could not this I know did sorely trouble them though when they fell to congregate in a Church-way they gave me good respect as needing the help of every one whose conscience as mine did led them out to stand and plead for liberty of Conscience I believe they were also not a little troubled that I closed not with them or some others in their Church-way for so I once perceived by one Mr Lamb a Linnen Draper in Cornhill to whom I having sold a good parcel of linnens and taking it very kindly that he would deal with me I would needs give him and some Friends with him a cup of beer and sugar one morning and we were all free and chearfull but Mr Lamb and I out-staid the rest falling very largely into discourse he puttâ—ng all the questions and doubts he had concerning my opinions which I answered one by one upon condition that he would give himself and me time then and hear me out all I had to say because as I then told him I never had received prejudice from any discourse that ever pass'd from me with ingenious men but where they carried away things peece-meal and by halfs So in a most friendly manner he heard me and in conclusion approved exceedingly of all I had said even with abundance of content and rejoycing but when we had done he fetches a deep sigh saying O Mr Walwyn thaâ— you had a good opinion of Churches To which I answered that I had no evil opinion of them that rather I did rejoyce to see with what amity and friendship they enjoyed each others society in a comfortable way assisting and supporting one another that I was glad they so contentedly enjoyed the exercise of their consciences in a way that was agreeable to their judgments that I had made it my work as far as I was able to preserve unto them and all others the enjoyment of that just liberty it being a principle in me that every man ought to be protected in the use of that wherein he doth not actually hurt another and that were I satisfied in some particulars I could not but joyn my self to some such society that I thought as I was I wanted much of that intimacy with good people which they had but yet must not purchase it upon a doubtfull conscience or against my judgment that I wish'd them all happinesse in their way and was not willing to disturb any and hop'd they would not disturb me hoping that they would have as good an opinion of me as I had of them though I did not joyn in a Church-way and with this he then seemed to be very well satisfied And so we held very fair and serious respects a good while I giving him some visits at his house where he would reade to me with much admiration some of Mr Goodwin's Books the weaknesse whereof I made somewhat bolâ— withall as being never used to flattery or to balk my judgment which proved aâ— noli me tangere for Mr Goodwin is the apple of their eie and in a short time not only his familiarity ceased but I was even slandered to death from this man's mouth no place wherever he came but his aspersions flew abroad as if to blast my reputation had been given him in commission from the whole Congregation this was the fruit of my intimacy with him Nor can I imagine any other reason why Mr Brandriff should deal so unworthily with himself and me for when we have been together he hath discours'd to me much concerning his Wife his Father his Children what he had done for his Kindred how ingratefull they were the manner of his trade how and by what means he got good store of monies in the midst of the wars by rising early in mornings and searching in Inns what goods were brought to Town indeed most commendably and industriously how he many times ventered to buy goods he had little skill in nor knew not when he had bought them where he was like to vent them yet how well he sped with abundance of things I will not repeat these being sufficient to shew the man was not certainly feigned towards me so long a time as afterwards he pretended only when we have been hearing Mr Goodwin together and come from him discoursing I have shewed suddenly some mistakes and weakuesses and drinesses in things which Mr Goodwin had much laboured to make good but would not endure my touchstone and Mr Brandriff hath been â—orc'd to confesse as much sadly smiling and saying well what shall we say where can we hear better To which I would answer that 's not the thing you see what this is Indeed but for this which can be nothing but emulation I know not any cause I have given them thus to persecute me they have thank'd me for Books I have written as my Whisper and others fore-named and for a Book entituled A help to the understanding of Mr Pryn which they would no nay but it should be mine though my name was not to it so good an opinion they had of my integrity Nay their Church disbursed fifty shillings towards the printing of ten thousand of that little Book called The word in season they then judg'd the dispersing of Books no sin which Mr Batcheler can tell who was Author of and they know well enough so far were they from believing what now they subscribe to that in all times I ever opposed the present Government but it will be found only that I never flattered them by such undue expressions as by the womb that bare you and the paps that gave you suck and the like more sutable to the liberty of Sycophants then Christians Nor did I ever oppose any just authority otherwise then as I have opposed men not to destroy them but their destructive errours and mis-applications of their power Well ye are the most strange conditioned people that ever I met withall the most inconsistent walking not by any principles but meerly by occasion and as the wind turns and I am heartily glad I have so nigh done with you for I never shall be induced to bestow the like pains about you again only I have this farther to acquaint the ingenious withall concerning you viz that you bear your selves very high and confidently upon your ability of proving whatsoever you alleadge by way of aspersion against any man And indeed herein I can resemble you to none so properly as to a people are called Gypsyes I must intreat pardon if there seem any lightnesse or despising in this simile for if I could have found one more handsome so proper I would not have stained my paper with this but just so have I found them confederated together if one but averr a thing presently there are a cloud of witnesses and not in a slighting way but such as will take their oaths of it Upon which accompt upon the Exchange all their affirmatives concerning others and there negatives concerning themselves are carried on
himself to be thorowly reproved by those present and he seemed then to be sorry for it but aspersions fly faster then any man can fetch them back and so did this to my extream desparagement and it served their turn at that meeting to blast all the reason I spake and to destroy that petition And those who had made use of this reproach and so made themselves guilty as the manner of men is resolved to disparage me to purpose and thereupon some leading people of master John Goodwins set themselves down as a Committee calling before them all they could finde had ever conversed with me to inform whatsoever I had said that might tend to my disparagement this is some three yeers since and so by way of articles most of the aspersions now in this book were then collected which I had continuall notice of as they came in and who did inform and who would not but declared confidently they were perswaded from long and much familiarity that I was really honest and conscientious amongst which Mr. Henry Brandriff Captain Chaplain Mr. Weekes and others Neverthelesse the violent party as Mr. John Price and others would go on with their articles me thoughts it was a strange work for a people who called themselves the people of God but so they did and at length had possest divers who formerly had well respected me that I was a dangerous man and not fit for society whereupon it was desired by my friends and agreed unto by theirs that a meeting should be on both parties and their articles should be heard and I have freedom to make my defence and the place appointed was the Dolphin in Corn-hill where I and my friends kept our time and continued there but on their parts none came And Mr. Brandriff my then intimate friend perswaded me it was not fit things should come to such a height that it would make but rejoycing for our enemies that he was confident there was no real enmity but only causles doubts and jealousies and that if I would but vindicate my judgement concerning the Scriptures and my owning of them I should find they had nothing to object against me and that they and I should be as good and as loving friends as ever Whereunto I was very inclinable as having never born any man a grudge for any injury ever done me esteeming the doer by wounding his own conscience to be punished sufficiently nor do I relate these things in way of revenge but only as to do my self right and to free my wife and children from the reproach of having so unworthy a husband and Father and the cause I honour from having so vile a servant as these would make me I told him my whisper to Mr. Edwards and my other writings did sufficiently testifie I owned the Scriptures and he confest it but yet wisht me to do something particularly to that end About this time upon occasion of Mr. Edwards writings I take it came forth Mr. John Goodwins Haggiâ—-Mastix wherein to the apprehension of some eminent men he in effect denied the scriptures to be the word of God and much discourse and great complaint there was about it in so much as Collonel Leighs Committee had it brought before them where it was my lot to be when the passage concerning the Scriptures was read openly by one thatamongst others informed against it and where it was called a most impious blasphemous Book and ordered to be seized all of them immediatly That Committee was of a most persecuting disposition and dealt most forwardly with divers conscientious people with whom and in whose behalf I continually appeared as for Mr. Kiffin Mr. Patience and many others I cannot now remember and Henry Mr. Overtons man the book-seller that as I am told prints this unchristian book called Walwyns Wiles might remember who it was that gave timely notice of the order for seizing his Master's Books for he priâ—ted Hagio Mastix and in thanfulnesse for the courtesie done to his dead Master might have forborn to have done me such a discourtesie but it hath been my usuall payment for all my services to that sort of men Divers did observe a strange providence that those who had so scandalized me for a denier of Scriptures should from a pen wherein they were all concerned receive occasion of so great suspicion and be put themselves upon a work of vindication on his behalf And though they called it a Candle to light the Sun as esteeming it altogether superfluous yet many still say it needs to be more cleared And hence some of my Friends perswaded me I needed not to publish my Vindication concerning the Scriptures for satisfaction of those who had enough to do for their own Vindication yet because I was willing to stand clear in the sight of all men I published my Still and foft voyce against which I never yet heard any objection And one of Mr Goodwin's People namely Mr Davenish meeting me a few daies after in the Court of Requests saluted me kindly and gave me thanks for publishing that Book I told him I was glad understanding men approved it and did hope it would be profitable to the publique he replyed it would be so and that he should make it his rule And so a good while after this I had much respect from many oâ— them and not an ill look from any but though Mr Leigh's Committee extremely perplexed honest people about their private meetings and doctrines yet did this sort of men that traduce me appear very slenderly in comparison of others that were thought to be lesse concerned In conclusion that Committee and their Favourers in both Houses grew to so great a height that the Generality of Congregations and others resolved to bear testimony openly against the same as being contrary to the many Declarations of Parliament and as doing the very same things they had condemned in the high Commission and thereupon drew up a Petition wherein they did parallel all the former practises complained of in the Star Chamber and high Commission with the present proceedings which Petition was drawn and debated by many persons chosen purposely thereunto and indeed was the most serious of any that was presented which the Author of this Pamphlet I perceive tearms sharpâ—esse and provoking and imputes it unto me This Petition was taken before it was handed and questioned as a scandalous and seditious paper and committed to Mr Leigh's Committee to enquire after the Authors and Promoters and Mr Lamb at whose meeting place it was taken ordered to appear there this occasioned a very great appearance in the owning of it by aboundance of consciencious honest people and that occasioned some discontent in the Committee which begot the commitment of Major Tulidah and Mr Tue and that occasioned another Petition to the House and that another unâ—ill the last and the first large one were ordered to be burnt by the common Hangmaâ— in all which time of motion and
so joy'd was I really with this as I thought renewed affection that I would often say within my self and to some others I now see The falling out of Lovers is the renewing of Love Nay so great a testimony I then had from my continued Fr end Mr Brandriffe that greater could not be for it was his lot to discourse with one Major West a Gentleman I take it of Cambridge-shire who was to have gone for Ireland this Gentleman told him divers secret things that rightly ordered were very usefull at that time Mr Brandriffe thinks me the fittest man to be acquainted therewith tels me of it and brings him to my house to whom I was not altogether a Sâ—ranger so he opens his breast to me in such things that as the times were if I had been base or false-hearted might have cost him his life I say as the times were but I proved as Mr Brandriffe had reported me to him and kept his councel Well very good Friends we were all and I was by very eminent persons of the Army sent for to Reading to be advised withall touching the good of the people a study my Conscience had much addicted me to and after this no jarr appeared amongst us till the Army had past through the City nor untill the businesse of the Tower afore-mentioned besell But then instead of Arguments against mine and my Friends Reason aspersions were produced and then afresh we were Atheists Non-Scripturists Jesuites and any thing to render us odious This whil'st I remained there begot a great falling out amongst our Friends and theirs in London which upon my comming looking upon it as a thing of very ill consequence I prevailed for a reconcilement so far have I ever been from dividing that I believe all those with whom I have most converst judge no man more deserves the name of a Reconciler But about this time I met with that Gentleman Major West in the street and he looks upon me somewhat ghastly saying what are you here yes said I why not why saies he being at my Lord Mayors you were there said to be the most dangerous ill-conditioned man alive that you seek to have the City destroyed that you would have no Government and all things common and drive on dangerous designs saies I who is it that avouches this why saies he Henry Brandriffe who saies he knows it to be true and that he hath kept you company these seven years of purpose to discover you I professe I was so astonisht to hear this from Mr Brandriffe that I had no thought nor did not then call to mind how upon intimate intire friendship he had brought this Mr West to unbosome himself unto me in a matter of so great concernment so I past it over and parted with him But in a little ruminating of the strangenesse and horriblenesse of this dealing the businesse of Major Wests comming to me with Mr Brandriffe withall circumstances came fresh into my mind and about a week after I met with Major West in Bishops-gate-street and after a salute askt him if he had seen Mr Brandriffe he told me he had and that he was of the same mind and would justifie it for he had kept me company seven years to discover me upon this I askt him whether he did not remember that Mr Brandriffe upon pre-discourse did bring him to my house to discover such and such things to me as the fittest Friend he had he answered me yes and were they not such things said I that if I had been base and deceitfull might have been much to your prejudice as the times then were yes saies he said I did he then know me to be base and to carry on dangerous designs and had kept me company seven years to discover me and would he bring you to discover such things and to un bosome your self to me said I whether was he most false to you or to me he makes a stand a little while truly saies he he must be very false and unworthy to one of us So I wisht him to consider what strange kind of men these were and how a man might come to know when they meant good faith in their discourse and society amongst men This Discourse I have set down thus punctually because a person of so good credit as this Major West is is ready as he told me lately to avouch this that Mr Brandriffe said of me and because it is their usuall way to beget credit in the foulest aspersions they cast upon me by saying this is certain I kept him company so long of purpose to discover him and will rather injure their own conscience then want of belief for I am confident Mr Brandriffe in all his society with me had not an ill thought of me if he did keep me company so long for ill and unworthy ends to entrap and make the worst of every thing I said which I cannot believe he was the more unworthy and cannot but lament his condition or any mans else that useth it I blesse God I never was a minute in his company but upon tearms of true hearty love and friendship nor ever circumvented him or any man else nor have used to carry tales or to make the worst of menâ— discourses but have set my house and heart open at all times to honest men where they have had a most sincere and hearty welcome and if any have turned my freedom and kindnesse to my prejudice God forgive them Yea so far hath it been from being my principle or practice as the uncharitable Subscribers of the Epistle Dedicatory to this-vain Book infer to say or do any thing against him whom I thought engaged to destroy me that both to those of the Kings Party with whom I had some acquaintance and those my old and many Friends of the Presbyterian judgment in all times I ever spake and advised them what I thought in my conscience was for their good perswading with all men to place their happinesse so as it might be consistent with the freedom peace and prosperity of the Commonwealth and I believe many will acknowledge they have found my councel good and wish they had taken it some having since confest I have told them truth when they did not believe it nor can any of them â—ustly say and I believe will not say that ever I abated one sillable of my principle of Common Freedom nor ever discovered a thought to the prejudice of the Parliament or Common-wealth But would these men turn their sight inward and look into their own hearts there they would find such a latitude of dissimulation as is hardly to be found in any sort of men pretending to Religion as may not only appear by these mens fair carriages outwardly alwaies to me and Mr Brandriffe's strange discovery of himself but in others also of the same people as Mr Richard Price the Scrivener the Author of one of the most notorious false scandals contained in
another of that name of this congregation and is this Mr. Richard Price his vnckle and Mr. Hilleslyes son in lavv from this Mr. Price I heard the first aspersion that ever I heard of my self and it vvas thus Standing in Cornhill at a Book-sellers shop a man comes and looks me very earnestly in my face I took little regard to it and went away I was no sooner gone but sayes he to the Book seller you are acquainted withall the sparcks in the town sparcks saies he the man seemes to be a rational man I But replied the party I am told he is a notorious drunkard and a whore master and that he painted his face but I see that 's false whereupon the Book-seller having some knowledge of me became troubled on my behalf and fell to be very serious with him to know his author and he honestly tells him naming this Mr. Price a mercer and the Bookseller soon after tells me the whole story and the authors name saying he had been abused himself with base reports and a man might be undone by them and never know it till t' was too late and therefore had resolved to hear no evil of any man but if he could he would learn the auâ—hor and tell the party concerned of it this Book seller is Mr. Peter Cole at the sign of the Printing presse and I esteem my self obliedged to him ever since for his plain dealing So away went I to this Mr. Price for I was somewhat troubled having never heard evil of my self till then and I found him at Mr. Hilslies and 〈◊〉 a friendly manner made him acquainted with my businesse he did not deny but he had spoken as much and that walking in Westminister hall he was called from me and bid beware of me for I was supposed to be a Papist and a dangerous man but he had not spoken any evil of me as beleeving any of it to be true so I told him he and I had come acquainted upon a very honest businesse about the remonstrance presented to the Common-councel and therefore why he should suffer such words to passe from him concerning me I did wonder at it I told him how with very little enquiry he might soon have been satisfied that I was no such man askt him if he knew any at Garlick-hill where I had lived fifteen yeers together in good and honest repute and where he ought to have informed himself and not so unadvisedly to disparage me he seemed to be sorry for it so I only desired him to let me know his author he told me I must excuse him he might not do it nor could I ever get him to tell me so being familiar with my then friend Mr. Brandiff I askt whether they had not some rule or method in their Church to give a man some satisfaction that had received palpable injury by a meraber come said he I know where abouts you mean trouble not your self no body beleeves it and this was all I could get in this case wherein I yet stand injured and since they are so desirous more then truth should be beleeved of me I think it fit this which is certainly true should be known of their dealing with me Nor can any ingenious people now blame me for being thus open and particuler since this sort of independents have made thus bold with my good name so long a time and since it is evident that manifestation dated the 14 of April 1649. Published by my self and my other three fellow sufferers that I was willing to have vindicated my self from those common reproaches they had aspert me withall without naming or reflecting upon any person or any sort of men whatsoever so carefull have I ever been as much as in me is to have peace withall men bearing and forbearing to my own losse rather then I would return eviâ— for evil But their mallicâ— breaking thus fouly out upon me in this vile book I should be unjust to my self if I should not do my best endeavour to manifest so detestable falsenesse uttered to so bad an end in so unseemly a time the time of my affliction which I shall do with as much truth as I can remember profeâ—sing withall from my very heart and conscience that I take no more pleasure in doing of it then I should do in gathering up and throwing away Snakes and Vâ—rmin scattered in my Garden and do wish withall my soul they had not necessitated me nor my other fellow-prisoners to have exceeded our joynt Manifestation but that we might all have been good friends thereupon In which Manifestation is to be seen all our very hearts and wherein all our four heads and hands were nigh equally employed though this câ—pritious author Mr. John Price it s said be pleased to suppose me to be all 〈◊〉 all therein yet I must and truly professe the contrary and must be bold to â—ell them where my friend Lieutement Collonel John Lillburn appeares otherwise in any of his writings I do not impute it to passion as his adversaries politiquely are accustomed to take weak people off from the consideration of what he says but unto his zeal against that injustice cruelty hypocrisie arrogancy and flattery which he hath found amongst a sort of men from whom of any men in the world he expected the contrary virtues being otherwise to my knowledge and upon experience a very lamb in conversation and whom goodnesse and love and piety justice and compassion shall as soon melt and that into tears I hope he will pardon my blabbing as any man in the world but he hates all kinde of basenesse with a perfect hatred especially that of ingratitude which he hath found I have heard him say so exceeding all measure in some of the subscribers of this pamphlet that it loathes him to think of it And as for my friend Mr. Prince whom this self-conceited author would make so weak in judgment as to have no ability towards such a work it is his unhappinesse to be so exceedingly mistaken yet I must tell him he hath given him so true a character for honesty and sincerity of heart towards the publick which in my esteem doth more commend him then if he had attributed to him all those parts abilities he falsly and for an ill end doth unto me lifting me up to heaven that he might cast me down to hell making me an Angel that he might make me a Devil which parts are more abounding in himself as is to be seen in this his unhappy Book and for which he will one day sigh and groan except he make a better use of them But Mr. John Price Mr. Prince hath not a congregation to cry up his parts amongst whom there is such a humor of flattery as is not to be found the like again amongst any sort of men Oh such a Sermon such a discourse such arguments as never was heard of when often times 't is meer lamp-work and ink horn termes such
is called Religion amongst them page the 14. This is very observable for by this expression all men shall easily understand the ground of their quarrell against me if they can but finde out what it is that is called Religion amongst them do not these men call such a thing Religion as the Pharises did I le deal so kindly with them yet as to leave the comparing the one with the other to themselves only 't was much in words and to be seen of men both which our Saviour reproves and both by example and precept invites to practice possitively concluding that not he that saith Lord Lord shall enter into the kingdom but he that doth the will of my father which is in heaven requireth That our light so shine forth before men that they seeing our good works may glorifie our heavenly father and at the last day he will say unto those on his right hand Come ye blessed of my Father receive the kingdom prepared for you for when I was an hungry ye fed me naked ye clothed me sick and in prison and ye visited me in as much as ye have done it unto these ye have done it unto me when to others that yet have to say Lord we have prophesied and done many great things in thy name he will say Away from me ye workers of iniquity I know ye not for when I was hungry ye sed me not naked ye clothed me not sick and in prison and ye visited me not inasmuch as ye did it not unto these ye did it not unto me And if now to invite to these and to reprove the want thereof be to be a Devil truly I 'l bear it and rejoyce that I am accounted worthy to suffer reproach for this cause of Christ I am sure the Apostle Paul that abounded with reall not pretended gifts or acquisitions rather boasted not of them but proclaims to all the world that though he spake with the tongues of men and Angels and have no Charity that he was but as sounding brasse or a tinkling Cymball and Saint James his pure and undefiled Religion is to visit the fatherlesse and the widowes in their distresse and to keep our selves unspotted of the world and saith plainly that he who hath this worlds goods and seeth his brother lack and shutteth up his bowels of compassion how dwelleth the love of God in him And truly if I must be a Devil for insisting upon these most needfull doctrines I had rather be these mens Devil then their Saint And if the use and application of these and the like will overthrow that which they call Religion amongst them certainly it is not pure and undefiled and hardly of Gods making I might enlarge my self upon this theme but the little Book called The vanity of the present Churches hath prevented me unto which I refer the ingenious Reader for satisfaction of what they call Religion among them And thus I think to all unbiassed men I have acquitted my self from going about to destroy Religion I mean true not false Religion or superstition too commonly dignified with the title of Religion And as for my designing as the desire of my soul the trouble misery and ruine of this Commonwealth it is so absurd a suggestion that it seems not worth my answer the utmost of my desire concerning this Commonwealth being held forth and contained in the Agreement of the People dated the first of May 1649. And as a testimony of our acquiescence therein is subscribed by Lieut Col John Lilburn Mr Richard Overton Mr Thomas Prince and my self so that all my designs are therein center'd and if that imports the trouble misery and ruine of this Commonwealth I am extremely mistaken and shall not refuse to acknowledge my errour when I see it but till then and whil'st I conceive it to tend to the good of all men I cannot but wish it might be establish'd with contentment and security of all sorts of people I know not the man in the world whose finger I desire should akâ— longer then he pinches another nor that any man should be reduced to any extremity by any alteration it might bring with it but that authority would provide rather a change of interests and remove men from that which is not to that which is consistent with the peace freedom and prosperity of the Nation it having been all along a sad thing to me to see men of parts and breeding and eminency upon reformation of interests or their reducements to be left to the wide world without any care or regard of a livelyhood for themselves their Wives and Children in some measure answerable to their former condition such extremities commonly begetting greater and more mischievous to the Commonwealth and it should in my poor opinion be the care of the supreme Authority no desire being more forcible in man then to live answerable to his breeding or to what he hath been long accustomed every one finding it an easie thing to learn how to abound but to abate most difficult and I fear our late and present times suffer much under these two extremes He upbraids me that I find fault that riches and estates and the things of this world should prefer men to offices and places of trust but say that virtue though in poor men should be more regarded as in Butchers or Coblers And truly I know some Butchers though not many as fit as some in your Congregations and I think you do not exclude for that trade And as for Coblers there are trades more in credit hardly so usefull and Mr Price knows it well and were he as busy in self examination as he is in reproaching others he would have little time to trouble himself about others motes he who thought it no robbery to be equall with God and yet despised not to be esteemed the Son of a Carpenter and chose simple herdsmen for his Prophets and poor fishermen for his Apostles did certainly judge otherwise then these Churchmen judge Besides there was a time when Samuel How a Cobler by trade and a contented man in that calling was not ashamed to preach before your most learned Pastor and printed his Sermon afterwards and your Pastor hath chang'd his mind since and is come somewhat neare to his judgment and had done then as is said and can be proved could any have shewed him a livelyhood with credit upon the exchange But by the way I am not so strong as to talk usually after this rule I know the generality of our times cannot bear it I indulge exceedingly towards the weakness of men for peace sake who ever heard me speak either in behalf of Butchers or Coblers as to places of government I professe I know not where nor when though for their callings I make no difference between them and my self for the callings are honest and mine can but be so And as for Riches Saint James whom I am exceeding in love with had no great