or_o external_a form_n for_o every_o man_n do_v eat_v that_o when_o they_o receive_v but_o the_o question_n be_v and_o be_v of_o the_o true_a body_n and_o therefore_o when_o saint_n austen_n speak_v of_o this_o body_n it_o be_v madness_n to_o understand_v it_o of_o any_o other_o thing_n than_o the_o real_a body_n but_o let_v we_o hear_v what_o be_v reply_v doctor_n weston_n say_v i_o bring_v theophilact_n against_o you_o judas_n say_v he_o gustavit_fw-la carnem_fw-la domini_fw-la judas_n do_v eat_v or_o taste_v the_o flesh_n of_o christ._n ridley_n 49._o that_o be_v the_o sacrament_n of_o the_o lord_n flesh_n doctor_n watson_n reply_v out_o of_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a exaltata_fw-la mente_fw-la fideliter_fw-la credamus_fw-la iacere_fw-la in_o illa_fw-la sacramensa_fw-la editionis_fw-la agnum_fw-la dei_fw-la tollentem_fw-la peccata_fw-la mundi_fw-la a_o sacerdotibus_fw-la sacrificatum_fw-la let_v we_o faithful_o believe_v with_o a_o exalt_a mind_n that_o there_o lie_v in_o the_o holy_a table_n the_o lamb_n of_o god_n that_o take_v away_o the_o sin_n of_o the_o world_n which_o be_v sacrifice_v by_o the_o priest_n ridley_n that_o council_n be_v collect_v out_o of_o ancient_a father_n and_o be_v to_o i_o of_o great_a authority_n etc._n etc._n ibid._n the_o word_n make_v for_o i_o the_o lamb_n of_o god_n be_v in_o heaven_n accord_v to_o the_o verity_n of_o the_o body_n and_o here_o he_o be_v with_o we_o in_o a_o mystery_n accord_v to_o his_o power_n not_o corporal_o watson_n but_o the_o lamb_n of_o god_n lie_v on_o the_o table_n ridley_n it_o be_v a_o figurative_a speech_n for_o in_o our_o mind_n we_o understand_v he_o which_o be_v in_o heaven_n watson_n but_o he_o lie_v there_o the_o greek_a word_n be_v keîta_n ridley_n he_o lie_v there_o that_o be_v he_o be_v there_o present_a not_o corporal_o but_o he_o lie_v there_o in_o his_o operation_n etc._n etc._n and_o by_o this_o 1321._o you_o may_v see_v to_o what_o purpose_n it_o be_v to_o dispute_v with_o this_o man_n for_o that_o god_n by_o his_o power_n and_o operation_n be_v every_o where_o and_o in_o every_o creature_n and_o if_o christ_n be_v no_o otherwise_o here_o but_o by_o his_o power_n and_o operation_n as_o in_o baptism_n what_o a_o impertinency_n be_v this_o of_o the_o council_n of_o nice_a to_o use_v so_o many_o and_o significant_a word_n that_o we_o must_v faithful_o believe_v with_o a_o high_a mind_n and_o courage_n against_o sense_n and_o reason_n that_o the_o lamb_n of_o god_n lie_v on_o the_o table_n sacrifice_v by_o priest_n and_o the_o like_a be_v there_o any_o protestant_n that_o speak_v thus_o or_o can_v the_o like_a word_n be_v verify_v in_o the_o protestant_n communion_n of_o sign_n figure_n representation_n and_o symboll_n 61._o last_o to_o skipp_v over_o diverse_a other_o thing_n doctor_n weston_n press_v he_o with_o two_o other_o place_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n so_o clear_a as_o nothing_o can_v be_v speak_v more_o clear_a the_o first_o be_v in_o these_o word_n we_o worship_n the_o â—_z same_o body_n in_o the_o eucharist_n which_o the_o wise_a man_n do_v worship_n in_o the_o manger_n and_o then_o again_o we_o have_v not_o here_o the_o lord_n in_o the_o manger_n but_o on_o the_o altar_n here_o a_o woman_n cor._n hold_v he_o not_o in_o her_o hand_n but_o a_o priest_n these_o be_v the_o word_n let_v we_o hear_v his_o answer_n ridley_n i_o grant_v the_o priest_n hold_v the_o same_o thing_n but_o after_o another_o manner_n she_o do_v hold_v the_o natural_a body_n the_o priest_n hold_v the_o mystery_n of_o the_o body_n so_o he_o and_o fox_n write_v in_o the_o margin_n the_o sâ—me_a thing_n 1322._o but_o the_o manner_n diverse_a but_o who_o see_v not_o that_o our_o contention_n be_v about_o the_o thing_n and_o not_o the_o manner_n for_o we_o teach_v also_o that_o the_o manner_n of_o christ_n be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n be_v different_a from_o the_o manner_n of_o his_o be_v in_o heaven_n but_o the_o thing_n real_o be_v all_o one_o and_o so_o if_o ridley_n do_v grant_v the_o same_o thing_n to_o be_v hold_v by_o the_o priest_n hand_n which_o the_o bless_a virgin_n hold_v in_o agree_v her_o hand_n as_o here_o you_o see_v he_o grant_v in_o word_n than_o the_o controversy_n between_o we_o and_o he_o be_v end_v but_o present_o he_o leap_v from_o his_o grant_n again_o say_v she_o do_v hold_v the_o natural_a body_n and_o the_o priest_n hold_v the_o mystery_n of_o the_o body_n which_o be_v different_a thing_n and_o not_o only_o different_a manner_n of_o holdinge_v wherefore_o doctor_n weston_n repeatinge_v again_o this_o argument_n out_o of_o s._n chrysostome_n to_o the_o multitude_n in_o english_a say_v john_n fox_n and_o consider_v the_o manner_n of_o ridleyes_n aunsweringe_v and_o that_o nothing_o more_o can_v be_v have_v of_o he_o he_o dissolve_v the_o disputation_n in_o these_o word_n videtis_fw-la praefracti_fw-la hominis_fw-la animunt_fw-la gloriosum_fw-la vafrum_fw-la inconstantem_fw-la etc._n etc._n you_o see_v the_o stubborn_a vauntinge_v deceytfull_a and_o inconstant_a mind_n of_o this_o man_n and_o with_o this_o encomion_n depart_v doctor_n ridley_n to_o his_o prison_n again_o and_o the_o other_o doctor_n each_o man_n to_o their_o own_o lodging_n out_o of_o the_o disputation_n with_o m._n hugh_n latimer_n together_o with_o the_o conclusion_n of_o the_o whole_a trial_n in_o this_o article_n §._o 4._o 64._o upon_o the_o three_o day_n be_v wednesday_n the_o 18._o of_o april_n be_v bring_v forth_o master_n hugh_n latymer_n to_o answer_v as_o the_o former_a have_v do_v but_o the_o disputation_n be_v much_o more_o short_a than_o the_o other_o and_o in_o english_a for_o master_n latymer_n say_v fox_n allege_v that_o he_o be_v out_o of_o use_n with_o latyn_n and_o unfit_a for_o that_o place_n he_o give_v 1323._o up_o his_o confession_n about_o the_o three_o article_n in_o writing_n after_o the_o imitation_n of_o cranmer_n and_o ridley_n full_a of_o scoff_n and_o bitter_a taunt_n as_o his_o vein_n be_v and_o rest_v most_o upon_o the_o mass_n and_o the_o four_o marrowbone_n thereof_o for_o so_o blasphemous_o he_o call_v they_o which_o be_v forsooth_o mass_n consecration_n transubstantiation_n oblation_n and_o adoration_n of_o all_o which_o you_o have_v hear_v the_o ancient_a father_n speech_n before_o how_o different_a they_o be_v from_o these_o of_o latymer_n as_o be_v also_o their_o spirit_n 63._o the_o first_o entrance_n to_o talk_v between_o master_n latymer_n and_o the_o doctor_n be_v for_o that_o he_o say_v in_o his_o writing_n that_o nothing_o be_v to_o be_v receive_v concern_v the_o sacrament_n which_o be_v not_o express_o set_v down_o in_o the_o institution_n of_o christ_n doctor_n weston_n infer_v that_o then_o woman_n must_v not_o receive_v the_o communion_n for_o that_o no_o express_a mention_n be_v make_v in_o scripture_n of_o their_o receavinge_v and_o when_o latymer_n answer_v that_o s._n paul_n say_v probet_fw-la autem_fw-la seipsum_fw-la homo_fw-la which_o signify_v say_v he_o both_o man_n and_o woman_n it_o be_v reply_v that_o in_o greek_a it_o be_v anthropos_fw-fr that_o be_v proper_a to_o man_n etc._n etc._n then_o doctor_n weston_n ask_v he_o how_o long_o he_o have_v be_v of_o this_o opinion_n he_o say_v about_o some_o seven_o year_n he_o be_v more_o than_o seaventy_n of_o age_n and_o that_o my_o l._n of_o canterburyes_n book_n have_v special_o confirm_v his_o judgement_n therein_o and_o if_o quoth_v he_o i_o can_v remember_v all_o therein_o contain_v i_o will_v not_o fear_v to_o answer_v any_o man_n in_o this_o matter_n so_o he_o and_o many_o time_n after_o he_o run_v still_o to_o this_o book_n of_o cranmer_n my_o lord_n of_o canterburyes_n book_n say_v he_o to_o a_o argument_n of_o doctor_n cartwright_n handle_v this_o very_a well_o and_o by_o he_o can_v 1325._o i_o answer_v you_o if_o i_o have_v he_o and_o again_o in_o another_o place_n to_o another_o argument_n the_o solution_n of_o this_o say_v he_o be_v in_o my_o lord_n of_o canterbury_n his_o book_n and_o yet_o further_o to_o another_o i_o remember_v i_o have_v book_n read_v this_o in_o my_o lord_n of_o canterburyes_n book_n whereto_o doctor_a tressam_fw-la answer_v that_o there_o be_v in_o that_o book_n six_o hundred_o lie_n but_o latymer_n reply_v nothing_o etc._n etc._n 64._o then_o say_v doctor_n weston_n you_o be_v once_o a_o lutheran_n latimer_n no_o i_o be_v a_o papist_n for_o i_o can_v never_o perceive_v how_o luther_n can_v descend_v his_o opinion_n without_o transubstantiation_n the_o tygurine_n once_o do_v write_v a_o book_n against_o luther_n and_o i_o oft_o desire_v god_n that_o he_o may_v live_v so_o long_o as_o to_o make_v they_o answer_v so_o he_o whereby_o be_v see_v that_o he_o favour_v luther_n more_o than_o the_o tygurine_n at_o that_o time_n for_o that_o he_o will_v have_v have_v they_o answer_v but_o doctor_n weston_n say_v further_o luther_n
sectarye_n 1._o of_o our_o time_n do_v follow_v he_o in_o that_o assertion_n then_o can_v they_o have_v no_o ground_n or_o certainty_n this_o way_n but_o each_o man_n and_o woman_n must_v seek_v other_o ground_n and_o proof_n and_o stand_v upon_o their_o own_o judgement_n for_o trial_n of_o the_o same_o which_o how_o well_o the_o most_o part_n of_o people_n can_v do_v be_v either_o young_a simple_a unlearned_a or_o otherways_o so_o busy_v in_o other_o matter_n as_o they_o can_v attend_v thereunto_o every_o man_n of_o mean_a discretion_n will_v consider_v and_o consequent_o they_o must_v needs_o be_v say_v both_o to_o live_v and_o die_v without_o any_o ground_n of_o their_o faith_n at_o all_o but_o proper_a opinion_n and_o so_o perish_v everlastinge_o 9_o the_o famous_a doctor_n s._n augustine_n handle_v this_o matter_n in_o a_o special_a book_n to_o his_o friend_n honoratus_n deceive_v by_o the_o manichy_n as_o himself_o also_o sometime_o have_v be_v and_o he_o intitule_v his_o book_n de_fw-fr utilitate_fw-la credendi_fw-la of_o the_o profitt_a that_o 6._o come_v to_o a_o man_n by_o believe_v the_o church_n and_o point_n of_o faith_n therein_o teach_v without_o demaundinge_a reason_n or_o proof_n thereof_o which_o the_o manichy_n deride_v and_o say_v that_o they_o require_v nothing_o to_o be_v believe_v of_o their_o follower_n but_o that_o which_o first_o shall_v be_v prove_v to_o they_o by_o good_a proof_n and_o reason_n and_o not_o depend_v only_o of_o man_n credit_n but_o the_o holy_a father_n scorn_v this_o heretical_a brag_v and_o ostentation_n of_o they_o and_o commend_v high_o the_o contrary_a custom_n of_o simple_a beleevinge_v upon_o the_o credit_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n for_o that_o otherwise_o infinite_a people_n shall_v have_v no_o faith_n at_o all_o and_o exhort_v his_o friend_n honoratus_n to_o take_v the_o same_o course_n first_o to_o believe_v and_o after_o to_o seek_v the_o reason_n his_o discourse_n be_v this_o fac_n nos_fw-la nunc_fw-la primum_fw-la quaerere_fw-la cuinam_fw-la religioni_fw-la animas_fw-la nostras_fw-la 7._o etc._n etc._n suppose_v that_o we_o now_o first_o of_o all_o do_v seek_v unto_o what_o religion_n we_o shall_v commit_v our_o soul_n to_o be_v purge_v and_o rectify_v without_o all_o doubt_n we_o must_v begin_v with_o the_o catholic_a church_n for_o that_o she_o be_v the_o most_o eminent_a now_o in_o the_o world_n there_o be_v more_o christian_n in_o she_o at_o this_o day_n then_o in_o any_o other_o church_n of_o jew_n and_o gentill_n put_v together_o and_o albeit_o among_o these_o christian_n there_o may_v be_v sect_n and_o heresy_n and_o all_o of_o they_o will_v seem_v to_o be_v catholic_n and_o do_v call_v other_o beside_o themselves_o heretic_n yet_o all_o grant_n that_o if_o we_o consider_v the_o whole_a body_n of_o the_o world_n there_o be_v one_o church_n among_o the_o rest_n more_o eminent_a than_o all_o other_o &_o more_o plentiful_a in_o number_n &_o as_o they_o which_o know_v she_o do_v affirm_v more_o sincere_a also_o in_o truth_n but_o as_o concern_v truth_n we_o shall_v dispute_v more_o afterward_o now_o it_o be_v sufficient_a for_o they_o that_o desire_v to_o learn_v that_o there_o be_v a_o catholic_a church_n which_o be_v one_o in_o it_o self_n whereunto_o diverse_a heretic_n do_v feign_v and_o divise_v diverse_a name_n whereas_o they_o and_o their_o sect_n be_v call_v by_o peculiar_a name_n which_o themselves_n can_v deny_v whereby_o all_o man_n that_o be_v indifferent_a &_o not_o let_v by_o passion_n may_v understand_v unto_o what_o church_n the_o name_n catholic_a which_o all_o part_n desire_v &_o pretend_v be_v to_o be_v give_v 10._o thus_o s._n augustine_n teachinge_a his_o friend_n how_o he_o may_v both_o know_v and_o believe_v the_o catholic_a church_n and_o all_o that_o she_o teach_v simple_o and_o without_o ask_v reason_n or_o proof_n and_o as_o for_o know_v and_o discern_v she_o from_o all_o other_o church_n that_o may_v pretend_v to_o be_v catholic_a we_o hear_v his_o mark_n that_o she_o be_v more_o eminent_a universal_a great_a in_o number_n and_o in_o possession_n of_o the_o name_n catholic_a the_o second_o that_o she_o may_v be_v believe_v secure_o and_o can_v deceive_v nor_o be_v deceive_v in_o matter_n of_o faith_n he_o prove_v elsewhere_o conclude_v final_o in_o this_o place_n si_fw-la iam_fw-la satis_fw-la tibi_fw-la iactatus_fw-la videris_fw-la etc._n etc._n 8._o if_o thou_o do_v seem_v to_o thyself_o now_o to_o have_v be_v sufficient_o toss_v up_o and_o down_o among_o sectarye_n and_o will_v put_v a_o end_n to_o these_o labour_n and_o tormoyle_v follow_v the_o way_n of_o cath._n discipline_n which_o have_v fly_v down_o unto_o we_o from_o christ_n by_o his_o apostle_n and_o be_v to_o flow_v from_o we_o to_o our_o posterity_n 11._o this_o then_o be_v the_o judgement_n and_o direction_n of_o s._n augustine_n that_o a_o man_n shall_v for_o his_o first_o church_n ground_n in_o matter_n of_o faith_n look_v unto_o the_o belief_n of_o the_o great_a &_o most_o eminent_a church_n of_o christendom_n that_o have_v endure_v long_a embrace_v most_o people_n &_o have_v come_v down_o from_o our_o forefather_n with_o the_o name_n of_o catholic_a not_o only_o among_o her_o own_o professor_n but_o even_o among_o her_o enemy_n jew_n infidel_n and_o heretic_n and_o so_o be_v term_v &_o hold_v by_o they_o 1._o in_o their_o common_a speech_n as_o the_o say_a father_n in_o diverse_a other_o place_n declare_v at_o large_a which_o rule_n of_o direction_n if_o we_o will_v follow_v about_o these_o three_o article_n of_o faith_n now_o propose_v the_o real_a presence_n transubstantiation_n and_o sacrifice_n of_o the_o mass_n it_o be_v easy_o see_v what_o ground_n we_o have_v for_o their_o belief_n in_o this_o kind_n of_o proof_n so_o high_o esteem_v by_o s._n augustine_n which_o be_v the_o authority_n of_o the_o universal_a cath._n church_n for_o that_o when_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n begin_v to_o oppose_v themselves_o in_o our_o day_n no_o man_n can_v deny_v but_o that_o our_o belief_n in_o these_o article_n be_v general_o receive_v over_o all_o christendom_n as_o well_o asia_n and_o africa_n where_o so_o ever_o christian_n be_v as_o europe_n and_o so_o upward_a time_n out_o of_o mind_n neither_o can_v any_o beginning_n be_v assign_v to_o these_o doctrine_n in_o the_o cath._n church_n but_o only_o a_o certain_a definition_n and_o determination_n of_o some_o counsel_n about_o the_o name_n of_o transubstantiation_n as_o after_o shall_v be_v declare_v 12._o now_o then_o have_v find_v out_o this_o first_o presence_n ground_n which_o s._n augustine_n and_o other_o father_n do_v make_v so_o great_a account_n of_o which_o be_v the_o authority_n and_o belief_n of_o that_o church_n that_o general_o be_v call_v catholic_a if_o we_o pass_v further_o and_o see_v what_o ground_n this_o church_n have_v or_o have_v to_o admytt_n the_o same_o which_o yet_o be_v not_o needful_a or_o possible_a to_o all_o sort_n of_o man_n for_o that_o only_o can_v be_v do_v by_o the_o learnede_a sort_n we_o shall_v find_v that_o she_o have_v such_o ground_n as_o may_v convince_v any_o man_n that_o be_v not_o obstinate_a and_o indurate_a to_o the_o contrary_n and_o first_o to_o begin_v with_o the_o article_n of_o the_o real_a presence_n what_o ground_n proof_n or_o theological_a demonstration_n can_v there_o be_v which_o the_o cath._n church_n have_v not_o for_o her_o belief_n in_o that_o high_a mystery_n which_o as_o it_o be_v to_o be_v one_o of_o the_o chief_a most_o sacred_a and_o admirable_a of_o christian_a religion_n so_o be_v it_o meet_v that_o it_o shall_v be_v confirm_v by_o all_o the_o principal_a way_n that_o any_o article_n of_o faith_n can_v or_o can_v be_v confirm_v that_o be_v to_o say_v both_o by_o scripture_n of_o the_o old_a and_o new_a testament_n and_o the_o true_a exposition_n thereof_o by_o ancient_a father_n that_o live_v before_o this_o controversy_n begin_v with_o sacramentaryeâ—_n by_o authority_n and_o tradition_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o their_o successor_n by_o testimony_n of_o ancient_a father_n from_o age_n to_o age_n by_o consent_n and_o agreement_n practice_n and_o use_v of_o the_o universal_a church_n by_o the_o concourse_n and_o approbation_n of_o almighty_a god_n with_o evident_a and_o infinite_a miracle_n by_o confession_n of_o the_o adversaries_n and_o other_o such_o general_a head_n of_o argument_n which_o catholic_a divine_v do_v produce_v for_o this_o truth_n for_o iustifyinge_v the_o church_n faith_n therein_o 13._o and_o out_o of_o the_o scripture_n their_o demonstration_n scripture_n be_v not_o single_a or_o of_o one_o sort_n only_o but_o in_o diverse_a manner_n as_o to_o the_o height_n and_o dignity_n of_o so_o divine_a and_o venerable_a a_o mystery_n be_v convenient_a for_o that_o out_o of_o the_o old_a testament_n they_o show_v how_o it_o be_v prefigure_v and_o prophesy_v and_o in_o the_o new_a both_o promise_v
that_o there_o be_v as_o well_o signum_fw-la &_o figura_fw-la rei_fw-la praesentis_fw-la quam_fw-la absentis_fw-la a_o sign_n or_o figure_n of_o thing_n present_a as_o well_o as_o of_o thing_n absent_a as_o for_o a_o example_n a_o firkyn_n of_o wine_n hang_v up_o for_o a_o sign_n at_o a_o tavern_n door_n that_o there_o be_v wine_n to_o be_v sell_v be_v both_o a_o sign_n of_o wine_n and_o yet_o contain_v and_o exhibit_v the_o thing_n it_o self_n and_o so_o it_o be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n which_o by_o his_o nature_n be_v a_o sign_n figure_n or_o representation_n do_v both_o represent_v and_o exhibitt_v signify_v and_o contain_v the_o body_n of_o our_o saviour_n 41._o and_o as_o it_o shall_v be_v a_o heretical_a cavil_n to_o argue_v out_o of_o the_o say_a place_n of_o s._n paul_n as_o the_o old_a heretic_n do_v that_o christ_n be_v call_v a_o figure_n of_o the_o substance_n of_o his_o father_n and_o the_o image_n of_o god_n or_o the_o similitude_n of_o man_n ergo_fw-la he_o be_v not_o of_o the_o real_a substance_n with_o his_o father_n nor_o real_o god_n nor_o true_o man_n so_o be_v it_o as_o heretical_a to_o argue_v as_o our_o sacramentarye_n do_v that_o tertullian_n augustine_n &_o some_o other_o father_n do_v sometime_o call_v the_o sacrament_n a_o similitude_n figure_n sign_n or_o remembrance_n of_o christ_n body_n his_o death_n and_o passion_n as_o in_o deed_n it_o be_v for_o that_o otherwise_o it_o shall_v not_o be_v a_o sacrament_n ergo_fw-la it_o be_v not_o his_o true_a body_n that_o be_v contain_v therein_o especial_o see_v the_o same_o father_n do_v in_o the_o selfsame_o place_n whence_o these_o objection_n be_v deduce_v express_o &_o clear_o expound_v themselves_o affirm_v christ_n true_a real_a body_n to_o be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n under_o the_o form_n of_o bread_n and_o wine_n as_o for_o example_n saint_n ambrose_n here_o object_v in_o the_o 4._o four_o book_n de_fw-fr sacramentis_fw-la cap._n 4._o do_v express_o and_o at_o large_a prove_v the_o reall-presence_n as_o exact_o as_o any_o catholic_a can_v write_v at_o this_o day_n say_v that_o before_o the_o word_n of_o consecration_n it_o be_v bread_n but_o after_o it_o be_v the_o body_n of_o christ._n and_o again_o before_o the_o word_n of_o christ_n be_v utter_v the_o chalice_n be_v full_a protestant_n of_o wyne_fw-mi and_o water_n but_o when_o the_o word_n of_o christ_n have_v wrought_v their_o effect_n then_o be_v make_v that_o blood_n which_o redeem_v the_o people_n and_o yet_o further_o christ_n jesus_n do_v testify_v unto_o we_o that_o we_o receive_v his_o body_n &_o blood_n and_o shall_v we_o doubt_v of_o his_o testimony_n which_o word_n be_v so_o plain_a and_o evident_a for_o the_o truth_n of_o catholic_a belief_n let_v the_o reader_n consider_v how_o vain_a and_o fond_a a_o thing_n it_o be_v for_o the_o protestant_n to_o object_n out_o of_o the_o selfsame_o place_n that_o we_o receive_v the_o similitude_n of_o his_o death_n and_o drink_v the_o similitude_n of_o his_o precious_a blood_n for_o that_o we_o deny_v not_o but_o the_o body_n of_o christ_n in_o the_o sacrament_n be_v a_o representation_n and_o similitude_n of_o his_o death_n on_o the_o cross_n and_o that_o the_o blood_n which_o we_o drink_v in_o the_o sacrament_n under_o the_o form_n of_o wine_n be_v a_o representation_n and_o similitude_n of_o the_o sheddinge_a of_o christ_n blood_n in_o his_o passion_n but_o this_o let_v not_o but_o that_o it_o be_v the_o selfsame_o body_n &_o blood_n though_o it_o be_v receive_v in_o a_o different_a manner_n as_o it_o let_v not_o but_o that_o christ_n be_v true_a god_n though_o he_o be_v say_v to_o be_v the_o image_n of_o god_n as_o before_o you_o have_v hear_v 42._o there_o remain_v then_o only_o to_o be_v answer_v that_o speech_n of_o s._n augustine_n object_v in_o these_o disputation_n quid_fw-la paras_fw-la dentes_fw-la &_o ventrem_fw-la crede_fw-la &_o manducasti_fw-la why_o do_v thou_o prepare_v thy_o joan._n tooth_n and_o thy_o belly_n believe_v and_o thou_o have_v eat_v whereunto_o i_o answer_v that_o this_o speech_n of_o s._n augustine_n and_o some_o other_o like_a that_o be_v find_v in_o he_o and_o some_o other_o father_n of_o the_o spiritual_a eatinge_v of_o christ_n by_o faith_n do_v not_o exclude_v the_o real_a presence_n as_o we_o have_v show_v before_o in_o our_o nine_o observation_n it_o be_v speak_v against_o they_o that_o come_v with_o a_o base_a and_o gross_a imagination_n to_o receive_v this_o divine_a food_n as_o if_o it_o be_v a_o corporal_a refection_n and_o not_o spiritual_a whereas_o indeed_o faith_n &_o charity_n be_v those_o virtue_n that_o give_v the_o life_n unto_o this_o eatinge_v faith_n in_o beleevinge_v christ_n word_n to_o be_v true_a as_o s._n ambrose_n in_o the_o place_n before_o cite_v say_v and_o thereby_o assuringe_v ourselves_o christ_n true_a body_n to_o be_v there_o and_o charity_n in_o prepare_v ourselves_o worthy_o by_o examination_n of_o our_o conscience_n that_o we_o do_v not_o receive_v our_o own_o damnation_n as_o s._n paul_n do_v threat_v and_o this_o be_v the_o true_a spiritual_a eatinge_v of_o christ_n body_n by_o faith_n but_o yet_o true_o and_o real_o as_o the_o say_a father_n do_v expound_v unto_o we_o who_o sentence_n more_o at_o large_a you_o shall_v see_v examine_v in_o the_o chapter_n follow_v 43._o these_o then_o be_v all_o in_o effect_n or_o at_o least_o way_n the_o most_o principal_a argument_n that_o i_o chapter_n find_v object_v by_o our_o english_a sacramentarye_n in_o the_o foresaid_a ten_o disputation_n against_o the_o article_n of_o christ_n true_a &_o real_a be_v in_o the_o sacrament_n you_o may_v consider_v with_o admiration_n and_o pity_n how_o feeble_a ground_n those_o unfortunate_a man_n have_v that_o be_v first_o dealer_n in_o that_o affair_n whereon_o to_o change_v their_o faith_n and_o religion_n from_o that_o of_o the_o christian_a world_n from_o time_n out_o of_o mind_n before_o they_o and_o to_o enter_v into_o a_o new_a sect_n and_o labyrinth_n of_o opinion_n contradict_v among_o themselves_o and_o accurse_a by_o he_o that_o be_v their_o first_o guide_n to_o lead_v they_o into_o new_a path_n to_o wit_n luther_n himself_o and_o yet_o to_o stand_v so_o obstinate_o &_o with_o such_o immovable_a pertinacy_n therein_o as_o to_o offer_v their_o body_n to_o temporal_a fire_n and_o their_o soul_n to_o the_o evident_a peril_n of_o eternal_a damnation_n for_o the_o same_o but_o this_o be_v the_o ordinary_a enchauntement_n of_o heresy_n found_v on_o pride_n self_n judgement_n and_o self-will_n as_o both_o by_o holy_a scripture_n and_o ancient_a father_n we_o be_v admonish_v 44._o one_o thing_n also_o be_v great_o here_o to_o be_v note_v by_o the_o careful_a reader_n upon_o consideration_n of_o these_o argument_n to_o and_o fro_o how_o uncertain_a a_o thing_n it_o be_v for_o particular_a man_n whether_o learned_a or_o unlearned_a but_o especial_o the_o unto_o ignorant_a to_o ground_n themselves_o &_o their_o faith_n upon_o their_o own_o or_o other_o man_n disputation_n which_o with_o every_o little_a show_n of_o reason_n to_o and_o fro_o may_v alter_v their_o judgement_n or_o apprehension_n and_o in_o how_o miserable_a a_o case_n christian_n man_n be_v if_o their_o faith_n whereof_o depend_v their_o salvation_n or_o damnation_n shall_v hang_v upon_o such_o uncertain_a mean_n as_o these_o be_v &_o that_o god_n have_v leave_v no_o other_o more_o sure_a or_o certain_a way_n then_o this_o for_o man_n to_o be_v resolve_v of_o the_o truth_n as_o we_o see_v he_o have_v by_o his_o visible_a church_n that_o can_v err_v yet_o think_v we_o good_a to_o examine_v this_o way_n of_o disputation_n also_o and_o the_o argument_n thereof_o use_v by_o protestant_n against_o the_o truth_n but_o now_o follow_v a_o large_a &_o more_o important_a examen_fw-la of_o the_o catholic_a argument_n allege_v by_o our_o man_n against_o they_o in_o this_o article_n of_o the_o reall-presence_n and_o what_o kind_n of_o answer_n they_o frame_v to_o the_o same_o whereby_o thou_o will_v be_v great_o confirm_v good_a reader_n if_o i_o be_v not_o much_o deceive_v in_o the_o opinion_n of_o their_o weakness_n and_o untruth_n of_o their_o cause_n what_o catholic_a argument_n be_v allege_v in_o these_o disputation_n for_o the_o reall-presence_n and_o how_o they_o be_v answer_v or_o shift_v of_o by_o the_o protestant_n chap._n v._n as_o i_o have_v brief_o touch_v in_o the_o former_a chapter_n the_o reason_n and_o argument_n allege_v for_o the_o sacramentary_a opinion_n against_o the_o reall-presence_n so_o now_o i_o do_v not_o deem_v it_o amiss_o to_o run_v over_o in_o like_a manner_n some_o of_o the_o catholic_a argument_n that_o be_v allege_v against_o they_o though_o neither_o time_n nor_o place_n will_v permit_v to_o recyte_v they_o all_o which_o the_o discreett_a reader_n may_v easy_o imagine_v by_o the_o ground_n and_o head_n thereof_o
they_o in_o these_o disputation_n not_o with_o the_o cup_n but_o with_o substantial_a grave_a and_o learned_a argument_n you_o will_v not_o marvel_v that_o he_o be_v so_o angry_a with_o he_o for_o in_o very_a deed_n he_o bring_v they_o always_o to_o the_o great_a exigent_n of_o any_o other_o and_o more_o than_o all_o the_o rest_n together_o now_o then_o let_v we_o pass_v to_o the_o disputation_n 19_o doctor_n chadsay_n be_v the_o first_o that_o dispute_v against_o cranmer_n begin_v with_o the_o institution_n of_o christ_n sacrament_n record_v by_o s._n matthew_n 22._o mark_v and_o luke_n show_v out_o of_o they_o by_o diverse_a plain_a clause_n and_o circumstance_n that_o christ_n in_o his_o last_o supper_n give_v unto_o his_o disciple_n not_o bread_n but_o his_o true_a natural_a body_n which_o be_v give_v the_o next_o day_n on_o the_o cross_n to_o all_o which_o cranmer_n answer_v thus_o if_o you_o understand_v by_o the_o body_n natural_a organicum_fw-la that_o be_v have_v such_o proportion_n of_o member_n as_o he_o have_v live_v 70._o here_o than_o i_o aunsivere_fw-la negative_o by_o which_o answer_n we_o may_v perceive_v that_o this_o great_a doctor_n who_o have_v write_v a_o great_a book_n against_o the_o reall-presence_n by_o which_o latymer_n among_o other_o be_v make_v a_o sacramentary_a and_o stand_v therein_o unto_o death_n upon_o the_o credit_n of_o this_o book_n as_o after_o you_o shall_v hear_v he_o often_o argument_n profess_v understand_v not_o the_o very_a state_n of_o the_o question_n between_o we_o for_o that_o we_o hold_v not_o christ_n body_n in_o the_o sacrament_n to_o be_v organical_a in_o that_o manner_n as_o cranmer_n here_o imagine_v with_o external_a dimension_n &_o proportion_n of_o member_n as_o he_o live_v upon_o earth_n 3._o though_o true_o organical_a in_o another_o manner_n without_o extension_n to_o place_n as_o in_o our_o four_o and_o five_o observation_n before_o set_v down_o we_o have_v declare_v so_o as_o he_o err_a in_o the_o very_a ground_n and_o first_o principle_n of_o the_o controversy_n you_o may_v imagine_v how_o he_o will_v proceed_v in_o the_o rest_n 20._o it_o be_v object_v unto_o he_o next_o after_o this_o that_o as_o a_o wiseman_n lyinge_v on_o his_o deathbed_n argument_n and_o have_v care_n that_o his_o heir_n after_o his_o departure_n do_v live_v in_o quiett_n and_o not_o contend_v about_o his_o testament_n do_v not_o use_v trope_n and_o figure_n but_o clear_a and_o plain_a speech_n in_o the_o say_a testament_n so_o must_v we_o presume_v of_o christ_n &_o for_o the_o confirmation_n of_o this_o doctor_n weston_n allege_v 1302._o a_o place_n out_o of_o s._n augustine_n de_fw-fr unitate_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la urginge_v this_o very_a same_o similitude_n that_o if_o the_o last_o word_n of_o any_o grave_n or_o honest_a man_n lyinge_v on_o his_o deathbed_n be_v to_o be_v believe_v 10._o much_o more_o the_o last_o word_n of_o our_o saviour_n christ_n in_o his_o supper_n to_o which_o argument_n i_o find_v no_o effectual_a answer_n give_v at_o all_o but_o only_o that_o cranmer_n say_v that_o he_o which_o speak_v by_o trope_n and_o figure_n do_v not_o lie_v but_o he_o answer_v not_o to_o the_o other_o inconvenience_n that_o his_o heir_n may_v fall_v out_o about_o his_o testament_n the_o one_o understand_v they_o literal_o the_o other_o figurative_o as_o we_o &_o they_o do_v the_o word_n of_o christ_n about_o this_o sacrament_n 21._o next_o to_o this_o be_v bring_v in_o a_o large_a testimony_n of_o s._n chrysostome_n out_o of_o his_o homily_n unto_o argument_n the_o people_n of_o antioch_n which_o begin_v necessarium_fw-la est_fw-la dilectissimi_fw-la mysteriorum_fw-la discere_fw-la miracuâ—um_fw-la antiâ—ch_n quid_fw-la tandem_fw-la sit_fw-la &_o quare_fw-la sit_fw-la datum_fw-la &_o quae_fw-la rei_fw-la â—tilitas_fw-la etc._n etc._n it_o be_v necessary_a most_o dear_o belove_v to_o know_v this_o miracle_n of_o mysterye_n what_o it_o be_v and_o why_o it_o be_v give_v and_o what_o profitt_a come_v to_o we_o thereby_o etc._n etc._n and_o then_o s._n chrysostome_n declare_v at_o large_a how_o christ_n most_o miraculous_o above_o all_o human_a power_n give_v his_o body_n to_o be_v handle_v and_o eat_v by_o we_o â—n_o the_o sacrament_n so_o as_o we_o fasten_v our_o tooth_n in_o his_o flesh_n and_o that_o he_o do_v more_o than_o ever_o any_o parent_n do_v who_o many_o time_n give_v their_o child_n to_o other_o to_o be_v feed_v but_o christ_n feed_v we_o with_o his_o own_o flesh_n and_o with_o that_o very_a flesh_n by_o which_o he_o be_v our_o brother_n and_o unite_v unto_o we_o in_o flesh_n out_o of_o which_o discourse_n d._n westonâ—rged_v â—rged_z that_o for_o so_o much_o as_o christ_n be_v make_v our_o brother_n and_o kinsman_n by_o his_o true_a natural_a &_o organical_a flesh_n erge_n he_o give_v the_o same_o his_o true_a natural_a and_o organical_a flesh_n to_o we_o to_o be_v eat_v in_o the_o sacrament_n whereto_o cranmer_n answer_v i_o grant_v the_o consequence_n and_o the_o consequent_a 1._o which_o be_v contrary_a to_o that_o he_o say_v a_o little_a before_o if_o you_o mark_v it_o that_o his_o organical_a body_n be_v not_o there_o 22._o but_o doctor_n weston_n go_v further_o that_o see_v he_o grant_v this_o than_o do_v it_o follow_v also_o that_o his_o true_a organical_a flesh_n be_v receive_v in_o our_o mouth_n which_o s._n chrysostome_n call_v our_o tooth_n but_o this_o cranmer_n deny_v and_o say_v he_o be_v eat_v only_o by_o faith_n whereupon_o weston_n come_v on_o he_o again_o say_v that_o for_o so_o much_o as_o he_o give_v we_o the_o selfsame_o flesh_n to_o eat_v in_o the_o sacrament_n and_o this_o with_o our_o tooth_n as_o s._n chrysostome_n say_v whereby_o he_o become_v our_o brother_n &_o kinsman_n it_o must_v needs_o import_v a_o real_a eatinge_v whereto_o cramner_n answer_v i_o grant_v he_o take_v and_o give_v in_o the_o sacrament_n the_o same_o true_a natural_a and_o organical_a flesh_n wherein_o he_o suffer_v but_o feed_v we_o spiritual_o and_o his_o flesh_n be_v receive_v spiritual_o this_o be_v his_o answer_n and_o this_o he_o repeat_v often_o and_o from_o this_o he_o can_v not_o be_v draw_v and_o here_o now_o you_o see_v the_o practice_n of_o that_o shift_n whereof_o we_o have_v speak_v before_o in_o our_o eight_o and_o nine_o observation_n whereby_o these_o wilful_a people_n under_o the_o term_n of_o spiritual_o and_o sacramental_o do_v delude_v themselves_o &_o their_o reader_n as_o though_o they_o say_v somewhat_o to_o avoid_v catholic_a argument_n take_v out_o of_o ancient_a father_n plain_a and_o perspicuous_a authoritye_n whereas_o indeed_o they_o say_v nothing_o in_o substance_n at_o all_o but_o do_v turn_n and_o wind_n and_o hide_v themselves_o under_o the_o sound_n of_o different_a word_n without_o sense_n for_o if_o it_o be_v true_a as_o cranmer_n here_o grant_v that_o christ_n give_v his_o true_a natural_a and_o organical_a flesh_n to_o be_v eat_v â—n_o the_o sacrament_n and_o that_o with_o our_o tooth_n or_o corporal_a mouth_n as_o s._n chrysostome_n say_v how_o can_v it_o be_v deny_v but_o that_o we_o eat_v his_o flesh_n real_o and_o not_o spiritual_o only_a if_o spiritual_o be_v opposite_a to_o real_o as_o in_o cranmers_n sense_n it_o be_v which_o understand_v spiritual_o and_o figurative_o to_o be_v all_o one_o but_o in_o our_o sense_n spiritual_o stand_v with_o real_o for_o that_o we_o hold_v christ_n body_n to_o be_v receive_v real_o and_o substantial_o in_o the_o sacrament_n but_o yet_o after_o a_o spiritual_a manner_n different_a from_o that_o which_o the_o capharnait_n do_v imagine_v of_o a_o gross_a carnal_a eatinge_v of_o christ_n flesh_n as_o other_o flesh_n be_v accustom_v to_o be_v eat_v wherefore_o to_o imagine_v that_o christ_n true_a natural_a or_o organical_a flesh_n be_v eat_v true_o in_o the_o sacrament_n and_o yet_o only_o absent_a by_o faith_n spiritual_o and_o in_o a_o figure_n be_v to_o speak_v contradictoâ—yes_n with_o one_o breath_n 23._o diverse_a other_o text_n and_o testimony_n of_o 〈◊〉_d chrysostome_n be_v allege_v by_o doctor_n weston_n reply_n â—o_o confute_v this_o ideacall_a fiction_n of_o doctor_n cranner_n as_o that_o for_o example_n homilia_fw-la 83._o in_o cap._n 26._o watch_n where_o he_o say_v among_o other_o thing_n â—eniat_fw-la tibi_fw-la in_o mentem_fw-la etc._n etc._n let_v it_o come_v into_o thy_o remembrance_n with_o what_o honour_n thou_o be_v honour_v in_o the_o sacrament_n what_o table_n how_o do_v enjoy_v for_o that_o we_o be_v nourish_v herein_o with_o the_o selfsame_o thing_n which_o the_o angel_n do_v behold_v and_o tremble_v at_o etc._n etc._n who_o shall_v speak_v the_o power_n of_o thy_o lord_n who_o shall_v declare_v forth_o all_o his_o praise_n what_o pastor_n have_v ever_o nourish_v his_o sheep_n with_o his_o own_o flesh_n etc._n etc._n christ_n feed_v we_o with_o his_o own_o body_n and_o conjoin_v &_o unit_v we_o to_o he_o thereby_o and_o
in_o his_o book_n de_fw-fr privata_fw-la missa_fw-la testify_v that_o the_o devil_n reason_v with_o contigit_fw-la he_o and_o persuade_v he_o that_o the_o mass_n be_v not_o good_a whereby_o it_o appear_v that_o luther_n say_v mass_n and_o the_o devil_n dissuade_v he_o from_o it_o latimer_n i_o do_v not_o take_v in_o hand_n here_o to_o descend_v luther_n saying_n or_o do_n be_v he_o be_v here_o he_o will_v descend_v himself_o well_o enough_o i_o trow_v so_o latymer_n leave_v luther_n to_o himself_o but_o fox_n will_v needs_o defend_v he_o with_o this_o marginal_a note_n say_v in_o that_o book_n the_o devil_n 1324._o do_v not_o dissuade_v he_o so_o much_o from_o say_v mass_n as_o to_o bring_v he_o to_o desperation_n for_o say_v mass_n such_o temptation_n many_o time_n happen_v to_o good_a man_n 65._o and_o will_v you_o consider_v the_o gravity_n and_o verity_n of_o this_o note_n first_o he_o say_v that_o the_o devil_n do_v not_o so_o much_o dissuade_v he_o from_o say_v mass_n as_o to_o bring_v he_o to_o desperation_n then_o somewhat_o he_o do_v dissuade_v he_o though_o luther_n not_o so_o much_o as_o to_o the_o other_o which_o i_o believe_v for_o that_o the_o one_o be_v his_o damnation_n and_o his_o leave_v of_o mass_n be_v but_o the_o way_n to_o it_o second_o if_o the_o devil_n do_v endeavour_v to_o bring_v luther_n to_o desperation_n for_o say_v of_o mass_n he_o must_v needs_o persuade_v he_o first_o that_o the_o mass_n be_v naught_o as_o if_o he_o will_v draw_v a_o man_n to_o desperation_n for_o use_v alm_n deed_n he_o must_v first_o persuade_v he_o that_o almsdeed_n be_v naught_o and_o wicked_a and_o as_o wise_a a_o man_n as_o he_o shall_v show_v himself_o that_o at_o the_o devil_n persuasion_n will_v believe_v that_o almsdeed_n be_v naught_o and_o leave_v the_o same_o so_o be_v luther_n &_o latymer_n as_o wise_a to_o believe_v this_o suggestion_n of_o the_o devil_n against_o the_o mass_n and_o where_o fox_n say_v that_o such_o temptation_n of_o the_o devil_n do_v happen_v god_n many_o time_n to_o goodman_n i_o grant_v it_o but_o not_o that_o ever_o any_o good_a man_n do_v yield_v thereunto_o or_o judge_v a_o thing_n evil_a for_o that_o the_o devil_n do_v say_v it_o be_v naught_o but_o rather_o to_o the_o contrary_a his_o impugnation_n of_o it_o be_v always_o a_o sign_n that_o the_o thing_n be_v good_a and_o please_a to_o almighty_a god_n who_o adversary_n the_o devil_n be_v yea_o the_o great_a his_o impugnation_n be_v the_o better_a must_v we_o presume_v the_o thing_n to_o be_v and_o consequent_o when_o he_o will_v make_v the_o mass_n to_o seem_v so_o heinous_a a_o thing_n to_o luther_n as_o that_o he_o shall_v be_v damn_v for_o say_v the_o same_o it_o be_v a_o good_a proof_n that_o the_o mass_n be_v a_o excellent_a thing_n &_o displease_v the_o devil_n and_o that_o luther_n and_o his_o follower_n leave_v to_o say_v mass_n do_v please_v much_o the_o devil_n in_o follow_v his_o suggestion_n therein_o as_o good_a and_o obedient_a child_n to_o so_o holy_a a_o ghostly_a father_n and_o so_o to_o he_o we_o leave_v they_o 66._o there_o follow_v that_o albeit_o latymer_n be_v loath_a to_o dispute_v yet_o some_o few_o argument_n be_v cast_v forth_o against_o he_o but_o all_o in_o english_a for_o so_o he_o will_v have_v it_o and_o first_o master_n doctor_n tressam_fw-la allege_v a_o authority_n of_o saint_n hilary_n affirminge_v a_o natural_a unity_n to_o be_v in_o we_o with_o christ_n by_o eatinge_v his_o flesh_n which_o place_n for_o that_o it_o be_v allege_v before_o against_o his_o fellow_n i_o will_v not_o stand_v much_o upon_o it_o but_o only_o note_v this_o man_n evasion_n latymer_n i_o can_v not_o speak_v latyn_n so_o long_o etc._n etc._n but_o as_o for_o the_o word_n say_v he_o of_o hilary_n i_o think_v they_o make_v not_o so_o much_o for_o you_o but_o he_o that_o shall_v answer_v the_o doctor_n have_v not_o need_v to_o be_v in_o my_o case_n but_o shall_v have_v they_o in_o a_o readiness_n and_o know_v their_o purpose_n melancthon_n say_v that_o if_o the_o doctor_n have_v forseen_v that_o they_o shall_v have_v be_v so_o take_v in_o this_o controversy_n they_o will_v have_v write_v more_o plain_o this_o be_v his_o answer_n and_o more_o than_o this_o you_o shall_v not_o find_v and_o in_o this_o there_o be_v a_o notable_a imposture_n of_o a_o old_a deceaver_n for_o that_o melancthon_n be_v of_o opposite_a opinion_n to_o he_o in_o this_o article_n and_o write_v a_o whole_a work_n of_o the_o doctor_n sentence_n for_o proof_n of_o the_o reall-presence_n against_o the_o sacramentarye_n as_o in_o his_o decembri_n life_n we_o have_v show_v what_o he_o speak_v of_o this_o mystakinge_v the_o father_n and_o doctor_n he_o speak_v express_o of_o the_o sacramentarye_n and_o not_o of_o those_o that_o defend_v the_o reall-presence_n which_o he_o also_o be_v a_o lutheran_n defend_v and_o affirm_v plain_o that_o all_o the_o father_n be_v of_o the_o same_o opinion_n though_o if_o they_o have_v foresee_v that_o such_o heretic_n as_o be_v the_o sacramentarye_n will_v have_v rise_v up_o and_o have_v wrest_v their_o word_n and_o meaning_n as_o you_o have_v hear_v both_o cranmer_n ridley_n and_o latymer_n to_o have_v do_v they_o will_v have_v speak_v more_o plain_o in_o the_o controversy_n though_o hardly_o they_o can_v have_v speak_v more_o clear_o against_o they_o and_o by_o this_o first_o entrance_n you_o may_v mark_v the_o plain_a dealing_v of_o old_a father_n latymer_n 67._o doctor_n seaton_n vicechauncelour_a of_o cambridge_n see_v these_o sleight_n of_o the_o old_a fellow_n begin_v thus_o with_o he_o i_o know_v your_o learning_n wool_n enough_o and_o how_o subtle_a you_o be_v i_o will_v use_v a_o few_o 1325._o word_n with_o you_o out_o of_o s._n cyprian_n who_o say_v that_o the_o old_a testament_n do_v forbid_v the_o drink_v of_o blood_n and_o dom._n the_o new_a testament_n do_v command_v the_o drink_v of_o blood_n out_o of_o which_o word_n he_o frame_v this_o argument_n that_o it_o be_v true_a and_o real_a blood_n which_o the_o old_a testament_n forbadd_a to_o drink_v ergò_fw-la it_o be_v true_a and_o real_a blood_n which_o the_o new_a testament_n command_v to_o drink_v for_o that_o otherwise_o the_o antithesis_fw-la or_o opposition_n of_o the_o two_o testament_n in_o this_o point_n can_v not_o hold_v if_o the_o one_o forbid_v the_o true_a drink_n of_o true_a and_o real_a blood_n and_o the_o other_o command_v the_o figurative_a drink_n of_o spiritual_a blood_n by_o faith_n for_o that_o these_o thing_n be_v opposite_a and_o that_o the_o jew_n also_o in_o the_o old_a testament_n do_v drink_v christ_n blood_n by_o faith_n etc._n etc._n to_o which_o argument_n latymer_n answer_v nothing_o in_o effect_n but_o this_o we_o do_v taste_v true_a blood_n 1325._o but_o spiritual_o and_o this_o be_v enough_o and_o then_o prove_v he_o the_o same_o by_o those_o word_n of_o s._n augustine_n before_o answer_v by_o we_o crede_fw-la &_o manducusti_fw-la believe_v joan._n &_o thou_o have_v eat_v as_o though_o the_o word_n credere_fw-la and_o edere_fw-la be_v all_o one_o in_o the_o scripture_n whereupon_o doctor_n weston_n recite_v a_o story_n that_o pass_v between_o master_n hooper_n and_o b._n gardener_n for_o when_o hooper_n will_v needs_o hold_v that_o to_o cate_z be_v to_o believe_v and_o that_o a_o altar_n signify_v christ_n in_o the_o scripture_n b._n gardener_n infer_v ergò_fw-la when_o s._n paul_n say_v to_o the_o hebrew_n that_o we_o have_v a_o altar_n whereof_o the_o jeuwe_n must_v not_o eat_v the_o 13._o sense_n be_v we_o have_v christ_n in_o who_o the_o jew_n must_v not_o believe_v and_o after_o this_o he_o retourneâ—_n to_o press_v latymer_n strong_o again_o upon_o this_o place_n of_o s._n cyprian_n say_v that_o be_v comusaund_v in_o the_o new_a weston_n testament_n which_o be_v forbid_v in_o the_o old_a but_o true_a blood_n be_v forbid_v in_o the_o old_a ergò_fw-la true_a blood_n also_o be_v command_v to_o be_v drunken_a in_o the_o new_a whereunto_o latymer_n aunsweringe_v twice_o utter_v two_o contraries_n for_o first_o his_o word_n be_v it_o be_v true_a as_o touchinge_v 27._o the_o matter_n but_o not_o as_o touchinge_v the_o manner_n of_o the_o thing_n where_o he_o grant_v as_o you_o see_v that_o true_a blood_n be_v mean_v in_o both_o testament_n but_o the_o manner_n of_o drink_v be_v different_a which_o also_o we_o grant_v &_o teach_v but_o hear_v his_o second_o answer_n upon_o the_o other_o instance_n 68_o weston_n the_o old_a testament_n do_v forbid_v the_o tastinge_n of_o blood_n but_o the_o new_a do_v command_v it_o latymer_n 70._o it_o be_v true_a not_o as_o touchinge_v the_o thing_n but_o as_o touchinge_v the_o manner_n thereof_o before_o he_o say_v it_o be_v true_a touchinge_v the_o matter_n but_o not_o touchinge_v the_o