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Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
book_n	authority_n	bishop_n	church_n	2,351	5	3.9478	3	true

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A36251	Reflexions on a pamphlet entitled, Remarks on the occasional paper, numb. VIII relating to the controversy betwixt Dr. Hody and Mr. Dodwell and on another entitl'd A defence of the vindication of the depriv'd bishops, some time since seiz'd and suppress'd by the Government, and now reprinted : with an answer to a third call'd historical collections concerning church affairs.	Dodwell, Henry, 1641-1711.; Hody, Humphrey, 1659-1707.	1698 (1698)	Wing D1816; ESTC R9160	29,610	34

was the Reason why after he was restored and Felix rejected some would not acknowledge him but continued to adhere to Felix whom they knew to be truly Orthodox When Hosius of Corduba was pushed on through the violence of the times to Communicate with the Hereticks Valens and Ursacius what was the Reason that he never could be brought to subscribe to Athanasius's Condemnation Was it not because he accounted even Heresie it self a less fault than to comply with a wrong Succession No such matter If Hosius still stood firm in that Point it was because to subscribe to Athanasius's Condemnation was to own his belief of those Crimes for which he was depos'd which he could not do being in his Conscience so extreamly satisfied that he was not guilty He could not find in his heart to be guilty of so great a Lie and of so great Injustice to the injur'd Athanasius And so we are told by Athanasius himself that the Reason why the Catholick Bishops chose rather to suffer so cruel a Persecution than to set their Hands to his Deprivation was because they saw plainly that the Crimes with which he was charg'd were only the Forgeries of his Enemies Thus Flavianus and Elias the Patriarchs of Antioch and Ierusalem though● they own'd Timotheus as Patriarch of C P. yet they never could be perswaded to subscribe to the Deprivation of his Predecessor Macedonius because that would have been to own a belief of the Crimes that were laid to his charge and of the Iustice of his Enemies Proceedings I shall here inform the Collector that it appears by the Testimony of St. Hilary himself who suffered in the Cause of Athanasius that the Catholick Bishops offered to subscribe to his Deprivation if his Adversaries would but subscribe to the Doctrine of the Council of Nice And the same is likewise attested by Sulpitius Severus If his Adversaries would have done this the Catholicks would then have been convinced that the Crimes which they laid to his charge were not forged against him for the advance of the Arian Heresie but might possibly be true This they could not perswade themselves as long as they plainly saw that his Deposers were Enemies to the Orthodox Faith The Schism of the Meletians and the Paulinists of Antioch which the Collector so tediously insists on that was likewise founded in Heresie and makes not a whit for their Cause The Paulinists accounted Meletius and his Successors Arians or disown'd at least the validity of their Orders The Meletians on the other side accounted Paulinus a Sabellian and he was not put upon them by any Sovereign Coercive Power which the Collector cannot be made to take notice of but by Lucifer Calaritanus who had no Authority over them Dr Hody had asked what Authority he had to Constitute a Bishop of Antioch The Collector here takes him up and shews him in a Digression of several Pages if any thing may be call'd a Digression in that Book that where Heresie is concern'd a Catholick Bishop has Authority any where Very pertinently done As if the Dr could be ignorant of what every Body so well knows But how could Lucifer's Authority oblige those that accounted Meletius Orthodox to reject him for another What power irresistible had he to put a new Bishop upon them That which chiefly continued that unhappy Division was the Opinion which Lucifer had instill'd into his Party that the Orders of the other side were null as being Arian To conclude I have already challenged Mr Dodwel and the whole Party and in this I am only a Second to the Dr to produce me any ONE single Instance of a Bishop disown'd by the generality of the Catholick Church for this Reason because put into the place of another deposed by the Civil Power The generality is the only thing that can be of any Authority But I 'll now for a Trial of skill be so bold as to give one challenge more Instead of the generality in the fourth Age I challenge the Collector who takes himself to be so much a Master of the Story of that Age to shew me any one single Person throughout all that Age that actually stood out on that account There is not to be found and I am not afraid to affirm it so much as one single Person among all the Catholicks of that Age who actually refused to own any Bishop that was put in by an irresistible Power but it was for one of these Reasons either because he accounted him a Heretick or because he look'd upon his Orders to be null and invalid as being deriv'd either immediately or mediately from one whom he accounted a Heretick or because the Bishop communicated with Hereticks or lastly because he was for some other Crime Excommunicated The Donatists themselves can afford the Collector no Example For the Reason why they disown'd the Catholick Bishops who were back'd by the Imperial Power was because they accounted their Orders and their Baptism invalid as being deriv'd from such whom they believed to have been Traditors This Rule being observ'd you have a full and a clear Answer to all that Long and Verbose Collection More Labour and more Words to less purpose in my Life I never saw But it 's usual with Men of that size for the cleanlier conveyance of their Tricks and Shuffles to stare their Readers with Confidence in the Face and to overwhelm them with a long run of Words With this I leave the Matter the Collector and all together For the sake of some Reverend and Worthy Persons who are unhappily engaged in the present Division for whom I must avow I have all along had and shall always have a very great and distinguishing Respect I shall here lay down an Example that relates to our own Country which to Men of good Tempers may be of good use When Wlketulus the worthy Abbot of Croyland in the time of Will the Conquerour was unjustly depriv'd of his Abbey Ingulphus the Historian being nominated to it without any scruple accepted of it tho' he own'd his Predecessor to have been wrongfully dispossessed Wlketulus being a very pious and good Man and skilful in the Affairs of the Monastery Ingulphus invites him to come and live with him placed him always in his own Stall and honoured him as his Father and Copartner in the Government Thus the good old Abbot lived lovingly and contentedly with his Successor to his death and was very useful to the Monastery I have only a word or two more to add and that is to put you in mind that when-ever you meet with any thing that may be published as an Answer to The Case of Sees Vacant the Dr desires you would be pleased to Read both together If you think he is at leisure or of an inclination to Answer every little thing and especially of their Vnderworkmen that shall be published against him you will find your self mistaken The Phaenomena of History

REFLEXIONS ON A PAMPHLET ENTITLED Remarks on the Occasional Paper Numb VIII Relating to the CONTROVERSY BETWIXT Dr. HODY and Mr. DODWELL And on another Entitl'd A Defence of the Vindication of the Depriv'd Bishops Some time since seiz'd and suppress'd by the Government and now Reprinted With an Answer to a Third call'd Historical Collections concerning Church Affairs LONDON Printed by T. Snowden for Iohn Everingham at the Star in Ludgate-street 1698. SIR THO' I do not at all know who are the Authors of the Occasional Papers yet I think so well both of the Performance and of the Prudence and Seasonableness of the Design as to be highly pleased to find 'em so acceptable to you Since I sent you the last which was Numb VIII there is come out a small Pamphlet called Remarks upon it in a Letter to the Author Which I here send you not for any thing considerable that I see in it but to gratifie your Curiosity There are a few things in it which I think sit to take a little notice of And the first is his blaming the Author of that Paper for charging the Vindicator of the deprived Bishops a little severely on the account of his Notions and Practice The Remarker tells ye that what the Vindicator has said and writ in defence of the Rights of the Clergy might one would have thought have secur'd him from the Pen of a Clergy-man The Temper of the Laity in this Age and Nation is such that few of 'em appear very forward to defend even the just Privileges of the Clergy and therefore when a Lay-man will write on their behalf they ought to be so true to their own Interests as at least to stand Neuters the mean while If the Learned Vindicator has writ any thing in defence of the Rights of the Church and the Just Privileges of the Clergy we own our selves much obliged to him But the Question is what are their Rights and what their Iust Privileges Did I see one of the best of my Friends endeavour to Rob another on my account I am a Knove if I stand Neuter and a greater if I side with him to deprive another of what is rightfully his I am oblig'd in Conscience and Equity to take his part whom my Friend would Wrong tho' it were for my own Profit It is no less honourable in a Clergy-man and no less his Duty to vindicate the Rights of the Laity when others would invade them than it is in a Lay-man to vindicate the Rights of the Clergy in opposition to Secular Usurpations And as it his Duty in the Point of Iustice and Honesty so it is also in the Point of Wisdom and Prudence For to grasp at more than one can well hold what is that but the ready way to lose what one has I must here observe how little the Clergy are oblig'd to Mr. Dodwell for promoting this as one of their Rights and Iust Privileges That for the sake of a Depriv'd Bishop they ought to bring a Persecution upon the Church go a begging themselves and ruine their whole Families This is one of Mr. Dodwell's very great Obligations and the chief of all those which with so much Kindness and Zeal he endeavours to lay upon us If it be one of the Rights of the Church that a Bishop ought not on any account to be Depriv'd by the Secular Power which I take to be utterly untrue Mr D. were he truly our Friend would allow us also this Privilege That whenever a Bishop is once so Depriv'd and we cannot avoid it we may peaceably submit to his Successor to secure our selves from that Ruin which must otherwise fall upon us and the Church from such a Concussion as would probably dissolve the whole Frame If he is not pleased to grant and to defend this Right of the Church and Iust Privilege of the Clergy I must freely profess my Opinion of his Services We have very little reason to thank him One notable piece of Service which the Learned Mr. D. has generously done both the Clergy and the Church I cannot here in Justice pass by and that his bestowing so sublime and worthy a Character upon our first Reformers and Martyrs particularly upon Arch Bishop Cranmer in his Preface to that Book which was sometimes since seized and suppressed by the Government A sort of Service which the greatest Enemies of our Church and Reformation will thank him heartily for Mr. Dodwell and Mr. Sanders will hereafter have the honour to stand both together as Witnesses against the Reformers and Martyrs of the Church of England I desire it may be Recorded and forever Remembred That as one was an open Enemy so the other when he wrote those black Declamations was no Member of our Church but was actually engag'd in a Schism against it What Thanks or Respect can that Man deserve from the Church who professing himself one of its Members does not study to maintain the Peace of it but only to advance his own Notions and prefers his Fondling Opinions to its Welfare and Tranquillity and endeavours to fix a black Character on its worthy Reformers and Martyrs The mention I made of a Book of Mr. Dodwell's which was seiz'd and suppress'd by the Government brings me to consider another Paragraph of the Remarks which wants a short Comment and ought to be set in a True Light I don 't at all doubt says the Remarker but that the Government had good Reasons to seize and suppress the Pamphlet you mention There were possibly some things in it which the Person by whose order it was suppressed did not think convenient should be expos'd to Publick view But yet since there was a Promise from one engag'd in the Controversie That he would secure whatever should be printed in that kind and since after it was seiz'd and before it was suppress'd there were offers made of striking out whatever was offensive and printing those Sheets over again it seems something hard it should after all be condemn'd to the Lining Trunks and Paper Boxes I confess I should scarce have understood this Paragraph if it had not been explained by another Book of the Party call'd Historical Collections concerning Church Affairs In the Preface of which there are these Words Why may we not suspect that these Papers will be seiz'd as well as the Learned Vindicators Answer was t'other day though Dr. Hody had dared him to make a Reply and promis'd him the Liberty of the Press in an unhandsom Letter which he sent him about August last and it was the only stroke in it which savoured of Decency and goods Manners I am apt to think that so great a Rudeness has not been offer'd to so Learned a Man before And if the Dr. does not make amends to his Reputation by finding some ways that the Sheets may be restored or by publickly declaring that it is not in his power to have it done he must his best Friends being

Iudges leave it in a very low and forlorn condition 'T is you see on Dr. Hody that this Charge chiefly falls and this is that which determin'd me to trouble you with these Reflections I shall give you Sir a full account of this matter as I have had it from several who are intimately acquainted with the Dr. and to whom he has frequently related it with the most serious and solemn Protestations In their Conversation in the University when Mr. D. excus'd his not Answering the Case of Sees Vacant upon pretence that it was difficult to print the Dr. told him that if he would take care to leave out all manner of Reflections which might offend the Government he himself would assist him to the utmost of his power in the publishing of it This he still protests he would readily have done And he thought at that time that it lay in his power to obtain a Connivance for it Two years and half after The Case of Sees vacant was published there came out a Pamphlet Entitl'd Discourses upon Dr. Burnet and Dr. Tillotson in which Dr. Hody is earnestly desired to reserve his Vindication of the Authority of the Civil Power in depriving a Bishop no longer that the most Learned and Pious Vindicator of the depriv'd Bishops who had long expected it might return an Answer both to that and the Case of Sees Vacant 'T was a great surprize to the Dr. to find after so long a time such a Reason as that given for Mr. Dodwel's not Answering his Book remembring very well that in all the Conversation which he had formerly had with him he never pretended that Reason but the difficulty of Printing and having often told him that he did not design to publish his Second Book till he saw some Answer to the First This was the occasion of his writing that unhandsome Letter to Mr. D. which the Collector speaks of the design of which he wholly mistakes He blam'd Mr. D. for pretending such a Reason and that he might not pretend to it any longer he gave him a fresh Assurance that till he had seen some Answer to his First Book he was resolved not to publish his Second About half a Year after this upon the Discovery of the intended Assassination and Invasion there being a search made for Conspirators and Declarations and the like the Sheets of Mr. Dodwel's Book fell accidentally into the Messengers hands So far were the Governours either of the Church or State from ordering them to be seized or the Dr. from contriving or desiring it that neither one nor the other knew any thing at all of their being in the Press Tho' Mr. D. has been pleas'd to report that it was by the Dr's means and procurement that his Book was seized Three days after the seizure of it the Dr. receiv'd a Letter from an unknown Person and without a Name concerning it and this was the first notice he had that there was any such in the World He was desired in the Letter to make use of his Interest to have the Sheets restored and immediately he applied himself to such in whose power he thought it might be to obtain a Retrieve for them But the Answer was That it could not be done because the Book was written against an Act of Parliament And to restore it when once seiz'd would be in effect to License it After he had procured a Copy and had perus'd it tho' he met with certain Strictures that discovered some Rancour of Spirit and prov'd the Writer to be a little too much under the power of Gall and Spite yet they made no Impression and a second time he signified his desire to have the Sheets remitted But the Reason being such his desire could not be granted Which he took all occasions to let the Party know by acquainting many with it This Sir is a true and full account of the matter And by this time you are able to judge which of the two has acted generously and Fairly Dr. Hody in endeavouring to Retrieve his Adversaries Book or Mr. Dodwel in wrongfully accusing him I cannot but here tell you that I have had my self a sight of this Book of Mr. Dodwels And upon the perusal of it I assure you I think it very much for that worthy Gentlemans Reputation that his Book was so seiz'd and not permitted to come abroad You fancy now that there was something very considerable in it had you seen it you would have been convinced that the Learned Mr. D. is in this Dispute very far from being a formidable Adversary and far from giving a just Answer to the Dr's Treatise I hope they will be pleas'd to Reprint it if they cannot at last Retrieve it I am sure this is what the Dr. himself heartily wishes 'T is the Learned Mr. D. that of all the Men of this Age has lain under the Misfortune of writing a whole Book and mistaking the Question As it plainly appears he did when he wrote his Vindication against the Barocian M.S. Though in his suppressed Treatise he a little mends the Mutter yet even in that too he frequently falls back into the very same Error How unhappy he is in his Reasoning is more than enough evident from that strange and surprizing lustance which the Dr. takes notice of in pag. 14. of The Case of Sees Vacant He pretends to justifie the present separation from our being Hereticks and yet makes us Hereticks for this very Reason because they separate from us A more Illogical and Unweighed thing never dropt from the Pen of any Learned Writer You do not at all doubt but that in his suppressed Treatise he offers at some Excuse or at least confesses his Frailty No No such matter He takes no notice of it but wisely passes that by as he does other things of the same kind You do not at all doubt but that he has endeavoured to defend himself in those several Points of History for which the Dr. has impleaded him as if he had thought fit but to step a fost or two out of his way he might have shewn him to be guilty of a great many Errors more No such thing as that neither I assure you All these he passes by as indefensible without taking the least notice of them All this I could have forgiven him had I found in his Book any Answer to that which makes up the main part of the Dr's Treatise The History of the Churches behaviour in such a Case as ours is No this too he perfectly gives up and does not so much as pretend to answer it Instead of all this he is wholly taken up in disputing against a part of the Doctors first Chapter and in laying down certain Conjectures videtur upon videtur as you know his Way is concerning Solomon and Abiath●r which signifie nothing I would not be thought from what I have said to Insult and Triumph over that worthy Persons Failings and Infirmities He that wisely

of such Facts were solid and concluding And how can he find in his heart to insist principally in his following Book on that very kind of Facts which he has acknowledged so unsafe to be relied on in his Preface He cannot pretend to argue ad Hominem when the Vindicator had so expresly enter'd his Exceptions against that whole Argument He cannot do it in his own Person when he professes himself unwilling to stand by the Consequences of it And how can he have the confidence to obtrude that upon us which he does not believe himself What ground in the Name of God! could he have for all this strange Talk He cites in the Margent these words out of the Dr's Preface Should our Adversaries be able to produce such an example as I think they will never be able 't will advantage their Cause but little especially if it be one of the later Ages since it is not agreeable to the Practice of the Church in general Is it really Mr Dodwel's mistake this Or did he intend to impose upon his Reader For my Life I cannot imagine how it was possible for a Man but of a common Capacity to be guilty of such a Mistake For all those Examples of the Church's peaceable Submission to the present Possessor in so many several Ages which are prov'd in The Case of Sees Vacant the Dr challenges Mr Dodwel and his whole Party and again the same challenge we here give them and desire they would take notice of it to produce him any one single Instance from the time of Aaron the first High-priest of the Jews to this very day of a High priest disown'd by the Jews or a Bishop disown'd by the generality of the Catholick Church for this Reason Because put into the place of another deposed by the Civil Authority And then he adds those words which you have read By which it is as clear as the Sun at high Noon that his meaning was no other than this That since the present Practice of the Church of England is warranted by the general Practice of the Church Catholick our Adversaries cannot be justified or excus'd by any one Instance on their side if they could produce one especially if it were one of the later and more degenerate Ages If the Dr does not look upon one Instance and that too in the more degenerate times to be conclusive against the general Practice of the Church and in the purer and more Learned Ages does he therefore not esteem the uniform Practice of the whole Church in general to be Conclusive To conclude this point and to satisfie Mr. D. how willing the Dr. is to be concluded by such a constant Vniformity of Practice in the Church I have leave to tell him That he prefers the Example of the Church which is so clearly made out in his Book to the Iudgment and Example of ten tho' I have leave to tell him yet I will not say how many Vindicators The Question betwixt Dr Hody and Mr. Dodwel is this Whether our Practice or the Practice of the Party be conformable to that of the Catholick Church in Ancient times 'T is expected that Mr. D. should either prove all the Instances which the Dr has produced to be false or produce as many and as good on his own side If he cannot do this much more if he cannot produce so much as one on his own side whatsoever he publishes with the Title of an Answer will be nothing but a Publick Declaration That they are not able to justifie themselves Time was as Mr D. well knows when the Practice and Example of the Church was of greater Authority with him When the Bishops were first depriv'd and their Sees fill'd all places that were honour'd with Mr Dodwel's presence as well publick as private rung aloud of Examples I have been often told by such as were at that time at Oxford and did themselves the honour to be often in Mr. Dodwel's company that till Dr Hody published his Baroccean Treatise Mr Dodwel constantly appeal'd to the Example and Practice of the Church It was this as I am very well assur'd that first put the Dr upon publishing that Treatise As soon as that was done then the usual Plea was quite alter'd Mr D. who before was so full of his History and Examples begins now not to esteem them And The Case of Sees Vacant when that was published made him utterly out of love with them He is now for Rules not Examples And he has good Reason for it for Rules he makes of his own but Examples he cannot When The Case of Sees Vacant first came out it was very well known that Mr D. and his whole Party presently fell upon a nice Examination of it I know my self a very intimate Friend of Mr Dodwels who examined the Quotations of a Chapter or two for him Who has freely acknowledged That he could not find any thing but what was rightly cited and fairly represented Had the History been found wrong the Examples and Precedents of the Church had been still looked upon by the Party as very good things But their great fault is They all make against them The Case is plainly this We are so much in love with our own Notions that we will not value any thing no not the Authority of the Catholick Church it self in opposition to them Of a piece with his other mistakes so I chuse to call them rather than disingenuitie● is that which he tells his Reader in several places in his last Treatise that Dr Hody owns the Invalidity of all Lay-deprivations Tho' the Dr had expresly told him in his Preface that he reserv'd the Vindication of the Authority of the Civil Power in such Cases for a particular Treatise I grant at present says the Dr that all Lay deprivations are Invalid The Learned Mr D. has it seems forgot the difference between dare and concedere It was not the Dr's business in The Case of Sees Vacant to concern himself with the Authority of the Civil Power His only business in that Treatise was to assert the Reasonableness of submitting to the present Possessor whether the other were validly depriv'd or not where the Power that depriv'd is irresistible and the Possessor otherwise unexceptionable It is easie to observe how desirous Mr D. and the Men of his side are to have another Cause call'd and to shift off that weight thet lies so pressingly upon them But to this the Dr keeps them And I think he does very well to hold them fast where he has them To what purpose should we who were not concern'd in the Deprivation of the Bishops concern our selves so much about that Question Whether it be lawful for the Civil Magistrate to deprive a Bishop or not since whether that be lawful or not this at least we know to be lawful The acknowledging the present Possessor if on all other accounts unexceptionable Whether it were the Doctrine of the