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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A43976	Considerations upon the reputation, loyalty, manners, & religion of Thomas Hobbes of Malmsbury written by himself, by way of letter to a learned person.; Mr. Hobbes considered in his loyalty, religion, reputation and manners	Hobbes, Thomas, 1588-1679.	1680 (1680)	Wing H2218; ESTC R6871	20,985	80

CONSIDERATIONS UPON The REPUTATION LOYALTY MANNERS RELIGION OF THOMAS HOBBES OF MALMSBVRY Written by Himself By way of LETTER to a Learned Person LONDON Printed for William Crooke at the Green Dragon without Temple-bar 1680. THE BOOKSELLER'S ADVERTISEMENT To the READERS I Do here present you with a Piece of Mr. Hobbes's Writing which is not published from an imperfect MS. as his Dialogue of the Civil Wars of England was by some that had got accidentally a Copy of it absolutely against his consent as you may see by some Passages out of some of his Letters to me which I have here inserted In his Letter of June 1679. he saith I would fain have published my Dialogue of the Civil Wars of England long ago and to that end I presented it to his Majesty and some days after when I thought he had read it I humbly besought him to let me print it but his Majesty though he heard me gratiously yet he flatly refused to have it published Therefore I brought away the Book and gave you leave to take a Copy of it which when you had done I gave the Original to an honourable and learned Friend who about a year after died The King knows better and is more concerned in publishing of Books than I am Therefore I dare not venture to appear in the business lest it should offend him Therefore I pray you not to meddle in the business Rather than to be thought any way to further or countenance the printing I would be content to lose twenty times the value of what you can expect to gain by it c. I pray do not take it ill it may be I may live to send you somewhat else as vendible as that And without offence I rest Chatsworth June 19. 1679. Your Very humble Servant Thomas Hobbes Part of his Letter in July 1679. If I leave any MSs. worth printing I will leave word you shall have them if you please I am Chatsworth July 21. 1679. Your humble Servant Thomas Hobbes Part of his Letter Aug. 1679. Sir I thank you for taking my advice in not stirring about the printing of my Book concerning the Civil Wars of England c. I am writing somewhat for you to print in English c. I am Chatsworth Aug. 18. 1679. Sir Your humble Servant Thomas Hobbes That no spurious Brats for the time to come be fathered upon the deceased Author I have printed verbatim these Passages out of his Letters written to me at several times Their Original I have by me I will be so just to his Memory that I will not print any thing but what is perfect and fitted for the Press And if any Book shall be printed with his Name to it that hath not before been printed you may be confident it is not his unless Printed for William Crooke Sir I Am one of them that admire your Writings and having read over your Hobbius Heauton-timorumenos I cannot hold from giving you some account of the causes why I admire it And first I considered how you handle him for his Disloyalty in these words pag. the 5 th His great Leviathan wherein he placed his main strength is now somewhat out of season which upon deserting his Royal Master in distress for he pretends to have been the King's Tutor though yet from those who have most reason to know it I can find but little ground for such a pretence was written in defence of Oliver's Title or whoever by whatsoever means can get to be upmost placing the whole Right of Government meerly in strength and Absolving all his Majesties Subjects from their Allegiance whenever He is not in a present capacity to force Obedience That which I observe and admire here first is That you left not this passage out for two reasons One because M r Hobbes could long for nothing more than such an occasion to tell the world his own and your little stories during the time of the late Rebellion When the Parliament sate that began in April 1640. and was dissolved in May following and in which many points of the Regal Power which were necessary for the Peace of the Kingdom and the safety of His Majesties Person were disputed and denied M r. Hobbes wrote a little Treatise in English wherein he did set forth and demonstrate That the said Power and Rights were inseparably annexed to the Sovereignty which Sovereignty they did not then deny to be in the King but it seems understood not or would not understand that Inseparability Of this Treatise though not Printed many Gentlemen had Copies which occasioned much talk of the Author and had not His Majesty dissolved the Parliament it had brought him into danger of his Life He was the first that had ventured to write in the King's defence and one amongst very few that upon no other ground but knowledge of his Duty and Principles of Equity without special Interest was in all points perfectly Loyal The 3 d of November following there began a new Parliament consisting for the greatest part of such men as the People had elected only for their adverseness to the Kings Interest These proceeded so fiercely in the very beginning against those that had written or preach'd in the defence of any part of that Power which they then intended to take away and in gracing those whom the King had disgrac'd for Sedition that Mr. Hobbes doubting how they would use him went over into France the first of all that fled and there continued eleven years to his dammage some thousands of pounds deep This Dr. was your time of harvest You were in their favour and that as you have made it since appear for no goodness Being at Paris he wrote and published his Book de Cive in Latine to the end that all Nations which should hear what you and your Concovenanters were doing in England might detest you which I believe they do for I know no Book more magnified than this is beyond the Seas When His Majesty that now is came to Paris Mr. Hobbes had the honour to initiate him in the Mathematicks but never was so impudent or ignorant as to call or think himself the King's Tutor as you that understand not what that word out of the University signifies do falsly charge him with or ever to say that he was one of His Majesties domestique Servants While upon this occasion he staid about Paris and had neither encouragement nor desire to return into England he wrote and published his Leviathan far from the intention either of disadvantage to His Majesty or to flatter Oliver who was not made Protector till three or four years after or purpose to make way for his return For there is scarce a page in it that does not upbraid both him and you and others such as you with your abominable hypocrisie and villany Nor did he desert His Majesty as you falsly accuse him as His Majesty Himself knows Nor was His Majesty as you unmannerly term

Majesties Interest in Himself or His Friends though some of them have since by extraordinary Service deserved to be received into favour But what 's that to you You are none of them and yet you dare to reproach the guiltless as if after so ill fruits of your Sermons it were not impudence enough to preach I admire further That having been forgiven these so transcendent Crimes so great a debt to the Gallows you take Mr. Hobbes by the throat for a word in his Leviathan made a fault by malicious or over-hasty construction For you have thereby like the unmerciful debtor in the Gospel in my opinion forseited your pardon and so without a new one may be hanged yet To that other Charge That he writ his Leviathan in defence of Oliver's Title he will say That you in your own conscience know it is false What was Oliver when that Book came forth It was in 1650 and Mr. Hobbes returned before 1651. Oliver was then but General under your Masters of the Parliament nor had yet cheated them of their usurped Power For that was not done till two or three years after in 1653. which neither he nor you could foresee What Title then of Oliver's could he pretend to justifie But you will say He placed the Right of Government there wheresoever should be the strength and so by consequence he placed it in Oliver Is that all Then primarily his Leviathan was intended for your Masters of the Parliament because the strength was then in them Why did they not thank him for it both they and Oliver in their turns There Doctor you decypher'd ill For it was written in the behalf of those many and faithful Servants and Subjects of His Majesty that had taken His part in the War or otherwise done their utmost endeavour to defend His Majesties Right and Person against the Rebels whereby having no other means of Protection nor for the most part of subsistence were forced to compound with your Masters and to promise Obedience for the saving of their Lives and Fortunes which in his Book he hath affirmed they might lawfully do and consequently not lawfully bear Arms against the Victors They that had done their utmost endeavour to perform their obligation to the King had done all that they could be obliged unto and were consequently at liberty to seek the safety of their Lives and Livelihood wheresoever and without Treachery But there is nothing in that Book to justifie the submission of you or such as you to the Parliament after the King 's being driven from them or to Oliver for you were the King's Enemies and cannot pretend want of that Protection which you your selves refused denied fought against and destroyed If a man owe you money and you by robbing him or other injury disable him to pay you the fault 's your own nor needs this exception Unless the Creditor rob him be put into the Condition of the Bond. Protection and Obedience are Relative He that says a man may submit to an enemy for want of Protection can never be construed but that he meant it of the Obedient But let us consider his words They are in pag. 390. Where he puts for a Law of Nature That every man is bound as much as in him lieth to protect in War the Authority by which he is himself protected in time of Peace which I think is no ungodly nor unreasonable Principle For confirmation of it he defines in what point of time it is that a Subject becomes obliged to obey an unjust Conquerour And defines it thus It is that point wherein having liberty to submit to the Conquerour he consenteth either by express words or by other sufficient signs to be his Subject I cannot see Doctor how a man can be at liberty to submit to his new that has not first done all he could for his old Master Nor if he have done all he could why that liberty should be refused him If a man be taken by the Turk and brought by terrour to fight against his former Master I see how he may be kill'd for it as an Enemy but not as a Criminal Nor can I see how he that hath liberty to submit can at the same time be bound not to submit But you will say perhaps That he defines the time of that liberty to the advantage of Oliver in that he says that for an ordinary Subject it is then when the means of his Life are within the Guards and Garrisons of the Enemy for it is then that he hath no protection but from the Enemy for his Contribution It was not necessary for him to explain it to men of so great Understanding that you and other his Enemies pretend to be by putting in the Exception Unless they came into those Guards and Garrisons by their own Treason Do you think that Oliver's Party for their submission to Oliver could pretend the want of that Protection The words therefore by themselves without that exception do signifie no more than this That whosoever had done as much as in him did lye to protect the King in War had liberty afterwards to provide themselves of such Protection as they could get which to those whose means of life were within the Guards and Garrisons of Oliver was Oliver's Protection Do you think when a Battel is lost and you at the mercy of the Enemy is it unlawful to receive Quarter with condition of Obedience Or if you receive it on that condition do you think it honesty to break promise and treacherously murder him that gave you your life If that were good Doctrine he were a foolish Enemy that would give Quarter to any man You see then that this submission to Oliver or to your then Masters is allowed by Mr. Hobbes his Doctrine only to the King 's faithful Party and not to any that fought against him howsoever they coloured it by saying they fought for the King and Parliament nor to any that writ or preached against His Cause or encouraged His Adversaries nor to any that betrayed His Counsels or that intercepted or decyphered any Letters of His or of His Officers or of any of His Party nor to any that by any way had contributed to the diminution of His Majesties Power Ecclesiastical or Civil nor does it absolve any of them from their Allegeance You that make it so heinous a crime for a man to save himself from violent death by a forc'd submission to an Usurper should have considered what crime it was to submit voluntarily to the Usurping Parliament I can tell you besides why those words were put into his last Chapter which he calls the Review It happened at that time that there were many Honourable Persons that having been faithful and unblemished Servants of the King and Souldiers in His Army had their Estates then Sequestred of whom some were fled but the Fortunes of them all were at the mercy not of Oliver but of the Parliament Some of these