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thomas_n hold_v the_o first_o and_o 3._o durand_n the_o late_a then_o you_o agree_v not_o whether_o the_o soul_n of_o christ_n do_v descend_v real_o and_o in_o essence_n into_o the_o low_a pit_n of_o hell_n and_o place_n of_o the_o damn_a as_o 16_o bellarmine_n once_o hold_v probable_a and_o prove_v it_o or_o real_o only_a into_o that_o place_n or_o region_n of_o hell_n which_o you_o call_v limbum_fw-la patrum_fw-la and_o then_o but_o virtual_o from_o thence_o into_o the_o low_a hell_n to_o which_o 11._o bellarmine_n reduce_v himself_o and_o give_v his_o reason_n because_o it_o be_v the_o 2._o common_a opinion_n of_o the_o school_n now_o the_o church_n of_o england_n take_v the_o word_n as_o they_o be_v in_o the_o creed_n and_o believe_v they_o without_o far_a dispute_n and_o in_o that_o sense_n which_o the_o ancient_a primitive_a father_n of_o the_o church_n agree_v in_o and_o yet_o if_o any_o in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n shall_v not_o be_v thorough_o resolve_v in_o the_o sense_n of_o this_o article_n be_v it_o not_o as_o lawful_a for_o they_o to_o say_v i_o conceive_v thus_o or_o thus_o of_o it_o yet_o if_o any_o other_o way_n of_o his_o descent_n be_v find_v true_a than_o this_o i_o deny_v it_o not_o but_o as_o yet_o i_o know_v no_o other_o as_o it_o be_v for_o 9_o durand_n to_o say_v it_o and_o yet_o not_o impeach_v the_o foundation_n of_o the_o faith_n f._n the_o bishop_n say_v that_o m._n rogers_n be_v but_o a_o private_a man_n but_o say_v i_o if_o m._n rogers_n write_v as_o he_o do_v by_o public_a authority_n be_v account_v only_o a_o private_a man_n etc._n etc._n b._n §_o 13_o num._n 1_o i_o say_v truth_n when_o i_o say_v m._n rogers_n be_v a_o private_a man_n and_o i_o take_v it_o you_o will_v not_o allow_v every_o speech_n of_o every_o 〈…〉_z though_o allow_v by_o authority_n to_o have_v his_o book_n print_v to_o be_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n be_v this_o have_v be_v oft_o complain_v of_o on_o both_o side_n the_o impose_v particular_a man_n assertion_n upon_o the_o church_n yet_o i_o see_v you_o mean_v not_o to_o leave_v it_o and_o sure_o as_o controversy_n be_v now_o handle_v by_o some_o of_o your_o party_n at_o this_o day_n i_o may_v not_o say_v it_o be_v the_o sense_n of_o the_o article_n in_o hand_n but_o i_o have_v long_o think_v it_o a_o kind_n of_o descent_n into_o hell_n to_o be_v conversant_a in_o they_o i_o will_v the_o author_n will_v take_v heed_n in_o time_n and_o not_o seek_v to_o blind_v the_o people_n or_o cast_v a_o mist_n before_o evident_a truth_n lest_o it_o cause_v a_o final_a descent_n to_o that_o place_n of_o torment_n but_o since_o you_o will_v hold_v this_o course_n stapleton_n be_v of_o great_a note_n with_o you_o than_o m._n rogers_n his_o exposition_n or_o note_n upon_o the_o article_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v with_o we_o and_o as_o he_o so_o his_o relection_n and_o be_v it_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n which_o stapleton_n affirm_v 1._o the_o scripture_n be_v silent_a that_o christ_n descend_v into_o hell_n and_o that_o there_o be_v a_o catholic_a and_o a_o apostolic_a church_n if_o it_o be_v then_o what_o will_v become_v of_o the_o pope_n supremacy_n over_o the_o whole_a church_n shall_v he_o have_v his_o power_n over_o the_o catholic_a church_n give_v he_o express_o in_o scripture_n in_o the_o 9_o key_n to_o enter_v and_o in_o 16._o pasce_fw-la to_o feed_v when_o he_o be_v in_o and_o when_o he_o have_v feed_v to_o 32._o confirm_v and_o in_o all_o these_o not_o to_o err_v and_o fail_v in_o his_o ministration_n and_o be_v the_o catholic_a church_n in_o and_o over_o which_o he_o be_v to_o do_v all_o these_o great_a thing_n quite_o leave_v out_o of_o the_o scripture_n belike_o the_o holy_a ghost_n be_v careful_a to_o give_v he_o his_o power_n yes_o in_o any_o case_n but_o leave_v the_o assign_v of_o his_o great_a cure_n the_o catholic_a church_n to_o tradition_n and_o it_o be_v well_o for_o he_o if_o he_o can_v so_o prescribe_v for_o what_o he_o now_o claim_v num._n 2_o but_o what_o if_o after_o all_o this_o m._n rogers_n there_o say_v no_o such_o thing_n as_o in_o truth_n he_o do_v not_o his_o word_n be_v 3._o all_o christian_n acknowledge_v he_o descend_v but_o in_o the_o interpretation_n of_o the_o article_n there_o be_v not_o that_o consent_n that_o be_v to_o be_v wish_v what_o be_v this_o to_o the_o church_n of_o england_n more_o than_o other_o and_o again_o ibid._n till_o we_o know_v the_o native_a and_o undoubted_a sense_n of_o this_o article_n be_v m._n roger_n we_o the_o church_n of_o england_n or_o rather_o he_o and_o some_o other_o judgement_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n num._n 3_o now_o here_o a._n c._n will_v have_v somewhat_o again_o to_o say_v though_o 47._o god_n know_v it_o be_v to_o little_a purpose_n it_o be_v that_o the_o jesuit_n urge_v m._n roger_n book_n because_o it_o be_v set_v out_o by_o public_a authority_n and_o because_o the_o book_n bear_v the_o title_n of_o the_o catholic_a doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n a._n c._n may_v undoubted_o urge_v m._n rogers_n if_o he_o please_v but_o he_o ought_v not_o to_o say_v that_o his_o opinion_n be_v the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n for_o neither_o of_o the_o reason_n by_o he_o express_v first_o not_o because_o his_o book_n be_v public_o allow_v for_o many_o book_n among_o they_o as_o well_o as_o among_o we_o have_v be_v print_v by_o public_a authority_n as_o contain_v nothing_o in_o they_o contrary_a to_o faith_n and_o good_a manner_n and_o yet_o contain_v many_o thing_n in_o they_o of_o opinion_n only_o or_o private_a judgement_n which_o yet_o be_v far_o from_o the_o avow_a positive_a doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n the_o church_n have_v as_o yet_o determine_v neither_o way_n by_o open_a declaration_n upon_o the_o word_n or_o thing_n controvert_v and_o this_o be_v more_o frequent_a among_o their_o schoolman_n than_o among_o any_o of_o our_o controverser_n as_o be_v well_o know_v nor_o second_o because_o his_o book_n bear_v the_o title_n of_o the_o catholic_a doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n for_o suppose_v the_o worst_a and_o say_v m._n rogers_n think_v a_o little_a too_o well_o of_o his_o own_o pain_n and_o give_v his_o book_n too_o high_a a_o title_n be_v his_o private_a judgement_n therefore_o to_o be_v account_v the_o catholic_a doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n sure_o no_o no_o more_o than_o i_o shall_v say_v every_o thing_n say_v by_o summa_fw-la thomas_n or_o disputata_fw-la bonaventure_n be_v angelical_a or_o seraphical_a doctrine_n because_o one_o of_o these_o be_v style_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n seraphical_a and_o the_o other_o angetical_a doctor_n and_o yet_o their_o work_n be_v print_v by_o public_a authority_n and_o that_o title_n give_v they_o num._n 4_o yea_o but_o our_o private_a author_n say_v a._n c._n be_v not_o allow_v 47._o for_o aught_o i_o know_v in_o such_o a_o like_a sort_n to_o express_v our_o catholic_a doctrine_n in_o any_o matter_n subject_a to_o question_n here_o be_v two_o limitation_n which_o will_v go_v far_o to_o bring_v a._n c._n off_o whatsoever_o i_o shall_v say_v against_o he_o for_o first_o let_v i_o instance_n in_o any_o private_a man_n that_o take_v as_o much_o upon_o he_o as_o m._n rogers_n do_v he_o will_v say_v he_o know_v it_o not_o his_o assertion_n here_o be_v no_o other_o then_o for_o aught_o he_o know_v second_o if_o he_o be_v unwilling_a to_o acknowledge_v so_o much_o yet_o he_o will_v answer_v it_o be_v not_o just_a in_o such_o a_o like_a sort_n as_o m._n rogers_n do_v it_o that_o be_v perhaps_o it_o be_v not_o the_o very_a title_n of_o his_o book_n but_o well_o then_o be_v there_o never_o a_o private_a man_n allow_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n to_o express_v your_o catholic_a doctrine_n in_o any_o matter_n subject_a to_o question_n what_o not_o in_o any_o matter_n be_v not_o vega_n and_o soto_n two_o private_a man_n be_v it_o not_o a_o matter_n subject_n to_o question_n to_o great_a question_n in_o these_o day_n whether_o a_o man_n may_v be_v certain_a of_o his_o be_v in_o the_o state_n of_o salvation_n certitudine_fw-la fidei_fw-la by_o the_o certainty_n of_o faith_n do_v not_o 14._o bellarmine_n make_v it_o a_o controversy_n and_o be_v it_o not_o a_o part_n of_o your_o catholic_a faith_n if_o it_o be_v determine_v in_o the_o tridentini_n council_n of_o trent_n and_o yet_o these_o two_o great_a friar_n of_o their_o time_n dominicus_n soto_n and_o andreas_n vega_n 1622._o be_v of_o contrary_a opinion_n and_o both_o of_o they_o challenge_v the_o decree_n of_o the_o council_n and_o so_o consequent_o your_o catholic_a faith_n to_o be_v as_o each_o of_o
they_o conclude_v and_o both_o of_o they_o write_v book_n to_o maintain_v their_o opinion_n and_o both_o of_o their_o book_n be_v publish_v by_o authority_n and_o therefore_o i_o think_v it_o be_v allow_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n to_o private_a man_n to_o express_v your_o catholic_a doctrine_n and_o in_o a_o matter_n subject_n to_o question_n and_o therefore_o also_o if_o another_o man_n in_o the_o church_n of_o england_n shall_v be_v of_o a_o contrary_a opinion_n to_o m._n rogers_n and_o declare_v it_o under_o the_o title_n of_o the_o catholic_a doctrine_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n this_o be_v no_o more_o than_o soto_n and_o vega_n do_v in_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n and_o i_o for_o my_o part_n can_v but_o wonder_v a._n c._n shall_v not_o know_v it_o for_o 47._o he_o say_v that_o for_o aught_o he_o know_v private_a man_n be_v not_o allow_v so_o to_o express_v their_o catholic_a doctrine_n and_o in_o the_o same_o question_v both_o catharinus_n and_o bellarmine_n 3._o take_v on_o they_o to_o express_v your_o catholic_a faith_n the_o one_o differ_v from_o the_o other_o almost_o as_o much_o as_o soto_n and_o vega_n and_o perhaps_o in_o some_o respect_n more_o f._n but_o if_o m._n rogers_n be_v only_o a_o private_a man_n in_o what_o book_n may_v we_o find_v the_o protestant_n public_a doctrine_n the_o bishop_n answer_v that_o to_o the_o book_n of_o article_n they_o be_v all_o swear_v b._n §_o 14_o num._n 1_o what_o be_v i_o so_o ignorant_a to_o say_v the_o article_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v the_o public_a doctrine_n of_o all_o the_o protestant_n or_o that_o all_o the_o protestant_n be_v swear_v to_o the_o article_n of_o england_n as_o this_o speech_n seem_v to_o imply_v sure_o i_o be_v not_o be_v not_o the_o immediate_a speech_n before_o of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n and_o how_o come_v the_o subject_a of_o the_o speech_n to_o be_v vary_v in_o the_o next_o line_n nor_o yet_o speak_v i_o this_o as_o if_o other_o protestant_n do_v not_o agree_v with_o the_o church_n of_o england_n in_o the_o chief_a doctrine_n and_o in_o the_o main_a exception_n which_o they_o joint_o take_v against_o the_o roman_a church_n as_o appear_v by_o their_o several_a confession_n but_o if_o a._n c._n will_v 47._o say_v as_o he_o do_v that_o because_o there_o be_v speech_n before_o of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n the_o jesuit_n understand_v i_o in_o a_o limit_a sense_n and_o mean_v only_o the_o protestant_n of_o the_o english_a church_n be_v it_o so_o there_o be_v no_o great_a harm_n do_v 48._o but_o this_o that_o the_o jesuit_n offer_v to_o enclose_v i_o too_o much_o for_o i_o do_v not_o say_v that_o the_o book_n of_o article_n only_o be_v the_o continent_n of_o the_o church_n of_o england_n public_a doctrine_n she_o be_v not_o so_o narrow_a nor_o have_v she_o purpose_n to_o exclude_v any_o thing_n which_o she_o acknowledge_v she_o nor_o do_v she_o witting_o permit_v any_o cross_v of_o her_o public_a declaration_n yet_o she_o be_v not_o such_o a_o shrew_n to_o her_o child_n as_o to_o deny_v her_o blessing_n or_o denounce_v a_o anathema_n against_o they_o if_o some_o peaceable_o dissent_v in_o some_o particular_n remote_a from_o the_o foundation_n as_o your_o own_o schoolman_n differ_v and_o if_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n since_o she_o grow_v to_o her_o greatness_n have_v not_o be_v so_o fierce_a in_o this_o course_n and_o too_o particular_a in_o determine_v too_o many_o thing_n and_o make_v they_o matter_n of_o necessary_a belief_n which_o have_v go_v for_o many_o hundred_o of_o year_n before_o only_o for_o thing_n of_o pious_a opinion_n christendom_n i_o persuade_v myself_o have_v be_v in_o happy_a peace_n at_o this_o day_n than_o i_o doubt_v we_o shall_v ever_o live_v to_o see_v it_o num._n 2_o well_o but_o a._n c._n will_v prove_v the_o church_n of_o england_n a_o shrew_n 48._o and_o such_o a_o shrew_n for_o in_o her_o book_n 5._o of_o canon_n she_o excommunicate_v every_o man_n who_o shall_v hold_v any_o thing_n contrary_a to_o any_o part_n of_o the_o say_a article_n so_o a._n c._n but_o sure_o these_o be_v not_o the_o very_a word_n of_o the_o canon_n nor_o perhaps_o the_o sense_n not_o the_o word_n for_o they_o be_v whosoever_o shall_v affirm_v that_o the_o article_n be_v in_o any_o part_n superstitious_a or_o erroneous_a etc._n etc._n and_o perhaps_o not_o the_o sense_n for_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n for_o a_o man_n to_o hold_v a_o opinion_n private_o within_o himself_o and_o another_o thing_n bold_o and_o public_o to_o affirm_v it_o and_o again_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n to_o hold_v contrary_a to_o some_o part_n of_o a_o article_n which_o perhaps_o may_v be_v but_o in_o the_o manner_n of_o expression_n and_o another_o thing_n positive_o to_o affirm_v that_o the_o article_n in_o any_o part_n of_o they_o be_v superstitious_a and_o erroneous_a but_o this_o be_v not_o the_o main_n of_o the_o business_n for_o though_o the_o church_n of_o england_n denounce_v excommunication_n as_o be_v 5._o before_o express_v yet_o she_o come_v far_o short_a of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n severity_n who_o anathema_n be_v not_o only_o for_o 39_o article_n but_o for_o very_a many_o more_o trident_n above_o one_o hundred_o in_o matter_n of_o doctrine_n and_o that_o in_o many_o point_n as_o far_o remote_a from_o the_o foundation_n though_o to_o the_o far_o great_a rack_n of_o man_n conscience_n they_o must_v be_v all_o make_v fundamental_a if_o that_o church_n have_v once_o determine_v 45._o they_o whereas_o the_o church_n of_o england_n never_o declare_v that_o every_o one_o of_o her_o article_n be_v fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n for_o it_o be_v one_o thing_n to_o say_v no_o one_o of_o they_o be_v superstitious_a or_o erroneous_a and_o quite_o another_o to_o say_v every_o one_o of_o they_o be_v fundamental_a and_o that_o in_o every_o part_n of_o it_o to_o all_o man_n belief_n beside_o the_o church_n of_o england_n prescribe_v only_o to_o her_o own_o child_n and_o by_o those_o article_n provide_v but_o for_o she_o own_o peaceable_a consent_n in_o those_o doctrine_n of_o truth_n but_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n severe_o impose_v her_o doctrine_n upon_o the_o whole_a world_n under_o pain_n of_o damnation_n f._n and_o that_o the_o scripture_n only_o not_o any_o unwritten_a tradition_n be_v the_o foundation_n of_o their_o faith_n b._n §_o 15_o num._n 1_o the_o church_n of_o england_n ground_v her_o positive_a article_n upon_o scripture_n and_o her_o negative_a do_v refute_v there_o where_o the_o thing_n affirm_v by_o you_o be_v not_o affirm_v by_o scripture_n nor_o direct_o to_o be_v conclude_v out_o of_o it_o and_o here_o not_o the_o church_n of_o england_n only_o but_o all_o protestant_n agree_v most_o true_o and_o most_o strong_o in_o this_o that_o the_o scripture_n be_v sufficient_a to_o salvation_n and_o contain_v in_o it_o all_o thing_n necessary_a to_o it_o the_o father_n again_o be_v plain_a the_o word_n schoolman_n not_o stranger_n in_o it_o and_o have_v not_o we_o reason_n then_o to_o account_v it_o as_o it_o be_v the_o foundation_n of_o our_o faith_n and_o fine_a stapleton_n himself_o though_o a_o angry_a opposite_a confess_v that_o the_o scripture_n be_v in_o some_o sort_n the_o foundation_n of_o faith_n that_o be_v in_o the_o nature_n of_o testimony_n and_o in_o the_o matter_n or_o thing_n to_o be_v believe_v and_o if_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o foundation_n to_o which_o we_o be_v to_o go_v for_o witness_n if_o there_o be_v doubt_v about_o the_o faith_n and_o in_o which_o we_o be_v to_o find_v the_o thing_n that_o be_v to_o be_v believe_v as_o necessary_a in_o the_o faith_n we_o never_o do_v nor_o never_o will_v refuse_v any_o tradition_n that_o be_v universal_a and_o apostolic_a for_o the_o better_a exposition_n of_o the_o scripture_n nor_o any_o definition_n of_o the_o church_n in_o which_o she_o go_v to_o the_o scripture_n for_o what_o she_o teach_v and_o thrust_v nothing_o as_o fundamental_a in_o the_o faith_n upon_o 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they_o very_o deserve_o and_o be_v these_o text_n more_o void_a of_o truth_n than_o they_o be_v yet_o it_o be_v fit_a and_o reasonable_a to_o uphold_v their_o credit_n that_o novice_n and_o young_a beginner_n in_o a_o science_n which_o be_v not_o able_a to_o work_v strong_o upon_o reason_n nor_o reason_n upon_o they_o may_v have_v authority_n to_o believe_v till_o they_o can_v learn_v to_o conclude_v from_o principle_n and_o so_o to_o know_v be_v this_o also_o reasonable_a in_o other_o science_n and_o shall_v it_o not_o be_v so_o in_o theology_n to_o have_v a_o text_n a_o scripture_n a_o rule_n which_o novice_n may_v be_v teach_v first_o to_o believe_v that_o so_o they_o may_v after_o come_v to_o the_o knowledge_n of_o those_o thing_n which_o out_o of_o this_o rich_a principle_n and_o they_o treasure_n be_v deduceable_a i_o yet_o see_v not_o how_o right_a reason_n can_v deny_v these_o ground_n and_o if_o it_o can_v than_o a_o mere_a natural_a man_n may_v be_v thus_o far_o convince_v that_o the_o text_n of_o god_n be_v a_o very_a credible_a text._n num._n 19_o well_o these_o be_v the_o four_o way_n by_o most_o of_o which_o man_n offer_v to_o prove_v the_o scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n as_o by_o a_o divine_a and_o infallible_a warrant_n and_o it_o seem_v no_o one_o of_o these_o do_v it_o alone_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o present_a church_n be_v too_o weak_a because_o that_o be_v not_o absolute_o divine_a the_o light_n which_o be_v in_o scripture_n itself_o be_v not_o bright_a enough_o it_o can_v bear_v sufficient_a witness_n to_o itself_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o holy_a ghost_n that_o be_v most_o infallible_a but_o ordinary_o it_o be_v not_o so_o much_o as_o considerable_a in_o this_o question_n which_o be_v not_o how_o or_o by_o what_o mean_v we_o believe_v but_o how_o the_o scripture_n may_v be_v propose_v as_o a_o credible_a object_n fit_a for_o belief_n and_o for_o reason_n no_o man_n expect_v that_o that_o shall_v prove_v it_o it_o do_v 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there_o be_v by_o historical_a and_o acquire_v faith_n and_o if_o consent_v of_o humane_a story_n can_v assure_v i_o this_o why_o shall_v not_o consent_v of_o church-story_n assure_v i_o the_o other_o that_o christ_n and_o his_o apostle_n deliver_v this_o body_n of_o scripture_n as_o the_o oracle_n of_o god_n for_o jew_n enemy_n to_o christ_n they_o bear_v witness_n to_o the_o old_a testament_n and_o christian_n through_o almost_o all_o nation_n 15._o give_v in_o evidence_n to_o both_o old_a and_o new_a and_o no_o pagan_a or_o other_o enemy_n of_o christianity_n can_v give_v such_o a_o worthy_a and_o consent_v testimony_n for_o any_o authority_n upon_o which_o they_o rely_v or_o almost_o for_o any_o principle_n which_o they_o have_v as_o the_o scripture_n have_v gain_v to_o itself_o and_o as_o be_v the_o testimony_n which_o it_o receive_v above_o all_o 1._o write_n of_o all_o nation_n so_o here_o be_v assurance_n in_o a_o great_a measure_n without_o any_o divine_a authority_n in_o a_o 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we_o be_v all_o of_o one_o belief_n that_o belief_n be_v taint_v in_o tract_n and_o corruption_n of_o time_n very_o deep_o a_o division_n be_v make_v yet_o so_o that_o both_o part_n hold_v the_o creed_n and_o other_o common_a principle_n of_o belief_n of_o these_o this_o be_v one_o of_o the_o great_a 4._o that_o the_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n for_o our_o belief_n of_o all_o thing_n contain_v in_o it_o depend_v upon_o it_o since_o this_o division_n there_o have_v be_v nothing_o do_v by_o we_o to_o discredit_v this_o principle_n nay_o we_o have_v give_v it_o all_o honour_n and_o ascribe_v unto_o it_o more_o sufficiency_n even_o to_o the_o contain_v of_o all_o thing_n necessary_a to_o salvation_n with_o 2._o satis_fw-la superque_fw-la enough_o and_o more_o than_o enough_o which_o yourselves_o have_v not_o do_v do_v not_o and_o for_o beget_v and_o settle_v a_o belief_n of_o this_o principle_n we_o go_v the_o same_o way_n with_o you_o and_o a_o better_a beside_o the_o same_o way_n with_o you_o because_o we_o allow_v the_o tradition_n of_o the_o present_a church_n to_o be_v the_o first_o induce_v motive_n to_o embrace_v this_o principle_n only_o we_o can_v go_v so_o far_o in_o this_o way_n as_o you_o to_o make_v the_o present_a tradition_n always_o a_o infallible_a word_n of_o god_n unwritten_a for_o this_o be_v to_o go_v so_o far_o in_o till_o you_o be_v out_o of_o the_o way_n for_o tradition_n be_v but_o a_o lane_n in_o the_o church_n it_o have_v a_o end_n not_o only_o to_o receive_v we_o in_o but_o another_o after_o to_o let_v we_o out_o into_o more_o open_a and_o rich_a ground_n and_o we_o go_v a_o better_a way_n than_o you_o because_o after_o we_o be_v move_v and_o prepare_v and_o induce_v by_o tradition_n we_o resolve_v our_o faith_n into_o that_o write_a word_n and_o god_n deliver_v it_o in_o which_o we_o find_v material_o though_o not_o in_o term_n the_o very_a tradition_n that_o lead_v we_o thither_o and_o so_o we_o be_v sure_a by_o divine_a authority_n that_o we_o be_v in_o the_o way_n because_o at_o the_o end_n we_o find_v the_o way_n prove_v and_o do_v what_o can_v be_v do_v you_o can_v never_o settle_v the_o faith_n of_o man_n about_o this_o great_a principle_n till_o you_o rise_v to_o great_a assurance_n than_o the_o present_a church_n alone_o can_v give_v and_o therefore_o once_o again_o to_o that_o know_a place_n of_o s._n augustine_n 5._o the_o word_n of_o the_o father_n be_v nisi_fw-la commoveret_fw-la unless_o the_o authority_n of_o the_o church_n move_v i_o but_o not_o alone_o but_o with_o other_o motive_n else_o it_o be_v not_o commovere_fw-la to_o move_v together_o and_o the_o other_o motive_n be_v resolver_n though_o this_o be_v leader_n now_o since_o we_o go_v the_o same_o way_n with_o you_o so_o far_o as_o you_o go_v right_a and_o a_o better_a way_n than_o you_o where_o you_o go_v wrong_a we_o need_v not_o admit_v any_o other_o word_n of_o god_n than_o we_o do_v and_o this_o aught_o to_o remain_v as_o a_o presuppose_a principle_n among_o all_o christian_n and_o not_o so_o much_o as_o come_v into_o this_o question_n about_o the_o sufficiency_n of_o scripture_n between_o you_o and_o we_o but_o you_o say_v that_o f._n from_o this_o the_o lady_n call_v we_o and_o desire_v to_o hear_v whether_o the_o bishop_n will_v grant_v the_o roman_a church_n to_o be_v the_o right_a church_n the_o b._n grant_v that_o it_o be_v b._n §_o 20_o num._n 1_o one_o occasion_n which_o move_v tertullian_n to_o write_v his_o book_n dâ—_n prescript_n adversus_fw-la haereticos_fw-la be_v that_o he_o profici_fw-la see_v little_a or_o no_o profit_n come_v by_o disputation_n sure_o the_o ground_n be_v the_o same_o then_o and_o now_o it_o be_v not_o to_o deny_v that_o disputation_n be_v a_o open_v of_o the_o understanding_n a_o sift_v out_o of_o truth_n it_o be_v not_o to_o affirm_v that_o any_o such_o disquisition_n be_v in_o and_o of_o itself_o unprofitable_a if_o it_o have_v s._n stephen_n 9_o will_v not_o have_v dispute_v with_o the_o cyrenian_o nor_o s._n paul_n with_o the_o 29._o grecian_n first_o and_o then_o with_o the_o jew_n 17._o and_o all_o comer_n no_o sure_o it_o be_v some_o abuse_n in_o the_o disputant_n that_o frustrate_v the_o good_a of_o the_o disputation_n and_o one_o abuse_v in_o the_o disputant_n be_v a_o resolution_n to_o hold_v their_o own_o though_o it_o be_v by_o unworthy_a mean_n and_o disparagement_n 48._o of_o truth_n and_o so_o i_o find_v it_o here_o for_o as_o it_o be_v true_a that_o this_o question_n be_v ask_v so_o it_o be_v altogether_o false_a that_o it_o be_v ask_v in_o this_o he_o form_n or_o so_o answer_v there_o be_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o difference_n especial_o as_o romanist_n handle_v the_o question_n of_o the_o church_n between_o the_o church_n and_o a_o church_n and_o there_o be_v some_o between_o a_o true_a church_n and_o a_o right_a church_n which_o be_v the_o word_n you_o use_v but_o no_o man_n else_o that_o i_o know_v i_o be_o sure_a not_o i_o num._n 2_o for_o the_o church_n may_v import_v in_o our_o language_n the_o only_a true_a church_n and_o perhaps_o as_o some_o of_o you_o seem_v to_o make_v it_o the_o root_n and_o the_o ground_n of_o the_o catholic_a and_o this_o i_o never_o do_v grant_v of_o the_o roman_a church_n nor_o ever_o mean_a to_o do_v but_o a_o church_n can_v imply_v no_o more_o than_o that_o it_o be_v a_o member_n of_o the_o whole_a and_o this_o i_o never_o do_v nor_o ever_o will_v deny_v if_o it_o fall_v not_o absolute_o away_o from_o christ._n that_o it_o be_v a_o true_a church_n i_o grant_v also_o but_o not_o a_o right_n as_o you_o impose_v upon_o i_o for_o ens_fw-la and_o verum_fw-la be_v and_o true_a be_v convertible_a one_o with_o another_o and_o every_o thing_n that_o have_v a_o be_v be_v
boty_n by_o divine_a and_o by_o infallible_a proof_n but_o our_o certainty_n be_v by_o faith_n and_o so_o voluntary_a not_o by_o knowledge_n of_o such_o principle_n as_o in_o the_o light_n of_o nature_n can_v enforce_v assent_n whether_o we_o will_v or_o no._n i_o have_v say_v thus_o much_o upon_o this_o great_a occasion_n because_o this_o argument_n be_v so_o much_o press_v without_o due_a respect_n to_o scripture_n and_o i_o have_v proceed_v in_o a_o synthetical_a way_n to_o build_v up_o the_o truth_n for_o the_o benefit_n of_o the_o church_n and_o the_o satisfaction_n of_o all_o man_n christianly_o dispose_v whereas_o have_v i_o desire_v only_o to_o rid_v my_o hand_n of_o these_o captious_a jesuit_n for_o certain_o this_o question_n be_v captious_o ask_v it_o have_v be_v sufficient_a to_o have_v restore_v the_o question_n thus_o how_o do_v you_o know_v the_o testimony_n of_o the_o church_n by_o which_o you_o say_v you_o know_v scripture_n to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n to_o be_v divine_a and_o infallible_a if_o they_o prove_v it_o by_o scripture_n as_o all_o of_o they_o do_v and_o as_o a._n c._n do_v how_o do_v 28._o they_o know_v that_o scripture_n to_o be_v scripture_n it_o be_v but_o a_o circular_a assurance_n of_o they_o by_o which_o they_o find_v the_o church_n infallibility_n upon_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o scripture_n and_o the_o scripture_n infallibility_n upon_o the_o testimony_n of_o the_o church_n that_o be_v upon_o the_o matter_n the_o church_n infallibility_n upon_o the_o church_n infallibility_n but_o i_o labour_v for_o edification_n not_o for_o destruction_n and_o now_o by_o what_o i_o have_v here_o say_v i_o will_v weigh_v my_o answer_n and_o his_o exception_n take_v against_o it_o f._n the_o bishop_n say_v that_o the_o book_n of_o scripture_n be_v principle_n to_o be_v suppose_v and_o need_v not_o to_o be_v prove_v b._n §_o 17_o why_o but_o do_v i_o say_v that_o this_o principle_n the_o book_n of_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n be_v to_o be_v suppose_v as_o need_v no_o proof_n at_o all_o to_o a_o natural_a man_n or_o to_o a_o man_n new_o enter_v upon_o the_o faith_n yea_o or_o perhaps_o to_o a_o doubter_n or_o weakling_n in_o the_o faith_n can_v you_o think_v i_o so_o weak_a it_o seem_v you_o do_v but_o sure_o i_o know_v there_o be_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o difference_n between_o ethnic_n that_o deny_v and_o deride_v the_o scripture_n and_o man_n that_o be_v bear_v in_o the_o church_n the_o first_o have_v a_o far_a way_n about_o to_o this_o principle_n the_o other_o in_o their_o very_a christian_a education_n suck_v it_o in_o and_o be_v teach_v so_o soon_o as_o they_o be_v apt_a to_o learn_v it_o that_o the_o book_n common_o call_v the_o bible_n or_o scripture_n be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n and_o i_o deal_v with_o you_o 13._o as_o with_o a_o christian_a though_o in_o error_n while_o you_o call_v catholic_a the_o word_n before_o speak_v by_o i_o be_v that_o the_o scripture_n only_o not_o any_o unwritten_a tradition_n be_v the_o foundation_n of_o faith_n the_o question_n between_o we_o and_o you_o be_v whether_o the_o scripture_n do_v contain_v all_o necessary_a thing_n of_o faith_n now_o in_o this_o question_n as_o in_o all_o nature_n and_o art_n the_o subject_a the_o scripture_n be_v and_o must_v be_v 3._o suppose_v the_o quaere_fw-la between_o the_o roman-catholic_n and_o the_o church_n of_o england_n be_v only_o of_o the_o predicate_v the_o thing_n utter_v of_o it_o namely_o whether_o it_o contain_v all_o fundamental_o of_o faith_n all_o necessary_n for_o salvation_n within_o it_o now_o since_o the_o question_v propose_v in_o very_a form_n of_o art_n prove_v not_o but_o ipsum_fw-la suppose_v the_o subject_a i_o think_v i_o give_v a_o satisfy_a answer_n that_o to_o you_o and_o i_o and_o in_o this_o question_n scripture_n be_v a_o suppose_a principle_n and_o need_v no_o proof_n and_o i_o must_v tell_v you_o that_o in_o this_o question_n of_o the_o scripture_n perfect_a continent_n it_o be_v against_o all_o art_n yea_o and_o equity_n too_o in_o reason_v to_o call_v for_o a_o proof_n of_o that_o here_o which_o must_v go_v avoidable_o suppose_v in_o this_o question_n and_o if_o any_o man_n will_v be_v so_o familiar_a with_o impiety_n to_o question_v it_o it_o must_v be_v try_v in_o a_o precede_a question_n and_o dispute_v by_o itself_o yet_o here_o not_o you_o only_o but_o 49._o bellarmine_n and_o other_o run_v quite_o out_o of_o the_o way_n to_o snatch_v at_o advantage_n f._n against_o this_o i_o read_v what_o i_o have_v former_o write_v in_o my_o reply_n against_o m._n john_n white_a wherein_o i_o plain_o show_v that_o this_o answer_n be_v not_o good_a and_o that_o no_o other_o answer_n can_v be_v make_v but_o by_o admit_v some_o word_n of_o god_n unwritten_a to_o assure_v we_o of_o this_o point_n â—_o §_o 18_o num._n 1_o indeed_o here_o you_o read_v out_o of_o a_o book_n which_o you_o call_v your_o own_o a_o large_a discourse_n upon_o this_o argument_n but_o sure_o i_o so_o untie_v the_o knot_n of_o the_o argument_n that_o i_o set_v you_o to_o your_o book_n again_o for_o yourself_o confess_v that_o against_o this_o you_o read_v what_o you_o have_v former_o write_v well!_o what_o ere_o you_o read_v there_o certain_z it_o be_v you_o do_v a_o great_a deal_n of_o wrong_n to_o m._n hooker_n 8._o and_o myself_o that_o because_o we_o call_v it_o a_o suppose_a or_o presume_v principle_n among_o christian_n you_o shall_v fall_v by_o and_o by_o into_o such_o a_o 3._o metaphysical_a discourse_n to_o prove_v that_o that_o which_o be_v a_o we_o praecognitum_n fore-known_a in_o science_n must_v be_v of_o such_o light_n that_o it_o must_v be_v know_v of_o and_o by_o itself_o alone_o and_o that_o the_o scripture_n can_v be_v so_o know_v to_o be_v the_o word_n of_o god_n num._n 2_o i_o will_v not_o now_o enter_v again_o into_o that_o discourse_n have_v say_v enough_o already_o how_o far_o the_o beam_n which_o be_v very_o glorious_a especial_o in_o some_o part_n of_o scripture_n give_v light_a to_o prove_v itself_o you_o see_v neither_o hooker_n nor_o i_o nor_o the_o church_n of_o england_n for_o aught_o i_o know_v leave_v the_o scripture_n alone_o to_o manifest_v itself_o by_o the_o light_n which_o it_o have_v in_o itself_o no_o but_o when_o the_o present_a church_n have_v prepare_v and_o lead_v the_o way_n like_o a_o prepare_v morning-light_n to_o sunshine_n then_o indeed_o we_o settle_v for_o our_o direction_n yet_o not_o upon_o the_o first_o open_v of_o the_o morning-light_n but_o upon_o the_o sun_n itself_o nor_o will_v i_o make_v needless_a enquiry_n how_o far_o and_o in_o what_o manner_n a_o praecognitum_n or_o suppose_a principle_n in_o any_o science_n may_v be_v prove_v in_o a_o high_a to_o which_o that_o be_v subordinate_a or_o accept_v for_o a_o prime_n nor_o how_o it_o may_v in_o divinity_n where_o prae_fw-la as_o well_o as_o post-cognita_a thing_n fore_o as_o well_o as_o after-known_a be_v matter_n and_o under_o the_o manner_n of_o faith_n and_o not_o of_o science_n strict_o nor_o whether_o a_o praecognitum_n a_o presuppose_a principle_n in_o faith_n which_o rest_v upon_o divine_a authority_n must_v needs_o have_v as_o much_o and_o equal_a light_n to_o natural_a reason_n as_o prime_a principle_n have_v in_o nature_n while_o they_o rest_v upon_o reason_n nor_o whether_o it_o may_v just_o be_v deny_v to_o have_v sufficient_a light_n because_o not_o equal_a your_o own_o school_n 3._o grant_v that_o in_o we_o which_o be_v the_o subject_n both_o of_o faith_n and_o knowledge_n and_o in_o regard_n of_o the_o evidence_n give_v in_o unto_o we_o there_o be_v less_o light_n less_o evidence_n in_o the_o principle_n of_o faith_n than_o in_o the_o principle_n of_o knowledge_n upon_o which_o there_o can_v be_v no_o doubt_n but_o i_o think_v the_o school_n will_v never_o grant_v that_o the_o principle_n of_o faith_n even_o this_o in_o question_n have_v not_o sufficient_a evidence_n and_o you_o ought_v not_o to_o do_v as_o you_o do_v without_o any_o distinction_n or_o any_o limitation_n deny_v a_o praecognitum_n or_o prime_a principle_n in_o the_o faith_n because_o it_o answer_v not_o in_o all_o thing_n to_o the_o prime_a principle_n in_o science_n in_o their_o light_n and_o evidence_n a_o thing_n in_o itself_o direct_o against_o reason_n num._n 3_o well_o though_o i_o do_v none_o of_o this_o yet_o first_o i_o must_v tell_v you_o that_o a._n c._n here_o step_n in_o again_o and_o tell_v i_o that_o though_o a_o praecognitum_n in_o faith_n need_v not_o be_v so_o clear_o know_v as_o a_o praecognitum_n in_o science_n yet_o there_o must_v be_v this_o proportion_n between_o they_o that_o whether_o it_o be_v in_o science_n or_o in_o faith_n the_o praecognitum_n or_o thing_n suppose_v as_o know_v must_v be_v prius_fw-la cognitum_fw-la
if_o be_v call_v will_v not_o be_v of_o one_o mind_n have_v christ_n our_o lord_n say_v he_o in_o this_o case_n provide_v no_o rule_n no_o judge_n infallible_o to_o determine_v controversy_n and_o to_o procure_v unity_n and_o certainty_n of_o belief_n indeed_o the_o protestant_n admit_v no_o infallible_a mean_n rule_n or_o judge_n but_o only_a scripture_n which_o every_o man_n may_v interpret_v as_o he_o please_v and_o so_o all_o shall_v be_v uncertain_a true_o i_o must_v confess_v there_o be_v many_o impediment_n to_o hinder_v the_o call_v of_o a_o general_n council_n you_o know_v in_o the_o ancient_a church_n there_o be_v 1585._o hindrance_n enough_o and_o what_o hurt_v it_o wrought_v and_o afterward_o though_o it_o be_v long_o first_o there_o be_v provision_n make_v for_o a._n frequent_a call_n of_o counsel_n and_o yet_o no_o age_n since_o see_v they_o call_v according_a to_o that_o provision_n in_o every_o circumstance_n therefore_o impediment_n there_o be_v enough_o or_o else_o some_o decline_v they_o wilful_o though_o there_o be_v no_o impediment_n nor_o will_v i_o deny_v but_o that_o when_o they_o be_v call_v there_o be_v as_o many_o 〈◊〉_d practice_n to_o disturb_v or_o pervert_v the_o counsel_n and_o these_o practice_n be_v able_a to_o keep_v many_o counsel_n from_o be_v all_o of_o one_o mind_n but_o if_o be_v call_v they_o will_v not_o be_v of_o one_o mind_n i_o can_v help_v that_o though_o that_o very_o not_o agree_v be_v a_o shrewd_a sign_n that_o the_o other_o spirit_n have_v a_o party_n there_o against_o the_o holy_a ghost_n now_o a._n c._n will_v know_v what_o be_v to_o be_v do_v for_o reunite_v 3_o of_o a_o church_n divide_v in_o doctrine_n of_o the_o faith_n when_o this_o remedy_n by_o a_o general_n council_n can_v be_v have_v sure_a christ_n our_o lord_n say_v he_o have_v provide_v some_o rule_n some_o judge_n in_o such_o and_o such_o like_a case_n to_o procure_v unity_n and_o certainty_n of_o belief_n i_o believe_v so_o too_o for_o he_o have_v leave_v a_o infallible_a rule_n the_o scripture_n and_o that_o by_o the_o manifest_a place_n in_o it_o which_o need_v no_o dispute_n no_o external_n judge_n be_v finem_fw-la able_a to_o settle_v unity_n and_o certainty_n of_o belief_n in_o necessary_n to_o salvation_n and_o in_o non_fw-la necessariis_fw-la in_o and_o about_o thing_n not_o necessary_a there_o ought_v not_o to_o be_v a_o contention_n to_o a_o sine_fw-la separation_n num._n 4_o and_o therefore_o a._n c._n do_v not_o well_o to_o make_v that_o a_o crime_n that_o the_o protestant_n admit_v no_o infallible_a rule_n but_o the_o scripture_n only_o or_o as_o he_o i_o doubt_v not_o without_o some_o scorn_n term_v it_o beside_o only_a scripture_n for_o what_o need_n be_v there_o of_o another_o since_o this_o be_v most_o infallible_a and_o the_o same_o which_o the_o 22._o ancient_a church_n of_o christ_n admit_v and_o if_o it_o be_v sufficient_a for_o the_o ancient_a church_n to_o guide_v they_o and_o direct_v their_o counsel_n why_o shall_v it_o be_v now_o hold_v insufficient_a for_o we_o at_o least_o till_o a_o free_a general_n council_n may_v be_v have_v and_o it_o have_v both_o the_o condition_n which_o 5._o bellarmine_n require_v to_o a_o rule_n namely_o that_o it_o be_v certain_a and_o that_o it_o be_v know_v for_o if_o it_o be_v not_o certain_a it_o be_v no_o rule_n and_o if_o it_o be_v not_o know_v it_o be_v no_o rule_n to_o we_o now_o the_o they_o romanist_n dare_v not_o deny_v but_o this_o rule_n be_v certain_a and_o that_o it_o be_v sufficient_o know_v in_o the_o manifest_a place_n of_o it_o and_o such_o as_o be_v necessary_a to_o salvation_n none_o of_o the_o ancient_n do_v ever_o deny_v so_o there_o be_v a_o infallible_a rule_n num._n 5_o nor_o need_v there_o be_v such_o fear_n of_o a_o private_a spirit_n in_o these_o manifest_a thing_n which_o be_v but_o read_v or_o hear_v teach_v themselves_o indeed_o you_o romanist_n have_v need_v of_o some_o other_o judge_n and_o he_o a_o propitious_a one_o to_o crush_v the_o pope_n more_o powerful_a principality_n out_o of_o pasce_fw-la oves_fw-la feed_v my_o sheep_n and_o yet_o this_o must_v be_v the_o meaning_n if_o you_o will_v have_v it_o whether_o gideon_n fleece_n be_v wet_a or_o dry_a judg._n 6._o that_o be_v whether_o there_o be_v dew_n enough_o in_o the_o 6._o text_n to_o water_v that_o sense_n or_o no._n but_o i_o pray_v when_o god_n have_v leave_v his_o church_n this_o infallible_a rule_n what_o warrant_v have_v you_o to_o seek_v another_o you_o have_v show_v we_o none_o yet_o what_o ever_o you_o think_v you_o have_v and_o i_o hope_v a._n c._n can_v think_v it_o follow_v that_o christ_n our_o lord_n have_v provide_v no_o rule_n to_o determine_v necessary_a controversy_n because_o he_o have_v not_o provide_v the_o rule_n which_o he_o will_v have_v num._n 6_o beside_o let_v there_o be_v such_o a_o live_a judge_n as_o a._n c._n will_v have_v and_o let_v the_o 58._o pope_n be_v he_o yet_o that_o be_v not_o sufficient_a against_o the_o malice_n of_o the_o devil_n and_o impious_a man_n to_o keep_v the_o church_n at_o all_o time_n from_o rent_v even_o in_o the_o doctrine_n of_o faith_n or_o to_o solder_v the_o rent_n which_o be_v make_v for_o oportet_fw-la esse_fw-la haereses_fw-la 1_o cor._n 11._o heresy_n there_o will_v be_v and_o heresy_n proper_o there_o 19_o can_v be_v but_o in_o doctrine_n of_o the_o faith_n and_o what_o will_v a._n c._n in_o this_o case_n do_v will_v he_o send_v christ_n our_o lord_n to_o provide_v another_o rule_n than_o the_o decision_n of_o the_o bishop_n of_o rome_n because_o he_o can_v neither_o make_v unity_n nor_o certainty_n of_o belief_n and_o as_o it_o be_v most_o apparent_a he_o can_v do_v it_o de_fw-fr facto_fw-la so_o neither_o have_v he_o power_n from_o christ_n over_o the_o whole_a church_n to_o do_v it_o nay_o out_o of_o all_o doubt_n it_o be_v not_o the_o least_o reason_n why_o de_fw-fr facto_fw-la he_o have_v so_o little_a success_n because_o de_fw-fr jure_fw-la he_o have_v no_o power_n give_v but_o since_o a._n c._n require_v another_o judge_n beside_o the_o scripture_n and_o in_o case_n when_o either_o the_o time_n be_v so_o difficult_a that_o a_o general_n council_n can_v be_v call_v or_o the_o council_n so_o set_v that_o they_o will_v not_o agree_v let_v we_o see_v how_o he_o prove_v it_o num._n 7_o it_o be_v thus_o every_o earthly_a kingdom_n say_v he_o when_o matter_n 60._o can_v be_v compose_v by_o a_o parliament_n which_o can_v be_v call_v upon_o all_o occasion_n why_o do_v he_o not_o add_v here_o and_o which_o be_v call_v will_v not_o always_o be_v of_o one_o mind_n as_o he_o do_v add_v it_o in_o case_n of_o the_o council_n have_v beside_o the_o law-book_n some_o live_a magistrate_n and_o judge_n and_o above_o all_o one_o visible_a king_n the_o high_a judge_n who_o have_v authority_n sufficient_a to_o end_v all_o controversy_n and_o settle_v unity_n in_o all_o temporal_a affair_n and_o shall_v we_o think_v that_o christ_n the_o wise_a 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