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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
B01449	The defence of the people called Quakers: being a reply, to a book lately published by certain priests of the county of Norfolk, under the pretended title of The Quakers challenge. And containing, some brief and modest animadversions upon the book it self. Several certificates, which detect the errors in those of West-Dereham, and clear the people called Quakers of the said challenge. The letters that passed between them and the priests.	Ashby, Richard, 1663?-1734.	1699 (1699)	Wing A3939; Interim Tract Supplement Guide 4152.f.20[18]; ESTC R1295	32,665	56

John Hubbard John Brown Dan. Phillips Phillip Tassill The Priests Answer to the Foregoing Letter Dated November the 3 d. 1698. Friends WE Observe in your last Dated October the 31st 1698. how apt you are to Catch at every little Escape tho' nothing relating to the Cause the omission of a Date We hope tho' we forgot the 27th of October we shall not forget the 8th of December You are offended we call your first Letter a Challenge to us tho' our betters have thought it the Boldest and Pertest that ever was sent to the whole Host of Israel viz. as you more than once in your Letter term it to us or any of us all and to any of our Cloth and that from the Hands of such whom we never took to be any great Goliahs But all this Anger it seems is because we so Zealously as you think Espouse Francis Bugg's Charge One may see how ready you are to take Fire when so small a Spark will kindle you For one of us was not there when he delivered his Charge Another of us came by meer accident and None of us were any other than as Witnesses to the Delivery of it which any Three of your honest Neigbours we suppose might have been without Offence As to the Books you mention'd to us to be Read which you conceive would have cooled our Zeal for Bugg and his so often as you say baffl'd Charge You may please to know that we have Read them and that Bugg is not Answer'd nor can be Answer'd any other way seeing the Charge is drawn from Quotations out of your own Books but by denying the Truth of Them which your pretended Answerers do not do but betake themselves to their usual Palliating and Painting Tricks to cover over and hide their Deformities We confess we had a better Opinion of your Principles before we saw your Books than now we have for indeed we have received more Satisfaction from your Answers than from the Books they pretend to Answer being confirm'd more in our Belief that they are Unanswerable And if you write in this manner we shall never desire to take the Pen out of your Hands for it will do us no Hurt but for your Gall that is in the Ink. Yet because you say he must be Rejected and you will have it so we have given you your Humour and have accepted of your Challenge without him Friends Your People have been ever ready to say Our Charges have been Lies Forgeries and every where have run with this Cry in their Mouths Lies all Lies because alas they never Read our Books or at least never Compar'd them with your Authors Therefore we perceive that Writing Books will not do but we must bring forth those that you have Written at a Publick Meeting and lay them open before your Deluded Followers and desire them to see with their own Eyes and perhaps they may see such a Frightful Sight as they little expected there You might easily have discerned that our Charge affects the whole Body of your People it relating to Blasphemies so long and so often Printed and yet never Contradicted or Censured but Asserted to be from Persons Infallible Blasphemies so often approved of by your Second Days Meetings where all your Books are Examined and by an Index Expurgatorius Corrected tho' written from the Mouth of the Lord. So that your Church hath owned them and we may justly Charge the Blasphemy of those Books upon it till they Disown them But you seem to be much Concerned for the Restraint we lay upon you so that you may not go out of this Diocess for your assistance But truly Sirs you see we have put the same Restraint upon our selves we will not go out of the Diocess perhaps but a little way from Home for ours we cannot think you can be at a want for help in such a Diocess where there are several Thousands of you Besides if you will have a little Patience the Persons you had probably designed for this Service may have work enough at Home ere long For we are Inclinable to believe that the like Charge to this will go through many Diocesses in this Kingdom So that they may save their Powder and Shot till the Charge comes to their Door Friends tho' we intend to Charge you with Blasphemy out of your own Books yet we cannot think it fit to give you the Authors Names Line and Page for that were to send you our Arguments before the Day we shall use them that you may have time the more cunningly to Elude the Force of them It is enough to let you see we intend to Charge you with Blasphemy as expressed in our last tho' we should not be so Foolishly Generous as to tell you the very Place where we intend to Assault you Besides we our selves have not yet read over some of your Books out of which as we are Reading them there arises every Day new Matter for a Charge and so perhaps there may to the time of our Meeting For we can scarce open a Book of yours but presently we are even Frighted with such Apparition that sends us to our Prayers for a Poor Deluded People that are daily Haunted with them And further we may add that you have their Books as well as we and would you read them over as we do ye your selves could not but see those Blasphemies we Charge you with being too big to escape your sight But you think it is fit the Authors of those Books out of which we extract your Charge should be permitted to speak for themselves You cannot but know that most of those Authors are Dead and as for them that are Alive we have already heard them in your Prints to little purpose However they have no Reason to Challenge it as a peculiar Due to them to be the only Vindicators of their Cause seeing every particular Member of your Church is concern'd in it as well as they So that it is a Charge upon every one of you all as well as upon the Authors of those Books you having Espoused them till they be Disown'd and Condemn'd by you To conclude We cannot see how it can consist with either Justice or Prudence to alter our Method for the Reasons given We therefore think it but a vain thing for you to trouble your selves or us with any more such Letters Poor People that are going Blindfold to Samariah instead of Dothan The Lord open your Eyes to see where you are and whither you are a going is the Prayer of your best of Friends tho' you may possibly think us your greatest Enemies Hen. Meriton John Meriton Lau. Parke To Henry Meriton John Meriton and Laurence Parke a Reply to the foregoing Letter dated November 3. 1698. Friends YOURS of the third Instant we received wherein is the date of your former in Answer to which when we in Friendly Sort told you of that Omission it was not that we did

Catch at any little escape of yours which did at least relate to the Letter if not the Cause But to proceed As in our last we Judge the Term Challenge not proper to the Offer we made whatever the Judgment of your Selves or Betters may be concerning it As for its Boldness and Pertness as you are pleased to Term it we take it to be another Escape of your Memories to suppose it herein to exceed any of those as you say which were sent to the whole Host of Israel But such as it is we doubt not to make Good and that in Truth void of Wrath. As to Francis Bugg you did Espouse his Charge Blindfold as appears by your after Inquiry and Reading of our Books and did Espouse it by more Ways than that of Witnessing to the Delivery of the Charge which none of our Honest unprejudicate Neighbours would As for Quotations made by Bugg from our Books you say the petended Answerers deny the Truth of them but betake themselves to their Usual Palliating and Painting Tricks This Assertion we have no Cause to Credit but for the present will say that we know that in several Answers of ours to Books of this sort there is frequently Detected false Quotations and his Apparent Forgeries which if either you have not Read or not Observed it might have been well enough to forbear that Scurrility of Painting and Tricks Now for your Charge you Acknowledge it to be upon the whole Body of us and therefore as in our former we think you are not just in your Limitation nor does your Threat if you will have a little Patience c. fright us from still Insisting on our Exceptions for as our last did declare our Acceptance of such of your Propositions as were Equal and Fair and desired the rest might be agreeable and such as we are Perswaded no Ingenuous or Just Persons would Evade or Deny us So we still insist on them not knowing any Power or Dominion you have over us to over rule what we have so fairly offered to qualifie your Limitations For if you intend to confine us as Respondents only who are within this Diocess it is Reasonable to confine you not to Charge Persons or their Books more Remote or Absent For why should a Man whom you may Charge be obliged to Answer by Proxy when perhaps he can better Defend himself the Justice of the Common Law in this Case much exceeds your pretence of Edification and this being denied by you we take it for granted your Design is to Censure and pass Judgment on Persons Unheard And if your Charge be to be drawn from Books it is as reasonable by the Common Voice of Mankind that their Titles and Pages be given the Authors of which if Living have an undoubted Right to Explain for Themselves or if Dead such Notice is reasonable for our due Preparation to Answer Till which we shall only say that the Living Labours of the Dead have this Justice due to Them viz. that the whole be considered and the Scope and Intent of the Writer be taken and not Rigidly much less Falsly to pervert his Words to a Sense Contrary and Repugnant to the Scope of the whole The refusal hereof will speak a Design Partial Injurious and Precipitant but we hoping on better Consideration you 'l do otherwise do expect as above to be sent us in such convenient Time as we may Examine them which cannot be in less time then Three Weeks at least This Demand it 's true you Laugh at and call it a Foolish Generosity yet it being Reasonable we insist on it For the Frightful Apparitions which by opening our Books you say sent you to your Prayers we doubt your Frights or Feavers have been so great as to prevent your having any true Idea of Them or any loving Concern for Vs therein And not finding our Selves Haunted as you Suggest we rather desire you to speak Truth than offer false Sacrifice For Conclusion to this and to Try your Ingenuity whether your Method be to do as you would be done unto we put these following Questions I. Whether you are willing to be Charged out of all the Old and New Books Pamphlets and Sermons that your Brethen the Clergy have Wrote and Printed to stand and fall by them II. Are you willing we should Publickly Charge you with Errors or Mistakes out of any of the abovementioned and not beforehand give the Particular Instances to you For know ye that we expect Equal Liberty with you to Charge as well as to be Charged III. Will you Personate all your Brethren as above both Dead and Living so as to be Charged out of their Books in their stead Your direct Answer we expect without further Evasion Boast or Menace in the interim conclude Your abused because not sufficiently known Friends Richard Ashby John Hubbard Daniel Phillips Richard Case The Reply dated November the 16th 1698. Friends YOUR last does not a little astonish Us. 1st That you should deny your Challenge which is as plain an one as Words in English can make it and truly very brave to all our Cloth that is to Nine or Ten Thousand of Us. 2ly That you affirm that we espoused Bugg's Cause which you or some of you cannot but know the contrary by one of us For when the last Summer you demanded of Hen. Meriton whether he would Justifie Bugg's Books Written against you he Answer'd They contained Matter of Fact which he was not capable of judging of having not the Books to compare them with Francis Bugg's Writings yet told you that if his Citations were true you see then he made an If of it and therefore did not justifie them he would justifie such Expressions were Blasphemy But you are still offended at our Unreasonable Limitation of you as to the Place whence you are to fetch your Disputants But Friends did not you begin with us Did not you limit us when you rejected Francis Bugg And all others too that were not of our Cloth some of whom you know too well might have been very useful to us in this Service Nay did not you reject Francis Bugg for this Reason because he had been Answered as you pretend over and over again and was unreasonable as if we had nothing to do but Actum agere And may not we say the same of your Hackney Disputants they have trudged so long in that Road and have been Spur'd and Gall'd by us enough already and therefore in reason we ought to turn them off a-while and give them rest till another occasion more plainly they have been Answered over and over already and are unreasonable Besides Your Church which you profess your selves to be so Zealous Members of have owned and approved of those Books we intend to quote and your selves have been known to admire and almost adore them and their Authors And therefore till you disclaim them you are as much concern'd to Vindicate them as the

Authors themselves for by owning them you become joynt Authors and your Plea for them will be the Plea of Parties and not of Proxies But now When your Court of Equity will not Relieve you you Fly to Common Law but if you give us no better Proof of your Skill in it then in this Instance we shall have little Reason to take your Counsel in Law Business Friends 'T is Matter of Fact we Charge you with that we find such and such Blasphemous Expressions in your Books For Matter of Right whether such Expressions are to be esteemed Blasphemy we shall leave it to the Judgment of the Auditors The Matters of Fact your Authors have already owned them at least so much as will make good our Charge And for Matter of Right whether such Expressions be Blasphemous or no we think the Common Law will not allow the Accused Malefactor when he 's accused of the Fact aright to Judge of the Law or whether his Fact hath been a Breach of it Suppose we had Charged some of your Friends with Common Swearing by their Maker and they should not deny Matter of Fact that they have said such words only they excuse them with a great deal of Artifice that they were spoke in Passion that they dropt from them rashly or their Minds did a little run out or truly they do not affect such Speeches or they may see Cause otherwise to word them is there any Law or Equity such Men should be admitted in any Court in the World to Plead and Apologize for Common Swearing If Matter of Fact be prov'd or own'd may not the Judge turn such Men out of the Court and pass the Definitive upon them The Fact is own'd by the Men themselves that such Expressions are in their Books so much at leastwise as will prove the Charge and let the Auditory whom we Appeal to as Judges in this Case Determine whether Blasphemy or no. We dare Affirm it will be easier for the People to Judge that such and such Words are Blasphemy then that such words are Swearing And we are Sorry to see you are so Zealous for such Authors only to give them an an opportunity to excuse Blasphemy At last you direct us to the Golden Rule in Divinity to do as we would be done by and think you have Gravell'd us with Three Questions which you suppose we cannot Answer if we stick to our former Measure without apparent Violation of it Now Sirs what are those hard Measures I pray Why truly after we have Charged some of yours with Blasphemy in some Books Printed Ten Twenty Thirty some Forty Years ago that were never Corrected nor Censured by your Church in your Second Days Meeting Erected on purpose to Examine Books and Licence them but have been Approved and Commended to us and Admired by almost all of you we Demand that you would either Justifie or Disown them Publickly under your Hands And now you ask us very Pertinently Whether we are willing to be Charged with all the Old and New Books and Pamphlets that our Brethren of the Clergy have Written or Printed to stand or fall by them Such an Impertinency as this is would be almost Intolerable but that we are so commonly used to them by your Party Do but Scratch your Heads a little and consider seriously the Force of such a Consequence We are bound to Justifie or Disown all the Books of our Brethren as to every little Error or Mistake because we call upon you only to Justifie or Dosown the Blasphemies of yours We doubt not but there have been some tolerable Errors in ours which are no great Blot to an Author that acknowledges himself to be a Man viz. Fallible but a Mighty Prejudice against the Infallible Club whether at Rome or Grace-Church-street that pretend they cannot Err And we are only obliged to a Charitable Forbearance in such Cases when you will be obliged for every Error you find in yours by reason of such a Pretence to disown them as Cheats But if any of our Authors have Wrote or Printed Blasphemy we are sure such have not been approved or allowed of by our General Meeting our Convocation who have made bold to Censure them without asking the Authors leave or if there be any such that have escaped the Knowledge of the Convocation and therefore not Censured by them perhaps they have been Condemned if not Burnt by Parliaments and Vniversities or if they have escaped such a Censure bring out such Books of ours when you will and you shall see we will either Justifie or Disown them without calling for the Authors to come and plead their Cause To the Second Question we Answer You shall have equal Liberty with us Produce our Books and your Charge against them Supposing it to be of Blasphemy when you will after you have first Answered ours and we will give you leave to reserve your particular Instances to the very Time and Place of Meeting if you please For we are assured that Blasphemy is of so strong and rank a Scent that every Christian that hath not his Nose quite stop'd that as St. Paul says can but exercise his Senses never so little about Good or Evil as soon as ever it 's open'd or discover'd will presently nauseate and turn away from it And we are sorry that so many of you have got such a Stuffing in your Heads as not to perceive it nay you think them sweet Odours sure that you will not be satisfied till you be allowed Advocates to Plead for them as sound and wholsome and therefore to be continued in the best Room of the House the Church The Third Question is Co-incident with the First but we must answer it or you 'll say we dropt it for its Weight for there is no reason we should appear in the Person of all those our Brethren so as to be Charged with every little Error out of their Books in their stead but this we will do bring forth their Books and Blasphemies as we have said before and we will either Justifie them or Disown them without consulting the Authors of them And this is all that we desire of you either to Justifie or Disown Yours and Their Blasphemies under your Hands which we may expect from you by the same Rule you lay before us Do as you would be done by And why may we not expect this of you seeing you have Abandoned your Authors in lesser matters as in their Orders about Ribbonds Lace Slit-wast-Coats Prancing Steeds Costly Habits Fine Clothes Stately Buildings in forbearing to Thee and Thou and Sir your Betters Seeing many of you have opposed their Orders in Paying Tithes Womens Meetings Swearing in Courts of Judicature of carrying no Guns in their Ships or using the Carnal Weapon Last of all We take notice with much joy to see you so much fall off from the former Rude and Rugged Behaviour of those Men whose Cause you Espouse towards the Clergy It

from the Quakers so call'd his mis-representing and abusing them in his Sermons was one great cause why some left him And whereas they say The Wife of one Becket a Quaker gave her self the trouble of going three Miles to the Ministers House on purpose to vex him with Quakerly Questions in a Quibling Way on Ascention day Morning 1695. To which take her Certificate This is to Certifie that I Mary Becket the Wife of Thomas Becket was much disatisfied in my Mind concerning some Religious Matters which I heard Laurence Parke the Priest of West-Dereham where I dwell preach in his Sermons where he use to preach frequently not only against the Quakers but other Dissenters at several times before I went among the said People called Quakers and for that reason I went to his House in Barton desiring to be satisfied by him touching those Matters they now call Quakerly Questions not designing to disturb him but to be instructed by him he told me he could not then resolve me but would endeavour to satisfie me in some of his Sermons if I would come to Church which I did but instead of being satisfied touching those Matters I grew more dissatisfied in my Mind until I heard some of the People called Quakers and then it pleased the Lord I came to be satisfied concerning those Matters And this was the true reason of my going to his House and not in the least to Vex or Disturb him Witness my hand Mary Becket And whereas they further say They remember the time that Becket the Husband himself watched their Minister in a Lane not far from the Church lined on both sides with People to Dispute him when his Spirits were exhausted with Preaching and his Strength weakened by performing the Duty of the Day Here follows Thomas Becket's Certificate This is to Certifie that I Thomas Becket was accidentally alone in my own Hired Ground which lies next the Steeple-House-Yard in West-Dereham when the Preist and the People were coming from their Worship and I had no intent to speak a Word to Laurence Parke the Priest but before he came near me I being by the Gate next the Road where he came he held up his Hand and said to his Hearers Look yonder stands a Man do not you think he looks as if he had seen God or to that purpose adding The Light is in him and then I replied If the Light be not within thee thou art in a Miserable Condition or Words to that effect When he came nearer he asked me how I did I asked him how he did and wished him to leave telling so many Lyes of the People called Quakers till he had heard the Truth of those Matters he reply'd When there was a Meeting at my House he would come to it and gave me his Hand to it but he never came although he had notice To the Truth hereof I Subscribe my Name Thomas Becket And whereas they further say that One Phillips a Quaker went to disturb their Minister at his own House one Munday in May last to Challenge and Provoke him to Dispute with the Quakers at a Meeting at Stoak that was to be held on the Morrow as himself confessed after he came Home And he and his Friends set abroad the Report some days before to call the Country together and then gave it out the Priest promised but durst not come Now here follows a Certificate of the said Phillips This is to Certifie that I William Phillips of West-Dereham being informed that Laurence Parke was much disturbed at a Meeting that was at our Town the beginning of the Month call'd May last and that he said If he knew where there was another Meeting he would come to it I thought fit to go to his House and let him know there was to be a Meeting the next day at Stoak he answered He could not or should not come for that he was not then ☞ provided but said that in a short time there would be Meetings enough when they had got the Books meaning our Friends Books and more Discourse we had together and he would have me sit down in his House and Drink and I did not think he was offended with me for my friendly going to his House for We parted as good Neighbours and I thought then in good Will to each other Witness my Hand William Phillips And whereas they further say This Phillips together with one Mason and Becket by speaking Profanely of the Ordinances of Christ and setting up a Conventicle contrary to Law c. This is a General and Proofless Charge and deny'd by them and till Prov'd needs no further Reply And whereas they further Certifie that their Minister Laurence Parke had many Provocations and Challenges One above all the rest say they we cannot forget which was given him in Writing when he was in the Pulpit by one Lilly in sight of the whole Congregation In Answer to which take the following Certificates This is to Certifie That about Five or Six Years ago I Phillip Tassill together with John Brown being at the Burial of a Relation at West-Dereham at which time some of the Parishioners being the hearers of Laurence Park told us that their Minister had Preached That the Quakers had not Read in a Bible these Forty Years and that they did not care if all the Bibles were Burn'd Now we hearing the Report of such a very Sad Wicked and most Uncharitable Abuse were concerned knowing our Innocency did therefore write a few Lines to him that he would admit us to a Friendly Conference that he might either Prove his Charge or Clear Vs before the People or to that Effect without Advising with any of our Friends Witness our Hands Phillip Tassill John Brown This is to Certifie That Mr. Park having Preached much against the Quakers and Discoursed that he would Prove them to be No Christians the Report thereof came to some of the said People and one of them gave me a few Lines to give him to desire a Friendly Conference with him about those Matters which I accordingly gave to the said Mr. Park and though I gave him them in the Church it was my own Doing and not by Direction of any one to give him them in that Place And I did not understand that more than One or Two of the said People wrote those Lines or that I might not give him them as Inoffensively in that Place as in any other being one of his Hearers This is about Five or Six Years ago as I remember Witness my Hand John Lilly And whereas they further Certifie That this and nothing but this made them and their Ministers willing to Permit Mr. Bugg to come amongst them to try if he could Conjure down that busie Spirit which possesses the Quakers and is so troublesome to us Reply First We may conclude by the Nature and Grossness of these words that you poor People know not what you have sign'd For you have given a Notable Reflection upon Fra. Bugg Is he indeed turn'd Conjurer But if it be so we know that Spirit the Sincere Quakers are led by has always been too hard for such Conjurers But pray wherefore are you so harsh in Reflections on your Neighbours as though they were led by a Diabolical Spirit This touches not them only but Christ also in whom they have Believed and that Spirit that dwelt in those that Persecuted our Lord dwells too much in you they call'd the Master of the House Beelzebub and also a Blasphemer no Marvel then if his Followers be called so We remember this Caution The Servant is not greater than his Lord we are sorry for your sakes that you should Offer that Injury to your own Souls but do desire you to Repent that God may shew you Mercy for you together with your Minister lie under that Wo spoken of in Isaiah 5. in calling Good Evil and Light Darkness Further whereas you confess That you and your Minister accompanied F. Bugg to one Quakers House and sent one of his Printed Charges in a Letter to Samuel Cater Answ This is a clear Confession here are Eighteen of you and your Minister have Espoused F. Bugg's Challenge and sent it not only to a Quaker's House but to S. Cater of Little Port in the Isle of Ely for him and Five more of his Brethren to come forth and joyn with your Minister and F. Bugg and Four more So now you have done well to be Ingenuous and Confess your Act for now the Challenge lies at your Door Here is a Printed Challenge you sent Dated August 10. 1698. And here is your Minister's Letter Dated August 28. 1698. And here is the 3 d of October fixt for the Day of the Dispute and if we do not Appear we must be judged Insincere and Cowardly And all this on your Part before the Quakers wrote their Friendly Letter Dated September the 7th 1698. ERRATA PAge 7. line 10. for laghed read laughed l. 29. f. ye there r. yet here p. 13. l. 13. f. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 r. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 p. 20. l. 27. f. Office r. Office p. 48. l. 10. f. Preist r. Priest FINIS