to cast in his face And though there be neuer so manie old and new writers that would leade you to the true senâ—…e of these words you leaue them all and will needs by wilfull abusing the Scriptures haue Christ to be sinfull and defiled hatefull and accursed euen to God for taking vpon him to purge vs from our sinnes I shewed you the iudgement of Austen and Ambrose in my conclusion for the right vnderstanding of these words but you satisfied with nothing saue with your owne sense pasâ—…e surly by them and the rest as multitudes of men and preferre the proud conceit you haue of your selfe before them all Yet for the Readers sake that he may settle his iudgement with trueth and sobrietie he shall see the consent of all ages and writers how Christ was made sinne for vs and how he condemned sinne in the flesh Origen that Christ was made the sacrifice for sinne and offered for the clensing of sinnes all the Scriptures witnesse touching this sacrifice of his flesh it is said he condemned sinne in the flesh as the same Apostle else where sayth he appeared in the later times to destroy sinne By this sacrifice then of his flesh which was offered for sinne he condemned sinne that is he chased sinne away and abolished it Cyrill Christ is therefore made according to the Scriptures a sacrifice for sinne For this cause we say he is called sinne at selfe for so Paul writeth Him that knew no sinne God the Father made sinne for vs. We doe not say that Christ was made a sinner God forbid but being iust yea Iustice it selfe the Father made him a sacrifice for the sinnes of this world Ierom the Father made Christ who knew not sinne to be sinne for vs that is as the sacrifice offered for sinne is called sinne in the Law In Leuiticus it is written He shall lay his hand on the head of his sinne So Christ being offered for our sinnes tooke the name of sinne Augustine Christ then did no sinne but God made him sinne for vs that is as I haue said a sacrifice for sinne For if thou remember or wilt reade thou shalt finde in the bookes of the old Testament the sacrifice for sinne to be called sinne Againe God then made Christ sinne for vs that is a sacrifice by which our sinnes should be remitted because sacrifices for sinne are called sinne And so in the questions vpon Numbers It is said he shall offer a Lambe for a sinne because that which was offered for sinne was called sinne Whence it is that the Apostle saith of the Lord Christ him that knew no sinne God the Father made sinne for vs that is a sacrifice for sinne He that will see this more at large repeated and confirmed let him read at his leasure Saint Austen 120. Epistle cap. 30. the third booke and 6. Chapter against the two Epistles of the Pelagians his Enchiridion cap. 41. besides the seuenth Sermon De verbis Apostoli and the 48. Sermon De verbis Domini secundum Ioannem which I formerly alleaged Oecumenius the sacrifice which is offered for sinne is called sinne as the Prophet saith they eate the sinnes of my people that is the sacrifices for sinne So the Father made the Sonne a sacrifice to be offered for sinnes Primasius likewise the sacrifice for sinne is in the Law called sinne though it did not sinne as it is written and he shall laie his hands on the head of his sinne So Christ being offered for our sinnes tooke the name of sinne Sedulius obserueth the same words Beda Our Redeemer was made sinne that we might be the righteousnesse of God in him How In the Law the sacrifices which were offered for sinne are called sinne When the offering was brought for sinne the Law sayth the Priests shall put their hands vpon the sinne that is vpon the sacrifice for sinne And what els was this but Christ the true sacrifice for sinne Behold by what sinne he condemned sinne by the sacrifice which he made for sinne euen thereby he condemned sinne To skip Haymo Lyra and others the eleuenth Councell of Toledo in the confession of their faith Christ in the forme of man which he assumed is according to the trueth of the Gospell beleeued to haue beene borne without sinne and to haue died without sinne who aloâ—… was made sinne for vs that is the sacrifice for our â—…innes The new writers beare euen with the old To omit Erasmus Bullinger Peter Martyr Musculus Gualter Vitus Theodorus and others who doe follow the same steps Aretius vpon these words God by sinne condemned sinne in the flesh that is saith he All our sinne in our flesh God condemned by or for sinne to wit by or for the Sacrifice appointed for sinne Now Christ is the Lambe of God which taketh away the sinne of the world this Lambe is called sin because in the Law the sacrifices are called the sinne for which they are offered Hence is it that Christ who knew no sinne was made sinne by his Father Beza in his notes on the New Testament and on those words Him that knew no sinne God made sinne sayth Paul calleth sinne in this latter place the sacrifice for sinne after a maner of speech proper to the Hebrewes with whom the word Ascham is so taken as Leuiticus 7. 2. Tremelius the publisher and interpreter of your Syriack Testament obserueth the like vpon the same place Him that knew no sinne he made sinne for you that is a sacrifice for sinne which euery where in the bible is called Chattath by which name sinne also is called The booke of Homilies authorised in this Realme holdeth so fast to this exposition that it setteth it downe in the Apostles name as the Apostles true meaning S. Paul likewise sayth God made him a sacrifice for our sinne which knew no sinne that we should be made the righteousnesse of God in him The Apostle farder sayth the second time Christ shall appeare without sinne meaning that the first time he appeared with sinne Put the Apostles words vttered in the same place touching Christes first appearing with sinne to these which you cite and the sense is plaine and easie of it selfe In the end of the world Christ appeared once to put away sinne by the sacrifice of himselfe and vnto them that looke for him he shall appeare the second time without sinne vnto saluation Christes first appearing was with sinne that is either with an offering for sinne or with the infirmitie tentation miâ—…erie and mortalitie of sinne for such was the time of his humilitie when he came to purge sinne by the oblation of his bodie the next time of his appearing shall be in glorie that is without either sacrifice for sinne or any other infirmitie of sinners For sinne applied to Christ in the Scriptures may receiue a triple interpretation as Austen obserueth
Hades or death The sorrowes of death by Peters wordes were then loosed when Christ was raised because it was not possible for him to be held thereof So that this pertaineth nothing to the sorrowes which he felt dying they ended all with death but the sorrowes of an other death euen of death in hell were loosed when he was raised because it was not possible for that kind of death to take hold on him Your two or three things wherewith you would shift of the Apostles wordes doe you no good That God loosed death from him are not the Apostles wordes you make a gloze vpon your owne wordes and not vpon the Apostles Such libertie you take to change the text to serue your turne The next is farder of from the reference of Peters words God loosed the sorrowes of death or Hades at Christs rising that is say you because his death had beene most painefull before his Soule was seuered from his body So Peter talketh of Christs rising and you wrest it to Christs dying on the Crosse. And here your hebraisme will not steede you For God did not loose the sorrowfull death of Christ on the Crosse at his rising but at his dying And therefore you are wider of then you were before Thus then it followeth euen by the Text that there were sorrowes in Hades where Christ was but they could not take hold of him The sorrowes of Hades must needes be the sorrowes in Hades otherwise if they were not in Hades they were not the sorowes of Hades As the ioyes of heauen are in heauen so the sorrowes of Hades must be in Hades where Christ was and not where Christ was not The very text implieth that Christ was holden in this which was loosed from him Saint Austen saith you fitten Snares may be broken and loosed ne tencant non quia tenuerunt not because they haue taken hold but that they should not take hold 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 you say is to be holden fast Your Greekish conceits crossing Saint Austins iudgement taste more of will then of skill Kratcisthai hath many significations amongst others it signifieth to touch to take to hold and in the the new Testament it is specially obserued by those that are learned that it signifieth prehendere or tenere to take or to hold The Maries that went to Christes Sepulchre meeting him as they came thence 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 touched his feete and worshipped him When Simons mother in law was sicke of a feuer Christ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 taking her by the hand lift her vp The rulers daughter of the Synagogue Christ likewise 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 tooke her by the hand and the maid arose Your Lexicons will tell you that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 standeth often for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to touch Now if you may choose what signification you will haue in euery word you are no Reader but an ouer ruler of the Scriptures Howbeit we now see Saint Austin hath better warrant in the Scriptures for his tenere then you were ware of Thou wilt not leaue my soule in Hades I say he was now in the same wherein he was not left nor forsaken I say the same and by your owne saying conuince you that if S. Luke by Hades heere signifie hell as he doth in his Gospell Christes soule was in hell by your owne illation in which it was not left nor forsaken But hee was in no sorrowes at all now Then is Saint Austins assertion confessed by your selfe the sorowes of death were loosed at Christes rising not that they had taken hold on him but that they should not take any hold of him or so much as touch him If he were in them I thinke he should haue felt them The Scripture saith his soule was not left 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the place of Hades it speaketh not there of the sorrowes of Hades as if Christ were not forsaken in them But God as Peter saith loosed them when he raised Christ that is hee made Christ the subduer and dissoluer of them at his resurrection You mightily vrge that it is Austins collection from this text I perceaue your argument is from Austin and not from Peter as you pretend It is better to imitate Austen and his collections then to rest on your idle braine as you doe and when you haue cleane mistaken both the scope and wordes of the text to range after butterflies Howbeit if it had pleased you to looke better into the 169. and 170. Page of my Sermons you should haue sound moe reasons there then Austins collections But your answeres and disproofes a man may soone perceaue come out of the bottome of your pocket for there is neither trueth nor learning in them Austen missed in his translation of these wordes Thus he readeth solutis doloribus Inferni quia impossibile erat teneri cum in illis God raised vp Christ loosing the sorrowes of hell because it was impossible he should be held in them But the text hath loosing the sorowes of death seeing it was impossible he should be holden fast or strongly holden of it Seeing therefore he fayled in expressing the text no maruaile if his collection from it were wide He that neuer saw water but the Themes will thinke there is none other Sea You neuer looke neither to the diuerse readings nor significations of wordes in the new Testament and that maketh you so hastely to pronounce that Austins collection hath no ground nor reason in the text but is wholly disprooued by it Austen followed the auncient and receiued translation of the Church in his time and missed not so much as you imagine For that Text hath two readings some bookes hauing Thanátou death some hauing Hadou which the old translator calleth infernum the places below or hell Peruse the new Testament in Greeke of the larger volume printed by Robert Steuen at Paris Anno 1550. and see whether he put not Hadou ouer right this place in the margine as standing yet in many copies The Greeke Bible printed at Frankford Anno 1596. consesseth the like varietie of reading Athanasius vseth sometimes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hee loosed the sorrowes of Hades and someties 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the sorrowes of death So doth Epiphanius Peter saith It was impossible Christ should be held 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of it that is of hades And against the Arians It is sayd by the Apostle it was impossible that he should be held 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of hades The Syriack translation reuerenced for antiquitie and fidelitie keepeth the word Sheiul twice in the foure and twentieth verse of this Chapter and saith But God raised him vp and loosed the sorrowes deshiul of Shool which Saint Luke calleth hades because it was impossible he should be detained bashiul in Sheol or hades The Arabicke translator
in saying the Angels shall cast the badde into a furnace of fire where indeed by your deuice the furnace of fire shal be cast into the badde the next in that he sayth the Angels shall cast them into the fire which hath no trueth in it if the soules of the wicked inwardly suffer from the immediate hand of God alone as you teach For how do the Angels cast the wicked into the fire when the immediate hand of God inflicteth that which you call hell fire on the soule without any instruments or inferiour meanes These mockeries you must make of the Scriptures before they will serue your new conceit that hell fire is an allegorie and importeth nothing but a paine raised within the soule by the immediate hand of God alone which what agreement it hath with the doctrine and descriptions of the Holy ghost I leaue the Christian Reader to consider Fiftly the word Gehenna which Christ authorized in the new testament to signifie hell hath no iust representation of hell if there be no substantiall and externall fire in hel For where anciently the children of Iudah built the place of Topheth in the valley of the sonne of Hinnom to burne their sonnes daughters in the fire vnto Molech which valley the eighteenth of Iosue placeth neere to Iebusi that was afterward Ierusalem and calleth Gehinnom and the chiefe councel of Ierusalem whiles their power lasted vsed to punish certaine offences with fire in the same valley lying neere to their citie Our Lord and Master either taking the word that was vsuall among the people in his time to import hell and establishing it with his authoritie or resembling hell to the place of tormenting burning malefactors with fire so wel knowen to the Iewes nameth it Gihanna in Syriack which the Hebrues call Gehinnam the Euangelists 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the Latines Gehenna In this application of the word that the one might fitly resemble the other three things were chiefly respected as Peter Martyr rightly obserueth vpon the second chapter of the second booke of Kings First that being a valley to wit a lowe bottome it resembled hell which is beleeued to be beneath the earth Secondly for the fire wherewith the wicked are tormented in hell euen as the children were in that valley burnt with fire Lastly the place was vncleane and detestable whither all vile and lothsome things were cast out of the citie of Ierusalem euen as defiled and wicked soules are cast out of the kingdome of heauen into hell And howsoeuer you may quarrell with the first and last respects because you thinke them not Canonicall though I finde them grounded on the Scriptures if that were to this present purpose the second is without contradiction the maine reason why our Sauiour tooke the word Gehenna to represent hell and is expressed by himselfe when so often in the Gospell he addeth fire to the word Gehenna and expoundeth the one by the other that is Gehenna by vnquenchable fire Whosoeuer shall say foole to his brother shal be worthy of the Gehenne of fire that is of the vale of fire or of hell And againe It is better for thee to enter into life with one eye than hauing two eyes to be cast into the Gehenne of fire which is the vale or lake of fire and hell fire In the Gospel written by S. Marke Christ ioyneth the one as an explication to the other It is better to goe halting into life than hauing two feet to be cast into GEHENNA into the fire that neuer shal be quenched So that the resemblance of true fire in either place painfull to the sufferer and dreadfull to the beholder was the chiefe respect why our Sauiour allowed GEHENNA in the new Testament to signifie hell and consequently doth assure vs there is true fire in hell For if hell haue no fi e in it besides an inward and inherent paine of bodie or soule as we see in all violent and burning diseases Christ might more fitly haue resembled hell to any sharpe and sore sicknesâ—…e than to an externall and sensible fire which can haue no reference to hell if the torments there be only spirituall and internall These reasons lead me to râ—…solue and beleeue that the fire of hell so much threatned to â—…he wicked in the Scriptures and inflicted on the damned shall be a true visible and externall fire wherein lest thou shouldest thinke Christian Reader I rest too much on mine owne opinion as this Dâ—…scourser doth in all things on his I am content to let thee see that the Ancient and Catholike Fathers of Christes Church haue constantly professed as much before me and condemned the Discoursers conceit as an open errour repugnant to the Scriptures and hurtfull to the Christian faith I haue alreadie produced the testimonies of so many Fathers in the conclusion of my Sermons touching this point the writers being of the greatest learning and account in the Church of Christ as may satisfie the â—…ober and stumble the froward theiâ—… iudgement concurring with the manifest words of holy Scripture yet because this Discouâ—…ser lightly regardeth their concents vainely shifteth off their proofes let vs heare and examine his answere to their assertions The Fathers by me cited were Austen Ambrose Chrysostome Eusebius Tertullian Lactâ—…ntius Cyprian Minutius Pacianus and Gregorie besides the wordes of Sibylla which many of those Fatheâ—…s accept and alleage as proceeding from God to witnesse the trueth and terrour of his generall iudgement to all the world and agreeing with the tenour of holy Scripture His answere beginneth and endeth in this wise You set your sâ—…lfe to prooue that in hell there is materiall fire But it seemeth you are now almost afraid so to call it yet you call it true fire which also wee vtterly denie All your proofes such as they arâ—… runne to prooue corporall and materiall fire yet eternall except your Scriptures which vtterly prooue nothing at all And me thinkes you should not care for corporâ—…ll fire now in hell seeing you seeme to beleeue no torments for damned soules saue on ly at the resurrâ—…ction For thus you reason as the bodie hath beene the instrument of the soules pleasure in sinne so it shall be of her paine But all prouocations and pleasures of sinne the soule taketh from her bodie all actes of sinne she committeth by her bodie Therefore the iustice of God both temporally and eternally punisheth the soule ONELY by the bodie Or therefore all the soules paine for sinne both temporally and eternally is by the body This is your owne reason which being true why should you care for corporall fire in hell before the last iudgemâ—…nt You begin and end with two notorious vntrueths and falsifications of my words that at least you may make others beleeue there is some likelihood in yours when I dare not stand by mine but am either afraid of them or conclude directly
sense and case that I do Peruse the labours of that learned Father Bishop Iewel and see how often in his Replie to Harding and his Defence of the Apologie he calleth the testimonies of the ancient Fathers and Councels Authorities We rest sayth he vpon the Scriptures of God vpon the Authoritie of the ancient Doctours and Councels And againe to reckon vp the authorities of ANTIQVITIE it would be infinite The halfe communion by the authoritie of Gelasuis may well be called open sacriledge In the conclusion of the same booke I grant you haue alledged authorities sundrie and many such as I knew long before Verely I neuer denied but you were able to bring vs the names and shadowes of m◅ny Fathers You haue defended the open abomination of your stewes by the name and AVTHORITIE of S. Augustine You haue sought vp a companie of new petite Doctors Authors void of Authoritie full of vanities In the conclusion of his defence of the Apologie my Authorities of Doctors and Councels as you haue vsed them are few enough What meant you in fauour of open Stewes to shew vs the name and AVTHORITIE of S. Augustine Peter Martyr against Smithes bookes of the singlenesse of Priests sayeth In iudging of things obscure we must haue two waies or meanes to direct vs one i◅ward which is the Spirit the other outward which is the word of God Tum si ad haec patrum etiam authoritas accesserit valebit plurimum to these if the authoritie of Fathers be ioyned it is of great force So Chemnitius in his examination of the Tridentine Councell Quod de patrum authoritate sentimus etiam ab ipsis Patribus didicimus That which we hold touching the authoritie of the Fathers we learned of the Fathers themselues Where also he teacheth you this Rule worth the noting for your new found Redemption and the rest of your nouelties Sentimus etiam nullum dogma in ecclesia no◅m cum t◅ta antiquitate pugnans recipiendum We also confesse that no point of Doctrine which is new to the Church and repugnant to all antiquitie is to be receiued If the Fathers themselues will better please you I want not their example for the vse of that word which so much offendeth you Ierome in his Epistle to Damasus in very earnest manner maketh this petition Vt ◅ihi epistolis tuis siue tacendarum siue dicendarū hypostase◅n detur authoritas That AVTHORITIF may be giuen me saith he by your letters to vse or refuse the word hypostases Vincentius in his book against heresies mooueth this question Here some perchaunce will aske where as the Canon of the Scripture is perfect and abundantly sufficient in it selfe for all things quid opus est vt ei ecclesiasticae intelligentiae iungatur authoritas what neede is there that the authoritie of the ecclesiasticall interpretation should be ioyned with it The effect of his answere which is good for you to obserue that claime such libertie for your selfe to expound the Scriptures at your pleasure is this least euery man should wrest the Scriptures to his fansie and sucke thence not the truth but the patronage of his error Saint Augustine that is euery where carefull to yeeld the Scriptures their due reuerence yet giueth the word Authoritie to the decrees of Councels and writings of godly Fathers before his time Speaking of generall Councels he saith Quorum est in ecclesia saluberrima authoritas Whose authoritie is most wholsome in the Church And alleaging the testimonies of Irenaeus Cyprian Hilarius Ambrose Gregorie Chrysostome Basil and others against Iulian the Pelagian he concludeth Hoc probauimus Catholicorum authoritate sanctorum this haue we prooued by the authoritie of Godly Catholike men vt vestra fragilis quasi argutula nouitas sola authoritate conteratur illorum that your weake and sleigh noueltie might be ouerwhelmed with their onely authoritie For your contumacie is first to be repressed by their authoritie With these testimonies and so great authoritie of holy men thou must either by Gods mercy be healed or else thou must accuse the egregious and holy Doctors of the Catholike truth against which miserable madnes I must so answere that their faith may be defended against thee euen as the Gospell it selfe is defended against the wicked and professed enimies of Christ. If then this word seeme insolent to you which is so frequent with the best Diuines of former and latter times let your Reader iudge whether it be ignorance or insolence in you to stumble at so plaine a word as if the religious and auncient Fathers and lights of Christs Church were not worthy with you to be counted learned Authors nor their testimonies to be named Authorities fit to guide and lead others to the knowledge of the truth I trust no aduised Christian will challenge more authoritie to the Fathers then was giuen by those of Beraea to the Apostle nor deny indeede to any priuate man much lesse to a Minister to iudge and discerne in themselues not onely the words of men but euen of the sense and meaning of the Scripture by the Scripture it selfe which thing the Beraeans did and are commended by the holy Ghost for it I trust you claime no power to iudge of the Scriptures you may discerne the truth there written but with necessitie to beleeue not with libertie to iudge And if by your freedome you fasten on falsehood it is no excuse for you but a condemnation vnto you Saint Austen speaking of the bookes of the Prophets and Apostles saith quos omnino indicare non audeamus which we may not dare at all to iudge And where you say the Ber◅ans are commended by the holy Ghost for not beleeuing that Paul spake touching Religion till they had examined by the Scriptures and seene whether the truth were so as he vttered You speake not one◅y vnwisely and vntruely but if you would haue Christians to follow that course you shew intolerable pride against the word of God for the Beraeans were commended when as yet they neither beleeued in Christ nor acknowledged Pauls Apostleship for their readinesse to heare and care to search whether Paul spake trueth or no. This if you now assume to your selfe ouer Pauls words or writings you incurre the crime of flat impietie Pauls words to vs that beleeue without further search or other credit are of equall authoritie with the rest of the Scriptures and not to beleeue him till we examine and see the trueth of his doctrine is meere infidelitie Behold I paul say vnto you must suffice all Christians and if an Angel from heauen preach otherwise than he preached we must hold him accursed For our comfort that beleeue and to perswade them which as yet beleeue not we may search and see the consent betwixt the Prophets and Apostles yea the sonne of God sent men to the writings of Moses and the
suffer then Christ did not so suffer If you flie to the purpose of the punisher which was different in Christ and his members and thinke there to succour your selfe you come to short the purpose of God in Christes afflictions as I haue shewed by the Scriptures was farre more fauourable and honourable in Christ then it can bee to any of the elect And therefore Gods purpose in Christes punishment will far der free him from hell paines then it will any of the faithfull The proportion of the pain which Christ suffered the inward peace of the sufferer will proue the same For where the paines of hell exceed the patience of men and Angels and are no way possible to bee suffered in the weaknesse of our mortall bodies the measure of Christes paine was so proportioned to the strength of his flesh that it neither ouerwhelmed his life nor his patience And though his sweate were like bloud in his earnest prayer and Agonie yet no Scripture decideth whether that were for paine feare or zeale and that dured but a while in the Garden where as after when his afflictions and paines were at sorest he shewed no signe of shrinking either at the torments of his body or at the affliction of his minde but as the Apostle saith For the ioy set before him endured the Crosse and despised the shame not wearied nor fainting in minde but with most perfect obedience and quiet patience persisting to the ende This conflict betweene paine and patience to serue Gods glorie and obey Gods will Christ proposeth to all his members on the same condition that it was offered to his humane nature To him that ouercommeth saith he will I giue to sit with me in my throne euen as I ouercame and â—…it with my Father in his throne As for the consequents of hell paines it is so brutish blasphemie to affirme them of Christ that I forbeare to obiect them I haue often named them and you say you abhorre such blasphemies as well as â—… doe that Christ so suffered hell paines But Sir you your friends must shew by the Scriptures that God hath seuered these consequents I meane reiection reprobation confusion malediction diction desperation and such like from the true paines of hell The Scripture proposeth them as necessarie and infallible consequents to the true paines of hell You will seuer them because otherwise Christ must either not suffer the true paines of hell which euerteth all your new Doctrine or he must also suffer these which the Scriptures annexe to the true paines of hell If you confesse the first that Christ did not suffer the true paines of hell the Question is well ended If you seuer these consequents from the true paines of hell shew by what authoritie of sacred Scriptures you doe it and then you may be excused from lewd and wicked presumption For if God by his word reuealed hath ioyned them together you doe or should know what sacriledge it is for your pleasure to pull them in sunder Let your Reader therefore iudge whether you can be quited from the one except you shew good warrant for the other which as yet you neither haue done nor offered to doe Your selfe graunt expresly that the wrath of God is hell indeede onely it causeth hell to be cruell yea you grant it to be sharper then hell So that we see hereby how vainely you say out of this proposition Christ suffered for vs the wrath of God for sinne I shall neuer conclude ergo he suffered the true paines of hell I haue here shewed you I trust that this followeth well seeing the wrath of God which Christ felâ—… in his spirit was his right and proper wrath albeit he suffered not all nor the whole wrath of God nor euery part thereof iust as the damned doe Here you see your full purpose is to conclude that Christ suffred for vs the true paines of hell though it hath beene your policie to conceale so much from the Reader all this while And indeede howsoeuer you dissemble it because you can no way prooueit The death of Christes soule and the true paines of hell or of the Damned are the maine markes which you shoote at though you closely carie it in other termes which are more generall and ambiguous as the wrath of God and the punishment of sinne to keepe your Reader from discouering your foolish reasons and reiecting your wicked deuices But cough vp your conceites freely and wander not thus about a wood of words to shew your contentious spirit or at least to hide your hatefull mysteries Here you haue shewed you trust that it followeth well seeing the wrath that Christ felt in his spirit was right and proper wrath You haue shewed vs what you intend but neither here nor else where doe you shew by what grounds of reason and trueth you can inferre it Christ suffered proper wrath and that in spirit you say You neuer went about to define or describe what proper wrath is much lesse haue you any way prooued that which Christ suffered to be proper wrath And now on the sudden you bend vp your bristles and boast you haue shewed that Christ suffered the true paines of hell But by what Scriptures I pray you haue you shewed it or by what Fathers Or if you haue neither of those to deriue your doctrine from what groundes of reason haue you produced for it You haue roued ignorantly confusedly and absurdly at the sufferings of mans soule you haue filled our eares with certaine new phrases of proper verie and right wrath and vengeance for sinne but first and last you haue proued nothing nay I see not so much as any offer of proofe but a bolde proiect of trifles and termes to support your errors But I grant expresly that the wrath of God is hell Hauing shewed by sundrie Fathers the verie page before that the wrath of God is often taken for the effects thereof and so for any punishment which God inflicteth for sinne I granted that hell and all the â—…orments there mightiustly be called the wrath of God because they are t the sharpest effects of Gods wrath against sinne What conclude you thence ergo euerie effect or degree of Gods wrath is hell If you clamper vs such conclusions you are fitter to ring a bell than to write a booke What shew of reason hath this illation of yours The wrath of God is applied to all the paines and punishments of sinne and so by consequent to hell as to the greatest vengeance that God taketh of men or diuels for sinne Will you hence inferre hell is the greatest punishment of sinne ergo hell is all the punishment that God inflicteth for sinne or whatsoeuer God inflicteth for sinne is hell By this Logike a rotten tooth a gowtie toe a broken head or a lame legge are the true paines of hell and all men liuing and dying are in the paines of hell But you will create vs
duely consider it appeareth so cleere as the Sunne at noone day that the paynes of his passion which plainly now he felt and feared because he knew he was to feele them further vnto death were the proper and direct cause of those agontes But we assume that such strange and lamentable things and behauiour in Christ were not the effects one lie and meerely of his bodilie paines and death Therefore Christ felt and endured more then his meâ—…re bodilie paines and death by the testimonie of the Scriptures which thinge you denie Your cleare Sun is the darke cloud of your owne imaginations your proper direct causes are the light and false coniectures of your owne braine your conclusion is a childish digression not onely from the thinges questioned by me but from the verie matters proposed by you onlie in the vpshot you hold your wonted course to strengthen your cause with a lie when trewth will not stand you in steed To beginne where you end you are not ignorant that I defend no such thing as meere bodily paines your selfe haue directly confessed the contrarie as I haue formerly shewed I say indeed Christ suffered no death but only the death of the body that you turne to a manifest vntrewth and say I denie that Christ felt any more then meere bodilie paines To what purpose then is your conclusion that Christ endured more then bodily paines What gaine you by that so long as Christ suffered none other death but the death of the body Christes feare and sorrow which the Scriptures expresse in the Garden were more then meere bodily paines and those though he felt you shall neuer thence conclude that he felt the paines of hell or of the damned l Defenc. pag. 91. Your assumption as you say I graunt and acknowledge and so your labour is the lesse but the proposition I gaine say in my whole discourse denying that the paines of Christes passion or the naturall feare of them was the proper and direct cause of those agonies or that the Scriptures implie so much If you looke well to my wordes they containe two things first that the n Serm pag. 17. li. 13. right cause of Christes agonie in the Garden is not n 14. determinately and o 15. certainely reuealed in the Scriptures secondly that the suffering of hell paines at that present was the least probable cause thereof if not altogether intolerable let vs now see how you impugne either of these p Defenc. pag. 91. li. 22. 14. 27. this your assertion I simply deny and then my proposition standeth firme that his paines inflicted on him by way of proper punishment and vengeance for sinne were the proper and maine cause thereof This is the cleerenes of your Sun-shining at noone day you deny my assertion and then your proposition standeth firme ergo the Scriptures doe certainly specifie the proper and direct causes of Christes agonie and those were the paines of the Damned which you call the proper vengeance for sinne Then if you list to denie any thing the contrary is presently prooued and concluded by you as cleere as the Sunne at noone day such proofes and conclusions which are nothing but strange and violent Imaginations your booke is full of and these twentie leaues and more which here you spend in examining Christs agonie haue nothing els in them but such meere falshoods and confusions Before we speake of the firmenesse of your proposition I would gladly know which of these three propositions which here you haue varied to shew the settlednes of your conceits is that which you offer to be examined In the first you say q Defenc. pag. 90. li. 37. the paines of Christs passion which plainly now he felt and feared to feele further vnto death in the second you say r Pa. 91. li. 7. those paines or the naturall feare of them in the third you say s Ibid. li. 26. his paines inflicted on him by way of proper punishment and vengeance for sinne these were the proper and direct cause of â—…hose agonies These and those these or those these alone and not those are childish and foolish contrarietiâ—…s with any wise man saue with you and yet all these are cleare and firme because you haue the witt to denie mine assertion Touching your proposition that the Reader may conceiue how you clutter things together to holde on your accustomed carriage he must marke that Christes agonie had many parts and circumstances some inward some outward some affections The parts of Christs agony some actions some apprehensions and all these had their causes efficient and adiuuant neere or remote sole or concurrent according to their differences The Scriptures expresly note in that agony which Christ had and shewed in the Garden the inward affections of sorrow feare admiration submission contention of mind in Christ. My soule saith he t Matth. 26. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is on euery side sorowfull or compassed round with sorow euen vnto death And he began sayth Matthew 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to be full of sorow and much grieued For so the Apostle vseth the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 what sense soeuer it beare with prophane writers whereof we shall not need to dispute u Phil. 2. v. 26. I thought it necessary to send vnto you Epaphroditus my fellow souldier and your messenger for he was very desirous of you all 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and very pensiue or much grieued because you heard he was sicke S. Marke sayth Christ in the Garden beganne x Mar. 16. v. 33 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to be afrayd or astonied and full of heauinesse or griefe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth feare and admiration which so fixeth the minde for the time that a man neither speaketh nor vseth the vigor of his senses As for submission of mind Christes y Matth. 26. falling flat with his face z Mark 14. on the ground when he powred foorth his prayers to God sufficiently sheweth as much inward humiliation of the soule in Gods presence as this outward gesture of his bodie declared or required His ardent zeale in prayer and vehement contention of minde S. Luke noteth when he sayth An a Luc. 22. Angell appeared to him to strengthen him with a message from God Christ then 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 falling into an agonie prayed more earnestly or feruently and his sweat was like drops of bloud trickling downe to the ground Of this agonie you haue often spoken and here you spend no small time about it but I scant beleeue you know what an agonie meaneth much lesse what was the true cause of this agonie Though an agonie be sometimes abusiuely taken for feare yet properly it is aâ—…firmed b Etymologicon ex Orione 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of him that is readie to descend into any combate or conflict with another as Orion a most ancient Grecian obserueth Damascene confesleth that 〈◊〉
is thrâ—…wen downe to Hades For he that minded neuer any high or heauenly thing 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 was woorthy of the lowest place In saying then he was buried the Lord secretly signifieth that his soule had the place that was lowest and darke And though hee there shew the opinion of some that thought hades to be rather the condition of the soule after death then a place yet he himselfe resolueth the coÌ„trary 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 What is hades Some say it is a place of darkenesse vnder the earth others say Hades is the change of the soule from sensible to obscure and vnseene And though the wordes of our Sauiour determine that doubt who maketh the rich man call it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 this place of torment yet Theophylact himselfe reasoning there against Origen out of Abrahams wordes saith As it is then vnpossible for any of the iust to passe to the place of sinners so Abraham teacheth vs it is impossible 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to passe from the place of punishment to the place of the righteous And since their names doe not appeare that were of this opinion and being latter in age deserue not the same credite for their iudgements that the auncient and learned Fathers doe I omit these petite masters whom no man knoweth as fansing somewhat if they could prooue it and will goe forward with the maine consent as of all Greeke diuines that are extant so of the best and eldest commentators and expounders of Greeke words to shew that Hades is a place of darkenesse vnder earth for soules where now none but wicked are contained and there punished Eustathius Archbishop of Thessalonica a man of no meane skill in the Greeke tongue as appeareth by his commenting vpon Homere saith Haïdes which is Hades is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a darke place vnder earth vnseene and appointed for soules Phauorinus Bishop of Nuceria in his commentaries of the Greeke tongue saith likewise 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Hades is a place vnder the earth secret and hidde which hee also calleth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a place without light and filled with eternall darkenesse The great Etymologist of the Greeke tongue concurreth with them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Hades is a place void of light and full of euerlasting darkenesse and mists I shall not neede with many wordes to vrge the properties and conditions of the place which these Greeke Fathers call Hades It is apparent to any who will pâ—…ruse them that they auouch it to be a place of darkenesse opposed to heauen and Paradise and vnder the earth where Diuels are keepers and tormentors of soules and where the wicked after this life are kept prisoners and suffer punishments according to their deserts which Christ destroyed and spoiled by his descent thither deliuering thence that is from the feare power and danger thereof all such as before or after did or should beleeue in him And though some of these writers did happily thinke the soules of the godly deceased before Christes death were kept in a part thereof in hope of their deliuerance thence yet with one consent they witnesse it to be nothing lesse then heauen or Paradise or the state of the dead common to good and bad after Christs resurrection as likewise they teach that Christ deliuered thence not onely such of his elect as were dead before that time but all the faithfull aswell then liuing as yet vnborne And therefore a deliuerance thence doth not exactly conclude a locall detention and inclusion there but a quiting and disloluing of all the right interest and challenge that hell or Satan had for sinne vnto the seruants and members of Christ whensoeuer they liued or died Onely Tertullian is opposite to them all who dreampt that the soules of all the faithfull saue Martyrs were kept in places vnder the earth which he calleth inferi till the generall resurrection wherein as in many other points deliuered in his booke de Anima he goeth a priuate way by himselfe without and against the maine resolution of the rest of the Fathers He doth not montanize in this as you obiect but consenteth with Irenaeus before and with others after him as shall appeare who were no Montanists Your mistaking Irenaeus here as you did before little helpeth your market and others when you bring them shall haue an answere fitting them In the meane while where you be so zealous to saue Tertullian from Montanisme he must haue a better proctor then you are to vphold his cause or els it will soone fall to the ground That none but Martyrs are in Paradise and all other the faithfull departing this life are in prisons and places vnder the earth till the day of iudgement this is not onely repugnant to the Scriptures and the rest of the Fathers but a plaine branch of Montanus heresie which Tertullian deriueth from no grounds of holy Scripture whence all trueth must be fet but from certaine Reuelations Prophesies different from the Scriptures which Montanus and others published as made by the holy Ghost after the writing of the Scriptures and which Tertullian in his writings coloureth with the name and pretence of the Paraâ—…te calling the true Christians that refused his new found doctrine Psychicos naturall men and not ledde by the latter direction of the spirit as Montanus and others were whom in exacting chastitie abstinence and Martyrdome more strictly then the Church of Christ did he followed And therefore not onely his doctrine in this place allowing Paradise to none besides martyrs but his alleaging Montanus verie words and pretending the Paraclete for his conceit no where written in the Scriptures declare him expresly in this to be a Montanist For plainer proofe whereof first Tertullian speaking of himselfe when he forsooke the rest of the Christians to cleaue to the reuelations of Montanus and his adherents saith Et nos quidem postea agnitio Paracleti atque defensio disiunxit a Psychicis The agnising of the Paraclet in the prophesies of Montanus and defending thereof did afterward disioine vs from the carnall men So he termed the Church of Christ for refusing the new prophesies of Montanus as appeareth euidently by his booke De ieiunio aduersus psycâ—…cos of fasting against the carâ—…all men which Saint Ierom saith was written specialiter aduersum ecclesiam particularly against the Church Where he likewise taxeth the Christians for resisting the Paraclet or new prophesies of Montanus couering them vnder the name of the Paraclet and interpreting the one by the other Hiparaeleto controuer siam faciunt propter hoc nouae prophetiae recusantur non quod alium Deum praedicent Montanus Priscilla Maximilla sed quod plane doceant saepius ieiunare quaÌ„ nubere These â—…arnall men quarrell with the Paraclet and therefore are the new prophesies refused not that Montanus Priscilla Maximilla preach another God but that they plainly teach oftner