an exceeding great number of Men of the better sort that had been so educated as that in their Youth having read the Books written by famous Men of the ancient Grecian and Roman Common-wealths concerning their Politie and great Actions in which Books the Popular Government was extoll'd by that glorious Name of Liberty and Monarchy disgraced by the Name of Tyranny they became thereby in love with their Forms of Government and out of these Men were chosen the greatest part of the House of Commons or if they were not the greatest part yet by advantage of their Eloquence were always able to sway the rest Fifthly The City of London and other great Towns of Trade having in admiration the prosperity of the Low-Countries after they had revolted from their Monarch the King of Spain were inclin'd to think that the like change of Government here would to them produce the like prosperity Sixthly There were a very great number that had either wasted their Fortunes or thought them too mean for the good Parts they thought were in themselves and more there were that had able Bodies but saw no means how honestly to get their Bread These long'd for a War and hoped to maintain themselves hereafter by the lucky choosing of a Party to side with and consequently did for the most part serve under them that had greatest plenty of Money Lastly The People in general were so ignorant of their duty as that not one perhaps of 10000 knew what right any man had to command him or what necessity there was of King or Common-wealth for which he was to part with his Money against his will but thought himself to be so much Master of whatsoever he possess'd that it could not be taken from him upon any pretence of common safety without his own consent King they thought was but a Title of the highest Honour which Gentleman Knight Baron Earl Duke were but steps to ascend to with the help of Riches and had no Rule of Equity but Presidents and Custom and he was thought wisest and fittest to be chosen for a Parliament that was most averse to the granting of Subsidies or other publick Payments B. In such a constitution of People methinks the King is already outed of his Government so as they need not have taken Arms for it for I cannot imagine how the King should come by any means to resist them A. There was indeed very great difficulty in the business but of that Point you will be better inform'd in the pursuit of this Narration B. But I desire to know first the several Grounds of the Pretences both of the Pope and of the Presbyterians by which they claim a Right to govern us as they do in chief and after that from whence and when crept in the Pretences of that long Parliament for a Democracy A. As for the Papists they challenge this Right from a Text in Deut. 17. and other like Texts according to the old Latin Translation in these words And he that out of pride shall refuse to obey the Commandment of that Priest which shall at that time minister before the Lord thy God that Man shall by the Sentence of the Judge be put to death And because as the Jews were the People of God then so is all Christendome the People of God now they infer from thence that the Pope whom they pretend to be the High-Priest of all Christian People ought also to be obeyed in all his Decrees by all Christians upon pain of death Again whereas in the New Testament Christ saith All Power is given unto me in Heaven and in Earth go therefore and teach all Nations and baptize them in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost and teach them to observe all these things that I have commanded you From thence they infer that the Command of the Apostles was to be obeyed and by consequence the Nations were bound to be govern'd by them and especially by the Prince of the Apostles St. Peter and by his Successors the Popes of Rome B. For the Text in the Old Testament I do not see how the Commandment of God to the Jews to obey their Priests can be interpreted to have the like force in the Case of other Nations Christian more than upon Nations Unchristian for all the World are Gods People unless we also grant that a King cannot of an Infidel be made Christian without making himself subject to the Laws of that Apostle or Priest or Minister that shall convert him The Jews were a peculiar People of God a Sacerdotal Kingdom and bound to no other Law but what first Moses and afterwards every High-Priest did go and receive immediately from the mouth of God in Mount Sinai in the Tabernacle of the Ark and in the Sanctum Sanctorum of the Temple And for the Text in St. Mathew I know the Words in the Gospel are not Go teach but Go and make Disciples and that there is a great difference between a Subject and a Disciple and between Teaching and Commanding And if such Texts as these must be so interpreted why do not Christian Kings lay down their Titles of Majesty and Sovereignty and call themselves the Popes Lieutenants But the Doctors of the Romish Church seem to decline that Title of Absolute Power in their distinction of Power Spiritual and Temporal but this distinction I do not very well understand A. By Spiritual Power they mean the Power to determine Points of Faith and to be Judges in the Inner Court of Conscience of Moral Duties and of a Power to punish those Men that obey not their Precepts by Ecclesiastical Censure that is by Excommunication and this Power they say the Pope hath immediately from Christ without dependence upon any King or Sovereign Assembly whose Subjects they be that stand Excommunicate But for the Power Temporal which consists in judging and punishing those Actions that are done against the Civil Laws they say they do not pretend to it directly but only indirectly that is to say so far forth as such Actions tend to the hindrance or advancement of Religion and good Manners which they mean when they say in ordine ad spiritualia B. What Power then is left to Kings and other Civil Sovereigns which the Pope may not pretend to be his in ordine ad spiritualia A. None or very little and this Power the Pope pretends to in all Christendome but some of his Bishops also in their several Diocesses Jure Divino that is immediately from Christ without deriving it from the Pope B. But what if a Man refuse obedience to this pretended Power of the Pope and his Bishops What harm can Excommunication do him especially if he be the Subject of another Sovereign A. Very great harm for by the Pope's or Bishop's signification of it to the Civil Power he shall be punish'd sufficiently B. He were in an ill Case then that adventured to write or speak
Learning there was none erected till that time thoogh it be not unlikely there might be then some that taught Philosophy Logick and other Arts in divers Monasteries the Monks having little else to do but to study After some Colledges were built to that purpose it was not long time before many more were added to them by the devotion of Princes and Bishops and other wealthy Men and the Discipline therein was confirmed by the Popes that then were and abundance of Scholars sent thither by their Friends to study as to a place from whence the way was open and easie to Preferment both in Church and Common-wealth The profit the Church of Rome expected from them and in effect receiv'd was the maintenance of the Popes Doctrine and of his Authority over Kings and their Subjects by School-Divines who striving to make good many Points of Faith incomprehensible and calling in the Philosophy of Aristotle to their assistance wrote great Books of School-Divinity which no man else nor they themselves were able to understand as any man may perceive that shall consider the Writings of Peter Lombard or Scotus or of him that wrote Commentaries upon him or of Suarez or any other School-Divine of later times which kind of Learning nevertheless hath been much admir'd by two sorts of Men otherwise prudent enough the one of which sorts were of those that were already devoted and really affectionate to the Roman Church for they believed the Doctrine before but admir'd the Arguments because they understood them not and yet found the Conclusions to their mind The other sort were negligent Men that had rather admire with others than take the pains to examine So that all sorts of People were fully resolv'd that both the Doctrine was true and the Pope's Authority no more than what was due to him B. I see that a Christian King or State how well soever provided he be of Money and Arms where the Church of Rome hath such Authority will have but a hard match of it for want of Men for their Subjects will hardly be drawn into the Field and fight with courage against their Consciences A. It is true that great Rebellions have been raised by Church-men in the Popes quarrel against Kings as in England against King John and in France against King Henry the 4 th wherein the Kings had a more considerable part on their sides than the Pope had on his and shall always have so if they have Money for there are but few whose Consciences are so tender as to refuse Money when they want it But the great mischief done to Kings upon pretence of Religion is when the Pope gives power to one King to invade another B. I wonder how King Henry the 8 th could then so utterly extinguish the Authority of the Pope in England and that without any Rebellion at home or any Invasion from abroad A. First the Priests Monks and Friars being in the heighth of their power were now for the most part grown insolent and licentious and thereby the force of their Arguments was now taken away by the scandal of their Lives which the Gentry and Men of good Education easily perceived and the Parliament consisting of such persons were therefore willing to take away their Power and generally the Common People which from a long Custom had been in love with Parliaments were not displeased therewith Secondly the Doctrine of Luther beginning a little before was now by a great many men of the greatest Judgments so well received as that there was no hope to restore the Pope to his Power by Rebellion Thirdly the Revenue of Abbies and all other Religious Houses falling hereby into the Kings Hands and by him being disposed of to the most Eminent Gentlemen in every County could not but make them do their best to confirm themselves in the possession of them Fourthly King Henry was of a Nature quick and severe in the punishing of such as should be the first to oppose his Designs Lastly as to Invasion from abroad in case the Pope had given the Kingdom to another Prince it had been in vain for England is another manner of Kingdom than Navarre Besides the French and Spanish Forces were employed at that time one against another and though they had been at leisure they would have found perhaps no better success than the Spaniards found afterwards in 1588. Nevertheless notwithstanding the Insolence Avarice and Hypocrisie of the then Clergy and notwithstanding the Doctrine of Luther if the Pope had not provoked the King by endeavouring to cross his Marriage with his second Wife his Authority might have remained in England till there had risen some other quarrel B. Did not the Bishops that then were and had taken an Oath wherein was amongst other things that they should defend and maintain the Regal Rights of St. Peter the words are Regalia Sancti Petri which nevertheless some have said are Regulas Sancti Petri that is to say St. Peter's Rules or Doctrine and that the Clergy afterward did read it being perhaps written in Short-hand by a mistake to the Pope's advantage Regalia Did not I say the Bishops oppose that Act of Parliament against the Pope and against the taking of the Oath of Supremacy A. No I do not find the Bishops did many of them oppose the King for having no power without him it had been great imprudence to provoke his anger There was besides a Controversie in those times between the Pope and the Bishops most of which did maintain that they exercised their Jurisdiction Episcopal in the Right of God as immediately as the Pope himself did exercise the same over the whole Church And because they saw that by this Act of the King in Parliament they were to hold their Power no more of the Pope and never thought of holding it of the King they were perhaps better content to let that Act of Parliament pass In the Reign of King Edward the 6 th the Doctrine of Luther had taken so great root in England that they threw out also a great many of the Popes new Articles of Faith which Queen Mary succeeding him restored again together with all that had been abolished by Henry the 8 th saving that which could not be restored the Religious Houses and the Bishops and Clergy of King Edward were partly burnt for Hereticks partly fled and partly recanted and they that fled betook themselves to those places beyond Sea where the Reformed Religion was either protected or not persecuted who after the decease of Queen Mary returned again to favour and preferment under Queen Elizabeth that restored the Religion of her Brother King Edward And so it hath continued till this day excepting the Interruption made in this late Rebellion of the Presbyterians and other Democratical Men. But though the Romish Religion were now cast out by the Law yet there were abundance of people and many of them of the Nobility that still retained the Religion of
they thought worthy even to be Senators of Rome and to give every one of the Common People the Priviledges of the City of Rome by which they were protected from the Contumelies of other Nations where they resided Why were not the Scotch and English in like manner united into one People A. King James at his first coming to the Crown of England did endeavour it but could not prevail But for all that I believe the Scotch have now as many Priviledges in England as any Nation had in Rome of those which were so as you say made Romans for they are all naturaliz'd and have right to buy Land in England to themselves and their Heirs B. It 's true of them that were born in Scotland after the time that King James was in possession of the Kingdom of England A. There be very few now that were born before But why have they a better Right that were born after than they that were born before B. Because they were born Subjects to the King of England and the rest not A. Were not the rest born Subjects to King James And was not he King of England B. Yes but not then A. I understand not the subtilty of that distinction But upon what Law is that distinction grounded Is there any Statute to that purpose B. I cannot tell I think not but it is grounded upon Equity A. I see little Equity in this that those Nations that are bound to equal obedience to the same King should not have equal priviledges And now seeing there be so very few born before King James's coming in what greater priviledge had those ingrafted Romans by their Naturalization in the State of Rome or in the State of England the English themselves more than the Scotch B. Those Romans when any of them were in Rome had their Voice in the making of Laws A. And the Scotch have their Parliaments wherein their assent is requir'd to the Laws there made which is as good Have not many of the Provinces of France their several Parliaments and several Constitutions and yet they are all equally natural Subjects to the King of France and therefore for my part I think they were mistaken both English and Scotch in calling one another Forreigners Howsoever that be the King had a very sufficient Army wherewith he marched towards Scotland and by that time he was come to York the Scotch Army was drawn up to the Frontiers and ready to march into England which also they presently did giving out all the way that their March should be without damage to the Countrey and that their Errand was only to deliver a Petition to the King for the redress of many pretended Injuries they had receiv'd from such of the Court whose Counsel the King most followed so they passed through Northumberland quietly till they came to a Ford in the River of Tine a little above New-Castle where they found some little opposition from a Party of the King's Army sent thither to stop them whom the Scotch easily master'd and as soon as they were over seiz'd upon New-Castle and coming farther on upon the City of Duresme and sent to the King to desire a Treaty which was granted and the Commissioners on both sides met at Rippon The Conclusion was that all should be referr'd to the Parliament which the King should call to meet at Westminster on the third of November following being in the same Year 1640. and thereupon the King returned to London B. So the Armies were disbanded A. No the Scotch Army was to be defrayed by the Counties of Northumberland and Duresme and the King was to pay his own till the disbanding of both should be agreed upon in Parliament B. So in effect both the Armies were maintain'd at the King's charge and the whole Controversie to be decided by a Parliament almost wholly Presbyterian and as partial to the Scotch as themselves could have wished A. And yet for all this they durst not presently make War upon the King there was so much yet left of reverence to him in the Hearts of the People as to have made them odious if they had declared what they intended they must have some colour or other to make it believ'd that the King made War first upon the Parliament and besides they had not yet sufficiently disgraced him in Sermons and Pamphlets nor removed from about him those they thought could best counsel him Therefore they resolv'd to proceed with him like skilful Hunters first to single him out by Men disposed in all parts to drive him into the open Field and then in case he should but seem to turn head to call that a making of War against the Parliament And first they call'd in question such as had either preached or written in defence of any of those Rights which belonging to the Crown they meant to usurp and take from the King to themselves Whereupon some few Preachers and Writers were imprisoned or forced to fly The King not protecting these they proceeded to call in question some of the King 's own Actions in his Ministers whereof they imprisoned some and some went beyond Sea And whereas certain persons having endeavoured by Books and Sermons to raise Sedition and committed other crimes of high nature had therefore been censured by the King's Council in the Star-Chamber and imprisoned the Parliament by their own Authority to try it seems how the King and the People would take it for their persons were inconsiderable ordered their setting at liberty which was accordingly done with great applause of the People that flocked about them in London in manner of a Triumph This being done without resistance the King 's Right to Ship-Money B. Ship-Money what 's that A. The Kings of England for the defence of the Sea had power to tax all the Counties of England whether they were Maritime or not for the building and furnishing of Ships which Tax the King had then lately found cause to impose and the Parliament exclaim'd against it as an oppression and one of their Members that had been taxed but 20 s. mark the oppression a Parliament-man of 500 l. a year Land taxed at 20 s. they were forced to bring it to a Tryal at Law he refusing payment and he was cast Again when all the Judges of Westminster were demanded their Opinions concerning the Legality of it of Twelve that there are it was judged legal by Ten for which though they were not punished yet they were afrighted by the Parliament B. What did the Parliament mean when they did exclaim against it as illegal Did they mean it was against Statute-Law or against the Judgments of Lawyers given heretofore which are commonly called Reports or did they mean it was against Equity which I take to be the same with the Law of Nature A. It is a hard matter or rather impossible to know what other Men mean especially if they be crafty but sure I am Equity was not their ground for
look'd to whereby the Interpretation of a Verse in the Hebrew Greek or Latin Bible is oftentimes the cause of Civil War and the Deposing and Assassinating of God's Anointed and yet converse with those Divinity Disputers as long as you will you will hardly find one in a hundred discreet enough to be employed in any great affair either of War or Peace It is not the Right of the Sovereign though granted to him by every man's express consent that can enable him to do his Office it is the Obedience of the Subject that must do that For what good is it to promise Allegiance and then by and by to cry out as some Ministers did in the Pulpit To your Tents O Israel Common People know nothing of Right or Wrong by their own Meditation they must therefore be taught the Grounds of their Duty and the Reasons why Calamities ever follow Disobedience to their Lawful Sovereigns But to the contrary our Rebels were publickly taught Rebellion in the Pulpits and that there was no sin but the doing of what the Preachers forbad or the omission of what they advis'd But now the King was the Parliaments Prisoner why did not the Presbyterians advance their own Interest by restoring him A. The Parliament in which there were more Presbyterians yet than Independents might have gotten what they would of the King during his Life if they had not by an unconscionable and sottish Ambition obstructed the way to their Ends. They sent him four Propositions to be signed and pass'd by him as Acts of Parliament telling him when these were granted they would send Commissioners to treat with him of any other Articles The Propositions were these First That the Parliament should have the Militia and the Power of Levying Money to maintain it for 20 years and after that Term the exercise thereof to return to the King in case the Parliament think the safety of the Kingdom concern'd in it B The first Article takes from the King the Militia and consequently the whole Sovereignty for ever A. The Second was That the King should justifie the Proceedings of the Parliament against himself and declare void all Oaths and Declarations made by him against the Parliament B. This was to make him guilty of the War and of all the Blood spilt therein A. The Third was To take away all Titles of Honour conferred by the King since the Great Seal was carried to him in May 1642. The Fourth was That the Parliament should adjourn themselves when and to what place and for what time they pleas'd These Propositions the King refused to grant as he had reason but sent others of his own not much less advantagious to the Parliament and desir'd a Personal Treaty with the Parliament for the setling of the Peace of the Kingdom but the Parliament denying them to be sufficient for that purpose voted That there should be no more Addresses made to him nor Messages receiv'd from him but that they would settle the Kingdom without him And this they voted partly upon the Speeches and Menaces of the Army-Faction then present in the House of Commons whereof one advised these Three Points 1. To secure the King in some Inland Castle with Guards 2. To draw up Articles of Impeachment against him 3. To lay him by and settle the Kingdom without him Another said That his denying of the four Bills was the denying Protection to his Subjects and that therefore they might deny him subjection and added that till the Parliament forsook the Army the Army would never forsake the Parliament This was threatning Last of all Cromwel himself told them It was now expected that the Parliament should govern and defend the Kingdom and not any longer let the People expect their safety from a Man whose Heart God had hardned nor let those that had so well defended the Parliament be left hereafter to the rage of an irreconcilable Enemy lest they seek their safety some other way This again was threatning as also the laying his hand upon his Sword when he spake it And hereupon the Vote of Non-Addresses was made an Ordinance which the House would afterwards have recalled but was forced by Cromwel to keep their word The Scotch were displeased with it partly because their Brethren the Presbyterians had lost a great deal of their power in England and partly also because they had sold the King into their hands The King now published a passionate Complaint to his People of this hard dealing with him which made them pity him but not yet rise in his behalf B. Was not this think you the true time for Cromwel to take possession A. By no means There were yet many obstacles to be removed He was not General of the Army The Army was still for a Parliament The City of London discontented about their Militia The Scots expected with an Army to rescue the King His Adjutators were Leavelers and against Monarchy who though they had helped him to bring under the Parliament yet like Dogs that are easily taught to fetch and not easily taught to render would not make him King So that Cromwel had these businesses following to overcome before he could formally make himself a Sovereign Prince 1. To be Generalissimo 2. To remove the King 3. To suppress all Insurrections here 4. To oppose the Scots and lastly To dissolve the present Parliament Mighty businesses which he could never promise himself to overcome therefore I cannot believe he then thought to be King but only by well serving the strongest Party which was always his main Politie to proceed as far as that and fortune would carry him B. The Parliament were certainly no less foolish than wicked in deserting thus the King before they had the Army at a better Command than they had A. In the beginning of 1648. the Parliament gave Commission to Philip Earl of Pembroke then made Chancellor of Oxford together with some of the Doctors there as good Divines as he to purge the University by vertue whereof they turned out all such as were not of their Faction and all such as had approved the use of the common-prayer-Common-Prayer-Book as also divers scandalous Ministers and Scholars that is such as customarily and without need took the Name of God into their Mouths or used to speak wantonly or use the company of lewd Women And for this last I cannot but commend them B. So shall not I for it is just such another piece of piety as to turn men out of an Hospital because they are lame Where can a man probably learn godliness and how to correct his vices better than in the Universities erected for that purpose A. It may be the Parliament thought otherwise for I have often heard the Complaints of Parents that their Children were debauched there to drunkenness wantonness gaming and other vices consequent to these nor is it a wonder amongst so many Youths if they did not corrupt one another in despite of their Tutors who
the House of Commons to shew they had not changed their Principles which after six readings in the House was voted to be printed and once a year to be read publickly in every Church B. I say again this re-establishing of the Long Parliament was no good service to the King A. Have a little patience They were re-established with two Conditions One to determine their sitting before the end of March another to send out Writs before their rising for new Elections B. That qualifies A. That brought in the King for few of this Long Parliament the Country having felt the smart of their former Service could get themselves chosen again This New Parliament began to sit April the 25 th 1660. How soon these called in the King with what Joy and Triumph he was receiv'd how earnestly his Majesty pressed the Parliament for the Act of Oblivion and how few were excepted out of it you know as well as I. B. But I have not yet observed in the Presbyterians any oblivion of their former Principles We are but returned to the state we were in at the beginning of the Sedition A. Not so for before that time though the Kings of England had the Right of the Militia in vertue of the Sovereignty and without dispute and without any particular Act of Parliament directly to that purpose yet now after this bloody dispute the next which is the present Parliament in proper and express terms hath declar'd the same to be the Right of the King only without either of his Houses of Parliament which Act is more instructive to the People than any Arguments drawn from the Title of Sovereign and consequently fitter to disarm the Ambition of all seditious Haranguers for the time to come B. I pray God it prove so Howsoever I must confess that this Parliament has done all that a Parliament can do for the security of our Peace which I think also would be enough if Preachers would take heed of instilling evil Principles into their Auditory I have seen in this Revolution a circular motion of the Sovereign Power through two Usurpers from the late King to this his Son for leaving out the Power of the Councel of Officers which was but temporary and no otherwise owned by them but in trust it moved from King Charles the First to the Long Parliament from thence to the Rump from the Rump to Oliver Cromwel and then back again from Richard Cromwel to the Rump thence to the Long Parliament and thence to King Charles the Second where long may it remain A. Amen And may he have as often as there shall be need such a General B. You have told me little of the General till now in the end but truly I think the bringing of his little Army intirely out of Scotland up to London was the greatest Stratagem that is extant in History FINIS Books lately printed for William Crooke at the Green Dragon without Temple-Bar 1682. DIVINITY SIxty one Sermons preached mostly upon publick occasions whereof five formerly Printed by A. Littleton D. D. Folio Brevis Demonstratio being the truth of Christian Religion proved by reason in Twelves p. 10 d. The primitive Institution shewing the Antiquity and usefulness of Catechizing by the Author of this Book price 12 d. A Funeral Sermon for a drown'd Man Octavo Mr. Howel's Visitation Sermon Quarto Dr. Hascard's two Sermons Quarto Mr. Maningham's Sermon Quarto A Sermon preached at the Savoy accused for Heretical French and English A modest Plea for the Clergy wherein is briefly considered the Reasons why the Clergy are so neglected by the Author of this Book Octavo H. Grotius's Catechism Greek Latin and English Octavo The Spirit of Prophecy proving that Christ and his Apostles were Prophets written by the Directions of and recommended to the Press by Dr. P. Gunning Lord Bishop of Ely Octavo The King-killing Doctrine of the Jesuites in a sincere Discourse to the French King written by a Roman Catholick in Quarto The Justifying Faith or the Faith by which the just do live Octavo Mercy Triumphant or the Kingdom of Christ inlarged beyond the narrow Bounds which have wont to be set to it by Ed. Lane Vicar of Sparsholt Quarto Responsio Valedictoria ad secundam Sandii Epistolam c. per Samuel Gardiner S. T. D. Du Moulin's Reflections Reverberated being a full Answer to his damning Doctrine also a Confutation of the railing of Edmond Hickeringgil by Ed. Lane in Quarto The Three last New HISTORY An Institution of general History or the History of the World being a Compleat body thereof in two Volumes by William Howel LL. D. and Chancellor of Lincoln Folio printed 1680. Historical Collection being an Account of the proceedings of the four last Parliaments of Queen Elizabeth wherein is contained the compleat Journals both of Lords and Commons of that time by Heywood Townsend Esquire Member in those Parliaments Folio printed 1680. A Chronicle of the late intestine Wars of the three Kingdoms of England Scotland and Ireland from 1639. to 1660. written by Mr. Heath since continued to 1674. by J. P. in Folio A Voyage into the Levant being a Relation of a Journey lately performed from England to Grand Cairo by Sir Henry Blunt Twelves pr. 1 s. Some years Travel into divers parts of Asia and Africa the great by Sir Tho. 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Attributes And the words God and Deity are of different signification Damascene a Father of the Church expounding the Nicene Creed denies plainly that the Deity was incarnate but all true Christians hold that God was incarnate Therefore God and the Deity signifie divers things and therefore Eternal and Eternity are not the same no more than a wise man and his wisdom are the same Nor God and his justice the same thing and universally 't is false that the Attribute in the Abstract is the same with the Substance to which it is attributed Also it is universally true of God that the Attribute in the Concrete and the substance to which it is attributed is not the same thing I come now to his next Period or Paragraph wherein he would fain prove that by denying Incorporeal Substance I take away Gods Existence The words he cites here are mine To say an Angel or Spirit is an Incorporeal Substance is to say in effect there is no Angel nor Spirit at all It is true also that to say that God is an Incorporeal Substance is to say in effect there is no God at all What alledges he against it but the School-Divinity which I have already answered Scripture he can bring none because the word Incorporeal is not found in Scripture But the Bishop trusting to his Aristotelean and Scholastick Learning hath hitherto made no use of Scripture save only of these Texts Who hath planted a Vineyard and eateth not of the fruit thereof or who feedeth a flock and eateth not of the milk of the flock and Rev. 4.11 Thou art worthy O Lord to receive glory honour and power for thou hast created all things and for thy pleasure they were created thereby to prove that the right of God to govern and punish mankind is not derived from his Omnipotence Let us now see how he proves Incorporeity by his own Reason without Scripture Either God he saith is Incorporeal or Finite He knows I deny both and say he is Corporeal and Infinite against which he offers no proof but only according to his custom of disputing calls it the root of Atheism and interrogates me what real thing is left in the world if God be Incorporeal but Body and Accidents I say there is nothing left but Corporeal Substance For I have denyed as he knew that there is any reality in accidents and nevertheless maintain Gods Existence and that he is a most pure and most simple Corporeal Spirit Here his Lordship catching nothing removes to the eternity of the Trinity which these my grounds he says destroy How so I say the Trinity and the Persons thereof are that one pure simple and eternal Corporeal Spirit and why does this destroy the Trinity more than if I had called it Incorporeal He labours here and seeketh somewhat to refresh himself in the word Person by the same grounds he saith every King has as many Persons as there be Justices of Peace in his Kingdom and God Almighty hath as many Persons as there be Kings why not For I never said that all those Kings were that God and yet God giveth that name to the Kings of the earth For the signification of the word Person I shall expound it by and by in another place Here ends his Lordships School Argument now let me come with my Scripture Argument St. Paul concerning Christ Col. 2.9 saith thus In him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead Bodily This place Athanasius a great and zealous Doctor in the Nicene Councel and vehement enemy of Arius the Heretick who allowed Christ to be no otherwise God then as men of excellent piety were so called expoundeth thus The fullness of the Godhead dwelleth in him Bodily Greek 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 id est 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 id est Realiter So there is one Father for Corporality and that God was in Christ in such manner as Body is in Body Again there were in the primitive Church a sort of Hereticks who maintained that Jesus Christ had not a true real Body but was onely a Phantasm or Spright such as the Latins called Spectra Against the head of this Sect whose name I think was Apelles Tertullian wrote a Book now extant amongst his other Works intituled De Carne Christi wherein after he had spoken of the nature of Phantasms and shewed that they had nothing of reality in them he concludeth with these words whatsoever is not Body is Nothing So here is on my side a plain Text of Scripture and two ancient and learned Fathers nor was this Doctrine of Tertullian condemned in the Council of Nice but the division of the Divine Substance into God the Father God the Son and God the holy Ghost For these words God has no parts were added for explication of the word Consubstantial at the request of the dissenting Fathers and are farther explained both in Athanasius his Creed in these words not three Gods but one God and by the constant Attribute ever since of the Individual Trinity The same words nevertheless do condemn the Anthropomorphites also For though there appeared no Christians that professed that God had an Organical Body and consequently that the Persons were three Individuals yet the Gentiles were all Anthropomorphites and there condemned by those words God has no parts And thus I have answered his accusation concerning the Eternity and Existence of the Divine Substance and made appear that in truth the question between us is whether God be a Phantasme id est an Idol of the Fancy which St. Paul saith is nothing or a Corporeal Spirit that is to say something that has Magnitude In this place I think it not amiss leaving for a little while this Theological dispute to examine the signification of those words which have occasioned so much diversity of opinion in this kind of Doctrine The word Substance in Greek Hypostasis Hypostan Hypostamenon signifie the same thing namely a Ground a Base any thing that has Existence or Subsistence in it self any thing that upholdeth that which else would fall in which sence God is properly the Hypostasis Base and Substance that upholdeth all the world having Subsistence not only in himself but from himself whereas other Substances have their subsistence only in themselves not from themselves But Metaphorically Faith is called a Substance Heb. 11.1 because it is the foundation or Base of our Hope for Faith failing our Hope falls And 2 Cor. 9.4 St. Paul having boasted of the liberal promise of the Corinthians towards the Macedonians calls that promise the ground the Hypostasis of that his boasting And Heb. 1.3 Christ is called the Image of the Substance the Hypostasis of his Father and for the proper and adequate signification of the word Hypostasis the Greek Fathers did always oppose it to Apparition or Phantasme as when a man seeth his face in the water his real face is called the Hypostasis of the phantastick face in the water So also in
that is Gods Vicegerent upon Earth and hath next under God the Authority of governing Christian Men and to observe for a Rule that Doctrine which in the Name of God he hath Commanded to be taught and thereby to examine and try out the truth of those Doctrines which pretended Prophets with miracle or without shall at any time advance c. And if he disavow them then no more to obey their Voice or if he Approve them then to obey them as Men to whom God hath given a part of the Spirit of their Soveraign Upon his Principles the case holdeth as well among Jews and Turks and Heathens as Christians Then he that Teacheth Transubstantiation in France is a true Prophet he that Teacheth it in England a false Prophet He that Blasphemeth Christ in Constantinople a true Prophet he that doth the same in Italy a false Prophet Then Samuel was a false Prophet to Contest with Saul a Soveraign Prophet So was the Man of God who submitted not to the more Divine and Prophetick Spirit of Jeroboam And Elijah for Reproving Ahab Then Michaiah had but his deserts to be clapt up in Prison and fed with Bread of Affliction and Water of Affliction for daring to Contradict God's Vice-gerent upon Earth And Jeremiah was justly thrown into a Dungeon for Prophecying against Zedekiah his Liege Lord. If his Principles were true it were strange indeed that none of all these Princes nor any other that ever was in the World should understand their own Priviledges And yet more strange that God Almighty should take the part of such Rebellious Prophets and justifie their Prophesies by the Event if it were true that none but the Soveraign in a Christian the Reason is the same for Jewish Commonwealth can take notice what is or what is not the Word of God T. H. To remove his Lordships doubt in the first place I confess there was true Prophesie and true Prophets in the Church of God from Abraham down to our Saviour the greatest Prophet of all and the last of the Old Testament and first of the New After our Saviour's time till the Death of St. John the Apostle there were true Prophets in the Church of Christ Prophets to whom God spake Supernaturally and Testified the truth of their Mission by Miracles Of those that in the Scripture are called Prophets without Miracles and for this cause only that they spake in the Name of God to Men and in the name of Men to God there are have been and shall be in the Church Innumerable Such a Prophet was his Lordship and such are all Pastors in the Christian Church But the Question here is of those Prophets that from the Mouth of God foretell things Future or do other Miracle Of this kind I deny there has been any since the Death of St. John the Evangelist If any Man find fault with this he ought to Name some Man or other whom we are bound to acknowledge that they have done a Miracle cast out a Devil or cured any Disease by the sole Invocation of the Divine Majesty We are not bound to trust to the Legend of the Roman Saints nor to the History written by Sulpitius of the Life of St. Martin or to any other Fables of the Roman Clergy nor to such things as were pretended to be done by some Divines here in the time of King James Secondly he says I make little difference between a Prophet and a Mad-man or Demoniack To which I say he accuses me falsly I say only thus much That I see nothing at all in the Scripture that requireth a belief that Demoniacks were any other thing than Madmen And this is also made very probable out of Scripture by a worthy Divine Mr. Meade But concerning Prophets I say only that the Jews both under the Old Testament and under the New took them to be all one with Mad-men and Demoniacks And prove it out of Scripture by many places both of the Old and New Testament Thirdly that the pretence or arrogating to ones self Divine Inspiration is argument enough to shew a Man is Mad is my opinion but his Lordship understands not Inspiration in the same sence that I do He understands it properly of God's breathing into a Man or pouring into him the Divine Substance or Divine Graces and in that sence he that arrogateth Inspiration into himself neither understands what he saith nor makes others to understand him which is properly Madness in some degree But I understand Inspiration in the Scripture Metaphorically for Gods guidance of our minds to Truth and Piety Fourthly whereas he says I make the pretence of Inspiration to be pernicious to Peace I answer that I think his Lordship was of my Opinion for he called those Men which in the late Civil War pretended the Spirit and New Light and to be the only faithful men Phanaticks for he called them in his Book and did call them in his Life time Phanaticks And what is a Phanatick but a Mad-man and what can be more pernicious to Peace than the Revelations that were by these Phanaticks pretended I do not say there were Doctrines of other Men not called Phanaticks as pernicious to Peace as theirs were and in great part a cause of those troubles Fifthly from that I make Prophetical Revelations subject to the examination of the Lawful Soveraign he inferreth that two Prophets prophecying the same thing at the same time in the Dominions of two different Princes the one shall be a true Prophet the other a false This consequence is not good for seeing they teach different Doctrines they cannot both of them confirm their Doctrine with Miracles But this I prove in the page 232 he citeth that whether either of their Doctrines shall be Taught Publickly or not 't is in the power of the Soveraign of the Place only to determine Nay I say now further if a Prophet come to any private Man in the Name of God that Man shall be Judge whether he be a true Prophet or not before he obey him See 1 John 4.1 Sixthly whereas he says that upon my grounds Christ was to be reputed a false Prophet every where because his Doctrine was received no where His Lordship had Read my Book more negligently than was fit for one that would confute it My ground is this that Christ in right of his Father was King of the Jews and consequently Supream Prophet and Judge of all Prophets What other Princes thought of his Prophesies is nothing to the purpose I never said that Princes can make Doctrines or Prophesies true or false but I say every Soveraign Prince has a right to prohibite the publick Teaching of them whether false or true But what an oversight is it in a Divine to say that Christ had the Approbation of no Soveraign Prince when he had the Approbation of God who was King of the Jews and Christ his Vice-Roy and the whole Scripture Written Joh. 20.31 to prove it
TRACTS OF M R. THOMAS HOBBS OF Malmsbury CONTAINING I. Behemoth the History of the Causes of the Civil Wars of England from 1640. to 1660. printed from the Author 's own Copy Never printed but with a thousand faults before II. An Answer to Arch-Bishop Bramhall's Book called the Catching of the Leviathan Never printed before III. An Historical Narration of Heresie and the Punishment thereof Corrected by the true Copy IV. Philosophical Problems dedicated to the King in 1662. but never printed before LONDON Printed for W. Crooke at the Green-Dragon without Temple-Bar MDCLXXXII Behemoth THE HISTORY Of the Causes of the Civil-Wars OF ENGLAND And of the Councels and Artifices by which they were carried on from the year 1640. to the year 1660. Written by THOMAS HOBBS of Malmsbury Printed from the Author 's true Copy Bella per Angliacos plusquam civilia campos Jusque datum sceleri loquimur LONDON Printed for W. Crooke at the Green-Dragon without Temple-Bar MDCLXXXII THE BOOKSELLER TO THE READER MY Duty as well to the Publick as to the Memory of Mr. Hobbs has obliged me to procure with my utmost diligence that these Tracts should come forth with the most correct exactness I am compell'd by the force of Truth to declare how much both the World and the Name of Mr. Hobbs have been abus'd by the several spurious Editions of the History of the Civil Wars wherein by various and unskilful Transcriptions are committed above a thousand faults and in above a hundred places whole Lines left out as I can make appear I must confess Mr. Hobbs upon some considerations was averse to the publishing thereof but since it is impossible to suppress it no Book being more commonly sold by all Booksellers I hope I need not fear the Offence of any Man by doing Right to the World and this Work Which I now Publish from the Original Manuscript done by his own Amanuensis and given me by himself above twelve years since To this I have joyn'd the Treatise against Arch-Bishop Bramhall to prevent the like prejudice which must certainly have faln on it there being so many false Copies abroad if not thus prevented as also the Discourse of Heresie from a more correct Copy and have likewise annex'd his Physical Problems as they were translated by himself and presented to His Majesty with the Epistle prefix'd in the Year 1662. at the same time they came forth in Latin These things premis'd there remains nothing but to wish for my self good sale to the Buyer much pleasure and satisfaction Your Humble Servant William Crooke Behemoth OR THE EPITOME OF THE Civil Wars OF ENGLAND PART I. A. IF in time as in place there were degrees of high and low I verily believe that the highest of time would be that which passed between 1640. and 1660. for he that thence as from the Devils Mountain should have looked upon the World and observ'd the Actions of Men especially in England might have had a Prospect of all kinds of Injustice and of all kinds of Folly that the World could afford and how they were produced by their Hypocrisie and self-conceit whereof the one is double Iniquity and the other double Folly B. I should be glad to behold that Prospect You that have liv'd in that time and in that part of your Age wherein Men use to see best into good and evil I pray you set me that could not see so well upon the same Mountain by the Relation of the Actions you then saw and of their Causes Pretensions Justice Order Artifice and Event A. In the Year 1640. the Government of England was Monarchical and the King that reigned Charles the first of that name holding the Sovereignty by right of a descent continued above 600 years and from a much longer descent King of Scotland and from the time of his Ancestors Henry the second King of Ireland a Man that wanted no vertue either of Body or Mind nor endeavour'd any thing more than to discharge his Duty towards God in the well governing of his Subjects B. How could he then miscarry having in every County so many Trained Soldiers as would put together have made an Army of 60000 Men and divers Magazines of Ammunition in places fortified A. If those Soldiers had been as they and all other of his Subjects ought to have been at his Majesties command the Peace and Happiness of the three Kingdoms had continued as it was left by King James but the People were corrupted generally and disobedient persons esteemed the best Patriots B. But sure there were Men enough besides those that were ill-affected to have made an Army sufficient to have kept the People from uniting into a Body able to oppose him A. Truly I think if the King had had Money he might have had Soldiers enough in England for there were very few of the Common People that cared much for either of the Causes but would have taken any side for pay and plunder but the Kings Treasure was very low and his Enemies that pretended the Peoples ease from Taxes and other specious things had the command of the Purses of the City of London and of most Cities and Corporate Towns in England and of many particular persons besides B. But how came the People to be so corrupted and what kind of People were they that did so seduce them A. The Seducers were of divers sorts One sort were Ministers Ministers as they call'd themselves of Christ and sometimes in their Sermons to the People God's Ambassadors pretending to have a right from God to govern every one his Parish and their Assembly the whole Nation Secondly there were a very great number though not comparable to the other which notwithstanding that the Popes power in England both Temporal and Ecclesiastical had been by Act of Parliament abolished did still retain a belief that we ought to be governed by the Pope whom they pretended to be the Vicar of Christ and in the Right of Christ to be the Governour of all Christian People and these were known by the Name of Papists as the Ministers I mentioned before were commonly called Presbyterians Thirdly There were not a few who in the beginning of the Troubles were not discovered but shortly after declared themselves for a Liberty in Religion and those of different Opinions one from another some of them because they would have all Congregations free and independent upon one another were called Independents Others that held Baptism to Infants and such as understood not into what they are baptized to be ineffectual were called therefore Anabaptists Others that held that Christ's Kingdom was at this time to begin upon the Earth were called Fifth-monarchy-men besides divers other Sects as Quakers Adamites c. whose Names and peculiar Doctrines I do not well remember and these were the Enemies which arose against his Majesty from the private Interpretation of the Scripture exposed to every Man 's scanning in his Mother-Tongue Fourthly There were