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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A31094	A briefe answer to A discourse, lately written by one P.B., to prove baptisme under the defection of Antichrist, to be the ordinance of Iesus Christ, and the baptizing of infants to be agreeable to the word of God wherein is declared ... that true baptisme and a false church are inconsistent, and cannot stand together : and also maintained, that the baptizing of infants hath no authority from the Scriptures / by R. Barrow.	Barrow, Robert, d. 1697.	1642 (1642)	Wing B967; ESTC R12474	18,380	26

A Briefe ANSWER TO A DISCOURSE Lately Written by one P. B. TO PROVE BAPTISME under the defection of Antichrist to be the Ordinance of IESUS CHRIST AND The Baptizing of Infants to be agreeable to the Word of GOD Wherein is Declared from his owne grounds that true Baptisme and a false Church are inconsistent and cannot stand together And also maintained That the Baptizing of Infants hath no authority from the Scriptures The simple beleeveth every Word but the prudent man looketh well to his goings PROV. 14.15 By R. BARROW LONDON Printed in the Yeere 1642. To the READER ALthough divers of the learned have declared the Baptisme of Infants to be but a humane tradition as P. B. confesseth in his Epistle page 3. yet notwithstanding there be many that have and doe take upon them to countenance the same by the Word of God wherein they commit a double offence one in seducing the people and leading them to disobedience against Christ Mat. 28.19 Mar 16.15 16. whom they are to heare in all things Acts 3. The other in taking the Word of Christ and putting it as a sword into the hands of men to defend and maintaine themselves in such their disobedience against him amongst whom one P. B. hath lately taken part in publishing a booke to proove the Baptisme of Infants to be agreeable to the word of God but as many times it falleth out when men undertake to defend an evill cause he hath so bewrayed the error of that doctrine that in the judgement of any who are but indifferently acquainted with the Scriptures there needs no more be said to discover the falsity thereof and sinfulnesse of his owne practice in the same things wherein unadvisedly hee accuseth others One instance J shall give thereby to cause the Reader in pursuing his discourse to take notice therin hee fighteth against himselfe and in that thing most of all whereupon his whole building standeth which is the perpetuity of the visible Church under the new Testament page 1. and so by consequent of Baptisme whereby the matter of the Church is differenced page 3.4 wherein hee maketh Baptisme to depend upon the Church whence then it must needs follow that unlesse hee can finde such a Church which hath successively continued from the first planting untill these dayes hee cannot assure himsefe that his baptisme received is the ordinance of Christ But pag. 2.3 he confesseth that he knoweth not where any such Church hath continued nor doth hee believe that any can be found that can make such a continuance of the Church to appeare therefore hee received not his Baptisme from any such Church nor is it then by his owne argument the baptisme of Christ but a counterfeit or Idoll come out of the bottomelesse pit as hee himselfe speaketh page 6. Having thus destroyed his foundation and impeached his owne baptisme and the baptisme of the Church of England derived from the Church of Rome a false state the mother of fornications c. as he affirmeth in the 3. page of his Epistle to the Reader his whole building must needs fall to the ground which thing being considered I know it may be thought that an Answer to such a Discourse should be altogether unnecessary for hee that impeacheth himselfe needs no other to accuse him yet neverthelesse hearing that some not well acquainted with the state of this controversie have by his mis-applying the Scriptures in the handling of the same been prejudiced against the truth by him evill spoken of for their sakes therefore is this briefe Answer made wherein not regarding to follow him to and fro in all his vaine wandering and tautologies wherewith his booke is stored I have reduced his whole Discourse into such particular heads as doe either concern the perpetuity of the visible Church the baptisme of the Church of Rome or the baptisme of Infants c. which hee undertaketh to prove for Answer I have made use of little save onely what I have found in his owne writing wherein indeed is sufficient to discover the vanity of his opinion in these particulars and to satisfie any that thereby have taken offence againg the truth but all that is said will appeare to thee courteous Reader in the following Answer and therefore I shall referre thee thereunto and also unto the grace and guidance of Christ our Redeemer in whose service I am alwayes thine R. BARROVV A BREIFE ANSVVER To a Discourse lately written by one P. B. c. FIrst he saith that the visible Church of Christ hath had a perpetuall continuance in the world from the first plantation thereof by Christ and the Apostles and shall so continue unto the end of the world this he saith was prophesied Esa. 9.7.59.21 witnessed Luke 1.33 Acts 5.29 and confirmed Matth. 16.18.28.20 and these Scriptures are stable and true and so to be accounted by all the Saints page 1. I answer That these Scriptures and all other being delivered by the spirit of God 2 Pet. 1.21 are stable and true and so to be accounted of all the world Acts 3.22.23 and yet are not therefore the severall glosses and understandings of men given upon these or other Scriptures alwayes stable and true nor so to be accounted of any man Before wee give credit therefore to his construction of these Scriptures wee will a little examine how he makes the truth thereof to appeare he saith that the perpetuity of the visible Church was prophesied Esay 9.7.59.21 And the Word is yea and Amen c. whereupon then it must needs follow that if the visible Church of Christ hath not had a perpetuall uninterrupted succession in the world ever since the first plantation thereof untill these dayes though this prophesie in it selfe be true yet his understanding and interpretation thereof must needs be false This rule the Lord himselfe hath given us thereby to distinguish the true Prophet from the false Deutron 18.22 hee saith when a Prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord and if the thing follow not nor come to passe that is not the thing which the Lord hath spoken but the Prophet hath spoken it presumptuously Now as hereby wee are taught to distinguish the true Prophets from the false so likewise are wee by the same rule taught to know the true interpretation of every prophesie from the false and therefore when any interpretation of any prophesie is given and accordingly the thing follow not nor come to passe that is not the thing which the Lord hath spoken in that prophesie but it 's a false interpretation and he is a false Prophet that hath given the same of whom wee are taught to beware Matth. 7.15 from which imputation we shall now see how well he acquitteth himselfe First he telleth us that the defection and falling away under Antichrist was very generall and marvellous universall and this he proveth Rev. 13.8 16. to which also he might have added the 3.4 and 7. verses and unlesse the defection under

they may perish and be damned and therefore not in any wise to be esteemed the Church of Christ or Temple of the living God And this must needs be so from his owne ground seeing that by Antichrist here spoken of he understandeth the Beast mentioned Rev. 13. as apeareth by his applying this Scripture against Antichrist pag. 2. Now for as much as those that wonder after the Beast and worship him are said to be such whose names are not written in the Lambs Book of Life Rev. 13.8 he cannot therfore understand the same to be the Temple of God where Antichrist sitteth and is worshipped unlesse he conceive that the Church of Christ consisteth of such persons whose names are not written in the Booke of Life which I suppose hee doth not and therefore I conclude from his own grounds that the Temple spoken of in the 2 Thes. 2.4 is no more the Temple of God then Antichrist who sitteth therein and is worshipped is God himselfe nor is otherwise to be esteemed nor hath hee any reason more to affirme the one then he hath to affirme the other from hence therefore it cannot be made to appeare probable that the visible Church hath continued under the defection of Antichrist but it must stand as P. B. at first affirmed page 2. that under the defection of Antichrist it could not continue But suppose it were probable that the Church had continued under that defection then he saith pag. 3. that Baptisme by which the matter of the Church is differenced hath there likewise continued and there also it will be probable that his Baptisme derived from thence is the Baptisme of Iesus Christ Here we may take notice by way that the best ground he hath for his faith in this particular is but a probability well but seeing that he holdeth that baptisme dependeth upon the true Church then where no true Church is there can be no true Baptisme Now I need not here demand whether conceives the Church of Rome to be a true Church because in his Epistle to the Reader page 5. he desireth that none should thinke so of him for there he saith that he holds that state to be the mother of Fornications the great whore Sodome and Egypt c. therfore it must needs hence follow that the Church of Rome hath not Christs Baptisme for thus he reasoneth if the Church hath continued then Baptisme by which the matter of the Church is differenced hath continued page 3. But the Church of Rome hath not continued the Church of Christ but is become the mother of fornications Sodome and Egypt as he faith in his Epistle page 5. therefore the Baptisme of Christ by which the matter of the Church is differenced hath not continued in the Church of Rome whereas therefore page 5. hee desireth those which hold that the Church and Baptisme hath not continued under the defection of Antichrist would shew him the error and absurdity of such an opinion he may easily discover the error and absurdity hereof himselfe if he will but take notice of what hee hath herein written viz. That Baptisme differenceth the true matter of the Church from the false pag. 3.4 whence it will necessarily follow that if the baptisme of the Church of Rome be the Baptisme of Christ which differenceth the true matter of the Church from the false then Rome the false matter must thereby be differenced from it selfe and become a true Church as when at first shee received Christs Baptisme and then shall Rome be no longer Rome but a true Church and State differenced from a false by her baptisme which differenceth the true matter from the false and therefore for any to hold the church of Rome to be a false church as P. B. doth and withall to maintaine that she retaineth the Baptisme of Christ whereby the true matter of the Church is differenced from the false is as much as if a man should affirme even as he doth that Rome is the mother of fornications and also that Rome is the true Spouse of Iesus Christ which is both absurd and contradictory I will therefore conclude this point thus Seeing that true Baptisme differenceth the true matter of the Church from the false as P.B. saith and yet the baptisme of the church of Rome doth not difference her from the false matter as he also affirmeth in his Epistle page 5. therefore the baptisme of the church of Rome is not that Baptisme of Christ which differenceth the true matter from the false page 3.4 Secondly That Church which hath no other baptisme then the Baptisme of Rome which differenceth not the true matter from the false cannot thereby be differenced from the false church but P.B. and his church have no other baptisme then the baptisme of the church of Rome which differenceth not the true matter from the false therfore P. B. and his church are not yet differenced from the false Church Whether therefore Christ will owne the same for his Spouse or reject her as a Harlot sprung from the mother of Fornications and Harlos may very well be a question without Question But he saith page 6. If the visible Church hath not continued then Baptisme is ceased and being ceased without a speciall commission such as Iohn the Baptist had at first to baptize it can never be againe obtained To this I answer That although Baptisme were ceased as hee intends it viz. That there were no baptized persons in the world to be found yet so long as Baptisme the Ordinance of God is found in the word with a Commission serving to the end of the world for Believers or Disciples to make and baptise Disciples as Mat. 28.19.20 Baptisme may be againe obtained without any such speciall Commission as that which at first was given to Iohn the Baptist for it will not follow that because Iohn the Baptist might not baptise before baptisme was instituted he commanded to baptise that therefore Believers after baptisme is instituted and commanded to make and baptise Disciples may not lawfully baptise such as are made Disciples no more then it will follow that because Abraham might not circumcise himselfe and his Males before circumcision was instituted and he commanded so to doe that therefore the Israelites after circumcision was instituted and they commanded to observe the same might not without a speciall Commission such as Abraham had lawfully circumcise their Males It was necessary indeed that Iohn the Baptist should have a speciall commission to baptise Baptisme being not before instituted nor yet he nor any other person required to baptise as it was necessary to the first building of the Temple that a patterne should be given Chron. 28.11.12 but as then another patterne was not expected as necessary for the rebuilding therof at the peoples returne out of captivity who performed all things according to the first appointment and ordination Ezra 3. so neither is it requisite now baptisme being ceased that a new