have an account of my own Doctrine in above an hundred Books of which I leave Posterity to judge L. Yes we hear what is said against you for your Rebellious Doctrine in former times M. I then gave the World an account in my Book called Political Aphorisms or a Holy Common-wealth written for Monarchy by Mr. Harrington's Provocation what moved me to be on the Parliaments side and I know nothing that they have charged on my Doctrine but the words of that Book which I revoked long ago and some Clauses in my Saints Rest which I expunged before the King came in And if my later writings as my Second Plea for Peace written purposely to satisfie them of my present judgment be not regardable why do they call me to retractations And if the Act of Indempnity have done nothing against our former Actions all General Monk's Army and the rest such that restored the King must expect the like reward if death deliver them not from mens wrath L But why should you not give over Preaching when you are silenced Have not the Bishops power to silence and degrade as well as to ordain or the Parliament at least M. We doubt not but the Magistrate hath power to hinder Preachers from doing mischief and to restrain those that Preach Rebellion Sedition or Heresie or that do more hurt than good But not on that pretence to hinder good and to forbid Christs Ministers to Preach his Gospel Bishops and Senior Pastors are Investing Ministers of Christ to ordain fit Men to the Ministry and judge of their fitness to that end And if men prove uncapable by Apostacy or Heresie or Perfidiousness they ought to do as Cyprian did about Martial and Basilides require the Congregation in the name of Christ to forsake them But they have no power to forbid any faithful Minister to do the Office to which he is ordained nor to forbid the people to hear them And if they do their Commands are nullities as to any Obligation to Obedience L. But they that give you the Office may take it away M. He that giveth it as a Donor may which is Christ but not he that only as a Servant delivereth that which his Master gives If you send a Servant to deliver a Man Possession of House Land Horse Money c. That Servant cannot take it from him at his pleasure I do not think that the Priest that Marryeth Men can unmarry them when he will If he could I think he would have more work I scarce think the Patron that giveth one a Benefice can take it away when he will which is more alienable than the Office. A man cannot renounce it himself when he will who hath some more power of himself than the Bishop hath Do you not know that all are agreed that the Office of the Ministry is as Marriage during Life and not for Tryal or at Pleasure except in case of Adultery Therefore the Papists say that Ordination maketh an Indelible Character Of this all Parties are agreed L. But why say you the Ordainers do not give you the Power but as Investing Ministers you are not called immediately by Christ as the Apostles were who then doth give it you if not the Ordainers M. 1. The Office lyeth in an Obligation to great labour and great patience as well as in a gift of power It is a power to work in a suffering state And as the Bishop can oblige no man to this against his will so neither can he oblige any man farther than Christ and his own consent oblige him Therefore it followeth that neither can he give the power farther than Christ giveth it and the Ordainers and People and Magistrates have each their part under Christ in the conveyance L. How doth Christ give Ministers their Office M. 1. He maketh a Law that there shall be a Ministry and specifieth the Office by describing their work and the necessary qualification of the Persons So that it is not left to Bishops nor any to alter the Office nor to admit any uncapable Persons into it 2. Next Christ blesseth Mens Preparatory Studies and endeavours and by his gifts and grace doth give them all Ministerial Abilities 3. He maketh them desirous and willing of the Office and Work in Love to the blessed Effects and so maketh them Consenters 4. His Providence bringeth them where their Labours are really needful 5. He moveth the minds of the Flock or Electors to desire chuse or accept them 6. He commandeth the Ordainers to Approve and Ordain those that are thus qualified as aforesaid 7. He commandeth Magistrates to protect and encourage them 8. He commandeth the Neighbour Church-Pastors to own them in their Neighbourly Communion Thus you may see how Ministers are made by Christ tho' not without mans Service Do you know how God maketh Marriages 1. He instituteth the State and by his Law maketh the Husband the Ruler of the Wife 2. He causeth their natural Capacity and Inclination 3. His Providence acquainteth them with each other And 4. He moveth them to Consent And 5. He maketh it the Ministers Duty to do his part so that the Husbands power is of God. Do you know who giveth the Lord Mayor and Sheriffs of London their Power 1. The King by Charter determineth what Power they shall have and how they shall be qualified and how chosen and how sworn and invested 2. The Citizens accordingly choose them 3. And the Recorder Sweareth them Who is it now that giveth them the Power The King's Charter tho' not till they be duly qualified and chosen The Recorder cannot depose them again No nor the Citizens who may do more unless it be in the Charter L. But what Sin fear you by ceasing your ministry M. 1. We fear the guilt of Perfidious breaking of our Ordination Vow by which we solemnly obliged our selves to diligent performing of our Ministry The Bishops put those of us on this whom they ordained who now would force us to violate it 2. Therein we fear the guilt of Sacriledge as alienating Persons consecrated to God. And we can judge it to be no better than Pharisaical Hypocrisie in them that aggravate the Sacriledge of alienating consecrated Utensils and Lands and yet will alienate consecrated Persons and take it to be well done whereas the Lands and Goods are but to serve the Persons who are nearer to God while they serve him 3. We fear the Sin of Cruelty Unmercifulness and the guilt of Damning Souls As if we were commanded to forbear feeding our Children or the Poor we should expect to be charg'd with Murdering them if they died of Famine by our Neglect 4. We fear being charged with fighting against Christ or as Enemies to his Kingdom and to his Saving Work He was so great an Esteemer of Souls and Holiness that by the greatest of Miracles he came in Flesh to redeem and sanctifie and save Men And if we starve and betray them to Satan by our neglect
said at the Grave than in the Pulpit L. But some say none of those words signifie the persons Salvation but his removal hence M. Read them If those do not none do L. But some say that by Excommunicate is meant Excommunicable or such as ought to be Excommunicate and then what more can you desire M. Their saying is a presumptuous contradiction to that which they consent to what reason have they for it Is Excommunicate and Excommunicable all one Or may they put what sense they list on Laws If they do but tell the Bishops this much they will make them know that they are not made Judges of who is Excommunicable When I have craved but the alteration of that word they answered me with contempt that so every Priest or Curate should have the power of damning whom he please But sure Siâ—encing our judgment of a man is not damning him But what place is there for any doubt when the Book nameth the three sorts excepted exceptio firmat regulam in non exceptis Yea the express exposition in the Canon â—8 is If he shall refuse to Christen the one or bury the other that is Any brought except the party deceased were Denounced Excommunicate Majori Excommunicatione for some grievous and notorious Crime and no man able to testifie of his repentance he shall be Suspended by the Bishop of the Diocese from his ministry by the space of three months And alas how many thousand Infidels Hobbists Sadducees Hereticks Adulterers Thieves Perjured Scorners at godliness c. are among us unexcommunicated If all in England be saved except the Unbaptized Excommunicate and Self-murtherers which de singulis one by one must be said of all the rest either Scripture and Pulpits are much mistaken or else we that live among men are in a dream and our senses are all deceived CHAP. XVII Point XIV Of Consenting to Read the Apocrypha L. WHat harm is there in reading the Apocrypha M. I told you that we scruple not reading most of it in the place of Homilies or other Books especially the books called Wisedom and Ecclesiasticus But 1. Many Bishops and Doctours of the Church of England have accused the books of Tobit of down right lies and the books of Iudith Bell and Dragon c. as being meer fictions 2. And when we read these it is to be done in the same order as we read the Scripture by the name of Lessons which is the Title given to the Chapters read out of the Old and New Testament 3. And if we could yet read all these that will not serve unless we declare our Assent Consent and Approbation of the Appointment of them in the book which we cannot do L. But they are for the most part to be read but on week days or holy days M. The Conforming Clergy Consent and Covenant to the Imposition that requireth them to read the Common-Prayer every day in the week unless they be hindred by sickness or some urgent cause And so it is still the publick Service God's Service is all to be done with holy Reverence and if the Book of Tobit and some others be guilty of so many gross falsehoods as Protestants have and do still accuse them of I fear both to use them as Lessons in the place of God's Word lest it be prophanation and also to subscribe or declare my Approbation of the Calender and that use lest I be guilty of the sin of all the Ministers in England that so use it And it 's dangerous to seem to tell the people that so many books are God's Word that are not such For they understand not the Greek word Apocrypha and every Reader at least that is not Licensed to Preach is forbidden by the Canon to expound even that one word to them CHAP. XVIII Point XV. Of Assenting to Mistranslations and Subscribing that they are not contrary to the Word of God. L. ARE not the Epistles and Gospels used according to the last Translation M. Yes in the new Books they are but the Psalms are not L. What great mistranslations are there M. Sometimes a whole Verse or more is left out and sometimes the Translation is quite contrary to the Text. As Psal. 105. 28. They rebelled against his word instead of They rebelled not against his word And in the Book which this justifieth are many in the Epistles and Gospels I have cited them at large elsewhere L. How cometh there to be so many faults in the old Translation M. The work was an excellent good work But the Authors it seems for want of skill in the Hebrew followed the Septuagint Greek translation which hath these and many such defects L. Sure it is lawful to use and follow the Septuagint for the Apostles did so in the New Testament M. 1. The Apostles some times use it and sometimes follow the Hebrew against it and sometimes neither 2. But to Use it is one thing and to Justifie it is another thing It was in common use in the time of Christ and his Apostles and they used that in speaking to the people which use made intelligible and acceptable And we scruple not using it But all the works of Man are imperfect as Man is And why must we subscribe that there is nothing in it contrary to the word of God When as every mistake in it is contrary to it L. It seems then you would not subscribe to the Bible that there is nothing in it contrary to the Word of God M. I will subscribe to the truth of all that is in the true Copies of the Original if there by any such And I will subscribe that the various Lections in those Copies that we have are not the failing of the Holy Ghost or Apostles nor are such as leave us in just doubt of any necessary Truth And I will subscribe to the Translation so far as it agreeth with the Original But I will not subscribe that any Translation is perfect or faultless or to this or that Hebrew or Greek Copie as if in every word or Lection it certainly agreed with the Autographs And why should men make snares for the Church by imposing Professions that any mere man's works are perfect when all mortal men are confessedly imperfect Is it not enough peaceable to use them and to profess that all the word of God is infallible Truth L. But I cannot think that an Approbation of all the Translations is intended in your Assent and Consent M. Are they no part of that which is contained in the Book and prescribed by it Or could not the Parliament speak sense Chap. XIX Point XVI Of Consenting to reject all from Communion who desire not our Episcopal Confirmation L. ME thinks you that have written a Book for Confirmation should not scruple consenting to this M. I told you that I am so far from scrupling the true use of Confirmation that I think it is the want of it that is the greatest corruption of
containeth ANY THING in it that is repugnant to the Scriptures let him be Excommunicated ipso facto and not restored but by the Bishop of the place or Arch-bishop after his Repentance and publick Revocation of such his wicked Error And when this Excommunication is sent from the Ordinary to the Minister you heard he must publish it twice a year L. And what have you against this M. Do I need to tell you 1. Judge by this with what Face the Prelates call us Puritanes or Catharists as if we pretended to perfection and to be without sin And whether it be not they that are far liker to the Catharists We confess that the best of our Prayers Preaching or Works hath somewhat in them repugnant to the Word of God For Gods Law is perfect and every sin in matter or manner or end or degree is repugnant to it Far be it from us Pharisaically to justifie any Book that ever we write as if we had no sin in it But these men that call themselves the Church of England do not only justify a large Volume of Forms Orders Rubricks and Kalenders c. but also force all other men to justifie it all as sinless and he shall be no Minister that will not do it nor a Christian Member of the Church that denieth it As if the perfection of their works were an Article of the Creed and necessary to Salvation to be believed Is not this Puritanism Pharisaical and Justification of Works 2. Judge by all that I have in this Book cited whether there be nothing at all in their Books that is repugnant to the Word of God. If I have made it past all modest denial then what a dreadful thing is this Renunciation of Repentance when Repentance is the condition of the pardon of all our sin even that which cleaveth to our Worship of God. But they that tell the World that their Works have no sin yea and force all the Kingdom to stand to that justification do in a very high degree renounce Repentance Yea they not only forbid all men to call them to repent or to amend any sin that is in their Book but Excommunicate them as wicked that do it 3. I told you before that this Excommunicating ipso facto is in it self a prophane subversion of the very nature of true Excommunication which supposeth due means to convince the Person that his words or deeds are sin and that of an intollerable degree and that he be heard speak for himself and be admonished and earnestly perswaded to repent and not Excommunicated till after all this he continue impenitent But here men are Excommunicated for saying that there is somewhat faulty in mens works and that before ever they are heard speak for themselves or ever told of their sin or called to repent I before referr'd you to what Spalatensis de Rep. Eccles. hath written to prove the great sinfulness of such Excommunicating Bishop Ier. Taylor writing against it yet feigneth this excuse that it must be understood but of the Minor Excommunication But Excommunication it is and I do not think that they can make any good sense of their distinction of Major Minor Excommunication unless it be that the Major declareth men to be no Christians and the Minor only to be scandalous Christians not cut off from the Catholick Church but only for the present suspended from being owned while they are under patient tryal whether they will prove impenitent or not that shame may drive them to Repentance But this Suspension is properly called Excommunication But both of them require a just tryal 4. It is a heinous injury and injustice to Excommunicate and Ruin men for Truth and Duty He that robbeth them by the High-way doth but take their Money and doth not also accuse them falsly and make their duty to be their sin Doubtless he that will take all that I have because I do my duty to God in Praying or Preaching doth me more wrong than he that will take all without accusing me 5. It is a publick turning Christs Ordinance against himself and serving Satan by it to make faithful Christians odious in the World as unworthy to live in humane Society out of Jayls if they do but exhort others to repent If a man but know and detect the least sin in their Books of Service he must be condemned of wicked Error and Drunkards and Whore-mongers and Perjured Rogues do seem to be no worse than he 6. If it were an Error to say that their Book is not faultless yet it can never be proved an Error of that magnitude and wickedness as to deserve Excommunication ipso facto For all men on Earth have Errors worse than that and so by proportion they virutally or consequentially Excommunicate all men L. But all this is their fault and not yours M. It 's mine if I publish their Excommunication L. If an Innocent Man be hang'd the Hang-man is Innocent He doth but his Office. M. Whatever he may be in Cases unknown to him and which he was not bound to know I will not believe you in a known or knowable Case If I had been commanded to Crucifie Christ to Stone Stephen to burn the Martyrs I do not believe that I could have done it without the guilt of Murder Else you may make a Man's command to Justifie the Execution of any Murder or Injustice in the World. L. But you may shift off such wicked Excommunications and leave the Publishing them to your Curate M. 1. I may not draw another into such heinous Guilt nor connive at his doing it in my Charge 2. There are but few Country Ministers that have Curates 3. If I do it not I am guilty of it if I declare my Consent to Accuse all such within fourteen days that the Ordinary may do it and to Covenant and Swear Canonical Obedience to him 4. What can be more pernicious to the Church of God than to cast good Men out of it and dismember Christ's Body and lay those in Jayls as unsufferable wicked Men whom Christ takes for his Members whom he will save and all this for telling Prelates that their Book is faulty and desiring any amendment of their work while Swarms of flagitious Men are endured and by this encouraged to scorn at Conscience and fear of Sinning and to take their wicked lives to be better than the Godly Conversation of those that are used far worse than they Thus Christ foretold his Apostles that they should be cast out of the Synagogues But as he found and saved the healed Man Ioh. 9. whom the Pharisees had cast out so he will own and gather his Flock and take their wrong as done to him Chap. XXIV Point XXI Of Publishing Excommunications according to the Fifth Canon about the Articles L. WHat is the Fifth Canon and its Excommunication M. Whosoever shall affirm that Any of the 39 Articles agreed on 1562. are in any part Superstitious or Erroneous or
the Ordainers investing action This is it which we mean in the Controversie which may not be done twice 2. Or it may signifie the meer words of the Ordainers and Ordained which make up the said Moral action We deny not but the same words repeated may make up one Moral Ordination If the Bishop by tautology repeat them twice or thrice Or if they should to satisfie men of divers Languages that are present be first spoken in English and after in French or when some that doubted require it should go over them again all this is but one Ordination L. How prove you that our Bishops intend any more when they say it is only to satisfie the Law that you may be capable in England M. 1. That it is not a meer relation to some particular cure that they mean is undenyable 1. Because they call that by the name of Institution and Induction and not of Ordination 2. Because they never ordain any over and over upon removals 3. Because the words of Ordination in the Book tell it us 2. That they do it not as a Repetition of the same valid Ordination is past doubt 1. Because the same repeated by the same men will not serve 2. It is to be done again ten or twenty years after the first 3. He is to be fined in an hundred pound that administreth the Sacrament without it 4. He is taken for no true Minister without it which cannot be true of a bare repetition of words No reasonable men would lay so much on that 3. It is undeniable that they take men for unordained and no Ministers till they ordain them 1. Because they all disown reordaining they know that the Canons called the Apostles and the whole antient and later Church condemn it as like Anabaptistry and no one Bishop in England will not renounce it Therefore its certain that they take the first Ordination for null 2. And they have so declared their judgment in many words and writings and in the Act of Uniformity it is plainly intimated in the penalty L. And what harm is there in being twice Ordained M. 1. Ad hominem I need not dispute it All the Bishops disclaim it as unlawfull so that we have their confession 2. It is the same fault as Anabaptistry If they be blameless why make you such a noise against the Anabaptists To be twice made a Christian and twice made a Minister is of the like kind 3. It is something causelesly to cast our selves under the Censure of all the Church that hath been against it and to be condemned by them 4. It is a plain prophanation of God's holy name and of a great and holy Ordinance by Lying and taking Godâ—s name in vain For they are said to be now admitted to the Office and this day to receive it and God is told that they are now called to it And all their Examinations and Answers imply that they were no Ministers before and the Bishop saith Receive the Holy Ghost for the Office and work of a Priest now committed to thee by the Imposition of our hands which all imply it not done before And in so sacred a contract with God to lie to him and prophanely abuse his name and the holy Ghosts and the Duty of Prayer and Praise is tremendous Be not deceived God is not mocked 5. It is a confederacy with Corrupters and Usurpers that arrogate and appropriate valid Ordination to themselves and a confirming all their injury to posterity that all that shall hereafter imitate them may be encouraged by alledging our Re ordination 6. It is a hainous injury to all the other Reformed Churches as if we degraded their Ministers and separated from them all as no Churches For one part of them have no Diocesans and the rest have Bishops that at the Reformation were Ordained by Presbyters 7. It is contrary to one of the Articles of our Religion 23. These we ought to judge them lawfully called and sent which be chosen and called to this work by men who have publick authority given to them in the Congregation to call and send Ministers c. But in other Countries Presbyters have publick authority given them And Art. 36. The book of Consecration doth contain all things necessary to such consecration and Ordaining But it hath nothing for Re-ordaining those before Ordained 8. It is a plain condemnation of the Church of England which hath professed Communion with the Reformed abroad as with true Ministers and Churches of Christ. And we are now told that to communicate with Schismaticks induceth the guilt of Schism 9. It introduceth Anabaptistry or utter confusion into the Nation leaving men in doubt whether for fourteen years the people had any true Baptism while it's a controversie whether Lay-mens Baptizing be valid and Mr. Dodwell maketh all men to be out of any Covenant-title to Salvation that have not the Sacraments from a Minister that hath successive Episcopal Ordination And all Christians must question whether they have not so long here lived out of the Church of Christ without Ministery and Communion Do you think that none of these nine Reasons prove Re-ordination sinful L. But because the Bishops deny it let me hear your proof that the former Ordination here by Presbyters is not a nullity M. I. Ad hominem the Church of England hath as I said judged the like valid in the Reformed Churches by holding Communion with them I cited a great number of Bishops and Doctors in my Christian Concord L. But they say that necessity differeth their case from ours here And even Doctour Sherlock tells you that if God make necessity necessity will make Ministers But ours Schismatically pull'd down the Bishops and now disown the very Order M. There is a satisfactory concession in these words but the accusations are made up of falsehood and deceit 1. Archbishop Vsher and others that thought the Ejectors of Episcopacy were guilty of Schism yet maintained that their Ordination was valid He told me how he pleaded it to the King. 2. Do they think that Salmasius Blundel and all others that have written more against our Prelacy than the English were deprived of it against their wills by necessity 3. What necessity can they pretend to the Hollanders Helvetians Geneva Embden Bremen the Palatinate and Scotland heretofore might they not have had Prelates when they would 4. Was not the necessity far more notorious to those that I now plead for They lived in a Land where Episcopacy was cast out and kept out by a potent Army I think there were but four or five Bishops alive when it was restored 5. It is false that they cast out the Bishops Those Ministers that joyned with the Parliament to cast them out were Ordained by Bishops and therefore are none of the men that we are speaking of These that were Ordained by Presbyters were then young men at School or in the Universities And what are other mens actions to them L. But
take on them to be necessary interpreters of its great difficulties If such men forbear that expounding which they forbid others till they will do it better the loss will be the less Scripture speaketh plainlier than this 2. But who giveth this exposition To expound the Law by a common obligatory Exposition is proper to the Law-makers He that maketh the words maketh not a Law if he make not the sense Judges make not the sense but decide particular Cases by it as they understand it The Canons are made by the Convocation which he that denyeth to be the Representative Church of England is Excommunicate The Pulpit Preachers nor the particular Bishops are not the Convocation and therefore have not power to expound their Canons by any Common obligatory exposition much less contrary to the express words Which way most of the Clergy went under Bishop Parker Grindal and Abbot is well known And yet now they are so far from being taken for the Expositors of the Churches sense that they are openly scorned as popular fautorer of Puritans and those of their mind called Grindalizers II. But it is the second that is the Trojan horse whose name is Legion I mean that hath many more evils in the belly of it viz. that we must profess that the three Books Articles Liturgy and Ordination are so utterly faultless that there is nothing in them Contrary to the word of God and that we Assent and Consent to all contained and prescribed in and by them L. What have you against this what is there in it that is contrary to God's word M. God's word is perfect and forbids the least faulty errour or defect If we had never seen the Book we know that men made it and that every one that made it had ignorance error and sin and can a perfect faultless volumn be made by such faulty men Operari sequitur esse They renounce all pretensions to Infallibility in the Articles of Religion L. You interpret the words rigorously By nothing contrary they meâ—n nothing so contrary as that one may not use the Books M. If by nothing they mean not nothing and if by contrary they mean not contrary we will better know what they mean before we subscribe else you may make it lawful to subscribe to any thing in the world and say that the Imposers mean better than they speak L. And Assent and Consent is expresly confined to the use M. 1. I shall prove that that is not true 2. That if it were true it no whit amends the matter nor maketh it lawful to us I. It is not true For. 1. The words of the declaration are as expresly universal as man can speak And the foregoing words to the use do speak but deâ—fine and the words of the Declaration de mediis And all Lawyers agree that when the title of a Law expresseth the End that limiteth not the sense of the words of the Law because the Means may be larger than the End. As the Oxford Act of Confinement is in the title to keep Nonconformists from Corporations And yet Lawyers resolve that it extendeth also to Conformists if one of them should but once preach in a Conventicle The Parliament and Prelates thought that the way to secure the Vse was to oblige them to Assent and Consent to all in the Book contained and prescribed 1. Therefore they ty all to declare in that same form of words and to add no other least they should make any exposition that limits them 2. And the word Assent signifieth an Act of the understanding which must have Truth for its object 3. And it is after exprest by the word Approbation whereas a man may use that which he doth not approve of 2. Oaths Covenants and Professions must be taken in the most usual proper sense unless another be exprest to be the Imposers meaning which is not here done and the words are most universal and without exception 3. And to put all out of doubt the Parliament expounded themselves 1. At the making of the Act this was debated and reasons given against the limited expressions which prevailed 2. Since then a new Act against Conventicles being made it was moved in the Lords House that seeing Non-conformists were thus far forbidden private worship they should be so far invited to Conformity as that a Proviso might be added to this Act that the Declaration in the Act of Uniformity should be understood to oblige men but to the Vse of the things required and the Commons rejecting that Proviso it came to a debate or conference between the two Houses where the Commons gave their reasons against that sense and proviso In which the Lords acquiesc't Though I was not present the Parliament-men that were reported this and I never met with man that contradicted it or questioned the truth of it II. But if it were otherwise it were to us never the better For 1. It were an ignorant reproach of the Church of England to say that they have put any thing in their Liturgy which is of no use This will Include every syllable They themselves tell you in their Prefaces what use the very Calender and every other part are of The use of the Articles of Faith and Doctrines is our understanding assent and belief of them in order to Love and Practice The use of the orders in the Rubrick is to oblige us to obedient practice and so of all the rest And to Assent approve and Consent to every thing contained and prescribed practically even to the use of them is more than a bare speculative assent L. Wherein lyeth the sin of such a Declaration M. 1. In general it is incredible as I said before in consideration of the matter and the Authors together The Book of Articles Liturgie and Ordination are a big Volumn and contain great variety of matter and that high and mysterious The Authors were every one of them men of imperfection that had ignorance error and sin And operation exceedeth not power Who dare say that any Sermon or Prayer that ever he maketh hath nothing in it but what he may assent and consent to Much less so great a Book 2. The Articles which must be subscribed as faultless say Art. 15. Christ alone is without sin But all we the rest though baptized and born again in Christ yet offend in many things and if we say that we have no sin we deceive our selves and the truth is not in us And Art. 21. General Councils For as much they be an Assembly of men whereof all be not governed with the Spirit and Word of God they may err and sometimes have erred even in things pertaining to God And are our Convocation more infallible than General Councils The Church must be exemplary in humility and is it humility to say we Bishops and Priests having written three Books he shall not preach Christ's Gospel that will not declare that there is not a word in them that is
during the Iewish Policy command them to use such a Discipline much more in his own Churches L. What are your other Reasons for it M. 2. The very Nature of Christ's Church required it which is a Society separated from the World under special Laws of Holiness and Love and for special heavenly Ends If therefore it shall be confounded with the World and not separated to Christ it is no Church 3. Christ did it for the Honour of himself and his Kingdom If he be no more for Holiness than the Infidel and Heathen World is what is he better than they or how is he a Saviour or what is the Church better than Infidels 4. It is needful to save Heathens from deceit that would come into the Church and to convince them that their impure Communion is insufficient 5. It is needful to save Christians from damning deceit that they may not think that a dead barren unholy Faith and Name of Christianity will save them without a holy obedient Heart and Life 6. It is needful to keep Christ's Ordinances from falsifying Profanation If a sealed Pardon and Gift of Life shall in the Sacraments be given as commonly to Dogs as Children it is a taking God's Name in vain and profane belying Jesus Christ. 7. It is needful to bring Sinners to Repentance that they may be Pardoned and Saved 8. And it is needful to the comforting absolution of Penitents 9. Accordingly God 's Church in all Ages hath owned it as their Law of Christ's institution to this day L. But some learned Men say This was but because there was at first no Christian Magistrate But when there was such the Discipline fell into their hands M. The first Christian Magistrates finding the Church in Possession of it confirmed it and too much accumulated and added to it but took it not away Of this see a small Book which I wrote of the Magistrates Power in Religion to Dr. Lud. Moulin which may end all this dispute Briefly I ask you Qu. 1. Would you have all Infidels and Pagans baptized and Communicate without any Profession of the Christian Religion first L. God forbid That 's a Contradiction M. Shall any words go for a Profession or what must that Profession be L. It must be a Profession of Christian Faith and Obedience M. Who must try and judge of that Profession whether it be Christianity or not Is it Magistrates or Pastors L. Magistrates have somewhat else to do Else they must study and exercise that work alone for they will have no time for Civil Government if they undertake this M. Did not Christ institute an Office for it and give them this Power of the Keyes And if one half that Office cease as soon as Magistrates were Christians why not the other half and so Magistrates must Preach Baptize and celebrate the Sacrament L. It must be no doubt the Ministerial Office to judge who is fit to be in Church Communion Else they were Slaves if they must be forced to take all uncapable Men to their Charge and Communion against their Consciences and Wills No Physician Tutor or School-Master will be forced to take such Patients Pupils or Scholars as will not be ruled by him and will make make him do what they list against his Will. M. You must confess the use of discipline or else openly disown the Word of God the very Being of the Church and the Judgment of the Universal Church to this day And do you think then that to deprive the Church of this is a lawful part of Conformity L. How prove you that the Laity is deprived of it M. 1. In our Great Parishes the People are few of them known to the Priest or to one another Of the two Parishes of my last abode I do not think but there are Fifty Thousand unknown to the Minister and to each other And how can these admonish the Offenders or the Minister exercise this discipline upon unknown Persons 2. The People know that it is in vain to begin where there can be no progress To what purpose is it to tell the Church when it 's sure to do more harm than good 1. The swarm of the Vicious is so great that they cannot be Prosecuted 2. The Minister himself forbeareth it as unpracticable 3. The accused must be Prosecuted at rates which Men cannot bear 4. And before Bishops that cannot possibly do this work to one of a Thousand any more than one School-master can Try and Correct all the faulty Scholars in a Diocess 5. And Men must be Judges that will never call Sinners to Repentance with Ministerial Evidence and Love and Patience but like Secular Courts bid them Recant or be Excommunicate 6. And the Cause must be decided by Lay-men that profanely usurp the Power of the Keys And how is Christ's discipline here possible Polluted common Churches frighten away the Religious conscionable People L. Do you not before complain of too much exercise of Discipline by Excommunications M. Yes of Discipline against Christ It is not enough for your Churches to be common and unclean without true Discipline but when you should drive out the Dogs and Swine you turn out the Children Witness all the fore-mentioned Canons As I said you first force in all the ignorant ungodly multitude that are unfit then these are the strength and major part Then they cannot come under due Discipline then this grieveth Religious People and they find fault with it And then they must be taken for Schismaticks and condemn'd and ruin'd for finding fault In short what need there disputing Is it not notorious matter of fact that this Discipline is not exercised against one Drunkard Swearer Fornicator c. of a multitude and are not Men then deprived of the use of it And when it 's known that they cannot have it in most or many Parishes how are they bound to live and die without the benefit of it L. Do you think Men are bound to separate from all Churches that have not this Discipline Sure it is not Essential to the Church M. I do not think that Preaching as distinct from reading is essential to a Church but that it may be at least for a time a sorry Church without it as those in Moscovy are But I would not continue in such a Church that is without it if I can have a better It 's one thing what a Man should endure that can have no better without more hurt than good and another thing what Men should chuse in obedience to Christ and for their own and the Churches good that can attain it Do you think it is lawful to omit all Duty that is not essential to the Church surely your many humane Offices your Forms and Ceremonies your Declarations and Subscriptions to them are further from being essential than true Discipline is and yet you think that the omission of these is unsufferable Is mans accidental inventions more necessary than Christs Ordinance and Church
are past doubt that to subject a Nation to a foreign Iurisdiction is to stigmatize it with the most odious Perjury Seeing as the Oath of Supremacy sweareth all expresly against it so the foresaid Corporation Oath Vestery Oath Militia Oath Oxford Oath and Vniformity Subscription have sworn or engaged the Nation never to endeavour any Alteration of Government in Church or State And if a foreign Iurisdiction be no Alteration we know nothing capable of that Name And when we see some of the same men at once endeavour to make us take such Oaths on pain of Ruin and to design to bring all under the Guilt of breaking them when we have done men think it best to take no more of them than is necessary till they see whether they must be kept or broken XXII Plagues Flames Poverty Convulsions that have befaln Corporations of late years makes us the more afraid of the sins which are like to be the Cause And the Earl of Argyle 's Case makes us afraid of stretching Expositions of Oaths And the Londoners have sped so ill by such stretching Expositions as confirmeth us in our Purpose to avoid them XXIII If we wilfully sin on pretence of Liberty to preach the Gospel we cannot expect God's Blessing on our Labours And then what is our preaching worth XXIV We read how joyfully many Martyrs in Queen Mary's days endured the Flames rather than grant the real Presence in the Mass And we that fear far greater sin must rather suffer than commit them XXV As we dare not Conform against Conscience so to lay by our Ministry while we can exercise it we take to be Sacrilege Covenant-breaking with God and Treachery and Cruelty to the Souls of Men. XXVI We are sure if all the Ministers should conform it would be so far from healing the Church that it would widen the Breach For the Dissenting People would be tempted to go the further from us all and think that none of us were to be trusted as many have turn'd further already on some such Accounts XXVII We are Commonly agreed that no men have right from God to Silence all the Ministers in the Land And we are fully satisfyed that Conformity to the things aforesaid being a Sin all the Ministers in England ought to have been Non-Conformists and then the Act of Uniformity had silenced them all XXVIII Lastly the dreadful effects of Canonical and the like Impositions the sufferings of Godly Minsters Congregations Cities Countries and Persons thereupon our doleful divisions especially among Ministers the evil Spirit that possesseth multitudes to cry down Love and call for Vengeance and the prospect of what is going on do affright us from approving consenting to or using the Engines that thus divide us and the Canons that are battering down our Peace and consequently to be guilty of all the Atheism Prophaneness Malignity Popery Persecution and Calamity to this Land which are like to come in at the breach of our Walls which the battery of those Canons and Engines make A Jayl and a Fire or a Gallows is an easier place than a bed where Conscience shall charge such Evils home upon us much more then the Judgments which the True and Righteous Judge of the World will shortly execute on Lyers Malignants or Persecutors of his Flock yea of the least of those that Christ will call Brethren at that day I have oft said if any Church-History of one man be credible St. Martin wrought many Miracles and when the Bishops about him being bad men to get down the Priscillian Gnosticks worse than our Quakers did 1. Seek help of the Magistrate's Sword 2. And bring strict Godly persons under suspicion of being Priscillianists Martin renounced their Communion by resolved separation to his death save that once at the Emperour's desire he Communicated with them on condition the Emperour would spare the lives of some condemned as Priscillianists and even for this was rebuked and chastized by an Angel if his Scholar and Companion Sulpitius Severus a Learned Godly man be to be believed CHAP. LVII Of the Reasons for Conformity L. NOW I will tell you what I hear said against your Non-Conformity and I will give you leave to answer the Objections as we go on Obj. I. It 's commonly said that you are Fanatick persons that build all your dissent on your own private Spirits and pretended Impulses and In spirations M. Have I pleaded with you any such Impulses or Inspirations as the Reasons of our Dissent Is there any such thing in above 100 Books that I have written Did we use any such Argument in our Dispute with the Bishops but the Papists call every mans Faith that is his Own and not taken meerly on trust as the Churches Faith by the Name of a Private Spirit L. Obj. II. They say you make a Schism and Stir for meer tristes and things indifferent viz. Ceremonies and Liturgy confessing that they are not unlawful M. 1. And what if they say that we are Turks or Heathens or have Horns and are Brutes what remedy have we To their honour be it spoken we would not hope to confute them 2. Do you not know that so far are we from this that even under the old easier Impositions we protested to the Bishops in our Petitions for Peace That we would yield to any thing but Sin against God and we endeavoured to prove Conformity sinful And do they well agree with themselves when Dr. Stilling fleet saith that I would represent Conformity such as should make them seem a company of Perjur'd Villains 3. I pray you tell me whether the 52. Points now opened by me be nothing but Liturgy and Ceremonies and whether you take them all to be things indifferent Is it not an odd sort of Accusers that we have that sometimes say we suspect the Nation of common Perjury and the Church of Subverting Corruption and overthrow of Discipline and Excommunicating Christs Faithful Servants and shortly after say We Dissent only about things Indifferent God have mercy on those miserably Souls that take such things for Indifferent 4. Who is it troubles the Land with their things Indifferent Is it we Did we devise them Do we impose them on any and say Vse our things indifferent or we will Silence you or Excommunicate you and lay you in Iayl with Rogues Be such things imposed as Indifferent L. III. They say you hold your Opinions in obstinate wilfulness and have no Reason to give for them and therefore are not to be born with as weak Brethren M. So said the Arians of the Orthodox and the Heathens of the Christians It 's a fine World when ignorant ungodly Lads are heard tell such men as were Dr. Reignolds Iohn Fox Amesius Blondel Dailee Chamier c. We can't allow you so much as the esteem of weak Brethren I do not think but some of their School boys might soon be taught by a Bishop to say thus to their Masters 2. But do all
practise Physick in London The Posts Walls and Gates are stickt with Physicians offers to cure the Lecherous pox To day I read Kirleu's Bill that saith he hath cured eight hundred of that disease I dare bet with you all the Money I have that if you enquire not eight or perhaps two of that eight hundred were Puritans or such as you now cast out for Non-Conformists unless you call Papists or such other Non-Conformists except any of them were Wives that catcht it of Husbands that are of your Church or Parishes and not of us or Husbands that catcht it of such conformable or Papist Wives But of these things we need no defence 3. But if our hearers be bad they have the more need of teaching and whether more are converted from ignorance sensuality worldliness and prophaneness by their teaching or ours ask others and not us L. Obj. XIV But they say that it 's by you that we are in danger of Popery because you keep up their hopes of a toleration by your divisions weakning us M. They may of the two say more probably it is we that bring in Prelacy Lay Excommunicators Ceremonies Liturgies For of the two we have done less against these than against Popery and stand not at so great a distance from them The impudency of some men is the shame of depraved humane nature They know that it is for being more against Popery than they are that our ruine is so implacably endeavoured They know that the Papists are our chiefest prosecutors thinking that if they could destroy us as their greatest adversaries they should bring the Church of England to their will and that it is but appropriating the name of Popery to the Italian Faction that set the Pope above Councils and calling the rest by a better Name and cutting off a few shreds named by Heylin in the Life of Arch-bishop Laud and it 's done They know that it is for drawing so near to Popery that the Non-Conformists Dissent from them and take it for granted that those men that are labouring to bring in Popery are the forwardest to make this putid accusation of us and that it hath been their labour these two and twenty years to have forc'd us to yield to an universal toleration and to petition for it that they might bring in Popery and then say it is we that did it and that for denying this and being unreconcileable to Popery the Papists are so unreconcileable to us as that nothing will satisfy them but our utter extirpation of which they would make blind sensual debauched malignant men that call themselves Protestants the instruments And how many of their pillars have written for a foreign Jurisdiction and defend Grotius I have told you before And to this day that Priest that is nearest to Popery is the bitterest enemy to the Non-Conformists and most preacheth for their destruction And these brazen-faced men cannot endure an honest Conformist that doth but preferr Protestants that dissent from their fetters before the Papists And those Bishops and Arch-bishops and the very Church of England in their times that were most against Popery are their scorn and hatred as you may see in Heylin's reproach of Arch-Bishop Abbot and the Bishops and Convocation except six Bishops in his days And by the base scorns that they now pour out against good Arch-Bishop Grindal calling such men as would strengthen us against Popery by reconciliation by the names of Grindalizers and Trimmers and such as would betray the Church And how they reproach and use Dr. Whitby for his Protestant Reconciler and Mr. Bold for his Sermon and the Author of the four Pleas of the Conformists for the Non-Conformists and such others you know The Author of the Reflections and the Samaritan they have not yet found out Mr. Tho. Beverley feareth them not The Bishop of Hereford Dr. Crofts the first man that ever I saw go forth with a Troop raised by his Brother for the King and his Sermon in my Pulpit the first that ever I heard against the Parliament when the King was in Yorkshire and he himself had been a Papist and is still zealous for their Church cause because he wrote the Book called Naked Truth to heal us and strengthen us against Popery they gnash the Teeth at him and so they do at Dr. Barlow Bishop of Lincoln that wrote of the treasonable principles of Papists tho' these Bishops are too big for them yet to vilify and openly oppose L. You may be more against Popery than they and yet bring it in imprudently by dividing us M. Who do you think in your Conscience is liker to bring it in we or they Who hath done and suffer'd more to keep it out We lay down all that we have to that end They will not part with a Ceremony or one Oath or a Re-ordination or an Excommunication of Christs Members to keep it out but plainly tell us that they had rather Popery came in than abate a jott of their Self-made Religion or Impositions or than such as I should Preach the Gospel But I confess I am not able to deny it that the Non-Conformists may be the occasion of bringing in Popery by way of Antiperistasis some men hate us and all serious Godliness so much that they are like enough to be for Popery because godly men are against it And I fear lest they that see the Non-Conformists would reform their Prelacy and Church-Courts and reduce them to the Primitive Episcopacy described by Bishop Vsher will be so much afraid lest they lose some of their Wealth and Domination by it that some of them will hearken to the Papists that will promise them an Encrease of that which they so esteem And indeed it is already no strange thing to hear them say They had rather the Papists came in with Popery than the Dissenters with their Reformation I think ere long you are like to be convinced more effectually than by Writing which Party is liker to bring in Popery and to turn Papists In the mean time I begin to praise Stephen Gardiner and such others for their Modesty that when they burnt Cranmer Ridley Hooper Philpot Rogers and the rest that they did not charge them with bringing in Popery and say we burn you for that L. XV. They say that you stretch the Words of the Oaths Declarations Subscriptions Liturgy and Canons to an ill sence by a rigorous Interpretation which was never the Meaning of the Authors and on that you ground your Dissent M. 1. I hope you will grant that when the things that men fear whether justly or mistakingly no less than deliberate Lying Perjury and Contracting by Justification the Guilt of many hundred thousand Perjuries and Swearing or Covenanting never to repent or endeavour that the Nation should repent of heinous Church-Corruptions or amend them and the nullifying of the Ordination and Ministry of thousands and Unchurching almost all the Protestant Churches and more such like a
forward to meddle with more publick Church matters without our Superiors invitation or consent but we may say that it is our judgment that these additions following would greatly strengthen the Interest of Religion Church and Concord I. That the Parish Churches be acknowledged True Churches and their Ministers such Overseers as are necessary to Essentiate True Churches that is That all Presbyters be Episcopi Gregis Overseers of the Flock and the Incumbent the President among his Curate Presbyters where there be such And that the Diocesan is not the sole Essentiating Church Pastors and the Diocesan Church the lowest particular Church and the Parish Assemblies but his Chapels or Parts of the lowest Church and the Parish Ministers his Curates and no true Pastors II. That no Lay-Elder Chancellour or Civilian have or use the Decretive Power of Excommunication or Absolution called the Keys III. That New and more Peaceable Canons be made instead of that Book which now obtaineth according to the Scripture Canons Or that there be no Canons but Scripture besides Statute Laws IV. That Bishops have no Forcing Power nor the Writ de Excommunicato Capiendo or any Force by the Sword be Annexed to Excommunication as such but that the Magistrates hear and judge before they punish and Obedience to Bishops be unconstrained and voluntary V. That Bishops judge Church-Causes in Session with their Presbyters and not alone nor with some few of their own Choice or with Lay-men but in regular Synods and Ordain there by their consent and after sufficient trial of them that seek Ordination And so of Institution VI. That Diocesses be not greater than the Diocesan is able to Oversee and that he forbid not the Parish Pastors their particular works but only use his general overcight and power on Appeals VII That Bishops oft visit the inferior Pastors and Churches and instruct the Juniors by direction and Example how to Preach and guide the Flock and rebuke the Erroneous Scandalous Unpeaceable and Negligent VIII That the Bishops be Chosen by the Diocesan Synod and Consented to freely without force by their City flocks where they reside and Invested by the King who hath the power of Temporal Privileges IX That the City and neighbour Pastors be the Cathedral Dean and Prebends at least where City Churches want maintenance or that they ambulatorily Preach abroad where there is most need X. If Arch-Bishop Usher's Form or Reduction of Government to the Primitive state or else King Charles the Second his Declaration about Ecclesiastical Affairs be but setled by Law it will be a Healing and Great Reformation inferior Synods not hurtfully fettered being allowed under the Diocesan Synods And whether the Diocesans be Called Bishops or Arch-Bishops as Successors to the Apostles and Evangelists in the ordinary parts of their Office a general care of many Churches the name is to be left to each mans free judgment As to the ignorant clamors for a real or seeming Re-ordination 1. I have said so much against it in my Treatise of Episcopacy and my Disputation of Ordination in my Dispute of Church-Government and my Christian Concord that while the objectors by contempt refuse to read and answer them it will be no cure of their pride and partiality to repeat the same again But I say that I have fully proved unanswered that they that were Ordained by Synods of Incumbent Pastors and specially those also then approved by the Westminster Assembly had a better Ordination and that by true Bishops than either Papists or meer English Diocesans that are not Arch-bishops can give And yet they Re-ordain not Papists 1. Either they take the Parish-Churches that is the Pastor and Communicants distinct from the meer Auditors and Catechumens and from the Aliens to be true proper Churches in political Sense or not If yea Then those Churches have Bishops For Ecclesia est plebs Episcopo adunata ubi Episcopus ibi Ecclesia Their own Principle is That it is no proper political Church without a Bishop There are three degrees of Bishops 1. All Presbyters are Episcopi Gregis by the consent of Papists and Protestants 2. The chief Incumbents that have Curates or may have are Episcopi Praesides The Ordination without Diocesans was by these two sorts of Bishops 3. True Diocesans are Arch-bishops Episcopi generales plurium Ecclesiarum We refuse not their Ordination but Men have true Episcopal Ordination without it But if they say that the Diocesan is the lowest Bishop of a particular Church and that the Parish-Incumbent Rectors are no true Bishops and their Assemblies no true political Churches formed of Bishops but only parts of one Diocesan Church infimi Ordinis we abhor such Tyrannical Schismatical Diocesans and their pretence of proper power to Ordain and the Primitive Church had never any such Ordaniers or Bishops And I advise all Ministers neither to be Re-ordained by such nor to yield to the appearance of such an evil by coming under their equivocating imposition of hands lest they take God's Name in vain and harden Papists and Church-Tyrants in their false condemnation of the Reformed Churches If it be want of a legal right in England that they pretend let the Magistrate give you a Licence or Legal right I write not this for my own interest for I was Ordained by a Diocesan and am past all hopes or fears of Man. CHAP. LX. The Reasons of these ten Articles L. YOV must give me leave to tell you what objections are like to be raised against your proposed Articles of Reconciliation And first your own party will be unsatisfied in them and so they will do no good because here is not a word against Arch-bishops Bishops Deans Arch-deacons and the rest that bear office in their Courts which yet is the thing that you your self seem most to dissent from and which the Covenant did renounce M. 1. We have so much swearing and unswearing and forswearing that I will meddle as little as I can in things that look like Perjury You know that as the last Generation was sworn against Prelacy this new Generation is sworn to it Yea in a manner the whole Land is sworn or covenanted never to endeavour any alteration of it And how much soever I am against that Oath yet I will meddle as little as I can in urging men to that which they take for Perjury And I have elsewhere told you that the Covenant renounced not all Episcopacy many of the Assembly of Divines declared their dissent from any such renunciation and had entred their protestation against it as Dr. Cornel. Burges told me had not the Explication been added which confineth the Renunciation to the English frame And that the present Non-Conformists would have thankfully received the Primitive Episcopacy they shewed by their motion 1660. 2. We offer this form on supposition that we may not have what we think best but what we can joyfully submit to for our Concord and the Churches safety 3. I have
Laws that all the Kings Subjects shall be extirpated that will not subscribe There is not one word in all the Statute Book or the most Learned Law-Books contrary to the Word of God and that the London Dispensatory hath no errour in Medicine and that no Licensed Book hath any errour in Divinity Verily if the Bishops and Clergy of England cannot give us better proofs of their infallibility or that their publick imposed Books are as free from errours as Adam was before his fall than by making all subscribe or swear or declare in the Church that it is so cowards may say your Lordships and Reverences have never an erroneous word but few men will believe it ever the more yea it will be the less believed that needeth such a proof as this Even as men would take him to be never the more an unerring Philosopher Lawyer or Physician who could force all the apprentice boys and women in the Town to swear that he is such Try first to make all the Kings Subjects of one opinion in all points of Learning Law or Trading and of one degree of wit and of stature and complexion and then hope to make them all of one measure of understanding not only in the substance of Religion but in all the little things that Bishops call indifferent and do or may impose L. But you run upon the Errour that all must have so great knowledge according to our rules as to know the Lawfulness of all Lawful things We know no Church-men reach so high But the way to Concord must be by obeying the Church in all cases that are doubtful to the Subjects M. 1. It 's well that you limit it to doubtful cases But what if I am past all doubt e. g. that it is a sin to make our sort of God-fathers the vowing Covenanters in Baptism excluding the Parents to cast out all from Christian Communion that scruple kneeling in the reception to deny Christendom to all that refuse our God-fathers and Crossings to pronounce all in England at Burial saved except the unbaptized excommunicate and self-murderers to profess that It is certain by the word of God that Infants excepting none baptized and dying before actual sin are undoubtedly saved To assent to a false rule to know Easter-day with many such What must I do in such undoubted cases 2. Tell us plainly Is it all doubted cases or some only in which you say we must obey If not all till you tell us which and how to know them you talk in vain If all what if men doubt whether Polygamy Lying Fornication c. be lawful Or what if a Papist doubt whether King-killing be lawful and the Clergy command it must it therefore needs be done 3. And I pray you tell us where and when it is that men must obey this rule Was it a duty in England in the days of Thomas Becket Anselm Dunstan c. or in the Reign of all the Kings that were Papists Is it a duty now in France Spain Italy Bavaria Austria c. or in the Dominion of the Turks Persians Tartarians China c Must all Subjects every where do all commanded them If they have but ignorance enough to be in doubt themselves sure they are bound to receive God's Light to overcome those doubts and in errour it is not obedience in Evil but seeking truth till they find it that is their duty But If you limit this Rule to Christians is it to all Christians If to Orthodox Rulers are the Subjects any fitter to judge whether their Kings and Bishops are Orthodox or not than whether the things imposed be good or bad If you dare say That all Subjects are bound to be of the Religion which their Kings or Bishops say is right speak out and you will need no confutation It 's granted by all sober men that as Rulers have the judgment of publick decision so every reasonable man must judge by private discerning whether his Actions be agreeable to God's Commands or not It is not Brutes and Infants but Men that have the use of reason that Kings and Bishops rule 4. But if you are stiff in the contrary opinion that all men must implicitely believe the King and Prelates in all that ignorance can but make them doubtful of I hope you have more brains than once to dream that ever you shall bring all the Kingdom to unite in this opinion and to lay by their reason and confess themselves Ideots or Brutes that must not labour to know whether they keep or break God's Supream Law or if you must rule men on these terms you must keep them in fetters and not at liberty And I pray you dishonour not the King so much as to make him a King of Beasts and Ideots and not of Men or Christians or at least expose him not so much to the Power of Usurpers as to say that his Subjects are not the Discerning Iudges who is their True and Lawful Soveraign and who not and if they must judge whether all their actions be agreeable to the Kings Laws or not lest they be hang'd or punished allow them also to judge whether or no they be agreeable to God's Law lest they be damned If men once believe that God is not their Supream Governour no wonder if they believe that Kings have no Governing right nor any are bound in conscience to obey them for who can give Governing Authority or who can bind Conscience to obey it but the absolute Soveraign the Almighty God L. Experience confuteth all that you have said what Countries live in greater Vnity than those that have procured and kept it by violence and do endure no Dissenters as Spain and Italy M. It seems you know not what you say 1. The Pope and Spaniards and Italians allow greater differences by many degrees than those that you condemn Dissenters for their Iesuits and Dominicans Thomists Scotists Nominals Durandists c. differ so much from each others in Doctrinals about God and Grace and Free-will and Providence and the Cause of Sin and many other Points that the Volumes they have written for their several Opinions make up huge Libraries which employ the hard studies of the most Learned men in the World and are as far as ever from being ended 2. The Iansenists and Iesuits differ not only in such Doctrines about Predestination Redemption Grace Free-will Perseverance c. but also about abundance of Doctrines commonly called Moral as about Murder Perjury Fornication Stealing c. as you may see in the Books lately published by the Iansenists against the Iesuits And though approved general Councils have made the doctrine of Deposing Excommunicated Princes and Absolving their Subjects from their Allegiance and giving their Dominions to others to be a very part of their Religion yet are not the Papists agreed in it but the Germans in the days of the Emperours Frederick Otho Henry 4th and 5th c. and the French to this day are
make us wish all the Sermons unpreach'd which we have preach'd and all the Books unwritten which we have written and all the Souls unconverted who have repented Q. 42. VVhen Ionas over-ran an unpleasing Ministery did not God overtake him with his Judgment And if we prove Ionasses may we not expect to meet with Storms more terrible than Jails Q. 43. Can all this said and done against such in the world ever make the sober that knew them believe that such a man as Anthony Burges Mr. Porter Mr. Hildersham the Son Mr. Hughes Mr. Richard Allen and hundreds much like them were worthy Silencing Imprisonment and Shame while such as fill some thousand Churches are worthy of maintenance and honour Or will sober Posterity who read the Lives and VVritings of such men as Iohn Corbet Ioseph Allen Iames and Iohn Ianeway and abundance such others believe that they were as bad as their accusers make them There is but one way to bring them under the Infamy and Odium of Posterity and that is the Papists way to kill all that are of another mind and to drive Truth and Conscience out of the world and then who would stay behind Q. 44. VVho did Christ mean by the Hypocrite that seeth a mote in his brothers eye and could not see the beam in his own VVas it not the Pharisee that blamed Christ's Disciples for crossing their Ceremonies and Traditions and saw not all the crimes in themselves recited Mat. 23. And is not the scrupling of a thing called by others Indifferent a mote in the eye of many truly godly persons I will not offend you by describing the beams Q. 45. Have we not often offered that as soon as any true reason can tell us that our Labours are here needless by the sufficient number and quality and labours of others we will joy fully be silent and seek for work where there is need Till then to starve souls is to be guilty of their damnation And if Meeting-Chapels be wanting why do not the great and rich Conformists build them Q. 46. Is it not a pleasing advantage to Papists if they can see two thousand of those Minister who are most against them silenced and driven from Cities and Corporations and made a hunting game and scorn and the Kingdom crackt by general divisions as turned into Guelphs and Gibelines weekly reviling and deriding each other as Whiggs and Tories Is it not their design to banish Conscience and absolute Obedience to God And you know who ruleth where God and Conscience doth not rule And what is it that the unconscionable will not do for worldly interest And did not the Papists always know that our Love and Concord would be our strength and their terrour Q. 47. Who is it that was or is able to cure all these our divisions It never was in our power nor yet is unless damning our souls by willful sin must be the cure For we have oft offered our Oaths that nothing but fear of sin shall hinder us from conforming If our fear come from ignorance do the Churches suffer none more ignorant than we But how easy were it with others without sin or cost to cure all Q. 48. Is it not God's great Mercy to our Land that we have had twenty years peace while other Lands have been miserable by Wars And if it be the Preachers of the Gospel that yet will give the Land no peace but cry out execute prosecute suffer not strike home and their judgment be the executioners encouragment who say The Clergy tells us it is our duty I had rather answer them with tears than words Q. 49. Should not the long and universal experience of the Christian VVorld be some warning to us which these thousand years hath been broken into shreds by the contentions of the Clergy and their Magisterial needless impositions and by forsaking the Primitive purity and simplicity Q. 50. Are not these words in the Liturgy before the Sacrament very terrible If any of you be a hinderer or slanderer of God's Word or be in malice or envy Repent of your sin and come not to this Holy Table lest after the taking of the Sacrament the Devil enter into you as he did into Iudas and fill you full of iniquities and bring you to destruction of Body and Soul And are not the Words of our Judge more terrible Mat. 25. Depart from me ye cursed into everlasting fire prepared for the Devil and his Angels For I was hungry thirsty a stranger naked in prison c. In as much as ye did it not to one of the least of these ye did it not to me And these shall go away into everlasting punishment but the Righteous into Life eternal O let me never be one of those who for nothing shall run on such a doom Q. 50. If yet objections or the mis-understanding of our cause do frustrate all these reasons I have answered so many objections and so far opened the cause already as here is not to be repeated viz. In the First and Second Pleas for Peace In the Apology for our Preaching and in the Treatise of Episcopacy And against the judgment of those Reverend Fathers who still cry Abate nothing and suffer them not do Execution I set the judgment I. Of the King 1. In his Declaration from Breda 2. His healing Gracious Declaration about Ecclesiastical Affairs 1660. 3. And that of 1662. II. The Judgment of the late House of Commons Ian. 10. 1680. Resolved that it is the Opinion of this House that the prosecution of protâ—stant Dissenters upon the Penal-Laws is at this time grievous to the Subjects a weakning the Protestant Interest and dangerous to the Peace of the Kingdom III. Christ's Canon-Law 1 Iohn 4. 8 16. He that Loveth not knoweth not God for God is Love God is love and he that dwelleth in Love dwelleth in God and God in him Joh. 13. 35. By this shall all men know that ye are my Disciples if ye have Love one to another Rom. 14. 17 18. The Kingdom of God is not Meat and Drink but Righteousness and Peace and Ioy in the Holy Ghost For he that in these serveth Christ is acceptable to God and approved of Men. vers 1. Him that is weak in the Faith Receive we but not to doubtful disputations c. 1 Thes. 5. 12 13. We beseech you Brethren to know them which LABOVR AMONG you and are over you in the Lord and to esteem them very highly in Love for their WORK sake and be at Peace among your selves 1 Sam. 2. 30. Them that honour me I will honour and they that despise-me shall be lightly esteemed ENGLANDS SLAVERY Q. 1. IS not Silencing taking all we have and lying in Jaile among Rogues from six Months to six Months till we die greater Slavery than the Turks inflict on Christians Q. 2. What is this for And on what sort of Men Q. 3. Who be they that have caused and continued it after 27 Years Experience of the effects Q. 4. What is Diabolism if this be not Q. 5. Why is not publick Repentance of it proclaimed * And Bucer thought so too when â—e so earnestly wrote for another sort of Disciplâ—ne to King Edw. 6. The Story of the King of Cappadocia and his Brotâ—â— that conspired with some Nobles to depose him and take his Kingdom and how the Senate of Rome detected the Plot and defeated it by the help of Cicero then Proconsul there is worth the reading in Cicero's Epistles Read the Lord St. Alban's Considerations of Reconciling and Edification of the Church of England and his Advertisement on the present Church-Controversies and see whether he thought there was no need of Reformation And Judge Hales Papers of Religion See the Lord Bacon about Subscription in his foresaid Considerations Dedicated to King Iames. This was written 1683. This was â—ritten when â—he Duke of Monmouth's Treason was most noised and the Dissenters cryed down