Selected quad for the lemma: book_n

Word A Word B Word C Word D Occurrence Frequency Band MI MI Band Prominent
book_n church_n scripture_n write_v 5,125 5 5.8373 4 true
View all documents for the selected quad

Text snippets containing the quad

ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A55374 A dialogue between a popish priest, and an English Protestant. Wherein the principal points and arguments of both religions are truly proposed, and fully examined. / By Matthew Poole, author of Synopsis Criticorum. Poole, Matthew, 1624-1679. 1667 (1667) Wing P2828; ESTC R40270 104,315 254

There are 8 snippets containing the selected quad. | View original text

and_o that_o the_o atheist_n ought_v to_o yield_v to_o they_o pop._n yes_o doubtless_o for_o every_o man_n be_v bind_v to_o receive_v the_o truth_n especial_o when_o it_o be_v so_o propose_v and_o prove_v to_o he_o prot._n it_o seem_v then_o by_o this_o when_o you_o list_v you_o can_v prove_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n without_o take_v in_o the_o church_n authority_n i_o hope_v you_o will_v allow_v i_o the_o same_o benefit_n but_o again_o let_v i_o ask_v you_o your_o church_n that_o you_o talk_v of_o which_o believe_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n do_v she_o believe_v it_o to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n upon_o solid_a ground_n or_o no_o pop._n yes_o doubtless_o our_o church_n be_v not_o so_o irrational_a as_o to_o believe_v without_o ground_n nor_o do_v we_o pretend_v revelation_n but_o she_o believe_v it_o upon_o solid_a argument_n prot._n i_o wish_v you_o will_v give_v i_o a_o list_n of_o their_o argument_n but_o whatever_o they_o be_v that_o be_v sufficient_a to_o convince_v your_o church_n why_o shall_v they_o not_o be_v sufficient_a to_o convince_v any_o private_a man_n popish_a or_o protestant_n or_o atheist_n and_o therefore_o there_o be_v no_o need_n of_o the_o church_n testimony_n or_o will_v you_o say_v the_o church_n have_v no_o other_o sufficient_a reason_n to_o believe_v the_o scripture_n but_o her_o own_o testimony_n that_o be_v she_o believe_v because_o she_o will_v believe_v pop._n god_n forbid_v that_o i_o shall_v disparage_v the_o church_n or_o give_v atheist_n that_o occasion_n to_o scoff_n at_o the_o stripture_n prot._n then_o i_o also_o may_v be_v satisfy_v without_o the_o church_n testimony_n that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o i_o be_o so_o by_o such_o argument_n as_o yourself_o mention_v but_o real_o i_o can_v but_o smile_v to_o see_v what_o cunning_a sophister_n you_o be_v how_o you_o play_v at_o fast_o and_o loose_a the_o same_o argument_n for_o the_o scripture_n be_v strong_a and_o undeniable_a when_o you_o talk_v with_o a_o atheist_n and_o be_v all_o of_o a_o sudden_a become_v weak_a as_o water_v when_o a_o protestant_n bring_v they_o pop._n but_o if_o you_o can_v prove_v in_o the_o general_n that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n yet_o you_o can_v without_o the_o church_n authority_n tell_v what_o book_n of_o scripture_n or_o which_o be_v canonical_a and_o so_o you_o be_v never_o the_o near_o prot._n here_o also_o i_o must_v ask_v you_o again_o how_o do_v your_o church_n know_v which_o book_n be_v scripture_n and_o canonical_a do_v she_o know_v this_o by_o revelation_n pop._n no_o we_o leave_v such_o fancy_n to_o your_o church_n prot._n how_o then_o do_v she_o know_v this_o and_o why_o do_v she_o determine_v it_o be_v it_o with_o reason_n or_o without_o it_o pop._n with_o reason_n doubtless_o be_v induce_v to_o believe_v and_o determine_v it_o upon_o clear_a and_o undoubted_a evidence_n prot._n i_o pray_v you_o tell_v i_o what_o be_v those_o evidence_n upon_o which_o she_o go_v pop._n i_o will_v be_v true_a to_o you_o our_o great_a bellarmine_n mention_n these_o three_o the_o church_n say_v he_o know_v and_o declare_v a_o canonical_a book_n 1._o from_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o ancient_n 2._o from_o its_o likeness_n and_o agreement_n with_o other_o book_n 3._o from_o the_o common_a sense_n and_o taste_v of_o christian_a people_n dicimus_fw-la prot._n since_o a_o private_a man_n especial_o one_o that_o beside_o learning_n and_o experience_n have_v the_o spirit_n of_o god_n to_o guide_v he_o which_o be_v that_o anoint_v give_v to_o all_o believer_n which_o teach_v they_o all_o thing_n 1_o joh._n 2._o 27._o may_v examine_v and_o apprehend_v these_o thing_n as_o well_o as_o the_o pope_n himself_o and_o better_a too_o consider_v what_o kind_n of_o creature_n divers_a of_o your_o pope_n be_v confess_v to_o have_v be_v he_o may_v therefore_o know_v without_o the_o church_n authority_n what_o book_n be_v indeed_o canonical_a but_o i_o pray_v you_o tell_v i_o do_v not_o you_o acknowledge_v those_o book_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n which_o we_o do_v that_o be_v in_o this_o bible_n pop._n i_o must_v be_v true_a to_o you_o we_o do_v own_o every_o book_n you_o have_v there_o but_o you_o shall_v receive_v the_o book_n which_o you_o call_v apocryphal_a so_o that_o indeed_o your_o bible_n be_v not_o complete_a for_o you_o believe_v but_o a_o part_n of_o the_o write_a word_n of_o god_n which_o i_o must_v tell_v you_o be_v of_o dangerous_a consequence_n prot._n if_o these_o book_n be_v a_o part_n of_o god_n word_n i_o confess_v we_o be_v guilty_a of_o a_o great_a sin_n in_o take_v away_o from_o god_n word_n and_o if_o they_o be_v not_o you_o be_v no_o less_o guilty_a in_o add_v to_o it_o so_o that_o the_o only_a question_n be_v whether_o these_o book_n be_v a_o part_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n or_o no_o now_o that_o if_o you_o please_v we_o will_v try_v bellarmine_n rule_n pop._n the_o motion_n be_v fair_a and_o reasonable_a prot._n first_o then_o for_o the_o judgement_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n let_v we_o try_v that_o i_o know_v you_o hold_v the_o church_n judgement_n infallible_a especial_o in_o matter_n of_o this_o moment_n and_o i_o suppose_v you_o think_v the_o jewish_a church_n be_v infallible_a before_o christ_n as_o the_o christian_a church_n now_o be_v pop._n we_o do_v so_o and_o the_o infallibility_n of_o the_o jewish_a church_n and_o high_a priest_n deut._n 17._o be_v one_o of_o our_o principal_a argument_n for_o the_o infallibility_n of_o our_o church_n 2._o prot._n then_o only_o these_o book_n of_o the_o old_a testament_n be_v canonical_a which_o the_o jewish_a church_n do_v own_o pop._n that_o must_v necessary_o follow_v prot._n then_o your_o cause_n be_v lose_v for_o it_o be_v certain_a the_o jew_n reject_v these_o apocryphal_a book_n which_o you_o receive_v and_o they_o reckon_v only_o 22._o josephus_n his_o word_n acknowledge_v for_o his_o by_o eusebius_n 310._o be_v most_o express_a for_o we_o the_o jew_n have_v only_o 22_o book_n to_o which_o they_o deserve_o give_v credit_v which_o contain_v thing_n write_v from_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o world_n to_o the_o time_n of_o artaxerxes_n other_o thing_n be_v write_v afterward_o so_o the_o apocryphal_a book_n be_v grant_v to_o have_v be_v but_o they_o be_v not_o of_o the_o same_o credit_n with_o the_o former_a because_o there_o be_v no_o certain_a succession_n of_o prophet_n 1._o and_o i_o be_o tell_v divers_a of_o your_o learned_a author_n confess_v it_o as_o catharinus_n maccab._n costerus_n lib._n marianus_n victor_n hieronymi_n and_o bellarmine_n himself_o who_o word_n be_v these_o all_o those_o book_n which_o the_o protestant_n do_v not_o receive_v the_o jew_n also_o do_v not_o receive_v principio_fw-la and_o this_o be_v more_o considerable_a because_o to_o the_o jew_n be_v commit_v the_o oracle_n of_o god_n rom._n 3._o 2._o and_o neither_o christ_n nor_o his_o apostle_n do_v accuse_v they_o of_o breach_n of_o trust_n in_o this_o matter_n moreover_o i_o be_o tell_v and_o sure_o in_o all_o reason_n it_o must_v needs_o be_v true_a that_o the_o canonical_a book_n of_o the_o jewish_a church_n be_v write_v in_o the_o jewish_a or_o hebrew_a language_n whereas_o these_o be_v write_v in_o greek_a only_o be_v these_o thing_n so_o pop._n what_o be_v true_a i_o will_v acknowledge_v it_o be_v so_o the_o jewish_a church_n indeed_o do_v not_o receive_v they_o nor_o yet_o do_v they_o reject_v they_o as_o our_o canus_n well_o answer_v 11._o prot._n either_o that_o church_n do_v believe_v they_o to_o be_v canonical_a or_o they_o do_v not_o if_o they_o do_v than_o they_o live_v in_o a_o mortal_a sin_n against_o conscience_n in_o not_o receive_v they_o if_o they_o do_v not_o they_o be_v of_o our_o opinion_n pop._n well_o what_o soever_o the_o jewish_a church_n do_v i_o be_o sure_a the_o ancient_a christian_n and_o father_n do_v receive_v these_o book_n as_o a_o part_n of_o the_o canonical_a scripture_n prot._n i_o doubt_v i_o shall_v take_v you_o tardy_a there_o too_o i_o be_o tell_v that_o the_o council_n of_o laodicea_n in_o the_o year_n of_o our_o lord_n 364._o draw_v up_o a_o catalogue_n of_o the_o book_n of_o the_o scripture_n in_o which_o as_o in_o we_o the_o apocryphal_a book_n be_v reject_v pop._n it_o be_v true_a they_o do_v not_o receive_v they_o nor_o yet_o reject_v they_o prot._n if_o they_o do_v not_o receive_v they_o that_o undeniable_o show_v that_o they_o do_v not_o believe_v they_o to_o be_v canonical_a and_o yet_o they_o diligent_o scan_v the_o point_n and_o the_o book_n have_v then_o be_v extant_a some_o hundred_o of_o year_n and_o they_o be_v far_o more_o likely_a to_o know_v the_o truth_n than_o we_o at_o this_o distance_n have_v then_o
&_o 12._o 6._o that_o be_v year_n it_o be_v a_o very_a familiar_a thing_n to_o put_v day_n for_o year_n in_o prophetical_a write_n but_o if_o the_o church_n may_v be_v obscure_v for_o three_o year_n why_o not_o for_o thirty_o yea_o three_o hundred_o do_v christ_n in_o his_o suppose_a promise_n of_o perpetual_a visibility_n in_o the_o church_n make_v a_o exception_n for_o these_o three_o year_n i_o trow_v not_o and_o tell_v i_o i_o pray_v you_o shall_v you_o live_v till_o that_o time_n when_o antichrist_n shall_v prevail_v and_o your_o religion_n no_o less_o than_o we_o be_v obscure_a and_o invisible_a if_o any_o of_o the_o follower_n of_o antichrist_n shall_v dispute_v against_o you_o that_o you_o be_v not_o the_o true_a church_n because_o not_o visible_a will_v you_o grant_v it_o pop._n god_n forbid_v i_o shall_v be_v so_o wicked_a to_o deny_v my_o mother_n and_o church_n because_o of_o her_o affliction_n prot._n then_o i_o see_v you_o yourselves_o do_v not_o believe_v this_o to_o he_o a_o good_a argument_n and_o that_o you_o do_v not_o make_v perpetual_a visibility_n a_o necessary_a token_n of_o the_o true_a church_n to_o this_o i_o add_v there_o be_v no_o need_n we_o shall_v show_v a_o constant_a succession_n of_o protestant_a church_n ever_o since_o the_o apostle_n day_n as_o you_o pretend_v be_v necessary_a the_o succession_n that_o you_o pretend_v in_o your_o church_n be_v sufficient_a for_o we_o and_o so_o long_o as_o we_o general_o agree_v that_o your_o church_n be_v a_o true_a church_n till_o late_a year_n though_o woeful_o corrupt_v and_o our_o predecessor_n continue_v in_o it_o till_o your_o wound_n stink_v and_o become_v incurable_a we_o need_v no_o other_o succession_n than_o you_o but_o when_o your_o impiety_n come_v to_o the_o height_n than_o we_o visible_o depart_v from_o you_o and_o have_v give_v such_o reason_n for_o it_o as_o you_o will_v never_o be_v able_a to_o answer_v in_o the_o mean_a time_n let_v i_o hear_v what_o you_o have_v further_o to_o say_v pop._n for_o as_o much_o as_o all_o your_o minister_n confess_v our_o church_n be_v once_o a_o true_a church_n i_o pray_v you_o tell_v i_o how_o and_o when_o she_o do_v fall_v you_o can_v tell_v either_o the_o time_n when_o she_o fall_v or_o the_o manner_n how_o by_o apostasy_n or_o heresy_n or_o schism_n if_o you_o can_v name_v your_o author_n prot._n this_o be_v a_o most_o unreasonable_a demand_n a_o friend_n of_o i_o have_v the_o plague_n last_o year_n and_o die_v of_o it_o i_o ask_v he_o when_o he_o be_v sick_a how_o and_o when_o he_o get_v it_o he_o say_v he_o know_v not_o shall_v i_o then_o conclude_v he_o have_v it_o not_o shall_v i_o make_v christ_n a_o liar_n and_o dispute_v that_o there_o be_v no_o tare_n because_o they_o be_v sow_v when_o man_n sleep_v mat._n 13._o 25._o and_o so_o can_v not_o know_v when_o or_o how_o they_o come_v shall_v i_o believe_v no_o heresy_n to_o be_v a_o heresy_n unless_o i_o can_v show_v how_o and_o when_o it_o come_v into_o the_o church_n what_o if_o the_o record_n of_o these_o thing_n by_o the_o injury_n of_o time_n be_v lose_v and_o their_o original_n leave_v in_o obscurity_n shall_v i_o therefore_o say_v it_o be_v now_o become_v no_o heresy_n i_o beseech_v you_o answer_v i_o free_o this_o question_n suppose_v i_o can_v bring_v plain_a and_o strong_a evidence_n from_o the_o holy_a scripture_n and_o from_o ancient_a tradition_n or_o the_o unanimous_a testimony_n of_o the_o ancient_a father_n that_o your_o doctrine_n of_o merit_n for_o instance_n be_v a_o heresy_n your_o doctrine_n of_o worship_v image_n be_v idolatry_n and_o that_o you_o be_v in_o divers_a particular_n apostatise_v from_o that_o faith_n which_o the_o scripture_n and_o father_n do_v own_o in_o this_o case_n will_v you_o not_o confess_v that_o you_o be_v guilty_a of_o idolatry_n heresy_n and_o apostasy_n pop._n if_o it_o be_v so_o and_o you_o can_v real_o bring_v as_o you_o false_o pretend_v you_o can_v but_o indeed_o can_v any_o such_o solid_a proof_n i_o must_v and_o will_v confess_v it_o for_o all_o our_o writer_n agree_v that_o although_o we_o must_v believe_v many_o thing_n that_o be_v not_o contain_v in_o the_o scripture_n yet_o we_o must_v believe_v nothing_o contrary_a to_o the_o scripture_n nor_o to_o the_o consent_n of_o the_o ancient_a father_n prot._n very_o well_o hence_o than_o i_o gather_v that_o the_o only_a question_n between_o you_o and_o i_o be_v whether_o we_o can_v evident_o and_o solid_o prove_v the_o particular_n now_o mention_v which_o if_o we_o can_v do_v as_o i_o be_o satisfy_v our_o minister_n have_v do_v you_o be_v convict_v in_o your_o own_o conscience_n and_o will_v confess_v yourself_o and_o your_o church_n guilty_a of_o heresy_n idolatry_n and_o apostasy_n whether_o i_o can_v tell_v the_o manner_n or_o time_n or_o author_n of_o this_o doctrine_n or_o no._n therefore_o leave_v these_o frivolous_a and_o impertinent_a question_n let_v i_o hear_v what_o you_o have_v to_o say_v more_o against_o our_o religion_n and_o whereas_o your_o discourse_n i_o observe_v have_v whole_o run_v upon_o general_n i_o beseech_v you_o come_v to_o some_o particular_n and_o show_v i_o the_o falsehood_n of_o the_o doctrine_n of_o our_o church_n but_o it_o do_v not_o a_o little_a confirm_v i_o in_o my_o religion_n that_o you_o confess_v as_o i_o show_v before_o most_o of_o our_o doctrine_n to_o be_v true_a and_o ground_v upon_o scripture_n whereas_o you_o be_v addition_n of_o your_o own_o devise_v now_o if_o thing_n be_v thus_o you_o shall_v not_o need_v to_o trouble_v yourself_o about_o many_o particular_n but_o if_o you_o please_v single_a out_o some_o of_o our_o principal_a heresy_n as_o you_o call_v they_o and_o let_v i_o hear_v what_o evidence_n you_o can_v bring_v against_o they_o pop._n your_o heresy_n be_v very_o many_o but_o i_o shall_v mention_v one_o which_o may_v be_v instead_o of_o all_o and_o that_o be_v your_o rule_n of_o faith_n and_o judge_n of_o controversy_n which_o you_o make_v to_o be_v the_o scripture_n only_o prot_n i_o be_o glad_a you_o have_v fall_v upon_o so_o material_a a_o point_n the_o decide_n whereof_o may_v make_v other_o dispute_n in_o great_a part_n useless_a tell_v i_o then_o what_o you_o have_v to_o say_v against_o this_o doctrine_n pop._n i_o will_v urge_v four_o argument_n against_o it_o 1._o scripture_n have_v no_o authority_n over_o we_o but_o from_o the_o church_n 2._o you_o can_v know_v what_o book_n be_v the_o holy_a scripture_n or_o part_n of_o it_o but_o by_o the_o church_n report_n 3._o if_o neither_o of_o these_o be_v true_a yet_o scripture_n be_v not_o a_o sufficient_a rule_n for_o your_o faith_n without_o tradition_n 4._o if_o it_o be_v sufficient_a yet_o it_o be_v so_o obscure_a that_o you_o can_v know_v the_o sense_n of_o it_o without_o the_o interpretation_n of_o the_o church_n you_o see_v here_o be_v a_o fourfold_a cord_n which_o you_o will_v find_v be_v not_o easy_o break_v prot._n make_v these_o thing_n good_a and_o i_o confess_v you_o do_v your_o work_n in_o a_o great_a measure_n let_v i_o hear_v your_o proof_n pop._n for_o the_o first_o then_o i_o say_v that_o scripture_n have_v no_o authority_n over_o we_o but_o from_o the_o church_n neither_o you_o nor_o i_o be_v bind_v to_o believe_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n nor_o can_v any_o man_n know_v it_o or_o prove_v it_o to_o be_v so_o but_o from_o the_o testimony_n of_o our_o church_n concern_v it_o prot._n i_o pray_v tell_v i_o if_o you_o be_v to_o discourse_v with_o a_o atheist_n who_o utter_o deny_v the_o holy_a scripture_n and_o the_o church_n too_o can_v you_o not_o prove_v against_o he_o that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n pop._n god_n forbid_v but_o that_o i_o shall_v be_v able_a to_o defend_v the_o truth_n of_o the_o scripture_n against_o any_o adversary_n whatsoever_o prot._n how_o then_o i_o pray_v you_o will_v you_o prove_v it_o pop._n i_o need_v not_o tell_v you_o the_o argument_n which_o in_o this_o case_n our_o doctor_n use_n and_o i_o stand_v by_o they_o in_o it_o they_o allege_v for_o the_o truth_n of_o the_o holy_a scripture_n the_o testimony_n of_o all_o age_n and_o all_o sort_n of_o person_n the_o miracle_n wrought_v for_o it_o acknowledge_v even_o by_o the_o enemy_n of_o it_o the_o martyrdom_n that_o so_o many_o thousand_o and_o many_o of_o they_o wise_a and_o learned_a man_n do_v run_v upon_o in_o the_o defence_n of_o they_o who_o live_v so_o near_o the_o time_n of_o the_o write_n of_o they_o be_v best_a able_a do_v discern_v the_o truth_n and_o the_o wonderful_a power_n that_o go_v along_o with_o they_o in_o convince_a convert_v and_o comfort_v or_o terrify_v sinner_n prot._n do_v you_o believe_v these_o be_v solid_a argument_n
the_o council_n of_o trent_n itself_o when_o one_o will_v expect_v they_o shall_v have_v grow_v wise_a though_o not_o better_a prove_v the_o unequal_a power_n of_o pope_n bishop_n and_o priest_n from_o rom._n 13._o 1._o the_o power_n that_o be_v be_v ordain_v of_o god_n that_o be_v digest_v into_o order_n i_o hope_v ere_o you_o have_v do_v you_o will_v put_v forth_o a_o entire_a comment_n upon_o the_o whole_a bible_n which_o i_o assure_v you_o will_v be_v the_o rare_a book_n that_o ever_o see_v the_o light_n but_o further_a i_o desire_v to_o know_v of_o you_o how_o your_o church_n come_v to_o have_v this_o true_a and_o certain_a sense_n of_o scripture_n have_v she_o it_o by_o revelation_n or_o inspiration_n pop._n no_o we_o pretend_v to_o no_o such_o thing_n but_o she_o come_v to_o know_v it_o by_o the_o diligent_a use_n of_o mean_n by_o prayer_n by_o read_v and_o compare_v scripture_n by_o consult_v ancient_a interpreter_n analogy_n of_o faith_n the_o coherence_n etc._n etc._n and_o even_o the_o pope_n himself_o when_o he_o set_v forth_o his_o translation_n of_o the_o bible_n he_o profess_v to_o all_o the_o world_n that_o he_o do_v it_o in_o the_o very_a same_o manner_n and_o by_o the_o same_o help_n that_o other_o translator_n do_v that_o be_v by_o advise_v with_o learned_a man_n and_o consult_v ancient_a copy_n and_o the_o like_a infallibiliy_v prot._n very_o good_a then_o i_o pray_v you_o tell_v i_o why_o a_o protestant_a minister_n be_v oft_o time_n both_o a_o learneder_n and_o better_a man_n than_o the_o pope_n may_v not_o as_o certain_o hit_v upon_o the_o true_a sense_n of_o the_o scripture_n as_o the_o pope_n himself_o pop._n the_o reason_n be_v plain_a because_o the_o pope_n be_v guide_v by_o the_o infallible_a assistance_n of_o god_n spirit_n prot._n you_o ought_v not_o to_o rant_v at_o this_o height_n until_o you_o have_v solid_o answer_v what_o our_o divine_n have_v write_v against_o this_o infallibility_n and_o i_o hear_v before_o the_o woeful_a weakness_n of_o your_o argument_n for_o it_o be_v to_o i_o the_o vain_a thing_n in_o the_o world_n to_o pretend_v a_o promise_n of_o the_o spirit_n of_o god_n infallible_o to_o guide_v such_o man_n as_o if_o the_o scripture_n be_v true_a have_v not_o the_o spirit_n of_o christ_n in_o they_o be_v as_o you_o confess_v many_o of_o your_o pope_n and_o bishop_n be_v sensual_a not_o have_v the_o spirit_n and_o have_v apparent_o no_o other_o spirit_n in_o they_o but_o the_o spirit_n of_o the_o world_n the_o spirit_n that_o lust_v to_o envy_v and_o all_o wickedness_n but_o since_o you_o pretend_v the_o scripture_n be_v so_o dark_a i_o pray_v you_o tell_v i_o what_o be_v the_o end_n for_o which_o god_n design_v the_o scripture_n sure_o i_o think_v it_o be_v for_o our_o understanding_n my_o bible_n tell_v i_o that_o whatsoever_o thing_n be_v write_v aforetime_o be_v write_v for_o our_o learning_n rom._n 15._o 4_o but_o if_o you_o say_v true_a it_o seem_v god_n mean_v only_o to_o put_v forth_o riddle_n god_n law_n be_v design_v by_o he_o for_o a_o light_n and_o that_o even_o to_o the_o simple_a psal._n 19_o 7_o 8_o 9_o and_o 119_o 105._o and_o in_o a_o word_n the_o gospel_n be_v so_o clear_a that_o saint_n paul_n pronounce_v it_o be_v hide_v from_o none_o but_o they_o that_o perish_v 2_o cor._n 4._o 3_o 4._o and_o saint_n luke_n write_v his_o gospel_n that_o theophilus_n and_o with_o he_o other_o christian_n may_v know_v the_o certainty_n of_o those_o thing_n wherein_o they_o have_v be_v instruct_v luke_n 1._o 4._o and_o general_o every_o discreet_a man_n that_o write_v a_o book_n write_v it_o so_o as_o it_o may_v be_v understand_v especial_o if_o it_o be_v for_o the_o benefit_n of_o the_o ignorant_a as_o well_o as_o the_o learned_a which_o the_o scripture_n assure_o be_v tell_v i_o then_o i_o pray_v you_o why_o shall_v god_n write_v his_o mind_n so_o dark_o and_o doubtful_o as_o you_o know_v who_o oracle_n be_v say_v to_o be_v deliver_v be_v it_o because_o god_n can_v not_o write_v plain_o and_o want_v the_o gift_n of_o utterance_n or_o because_o he_o will_v not_o pop._n notwithstanding_o all_o this_o it_o be_v certain_a the_o scripture_n be_v full_a of_o obscure_a place_n prot._n i_o do_v not_o deny_v this_o but_o those_o thing_n which_o be_v obscure_o deliver_v in_o one_o place_n be_v more_o clear_o deliver_v in_o another_o and_o those_o dark_a place_n general_o be_v about_o prophecy_n and_o such_o other_o thing_n the_o knowledge_n of_o which_o be_v not_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n but_o for_o necessary_n the_o scripture_n be_v plain_a and_o i_o be_o tell_v that_o divers_a of_o your_o author_n acknowledge_v so_o much_o be_v that_o true_a pop._n i_o confess_v costerus_n have_v this_o expression_n that_o thing_n which_o be_v necessary_a to_o be_v know_v by_o all_o christian_n be_v plain_o and_o clear_o deliver_v in_o the_o write_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o some_o other_o of_o our_o doctor_n say_v as_o much_o 4._o much_o see_v nullity_n of_o rom._n faith_n chap._n 7._o sect_n 4._o prot._n it_o can_v be_v nothing_o but_o the_o evidence_n of_o the_o truth_n which_o force_v such_o a_o acknowledgement_n from_o its_o great_a adversary_n therefore_o let_v this_o go_v and_o let_v i_o hear_v what_o further_o you_o have_v to_o say_v against_o our_o religion_n pop._n i_o find_v you_o be_v a_o obstinate_a heretic_n and_o settle_v upon_o the_o lees_n and_o therefore_o it_o will_v be_v needless_a to_o discourse_v further_o with_o you_o if_o any_o thing_n can_v have_v convince_v you_o sure_o the_o argument_n i_o have_v offer_v will_v have_v do_v it_o for_o i_o assure_v you_o i_o have_v pick_v out_o the_o strength_n and_o marrow_n of_o the_o catholic_n cause_n in_o the_o point_n we_o have_v discourse_v and_o since_o i_o see_v you_o turn_v a_o deaf_a ear_n to_o my_o counsel_n i_o shall_v give_v you_o over_o as_o incorrigible_a prot._n you_o see_v i_o have_v hear_v you_o with_o great_a patience_n and_o give_v you_o all_o the_o freedom_n you_o can_v desire_v now_o i_o have_v one_o request_n to_o you_o that_o you_o will_v allow_v i_o the_o same_o privilege_n with_o patience_n to_o hear_v and_o if_o you_o can_v answer_v what_o i_o shall_v object_v against_o your_o religion_n pop._n with_o a_o very_a good_a will_n i_o will_v meet_v you_o here_o to_o morrow_n at_o this_o time_n so_o at_o present_a adieu_o the_o second_o conference_n prot._n well_o meet_v sir_n i_o see_v you_o be_v as_o good_a as_o your_o word_n and_o i_o hope_v you_o will_v allow_v i_o as_o much_o freedom_n and_o patience_n as_o i_o do_v you_o pop._n i_o shall_v willing_o do_v it_o therefore_o speak_v free_o and_o so_o will_v i_o and_o if_o truth_n be_v on_o your_o side_n let_v it_o prevail_v prot._n i_o shall_v divide_v my_o discourse_n into_o two_o part_n 1._o some_o general_n consideration_n which_o indeed_o do_v very_o much_o set_v i_o against_o your_o religion_n 2._o i_o shall_v examine_v the_o ground_n of_o your_o principal_a point_n of_o doctrine_n for_o to_o meddle_v with_o all_o will_v be_v needless_a if_o your_o pillar_n fall_v the_o rest_n can_v stand_v for_o the_o first_o there_o be_v several_a weighty_a consideration_n against_o your_o religion_n i_o shall_v give_v you_o they_o in_o order_n the_o first_o general_n consideration_n be_v this_o 1._o that_o your_o church_n decline_v all_o judgement_n but_o her_o own_o and_o make_v herself_o judge_n in_o she_o own_o cause_n you_o do_v not_o allow_v scripture_n to_o be_v judge_n nor_o the_o ancient_a father_n for_o all_o your_o talk_n of_o antiquity_n nor_o indeed_o any_o but_o yourselves_o the_o pope_n or_o a_o council_n of_o your_o own_o and_o your_o church_n it_o seem_v must_v determine_v whether_o she_o be_v a_o true_a church_n or_o no_o and_o whether_o she_o be_v pure_a or_o corrupt_a or_o whether_o she_o be_v infallible_a or_o no_o be_v this_o so_o pop._n i_o confess_v this_o be_v our_o doctrine_n and_o i_o think_v ground_v upon_o reason_n prot._n you_o speak_v against_o the_o common_a sense_n of_o all_o man_n in_o all_o controversy_n or_o difference_n between_o man_n and_o man_n we_o general_o suspect_v that_o party_n who_o will_v submit_v to_o no_o judgement_n but_o his_o own_o and_o he_o who_o be_v willing_a to_o refer_v himself_o to_o any_o three_o indifferent_a party_n be_v general_o presume_v to_o have_v the_o best_a cause_n and_o th●s_o be_v our_o case_n protestant_n do_v not_o make_v themselves_o and_o their_o own_o church_n the_o only_a judge_n though_o they_o may_v as_o just_o and_o reasonable_o do_v it_o as_o you_o but_o they_o be_v very_o willing_a to_o submit_v to_o other_o judge_n they_o refer_v themselves_o to_o be_v judge_v by_o the_o scripture_n which_o be_v acknowledge_v to_o be_v a_o most_o indifferent_a judge_n if_o
a_o dialogue_n between_o a_o popish_a priest_n and_o a_o english_a protestant_n wherein_o the_o principal_a point_n and_o argument_n of_o both_o religion_n be_v true_o propose_v and_o full_o examine_v by_o matthew_n poole_n minister_n of_o the_o gospel_n the_o last_o edition_n correct_v and_o amend_v london_n print_v by_o e._n cotes_n and_o be_v to_o be_v sell_v by_o s._n tompson_n at_o the_o bishops-head_n in_o duck_n lane_n 1667._o to_o the_o reader_n the_o variety_n and_o difference_n of_o religion_n between_o protestant_a and_o papist_n distract_v the_o mind_n and_o trouble_v the_o heart_n of_o all_o that_o have_v any_o sense_n of_o religious_a concernment_n in_o this_o distraction_n every_o serious_a man_n that_o have_v any_o care_n of_o his_o soul_n health_n can_v choose_v but_o hearty_o desire_v and_o seek_v for_o resolution_n to_o obtain_v this_o there_o can_v be_v no_o better_a way_n than_o to_o understand_v and_o examine_v the_o pretension_n and_o ground_n of_o both_o religion_n in_o order_n to_o this_o i_o have_v endeavour_v faithful_o to_o represent_v and_o due_o to_o weigh_v they_o in_o the_o follow_a discourse_n wherein_o though_o i_o have_v not_o discuss_v all_o the_o point_n in_o controversy_n between_o we_o and_o they_o yet_o i_o have_v select_v the_o most_o material_a and_o have_v discourse_v of_o most_o if_o not_o all_o their_o weighty_a and_o plausible_a argument_n against_o the_o protestant_a religion_n and_o this_o i_o may_v say_v and_o no_o know_v papist_n i_o think_v will_v deny_v it_o all_o the_o other_o point_n will_v follow_v the_o fate_n of_o those_o which_o be_v here_o examine_v and_o live_v or_o die_v with_o they_o i_o know_v it_o will_v be_v pretend_v that_o i_o have_v manage_v the_o work_n with_o partiality_n and_o deceit_n and_o that_o i_o make_v the_o papist_n speak_v what_o i_o please_v not_o what_o they_o think_v this_o must_v be_v say_v of_o course_n else_o the_o romanist_n lose_v their_o old_a wont_a nor_o shall_v i_o at_o all_o think_v it_o strange_a if_o in_o stead_n of_o solid_a answer_n they_o return_v calumny_n their_o cause_n require_v it_o and_o no_o wonder_n if_o they_o that_o want_v truth_n in_o their_o religion_n make_v lie_v their_o refuge_n to_o silence_v all_o clamour_n and_o satisfy_v all_o jealousy_n will_v be_v impossible_a i_o shall_v never_o attempt_v it_o but_o for_o satisfaction_n of_o such_o as_o be_v rational_a and_o ingenuous_a i_o shall_v give_v this_o follow_a account_n 1._o god_n be_v my_o witness_n that_o i_o do_v diligent_o endeavour_v to_o pick_v out_o the_o strong_a argument_n i_o can_v find_v in_o their_o best_a author_n in_o each_o point_n nor_o have_v i_o willing_o decline_v any_o thing_n of_o moment_n in_o the_o question_n here_o debate_v if_o any_o papist_n think_v otherwise_o let_v he_o produce_v their_o great_a strength_n and_o i_o hope_v he_o shall_v find_v it_o fair_o examine_v 2._o the_o several_a discourse_n argument_n and_o answer_n which_o i_o put_v into_o the_o papist_n mouth_n be_v such_o as_o be_v first_o take_v out_o of_o their_o mouth_n and_o so_o it_o be_v but_o a_o piece_n of_o justice_n and_o restitution_n to_o return_v they_o thither_o they_o be_v general_o such_o as_o be_v either_o know_v to_o be_v their_o opinion_n and_o by_o themselves_o own_v or_o else_o deliver_v in_o the_o sense_n and_o very_o oft_o in_o the_o word_n of_o their_o most_o approve_a author_n who_o i_o have_v quote_v in_o the_o margin_n but_o here_o i_o expect_v the_o old_a clamour_n of_o false_a quotation_n wherein_o they_o have_v be_v so_o often_o take_v tardy_a that_o they_o must_v now_o look_v for_o the_o common_a infelicity_n of_o not_o to_o be_v believe_v if_o they_o shall_v chance_v to_o stumble_v upon_o truth_n all_o the_o relief_n i_o desire_v in_o that_o case_n be_v that_o the_o reader_n who_o be_v able_a to_o do_v it_o will_v examine_v they_o with_o his_o own_o eye_n and_o that_o will_v be_v my_o best_a justification_n i_o shall_v detain_v thou_o no_o long_o but_o commend_v thou_o to_o the_o good_a spirit_n of_o truth_n to_o enable_v thou_o to_o discern_v between_o good_a and_o evil_n to_o the_o people_z of_o the_o romish_a church_n the_o controversy_n between_o your_o church_n and_o we_o be_v by_o god_n blessing_n upon_o the_o endeavour_n of_o his_o minister_n bring_v to_o this_o pass_n that_o i_o be_o persuade_v there_o be_v nothing_o want_v to_o the_o conviction_n of_o divers_a of_o you_o but_o a_o free_a and_o diligent_a perusal_n of_o theri_fw-la book_n without_o prejudice_n and_o partiality_n this_o your_o priest_n know_v it_o be_v their_o great_a design_n to_o keep_v you_o from_o look_v into_o they_o and_o to_o that_o end_n to_o possess_v you_o with_o this_o principle_n that_o you_o need_v not_o trouble_v yourselves_o to_o inquire_v into_o book_n you_o be_v safe_a enough_o so_o long_o you_o believe_v as_o the_o church_n believe_v and_o follow_v the_o guidance_n of_o your_o priest_n and_o father_n if_o this_o be_v a_o error_n it_o be_v a_o dangerous_a one_o and_o may_v prove_v damnable_a that_o it_o be_v so_o and_o that_o it_o will_v prove_v but_o a_o break_a reed_n when_o you_o lean_a upon_o it_o i_o hope_v you_o will_v see_v there_o be_v reason_n to_o believe_v if_o you_o will_v but_o do_v your_o soul_n that_o justice_n not_o prodigal_o to_o cast_v they_o away_o upon_o blind_a and_o wilful_a mistake_n and_o take_v the_o pain_n to_o read_v these_o ensue_a line_n 1._o if_o your_o church_n be_v not_o infallible_a than_o this_o principle_n be_v rot_v howsoever_o you_o can_v with_o safety_n or_o discretion_n venture_v your_o soul_n on_o it_o till_o you_o have_v examine_v at_o least_o this_o one_o point_n of_o the_o church_n infallibility_n do_v but_o examine_v that_o and_o if_o you_o do_v not_o stifle_v both_o reason_n and_o conscience_n you_o will_v see_v it_o be_v a_o mere_a cheat_n 2._o if_o the_o church_n that_o be_v a_o pope_n with_o a_o council_n be_v infallible_a which_o be_v all_o that_o your_o great_a champion_n plead_v for_o yet_o all_o confess_v that_o your_o particular_a priest_n upon_o who_o conduct_n you_o hazard_v your_o eternal_a welfare_n be_v fallible_a and_o subject_a to_o mistake_n it_o be_v most_o certain_a that_o divers_a of_o your_o priest_n and_o confessor_n lead_v you_o into_o many_o and_o some_o ●f_n they_o damnable_a error_n thousand_o of_o ●our_n priest_n and_o learned_a doctor_n do_v charge_v the_o jesuit_n with_o poison_v the_o soul_n of_o the_o people_n with_o divers_a pestilent_a and_o damnable_a error_n such_o as_o these_o that_o a_o man_n may_v venture_v his_o soul_n upon_o any_o probable_a opinion_n and_o that_o be_v probable_a which_o but_o one_o of_o their_o learned_a doctor_n affirm_v that_o a_o private_a man_n may_v kill_v his_o enemy_n to_o maintain_v his_o honour_n though_o not_o by_o way_n of_o revenge_n that_o a_o priest_n may_v absolve_v even_o old_a and_o inveterate_a sinner_n and_o such_o as_o he_o believe_v incorrigible_a that_o affliction_n or_o sorrow_n for_o sin_n arise_v mere_o from_o fear_n of_o punishment_n be_v sufficient_a for_o salvation_n and_o that_o the_o affection_n of_o love_a god_n be_v not_o absolute_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n all_o these_o and_o many_o more_o be_v clear_o prove_v out_o of_o their_o own_o word_n and_o write_n in_o the_o provincial_a letter_n otherwise_o call_v the_o mystery_n of_o jesuitism_n see_v the_o latin_a edition_n set_v forth_o and_o defend_v by_o wendrockius_fw-la now_o if_o the_o jesuit_n may_v and_o do_v so_o damnable_o deceive_v those_o thousand_o of_o you_o that_o depend_v upon_o their_o counsel_n and_o conduct_v why_o may_v not_o other_o order_n deceive_v you_o in_o other_o thing_n or_o what_o be_v there_o that_o can_v give_v you_o any_o reasonable_a security_n be_v it_o their_o learning_n prudence_n pretend_a devotion_n or_o honesty_n or_o any_o other_o such_o like_a quality_n why_o divers_a of_o the_o jesuit_n have_v give_v as_o plausible_a testimony_n of_o those_o thing_n so_o far_o as_o man_n can_v judge_v as_o most_o of_o the_o other_o order_n or_o will_v you_o say_v all_o other_o order_n be_v infallible_a the_o jesuit_n only_o except_v 3._o nothing_o can_v be_v more_o evident_a if_o the_o bible_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n than_o that_o the_o error_n or_o misguidance_n of_o the_o priest_n will_v not_o excuse_v the_o sin_n of_o the_o people_n to_o satisfy_v you_o in_o this_o i_o beseech_v you_o consider_v these_o few_o reason_n 1._o the_o scripture_n condemn_v and_o god_n severe_o punish_v those_o people_n which_o do_v follow_v the_o error_n of_o their_o priest_n this_o do_v not_o excuse_v the_o jew_n in_o aaron_n time_n that_o they_o be_v mislead_v by_o aaron_n exod._n 32._o nor_o those_o in_o the_o time_n of_o the_o wicked_a king_n of_o israel_n and_o judah_n that_o their_o priest_n do_v universal_o deceive_v they_o and_o
poor_a elijah_n and_o so_o michaiah_n be_v leave_v alone_o nor_o those_o in_o malachy_n day_n that_o the_o priest_n cause_v they_o to_o stumble_v at_o the_o law_n malac_n 2._o 8._o nor_o the_o crucifier_n of_o christ_n that_o they_o obey_v the_o decree_n of_o their_o priest_n and_o ruler_n i_o list_v not_o to_o repeat_v what_o i_o have_v say_v elsewhere_o therefore_o read_v nullity_n of_o romish_a faith_n ch_n 2._o sect_n 12._o and_o will_v you_o yet_o stumble_v at_o the_o same_o stone_n 2._o the_o people_n will_v not_o be_v excuse_v by_o their_o priest_n misguidance_n because_o they_o neglect_v their_o duty_n if_o indeed_o there_o be_v no_o duty_n incumbent_a upon_o the_o people_n but_o to_o believe_v what_o your_o priest_n say_v and_o do_v what_o they_o require_v than_o your_o church_n speak_v reason_n but_o that_o none_o but_o a_o mad_a man_n will_v say_v there_o be_v several_a duty_n require_v of_o the_o people_n no_o less_o than_o of_o the_o priest_n the_o law_n of_o god_n be_v not_o give_v only_o to_o the_o priest_n but_o to_o all_o the_o people_n god_n publish_v this_o law_n in_o the_o hear_n of_o all_o the_o people_n and_o speak_v in_o the_o singular_a number_n to_o every_o one_o of_o the_o people_n thou_o shall_v do_v or_o forbear_v this_o or_o that_o and_o the_o curse_n be_v threaten_v to_o the_o people_n deut._n 27._o 26._o curse_a be_v he_o that_o confirm_v not_o all_o the_o word_n of_o this_o law_n to_o do_v they_o and_o all_o the_o people_n shall_v say_v amen_o which_o the_o apostle_n repeat_v gal._n 3._o 10._o curse_a be_v every_o one_o not_o priest_n only_o but_o the_o people_n too_o that_o continue_v not_o in_o all_o thing_n which_o be_v write_v in_o this_o book_n of_o the_o law_n to_o do_v they_o if_o the_o priest_n than_o shall_v have_v teach_v the_o israelite_n as_o your_o priest_n now_o teach_v you_o thou_o shall_v worship_v a_o grave_a image_n when_o god_n say_v thou_o shall_v not_o worship_v a_o grave_a image_n can_v any_o serious_a man_n think_v this_o will_v have_v free_v they_o from_o that_o curse_n and_o that_o it_o be_v safe_a for_o they_o to_o obey_v the_o command_n of_o man_n than_o of_o god_n o_o the_o impudence_n of_o your_o priest_n that_o dare_v say_v so_o o_o the_o blockishness_n of_o those_o people_n that_o will_v believe_v they_o when_o they_o say_v so_o your_o pope_n may_v well_o contend_v with_o we_o for_o it_o seem_v your_o priest_n will_v contest_v with_o god_n for_o supremacy_n when_o the_o priest_n and_o prophet_n in_o isaiahs_n day_n be_v general_o corrupt_v the_o people_n be_v not_o advise_v to_o believe_v all_o that_o they_o teach_v and_o to_o obey_v all_o that_o they_o decree_v which_o be_v the_o strain_n of_o your_o church_n but_o be_v command_v immediate_o to_o go_v to_o the_o law_n and_o to_o the_o testimony_n and_o if_o any_o speak_v not_o according_a to_o they_o they_o be_v to_o be_v reject_v because_o there_o be_v no_o light_n in_o they_o isa._n 8._o 20._o even_o people_n be_v require_v not_o to_o believe_v every_o spirit_n but_o to_o try_v the_o spirit_n 1_o john_n 4._o 1._o nor_o do_v the_o apostle_n exempt_v themselves_o and_o their_o doctrine_n from_o this_o trial_n but_o allow_v commend_v and_o require_v it_o in_o the_o people_n the_o beraean_o be_v not_o reprove_v and_o censure_v as_o they_o will_v certain_o be_v that_o shall_v tread_v in_o their_o step_n at_o rome_n but_o commend_v for_o examine_v the_o doctrine_n of_o s._n paul_n by_o the_o scripture_n act_v 17._o 11._o and_o the_o same_o apostle_n allow_v the_o galatian_n not_o only_o to_o try_v his_o doctrine_n whether_o they_o be_v agreeable_a to_o what_o they_o have_v receive_v but_o in_o case_n they_o find_v they_o contrary_n he_o give_v they_o commission_n to_o censure_v and_o anathemize_v he_o gal._n 1._o 8_o 9_o and_o he_o bespeak_v the_o corinthian_n in_o this_o language_n i_o speak_v to_o wise_a man_n judge_v you_o what_o i_o say_v 1_o cor._n 10._o 15._o and_o he_o command_v the_o thessalonian_n to_o prove_v all_o thing_n without_o exception_n as_o well_o as_o to_o hold_v fast_o that_o which_o be_v good_a 1_o thess._n 5._o 21._o consider_v these_o thing_n i_o beseech_v you_o and_o do_v not_o wilful_o cast_v away_o your_o precious_a soul_n upon_o trifle_n god_n have_v give_v the_o scripture_n as_o a_o rule_n to_o try_v thing_n by_o and_o this_o be_v write_v for_o the_o ignorant_a and_o the_o people_n as_o well_o as_o the_o learned_a and_o the_o priest_n john_n 20._o 31._o he_o have_v give_v people_n reason_n to_o try_v thing_n with_o if_o you_o will_v hide_v these_o talent_n in_o a_o napkin_n at_o your_o peril_n be_v it_o the_o prince_n be_v command_v to_o read_v and_o meditate_v in_o the_o book_n of_o the_o law_n that_o he_o may_v observe_v to_o do_v all_o that_o be_v write_v therein_o josh._n 1._o 8._o can_v you_o serious_o think_v that_o if_o the_o corrupt_a priest_n have_v agree_v to_o teach_v he_o to_o do_v contrary_a to_o all_o that_o be_v write_v therein_o that_o this_o will_v have_v excuse_v he_o before_o god_n then_o that_o precept_n be_v both_o superfluous_a and_o dangerous_a and_o if_o you_o do_v not_o think_v so_o as_o you_o must_v needs_o if_o you_o have_v any_o conscience_n than_o neither_o will_v it_o excuse_v your_o people_n for_o according_a to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o your_o church_n prince_n and_o people_n be_v alike_o in_o this_o both_o tie_v to_o believe_v as_o your_o church_n believe_v god_n command_v every_o christian_n to_o prove_v his_o own_o work_n and_o tell_v we_o that_o every_o man_n shall_v bear_v his_o own_o burden_n gal._n 6._o 4_o 5._o and_o that_o every_o man_n shall_v give_v a_o account_n of_o himself_o to_o god_n rom._n 14._o 12._o do_v not_o think_v your_o priest_n account_n shall_v serve_v turn_n and_o all_o the_o christian_a people_n of_o corinth_n be_v command_v to_o examine_v themselves_o whether_o they_o be_v in_o the_o faith_n 2_o cor._n 13._o 5._o and_o dare_v you_o still_o live_v in_o the_o wilful_a breach_n of_o all_o these_o command_n and_o blind_o give_v up_o your_o soul_n and_o conscience_n by_o a_o implicit_a faith_n to_o the_o conduct_n of_o your_o priest_n to_o lead_v they_o whether_o they_o please_v 3._o the_o scripture_n have_v give_v you_o full_a warning_n of_o your_o danger_n read_v but_o two_o place_n ezek_n 33._o 8._o where_o god_n assure_v we_o that_o the_o wicked_a shall_v die_v in_o his_o iniquity_n though_o he_o perish_v through_o the_o watchman_n fault_n and_o matth._n 15._o 14._o where_o christ_n confute_v this_o very_a opinion_n of_o you_o which_o be_v also_o the_o opinion_n of_o the_o jew_n that_o they_o be_v safe_a enough_o while_o they_o follow_v their_o priest_n decree_n and_o counsel_n and_o tell_v they_o if_o the_o blind_a lead_v the_o blind_a both_o shall_v fall_v into_o the_o ditch_n and_o doubt_v of_o this_o if_o you_o can_v or_o dare_v in_o a_o word_n if_o this_o senseless_a doctrine_n be_v true_a not_o only_o man_n will_v have_v dominion_n over_o our_o faith_n contrary_a to_o express_v scripture_n be_v not_o you_o call_v master_n for_o one_o be_v your_o master_n even_o christ_n matth._n 23._o 10._o not_o that_o we_o have_v dominion_n over_o your_o faith_n say_v the_o great_a apostle_n but_o also_o christ_n shall_v lose_v his_o dominion_n and_o have_v no_o authority_n in_o his_o church_n but_o as_o your_o priest_n please_v and_o it_o seem_v he_o shall_v not_o have_v this_o favour_n from_o you_o to_o continue_v in_o his_o office_n quamdiu_fw-la bene_fw-la se_fw-la gesserit_fw-la but_o quamdiu_fw-la vobis_fw-la placuerit_fw-la and_o christ_n power_n be_v apparent_o limit_v to_o your_o interpretation_n but_o the_o power_n of_o your_o church_n be_v absolute_a and_o unlimited_a and_o the_o people_n oblige_v to_o believe_v they_o quamcunque_fw-la sententiam_fw-la tulerint_fw-la whatsoever_o they_o shall_v decree_v as_o gretser_n express_v it_o if_o this_o be_v not_o to_o make_v the_o word_n and_o authority_n of_o god_n and_o christ_n void_a through_o your_o tradition_n i_o know_v not_o what_o be_v i_o will_v trouble_v you_o no_o further_o if_o you_o be_v capable_a of_o counsel_n take_v warning_n and_o suffer_v not_o yourselves_o to_o be_v lead_v hoodwink_v to_o hell_n to_o serve_v a_o carnal_a interest_n of_o some_o among_o you_o but_o quit_v yourselves_o like_o man_n and_o by_o the_o grossness_n of_o this_o delusion_n learn_v to_o suspect_v the_o rest_n and_o with_o humble_a and_o honest_a heart_n read_v what_o be_v here_o propose_v to_o you_o for_o your_o soul_n good_a and_o god_n give_v you_o light_n let_v my_o soul_n prosper_v no_o otherwise_o than_o i_o hearty_o wish_v the_o good_a and_o salvation_n of_o you_o all_o but_o if_o you_o will_v still_o persist_v in_o your_o blindness_n and_o add_v further_a obstinacy_n to_o your_o
fall_n so_o that_o if_o this_o text_n and_o prayer_n reach_v to_o your_o pope_n it_o shall_v rather_o secure_v they_o from_o damnable_a apostasy_n in_o practice_n which_o you_o confess_v many_o of_o they_o fall_v into_o and_o die_v in_o then_o from_o heresy_n of_o which_o this_o text_n speak_v not_o at_o all_o but_o have_v you_o no_o other_o argument_n pop._n yes_o there_o be_v one_o more_o which_o be_v sufficient_a if_o there_o be_v no_o other_o and_o that_o be_v from_o god_n providence_n it_o be_v unbecoming_a the_o wisdom_n of_o god_n to_o leave_v his_o church_n without_o a_o guide_n or_o infallible_a judge_n by_o which_o mean_v there_o will_v be_v no_o end_n of_o controversy_n and_o since_o you_o do_v not_o pretend_v to_o have_v any_o such_o in_o your_o church_n it_o must_v be_v in_o we_o or_o else_o there_o be_v none_o in_o the_o world_n prot._n i_o have_v think_v you_o will_v have_v only_o teach_v i_o but_o now_o it_o seem_v you_o will_v teach_v god_n how_o to_o govern_v the_o world_n it_o shall_v seem_v to_o i_o that_o god_n be_v not_o of_o your_o mind_n he_o do_v not_o think_v fit_a to_o end_v all_o controversy_n but_o to_o permit_v that_o there_o shall_v be_v heresy_n 1_o cor._n 11._o 19_o and_o if_o god_n in_o his_o wisdom_n think_v a_o infallible_a judge_n necessary_a certain_o that_o same_o wisdom_n will_v have_v name_v the_o place_n person_n or_o person_n where_o people_n shall_v have_v find_v this_o infallibility_n be_v it_o ever_o know_v since_o the_o begin_n of_o the_o world_n that_o any_o prince_n constitute_v judge_n in_o his_o kingdom_n not_o so_o much_o as_o give_v notice_n to_o his_o people_n who_o they_o be_v to_o who_o they_o must_v resort_v for_o justice_n this_o god_n have_v not_o do_v for_o you_o do_v not_o pretend_v a_o particular_a place_n which_o settle_v this_o infallible_a judge_n at_o rome_n but_o only_o some_o general_n and_o fallacious_a argument_n as_o i_o have_v prove_v and_o beside_o it_o be_v so_o far_o from_o be_v evident_a that_o yourselves_o be_v not_o agree_v about_o it_o but_o some_o seek_v for_o this_o infallible_a judgement_n in_o the_o pope_n other_o in_o a_o general_n council_n and_o these_o do_v as_o fierce_o dispute_v one_o against_o another_o in_o this_o point_n as_o you_o do_v against_o we_o in_o many_o other_o and_o therefore_o it_o be_v much_o more_o rational_a for_o i_o to_o conclude_v thus_o god_n have_v not_o nominate_v and_o appoint_v such_o a_o infallible_a judge_n in_o the_o church_n therefore_o there_o be_v none_o and_o it_o be_v not_o fit_a there_o shall_v be_v one_o than_o saucy_o to_o undertake_v to_o be_v the_o counsellor_n of_o the_o almighty_a and_o to_o tell_v he_o what_o be_v fit_a to_o be_v do_v and_o then_o conclude_v that_o it_o be_v do_v in_o short_a for_o controversy_n about_o fundamental_a and_o necessary_a thing_n god_n have_v provide_v sufficient_a mean_n for_o the_o end_n of_o they_o have_v clear_o enough_o determine_v they_o in_o his_o word_n for_o the_o satisfaction_n of_o all_o that_o be_v diligent_a and_o humble_a and_o teachable_a and_o for_o controversy_n of_o lesser_a moment_n there_o be_v no_o necessity_n of_o have_v they_o end_v nor_o will_v they_o be_v much_o prejudicial_a to_o the_o peace_n of_o the_o world_n and_o the_o church_n if_o man_n will_v learn_v to_o give_v any_o allowance_n for_o the_o infirmity_n of_o humane_a nature_n and_o exercise_v that_o great_a and_o necessary_a duty_n of_o charity_n and_o mutual_a forbearance_n but_o since_o this_o be_v all_o you_o can_v say_v upon_o this_o particular_a i_o pray_v you_o let_v i_o hear_v what_o other_o argument_n you_o have_v against_o our_o church_n and_o doctrine_n pop._n then_o another_o argument_n against_o your_o church_n and_o way_n be_v take_v from_o the_o novelty_n of_o it_o as_o for_o our_o religion_n it_o have_v have_v possession_n in_o the_o world_n ever_o since_o the_o apostle_n day_n but_o you_o be_v of_o yesterday_n and_o know_v nothing_o your_o religion_n be_v a_o upstart_n religion_n never_o hear_v of_o in_o the_o world_n till_o luther_n day_n prot._n first_o let_v i_o ask_v you_o this_o question_n if_o you_o have_v live_v in_o the_o day_n of_o christ_n or_o of_o the_o apostle_n or_o of_o the_o primitive_a father_n what_o will_v you_o have_v answer_v for_o yourself_o you_o know_v better_o than_o i_o that_o this_o be_v the_o very_a argument_n which_o jew_n and_o heathen_n urge_v against_o the_o christian_n then_o they_o charge_v christ_n with_o not_o walk_v after_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o elder_n matth._n 7._o 5._o and_o the_o athenian_n say_v to_o paul_n may_v we_o know_v what_o this_o new_a doctrine_n be_v act._n 17._o 19_o and_o the_o pharisee_n have_v antiquity_n on_o their_o side_n be_v zealous_a for_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o father_n gal._n 1._o 14._o and_o though_o it_o be_v true_a that_o the_o apostle_n have_v the_o first_o antiquity_n for_o they_o deliver_v nothing_o but_o what_o for_o substance_n be_v in_o moses_n and_o the_o prophet_n act._n 26._o 22._o which_o also_o be_v our_o case_n yet_o the_o immediate_a and_o latter_a antiquity_n be_v against_o they_o and_o for_o divers_a age_n together_o these_o doctrine_n have_v be_v in_o great_a measure_n obscure_v and_o unknown_a what_o then_o will_v you_o have_v answer_v to_o a_o jew_n or_o a_o heathen_a object_v this_o novelty_n to_o you_o learn_v from_o christ_n who_o when_o the_o jew_n plead_v for_o the_o continuance_n of_o their_o old_a practice_n in_o the_o matter_n of_o divorce_n he_o account_v it_o sufficient_a confutation_n that_o from_o the_o beginning_n it_o be_v not_o so_o mat._n 19_o 7._o and_o to_o all_o the_o pretence_n of_o the_o pharisee_n from_o antiquity_n he_o oppose_v this_o one_o thing_n search_v the_o scripture_n john_n 5._o 39_o so_o you_o dispute_v against_o we_o with_o the_o argument_n which_o the_o pharisee_n use_v against_o christ_n and_o we_o answer_v you_o as_o he_o answer_v they_o beside_o let_v i_o ask_v you_o this_o question_n if_o i_o can_v clear_o prove_v to_o you_o all_o the_o point_n of_o our_o faith_n and_o disprove_v the_o point_n of_o you_o from_o the_o holy_a scripture_n tell_v i_o will_v you_o then_o acknowledge_v the_o truth_n of_o the_o protestant_a religion_n notwithstanding_o all_o this_o pretend_a novelty_n pop._n yes_o certain_o for_o we_o all_o confess_v the_o truth_n of_o all_o that_o be_v contain_v in_o the_o holy_a scripture_n prot._n hence_o than_o it_o follow_v undeniable_o that_o the_o main_a thing_n that_o you_o and_o i_o must_v look_v to_o in_o our_o faith_n be_v that_o it_o be_v agreeable_a to_o the_o holy_a scripture_n and_o if_o we_o be_v so_o as_o i_o be_o full_o persuade_v it_o be_v and_o you_o the_o contrary_a neither_o antiquity_n be_v any_o argument_n for_o you_o nor_o novelty_n against_o we_o beside_o when_o you_o charge_v our_o church_n with_o novelty_n i_o suppose_v you_o mean_v that_o our_o doctrine_n be_v new_a pop._n i_o do_v so_o prot._n then_o you_o can_v just_o charge_v we_o with_o novelty_n for_o 1._o you_o confess_v the_o antiquity_n and_o verity_n of_o most_o of_o our_o fundamental_a doctrine_n and_o yourselves_o do_v approve_v they_o only_o you_o make_v addition_n of_o your_o own_o to_o they_o you_o own_o all_o the_o scripture_n in_o our_o bible_n only_o you_o add_v the_o apocrypha_fw-la you_o acknowledge_v scripture_n the_o rule_n of_o faith_n only_o you_o add_v tradition_n we_o believe_v all_o the_o article_n of_o the_o apostle_n creed_n the_o chillingworth_n belief_n whereof_o the_o ancient_a father_n think_v sufficient_a to_o salvation_n and_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o four_o first_o general_n council_n as_o you_o do_v also_o you_o own_o our_o doctrine_n of_o christ_n satisfaction_n and_o justification_n by_o christ_n and_o faith_n only_o you_o add_v your_o own_o work_n and_o satisfaction_n our_o two_o sacrament_n you_o approve_v only_o you_o add_v five_o more_o our_o doctrine_n of_o the_o two_o state_n of_o man_n in_o heaven_n and_o hell_n you_o own_o only_o you_o add_v purgatory_n you_o own_o christ_n for_o your_o mediator_n and_o prayer_n to_o god_n through_o he_o only_o you_o add_v other_o mediator_n our_o worship_n of_o god_n you_o own_o only_o you_o add_v image_n these_o be_v the_o principal_a point_n of_o our_o religion_n and_o dare_v you_o now_o say_v that_o our_o doctrine_n be_v new_a 2._o many_o of_o your_o able_a doctor_n confess_v that_o divers_a of_o the_o peculiar_a doctrine_n of_o your_o church_n be_v new_a and_o unknown_a to_o the_o ancient_a father_n and_o it_o be_v most_o evident_a and_o undeniable_a concern_v indulgence_n purgatory_n communion_n in_o one_o kind_n worship_n in_o a_o strange_a tongue_n the_o receive_v some_o of_o your_o apocryphal_a book_n transubstantiation_n especial_o as_o a_o article_n of_o faith_n the_o pope_n infallibility_n worship_n of_o image_n
such_o special_a opportunity_n of_o know_v the_o judgement_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n both_o jewish_a and_o christian_a beside_o i_o be_o inform_v that_o the_o famous_a bishop_n of_o sardis_n melito_n a_o man_n of_o great_a judgement_n and_o venerable_a holiness_n as_o your_o sixtus_n senensis_n say_v do_v take_v a_o journey_n to_o the_o eastern_a church_n where_o the_o apostle_n principal_o preach_v to_o find_v out_o the_o true_a canon_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o return_v with_o the_o same_o canon_n that_o we_o own_v but_o for_o the_o apochrypha_n bring_v home_o a_o non_fw-fr est_fw-la inventus_fw-la and_o moreover_o that_o divers_a of_o your_o great_a champion_n do_v confess_v that_o a_o great_a number_n of_o the_o ancient_a father_n be_v of_o our_o opinion_n among_o which_o themselves_o reckon_v melito_n origen_n athanasius_n eusebius_n ruffinus_n hierom_n and_o amphilocius_fw-la so_o say_v canus_n and_o bellarmine_n and_o andradius_fw-la and_o in_o the_o general_n sixtus_n senensis_n confess_v that_o the_o ancient_a father_n be_v of_o our_o opinion_n be_v these_o thing_n so_o pop._n i_o will_v not_o deny_v the_o truth_n it_o be_v so_o but_o you_o must_v know_v that_o other_o father_n be_v of_o another_o mind_n as_o clemens_n cyprian_n and_o ambrose_n and_o especial_o st._n austin_n and_o the_o council_n of_o carthage_n prot._n the_o father_n of_o our_o opinion_n be_v both_o far_o more_o numerous_a and_o such_o as_o live_v near_a the_o apostolical_a time_n and_o church_n the_o council_n of_o laodicea_n be_v more_o ancient_a than_o that_o of_o carthage_n and_o therefore_o of_o great_a authority_n and_o beside_o the_o six_o council_n of_o constantinople_n do_v express_o confirm_v all_o the_o decree_n of_o the_o council_n of_o laodicea_n among_o which_o this_o be_v one_o and_o the_o council_n of_o carthage_n too_o do_v not_o your_o work_n for_o in_o their_o catalogue_n there_o be_v both_o more_o than_o you_o own_o to_o wit_n the_o three_o book_n of_o esdras_n although_o they_o call_v it_o the_o second_o as_o the_o greek_n do_v and_o less_o too_o for_o they_o shut_v out_o baruch_n and_o the_o maccabee_n but_o beside_o all_o this_o i_o be_o tell_v that_o very_o many_o of_o your_o most_o eminent_a doctor_n have_v disow_v these_o book_n which_o we_o reject_v as_o the_o parisian_a divine_n and_o cardinal_n ximenius_n with_o the_o complutensian_a university_n and_o aquinas_n and_o lyra_n and_o pagnim_fw-la and_o many_o other_o be_v it_o so_o pop._n i_o confess_v this_o be_v true_a 43._o prot._n then_o i_o be_o sure_a this_o may_v satisfy_v any_o rational_a man_n concern_v the_o testimony_n of_o the_o ancient_a church_n and_o for_o the_o next_o point_n viz._n their_o agreement_n with_o the_o canonical_a book_n i_o think_v it_o be_v plain_a enough_o that_o they_o do_v gross_o contradict_v they_o and_o the_o truth_n too_o that_o fact_n of_o simeon_n and_o levi_n which_o good_a jacob_n act_v by_o god_n spirit_n detest_v judith_n commend_v chap._n 9_o tobit_n be_v say_v to_o have_v live_v 202._o year_n chap._n 14._o whereas_o if_o he_o say_v true_a he_o must_v have_v live_v twice_o as_o long_o for_o he_o say_v he_o be_v take_v captive_a by_o salmanasser_n chap._n 1._o and_o 2._o and_o 14._o and_o when_o he_o be_v about_o to_o die_v he_o say_v the_o time_n be_v near_o for_o the_o return_n of_o the_o israelite_n from_o their_o captivity_n and_o the_o re-building_n of_o the_o temple_n which_o be_v burn_v if_o the_o book_n of_o the_o maccabee_n say_v true_a antiochus_n his_o soul_n have_v a_o lease_n of_o his_o body_n for_o three_o life_n and_o he_o be_v kill_v thrice_o over_o i_o commend_v the_o author_n he_o be_v resolve_v to_o make_v sure_a work_n of_o he_o 1._o he_o die_v at_o babylon_n in_o his_o bed_n 1_o mac._n 2._o 6._o then_o he_o be_v stone_v in_o the_o temple_n of_o nanea_n 2_o mac._n 1._o last_o he_o die_v in_o the_o mountain_n by_o a_o fall_n out_o of_o his_o chariot_n 2_o maccab._n 9_o and_o the_o fine_a fetch_n of_o your_o author_n to_o reconcile_v these_o gross_a contradiction_n put_v i_o in_o mind_n of_o a_o story_n we_o hear_v at_o school_n if_o you_o remember_v of_o a_o gentleman_n that_o tell_v this_o lie_n apocryphis_fw-la that_o he_o shoot_v a_o deer_n at_o one_o shot_n through_o his_o right_a ear_n and_o leave_v hinder_v leg_n and_o you_o know_v how_o hard_o his_o man_n be_v put_v to_o it_o to_o help_v his_o master_n out_o but_o i_o will_v not_o launch_v forth_o into_o the_o sea_n of_o untruth_n and_o absurdity_n that_o be_v contain_v in_o those_o book_n these_o may_v suffice_v to_o show_v you_o that_o we_o do_v not_o without_o warrant_n reject_v they_o but_o howsoever_o it_o be_v sufficient_a for_o my_o purpose_n that_o you_o grant_v that_o my_o bible_n as_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o these_o book_n in_o it_o canonical_a and_o i_o can_v know_v this_o without_o the_o church_n authority_n pop._n do_v not_o make_v too_o much_o haste_n if_o i_o do_v grant_v that_o these_o book_n in_o the_o original_a language_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n yet_o you_o be_v but_o a_o translation_n prot._n be_v it_o right_o translate_v for_o the_o substance_n or_o be_v it_o not_o what_o bible_n be_v that_o which_o you_o have_v pop._n a_o latin_a bible_n prot._n be_v that_o the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o right_o translate_v pop._n yes_o the_o council_n of_o trent_n have_v decree_v so_o prot._n then_o i_o pray_v you_o let_v we_o try_v this_o experiment_n do_v you_o pick_v out_o any_o 20._o verse_n in_o several_a part_n of_o the_o bible_n and_o turn_v they_o into_o english_a out_o of_o your_o bible_n pop._n the_o motion_n be_v fair_a i_o will_v do_v it_o prot._n i_o do_v not_o find_v any_o substantial_a difference_n in_o all_o these_o place_n between_o your_o translation_n and_o i_o the_o difference_n be_v whole_o in_o word_n not_o at_o all_o in_o sense_n so_o now_o i_o thank_v you_o for_o this_o occasion_n for_o i_o have_v hear_v some_o of_o your_o priest_n rant_a high_o against_o our_o translation_n and_o now_o i_o see_v they_o have_v no_o cause_n for_o it_o pop._n if_o all_o this_o be_v over_o yet_o the_o scripture_n be_v not_o a_o sufficient_a rule_n to_o guide_v you_o to_o heaven_n of_o itself_o without_o tradition_n prot._n why_o so_o i_o beseech_v you_o pop._n because_o you_o be_v also_o command_v there_o to_o hold_v the_o tradition_n true_a in_o your_o bible_n to_o 2_o thes._n 2._o 15._o hold_v the_o tradition_n which_o you_o have_v be_v teach_v whether_o by_o word_n or_o epistle_n prot._n how_o do_v you_o prove_v that_o he_o speak_v of_o such_o tradition_n as_o be_v not_o write_v in_o the_o scripture_n pop._n because_o he_o so_o plain_o distinguish_v between_o what_o he_o teach_v they_o by_o word_n and_o what_o he_o teach_v they_o by_o epistle_n or_o write_n prot._n that_o may_v be_v true_a that_o he_o speak_v of_o some_o thing_n of_o which_o he_o have_v not_o write_v to_o they_o and_o yet_o they_o may_v be_v write_v by_o he_o to_o other_o or_o by_o other_o at_o least_o after_o that_o time_n but_o beside_o notwithstanding_o this_o distinction_n between_o word_n and_o epistle_n divers_a of_o your_o own_o author_n affirm_v that_o tradition_n be_v perfect_a and_o that_o st._n paul_n teach_v all_o thing_n necessary_a by_o word_n of_o mouth_n and_o why_o may_v not_o i_o as_o well_o say_v that_o he_o teach_v all_o by_o epistle_n but_o i_o pray_v you_o what_o do_v you_o mean_v by_o these_o tradition_n pop._n i_o mean_v all_o the_o tradition_n which_o either_o he_o or_o any_o other_o apostle_n do_v deliver_v all_o these_o you_o be_v bind_v to_o receive_v prot._n i_o will_v not_o quarrel_v with_o you_o for_o that_o bring_v i_o solid_a proof_n of_o any_o of_o your_o unwritten_a tradition_n that_o they_o do_v indeed_o come_v from_o the_o apostle_n i_o promise_v you_o i_o will_v joyful_o receive_v they_o but_o i_o pray_v you_o what_o be_v these_o tradition_n you_o speak_v of_o pop._n such_o as_o these_o the_o doctrine_n of_o purgatory_n invocation_n of_o saint_n of_o the_o pope_n supremacy_n of_o the_o single_a life_n of_o priest_n of_o the_o fast_n of_o the_o church_n private_a mass_n worship_n of_o image_n etc._n etc._n prot._n and_o do_v you_o think_v that_o all_o that_o do_v not_o believe_v and_o receive_v these_o tradition_n shall_v be_v damn_v pop._n no_o by_o no_o mean_n for_o than_o i_o shall_v condemn_v many_o of_o the_o holy_a father_n and_o martyr_n who_o differ_v from_o we_o at_o least_o in_o some_o of_o these_o point_n prot._n then_o it_o be_v not_o necessary_a to_o salvation_n to_o receive_v these_o tradition_n and_o the_o scripture_n may_v be_v sufficient_a without_o they_o but_o further_a these_o unwritten_a tradition_n you_o talk_v of_o i_o beseech_v you_o how_o come_v you_o to_o discover_v they_o and_o
tell_v i_o i_o pray_v you_o do_v you_o not_o hold_v that_o there_o be_v two_o kind_n of_o religious_a worship_n namely_o absolute_a which_o you_o give_v to_o god_n or_o the_o saint_n and_o relative_a which_o you_o give_v to_o their_o image_n pop._n i_o must_v own_v it_o prot._n then_o it_o be_v horrible_a impudence_n to_o say_v you_o do_v not_o give_v worship_n to_o the_o image_n since_o you_o give_v one_o of_o these_o two_o kind_n unto_o they_o and_o unto_o they_o only_o beside_o if_o all_o you_o say_v be_v true_a this_o will_v not_o acquit_v you_o from_o idolatry_n for_o your_o church_n profess_v and_o command_v the_o worship_n of_o the_o image_n of_o saint_n as_o well_o as_o of_o god_n and_o christ_n and_o since_o it_o be_v idolatry_n to_o give_v divine_a honour_n to_o any_o creature_n as_o i_o before_o prove_v you_o be_v no_o less_o guilty_a in_o give_v it_o to_o the_o saint_n themselves_o than_o to_o their_o image_n and_o so_o you_o be_v double-dyed_a idolater_n my_o second_o argument_n be_v take_v from_o the_o second_o commandment_n thou_o shall_v not_o make_v any_o grave_a image_n but_o first_o i_o pray_v you_o tell_v i_o true_a have_v your_o church_n leave_v out_o this_o second_o commandment_n in_o divers_a of_o her_o breviaries_n and_o office_n of_o prayer_n or_o do_v our_o minister_n slander_v they_o i_o hear_v that_o in_o the_o hour_n of_o our_o lady_n print_v at_o paris_n a_o 1611._o the_o commandment_n of_o the_o first_o table_n be_v set_v down_o in_o these_o word_n and_o no_o other_o 1._o commandment_n i_o be_o the_o lord_n thy_o god_n thou_o shall_v not_o have_v nor_o worship_v any_o other_o god_n but_o i_o 2._o commandment_n thou_o shall_v not_o take_v the_o name_n of_o the_o lord_n thy_o god_n in_o vain_a 3._o commandment_n remember_v to_o keep_v holy_a the_o sabbath_n day_n and_o feast_n and_o that_o the_o council_n of_o ausburg_n ann._n 1548._o deliver_v the_o commandment_n in_o dutch_a for_o the_o people_n leave_v out_o the_o mention_n of_o image_n and_o that_o their_o cheat_n may_v not_o be_v discover_v that_o the_o people_n may_v have_v their_o full_a number_n they_o make_v use_v of_o the_o mistake_n of_o one_o of_o the_o father_n and_o divide_v the_o last_o command_n into_o two_o against_o sense_n and_o reason_n and_o the_o practice_n of_o the_o whole_a ancient_a church_n be_v these_o thing_n so_o pop._n it_o be_v true_a it_o be_v leave_v out_o in_o some_o of_o our_o book_n but_o we_o leave_v it_o in_o in_o all_o bibles_n and_o divers_a of_o our_o catechism_n prot._n very_o well_o i_o see_v you_o have_v wit_n in_o your_o anger_n i_o commend_v your_o discretion_n that_o you_o do_v not_o your_o work_n so_o gross_o that_o all_o the_o world_n shall_v cry_v shame_n of_o you_o but_o that_o you_o blot_v it_o out_o in_o any_o be_v a_o evidence_n of_o your_o guilt_n but_o what_o say_v you_o to_o this_o argument_n pop._n then_o my_o first_o answer_n be_v that_o this_o command_n be_v peculiar_a to_o the_o jew_n who_o be_v most_o prone_a to_o idolatry_n adoratione_n prot._n this_o be_v not_o true_a it_o sufficient_o appear_v that_o the_o gentile_n be_v under_o the_o obligation_n of_o this_o law_n from_o those_o punishment_n which_o god_n inflict_v upon_o they_o for_o their_o transgression_n or_o breach_n of_o it_o by_o idolatry_n rom._n 1._o but_o where_o there_o be_v no_o law_n there_o be_v no_o transgression_n beside_o christ_n tell_v we_o he_o come_v not_o to_o destroy_v the_o law_n the_o moral_a law_n but_o to_o fulfil_v it_o mat._n 5._o 17._o belike_o you_o be_v not_o of_o his_o mind_n and_o dare_v you_o say_v the_o jew_n as_o soon_o they_o believe_v in_o christ_n be_v discharge_v from_o this_o command_n and_o allow_v to_o worship_v the_o image_n which_o that_o command_n forbid_v pop._n i_o will_v not_o say_v so_o but_o i_o have_v a_o second_o answer_n the_o thing_n prohibit_v here_o be_v not_o image_n which_o be_v representation_n of_o real_a thing_n as_o you_o false_o render_v it_o but_o idol_n which_o be_v the_o image_n of_o false_a god_n which_o be_v not_o and_o never_o be_v in_o the_o world_n prot._n the_o text_n its_o self_n be_v full_a against_o you_o for_o the_o image_n there_o prohibit_v be_v not_o say_v to_o be_v the_o image_n of_o the_o false_a god_n of_o the_o heathen_n whereof_o many_o never_o have_v any_o be_v but_o the_o image_n of_o any_o thing_n in_o heaven_n or_o earth_n etc._n etc._n moreover_o divers_a of_o the_o heathen_a god_n be_v man_n who_o they_o deify_v i_o hope_v their_o picture_n be_v picture_n of_o real_a thing_n yet_o these_o be_v idol_n pop._n though_o they_o real_o be_v man_n yet_o their_o picture_n be_v make_v to_o represent_v they_o as_o god_n and_o such_o they_o be_v not_o real_o and_o therefore_o be_v idol_n prot._n the_o learned_a heathen_n know_v as_o well_o as_o you_o and_o i_o do_v that_o jupiter_n and_o mars_n and_o mercury_n and_o the_o rest_n be_v mere_a man_n and_o they_o smile_v at_o the_o ignorance_n of_o their_o vulgar_a that_o think_v otherwise_o only_o they_o think_v of_o they_o just_a as_o you_o do_v of_o the_o saint_n that_o the_o great_a god_n have_v put_v some_o of_o his_o honour_n upon_o they_o and_o therefore_o they_o may_v worship_v they_o you_o can_v be_v so_o silly_a to_o think_v the_o learned_a heathen_n think_v augustus_n be_v a_o god_n real_o when_o he_o be_v dead_a yet_o their_o worship_n of_o his_o image_n be_v idolatry_n and_o they_o that_o worship_v the_o image_n of_o caligula_n while_o he_o live_v be_v not_o so_o sottish_a to_o take_v he_o for_o a_o god_n who_o they_o know_v to_o be_v a_o foolish_a and_o wicked_a man_n yet_o i_o hope_v you_o will_v not_o excuse_v they_o from_o idolatry_n but_o further_a as_o the_o jew_n do_v universal_o understand_v this_o to_o be_v a_o prohibition_n of_o all_o manner_n of_o image_n so_o all_o the_o prophet_n and_o christ_n and_o the_o apostle_n be_v so_o far_o from_o reprove_v they_o which_o they_o will_v have_v do_v if_o it_o have_v be_v a_o error_n that_o they_o every_o where_o strengthen_v they_o in_o this_o opinion_n by_o declaim_v against_o all_o worship_n of_o image_n without_o any_o distinction_n and_o tell_v i_o i_o pray_v you_o if_o any_o jew_n have_v at_o that_o time_n make_v for_o instance_n a_o image_n of_o the_o sun_n not_o look_v on_o it_o as_o god_n but_o as_o a_o glorious_a creature_n of_o god_n and_o therefore_o fit_a to_o be_v religious_o worship_v as_o you_o think_v of_o the_o saint_n and_o angel_n and_o have_v bow_v down_o to_o it_o and_o worship_v it_o do_v you_o think_v he_o have_v not_o break_v this_o law_n pop._n i_o dare_v not_o deny_v but_o he_o have_v break_v it_o prot._n yet_o this_o have_v be_v no_o idol_n but_o a_o image_n according_a to_o your_o sense_n of_o it_o beside_o i_o find_v that_o all_o manner_n of_o image_n be_v forbid_v leu._n 26._o 1._o howsoever_o to_o i_o you_o seem_v to_o venture_v your_o salvation_n upon_o a_o nice_a point_n for_o the_o hebrew_n word_n be_v neither_o image_n nor_o idol_n but_o pesel_n as_o a_o divine_a tell_v i_o and_o this_o i_o understand_v be_v diverse_o translate_v some_o render_v it_o a_o image_n other_o a_o idol_n now_o you_o ventrue_a your_o soul_n upon_o it_o that_o the_o last_o be_v the_o only_a true_a translation_n which_o be_v a_o dreadful_a hazard_n because_o it_o be_v otherwise_o render_v not_o only_o by_o protestant_n but_o by_o the_o most_o and_o best_a ancient_a interpreter_n 〈◊〉_d even_o those_o who_o your_o vulgar_a translation_n very_o oft_o follow_v in_o other_o place_n these_o render_v it_o not_o a_o idol_n but_o a_o grave_a image_n and_o the_o seventy_o interpreter_n i_o be_o assure_v poo_o promiscuous_o render_v the_o word_n sometime_o a_o idol_n sometime_o a_o grave_a image_n nay_o more_o than_o this_o that_o it_o may_v appear_v how_o desperate_o our_o cause_n be_v i_o be_o inform_v your_o own_o vulgar_a translation_n from_o which_o you_o be_v oblige_v not_o to_o swerve_v do_v frequent_o render_v it_o not_o idol_n but_o a_o grave_a image_n sculptile_n particular_o in_o exod_n 20._o 4._o levit._fw-la 26._o 1._o and_o deut._n 4._o 16_o 25._o and_o 5._o 8._o be_v these_o thing_n so_o pop._n i_o can_v deny_v it_o for_o the_o author_n themselves_o will_v confute_v i_o but_o one_o thing_n i_o have_v to_o say_v you_o must_v understand_v one_o scripture_n so_o as_o to_o agree_v with_o another_o now_o i_o find_v god_n himself_o allow_v and_o prescribe_v some_o image_n as_o those_o of_o the_o cherubim_n either_o than_o he_o contradict_v himself_o or_o he_o do_v not_o forbid_v all_o image_n but_o idol_n only_o prot._n though_o i_o may_v say_v god_n may_v make_v a_o exception_n to_o some_o of_o his_o law_n when_o no_o man_n can_v as_o