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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A62556 A treatise of the nature of Catholick faith and heresie with reflexion upon the nullitie of the English Protestant church and clergy / by N.N. Talbot, Peter, 1620-1680. 1657 (1657) Wing T119; ESTC R38283 71,413 104

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it_o be_v very_o credible_a that_o if_o master_n laud_n have_v find_v success_n in_o his_o first_o attempt_n he_o will_v in_o time_n reform_v the_o form_n of_o the_o english_a ordination_n and_o thrust_v in_o some_o word_n express_v the_o power_n of_o priest_n and_o bishop_n see_v he_o and_o other_o of_o the_o protestant_a clergy_n of_o late_a 94._o kallend_n a_o 3._o ed._n vl._n c._n 12._o mason_n pag._n 94._o do_v differ_v so_o much_o in_o opinion_n concern_v priesthood_n and_o episcopacy_n from_o those_o who_o live_v in_o king_n edward_n the_o vi_o time_n and_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o queen_n elizabeth_n reign_n he_o can_v not_o miss_v with_o six_o prelate_n and_o six_o other_o man_n learn_v in_o god_n law_n whereof_o the_o great_a number_n may_v devise_v as_o warrantable_a a_o form_n of_o make_v bishop_n and_o priest_n as_o be_v devise_v by_o the_o same_o number_n in_o king_n edward_n time_n yet_o all_o have_v be_v in_o vain_a because_o neither_o master_n laud_v himself_o nor_o any_o of_o the_o rest_n then_o live_v can_v consecrate_v other_o even_o with_o the_o catholic_n form_n see_v none_o of_o they_o all_o have_v valid_a ordination_n as_o have_v be_v demonstrate_v therefore_o it_o be_v think_v expedient_a to_o cover_v the_o want_n of_o the_o reality_n of_o true_a ordination_n with_o a_o exterior_a formality_n of_o long_a cloak_n and_o surplise_n and_o supply_v the_o want_n of_o sacrifice_n with_o cross_n and_o candlestick_n upon_o the_o altar_n 26_o master_n mason_n commend_v much_o the_o wisdom_n of_o the_o english_a church_n that_o so_o discreet_o and_o religious_o pare_v away_o all_o superfluous_a ceremony_n in_o ordination_n and_o say_v it_o be_v a_o singular_a privilege_n of_o master_n parker_n that_o be_v the_o 70._o archbishop_z after_o saint_n austin_n the_o apostle_n of_o england_n yet_o of_o all_o that_o number_n he_o be_v the_o only_a man_n that_o receive_v consecration_n without_o the_o pope_n bull_n and_o superfluous_a aaronicall_a ornament_n how_o discreet_a and_o religious_a the_o english_a church_n be_v in_o pare_n away_o pretend_a superfluity_n in_o ordination_n can_v not_o be_v determine_v by_o master_n mason_n until_o he_o make_v appear_v that_o all_o be_v superfluous_a in_o that_o kind_n which_o he_o and_o the_o puritan_n who_o make_v the_o english_a ritual_a in_o king_n edward_n the_o vi_o time_n fancy_v superfluous_a it_o be_v not_o the_o part_n of_o any_o particular_a church_n to_o pare_v away_o any_o thing_n that_o have_v be_v deliver_v to_o they_o by_o antiquity_n to_o be_v observe_v though_o some_o word_n have_v be_v add_v to_o ancient_a form_n of_o ordination_n for_o their_o great_a explanation_n or_o solemnity_n yet_o none_o be_v ever_o so_o rash_a as_o to_o pare_v away_o any_o especial_o those_o that_o seem_v to_o signify_v the_o power_n and_o authority_n intend_v by_o the_o ordainer_n 27_o to_o conclude_v this_o matter_n i_o say_v with_o saint_n jerome_n ecclesia_fw-la non_fw-la est_fw-la quae_fw-la non_fw-la habet_fw-la sacerdotem_fw-la how_o can_v the_o protestant_n church_n be_v the_o true_a church_n see_v it_o have_v not_o any_o one_o priest_n or_o bishop_n though_o it_o be_v not_o evident_a that_o it_o have_v no_o valid_a ordination_n yet_o so_o many_o manifest_a uncertainty_n and_o doubt_n as_o themselves_o must_v acknowledge_v concern_v their_o ordination_n do_v demonstrate_v the_o nullity_n of_o their_o church_n for_o if_o there_o remain_v but_o one_o solid_a and_o prudent_a doubt_n of_o the_o validity_n of_o ordination_n of_o any_o church_n its_o impossible_a it_o shall_v be_v the_o true_a catholic_n and_o apostolic_a because_o a_o doubtful_a clergy_n make_v a_o doubtful_a church_n and_o a_o doubtful_a church_n be_v no_o church_n the_o first_o step_n to_o christian_a and_o catholic_n belief_n be_v the_o well_o ground_a credibility_n exclude_v all_o prudent_a doubt_n of_o that_o church_n whereof_o we_o be_v member_n if_o we_o have_v any_o prudent_a ground_n to_o doubt_v of_o the_o clergy_n we_o have_v the_o same_o to_o doubt_v of_o our_o church_n and_o of_o the_o faith_n or_o doctrine_n propose_v by_o its_o testimony_n and_o the_o true_a faith_n admit_v of_o no_o such_o doubt_n therefore_o protestant_n before_o they_o can_v prudent_o believe_v to_o have_v true_a faith_n or_o be_v in_o the_o catholic_n must_v clear_v all_o the_o doubt_n heretofore_o object_v against_o their_o ordination_n which_o i_o will_v brief_o sum_n up_o 28_o first_n they_o must_v prove_v clear_o that_o the_o story_n of_o the_o nagshead_n be_v a_o fable_n and_o consequent_o that_o master_n neale_n and_o the_o other_o catholic_n who_o say_v they_o be_v eye-witness_n of_o what_o pass_v be_v impudent_a impostor_n and_o content_a to_o be_v convict_v as_o such_o in_o the_o same_o place_n and_o time_n that_o they_o invent_v so_o palpable_a a_o lie_n second_o they_o must_v make_v appear_v evident_o that_o all_o the_o catholic_n of_o that_o time_n both_o bishop_n priest_n and_o other_o who_o believe_v master_n neale_n and_o suffer_v much_o for_o conscience_n be_v all_o run_v mad_a because_o they_o believe_v so_o great_a a_o foppery_n or_o if_o they_o do_v not_o believe_v he_o they_o be_v most_o wicked_a and_o sacrilegeous_a person_n to_o engage_v posterity_n by_o their_o relation_n and_o testimony_n to_o reordaine_v the_o protestant_a clergy_n three_o they_o must_v demonstrate_v that_o all_o the_o first_o protestant_n bishop_n and_o other_o consecrate_v by_o they_o do_v conspire_v not_o to_o contradict_v the_o story_n of_o the_o nagshead_n and_o their_o own_o invalid_a consecration_n for_o the_o space_n of_o fifty_o and_o odd_a year_n to_o the_o great_a discredit_n of_o themselves_o and_o their_o whole_a church_n where_o as_o they_o may_v easy_o stop_v their_o adversary_n mouth_n by_o produce_v witness_n and_o record_n of_o the_o pretend_a solemn_a congregation_n at_o lambeth_n be_v so_o often_o demand_v in_o print_a book_n by_o who_o and_o how_o be_v they_o ordain_v four_o it_o must_v be_v make_v appear_v to_o the_o world_n that_o bancroft_n bishop_n of_o london_n can_v be_v ignorant_a of_o the_o public_a register_n of_o parker_n ordination_n at_o lambeth_n himself_o be_v so_o much_o concern_v in_o it_o and_o in_o the_o knowledge_n of_o it_o if_o he_o be_v not_o ignorant_a of_o the_o public_a register_n why_o do_v he_o answer_v so_o fond_o and_o contrary_a to_o the_o very_a protestant_a principle_n that_o a_o priest_n may_v ordain_v bishop_n in_o case_n of_o necessity_n five_o it_o must_v be_v manifest_o prove_v that_o not_o only_a bancroft_n be_v ignorant_a of_o the_o public_a register_n but_o that_o all_o the_o bishop_n of_o england_n who_o be_v present_a in_o the_o late_a parliament_n know_v nothing_o of_o they_o whereas_o doctor_n morton_n pretend_v bishop_n of_o durham_n affirm_v public_o in_o the_o upper_a house_n that_o the_o first_o protestant_n bishop_n be_v consecrate_v at_o the_o nagshead_n this_o answer_n all_o the_o rest_n approve_v by_o their_o silence_n and_o be_v glad_a to_o have_v that_o retire_a place_n against_o the_o presbyterian_o who_o prove_v clear_o that_o they_o be_v not_o consecrate_v at_o lambeth_n as_o master_n masen_n pretend_v but_o if_o doctor_n morton_n and_o the_o rest_n of_o the_o bishop_n know_v any_o thing_n of_o mason_n book_n and_o register_n as_o infallible_o they_o do_v why_o do_v not_o they_o stick_v to_o that_o this_o prove_v evident_o that_o none_o of_o they_o do_v give_v credit_n to_o mason_n new_o find_v register_n 29_o sixthly_a suppose_v master_n mason_n forge_v record_n be_v true_a it_o must_v be_v make_v clear_a that_o there_o be_v in_o their_o ordination_n a_o competent_a number_n of_o true_a bishop_n and_o consequent_o that_o the_o bishop_n of_o edward_n the_o vi_o be_v valid_o consecrate_v notwithstanding_o the_o declaration_n of_o the_o contrary_a by_o public_a act_n and_o sentence_n in_o queen_n maryes_fw-mi reign_n seven_o if_o there_o be_v not_o a_o competent_a number_n of_o true_a bishop_n whether_o in_o the_o begin_n of_o queen_n elizabeth_n reign_n there_o as_o any_o such_o necessity_n as_o protestant_n pretend_v have_v then_o in_o england_n 14._o catholic_n and_o true_a bishop_n eight_o it_o must_v be_v make_v appear_v that_o barlowe_n be_v consecrate_v who_o be_v the_o principal_a consecrator_n of_o parker_n for_o if_o he_o be_v how_o be_v it_o possible_a that_o in_o all_o the_o register_n of_o england_n and_o wales_n there_o shall_v be_v no_o mention_n of_o his_o consecration_n last_o it_o must_v be_v prove_v clear_o that_o the_o form_n use_v in_o the_o ordain_v of_o protestant_a minister_n and_o bishop_n be_v valid_a it_o will_v be_v a_o very_a hard_a task_n to_o clear_v all_o these_o doubt_n and_o exception_n how_o unfortunate_o be_v charles_n the_o first_o late_a king_n of_o england_n misinform_v in_o matter_n of_o his_o bishop_n and_o clergy_n what_o scruple_n can_v he_o have_v have_v if_o he_o have_v know_v
age_n that_o be_v to_o say_v in_o every_o century_n or_o age_n there_o be_v honest_a man_n and_o lawful_a witness_n who_o testify_v that_o henry_n the_o iv_o ancestor_n descend_v from_o saint_n lewis_n though_o one_o only_a age_n can_v remember_v or_o see_v saint_n lewis_n yet_o the_o next_o ensue_v do_v see_v the_o first_o and_o hear_v their_o testimony_n the_o three_o do_v see_v the_o second_o etc._n etc._n in_o every_o age_n do_v live_v man_n who_o testimony_n may_v be_v rely_v upon_o it_o must_v be_v grant_v therefore_o by_o all_o that_o the_o knowledge_n which_o be_v ground_v upon_o a_o continual_a and_o never_o interrupt_v tradition_n be_v sufficient_a for_o lawful_a witness_n 6_o that_o the_o roman_n catholic_n church_n have_v a_o continual_a and_o never_o interrupt_v tradition_n of_o its_o faith_n and_o sense_n of_o scripture_n be_v teach_v by_o christ_n and_o the_o apostle_n can_v not_o be_v deny_v by_o our_o adversary_n it_o be_v evident_a to_o the_o world_n that_o they_o who_o contradict_v any_o article_n of_o this_o faith_n we_o now_o profess_v in_o former_a age_n be_v look_v upon_o and_o condemn_v as_o heretic_n which_o be_v a_o infallible_a argument_n that_o we_o in_o every_o age_n receive_v our_o doctrine_n from_o the_o former_a not_o as_o the_o word_n of_o man_n but_o as_o the_o word_n of_o god_n or_o as_o divine_a revelation_n for_o if_o it_o be_v not_o believe_v as_o divine_a revelation_n why_o shall_v we_o condemn_v man_n as_o heretic_n because_o they_o deny_v it_o neither_o do_v protestant_n deny_v that_o we_o believe_v our_o tradition_n and_o the_o testimony_n of_o our_o church_n to_o be_v ground_v upon_o divine_a revelation_n they_o only_o say_v we_o be_v mistake_v and_o that_o both_o our_o tradition_n and_o testimony_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n be_v fallible_a but_o then_o we_o urge_v that_o they_o acknowledge_v both_o be_v infallible_a in_o deliver_v to_o they_o the_o scripture_n and_o testify_v that_o it_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n therefore_o in_o deliver_v and_o testify_v all_o the_o rest_n see_v the_o same_o testimony_n deliver_v many_o thing_n together_o must_v be_v of_o equal_a authority_n in_o all_o and_o equal_o believe_v by_o they_o who_o accept_v of_o it_o as_o a_o lawful_a proof_n all_o our_o pretend_a reformer_n have_v no_o other_o ground_n in_o the_o year_n 1517._o to_o believe_v scripture_n as_o divine_a revelation_n but_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n therefore_o they_o ought_v to_o believe_v all_o the_o rest_n or_o not_o to_o believe_v scripture_n 7_o i_o say_v it_o concern_v also_o our_o adversary_n to_o grant_v that_o their_o reform_a church_n have_v no_o lawful_a witness_n in_o matter_n of_o faith_n because_o there_o can_v not_o be_v that_o sufficient_a knowledge_n which_o be_v require_v in_o a_o lawful_a witness_n of_o faith_n without_o tradition_n whereby_o it_o may_v appear_v that_o the_o faith_n and_o sense_n of_o scripture_n of_o this_o age_n do_v agree_v with_o that_o of_o the_o primitive_a church_n if_o once_o our_o adversary_n acknowledge_v lawful_a witness_n of_o thing_n pass_v long_o since_o without_o a_o constant_a and_o never_o interrupt_v tradition_n every_o man_n who_o spirit_n of_o ambition_n move_v he_o may_v pretend_v to_o be_v true_a heir_n of_o any_o hereditary_a crown_n or_o estate_n and_o without_o further_a proof_n than_o his_o own_o word_n and_o spirit_n or_o some_o obscure_a text_n of_o scripture_n will_v exclude_v king_n and_o other_o who_o right_n be_v ground_v upon_o tradition_n but_o if_o tradition_n be_v so_o necessary_a to_o preserve_v and_o make_v credible_a the_o testimony_n of_o man_n in_o matter_n of_o estate_n and_o right_n in_o the_o commonwealth_n it_o can_v not_o be_v superfluous_a to_o make_v credible_a the_o testimony_n of_o man_n concern_v matter_n of_o faith_n 8_o it_o remain_v now_o we_o prove_v that_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o roman_n catholic_n church_n have_v be_v confirm_v with_o supernatural_a sign_n or_o miracle_n but_o see_v there_o be_v in_o the_o roman_a church_n lawful_a witness_n who_o prove_v that_o the_o faith_n which_o they_o now_o profess_v be_v the_o same_o with_o that_o of_o the_o primitive_a church_n miracle_n also_o be_v prove_v by_o the_o same_o witness_n it_o be_v grant_v by_o protestant_n themselves_o that_o miracle_n be_v wrought_v in_o the_o primitive_a church_n to_o confirm_v the_o faith_n which_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n teach_v yet_o in_o the_o roman_n catholic_n church_n there_o be_v now_o lawful_a witness_n and_o have_v be_v in_o every_o age_n since_o christ_n preach_v that_o there_o have_v be_v miracle_n do_v in_o confirmation_n of_o the_o roman_a faith_n this_o be_v evident_a to_o all_o who_o read_v the_o ecclesiastical_a history_n of_o present_a and_o past_a time_n neither_o can_v our_o adversary_n deny_v that_o we_o have_v lawful_a witness_n for_o miracle_n now_o wrought_v in_o our_o church_n even_o in_o confirmation_n of_o that_o doctrine_n wherein_o we_o differ_v from_o they_o and_o report_v by_o so_o credible_a testimony_n chap._n see_v the_o 13._o chap._n that_o it_o be_v imprudence_n in_o any_o person_n whosoever_o to_o deny_v they_o which_o be_v enough_o to_o propose_v sufficient_o our_o doctrine_n as_o divine_a revelation_n but_o protestant_n do_v not_o believe_v our_o miracle_n because_o they_o imagine_v that_o they_o be_v against_o scripture_n that_o be_v against_o their_o own_o interpretation_n of_o it_o and_o that_o some_o miracle_n have_v be_v false_a and_o forge_v we_o do_v not_o say_v that_o all_o thing_n which_o the_o common_a people_n think_v to_o be_v miracle_n be_v real_o true_a miracle_n but_o we_o affirm_v that_o true_a miracle_n there_o be_v in_o our_o church_n and_o very_o frequent_a confirm_v that_o very_a doctrine_n which_o protestant_n reject_v the_o forgery_n or_o knavery_n of_o some_o particular_a wicked_a man_n in_o feign_a miracle_n can_v not_o prejudice_v all_o especial_o such_o as_o be_v see_v and_o experiment_v by_o person_n of_o know_a integrity_n and_o learning_n able_a to_o discern_v between_o true_a and_o false_a miracle_n otherwise_o it_o will_v follow_v that_o all_o the_o new_a testament_n must_v be_v call_v in_o question_n or_o deny_v to_o be_v god_n word_n because_o saint_n thomas_n his_o pretend_a gospel_n or_o nicodemus_n his_o writing_n be_v condemn_v as_o forge_v or_o apocryphal_a that_o no_o reform_a church_n of_o protestant_n can_v have_v lawful_a witness_n to_o propose_v sufficient_o their_o doctrine_n as_o divine_a revelation_n be_v evident_a because_o for_o the_o space_n of_o 1500._o year_n they_o be_v without_o any_o visible_a church_n or_o tradition_n therefore_o their_o witness_n also_o be_v invisible_a and_o by_o consequence_n not_o lawful_a or_o credible_a fox_n and_o other_o make_v a_o certain_a catalogue_n of_o man_n who_o oppose_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o roman_a church_n in_o former_a age_n but_o they_o be_v know_v heretic_n and_o do_v neither_o 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