Necessarie il shoulde comme in place Howe be it S. Paule saithe Let vs not doo il that good maie folowe For iuste is the damnation of them that so saie But S. Augustine standeth ful of your side S. Augustine hath written in the behoufe of the Stewes S. Augustine saithe Take Harlottes awaie from emonge menne and ye fil al the Countrie with ribaudrie and villanie In deede the very name of S. Augustine is great and Reuerende But what if S. Augustine when he wrote these woordes were not S. Augustine What if he wrote that Booke De Ordine beinge as yet a very yonge man but a Nouice in the Faithe not yet wel instructed not yet Baytized in the name of Christe him selfe as yet keepinge a Concubine and liuinge in whooredome Shal sutche a one so yonge and so youthful goe for a Saincte Or shal his bare name and vnseasoned fantasies stande you in steede to proue your Stewes Verily the same S. Augustine beinge afterwarde fully instructed and Christened saith thus Istam in vsu scortatorum terrena Ciuitas licitam fecit turpitudinem The worldly Citie not yâ— Church of God hath made this filthinesse of harlottes to be laweful And Ludouicus Viues writing vpon yâ— same saithe Satis apertè Augustinus â—estatur lure Ciuili veteri Romano multa esse permissa quae sint contraâ—ia Legibus Diuinis Hoc isti volunt qui dum Gentilitatem coniungere coaptare Christianismo laborant corrupto vtroque alterius impatiente nec Gentilitatem nec Christianismum retinent S. Augustine plainely witnesseth that by the olde Ciuile Romaine and Heathen Lawe many thinges were suffered whiche were contrarie to the Lawes of God This thinge wil not these menne allowe whoe while they studie as you M. Hardinge doo to ioine Heathennesse and Christianitie bothe togeather bothe beinge corrupted and the one not standinge with the other keepe nowe neither Heathennesse nor Christianitie Therefore wee maie mutche better exchange these woordes of Augustine spoken in his youthe before he had wel learned to speake and maâ—e mutche better saie thus Permitte Lupanaria implebis omnia libidinibus Suffer and allowe the Stewes and ye shal fil al the Countrie with Ribaudrie and Villanie And in this sense S. Bernarde saithe â–ª Tolle de Ecclesia honorabile Coniugium thorum immaculatum Nonne reples eam Concubinaâ—ijs incestuosis seminifluis mollibus masculoruÌ„ Concubitoribus omni denique genere immundorum Take once from the Churche honourable 〈◊〉 and the Bedde vndefiled and doeste thou not fil the same Churche ful of brothelles keepinge Concubines c. and with al soâ—tes of filthy personnes Further ye saie And wherefore is the Bishop of Rome more to be blamed for mainteinance of his Stewes then the Frenche Kinge or the Kinge of Spaine This is but a simple reason for a Doctour of Diuinitie It is an olde saieinge Nil iuuat exemplum quod litem lite resoluit Christe bade not his Apostles to be leadde by the example of worldly Princes If it be il in them it is mutche woorse in him that woulde be called the Vicare of Christe the Heade of the Churche and the Holy one of Israel An other parte of theire paunishemente is as you tel vs that they maie not ride sumptuousely in Coches or Charettes or dwel in the open faire stréetes and in the sight of the Cittie but are forced to goe a foote and to hide them selues in corners and in out houses and bylanes and that by your description in sutche simple and poore and beggerly sorte as if they were the vileste and ougleste of al the people and had not a good clowte to couer theire bodies Certainely M. Hardinge your Courteghianes if they vnderstoode hereof woulde thinke them selues litle beholden to sutche a Proctoure Doctoure Peter Martyr of whom I cannot speake without great reuerence hauinge good cause to knowe the state of Rome as fewe menne better hereof wrteth thus None O Deus bone quomodò Romae coercentur Meretrices Habent ornatissimas domos vehuntur per publicum habitu principum Sedent in equis gradarijs habent secum Torquatos Laruatos Comites interdum etiam Cardinales praesertim noctu ancillarum sumptuosissimum gregem Nowe a daies O good God howe are the Courteghianes pounished in Rome They dvvel in the fairest houses They are caried vvith honoure through the Cittie as if they vvere Ladies They are mounted on amblinge palfraies They are attended with chaines of golde and personnes disguised and sometimes Cardinalles and specially in the night season and haue a sumptuous sorte of Maides to waite vpon them If ye shal happen to doubte M. Martyrs reporte in this behalfe yet I truste ye wil geue somme credite to your owne Frendes the Cardinalles of the Churche of Rome Theire woordes hereof be these In hac etiam Vrbe Meretrices vt Matronae incedunt per Vrbem seu Mula vehuntur quas affectantur de media die Nobiles familiares Cardinalium Clericque Nulla in vrbe vidimus hanc corruptionem praeterquam in hac omnium exemplari Habitant etiam insignes aedes In this Cittie of Rome the Courteghianes passe through the streetes or ride on their Mules like honeste Matrones or Ladies and in the middest of the daie Noble menne the Cardinalles deere frendes and Priestes attend vpon them Wee neuer saw sutche corruption but onely in this Cittie whiche is the example and paterne of al others Moreouer they dwel in faire and notable houses This Information was presented vnto Pope Paule the thirde by certaine of his graueste Cardinalles appointed thereto by special Commission Nowe good Christian Reader I beseeche thée consider the Conformitie of these tales M. Hardinge saithe The Courteghianes of Rome goe onely a foote These Cardinalles saie They ride on Mules M. Hardinge saithe They haue a special apparel of dishonestie to be knowen by These Cardinalles saie They goe or ride as honeste Matrones or great Ladies or Noble wemenne M. Hardinge saithe They be despised and reuiled of the people These Cardinalles saie They haue Priestes Noble menne and the Cardinalles frendes to attende vpon them M. Hardinge saithe They dwel onely in out houses and backe lanes â–ª These Cardinalles saie Habitant insignes Aedes They dwel in faire and notable Houses So many Vntruthes it is no harde mater for M. Hardinge to vtter in so shorte a tale Nowe beinge so fine Dames and so richely attired it were great sclaunder to saie They serue onely for Vâ—rlettes or common rascalles If the reporte be true vpon Twelueth daie at night in the yere of our Lorde 1564. there were seene Seuentéene Coches of Courteghianes arriuing togeather euen into the Popes owne Palaice If any man shal thinke this reporte incredible yet Luitprandus of yâ— like hereof saith thus Lateranense Palatium Sanctorum quondam hospitium nunc est Prostibulum Meretricum The Popes Palaice at Laterane sommetime the harbour of Holy Sainctes
to Lawe in that behalfe made allowed neither by Parlament nor by Proclamation nor agreed vpon by the Cleregie in Publike and lawful Synode This packinge becommeth you it becommeth not the vpright Professours of the Truthe Wherefore your vnlawful Booke as it is so it maye be called an Inuectiue or rather a Famous Libel and sclaunderous VVrite as that whiche seemeth to haue benne made in a corner and cast abroade in the streetes the Authours whereof the Ciuil Lawe punis heth sharpely The B. of Sarisburie Howe far foorth these examples maye serue vs wée remit the iudgement thereof to the discrete Christian Reader It is not yenough thus to crie out Impieties and Heresies M. Hardinges bare Woorde in this behalfe is not sufficient to warrant an euidence Certainely emonge other greate comfortes that wee haue in Goddes mercies this is one and not the leaste that touchinge the Innocencie and right of out cause wée maye saye to you as Christe saide to the Phariseis Wee haue not the Diuel but wee glorifie our Father Or as S. Paule saide vnto Festus Wee are not madde M. Hardinge as ye reporte of vs but wee viter vnto you the Woordes of Truthe and sobrietie But this is a piteous faulte The names of al the Bishoppes Deanes Acchedeacons Personnes Vicares and Curates of England are not sette to our Apologie It is directed neither to the Emperour nor to the Pope nor to the Councel Neither is it Printed with Priuilege of the Prince This laste clause is a manifest Vntruthe and maye easily be reproued by the Printer Hereof ye conclude It is a sclaunderous Libel and was written vnder a Hedge and as you saye in Hucker Mucker Firste were it graunted that al ye saye of Hilarie Melito Iustinus Tertullian and Apollonius were true Yet muste it néedes folowe that al Bookes that are not Subscribed with the Authours names were written in a corner Firste to beginne with the Scriptures tel vs M. Hardinge who wrote the Bookes of Genesis of Exodus of Leuiticus of Numeri of DeuteronomiuÌ„ of Ioâ—ue of the Iudges of the Kinges of the Chronicles of Iob c. Who inrote these Bookes I saye Who authorized them Who Subscribed his name Who set to his Sâ—ale The Booke of Wisedome by some is Fathered vpon Philo by some vpoÌ„ Salomon The Epistle vnto the Hebrewes some saye was written by S. Paule Some by Clemens Some by Barnabas Some by some other so are wee vncertaine of the Authours name S. Marke S. Luke S. Iohn neuer once named them selues in their Gospels The Apostles Crede the Canons of the Apostles by what names are they Subscribed Howe are they authorized To what Pope to what Emperour were they offered To leaue others the Auncient Doctours of the Churche whiche as you knowe are often misnamed Ambrose for Augustine Gréeke for Latine Newe for Olde your Doctour of Doctours the fairest flower and croppe of your garlande Gratianus is so wel knowen by his name that wise menne can not wel tel What name to geue him Erasmus saithe of him thus Quisquis fuit siue Gratianus siue Crassianus What so euer name wee may geue him be it Gratianus or Crassianus And againe he saithe Eruditi negant illam Gratiani nescio cuius congeriem vlla vnquam Publica Ecclesiae authoritate fuisse comprobatam The learned saye that Gratians Collection or heape of maters was neuer allowed by any Publique Authoritie of the Churche And againe Non constat vllis argumentis quis fuerit Gratianus quo tempore opus suum exhibuerit cuius Pontificis cuius Concilij fuerit Authoritate comprobatum It cannot appeare by any tokens of recorde neither what this Gratian was nor at what time he offered vp his Booke nor what Councel nor what Pope allowed it Who subscribed the late Councel of Colaine Who subscribed the Booke not longe sithence sette abroade vnder the name of the Churche of Colaine and named Antididagma To be shorte who subscribed your owne late Booke intituled the Apologie of Priuate Masse Where were they written Where were they Subscribed By what authoritie and vnder what names were they allowed I wil saye nothinge of your late Famouse Volume bearinge the name of Marcus Antonius Constantius This Booke as you see hathe three greate names Notwithstandinge the Authour him selfe had but twoo and yet not one of al these three What M. Hardinge would you make your Brethren beleue that al these be but sclaunderous Writes diuised onely in Hucker Mucker and vnder a Hedge The Decree the Apostles made in the fiftenthe Chapter of the Actes it appeareth not it was so curiously subscribed with al theire names The Protestation of the Bohemiens in the Councel of Basile the Confession of the Churches of Geneua Heluetia for ought that I knowe haue no sutche Publique Subscriptions Neither is it necessarie nor commonly vsed to ioyne Priuate mennes names to Publique maters neither in so mightie ample a Realme vpon al incident occasions is it so easy to be donne Briefely our Apologie is coÌ„firmed by as many names as the highe Courte of Parlamente of England is confirmed Neither was the same conceiued in so darke a corner as M. Hardinge imagineth For it was afterwarde imprinted in Latine at Parise and hathe henne fithence Translated into the Frenche the Italian the Duche and the Spanishe tongues and hathe benne sente and borne abroade into France Flaunders Germanie Spaine Poole Hungarie Denmarke Sueucland Scotland Italie Naples and Rome it selfe to the iudgemente and trial of the whole Churche of God Yea it was Readde and sharply considered in your late Couente at Trident greate threates made there that it should be answeared and the mater by twoo Notable learned Bishoppes taken in hande the one a Spaniarde the other an Italian Which twoo notwithstandinge these fiue whole yéeres haue yet donne nothinge nor I belèeue intende any thinge to doo In deede certaine of your Brethren haue benne often gnawinge at it but sutche as care nothinge nor is cared what they write But if names be so necessarie wee haue the names of the whole Cleregie of Englande to confirme the Faithe of our Doctrine and your name M. Hardinge as you can wel remember emongst the reste onlesse as ye haue already denied your Faithe so ye wil nowe also denie your name To conclude it is greatter modestie to publishe our owne Booke without Name then as you doo to publishe other mennes Bookes in your owne Names For in deede M. Hardinge the Bookes ye lende so thicke ouer are not yours Ye are but Translatours ye are no Authours Yf euery birde shoulde fetche againe his owne Feathers alas your poore Chickens woulde die for colde But you saye Wee offered not our Booke to the Pope No neither ought wée so to doo He is not our Bishop He is not our Iudge Wee maye saye vnto him as the Emperour Constantius saide sometime to Pope Liberius Quoia es tu paâ—s Orbis
it is a Bastarde Epistle and not written by S. Iames. Likewise S. Hierome saithe Epistola Iacobi ab alio quopiam sub eius nomine edita asseritur It is saide that the Epistle of S. Iames was set foorthe by somme other man vnder his name This therefore is no Newe fantasie but the Iudgemente of the Ancient Learned Fathers Neuerthelesse wee doo bothe receiue the same Epistle and also reade it in Oure Churches and allowe euery Clause and Sentence that therein is written M. Hardinge saithe If yee haue this Lighte of the Scriptures before your eies howe is it that yee agree no better emongest your selues And here he reckeneth vp by rote a many of names of his owne makinge Lutherans Zuinglians Arians Osiandrians Libertines Adiaphoristes Anabaptistes Caluinistes and Sathanistes In whiche his so pleasante fansie he maie haue leaue to sporte him selfe while he listeth God be thanked wée agrée thorowly togeather in the whole Substance of the Religion of Christe and altogeather with one harte and one Sprite doo glorifie God the Father of our Lorde Iesus Christe Certainely S. Augustine S. Hierome S. Chrysostome Epiphanius and Theophilus as it appeareth by theire writinges agreed no better togeather in theire time then wee doo nowe Yet had they and euery of them the Woorde of God and the same Woorde of God was a Light vnto their feete It was not for any greate stoare of better mater I trowe that M. Hardinge thus chargeth vs with so often changinge the Communion Booke For of more then of one Onely Change he cannot tel vs. And if there had benne lesse then that there had benne no change at al. And yet for that One change he him selfe in the meane season hath changed thrise But the Holy Communion Booke and the Order of the Holy Ministration standeth and by Goddes Mercie shal stand stil without any further Change How be it Gentle Reader if thou wilt knowe the often Alterations and Changes of the Masse reade I beseche thée Platyna and Polydore Vergil touchinge the same There shalte thou finde howe and by whome and vpon what occasion and in what processe of time al the partes of the Masse were peeced and sette togeather and that in the space of seuen hundred whole yéeres scarcely and with mutche adoo it was made vp at laste and brought to somme perfection Christes Commaundement of Hearinge the Churche is answeared before S. Augustine saithe Credimus Sanctam Ecclesiam non Credimus in Sanctam Ecclesiam VVee beleeue that there is a Holy Churche But wee Beleue not in the Holy Churche For the Churche is not God nor is hable of her selfe to make or alter any one Article of the Faithe The Prophete Esay saithe Ad Legem potiùs ad Testimonium Si non responderint secundum Verbum hoc non erit illis Lux Matutina To the Lawe rather and to the Testimonie If they answeare not accordinge to this VVoorde they shal haue no Morninge Light M. Hardinge saithe further If quietnesse of Conscience comme of the VVoorde of God onely then had Abel no more quietnesse of Conscience then wicked restlesse Cain Then should Paule the Eremite and Antonie and Hilarion and Pambus and other Holy menne liuinge in Wildernesse without Letters haue had no reste ne quiet at theire hartes And why so Bicause they had no Woorde written Who woulde thinke that M. Hardinge bearinge sutche a countenance of Diuinitie woulde thus goe aboute to deceiue him selfe with a pointe of Sophistrie Chrysostome saithe Deus Conditor Humani Generis ab initio per seipsum homibus loquebatur God the Creatour of Mankinde froÌ„ the beginninge spake vnto menne by him selfe in his owne personne And S. Paule saithe Deus olim multifarià m multisquemodis Patribê° locutus est In Old times God spake many vvaies and in sundrie sortes vnto the Fathers And doothe M. Hardinge thinke when God him selfe in his owne personne and presently spake vnto Abel that Abel bearde not then the Woorde of God Wée speake not so precisely and nicely of Goddes Woorde written in Paper For so it is a Creature Corruptible and shal consume and perishe as other Corruptible Creatures doo But the VVoorde of God whiche wée speake of endureth for euer S. Hierome saithe Quomodò Aeternae erunt Scripturae Diuinae si Mundus certo fine est terminandus Verum est quidem quòd Librorum pelliculae cum ipsis Literis abolendae sunt Sed quia subiungit DnÌ„s Verba verò mea non praeteribunt proculdubio quod illis apicibus pollicetur erit Aeternum Howe shal the Holy Scriptures he Euerlastinge seeinge the Worlde shal haue on ende True it is that the parchement or leaues of the Bookes with the letters and al shal be abolished But for as mutche as our Lorde addeth My Woordes shal neuer passe doubtelesse though the Papers and Letters perishe yet the thinge that is promised by the same letters shal laste for euer So Chrysostome saithe Paulus Praedicationem non Scripâ—am appellat Euangelium Preachinge not vvritten Paule calleth the Gospel That M. Hardinge addeth of Antonius and Paulus Hilarion other Eremites that they liued in Wildernesse vvithout Letters and therefore presumeth they liued vvithout the VVoorde of God it is very vnaduisedly spoken and vtterly vntrue For proufe whereof to name onely One in stéede of the reste S. Augustine saithe that Antonius the Eremite was notably Learned and perfite in the Scriptures His woordes be these Antonius sine vlla scientia Literarum Scripturas Diuinas memoriter audiendo tenuisse prudenter cogitando intellexisse praedicatur It is reported that Antonius without knowledge of Letter bothe Learned the Holy Scriptures and bare them vvel in minde by hearinge and also by Wisedome and studie vnderstoode them And whereas M. Hardinge woulde séeme to make sutche an accoumpte of Praier and Holinesse without knowledge S. Augustine saithe Lectio sine Meditatione arida est Meditatio sine Lectione erronea est Oratio sine Meditatione tepida est Readinge without Meditation or studie is drie and barren Meditation or studie vvithout Readinge is erroneous And Praier without Cogitation or studie is halfe colde and vnfruiteful Thus wée sée by S. Augustines Iudgement that the Force and Substance bothe of Praier and of Meditation dependeth of Readinge How be it what Comforte and peace of Conscience wée haue by Hearinge the Woorde of God S. Paule can tel vs somewhat better then M. Hardinge Thus he saithe Quaecunque Scripta sunt c. What so euer thinges are written they are written for our learninge that by Patience and Comforte of the Scriptures we maye haue hope Euen so saithe Christe him selfe O Father this is the Euerlastinge Life that they maye know thee the onely and very God and Iesus Christe whome thou haste sente But S. Paule saithe Keepe the Traditions whiche ye haue receiued either by Epistle or by VVoorde And S.
your Late Chapter of Tridente saith Apparet quòd pro peccatis sub Nouo Testamento post acceptam Salutaris Hostiae in Baptismo efficaciam commissis non habemus pro Peccato Hostiam illam quam Christus obtulit pro Peccato Mundi pro delictis Baptismum Praecedentibus Non enim nisi semel ille Mortuus est Et ideò semel duntaxat hostia illa ad hunc effectum applicatur It appeareth that for the Sinnes committed vnder the Newe Testamente after that wee haue receiued in Baptisme the Power of the Healthful Sacrifice vvee haue nomore that sacrifice for Sinne vvhiche Christe once offered for the Sinne of the VVorlde and for sinnes committed before Baptisme For Christe neuer died but once And therefore that Sacrifice of Christe Crucified is applied vnto vs once onely to this effecte Hereby M. Hardinge ye maie sée that this Doctrine lacketh no defence emongest your Catholiques The summe and meaninge hereof is this That our Sinnes committed after Baptisme are not foregéeuen by the Death of Christe but Onely by the Sacrifice of the Masse Whiche thinge what it séemeth to you I cannot tel But vnto al Godly eares it seemeth an horrible greate blasphemie Here to speake of Praiers specially in so large a sorte it was far impertinente to your pourpose as beinge vtterly no parte of this question The Merites of Christes Deathe whereof wée entreate are conueied vnto vs by God and receiued by vs. God conueieth them to vs onely of his Mercie and wée receiue them Onely by Faithe But the waies whereby either to procure Goddes Mercie or to enkendle our Faithe are many and sundrie Goddes Mercie is procured sommetime by Praier sommetime by other Meanes But to bréede or encrease Faith in vs there are moe waies then can be reckened Somme menne are moued Onely by the Hearinge of Goddes Woorde Somme others by the beholdinge and weighinge of Goddes Miracles Iustinus the Martyr was firste alluered to the Faithe by the crueltie of the Tyrannes and by the Constancie and Patience of Goddes Sainctes S. Cyprian saith Tanta est vis Martyrij vt per illam credere etiam cogatur qui te vult occidere So greate is the Power of Martyrdome that thereby euen he is forced to beleeue that woulde kille thee S. Augustine saithe He was sturred vp to comme to Christe by readinge a Heathen Booke written by Cicero called Hortensius Thus he saithe Ille Liber mutauit affectum meum ad â—eipsum Domine mutauit Preces meas That Heathen Booke changed my minde and turned my praiers ô Lorde vnto thee Emonge other causes the Sacramentes serue specially to directe and to aide our Faithe For they are as S. Augustine calleth them Verba visibilia Visible VVoordes and Scales and Testimonies of the Gospel All this notwithstandinge wee saie It is neither the Woorke of the Prieste nor the Nature of the Sacramente as of it selfe that maketh vs partetakers of Christes Deathe but onely the Faithe of the Receiuer S. Augustine saithe Vnde est ista tanta Virtus Aquae vt Corpus tangat Cor abluat nisi faciente Verbo Non quia dicitur sed quia creditur From whence hathe the Water this greate power that it toucheth the Body and wassheth the Harte sauinge by the VVoorkinge of the VVoorde Not for that it is pronounced but for that it is beleeued So saithe Hesychius Gratia Dei comprehenditur Sola Fide The Grace of God of our parte is receiued by Onely Faithe So saithe Cyrillus Siclus Fidei nostrae Formam habet Si enim Fidem obtuleris taÌ„quam Pretium à Christo velut Ariete immaculato in hostiam dato accipies Remissionem Peccatorum The Sicle hath the Fourme of our Faithe For if thou offer vp thy Faithe as the Price thou shalt receiue Remission of thy Sinnes from Christe that vnspotted Ramme that was geeuen for a Sacrifice Where ye saie ye offer vp Christe the Sonne of Godde Really and Substantially vnto God the Father If ye speake in your dreame it is a very pleasante phantasie but if ye be awake and knowe what ye saie then is it a greate blasphemie as in my Former Replie it maie appeare more at large The Apologie Cap. 16. Diuision 1. And as for theire bragges they are woonte to make of theire Purgatorie though we know it is not a thing so very late risen emoÌ„gest them yet is it no better then a blockishe and an olde Wiues deuise M. Hardinge Purgatorie semeth not to vs a thinge that wee shoulde mutche bragge of no more then yeâ— wil bragge of Hel. VVe tremble at the remembrance of it rather then bragge of it VVel howe so euer it be wil ye nil ye we see ye be driuen to confesse the same to be no newe thinge In deede if you cal them Papistes among whom the Doctrine of praieing for the deade whereof necessarely foloweth the Doctrine of Purgatorie is deliuered taught and holden then are the Apostles who deliuered it by Tradition as Chrysostome and Damascene reporte Papistes Firste forasmutche as nothing that is defiled commeth into the Kingdome of Heauen and some departe out of this Life though in the Faithe of Christe and Children of the Euerlastinge Kingdome yet not throughly and perfitly cleane it remaineth that sutche after this Life before they come to the place of Euerlastinge ioye haue theire Purgation Furthermore the Apostle saithe Seeinge then we haue these promises derely beloued let vs cleanse our selues from al filthines of the Fleashe and Spirite makinge perfite our satisfaction in the feare of God VVho seeth not hereof to folowe that to many whiche be iustified somewhat of satisfaction and Holynes lacketh VVhiche if they be taken from hence before they atteine to the measure of Holynes requisite be they not then after this Life in state to be purged and cleansed The B. of Sarisburie Here are wée comme to the Paper VValles and Painted Fieres of Purgatorie For so it liked M. Harding not longe sithence pleasantly to sport at it in the Pulpites as a bugge méete onely to fraie Children Yet now vpon better aduise and déeper studie he tremblethe God wote and quaketh for feare to remember the tormentes that somme body hath sithence tolde him to be there Howe be it Let him not so mutche dismaie him selfe The Pope as he either firste made it or receiued it by hande from the Heathens and firste allowed it euen so hathe he the whole Iurisdiction and Power ouer it and commaundeth in and out at his pleasure Whether ye make bragges hereof or no I leaue it in question Certainely for this and other like causes One of your felowes saithe Papa potest quicquid Deus ipse potest The Pope can doo vvhat so euer God him selfe can doo An other saith Animae existentes in Purgatorio sunt de Iurisdictione Papae Papa si vellet posset totum
hauinge that Auctoritie ouer you whiche Festus had ouer S. Paule To Augustine ye referre this mater and by Augustine shall ye be iudged I woulde alleage vnto you sundrie places of the Scriptures whiche maie Sufficiently proue Purgatorie to a Christen man that is not contentious but that wil we doo hereafter as occasion serueth Nowe to Saincte Augustine VVe saie plainely that S. Augustine affirmeth Purgatorie and that it cannot be shewed where he doubteth of it mutche lesse where he vtterly denyeth any sutche to be In sundry places of his woorkes he expoundeth the woordes of S. Paule to the Corinthians of Purgatorie where the Apostle saithe that the woorkes whiche be builded vpon the fundation whiche is Christe shal be tried by Fire In the 21. Booke de Ciuitate Dei after that he hathe declared his iudgemente touchinge paines of diuerse sortes whiche men suffer for Sinnes committed he saithe thus But paines temporal some suffer in this life onely some after theire Death some both now and also then yet before that moste seuere and laste iudgemente May it therefore please you Syrs to reade S. Augustine in some sutche places for to reade al that he hathe written to that ende were very mutche and a greate lette to your domestical cares and I thinke verily ye wil secretly agree in iudgemente with vs thoughe for shame and consideration of the stage ye plaie your parte on openly the same ye wil not confesse And therefore in his booke de Haeresibus ad Quoduultdeum he condemneth Aërius of Haeresie and so consequently al others that be of his opinion because to the Heresies of the Arians he had added this also that none ought to praie or make oblation for the deade VVhere ye make S. Augustine very vncertaine in this pointe as though he saide sommetime there is sutche a certain place sometime there maie be sutche a one sometime he doubted of it sometime plainely denied any sutche to be either ye vnderstande not S. Augustine or ye saie contrary to your owne knowledge Verily ye be too bolde with him Firste that he denieth Purgatory that is false And where ye alleage Hypognostica in the margent of your booke reade it once againe at my request and your selues wil saie the place proueth not your purpose The Author of that woorke whether he were S. Augustine whiche Erasmus beleueth not or who so euer he was denieth not Purgatory but that after the daie of general iudgemente there is any place of Euerlastinge rest or paine but the Kingdome of Heauen and Hel that he denieth VVhiche we also denie And there he speaketh againste the Pelagians who as S. Augustine writeth of them ad Quoduultdeum promised to infantes dyinge without Baptisme a certaine euerlastinge and blessed life without and besides the Kingedome of God VVhiche Heresie in sundry places he reproueth It seemeth the woorde Purgatorium noted in the margent of that booke by thunlearned Printer begiled you VVhiche sheweth howe profoundely ye be seene in the Doctores The thinge he doubted of touchinge this matter is this VVhether those temporal paines do onely punishe for the Satisfaction of the Iustice of God or also do purge and correcte the soules of the deade in sutche wise as temporal paines are wont to do in this life But nowe whether the smarte and sorowe of thinges lefte behinde whiche proceded in this life of Carnal affection remaine also to the soules after theire departure from the Body whereof S. Augustine sheweth him selfe to stande in doubte in Enchiridio ad Laurent cap. 68. 69. and whether the fyre whiche soules feele in Purgatory as it paineth them so also do by degrees diminishe and correcte those venial and Secular affections whiche they carried with them at theire Deathe or whether deathe it selfe do so ende them as there remaine not any correction of the minde yet beinge vicious but onely the punishemente of the sinne paste that is the thinge whereof S. Augustine semeth to haue doubted In effecte his question is whether the Fire of Purgatorie be not double The one whiche punisheth the Venial sinne past the other whiche diminisheth and taketh awaie thaffection of sinne yet remaininge Of the firste he doubteth not of the other he saith non redargno quia forsitan verum est I saye not againste it for per aduenture it is true The B. of Sarisburie Wée raite at you M. Hardinge euen as Christe railed at certaine others in whoe 's steppes ye séeme to treade for that they had made of the House of God a Caue of theeues The places of the Scriptures whiche ye thought it beste to passe ouer and whereby your Purgatorie by your iudgemente vndoubtedly maie be proued if a man be not very contentious I trowe be these Verily Verily I saie vnto you he that heareth my Woorde and beleeueth in him that sente me hath Euerlastinge Life and shal not comme into damnation but hathe passed from Deathe vnto Life Or that Esai the Prophete saithe of Christe He was wounded for our transgressions He was broken for our iniquities The chastisemente of our Peace was vpon him and with his stripes wee were made whole Or that S. Paule saith Christe hath taken the Obligation that was againste vs and hathe fastened it vnto his Crosse Or that S. Iohn saith Blessed be the Deade that die in the Lorde Euen so saithe the Sprite For they reste from theire laboures and theire Woorkes folowe them He saithe not they be in Purgatorie but they reste from theire Laboures And againe They shal hunger nomore They shal thirste nomore For the Lambe whiche is in the middes of the throne shal gouerne them and shal leade them not into Purgatorie but vnto the liuely Fountaines of VVaters and God shal wipe a waie al teares from theire eies These or sutche other like Places I trowe they be whereby ye assure your selfe so certainely of your Purgatorie But vnto S. Augustine wée haue appealed and to S. Augustine ye saie wée shal goe Howe be it if ye consider the mater wel ye shal finde that our appeale liethe not vnto S. Augustine It had benne more indiâ—ferente dealinge to haue saide with S. Bernarde Ad Euangelium appellasti ad Euangelium ibis Ye haue appealed vnto the Gospel and vnto the Gospel ye shal goe As for S. Augustine notwithstandinge his Authoritie be greate and his learninge deepe yet in these cases as it shal wel appeare he can be but a doubteful Iudge And a doubteful Iudge so far foorthe as he doubteth is no Iudge Your owne Canon telleth you In erroris Labyrinthum nonnulli intricando impingunt cùm ante iudicant quà m intelligant Many menne geuinge Iudgemente before they can vnderstande by entanglinge them selues fal into a Maze of errour For howe can he pronounce sentence of that he confesseth he knoweth not Or how can he assure vs that
your side bothe sworne to the Pope bothe presente at your late Chapter at Tridente Yet thus doothe the one of them gréete the other Tu permanes in sensu damnato per Synodum Thou remainest stil in a sense condemned by the Councel Catharinus condemneth Cardinal Caietan for twoo hundred sundrie errours somme of them he calleth vvicked and Antichristian These Termes must néedes be very Metaphysical M. Hardinge that can yelde you sutche Heretical Antichristian errours The Apologie Cap. 6. Diuision 1. They were beste therfore to goe and sette peace at home rather amonge them selues Of a truthe Vnitie and Concorde doothe best becomme Religion Yet is not Vnitie the sure certaine marke whereby to know the Churche of God For there was the greatest Vnitie that might bee amongest them that woorshipped the Golden Calfe and amonge them whiche with one voice iointly cried against our Saueour Iesus Christe Crucifie him Neither bicause the Corinthians were vnquieted with priuate dissensions or bicause Paule did square with Peter or Barnabas with Paule or bicause the Christians vpon the very beginninge of the Gospel were at mutual discorde touchinge some one mater may wee therefore thinke there was no Churche of God amongest them And as for those personnes whome they vpon spite cal Zuinglians Lutherans in very deede they of bothe sides be Christians good Frendes Brethren They varie not bitwixte them selues vpon the Principles Fundations of oure Religion nor as touchinge God or Christe or the Holy Ghoste or the meanes of Iustification or of euerlastinge life but vpon one onely question whiche is neither weighty nor greate neither mistruste wee or make doubte at al but they wil shortely be agreed And if there bee any of them whiche haue other opinion than is meete we doubte not but ere it bee longe they wil put aparte al affections and names of parties that God wil reuele the truthe vnto them so that by better consideringe and searchinge out of the matter as once it came to passe in the Councel of Chalcedon al causes and seedes of dissension shal bee throughly plucte vp by the roote and be buried and quite foregotten for euer Whiche God graunte M. Hardinge These Defenders be like in conditions to suche honest women as commonly we call Scoldes Because vnitie pleaseth you not as beinge that through lacke whereof your newe Churche is of al good men detested and of the meanest very muche suspected ye saie it is not a sure and a certaine marke whereby to know the Churche of God Yeas Maisters amonge other notes and markes of the true Churche Vnitie is one Not euery Vnitie but Vnitie in the Holy Ghost whiche geueth life to that one Body the Churche whereof euery faithful is a member and Christe the Head and powring Charitie abroade in our Hartes so linketh al right beleeuers togeather in the bonde of peace as they al saie one thing thinke one thing sauer one thing The Vnitie that â—s the note and marke of the true Church whereof wee speake is that for whiche the Churche is called one â–ª and beinge gathered and knitte togeather professeth Vnitie of Faithe of good wil and mutual love togeather and of Sacramentes The Vnitie of them who worshipped the Golden Calfe and with one consent againste our Sauiour cried Crucifige was farre distant from the Vnitie whiche is a note of the Churche and is the woorke of the Holy Ghost Suche is the Vnitie of the Deuils who conspire against Christ and al his with one consente Such Vnitie is oftentimes in Theeues such Vnitie is founde in you and all your sectes For be ye neuer so diuerse and at variaunce within your selues yet ye ioâ—ne togeather in wicked amitie and Vnitie against the Church of Christ And therefore S. Augustine compareth you and all such as ye be to Samsons foxeâ— that were sundred by the heads and tied togeather by the tayles Neither saie we that amonge them who vary in small pointes and thinges not perteininge to the groundes of Faithe there is no Churche For all that certaine of the Corinthians in the Primitiue Churche were at square howe so euer Paule tolde Peter that he thought good though Barnabas and Paule agreed not about Iohn Marke yet were they of Christes Churche what els But where ye bringe this for excuse of the Luthâ—rans and the zwinglians and other sectes spronge out of them the cause is not like pardye For saie on what ye liste and lie so longe as ye liste their dissensions can not be dessembled muche lesse can they be accorded c. Yet lest they whose fortune is not to see ought thereof written els where should mistrust my reporte as all do espie your lyinge the woordes of Nicolaus Gallus your owne Doctor of Luthers scoole here I will rehearse Non sunt leues inter nos concertationes de rebus leuibus sed de sublimibus doctrinae Christianae articulis de lege euangelio de iustificatione bonis operibus de Sacramentis c. The strifes sateth he that be amongest vs be not light nor of light matters but of the highe Articles of Christian â—octrine namely of the lawe and of the Gospel of iustification and of good woorkes of the Sacramentes c. Here as ye see he rekeneth vp a greate many of the weightiest pointes of our Religion whereof they dâ—ssent amonge themselues But I doubte what I maye call weighty and great seinge these good felowes call the controuersie whiche is betwixte the Lutherans and the zwinglians concerninge the Body of our Saucour Christe neither weighty nor greate But as they make a foule lie therein so do they also in sayinge they vary not betwixte them selues but vpon one onely question Of the dissension that is betweene the Lutherans and Zwinglians thus pittifully complaineth Nicolaus Amsdorffius in his Booke entituled Publica confessio purae Doctrinae him selfe beinge an earnest Lutheran The worlde goeth with vs worse and worse dayly All thinges doo prognosticase the vtter ruine of the Gospell and that in place of the Gospell we shall haue nothinge but mere errours and the same very notable Then after a fewe woordes nowe Brenttus saithe he and the Adiaphoristes they be a speciall secte of the Lutherans beinge at the Communication or conference at VVormes would not condemne zwinglius and Osiander because they were â—rimme men in the tongues and well seene in Humanitie And as for vs and our side because we refused to agree vnto that communication onlesse they were condemned they dressed vs vily with theire scoffes and railinges thrust vs out of the communication and compelled vs to goe awaie c. Item after a fewe There be that saie they condemne zuinglianisme but the preface of Brentius to Maister Iames the minister of Goppingen his booke witnesseth farre otherwise For there they goe about a Gods name to conciliat good father Luther and Zuinglius and make them friendes one with an other Quod
Pope Bonifacius and that Kinge that if he did not onely excommunicate him but also offered gifte of his Kingedome to Albert the Emperour as Platina your Authour herein writeth he maie seeme therein to haue done not altogeather so euill as ye pretende For as bothe AEmilius and Platine doo witnesse the cause of their fallinge out was that whereas the Pope being first sued vnto by Cassanus a Christian Prince and a greate Conquerour in the Easte to ioine with him for the recouery of the Holy lande sente the Bishop of Apamea to the Frenche Kinge for his necessary aide in that so common a quarell of al Christendome he beinge offended either that the sute was not firste made to him either for that the saide Bishop had done his Ambassade with she we of more Auctoritie then the Kinge thought it became him or vpon some other priuate grudge did not onely vtterly refuse to sende any healpe towarde the voiage but also contemptuously beside common order and cruelly committed the Popes Legate to Prison and there kepte him vntill suche time as through the Popes interdict the Kinge was compelled to set him at libertie Nowe of geuinge awaie his Kingedome this chiefe Frenche Historiographer maketh no mention And if the Pope so did why maie he not seme to haue done it rather to feare him and to reclaime his minde from disobedience Verely Platina writinge it declareth howe before the Pope proceded to that extremitie the Frenche Kinge did what in him laie to withdrawe the people of Fraunce from the obedience of the Churche and See Apostolike The B. of Sarisburie Here M. Hardinge ye stammer in your tale and knowe not wel what to saie If the Pope gaue awaie the Kingedome of France from the Prince he did it ye saie to the intent to feare him A prety diuise to fraie a Kinge to pulle the Crowne Emperial from his heade Firste this Pope Bonifacius is he of whom it was saide Intrauit vt Vulpes Regnauit vt Lupus Mortuus est vt Canis He entred into the Popedome as a Foxe He reigned as a Woulfe he died in prison as a Dogge In Solemne Procession he wente attired with the Crovvne Emperial and Robe of Maiestie as an Emperoure and commaunded the Naked svverde to be borne before him In the Storie of his Life ioined with his owne Booke named Sextus Bonifacij 8. it is written thus Moritur hoc modo Bonifacius qui Imperatoribus Regibus Principibus Nationibus Populis terrorem potiùs quà m Religionem inijcere conabatur Thus died Pope Bonifacius a man that sought more to strike terroure into Emperours Kinges Princes People and Nations then true Religion This Bonifacius saithe Sabellicus sente to the Frenche Kinge for monie as he pretended towardes the recouerie of Hierusalem The Bishop of Apamea beinge his Legate in that behalfe vttered certaine greate woordes in the presence of the Kinge and threatened him onlesse he woulde graunte it The Kinge not quietly bearinge sutche presumptuous boldenesse commaunded the Apostolique Legate vnto warde This iniurie so inflamed the Popes choler that immediately he sente the Archebishop of Narbon to the Kinge to require him to set his Legate at libertie otherwise to tel him that for his wickednesse the righte of his Kingedome was fallen to the Churche of Rome Thus Sabellicus in fauoure of the Pope thought it good somewhat to shadowe the mater But others thereof haue written thus Bonifacius 8. mandat Regi se esse Dominum in Spiritualibus temporalibus in vniuerso Mundo Vtque Rex recognoscat Regnum Franciae à se Contrarium enim sentire tenere Haereticum esse Bonifacius 8. sente vnto the Frenche Kinge and tolde him that he was Lorde bothe in Spiritual and also in Temporal maters throughout the worlde and therefore that the Kinge shoulde holde his Kingedome at his hande For otherwise to thinke and holde he saide it was Heresie This is it that in the name of the Pope is noted in your Glose Quicunque praeceptis nostris non obedierit peccatum Idololatriae Paganitatis incurrit Who so euer obeieth not our commaundementes falleth into the Sinne of Idolatrie and Infidelitie Hereof Vrspergensis writeth thus Habes Roma quod sitisti decanta Canticum quia per malitiam non per Religionem orbem vicisti O Rome thou haste nowe that thou haste so longe thirsted after Nowe singe menly For by thy malice not by Religion thou haste conquered the worlde The Kinge beinge moued herewith commaunded that none of his Cleregie shoulde comme to the Popes Councel He openly burnte the Popes vvrites He commaunded the Popes Legate to departe out of his Realme He forebade that any monie shoulde be made thence to the Pope He gaue out Proclamations that none of his Subiectes shoulde goe to Rome And in the Synode at Parise he charged the Pope with Pride Ambition Murder Simonie and Heresie Thus mutche of the dealinge of the Crowne of France vnto a stranger that is to saie of the Faithe and Reuerence that the Pope beareth to Kinges and Princes Here folowed sommewhat of the spoilinge of the Duke of Sauoie and of the alteringe of the state of Florence whiche thinges I thought it beste to passe ouer as not woorthy of any Answeare The Apologie Cap. 5. Diuision 4. Wee are accloied with Examples in this behalfe and it should be very tedious to reckē vp al the notorious practises of the Bishoppes of Rome But of whiche side were they I beseche you that poisoned Henrie the Emperoure euen in the receiuinge of the Sacramente Whiche poisoned Victor the Pope euen in the receiuinge of the Chalice Whiche poisoned our Kinge Iohn Kinge of England in a Drinkinge Cuppe Whoe so euer at least they were and of what secte so euer I am sure they were neither Lutherans nor Zvvinglians M. Hardinge The Findes of Hell were not yet let loose that begate Lutherans Zwinglians and Caluinistes And hereof we vnderstande the youthe of your Churche whiche hauinge diuided it selfe from the olde and Catholike Churche is no other but the malignante Churche and Synagoge of Satan To answeare your demaundes VVho so euer they were that poisoned these greate personages if they were poisoned at all good men were they not neither the doers nor the counsailours Henry of Luxenburg it was who was poisoned by reporte VVhome your Latine Booke printed amonge the Huguenots calleth Henry the seuenth M. Doctor Haddon in his answeare to Osorius accompteth him the fourthe in bothe your Englishe translations that I haue seene he is called onely Henry As he laide siege to the Citie of Florence and had now brought the Citizens to despaire of their safetie when manly courage might not serue they betooke them to cowardly malice Firste they poysoned as it is saide the minde of a frier Dominican with Golde that afterwarde he shoulde aduentere to poison the Emperours body with Venime Paulus Aemilius saith that
S. Paule allegeth the Authorities of the Heathen Poëtes Aratus Menander Epimenides that neuer knewe God Christe thought it no scorne to receiue witnesse at Infantes mouthes No he refused not the Diuels when they bare witnesse with him and saide We knowe that thou arte Christe the Sonne of the Liuinge God Pauperes à Lugduno founde faulte with the Pride of the Pope with the lewde life of the Cleregie with Purgatorie with Holy Water with Pardonnes and with other your like deceiuinges of the people They translated the Bible and praied in theire natural knowen mother tongue These were theire Erroures Therefore were they called detestable Heretiques therefore were they coÌ„demned by your Churche of Rome But Goddes Name be blessed for euer Sithence that time the Popes painted Power hath stil abated and these poore detestable condemned Heretiques haue stil encreased The Apologie Cap. 15. Diuision 2. I knowe wel yenough the Authoritie of these foresaid persones wil be but lightly regarded amongest these men â–ª Howe then if I cal foorth those for witnesses whoÌ„ they theÌ„ selues haue vsed to honoure What if I saie that Adrian the Bishop of Rome did frankly confesse that al these mischieues braste out firste from the high Throne of the Pope M. Hardinge Here haue wee a man of strawe set vp whom this defender nameth Adrian Bishop of Rome He geueth him a waze of strawe in his hande that a farre of semeth to be a sore weapon taken out of the armorie of Platina as is pretended But when ye come neare and beholde what felow this is and conferre with Platina touchinge his weapon ye see it to be a fained thinge For there is no sutche saieinge by Platina attributed to any of the six Adrians Bishoppes of Rome ‡ whose liues he writeth And mo there were not Therefore where you saie What if I saie that Adrian c. I answere thereto that if you so saie you saie a false lie The B. of Sarisburie Touchinge this pretie fansie of a man of Cloutes and a vvaze of stravve I sée wel M. Hardinge ye thoughte it good policie to clowte vp the matter and to satisfie your Reader with a stravven ansvveare The stravve was in your eies M. Hardinge not in the man Ye stoode too far aluffe your eies daseled and therefore ye knewe not what ye sawe If ye had drawen neare ye should soone haue founde your owne erroure It was no man of stravve but Pope Adrian the sixthe and laste that wée spake of Onlesse ye thinke the Popes Holinesse to be a man of stravve For thus he pronounced at Norinberg in Germanie in the great assemblie of yâ— Empiere by the mouthe of Cheregatus his Legate a Latere A Sacerdotibus iniquitatem populi dimanare multis nunc annis grauiter multisque modis peccatum esse Romae inde à Pontificio Culmine malum hoc atque luem ad inferiores omnes Ecclesiarum Praefectos defluxisse Thus Pope Adrian bade his Legate saie That the iniquitie of the people grewe from the Priestes And that nowe for the space of many yeeres there haue benne greate and greuous offenses committed in Rome And that al this plague and mischiefe hath flowed vnto al the Inferioure Rulers of the Churche euen from the Highe Throne of the Popes Holinesse This same storie is also extante printed at Colaine in a Booke called Fasciculus rerum Sciendarum Thus therefore once againe wée saie M. Hardinge that Pope Adrian 6. frankly confessed that al these mischiefes procéeded firste euen from the Throne or Seate of the Popes Holinesse and saieinge the same notwithstandinge your vnciuile speache wée saie no lie And leste ye shoulde thinke this Legate Cheregatus either of foregeatefulnesse or of malice did his errante otherwise then he had in Commission the like woordes haue sitheÌ„ce beÌ„ne vttered in your owne late chapter at Tridente by Cornelius the Bishop of BitoÌ„to These be his woordes Effecerunt tandem vt Pietas in Fucum Hypocrisim c. They haue brought to passe that Godlinesse is turned into Hypocrisie and that the Sauoure of Life is turned into the Sauoure of Deathe Woulde God they were not gonne wholy with general consente from Religion to Superstition from Faithe to Infidelitie from Christe to Antichriste from God to Epicure saieing with wicked harte and filthy mouthe There is no God Neither hath there benne this greate vvhile any Pastoure or Pope that regarded these thinges For they al bothe Pope and others sought theire ovvne and not so mutche as one of them neither Pope nor Cardinal sought for the thinges that perteine to Iesus Christe Therefore M. Hardinge ye maie hencefoorthe spare your Vnsauery and bitter speaches For in these reportes there is no lie The Apologie Cap. 15. Diuision 3. Pighius acknowlegeth herein to be a faulte that many Abuses are brought in euen into the very Masse whiche Masse otherwise he woulde haue seâ—â—e to be a moste reuerend matter Gerson saithe that through the number of moste fonde Ceremonies al the Vertue of the Holy Ghoste whiche ought to haue ful operation in vs and al true godlinesse is vtterly quenched and deade Whole Graecia and Asia complaine howe the Bishoppes of Rome with the martes of theire Purgatories and Pardons haue both tormented mennes Consciences and piked theire purses M. Hardinge In deede pighius in his sixth coÌ„trouersie speaking of priuate masses denieth not but certaine abuses be crept into that most Holy and most helthful thing for so he speaketh And adding further we snow saith he to what man and to what men it perteineth the same to correcte And let eche man acknowledge his owne measure and vnderstande his dutie As who shoulde saie it is not meere for euery man to take vpon him to amend any thinge that is amisse about the Masse For he meaneth not that the Masse it selfe is erroneus as ful wel there he declareth but that men be faulty in abusinge that moste Holy Sacrifice For many come to the Aulter vnworthely Many be presente at it that ought not to come within the Churche dores Some Priestes be of so lewde liues and of so vnreuerent behauiour at it as it were better they abstained Albeit I thinke he meante rather sutche abuses as the learned Fathers of the prouincial Councel of Coulen woulde to be amended to witte certaine peculiar offices of Masses deuised by men of late yeeres besides the ordinance of the Ancient forefathers As for the other greate troupe ye bringe with you out of Grece and Asia firste we require you to make them agree with your selues and with the Catholike Churche aboute the procession of the Holy Ghoste and then we shal answere both you and them concerning your greuous matter of Purgatorie and Pardons It is not our manner to take the saieinges of Heretikes for good and sufficient Auctoritie The B. of Sarisburie In déede M. Hardinge here ye hewe ouer highe Ye take vpon
lies here be made at once VVhereas of al these neuer a one leadde his life at Rome but Laurence Valla who was a Canon of Laterane and this Defender saieth that al did there is one lie That al these might see the Popes secretes there be two lies That none of these foresooke the Catholike faithe there be three lies As for Laurence Valla he was not in euery pointe very sounde as it appeareth in his Booke of Free wil and in his annotations vpon the newe Testamente In althinges he handled he shewed him selfe newe fangled rather then groundedly lerned as wel in grammer and logike as in diuinitie But Mars lius of Padua to please the Emperouve Ludouicus Bauarus who liued aboue twoo hundred yeeres paste through malice conceiued againste Pope Iohn the xxij of whom the saide Ludouicus was for iuste causes excommunicate went so farre in schisme as at length he fel into Heresie And Abbot Ioachim whiles he reproued Peter Lombarde vttered Heresie contrarie to the Catholike faithe touchinge the Trinitie and therefore his booke was condemned by the Churche though his person was not condemned because he submitted him selfe and his writinges to the iudgemente of the Holy Romaine Churche as we finde in the Decretals That al these haue greately and often complained of the Bishoppes of Rome theire tyrannie and pride there be foure lies That they declared the Pope him selfe to be very Antichriste there be fiue lies And whereas to make this shameles lie you aske leaue so we aske leaue of you to tel it you and to challenge you of a lie and saieplainely vnto you that speaking of them al you belie them and that you shal neuer be able to proue that you saie of them Francis Petrarch the Italian Poēte and Baptiste of Mantua the Latine Poëte speake like Poëtes eche of them once in theire woorkes againste the euil manners of the Courte of Rome But what proufe maketh al this that the Romaine Churche that is to saie the Weast Churche whiche onely remaineth and euer hath remained whole and sound of Faithe erreth in Doctrine Or what argumente can you gather out of al these I wil not saie againste the life but againste the office Auctoritie and dignitie of the Bishop of Rome The argumente you can make hereupon is this Poëtes reprehende the vices of the Courte of Rome Ergo the Pope is Antichriste Or ergo the Catholike Churche erreth and is to be foresaken VVhat force is in this reason euery reasonable man be he neuer so meane of witte may soone iudge The B. of Sarisburie Your Comparison of Madde Dogges M. Hardinge becommeth wel the rest of your Courteous eloquence Who so shal marke howe vainely you snappe at what so euer ye can imagine is in your waie nowe at our Logique nowe at our Rhetorique nowe at our Greeke nowe at our Latine nowe at our Lamenesse nowe at our leane Cheekes nowe at oure thinne Beardes nowe at our Superintendenteshippes nowe at our Ministershippes nowe at oure Maistershippes nowe at our Mashippes for this is the sobrietie and grauitie of your speache and further howe greedily and egrely ye fasten your teeth and feede your selfe with Winde and are stil snappinge and catche nothinge although in regarde of manhood he spare to cal you a Madde Dogge as it liketh you to calle others yet he maie wel thinke you scarcely to be a sober man Christe founde faulte sommetime with the Bishoppes Sommetime with the Priestes Sommetime with the Scribes Sommetimes with the Phariseis Sommetime with the People Sommetime with theire Religion Sommetime with theire Traditions Sommetime with theire Ignorance Sommetime with theire Praiers Sommetime with theire Fastinges sommetime with theire Life Sommetime with theire Hypocrisie Sommetime with theire Crueltie And thus in your fantasie he ranne hither and thither vp and downe Yet I trowe ye wil not touche him with your Comparisons nor saie therfore as ye saie to vs he had a very vnquiet Heade Who so hath eies to see and considereth the miserable Abuses of the Churche of Rome touchinge either Life or Religion cannot lightly wante iuste mater to reproue Ye remember what Churche it is whereof S. Bernarde saithe A planta pedis vsque ad verticem Capitis non est Sanitas vlla Non est iam dicere vt Populus sic Sacerdos Quia nec sic Populus vt Sacerdos There is not one whole place from the sole of the foote to the toppe of the Heade Wee maie not nowe saie As is the People so is the Prieste For the People is nothinge so il as is the Prieste Ye saie these witnesses dwelt not in Rome and here in a smal matter ye haue noted a great lie Howe be it Bernarde the Abbate that dwelte furtheste of was twise in Rome and was Chiefe of Councel with Pope Innocentius in his greateste affaires Franciscus Petrarcha was made Poete in the Capitol and keapte Laura his Concubine in the eie of the Pope and had his moste aboade in Rome Laurentius Valla vvas Cauon of the Cathedral Churche in Laterane and leadde his Life and died in Rome Briefely S. Bernarde onely excepted al the reste were Italians and dwelte neuer far from Rome as it maie appeare by the plainenesse of theire speache vnderstoode somme parte of the déepeste Secretes of the Churche of Rome Marsilius Patauinus ye saie was an Heretique But what one Heresie he defended or before what Iudge he was conuicted or where he was either abtured or pounisshed for the same neither you nor any of al your Felowes haue hitherto tolde vs. Therefore wée muste thinke He vvas an Heretique vvithout Heresie as somme menne be Doctoures vvithout Diuinitie Ioachimus Abbas founde faulte with the Bishop of Rome And therefore he muste néedes be an Heretique As for that he is charged in the Popes Decretalles with erroure touchinge the Trinitie it is a greate Vntruthe as ye maie clearely perceiue by a Booke that Martin Luther hath pourposely written in his Defence But to comme neare the matter and to speake of the thinge that moste misliketh you S. Iohn saith Antichriste shal fitte in a Cittie builte vpon seuen Hilles and so is the Cittie of Rome Irenaeus saith The number of Antichristes Name shal be expressed by this woorde Latinus Sibylla saith The greateste terroure and furie of his Empiere and the greateste woe that he shal woorke shal be by the bankes of Tyber Whiche circumstances séeme plainely to painte out the Cittie of Rome S. Hierome saithe Antichristus fedebit in Templo Dei vel Hierosolymi vt quidam putant vel in Ecclesia vt veriùs arbitramur Antichriste shal fit in the Temple of God either at Hierusalem as somme thinke or els in the Churche of God it selfe vvhiche vvee take to be the truer meaninge S. Gregorie saithe Ego fidenter dico quo'd quisquis se Vniuersalem Sacerdotem vocat vel vocari defiderat in elatione
Proselytes Whereas in deede he was amere altene and a stranger to the House of Israel and a very tyrannous Vsurper of the Crowne as beinge lineally descended not from Iacob but from Esau But ye saie You haue keapte and preserued the Scriptures in your Libraries in veleme and I trowe in letters of golde Euen in like sorte and with like truthe ye might saie that you haue keapte the Sonne and the Moone and had it not benne for your kéepinge they had benne loste It was God M. Hardinge that of his Mercie preserued his Holy VVorde euē as he preserued Daniel in the Caue of Lions Ionas in the Whales belly The three Children in the middes of the flaming Fire Yée kéepe the Scriptures as the Dogge keepeth the haie whiche neither eateth it him selfe nor suffereth the poore hungrie cattle that faine woulde eate it Yée kéepe thē in warde in duste moulde as the Ievves before the time of Kinge Iosias keapte the Booke of Deuteronomie closely in the corners or emongest the treasures of the Temple so the noman knewe where to finde it Had it not benne for Goddes special prouidence notwithstandinge your kéepinge they might haue perished S. Chrysostome saithe Nunc neque an sint Scripturae quidam sciunt Spiritus tamen ita dispēsauit vt custodiantur Now a daies there are somme that cannot tel whether there be any Scriptures or no. Yet hath the Sprite of God so prouided that they are stil preserued Thus the Ievves made theire vauntes that they were the keepers of the Lavve that the Christians had al of them S. Augustine saith Iudaei dicūt non Nostra nos Lege vti sed Sua The Ievves saie That wee haue no Lawe of our owne but onely theires Likewise euē at this daie the Iewes keepe vse the Lavve of God with al reuerence They neuer laie any other Booke vpon the Bible Thei wasshe theire handes before they touche it They wil not sit vpon the benche where the Bible lieth As often as they either open it or shutte it they vse to kisse it when the Pope goeth through Rome to his Palace of Laterane the Ievves méete him vpō the waie and offer him the Bible and desire him reuerently to embrace it as though the Pope coulde haue no Bible but onely of them Al these thinges notwithstandinge the Pope answeareth them of course euen as wée maie answeare you Sanctam Legem viri Hebraei laudamus veneramur obseruantiā verò vestram vanam interpretationem damnamus improbamus Ye menne of the Ievves Profession wee praise and honoure the Holy Lavve But your Tradition and vaine Interpretation wee vtterly condemne and reproue For Chrysostome saithe Nihil nunc apud Iudaeos remansit nisi Sola Scriptura Librorum omni Legis obseruantia pereunte There remaineth nowe nothinge emonge the Ievves but onely the writinge conteined in Bookes for al the obseruation of the Lavve is paste from them Againe he saithe Literae quidem Legis apud illos sunt Sensus autem est apud nos The Letters of the Lavve are with the Ievves But the Sense and Meaninge is with vs. Likewise he saith vnto the Ievves Vos complicatis membranas animaltum mortuorum Nos possidemus Spiritum viuificautem You turne the leaues of the Scriptures made of the skinnes of deade Cattle but we haue the Sprite that geeueth Life So saithe S. Augustine Iudaei in Libris suffragatores nostri sunt in Cordibus hostes nostri The Iewes healpe vs and aide vs with theire Bookes But thei are our enimies in theire hartes Againe he saith Magnum aliquid actum est in vsum nostrum de Infidelirate Iudaeorum vt ijdem ipsi qui haec propter se non haberent in Cordibus ea propter nos haberent in Codicibus Somme greate good thinge is wrought to our vse by the infidelitie of the Iewes that they that to doo them selues good had not these thinges in theire hartes yet for our sakes to doo vs good shoulde haue same thinges in theire Bookes Speake not therefore so mutche M. Hardinge of your safe keepinge of the Scriptures For the Jevves haue keapte and vntil this daie doo kéepe them as safely as you Yae keapte the Scriptures as the Augures of Rome sommetime keapte the Sibylles Bookes that is to saie yée keapte them to your selues in close prisonne in secresie that the people should knowe nothing but in al cases should be forced to seeke to you Thus ye keapte the Light in Darknesse and as S. Paule saithe ye keapte the Truthe of God in VVickednesse S. Chrysostome saithe Quando vides Scripturas Prophetarum Euangelij Apostolorum traditas esse in manus Falsorum Sacerdotum num intelligis quód Verbum veritatis traditum est Principibus iniquis Scribis When thou seeste the Scriptures of the Prophetes of the Gospel and of the Apostles to be deliuered into the handes of False Priestes dooste thou not vnderstande that the Woorde of Truthe is deliuered vnto the wicked Princes and vnto the Scribes To be short I maie answeare you with the woordes of Chrysostome Arcas Scrinia rerum pretiosissimarum adhuc seruatis The sauro destituti Yee keepe stil the Cheastes and boxes of moste pretious thinges but the Iewelles and Treasures be cleane gonne Therefore your safe kéeping of the Scriptures notwithstandinge wée maie saie to you as S. Augustine sommetime said to the Heretique Petilian Iudas Christum Carnalem tradidit Tu Spiritualem furens Euangelium sanctum flammis sacrilegis tradidisti Iudas betraiede Christe Carnal thou haste betraied Christe Spiritual for thou in thy rage haste deliuered the Holy Gospel vnto wicked fires Yée replie You rather haue burnte the Gospel for that you denie the woordes of the Gospel For example ye allege these woordes of Christe This is my Body vvhiche vvoordes ye saie of our part are denied God be thāked as wee haue not burnte so haue wée not denied any woorde or parcel of the Gospel Touchinge these wordes by you alleged wée embrace them and reuerence them and beleue them euen as the VVoordes of Christe But wée embrace them not as you haue fondely rackte wreasted them and fowly abused them by your vaine Constructions but as Christe meante them and as the Aunciente Catholique Fathers in the Olde times haue expounded them S. Chrysostome saithe Sacrae Scripturae Verba non vult Deus vt Simpliciter sed multa cum prudētia intelligantur God wil not that we shoulde vnderstande the vvoordes of the Holy Scripture simply and plainely as thei lie but with greate wisedome and discretion Againe he saithe Diligenter inuigilandum est vel potiùs Diuina Gratia opus est ne nudis verbis insistamus Ita Haeretici in Errorem incidunt Wee must take great heede or rather we haue neede of the Grace of God that wee reaste not vpon the bare VVoordes of the Scriptures For by
of the Romaine Churche is the infallible Rule of Faithe from the vvhiche the Holy Scripture taketh her force And Indulgences and Pardonnes saithe he are not made knovven to vs by the Authoritie of the Scriptures but they are knovven to vs by the Authoritie of the Romaine Churche and of the Bishoppes of Rome vvhich is greater then the Scriptures Pigghius also letteth not to saie that without the licence of the Romaine Church we ought not to beleue the very Plaine Scriptures Mutch like as if any of those that cannot speake pure and cleane Latine and yet can babble out quickely and readily a litle somme sutche Lawe Latine as serueth the Courte woulde needes holde that al others ought also to speake after the same waie that Mammetrectus and Catholicon spake many yeeres agoe and whiche themselues doo yet vse in pleadinge in Courte for so maie it be vnderstoode sufficiently what is said mennes desires maie be satisfied that it is a fondenesse nowe in the later ende to trouble the worlde with a newe kinde of speakinge and to cal againe the olde finenesse and eloquence that Cicero and Caesar vsed in theire daies in the Latine tongue So mutche are these menne beholden to the folie darkenesse of the former times Many thinges as one writeth are had in estimation oftentimes bicause thei haue benne once dedicate to the Temples of the Heathen Goddes Euen so wee see at this daie many thinges allowed highly sette by of these menne not bicause they iudge them so mutche woorthe but onely bicause they haue benne receiued into a custome and after a sorte dedicate to the Temple of God M. Hardinge Ye haue neuer donne with the Churche of Rome I cannot blame you For so long as that standeth without ye repente and tourne ye shal neuer be taken but for sutche as ye be Schismatikes and Heretikes But alas poore soules what thinke ye to ouerthrowe that Churche builded vpon the rocke Peter againste whiche hitherto neither tyrauntes nor Heretikes farre passinge you in lerninge and honestie of common life coulde euer preuaile Trowe ye to extinguishe that faithe of the Romaine Churche whiche is the same that was the faithe of Peter for which Christe praied that it should neuer faile Ye laboure in vaine VVel may Sathan winne you the Churche whiche our Lorde praied for by you shal he neuer winne Geue ouer therefore your vaine and wicked attemptes Trust not in the patches that falsely ye allege out of Canonistes gloses scholemen riminge poetes Heretikes and who so euer be they neuer so bad Some ignorant persons maye ye deceiue whose sinnes deserue the same VVhat Syluester Prierlât saieth I minde not here to discusse Neither where he saithe that you alleage haue you thought good to tel vs lest by perusinge the place we shoulde take you in a lie as we haue almoste in al your other allegations The like sinceritie you use in alleaginge Pighius VVe binde our selues neither to the wordes of Syluester nor of Pighius If they erre what is that to vs Let them beare theire owne burthen If they tel truth we beleue them for truthes sake If otherwise we leaue that parte for you to carpe If Syluester Prierias saide that for pointes of belefe the Doctrine of the Romaine Churche is a squire to trie theire truthe by the same beinge wel vnderstanded is right true Likewise if Pighius saie that the Romaine Churche sheweth vnto vs which be the approued and vndoubted scriptures and whiche be not this is so true as your selfe I suppose wil yelde thereunto As for that the scripture receiued from the Churche of Rome Authoritie credite and force if in your meaninge you exclude God that is your lie not Syluesters sentence If relation be made to vs that we ought not geue credite vnto it onlesse it had ben shewed to be holy scripture by the Romaine Church whiche is the true Churche of Christe in this sense be it Syluester or who els so euer saithe it it is a true saieinge and agreable to S. Augustine Ego Euangelio non crederem nisi me Catholicae Ecclesiae commueret Authoritas I woulde not beleue the Gospel except the Auctoritie of the Catholike Churche moued me And for that you alleage out of him touchinge indulgences truthe it is the ful and whole knowledge of them is not plainely opened vnto vs by expresse and euident wordes of Scripture no more then the mysterie of the blessed Trinitie baptizinge of infantes and many other truthes but rather by the doctrine of the Romaine Churche VVhere you tel vs of Pighius that he letteth not to saie that without the licence of the Romishe Churche for in that word you please your selfe wel we ought not to beleue the very plaine scriptures we wil proclaime you a lyer vntil you shewe vs where he spake so farre beside reason and lerninge The holy Churche doth not wil vs to staie from belefe of the scriptures vntil we haue licence but by al waies and meanes inuiteth and stirreth vs to beleue the truthe in the scriptures vttered The B. of Sarisburie The greatest weight hereof vpon twoo of your Doctoures Syluester Prieriâs and Albertus Pigghius Whoe 's credite notwithstandinge yée woulde faine otherwise saue vpright yet here as it séemeth ye are contente for shame to géeue them ouer VVe binde our selues yée saie neither to the woordes of Syluester nor of Pigghius If they erre what is that to vs This shorte and blunte answeare notwithstandinge it séeme to like wel you yet perhaps Prieriâs and Pigghius it woulde not like I sée no greate cause to the contrarie but either of them might as wel renounce your Authoritie and saie of you Wée are not bounde neither to M. Hardinges woordes nor to his felowes For that yée doubte the Truthe of our allegations reade Syluester Prieriâs Maister of the Popes Palace in his Booke entituled Contra praesumptuosas Martini Lutheri Conclusiones de potestate Papae His wordes there emongest others be these Quicūque nō innititur Doctrinae Romanae Ecclesiae ac Romani pōlificis tanquam Regulae Dei infallibili à qua etiam sacra Scriptura robur trahit Authoritatem Haereticus est Who so euer leaneth not to the Doctrine of the Romaine Churche and of the Bishop of Rome as vnto the infallible Rule of God of vvhiche Doctrine the Holy Scripture taketh force and Authoritie he is an Heretique Againe he saithe Authoritas Romanae Ecclesiae Romanique pontificis maior est c. The Authoritie of the Romaine Churche and of the Bishop of Rome is greater then the Authoritie of Goddes woorde As for that is here alleged of Pigghius it is the very sounde and sense of the greatest parte of his Common place De Ecclesia Of whoe 's iudgemente herein M. Caluine writeth thus Pighius ait Nullius Scripturae Authoritate quantum libet Clarae nostro quidem
the turninge of the Right hande of God Therefore S. Augustine saithe vnto Faustus the Heretique Cur non potiùs Euangelicae Authoritati tam Fundatae tam stabilitae tanta gloria diffamarae atque ab Apostolorum temporibus vsque ad nostra tempora per Successiones certissimas commendatae te non subdis VVhy doest thou not rather submitte thee selfe vnto the Authoritie of the Gospel beinge so grounded so stablished Preached and published with so greate glorie commended and deliuered vnto vs by most certaine Successions from the time of the Arostles vntil our time Likewise in this same place by you alleged S. Augustine saithe Ego non crederem Euangelio nisi me Catholicae Ecclesiae coÌ„moueret Authoritas Quibus ergo obtemperaui dicentibus Credite Euangelio Cur eis non obtemperem dicentibus Noli credere Manichaeo I woulde not beleue the Gospel onlesse the Authoritie of the Catholique Churche moued me Seeinge therefore I haue obeied them saieinge to me Beleeue the Gospel why should I not also obeie them saieinge vnto me Beleeue not Manichee Thus the consente of the Churche heareth witnesse to the Gospel without whiche witnesse notwithstanding the Gospel neuerthelesse were the Gospel stil Therefore Chrysostome saithe Si dixerint in ipsis Veris Ecclesijs Christum apparuisse nolite eis credere dicentibus ista deme Quia non est digna Diuinitatis meae notitia haec If they shal tel you that Christe hath appeared yea euen in the very True Churches yet beleue them not saieinge thus of mee For this is no meete knowledge for my Godhedde To conclude M. Hardinge wée wil saie to you as S. Augustine sommetime saide to the Donatian Heretiques auancinge their onely Churche in Aphrica euen as you nowe auance onely your Churche of Rome Nos post vocem Pastoris nostri per ora Prophetarum per os proprium per ora Euangelistarum nobis aperrissimè declaratam voces vestras non admittimus non credimus non accipimus After the voice of our Shepehearde vttered moste plainely vnto vs by the mouthes of the Prophetes by his owne mouthe and by the mouthes of the Euangelistes if ye bringe vs your owne voices wee allowe them not wee beleeue them not wee receiue them not The Apologie Cap. 11. Diuision 1. Our Churche saie thei cannot erre They speake that I thinke as the Lacedaemonians longe sithence vsed to saie that it was not possible to finde any Adulterer in al their Common Healthe whereas in deede they were rather al Adulterers and had no certaintie in their Marriages but had their wiues in common amongest them al Or as the Canonistes at this daie for theire bellies sake vse to saie of the Pope that for so mutch as he is Lorde of al Benefices though he selle for monie Bishoprikes Monasteries Priesthoode Spiritual Promotions and parte with nothinge freely yet bicause he counteth al his owne he cannot committe Simonie though he vvould neuer so faÃne But how strongly agreably to reason these things be spoken wee are not as yet hable to perceiue excepte perchaunce these menne haue plucked of the whinges from the Truthe as the Romaines in olde time did proine and pinion their Goddesse Victorie after they had once gotten her home to the ende that with the same whinges she shoulde neuer be able to flee awaie from them againe M. Hardinge Towarde the ende of your Apologie Syr Defender who so euer you be that pieced it togeather you doo but trifle Of like your stuffe is spence For here litle saie you that you haue not saide already VVherefore I craue Pardon of the Reader if accordinge to the slendernesse of matters obiected my confutation seeme also slender Sir you doo now but patche peeces togeather whiche you haue gathered out of your note Bookes into the same infarâ—ed some out of the Canonistes some out of the Scoolemen and them not of the greatest estimation most of al out of Humanitie bookes wherein you be pretely seene And that seemeth to be your chiefe profession As for Diuinitie there appeareth no greate knowledge in you VVhat ye rehearse of the Lacedemonians it perteineth to your owne companies no lesse then to them I meane onely your Apostates Monkes and Friers Priestes and Nonnes You finde greate faulte in the Canonistes that be at this daie and name in your Margent Summa Angelica the Author whereof died many yeeres paste If he Theodoricus what so euer he was or any other Canoniste offende you as for his bellies sake speakinge of the Pope that should sette your teeth anedge what pertaineth that to vs who defende the Catholike Faithe not the saieinges of euery Canoniste You were beste seeinge you make so muche adoo with them to Article their errours and either write a railinge Booke against them which ye can easely doo or sende one of your best learned superintendentes to Bononia there in open scoole with disputations to confute them And so doubtlesse ye shal either conuerte them whiche were a woorthy acte or proue your selues fooles whiche were greate pitie But to answeare your obiection we saie firste that you alleage Summa Angelica falsely Nothing is founde soundinge to that you burthen the Pope withall in the place by you quoted in dict Papa Nexte whereas it is written in Summa Angelica In curia Romana titulus de Simonia non habet locum you Syr Defender either nor knowinge what folowed or of malice abusinge the place haue reported the same as if it were precisely saide without any distinction VVhereas in deede the selfe same Summe vseth this distinction saieinge Verum est in ijs quae sunt Simoniaca de iure positiuo solùm sed non in ijs quae sunt Simoniaca de iure diuino VVhereby he meaneth that the Pope is not vnder the rules of Simonie concerninge suche lawes and paines as he himselfe or his predecessours haue made in that behalfe For they haue made many thinges belonginge thereto as you may well knowe your selfe who are so pretely seene in the Canon Lawe as it may appeare by the often and cunninge allegations whiche you bringe out of the Gloses But concerninge that Simonie whiche properly is so called the Pope is nolesse subiecte thereto by the true iudgement of Summa Angelica whiche you haue shamefully belied then any other man You iest at Gods blessed Truthe alwaies remaininge in his Holy Churche and prophanely resemble it to a birde proined and pinyoned that it flie not a waie As though the Churche kepte truthe with suche policie as the olde Romaines are fained to haue kepte their Goddesse Victorie VVell Syr we tell you in sadnesse we are assured of the Truthe that it is in the Churche and that it shall neuer departe from thence And if ye call this cuttinge away of her winges that it neuer flie from the Churche wee graunte they be cut in suche sorte as shee shall
your Popes Holinesse so entitled wee finde neuer Onlesse it be in somme certaine late Decrees and Gloses of his owne Al be it you of late haue mutche abated the Emperoures Honoure and haue made him onely the Popes man For thus yee saie Imperator Occidentis est Procurator siue Defensor Romanae Ecclesiae The Emperoure of the Weaste is the Proctoure or Stewarde of the Churche of Rome Yet Chrysostome saithe Imperator est Summitas Caput omnium super terram hominuÌ„ The Emperoure is the Toppe and Heade of al menne vpon the Earthe In the Councel of Chalcedon the Emperoure is called Dominus Vniuersi Mundi The Lorde of the Whole Worlde Perhaps ye wil saie The State of the Empiere is nowe empouerished And therefore the Emperoure hathe loste his Title Yet your owne Doctours Glosers coulde haue tolde you Iura communia dicunt quòd Imperator est Dominus Mundi NotwithstaÌ„ding the decaie of yâ— Empiere The Common Lawes saie that the Emperoure is the Lorde of the Worlde Rob. Holâ—ote speakinge of the Emperoure of Germanie saithe thus Hic est Rex Regum cui omnes subditae sunt Nationes Populi c. The Emperoure is the Kinge of Kinges vnto whom al Nations and Countries be in subiection The Romaines of late yeeres wrote thus vnto the Emperoure Conradus Excellentissimo Praeclarissimo Vrbis Oibis totius Oâ—mino c. Vnto the moste excellente and moste Noble Emperoure the Lorde bothe of the Cittie and also of al the whole Worlde Therefore M. Hardinge to moue this vaine quarrel without somme cause it was great folie Councelles ye saie In olde times were holden by Authoritie of the Pope For proufe whereof yee allege Socrates in the eight booke and the seconde Chapter But Woorde or Sentence yee allege none Howe be it it was a great ouersight to allege the Eighth Booke of Socrates whereas Socrates him selfe neuer wrote but Seuen and so far to ouerleape your Authoure Notwithstandinge this smal Erroure maie wel be dissembled emongest so many How be it touchinge the thing it selfe yee maie as easily finde it in the Eighth Booke of Socrates that neuer was written as els where For in deede emongeste al that euer he wrote this thinge certainely that you allege he wrote neuer The Apologie Cap. 12. Diuision 5. Ca. 13. Diui. 1. And although the modestie and mildenesse of the Emperoure Ferdinando be so greate that he can beare this wronge bicause peraduenture he vnderstandeth not wel the Popes packinge yet ought not the Pope of his holinesse to offer him that wronge nor to claime an other mans right as his owne But hereto somme wil replie The Emperoure in deede called Councelles at that time yee speake of bicause the Bishop of Rome was not yet growen so greate as he is nowe but yet the Emperour did not then sitte togeather with the Bishoppes in Councel or once bare any stroke with his Authoritie in theire consultations I answeare nay that it is not so For as witnesseth Theodorete the Emperoure Constantine sate not onely togeather with them in the councel at Nice but gaue also aduise to the Bishoppes howe it was best to trie out the mater by the Apostles and Prophetes vvritinges as appeareth by these his owne woordes In disputation saithe he of maters of Diuinitie vvee haue set before vs to folovve the Doctrine of the Holy Ghoste For the Euangelistes and the Apostles vvoorkes and the Prophetes saieinges shevve vs sufficiently vvhat opinioÌ„ vve ought to haue of the vvil of God M. Hardinge For the sittinge of Emperoures in Councelles you treate a common place not necessarie No man euer denied but Emperoures maie sitte in them we acknowledge two sortes of settinge one for the assessours an other for the Iudge No Emperoure euer sate as a Iudge in Councel but many both Emperoures in person and their Lieutenauntes for them haue sitten as being ready to assiste and defende that whiche the Bishoppes had Iudged and decreed VVhat maner a seate greate Constantine had in the firste Councel at Nice Eusebius in his life and Theodoritus doth declare After that al the Bishoppes were sette in their seates to the number of 318 in came the Emperoure last with a smal companie A lowe litle chaire beinge sette for him in the middest he would not sitte downe before the Bishoppes had reuerently signified so mutche vnto him and as Theodoritus writeth not before he had desired the Bishoppes to permitte him so to doo Nowe thinke you that the Supreme head of the Churche should haue comme in last and hane sitten beneath his subiectes and haue staied to sitte vntil thei had as it were geuen him leaue Neither consulted he with the Bishoppes but required them to consult of the maters thei came for as Theodorite witnesseth Neither spake he there so generally as you reporte nor framed his tale in that sorte as you faine vniuersally of the wil of God ‡ but of the Godhed saieinge that the bookes of the Gospels and of the Apostles and the Oracles of the Prophetes doo plainely teache vs what we ought to thinke of the Godhed 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 For the coÌ„trouersie about whiche the Arians made so mutche adoo was touchinge the equalitie of Godhed in Christe and his consubstantialitie with God the Father And by those wordes and other whiche there he vttered he tooke not vpon him to define or Iudge but onely to exhorte them to agree together in one Faithe For amonge those Bishops certaine there were that fauoured the Heresie of Arius Suche examples you bringe for defence of your parte as make mutche against you Not that you delight in making a rodde for your selfe but bicause you haue no better and somwhat must you needes saie lest the stage you plaie your parte on shoulde stande stil The B. of Sarisburie Emperoures ye saie sate in Councelles as Assessours onely but not as Iudges That is to saie thei sate by the Bishoppes helde theirpeace tolde the clocke saide nothinge Yet youre Doctours saie Assessor Episcopi non potest esse Laicus The Assessoure of a Bishop maie not be a Laieman But touchinge the mater it selfe Eusebius that was alwaies neare aboute the Emperoure Constantine wrote his life and was presente at the Councel saithe thus Constantinus quasi Communis quidam Episcopus à Deo constitutus Ministrorum Dei Synodos conuocauit Nec dedignatus est adesse considere in medio illorum consorsque fieri ipsorum c. Constantine as if he had benne a Common Bishop appoited by God called togeather Councelles of Goddes Ministers and disdeigned not him selfe to sitte in the middes emongest them and to be partetaker of theire dooinges Againe Constantinus him selfe saithe thus Ego intereram Concilio tanquam vnus ex vobis I was presente at the Councel emongeste you as one of you Againe Eusebius saithe Vnus Vnicus
Sanctae synodo quae apud Nicaeam congregata est Constantinus the Emperoure beinge Presidente of the Holy Councel that was keapte at Nice These be not our woordes but the Popes registred euen in his owne Recordes Therefore I truste yee wil not refuse to geeue them credite But you saie The Emperoure determined and defined nothinge Yet the Emperoure him selfe contrarie to youre saieinge saithe thus Ego suscepi perfeci res salutiferas persuasus Verbo tuo O Lorde I tooke in hande and broughte to passe vvholesome thinges beinge persvvaded by thy VVorde And againe writinge hereof vnto the Bishoppes of sundrie Churches he saithe Ego vobiscum interfui tanquà m vnus ex vobis Non enim negauerim conseruum me vestrum esse Qua de re mihi maximè gratulor I was presente at the Councel with you as one of you For I cannot denie mee selfe to bee youre Felovve Seruante In whiche thinge I moste reioise Likewise againe he saithe Ego Nicaeam contraxi magnum numerum Episcoporum Cum quibus cùm essem vnus ex vobis Conseruus vester vehementer esse cuperem etiam ipse suscepi inquisitionem Veritatis I caused a greate companie of Bishoppes to come to Nice with whome togeather I tooke in hande the Examination of the Truthe beinge mee selfe one of you and mutche desieringe to be therein youre Felowe Seruante Likewise saithe Eusebius Imperator quasi Iuculentam facem accendens ne quae occultae Erroris reliquiae superessent oculo Regio circumspexit The Emperoure as hauing enkendled a greate flame lookte wel aboute with his Princely Eie that no priuie remnantes of erroure shoulde reaste behinde The Bishoppes in the same Nicene Councel beinge at variance emongeste them selues offered vp theire Bookes of accusation not vnto the Pope or to his Legates of whom they had then no greate regarde but vnto the Emperoure Neither did the Emperoure put ouer theire quarelles vnto the Popes Iudgemente but vnto the Iudgemente of God Againe the same Emperoure Constantine saithe If any Bishop vvickedly offende by the hande of Goddes seruante that is to saie by my hande he shal be pounished To be shorte Cardinal Cusanus saithe Sciendum est quòd in vniuersalibus octo Concilijs vbi Imperatores interfuerunt non Papa semper inuenio Imperatores Iudices suos cum Senatu Primatum habuisse officium Praesidentiae per interlocutiones ex consensu Synodi sine mādato conclusiones iudicia fecisse Et non reperitur instantia in octo Concilijs praeter quam in tertia Actione Concilij Chalcedonensis Wee muste knowe that in the Eight General Councelles where the Emperoures were present and not the Pope I euermore finde that the Emperoures and theire Iudges with the Senate had the Gouernemente and Office of Presidence by hearinge and conferring of maters and that they made Conclusions and Iudgementes with the consente of the Councel and without any further Commission And there is no manner instance or exception to be founde in the firste Eight Councelles sauinge onely in the thirde Action of the Councel of Chalcedon Here yee see plainely by the Authoritie of Cardinal Cusanus one of youre owne special Doctours that in the Eight firste General Councelles the Emperoure was Presidente and not the Pope Where as the Emperoure willed the Bishoppes to conclude theire maters by the Apostolical and Prophetical Scriptures He speaketh not saie you so generally as wee reporte him nor frameth his tale in that sorte as wee saine vniuersally of the vvil of God but of the Godhedde For 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in your fansie signifieth onely the Substance and Nature of God and not Goddes VVil or his Religion Here M. Hardinge it were somme pointe of Learninge to knowe what skilful Greke Reader told you this tale Verily Cassiodorus in plaine wise trāslateth it thus Euangelici Apostolici libri erudiunt nos quid de Sacra Lege sapiamus The Bookes of the Euangelistes and Apostles teache vs what wee ought to thinke not onely of the Substance and Nature of God but also of the Holy Lavve Therefore Theodoretus addeth further these woordes Accipiamus Explicationes quaestionum nostrarum ex dictis Sancti Spiritus Let vs take the resolution of our questions out of the woordes of the Holy Ghoste And immediately before he saithe De rebus Diuinis disputantes praescripram habemus Doctrinam Sancti Spiritus In our Disputations not onely of the Godhedde but also of Godly maters wee haue laide before vs the Doctrine of the Holy Gospel In like sense S. Hilarie saithe Non est relictus hominum eloquijs de Dei rebus alius praeterquam Dei Sermo Omnia reliqua arcta conclusa impedita sunt obscura In maters touchinge God there is no speache leafte vnto menne but onely the woorde of God Al other Authorities be shorte and narrowe and darke and troublesome Beleue them not hencefoorth therefore M. Hardinge that tel you that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth onely the Substance and Nature of Goddes Diuinitie For as yee maie easily see your Glose is vaine and fighteth directely againste the Texte The Apologie Cap. 13. Diuision 2. The Emperoure Theodosius as saithe Socrates did not onely sitte amongest the Bishoppes but also ordered the whole argueinge of the cause and tare in peeces the Heretiques Bookes and allowed for good the Iudgemente of the Catholiques M. Hardinge It is wonder to see howe these menne abuse the Ecclesiastical histories VVhereas thei talke a litle before of the sitting of Emperours in general Councelles a man would thinke that now also Theodosius had benne saide to haue sitten among Bishoppes in some general Councel But there is no sutche mater Theodosius the Emperour conferred with Nectarius the Bishop of Constantinople howe al Christen men might be brought to an vnitie in Faithe And after that Nectarius had lerned of Sisinnius a greate Clerke the best way to be if al the heades of eche Heresie and Secte might be induced to be iudged by the olde Fathers and Doctours of the Churche the godly Emperoure hearing this aduise caused bothe the Heretikes and Catholiques also to write eche of them sutche thinges as eche of them had to saie for his Belefe And after praier made reading ouer al the writinges he reiected the Arians the Macedonians and the Eunomians ‡ embracing onely thier sentence who agreed vpon the Consubstantialitie of the sonne of God Here saie these Defenders Theodosius did not onely sitte amongest the Bishoppes but also ordered the whole arguing of the cause tearing the papers of the Heretikes and allowing the Iudgemente of the Catholiques To whiche obiection I make this answeare First that Theodosius here tooke counsel of Nectarius the Bishop and folowed it Secondely that he intended not to Iudge whether opinion of al the Sectes were truer but onely sought howe to ridde the Churche of cōtrouersies Otherwise
haue had ere nowe in Englande Prouincial Synodes and haue gouerned our churches by home made Lavves What shoulde one saie more Of a truthe euen those greatest councelles and where moste Assemblie of people euer was whereof these menne vse to make sutche an exceedinge rekeninge compare them with al the churches whiche thoughout the worlde acknowledge professe the Name of christe and what els I praie you can they seeme to bee but certaine Priuate councelles of Bishoppes and Prouincial Synodes For admitte peraduenture Italie Fraunce Spaine Englande Germanie Denmarke and Scotlande meete togeather if there wante Asia Graecia Armenia Persia Media Mesopotamia Egypte Ethiopia India and Mauritania in al whiche places there bee bothe many christian menne and also Bishoppes howe can any man beinge in his right minde thinke sutche a councel to be a General councel And where so many partes of the worlde doo lacke howe can they truely saie they haue the consente of the whole worlde Or what manner of councel weene you was the same laste at Tridente Or howe might it bee termed a General Councel whereas out of al Christians Kingedomes and Nations there came vnto it but onely fourtie Bishoppes and of the same somme so conninge that they might be thought meete to bee sente home againe to learne theire Grammare and so wel learned that they had neuer studied Diuinitie M. Hardinge Your waitinge for a general Councel was not vncertaine For at the settinge foorthe of your Apologie it was farre and wel entred and almost ended VVhat so euer successe thereof should folow ye ought not to haue refused it beinge in al respectes lawful Your assurance of Gods wil is none That is but your common biewoorde as it hath alwaies benne of Heretikes Ye ought to haue shewed good euidence for your beinge sure of Gods wil before ye attempted these greate and dangerous changes in Religion Neither becommeth it you to cal the determinations of a General Councel the iudgementes of mortal men so mutche as concerneth declaration of necessarie pointes of faithe but the promptinge and teachinge of the Holy Ghoste As for your prouincial Synode it was none Synodes cannot be keapte without Bishops Before ye claime the name of a Synode for your packinge and hudlinge togeather ye muste proue your selues Bishops whiche ye are not able to doo VVhat so euer ye saie there were neuer good men nor Catholike Bishops that kepte prouincial Synodes contrarie to approued and lawful General Councels as your Synode is moste contrary Neither can ye pretend that ye folowed any olde fathers puttinge thinges in experience before the comminge to an Vniuersall Councel Your Councel prouincial holden in Germanie by Charles the greate againste the seconde Nicene Councel general is a false forged matter as the Booke againste Images is whiche one Eli Phili the man in the Moones sonne Caluine Illyricus and other Heretikes haue fathered vpon that moste godly and Catholike Emperoure The Councel whiche you meane was a Godly and a Catholike Councel holden at Franck forde by Pope Adrian and Charles the greate againste the wicked Councel of the Heretikes named * Imagebreakers whiche they helde a litle before that at Constantinople whiche of those Heretikes was called the seuenth and general of the Catholikes Pseudosynodus that is to saie the false or forged Councel Of bothe these Councels thus writeth Abbas Vrspergensis so mutche commended of Melanchthon The Councel whiche a fewe yeeres before was assembled at Constantinople in the time of Irene and Constantine her sonne of them called the seuenth and Generall in this Councel holden at Frankforde was repealed and put awaie by consente of al as voide and superfluous so as from thence foorthe it shoulde be named neither the seuenth nor ought els If you beleue not this as the witnes of a Catholike writer then beleue Anselmus Rid an erneste professour of your owne the newest Gospell VVho writeth that Adrian the Bishop of Rome and Kinge Charles at the Councel holden at Frankforde execrated and accursed as Heretical the Councel of the Empiere of Constantinople and of the Greekes whiche they helde for thabolishinge of Sainctes Images Those be his very woordes Beleue Peucerus Philip Melancthons sonne in lawe writinge that the Councel of Nice was kepte by common consente of the Greeke Emperoure and of Charles If the seconde Councel of Nice whiche was altogeather for Images was holden by consente of Charles howe helde he a Councel in Germanie for puttinge awaie Images againste the Councel of Nice Beleue Carion and specially Pantaleo of Zurich a man of your owne the moste Euangelical Religion who vpon warrante of thauthoritie of Regino writeth that the Councel of Frank forde abrogated and disanulled the Greekes Councel that was againste the woorship of Images Briefely howe falsely you and sundrie other of your secte haue herein belied that woorthy Prince Charles the greate it maie easely appeare by that Paulus Aemylius writeth of him That he sente twelue Bishops out of Fraunce to the Councel then holden at Laterane in Rome in whiche the Imagebreakers false named and forged Councel was abrogated VVhere of General Councels ye make priuate and prouincial Synodes ye doo bisides learninge reason and custome of the Churche A Councel is not accompted general bicause Bishops of al Countries vnder Heauen be assembled but bicause many be assembled and al be lawfully called Els in times when Heresies raigne the Churche should neuer haue the necessarie remedie of a general Councel for alwaies Heretikes woulde refuse to come to it as ye haue to come to the late Councel at Trente In Persia Media Egypte Mauritania I wene ye finde fewe Bishops at this daie nor many in the other Countries whiche ye recken and those in manner altogeather ignorant and schismatikes Yet the Patriarkes of Assyria or Syria Orientalis and of Armenia who of late yeres were at Rome haue for theire Prouinces bothe subscribed to the Councel of Trente and receiued the whole Decrees of the same for theire peoples Your reporte of fourty Bishops onely present at the Councel of Trent and of their slender lerning is as true as your Doctrine contrary to that Councel is that is to saie in plaine termes starke false It is wel knowen there were at this late Councel of Trent in this Popes time wel neare two hundred Bishops The B. of Sarisburie What hope wee might conceiue of your Late Chapter of Tridente wée were sufficiently warned by the former holden vnder Pope Paulus 3. and Pope Iulius 3. wherein notwithstandinge your many yéeres studie and greate conference of so many and so Learned and so excellente and so mutche a doo yet in the end yée were neuer hable neither to suppresse your open stewes nor to auoide your Priestes Concubines nor to cause your Bishoppes to be residente vpon theire Charge and to doo theire deuties nor to resolue vs whether the Pope be aboue the Councel or the
Kinge Iohn and set al the people at libertie from their othes whereby thei ought allegeance to their Kinge and at laste wickedly and moste abominably they bereeued the same Kinge not onely of his Kingedome but also of his life Bisides this thei ExcoÌ„municated and cursed Kinge Henry the Eighte that moste famous Prince and stirred vp against him sommetime the Emperour sommetime the Frenche Kinge and as mutche as in them was put our Realme in hazarde to haue benne a very praie and spoile vnto the Enimie Yet were they but fooles and madde menne to thinke that either so mighty a Prince could be feared with bugges rattles or els that so Noble and greate a Kingdome might so easily euen at one morsel be deuoured and swalowed vp M. Hardinge Concerninge the case betweene these three Kinges of Englande and the Bishops of Rome for the time beinge I saie litle If they did wel and the Bishops euil they haue their rewarde the other their punishemente â—f otherwise or howe so euer eche one at Gods iudgemente shal haue his deserued measure But be it graunted al were true ye saie though we know the more part to be false VVhat though Kinge Henry the seconde were euil treated of Pope Alexander about the murthering of S. Thomas the Archebishop of Cantorbury and Kinge Iohn likewise of that zelous and learned Pope Innocentius the thirde c. The B. of Sarisburie Notwithstandinge the Pope as his manner hath benne raise Commotion within the Realme and arme the subiectes againste theire Soueraine and pulle the Crovvne Emperial from his heade yet by your Doctrine who so euer dare speake in his Princes right is a foole and killeth him selfe as if there were no life or saluation but onely vnder the frantike gouernement of the Pope Sutche obedience and loialtie the Pope hathe taught you towardes your Prince The Apologie Cap. 23. Diuision 2. And yet as though al this were too litle thei would needes haue made al the Realme Tributarie to them exacted theÌ„ce yeerely most vniuste and wrongeful taxes So deere coste vs the frendeship of the Cittie of Rome Wherefore if they haue gotten these thinges of vs by extortion through theire fraude and suttle sleightes we see no reason why we maie not plucke awaie the same from them againe by lawful waies and iuste meanes And if our Kinges in that darkenesse and blindenesse of the former times gaue them these thinges of theire owne accorde and liberalitie for Religions sake beinge moued with a certaine opinion of their fained holinesse now when the ignorance and erroure is spied out maie the Kinges theire Successours take them awaie againe seinge they haue the same Authoritie the Kinges theire Auncestours had before For the gifte is voide excepte it be allowed by the wil of the geeuer and that cannot seme a perfit wil whiche is dimmed and hindered by erroure M. Hardinge As for Peterpens and what other so euer summes of monie were yeerely paide to the Churche of Rome whiche were not by extorcion suttil sleightes by the Popes gotten as ye slaunder but freely and discretely by the prince and the realme for a greate cause graunted it is not a thing that so mutche grieueth the Pope as your departure from the true faith and Churche dothe as it maie wel appere by that whiche happened in Queene Maries raigne In whiche time although the Pope were acknowledged â–ª yet him selfe neuer was knowen to haue demaunded his Peterpens or any other yeerely paimentes againe But what is this to your schismes and Heresies This healpethe you nothinge for answeare to the hainous crime of your Apostasie The liberalitie of our countrie to the see of Rome whiche is the mother of al the VVeaste Churches hath ben so smal in comparison of certaine other Realmes as with the honoure of the Realme it might not seme to finde it selfe greued therewith Yet here ye sette a gnatte to an Elephante and make greate adoo about a litle The Realme is not so mutche enriched by retaininge that smal summe from the Pope as it is dishonored by your vndiscrete talke saueringe altogeather of miserie and niggardnes Ye shoulde haue shewed better stuffe at leaste in th ende of your booke The laste acte of a fable by rules of Poeterie shoulde be beste Ye haue done like a foolishe Poete making your ende so badde The Pope seeketh not your monie he seketh you He seeketh the safetie of your soules He seeketh like a good shepherde howe to reduce the streied shepe of Englande vnto the folde of Christes Churche God graunte we maie see his good intente happely acheued The B. of Sarisburie The Pope hathe enriched him selfe and gotten the treasures of the world into his owne handes not by fraude or guile as you saie but onely by the frée liberalitie of Kinges and Princes Yet S. Augustine saithe Non possumus dicere Nemo nos inuasores arguit violeÌ„tiae nullus accusat Quasi non maiorem interdum praedam à viduabus blandimenta cliciant quà m tormenta Nec interest apud Deum vtrùm vi an circumuentione quis res alienas occupet dummodò quoquo pacto teneat alienum Wee cannot saie No man chargeth vs with extorsion noman accuseth vs of violence For oftentimes of poore widowes a man maie geate more by flatterie then by rackinge And there is no difference before God whether a man holde an other mannes goodes by open violence or by guile if the thinge that he holdeth be not his owne But how maie this by your learninge M. Hardinge be called the liberalitie of the Prince He is liberal that is frée in bestowing of his own But you tel vs that al the Temporal goodes of the vvorlde are the Popes and not the Princes and that the Prince hath nothinge but by fauoure sufferance of the Pope Your Doctours wordes be these Papa est Dominus omnium temporalium secundum illud dictum Petri Dabo tibi omnia regna mundi The Pope is the Lorde of al temporal goodes accordinge to that saieinge of S. Peter that S. Peter neuer spake for they are the woordes of the Diuel I wil geue thee al the Kingdomes of the world An other of your Doctours saithe thus Dicunt quòd solus Papa est verus Dominus temporalium ita quòd potest auferre ab alio quòd aliâs suum est Sed praelati caeteri Principes non sunt Domini sed Tutores Procuratores Dispensatores Thei saie that the Pope onely is the very Lorde of Temporal thinges so that he maie take from any man that is his own As for other Prelates and Princes thei be the ouerseers and fermours and stewardes of wordly thinges but not the Lordes And Matthias Parisiensis saithe that Pope Innocentius 3 called Kinge Iohn the Kinge of England Vasallum suum That is to saie his féede man or his Tenante meaning thereby that the Realme of England vvas the Popes and not the Kinges If
others that al the furniture of his Booke was broughte to his hande somme by Greeke Readers somme by Scholemaisters somme by Ciuilians somme by Canonistes somme by Summistes somme by Glosers somme by others that he hath nothinge els but patched Notebookes huddled togeather by snappes and peeces Some parte hereof or rather the whole al togeather without exception to doo you pleasure I would easily haue graunted you M. Hardinge vpon smal suite with more fauoure and lesse adoo Take from mee what learninge yee liste distreine it and pounde it at your pleasure I wil neuer trouble you with Repleuin How be it if yee vtter al this of your indifferente iudgemente and certaine knowledge yet is it impertinente for wee pleaded of Faithe and not of Learninge if otherwise yee speake it of heate of minde and abundance of Cholere and therevpon thus proclaime it vnto the world it is great folie Truely yee neuer sawe Sir Defenders Bookes nor neuer sette your foote within his studie A wise Iudge wil seldome pronounce before he knowe If it shal please you for trial hereof to sende your frende he maie happily see that Sir Defender hath al these Summistes and Canonistes and Greekereaders and Scholemaisters of his owne Notwithstanding it maie becomme vs bothe to saie as a Heathen wiseman sommetime saide This onely thinge vvee knovve that vvee knovve nothinge Goddes Truthe dependeth not of our knowledge Our Tongues shal cease and our knowledge shal faile But the Glorie of God shal stande for euer For my parte I wil saie to you with S. Augustine Quaere doctiores sed caue praesumptores Seeke others of more Learninge but bevvare of them that praesume of Learning If any praise falle out in this respecte bestowe it freely vpon your Greeke-readers and Scholemaisters who in your iudgemente haue beste deserued it It shal be sufficiente for mee to haue saide the Truthe whiche though it appeare neuer so simple is hable to remoue a Mountaine of Learninge But happy are your Brethren of Louaine that are so speedily growen Learned vpon the suddaine not by greate studie I trowe but rather by destinee As soone as they had once sauoured the soile of that countrie they lookte onely vpon twoo poore Titles of the Lavve De Maledicis and De Clerico promoto per saltum and suddainely they were transfourmed and nowe goe for Doctours As for your Learninge M. Hardinge wee neuer reproued it How be it greately to feare it wee haue no cause God geeue you Grace yee maie wholy turne it to his glorie leste in the daie of the Lorde it be laide againste you He is ouer wel learned that bendeth his Learninge againste God But if wee be so vtterly voide of al manner of Learninge paintinge as you saie our Bookes and Margines with the Names and Authorities of so many Doctours what maie your frendes then thinke of you that standing so longe in the Defence of your Priuate Masse are not yet hable to allege one Doctoure nor Greeke nor Latine nor one nor other It seemeth greate marueile yee shoulde haue sutche abundance of Doctours and shewe so fewe specially where it standeth you so mutche vpon to open your stoare Consider I beseeche you your late Reioinder wherein as it is thought nothinge of your parte is leafte vntouched Of the Seuen and twentie Articles conteined in my Replie yee haue taken vpon you onely to answeare One. And yet of the same One yee haue scarcely touched the tenthe parte Your pourpose should haue benne therein by euidente Examples and good Authorities substantially to haue proued your Priuate Masse Now consider the order and plainenesse of your dealinge Yee bestowe welneare the thirde parte of your Booke aboute the Sacrifice as though there were no Sacrifice without Priuate Masse Al the reste yee consume in idle discourses and needelesse talkes of Consecration of the Intention of the Prieste of Minglinge the vvater vvith the vvine of the Name of the Masse of Transubstantiation of Real Presence of Churche Feastes whiche in olde time were called Agapae of Singulare Communion of Communion of Faithe of our Vnion with Christe of sendinge abroade the Sacramente of Priestes vviues of Vovves of Bigamie of Good vvoorkes of Onely Faithe of Publique Praier in a tongue vnknowen of Ceremonies of Fourmes of Accidentes of the Epistles Decretal of Clemens Cletus Anacletus Abdias Leontius c. Hereof yee haue tolde vs sutche thinges as perhaps wee knewe before and were not harde to be knowen and perteined ful litle to the pourpose Yee should rather haue proued that within the firste sixe hundred yeeres after Christe somme one or other of the Holy Learned Catholique Fathers Ministred the Holy Communion openly in the Churche and receiued the Sacramente Alone not diuidinge the same to any other the vvhole multitude of the people sittinge or standinge by and lookinge on him This was the mater that laie bitweene vs Hereunto yee should haue laide your force This was it yee should haue proued For proufe of sutche thinges as needed no proufe yee haue brought foorthe greate shewes of Learninge But as touchinge your Priuate Masse whiche onely yee had taken in hande to proue yee haue hitherto proued nothinge Your Reader M. Hardinge can neuer be neither so simple nor so partial but he muste needes haue an eie vnto your issue and remember what yee had in hande If emongest so many and so Learned woordes he finde not one woorde of that he sought for maie he not thinke he hath loste his laboure and that there is somme folie in your fardle Maie he not saie within him selfe Quò nunc se proripit iste VVhat shal I make of these vagaries what meaneth this man to shoote so faire biside the marke He muste needes perceiue by your silence that notwithstandinge your so many faire and liberal promisses yet the thinge he sought for cannot be founde Naie you your selfe for excuse hereof by expresse woordes haue tolde vs plainely It mighte be that none receiued the Sacramente vvith the Prieste And againe VVhether the Prieste had alvvaies a companie to receiue vvith him or sommetimes receiued alone that is a circumstance of a facte the proufe vvhereof by manifeste Testimonies cannot vvith reason be demaunded Againe It is contentious to put vs to proufe of the Circumstance Againe It forceth not vvhether vvee bringe foorthe Testimonies of the sixe hundred yeeres or no. Againe VVhether I can shevve that a Masse vvas saide vvithout companie presente to receiue vvith the Prieste that saide it or no vvhat skilleth it Againe I must telle you that I seeke not for Priuate Masse vvhiche to finde your scoffinge pretendeth me to be desirous I seeke not for that vvhiche I acknovvledge not And againe It forceth not greately vvhether it maie be proued or no VVhiche is as mutche as if yee had tolde vs in plainer wise that for the space of sixe hundred yeeres after Christe yee can heare no tidinges in any Doctoure or
Councel of your Priuate Masse VVhiche thinge thus of your parte confessed to our pourpose is sufficiente Now touchinge the Authoritie of your Amphilochius not long sithence yee thought his force had benne inuincible And therefore yee stoode vp alofte and braied alowde Novve M Ievvel and his Consacramentaries doo stagger I doubte not And for that cause as if it had benne somme greate woorthy Authoure yee alleged him seuen times with special reuerence in one Booke And yet nowe at the laste yee are contente for shame to turne him ouer and to let him goe Perhaps yee thought for the while a weake threede was sufficient to leade the people and that as folkes vse sommetimes to please children yee might quenche their thirste with an emptie cuppe Thus mutche hitherto touchinge somme partes of your Reioinder Concerninge your Former Booke whiche yee haue intitled a Confutation I neede to saie nothinge By the iudgemente of the wise it saithe sufficiently of it selfe But what meante you M. Hardinge therein to make so large discourse I wil not saie in the Defence for that woorde your frendes maie not beare but at the leaste in the fauoure of Open Stevves and to calle the same Malum necessarium that is to saie although an il thinge yet sutche a thinge as no good Common weale maie be without it VVhat meante you to that purpose to shewe vs the name and Authoritie of S. Augustine and thus to vpbraide vs in the ende In good soothe Maisters ye are too yonge to cōtrolle the Cittie of Rome in her doinges VVhat needed you to bestowe so fine eloquence in so fowle a cause Is vice growen so colde in Louaine that it muste be enflamed and authorized by open VVritinge VVhat meante you to allege the Prophete Dauid the Euangeliste S. Mathevve and S. Paule the Apostle for proufe of your Pardonnes VVil yee telle vs that Dauid Matthevve and Paule were Pardoners Or if yee dare to telle vs so must wee beleeue it If yee so manifestly mocke vs with open folies howe maie wee truste you in higher Mysteries S. Paule saithe Though our outwarde man be corrupted yet our inwarde man is renewed daie by daie Here yee telle vs in greate soothe that these woordes vndoubtedly serue to proue Purgatorie Christe saithe vnto Peter I haue praied for thee c. Therefore yee saie Christe novve requireth vs not to be obediente to Peter or Paule but to the Pope that sitteth in theire Chaire Christe saithe The Sonne of Man came not to destroie but to saue Ergo saie you The Breade and VVine in the Sacramente lose no parte of their former vertues but remaine in Fourmes and Accidentes euen as they vvere before as if the Sonne of God had come downe from Heauen to saue Accidentes Thus yee nippe of the sense and meaninge of the Holy Scriptures and feede vs onely with emptie woordes as if yee woulde pike awaie the corne and geeue vs the chaffe or conueigh awaie the iewels and throwe vs the bagge O M. Hardinge be not wilful let your owne conscience leade you VVas this the meaninge of S. Paule was this the comminge of Christe into the worlde was this the sense of the Holy Ghoste I wil not saie what Olde Doctour or Anciente Father but what Summiste what Canoniste what Childe what Heretique euer either so vndiscretely or so vnreuerently vsed the VVoorde of God I leaue the misconstrueinge and falsifieinge of so many Fathers the allowinge and soothinge of manifest Forgeries the vpholdinge of Abuses and open Erroures your weake Proufes your seely Coniectures your simple Gheasses your greate Ouersightes your bolde Affirmations your heapes of Vntruthes your disdeigneful Scornes your immoderate Scoffes your vngentile and vnciuile woordes as for example Villanes Theeues Fooles Disardes Lourdaines c. I leaue other your vnmannerly and vncleanely speaches Hungry Dogges eate dirty puddinges As common as life vvith beggers They serue the belly and the thinges beneath the belly VVas this a presente M. Hardinge meete either for the Modestie of a Virgine or for the Maiestie of a Prince specially sutche a Virgine and sutche a Prince so Chaste so Graue so Learned so VVise so Vertuous so Godly as Christendome seldome hath seene the like VVhat thought you that either her wisedome coulde not espie your fraudes and mockeries or that her chaste eares coulde quietly beare your lothesome talke Or thought you by the weight of sutche reasons to mooue Mountaines and to woorke woonders and to force her Maiestie to leaue christe and his Gospel and comme to Louaine to folowe you Yee threape her Maiestie fondely with kindenesse and as yee woulde haue the worlde imagine with good likinge and fauouringe of your side as if her Maiestie hauing benne brought vp from her cradle in the knowledge and feare of God and through Goddes greate Mercie and accordinge to his knowen VVil by the good aduise and counsel of the states of her Realme hauinge refourmed the House of God from the filthe and soile of your diuises shee stoode nowe in a mammeringe and were not hable to discerne either Falsehedde from Truthe or Darkenesse from Light or as if your Errours were not so grosse that a blinde man maie groape them with his Fingers Yee telle her Maiestie shee hath neither Parlamente nor Lavve nor Churche nor Cleregie The Churche of Englande yee commonly calle the Tovver of Babylon the Synagog of Antichriste and the Schoole of Sathan ye charge her Maiestie with disordered proceedinges with mainteinance of Infidelitie of Sacrilege of Schisme of Heresie For your possible power ye dishonour her Maiestie bothe abroade and at home where yee maie geate credite to your folies yee sclaunder the gouernmente yee disquiete her Maiesties louinge Subiectes yee breede Seditions yee procure Rebellions yee hazarde her estate And yet dare yee to pouder al this poison with a fewe dissembled and sugred woordes and to offer the same vnto her Maiestie for a presente VVel M. Hardinge if yee had foreseene the thankes that her Maiestie moste iustely yeelded you for your trauailes yee woulde not haue benne so bolde so rudely to presse into her presence It behooued you to be aduised not onely what yee wrote but also what Personage shoulde viewe your writinges If yee shal happen to write hereafter sende vs fewer woordes and more Learninge If yee shal diuise to talke any more of your Priuate Masse leaue your vagaries and goe directly to the pourpose Telle vs no moe sutche longe tales either of the Sacrifice or of other maters so farre from the question It is no good Logique to shifte of the thinge yee haue in hande and to mocke your poore Reader with an other Treade not so nicely and so gingerly M. Hardinge Saie not your Masse is a Circumstance and a mater of Facte and standeth onely vpon supposalles and gheasses and therefore needeth no further proufe VVhy soulde yee so trifle with the simple This is the Issue
ca. 19. Pius in Dialog Fol. 21. Dist 97. Ecclesia In sexta Synodo Constan Act. 4. In eadem Synodo Actione 1. Nicol. Cusanus de Donatione Constantini Legates PardoÌ„nes Citatur ab Agrippa de vanita Scientiar Nicol. Machiauel in Historia Concil Aphrica Cap. 105. * Vntruthe For they depende of the deceitfulnesse of man not of the povver of God Matth. 16. ‡ Vntruthe For Christe neuer gaue the Pope povver to deale Pardonnes * Vntruthe ioined vvith open folie For this vvas the onely vvaie to strengthen the Saracenes Marsilius Pataninus The very true cause of the â—â—uision of the Empiere Platyna in Leone 3. ‡ Vntruthe For S. Gregorie saithe Antichristus ipsas summas huius Saeculi potestates obtinebit * A nevve Sinne against the Holy Ghoste ‡ Vntruthe easy to be seene Reade the Ansvveare * A Diuine Povver in the Pope Iohn 12. 14. 16. Depofinge of Kinge Matthae 4. Apocalyp 17. In eodem Cap. Apocalyp 13. Augustin in Psalm 9. August in eundem Psalm Gregor in Iob. Ca. 41. Lib. 33. Ca. 22. Chrysostom In. 2. Thessaloni 2. Homil. 4. Clemen Lib. 2. De Appellationib Pastoralis Distin 22. Omnes In Sexto Li. 3. Ti. 16. De Statu Regularium Antonius de Rosellis Auentinus in Adriano 4. Clemen in Proâ—mi In Glossa Platyna in Liberio 2. Tomo Conciliorum In vita Syluerij Vigilij Heruaeus De potest Papae ca. 13. Appendix Eutropij in Syluerio Vrspergen Anno 1045. Heruaeus De Potest Papae Ca. 13. Paulus Aemylius Lib. 2. Gaguinus Plutarch in Catone Vticen Benuenutus Imolensis in Augustali Paulus Aemylius Lib. 3. Paul Aemylius in Chronice Benuenutus Imolen in Augustali Nihilo foelicior Patre In eo defecit Imperium in Gente Carolorum * Not altogeather so euil A proper qualification ‡ A ioily vvaie to fraie a Kinge * By this Diuinitie if any Kingedome refuse to be subiecte and thral to the See of Rome the Pope maie geue the same avvaie at his pleasure Philippus Bonifacius 8. Paralip Vrspergen In vita Bonifacij 8. In Sexto Idem in Platyna Sabel Aenead 9. Lib. 7. Martinus Polonus Dist 81. Si qui. In Glossa Abbas Vrspergen Paulus Aemyl Platyna Sabellicus Nauclerus Poison in the Sacramente Lib. 8. In scholijâ— in PlatinaÌ„ In Chronographia Paralipom Vrsperg Ann. 1313. Bapt. Egnatius Auentinus Carion Supplementum Chron. Textor in Officina Veneno extincti Matthias Parisien An. 1211. * A proper Schole of Humilitie Platina in vita Adriani ‡ Phy forshame cannot the pope learne Humilitie but by a draughte * Vntruthe For it is not sur mised by vs but recorded by your ovvne vvriters Sabellicus saithe Vt sedentis genitalia ab vltimo Diacono attrectentur Chrysostom in Matthae Homil. 74. Hieronym in Epist ad Galathas Cap. 4. Kisse the Popes foote Gregor Lib 4. Epist 38. Ceremoniar Li. 1. Sectio 5. Ca. 3. Deuotè osculatur Ceremoniar Li. 1. Sectio 5. Ca. 6. Ceremoniarium Lib. 3. Cap. 2. Seneca Pomponius Laetus in Diocletiano Alexander ab Alexandro 2. Thessalon 2. Matthae 4. Antoninus in Summa Par. 3. ti 22. Ca. 5. §. 4. Plutarch in Alexandrâ— * Vntruthes tvvoo togeatherâ— Reade the Ansvveare ‡ Al this is a great vntruthe and a shamelesse Fable 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 This is Greeke euen for a Pope * Vntruthe most manifeste For it is thus Ordred in the Popes ovvne Pontifical and in his ovvne Booke of Ceremonies The Popes Bridle The Popes Stirope Ceremoniarium Lib. 1. Cap. 8. Etiamsi Imperator aut quiuts maximus Princeps adesset Sellam ipsam cum Pontifice in humeris aliquantulum portare debet Ceremoniar Li. 1 sectio 5. Ca. 4. Dum Imperator haec vtilitatis Officia vult exhebere c. Tandem cum aliquibus bonis verbis recipieÌ„do permittit c. Ceremoniarium Lib. 1. Cap. 8. * Ceremoniar Li. 1. Sectio 3. ‡ Ceremoniar Lib. 2. Cap. 10. Etiamsi Rex aut Imperator sit * Ceremoniar Li. 1. Sectio 3. ‡ Ceremonia Li. 1. Sectio 13. ca. 2. Auentinus in Fredericho 1. ‡ In this One litle Marginal note M. Hardinge hath vttered foure Vntruthes altogeather Reade the Ansvveare ‡ Sabellicus Decadis 2. li. 1. 1220. Historiae rerum Venâ—taruÌ„ lib. 4. Franciscus Dandalus ‡ Vntruthe For he vvas then a Senatour of very greate Honour And at the nexte Election vvas chosen Duke * The offence stoode onely in healpinge their Neighbour beinge a bannished man into his Countrie ‡ Yet the right and state of bothe these Kingedomes is in his hande * Al these maters be ful solemnely proued and are vvoorthy to be publisshed by Proclamation * Al these maters be ful solemnely proued and are vvoorthy to be publisshed by Proclamation * Al these maters be ful solemnely proued and are vvoorthy to be publisshed by Proclamation Folio 186. a. Decades Seconde Decade Franciscus Dandalus Firste Booke Anno Do. 1220. Hierony Aduersus error Iohan. Hierosolymit Hierony De optimo genere interpretandi Not Duke August De Consensu Euangelist Lib. 2. Cap. 17. Iohan. 2. Hierony De Errorib Origenis Hierony in Ezechielem Lib. 9. Cap. 30. Franciscus Dandalus Genes 35. Augu. in quaest super Genesim Quaest 117. Matth. 2. Chrysost in Matthae Homil. 2. Clemens Stromat 1. Tertul. Contra Iud. cos Irenaeus Lib. 2. Cap. 34. 40. Matth. 26. Hilarius in Psalm 54. Donatio Constantini Dorman Fol. 22. Dorman Fol. 24. M. Hardinge Fol. 308. b. Athanasi in Apolog. M. Hardinge Fol. 309. a. willingly Chrysostom in 1. Corin. Homil. 21. Vrspergen Sabellicus Ennead 9. Lib. 3. Beno Cardinalis Gnavve boanes No Dogges vnder the Popes Table Clem. Lib. 2. De Senten re iudica Cap. 2. Sabellicus Ennead 9. Lib. 7. Rom. 1. Hierony Aduersus Pelagianos Lib. 1. * Vntruthe For the stories be plaine Reade the Ansvveare ‡ Vntruthe easily reproued by good Recordes Henricus Impera 4. Henricus Impera 5. * Manifeste Vntruthe See the Ansvveare ‡ Vntruthe For this vvas not the cause But the Pope vvoulde haue geuen the same him selfe ‡ Vntruthe For then he was at no variance with yâ— Pope * This Ancient Doctour is yet aliue and vvriteth vvoorthily for his hiere Gregor Heimburgen Carion An. 1103. Vrspergen Anno 1105. Vrspergen eod loco Pag. 257. Carion Auentinus Vrspergen Pag. 239. Carion Platyna in Seuero Papa Vrspergen Pag. 264. Auentinus Vrspergen Pag. 235. Sabellicus Enneadis 9. Lib. 3. Carion Helmoldus Matth. Palmer Synesius Plato Pope Hildebrande Socrat. Lib. 3. Cap. 22. Beno Cardinalis Auentinus Vrspergen ‡ As though for the moste parte they liued like Angelles In praescriptio CoÌ„tra Haeret. * VVhat faulte can ye finde in the Popes preachinge He neuer preacheth Treadinge on the Emperours necke * Vntruthe shamelesse as it shal appeare Carion Non tibi sed Petro. Et mihi Petro Aurelius Victor Pomponius Letus Budaeus de Asse Matthias à Michouia De Sarmatia Cap. 12. Platyna Textor in Officina Platyna Platyna in Syluestro 3. Constantien Concilium
ad Epis per Italiam Galliam Eusebi De vita Constan Orati 2. Cod. De SacrosaÌ„ Ecclesiis L. Iubemus §. ScieÌ„tes Cod. in Eod. titu 1. Decernimus Epist Eccle. Constantinop Ad Eccle. Pragen Concil Trident. Oratio Episcopi Bitontini In opere Triparti li. 2. ca. 1. In. 2. To. Concil ‡ Vntruthe As it shal plainely appeare * Vntruthe As large as manifeste ‡ Vntruthe For the Grecians neuer receiued these fantasies of Purgatorie O so merily this maÌ„ plaieth vvith his fansie Cicero De Oratore 2. Dist 17. Concil in Gloss Galenus The Greke Churche Liturgia Basilij Liturgia Chrysostomi Polydor. De Inuentoribus li. 8. cap. 1. Irenaeus li. 1. ca. â— Chrysost De Incomprehensi Dei natura Hom. 3. Leo. Epist 93. cap. 12. Leo Epist 97. cap. 3. August Epist 165 Priuate Masse in the Greke Churche Gregorius li. 4. Epist 32. Liturgia Iacobi Liturgia Chrysostomi Litur Basilij Georgius CassaÌ„der in Liturgijs Bessarion De Sacrament Eucharistiae Circa annum Domini 1450. Priuate Masse in the Greke Churche Matthi Illyricus in Testibus Veritatis pag. 5. Concil Ferrariâ— in Prooemio Petrus Vrbeuetanus in Vita Deusdedit Pap. DuraÌ„dus in Rationali li. 4. * Vntruth For God him selfe saithe Comme foorth from the middes of them O my people Apocal. 18. Daniel 6. 3. 1. Pet. 5. A hote kinde of Diuinitie Matthae 21. Iohan. 9. 12. 16. Iohan. Epist 3. Qui amat Primatum gerere Apocalyp 13. 24. Quae. 1. Ait 24. Quae. 3. Comperimus Rubri August Ad Clericos Hipponen Citatur 11. Quae. 3. Quid obest Augustin In Iohan. Tract 45. 1. Corinth 14. * Vntruthe For there is no better comparison then bitvvene Contraries Contraria iuxta se posita magis elucescunt ‡ Yenough no doubte and sufficiente For in the selfe same foure Articles M. Hard. hath vttered foure score and fourteen great vntruthes * Vnfruteful vaine distinctioÌ„s Reade the Ansvveare Comparison of churches Gregor Dialog li. 4. * This Booke is ful of Fables and Vanities and therefore not thought to bee S. Gregories Augustin Epist 162. ‡ S. Augustine is directely to the Contrarie See the Ansvveare * Our Price He meaneth the Sacramente of our Price 1. Corin. 11. Iohan. 3. Plini li. 18. CypriaÌ„ Ad CorneliuÌ„ li. 1. Epi. 3. Chrysostom In Matthae ca. 23. Tertul. De praescription Aelius Lampridius 1. Regum 5. Hieronym Ad AlgasiaÌ„ Quae. 11. Infidelles Dogges Mise August in IohaÌ„ tracta 26. Iohan. 6. Augusti Epist 162. Chrysostom Ad Haebr Homi. 16. De Con. Dis 2. Hoc est Augustin In Psalm 3. 1. Cor. 11. August Contra Cresco li. 1. ca. 23. August Contra Cresco li. 2 ca. 13. Tertullian De Baptismo Guilty of the Bodie and Bloude c. August De Tempore Sermo 20. Athana De Passione Cruce Domini Ezechiel 33. Luke 11. Concil Nicen. 2. Actio 6. Cyprian De Ablutione pedum August Ad Bonifaci Epist 50. August In IohaÌ„ tracta 26. Guiltie of the Bodie and Bloude c. August De Tempore Sermo 120. Ambros De Benediction Patriarch cap. 6. August In IohaÌ„ tracta 26. August â—odem loco * This is nothing but open mockerie ‡ Vntruthe too fonde for a child For there vvas neuer sutche order taken by the Gouernours of the Churche August Epist 48. August De Doctrina Christiana li. 2. ca. 5. August In Psal 105. The Scriptures in the vulgare tongues Chrysost in Iohan Homil. 1. Hieronym in Psalm 86. Theodoret. De corrigend Graecorum affectib Lib. 5. Articulo 15. * A mockerie For many heare not one Sermon in tvventie yeeres Apolog. Sacratis Matth. 11. Augusti Contra Iulian. Li. 5. Ca. 1 Chrysostom in Matth. Homil. 1. Augusti Episc 3. Cyrillus contra Iulian. Lib. 7. Augu. in Psal 131 Augu. In SeÌ„ten exceptis ex Augustino Pa. 1067. A vvoorthy Councel of fourtie Bishops sutche as they vvere In the time of Paulus 3 Augu. Epist 169. Esai 5. Dorman Pag. 15. Stanislaus Orichonius in Chimaera Ambros Lib. 5. Epist 33. Flattering of Princes Petr. De palude de potestat pp. 〈◊〉 40. Non nos on Glossa Extrauag Iohan 22. â—um inter in Glossa Hostien De traÌ„slaitone Praelais Quanto Hosiuscontra BrentuÌ„ Lib. 1. * Vntruthe staÌ„dinge in open and vvilful corruption Iacobus Andreae contra Hosium Pag 352. * Vaine folie For vvhat haue Humaine or Natural senses to doo vvith the sense of God To take Counsel of men ‡ The ExpositioÌ„s of the Fathers very seldome agree togeatâ— er Yet are they for the most parte contrarie to the Churche of Rome * The tradit 〈◊〉 novve vsed in the Romaine Churche are coâ—â—only coÌ„trarie to the TraditioÌ„s of the Anciente Learned Fathers Therefore this Rule is deceitetul Parte 5. Ca 10. Diui 2. Nic. Cusanus de Authoritate Ecclisiae c. Hierem 2. Tertullian in Apologetico Clemens AlexaÌ„drin in Oratione ad Genies Chryso in Epist ad Galat. Ca. 1. ‡ VVee preache againste your folies and fantasies not againste the Doctrine of the Churche * Vntruthe enclosed For they had Diuines a solemne Disputation vvas appointed at VVeasteminster in the preseÌ„ce of the States of the Realme But your Felovves fladde from it Parlamente * A notable great coÌ„panie There vvere onely fouretie poore Bishoppes and yet somme of the samevvere no Bishoppes Parlamente An. Dom. 1296. Anno 1273. In Prouisione de Martonae Ca. 9. Extra Qui Filj sint Legitimi Leges Canuti TrideÌ„tine councel Superintendentes Concil Trident. Sub Carolo Quinto Robert Coecus vide Concil Trident sub Paulo 3 Matthias Plac. Illyricus in Protest contra Concil Trident. Pagin 79. Io Sleâ—danus Li. 23. Anno. 1551. Conuentus quorundam Priuatus vtilitatis gratia institutâ—es Augustin De Ciuit Li. 19 Ca. 19. Augustin in Psalm 126. Chrysostom 1. ad Timoth. Hom 10. Hieronym Ad â—uagrium Anselm ad Philippen Ca. 1. Beda 1. Petri. 2. Petrus de Palude De Potest Colla. Apostolis Arti. 1. Thom. 2. 2. quae 184. Ar. 6. Al soares salued by the Councel of Tridente * Vntruthes open and vvithout same For example your Stevves your Courteghianes and Fornications vvere neuer touched Bernard in Cantica Sermo 33. Hulcote in Lib. Sapien. Lectio 23 Bernard in Conuers Pauli Bapt. Mantuan Fastor Lib. 4. Ad Leonem 10. Concil Trident. Nazian ad Procopium * Vntruthe For he speaketh of al manner of Councelles as vvel General as Prouincial His vvoordes be Prorsus decreui fugere Omnem Conuentum EpiscoporuÌ„ ‡ This is a lusty kinde of Diuinitie * Vntruthe For they are committed onely by the appointemente of the Prince Gregor Nazianzenus ad Procopium 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 The successe of councels Monkes and Abbates Sozomenus Hieronym Aduersus Luciferianos Tit. Liuius Maior pars vincit meliorem Oratio Synodica Legati Regis Franciae An. 1562. Copus Fol. 284. August Epist 81. August Epist 76 Erasm in Scholijs in Epistolam ad Rusticum Monachum ‡ S. Cyprians vvoordes be plaine Nihil sine