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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A20001	A summarie ansvvere to al the material points in any of Master Darel his bookes More especiallie to that one booke of his, intituled, the Doctrine of the possession and dispossession of demoniaks out of the word of God. By Iohn Deacon. Iohn Walker. Preachers.	Deacon, John, 17th cent.; Walker, John, preacher. aut	1601 (1601)	STC 6440; ESTC S109440	212,590	277

selfe same primarie dispossessions performed by Christ may seeme to import saying thus the like was neuer seene in Israell Exorcistes That is the like manner of curing not the like matter of essentiall possessing Orthodoxus If there had beene the like matter of essentiall possessing before the comming of Christ but not the like manner of curing the same then tell vs I pray you what manner of curing they had in those dayes I meane by what meanes they were cured before the comming of Christ. I hope you will not say they were cured by physicall meanes Neyther may you for shame auouch their cure to be wrought by that your supposed new ordinance of prayer and fasting because such an ordinance before the comming of Christ was neuer establisht and so much also you doe else where affirme your owne selfe If therefore the manner of curing your supposed possessions then was neyther by physicall meanes nor by praier and fasting it followeth necessarilie that their said cure it was then also effected by some supernaturall and miraculous meanes Now then if the cure of those your supposed possessions before the comming of Christ were euerie of them supernaturall strange and miraculous how can it be possiblie true which the Euangelist reporteth here saying thus the like was neuer seene in Israell sith the miraculous expelling of spirits and diuels had beene in euerie age of the world euen equallie admirable straunge and most meruellous Againe sith Christ is in deed that promised seed of the woman who in his owne proper person was actuallie to breake the Serpents head it is meruellous probable that the eternall father euen in his foreseeing wisdome had purposelie determined from before all eternities that the primarie and first actuall encountring with Satan his actuall possossion should be primarily and actuallie accomplished by Christ himselfe in his owne person first and that therefore this temporarie iudgement of Satan his actuall possession was neuer actuallie inflicted vpon anie before the comming of Christ. Besides that if there had beene possessions and dispossessions from the beginning of the world as your selfe doth else where auouch the same then no doubt being so fearefull a iudgement would haue beene eftsoones foretold and threatned the Iewes by some of the Prophets at least for an especiall part of the counsell of God as well as many other speciall iudgements of lesse moment by much and so euen those their propheticall predictions and denuntiations of that so fearefull a iudgement being so necessarie for the Church of God it would no doubt haue beene as carefullie registred for the succeeding ages to the end of the world as any other like iudgement of God whatsoeuer Moreouer if there had beene such a miraculous dispossessing of diuels any long time before the comming of Christ then surelie the same vndoubtedlie being such admirable matters of fact they would in some one booke or other throughout the old testament haue beene most carefullie recorded for all posterities sith many other miracles of lesse importance by much are so precisely put downe in euerie place namelie the miraculous deliuerance of Israell the straung wonders in Egypt in the red sea in the wildernes in mount Sinah and els where the wonders recorded in the bookes of Ioshuah Iudges Samuell of the Kings the Chronicles and other historicall bookes wherein all such admirable matters of fact are purposelie put downe and recorded All which precedent miraculous actions being in some of those bookes at the least so exactlie registred by the spirit of God it is not to be doubted but that the miraculous dispossessing of diuels if any such then would haue beene likewise most carefullie recorded as matters eyther actuallie or typicallie performed But no such authenticall record is any where extant in all the Canonicall scriptures and therefore it is verie probable there was then no such miraculous dispossessing of diuels before the comming of Christ. Exorcistes Howsoeuer such a miraculous manner of curing then be not actuallie recorded it is likelie the same was typicallie shadowed forth in the brazen Serpent Because that Serpent was a liuelie figure of Christ himselfe who was actuallie to cure the deadlie sting of that infernall Serpent the diuell Orthodoxus Be it so as you say Yet that brazen Serpent it onelie prefigured the effectuall curing of the serpentine sting of sinne and not the power of Christ his actuall expelling of diuels from out of the bodies of men vnlesse happily you imagine that as all the Elect were effectuallie wounded with the serpentine sting of sinne so were they also essentiallie possessed with diuels inherently dwelling within their bodies Besides that the brazen serpent was onlie a shadow of that whereof Christ was the bodie and therefore by that reason there could be onelie a bare shadow but no essentiall possessions or dispossessions before the comming of Christ. Furthermore if there had in deed bin essentiall possessions before the comming of Christ what then could Christ himselfe haue done more at his comming then manie others had effected before him Besides that if there had beene such miraculous dispossessions before then surelie though Christ at his comming had also for the declaration of his deitie dispossessed ten thousand Demoniakes moe then he did yet this one exception had bin verie forcible against him from time to time namelie that many others before him had performed as much in effect And therefore no reason that for such a miraculous dispossessing of diuels they should esteeme him to be rather the Messiah then any of the rest Moreouer if there had beene any such miraculous dispossessings before then had not that beene true which our Sauiour speakes of himselfe saying thus If I had not done works among them which none other man did they had not had sin but now haue they seene and hated not onely mee but also my father Brieflie if there had beene such dispossessions before the comming of Christ how then should our Sauiour himselfe by such his powerfull expelling of diuels haue beene so particularlie reputed for that sonne of Dauid who especiallie was to walke vpon the Lion and Adder and triumphantlie to tread the young Lion and Dragon vnder his feet Exorcistes Whatsoeuer you say I will neuer be perswaded but that there were dispossessions before the comming of Christ. Orthodoxus Well be it supposed there were such miraculous dispossessings in Israell before the comming of Christ yet is it to too absurde to auouch that those extraordinarie effects which apparantlie brake forth in former Demoniakes are purposelie recorded for infallible ordinarie meanes or signes to discerne soundlie and truelie of all the succeeding Demoniakes Both because wee are no where foretold by the Lord your selfe also els where auouching the contrarie that diuels should preciselie obserue but one and the selfesame methode or order in tormenting the parties possessed and for that also there was then no such vrgent necessitie of any such

others Moreouer it may please the good Reader to remember withal that such absurd positions and so many apparant contradictions they cannot possiblie proceed from that spirit of truth which leadeth into all soundnes of truth and religion and that therefore they haue in them no force at all to fight for the Lord who needeth not the lies of mortall men Brieflie this we our selues doe certainely know all men more especiallie the iudiciall sort they plainely perceiue that howsoeuer those their pretended essentiall possessions and dispossessions of diuels may haplie accord with the truth of the Scriptures yet these their published Pamphlets they will neuer be able to make good the supposed truths which themselues doe pretend and that therefore they must of necessitie be forced to begin a new ground or to giue ouer their cause The Lord by his spirit direct vs only vnto that which tends to the glory of his great name the present good of his Church and our owne euerlasting comforts in Iesus Christ. So be it euen so Lord Iesu. Amen The seuerall Arguments handled at large in the subsequent Dialogues concerning our second encounter The first Dialogue Pag. 1. The Argument 1 WHether Master Darel his second encounter contayning an hotch-potch of things confusedly shuffled together hath found a better successe concerning the pretended essentiall possession of Spirits and Diuels then any the precedent particulars propounded at large in our former Dialogues The second Dialogue Pag. 81. The Argument 2 WHether this fresh encounter contayning an hotch-potch of matters confusedlie shuffled together hath found a better successe cōcerning the pretended dispossession of Diuels by prayer and fasting then any of the precedent particulars propounded at large in those our former discourses The third Dialogue Pag. 197. The Argument 3 THe holie and right vses which the Church and Children of God are to make of this Doctrine concerning the finall determination of possessions and disposessions of spirits and diuels A SVMMARIE ANSWERE TO ALL THE MATERIALL POINTS in any of Master DAREL his bookes The first Dialogue THE ARGVMENT Whether Master Darel his second encounter containing an hotch-potch of things confusedly shuffled together hath found a better successe concerning the pretended essentiall possession of Spirits and Diuels then any the precedent particulars propounded at large in our former Dialogues The speakers names PHILOLOGVS LYCANTHROPVS PNEVMATOMACHVS PHYSIOLOGVS ORTHODOXVS EXORCISTES Orthodoxus EXorcistes Hauing very lately receiued your late-spread factious Pamphlets as also your Champion-like challenge concerning your old inueterate opinions about the essentiall possessions of Spirits and Diuels I vnderstand by Master Physiologus and the rest of our companie that according to your owne appointment for time and place you are now come purposely ouer vnto vs to mannage your challenge Surely howsoeuer your maine forces may happely be feeble there is no want I perceiue of a valorous minde Well sir you are welcome vnto vs. And therefore what say you man Doe you feele your selfe no lesse readie than willing to aduenture the combate afresh Exorcistes Yea sir I am very willing and readie at all assaies and doe purpose very valiantlie to hold out the encounter or lie fast by the heeles But what say you first to those my three late published treatises which you so scornefully brand with the odious title of factious Pamphlets Orthodoxus Or euer I come to open my mouth concerning any your owne matters I must first of all be very importunate vpon the rest of our companie that they would in no wise interrupt our talke for protracting the time but onely attend with silence and become indiff●rent Iudges concerning the scope of our conference Vnles happilie it may please Master Physiologus for better ease vnto me and more delight to your selues to enterlace now and then some such Philosophicall points as may in any sort tend to the further manifestation of the maine purpose in hand Lycanthropus We like very well of and doe willinglie submit to your motion proceede therefore in your matters as the Lord in mercie shall direct your minds Orthodoxus Content Come on therefore Exorcistes what say you now to the essentiall possession of Spirits and Diuels Exorcistes Sir be you sure you must finde me no Changeling concerning that so weightie a matter But first shew me I beseech you how you may possiblie make good the intolerable disgrace which you haue primarilie imposed vpon those my fruitefull labours which it pleaseth your own selfe to terme but factious Pamphlets Orthodoxus Why man It hath been euer my ordinarie manner of dealing you know to call a spade a spade and therefore you must pardon my plainenes herein Howbeit be patient I pray you we will neuer fall forth for naming the Childe And therefore pretermitting the terme of factious Pamphlets those your three last published treatises sith forsooth you will needes haue them intituled so they are either such as concerne onely but matters of fact or such as concerne matters of fact and Doctrine together Your treatises concerning onely but matters of fact namely your Triall and Detection I doe purpose at no hand to intermeddle withall Both because you your owne selfe haue purposely singled forth from the rest your proper Antagonists whom you proudely intitle the two English Inquisitours Samuel Harsnet I meane and his Master whom also in the very heate of your pride you haue by a Hysteron Proteron preposterouslie put downe in your Pamphlet and for that I also my selfe haue no authenticall Commission to enquire after much lesse to determine such factious proceedings For which speciall respects I doe purposely put ouer the trying forth of your Triall as also the orderly deciding of that your Detection to such Ecclesiasticall Commissioners as her excellent Maiestie hath authenticallie subordinate vnder her Highnes for the orderlie finding forth of all those vnorderlie and grosse malefactors which doe indirectlie withstand or impugne the same Exorcistes Well what say you then to the other of my treatises Orthodoxus You shall vnderstand anon my censure concerning the same In the meane time howsoeuer for the former considerations I doe vtterlie refuse to meddle with those two forenamed Pamphlets being meerelie but matters of fact yet must I bicker with you a blowe or two concerning the seuerall Epistles prefixed to both For besides that they are in some places absurd and senseles doe labour thoroughout vpon a pitifull begging of the cause of Possession and Dispossession are branded with Grosthead his corrections by matching in your Apocryphall text that your pretended miracle with the true miracles of Christ but yet making the same in your marginall note no miracle at all besides I say that they all keepe onely a circular motion are full fraught with idle excursions with rouing phantasies with extrauagant speeches are thirteene times pestered with an idle traducing tautologie are stored with fearefull disloyall titles and termes of disgrace with vaunting challenges virulent raylings and

or rather their vnwarranted trifling toyes as they haue bin hitherto receiued hand ouer head among the irreligious and prophane of the world with no l●sse admiration forsooth then if they had been the Alcoranean Oracles of Mahomet himselfe so are they alas at this present to too readily entertained with many of no small accompt in the Church as the infallible truths of the eternall God Howbeit the same being once equallie waied and wisely examined according to the very touchstone of truth they will notwithstanding any the supposed sway of their bookes appeare to be no better in effect than old wiues fables then the Legerdemaines of cunning Imposters and the cousoning sleights of some Popish priests as hath beene proued at large The premisses therefore considered let the authors or fauourers of those published Pamphlets endeuour what they possiblie may to support and vphold those fondly conceited fooleries in their former account with the people of God they will notwithstanding very shortly vanish away like snow in the Sunne be deemed no better in effect then Hobgoblings Bugboies Night-sprites or Fairies to make the yoong children afraid with their supposed shadowes while the aged ones in Christ doe take their comfortable rest in an assured confidence concerning the ouerruling power and prouidence of Iehouah himselfe And thus much in effect for those seuerall vses which doe generally appertaine to all men Pneumatomachus They are all singular vses no doubt But proceede now I beseech you to the putting downe also of such as are more particularly befitting some speciall persons Orthodoxus With very good will Wherein we haue first to consider that the seuerall vses more particularly befitting some speciall persons they are summarily of two sorts Namely either such only as concerne the affectors of that new-found Diuillitie or else such also as respect the mislikers thereof Lycanthropus What are those vses I pray you which more speciallie concerne the affectors thereof Orthodoxus They are summarily such as doe purposely tend to the timely informing either of the authors themselues or of any their fauourits Philologus Declare first I pray you those seuerall vses which more particularly respect the authors themselues Orthodoxus Content Wherein wee haue first to consider that for so much as all those the former conceits which Exorcistes hath broached abroad concerning these matters in question are euery of them vndoubtedly such as notwithstanding any his glorious pretences doe not onely not bring any one benefit to the Church in generall or to any the particular members thereof but doe rather tend couertly to the timely support of his owne priuate purposes without hauing relation to publike good nay rather to the vntimely procuring of many publike and priuate mischiefes The consideration hereof may serue to discouer those secret plots and vnder-hand practises which our miracle-mongers of what condition soeuer doe mutually obserue among themselues with one harmonicall consent and course For they all in the very first progresse of any their plotted proceedings doe primarily propound to themselues such purposed proiects as they notwithstanding any their outward iollie pretences doe cunningly prosecute and eftsoones accomplish by the secret meanes of many their vnder-hand practises and iuggling sleights of legerdemaine yea and this also with such a slie and nimble conueiance as a man would hardly imagine that not any other but May-butter it selfe could possiblie melt in their mouthes For these cunning practitioners as they haue euermore had an insatiable thirst to the filthie pleasures and pelfe of the world as to the onely true obiects of their hearts desire and the very purposed proiects which they principally propound to themselues in any their vnder-hand practises though they falsely make shew of a quite contrarie end in all outward appearance so haue they their sundrie deuices to further their said enterprise and to accomplish effectually that their primarie pretended purpose wherein also they are resolutelie bent notwithstanding any crossing occurrents although yet with as little suspition as they possiblie may And therefore in the very first progresse of those their proceedings they solemnely pretend the glorie of God the gracing of sundrie his sacred ordinances and the singular great good of his Church Namely either an approbation of the real presence of Christ in their Masse or a confirmation of publike fasts in those their solemne meetings or a perpetuall establishment of the worship of Saints of Purgatorie of Masses of Trentals of Dirges of praying for the dead of plodding on Pilgrimage with tenne thousand such other deuices Howbeit notwithstanding these wonderfull sturres if wee more prouidently respect the full period of those their proceedings wee may plainly perceiue that their primarie propounded pleasures and profits which they hourely expect as an ordinarie interest successiuely arising from such coloured courses they are that quickening spirit which only affoordeth life and motion to those their entended actions yea and that onely preexisting efficient which giues an essentiall forme to all their purposes and without which their vnder-hand practises would become an vntimely birth would quickly vanish away of themselues and forthwith come vnto nothing Neither only these their lewd plots and practises are apparantly laid open but the fearefull effects also of such counterfeit pranckes they are by the consideration hereof verie plainly discouered For who seeth not how opposite the same is to the eternall purpose of God concerning the actual brusing of the Serpents head how derogatorious to the supereminent dignitie and power of Christ for the finall determination of Satan his power of possession how iniurious vnto the certaine established truth of the Gospell in that it reuiueth the miraculous confirmation thereof afresh how hurtfull to the Church of Christ by breeding therein such vnnecessarie and fruitlesse garboyles how grieuous to the godly in procuring such an horrible prophanation of prayer and fasting vnder an holie pretence of doing great good to the Church how scandalous to the weake in making them doubt whether the Gospell bee yet fully confirmed by miracles how offensiue to Athei●●s in causing them to skorne the holie things of God so odly prophaned how gratefull an enterprise to Antichrist in that it puts vpon the true spouse of Christ the proper badge of his whorish strumpet how dangerous to all men by drawing them thereby into many idle conceits and needlesse troubles and lastly how acceptable a seruice it is to the Diuell and his Angels in that it erecteth and holdeth vp their kingdome afresh by bearing the world in hand that Spirits and Diuels haue such an essentiall inherencie in the bodies of men as cannot bee helped without fasting and prayer when there is no such matter at all but only the bare imaginations of idle braines and the deluding deuices of such cunning Impostors as accompt worldly gaine the greatest godlinesse and thereunto also doe hourely applie all their purposed plots and predetermined practises as experience in euery age