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A19658 A deliberat answere made to a rash offer, which a popish Antichristian catholique, made to a learned protestant (as he saieth) and caused to be publyshed in printe: Anno. Do[mini] 1575 Wherein the Protestant hath plainly [and] substantially prooued, that the papists that doo nowe call themselues Catholiques are in deed antichristian schismatiks; and that the religious protestants, are in deed the right Catholiques: VVriten by Robert Crowley: in the yeere, 1587. Crowley, Robert, 1518?-1588. 1588 (1588) STC 6084; ESTC S110998 131,595 191

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those workes that our Lord the hath made vs redéemed vs consecrated vs to his own seruice hath prepared for vs to walke in As for workes diuised by men wee esteeme of them as wee finde them If wee sée that they bend to the setting foorth of Gods glory in our edification wee vse them otherwise wee refuse them But the workes that God hath commaunded wee are carefull to doo And when by the infirmitie and corruption of our nature wee stumble and fall wée crie vnto our mercifull father for help as being assured that hee heareth vs and in tender affection towards vs will help vs yea though hee doo for a time suffer vs to lie vnder that too too heauie burthen of sinne vnder which wée are fallen by infirmitie Wee seeke not to our fellow seruants as to Angels or men much lesse to Antichrist the professed enimie of our Christ and sauiour Wee trust not in our owne strength nor in any merites that may bée in vs but wée trust in our God and our onely sauiour Iesus Christ And when wee haue walked vpright and haue done that which wee are commaunded to doo wee say as our Sauiour hath taught vs to say wee are vnprofitable bond slaues wee haue done nothing but that which of duetie wee ought to doo But now let vs sée the second offer that our Offerer maketh The second offer The Offerer Second Christ his Catholique Church being on this wise planted by the Apostles and Disciples of Christ by Bishops and Priests the successors of them had at all times a speciall care and regarde not onely of preaching Gods word but also of the preseruation of the same woord and gospell by writing of the sacred Bible and holy scriptures and did discerne and iudge them from all other writings prophane or authentique of all sortes What Church hath had from time to time the custodie of the sacred scriptures and most safely hath preserued them for the necessarie foode of Gods people and from the corruption of the aduersaries as well Iewes and Gentiles as schismatikes and heretikes of all sorts but onely the common knowne Catholiqu● Church of Christ When therefore the learned Protestants shal be able to bring proofe to the contrarie that their priuate conuenticles and Congregations were the first bringers forth of this sacred Bible and word of God written the chiefe preseruers and defenders of the same in all times and ages from all Iewes Gentiles betikes and schismatikes then will I as I sayd before reuolt and recant Crowley In this his second Offer the Offerer vseth a fallace or disceit which in reasoning is called Petitio principij That is hee laboureth to confirme his assertion wherein there is no certenty by that wherein there is as litle or lesse certenty then in that assertion that hee holdeth And yet hee setteth a face vpon it as though nothing were or could bee more certaine then both the assertion and that whereby hée would prooue it bee His assertion is that the Church of Rome which he calleth Catholique is and euer hath bin from time to time the conseruer and kéeper of the sacred scriptures and this hee would prooue by another like assertion that is that the same Church was the first Preacher and Writer of the same scripture which hée calleth the sacred Bible and holy scriptures When the vnlearned Reader considereth this assertion hée is brought into such a maze that hee knoweth not which way to take For this Offerer would beare him in hand that the sacred Bible which containeth those bookes that are called the old Testament were neuer written before the church which he calleth Catholike did take in hād to write them Where as in very déede some of those bookes were written before the first foundation of Rome was layde Yea hee would that men should thinke that that Romish Church which hée calleth Catholique is the same that was first planted amongst the Nations of the worlde by the preaching of the gospell amongst them Which preaching began at Hierusalem sprang from thence as from a most plentifull Fountaine and was by the labour and trauell of the Apostles and Disciples of our sauiour Christ in preaching the gospell speedily spred ouer all the worlde And that it was this Romish Church that did first wryte the Gospels and other bookes of the new Testament and hath discerned of those bookes that are accounted for holy scripture and hath seuered them from all other writinges what so euer and hath preserued them from all corruption c. But such as bee learned doo know that all the bookes of the old Testament commonly called the Bible were written before the Incarnation of our sauiour Christ and therefore before any such Church as this Offerer imagineth the Romish Catholique Church to bée could haue any being Our Sauiour him selfe hath sayd Iohn 5. Iohn 5. Scrutamini scripturas c. Serch the Scriptures for you think to haue euerlasting life in them And those scriptures bée they that doo giue testimonie of mee And againe the Euangelist Luke saith thus Chapt. 24. Et incipiens a Mose Luc 24. omnibus Prophetis c. And beginning at Moses and all the Prophets hee did interpret vnto them all the scriptures which were written concerning him Saint Peter also saith thus Act. 3. Act 3. Et omnes Prophetae a Samuele c. And all the Prophets from Samuel forward euen as many as haue spoken haue made mention of these daies yea and saint Paule in that Epistle that hée directed to those Romaines that were the first Christians in Rome Rom 15. wryteth thus Quaecunque en●m scripta sunt c. What so euer things haue bin setdowne in writing haue bin written for our learning that through patience and consolation of the scriptures wée might conceiue hope And to Timoth. 2. Timoth. 3. 2. Timot. 3. Saint Paule saith thus Omnis scriptura diuinitus inspirata vtilis est c. Euerie scripture giuen dy diuine inspiration is profitable for teaching for reproouing for rebuking for instructing c. By all these places of scripture it appeareth plainely that the sacred Bible was written before the Romish Catholique Church had hir beginning and therefore coulde not bée first written by that Church as this Offerer laboureth to perswade that it was Yea and the bookes of the new testament were written by the Euangelists and Apostles and not by any such Bishops and Priests as this Offerer would haue vs think to bée the immediate successors of the Apostles and Disciples of our sauiour Christ and to bée the Bishops Priests of the City of Rome For when saint Paule being in prison at Rome wrote his second Epistle to Timothie there were no such Bishops or Priestes there as might worthyly bee taken for Christians For thus dooth S. Paule write In prima mea defensione nemo mihi affuit c. In my first defence 2. Timot. 4. there was not one man that
eyther admit any to be of the fellewship of Christians or by excommunication cut of any man from that body of Christ but onely that knowen Catholique church of Christ which is builed vpon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets Iesus Christ being the head cornerstone You doo therefore offer vs great iniurie in that you require vs to prooue that which we dyd neuer affirme But I sée what stone it is that the Offerer dooth so often stumble at He is perswaded that there can be no knowen Catholique Church of Christ but that Romishe Church whereof he himselfe is a member which is now manifestly knowen to be an Antichristian congregation and not the knowen Catholique Church of Christ as the Offerer and hys fellowes would beare vs in hand that it is The knowen Catholique Church of Christ hath alwayes vsed to execute ecclesiasticall censures vpon such as haue béene offensiue in lyfe and manners and vpon such as haue béene disturbers of the common peace of the Church and so doo we at this day without respect of any mans person so farre foorth as in dutifull obedience to such as God hath made our gouernour we may But to excommunicate and depose Princes we haue not learned of S. Paule nor of the Fathers that lyued in the first sixe hundered yéeres after the ascention of our Sauiour Christ Your bragge of 1500. yéeres continuance in the executing of your discipline must bee cut shorter by 600. yéeres for your Catholique Antichristian Church hath not floryshed in her pride full one thousand yéeres as yet neither haue you executed your tirannous discipline in such sorte as you would séeme to haue doone in that tyme of your tirannous raigne But whensoeuer you tooke in hand to execute any discipline you had and so yée haue still a speciall regarde to your owne ease and commoditie and to the aduanceing and vpholding of your owne honour and dignity Your owne Histories are full of the reportes of your corrupt and partiall dealinges in that behalfe It is God himselfe that hath prescribed an order of discipline and hath in all tymes and ages committed the execution thereof to hys Church which hath had continaunce euen from the beginning of the world This discipline was first engrauen in the hartes of men and after that in tables of stone and last of all in bookes that by those outwarde meanes the discipline grauen in the hart might be daily refreshed but euen the best men that haue béene in Authority in the Church and haue had the execution of thys discipline haue béene to slacke in that he halfe as by histories it appeareth No maruaile therfore though to great slacknes in the execution of this discipline be found in that Church which you and your sorte doo account to be Schismaticall but is in déede Catholique and that knowen Catholique Church from which your Antechristian Church is fallen That discipline that you make so great a reckoning of is your cannon lawe I am sure which your Popes haue patched together since they gate the vpper hand and enforced Princes to doo them seruice and to kysse their féete That discipline you execute with Precipimus firmiter iniungendo mandamus Wee charge you say you and with firme iniūction we commaund you And what is it that you doo thus commaund to be doone That such a man or such a woman as hath not appeared in your courte or hath refused to pay such fées as your officers requyre or that hath failed in dooing some acte that by that lawe they are bound to doo be denounced excommunicated sub pena iuris Vnder payne of hauing the penalty of the Lawe executed vppon that minister that wyll not denounce such a one excommunicated But if a whore or a whoremonger a drunkarde or a blasphemer of God an Vsurer or a simmoniacke or any other wicked person shal be conuented before your ecclesiasticall iudge if hys pursse be waightie and his hande readie to reache out money in paying double fées and in giuing to such vses as you cal Godly so that you may haue the disposing therof then this party must be receiued as a communicant amongest Christians although it doo appeare manyfestly that there is neyther amendment of lyfe nor hope of repentaunce shewed any way And would God that our execution of discipline were more frée from this corruption then it is But that wyll not be so long as so many of your minde may be suffered to bée in offyce vnder them that haue the execution of discipline I thinke you doo now sée that the right dscipline hath not béene prouided and made by men neither of your sorte nor of ours but by God himselfe And that there hath béen and is still as great yea greater corruption vsed in the executing of discipline amongst you as is or hath béene amongst vs. Yea and that your Church which is Antichristian hath not had the continuance of 1500. yéeres in that glory that now it dooth claime vnto it selfe Wherfore I doo require you now to recant according to promise although you would not before The seauenth Offer Offerer Seauenth Let me knowe of the Protestantes what Church hath brought forth for the space of these fifteene hundered yeeres past as Children begotten of her owne wombe so many thousandes of blessed Martyrs of stoute and bolde confessers of pure and innocent virgins and of other holy Saintes of all sortes and so acknowledged by eyther party And if it shal in fine fall out that any one of them was of the Protestantes congregation fayth or beleefe whiles they liued heere and not of the common knowen fayth and religion of the Catholique Church of Christ or that they were approoued and canonized for Saintes when they were dead by the Protestantes congregation not onely by the Catholique Church of Christ I shall then submit and recant and not before Crowley It séemeth that M. Offerer hath conceiued a wrong opinion of vs Protestantes He séemeth to be perswaded that none of vs haue seene the Histories of the Church Otherwise he had béene too too madde to make this large Offer For any Protestant that hath reade any thing of the Ecclesiasticall Histories may easily enforce him eyther to flie from his promisse or else to submitte himselfe and recant If any one sayth hée amongst the thousandes of the blessed Martyrs c. Shal be found to haue béene of the Protestantes fayth and religion c. Then he wyll submit hymselfe and recant I am sure of it that amongst the thousands that suffered Martirdome within the space of the first six hundereth yeres after Christs ascention he can not name one that was not whiles he liued of the same faith religion that we be of now Al we do beleue al the articles of the common tréed so did they we do beléeue that as there is but one God so there is but one mediatour betwixt God man and that the same is the man Christ Iesus
vpon hir the title of Antichrist which was in the dayes of Phocas the Emperor at whose hands Bonifacius obtained the prophane title of vniuersall bishop whereof Gregorie the first surnamed the great writeth thus Grego Epi. 66. Epist 66. ad Mauricium imperatorem Sed absit a cordibus christianorum nomen istud blasphemiae in quo omnium sacerdotum honor adimitur dum ab vno sibi d●m●nter arrogatur But let this name of blasphemie bee far from christian hearts wherein the honor of all Priests is taken away whils one Priest dooth like a mad man arrogate the same vnto him selfe And againe Episto 68. Grego Epi. 68. Ad Iohn Episc Constantinopol Tu quid Christo vniuersalis scilicet Ecclesiae capiti in extremi iudicij es dicturus examine qui cuncta eius membra tibimet conaris vniuersalis appellatione supponere What wilt thou say vnto Christ that is to the head of the vniuersall Church saith Gregorie to Iohn bishop of Constantinople in the triall of the last iudgement which doost by the name of vniuersall goe about to make subiect vnto thy selfe all his members who can write or speake more plainely in this matter then this Gregorie hath written both to Mauricius the Emperour and to Iohn Bishop of Constantinople I hope therefore you will take this for a stayed certaine tale and bée therewith satisfied Considering that after Constantine the first christened Emperor had endued the Church with some possessions and so poysoned the Church as by a voice that was heard from heauen it was signified which voice vttered this speach Hodie datum est venenum in Ecclesiam This day is the Church poysoned that poyson did not presently worke the effect but by litle and litle So that the change from the Protestants religion to Poperie was not sodaine although meruailous but brought to passe by leysure and yet with as much spéede as the Dragon could by his members and ministers bring it to passe As for gainesayers it lacked none amongst whom I thinke you will allowe Gregorie the first to bee one of the chiefest Now therefore I require your promise which is to recant and yéelde although you haue hitherto refused so to doo The eleuenth Offer Offerer Let the learned Protestant shew me what order of seruice or cōmon prayer what order of ministration of sacraments their Church had before Papistrie as they call it preuailed in the world Let him shew mee one booke or copie of any communion or what els you list that was in English or in any vulgar or cōmon tongue beside the Hebrew Greeke and Latine or that lacked prayer for the foules departed or inuocation to saints or sacrifice for the sinnes both of the quicke and the dead or that charged a number to receiue with the priest or that he could not els consecrate or say Masse receiuing alone or that the people should take the sacrament for bread and wine and not for the reall body blood of Christ or that they should giue no honor to it or not reserue the same for the comfort of the sicke and diseased people or that denied extreme vnction with the rest of the sacraments to bee behoufull or necessarie for them let the learned Protestant bring forth and shew such a communion booke or any leafe line or word of any such doctrine or any Church or congregatition that euer had authenticall seruice or ministration of the sacraments other then that which is yet daily and o-openly practized in the common knowne Catholique church of Christ and I shall then recant and not before Crowley It séemeth by this Offer that this Offerer and his fellowes are perswaded that what soeuer is now openly practized in the popish diuine seruice and ministration of sacraments hath bin so openly practized as now it is euen euer since the Church of Christ was first planted in the City of Rome Which is a wronge persuasion For the greatest number of the ceremonies yea well nigh all that are now vsed in that ministration haue bin diuised since the ende of the first 300. yéeres as by their owne Hystories it dooth most plainly appeere I will therefore answere this offer with another not much vnlike to this and thus I say Let this Offerer shew mée what order of seruice or common praier what order of ministration of sacraments the Church had before the end of the first 300. yéeres Let him shew mée one booke or copy of any communion or what els you list that was in Hebrew Gréeke Latine or in any other language that had in it prayer for the soules departed or inuocation to saints or sacrifice for the quicke and the deade or that did not cōmand a number to receiue with the priest or that did teach the people not to take the sacrament for breade and wine but for the reall body and blood of Christ or that they shoulde giue honor to the outwarde sacrament or that they should reserue it for the sicke diseased people or that taught extreme vnction Confirmation Order Penance and Matrimony to bée Sacraments behooufull or necessarie for Christians let this learned Offerer bringe foorth and shew such a communion booke or any leafe line or word of any such doctrine or any Church or congregation that euer had any such authenticall seruice or ministration of sacraments as is now openly practized in the cōmonly knowne popish Catholique church before the ende of the first 300. yeeres And then will I recant and bée a Papist as this Offerer is and not before I thinke I haue offered you faire play If you like the offer take it I will not flée from it If not for shame bragge no more of the antiquitie of your authentike seruice that is now practized in your Antichristian Catholike church But recant as you haue promised The first bishop of Rome that was bolde to diuise any thing to bée added to that which the Apostles vsed in the ministration of the Lords supper was Alexander the first And what did hée Platina saith that this man added Qui pridem quam pateretur vsque ad hanc clausulam hoc est Corpus meum Which is thus in English Which a day before hee suffered euen vnto this clause This is my body And Platina saith that Alexander did this that there might bee a remembrance of the passion of Christ Hée deuised also the making of holy water the vse whereof was to driue diuells out of Temples and chambers He ordained also that water should bée mixed with the wine in the ministration of the Sacrament and that the breade should not bée leauened but vnleauened to take away the occasion that the Ebionits tooke to finde fault in that behalfe Thus much writeth Platina in vita Alexandri primi This Alezander was the sixt bishop of Rome after Peter Plantina in vita Alexandri primi if Platina haue written truly and was made bishop in the yéere 110. after the incarnation of our sauiour
Christ which was 70. yéeres after as it is supposed that Peter was made bishop of Rome So that the church vsed none of those things that were diuised by him for the space of those 70. yéeres of the first 300. yeeres After this Alexander Sixtus 1. was made bishop of Rome in the yeere 121. after the incarnation of our sauiour Christ if the hystories bee true and the fourescore yeere after the supposed entring of Peter into the Byshopricke of Rome This man diuised sundrie things as Sanctus sanctus sanctus to bée songe in the celebration of the Lords supper But heere I must note how vnlikely this is to bée true for as saint Augustine hath written in the 7. August li. 9. Conf. Ca. 7. Chapter of the 9. booke of his confessions the custome of singing in churches was not begun in the Latine church before the dayes of Ambros who liued about the yeere of our Lord 380. And more ouer it can not bee prooued by any hystories that the Christians had any liberty to builde any church in the citie Rome before the time of Constantine the Emperoure who builded at his owne charges the first churches that the Christians had in Rome But let it bée as Platina hath written in the life of Sixtus the first Hée commanded that Sanctus sanctus sanctus that is holy holy holy should bee songe in the celebration that is in the ministration of the cōmunion But I pray you marke what Platina saith further Nuda primo haec erant c. At the first those things were bare and naked and all thinges were handled simply For when Peter did consecrate hée vsed the prayer Our father Iames the bishop of Hierusalem encreased or enriched these mysteries and so did Basill and other For Celestinus gaue the Introite of the Masse Gregorie the Kyrie eleison Telesphorus the Gloria in excelsis Deo Gelasius the first gaue the Collations and Hierome the Epistle and the Gospell Haleluia was taken from the church of Hierusalem The Credo from the counsell of Néece Pelagius inuented the cōmemoration of the deade Leo the third inuented the Incense Innocent the first inuented the kissing of the Paxe And Sergius ordained that Agnus Dei should bée songe But séeing that in the daies of Sixtus fewe were founde by reason of the often murders or slaughters of Christians that durst professe the name of Christ and the Christians in France did desire to haue a bishop Sixtus did send vnto them one Peregrinus a citizen of Rome c. Thus far Platina By these woords of Platina it appeareth that during the first 80. yeeres after saint Peters supposed entring into the bishopricke of Rome there was no more vsed in the ministration of the Lords supper but the Lords prayer which beginneth thus Our father which arte in heauen c. Celestinus that gaue the Introite of the Masse was not bishop in Rome before the ende of 420. yeeres after Christ so that for the space of 420. yéeres your Masse had no Introite That Gregorie that appointed the Kyrie eleison was made bishop of Rome in the yéere 590. after Christ so that your Masse lacked that parte for the space of 600. yeeres almost Telesphorus added the Gloria in excelsis about 130. yeeres after Christ so that your Masse did lack that parte so longe time Gelasius the first that diuised the Collations was bishop of Rome about 490. yeeres after Christ so that your Masse lacked hir Collations almost 500. yéeres Hieronimus that added the Epistle and Gospell was neuer bishop either in Rome or else where Hee liued in Bethlehem about 380. yéeres after Christ so that your Masse had no Epistle or Gospell for 380. yeeres after Christ And your Halleluia was taken from the church of Hierusalem by Gregorie the first who was bishop of Rome about the yéere of our Lord 590. The Nicene Créede could not be vsed before that councell wherein it was agréed vpon which was 330. yeeres after Christ And Pelagius that inuented the remembrance of the deade was made bishop of Rome in the yeere of our Lord 556. so that for the space of so many yeeres after Christ there was no remembrance of the deade in your Masse Leo the third that inuented the burning of Incense was made bishop of Rome in the yeere 796. after Christ so that for the space of so many yeeres there was no burning of Incense in churches Innocent the first was made bishop of Rome in the yeere 406. hée inuented the kissing of the Paxe at Masse so longe therefore was your Masse without that ceremonie And Sergius that appointed the singing of Agnus Dei was made bishop of Rome in the yeere after Christ 694. or there about so that your Masse lacked hir Agnus Dei for the space almost of 700. yeeres after Christ Now M. Offerer consider with your selfe I pray you whether the learned Protestant may not as easily prooue the antiquitie of his communion booke euen from the Apostles time as you may prooue your Authenticall seruice and ministration of sacraments now daily openly practized If you would with indifferent iudgment weigh al that I haue here written I doo not doubt but you would cōfesse that during the first 90. yéeres after Christs ascention there was no prescribed order set downe in any booke for publike seruice or ministration of sacramēts other then that which is contained in the scriptures Wherefore there is none so great a cause of misliking in oure common booke as that there be so many of your latter inuētions allowed of in it And surely if our princes people would yéelde to a perfect reformation wee might make our communion booke a great deale lesse then it is by blotting out of it all that hath bin inuented by your bishops of Rome Thus I doo thinke I haue said enough to cause you to recant although you would not before The twelfth Offer Offerer I demaund of the learned Protestant to know cause and reason why their congregations doo admit and receiue all bishops priests deacons and other officers spirituall ordered by our Catholike church as men lawfull and sufficient to preach the word of God to minister the Sacramēts to exercise all spirituall iurisdiction in no lesse wise but rather more then if they had bin ordred in their owne congregations whereas the Catholike church of Christ dooth not acknowledge any man of their ordering and calling to be any whit the more fit for any spirituall function in Christ his church then other cōmon lay men When therefore the learned Protestant shal be able to shew good cause and reason why our Catholike church hauing by their owne consent and approouing lawfull priestes bishops and spirituall ministers not to be also the lawfull true and Catholike church of Christ I will then recant and not before Crowley This Offer is altogither friuolous and foolish For what reason was it that mooued this vnreasonable Offerer to require the learned
they preach except they be sent Had no such meaning as this Offerer dooth beare the world in hand that hée had That is that no preachers can be thought to be sent of God but such only as are allowed of by some popish Prelate S. Augustine in his Dialogue of 65. August in Dialog 65. questionū questions if that booke may bée called his hath this question in the later end of that booke Quot genera sunt Apostolatus vel quale nomen sit Apostolus volo cognoscere I am willing to know saith Orosius how many sorts of Apostleships there bée or what maner name this name Apostle is The answere that saint Augustine is supposed to make is thus This name Apostle is interpreted to signifie sent Of Apostles or messēgers there be foure sorts or kings One sort are sent from God not by men another sort are sent from God but yet by mē a third sort are sent by men onely and the fourth sort are sent of them selues From God only was Moses sent from God by man was Iosua sent by man onely are such sent as by the fauor of the cōmon people are aduaunced to the office of priesthoode as in our daies many are Of themselues are sent such as be false prophets then Orosius asketh another question which is the last question of that booke Quomodo possumus scire qui mittatur a Deo How may wée know saith hee who it is that is sent of God Augustine answereth Illum cognosce missum a Deo quem non paucorum hominū laudatio vel potius adulatio eligit sed illum quem vita mores optimi apostolicorum actio commendat sacerdotum vel etiam qui vniuersorum populorum iuditio comprobatur qui non appetit praeesse qui nec pecuniam dat vt Episcopatus honorem acquirat Nam qui praeesse festinat quidam patrum eliganter expressit dicens sciat se non esse Episcopum qui praeesse cupit non prodesse In english thus Know this that not the man whom the commendation or rather the flatterie of a few men dooth choose but he whom both life and maners of the best sort the action of Apostolike priestes dooth commend is sent of God or els that man that is allowed of by the iudgment of all people such a one as desireth not to beare rule that doth not giue money that he may obtaine the honor of a bishop For he that is hasty to beare rule is by one of the Fathers finely painted out in this saying let that man that coueteth to beare rule and not to doo good know that hée is no bishop In these woords of S. Augustine it appéereth that in his iudgment it is not the ordinarie calling and externall vnction that wee should looke vnto when wée bee desirous to know what preachers be sent of God but it is their good life the good liking that good men haue of them yea and the good opinion that all men are enforced to haue in them bicause they sée in them no signe of ambition or desire of honor but contrariwise that they are desirous to be occupied in doing good By these signes saith S. Augustine yee shall know that they are sent of God So that as Chrysosostome saith that they are knowne by the maner of their preaching so S. Augustine doth say that they are knowne by their life But now the Offerer or some of his friends will say that S. Augustine is against vs in these woords Et apostolicorum actio commendat sacerdotum In english thus And such a one as the action of the Apostolike priests dooth commend These Apostolike priests must néedes be popish Catholiques in the iudgment of this Offerer his fellows for with them onely Peter is the Apostle and Rome the Apostolike seate bicause as they imagine Peter was byshop there 25. yéere left his powre authority there with his immediate successor But who was that successor they are not yet agréed for some of them say it was Clement some say it was Limus But this is their conclusion that whosoeuer is bishop of Rome must néedes haue Peters authority by succession in that seate although hee bée in life doctrine neuer so vnlike or cōtrary to Peter And none may be accounted Apostolike but such as be of or vnder the obedience of that Apostolike succession but by the circumstance of S. Augustines woords it appéereth that hee taketh them for Apostolike priests that are most like vnto the Apostles in life and in doctrine and in painefull trauell and in continuall care to doo good in the Church of Christ Such are not the popish Catholiques for all their care is as in the Decrées of their generall Counselles it dooth appéere to aduance them selues in degrée aboue all other sortes of men and to maintaine them selues in that high estate And they are euen the same men that are spoken vnto in those last woords that I haue cyted out of S. Augustine sciat se non esse Episcopum qui praeesse cupit non prodesse Let that man which coueteth to beare rule and not to doo good knowe that hee is no bishop But let vs nowe see what this Offerer hath cited out of the fift Chapter to the Hebrewes Heb. 5. Nec quisquam sibi sumit honorem nisi qui vocatur a Deo quemadmodum Aaron No man taketh honor vnto him selfe except hee bée called of God as Aaron was First I must note that this Offerer hath not dealt simply in that he hath translated these wroodes thus let no man take vnto him selfe c. For by this translation it séemeth to bée a commaundement giuen or a rule set downe by the Apostle which rule must néedes bee kept in the admitting of all such as shal be ministers in the church of Christ So that who soeuer is not admitted according to that rule may not bée taken for a Catholique minister nor his ministration allowed of But let vs sée in what meaning the Apostle did write the woords The circumstance of the text dooth make it plaine that the Apostles purpose was to prooue that Aarons priesthoode was at an ende and that the high priestes that had bin made after the Order of Aaron were farre inferiour vnto Christ that is our high Priest not after the Order of Aaron but of Melchizedech And yet our Sauiour Christ was no vsurper for hée was called of God as Aaron was And herein hée was like vnto Aaron But in that Aaron and such as were made high Priests after his Order did offer Sacrifice for their owne sinnes Christ was nothing like them for hee neded not to offer for any sinnes of his owne sith there was no sinne in him But how maketh this for our Offerers purpose The Apostles meaning was to prooue that Aarons Priesthoode was now come to an ende and must now giue place to the Priesthoode of Christ which shoulde neuer haue