Father for thē nor for any one thing that they hold against vs The 34. Demaund Authoritie VVHETHER the Church of Christ did not euermore take her selfe to be of Authoritie irrefragable and so beare her selfe as necessarie worthie to be beleeued vpon her onelyword and therfore no man to controll her a Aug. ep 105. Sentence or Iudgement no man to misdoubt her b Aug ep 118 c. 3. ep 105. Practise And whether S. Augustine haue not written a booke therupon which he calleth De vtilitate credendi Of the vtilitie of beleeuing the Church in all thinges shewing how profitable how necessary how sure a way that is for the finding out of true Religion And whether the Maniches then as the Protestantes now founde not fault with that way And whether the true Christians notwithstanding did not for all that hold thē against those all other Heretickes vpon the Churches Authoritie Chris con gent. de S. Ba◠coll 882. 884. Et con Iud. ar 2. col 928. Eus Hist l. 1. c. 3. Devt or c. 14. yea and alleage it also vnto the Iewes and Painimes to proue that Christ is God and that the holy Scriptures with the Miracles and all other things in them contained be true because I say the Church or company of the Christians so saith and so beleeueth And whether Saint Augustine and that by true reason doth not infer therupon that seeing we beleeue Christ and the Scriptures because of the church we must therfore beleeue the Church in all other thinges also whatsoeuer it saieth against the Heretickes And whether this Authoritie do not therefore argue that the Church can neuer erre And whether neuer erring doe not argue that it can neuer perish And therfore again whether it do not now also well worthely claime the same authoritie Yea whether the Protestants themselues haue not receaued many thinges as Christ himselfe and the Scriptures themselues c. vpon our churches credite the church I say that now is Aske them then howe they can possiblye bee the church who willingly doe renounce the claime of such Authoritie and doe by their doings confesse it to be in the companie of their aduersaries Finally bydde the deceaued consider this well that they haue no forte or nūber of men amōgst them whom they may truste in all thinges with whom and in whose steppes they may venture to walke the way of Faith and Religion towardes saluation None of all the Sectes in our countrey nor in all the world so happie none so secure and therfore no Church amongest them because I say they openly renounce the claime of Authoritie confessing therby that it is not of them that the Creed saith I beleue the Church in so much that they haue suffered of late an vnlearned Christian as he is called to set out in Print a vaine libell againste the Aucthoritie of the Church of God comparing and opposing vnto it the Authority of the word of God as though the word of God and the Church of God were one against the other it being yet so plainely written that as the Father saied of his Sonne Mat. 17. Mat. 18. Ipsum audite Heare him So the Sonne said of his church Si Ecclesiam non audierit sit tibi ficut Ethnicus Publicanus If he will not heare the Church do thou vse him as the Iewes did as an Heathen and a Publican And yet this felow trusteth so much in his owne folie Prou. 17 that he is bold to prouoke all catholiks to answere his childishnes or els they must be accounted saith he no lesse then very Murderers It were good for him poore man that he had in him no more pride then learning My best counsaile to him for his saluation is that he reade humblye these Demaundes and looke whether any of his greate Masters will answere them And if after this his stomacke serue him still let him set out his Libel more orderly with his name with approbation of their Rabbins and with priuiledge that we labour not in vaine with the grace of God he shall quickly see it answered as vnworthy as it is The 35. Demand Vnity THEN whether vnity proced not of the sayd Authority And our Church therefore one for euer and not possibly by any questiō or controuersy to be desperatly deuided within it selfe They on the other side for lacke thereof running euery day into more and more diuision amongst thēselues multiplying Sectes as all men do see without hold or measure not being able to aleage herein any excuse for thēselues which the Arians Donatistes other olde Hereticks might not as well aleage for excuse of their diuisions yea euen their owne Doctrine being the very cause therof and they therfore guiltie of all these sectes that doctrine I say wherin they teach that the Scriptures are so easye and that therefore euerie one may folow his owne sese yea and vant also that it is the sence of the Spirite himselfe And whether the Churches inseparable vnitie be not so sure an argument of Truth that it is a moste iuste Motiue by Christes owne saying for the world to beleeue in Christ that no man meruaile seeing the infinite Sects that be now in Englād that there be also so many incredulous that beleeue not in Christ The 36. Demaund Kepers of Scriptures VVHether it were not our Church that notified to the worlde the Canon of the holye Bookes of the new Testament Whether it were not our Church that hath had the custodie construing both of the foresaid and of the other Bookes of the holy Bible euer since the Apostles time Or else whether before this time the Expositors thereof were Protestants And whether the Protestants had not the saide Books of vs And whether they can charge our Church all this longe while of her possesion with adding or minishinge any iote thereof Or whether they can not bee charged this short while of their vsurpation with robbing vs of many wholle Bookes thereof Bookes I say canonized in aproued Concels and of many a particulare portion more or whether euer any coulde be so charged but only Heritikes Finally whether our Church therefore be not the ōly true possessor or keper of this treasure as to whom only the Apostels cōmited it and therefore againe ours the only true Church The 37. Demaund Storehouse of all Truthe VVHETHER not onely all Canonicall Scripture as I haue saide but also all other truthes agreed vpon at any time by the Church of God and as it were laide vp for euer are not at this tym to be foūd in our church as that which was agreed vpon against the Arians that which was concluded against the Donatistes briefly that which was defined aganst all other Heretikes Aske them whether it haue not bene hither vnto and whether it be not still safelye keapt in our Church And how them selues came by the saide Truthes whether otherwise then at our
Seeing you acknowledge in your Confession of faith that the Sacraments ought only to be ministred by such as are called therunto by ordinary vocation I demand if your vocation vnto the ministrie be like vnto the calling of all others who haue gone before you in the Church of Christ since the time of the Apostles whom both yee and wee repute and hould to haue been Iawfull pastors and teachers of his flock as S. Cyprian S. Augustin S. Ambrose and diuers others wishing you to shewin al points the conformitie of your vocation with that of theirs 5. who their Doctors Seing after the discours of the election of your Ministers Elders and Deacons yee acknowledge that the Scriptures make mention of a fourth kind of Ministers lest vnto the Church of Christ which also are very necessarie profitable Ephes 4. 1. Cor. 12. and are called by the name of teachers and doctors whose office it is to teach and instruct the faithfull in sound doctrine prouiding with all diligence that the puritie of the gospel be not corrupted ether throgh ignorance or false opinion I pray you to shew at what time any Doctors of such calling haue bene in your Church before Iohn Caluin because the places of Scripture noted by you teach and declare that God hath appointed such meanes in his church that it should neuer be left desolate nor yet his Doctrine to decay for wāt of Doctors other teachers 6. Their admission of Tinkers c. And seeing yee confes in the same place that men cannot profit so well in the knowledge aforesayd vnles they be first instructed in the learned tongues humane sciences for now God doth not commonly worke by miracles and that therefore it is necessary that seed be sowen for the tyme to come to the end that the Church be not left barren wast vnto posterity and also that for this effect schooles be erected wherin youth may be trayned vp in the knowledge and feare of God I demand why yee admitted at the first entry of your doctrine into Scotland and yet doe Taylors Skinars and other Artificers who were neuer instructed but in their owne craft and occupation which they left and abiured and out of their owne heades without any further calling vnto the ministery began to teach the people hauing for all their learning and forme of preaching some English books only which yet themselues very hardly vnderstood 7. If the only written word be Iudge Seeing that among other heads of your alleadged fayth this is one principall that nothing is to be beleeued Cal. l. 4. Inst c. 8. sect 8. but what is found in the written word I demaund what testimony yee haue in the same for assurance of your faith in this point And whether the fayth of the Apostles was groūded on the written word or not 8. S. Thomas Ghospell Where is it written that there is only foure Ghospels and that the Ghospell of S. Matthew with the other three ought to be recea ued and not the Ghospell of S. Thomas Or what authority hath moued you to receaue som books or chapters for canonical scriptur and to refuse or reiect others Or if any man deny any booke of the new Testament as Martin Luther doth the epistle of S. Iames what argumentes haue yee from the Scripture to condemne him Praef. in nou Test 9. VVhy Iewes credited Seeing yee giue so great authority to the Synagogue of the Iewes that according to their canon yee admit reiect sundry bookes of holy Scripture why giue yee not the like authority to the Christian church which hath gone before you in receauing such bookes as are approued by her for canonicall Scripture And if the only cause which moues you to reiect such bookes be because they were not approued by the Synagogue of the Iewes why by the same reason reiect yee not Christ himselfe seeing that Synagogue would not admit him for their Messias 10. Churches authoritie If it be the office of the church to discerne betwixt canonicall Scripture and not canoniall as a De capt Bab Luther b In prologo cont Pet. à Soto Brentius and other of your owne masters doe confes why should not the same church be heard of you in giuing her interpretation vpon any doubtfull place therof called in question Or why call yee more in dout the interpretation of the Scripture giuen by the Church then the very bookes themselues Or why prefer yee the priuat opiniō of Iohn Caluin and your selues before the vniuersall and vniforme consent of all Christian people before you 11. Citing only the written word Why esteeme yee Calu. l. 4 Inst c. 8. num 13. that yee haue an infallible marke of the true religion because yee cite only the written word seeing this hath beene common to all heretiques from the beginning Or what haue you more to say for your felues then they had for themselues in this point 12. If Scripture be easy If the Scripture be so easy as yee teach it to be c Luth de ser arbit what hath moued your owne writers to make so many cōmentaryes therupon Or what is the cause that ther is so great controuersy in religiō as we see at this day Yea euē vpon the expresse wordes of the last Testament of our Lord which according to the nature of a Testament should be most cleere 13. Conference of places If the priuate iudgment of euery one conferring Scripture with Scripture be a certaine and infallible rule of right interpretatiō as yee say how is it that so many grosse contradictions are foūd in your writinges gayn-saying not only one another but your selues also as is euident in your owne bookes 14. No meanes to be resolued Seeing that the Lutherans the Zuinglians and the Caluinists besides an infinite number of other sectes doe euery one alleage the written word for cōfirmation of their contrarie opinions how shall it be knowen to any man that would resolue himselfe in matters of religion which of them haue the true word sith it is the true vnderstanding that maketh the word and not the outward sounding of the voice as Christ himselfe saith who obiected to the Saduces Mat. 12. that they mistooke the Scriptures because they vnderstood not the meaning of them 15. Traditions Why deny yee any credit to be giuen to Traditions contrary to a Cal. l. 4. iust c. 10. the expres commandment of the Apostle writing to the Thessalonians in this maner b 2. Thes 2. Stand and keepe the Traditions which yee haue receiued whither by word or by our epistle And also contrary to the doctrne of all the auncient doctors of the church Or how haue yee the Scripture it selfe but by Tradition And seeing yee will giue no place vnto Traditions what assurance haue yee that since the Natiuitie of Christ there is only 1623. yeares Or whither it be lawfull for Christian men to call this point in
of themselues of their folowers The 51. Demaund Apostasie LAST of all to be short to cut off many other questions of like weight that I could demaund whether as in euery one of these Demaundes it is euident that they be Heretickes and Seducers so in many of them and much more in all of them it bee not likewise euidēt that they be litle better thē plaine Apostataes as First in changing the Priesthoode Heb. 7. c. 12. wherupon the change of al the Lawe ensueth as we see they also thereupon haue chānged wel neare all which no olde Heretikes euer durst to do except it were the Manichees Orat. de 5. Haer. c. 7.10.6 whom S. Augustine for that cause did note to be somthing els then Heretiks in saying that there were fiue sorts of people in the world Iewes Paganes Manichees Heretikes and Catholickes Secondly in reuiuing not one or two but so many olde Heresies besides as I am bould to say at leaste a thousand more of their owne inuention Thirdly for taking from Christian men so many arguments of Christs God head and Diuinitie as the inuisible Continuance and Authoritie of his Church the Honour of Crosses the vertue of Crosses the Honor of Relikes the vertue of Relikes Miracles Exorcismes Vnitie Sacrifice c. Fourthly for leauing nothing vndenied not Fathers not Councels not Traditions not Scriptures nor the only witnesse of all Canonical Scripture the Churches authoritie departing from the Faith of al ages since Christs time agreeing with no Christian time nor none with them Fifthly in place of al Religion and goodnes which they haue remoued deuising a new gospel of their foresaid onely vaine Faith which teacheth all Sinnes and all Heresyes to presume of saluation Besides much more that I need not to repeate And whether therefore people now a daies be not to to carelesse and negligēt of their soules that whereas they shoulde not vnder paine of euerlasting damnation yeald to any one Heresie haue so fowly yelded to so fowle Apostasie How beit as S. Peter saide to the Iewes Act. 3. Et nunc fratres scio quia per ignorantiam fecistis sicut principes vestri so I doubte not but that in our Countrey likewise many of all sortes may be somewhat excused by ignorance and therefore the more hope there is for such as wil repent But otherwise if any for all this list wilfully to folow on most fowly and most miserably deceauing them selues by cause afore God they can not possibly haue any excuse of their so doing no more then if they should consent to folow the proceedinges or to frequent the churches of the Arrians or of any other olde Heretikes yea or of the Turkes them selues if perhappes they liued vnder the raigne of such And therefore I say if any liste to contemne stil all holsome counsell and desperatelye to followe on not to returne to the Truth so manifoldly and so plainely opened some also to perfecute it moste malicioussy their blood at leaste wise Ezecb. 3 shal not bee required at our handes hereafter when they shall repente to late CERTAINE OTHER DEMANDS ANNEXED TO THE FORMER VERY FIT Also to be proposed to our En-English Protestants but principally vnto our Puritans EXTRACTED Out of a learned booke made by the Reu. Fa. Iohn Hay Priest of the Society of Iesus proposed vnto the Ministers of Scotland With licence Anno 1623. Stand yee vpon the wayes and see and aske of the old pathes which is the good way and walke yee in it and you shall find refreshing for your soules Ieremy 6.16 There must be heresyes that they who are approued may be knowne among you Cor. And I desire you brethrē to mark them that make dissentions and scandals contrary to the doctrine which you haue learned and auoyd them for such do not serue Christ our Lord but their owne belly and by sweet speaches and benedictions seduce the harts of innocents Rom. 16.17 I know that after my departure there will rauening wolues enter in among you not sparing the flocke and out of your owne selues shall arise men speaking peruerse thinges to draw away disciples after themselues Acts 20.29 THE PREFACE GENTLE Reader by the little experience that I haue in matter of disputation against Protestants I find the Prouerb to be verifyed which sayth That Aristotles Asse is able to deny more then Aristotle himself is able to proue For the most ignorant companion that euer handled a cudgell in schoole makes a shew to be some tale and iollie fellow all the while the skilfull Fencer suffers and wills his young schollar to lay at his Master he in the meane tyme lying only at his locke and defending himselfe and not offending his vnskillfull schollar But when this Maister begins to let flye at this ignorant fellow and to teach him the Art as well to defend himselfe as to offend others alas how doe the standers by laugh at this poore apprentice To see him who seemed some-body a little before to be now no-body and to be knockt and rapt how and where his Master listes The very like is to be sayd of the combate or Controuersy in Religion where let Protestantes alone still to stricke obiect and lay loade at Catholikes one would thinke I wosse that there were some matter in them For in opposing the Reall presence Purgatory Images Prayers to Saints Rayling at the Pope and the like you would thinke them to be some iollie fellowes but alas turne the offenciue weapon towardes him lay at him a little and do but teach this bould offender of others to defend himself all the beholders burst out in laughter and the poore schollar proues so vnskillfull that the blowes he should receaue vpon his buckler he beareth them off with his head and shoulders and is knockt and rapt euery where where the Fencer listes For euen so Protestantes seeme to shew some small skill in offending vs and our Religion but being put to defend their owne alas what poore Fencers doe they proue Let the Reader be but an indifferent behoulder of this ensuing combate and I assure him he cannot looke on but he shall laugh for his labour The 1. Demaund Their first Preachers VVHETHER the gospel of Christ was at any time preached in Scotland before Paul Methuen sir Iohn Knox yea or no 2. VVhence their Doctrine Seing no man ought to preach any doctrine but that which he hath learned in the Church of God because as witneseth S. Paul saith cometh by hearing Rom. 10 I demand from what Doctors or Pastors Iohn Caluin sir Iohn Knox and their like first learned their new doctrine now preached in the realme of Scotland 3. VVhence their vocation And sith it is written that no man may preach vnles he be sent Rom. 10 I demād by what power Syr Iohn Knox with other Apostataes Priests Monkes and Friars tooke vpon them this vocation 4. If Conforme to predecessors