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Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
book_n	speak_v	word_n	write_v	6,248	5	5.5490	4	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A03883	A treatise concerning the ground of faith. VVritten in Latin, by the reuerend Father Iames Gordon Huntley of Scotland, Doctour of Diuinity, of the Society of Iesus. And translated into English, by I.L. of the same Society. The second part of the second controuersy; Controversiarum epitomes. English. Selections	Gordon, James, 1541-1620.; Wright, William, 1563-1639.	1614 (1614)	STC 13997A; ESTC S118149	27,760	72

the groūd of our fayth that is the true ground therof because our fayth cannot well nor must not be considered but in regard of men seeing that our fayth cannot be found but in men only if therfore in regard of men the Church is the gound of truth it is also most truly and necessarily the ground of our fayth 20. Furthermore that the ancient Church of the holy Fathers did cōstantly hold the preaching and authority of the Catholike Church to be the ground of our fayth those excellent words of S. Augustine do manifestly declare when he writeth thus disputing against the Manichees I sayth he would not belieue the Ghospell but that the authority of the Catholike Church moued me therunto this sētēce of S. Augustine vexeth our Aduersaries very much Caluin goeth about to perswade the ignorāt people that S. Augustin speaketh of himselfe as yet remayning a Manichean heretike and not of himselfe as being conuerted and made a Catholike But this is a ridiculous euasion for the words which follow a litle after do shew that this is a false interpretation of Caluin If thou doest hold thy selfe to the Ghospell S. Augustine soeaketh vnto a Manichean heretike I would hold my selfe to those by whose commandment I belieued the Ghospell He speaketh therfore of himselfe as now being a Catholike and after a few words VVhose authority sayth he being infringed weakned I could not now euen belieue the Ghospel it selfe Where he sheweth plainly that our fayth doth so depend of the authority of the Church that it being weakned or taken away it could not remayne or continue by any fayth of the Gospell Wherby it is manifest that it is false which Iunius writeth that S. Augustine did only speake of the accidentary and not of the necessary cause 21. Others say that S. Augustine did speake of this or that booke of the Gospell and not of the whole Ghospell in generall But the very words of S. Augustine doe teach the contrary because he speaketh euery where of the Gospell it selfe in generall Moreouer one and the same reason is of one booke of the Ghospell and of all the rest as concerning fayth 22. Others lastly do answere that S. Augustine did not speake of the Church of his tyme but of the primitiue Church wherin were the Apostles who approued the Ghospells But this solution is also easily refuted out of the words next following to whom faith S. Augustin I haue obeied saying Belieue the Gospell why should I not obey them then saying vnto me Doe not belieue Manicheus But it is manifest that the primitiue Church spake nothing of Manicheus but that Church only which was in S. Augustines tyme sayd vnto him doe not belieue Manicheus For Manicheus liued many yeares after the primitiue Church yea euen after S. Cyprian that is to say almost three hundred yeares after Christ as the same S. Augustine testifyeth and it is otherwise sufficiently well knowen that the Manichean heresy was vnknowne in the world before the yeare 277. See Baronius in his 2. Tom. in the yeare 277. in the 2. number and others following CHAP. VI. The arguments of our Aduersaries are confuted NOvv it remayneth we answere to the arguments of our Aduersaries for by our answers the difficulty of this whole controuersy wil be more perspicuously resolued Their first argument is if the authority of the Church were the ground of fayth then it would follow that our faith relied vpon men and not vpon God for the Church consisteth of men Our Aduersaries do often repeate and inculcat this argument vnto vs. I answere that the same argument if it were any thing worth would also proue that we should not belieue Scriptures because al those who wrot the books of the Bibles were also men but as we do belieue their writinges not because they were men but because they had a certaine peculiar assi●…āce of the holy Ghost who did so gouerne and direct the that they could not erre so in like manner we belieue the Church and make it the ground of our fayth not as it consisteth of men but as it hath a speciall and continuall assistance of the holy Ghost by whome she is continually gouerned and directed wherby it commeth to passe that she can neuer erre as we haue proued a little before 2. Wherefore to make the Church the ground of our fayth is nothing els then to make the holy Ghost and Christ himselfe the ground therof For it is he who speaketh vnto vs by the mouth of the Church according to that saying of S. Paul Seeke you an experiment of him that speaketh in me Christ And in another place speaking of his own doctrine he sayth therfore he that despiseth these things despiseth not man but God who also hath giuē his holy spirit in vs. But our Aduersaries do thinke speak too basely of the Church as though it consisted of men only as the Churches of Insidells and Heretikes seeing that the chiefe part of the true Church of Christ is the holy Ghost who is as it were the soule and spirit of the Church 3. But neither is this to make the Scripture or the holy Ghost subiect inferito our men as our Aduersarise are wōr to cauil but ōly to shew that the holy Ghost is euery where conformable to himselfe that in all things he neuer differeth or disgreeth frō himselfe Whether he speake vnto vs by the holy Scripture or by the mouth of the Church as Caluin acknowledgeth disputing against the Anabaptists and Libertines who by such an argument went about to reiect the holy Scriptures to wit least the holy Ghost might be made subiect and inferiour vnto them 4. The second argument is that Christians may and ought to iudge and examine all things as the Apostle sayth therefore the spirit of euery Christian ought to be the groūd of al things I answere that by the same argumēt the Anabaptists Libertines reiected all the Scriptures that they might only retaine the spirit as witnesseth Caluin but badly for euen as Christians must discerne and iudge all things so must they also obserue the rule and method in iudging which the Scripture doth prescribe vnto them and which himselfe appointed but this rule is not euery ones priuate spirit but the spirit of the whole Church For it is altogeather necessary that the rule of fayth be most certayne free from all errors as the spirit of the whole Church is and not that of euery priuate man Hereupon sayth S. Iohn He which knoweth God heareth vs he who is not of God doth not heare vs in this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error We must therfore iudge of euery man by that they eyther heare or do not heare the Church c because they either agree or disagree frō the spirit of the Catholike Church 5. The third argument is that Catholikes proue the Church and

approue all the Canonicall bookes of the new testament For if they had donne so there had remayned no doubt of many of them for many ages after the death of the Apostles euen among Catholike good men as we haue noted before But many yeares after the Apostles tyme by the generall Councells and Decrees of the Church some bookes were approued wherof there was before some doubt 7. Yea more then six hundred yeares after Christ there were many Catholikes who did not receyue the authority of the Apocalyps as appeareth out of the fourth Toletane Councell 8. And that which is more before the Councell of Trent the were many Catholikes who thought that it was lawfull for them to doubt of all the bookes of the new Testament the which in tymes past S Hierome seemed to iudge as doubtfull as are the Epistles of S. Iames the second of S. Peter the second and third of S. Iohn the Epistles of S. Iude the Epistles to the Hebrewes and the Apocalyps And if it had not byn for the Councell of Trēt or some other new Decree of the Church none would as yet condemne them as Heretikes who called those bookes in question 9. By that which hath byn sayd it appeareth manifestly that the Canonicall Scriptures receiue their strength and authority not from the approbation of the primitiue Church but rather from the approbation of the Church succeeding yea euen of this present Church to wit of the Councell of Trent 10. Lastly albeit the present Church should not haue the authority of approuing Scriptures as these men say yet notwithstanding for three other reasons the authority testimony of this present Church is necessary First because we know not certainly what bookes the primitiue Church hath eyther written or not written approued or reiected but by the testimony of the present Church Secondly neyther do we know whether those bookes came vncorrupted vnto vs or noe but by the same testimony Thirdly because we cannot otherwise know which is the true sense of those bookes CHAP. VIII The Argument of our Aduersaryes are confuted THE first argument of our Aduersaries is The Church is grounded vpon the word of God and by the word also of God it is engendred nourished and gouerned and it is subiect to the word of God as to the words of her spouse I answere our Aduersaries do in a manner cōfound the writtē word of God with the word of God in generall the which they should not doe for ther are three sorts of the word of God to wit that which is belieued preached and written The belieued word is in the hart of the Church that which is preached is in her mouth and that which is written is in her bookes Of the belieued and preached word the Apostle sayth the word is in thy mouth and in thy hart this is the word of fayth which we preach We confesse that in the belieued and preached word the Church is founded because by the same it is ingendred nourished and gouerned and that vnto this word it is subiect and obedient as vnto the Words of her spouse For indeed this kind of word is necessary for the Church For with our hart sayth the Apostle we belieue vnto Iustice but with the mouth confession is made to saluation And againe How shall they heare without a preacher 2. But the nature of the written word is farre different for this is neyther altogeather necessary for the Church seeing that the Church was without it more then two thousand yeares neyther can the written word be profitable to the Church vnlesse it be also rightly preached and belieued For what doth it profit a man to haue the Bible vnlesse he rightly belieue and vnderstand it 3. But the Scripture whereof we now dispute doth only conteyne written word but the belieued and preached word are cōteined in the visibe Church as the necessary and essentiall parts therof seing the one is as it were the life in the hart of the Church the other as it were the speach in her mouth neyther can they euer be separated from her according to that saying and promise of God The words which I haue put in thy month shall not depart from thy mouth nor from the mouth of thy seede nor from the mouth of thy seedes seede from hence forth for euermore 4. Wherefore this argument doth proue the quite cōtrary for seeing that the written word receiueth it pro●… and authority from the rightly belieued and preached word which are the partes of the Church it is necessary that the written word receiue that authority and ●…ity from the Church as that wherin only the word rightly preached and belieued is to be found 5. The second argument If the Church should teach any thing contrary to the Scriptures we were not to belieue the Church Therefore the Scripture doth not rece●…ue that authority from the Church but rather the Church from the Scripture I answere that in the same māner it may be said that if the Scripture should conteine any thing against truth we should not also belieue it if the holy Ghost should vtter and speake any ly we should not belieue him But these conditions are indeed impossible and blasphemous against God wherefore they are not only to be admitted but not euen to be proposed of Christians For it is impossible that the Church should teach any thing contrary to the Scriptures for then the holy Ghost should lye because he should teach one thing by the Church and the contrary by the Scriptures 6. The third argument if the Scripture receiue that authority from the Church then the Church should be aboue the Scripture which seemeth to be very absurd 〈◊〉 That the Church is aboue the Scripture may be vnderstood two wayes First because the Church exceedeth the Scripture in dignity and excellency and in this sense without all doubt the Church is aboue the Scripture for the Scripture is made for the Church and not contrarywise All things sayth the Apostles are done for you Christ dyed for the Church and not for the Scriptures the Church belieueth hopeth loueth and praysed God but the Scripture doth none of these The Church shall reigne and liue euerlastingly with Christ in heauen the Scripture shall perish after the day of Iudgement Lastly the Church conteineth in it the word of God rightly belieued preached and the holy Ghost it selfe all which do farre exceede the written word in excellency and dignity 7. Secondly it may be vnderstood that the Church is aboue the Scripture 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 she may change the Scripture or of Scripture make no Scripture or lastly she may teach somewhat cōtrary to Scri●… or depart from the true sense of Scripture In which sense the Sectaries of this tyme say that we affirme the Church to be aboue the Scripture And thus it is falso that the Church is aboue the Scripture but neyther is there any Catholike which in this sense will