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A35559 A letter of Meric Casaubon D.D. &c to Peter du Moulin D.D. and prebendarie of the same church concerning natural experimental philosophie, and some books lately set out about it.; Letter of Meric Casaubon to Peter du Moulin concerning natural experimental philosophie Casaubon, Meric, 1599-1671.; Du Moulin, Peter, 1601-1684. 1669 (1669) Wing C805; ESTC R17546 22,974 40

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now further explain my self I observed there Practical useful learning appropriated to the way now in use by experiments and those that go any other way and follow other studies which have been formerly in request styled men of the Notional way By Practical useful learning Chymistry and the Mathematicks as the Author doth explain himself are also comprehended whatsoever is besides so far as I can understand by the book is proscribed as useless notional and unprofitable I had observed it before in another book written by a learned man a great admirer and abetter of Experimental Philosophy who speaks of the Ancients and ancient learning with a shew of much more respect and moderation but in effect to the same purpose to cry down all other studies and learning ordinarily comprehended under the title of humane learning to be but umbratick things verbal things of little or no use since this new light of true real Knowledge especially Now what other arguments need they either to advance the credit of their way and of that way they commend to us or to cry down any other way that hath hitherto been in request then to make the world beleeve that it is of no use You know what judgement was pass'd against the fig-tree that bare no fruit And that earth or ground which instead of herbs meet for the use of men beareth nothing but thorns and bryers disputing and wrangling in their phrase is pronounced by St Paul accursed and worthy to be burned But I ask what is it that these account useful and useless For if nothing must be accounted useful as some seem to determine but what doth afford some use for the necessities or conveniencies of this present life I do not know but that a Brewer or a Baker a skilful Horse-leech or a Smith or the like may contest in point of true worth or desert with many who for their learning as then thought have been reputed generally the great Lights and Ornaments of their age though such as never medled in their writings with experimental philosophy They that beleeve that man doth consist of two chief parts the body and a soul whereof the soul the more noble and more considerable part as even Heathens most of them have determined it natural reason will oblige them to beleeve that a greater share of care and provision doth belong to that which is immortal from the right ordering of which all true happiness present or future doth depend then to that which is mortal and naturally brutish and of little continuance Those men therefore who have applied themselves by their writings to promote vertue and godliness in their kind that is so far as God was known to them were generally thought to have deserved of mankind as well if not better as the most renowned inventours or promoters of useful Arts or Trades Had Aristotle never written any thing but his Ethicks that incomparable piece he deserved the thanks of all ages and I make no question but in all ages even since Christianity many thousands have reaped the fruit of that incomparable work which alone is sufficient where it meets with right palats to speak its worth but compared with others that have written of that argument since and have not troden in his paths becomes more illustrious I might say the same of those Aurea Carmina which are attributed to Pythagoras and which Galen that excellent both Philosopher and Physician had in such esteem that he did not onely commend them to others as a sovereign antidote against the diseases of the mind but himself doth profess of himself that he was wont first to read but afterwards to repeat them once or twice every day for the benefit he reaped by them So of Cebes his Table of Cicero's Offices and not to name others of Epictetus his Enchiridion though much later then some of the rest yet not inferiour unto any And here by the way both by him and some others that have written upon him we may find this very point excellently well handled Whether those men who make it their work to reclaim men from that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or close adherence of the mind to the body and senses which most men are naturally prone to to the care and culture of their souls ought in reason to be accounted unprofitable to the Common-wealth or rather of all Professions the most useful and necessary I wish some of our Mechanicks who are so highly conceited of their way laying aside prejudice and preengagement if they can would take the pains to read those admirable discourses it may be they would find that the sway of the times more then any weight of right reason hath led them hitherto into this opinion But alas poor Aristotle your Author will not allow of above three books of his to be worth the reading and his Ethicks is none of them And elsewhere he doth question whether those works generally ascribedto Aristotle were or are his indeed whereby we may guess though he have written against him he saith how well he was read in Aristotle Else the style of Aristotle so constant to it self every where and in a manner unimitable but much more the matter so solid and rational every where almost would easily have convinced him But certainly the light account he makes of him all along reproaching his adversary so often for his love to and esteem of Aristotle would make a man admire what account he made of himself I think he had done well before he had taken such a task upon himself to have made it appear the easier task of the two as I conceive that all men that have been famous in former ages for their judgement wit and learning were no such thing really as they appeared unto the world but meer Idols and Phantasms not true rational men such as this latter age hath produced and their judgement therefore not at all to be regarded Then indeed we might with more patience and equanimity hear what he hath to say against Aristotle for sound and solid reason and for all manner of knowledge attainable by meer man without divine revelation the wonder of all ages hitherto But not to insist on former ages I will name but one man of very fresh memory What do you think that Julius Caesar Scaliger for learning and judgement may be put in the balance to be weighed with your Author Vir propter excellentem omnium disciplinarum eruditionem admirandus So Pererius that learned and judicious Jesuite of him and so so many others that a man out of all kind of writers might easily swell a book into a great volume of testimonies concerning that admirable man He had read Aristotle to the purpose it seems again and again by the use that he makes of him upon every occasion but seldom names him without some intimation of highest admiration and veneration that can without Idolatry be deferred unto man And what think you of meer Naturalists
more without Divine revelation is most beloved of God 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and that God will do him good or requite him and that he is likely thereby to become most happy Who also doth maintain that this is the way for a man 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to purchase immortality to himself there also reproving a speech very rife in those days among worldly men what may we think of them who are so set upon the conveniences of this life that they will scarce allow any thing else to be considerable that mortals so born should not trouble their minds with the thought of things immortal What think you doth this deserve the note or censure of heathen notions why I say so you shall hear by and by But I have done with Aristotles Ethicks Now to return to the magnificent Plea of useful knowledge much such a judgement ordinary people made anciently of the most renowned Philosophers as Anaxagoras Thales and others whom they did acknowledge to teach 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is things in themselves excellent indeed profound and sublime 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but useless because they contributed nothing to the uses of this present life as Aristotle doth somewhere report This in ignorant Heathens might be tolerable but in Christians great pretenders to knowledge more to be wondred at ¶ I lighted some years ago upon a little book intituled The reformed Schoolmaster c. but he treats of the reformation of Universities also whose case he doth make so sad and lamentable as nothing can be conceived more but yet doth give us this comfort that if he may have his will or desire they may become a thousand times we may bate him nine hundred I think one hundred will serve more useful Indeed I never read any man that did not pretend to immediate commission from God speak more magisterially and as it were authentically but withal I must say I never read any thing more whimsical and chimerical then his Reformation doth appear unto me He doth much relish of Comenius his project of making all men wise and goes upon the same grounds When I see fair Towns built in the air and a sure commerce between those who inhabit the earth and those of the Moon whoever they are established I shall have some hopes that these projects in case which God forbid they be beleeved and trial made may come to somewhat Whether your Author had his Plùs ultrà from thence I know not but it matters not for I think no sober man ever denied but that all kind of learning with Gods blessing is capable of improvement but withall it must be acknowledged that many conceited whimsical men as Lullus Ramus and the like have projected wayes of improvement which if generally received would have proved very destructive to learning Amongst other passages of that little book this is one Whatsoever in the teaching of tongues doth not tend to make them an help to traditional knowledge by the manifestation of real truths in sciences is superfluous and not to be insisted upon especially towards children whence followeth that the curious study of Criticisms and observation of styles in Authors and of strains of wit which speak nothing of reality in sciences are to be left to such as delight in Vanities more then in Truths Truth and Reality and Sciences brave words are they not to work upon them who either want will or wit to search into the bottom of things where in very deed instead of deeds and realities nothing will be found but words Such is his conceit that boys and children must be taught things before they be taught words or languages His project was to advance the credit of Januae linguarum every page almost hath them and sometimes he speaks of them as though all useful learning might be reduced to them For my part I wonder they were ever received into any good School except it be to cashier good authors out of them as needless whereas I think the best use of languages is the reading of such authors not for their words onely but for the excellency of the matter which in several kinds and to several uses they do contain and am very confident that where the reading of such authors is out of fashion barbarism and grossest ignorance will quickly follow I speak it of Poets as well as others I cannot but admire at the conceit of a more considerable man of the same society as I conceive who would erect a new kind of Poetry grounded upon the Scriptures and knowledge of Nature and experiments and some other heads excluding ancient Mythology the chief ground and foundation of ancient Poetry as useless and fictitious What would he have all ancient Poets Greek and Latin turned out of doors Can such a thing enter into the heart of men that pretend to the improvement of learning This indeed Julian the Apostate did maliciously plot and enact against the Christians of his time forbidding them the use of publick Schools and reading of ancient Poets which by the Fathers of the Church was looked upon as none of the least persecutions And indeed if ancient Poets with their Mythology be turn'd out of doors all ancient authors must likewise which without a competent knowledge of ancient Poets and their Mythology no more can ancient Fathers Greek especially in very many places cannot be understood Of Homer particularly as elsewhere in a peculiar Dissertation of this subject I have had occasion more fully to declare my opinion is that by reason of his antiquity and that conformity in many rites speeches and some choice sentences which may be observed in him with the Scriptures of the old Testament observed by some learned Commentators as Ribera and some others in their frequent quotations out of Homer which also made learned Capellus of Sedan so confidently to profess his opinion or suspicion at least that the Scriptures of the old Testament were known to him he doth not onely very much conduce to the right understanding of many obscure places in Scripture but also may be some confirmation to the antiquity and by consequent in some degree to the truth of the same And should I say that St Paul was no stranger to Homer as I am sure he was well read in Demosthenes or Homer no stranger to him I hope it would be no disparagement to St Paul or matter of scandal to any judicious sober man no more then the citing of those Greek Poets Epimenides Menander and Aratus their words is or hath been much inferiour the best of them to Homer in many respects And for Virgil the best of Poets after Homer that God was pleased to make use of his incomparable wit whereof himself was the Author or Donor to celebrate the coming of his Son our Saviour into the world hath been the opinion of some ancient and later Christians men of excellent judgement But again a great part of the ancient Mythology though with much
out his matter to the best advantage pressed very vigorously which is in his own words that it hath kept him from surveying the works of God that magnifie and discover their Author from which onely the true Philosophie is obtained Good God! can any body that hath but looked into Aristotle though never so perfunctorily except it be by the help of some glass that represents things quite contrary say so But he goes on And the zeal I have for Almighty God his glory discovered in his creatures hath inspired me with some smartness and severity against heathen notions which have so unhappily diverted learned men from the study of Gods great book universal nature and consequently robbed him of that honour and those acclamations that are due to him for those admirable results of his wisdom and goodness This Author I said before doth not want words he can express himself smartly enough upon very light occasions which in a good cause is no small commendation but otherwise I should have been very suspicious if not confident he had borrowed this goodly language from some profane Chymist such as our Robert Fludd was with whom such professions of zeal for the glory of God are very frequent and ordinary and to that end to set out his glory in its greatest Iustre doth propose unto us the consideration of the Philosophers stone applying all or most mysteries of the Scripture to it as that wherein onely or chiefly the Goodness Power and Wisdom of God is to be seen and admired so that in very truth his zeal was more for the Philosophers stone then God or the Philosophers stone a God of his own making for which he was so zealous But this I cannot averr upon mine own credit For though his books when I was very young curious enough to pry into every thing that promised somewhat more then ordinary did offer themselves to me in Book-sellers shops yet I profess I could never dispense so much with my reason or conscience as to read long where I found nothing but what I judged in a high degree both impertinent and blasphemous I must therefore discharge my self upon learned Gassendus who together with Mersennus will I think make good what I have said of him to the full But indeed it is the common language of all extravagant Chymists they all as many as I have seen that are such insist upon the same thing Neither is it their plea or language onely but of all men generally who professing Christianity would raise admiration by broaching unheard of mysteries There be men in the world we know who maintain with much shew of zeal and holiness that the stars of heaven are so many significant Characters and Hieroglyphicks there placed by God of purpose the better to manifest his Wisdom to the beholders and from the right reading understanding whereof greatest mysteries depend Neither want they some places of Scripture which they miserably abuse to countenance the business Gafarell is a great abetter of this heavenly mystery The Glory of God and the Wisdom of God here also must be the pretence which to oppose in very truth the result and product of sick brains hunting after Novelties how can it be less then heathenish profaneness and impiety Yes if you will beleeve them But granting as I do and all men will that well consider of it that praesentem Deum quaelibet herba that there is nothing in nature in sight so inconsiderable but may give an intelligent man matter and occasion to admire and magnifie the Power and Wisdom of God Is the consideration of all those mentioned in this book or like curiosities the Great Book of God from which men must learn the great Power and Wisdom of the Creator It is ordinary enough indeed observed by many among men to wonder at nothing though never so wonderful and admirable but what is unusual far fetch'd and seldom seen Many who never took notice of either Sun or Moon and the benefits of either the vicissitudes of the year the flux and reflux of the Sea and the like to admire them or God in them because daily and ordinary will yet gaze with wonder at a Meteor the shooting of a Star as they call it or an ignis fatuus and the like But they are not thought the wisest of men that are of that temper David I hope understood wherein the Glory of God consisted and for what God himself would be magnified by men principally as well as another We do not find by any of those admirable Psalms that are written of that subject that any other works of God are specified but those that are very visible to all men sufficient also to make God visible to them who have so much grace which wicked Epicurus had not to beleeve that they were not made to eat and drink and to enjoy the pleasures of this life but to observe the works of God and to glorifie him therefore And besides those admirable Works of the Creation which many now too many taught by Epicurus and his mates are apt to despise and vilifie as being the works not of a wise God but blinde atoms there be other works of God not less to be admired and those be the Works of his Providence and Government of the World which the same Psalmist in his 107. Psalm doth very particularly insist upon and doth advise all men to consider well they that are wise saith he will consider these things implying also as I conceive that the consideration of those things will make a man wise so that it is very possible if we beleeve him for a man to be both wise and religious a great admirer of Gods works his Goodness Wisdom and Power who never understood or shall understand any of those things never known before as we are told here After all this we need less wonder that your Authour I pray excuse me that I call him so not that I think you are bound to maintain whatsoever he saith but because I had him first from you should appropriate substantial wisdom to this kind of Experimental Philosophy though I hope he doth not intend thereby Solomons 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in our English found wisdom intended by Solomon of the true fear and sanctifying knowledge of God to which the promises of eternal life are annexed from whence it would follow that according to him none can be saved but by this way of Philosophy But I will be more charitable then to think he could forget himself so much though some may justly stumble at such superlative expressions and his Philosophy with sober men more likely to lose then to gain by them For though I deny not I said it before and say it again that the study of Nature to a man that hath grace and is well grounded in the principles of Faith may afford somewhat beside the known and most visible works of God as Sun and stars c. wherein God as the
the Ancients and what they are which happily might deserve as much respect so much at least as not to be passed in silence Many such things besides what is collected by Pancirollus in a Treatise of that Argument have been observed by more then one Physicians and others all which I cannot call to mind suddenly One thing may be cutting for the stone in the kidneys which in Hippocrates time was practised I have read it in more then one with good success but now and ever since Galens time for which some blame him lost and forgotten To this divers other things are added by learned Physicians as that which they call dissectio in Empyematibus exustio in jecoris humoribus cranii perforatio in aqua cerebri sectio supra oculum in suffusionibus extractio aquae intercutis which last though some venture upon in these days also yet it is observed that few or none escape for want of the right way To these I make no question but many more might be added and I am sure I have met with more in their books which I do not at this time remember Whether Galen had any knowledge of the venae lacteae and the like I know not but I am confident he had that knowledge of all the muscles sinews arteries fibers and the like and their proper use in every part of the body as doth appear by those admirable books he hath written of that subject as I think few Physicians have at this day of which knowledge what use he made may appear by one story which I remember to have read in him A young boy belonging to a great man in Rome had received some hurt in his body by a fall out of a Coach or Chariot such as they had in those days The boy was very dear to his Master who spared no cost to have him perfectly cured Many Physicians and Chirurgeons were employed but for all they could do two fingers of one of his hands continued as it were dead Galen happened to come to Rome about that time and was invited by the great man to see the boy he did and being well informed of all particulars of his fall he presently took away all that he found applied to the sick fingers and applied somewhat to one of the bones of his back whereupon the fingers immediately or soon after recovered their former use strength Yet I know Vesalius made it his business to contradict Galen as much as he could but other later Anatomists have defended him and Vesalius though generally acknowledged an excellent Anatomist hath found some who have taken as much pains to contradict him It is my opinion that there is scarce any art or faculty wherein we do not come short of the Ancients Indeed their industry much provoked by the greatness of rewards was greater generally that cannot be denied Painting Carving the Statuaria are in a manner lost in comparison of what they had attained to So is the Art of Coyning of money as used in the best times of the Roman Empire best Writers and Artificers of these days acknowledge it So is Musick Ludovicus Vives besides Pancirollus before named was of that opinion I am sure and there is so much to be said that it is so that I do not see how it can be doubted or denied by any man The secret of those eternal Lamps as we may call them found in divers ancient graves though so much by more then one hath been written of them continues a secret to this day and I doubt whether modern Chymistry so much admired by some men afford any thing that deserves more admiration Doth any body pretend in these days to understand the Mathematicks as Archimedes did What would not men Kings and Princes give for one of his inventions But I have said more of him very lately Hitherto nothing hath been said to impair the credit or usefulness of Natural or Experimental Philosophy but that we would not allow it to usurp upon all other learning as not considerable in comparison Now I crave leave to tell you that it is as all good things more or less very apt to be abused and to degenerate into Atheism Men that are much fixed upon matter and secundary causes and sensual objects if great care be not taken may in time there be many examples and by degrees forget that there be such things in the world as Spirits substances really existing and of great power though not visible or palpable by their nature forget I say and consequently discredit supernatural operations and at last that there is a God and that their souls are immortal This is a great precipice and the contempt of all other learning an ill presage I cannot tell what should make the Metaphysicks that noble science so despicable unto them them I mean who have declared themselves and their opinion of it Indeed they have nothing to do with the senses and may be called Notional but real though and the more abstracted from the senses therefore the more divine What a coil hath been kept with Cartesius's Ego cogito to prove the immortality of the soul thereby How much more effectually may it be proved by the capacity men have of Metaphysical contemplations or the consideration of Ens quatenus Ens so abstracted from all that is sensual and material For my part I profess next the mysteries of our faith I never have been more sensible of the immortality of humane souls then when I had the happiness to be conversant with that noble Science To me truly it is no good signe that this secondary kind of Theology or Divinity and so called by many you know is so out of request But Natural Philosophy I grant is more taking and bewitching generally there is a plain reason for it and though cryed up for the onely useful knowledge yet if well considered it may be found sometimes to have much more of pleasure and curiosity in it then use and profit even in that sense for what is truly useful and profitable or most useful and profitable is another question which they intend Yet Give me leave I pray to tell you this pretty story by the way if we must or may beleeve every thing that is written by men addicted to this way we may find wonderful effects of it even to moralize men which indeed is the best use of any worldly thing which can be made Gassendus in the life of Peyreskius a right worthy man and great Patron of all kind of learning hath this story of him Dicebat verò nihil sibi unquam animi regendi persuasionem aequè fecisse c. Give me leave to tell it you in English though I know you a great Master of the Latin Tongue Peyreskius it seems had shut in a microscope a louse and a flie together how they fell out Gassendus doth not tell us but it seems they were not long together but they began to quarrel and to fight and