellowes pocketts O intemperate tonge which can not spare such tauntes as redounde to him selfe and his owne good maisters reproch Your lyes of offering worshipping and praying to the hoste be reproued alredy you say we might with more honesty haue coped for one of those Lyturgies if we liked not Gregories Masse rather then to haue forged a new I aunswere we haue with more honesty reformed our Lyturgie according to the worde of God and example of the oldest Church then Gregory Basill Chrysostome if they were theirs or who so euer were authors of those Liturgies did leaue the auncient Lyturgies that were vsed in the Church before their time because they did not sufficiently expresse their errors and superstition and forge them newe of their owne contrary to the worde of god And where as you prate of the Latine Church and the East parte we neither refuse the Latine Church while it was pure nor receiue the East Church where in it was corrupt but the scripture is a rule vnto vs to iudge all Churches by Although it were easy to proue by that coÌ„trouersie which the Britaynes and the Scottes had against the Saxons about the celebration of Easter that our countrie first receiued their conuersion from the East Church whose ceremonie they did then defend euen as the East Church did longe before against Victor Bishoppe of Rome By which it appeareth that this lande did neuer receiue the doctrine and ceremonies of the Latine Church before the time of the Saxons And whereas you slaunder vs for referringe our faith to an vncertaine and vnknowen Origine the contrary is manifest when we referre it to no iudgement or company of men but to the authoritie of Gods worde and all them that will be subiect therevnto But I tarye to longe in these trifles 3. Euery man in the primitiue Church counted the spring of his faith more pure and a great deale more cleare if he coulde against an heretike declare by good testimony that his belefe did at length by iust counte fall into the Romane Church So doth Irenaeus against the Valentinians so doth Cyprian against the Nouatians so doth Tertullian and Vincentius against all heretikes so doth Augustine and Optatus against the Donatistes so doth Hyerom and all the reste against the Arians All these thought they had a great vauntage if they could by plaine accompt proue against an heretike that their doctrine ishued from the Byshop of Rome Goe whether thou wilt saith Tertulian and thou shalt finde some Apostolike seat to instruct thy conscience thou hast harde by the Philippos or Ephesus or Rome and there loe fetch we the authority of our faith S. Augustine that knewe best how to fetche an heretike ouer the coles vrgeth him euer to reduce his doctrine to some Bishop of Rome when he had him once at that strait then loe he goeth through the whole ranke of holy Byshoppes by name to the nomber of fourty well neare Bring me once an euident declaration that your faith ishued from any one byshop of that Sea and then you may passe throw the longe line of that succession with out bracke or any rupture in the worlde I coulde make accompt sayth Irenaeus of many successions of Apostolike Churches but that were to longe only Rome shall serue that is the greatest the auncientest and best knowen and by the tradition of that Church confundimus omnes eos we vtterly confounde all heretikes It is a straunge thinge that the fathers hauing store of Apostolike
hearte or eare coulde abide these blasphemous tonguesâ— who of vntolerable arrogancy doe so deface the examples and doctrine not onely of the pillours of the whole Christian Church whome they impudently for lacke of a more reasonable aunswere condemne not onely of simple ignoraunce and errour in this point with the residue of the whole faithfull people which surely is ouer much to say of such learned and godly men as they were but also of wilfull errour and superstition in bearing and maintenaunce of the common ignoration and ethnicke perswation of the worlde in their dayes and following the heathen vsage of the gentilitie And yet not content therewith these lying maisters of their meere mercy be content to offer a pardon to the author of that booke for his errour which booke the whole catholike Church of God through out Christiandome taketh for canonicall scripture VVhich arrogancy and passing boldnesse although I perswade my selfe no vertuous man will in them allowe sith they nowe being put to their shiftes vtterly doe condemne those fathers whose names with great oftentation they often to the simple repeate to make them suppose they be not with out scripture or doctors for the proofe of their willfull heresies yet euen the very aâ—nswere it selfe which they imagine here in to disgrace the doctors and delude the ignoraunt is contrary to it selfe in sundry points For they one while affirme that S. Augustine and others allowed that errour which the people by their superstitious deuotion had before their time brought in to the prayers of the Church and an other while that Iudas Machabaeus did institute it who was before these authors diuars hundreths of yeares and somewhile that they borowed it of the gentilitie all which pointes be repugnant eche to other For neither coulde that beginne in our Christian doctours dayes which was vsed before Christes birthe neither neede they to borowe it of the heathen which was in estimation and praysed amongest the Iewes 9 We neede no shiftes M. Allen for the authoritie of the doctors whome we neuer allow for canonicall Scriptures and therefore we may boldly say as Augustine sayth of Cyprian what so euer we find in them agreable to the Scriptures we receaue it with their prayse and what so euer is disagreeable to the Scriptures we refuse with their leaue Now by what meanes they fell into this errour that maintained prayer and almes for the dead I shal haue better occasion to shew in the aunswere to the 14. chapter although it be not greatly material to know how they came into errour when it is sufficiently proued that they did erre As for the abridgement of Iason the Cyrenians story which M. Allen maketh such a precious iewell I haue aunswered inough before that the author him selfe desiring pardon of his readers hath testified sufficiently that he was no scribe of the holy Ghost as also by many other vnauoydable reasons with the consent of the Catholike Church which it were superfluous here to repete Finally whereas you say that our aunswere is contrary to it selfe you seeke a knot in a rush For all may be true First the deuill suggested superstitious deuotion into the Gentiles by peruerse emulation of whom Iudas might be deceiued and his fact giue occasion to the ignorant people of errour and their ignorance first winked at because it had a shew of pietie confirmed by custome might at length be allowed of Augustine and others who neuer weighed the matter by Scriptures but by the commoÌ„ practise And this I thinke is the right degree of prayers for the deade and purgatory That the praying for the dead vvas appointed to be had in the holy sacrifice by the Apostles commaundement and prescription And that our doctors by the maiesty of their name beare dovvne our light aduersaries CAP. XIII 1 BVt that this falshood may better appeare in these men we will by good testimony trye out when and by whom the oblation and sacrifice with other ordinarie reliefes of the departed were so vniformely vsed through the Christian worlde as like wise it shall be profitable to consider who were the first authors of the contrary opinions And that the holy Ghost by the Apostles owne preaching and prescription was the first author of this solemne supplicatioÌ„ in masses of all vsages for the departed I might first proue by this generall rule of S. Augustine Quod vniuersa tenet ecclesia nec concilijs institutum sed semper retentum est non nisi authoritate apostolica traditum rectissime credimus that which the whole Church obserueth and hath alwayes so bene kepte being not instituted by any Councell it can not otherwise be had but by the Apostles authoritie and tradition And so by the like saying of Leo the greate Dubitandum non est quicquid in ecclesia in consuetudinem est deuotionis retentum de traditione apostolica de S. Spiritus prodire doctrina It can not be doubted but that what so euer is in the Church by generall custome of deuotion kept and mainteined it came out of the Apostles traditioÌ„ and doctrine of the holy Ghost But I will seeke with them by certaine demonstration and plaine ordre of reason that it must needes so be Praying for the deade was inuented by no man sith the Apostles dayes there can no one be named by the aduersary before whome I can not name an other that praide for the dead Let him say where he list this man or that man was the first that euer praide for the deade in Christes Church if I can not shewe an other before him so named to haue praide also we will take him for the first author and then he fully stoppeth our course that we can not bring this obseruation so high as the Apostles dayes But if the aduersary can apoint me out no time nor person that began this vsage before which I am not able to proue it was practised then they can not let vs but we must needs driue it vpwarde to the Apostles and Christes owne institution CAP. XIII 1 IF prayer for the deade was appoynted by the Apostles commaundement why is there neuer a worde thereof in their writinges there is warrant â—or lesser matters then this is made of why is this and all other popish trash counted their tradition which can not be warranted by their writing If I were disposed to pose you this question would make you clawe your poll an hundred times before you could imagine any couloâ—able aunswere for right aunswere you shall neuer be able to make But I take not vpon me to pose but to aunswere first your authoritie of Augustine serueth not your turne for prayers for the deade haue not bene alwayes obserued namely in the Apostles times nor long after The saying of Leo the great may be backed with the writing of Leo the great Epi. 10. Sed in hanc insipientiam cadunt qui cum ad cognoscendum veritatem aliquo impediuntur
dayes they thinke they haue a good argument against the Catholikes Therefore they woulde father transubstantiation vpon this Councell the adoration of the Sacrament vpon that Pope indulgencies vpon that byshop c. For they be as saulcie with Gods Church Councells chiefe gouernors as we be with the Iacke strawes of Geneua And yet when they haue traualed to their heartes ake they can finde no one thing first inuented by any of them whome they falsely name to be the authors thereof But well seeing it is so stronge an argument of heresie to haue the ofspring of a later author with plaine prouisò of Gods Church for his markinge let vs adde so much strength to our cause to haue the father of the contrary falshood knowen and noted of the antiquity by his name 3 If you haue not a better vnderstander then you are a rule giuer your rule is false for though you hedge it in with many conditiōs yet you leaue out the chiefest which is that the opinion it self be cōtrary to the truth first preached by the Apostles or else it is no heresie though it may be truely fathered vpon any man priuate or publike sooner or later And here I muse why you put in the condition of a priuate man belike if the Pope inuent a new doctrine because he is a publike person that can not erre it must not be taken for heresie In your second rule except you vnderstand that the opinion of him which is withstāded be new and of his owne inuention the withstanding thereof no not by good men maketh it not false They that defended that heretikes should not be rebaptised were withstoode by Cyprian and all the Bishops of Africa who were notwithstanding their error in the vnitie of the Church yet were they not heretikes nor their opinion heresie because it was not of their inuention but of the word of god And wheras you affirme that we can not find any of those thinges inuented by them by whome we say they were inuented though we trauail vntill our hartes ake I aunswere though you seeke vntill your head ake lye vntill you haue worne your tongue to the stumpes you shall neither finde those things in the word of God nor to haue any other authors thē the writers of your owne sect haue named to be the fathers of most of them And that you charge vs with like saucines towards your Prelates that you vse toward the Iacke strawes of Geneua if you had not thereby confessed your selfe to be a saucy Iacke you might haue giuen vs occasiō to think no lesse of you For although perhaps you count the chief teachers of that Church for Iacke strawes yet the worlde can testifie that there is more grauitie and modesty in the lightest persons of all that Church then hath appeared of many Popes and Cardinalls of your Church of Rome 4 Epiphanius that notable man in his booke that he wrote for the confutation of all the heresies that were before his time and in other of his workes too nameth an obscure fellowe one Aërius to be the first author of this heresie that prayers and sacrifice profiteth not the departed in Christ. But what maner a fellowe he was and how lickely to be the founder of such a schoole thou shalt perceiue best by the writers wordes When Aërius coulde not obteine the byshopricke of Eustathius deposed after that he was once perfectly well skilled in Arius doctrine he inuented new sectes of his owne affirming that there shoulde be no offering for the departed and of him loe the scholars were called Aërians Let not the simple whome I woulde helpe in this cause be deceiued by the liknes of these two names Arius and Aërius for this later was the author of their secte and was a follower of the first called Arius in his doctrine beside And of the same sect and sectmaister S. Augustine thus sayeth following Epiphanius The Aërians were so named by one Aërius who taking snoffe that he coulde not get a byshopricke fell into the heresie of Arius first and then added therevnto other heresies of his owne makinge saying that we shoulde not offer sacrifice for the deade nor obserûe the solemne appointed fastes of the Church but that euery man should abstaine when he liste And there both he and Epiphanius doe recken moe of his holy opinions which I omit For it is enough for our purpose and to confunde all the heretikes of our dayes that this opinion was noted as it spronge vp in the primitiue Church for heresie and the authors not onely condemned as heretikes in that point but in many other thinges beside For I neuer reade of nor yet knewe any heretike but if he once mistrusted the catholike Church the Deuill was hable to perswade with him as well in a numbre of matters as in one And that is the cause that any man seduced falleth from one falshood to an other till he wholy be drowned in the waues of tempesteous doctrine And when he commeth once at the bottom then God knoweth he setteth light by the matter contemneth it and is often past recouery as it is sayde Peccator cum in profundum venerit contemnit Euen so did this Aërius first through ambitious pride fall to the Arians sect but because he counted it nothing glorious to be a scholar he woulde be a maister and that of a misheuous matter and a matter repugnāt to the sense of all Christes Church which before his preaching generally as after receiued and faithfully vsed prayers and oblation for the deade Of which consent of the vniuersall worlde and the heretikes follye in withstanding the same the sayde Epiphanius sayeth thus I will report his wordes in Latine because they sounde very well though him selfe wrote not in that language Assumpsit ecclesia in toto mundo assensus est factus antequà m esset Aërius qui ab ipso appellantur Aëriani quis autem magis de his nouit hic ne seductus homo qui etiam superest nunc an qui ante nos testes fuerunt c. Thus in english The Church hath receiued this trueth through the wide worlde it was sattled in all mens mindes before Aërius was borne or any of his secte that be nowe called Aërians And who I pray you is most like to knowe the trueth of these thinges this false wretche yet liuinge at this daye or else the faithfull witnesses that were before our time Beholde here you worshipfull maister ▪ you may suerly take greate cause of comforte in his liuely worde mary Sir he might haue bene an Archbishoppe in our dayes for he loued neither fasting nor praying He was fayne to be an heretike for anger because he coulde not be made a bishoppe then who now if he were in this happy age when the light is more plentifully powred vpon the people might haue bene promoted at Caluins decease to the ouerlooking of Geneua But his opinion was