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book_n	church_n	faith_n	word_n	3,077	5	4.1931	3	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A20361	A true report of all the doynges at the assembly co[n]cernyng matters of religion, lately holden at Poyssy in Fraunce. Written in Latine by Mayster Nicholas Gallasius, minister of the Frenche Churche in London, and then present, [and] one of the disputers in the same, translated into English, by I. D.... Seen and allowed accordyng to the order appoynted by the Queenes Maiesties iniunctions; True report of all the doynges at the assembly concernyng matters of religion, lately holden at Poyssy in Fraunce.	Des Gallars, Nicolas, ca. 1520-ca. 1580.	1561 (1561)	STC 6776; ESTC S110901	50,348	138

neither if any manne should ryse from death would they beleue him Or howe did they which had the writings of the Apostles onely when neyther bookes nor commentaries were written of thesame But whereas my Lord Cardinall woulde haue that taken for an Apostolike tradition whiche hathe bene receiued of the church at al times in all places and of al men I see not howe these iii. pointes maie be proued For how great diuersitie shal we find in the bookes of auncient fathers yea and euen in the verye articles of oure faith If these wordes should be weyed at all tymes and of all men wher shall we beginn but at the Apostolike church Who shall be firste in order but onely the Apostles Whose liues and doings are partly faithfully written by Luke and partly gathered out of their owne writinges To be shorte we returne at the last to the first foundatiō of the scriptures sith all truthe came from god who cōmaunded the prophets and Apostles to bee interpreters messengers of oure saluation In the meane time we dooe not reiecte the councels of the fathers as farre as they be confirmed with the testimonies of the holye scripture For them as Austine sayeth the holy●… ghost hath so tempered that it which●… in some place is obscurely spoken in some other is expressed more plainlye and more at large And that rule chiefly amonges others he geueth whereb●… we may vnderstande the scriptures i●… that booke whiche he wrote of christia●… doctrine yet there remaineth som●… doubt in this question Some mē hau●… thought that the will of God in these thinges whiche pertaine to oure saluation is not fullye declared in those writinges whiche the Prophetes and Apostles haue lefte vnto vs. Whiche doubte if it should take any place what a gap wer ther opened to all mischefe And certes this was the breache by the which Sathan first pearced into the vine yard of the lord to destroy it God truely before the tune of Moyses with visiōs reuelatiōs directed his church in like maner yeapostles before thei put theyr doctrine in writīg taught yesame by worde of mouth But because the nūber of men encreasing their noughtynesse encreased also the lorde would y● this doctrine shoulde bee contayned in writinges and monumentes Whiche might be vnderstoode and perceiued of al men why so that he might confoūd the impudence and rashnesse of suche as wil set foorth cloke their dreames with the name of tradition reuelation and custome But if the doctrine of god be written onely in some part to what purpose is this remedy Truely it can not be so Iohn spake of the scriptures when he sayeth that those things which are written are written to that ende that we beleuing them may haue life euerlasting Iohn xx ●… ●…xi whiche he had falslye sayde yf thei themselues had concealed any doctrine necessary to life and saluation But Paule when he declareth the vse of scripture vnder the person of Tymothe teacheth all ministers yf anye thing should haue ben added to the scriptures wuld not haue affirmed that by them the man of god is made perfecte i. Timo. ii d. xvi Neither do we denye but y● at all times there haue ben somtraditions of the apostles which be not written But those were suche as pertained to the ciuil order of the churche But forasmuche as many men haue abused this name this great while I thinke good to shewe what traditions ought to bee counted Apostolike Whiche shall not be hard yf in iudgyng and discernyng them we vse the markes For fyrst we must consyder whether they doe agree with the doctryne of the woorde and then whether they bee apte and meete to edify●… For it is certayne that the Apostles dyd neuer institute any rites and ordinaunces whiche eyther directly or els in anye parte were contrarye to theyr owne doctryne or myghte withdrawe menne from spirituall worshippyng whereof theyr owne wrytynges beare sufficiente recorde If thys rule be obserued bothe doctrine shall easilye be discerned frō traditions also false traditions frō the true Neyther are you ignorant how foolishe Tertullian iudgeth their opinions which think that the apostles haue ouerpassed an●…thīg necessary to saluatiō which ether by word of mouth or writīgs thei haue not taught but we will adde more hereto Namely that those things which herein the Apostles decreed were not continuall Truelye their instytutions passe all exception yet neuerthelesse by the rule of charitye they yelded somewhat to the weaknes of men As when the eating of suffocatorū and bloud was forbid the Iewes Also those thynges which Paule himselfe taught and obserued in Timothe and his own persō Ac. 15. f. 25. Act. 16. a. ● i Co. 16. d. xxix i Co. 11. a 7 Which now truly shuld haue no place but by the generall rule of charitye whereby we are willed in things indifferēt to apply our selues to our neighbours Other such like may be gathered of their rytes as of kissing vncouering the head which was the signe of authority and other such lyke whiche at this daye are contrarye to y● customes of many nations amōg whō it would seme most folish the men should kisse the one the other to talke with the heade vncouered is commonly a signe of y● lowest state and condicion These thinges therefore ought to be considered before anye custome be thought Apostolyke Also no man must grounde vppon the authority of the Apostles to trouble the church As it hapned in the cōtrouersye of the daye in the which Easter should be kept whiche bred miserable deuision and euē in the Apostles tyme by those that did abuse the authoritie of the churche at Ierusalē to myngle Iewishnesse wyth Christian religion Of whom it is writen in the Actes of the Apostles where it was decreed by a councell that no man should lay that yoke on mennes cōsciēces Wherby it may easely be perceiued that the Apostles could not be the authoures of so many ceremonies to the which afterwardes Satisfaction merites and remission of sinnes wer attributed For they taught far otherwise And so much they dissented from makyng newe ceremonies that they gaue no place to those of Moses lawe of the whiche God was the author Of thys yoke of traditions obseruances Austine long since writing to Ianuarius much cōplained if he had liued in our tyme how would he haue lamented thē Wherfore to be shorte we desyre that the Scripture whiche herein is playne maye iudge good traditions frō euil holy from prophane profitable frō hurtful necessarye frō superfluous When of these articles we are once agreed this question shall easily be dissolued whether the authoritie of the church be greater thā of the woorde of god which certes is no lesse fonde than if a man should doubte whether the sōn ought to be aboue his father the wife aboue her husbande or man aboue god And sure neuer the true church or any godly mā woulde moue such

all agreed it best to abstayne frō force But neuetthelesse they meant to prouyde that their feare patience should not encrease the furye and insolence of their foes First of al therfore wheras their number was so great that the cōgregation could not assemble wythin their priuate howsen they determined to come together openly and to haue their sermons and readinges in the open congregations Partly bicause necessitie enforced them therto and partly to cleare themselues of such slaunderous reports as already their impudēt aduersaries had raysed of them For it was openly bruted that most haynous and detestable crimes were committed in their assemblies Therefore they came into the yardes and open places some in their priuate howsen and some in the opē cities Few toke the churches For least any thing should be rashly or vnaduisedly done or leasr their aduersaryes myght haue any couloure to accuse them of rebellion the ministers pastours of euery Churche as much as they myght kept the multitude in awe and order yet neuerthelesse hereof rose sondry tumultes and facrions of their aduersaryes Which notwithstanding could not staye or hynder their open metinges Hereof rose sondry troubles and great suspition and feare of rebellion And thys caused at the last that by the commaundement of the kyng and hys councell it was openly proclaimed that none shuld iniury or molest other for any matter of religiō After thys also was published an other whereby as wel the Bishops as other nobles of the realme were commaunded to repayre to Poyssye to deliberate both for the leauyeng of a tribute to discharge the kynges dettes to foren Princes but chefely for the reforming of the estate of religion Therby also the kinges peace and safecondwite was graunted to all suche as woulde come thither freely to propose whatsoeuer perteined to true religion and the establishing of cōcord And it was commaunded vnder payne of death that no mā should trouble thē cōming together assembled or departing but that quietly and freely they myght mete together without trouble or veracion Shortly after by an Act of parliamēt in that which the Bishops and other nobles of the realme wer not only parties but rulers it was decreed vnder paine of death that hereafter none should make any assemblies eyther for preaching or for ministring of the Sacramentes or for mariage other where than in the Churches or after any other sorte than the olde and accustomed maner And furthermore that wythin a certayne space the mynisters that professed the Ghospell should departe the realme of Fraunce Hereof rose gret trouble Bicause now their liberty of comming together takē away it was likely to be greatly preiudicial to the tryall of the whole matter After thys the nobles met at Poyssye Shortly after the ministers of the Gospel came to the court to the king which then lay at Saynt Germans nye to Poyssye Thither somwhat afore were come certayne chosen men sent by the refourmed churches out of the .xii. prouinces to aduaunce religiō These deliberating with the others determined to offer vp to the king a boke in maner of a supplication wherby they woulde uponsome meanes to disputation and conference Therewithal also was geuen vp the cōfession of that faith which they professed thēselues ready to maintayne and defende Of that boke the thiefe poyntes were fowre First that no Bishops nor others of the ecclesiasticall orders should vsurpe the authoriti of Iudges ouer vs. Forasmuch as it behoueth rather that they themselues shoulde pleade their owne cause and stande in triall of reformation Secondly that the king Queene and nobilitie should rule the whole doinges leaste any trouble might arsie So that without contention and strif all matters myght be handeled and decreed Thirdly that al controuersies might be tryed by the worde of god whereupō onely all our fayth and religion ought to be grounded Fourthly that certayne notaryes and Scribes should be chosē of eyther part which might faithfully register whatsoeuer wer done or decreed Whose notes should be of no credite vnlesse they were allowed and confessed of either part These requestes no man misliked And the kyng answered that he would take thaduise of his councell and by his Chauncelour shortly make them an answere yet thesame was long deferred Bicause the matter was cōmunicated with the Bishops without whose councel or knowledge to do any thing it semed not mete For not only for thys matter of religion had the kyng assembled them but also for the leauyeng of mony to discharge hys dettes They waxing proude wyth thys confydence that the kyng semed to nede their aide assured themselues of the obtayning of any thyng agaynste vs nothyng doutyng the assured conquest of Ladye money Furthermore they tryfled and prolonged the tyme seeking al occasions to auoide our conference and disputation For they sayd we were already condemned and that they might not dispute with heretykes These and such other like their accustomed stayes they began to blase whiche neuerthelesse afterwardes they denied Boasting that they wer ready to he are vs. For they were ashamed openly to refuse our conference sith by their own consent we were sent for thither But they fully perswaded themselues that our courage or constancy would not be such as to hasard our lyues for that speach of our wordes Duryng this tyme oure nūber increased For out of euery prouince not in Fraunce onely but also from al the realmes adioyning as many as might without the hynderaunce of their churches drew thither Wherfore at the last we chose certayne to the nūber of .xii. whose names wer these Augustine Malorat Fraūces of Paulon Iohn Remonde Merlin Iohn Mallet Fraūces Morel Nicolas Tolye Theodore Beza Claudius Bessierus Iohn Bodwine Iohn Virell Iohn a Tures Nicolas Gallasius To these Iohn Soma adioyned himself which openly renounced papacy and subscribed to the doctrine Discipline of our Churches Afterwardes came also the reuerende father in God Peter Martir sent for from Tigur Whose comming was scarsely acceptable to our aduersaryes aswell for his singular learning as also for the maiesty and authority which both his Godlinesse and reuerende age haue gotten hym What in thys meane tyme was don of the Bishops whiche were assembled at Poyssye I thynke not good to ouerpasse For least any man should thynke they were ydle I wyl shew wyth what grauer matters they were letted so that they could not presētly heare vs. These questions they disputed amōges themselues What ought to be prescribed vnto Bishops Of the dignities of cathedral churches Of the Canonicalls their exemptions Of Curates their institutiō either by presentation or ordinary collatiē Of assigning them a Canonicall portion Of the lesser that is to wyt the ignoraunt chaplens and their vnreasonable number Of the reformation of monasteryes What should be done of cōmendes Of the number of benefices and their incompatibility What waye hereafter they myght prouide for churches and Monasteryes in time of vacation Whether there myght be any

Church is it which is euery where knowen and of all mē To the authority of y● church he sayd al interpretation of Scriptures and making of traditions ought to bee referred Saying that the succession as well of that Church as of the pastours therof was perpetual but of the Lordes Supper he so entreated the touching nothing at al of the chaūge of the natures of the elements he came very nye to their opinion which ioyne the body bloud of Christ with the elementes And say that they be both vnder them and in them Which afterwardes we vnderstode was done for a polecy partly to procure their fauoure whom he had so kindly clawed and partly to make vs the more hatefull to them Neither yet did he plainly agree with them but shewed that in thys respect he did willingly ioyne with them that they myghte ioyntly warre against vs. The ende of his oration was to this effect That the kyng and his counsell leauing our opinion should folow the steppes of theyr for fathers and not leaue their accustomed vsage When he had ended we desired that presently whiles the memory therof was yet fresh we might satisfye his obiections and refute his argumētes For we feared least after thys the Cardinals answere we should scarcely haue leasure or liberty afterwardes to speake Bicause the day afore many bragged that we shuld loke for nothing els thā condemnation the thūderbolt of excomunication Neyther wer we ignorant therof The Queene taking the aduise of her coūcel cōmaunded vs to depart saying that we should answere it an other tyme that she would appoint vs a day whē we shuld be presēt again And surely meruaile had it ben if the byshops which wer of that coūcel would haue geuē any other councel The next day againe we desired that we might be presētly heard and the tyme no longer prolōged But we could obtayne nothing neither wer we heard before the eight day In the meane time false rumors were spred abrode that we wer ouercome put to silēce had nothyng to say Whereas we were ready to haue answered their oration presently And how false such tales be here by men may sufficiently gesse that the Bishops did what they could to breake of the cōference so that at the last by their importunity they obteined of the Queene that the matter shuld not be opēly heard afore the king but in a more secret place afore few Therfore it was deferred til the .xxiiii. day of that moneth at the whiche cōmaunded to returne to Poyssye we came before the Quene the king Queen of Nauarre the rest of the Lordes and counsallours there were present also ●… Cardinalles and many Byshops and diuynes of al sortes we the mynisters were admitted only to the number of xij Those being seuered which wer sēt frō other Churches which afore were ioyned with vs. For now the matter was heard both in narower place in lesse companye than before the Cardynals of lorayne shewed in few wordes that this assemblye was to this end that if we would obiecte any thing agaynst that which he had sayde eyght dayes before we might freely speake shuld be herd Then Beza in the name of vs al said That he would haue wished that immediatlye he might haue aunswered the Cardynalls oration whyles the same was fresh in memorye or at the least that he might haue had som copye therof that he might aūswere certaynly perfectly to euery poynt but forasmuch as he coulde not obtayne that he woulde aunswere so much as he coulde call to mynde Fyrste there fore as concerning the article of the Churche which the Cardinall fyrste handled he deuided it into thre partes First what it is Then what are the marks therof Thirdly what and how great is the authoritie therof It is wel knowē quoth he that this name Ecclesia which signifieth the church is deriued from the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifyeth to call frō on place to another Of calling we find .ii. sorts in the scriptures the one cōioyned with the working of the holy ghost wherof Paul to the Romains writeth whom he called them he iustified Rom. viii c. xxviii The other althoughe in outward shew It be al one with the first yet is altogether vnprofitable to saluation And that only through the fault of man beyng deaffe at the calling of God Of this calling spake the Lorde when he sayde That many wer called but fewe chosē Mat. xxii b. xiiii Hereof it happens that the name of the church which signifyeth the congregacion of those that are assembled by the word of god is taken .ii. wayes For generally it contayneth al those which outwardly professe to folowe the calling of god Neyther is it to be doubted but manye hypocrites and reprobate persons are within this nūber Neither we thanks be to god therefore haue at any tyme Either written or taught otherwise for asmuch as both the scripture and also common experience doth plainly proue the same but takyng this name of the churche proprely and streyghtlye as manye tymes we doe we then say that it comprehendeth onlye the electe and chosen of god And that al men may know that we be not the authours of this maner of speache or of this doctrine when it is written that the church is the body of Christ bones of his bones fleshe of his fleshe yea when the name of Christ it selfe is geuen vnto it Eph. ii g. xxx as Paule wrytyng to the Corinthians ioyning the members with the heade calleth her Christ i. Cor. xii b. xii xvii how could in the number be contayned the reprobate in as muche as they are the members of the deuill For it cannot bee that we shoulde be members bothe of Christ and of the deuil which Austine writyng agaynste Cresconius well noteth in his seconde booke and xxiiii Chapter He also writyng on the .lxiiii. psalme vsed this distinction of the churche saying y● that church whiche is signifyed by Ierusalē toke her begynnyng of Abel and Babilon of Eain And afterwardes in his fyrst booke of baptysme agaynst the Donatistes the seconde Chapter wheras he taketh the name of the church more largely he saieth that he that begot Abell Enoch Noe Abraham the reste of the Prophetes begot also Cayn Ismaell Dathan and suche lyke Therefore to conclude we muste take that whiche Austine hymselfe wrote in the seuenth boke of the same booke the. 51. chapter whiche is also rehearsed .xxiiii. ix i. a. ca. All thyngs consydred it is said that there are two kynde of men in the churche Some of them sayeth he bee the members of Christe and of the house of God yea the house of GOD it self Other some bee in the house but not of the house For they bee as chaffe with the corne tyll suche tyme as they bee seuered Hereof ryseth a questyon whether the Churche bee inuisible Whiche I thynke good to affyrme and

shuld perish But neuerthelesse his decres or counsell is not therfore alowed as though he had rightfullye condēned Christ For the holy gost prophecied it not he which vnderstode not what he spake For he was styrred with a cōtrary spirit and altogether deuillishe For he gaue iudgement against the innocent Christ y● son of god Furthermore if this priuilege be geuē to general councels that they cannot erre either in y● rule of doctrine or forme of life we woulde fain know at what time this was done For there was alwaies one faith one church Ephe. iiii a. v In the olde churche vnder the olde testamont the histories prophets witnesse y● errours were commonlye taught receiued All their spies saith Esay be blind their dogges bee dūme not able to barke Psa lvi d x. Also Ieremy Bothe prophete priest do all forge lyes Iere. vi ● xv And least you should thinke yesame to be referred to the liues of priuate persons it in writtē in yesame prophet the prophetes prophecy falsly in my name Ier. xiiii c. xiiii For I sent thē not neither did I cōmaund them to speak neither did I speak vnto thē but lying visiōs diuinations yea nothyng or y● dece●…s of their own hert they prophecie vnto you Also Esai the wisdom of y● wise shal perish the witte of the witty shal hide it selfe Ps xxiiii c. xiiii Also Ezechiell The law shal perish frō the priest councel from the elders Ezec. vii g. xcvi Furthermore who cōdemned the prophets as Ieremy Michae yea the son of god himself his Apostles but y● councels of the priestes of Israel If any man answer that these things hapned vnder y● olde testamēt we will replie that he doth not satisfy our reasō nor speake any thing to y● purpose For not wt●…ding y● his cōclusion remaineth That y● caūs●…ls of the prelates albeit they wer vniuersal wer oftētimes ruled rather with y● spirit of error thā of god But that we may com to the newe testamēt did not Paul specially warne that church writīg to the Ephesiās y● wolues should com frō amonges thē Acte xx ● xix that the son of perdition shuld sit in y● tēple of god ii Thessa ii a. iiii And truely yf we weigh the coūsels seuerallye we shal find so much repugnant cōtrariety in thē that we must nedes cōfesse that the holye gost ruled thē not but Sathan whiche long since knowes how to trāsform hīselfe into an Angell of light There is a place very manifest in Austine as concerning this in hys seconde booke of Baptisme against the Donatistes the thirde Chapter wherein he plainly sheweth that the writinges of seueral Bishops are amended by particuler councels And prouiniciall Synodes by vniuersall And vniuersall counsels reformed by others after when by experiēce that is detected which afore was hiddē or that disclosed which afore was couered Where Austyne doth not entreate of the outwarde forme but of the doctryne and of the Aphricane councell wherin thei did deliberate whether thei ought to be Baptised againe that had bin Baptised of hereti●…es There wyll perhaps be obiected an other reason commō enough namely that Christe did promise as oft as .ii. or three are gathered together in his name to be himselfe in the middest of thē Math. vi viii c. xx And therefore much more he would be present at a general councel We graūt ye that may wel be presumed but farr differs a presumption from a necessary conclusion For such is the naughtinesse of men that they abuse the name of God to the decreeing of their own lyes And they often tymes haue the name of God moste in their mouthes whose heartes ar enemies and haters of God i. Cor. xv c. ix And whereas the weakenesse of mannes witt is such as dayly experience proueth and many are blynded with noughty affections We say that those that grounde on no other foundation than the iudgemente of men and coloure of a councell are in great perill How then Thynk we that the doctrine of the Church is vncertam for that she may erre No. For we graūt that although we knowe God onely in parte as Paule sayeth and in that respect error is mingled with the truthe yet God did neuer permit that the chiefe and substantiall poyntes were wholye ouerthrowen and buryed For alway●…s he hath reserued to hymselfe a flocke some tymes greater sometymes lesser to speake and vnderstande those thynges which it behoueth both to vnderstande speake As in Elias tyme in Israell Also in the captiuity of Babilō and about the comming of Christ At which tyme scarse Zacharias onely Elizabeth Ioseph the virgine Marye Simon and Anne the Prophetess●… remained that knew God and among●… so great corruption of the Scribes and Pharises did truely vnderstande the fulfilling of the Prophecies Suthe breaches whiche happen in the churche of God for our sinnes be as it were tempestes whiche afterwardes the Lor●… calmes and lyke cloudes which vanish awaye at the rising of the sonne Dooe we then condemne the olde councels God forbidde For if by theyr decrees thinges shoulde bee refourmed you knowe that you should be compelled to chaunge more than we Onely this we desire that the scripture maye be to vs as a touchestone whereby all thinges ought to be allowed that are doone or spoken in the churche Whiche yf anye man thinke vnreasonable let him read that famous saying of Austine writing to Maximinus the Arian in his second booke and .xiiii. chapter where he entreateth of the coūcel of Nice and Ariminum For I thinke there is no councell that maye rather bee called vnyuersall than the first councel of Nyce And contrariwyse all menne confesse that the councel of Ariminum oughte worthily to bee reiected and condened Vppon what occasion dothe Austine talke of those two councels About the controuersie of an article of our fayth nowe confirmed established Namely the consubstantialitie of the sonne of god And yet neuerthelesse Austine professeth that he would neither ground●… on the councel of Nyce nor yet of Ariminum But would be tryed by the scriptures whiche ought to bee the prooues on eyther parte If anye man obiect the darkenesse of the scripture we wyll graunt that whiche Paule sayeth that the naturall man dothe not perceyue those thynges whiche procede from the spirite of god i. Cor. ii d xiiii Also we with Peter saye that the scripture is not of priuate interpretation ii Pet. i. d xx But if y● darknes of it be such that it cannot lighte our minds why dothe Christe referre vs onely to these scriptures to take coūcel of thē Serch ye the scripture saith he ▪ Ioh. f. xxix Also whē Abrahā was desired of that rich vnhappy man y● was tormented in hell that he woulde sende some manne to warne hys brethren he aunswered they haue Moyses and the Prophetes If they beleue not them