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A28899 A defence of the Scriptures, and the Holy Spirit speaking in them, as the chiefe iudge of controversies of faith ... with a vindication of that honour due to magistrates, ministers, and others ... in a relation of a disputation at Chesterfield in the county of Darby, between some ministers of the Gospell and James Naylor, an erring Quaker ... : with some animadversions upon a lying relation of that disputation, published by Iames Nayler / by Immanuel Bourne ... Bourne, Immanuel, 1590-1672. 1656 (1656) Wing B3852; ESTC R23281 45,977 64

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and holiness and by our own good conversation 1 Pet. 2.15 put to silence the scandals of malicious the ignorance of foolish men that God wil give repentance free pardon in Christ to all our Adversaries who complain of us as contentious because though after long sufferings we seeke in a just and lawfull way to recover our due and just Rights which they unjustly detaine from us desiring if it be the will of God that they may obtaine salvation in the Lord Jesus and be delivered from wrath to come and that one day they may enjoy a happy and peaceable communion with us in glory and to conclude daily powring out my soule to God That the Lord the great Protector of Sion will be pleased to preserve his Highness and Honourable Councell and you my Honourable Lords and the rest of the Honourable Judges Justices Magistrates and other Worthies who are Actors for Piety and Peace to Gods glory and the benefit of these Nations together with this whole Common wealth in Truth Unity and Peace long to continue Most humbly subscribing my selfe Your Honours daily Oratour at the Throne of Grace Immanuel Bourne Pastor of the Church in Ashover London Feb. 26. 1655. A Defence of the Scriptures and of the Holy Spirit of God speaking in them as the chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith c. In a Disputation at Chesterfield in the County of Darby Jan. 3. 1654. FIrst when the Ministers came to the Church or Meeting House-yard Iames Nayler was there with his company but seemed unwilling to goe into the Church or Church-House yet at last went into the lower end and stood there But when Mr Billingsley Minister of Chesterfield began with praier to God for a blessing upon the meeting Nayler and his fellowes went forth againe pretending some plot might be against them But after praier assurance given there was none they came in againe Secondly Mr John Billingsley began to read the Questions But after Nayler read them in the Paper sent to him as I take it and then began to read his Answer in writing and when he had read his Answer to the first Question it was desired that that Question and his Answer to that might be first Argued and so the rest afterwards in order Question 1 The first Question was Whether the Spirit of God speaking in the Scriptures bee the chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith Mr Bourne shewed Nayler the Bible and asked him if he would owne that as Gods word he answered part of it or to that effect First For the state of the Question By the Spirit was meant the Spirit of God 1 Iohn 5.7 the third Person in Trinity one with the Father and the Sonne Secondly by the Scriptures the Canonicall books of the Old and New Testament Thirdly By the Spirit of God speaking in the Scriptures that voice or speaking forth of Gods Spirit recorded in Scripture which is there now to be found so whether the holy Scriptures or Spirit in them be judg This state was not so fully opened by reason of disturbance even in the entrance Nayler endeavouring to avoid this Question Naylers Answer Nayler in his Answer owned the Spirit that did speake in the holy men who gave forth the holy Scriptures to be Judge and said that Spirit was Judge before the Letter was written and all Controversies were judged by that Spirit but hee did not owne that Spirit that doth now speak in the Scriptures Hee said hee granted the Spirit was Judge and would have avoided the Question Mr Bournes Reply But Mr Bourne pressed to go on with the Question and affirmed it was one thing to say the Spirit that did speake in the holy men that gave out the Scriptures was Judge and another to say the Spirit of God speaking in the Scriptures was Judge or that the holy Scripture was Judge Therefore pressed to go on with the Question and began as I remember with this Reason Mr Bourns 1 Argument Whatsoever was and is the speaking forth of the Holy Ghost himselfe that was and is the chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith but the holy Scriptures are the speaking forth of the holy Spirit himselfe therefore they are the chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith The first proposition was not denied and the second was proved Acts 1.16 the Scripture which the holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake concerning Judas Here it is evident what Scriptures David writ or spake by writing that the Holy Ghost spake Therefore the holy Scripture is the speaking forth of the Holy Ghost and so judge of Controversies The same again witnessed by the Spirit Acts 28.25 wel spake the Holy Ghost by the mouth of Isaias the Prophet saying c. Here you see the Holy Ghost is witnessed by the Apostle Paul to speak by the mouth of Isaias and that Scripture which Isaiah writ was the speaking forth of the Holy Ghost and so the supreme Judge of Controversies c. Naylers Answer Nayler gave no direct answer but he wrangled and said he did owne the Spirit to be Judge but not the written word or to that effect and that the Spirit did speak not in the dead but in the living which was as I did understand him not in the dead letter of the Scripture but in living men and vapoured as if he had said much but yet would have avoided the Question as needlesse to be further disputed on since he did yield the Spirit to be Judge although he denyed that the Spirit speaking in Scripture was the chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith But Mr Bourn went on to press another Argument Mr Bourns 2 Argument Whatsoever Christ himselfe did appeale unto as to a chiefe Judge and send his hearers unto as to a chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith that is and ought to be esteem'd the chief Judge of Controversies of Faith But Christ himselfe appealed to the Scriptures and sent his hearers to the Scriptures as to the chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith therefore the holy Scriptures are the chiefe Judge of Controversies of Faith The first not denyed the second witnessed by the Spirit in John 5.39 in that great controversie of Faith whether Christ were the Sonne of God or equall with God Christ appeales to the Scriptures Search the Scriptures for in them you thinke to have eternall life and they are they that testifie of me therefore the Scriptures are the chiefe Judge Naylers Answer Nayler did not give any answer to satisfie the Argument but said still the Spirit was the Judge not the written word and cried out liar liar hold thy peace the Spirit is Judge not the written word Mr Bourne bad him yield the Question since Christ himselfe appealed to the Scriptures But he cried out and one of his fellow Quakers away lyar the Spirit is Judge Mr Bourn replied The Spirit is Judge but not the Spirit speaking in any man but the Spirit speaking in the Scriptures and pressed