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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A45122	An answer to Dr. Stillingfleet's book of The unreasonableness of separation so far as it concerns The peaceable designe : with some animadversions upon the debate between him and Mr. Baxter concerning the national church and the head of it.	Humfrey, John, 1621-1719.; Humfrey, John, 1621-1719. Peaceable design.; Baxter, Richard, 1615-1691. Of national churches.; Stillingfleet, Edward, 1635-1699. Unreasonableness of separation.	1682 (1682)	Wing H3667; ESTC R28713	17,588	40

Neither Church or any Members of Either shall Unchurch one another and That no Man should depart from the One Church to the Other but upon a sufficient peaceable Reason under the pain of Ecclesiastical Censure They should not permit any person unlearned till come to very grave Years which are past Heat and Ostentation to Exercise in these Meetings They should decree the Doors of such Meetings to be kept open that the Magistrate may be secure against Sedition They should determine many things of such a Nature but especially that when a Man hath his choice to be of what Congregation he will in regard to Fixed Communion as he finds it most conducive to his Souls Edification yet should he be allowed and enjoyned to come Occasionally also to the Parish Meetings so far as he can in point of Conscience for the testifying his Union with the Body as the Church is National in this Kingdom And I would have persons likewise who come for their Stated Worship to the Parish Church to go sometimes to the Meetings also without scruple by the way of Occasional Communion I will here deliver my own Soul I know that the Laws of the Magistrate that are Good do Bind the Conscience but there are two Cases that Loose a Man from Obedience One is When that which is Commanded is against his Conscience and the Other is When that which is Commanded is Superseded by a Duty of greater concernment I cannot say for my part that to go to Church and hear Common-Prayer is against my Conscience though a thorough Conformity in all things on the Ministers part is like still to be so seeing the Doctor himself does shrink from a Defence of the Lawfulness of That but this I can say that when it is my duty to go to Church and my duty also to go Preach supposing I am called to one of these Meetings the leaving undone that Duty which is the Less for the doing the Other that can't be done otherwise is no Sin or Evil as I am perswaded in my Judgment And it is upon the Plea of the Greater Duty that the Peaceable Design does stand I know well how my Brethren state Their Case They will have going to Their Meetings to be for their Fixed Communion and allow Occasional Communion with the Parish Church to defend themselves from Schisme but I for my part must confess that I see not and cannot see my Defence to be so Safe unless I take the Parish Assembly where I have convenience for my Fixed Communion and my Preaching in the Meetings and the Peoples going to them to be Occasional only for our Greater or Farther Edification The Doctor therefore should indeed have taken particular Notice of this and Providing only against such Preaching to be at that time when Publick Authority requires the General Attendance otherwhere he should by giving an Approbation to such a State of Our Cause have consulted his Own both with more Judgment and with more Moderation then for ought I see he hath done or was able to do Indeed if the Scene were altered I need not be so wary If these Separate Assemblies were made Legal the Schisme presently in reference to the National Church were at an End Schisme is a Separation from that Church whereof we ought or are bound to be Members If the Supreme Authority then loose our Obligation to the Parish Meeting so that we are bound no longer the Iniquity upon that account is not to be Found and the Schisme gone It is one Act of Parliament would give a full Answer to all Mens Arguments In the mean time the Non-conformists I know have other Pleas besides One for what they do They think themselves bound in Conscience to Meet and Preach and account it Serving God and Doing their Duty The Doctor and others call it Sin and Wickedness When I Hear such Sayings therefore and Read such Books I may still bear Reverence to the Persons but I do not in my Heart care one Penny for what they say for there is a Conscience within quite above such Words They may cry This is Schism There never was such Horrible Schism as this Practise heard of before in the Christian World sayes one very serious Author whom I name not but I am not moved for all that I cannot think a Nonconformist Meeting such a Horrible Creature considering how our case in England now stands as these Church-Men generally would make it The great Bear I must count still hath been lead so long about the Streets that the very Children are no longer afraid of it Not but I am sensible of the dangerous consequence into which our Divisions may bring us but who can help it Who is the Cause of them Who is in Fault is the Question Who is it can Remedy these Terms imposed on us as necessary to Communion The Nonconformist hath no Conscience of Sin upon him in the thing and if he cannot have Peace with his Brethren of the Church upon any terms but Full Conforming it is God must be the Judg and the Bishop and Presbyterian the Doctor and Mr. Baxter shall know which of them it is that are to Blame at the Great Day And wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses The Doctor had no Need to lay out his Parts upon such a Design as that he hath under his hands Nor has he Reason I must inculcate to Despise or Scorn no nor to Slight or Neglect any body though the Meanest person There is a late Reverend Conformist for so I take him to be who in a certain Book Entituled Liberty of Conscience in its order to Universal Peace hath deserved better of us I suppose sayes he there is a Society or Societies of Christians that hold Christ the Head and the great points of Union but refuse to Ioyn in such Opinion or Practise as they conceive not Allowable by the Word of God nor can they that require their Compliance pretend on their part that the things are Absolute Necessary to make a Member of the Body of Christ In this case I say he is only the Schismatick that hath not a Love that hath no Sympathy with the Body and therefore if neither hath they must be both Schismaticks I should not fill so much room with a Quotation but that I am taken with the Genius of the Writer He is a man quite Unknown to me but he hath a fine Spirit and his Book savours of it That is so Generous so Candid so Benign towards the Dissenters as the temper is quite contrary in the Authors of the Friendly Debate the Ecclesiastical Polity and the Unreasonableness of Separation I am concern'd I must needs say that I put these three Names together Not that the Authors of either of the first Books are men of less bright Parts or that the Books have less Excellency of their kind in them than the last but because of the reason why I do it For I must confess it is a matter of real Offence to me that a man who is so Learned a man so Honoured a man throughout the Nation should prove a Proud man a Disdainful Contemptuous person Which Temper if it be Indulged is so un-endurable by God and Man that it will hurl any one into the dust And I cannot do any better Service in the Earth to this otherwise very Worthy and Excellent Doctor than to contribute the best I can to my utmost for bringing him to some Ingenuous Sense and Amendment of it And so I leave him to the World to judg who is most fit to be Pityed the Doctor himself or Mr. Baxter Thou shalt not Hate thy Brother in thy Heart but thou shalt in any wife Rebuke him and not suffer Sin upon him THE END ERRATA PAge 8. Line 11. in some of the Copies the word Last is put for First p. 26. l. 3. for shall read still p. 27. l. 18. for own read once

AN ANSWER TO Dr. Stillingfleet's Book OF THE Unreasonableness OF SEPARATION So far as it Concerns the Peaceable Designe With Some Animadversions upon the Debate between Him and Mr. Baxter concerning the National-Church and the Head of it Against whom hast thou Exalted thy Voice and Lifted up thine Eyes on High LONDON Printed for Thomas Parkhurst at the Three Bibles in Cheap side near Mercers-Chappel AN ANSWER TO Dr. Stillingfleet c. IN Dr. Stillingfleet's Book there is one thing I meet with that I perhaps can better tell how than another to Answer It is in his Preface where he is going about to make the Nonconformists a kind of Parties with the Papists as if they were joyning with them for the bringing in of Popery and for the proof of this he produces one Evidence I will set down his own words and Answer the Allegation In Ann. Dom. 1675. there was a Book printed Entituled The Peaceable designe or an Account of the Nonconformists Meetings by some Ministers of London In it an Objection is thus put But what shall we say then to the Papists His Answer is The Papist in our Account is but one sort of Recusants the Conscientious Peaceable among them must be held in the same Predicament with those among ourselves that likewise refuse to come to Common-Prayer What is this but Joyning for a Toleration of Popery If this be not plain enough these words follow But as for the Common-Papist who lives Innocently in his way he is to Us as other Separatists and so he comes under the like Toleration This notable Book with some few Additions Alterations hath been since Printed with great sincerity called An Answer to my Sermon And the Times being Changed since the former passage is thus Altered The Papists is one whose Worship to Us is Idolatry and we cannot therefore allow them the Liberty of Publick Assembling themselves as others of the Separation Is it Idolatry and not to be Tolerated in 1680 And was it Idolatry to be Tolerated in 1675 Or Was it no Idolatry then but is become so now and intolerable Idolatry too The latter passage hath these Alterations Instead of He is to Us as other Separatists and so comes under the like Toleration These are put in He is to Us in regard of what he doth in private in the matter of his God as other who refuse to come to Common-Prayer Now we see Toleration struck out for the Papists but it was not only visible enough before but that very book was Printed with a design to present it to the Parliament which was the highest way of owning their Concurrence with the Papists for a general Toleration And the true Reason of this Alteration is that Then was Then and Now is Now. For the Answering this Evidence In the first place this Book the Doctor mentions was drawn up by One man though put out by Others and the first Mistake of the Doctor is to lay a Charge on the Party of the Nonconformists for a passage which indeed concerns but One person only In the next place the Reason of bringing that passage into the Book was because the Objection is so Obvious it could not be Baulkt and the Consequence appearing to the Author Undeniable he thought it but Honest to yeild it The Doctor then is mistaken next that believes or pretends the Reason of the bringing in that passage was on purpose only to Favour or fall In with the Papists That which is said in Right to All ought not to be interpreted in Favour to Any In the Third place for the Alteration mentioned it is to be known that when the Author had drew up this Book he left it with a Non-conformist Doctor to shew it to his Brethren who return'd it after a while telling him That they Disliked some passages in it which made him put it into some other hands who afterwards while he was Absent printed it They altered nothing but when it came out the Author indeed found his Brethren Offended at some things and that passage most obnoxious to Exception so that he presenrly made his Emendations and seeing the Book ill Printed intended in time to have another Impression Upon this it appears the Doctor is again Mistaken in regard to this Alteration which he Quotes who judges the Reason of the Change to be only because of the Times The True Reason sayes he is because Then was Then and Now is Now. The True Reason as if he knew it when you see how perfectly he is out in his Confidence as well as his Conjectures The making the Emendations which he did at the present Season is a Demonstration The Nonconformists are here Suspected or Impeached by this Doctor for Favouring Ioyning with the Papists because of a passage in that Book when the very Reason of Altering that passage was because of their presumed Finding Fault with it In the Last place we have here not only a Mistake in the Doctor which might be born but an open Wrong or Injury if it be not want of Consideration The Doctor Thinks or Speaks as if the Author in Re-printing the Book had Changed his Opinion wherein I count he most of all is Out and most to Blame He who drew up the Book is not one of that Humour as to Turn with the Times but rather against them The Opinion he offered in the Year 75 is the same with what he holds now in the Year 80. Here is an Alteration indeed as to more Words or some other words but the same Opinion or Solution with the Difference only of a farther Explication of it and nothing else therein besides avoiding offence entended The Author had been wary in declaring the Toleration he proposed to be a Limited one and provided against the Iesuite upon reason of State and shewed his dread of Popery in Dominion but had omitted the distinction of a toleration in regard to Publick Assemblies and the Private exercise of a Man 's own Religion He explains himself therefore by way of supply signifying that what he said at first should be taken in regard to the tolerating the Papist only privately as his meaning really was then and is now but fullier expressed This is the Opinion he recedes not from whether peculiar to himself or not that No Man should be persecuted meerly for his Conscience if there be no other Reason Whether a Man be a Dissenter of one kind or of another The Common Rule of Christianty must be remembred he sayes still that we do to all Men as we would be done by and that with what Measure we mete to others it shall be met to us again These Words remain in all the Impressions And now for the Title I have this also to Answer The Book as it came out An. 75. was then gone and now Re-printed against the Parliament Sate but they not Sitting was laid by till the Doctor 's Sermon comming out it was thought

Seasonable The Doctor Charges the Nonconformists Meetings with Schisme This Book gives an account of their Meetings and Vindicates them from Schisme and forasmuch as something was Inserted in regard to the People whom his Charge mainly concerns when the Ministers only were Vindicated in the First Edition and the first Sheet was new Printed over on purpose and the Doctor named it was sent out with this also in the Title There was no Concealment that it was a former Book it was still call'd The Peaceable Design and said to be Renewed but there was this Addition and this Reason And so I have given an Account of Doctor Stillingfleet's Book so far as concerns that Author and do not doubt but the Doctor will have an Account also from others so far as it concerns them in due Season As Mr. Baxter Mr. Alsop Dr. Owen And here I had thought to have given over and got one of these Friends to have put so much for me in one of their Books but when I remember there is a Postscript to the last Impression of the Book mentioned and what there is said and with what openness I must needs say that I did expect something from a Candid person more like a Gentleman that is so much Ingenuity as to cover a Fault which was confessed rather than expose it if there were any but I see there is nothing of this Nature no such Ingenuity I thought to be expected from the Doctor I am sensible of his Spirit and that temper I observe in him from a few Words let out of his Soul here and there in this Ironical Way of his which is a sufficient Indication of what kind of Estimation he hath of himself in his contempt of others I will give one instance in a place somewhere where he is speaking of Mr. Alsop He begins his Sentence This Learned Man but before he ends it he tells us of an Admirable Peice of his Reading so that when I was thinking him to be in earnest I find it only to disdain him I do therefore hate such a counterfeit Epithet as this is and these fleering Expressions It is all one in good earnest as if he should more at large speak thus to his Readers Readers you may perhaps think that Mr. Alsop is a Learned Man but alass What is he in comparison of me I am the Man that have all Learning in me 'T is I have done such Feats especially against the Papists I am the Man that have Kill'd the Philistine I forbear to mention a place where he Treats this same Worthy Man after the rate as if he were some Person distraught which is a vile Abuse but that is not the thing I Note Another Instance I must not forbear in regard to Mr. Baxter and it is this That when he at first names that Good Man he tells us he Pitties him Mr. Baxter belike is one scarce worthy of the Doctors Conquest but fit for his Compassion And can the Doctor here be in good earnest Mr. Baxter certainly is not an Enemy so Contemptible nor the Doctor I hope quite so Elated as he is Idle The Doctor is one who may look on himself to have Abilities in some regard which Mr. Baxter hath not but if he should really value himself mith Mr. Baxter upon the account of a Profound Divine which one may think here he would be at he is a Man who must want that Modesty in good Earnest whereof he makes a Shew in the Beginning of his Book upon a Comparison of his with Iewel The Doctor hath Learning and hath apt Words and is a ready sufficient Man but Mr. Baxter is really a Man Extraordinary and whose Talents are of another sort than the Doctors can reach unto Mr. Baxter is one I will say like the Man in the Neighbourhood who is first up and all the Neighbours come for Fire to his House that is one from whom the present Age do fetch Light and unto whom the Ages to come will bring Honour Neither care I for any Bodies saying this is Odious for the Old-Proverb shall not hinder me to end the Comparison The Doctor is one as well as others who may be willing to Learn or else I am sure be will have the more need to be Taught of that Man whom he Pitties It is fit after I have said this that I make it good And there is a Dispute between these Two concerning the National Church will help me to do it If there be a National Church it must have a Head a Constitutive-Head sayes Mr. Baxter and therefore asks the Doctor where the Constitutive Regent part of the Church of Eng is to be placed It is a matter of Polity the Doctor is put upon The Question also seems something Perplext it may be on purpose to try the Doctor but this we find the Doctor is posed that is flat for he cannot Answer but is driven to say there is no such Head and that there is no need of any which is the Absurdity unto which the Opponent would drive him If ever any Boy in the higher Form at School was posed by his Master the Doctor here is posed who is indeed in Mr. Baxter's Hands no other but such a one when he takes him on such a point where his Books and Polite Style do not serve him That there is a Government in the Church of England I hope the Doctor does not doubt who pleads for Conformity to it Where there is a Government established there must be a Political Society Every Political Body consists of a Pars Imperans subdita Does or does not the Doctor know this If the Church of England then be a Political Church it must have a Regent part and this Constitutive Regent part must be Assigned The Doctor here is indeed something more Unfortunate in his Reading than he uses or else it need not be so hard for any to find out where the Head or Regent part of every Political Society is or must be placed whether Mr. Baxter contradicts it or not There are therefore certain Rights of Soveraignty Iura Magistatis as Writers of Politicks do call them or Prerogatives and where those Rights are invested there the Headship must be placed The chief of these Rights is Legislation Wheresoever then the Power of giving Laws to any Society is found there must this Constitutive Regent part which Mr. Baxter enquires for be Assigned The Church of England now we know hath Her Laws There are Laws Ecclesiastical and these are called Canons or Constitutions We must then enquire where it is the Power of Making these does lye And here we find that the Arch-Bishop of the Province with the Bish●ps and Clerks making up a Convocation do frame these Canons If the Doctor now could but prove That the Hierarchy of the Church thus Congregated were certainly of Divine Institution so that there needed no other Authority but of the Convocation only for their Ratification then could he