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A48472 The picture of the Councell of State, held forth to the free people of England by Lieut. Col. John Lilburn, M. Thomas Prince, and M. Richard Overton, now prisoners in the Tower of London for bearing testimony to the liberties of England against the present tyrants at White-Hall, and their associates, or, a full narrative of the late extrajudiciall and military proceedings against them ; together with the substance of their severall examinations, answers, and deportments before them at Darby-house, upon March 28 last. Lilburne, John, 1614?-1657.; Prince, Thomas.; Overton, Richard, fl. 1646. 1649 (1649) Wing L2155; ESTC R10562 40,210 29

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power of the whole Parliament to execute the Law they can give no power to you their Members to meddle with me in the case before you For an Ordinary Court of Justice the proper Administrator of the Law is the only and sole Judge in this particular and not you Gentlemen no nor your whole House it self And therefore if you be honest men and will be as good as your words oaths and promises which are to maintain the Laws in reference to the peoples Liberties I challenge at your hands the benefit of the Law and not to be past upon otherwise in any kinde For with your favour Mr. Bradshaw the fact that you suppose I have committed for till it be judicially proved and that must be before a legall Judge that hath cognisance of the fact or confessed by my self before the Judge it is but a bare supposition is either a crime or no crime a crime it cannot be unlesse it be a transgression of a Law in being before it was committed acted or done For where there is no Law * Rom. 4. 15. See the 4. part of the L. Cooks Institutes ch 1. High Court of Parl fol. 37. 38. 39. 41. See also my printed Epistle to the Speaker of the fourth of April 1648. called the Prisoners plea for an Habeas Corpus p. 5 6. and Englands Birth-right p. 1. 2. 3. 4. and the second edition of my Epistle to Judge Reeves p. 11. 12. 13. 14. 15. and M. John Wildmans Truths Triumph p. 11. 12. 13. 14. and Sir John Maynards Case truly stated called The Laws Subversion p. 9. 13. 14. 15. 16. 38. there is no Transgression And if it be a Transgression of a Law that Law provides a punishment for it and by the Rules and method of that Law am I to be tryed and by no other whatsoever made ex post facto And therefore Sir if this be true as undoubtedly it is then I am sure you Gentlemen have no power in Law to convene me before you for the pretended crime laid unto my charge much lesse to fetch me by force out of my habitation by the power of armed men For Sir let me tell you The Law of England never made Colonels Lieutenant Colonels Captains or Souldiers either Bailisss Constables * See the Petition of Right in the 3. C. R. and my Book called the peoples Prerogative p. 44. 45. 46. 47. 48. 56. c. Yea I say that is the Generall take away by Martiall Law the life of Laughorn c. now in time of Peace the Courts of Justice being open he murders him or them and ought to die therefore or Justices of Peace And I cannot but wonder that you should attach me in such a manner as you have done considering that I have all along adhered to the Interest of the Nation against the common Enemy as you call them and never disputed nor contemned any Order or Summons from Parliament or the most irregularest of their Committees but always came to them when they sent for me although their Warrant of Summons was never so illegall in the forme of it and I have of late in a manner de die in diem waited at the House dore and was there that day the Votes you have read past till almost twelve a clock and I am sure there are some here present whose Couscience I beleeve tells them they are very much concerned in this Book row before you that saw me at the dore and stared wishfully upon me as they went into the House and I cannot but wonder there could be no Civil Officer found to summon me to appear but that now when there is no visible hostile enemy in the Nation and all the Courts of Justice open that you that have no power at all over me must send for me by a hundred or two hundred Armed Horse and Foot as though I were some monstrous man that with the breath of my mouth were able to destroy all the Civil Officers that should come to apprehend me Surely I had not endeavoured to fortifie my house against you neither had I betaken my self to a Castle or a defenced Garrison in hostility against you that you need to send a hundred or two hundred armed men to force me out of my house from my wife and children by four or five a clock in the morning to the distracting and afrighting of my wife and children Surely I cannot but look upon this irregular unjust and illegal hostile action of yours as one of the fruits and issues of your new created Tyranny to amuse and debase my spirit and the spirits of the People of this Free Nation to fit me and them for bondage and slavery This being the very practise of the Earl of Strafford before you as M. Pym in his declaration against him doth notably observe And Sir give me leave further to tell you that for divers hundreds of men that have often been in the field with their swords in their hands to encounter with hostile enemies and in their engagements have acquitted themselves like men of valour and come out of the field conquerours for these very men to put themselves in Martial Array against four Mise or Butterflyes taking them captives and as captives lead them through the streets me thinks is no small diminution to their former Martial Atchievements and Trophies And therefore to conclude this I do here before you all protest against your power and Jurisdiction over me in the case in controversie And also doe protest against your Warrant you issued out to apprehend me And against all your martial and hostile acts committed towards me as illegal unjust and tyrannical and no way in Law to be justified Further telling you that I saw most of the Lord of Strafford's arraignment and if my memory fail me not as little things as you have already done to me were by your selves laid to his charge as acts of Treason For which I saw him lose his head upon Tower-hill as a Traytor And I doubt not for all this that is done unto me but I shall live to see the Laws and Liberties of England firmly setled in despite of the present great opposers thereof and to their shame and confusion and so M. Bradshaw I have done with what I have now to say Upon which M. Bradshaw replied Lieut. Col. Lilburn you need not to have been so earnest and have spent so much time in making an Apologetical defence for this Councel doth not go about to try you or challenge any jurisdiction to try you neither doe we so much as ask you a question in order to your tryal and therefore you may correct your mistake in that particular Vnto which I said Sir by your favour if you challenge no Jurisdiction over me no not so much as in order to a tryal what do I here before you or what do you in speaking to me But Sir seeing I am now here give me leave to say
one word more and that is this I am not onely in time of peace the Courts of Justice being all open fetcht and forc't out of my house by multitudes of armed men in an hostile manner and carried as a captive up and down the streets contr●ry to all Law and Justice but I am by force of Armes still kept in their custody and it may be may be intended to be sent to them again who are no Guardians of the Law of England no nor so much as the meanest Administrators or executors of it but ought to be subject to it themselves and to the Administrators of it as is cleer by the Petition of Right c. yea the General himself And truly Sir I had rather die then basely betray my Liberties into their martiall fingers who after their fighting for our Freedoms would now destroy them and tread them under their feet that have nothing at all to do with me nor any pretended or reall civill offender in England I know not what you intend to do with me neither do I much care having learned long since to die and rather for my Liberties then in my bed It s true I am at present in no capacity effectually to dispute your power because I am under guards of armed Masketiers but I intreat you if you will continue me a prisoner that you will free me from the military Sword and send me to some Civil Gaol and I will at present in peace and quietnesse obey your command and go And so I concluded and was commanded to withdraw which I did and then Mr. William Walwin was called in and while he was within I gave unto my Comrades Mr. Prince and Mr. Overton and the rest of the people a summary account of what had past between me and them And within a little time after Mr. Walwin came out again and Mr. Overton was called in next And at Mr. Walwin's coming out he acquainted us what they said to him which was in a manner the same they said to me and all that he said to them was but this That he did not know why he was suspected To which Mr. Bradshaw replyed Is that all you have to say And Mr. Walwin answered Yes So he was commanded to withdraw And after M. Overton was come out M. Prince was called in and after he had withdrawn they spent some time of debate among themselves and then I was called in again So I marched in Sutable to my first posture and went close to M. Bradshaw who said unto me to this effect Lieut. Colonel Lilburn this Councel hath considered what you have said and what they have been informed of concerning you and also of that duty that lies upon them by the command of the House which enjoynes them to improve their utmost ability to find out the Author of this Book and therefore to effect that end they judge themselves bound to demand of you this question Whether you made not this Book or were privie to the making of it or no And after some pause and wondring at the strangeness of the quesion I answered and said M. Bradshaw I cannot but stand amazed that you should ask me such a question as this at this time of the day considering what you said unto me at my first being before you and considering it is now about eight yeers ago since this very Parliament annihilated the Court of Star-chamber Councel board and High Commission and that for such proceedings as these * See the Acts that abolished them made in the 16 C. R. printed in my Book called The peoples Prerogative p. 22. 23. 24. 25. And truly Sir I have been a contestor and sufferer for the Liberties of England these twelve years together and I should now look upon my self as the baseft fellow in the world if now in one moment I should undo all that I have been doing all this while which I must of necessity do if I should answer you to questions against my self For in the first place by answering this question against my self I should betray the Liberties of England in acknowledging you to have legall Jurisdiction over me to try and adjudge me which I have already proved to your faces you have not in the least And if you have forgot what you said to me thereupon yet I have not forgot what I said to you And Secondly Sir If I should answer to questions against my self and so betray my self I should do that which not onely Law but Nature abhorrs And therefore I cannot but * And well might I for M. John Cook and M. Bradshaw himself were my Counsel at the Lords Bar against the Star-chamber the 13 of Feb. 1645. where M. Bradshaw did most excellently oppen the Star-chamber injustice towards me and at the reading of their first Sentence he observed to the Lords that that Sentence was felo de se guilty of his own death the ground whereof said he being because M. Lilburn refused to take an oath to answer to all such questions as should be demanded of him it being contrary to the Laws of God Nature and the Kingdom for any man to be his own Accuser whose words you may more at large read in the printed Relation thereof drawn up by M. John Cook and my self p. 3. But he that condemned it in the Star-chamber now practiseth it in the Councel of State but the more base and unworthy man he for so doing wonder that you your selves are not ashamed to demand so iilegall and unworthy a thing of me as this is and therefore in short were it that I owned your power which I do not in the least I would be hanged before I would do so base and un-Englishman like an Action to betray my Liberty which I must of necessity do in answering questions to accuse my self But Sir this I will say to you My late Actions have not been done in a hole or a corner but on the house top in the face of the Sun before hundreds and some thousands of people and therefore why ask you me any questions Go to those that have heard me and seen me and it is possible you may finde some hundreds of witnesses to tell you what I have said and done for I hate holes and corners My late Actions need no covers nor hidings they have been more honest then so and I am not sorry for what I have done for I did look well about me before I did what I did and I am ready to lay down my life to justifie what I have done And so much in answer to your question But now Sir with your favour one word more to minde you again of what I said before in reference to my Martiall imprisonment and truly Sir I must tell you Circumstantials of my Liberty at this time I shall not much dispute but for the Essentials of them I shall die I am now in the Souldiers custodie where to continue in silence and