which some doe with such cōfidence for surely they must ether be proude dunces and ignorant doltes not vnderstanding what is proofe and what is not or else preuaricating miscreants counterfeiting what they doe not belieue and thinke our learned men vnable or vnwilling to discouer the follye of theyr enterprise Vncle. Your bloode is too hot nephew but if you said only that such men as promise them selues victorie with so much confidence in this case are rash and vnaduised I should thinke you wronged them not For the truth is there 's none but is so in his measure And where interest or affection is ioyned to some litle apparēce which the first sight of the text affordeth there 's presently a great impression made It is true in so graue and important a case they ought to be more staied but he whose conscience quitteth him from all too forward iudging of his neighbours euen in matters of consequence let him cast the first stone for mee I will leaue them to them selues and let you see that we are not yet at an end but farther §. 9 That there riseth an vncertaintie out of this that the scripture was written in languages now ceassed FOr not only the languages in which the Holy scrtpture was writtē doe of their owne nature as I tould you breede great ambiguitie in the text but also in this that those languages are now extinct And therefore wee see that the knowledge of them is not cōmon ad vniuersall but only of some particular men and amongst them in most things mainely controuerted And of this disputable vncertaintie amongst our famous linguists none can be ignorant the nūber of Critickes in this age and the multitude of their volumes giue sufficient testimonie of it The vncertaintie of criticisme Nay they will tell you that an exact and skillfull knowledge in this Criticisme is a necessarie part and qualitie for all those who will professe the studie or interpretation of scripture And yet God knowe's vpon what slight grounds they proceed what weake ghesses are their iudgmēts how full of quarells and mistakes so that a wise man no sooner seeth them but seeth likewise that there is nothing but varieties of disputs vpon coniecturall probabilities and neuerthelesse you shall haue thē cry out runne to the fountaine goe to the spring see the originall texts not considering that there is nothing there but trubled waters that is obscure cōiectures I could tell you also that often times it happeneth that such as are imployed in the translations of these ambiguous originalls haue got by friēds and fauour that preferment and so haue let passe some places in their trālations which I could cite against their owne iudgment to complie with the will of their patrons and higher powers whom they durst not resiste But in deede their principles in them selues are so vncertaine as that the best and wisest of them will confesse they haue beene often mistaken and will not sticke to chāge their mindes now and then euen in such pointes as they thought they had the greattest euidence their art could aftord them What thinke you then deare cozen would become of Christian faith if it were only to relye vpon such a weake fundation Which must needes follow if the most substantiall pointes of Christian Religion must haue their only warrant and decision from the bare written word and bee euer agitated by places of scripture and neuer concluded by a definitiue sentence Were it not too tedious I would let you see the vncertaintie of diuers particular languages wherein seuerall parts of the scripture are said to haue beene originally written but I will only tell you in a word §. 10 What vncertaintie followeth the two particular languages of Hebrew and Greeke wherein the scripture was written FIrst therefore the Hebrew hath two proprieties verie considerable the one that it is thought to be the shortest language in the world the other that it is the most eloquent For the first it cōsisteth cheefely in the writing of the words and in the scarcitie of bookes For the writing all the vowells are supposed not expressed in the originall copies and therefore only conserued by memorie and to memory we must trust for them I confesse they are now expressed by pointes wherein there is great mistaking the rules thereof being verie vncertaine and the more in that these rules and the practize of them were varied according to the diuersitie of the countries wherein the Iewes haue beene dispersed The reason of their writing without points I conceiue was becaus their vowells being at the first but fiue by making long and short grew to be more and so the first figures of them to stand only for the consonant vse of some vowells or els to haue no sound But what soeuer the origine was the effect must of necessitie breede a great obscuritie and doubtfullnesse in the language the vowells though fewer yet in vse being verie neere as much as the consonants The words are all of one or two sillables if anie be of more they are accounted exoticke and therefore verie like one an other which is also increased by the neerenesse of diuers of their letters So that both their pronuntiation and writing being easily mistaken and confounded bring 's a great disorder in the language This is likewise augmented by the want they haue of coniunctions and prepositions which not being of a sufficient number make the construction verie equiuocall manie times For the scaretie of bookes you may well conceiue it if you doe but know that the legitimate Hebrew is wholy contained in the old scripture whereof some parts were not written in Hebrew and if you saw the booke in a smale print and yet the letter bigger then our litle latin character you would see it is but a verie litle booke And what soeuer besides is written in Hebrew is not warrantable to explicate the text The Rabins affecting manie diuersities as well in words and stile as in writing Nay perhaps I might add to this that the characters them selues haue beene wholy changed since the beginning and that it is credibly reported to haue beene once lost and restored only by the memorie of Esdras So that we haue the least assurance of this language that almost can be of anie not entirely extinguished For the proprietie of the Hebrew 's Eloquence it consisteth cheefely in figures translations and number Figures or schemes are the highest part of proper Rhetoricke because they contayne the greatest force and swaye that words can giue to our appetit and if they bee rightly applyed carrie a way the auditor euen against his will vnto a strong and sadaine action These although the Prophets vse them more perfectly then euer anie Poet or Orator did yet doe they not cause much obscuritie vnlesse it be when they are vsed in Dialogue forme which where it is vsed in scripture t' is hard to discerne How soeuer they are a conuincing proofe that who
vseth them much inteÌ„de's not his writings should be dogmaticall and decisiue Translations or metaphores are cause of great obscuritie and therefore we see the Poets who cheefely vse them are not to be redd vntill a man be exercised in theÌ„ without studie and paines Nor doe anie Greeke or Latin examples shew that strength which the scripture hath in this kinde The number or Cadence which one would thinke could not be suspected of anie such matter is a cause of great ambiguitie for the Hebrews being wholy giuen there vnto in their scripture haue so manie accents of diuers effects whereof one manie times staÌ„deth for an other or is like an other in figure that you had neede of an Ariadne to lead you thorough Some of their accents are Grammaticall some Rhetoricall some musicall and as much a doe with them as with the reste of the words and verie hard it is to know when it is one accent when it is an other and when it hath this effect when that Who therefore would haue recourse to the Hebrew Text for precise and conuincing decisions doth like him that being not skillfull at his weapon would choose vpon a challenge for the hower of his combat a moonelesse midnight when the skill of his enimie could not preiudice him Nephew Marrie sir I thinke such a man should doe wisely for the question being not of fencing but of valour his enimie's skill would be no disaduantage vnto him But yet I cannot commende him that chooseth obscuritie for the decision of a doubt vnlesse he feare his cause and thinke him self in the wrong and then peraduenture his witt may be commended Vncle. It is sufficient for mee that you conceiue that this is not the way to cleere the truh To the Greeke text therefore which I will tell you that the ambiguitie of it is nothing so great as of the Hebrew yet hath it two defects The one that it wanteth those sense varying coniugations whereby the Orientall languages expresse them selues the other that by abundance or rather redundance of vnprofitable varieties it is both hard to learne and vncertaine in seÌ„se the same word signifying diuersly ether because of diuers Dialectes or of diuers applications of authours so manie hauing written in seuerall countries not depending one of an other and hauing great diuersitie of phansies Their prepositions both in constructioÌ„ and composition are irregular changing some times the sense of the primatiue verie extrauagantly in so much that meere ghesse and coniecture must preuaille the word if it be coÌ„mon being vsed in sundrie seÌ„ses if it be rare the meaning of it must be gathered out of some thing adiacent Nephew Here is enough vncle of this verball and GraÌ„maticall stuffe Wherefore I will now put you in minde of your promise to wit that you will tell mee to what end the scripture was left to the church since by reason of it's ambiguitie it is not fit to be a judge of controuersies Vncle. I will tell you presently but first I haue a word more to saie vnto you wherein because I see you are half wearie I wee wil be short and it shal bee to shew you §. 11 That the verie nature of the bookes of scripture is not fitting to decide controuersies TEll me then cozen suppose you were to giue a law in writing which should last for manies ages and be obserued in manie couÌ„tries how would you cause it to be written I meane not for the language but for the frame of the worke and for the manner or methode of the deliuerie of it Nephew I doe not professe my self able to bee a law-maker yer according to the example of our laws and of the ciuill law In What forme laws ought to be made and I imagine the like of the laws of other countries it were me thinke's to be donne thus I would first cause the most commoÌ„ things to be commanded then by degrees I would descende to particulars still obseruing that seuerall matters should be vnder seuerall chapters or diuisions and not one peece here an other there euerie chapter containing all things necessarily belonging to that matter Farther I would distinguish the degrees of commandes by the degrees of penalties and rewards And if anie thing were fit partly to be declared partly to be left to discretion I would expresse so much that there might be no mistake As for the stile I would endeauour to make it the most proper and exact that possibly I could explicating ambiguous words to my power and declaring in what sense they were to be taken cutting of all superfluous words which might anie waye confound or prolong the sentences without necessitie In fine I would labour to make it the most ordinarie the most plaine and the most short that my witts could reach vnto and then according as I should haue followed these rules I should thinke to haue performed my raske Vncle. I see you would make a good states man And if reason teach you this will not the same reason tell you likewise that if the Authour of reason him self were to giue a law would he not doe the same in a more perfect degree And if in anie booke he hath not donne it doth not the same reasoÌ„ tell you that his intention was not that that booke should be a iudging law Let vs therefore see whether these conditions be obserued in the scripture or no And if it be manifest that the scripture hath them not this controuersie must needes be at an end sithence it will euidently follow that God neuer ordained the scripture for anie such pourpose but for some thing els and consequently that it were as ridiculous to seeke the decision of controuersies out of scripture as to cut with beetle or knoke with a strawe Deuiding therefore th holy scripture you shall finde The diuision of the â—ookes of the old TestameÌ„t that the bookes of the old Testament sauing Deuteronomie which is or containeth the old law with much admixtion of historie are ether Historicall oratoricall poeticall or Philosophicall Whereof the three first are excluded by their verie names from the qualities and conditions of a law instituted for the deciding of quarells though some coÌ„mandes may be therein contained vpon occasion The philosophicall bookes are such as touch litle vpon our coÌ„trouersies because they are but ether morall instructions for the life and conuersation of men amongst their neigbours or else they treate and speake only of such pointes as wee and all our Aduersaries agree in But in deede there is a maine reason against the whole text of the old law which is that the commandes were giuen as we saie personally to one people and did no farther belong to the rest of the world then in that they were naturall commandes that is in the vertue of nature obliging to obedience So that who soeuer will argue out of the old Testament must first proue the commande to be naturall which if he doe
it but by the scripture which we doe not hold to be sufficient to determrne controuersies without tradition So that I haue no more to saye to you but wish you may begine this new yeare with a good night's rest which God send vs both Whether scripture alone is fit and able to decide controuersies in Religion THis Dialogue containeth 15. parts or paragraphes 1. The Preface or introduction 2. That tradition for scripture is not of as great force as for pointes of Doctrine 3. That tradition for scripture is not more vniuersall then tradition for doctrine 4. That it is impossible the text of scripture should haue remained incorrupted 5. What vncertaintie the errors of writers and copists hath bredd in scriptures 6. What vncertaintie the multiplicitie of translations hath bredd in scripture 7. That the verie repeating and reciting of an others words breedeth a varietie and vncertaintie 8. The vncertaintie of EquiuocatioÌ„ which of necessitie is incident in all writings 9. That there riseth an vncertaintie out of this that the scripture was written in languages now ceased 10. The vncertaintie which followeth the particular languages of Hebrew and Greeke wherein the scripture was vritten 11. That the nature of the bookes of scripture is not fitting for deciding of controuersies 12. Two manners of iudging of Religion out of scripture 13. How scripture doth determine controuersies 14. what laws are requisite for disputation out of scripture 15. Of an other manner of disputing out of scripture §. 1 The Introduction VNCLE How now cozen what make's you so early this morning could you not sleepe this last night Nephew Yes indifferent well I thanke God but t' is not verie early Howsoeuer if I be trublesome I will expect your better leasure for I am come only to tell you a scrupule that I had yesternight which hath tormeÌ„ted me euer since And it is that we Catholikes who beare so great reuerence and veneration to the holy scripture receiue more of it then others write infinite volumes of commentaries vpon it as Paul's church yard can witnesse and are so exact to improue our selues I meane our learned men in the knowledge of it should neuerthelesse when wee come to ioyne in the maine point that is to the decision of controuersies in Religion seeme to fly of and recurre to other iudges though we acknowledge it to be Christ owne word and law And now I haue tould you my difficultie I will leaue you to your better imployments knowing how much you esteeme and how precious you accompt your mornings and therefore I will make bould to call for your answere an other time Vncle. Nay stay cozen God forbid I should thinke I could better imploy my time then in giuing you satisfaction in question of such importance or that you should be importune vnto me by desiring the knowledge of a thing so necessarie and so be seeming you I were to blame if I would not leaue euen my prayers to assist you in this point and perhaps an other time you will not be so earnest on it Although I must coÌ„fesse I am some what vnwilling to diue into this questioÌ„ for I see by experieÌ„ce that the one part seeketh by all meanes to destroy the authoritie of God's church and the other seemeth to lessen the power of scripture for the deciding of controuersies so that indifferent men and as yet vnsetled be left as it were without all meanes of coming to the truth How soeuer necessitie excuseth vs for were our Aduersaries able to performe what they promise that is to resolue pointes of controuersies by scripture we were worse theÌ„ beasts if we should refuse to be iudged thereby But if to stand to scripture only as they doe be but a plausible way to Atheisme and so the question will only be whether we must rely vpon a church or be Athiests for we thinke by scripture alone lefâ—t without the guard of the church nothing or at least not enough for the saluation of mankinde can be sufficiently prouued then euerie man wil see that we are forced by reasoÌ„ and Religion to make euident and knowne as farr as we caÌ„ the necessitie of relying vpon a church and to vse all our power to persuade men therevnto And if you remember we said yesternight that Christian Religion or the law of Iesus Christ cannot be learned by witt and studie but by authoritie and by receiuing it from Iesus Christ And that wee said likewise that he is no true Christian nor truly of the communitie of Christians what so euer be his materiall beliefe who doth not accept of that rule and meanes which Iesus Christ hath left and ordained for the receipt of his law and the like of him who should follow anie other rule which must needes be ether scripture or tradition or both it will therefore euiâ—â—ntly follow that ether we must be no Christians or accept and acknowledge tradition to be this rule if wee can shew that the scripture is not fitt nor hath the conditions requisite for the deciding of controuersies nor was made or left to the church for this end Nephew The greater is the necessitie of this question the more gladd am I that I haue moued it though me thinke's I my self might well see it is not fitt to make the scripture iudge of coÌ„trouersies because we finde by experience that after so manie disputations and so manie bookes written on ether side there is nothing resolued nor are we the nearer an end and therefore t' is euident that scripture alone will neuer decide and determine our quarells and disputes Vncle. Well cozen since you will haue it so our first question shall bee §. 2 Whether tradition for scripture be of as great force as it is for pointes of doctrine ANd first I pray you tell mee doe you thinke that the Apostles when they weÌ„t about the world to preach Christ Iesus carried with theÌ„ all the bookes of the ould and new Testament ether readie translated into the languages of the people whom they preached vnto or else caused them to be translated by the first Christians Nephew I neuer thought of this question before but I see well enough that they could not carie all with them for some parts certainely were not made before they went to to preach nay I a'm not assured whether anie part of the new testament was made before their dispersion from Hierusalem so that well may they haue caried the ould Testament with theÌ„ if they thought it sitting but for the new they could not if I be not mistakeÌ„ Vncle. It is verie true I will tell you therefore cozen how the authoritie of the scripture that is Now the neW Testament Was pro aga ted of the new Testament came into the church An Apostle or Disciple writing a booke or Epistle coÌ„municated it to that church or Countrie wherein he preached or to which he writte it that church coÌ„municated it to their neighbours as the worke
correction and amendment of the Bible whose complaints of the varietie of texts all the world knowes and indeede the inutilitie and discommoditie of such multiplicitie caused them all to be neglected though some thinke our vulgata editio to haue euer beene conserued Howsoeuer we may goe on with our supposition and add that of those twenty trāslatiōs now extāt euerie one is equall to anie other Let then a sentence be proposed whose nature and definition is to decide a controuersie but with this condition which ordinarily happeneth in such a case to witt that it dependeth on the proprietie of some word or on the Emphasis of some manner of speaking Is it possible that anie reasonable man should thinke that all these translations will agree in such a thing Three or fouer peraduenture may but for twentie t' is absolutly impossible And if anie one of these translations be substantially different all the rest cannot with certaintie or euidence beare it downe sithence this might be out of a different copie with which perhapps agreed more then we haue so that we shall still returne to our former non liquet And hence followeth that although a translation in the whole bulke be morally the same booke with the originall yet metaphysically and rigorously there is great diuersitie and at least such as in our case maketh all translations of the scripture vnfitt to decide cōtrouersies by them Nephew Your discourse will not only make mee beleeue what I haue heard reported S. Augustin should saie Epist Man funda cep 5. that hee would not belieue scripture vnlesse the church's authoritie moued him therevnto but I feare it tendeth to the too great weakening of the scripture which hath beene so happily planted in the church and got this supereminent authoritie which it hath to some good effect without doubt though not for the decision of controuersies and therefore you will proue to much and in seeking to destroy one errour you will bee in danger to fall into an other This I am sure of that if you should preach this doctrine at S. Antolins the people would stone you with their brasencornerd Bibles though peraduenture if they laid all their heads together they could not giue you a sufficient answere But thus much I learne now when I reflect vpon them that they haue no reason to obiect against vs our trusting of our church and Pastours for the sense and explication of the scripture whereas thē selues must needes rely vpon a douzen or twenty Parsons or Ministers if there were so manie imployed in their translation for the verie text it self whose skills or wills might be defectiue according to their owne maxime so that we rely vpon the whole church they pore people vpon what they nether thinke certaine nor infalible nor probable but as farr as they please Vncle. I will finde a time to satisfie your feares of my diminishing the scripture's authoritie and will shew you how all I haue said doth nothing preiudice the layfull and intended vse of the scripture and if I should chance to forget I pray you put mee in minde before we part For the present I will propose you an other difficultie which is §. 7 Whether the verie rehearsing and citing of an others words doe not breede varietie and vncertaintie ANd let vs suppose the writer him self play the translatour As for example that our sauiour him self hauing spoken in Hebrew or Syriake the Holy writer is to expresse his words in Greeke or Latin And farther that this which we haue said of translatiōs be as truly it is groūded in the verie nature of diuers languages and therefore vnauoidable by anie art or industrie will it not clearely followe that euen in the originall copie writtē by the Euāgelist's owne hand there is not in rigour the true and self-significant words of our sauiour but rather a comment or Paraphrase explicating and deliuering the sense thereof Nay let him haue written in the same language and let him haue set downe euerie word and sillable yet men conuersant in noting the changes of meanings in words will tell you that diuers accents in the prononciation of them the turning of the speakers head or bodie this way or that way the allusion to some person or to some precedēt discourse or the like may so change the sense of the words that they will seeme quite different in writing from what they were in speaking So that you see how like negligent men wee cōmonly vse to presse words as the proper and identicall words of our sauiour finding them registred in the Holy writt Which in rigour and exactly speaking are but in some sorte an imperfect and equiuocall paraphrase or expression of Christ's owne true words the weakenesse of mā's speach and expressiō bearing no greater exactnesse And surely all experienced men but especially disputatife schollers who finde meanes dayly to explicate the planest words of ā authour to a quite different sense will tell you that to seeke to conuince an exact truth out of bare and dead words is to put your self into a darke some and wild laborinth And to rely vpon them is to fixe the Camelions colours in the currēt of the winde or water Wherefore cozen hauing I thinke sufficiently tould you my minde concerning the text it self let vs goe farther and looke into §. 8 The vncertaintie of equiuocatiō which of necessitie is incident in all writings ANd to proceede more clearely wee will suppose for the present that there is but one authenticall copie of the scripture written in some one language and hereby abstract from all varieties of texts by translations or errours or anie such accident and meerely considere what of necessitie followes out of this that the scripture is a booke written in words of men and whether this supposed there can be anie decisiue and decretory sense euidently and certainely gathered out of it Tell me then cozen doe you thinke t' is an easie matter to decide cōtrouersies by words or why not Nephew I know words are but signes of what is in our mindes sett and ordained to that ende by the will of man wha ars words and therefore that diuers men signifying their mindes by diuers signes come to make diuers languages And I know likewise that though it bee an ordinarie thing amongst vs to hange vp a bush to signifie thereby that in the house there is wine to be sould yet peraduenture in an other coūtrye some thing else may signifie the selling of wine and a bush some other thing So may it happen that the same word in one language may signifie one thing and in an other some thing else And because I likewise see that it may so fall out that these two nations ioyne in one or haue much commerce together by vse and custome this word may come to haue two significations euen in the same language And so will breede a difficultie in whether of the two senses it is to be
taken which I coÌ„ceiue is caled Equiuocation The origine of equiuocation And sithence there is no other grounde for ether of these significations but man's will which cannot be easily demonstrated I know not well how the truth can bee certainly knowne Vncle. You saie verie well for the signification of words must needes depende of maÌ„'s will and of the custome or vse of them two verie mutable things Wherefore separating these two and taking words in them selues you shall finde that man's will doth put diuers significations vpon the same word ether by chance or onsett pourpose by chance as you declared but now which in deede doth not teach to manie words but is casuall as the cause of it is on sett pourpose and that ether for want of words or by desire of elegance and varietie in our deliuerie And this belongeth to allmost all the words wee haue for there is scarsely anie word if you note it but may be so vsed and if it may be so taken it is so one time or other This multiplicitie of variously taking words in Logicke is said by who maketh the least to be eight fold for some make no end of multiplying the sortes of it And vnder the name of Equiuocation or Analogie it much confoundeth all scholasticall learning Now for the custome and vse of words there be manie things to be respected as the varieties of times and qualities of persoÌ„s for in one time a word may signifie one thing and in an other a quite differeÌ„t thing So wee see that those who write of eloquence giue words their births â—nd ould ages And likewise who knowes not how great difference there is betwixt the vse of words in the Court or vniuersitie or great cities and the vse of the same words in remoter parts and villages Nay if you marke it you shall finde that as languages in generall are the institution of a multitude of men so almost euerie particular man is Master and as it were founder of some particular expressions or phrases not common to others whereby some declare them selues more exactly and plainely others more confusedly and ambiguously in so much that Critickes curious in antient Writings Will attribute or derogate certaine workes from Authors vpon this only ground And now I pray cozen in such an antient writing as the scripture is how manie ambiguities may grow from all these principles Or rather what certaintie can be had out of such multiplicitie of vncertitudes But let me particularly vrge one thing that is whether t' is possible that a language should be entirely conserued in written bookes which still remaine the same Nephew Why not if there be bookes enough How a laÌ„guage is conserued for then all the words of that language may be found in them in all their senses and then I thinke the language cannot perish Vncle. Your answere is partly true but not sufficient for you were to considere whether so manie bookes of one language may haue beene conserued for if the Countrie be litle few bookes will be written in the language but if the language be dispersed through manie Countries it will haue it 's proper words and significations for euerie Countrie So that bookes being written for the subiects and not for the language as Dictionaries and phrase bookes are it must needes follow that only so much of the language will be conserued as is necessarie for the vnderstanding of those bookes which of them selues are so good as that the people will still desire to haue them and continue them Wherefore nether all bookes that are written nor if we iudge by these of our time anie notable part wil be conserued nor yet the whole language contained in all the bookes that are written And if part of the language be lost part conserued of necessitie the conserued part must be imperfect by the mistake of such words as be rarely found and where they are found only ghest at by the rest which are to make sense with them And all this equiuocall ambiguitie is purely in the bare words not yet placed in construction Nephew I thinke so vncle for altough I see there be cases numbers moodes tenses and persons in euerie language yet I hope those doe rather take awaie equiuocation then make it Vncle. It is true those things are made to take awaie equiuocation but if you reflect you shall finde that the want of them and the confused or vnexact vse of them doth likewise cause it and where they are more aboundant as in some languages there the abuse of them is more frequent people being in nothing more vnwarie theÌ„ in their words And where they are but rare and few that likewise of it self causeth ambiguitie And if you will looke into those particular languages wherein the scripture was primitiuely written you shall finde that the Hebrew hath eight moodes wholy different from anie of ether the Greeke or Latin moodes and euer varying the sense as much as the actiue and passiue doe in Latin and Greeke The Greekes haue seuen tenses all of different significations and of numbers genders persons three a peece The Latin six cases So that you see new occasions of Equiuocation almost in euerie word and consequently what obscuritie and doubtfullnesse must of necessitie follow anie language or sense relying vpon words and yet for breuitie sake I haue not tould you the half of what the matter giueth me scope to saie for the scripture dependeth and hath beene originally written in more languages then I haue spoken of Where of some haue much more varietie then anie of those that I haue expressed For coÌ„struction you may first conceiue that the verie pointing and accenting of words doth beget a number of doubts and Equiuocations a diuers comma or virgula making some times the sense quite different Secondly that word which is construed with an other to cleere the signification of it is some times it selfe of no lesse ambiguitie then the other Thirdly in the same construction it may happen that the same two words will haue diuers senses And of all these your Grammer and Oratory Masters doe enlarge their precepts And aboue all there is an Equiuocation in the most commoÌ„ words wee vse rising out of a kinde of custome depending of particular times and places which the compilers of the Ciuill law thought to be of so great importance as that they iudged it necessarie to make a speciall booke de vsu interpretatione verborum and that for the commonest words that were in vse These reasons being vnauoidable in anie language by human industrie are more then sufficient to let you see that t' is impossible to conuince and demonstrate anie thing out of bare and dead words and that who vndertakes such a taske doth not see what hee attempteth Nephew If all these things bee true which you tell me I wonder with what face anie man can pretende to conuince pointes of controuersies so clearely out of the scripture
of such an Apostle so by litle and litle it grew froÌ„ one countrie to an other vntill it was spredd ouer the whole Christian world So that some countries had not the new Testament complete that is all the bookes of it for a long time Wherefore no wonder that some haue doubted of seuerall parts thereof being not able to auerre as not assured by reason of some accident that such bookes were truly the workes of such an Apostle or Disciple which not withstaÌ„ding Why the canon of scripture is cheefely to be had from Rome better intelligeÌ„ce being gotten might be afterwards receiued for scripture And here you may note by the way that the Roman church is that church to which in reason wee ought to giue most credit touching the canon of the scripture For Rome being at that time â—that is at least for the first 300 yeares to the Christian world or rather to all the Christians dispersed in diuers parts of the world as London is to England And that wee see the collection of things estimable dispersed in seuerall Prouinces of our Kingdome is sooner and better made in London then in anie other part of our Countrie it must needes follow that the collection of the Holy scripture or new Testament was more exactly faisable at Rome then at anie other place But this by the way For my ayme is to make you iudge whether anie one substantiall point The state of the questioÌ„ which the Apostles whith common conseÌ„t preached through the whole world compared to anie one booke of the new Testament which soeuer you thinke first or best receiued whether I say of these two haue descended vnto vs with more certaintie the one to be the Apostles doctrine the other to be such an Apostle's booke Nephew I should distinguish your question for ether it may be compared to that particular Prouince or church where the Apostle him selfe deliuered it both in word and writing or to the whole church And I confesse that in respect of the whole church that point of doctrine which is euerie where preached must needes haue more certaintie but where both are equaly deliuered by the same Apostle to the same church I should thinke the worke should haue more authoritie theÌ„ the word For t' is an easie matter to let slipp a word some times Whereas writing requireth a more setled consideration Vncle. If the question be but of a particular church or Prouince I doubt it will not be sufficient to giue vs a firme authoritie for ether one or the other vnlesse we add more circumstances then we haue declared And the reason is because one Prouince maye haue had Religion so ruinated in it by the incursion of infidells that recouering theÌ„ selues after a long time they may as well mistake one booke for an other as one doctrine for an other and so this point is not much to our pourpose Although euen in this case the doctrine taught by word of mouth hath these aduantages That it is deliuered to manie the booke to few or in some one place The doctrine heard and vnderstood by manie the booke only to such as can reade nor to all them nether but to such as are carefull The booke belonge's not much to the practize of the multitude the doctrine gouernes their whole liues The booke brought often times by some one maÌ„ as some messeÌ„ger if it be an Epistl or other wise sent from some other place or froÌ„ some one person as from Titus of Timotheus to whom it was first written and vpon whose authoritie only the whole veritie must originally rely But to returne to our case Doe you not see that the whole church trusteth some one particular man at the first vpon whom she buildeth hir beliefe tht this is such an Apostles worke that is scripture But for anie materiall point of doctrine she relyeth vpoÌ„ the vniuersall knowledge of theÌ„ who heard it preached in diuers parts of the world So that as I doe not intende to say the one is certaine the other not for a particular churche's authoritie may be certaine in some circonstances yet I must needes say that betwixt these two certainties there is such a differeÌ„ce that if the one were to bring in verdict vpon the other it would be much more forcible and euident to conclude that this booke is scripture because it is according and conformable to the doctrine taught and preached then that this doctrine is the Apostle's because it is conformable to this booke For if it be true that the whole church once relyed vpon some one particular church for this veritie it can neuer come to passe that the certaintie of this booke proue greater then was the authoritie of that particular church at that time And consequently the same comparison which is to be made betwixt the authoritie of this particular church and of the vniuersall church the same I say is to be made betwixt the certaintie of this booke 's being scripture and of this point of doctrine's being catholike and Apostolike And for the inconuenience you were jealous of it falleth out quitt contrarie For whether we considere the inspiration and assistance of the holy ghost or the industrie aed carefullnesse of man you shall euer finde that the end is more principally aymed at then the meanes to compasse the end and likewise amongst diuers meanes the most immediate to the end is still most aymed at wherefore in our case the end both of writing and speaking being the deliuerie of this doctrine for the good of the people no doubt I say but that both the AssistaÌ„ce of the holy ghost and the care of man tendeth more principally to the deliuerie of this doctrine then to other things that came in by chance in which only there might be a slipp as you immagine Wherefore sithence tradition containeth not all the words the Apostles spoke but meerely what belong's to ChristiaÌ„ doctrine which was principally deliuered and the cheefe errand of the Apostles and that in the scriptute manie things are written vpon occasion and as it were by the bye no doubt but in both these respects to wit of the assistance of the holy ghost and of the care of man the certaintie will be greater of the doctrine deliuered by word of mouth theÌ„ of the holy writt Besides the slipps you speake of are when things are only once deliuered or spoken without great premeditation whereas this doctrine was a thing perpetually beaten on so as there can be no feare of such slipping HoW the old Testament came to Christians hands For the ould TestameÌ„t as I confesse t' is possible that the Apostles might haue deliuered it in all Countries where they preached so likewise I thinke t' is euident that they neuer did it being that the church hath no such memorie And that the Canon hath beene doubted of by some and the Iewish Canon alleadged whereof there had beene no vse nor neede if the
reiected make the case more ambiguous becaus they giue meÌ„ power out or such or such a probabilitie to coniecture a truth and out of coniecturall proofe to belieue it For as we all confesse that what soeuer is certainely knowne to be scripture is not to be touched so we know likewise that what soeuer may be doubted of whether it be scripture or no obligeth to no such respect Wherefore if reason conclude and tell vs that in all likelyhood there hath beene twenty variae lectiones in euerie particular columne though perhapps two or three only are extant the rest probably knowne to haue beene yet so as that there is no certaine signe of which or where they were And now there cometh one to presse a place in this or that columne which his opponent thinketh to be contrarie to other places may he not then iustly saiâ—â— sir I mistrust this place to be corrupted Or can his Aduersarie in prudence vrge it on as an assured text Or can he presse and auerre for certaine that this is none of the 17. vnknowne variae lectiones Certes he cannot abstracting from all warrant and commande of the church and standing to pure and precise reason So that all controuersies would be ended where nothing but scripture is admitted as iudge with a Non liquet Nephew I expected you should haue shewed me how hard it is to agree about the true sense of the words of the scripture but as I now perceiue there is as much difficultie to know whether we haue the true and right text or no which if it were well conceâ—â—â—d and vnderstood by our deuout and pure citizen's Wifes of London who turne and vew the text so curiously wheÌ„ the preacher citeth it I belieue it would much coole the zeale of their spirit if such a qualme should come ouer their stomackes as to thinke these words peraduenture are not the Holy scripture But to this vncle may you not add the varietie of translations I pray tell me §. 6 What vncertaintie the multiplicitie of translations haue bread in scripture VNcle No doubt cozen but great vncertaintie is sprung from the varietie of translations Whereof we may first suppose that there is no constat of anie infalibilitie in the translatours no not of the septuaginta them selues what of the septuaginta translation which the Protestants will easily graÌ„t I know there is a storie how that the septuagiÌ„ta being seperated one froÌ„ an other their traÌ„slatioÌ„ light to be the same word for word Which if it were certaine I should esteeme their traÌ„slation of as great authoritie as the originall text it self But we see that eueÌ„ in the Apostles time some sought to mende their interpretation as Theodotion and Aquila whose translations were neuerthelesse accepted of by the church and conserued and esteemed Wherefore there is no likelyhood that the Apostles and the church of their times held the septuaginta traÌ„latioÌ„ to be specially froÌ„ the holy ghost Not doth it import that the Apostles some times vsed in their speeches or writings this translation for they must needes vse it or none wheÌ„ they wrote to those whose language was Greeke and therefore would haue thought them to haue mistaken the text if they had cited the scripture's words according to the Hebrew When the Hebrew was differeÌ„t from the Greeke Nor can wee certainely tell that is was alwayes the Apostle that vsed it and not the Historian Who writing in Greeke and to Grecians cited the Greeke words what words soeuer the Apostle had vsed being both to the same effect The next point which we may considere in this varietie of translations is why diuers traÌ„slations in the same tongue that neuer anie begane a new version in the same language but for some mislike in the former For if he thought a new traÌ„slation to be necessarie he must needes conceiue that the former traÌ„slator had in manie and important pointes missed and altered the minde of the author Whereby euerie wisman will see that a booke of importaÌ„ce is neuer left of to be translated vntill there be some inhibition to the contrrrie And hence we may conclude that it is impossible for a translator to be so exact as that his words shall be taken for the words of the author Nay contrariewise it is the law of a good translator not to yeild word for word with the verie originall but to expresse the seÌ„se thereof in the best manner he can For since no two laÌ„guages jumpe equaly in their expressions it is impossible that euerie word of the one should haue a full expression of euerie word of the other much lesse that their phrases should be the same so that per force there must needes be a great differeÌ„ce in particulars although the substance of the sense and meaning be the same And who should conferre anie one chapter of two translations in the same language and see whether anie one senteÌ„ce doe so exactly agree as that scanning rigorously the varietie of their words there may not be some different sence gathered out of them And he will not denie but t' is impossible to put fully and beyond all quarell the same sense in diuers words And truly I thinke that euerie one wil admit at least as much difference and varietie betwixt the originall and the translation as betwixt translation and translation these agreeing in the same tongue those not and yet hauing all the other reasons of disagreeing And doe you not thinke cozen that if one should take twentie of the best schollers in a schoole and giue them an author to translate ether out of latin into English or out of English into latin that their translations would so differ in manie sentences as that diuers senses might be easily gathered out of them And iudge there vpon that when witts are sett contentiously to discusse euerie possible varietie what truth can be conuinced where anie two may disagree though both acknowledge the author An other considerable circuÌ„stance is that amoÌ„gst all antient translations none can be reiected because it may euer be supposed that the reasoÌ„ of this varietie may proceede from a various copie out of which they were translated and by reason we cannot disapproue the copie as wee said before we cannot therefore likewise nether iustly nor certainely refuse the translation hauing nothing to grounde such refusall but coniectures and likelyhoods which be verie imperfect And if we come to calculate we may verie well suppose that there are now some twenty translations made into seuerall laÌ„guages I might put more for there hath beene peraduenture 200 latin translations considering the greatnesse of the Roman Empire for so manie Ages and the esteeme of the booke making euerie man desirous to haue an exact text none being as yet euer acknowledged for such nor anie prohibition of translating scripture Which varietie of latin translations the Protestants them selues acknowledge and saie verie well that they perished after S. Hierome's
hee needeth not produce the text for it The new Testament is Historicall Epistolar The diuision of the bookes ef the new Testament or Misticall which by their verie names and natures exclude all such exactnesse as of necessitie is required to a iudging law they being all written vpō speciall occasions and for particular ends manie things repeated manie things left out in one which are found in an other scarsely anie one knowing of an others writings Those things which are in the Historie and in the Epistles are expressed as was fitting for the vnderstanding of them to whō they were written or to whom the recited speech was made circumstances farr different to what is conuenient and accōmodated to our vnderstandings now And as an able mā saith of historie that because it must needes leane and rely vpon all circumstances euen of smale moment he that should gouerne him selfe by it must of necessitie be misled so in our case the want of knowing circumstances and not comprehending the true meaning of what was written in a particular occasion must of necessitie make vs apt and subiect to take our ayme and rule amisse The misticall booke which we call the Apocalips being a pure Allegorie is the most vnfitting of all This in my iudgment is so euident that if anie man of common sense would but reflect and really considere what is requisite to determine a litigious controuersie betwixt two men passionate of their owne opinions he would neuer saie that scripture is a booke ether intended by Allmightie God or anie waie fit for such a pourpose Besides a prudent and experienced man will tell you that who looketh in to the various dispositions of men's vnderstandings but especially of men's wills and seeth the varietie and miltiplicitie of men's interests and passions Which for the most part are publickly noted in euerie mā or at least so inwardly hidden and secretly couered that some times euen he who would and doth sweare and protest him self free from all such pre-occupations is neuerthelesse the most dangerously intangled that such an one I saie will neuer thinke to finde two in two thousand who left to their owne libertie will agree in the interpretatiō of anie law how plane soeuer where both are oppositly interressed But if wee put this law to be supernatural and Deuine full of misticall and sublime commandes wherevnto nature hath not the least inckling whereby to raise hir self to the knowledge thereof but must of necessitie wholy and precisely rely vpon authoritie and captiuate hir vnderstanding in obsequium fidei and this to the most obscure and darke points and articles that can be imagined shall wee saie that in this case euerie one is to gather this law and come to the knowledge of it as well as he can out of the scripture alone so full of infinite ambiguitie as you haue seene Were it not first to be proued that scripture was made and intended for this end which how possible it is to performe let anie indifferent mā iudge Whereas to remitte the iudgment of all quarells disputes and controuersies of Religiō vnto liuing men is more efficacious more sutable to nature and discretion and in a word conformable to the practize of our forefathers and to the principles of common sense and reason Nephew I must confesse I shall neuer thinke scripture was giuen for a iudge of controuersies For to make so large a booke and to mingle in it so manie things which ether appertaine not at all to the substance of our beliefe or be verie remotely cōnexed vnto it And then to leaue it to our ghessing what may be the meaning of the words doth plainely argue some other intention in the writer then to set downe a standing and authenticall text to decide quarells And although I heare the Protestants saie that a plaine passage cleareth an obscure so may it be said that an obscure passage darkeneth a cleere so that 's all one Wherefore I long to know for what vse the scripture was made Vncle. Haue yet a litle patience cozen Diuers substantiall points haue beene opposed by antient Heretickes and make a reflexion vpon some cheefe pointes which haue beene cōtrouerted in the church of God As by the Arrians how a spirituall ād indiuisible essēce such as God is coulde haue a natural sonne By the Trinitarians and Sabellians how the same indiuisible thing could bee three persons By the Nestorians and Eutychians how one person could subsiste in two natures By the Pelagians how God's foreknowledge and predestinatiō could stand with merits and freewill By the Iconoclasts how the adoration of Images tended and ended in the Archetype By the Berangarians how a naturall bodie can haue corporall presence otherwise then by it's quantitie By our Wicklefists how all things be not gouerned by a fatall necessitie And all these renewed by the libertie and confusion of our last ages Considere the subtilitie of these questions how they are aboue nature and aboue our comprehensiō how the truths of these disputes are like the passage betwixt Scylla and Charybdis limited betwixt two errours so narrowly as that when they are spoken of at large and not dogmatically specially before they be examined and before the speaker by mistrust of opposition is made warie it is almost impossible the speaker should be so iust and straight in his language as not to giue occasion to one who comes after him to pretende his fauour for the one or the other errour Considere farther that wrangling witts such as for the most part they are who first beginne a new factiō in the church haue this property that they reduce their questions by litle and litle to logicall and abstracted notiōs and force the Catholikes to follow them if they will not desert their antient truths so that after a while one knoweth not where the controuersie lyeth For example Simon Magus and the first authours of our last Breaches preached that faith did so iustifie as that good workes were not necessarie now their followers drawe the question to this whether faith or charitie be the forme of iustification which is all most pure Logicke Now if an Arrian come and tell you that the scripture saith Pater maior me est and therefore that Christ Iesus was not truly God nor consubstantiall to his father And the like maie be said of the rest of these heresies and euen of all the most substantiall and fundamentall points of Christian faith The Catholike maintaine's the cōtrarie now I saie is it possible that anie rationall man should thinke that these and the like questions can be diffinitiuely resolued by a criticall libratiō of dead and vncertaine words full of equiuocall ambiguitie their sense and meaning lying in the brest and minde of him who is not to be found but deceassed manie ages agone And if they cannot as it is more then euident they cannot shall wee thinke that Christ Iesus hath left and established no meanes
two Protestants of one Religion They Tiffâ—â—iâ— so manie points that they daâ—â—â— one the other for 〈◊〉 belieuers Doe but examine whether the positions wherein they disagree amoÌ„gst themselueâ— be not of as maine importance as those wherein we differ from them all and you shall finde manie of theÌ„to be the verie same Naythere be not two Doctors or persons bere in England of one Religion no nor two laye men who giue them selues to expound scriptures and make their priuat spirit iudge of their beliefe and tenets And this not only because so manie variable phaÌ„sies grounded euerie one vpoÌ„ it selfe cannot possibly agree wherevpon you shall hardly see two meete and conferre of ReligioÌ„ but they will disagree if they talke long but also because all knowledge hath it's vnitie from some setled and certaine principles which being not to be found out of the Catholike church in matters of Religion there can be no vnitie or beliefe amongst Protestants For althought our ParlemeÌ„t hath comanded diuers articles to be â—â—ght in the churches of England yet doth not the Protestant Clergie acknowledge that the Parlement who are theâ—â—â—â—â—ke and taught by the 〈…〉 anie power to iudge or determine pointes of doctrine And in deede it were ridiculous for those who thinke that an vniuersall CoÌ„gregation of Bishopps and the bodie of the whole church may erre in beliefe should 〈◊〉 no attribute this vâ—errable power to their owne schollers Nether doe they that I know of but still mantaine constantly their cheefe grounde that all when are fallible and subiect to erre why Protestants ought not force anie man to belieue with them Where by the way you may note how hardly they deale with Catholikes in punishing them for professing a different faith from theirs seeing that if we belieue differently we must needes professe differeÌ„tly and they by their owne confession not hauing anie authoritie whereby they can or ought force anie maÌ„ to belieue as they doe t' is euident that they must per force contradicte their owne principles if they will persecute vs. Now therefore seeing that to be of one faith is to be of one setled opinion and setling cannot be without infalibilitie or necessitie the Protestants hauing no common principles which them selues esteeme infalible euerie maÌ„ expounding scripture their only rule of faith at his pleasure nor anie hauing power or authoritie to controle an others interpretation of anie passage what soeuer t' is impossible anie two ministers should be of one faith and Religion T' is true per chaÌ„ce they may be of one minde to day but eare night if ether of them light of a place of the scripture which after more consideration seemeth to haue an other sense then he thought before they may well be of different opinions And this in what pointe how materiall or essentiall soeuer These men therefore may be said to be some times of one minde or opinion but neuer of one faith and Religion faith being like mariage not to be taken vp for a yeare and a day but for all Eternitie The learned Catholikes be more learned then the learned Protestants And now to returne to the discourse we ayme at As the number of our learned men doth farr exceede the number of learned Prostants so likewise by all likelyhood doth their learning The English Diuinitie generally speaking is nothing but controuersies which are but the fourth or fift part of Catholike Diuinitie For besides controuersies we haue scholasticall Theologie which explicate's the mysteries of our faith and shewe's their conformitie to nature and naturall reason We haue morall Diuinitie which searche's into the practize of the Sacraments aÌ„d Precepts of good life We haue scripture lessons which diue into the deepe sense of the written word of God without farther application We haue misticall Theologie which examine's the extraordinarie waies of conuersation with God And lastly we haue Ecclesiasticall historie which shewe's the progresse increase and practize of Christian faith through all ages and places And of all these we haue I doe not saie bookes or volumes but whole libraries written and extant amongst vs. And for other eruditions as languages Poetrie Rhethoricke Logicke and Philosophie if the Protestants haue anie let them looke into their samples and they shall finde the most eminent and worthie men to haue beene and to be Catholikes so that as of all ReligioÌ„s the Christian so of all Christian's the Catholike is without questioÌ„ the most wise and the most learned profession And what I saye is not to be sought out in old manuscripts or learned papers your eyes and eares will tell it you in Catholike countries and euen in Paule's church yard where you may finde multitudes of volumes of all these sorts of learning written by Catholikes And if their shopps were well shaked vp I doubt not but for bookes of worth except some English pamphletts and a few controuersies one hundreth for one would be found to haue beene written by Catholikes What apparence theÌ„ can there be that the Protestants arguments should be so mightie and so cleerely better then what Catholikes can saie for them selues as to beare downe the right of Antiquitie and possessioÌ„ whereof the Catholikes are the sole Claymers Nephew I cannot denie but that your discourse is sound and grounded vpon common sense and vpon such euidence as when I was in Paris I heard was there to bee seene but my minde was then more fixed vpon the Tennis court then vpon such enquiries But why might not one replye that all this and more is necessarie for the iustifying of so euill a quarell If Catholikes be not honest and vertuous men the more learned they are the more daÌ„gerous and more able to mantaine a false position And t' is like the Protestants would replye in this manner for they tell vs that the Pope hath gotteÌ„ so mightie a power ouer our verie vnderstandings that for manie ages we haue bent all our witts how to mantaine his tiles aÌ„d decrees without anie care of truth or probabilitie wherefore the more wit and learning the more blindnesse of passion and interest As the learned Catholikes are more learned theÌ„ the learned ProtestaÌ„ts so they are more vertuous then they Vncle. I did not thinke that learning had deserued so ill at your hands as to censure it so seuerely No no coseÌ„ one maÌ„ or two or three may be the more daÌ„gerous for their learning but not whole multitudes For of it 's owne nature it is a great instrument of vertue being the CompanioÌ„ of truth so that there can be no greater signe of truth in anie ReligioÌ„ then to see it beare the touch of reason and that the professors of it be addicted to learning Besids I pray remember I speake to one who professeth no schollershippe and therefore doe not inquire what is or is not but what is most likely and apparent It must therefore be knowne that the Religion is false before it can