whome the papistes counte no parte of their church but schismatikes conuerted the Moscouites first of all vnto the profession of the name of Christ which yet continue in their religion being neither the true faith nor yet popish religion As for the popish church as it is certeine that it hath peruerted and corrupted all partes of the Latine or Westerne Church with Idolatry and false religion so it shal be harde for the papistes to proue that it hath conuerted any Nation from Gentility to the popish religion except some partes of Germanie and them by force of armes rather than by preaching and reaching as appeareth by the conuersion of Liuonia Anno Domini 1200. of Prussia Anno Domini 1254. and of Lithuania Anno Domini 1386. wherefore I conclude that seeing I haue shewed that our Church holding the true doctrine of the Apostles is that which conuerted all nations to true religion and that the popish church hath not conuerted any people to true religion nor all people to the profession of the name of Christ this chalenger whosoeuer he be do the recant The second article conteyneth 4. demandes 1 I aske of him what Church it was which hath induced the Christian people through the whole worlde to geue most humble credit in all points to the holy bookes of the Byble I Aunswere it was the Church of Christ and not the Popish church which hath commended the bookes of holy Scripture to be beleued of all true Christians where soeuer they be although it be the office of the holy Ghost to open the hartes of men and to forme them that they may beleue the scripture to be true like as it is the office of the scripture or worde of God to trie and examine whether it be the spirite of God that perswadeth vs to beleue any thing so the spirite beareth witnesse to the worde and the worde to the spirite As for the popish church it coulde not induce the Christian people to geue credit to the scripture in all pointes because she is contrarie to the scripture in many pointes and euen in the cheefest pointes of Christian Religion namely in pointes concerning the glorie of God and the saluation of mankinde geuing the glory of God to dead men and dumbe Images and denying the mercy of God pourchased by the onely sacrifice of Christes death to be the onely cause of mans saluation Finally seeing it is manifest by the aunswere to the first article that the popish church did not conuerte all nations to the profession of the Christian faith it is euident thereby that the popish church did not induce all them that are called Christians to geue credit to the bookes of the holy Bible as this chalenger woulde haue it to be thought 2 VVhat Church hath had the discerning seuering of them from other writinges of all sortes THe Church of Christ hath not an absolute authority to allow or refuse bookes of the scripture but a iudgment to discerne true writinge from counterfaicts the word of God of infallible verity from the writing of men which might erre this iudgement she hath not of her selfe but of the holy Ghost as for the popish Church it can not be said to haue this iudgemēt of discerning the scripture of God from other writings not only because she is so blind that she can not discerne betwene the Canonical bookes of the scripture from the Apocrypha writings as appereth by receauing the bookes of the Machabees Ecclesiasticus c. to be of equall authoritie with the bookes of the Law Psalmes c. but also because she is so presumptuous as to compel men to beleue that Customes and traditions writinges of doctors decrees of Popes and Councells are equall with the authoritie of God his worde yea are of force to alter and change the lawe of God and the institution of Christ set forth vnto vs in the scripture And although she boast that she receaueth all the bookes of scripture yet this proueth no more that she is the Church of Christ than was the churches of the Arrians Donatistes Nouatians Euthychans other heretikes which receiued the Bible as well as the Popish church 3 VVhat Church hath had the custodie of them and most safely hath preserued them for the necessary vse of God his people and from the corruption of aduersaries as well of Iewes as heretikes of all sortes THe prouidence of God hath alwayes preserued the Scripture both from the violence of tyrants from the falshoode of heretikes and hath neuer suffred the true Church to be destitute of the necessarie vse thereof But the popish church hath not kept the scripture for the necessary vse of the people which hath so kept it in an vnknowen tongue that the people coulde haue no vse much lesse the necessary vse thereof wherefore if this be a note of the Catholike Church to kepe the worde of God for the necessarie vse of God his people it is plaine that the popish church is not the Catholike Church which hath kept the scripture so that God his people coulde haue no vse thereof And if the only custodie of the scripture from corruption of heretikes be a sure note of the Church why is not the Greeke Church the Catholike Church which vnto this day hath kept the scripture as safely as the popish church why are not other Estern Churches of Asia which neuer acknowledged the Pope or popish religion true Churches which likewise haue preserued the scripture as we haue seen of late that the newe Testament is printed in the Syrian tongue at themperours charges for the encrease of Christian faith among them And finally why are not the Iewes the Catholike Church which haue kept the old Testament in Hebrue more faithfully than euer the Papistes And because they boast of safe preseruing of the scriptures all men that are learned in the tongues can testifie in how corrupt a Latin translation they haue kept the scriptures both of the olde and of the new Testament 4 And let the Protestant declare to me that their Congregation hath had from time to time or euer had right herein or any other Church sauing the Catholike Church and I recant OVr Congregation which is the body of Christ hath euer had both right and possession of the inestimable treasure of the word of Christ her heade as appeareth by this that our Church and Congregation beleueth nothing but that she learneth in it acknowledgeth that all thinges profitable to saluation are sufficiently conteined in it and finally in all thinges submitteth her selfe to the iudgemēt of it But the popish church which beleueth many thinges contrarie to the scripture teacheth many thinges beside the scripture necessary to saluation and refuseth to haue her faith doctrine and ceremonies to be iudged by the scripture neither hath neither euer had any right to the scripture though she haue neuer so many bookes of them in possession Wherefore these thinges considered this chalenger
charge them with other authorities that the Papistes alleage beside the authoritie of holy scriptures And in his booke De Vniâ—ate Ecclesiae against the Donatistes the 16. chapter Sed vtril ipsi Ecclesiam teneant non nisi diuinarum scripturarum Canonicis libris oftendant quia nec nos c. But whether they holde the church or no let them shew none other wise but by the canonicall bookes of holy Scripture for we our selues doe not say that men ought to beleue vs that we are in the Church because we holde that Church which Optatus of Mileuitum or Ambrose of Millayn or innumerable other Byshops of our communion haue commended to vs or because it is set forth by the Councels of our felowe byshops or because so many myracles of hearing requests or healinges are don in the holy places which our fellowship doth frequent in the whole worlde so that the bodies of Martyrs which were hidden so many yeares which thinge if they will aske they may heare of many were reuealed vnto Ambrose and that at the same bodies one that had bene many yeares blinde very well knowen in the citie of Millayn receyued his eyes and eye sight either because this man dreamed or that man was rauished in the spirite and hearde a voice that he should not ioyne himselfe to Donatus or that he shoulde departe from the faction of Donatuâ— for when soeuer such thinges are don in the Catholike Church they are to be allowed because they are don in the Catholike church â–ª but the church it selfe is not therfore proued to be Catholike because these thinges are done in it By this Augustine declareth first that heretikes must be confuted onely by the scriptures and secondly that neither Councells succession of byshops vniuersality miracles visions dreames nor reuelations are the notes to trie the Catholike church but onely the scriptures Moreouer in his booke De Pastoribus cap. 14. Quaerit infirmus Ecclesiam c. A weake person seeketh the Church he wandreth and seeketh the church â–ª what sayest you The church is of Donatus side Enquire for the shepheards voice Reade me this out of some Prophet reade me this out of some Psalme rehearse me it out of the lawe rehearse it out of the Gospell rehearse it out of the Apostle out of them do I rehearse the Church dispersed ouer all the worlde And a litle after Tu accusas non Euangelium c. Thou accusest not the Gospell thou accusest not the Prophet not the Apostle of whome this voyce speaketh to me I beleue him other I beleue not But thou wilt bring forth decrees I will also bring forth decrees shoulde I beleue thine beleue thou mine likewise I beleue not thine neither do thou beleue mine then let mens writings be layd away and let Gods worde sounde betwen vs bring me one place of scripture for Donatus side c. These places maye sufficiently declare by what meanes this doctor thought the Church shoulde ouerthrowe heresies namely by the worde of God onely which thing also Leo the first byshop of Rome in his Epist. 10. ad Fabianum contra Eutychen plainely confesseth saying Sed in hanc insipientiam cadunt qui cum ad cognoscendam veritatem c. But those men fal into this foly which when they are hindred by any doubt to knowe the trueth haue not recourse to the voyces of the Prophets not to the writings of the Apostles not to the authoritie of the Gospell but to them selues And therefore they become maisters of error because they haue not bene schollers of trueth Of the same iudgement was the whole Councell of Constantinople the sixt as appeare Actione 18. Si igitur omnes simpliciter c. Therefore if all men from the beginning woulde haue simply and without subtiltie taken vpon them the preaching of the Gospell and haue bene content with the constitutions of the Apostles suerly matters shoulde haue bene well and in good case neither shoulde painefull contention haue bene exercised against the authors of heresies nor against the fauorers of priests Here the Councell confesseth that the heretikes and schismatikes grow so fast because they were not beaten downe by preaching of the Gospell and authority of the scriptures Thus I haue declared by example and authority of these Fathers that the true Church of Christ hath conuicted all heretikes onely by the scripture 2 And what Church it was that hath alwayes stande still and stedfast whilest all other Congregations as well of Arrians as Anabaptistes Aerians Nouatians Vigilantians Iouinians and the rest haue decaied THe true Church of Christ hath alwayes stoode stedfast and vnseparable from Christ her heade when all heretikes haue bene and shal be confounded But the true Church hath not alwaies florished in wordly peace and tranquilitie for vntill the tyme of Constantine the great which was Anno Dom. 339. the Church had small rest from cruell persecution in most places and soone after againe vnder the Emperors Constantius Constans and Valens it was greatly infected with the heresie of Arius what time also Tiberius Bishop of Rome was infected with the same heresie After that when Iulianus the Apostata was Emperor the temples of Idolls were opened and gentilitie againe restored so that the Church suffered great detriment To be short when the barbarous Goathes Vandales Alanes and other Idolatrous or heretical nations destroyed the Empire the Church of God suffered a great Ecclipse But when Mahomet in the East Antichrist the Pope in the West seduced the world with most detestable heresie then was fulfilled that which was reuealed to S. Iohn in the 12. of the Apocalyps the woman clothed with the Sonne which you your self confesse to be the Church was so persecuted by the Dragon that she fled into the wildernes there to remaine a long season Where she hath not decayed but ben always preserued vntil God should reueale Antichrist and bring her againe into open light which his holy name be praysed is now brought to passe in our dayes to our inestimable comfort and his euerlasting glory 3 And if it can be proued that either the Protestants Church or any other Church but ours hath mightely ouerthrowne these foresayd sectes and other of all sortes I recant IT hath bene already proued sufficiently that the true Catholike Church which is ledde onely by the worde of God as a most infallible rule hath ouerthrowne heresies of all sortes But the popish church which refuseth the only weapon by which heresies are cut downe to be sufficient for that purpose neuer was nor shall be strong enough to encounter with heretikes therefore she practiseth to vanquish those whom she counteth for heretikes not by authoritie of the Scriptures but by fire and sworde and cruell warre as appeareth by her dealing with the Waldenses Albigenses Bohemians and in our dayes with the true Christians But where her power of fire and sword could not preuayle there hath she not ouerthrowne such as she condemneth for
thankesgeuing which S. Paule affirmeth to be the doctrine of Diuells 1. Tim. 4. Also your distinctions and varieties of seruice because they consiste most of blasphemous prayers to dead Sainctes and sometimes to damned spirites with foolish lessons responses versicles c. Lewde lies and vncertaine tales which you reade and sing as God his seruice they are all abhominable In vaine do they worship me saith our Sauiour Christ teaching for doctrine the preceptes of men Math. 15. Also it was decreed in the Councell of Laodicea the 59. chapter that nothing should be song or reade in the Church but the Canonicall bookes of holy Scripture wherefore if you demande whence your ceremonies festiuall dayes fastes and varieties of seruice did proceede I aunswere plainely out of the bottomles pit of hell 2 From whence did all thinges yet indifferently for most part obserued and allowed on both sides from whence did they proceede IF you had vttered what thinges you meane that are so indifferently allowed on both sides we might better haue aunswered but seeing you haue not we must coniecture what you meane if you meane any thinge that is allowed without controuersie on both sides it did either proceede from the scripture of God or from the primitiue Church or else it a thing meerely indifferent but if it haue no grounde in holy Scripture nor example of the primitiue Church nor iudged meerely indifferent it not indifferently obserued for the most parte nor yet allowed on both sides 2 And if it can be proued that the Protestants Congregation or any other Church but ours hath instituted and ordered all these or any of these for the comelinesse and honour of God his house I recant I Haue aunswered before that the Protestants Congregation geueth you leaue to bragge that you are the inuentors of all these Idolatrous superstitions false worshipping of God and yet because you offer so liberally to recant if it can be proued that any Church but yours hath instituted and ordered all these thinges you shall heare what can be saide First your great doctor Durande plainely affirmeth that many of your ceremonies and solemnities had not their first institution of your church but were taken of the Iewes or Gentiles And it may easily be proued that many of your ceremonies were instituted of heretikes as your holy water which you say you vse to put men in minde of their baptisme was deriued of the heretikes called Hemerobaptistae which were baptized euery daye Epiphan lib. 1. Tom. 1. cap. 17. Of the Ossenes you tooke the great estimation of water salt oyle breade c. and vse to sweare by them as they did Epiph. contra Ossenes 19. Of the same heretikes you receiued the superstition of reliques for they vsed to take the spittle and other filth from the bodies of Marthys and Marthana which were of the seede of Elxai that is great Sainctes with them and vsed them to cure diseases as Erasmus witnesseth at Canterbury were kept the clowtes that Thomas Becket did occupy to wipe of his sweate and to blow his nose on which were kissed as holy reliques and thought also to be holsom for sicke folkes of the same heretikes you learned to commande the people to pray in an vnknowene tongue as Elxai the great Pope of those heretikes sayde Nemo quaerat interpretationem sed solum in oratione haec dicat Let no man seeke the interpretation but onely saye these wordes in his prayer Which wordes were in a strange tong either the Hebrue or the Arabike Epiphan lib. 1. Tom. 1. haeres 19. Likewise the Marcosians when they baptized vsed to speake certaine Hebrue wordes that the ignorant people might maruell the more at them as you doe in Baptisme Ephata c. Epiph. lib. 1. Tom. 3. haer 34. To make the Images of Christ and of the Apostles and to sense them you learned of the heretikes called Gnostici and Carpocratiâ—ae Epip lib. 1. Tom. 2. in the preface Epiph. lib. 1. Tom. 2. haer 27. and Irenaeus lib. 1. cap. 23. Of the Valentinians you learned to haue in price the signe of the crosse and to abuse the places of scripture for the same superstitious vse as God forbidde that I shoulde reioice but in the crosse of Christ c. Irenaeus lib. 1. cap. 1. Epiphan lib. 1. Tom. 2. haeres 31. Of the Heracleonites you learned to annoynte men at the point of death with oyle and balme and to cast water vpon dead men with inuocations Epiph. lib. 1. Tom. 3. haeres 36. Of the Cayanes you learned to call vpon Angels Epiph. lib. 1. Tom. 3. haeres 38. Of the Marcionistes you learned to giue women leaue to baptize Ep. lib. 1. Tom. Haer. 42. George Bishop of Alexandria inuented beares to carry deade corpses charging all men to vse them for his owne aduantage as doe you Papistes your bearing clothes other toyes for funerall pompes Ep. lib. 3. Tom. 1. Haer. 76. Of the Colliridianes you learned to make images of the virgine Marie worship them her with offering of candells c. as they did of cakes c. Ep. lib. 3. Haer. 79. Of the Messalians or Martirians you learned to shaue your beardes and to let your lockes grow long Ep. lib. 3. Haer. 80. Of the Pharizees you receaued your superstitious masking garments which you call amictus dalmaticus and pallia as witnesseth Epiphanius in his epistle to Acacius and Paulus Last of all what say you to the ceremonies festiuities fastes and solemnities vsed in the Greeke Church and in the other Oriental Churches if they be sufficient to make their church Catholâ—ke why doe you count them heretikes and Schismatikes if they be not sufficient why doe you reason of the instiâ—ution of the like to proue your Church Catholike You see that proued which you desired play the honest man therfore and recant The 7. article conteineth 3. demaundes 1 Further I aske them what Church that is which hath brought forth out of her wombe so many noble personages of Martyrs Confessors Doctors Virgines and holy Sainctes of all sortes all which both they and we doe outwardly professe by the continuance of the Callendare which yet is vsed euery where to be Sainctes in heauen FVrther I aunswere you that all true Sainctes whether they were Patriarches Prophets Apostles EuaÌ„gelistes Martyrs Confessors Doctors Scholars Virgins wiues widowes married or vnmarried are all children of that Church in whose fellowship we reioyce to be and are our deare brethren and sistern begotten in Iesu Christ by the gospell and we all hold of one head Iesus Christ as members of his mysticall body We all beleue to be receaued into that glory that they are by the onely meane that they were that is by the mercie of God in Christ Iesus But as for the continuance of the Callendar we haue litle respect vnto it yea no regard at all to vse it either as a recorde or as a register of those whom we acknowledge to
church if we could name such notable persons as you speake of in all ages florishing in their gouernment and ministerie And it is a good argument that the Popish church is not the church of Christe because it was neuer hidden sence it first sprang vp in so much that you can name all the notable persons in all ages in their gouernment and ministerie and especially the succession of Popes you can reherse in order vpon your fingers in which beadroole neuerthelesse you must name many tyrants many traytors one whore many whoremongers many Sodomites many murtherers many poysenors many sorcerers and Necromancers and from Boniface the third all blasphemous heretikes and Antichristes But our church which hath not had so many registers chroniclers and remembrancers hath perhaps fewer but yet honester men to name we can name Peter Paule Mathew Iohn c. Marke Luke Timothe Agabus Epaphras c. Iustinus Irenaeus Cyprianus Athanasius Hylarius Ambrosius Augustinus c. Gyldas Bertramus Marsilius de Padua Ioan. de Ganduno Bruno Andagauensis VVickleue Iohn Hus Hierome of Prage c. With the first namely Apostles Euangelistes and Prophets we consent wholly in all pointes of doctrine with the rest in the cheefe and most substantiall articles of faith alwayes agreeing with any man so farre as he agreeth with the worde of God. 3 And if he can proue vnto me that their Church hath neuer lacked the same appointed officers or that any Church or Congregatiō but ours hath kept that charge thē I recant FOr some of those officers I haue twise aunswered before that they were not ordeined to continue alwaies with the church wherefore they are not to be exacted of vs but such officers as are necessary for the conseruation of God his people in the vnitie of faith and the knowledge of Christ our Church hath neuer lacked although in time of the great defection and Apostasie whereof S. Paule doth prophesie 2. Thess. 2. there were but few as there were but fewe members of Christ his Church notwithstanding that through iniurie of the time the remembraunce of all their names is not come vnto vs And although we could rehearse in order as many successions in our Church as the papistes boast of in theirs yet were that nothing to proue it to be the Church of Christ which must be tried onely by the Scriptures as S. Augustine sayth in his booke de vnitate Ecclesiae against the Donatistes cap. 16. Sed vtrum ipsi Ecclesiam teneant non nisi diuinarum Scripturarum canonicis libris ostendant quia nec nos propterea dicimus nobis credere oportere quod Ecclesia sumus quia ipsam quam tenemus commendauit Mileuitanus Optatus vel Mediolanensis Ambrosius vel alij innumerabiles nostrae communionis Episcopi c. But whether they holde the Church or no let them shew none otherwise but by the canonicall bookes of holy Scripture for we our selues doe not therefore say that men must beleeue vs that we are in the Church because we hold the same Churche which Optatus of Mileuitum hath commended or Ambrose of Millayn or innumerable Bishops of our communion Euen so we require at the Papistes handes that shewe them selues to holde the Church not by succession of Bishops or rehearsing of their names but onely by the Scriptures for although we did rehearse innumerable names of Bishops in orderly succession on our side we would not require men to beleue vs but onely because we proue the doctrine of our Church by the authoritie of the Scriptures But as for the popish church neyther hath nor euer had any of those officers which S. Paule speaketh of for Apostles Euangelistes and Prophets she can chalenge by no reason seing she refuseth to be tried by their doctrine vttered in their writings in steede of pastors teachers she hath wolues dūme dogges or false prophets which either teach not at all or else teach the doctrine of deuills the dreames of men And further I would desire none other place in all the Scripture to ouerthrow the popish Hierarchie which is the greatest glory of their Church then this place of Paule Ephes. 4. he speaketh of Apostles Euangelists Prophets Pastors and teachers But where are Popes Cardinalls popish archbishops Bishops Preestes Deacōs Subdeacons Exorcistes Cantors Acolyts Ostiares Monkes Friars Chanōs Nunnes c. Wherfore I cōclude that all these popish orders are no offices in the Church of christ And especially seeing the Apostle both in this place Eph. 4. and 1. Cor. 12. by these offices proueth the vnitie of minde he acknowledgeth no Pope as one supreme head in earth which might be very profitable as the Papists say to mainteine this vnity for if there had bene any such office appoynted of God S. Paule in no wise woulde haue omitted it especially when it made so notably for the confirmation of his purpose which was vnitie To conclude if it be sufficient or any thing worth to rehearse the names of them that haue orderly succeded in all ages in the bishops sees in an outwarde face of the Church the Greeke Church is able to name as many as the Latine Church and in as orderly succession Wherefore if you be as ready to performe as to promise you recant The nynth article may be deuided into nyne demaundes 1 And for the necessary vse and execution of the foresayd offices they must further be asked what Sacramentes the Protestants ministred for the space of a thousand yeares togither in which they confesse their congregations to haue bene neare or else wholy hidden THey ministred those Sacramentes which Christ did institute namely the Sacrament of baptisme and the Sacrament of the body and blood of Christ at such times as the cruell tyrannie of you Papistes did not hinder them to come togither for such purposes 2 VVhat correction they kept and discipline for offenders THey did vse such discipline as was vsed in S. Cyprians time when persecution hindered not the free course of it As he doth often complaine in the places aboue rehearsed They did admonish secretly before witnesses and when persecution stayed them not they did also excommunicate 3 To whome they did preach their Fayth TO such as woulde geue them hearing as VVickleue to the Englishmen Iohn Hus to the Bohemians VValdo to the Frenchmen and so of the rest 4 How did they reproue heresies THey reproued heresies by the worde of God and patient sufferinge of your tyrannie the one you may reade in their workes that are yet extant of VVickleue Bertrame Hus c. The other in histories of your owne writers 5 VVhere did their principall Pastors sit in Iudgement I Might aske you where the Apostles did sit in iudgement and you are neuer able to shew me for I reade as one sayth that they stoode often to be Iudged but I neuer reade that they sat in iudgement vpon others And so I aunswere of the principall Pastors of our Church especially in time of persecution 6
Idolatrie proueth that there is a God but Idolatry is not therefore the true worship of god Of the heresie of the Pharisies that helde Pythagoras opinion of the passing of one soule into diuers bodies may be concluded the immortalitie of the soule but this doth not iustifie that errour of the Pharisies by the heresy of Origines which taught that all men should be saued at length not onely the immortalitie of the soule and the resurrection but also the infinite mercy of God may be concluded which all are true articles yet was not the heresie of Origine true for all this vnlesse M. Allen hath forgotten that olde sophisme which children can solute who so euer sayth you are an asse sayth you are a lyuing creature but he that sayth you are a liuing creature sayth true therefore who so euer sayth you are an asse sayth true And such for all the worlde is M. Allens reason who so confesseth prayers for the deade confesseth that the deade doe liue and shall rise againe but he that confesseth that the dead doe liue and shall rise againe doth not erre therefore he that confesseth prayers for the deade doth not erre 2 But now their aunswere must be here that this booke by which I haue vrged them so farre shall be no scripture And this is the ishue of heresie lo. These men that lightly writh wreast Gods worde from all true meaning to the maintenaunce of their matter being further charged by euidence of the wordes when other conuenient shifte can not be founde they are driuen to refuse vtterly the sacred canonicall scripture of God for notwithstanding their perpetuall bragges of scripture yet there can no scripture holde them but they will either finde a fonde shifte to loose it or els a shamefull stoutnes vtterly to brast and breake it They first seeke by suttelty to vnfasten the bonde of Gods trueth which is euery waye so enwrapped with the testimonies of holy Scripture then as they can not worke by wiles they boldely brast the bandes in sonder Thus when for misconstruing of this plane assertion of the booke of Machabees they can conuey no fit meaning they are driuen to harde shiftes and vnsemely to deny the whole booke to be scripture and therefore in matters of question of no authority In which pointe the authoritie of the Iewes moueth them more in denying the bookes to be in the canon of Gods scripture then the decree of the holy Church for the approuing of the same to be scripture But S. Hierome though he confesse the Iewes not to allowe them yet is bolde to recken them amongest the bookes of the holy Histories not measuring their authority by the canon of the Hebrues but by the rule of Christian councells The Canons of the Apostles will chalenge them from the Iewes and heretikes to be scripture still Innocentius the first in his rehersall of diuine bookes numbreth these of the histories of the Machabees also the Councell of Carthage the third authorisheth them S. Augustine in his bookes De doctrina Christiana numbring all canonicall scriptures with the reste reciteth these also Of which bookes in the xviij of the Citie of God he thus further testifieth Ab hoc tempore apud Iudaeos restituto templo non reges sed principes fuerunt vsque ad Aristobulum quorum supputatio temporum non in scripturis sanctis quae Canonicae appellantur sed in alijs inuenitur in quibus sunt MachabaeoruÌ„ libri quos non Iudaei sed Ecclesia pro canonicis habet From this time he meaneth after the history of Esdras there was no kinges but chiefe gouernours after the restitutioÌ„ repaire of the temple till Aristobulus time of all which time there is no Chronikle nor couÌ„te in the scriptures which be Canonicall but in other that be extant we finde that supplied as in the bookes of Machabees which bookes although the Iewes do not yet the Church of God counteth for canonicall scripture But what shoulde we stande in this point the whole Church of God and euery part or prouince thereof euery learned doctour and vertuous Christian man hath receiued and allowed them for scripture the which constant and perpetuall iudgement of the Church of Christ if any man refuse let him be esteemed an Ethnike Or because he defendeth the Iewes authority against the determination of Christes Churâ—h let him be at this time accompted for a iewe And yet I thinke he ouer shooteth them herein for they confesse the history to be true although not holy Scripture neither haue they found any such errour of doctrine therein conteined as he doth And as for the auncient Christian writers and famous doctours they alleage euen that place to proue the lawefull prayer for Christian soules departed whereby these fellowes take occasion to saie it is no scripture at all As godly Damascenus in these wordes Scitis enim quid dicat scriptura quomodo Iudas ille Machabaeus in Syon Ciuitate regis magni vt cognouit populum sibi subiectum à Palestinis hostibus occisum scrutatione facta inuenta idola in sinibus corum statim pro vnoquoque eorum ad dominum qui ad misericordiam facilis paratus est munera propitiatoria obtulit sane ob summam religionem fraternamque charitatem in hoc facinore vt in omnibus alijs a diuinissima scriptura magnificus admirabilis habebatur You know sayth he what the scripture reporteth how that worthy Iudas Machabeus of Syon the City of the great kinge after he vnderstood certeine of his subiectes to haue bene slaine of the Palestines his enemies and search being made had founde in their lappes idols straight wayes offered to God who is much inclined to mercy for euery of his souldiars so slaine propitiatory oblations â–ª who suerly for that act as proceding of wonderfull religion and brotherly loue and in all other affaires is of the holy writte esteemed mighty and meruelous Longe before this writer did S. Augustine vse the same booke and text of Machabees to proue the prayers sacrifice for the departed in peace In the booke of Machabees sayth he we reade that sacrifice was offered for the deade But if it were in none of the olde scriptures reade at all yet the authority of the vniuersall Church which for this point is plaine were of no small force whereby it is prouided that in the prayers which be made at the altare by the priest to our Lorde God the commemoration of the deade shall haue their place Thus by these auncient authors both the bookes be approued the text it selfe for which our aduersaries vnworthely denied the booke alleaged for the same purpose and the doctrine so sure that if no scripture coulde be founde it would beare out it selfe against all falsehood But this doctor handleth Pelagius the heretique denying the booke of VVisdome to be scripture because there was a sentence out of the fourth Chapter thereof brought
against his wicked doctrine euen as he shoulde be and as these wranglers in the like case must be The place well marked shal serue our turne when so euer we heare them so impudently reiect scriptures because they impugne their heresies which els shoulde be as good scriptures as any booke of the Bible if they either woulde make with them or by any crafty colouring not plainely make against them Thus he sayth Nec ideo liber Sapientiae qui tanta numerositate annorum legi meruit in ecclesia Christi pati debet iniuriam quoniam resistit eis qui pro meritis hominum falluntur rursus omnibus hic liber tractatoribus anteponendus quoniam sibi cum anteposuerunt etiam temporibus Apostolorum proximi egregij tractatores qui eum testem adhibentes nihil se adhibere nisi diuinum testimonium crediderūt in English thus It is no reason that the booke of VVisdom which so many worlde 's together hath bene worthy the reading in the Church of Christ shoulde nowe receiue such wrong at our handes because it plainely resisteth these fellowes that exalt mans merites aboue Gods grace And againe this booke is of more authority then all the expositours in the worlde for the noble writers hard by the Apostles time did much preferre this booke before them selues who alleaging the testimony of that scripture doubted not but they vsed thereby the witnesse of Gods holy word Euen so must we tell our maisters that it were plaine wrong to discredit the history of the Machabees which hath bene in our Bible euer sith Christes time for holy Scripture because it hath an euident testimonie against their false belefe concerning the state of the soules departed which booke is not onely better to be beleued then all Caluins false gloses but of more authority then all holy expositors Out of which booke both S. Augustine others many haue vsed proofe of their matters as of the testimonie of Sacred and holy scripture 2 I will not gaine saye but who so denyeth the authority of the holy Scriptures thereby bewrayeth him selfe to be an heretike as all Papistes doe which I will proue afterwarde But he that admitteth for scripture that which is not proceded from the spirite of God and thereby will auouch for trueth that which is contrary to the vndoubted worde of God is no lesse heretike then he for it is all one sinne to adde to the worde of God and to take from it But M. Allen pretending to proue the booke of Machabees canonicall by authority of the Church when he can not by consent that it hath with the scriptures of God beginneth with the authority of Hieronym in prol Mach. But what he meaneth thereby or what place he noteth I know not But this I knowe that in his Preface vpon the booke of kinges he doth not onely omit it in rehersall of the canonicall bookes but also accompteth it plainely among the Apocryphall Next he alleageth the canons of the Apostles Wise canons I promise you as truely made by the Apostles as the double canons that lie on the tower hyll of London In which are rehersed 3. bookes of Machabees two Epistles of Clemens for canonicall scripture but the Apocalypse of S. Iohn hath no place at all by which it may appeare what Apostles they were that made that canckred canon Then followeth the prouinciall Councell of Carthage the third which nameth the 2. bookes of the Machabees amonge the canonicall scriptures euen as it doth the 5. bookes of Salomon whereas the Church alloweth but 3. namely the Prouerbes the preacher and the Canticles and although you shoulde numbre to these the booke of Wisdome yet can you make but 4. in all that we know of Againe in what sence they did call those bookes canonicall appereth by Augustine that was one of that Councell namely that they maye be reade so it be with iudgement Contra 2. Gaudentij epistolam lib. 2. cap. 23. Et hanc quidem scripturam quae appellatur Machabaeorum non habent Iudaei sicut legem Prophetas Psalmos quibus dominus testimonium perhibet tanquam testibus suis dicens oportet impleri omnia quae scripta sunt in lege prophetis in psalmis de me Sed recepta est ab ecclesia non inutiliter si sobriè legatur audiatur And this scripture of the Machabees the Iewes compte not as the lawe and the prophetes and the Psalmes to whome our Lorde geueth testimony as to his witnesses saying it behoued that all thinges should be fulfilled that were written of me in the lawe and in the Prophetes and in the Psalmes But it is receiued of the Church not vnprofitably if it be soberly reade and harde Here you see that Augustine howsoeuer he alloweth those bookes yet he alloweth them not in full authority with the lawe Prophetes and Psalmes nor with out condition of sobriety in the reader or hearer But Hieronym sayth plainely the Church receiueth them not as canonicall scriptures in his preface vpon the booke of Prouerbes Sicut ergo Iudith Tobiae Machabaeorum libros legit quidem ecclesia sed eos inter canonicas scripturas non recipit Sic haec duo volumina legat ad aedificationem plaebis non ad authoritatem ecclesiasticorum dogmatum confirmandam Therefore euen as the Church readeth in deede the bookes of Iudith Tobias and Machabees but yet receiueth them not among the canonicall scriptures so maye she reade these 2. bookes videlicet Ecclesiasticus and the booke of Wisdome falsely intitled to Salomon for the edification of the people but not to confirme the authority of ecclesiasticall opinions Thus if Augustine doe simply allowe these bookes you haue Hieronym that doth simply refuse them If Augustine saye the Church receiueth them for canonicall Hieronym sayth the Church receiueth them not for canonicall As for Damascene except you woulde stryue with numbre of witnesses I know not why you alleage him being one to whose iudgement as but a late writer in comparison you know we ascribe small credit I might produce against him Athanasius or at leste wise one of elder time then Damascene vnder the name of Athanasius but that I haue alleaged already is sufficient to represse that vaine and vnskilfull insultation that you vse in so many wastfull wordes against vs for refusing the authority of him that abridged Iason the Cyrenians bookes for canonicall scriptures 3 But our aduersary learned not this practise of Pelagius onely for it is an older sore and a common sicknesse to all deuisers of deuilish doctrine as the skillfull in the Churchies affaires may acknowledge For some there were that otherwise coulde not vpholde heresy but by the vtter deniall of all the olde Testament as Carpocrates Ceuerus Manicheus But Marcion and Cerdon reiect all together sauyng Lukes Gospel Now Cerinthus and Ebion make counte of none of all the Euangelicall histories but the Gospell of Matthewe Cerinthus againe and Seuerus
woulde haue robbed the Church of the actes of the Apostles A sect called Alogiani do refuse the Gospell of S. Iohn with the Apocalypse Martine illiricus Caluine and their companions that no man being but an heretique shoulde euer out pricke them will shoulder with the proudest and lifte out of our Bibles the bookes of Machabees with S. Iames Epistle and more when more nede requireth The which Epistle as also the Epistles of Iohn and Iudas were once doubted of not as conteining any matter wherof the trueth was vncertaine but as bookes not knowen to be of like force as canonicall scripture in the impugning of heresies or confirming articles of belefe as all workes be till Gods Church haue published their authority and declared all thinges in them conteined to be of the same credit that the spirite of God is and of Gospell like trueth And by that authority of the Church what booke so euer be allowed though it was not so taken before yet now we must needes accept it sicut vere est verbum Dei as the very word of god And so be these canonicall Epistles and bookes of Machabees as before is declared Here nowe euery man may learne that it is a very daungerous matter to geue lesse credit to any of these bookes or wauer in any point of faith written in them for such fellowes iudgements that nowe amongest them haue lefte vs neither olde nor newe Testament Such stubborne boldenesse had these willfull men in mainteinaunce of mischeuous doctrine VVhose open impudencie was counted handsome conueiaunce of their scholers and adherents which were very many notwithstanding the Catholike Christian men in all ages both meruailed and lamented their blindnesse And yet doubtlesse it is not much to be wondered at to see that man flatly forsake the scripture of God who is not abashed to refuse and condemne that sense and vnderstanding of the Scripture which the whole Church with all her learned men haue euer allowed and counted most holy VVell by the strength of this piller we haue chalenged and saued hitherto for all the barking of bandogges the Scripture of God with the knowne meaning thereof And so I trust we shall doe still from the new aduersaries by the assured promise of thassistance of Gods holy spirite which shall leade vs not onely to the true canonicall Scriptures with the sense of the same but also guide vs in all truth necessary for our saluation Let euery man therefore here take heede how he doubteth of the knowne and certayne sense that the Church of Christ by decree of councell or consent of doctors applyeth to any Scripture least by mistrusting the sayd sense he goe forward vnaduisedly from open deniall of the common to found a priuate meaning of his owne in the stubborne defense whereof when he shall against the truth malipertly stand he goeth vnluckely forward at the end blasphemously reiecteth the blessed word sacred Scripture of God as we haue proued the auncient enemies of truth to haue done and as in these new sect maisters we may to our great dolour see Yet loe euen these are they that in all ages as Vincentius sayth flye in their talke and teaching ouer the law the prophets the Psalmes the Gospell That cry out of pottes pulpits nothing but Gods word the booke of the Lorde the testament of Iesus Christ Paule scripture as it may be supposed and as in th ende it is proued to driue out of doores Paule Scripture Testament and Christ too and not to bring into the peoples heades or heartes the feare and loue of God the holsom precepts of Paules heauenly preaching nor the true meaning of any Scripture VVho being vrged will rather credit a minstrells ballat then the Machabeis or best booke in the Bible But now you may see that whiles these men thought to saue their credits by miscrediting the Scripture they haue wrought so wisely that they haue lost their owne credits both in this poynt and in all other for euer And as they hoped by deniall of Scripture to cloke their errour they haue wonne to them selues the property of an heretike by open shew of their owne folly 3 And euen as vaine friuolous is this discourse that followeth to shew what bookes of scripture were in olde time refused by what heretikes But you thinke to match vs with them for denying the Machabees where vnto you adde the Epistle of S. Iames. If Martine and Illyricus haue some times doubted of that Epistle they are not the first that doubted of it Eusebius sayth plainely it is a counterfect Epistle lib. 2. cap. 23. And yet he was not accompted an heretike I saye not this to excuse them that doubt of it for I am perswaded they are more curious then wise in so doing but whereas you ioine Caluine with them it is because you can not leaue to lye with out shame while you are an instrument to defend diuelish errors with out shewe of trueth For Caluine receiueth it defendeth it expoundeth it and in all his writings allegeth it as canonical scripture Therefore if he were as ill as you compt him yet it were shame to lye on the deuill But we shall not nede to â—ake among the olde heresies to finde what bookes of holy Scripture you Papistes refuse when it is an easy matter to take your owne confessions and bolde assertions by which it is manifest that you doe not as those heretikes which you name reiect some one or two bookes but the whole authority of all the canonicall scriptures For when you affiâ—me that no booke of holy Scripture is canonicall but so farre forth as your Church will allow it who seeth not that you doe abrogate all maiestie and authoritie from the word of God submitting it to the iudgements of men Moreouer when you will not admit any sence of the scripture but such as your Church wil allow although the same be contrary to the plaine wordes thereof what authority doe you leaue to the worde of God which you make to be but a dead lettre vntil you geue it such a sence as it pleaseth you Finally where you make decrees of men either priuate or common customes traditions vnwritten verities in which is no certainety at all not onely equiualent but also oftentimes superior to the auctority of holy scriptures what certainety credit or estimation doe you leaue to the scriptures of God aboue other writinges nay all other writinges are in better case then the scriptures are with you For other writings may be compted the workes of their authors with out your censure the holy Scripture may not be compted the worde of God except you list so to allow it which may as well refuse that which is Gods worde in deede as you receiue and obtrude that which is not the worde of God at all Other writings haue such sence as the authors haue expressed them selues in their workes and maye be gathered by their wordes The
testifieth that the Gospell was preached in this lande in the reigne of Tyberius the Emperour proue vnto vs that Paule or Simon or Thaddeus or Ioseph or who so euer first preached the Gospell in this Ilande tought prayers or sacrifices for the deade Proue it I saye and the daye is yours for euer if you proue it not as neither you nor the deuill for you is able to doe it the worlde may see your swelling bragges to be nothing but blowen bladders or bubles in which there is nothing but ayre as your wordes are nothing but winde yet are you not ashamed to name Gildas who as about the first conuersiō of the Britaynes to the faith he hath no worde of any such matters so where he complayneth of there ruyne and decaye he accuseth the priests of his time for sieldome sacrificing but of sacrificing for the deade he speaketh not although the error of praying for the deade were receiued in other places and whether this countrye were free from it I am not able to saye nor you to proue that it was infected with it And therefore hauing nothing to shew for six hundreth yeare◠almost in which this lande was neuer voyde of Christians you come in at last with the peruersion of the Saxons by Augustine that prowde cruell and vnlearned monke of whose pryde and cruelty our stories doe testifie at large his ignorance and vnskilfulnesse is bewrayed by him selfe in his writinges to Pope Gregory I force litle what miracles he wrought to cōfirme his errors neither doe I waye worth a flye that longe tale you tell out of Beda of him that had his cheines fallen o◠in Masse time That credulous and superstitious age had many such fayned miracles 500 such tales are toulde in vitas patrum serm discipuli legenda aurea the festiuall c. But make you no more accompt of Beda his graue authority then of those fayned fables suerly I make this accompt of Beda that if he had reported the matter of his owne knowledge I woulde haue credited the facte done and yet tending to the maintenaunce of false doctrine I would neuer the sooner haue bene moued from the trueth of Gods worde But when he reported it onely of heare saye and that not of the parties them selues that might haue bene witnesses but of them that hearde this one man tell it by him selfe it caryeth small credit with it I beleue that such a tale was tolde to Beda but what if they added some what to it that tolde him and what if he that tolde them lyed if Beda had not bene ouer light of credit him selfe he shoulde not haue put it in writing before he had perfect intelligence not only of the party him selfe but also of that Londiner and gentleman and those that kept him in prison But how so euer the matter weare true or false it is no proofe nor preiudice against the trueth of God vttered in the holy scriptures Let Augustine speake for vs in his booke ae vnitate ecclesiae against the Donatistes which boasted of miracles as the Papistes doe but Augustine will not allow them for sufficient proues with out the authoritie of the scriptures non dicat verum est quia ego hoc dico aut quia hoc dixit ille collega meus aut illi collegae mei aut illi episcopi vel clerici vel laici nostri aut ideo verum est quia illa illa ▪ mirabilia fecit Donatus vel Potius vel quilibet alius aut quia homines ad memorias mortuorum nostrorum orant exaudiuntur aut quia illa illa ibi contingunt aut quia ille frater noster aut illa soror nostra tale visum vigilans vidit vel tale visum dormiens somniauit c. Sed vtrum ipsi ecclesiam teneant non nisi diuinarum scripturarum canonicis libris oftendant c Let him not saye it is therefore true because I say it or such a one my companion sayed it or those my companions or those our byshoppes or clerkes or laye men or it is therefore true because Donatus or Pontius or any other did these or those miracles or because men praye at our dead mens memories and are harde or because these or these thinges doe happen there or because this our brother or that our sister sawe such a vision waking or dreamed such a vision sleeping c. but whether they holde the Church or no let them shewe none otherwise but by the canonicall bookes of the holy Scriptures This place M. Allen if it might take place with you might serue to cut of all controuersies not onely of purgatory but of the Church it selfe and what so euer is in question betwene vs But you are wise enough you will neuer venture your cause vppon that triall 2 VVe must here stay a litle and ponder in our mindes how our forefathers and people of our owne lande were taught in this article when they were first deliuered out of Sathans bondage and conuerted to the fellowship of Christes Church and let vs nothing doubt but that which our owne Apostles both by worde and worke by miracle and by martyrdome first proued vnto vs is the very true and unfallible faith of our Christianitie For if that were not true which at our first conuersion was preached vnto vs then we receiued not the faith but falsehoode at their handes then the histories doe make a lowde lye in testifying we were turned to the Christian faith both at that time and by such men then it were no conuersion from heathen Idolatrie to the worship of Christ but it were a chaunge from one superstition to an other and this latter so much worse then the other because vnder the name of Christ there were practise perpetuall of execrable sacrilege in instituting of a sacrifice to the defasing of our redemption in adoring bare breade as the hoste of our saluation in offering it vp to God for the sinnes both of the quicke and deade in practise of vnprofitable prayers for the soules deceased with the like false worship of God in all pointes Then their preaching was highly to Gods dishonour pernicious to the people and damnable to them selues Then haue all that euer ranne the rase of that faith and doctrine till this daye which they taught perished with them then are they founde false witnesses whome we haue accompted as our vndoubted true and lawfull pastors then God hath purposely deceiued vs with fayned miracles full many with numbers of vaine visions then all our labour is lost till this day The holynesse of so many good princies and priestes is praised in vaine the bloude of Martyrs shed in vaine the exercise of all sacraments in vaine and because all deuotion consisted in our fathers dayes in the earnest zele of so false a religion as they thinke this to be then the more deuotion the farther from Christ the lesse religion more neere to saluation then happy was he
true worship to banish together our fathers faith CAP. XII 1 IN this chapter where he vomiteth out nothing but rayling and lying he doth rather bewraye his owne infirmitie then touch the strength of our cause For being trobled with a sore laxe of the tongue which I take to be a like disease in the mouth that it is in the wombe he gusheth out nothing but bragging and faceing scolding and sclaundering tauntinge and trifling And therefore I will but breefely confute his vanity and turne him to his matches to contend in that kind of quarreling The chiefe argument he sayeth that the Church in times past and Augustine the Churches champion vsed against the Pelagians was to shewe that their heresie was contrary to the publicke prayers of the Church what shoulde I vse many wordes I appeale to the iudgement of all Papistes that haue not loste all vse of naturall reason and indifferent iudgement which either haue reade or will take paines to reade so many workes as Augustine did write against the Pelagians whether of an hundreth arguments that he vseth this insultation be not one of the feeblest which tooke no holde of the Pelagians by force of trueth that is in it but by their owne concession and graunt of that prayer to be godly and them to be of the Church that so prayed But now the controuersie is not onely of the substance of doctrine but of the Church it selfe also And therefore when Augustine had to doe with the Donatistes that challenged the Church vnto them selues he setteth all other tryalles aside and prouoketh onely to the scriptures Therefore M. Allen if you wil teach your schollers to kepe vs at the baye as heretikes you must not teach them to barke and baule nothing but the Church the Church like tinckers curres but you must instructe them to open conningly out of the scriptures how our doctrine is cōtrary to the trueth and yours agreable to the same I do not blame you if you would faine haue that argument of the Church without tryall which is the Church to take place for it woulde ease you and your fellowes of much paine it woulde serue you both for a sworde and a buckler all other bookes arguments and reasons might be layed a side and keepe silence The Church sayth it and we are the Church therefore it is true The scriptures them selues are altogether needelesse where this argument may stand for payment This is so plaine a proofe that the aduersaries shall not be able to saye baffe vnto it In deede they were but sory whelpes that could not say baffe to the bleating of such a calfe as you are which thinke that such a foolish cauill can carry credit with them that haue any cromme of brayne in their heads The Church prayeth so therefore it is true Nay Syr you pray and practise to controle the word of God therefore you are not the Church of god Proue that you doe not so or else prate as long as you wil. And thinke not to dorre vs with Cyprians name where as if you had his iudgement we might be bold to say as the same Augustine hath giuen vs example Nos nullam Cypriano facimus iniuriam cum eius quaslibet literas à canonica diuinarum scripturarum auctoritate distinguimus Neque enim sine causa tam salubri vigilantia canon Ecclesiasticus constitutus est ad quem certi Prophetarum Apostolorum libri pertinent quos omninò iudicare non audeamus secundum quos de caeteris literis vel fidelium vel infidelium liberè vindicemus Contra Cresconium Gram. lib. 2. cap. 31. We doe Cyprian none iniurie at all when we put difference betwene any of his writinges from the canonicall authoritie of the holy Scriptures For not without a cause with so holesome diligence is the ecclesiasticall canon appoynted vnto which certeyne bookes of the Prophets and Apostles doe perteyne which we dare not iudge at all according to which we may freely iudge of all other writings either of faithfull men or infidells And againe in the 32. chapter Ego huius epistolae auctoritate non teneor quia literas Cypriani non vt Canonicas habeo sed eas ex canonicis considero quod in eis diuinarum scripturarum auctoritati congruit cum laude eius accipio quod autem non congruit cum pace eius respuo I am not bound to the authoritie of this epistle because I count the letters of Cyprian not as canonicall scriptures but I consider them by the canonicall scriptures and what so euer I finde in them agreeable to the authoritie of holy Scriptures I take it with his prayse that which agreeeth not I reiect it with his leaue Iudge here gentle reader whether Augustine would or should with any indifferency bind either men to the absolute admitting of Cyprians authoritie wherwith he would not be holden him self and know Allen for a Iangler on Augustines wordes against the meaning of Augustine or any reasonable man. 2 I would learne by what Churches example they haue lefte out of their newe fangled phantasticall seruice the offering and praying for the departed One of them was so impudent to say in an open booke that the Lyturgies of the fathers made all against the Catholikes for the proofe of their false assertions VVherein sir I pray you tell me I woulde call you by your name if I knew who you were there you were ashamed of your owne name therefore ye shall lacke the glory of your assertion But who so euer you be I pray you what affinitie betwixt their office of celebration and yours doe you finde they offer the holy hoste they worship it they shewe it they pray vnto it which of all these doe you they blesse it with the signe of the holy crosse they practise the action vpon an altar how well follow you these they pray for the deade they make inuocation solemnely to sainctes they ioyne with all catholike Churches in the worlde where is your cause here amended or ours not plainely proued If their seruice like you so wel or at least better thē S. Gregories Masse you might with more honestie haue chosed for any one of them then haue forged a newe one of your owne which in deede is directly repugnant to all other rites in the Christian world VVhich you may well terme the seruice of contradiction and damnation as one that neither communicateth with the sainctes in heauen with the soules in purgatory nor with the faithfull a liue And being ashamed of the Latine Church you chalenge an other origine of faith out of the Easte parte as though your matter were well amended if you might shake of that faith and worship which our countrie in her conuersion first receiued and in which till this daye she hath happely lyued and make the heade of our holy tradition vncertaine by referring vs vnto an vnknowen origine 2 He would know by what churches example we haue
hearte or eare coulde abide these blasphemous tonguesâ— who of vntolerable arrogancy doe so deface the examples and doctrine not onely of the pillours of the whole Christian Church whome they impudently for lacke of a more reasonable aunswere condemne not onely of simple ignoraunce and errour in this point with the residue of the whole faithfull people which surely is ouer much to say of such learned and godly men as they were but also of wilfull errour and superstition in bearing and maintenaunce of the common ignoration and ethnicke perswation of the worlde in their dayes and following the heathen vsage of the gentilitie And yet not content therewith these lying maisters of their meere mercy be content to offer a pardon to the author of that booke for his errour which booke the whole catholike Church of God through out Christiandome taketh for canonicall scripture VVhich arrogancy and passing boldnesse although I perswade my selfe no vertuous man will in them allowe sith they nowe being put to their shiftes vtterly doe condemne those fathers whose names with great oftentation they often to the simple repeate to make them suppose they be not with out scripture or doctors for the proofe of their willfull heresies yet euen the very aâ—nswere it selfe which they imagine here in to disgrace the doctors and delude the ignoraunt is contrary to it selfe in sundry points For they one while affirme that S. Augustine and others allowed that errour which the people by their superstitious deuotion had before their time brought in to the prayers of the Church and an other while that Iudas Machabaeus did institute it who was before these authors diuars hundreths of yeares and somewhile that they borowed it of the gentilitie all which pointes be repugnant eche to other For neither coulde that beginne in our Christian doctours dayes which was vsed before Christes birthe neither neede they to borowe it of the heathen which was in estimation and praysed amongest the Iewes 9 We neede no shiftes M. Allen for the authoritie of the doctors whome we neuer allow for canonicall Scriptures and therefore we may boldly say as Augustine sayth of Cyprian what so euer we find in them agreable to the Scriptures we receaue it with their prayse and what so euer is disagreeable to the Scriptures we refuse with their leaue Now by what meanes they fell into this errour that maintained prayer and almes for the dead I shal haue better occasion to shew in the aunswere to the 14. chapter although it be not greatly material to know how they came into errour when it is sufficiently proued that they did erre As for the abridgement of Iason the Cyrenians story which M. Allen maketh such a precious iewell I haue aunswered inough before that the author him selfe desiring pardon of his readers hath testified sufficiently that he was no scribe of the holy Ghost as also by many other vnauoydable reasons with the consent of the Catholike Church which it were superfluous here to repete Finally whereas you say that our aunswere is contrary to it selfe you seeke a knot in a rush For all may be true First the deuill suggested superstitious deuotion into the Gentiles by peruerse emulation of whom Iudas might be deceiued and his fact giue occasion to the ignorant people of errour and their ignorance first winked at because it had a shew of pietie confirmed by custome might at length be allowed of Augustine and others who neuer weighed the matter by Scriptures but by the commoÌ„ practise And this I thinke is the right degree of prayers for the deade and purgatory That the praying for the dead vvas appointed to be had in the holy sacrifice by the Apostles commaundement and prescription And that our doctors by the maiesty of their name beare dovvne our light aduersaries CAP. XIII 1 BVt that this falshood may better appeare in these men we will by good testimony trye out when and by whom the oblation and sacrifice with other ordinarie reliefes of the departed were so vniformely vsed through the Christian worlde as like wise it shall be profitable to consider who were the first authors of the contrary opinions And that the holy Ghost by the Apostles owne preaching and prescription was the first author of this solemne supplicatioÌ„ in masses of all vsages for the departed I might first proue by this generall rule of S. Augustine Quod vniuersa tenet ecclesia nec concilijs institutum sed semper retentum est non nisi authoritate apostolica traditum rectissime credimus that which the whole Church obserueth and hath alwayes so bene kepte being not instituted by any Councell it can not otherwise be had but by the Apostles authoritie and tradition And so by the like saying of Leo the greate Dubitandum non est quicquid in ecclesia in consuetudinem est deuotionis retentum de traditione apostolica de S. Spiritus prodire doctrina It can not be doubted but that what so euer is in the Church by generall custome of deuotion kept and mainteined it came out of the Apostles traditioÌ„ and doctrine of the holy Ghost But I will seeke with them by certaine demonstration and plaine ordre of reason that it must needes so be Praying for the deade was inuented by no man sith the Apostles dayes there can no one be named by the aduersary before whome I can not name an other that praide for the dead Let him say where he list this man or that man was the first that euer praide for the deade in Christes Church if I can not shewe an other before him so named to haue praide also we will take him for the first author and then he fully stoppeth our course that we can not bring this obseruation so high as the Apostles dayes But if the aduersary can apoint me out no time nor person that began this vsage before which I am not able to proue it was practised then they can not let vs but we must needs driue it vpwarde to the Apostles and Christes owne institution CAP. XIII 1 IF prayer for the deade was appoynted by the Apostles commaundement why is there neuer a worde thereof in their writinges there is warrant â—or lesser matters then this is made of why is this and all other popish trash counted their tradition which can not be warranted by their writing If I were disposed to pose you this question would make you clawe your poll an hundred times before you could imagine any couloâ—able aunswere for right aunswere you shall neuer be able to make But I take not vpon me to pose but to aunswere first your authoritie of Augustine serueth not your turne for prayers for the deade haue not bene alwayes obserued namely in the Apostles times nor long after The saying of Leo the great may be backed with the writing of Leo the great Epi. 10. Sed in hanc insipientiam cadunt qui cum ad cognoscendum veritatem aliquo impediuntur
the deade you followe your customable course of lying and sclaundering And yet we maye saye it is a greate preiudice against your purgatory and prayer which you make so necessary and about which no small parte of your religion is occupyed that it is not so much as once named in the scriptures But we saye and truely saye that neither the name nor the thinge it selfe is taught or can be proued by the scriptures so of all other heresies All trueth maye be proued by scripture either in plaine wordes or by necessary conclusion which is all one And therefore the Arians or Anabaptistes haue no more helpe of this argument then you Papistes As for the perpetuall virginitie of the mother of Christ as we can thinke it is true so because the scripture hath not reueled it neither perteineth it vnto vs we make no question of it what scriptures you haue alleaged and howe falsely you slaunder vs for denying the canonicall scripture is set forth at large allready 3 But yet one of these ouerthrowers frameth as he supposeth his negatiue argument to the more sure shake of our faith herein after this sorte In the olde lawe all sacrificies and expiations both appointed and reckoned euen for the smallest offensies that man coulde commit yet there was neuer no sacrifice for the purgation of the dead◠How Lorde like Maister Grindall made his Argument here VVhere he shoulde plainely haue inferred the contrarie after this sorte There was no sinne so small vnpardoned but there was some sacrifice of release or expiation thereof in the olde lawe ergo if any man were bounde with sinne were it neuer so small whether he were aliue or deade there was some appointed purgation therefore For there is no consequence nor any apparance of right deductiō to inferre vpon the naming or rehearsall of all sinnes the peculiar mentioning or plaine rehersall of such persons as maye be burdened with those sinnes There were sacrificies then in the olde lawe for wemen as well as men for the Princies no lesse then for the poore for the priest for the people for the deade as well as for the liue And where there was no difference nor respect of persons in that point there was no peculiar mention to be made for the distinction of states The peculiar rehersall therefore was onely made for the diuersity of offensies and not alwayes for the difference of persons And nowe the departed in faith being but distincted by state of life and not by bonde of sinne from those that be aliue must needes in the case of like sinne for the vnitie which he is in haue the like remedie as the lieue hath for the same sinne And therefore to helpe your ignorance some thing thus you must learne that there was no peculiar sacrifice for the deade as though they were not of the common body with the liuing but they had the same sacrifice done for them that the liuing in this worlde in the like case of sinne or punishment for offensies had Doe you not see Gods Church Maister Grindall sacrifice for the deade but not for them by a peculiar meanes of offeringe but the very selfe same oblation she euer vseth for her Children departed that she practiseth for her faithfull flocke a liue And in all other practises there is a perfect communitie of all benefites betwixt the deceased and their brethern remayning yet in this worlde And therefore when you seeke for sacrifice in the olde lawe looke not for any distincte waye of handeling their offensies which is not common with the lyuing But consider what there was practised for the release of the smaller trespassies and that was vsed for both the liue and dead without distinction Marke what sacrifice was for the abating of any paine due for great offensies and the same shall be well vnderstande to be with out difference practised for the liue and deade together That therby we may by good reason conclude seeing sacrifice was then offered for purgation of euery light offense that it was done for all states of persons that were either in this life or after their death to be perfectely clensed from the same Although the facte of Iudas Machabeus be a plaine proofe that there was a common knowen ordre of sacrifice for else howe coulde he haue conceyued any such sacrifice neuer hearde of before howe coulde he limite the value of procurement therof by a certaine summe for euery soule deceased howe coulde he gather in pretence of a thinge neuer vsed before the peoples almes with out their murmure or motion therein VVhy woulde he haue sent mony to Hierusalem to procure that which had no example in the lawe or vse in the Church was he so ignorant that he knew not their ordre herein or so vnwise to haue sent his mony for nothing S. Augustine aunswering an heretike that by the authoritie of the facte of Iudas woulde haue proued that by sacrifice men might be saued though they died vnbaptized or in deadly sinne sayth vnto him that he is not hable to proue that Iudas or any other in the lawe offered for his freinde or any man else being vncircumcised no more then the Church nowe practiseth for any man not baptised VVhereby he plainely confesseth that the lawe had a sacrifice for the deade which being vrged by that heretike he might haue denied with good helpe of his cause and aunswere to the aduersary but that the contrary case was so cleare not onely by that booke which he tooke for Canonicall scripture as before is proued but also by the full consent of all the Church of God which both by plaine practise and most graue ordinaunce had from Christes time set forth and approued the vndoubted trueth thereof 3 To passe ouer your saucines and scurrilitie being as agreeable to your profession and leuitie as vnmeete for his grauitie and dignitie whom you name the argument is of more force then you haue wit to vnderstand But to beate it smaller that it may enter into your head or at least wise that they which haue any brayne in their heades may conceiue the strength of it I will vse your owne figure and mode All lawfull sacrifices were prescribed by the lawe sacrifice for the deade was not prescribed by the law therfore it was no lawfull sacrifice you aunswere that the rehersal of sinnes proueth not the peculiar persons that may be burdened with those sinnes And with this foolish distinction you thinke you haue broken out of prison But you that so like a proud foole take vpon you to help his ignorance bewray your owne intollerable arrogancie and more then beastly blindnes For if you had redde the law whereof you make your selfe such a Rabbine Leuit. 4. 5.12 15. you should haue seene the peculiar mentioning and playne rehersing of all such persons for whome sacrifice was to be offered both men and women the Princes and the priuate persons the Priest
TVVO TREATISES WRITTEN AGAINST THE PAPISTES THE ONE BEING AN answere of the Christian Protestant to the proud challenge of a Popish Catholicke THE OTHER A CONFVTATION OF THE POPISH CHVRCHES doctrine touching Purgatory prayers for the dead by William Fulke Doctor in diuinitie Imprinted at London by Thomas Vautrollie◠dwelling in the Blacke friers 1577. TO THE CHRISTIAN READER WILLIAM FVLKE WISHETH GRACE AND PEACE from God the father and from our Lord Iesus Christ. THE great bragges that vvere made by diuers Papistes of this treatise of Purgatory that it vvas vnansvverable vvere so vntollerable that certeine of my godly friendes vvere moued thereby to sende the booke to me desiring me to shape an aunsvvere vnto it But vvhen I had readde it ouer and founde therein in deed much nevv rayling yet nothing else but the olde fonde kinde of reasoning I vvas altogether vnvvilling to deale vvith it both because there hath bene so much already vvritten of that argument and for that I thought that our contrymen vvere novv as vvel by reading of that vvhich hath ben vvritten before as also by continuall preaching against that absurde doctrine sufficiently dissvvaded from that blaspemous heresie of Purgatory But vvhē this excuse or any other that I could bring vvoulde not satisfie there ernest desier vvho importunatly still vrged me to take the matter in hand that I had once againe perused the treatise I began to thinke othervvise of the vvhole case then I did before I considered that many there vvere vvhich perhaps had not seene and many also that vvoulde not reade such bookes as haue bene vvritten in times past of this question that some also vvere so simple that they could not discerne this nevv disguised defence of the Catholike churches doctrine from the olde drousie dreame of popish Purgatory VVherefore if any one of these or any other that shall voutsalfe to reade this ansvvere might therby either be confirmed in trueth or reclaymed from error I began to thinke it vvere sufficient cause for me to take the paines and the paines so taken to be vvel bestovved Againe vvhen I remembred the spightfull rayling and the most disdainefull arrogance of Allen him selfe together vvith the presumptuous boasting and vaine confidence that some of his friends haue in his vvriting I cōfesse it kindled that smal zeale of godlines that is in me both to meinteine the common hope of Christians against the insolent assaultes of so malicious and proud an aduersary and also to discouer the infirmitie feeblenesse of that fortres vvhich these vvillfully blinde Papistes do vaunt to be inuincible In vvhich doinge I haue vsed great breuitie not onely by a naturall inclination vvherby I loue to be short in any thing that I vvright but also because my friendes vrged me to dispatch it vvith so great expedition And yet in this shortnesse I trust I haue not omitted any thing that hath any shadovv of reason or shevv of matter in it but that I haue sufficiently discharged it as the diligent and attentiue reader I hope vvill confesse no lesse Hovv be it neither my hast in finishing nor my friendes diligence in soliciting vvas so great but the slacknesse and vntovvardnesse of some Printers vvas much more For vvhere as it vvas ended authorized almost tvvo yeares a goe yet it hath stayed hetherto vntill a godly and learned brother vvho vvas once purposed to haue aunsvvered the same him selfe and colde full vvell and substantially haue acquited him selfe there in if other busines had not hindred him moued of godly zeale hath novv at the last vndertaken the printing thereof and brought it to this passe as you see I hearde of late also of a third man vvhich had learnedly begon the aunsvvering of this booke hovv so euer he vvas letted from accomplishing the same But hovv so euer Satan hath hether to hindred the setting abroade of this aunsvvere yet God hath novv at the length brought it forth I doubte not but to his glorie and the confusion of Satan in his membres the Papistes I haue thought good also to ioygne vnto this vvorke an other short treatise that hath lyen by me these eight or nine yeares vvritten at the request of a godly and learned friende of mine in aunsvvere to a proude challenge of the Papist against the Protestāt vvhich though at the first many yeares after I determined not to publish supposing the same challenge to haue ben priuate or in fevv mens handes yet novv of late that I haue seen it in diuerse godly Gentlemens handes to vvhome it hath bene deliuered by Papistes be like to peruert them and of vvhome also I haue bene desired to ansvvere it am further credibly informed that the same is in printe esteemed of many ignorant Papistes to be so vnaunsvverable that although it be protested by Gētlemen of great vvorshippe and credit that they haue seene the aunsvvere thereof in vvriting yet they vvill not beleue that any man dare set his penne to the paper once to attempt the matter I haue thought beste to putte it in printe as it vvas vvritten at the first Nothing doubting by Gods helpe but I shal be able to stande to that defence if the challenger vvill proceede to meinteine his challenge any longer That I haue copled it vvith the aunsvvere vnto M. Allens booke is because I doe greatly suspect that he vvas the authour thereof for the similitude of the stiles and of the stomakes in both at the least I trust I doe him no vvronge to suppose him to be so stout a champion And thus I committe the Christian reader to the direction of Gods spirite vvho voutsalfe to lead thee into all truth for Christes sake Amen The faultes of this impression are thus to be amended The first figure signifieth the page the second the line In the aunswere of a true Christian c. Pag. 3. line 35. Lithuania reade Lithūanda 5.3 vvriting r. vvritinges 10.10 the scripture reade the booke of scripture 13.17 then reade thou and line 19. you reade thou 15. line the laste Tiberius reade Liberius 19.4 you reade the. and line 10. Ca. line 58. reade Carolines 8. and line 19. Mercamas r. Marranias 20.9 fauour reade honor 23.26 the prince reade the printers 24.1 put out and. 25.9 not for his r. for his 29.10 vnitie of minde r. vnitie of faith minde 30.3 in the places aboue rehearsed in diuerse places of his epistles a◠lib. 3. epist. 14. and 15.16 c. 41.30 Rhenes r. Rhemes 49.5 the the r. that the. the 12. r. the Catho c. 52.13 in Brytish reade in the Brytish 63.14 about the articles r. about the chiefest articles 64.20 put out that hilde and the 24. here rea sore 67.21 vvhich can not rea vvhich you can not 68.4 in a name reade in a manner 69.4 prorsus opinemur r. prorsus non opinemur and 34. vniuersally r. vniuersalitie and 36. vvhich you do r. vvhich you do not 70.17 proponēda
prayer what waye of ministring of the sacraments your Church had before Papistry as you call it did preuaile in the worlde IVstinus Martyr in his second Apollogie to the Emperour declareth plainely what order of seruice and ministration of sacramentes our Church had before Papistry preuayled On the daye called Sonday sayth he there is a meeting together of all them that dwell in the Citie or in the countrie and the monumentes of the Apostles or the writinges of the Prophetes are reade vntill it be thought sufficient when the reader hath made an ende he that is our ouerseer or cheefe minister maketh a sermon of admonition and exhortation to follow those good thinges that are reade After this we all stande vp together and make our prayers and as we haue saide before when our prayers are ended there is brought forth bread and wine water and the cheefe minister doth likewise with all his might yelde prayers and thankesgeuing and the people aunswereth Amen Then is made distribution to euery one and receyuing of those thinges for which thankes was geuen and to them that be absent it is sent by the deacons Such as are riche and willing doe geue almes what they will c. By this one authoritie it may be seene though other might be brought what order of seruice and ministration of sacraments our Church vsed before Papistry gat the vpper hande 2 Shew one booke of Communion or what els you list that was in English or lacked prayer for the departed or inuocation of Sainctes in heauen or that wanted oblation or sacrifice or that charged a number to receyue or els that the preest coulde not consecrate nor say Masse himselfe or shew any note in a Communion booke that the people shoulde take the sacrament for plaine breade or that they should geue no honor to it shew this booke or any leafe or line of this booke IT may trouble a wise man to aunswere all the questions that a foole can propounde you requier to see a booke of Communion in English or that lacked c. When it is confessed that the English nation receiued their religion first from Rome at such time as Religion there was verie corrupt what marueill is it if we can not shewe you such a Communion booke as you require but we can easily shew you out of the scripture the the Communion ought to be ministred in the vulgare tongue that prayer for the deade and to the deade ought not to be vsed that the sacrament ought not to be turned into a sacrifice that there ought to be a communiō of many receauers and not a priuate masse that the substance of the bread is not changed that the elementes of the sacrament are not to be honored these I say we can proue out of the worde of God the Catholike writers of the olde Church And though perchaunce it wil be harde to finde a communion booke in English yet haue I founde you a canon of the Laterane Councell that it ought to haue bene translated into English yet are there founde diuers monumentes of Antiquitie as Prayers Psalmes and Homilies c. in the olde English or Saxons tongue in which the reall presence transubstantiation and other poinctes of Popish doctrine are plainly confuted There may be shewed you also Bybles both the olde Testament and New in the English tongue of diuers translations in olde written hande Also great bookes of English homilies inueighing directly against the Pope and all Popish doctrine in olde English written hande with diuers other small treatises and pamphlets of like matters if these woulde do you any good you might haue the sight of them when you please 3 Or any Church or Congregation that euer had any Authenticall seruice but ours and I recant THe Church of the Brytannes before Augustine came in with Romish seruice had they not trow you Authenticall seruice which continued in the faith of Christ euen from the Apostles time The Grecians also Orientall churches haue they not vnto this day their Authenticall seruice which is not yours If you can not deny this you should recant The 13. article hath 2. demaundes 1 Furthermore I requier to know what shoulde be the cause that the Protestants them selues doe receiue all Byshops Priestes Deacons and other officers spirituall of all sortes of our Catholike church and doe admit them as men lawfully and sufficiently ordered both to preach minister sacraments and to exercise spirituall iurisdiction no lesse but rather more than if they were of their owne ordering where we of the Catholike church doe not acknowledge any man of their calling to be any whit more fitte for any spirituall function than other lay men ALthough all godly men wishe more seueritie of discipline to be vsed in receyuing them that come out of heresies to serue in the Church than is commonly practised in England yet you are highlie deceyued if you thinke we esteeme your offices of Bishops priests deacōs any better than the state of lay men but farre worse for we iudge them to be nothing els but Antichristianitie heresie and blasphemie And therefore we receiue none of them to minister in our church except they forsweare your religion And so their admission is not an allowing of your ordering but a new calling vnto the ministerie 2 Therefore vpon this presumption that they doe not onely admit our ministring of sacraments but also the lawfull ordering of the ministers for the same if they can shew me why our church hauing by their owne consent and approuing lawfull priestes and bishops should not be the true church I recant YOu presume to much as I saide before to thinke that we receiue your orderinge to be lawfull or your ministring of sacraments to be pure And if you gather that we admitte your ministration of sacraments because we doe not rebaptize them that were baptized by you we maye likewise gather that you admit our ministration of sacraments because you doe not rebaptize them that are baptized of vs nor marrie againe those that are married in our Church wheras you compt mariage to be a sacrament so that our accepting of your doings doth no more allow your church than your accepting of our doinges doth allow our Church And as touching the sacrament of Baptisme because you reteyne the Institution in baptizing in the name of the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghost and in asmuch as the sacraments take not their effect of the minister but of God we receiue it as of other heretikes which likewise reteine the Institution Wherefore there is no cause why you shoulde thinke we allow yours to be the true Church thereby So that there is good cause why you shoulde recant The 14. article hath 5. demandes 1 Also I demande what furniture or commodity in seruing God the Christianity of any age or any part of Christendome had euer by your Congregations THe seruice of God hath small neede of furniture in outwarde thinges for
you must repeat that which is nothing like to your matter Paula was penitent for her sinnes with prayers almes and fasting and all for feare of purgatory So sayth M. Allen. But Ieronyme sayth not so M. Allen is here all the credit of the matter beleue him as you list But if any man had rather beleue Chrysostome speaking of such kind of workes as M. Allen and his fellowes count to be the chiefe workes of penaunce whether they serue for satisfaction for our sinnes vnto God let him consider what he writeth in his treatise de compunctione cordis lib. 2. Non requirit Deus ciliciorum pondus neque concludi inter angustias cellulae neque in obscuris antris tencbrosis sedere iubet hoc solum est quod exposcatur à nobis vt semper recordemur mala nostra c. God requireth not the burden of heauy garments not to be shut vp with the streights of a litle cell neither doth he commaund vs to sit in obscure and darke dungeons or dennes this onely is that which is required of vs that we should alwayes remember our euill life c. you see therefore by Chrysostoms iudgement that neither the satisfaction of Gods righteousnes nor any obedience of Gods commaundement hath banished the Heremites closed vp the Anachorets and cloyed the world with cloysterers but the superstitious and slauish feare of purgatory the blasphemous presumptuous pride of mens merites I passe ouer as not proper to your matter that for the honour of Christ you except his mother from confessing her selfe to be indebted to God and not to be in the numbre of those by whome the Lordes prayer is to be sayd Such honor neither doth God allowe her nor she arrogate vnto her selfe but acknowledgeth her owne basenesse and ioyfully accepteth Gods saluation It is greater honor to Christ to be sauiour of his mother then to haue such a mother as had no neede of his saluation He him selfe more then once is reade to haue reproued her wherein he had done her wrong if she had committed no trespasse Luke 2. Iohn 2. 6 But list you see how this doctrine of penaunce liked Caluine The shrew saw that by graunting of this satisfaction for sinne and the profitable vsage thereof in this life that it might argue of necessitie the residue of some paines in the next if it were here omitted or not ended And therefore I pray you see how substantially he aunswereth and how like him selfe Parumme mouent sayth he quae in veterum scriptis de satisfactione passim occurrunt video enim eorum nonnullos dicam simpliciter omnes fere quorum libri extant aut in hac parte lapsos esse aut nimis aspere dure loquutos I make small accompt of that which I often finde concerning Satisfaction in the auncient writers for I perceiue diuers of them shall I be plaine with you in a maner euery one that euer wrote till this daye in this point to haue bene fouly deceiued or spoken more roughly then they shoulde haue done Is not this a fellow a lone whether thinke you now our English bragger craking all the doctors to be on his parte or this man confessing plainely that they be all against him and yet setting not a butten by them all whether thinke you is more arrogant I am sure Caluine dealeth here more sincerely and the other more deceitfully If craking had bene a maisterie in sommer games as lying is our man might haue wone of all the worlde two games at a clappe But there is no remedy he must yelde to the learned that haue opened his impudencie Therefore I leaue him and take the benefit of this his maisters confession for further confirmatiō of my cause doubting nothing but that most wise men seeing by the aduersaries graunt all learned fathers to be on our side will accept it either as a full proofe or no small presumption of that trueth which we defend 6 But list you heare how this presumptuousse pratler can not conclude his chapter which he began with lying vpon Melancthon but by slaundering of Caluine He faineth that Caluine in the wordes by him rehersed confesseth all the doctors to be against him and yet setteth not a butten for them all The best reproofe of this calumniation shal be to sende them that be desirous to know the trueth vnto the whole discourse of Caluine vpon satisfaction Insti lib. 3. cap. 4 which who so list to doe shall plainely see whether Allen doth him not here open wrong But because euery man either can not for the lacke of the booke or will not for want of good affections towardes Caluine take so much paines as to peruse his owne writing I will aunswere in a worde or two After that Caluine hath most substantially proued both by authority of holy Scripture and also by consent of auncient doctors that their is no satisfaction vnto God for our sinnes but onely the death of Christ he cōmeth at length to speake of the worde of satisfaction which sayth he as it is often vsed in the olde writers so sometime hardely as improperly that M. Allen calleth roughly or if any of them haue erred about satisfaction it were not reason that their error shoulde preuaile against the open trueth And cleerely to conuicte M. Allen of a loude lye where he sayth that Caluine confesseth all the doctors to be against him his wordes follow immediatly after those rehersed by M. Allen Sed non credam eos ipsos adeo fuisse rudes imperitos vt eo sensu illa scripserint quo à nouis istis satisfactionariis legūtur That is how soeuer they haue either erred or spoken vnproprely of satisfaction yet I will not graunt that the same men were so rude and ignoraunt that they did wright those thinges in that sense in which they are read by these new satisfactionaries Then doth he bring forth diuers testimonies both out of Chrysostome and Augustine to shew what their iudgement was of satisfaction agreable to the Scriptures by which must be expounded what so euer they haue vttered that seemeth either erroneus or at the lest vnproprely spoken As for that reuerend father M. Iewell whome this arrogant Louanist calleth the English bragger how well he hath answered his challendge his owne learned labors do more cleerely testifie vnto the worlde then that it can be blemished by this sycophants braynlesse babling A briefe ioyning in reason and argument vpon the proued groundes vvith the aduersaries for the declaration of Purgatory CAP. V. 1 HAving vndoubtedly wonne thus much both by euidēt testimony of holy writ by the warraunt of all the learned fathers by good reason and by the aduersaries owne confession I will be bolde to bare the very iointes of the argument that both the simple may acknowledge my plaine dealing and the Protestant haue his vauntage if the reason stand not vpright VVith out colour or glose then thus I make my proofe
which Christ sweareth shall be made vnto the vttermost farthing For he that refuseth reconciliation or repentance in this life must not looke for a pardon after this life Therefore if M. Allen will needes vnderstand this pryson for purgatory I will be so bold vppon Christes oth and earnest asseueration to affirme that he which is so imprisoned shall neither looke for mercy nor satisfaction by other mens payment but by his owne suffering But let vs see how he proueth that this place is to be vnderstood of purgatory First by likelihood that he should not haue sayd he shall not escape vntill he hath payd the vttermost farthing but rather cast him into the darke dungeon of euerlasting damnation M. Allen either can not or will not see that Christ here continueth an allegory of a temporall iudgement as Matt. 18. where he hath the same Donec as the same in like sense is often vsed else where Secondly the name of imprisonment will not well admitt he sayth any other meaning but of a temporall torment as though hell is not called a prison 1. Peter 3. And Apoc. 20. which is a place of euerlasting torments Therefore here is no shew of matter but bigge wordes onely 2 And these notes well and diligently considered may geue greate light to the alleaged wordes otherwise somewhat obscure and therewith proue our matter too They be not of my scanning onely as for some parte thou shalt perceiue by these wordes of Rupert an excellent good author Aduersarius eorum qui erant eiusmodi sermo fuit euangelij omnis praedicator euangelicae veritatis potestatem habens non consentientem sibi tradere iudici non solum iudici verum etiam malo ministro quemadmodum vnus eorum tradidâ—t hominem satanae The aduersary of such men was the worde of the Gospell and ech preacher of the trueth who had poure to deliuer him that would not agree vnto him to the iudge yea further then that he had authority to commit him to an euill minister as one of them gaue vp a man to Satan Here we see what that aduersary is to whome we must consent in this life and withall we haue an example in this iudgement of Gods ministers how man may be committed in the next life to a tormenter that may vexe him then at Gods prescription as he doth now at the charge onely of his minister then in fauour and mercy of the iudge as it is now in loue and charity of the vicegerent then for the atteining of heauens blesse as it is nowe for the saluation of the person punished For the executioÌ„ of Gods sentence may be either by a good spirite or our aduersary Angell or by his will and worde onely to whome all creatures serue and obey In this sense Paulinus who was S. Augustines peare writeth that the holy Ghost and Gods worde be mans aduersaries in earth to whome if we applie our selues obediently in this world our sorowe can not be long in the next life But these be his owne wordes Neque septem dies luctus noster excedat si consentiamus in huius vitae via aduersario nostro id est spiritui ac vei bo dei quod nobis peccaÌ„tibus aduersatur c. Our griefe can not be much longer then seuen dayes he meaneth it shall be a temporall paine and not very long if we consent in the way of this life to our aduersary that is to witte the spirite and worde of god For they be our aduersaries when we sinne because the holy Ghost chargeth the world with sinne and the worde of God if we obey not will be our accuser and promotour vp vnto the Iudge who will haue an accompt of his talent to the vttermost farthinge Thus farre spake this Author and in like sense many moe whome I neede not nowe name Because there is such store of testimonies that not onely in some part make for the opening of this scripture but altogether for Purgatory And one or two of them I will briefly recite because I determined with my selfe and bounde my selfe for my discharge and the readers more safe warraunt to bring no texte of scripture for the proofe of my purpose except I might finde some holy writers of the antiquity that vsed the same directly in that sense that if any maÌ„ would repreheÌ„d my meaning yet he should not be so bold with such as I caÌ„ name proue to be my authors therin 2 In this part are two testimonies alleged one of Rupertus an other of Paulinus of which Rupertus affirmeth his exposition of the aduersary but touching purgatory he sayth nothing Paulinus interpreteth the aduersary somewhat otherwise but he speaketh of them that doe agree with him in the way of this life whose sorrow he sayth shal not exceede seuen dayes but what sorrow they shall abide that contemne this agrement he sayth nothing but generally of the accompt of the vttermost farthing I maruell whether M. Allen was awake when he alleged these two testimonies for purgatory or whether he thought that all men should be asleep that should reade them 3 But whome may I more safely alleage for the contentatioÌ„ of sober wittes and repressing the aduersaries boldenesse then the blessed martyr S. Cyprian VVho in the forth booke of his Epistles for the declaration that euery one which here is pardoned of his sinnes shall not straight be exalted to the glory of sainctes and martyrs after their death vseth very fitly as he doth all other placies of scripture the forsaide text by these wordes Aliud est ad veniam stare aliud ad gloriam peruenire aliud missum in carcerem non exire donec soluat nouissimum quadrantem aliud statim fidei virtutis accipere mercedem aliud pro peccato longo dolore cruciari purgari diu igne aliud peccata omnia passione purgari aliud denique pendere in die iudicij ad sententiam domini aliud statim a domino coronari In English it is an other thing to stande at a pardon then out of hande to atteine to glory it is an other maner of matter to be coÌ„mitted to prison thense not to depart till the last farthing be discharged to receiue out of hand the rewarde of faith and vertue It is one thing by greate sorow to be tormented for our sinnes and by long fire amended purged of the same and an other to haue sufficiently purged them by martyrdom in fine it is not all one to hange on Gods sentence in the day of iudgement and out of hande to be crowned of our Lorde These wordes as you see expressely proue our matter open the meaning of the scripture whereon we nowe stoode and do clearely set forth the ordre of Gods iustice in the next life And they shall content the reader better if he marke vpon what occasion this blessed man spake these wordes There were many in the persecutioÌ„ of that time
stand with trueth and be not repugnaunt to good life and maners And he hedgeth the diuersity of mens wittes in the exposition of scripture with in the double knot of loue which is towards God and our brother Who so euer sayth he taketh him selfe to vnderstand scripture or any parte thereof and in that meaning edifieth nothing at all the double loue of God and our neighbour he misseth the true meaning thereof But who so euer can finde out such a sense that may be commodious to the increase of charitie although it were not directly intended by the writer yet he is not harmefully deceiued nor founde a lyar therein so sayth he Now as for our matter I am well assured there dare no man though he were destitute of Gods grace yet not for shame of him selfe affirme that the doctrine of purgatory is hourtfull to vertuous life the only miscredit whereof hath vtterly banished all good Christian condicions or iniurious to the faith of Gods Church which is not only agreable but principally intended by the plaine letter of Gods worde and consonant to all other meanings that may be gathered by any such scripture as we haue alleaged there for and to be short receiued of so many fathers so wise and so well learned as we haue named for that purpose as a trueth most reasonable most naturall and most agreable to Gods iustice VVell then the misbeleuers can haue no shifte nor escape by the chalenge of Gods word or doctures or diuersity of sensies here is no holde for errour all I trust be safe and sure on euery side CAP. XI 1 YOu shoulde breake your olde wonte if you did not in this chapter ouerthrow something that you haue builded in that which went next going before He hath labored all this while to proue that purgatory hath grounde in the Scriptures now he cōfesseth franckely that there hath bene no text of scripture by him alleaged to proue it but it may haue an other meaninge and is sometime other wise construed of the fathers them selues I will aske no more to proue that purgatory hath no grounde in the worde of God which is not an ambiguous oracle that may be drawen euery way like a leaden rule hath but one true sence or meaning which is the right meaning of the holy Ghost For although diuerse men may geue diuerse interpretations of some obscure and harde place which all conteine no impiety or falshode yet the spirite of God meaneth but one thing and not what euery mans wit and iudgement will take it to be True it is that so longe as the proportion of faith is kept the Church beareth with them that geue wronge interpretations but the spirite of God which is in his Church alloweth not wronge interpretations for right And where as M. Allen alloweth all the interpretatiōs that the fathers haue made of the text by him alleaged as true so long as they affirmed no error he may by the same reason affirme that contradictories are true as in that saying of him that shall not come out vntill he haue payed the vttermost farthing some haue expounded that he shal be alwayes punished some that he shall not be alwayes punished One sayth he shal neuer be released an other saith he shall be released at length how is it possible that both these interpretations can be true and yet both these interpretations are founde in some writers But his suerest shifte is that the doctrine of purgatory was a knowen trueth in all ages But this is the whole matter in controuersie For how can it be taken for a knowen trueth in all ages which hath none so suer grounde in any text of scripture that cā be wrested for it but the same text may haue an other and that a true interpretation But of the antiquity of that error we shall haue better occasion hereafter to discusse in the second booke where this matter is of purpose intreated of In the meane time we wil take that which is here graunted so liberaly that there is no text of scripture alleaged for purgatory but it may be otherwise truely interpreted and not of purgatory and that the fathers haue so done by M. Allens owne confession 2 Their extreme and onely refuge is that the paine of Christes passion and his sufficient payment for our sinnes standeth not with our satisfaction or penaunce in this life nor with paine or purgatory in the next O Lorde how farre may mans malice reach that not contented to abuse their reason and the word of God in persuasion of errour but are bolde to referre Christes blessed death also to cloke together with falsehood wanton and licentious liuing Many vertuous persons haue bene prouoked by the meditation of our Sauiours sorowes to leaue the stattering welth of this worlde and to charge them selues with perpetuall vexation of body but that any did euer so rest vpon Christes passion that in respect thereof they might passe their dayes in idle welth of lust and liberty that was I trow vnhearde of before this sinnefull sect These fellowes argue thus Christ hath paide the full price of our sinnes ergo we must do no penaunce nor suffer any paine for them But S. Paule thus Christ by paine and passiō is entred into the glory of his kingdome ergo if we looke to be his fellow heires or partakers of his glory we must suffer affliction with him and ioyne with him in paines and passion S. Peter also thus Christ hath suffered leauing you an example that ye should follow his steppes therefore all his blessed life passed in paine must be a perpetuall sturring vp of toleration gladde suffering for his name againe Iohn our maisters messenger prepared the way of Christes death and doctrine by worthy fructes of penaunce and that was the beginning of Christes owne preaching therfore I dare be bolde to say these thinges are not abrogated by the teaching of the Gospel nor voide by Christs passion which onely maketh our workes and merites to be of that value and acceptation that all Catholike men counte them of which els to the satisfying for sinne shoulde be nothing auaileable nor to the atteining of heauen any thing profitable But it is foly to make ouer many wordes in a case so plaine seeing the example of both God and good mens dealing abundantly proueth mans punishment either temporall or eternall to stande well with the excellent value of our Sauiours death For if paine for sinne were iniurious to Christes death then the holy prophet Dauid that liued long in greuous penaunce were iniurious to his Lordes death then the Church were iniurious to her owne spouse his death that chargeth all offenders with penaunce then God him selfe were iniurious to his owne sonnes death that sharply punisheth sinne forgeuen then Christ him selfe were iniurious to his owne death that both by his example and holy preaching did euer commend sharpe penaunce and paine These
flambes of purgatory But as I haue noted before that you haue hetherto kept this order for the most parte to plante one thinge in one chapter and then to pull it vp by the rootes in the next so you haue not forgotten your selfe in the diuision of your bookes But that the latter shoulde be a sufficient confutation of the former or else the former a manifest excluding of the latter For if the iustice of God doth so necessarily require a punishment for sinnes remitted that the same coulde not be satisfied no not by that only sacrifice which the sonne of God offered once for all on the aulter of the crosse it is a colde comforte that a carefull conscience can receiue that the same shoulde be done by his merites or your Masses which was not done by the bloude of Christ Yet now you will talke how the fiery sword maye be turned away surely if the fiery and shaking sworde that was set to exclude man from Paradise was not taken away by the death of Christ when he opened Paradise yea the kingdome of heauen whereof Paradise was but a sacrament vnto all beleuers I meruaill how either the penitent these had passage into Paradise or what engins you Papistes haue to turne it awaye which he had not The wordes of Damascene if they were not applied as you saye they are to purgatory paines and remedies of the same were true of Gods iustice and his mercy but as his age is to young so his authoritie is to light to controll the trueth of the worde of God or the practise of the first purest Church which knew no purgatory nor prayers for the deade But if our sinnes forgeuen were neuer so greuous c. what mad man woulde euer write thus Euen such a one as might be allowed to speake thus if blacke were neuer so blacke before it were cleane taken away and perfect white placed in the steede yet when white is white it is white But M. Allen wil not allowe that the coullor of our sinnes is cleane taken away and a contrary coullor of righteousnesse set vppon vs but that sinnes forgeuen be but halfe forgeuen the gilte taken awaye the punishment due for the gilte still remayning And this one halfe of forgeuenesse is but graunted in wordes and denied in deede For if the gilte of our sinnes be cleane taken away from vs and layed vpon the person of Christ and the righteousnesse of Christ is communicated vnto vs what is there lefte in vs that God of his goodnesse can hate or of his iustice can punish So it is but for a fashion that the papistes graunt any parte of our sinnes forgeuen when they will haue vs make satisfaction for them our selues But where as M. Allen is out of measure prodigall in promising releiffe and release of purgatory paines to them whose sinnes were neuer so greuous their vicious life wasted in idle wealth the space of penaunce and opportunity of working neglected in time preuented by sodaine death c rehersing so many meanes of mitigation as sometime the bloude of Christ the residew of his merites the crye of the mother Church the memory of the Masse the merites of all Sainctes the prayers of the faithfull and workes of the charitable All this notwithstanding take heede you poore Papistes that you geue no credit to these flattering wordes For it is the opinion of all the olde writers that doe allowe any of these thinges to profit men after their death and concluded by the Maister of the Sentence and aduouched by Allen him selfe afterwarde chapt 7. that no man can receiue benefit after his departure by any worke or will of the liuing but he that in his life deserued the same neither shal any thing worke vpon him more or lesse but according to his owne deseruing in this life Trust not therefore in these sophisticall vanities which are contrary one to an other but imbrace the vniforme vndoubted doctrine of Gods word which teacheth repentaunce faith iustification and saluation not with curious questions to troble your braynes but with perfect conclusions to quyet your conscience not suffering you to sleepe in securitie vpon hope of helpe after your death but charging you to shew the force of mortification and fruictes of fayth while you are aliue Not puffing vp your phantasie with pride of your owne merites but teaching you to ascribe all prayse to Gods glorious grace and infinite mercy 2 The cruell aduersary of man kinde as before he wrought his worst against Purgatory so here he busely pricketh forwarde the schoole of Protestantes to improue to their owne vtter damnation and the notable hinderaunce of our louing bretherns saluation all such meanes as God by scripture or other testimony of his worde hath reueled to be profitable for the abating of paine or the release of the apointed punishment in that place of temporall torment to come Against which deceiuers I meane by Gods helpe in this ordre to trauell 2 The cruell aduersary of mankinde and enuyor of Gods glory inuented Purgatory to deface the merites of Christes death and to blemish the onely meanes of mans eternall life which when he coulde not with any seemely coullor establish by the authority of the holy Scriptures the onely testimony of his worde and will reueiled and confirmed by his holy Spirite he hath inuented fayned fables and deuilish illusions to deceiue the mindes of them whome he had enclined vnto superstition and not bene ashamed to match them in credit and estimation with the very worde of God it selfe As appereth by this scribe of Sathan which nameth the scriptures for a simple shew but by and by addeth other testimonies of Gods worde beside the scriptures inspired by God whereby he maketh equiualent those false reuelations raised vp from Hell with the inspiratiō of the holy Ghost which hath brought the truth from heauen But now commeth in the order of this deuillyshe horror 3 First I will proue that sinnes may be pardoned or the debt and bonde thereof released in the next worlde 3 You shall neuer proue by authoritie of Gods word that sinnes not repented in this life shal be pardoned after this life where there is no repentaunce profitable nor yet any debt payed but by them that paye it eternally in perpetuall torments 4 Then I shall shewe what meanes the holy Scripture approueth or the example thereof awarraunteth to be proffitable for the soules departed 4 When you can proue either by doctrine or example agreable to doctrine of the canonicall Scriptures that any thing profiteth the soules departed that be not in happy state we will beleue it 5 I will open what the principall pillars and in a maner the flowre of all the faithfull sorte in sundry agies and almost in all Christian contryes haue lefte in writinge for this pointe 5 You are not able to bring one authenticall writer that within one 100 yeares and more after Christ hath allowed prayer for
the dead or any point of purgatory 6 I will declare what they practised for their dearest frends priuately and what the Churches of most notable Nations vsed for all deceased in Christes faith in their publike seruice openly I shall proue vnto you that the practise of suffrages and Sacrifice for the deade isshued downe to vs from the Apostles dayes 6 You shall not proue that either in publicke or priuate prayers the deade were commended otherwise then by waye of thankes geuing for their departure or that any suffrages or sacrifice was offered for them by the Apostles or their lawefull successors or many yeares after the Apostles times 7 I shall pointe you to the first father of the contrary doctrine and his principall abettours in such troublesome times at such marchants were to be founde Ye shall see them knowen amongest all the holy of their time by the name of heretikes 7 You shall shew no heretike that denied your doctrine but I will shew you other heretikes before him that allowed it 8 You shall see their doctrine improued and them selues condemned by the graue iudgement of Councells both Generall prouinciall for heretikes If any of them all can say any thing to the contrary of that which we vpon so good groundes mainteine he shall be aunswered with no worse then the very wordes of the holy auncient writers Finally if any other thinges be necessary beside for the declaration of this matter to the simple or for proofe against our aduersaries they shall not be omitted as occasioÌ„ by course and fall of the matter may be geuen All which pointes being auouched and not proued shall condemne me of arrogancy But both auouched and fully proued they shall deserue any reasonable mans consent and beare testimony of the aduersaries impudency here and witnesse of their contempte of Gods approued trueth in the worlde to come 8 How vayne your bragge is of generall counsels it appeareth by this that with in fouretene hundreth yeares after Christ you can finde none to serue your turne vntill you come to the councells Florens and Trent whereof the one was held in our grandfathers dayes the other within these 20. yeares your prouinciall councells shal be aunswered by as good prouinciall councells as they are And that which I haue to say in confutation of your heresie shall be no worse then the very word of God it selfe which is better then the consent of all the world against it And although the custome of praying for the dead be an auncient errour so that fewe of the latter writers there are but they shewe them selues to be infected therewith yet hath it not such an vniuersall consent of all writers but that I shall be able by Gods grace to shew that the most auncient and nearest to the Apostles tyme receiued it not and that they which of later time admitted it had neither any ground out of the Scriptures to warrant their doing nor any certainty of faith to assure their conscience which when it is found in the ende as it is now sayd in the beginning your arrogant boasting and impudent lying togither with the falshoode of your opinions shall be manifest to all men That there be certaine sinnes vvhich may be forgeuen in the next life and that the deserued punishement for the same may be eased or vtterly released before the extreme sentence be to the vtmost executed CAP. I. 1 ANd first that sinnes may be pardoned in the next worlde that were not in this life forgeuen our Sauiours owne wordes do teach vs written in the Gospell of S. Matthew thus Ideò dico vobis omne peccatum blasphemia remittetur hominibus spiritus autem blasphemia non remittetur Et quicuÌ„que dixerit verbum contra filium hominis remittetur ei qui autem dixerit contra spiritum sanctum non remittetur ei neque in hoc saeculo neque in fuâ—uro I tell you that all maner of sinne and blasphemy shall be forgeuen vnto men but the blasphemy of the spirit shall not be forgeueÌ„ And who so euer shall speake against the sonne of man it shall be forgeuen him But if he speake against the holy Ghost it shall neither be pardoned in this worlde nor in the worlde to come The same thing in sense hath Marke and Luke affirming that such offense shall neuer be forgeuen The which worde Neuer S. Marke expresseth thus in aeternuÌ„ non habet remissionem he shall not haue pardoÌ„ as you would say in all eternity by which he may plainely seeme to reache further then the limites and borders of this worlde for the remission of sinne And this speach hath as much pith and proper force in it as S. Matthewes who expressely distinctly and belike as Christ spake it vttereth that sense of the eternity which passeth the measure of worldely time by these words Neither in this world nor yet in the world to come And for that cause S. Marke sayth Reus erit aeterni delicti he shall be gilty of an eternall faulte signifying that in some case a man might perhaps not speede of a pardon in this life yet may obteine it in the next But for that horrible blasphemy he in a maner dischargeth the offender of all hope of remission either in this life or in the next that is to come VVhich forme of wordes can neither be founde in scripture nor in mans common talke to haue any place in such thinges as extend no further but to the transitory time of our life for in those matters it had bene vsually and truely spoken it shall neuer happen in this world And therfore instructing vs that sinnes or the paine due vnto sinnes may either be released in this worlde or in the worlde to come he followeth that phrase and forme of wordes in which man might well conceiue the reache of remission and pardoning of sinnes farre to passe the compasse of our time and life CAP. I. 1 YOu were as good to kindle a fire out of yâ—e and snow as to goe about to frame your fiery forge of purgatory out of this place The meaning of our Sauiour Christ is so playne his wordes so expresse that no reasonable man can gather any errour out of them For vndoubtedly the errour of purgatory was first inuented before this place was drawne vnto it So is there no heresie so absurd which Satan putteth into the head of wicked men but it may finde some sound of wordes in so many bookes of the holy Scriptures that by peruerse wit may be wrested vnto it But the doctrine of Gods truth and all articles of our beliefe are plainly taught in the Scripture either by manifest words or by necessary conclusion and argument which by no subtilty of SataÌ„ or his instrumeÌ„ts may be auoided or deluded And this is the difference betwene heresie and truth when they both apeale to the authorities of the Scripture Truth as she hath her foundation in the Scriptures and
for the soules resurrectionis spes solidatur the hope of resurrection is established And therefore Dionysius the auncient in his misticall prayer and saâ—râ—fice for the departed declareth that there was a minister that did solemnely recite certaine places out of scripture for to confirme the hope of resurrection So that this practise of the faithfull hath not onely bene euer accompted a plaine trueth but it hath bene a grounde and a principle to confirme the article of resurrection and immortality of the soule And therefore the facte of Iudas is with such commendation mentioned in the scripture For in those dayes the heresie of the Saduces denying the resurrection and the life to come as Iosephus writeth began to take greate holde amongest the Iewes about byshop Ionathas his time in which tiue of diuersity that true beleuer thought to make plaine protestation of his faith by his notable facte And now I must needes be bolde to tell these enemies of our communion that in acknowledging them selues to haue nothing to do with the soules departed they are at the next doore by to denie the immortalitie and to terme them deade soules as Vigilantius did VVhome Gods Church very conformably to Christes calling and fittly for the protesting the common faith nameth Dormientes in signo pacis Those that sleepe in the signe of peace and the named Scripture for the same cause calleth them men a sleepe in pietie VVell if their denial of prayers for the deceased grow so farre as the vtter impugning of Christian hope for the life euerlasting and so with purgatory take away hell and heauen togither as the Sadduces did which God of his might turne from them but if they doe because there is such affinitie betwixt both their teachings and this of theirs may seeme alwayes to haue bene ioyned to that extreme falshoode of the others then shall Gods Church still protest the faith of her children by prayers and practise for the deade both by the example of the fathers in Christes Church vnder the Gospell and by the fact of worthy Iudas in the lawe before CAP. III. 1 WE haue all this while called for authoritie of the scripture now we shall haue scripture I trowe or else M. Allen shall misse of his purpose Sacrifice almes prayers commended by scripture to be meanes to helpe the soules in purgatory And the scripture is written 2. Machab. 12. Prothesauro carbones we haue founde coles in the steed of treasure Is this all the scripture we are like to haue this hath bene aunswered of olde to be no holy nor canonicall scripture and that by many reasons First because it conteineth matter contrary to the vndoubted worde of god I omit this matter in coÌ„trouersy in the 14. chap. the author of the booke commendeth one Razis for killing him selfe which is contrary to the word of god Wherefore M. Allen by authoritie of this booke the example of a good man Razis may as well conclude that it is lawfull for men to kill them selues as by the example of Iudas that men may offer sacrifice for the dead Secondly the author of this booke declareth that he abridgeth the fiue bookes of Iason the Cyrenian into this one which is a manifest argument that he was not the instrument of the holy Ghost For the holy Ghost maketh no abridgements of others mens writings Againe the purpose of the author proueth that he was not directed by Gods spirite for he confesseth that he tooke this matter in hande that men might haue pleasure in it which could not away with the tedious long stories of Iason But the spirite of God serueth not such vayne delight of men Moreouer he sheweth what labour and sweate it was to him to make this abridgement and to be short he maketh a very prophane preface ambitiously commending his trauell and shewing the difference betwene a story at large and an abridgment all which thinges sauour nothing of that spirite by which the holy Scriptures of God were written which as S. Peter sheweth came not by priuate mens will and ordinance but the holy men of God spake as they were inspired by the holy Ghost 2. Pet. 1. where as all this preface sheweth nothing but a priuate motion an humane purpose And yet the man is to be commended for this that he doth not boast of any more reuelation then he had but in the end of this booke coÌ„fesseth his infirmity desireth pardoÌ„ which is as farre from the maiesty of gods spirit as it is agreeable to the weakenes of our deceiuable nature which are apt to deceiue and be deceiued If I haue wel done sayth he and as the story required it is the thing I desired but if I haue spoken slenderly and barely it is that I could For as it is hurtfull to drinke wine alone and then agayne water and as wine tempered with water is pleasant and delighteth the tast so the setting out of the matter delighteth the eares of them that readeth the story c. Who is so voyd of the spirite of God that can not see plainly that this man had neither the purpose to write that which shoulde instruct much lesse that should bind the consciences of men neither the gift so to write as in writing he could not erre But now to come to the text it selfe first the greeke copy in this place is so mangled and corrupted that no good sense can be gathered of the wordes by which it appeareth that the deuils limbes haue bene â—umbling with this booke as they haue bene with the olde doctors in places where mention is of prayer for the deade Secondly seeing this facte of Iudas hath no commaundement in the law in which not so much as one pinne of the tabernacle was omitted lest any thing might be left to the will of man to deuise in the worship of God it is so farre of that it is to be drawne into example that we may be bold to condemne it for sinne disobedience you shall not doe sayth the Lord what seemeth good in your owne eyes but that which I commaund you that onely shall you doe without adding any thinge to it or taking away any thing from it But M. Allen thinketh he hath a sure post to leane vnto because Iudas Machabaeus did by this fast testifie his hope of the resurrection as Iasons abridger sayth and also that prayers for the deade may be an argument to proue the faith that men haue of the resurrection It is not vnlike that this reason preuayled much with the auncient fathers as appeareth by their writings for commonly it hath the best colour of any reason that they bring to allow prayers for the dead But if it be weighed with good iudgement it is of no force to proue that prayers for the dead are lawful For as truth may be proued alwayes with true principles so often tymes it may be concluded out of false affirmations As for example
or daunger or to shew their sorrow for prophanation of Gods glory And any of these are more reasonable causes then the superstitious surmise of Beda with his curious conceit of the six ages of the worlde where other make seuen and eight ages 3 And that charitable reliefe of the poore by open almes and doles was also practised for the welth of the departed in the obittes of olde time the scripture it selfe in the fourth chapter of Tobie maketh mention by report of that godly commaundemeÌ„t that the good olde father gaue is sonne herein Panem tuum cum esurientibus comede de vestimeÌ„â—is tuis nudos tege Panem tuum vinum tuum super sepulturam iusti constitue noli ex eo manducare bibere cum peccatoribus Eate thy breade with the hongry and needy and couer with thy clothes the naked Set thy breade and wine vpon the sepulture of the vertuous make not the sinnefull partaker therof which wordes of exhortation can haue no other sense but that as before in the same place he gaue his sonne in charge to bestow vppon all men according to his hability for that there was hope to all charitable almes giuers of Gods mercy so now he warneth him to feede the poore and breake his breade to such especially as should come to the iustes and funeralls of the departed He would neuer haue put him in minde to haue releeued the poore at burialls but for some commodity that might arise to the party deceased for otheâ—wise his charity might haue proffeted the needy at other times as well as vpon mens departure Some tooke foolish occasioÌ„ by this place to set store of meate vpon the graue it selfe where their father or freinde was buried as though the dead had bene desirous of corporall foode The which superstitious error S. Augustine earnestly improueth Other some made great feastes at the daye of their freindes death But the texte is plaine it was the needy and good people that were at those soleÌ„ne exequies or other wise by their prayers might be profitably present in the dayes of memories holden for them which practise was not prescribed as a newe thing to the yong Tobie but it was moued and praised vnto him as a holy vsage of other burialls in those dayes and alwayes before Bona est oratio cum ieiunio elecmosina Prayer is profitable sayth the holy Raphel when it is ioyned with fasting and almes and therefore as the fathers in their prayers for the dead fasted as we haue proued so nowe I doubt not but almes shall crie for mercy at Gods hande for the soule departed vpon whose sepulture these thinges be charitably wroght 3 What else if we had not doles at burialls proued by the example of the Patriarkes all were marred Therefore Tobias must saye for doles But first we haue shewed already by authoritie of Hieronym which is proofe sufficient against the Papist that the Church receiueth not this booke of Tobias for canonicall scripture And secondly if we shoulde receiue it yet here is nothing that helpeth M. Allens cause but his owne simple surmise He sayth in dede the wordes can haue no other sence yet all that he sayeth is not gospell but what if the truer texte of Tobias hath other wordes First in the Greeke there is no mention at all of wine as is in the Latine nor of setting breade and wine vpon the graue of the vertuous but the sence is this As before he exhorted his sonne to feede the hongry with his owne breade and to cloth the naked with his owne garments so nowe he willeth him to spare the breade out of his owne mouth to bury the righteous as he him selfe had done chap. 1. which is a cleere interpretation of this but to geue nothing at all to the vngodly or to be liberall to the rightuous euen to their death and to see them buried honestly As for the iustes and funeralls M. Allen dreameth that the poore came vnto to receiue penny dole or soule breade appeareth in the first and second Chapters how solemne they were when poore Tobie was fayne to steale the bodyes and bury them priuily by night yet vpon that corrupt Latine texte as it should seeme wherevpon M. Allen buildeth they vsed in Affrica to make sumptuous and dronken feastes vpon the graues of men in the places of buriall which they thought not onely to perteine to the honor of the martyrs but also to be some comforte to the soules of the deade This olde superstition Augustine reproueth epist. 64. Aurelio But it is pretily renewed in the funerall feastes of the Papistes as also the selling of oblations for the deade which he in the same place condemneth 4 VVe haue a notable example in the Actes of the Apostles of the force of almes with prayers which wroght life and procured mercy eueÌ„ in the next world For the benefit of faithfull workes and holy prayers will not be limited by the termes of this worlde it will haue course doune so farre as the fellowship of this Christian societie reacheth the deuill and all his abettours can not stoppe the rase thereof The onely shew of certaine cotes with the requeste of the pore widowes that wore them made to Peter the Apostle turned Tabitha to life againe after her departure those garments geuen by her when she was a lieue by the careful trauel of her almes folkes procured reliefe in the worlde to come They warmed the backes of widowes in earth sayth Emissenus and the geuer had comforth of them being gone from the earth It is good we shoulde all learne here that haue receiued benefite of any man in this liefe with loue and carefullnesse not onely in this present worlde but most of all when our frend is departed to represent vnto God before his altare and holy ministers with sorowfull weeping hearty prayer the memory of such thinges as we haue receiued by way of almes or loue at his hand It shall be a soueraigne remedy for his infirmities and the approuedst way to procure Gods mercy that can be The elders of the Iewes making earnest supplication to our Sauiour for the Centurions seruaunt lying in extremitie vsed the memorie of that gentilmans charitable actes in their church as the rediest waye to obteine grace and fauour at his handes They cried out together dignus est vt hoc illi praestes diligit enim gentem nostram synagogam ipse aedificauit nobis Lorde be gratious vnto him he is worthy that benefite for he loueth our nation and hath him selfe founded a Synagoge And S Cyprian sayth notably that good workes make a more effectuall intercession then good wordes he speaketh of the same Tabitha as followeth Circumsteterunt Petrum viduae flentes rogantes pallia tunicas omnia illa quae prius sumpserant indumenta monstrantes nec pro defuncta suis vocibus sed ipsius operibus
Gods worde or authorities of scriptures but such as is so pitifully wrested and drawen vnto them as euery man may see the holy Ghost neuer ment any such thinge as they gather of them 3 Holde on vpwarde still and Tertullian will witnesse with thee that in that floure of Christes Church with in lesse then CC. yeares of our maisters death Oblationes fiebant annua die pro defunctis That oblations and sacrifice were yearly made at the xij monthes mindes of most men he meaneth both by the sacrifice of the Church and offeringes of the freindes of the departed as there also Repete apud Deum pro cuius spiritu postules pro qua oblationes annuas reddas Call to thy remembraunce for whose soule thou prayes and in whose behalfe thou makes yearly offeringes He speaketh of a freinde of his that practised thus for his wiues departure And in an other place he well declareth the duety of maried persons one towards an other if God by death separate them in sonder Pro anima eius orat refrigerium interim postulat offert annuis diebus dormitionis eius She prayeth for her husbandes soule and obteineth in the meane space ease and offereth euery yeare at the mind day of his passing hense And he letteth not to affirme that the maried couple that practise not thus do not beleue the resurrection Therefore he concludeth thus Nunquid nihil erimus post mortem secundum aliquem Epicurum non secundum Christum quòd si credimus mortuorum resurrectionem vtique tenebimur cum quibus resurrecturi sumus rationem de altetutro reddituri VVhat say you shall we fall to nothing after our death as the Epicure thinketh and not rise againe as Christ teacheth And if we beleue the resurrection of the deade then doubtlesse we shall be bounde to make accompt one of an other as we shall together rise againe Beware here my maisters once againe I must tell you you are going towardes the deniall of the resurrection so many as condemne the vsage of the Church in praying or offeringe for the deade Tertullian sayth you be Epicures in this point and so you be in all others I say you are past priuy muttering in your heartes that there is no God for you are come to plaine Manducemus bibamus cras enim moriemur Let vs eate and be mery we can not tell how longe we lieue I say you must aunswere for parting the affection of man and wife and the one must be countable at the day of iudgement to an other that they procured not the dueties of the deade by right of Gods holy Church for their soules departed Take heede therefore you are warned 3 Nay ho there M. Allen no higher then Tertullian And when we haue examined the testimonies of Tertullian in order as you haue brought them you shall haue small aduantage out of him yea your friendes shall thinke you had bene better to haue made no mention of him For first I must tell you that these three lines which are all that he hath written sounding that way are found in three bookes which all were written by him when he was an heretike separated from the catholike Church And therefore it may well be that all that he speaketh of prayers and oblations for the deade was onely in the conuenticles of the Montanistes of which sect he was an earnest defender rather then in the catholike Church And this coniecture seemeth the more probable because Cyprian which was afterward a catholike Bishop in the same city where Tertullian sometime had liued maketh no mention of prayers for the dead but onely of sacrifice for the Martyrs which was none other but the sacrifice of thankesgiuing lib. 4. Ep. 5. But admit that the Church of God in that time vsed these superstitious prayers and oblations for the deade let vs consider vpon what ground they were vsed The firsâ— place M. Allen allegeth in this forme Oblationes fiebant annua die pro defunctis But Tertullians wordes in libro de corona militis be these Oblationes pro defunctis pro natalitijs annua die facimus We make oblations for the dead for our birthes on the yearly day By which it is euident that M. Allen did not read these wordâ—s him selfe but receiued them of some other mans collection or sound them in some booke of common places But to the matter Tertullian him selfe shall say for me that the same custome with many other which he there rehearseth hath no ground in the holy Scripture Harum aliarum eiusmodi disciplinarum si leges expostules scripturarum nullam inuenies traditio tibi praetendetur autrix consuetudo confirmatrix fides obseruatrix Of those and such like disciplines if you require the lawes of the Scriptures you shall finde none tradition shall be pretended to you to be the author Custome the confirmer and faith the obseruer It is good to take that which is so franckly giuen and more is Tertullian to be commended that confesseth the ground of his errour not to be taken out of the word of God then they that labour to wreâ—t the Scriptures to find that which Tertullian confesseth is not to be found in them I knowe the Papistes will aunswere that tradition is of as good credit as the Scripture is the word of God vnwritten as well as the Scripture is the word of God written But why then doe they not obserue all other things that Tertullian in the same place affirmeth to be tradition if tradition be the word of God why doe they not giue to them that are newly baptised a temper of milke and hony and from the day of their baptisme forbid dayly washing all the weeke after Why doe they not count it a wicked thinge to fast on the Sunday or to pray and worship God on their knees Why doe they not count it a wicked thinge to fast betwene Easter Whitsontide or to pray on their knees all that time Finally why doe not they crosse them selues in the forehead at euery steppe they set forth at comming in at going out at putting on of garmentes at putting on of shoes at washing at the tables at lighting of candles at beddes at stooles and at all thinges what so euer they doe What aunswere can they here make but that their Church may dispense as well with the word of God vnwritten which they cal tradition as she doth against the word of God conteyned in the holy Scriptures So that alwayes what so euer they prate of antiquitie customs traditions vnwritten verities or the word of God vnwritten the authority of their blasphemous church is aboue them all Now to the second testimony alleged out of Tertullian S. Ieronym shall testifie for vs that this booke as the other that followeth was written against the Church so was also his booke de corona militis when he was out of the Church whereby it may
should pray yet she should not be heard euen of men remayning in this life your second reason as I conceiue it is that so long as men are in â—his world they may repent then sinne is not to death Therfore S. Iohn meaneth that they that dyed without bond of deadly sinne are to be prayed for your antecedent as before is false for the Apostle to the Hebrewes the sixt chapter sheweth that there be some which sinne so horribly in this life that it is vnpossible for them to be renewed by repentaunce So that your exposition being both voyd of authoritie and contrary to the manifest word of God of none that is wise or godly can be receiued Beside this the whole context of S. Iohns wordes doe plainly declare that he speaketh of prayers for the brethern that are liuing and not for them that are dead But I am to blame to spende so many wordes in a matter so manifest If the holy Ghost had euer allowed prayer for the dead he would once at the lest haue vttered the same plainly in holy canonicall Scriptures But Tertullian as wise a man as M. Allen affirmeth as we heard before that prayer for the deade hath no foundation in the Scriptures 2 To this place also S. Augustine disputing in his booke de ciuitate dei that praiers profiteth not all men departed alludeth or rather leaneth vnto it as a sure grouÌ„d against the Origenistes that woulde haue Gods mercy by mans prayers obteined for the wicked soules deceased after this sort Si qui autem vsque ad mortem habebunt cor impoenitens nec ex inimicis conuertuntur in filios numquid iam pro eis id est pro talium defunctorum spiritibus orat ecclesia cur ita nisi quia iam in parte diaboli computantur qui dum essent in corpore non sunt translati in Christum If there be any that till death continue in stubborne impenitency of hearte and of enemies to Gods Church will not be made children doeth the Church make intercession for such that is to say for the soules of them being departed in that state and why prayeth she not for them but because they be nowe reckoned for the deuills lot being deade that woulde not moue to Christes part when they were in their bodies And this is the cause that for such as in desperatioÌ„ destroy them selues by any kind of wilfull or violent death or in the stubborne maintenance of heresie offer them selues to be extirpate as well out of the society of mans life as out of the coÌ„munioÌ„ of the Christian company our holy mother the Church who by her practise is the best construer of Gods worde neuer vseth any meanes for their quiet rest VVheron there is a holy decree of Councell in this sense qui sibi ipsis quolibet modo culpabili inferunt mortem nulla pro illis fiat commemoratio neque cum psalmis sepeliantur All those that by any vnlawfull way procure their owne death let no commemoration be had of them nor be brought home with psalmes The which hath ben both diligently obserued euer amongest Christians and for terrour of the wicked often by holy Canons renewed VVherof there is no other cause but this that such persons being at the ende cut of the common bodie can receiue no vtility of that where vnto they are not nor now can not be ioyned And as in that case where Gods Church hath plaine presumption of any persons euerlasting perishing either by continuance in infidelitie out of her happy family or by heresie and separation of him selfe till the last ende leaping out of her holy lappe where he once was before or being and continuing with some open euidence thereof an vnprofitable membre and a deade branche as I saye in any plaine proofe of these thinges the Church neuer practiseth for his rest because she neither hath hope of getting any grace nor meanes to conuey any benefite vnto such as be not in the limmes of life so if our saide carefull mother doe bestow of her customable kindnesse all her godly meanes vpon those whome she knoweth not otherwise but in finall piety and penitence to haue passed this life and yet in deede before God to whome onely all secrets of mans hearte be perfectly open dyed as abiectes and outcastes in sinne and impenitencie she can not for all that any whit helpe their estate so miserable nor appeace Gods wrath towarde them being now out of the time of deseruing out of the Churchies lappe effectually and finally separated from the chosen people and out of the compaesse of grace and mercie Much lesse any priuate mans prayer can be any thing at all beneficiall to his freinde or other that dyed not in Gods fauour whose payne can neither be finished nor by any of these ordinary meanes one moment released or lessened Yet euery good faithfull person must imitate the diligence of Gods Church herein that ceaseth not both to offâ—â— and pray for all sortes with in her limites that be hense in any likelyhood of repentaunce departed who hadde rather they shoulde abounde to the needelesse then at any time lacke for the reliefe of such that might wante them 2 All this discourse is needelesse to proue that prayers profit not the infidels or the impenitent against them that beleue that the soules of the faithfull the repentant are where Christ is as he prayeth Ioan. 17. Father I will that those whome thou hast gyuen me where I am they also maye be with me that they may see my glory And euen so he sayeth to the theefe no perfect iuste man but a sinner repentant This daye thou shalt be with me in Paradise Luke 23. And S. Paule desireth to be dissolued and to be with Christ Philip. 1. This is the fayth of the Church of Christ and these be the groundes of our fayth voide of all doubtfulnesse obscurity sophistry and variable sentence of deceiuable men builded vpoÌ„ the certaine foundation of the eternall word of God The authoritie of Augustine proueth that the Church prayed not in his time for the spirits of infidells But the Councell Bracharense as afterwarde I shall more plainely shewe doth insinuate that no prayers were made at all for the soules of the departed in their Church at their burialls but onely a remembrance of them in prayers with thankesgeuing and singing of Psalmes For purgatory shoulde seeme had not yet trauelled into spaine But touching this assertion of M. Allen that those which dye out of the fauour of God as infidells and such like are not to be prayed for whose payne can neither be finished nor one moment released or lessened by any of these meanes what saye you then to Gregory the first byshop of Rome which with his vehement prayer as your owne Damascene and many others doe witnesse deliuered the soule of Traianus the heathen Emperour from Hell whereof there riseth a great controuersie among your doltish
them your selues by the worde of God if you can And because you bring in a witty example of the common wealth I will aunswere you with the like Must the Magistrate either iustifie a theefes possession or else bring out the author where he had it Nay the theefe must bring out good proofe howe and by whom he came by such goods or else he is worthy to be serued like such a one So shall you not compell vs to tell you where when or how your heresie came in seeing it is sufficient for vs to shew that it came not from God nor by the Apostles nor through their doctrine But you doe well to conclude your reason in a syllogisme for then by the weakenes therof doth appeare your maior and minor be both false or at the least wise vnable to be proued of you For euery falshod hath not bene preached against at the first entry And how are you able to proue that purgatory and praying for the deade hath not bene preached against therfore your conclusion is as true and as certeyne as your premisses 3 But what needes all this a doe by their owne consent we shall driue this doctrine thirtene C. yeares vpward For so neare was Tertullian the Apostles dayes whome they confesse to haue practised that pointe of oblations for the deade And aske him where he had it for surely he inuented it not him selfe and he appointeth vs to his forefathers he nameth the Apostles for the authors and founders thereof as of many other thinges which he there reckeneth beside that were generally receiued and nowe be of heretikes likewise contemned VVe might yet steppe two C. yeare forward and find amongest the Apostles owne hearers the same doctrine both allowed and practised but that they will make exception of Dionysius and Clements workes such shiftes men must finde that will defend falshood Other I will name that be out of their exceptions VVho I thinke as well for their time knowledge and credit as their excellent vertue both can and will better tell the origine of that thinge the authors whereof were more nigh their time then ours If they woulde beleue S. Augustine as they often professe they will the matter might soone be ended but because I feare they stand so much in the corrupt conceite of their owne singularitie that they will be bold to reiect him I shall both lay him to their charges diuers other of greater antiquity that shal in expresse words affirme this vsage to come from the Apostles owne schoole That thereby they may either acknowledge their errors or else by such graue and vncorrupt iudges be condemned of willfull malitious blindnesse Thus S. Augustine writeth By the prayers of the holy Church the profitable sacrifice and almes bestowed for the soules departed out of all doubt the deceased be releued so that thereby almighty God may deale more mercifully with them thē their sinnes required For this practise deliuered vnto vs by our fathers is obserued vniuersally in Christes Church that for such as be departed in the communion of Christes body and bloud when at the sacrifice they be orderly named praiers shoulde be made and the same sacrifice mentioned to be done for them Here by his words thou vnderstands that the profit rising by the prayers or sacrifice to the departed hath no doubt in it They were through the world vsed not in the Church which they say hath bene for nyne C. yeares corrupted by supersticious ignorāce but in that Church which our aduersaires doe confesse maugre their heades to haue bene holy Catholike and Apostolike And it was not then begon but receiued by the prouision of Gods holy spirite of the Apostles whome he calleth the fathers of our faith 3 It is not denied but Tertuillan maketh mention of oblations for the dead but what kind of oblations it is not yet agreed vppon but such they were as were offered for mens birthes for they be ioyned togither Oblationes pro defunctis pro natalitijs annua die facimus we make oblations yearely for the day of mens death and the day of mens birth Now it is not like they offered prayers but thākes giuing for mens birth and euen so for their death For those places out of the other bookes where he speaketh of prayers for mens spirites I will consider afterward But in this booke de corona militis if oblations were prayers which he saith came from the Apostles he vtterly denyeth that they came from the Scriptures Therefore by Tertullians iudgement you doe abuse the Scriptures which woulde wrest them to proue out of them that which he sayth can not be proued by them But think you prayers for the dead came from the Apostles because he sayth so If you aunswere yea then must you likewise thinke that it is a wicked thing to fast on Sonday or to pray on your knees for in the same place he sayth that these opinions came also from the Apostles If you aunswere he sayth vntruely of these so doe we answere of the other Now come backe of your 13. hundreth yeares to seeke your apostolike tradition where you can finde it All is not Gospell that Tertullian hath sayd As for the works of Clemens and Dionysius you know full well they be not currant and therefore I maruell at your modestie that you will not now oppresse vs with them But it is because you haue store enough beside Howbeit if the most auncient fayle you it is not for the later sorte to helpe you If Tertullian had no ground of his saying when he affirmed that oblations for the deade came from the Apostles what ground can Augustine haue which was 200. yeares farther from the Apostles time then he But where you charge vs to confesse that the Church in Augustines time was holy Catholike and Apostolike you must witte if you will that although we may so confesse in respect of the substance of true doctrine which then was taught yet we doe not therby iustifie euery error superstition of that age But as Augustine sayth in his retractations lib. 2. cap. 18. he doth not meane that the Church is pure and perfect in this life with out all spot of blemish for euen the whole Church by reason of certeine ignorance and infirmities of her members hath neede to say euery day Forgiue vs our debtes 4 Athanasius me thinke the aduersary part should quake when I name him who was in his dayes terrible to the wicked odible to heretikes to all vertuous mē an especiall stay in the troblesome times of the Church whose grace was so great that he abbrigeth our whole faith into a briefe psalme called the Creede of Athanasius which is beleued of all Christian men no lesse then the holy Scriptures of the new Testament VVho as he right well knewe howe to defend him selfe against the wicked Arrians by the doctrine of the Catholike Church so he hath left vs in writing howe to
and knowe of their owne conscience that they be directly against them yet dare not openly charge them with falshood as they doe vs their scholars but rather as I sayd seeke some sentence out of them to helpe their owne cause then with their plaine condemnation of falshood to refuse their authoritie S. Augustine busyed much with the Pelagians and charged by them in disputation that he defended the Manicheis doctrine concerning originall sinne for his defense and warraunt proueth vnto them that S. Ambrose taught the same doctrine that he did and yet they durst not be so bolde to call him a Manichie Dic huic Ambrosio si audes quae mihi tam petulanter obiectas Thou heretike sayeth he say the same by S. Ambrose if thou dare for shame which thou so sausely and wantonly obiectes to me Looke I pray you Ambrose was but newe deade when his onely name did feare the heretike wheÌ„ other aliue of as good learning was contemned of him and by wordes of reproche charged with the Manicheis secte who was a wicked man of horrible sectes not long before those dayes Pelagius out of doubte thought no better of Ambrose and Cyprian deade then he did of Augustine and Innocentius a liue because their doctrine was all one but yet the men departed were of more authority in Gods Church then the liuing of whose continuance to the ende men were vncertaine before the proofe thereof and their wordes being deade might easely be wrasted to some shew of their purpose when the authority of the liuing coulde not admit any such false dealinge them selues bearing witnesse of the meaning of their own words VVell then our doctors of Gods Church being all of holy estimation and blessed memory doe so dase the eyes euen of their owne aduersaries that being of the very same doctrine that we who by Gods grace be membres of the Catholike Church be of yet they are past the malice of those which like not their doing and doctrine For the heretikes well knowing them to be the authors or at the least especiall mainteiners of this our assertion of the valew of prayers and the holy sacrifice for the departed yet they dare not but clokedly reprehende them when they flowe against the poore Catholikes nowe aliue with wordes of infinite blasphemie and sclaunderous reproche Therefore I nowe will call vppon them with S. Augustines wordes Come on all the packe of you who so euer is the prowdest Protestant vpon the earth call if he dare S. Denyse S. Clement Athanas. Chrysostom Ambrose Gregory Bede we are not ashamed of their names as you be of your Maisters Call these Papistes for praying for their freindes call them Idolaters call them superstitious call them enimies of Christes passion say they be iniurious to his death by prouiding a newe sacrifice for sinne tell them they inuented Anniuersaries monthes mindes and yearly offeringes for their owne gayne call them masse mungers call them blinde gydes No you dare not for your eares you dare not disprayse our heauenly gydes you dare not once name your owne 9 M. Allen staâ—â—our wisedome there is no man will graunt you that the doctors of Gods Church Augustine Ambrose Chrysostom Basill c. are al togither yours because they haue allowed some one or two thinges that you doe and haue condemned the whole substance and principall groundes of your religion Nay rather count vpon the Popes to be the pillers of your Church doctors of your learning and fathers of your faith that haue bene within these seuen or eight hundreth yeares and see whether we might not with more honesty bragge of Iouinian and Vigilantius then you in your conscience can glory in a whole huÌ„dreth of them almost And whereas you bable of Augustine and the Pelagians if you were posed to answere vppon your conscience doe you defend Gods eternall predestination with Augustine rather then free will with Pelagius the only grace of God to be the whole cause of mans saluation as Augustine doth or the merites of workes as the Pelagians doe And whereas you allege that saying of Augustine dic huic Ambrosio c. to proue that Ambrose may not be gaine sayde what so euer he writ you shall heare what Augustine him selfe sayth of the same Ambrose when he was pressed with his authority by the Pelagians as though he defended freewill in his booke de gratia Christi contra Pelagium cap. 43. Beatus inquit Ambrosius Episcopus in cuius praecipuè libris Romana elucet fides qui scriptorum inter Latinos flos quidem enituit cuius fidem purissimum in Scripturis sensum ne inimicus quidem ausus est reprehendere Ecce qualibus quantis praedicat laudibus quamlibet sanctum doctum nequaquam tamen authoritati Scripturae canonicae comparandum Blessed Ambrose sayth the Pelagian that Bishop in whose bookes specially the Romane faith doth shine which glistered as a certeyne flower among the Latine writers whose fayth and most pure sense in the Scriptures no not his enemy durst reprehend c. Behold sayth Augustine with what howe great prayses he extolleth him which though he be neuer so holy and well learned yet is he not to be compared with the authoritie of the canonicall Scriptures Loe here the authoritie of Ambrose or any man And by the way note here the hereticall bragge of the Romane faith Finally where you stand forth like a peeuish quarrell picker to dare vs with S. Augustines wordes we may well say vnto you as to such a busy body good fellow thou makest more a doe then thou needest here is no man disposed to striue with Clemens Dionysius Athanasius Chrysostome nor Augustine if they haue spoken any thing that helpeth the matter bring it forth where due triall may be had in the meane time bragge of them as much as thou wilt thou shalt neuer be able to proue that of 20. errors which thou defendest they did hold one If they haue spoken otherwise then truth in any matter they must be told of it as well as other men But thou must not thinke that for one error common with them thou must hold an 100. coÌ„trary to them Thou doest them wrong to make them thy partakers as thou shalt well know when the triall commeth therefore quiet thy selfe and talke of thyne owne mates as for those men thou hast litle to doe with them nor they with thee but for sclaundering of them to be altogither on thy side 10 Such force hath the trueth and such feare there is in falshood and yet these doctors must needes be in a thousand times worse case then we be if the doctrine of purgatory and prayers be not true VVe may be saued or at least reasonably excused by following they in leading vs in falshood can haue no excuse of their impietie But howe glad may all we Catholikes be in our heartes that haue the full consent of all them in the proofe of our beleue out of
fitly stande with the happy case of all those that dye in the fauour of God and assurance of their saluation though they abide sharpe but sweete paine of fatherly discipline for their better qualifying to the ioyes prepared for them and all other the elect So that nowe the mouing of these doubtes hath so litle aduantaged our aduersaries that it hath somewhat geuen occasion of further declaration of our matter then otherwise perchaunce we shoulde haue had 6 The last obiection that you list to trouble your head with all is that voyce which was heard from heauen Apoc. 14. of the blessed state of them that dye in the Lord in the meaning of which you wrest and wrigle like a snake that is smitten on the head but you can not auoyd the strife First you vnderstand it onely of Martyres that dye in the Lord and call Augustine to witnesse thereof As I will not deny but Martyrs are specially comforted by that voyce so I wil affirme that it is to the common comfort and rewarde of all the faythfull in Christ who as they liue in Christ so they dye in christ And witnesse hereof I will not take of flesh and blood but of the holy Ghost Rom 14. None of vs liueth vnto him selfe neither doth any dye vnto him selfe for whether we liue we liue vnto the Lorde and whether we dye we dye vnto the Lorde And the Apostle 1. Cor. 15. nameth the faithfull that are a sleepe in Christ and 1. Thes. 4. them that are deade in christ Wherefore in despite of the deuill and the Pope this blessing apperteyneth to all them that dye in the Lord Iesus Christ as true members of his body and not to them onely that shedde their bloud for christ True it is that all they that would liue godly in Christ Iesus suffer persecution but not all to the death else who are those innumerable Saincts that no man can number of all nations and tongues which S. Iohn sawe Apoc. 7. who are likewise in happy and blessed rest without all maner lacke or hurt hunger thirst or heate but when you are weary of that interpretation you wring out an other that they in purgatory also be happy because they be sure of saluation at last and the rest from labours is either the rest from sinne or else no more but ioy of conscience witnesse of this exposition is the canon of the Masse The witnesse the matter and he that vseth it are all of like credit But if I might pose your conscience M. Allen can you call that a happy rest which is ioyned with such torment misery as you beare men in hand is in purgatory Haue you forgotten that you sayd yere while of Tabitha and Lazarus that it was a benefite for them to be deliuered out of purgatory into this life and is it now a blessing to be dispatched out of this life into purgatory And as for that which you allege out of the canon of your masse declareth that your masse was patched togither of many peeces of diuers colours For you pray for the rest of them whome you confesse to be at rest in Christ you wish easement for them whom you affirme to sleepe in peace As though in Christ were not perfect rest as though in peace there were torment and this exposition you your selfe are weary of also and turne agayne to your former and then backe againe to the latter An vnconstaâ—t man is vncerteyne in all his wayes yet all were litle worth if this place helped not to proue purgatory also For the payne of purgatory is a sweete payne a happy rest a fatherly discipline And yet as Augustine sayth it is but for small faultes or as you say for great faultes that by penance are made small And is God such a mercifull father to punish small faultes so extremely in his children whom he pardoneth of all their great and heynous sinnes O blasphemous helhoundes An aunsvvere to their negatiue argument vvith the Conclusion of the booke CAP. XVII 1 BVt yet one common engine they haue as well for the impugnation of the trueth in this point as for the sore shaking of the weake walles of the simples faith allmost in all their fight that they kepe against the Catholikes VVhich though it be not stronge yet it is a marueillous fit reasoning for so fonde a faith For if thou caste an earnest eye vpon their whole doctrine thou shalt finde that it principally and in a maner wholy consistithe in taking awaye or wasting an other faith that it founde before so that the preachers thereof must euer be destroyers pluckers downe and rooters vp of the trueth grounded before VVill you see then what a Protestants faith and doctrine is deny onely and make a negation of some one article of our belefe and that is a forme of his faith which is lightely negatiue There is no free will there is no workes needefull to saluation there is no Church knowen there is no chiefe gouernour therof there be not seuen sacraments they doe not conferre gratiam geue grace Baptisme is not necessary to saluation Christ is not present on the aultar there is no sacrifice there is no priesthood there is no aultar there is no profit in prayers to sainctes or for the deade there is no purgatory Christ went not downe to hell there is no limbus finally if you liste goe forwarde in your negatiue faith there is no hell there is no heauen there is no god Doe you not see here a trimme faith and a substantiall looke in Caluins Institutions and you shall finde the whole frame of this wasting faith There is nothing in that blasphemous booke nor in their Apologies but a gathered bodie of this no faith For so it must needes be that teacheth no trueth but plucketh vp that trueth which before was planted Is it not a prety doctrine that Caluine makes of the sacraments when he telleth not the force of any of them all but onely standeth like a fearce monstruous swhine rooting vp our fathers faith therein CAP. XVII 1 IT vexeth you at the very hart that we require the authority of the holy Scriptures to confirme your doctrine hauing a playne commaundement out of the word of God that if any man teach otherwise then the word of God alloweth he is to be accursed And therfore you runne to a childish kinde of Sophistry to say that our argument is negatiue A perlous point that almost all the Papistes thinke them selues more then Chrisippus or Aristoteles when they tell vs that our argument is ab auctoritate negatiuè Alacke poore logicke All knowledge that christian men haue of heauenly thinges is grounded vpon the authority of Gods word therefore as it is no good logicke to conclude negatiuely of one place or booke of Scripture this is not conteined in it therefore it is not true so of the whole doctrine of God wherein all truth necessary to saluation is