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book_n apostle_n church_n scripture_n 4,023 5 5.8096 4 true
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A07646 A gagg for the new Gospell? No: a nevv gagg for an old goose VVho would needes vndertake to stop all Protestants mouths for euer, with 276. places out of their owne English Bibles. Or an ansvvere to a late abridger of controuersies, and belyar of the Protestants doctrine. By Richard Mountagu. Published by authoritie. Montagu, Richard, 1577-1641. 1624 (1624) STC 18038; ESTC S112831 210,549 373

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tradition_n act._n 16._o 4._o this_o be_v one_o act._n 15._o 29._o to_o abstain_v from_o blood_n and_o strangle_v exempt_a such_o dish_n specify_v from_o such_o dress_n &_o have_v with_o you_o to_o mass_n to_o mr._n mayes_n as_o i_o be_o invite_v by_o sir_n a._n p●_n peradventure_o yourself_o 2_o tim._n 1._o 13._o we_o find_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d the_o form_n of_o wholesome_a word_n in_o our_o bibles_n and_o if_o this_o be_v tradition_n unwritten_a judge_v you_o good_a catholic_n and_o set_v not_o so_o high_a a_o price_n upon_o this_o arrant_a blunderer_n than_o who_o a_o very_a goose_n never_o handle_v goose-quill_n and_o so_o go_v see_v if_o your_o leisure_n will_v serve_v father_n same_o that_o affirm_v somewhat_o not_o what_o they_o shall_v the_o first_o you_o must_v see_v if_o you_o please_v be_v irenaeus_n lib._n 3._o cap._n 4._o for_o he_o will_v not_o trouble_v your_o see_v with_o clemens_n ignatius_n dionysius_n areopagita_n polycarpus_n egesippus_fw-la justinus_n martyr_n all_o elder_a than_o irenaeus_n and_o vaunt_v of_o by_o his_o good_a master_n and_o no_o doubt_n as_o much_o to_o point_v as_o irenaeus_n who_o yet_o be_v hold_v to_o be_v resolute_a and_o irrefrageable_a in_o that_o place_n propter_fw-la quod_fw-la oportet_fw-la devitare_fw-la quidem_fw-la illos_fw-la quae_fw-la autem_fw-la sunt_fw-la ecclesiae_fw-la cum_fw-la summâ_fw-la diligentia_fw-la deligere_fw-la &_o apprehendere_fw-la veritatis_fw-la traditionem_fw-la for_o which_o cause_n we_o must_v shun_v and_o eschew_v they_o but_o with_o all_o possible_a diligence_n make_v choice_n of_o the_o thing_n belong_v to_o the_o church_n and_o lie_v hold_v upon_o the_o tradition_n of_o truth_n which_o tradition_n be_v no_o other_o thing_n but_o the_o rule_n of_o our_o faith_n the_o holy_a scripture_n nothing_o unwritten_a uncertain_a beside_o much_o less_o against_o scripture_n this_o be_v somewhat_o in_o your_o opinion_n but_o that_o which_o be_v the_o thing_n intend_v indeed_o be_v this_o which_o follow_v in_o irenaeus_n et_fw-la si_fw-la quibus_fw-la de_fw-fr aliquâ_fw-la modicâ_fw-la quaestione_fw-la disceptatio_fw-la esset_fw-la nun_n oporteret_fw-la in_o antiquissimas_fw-la recurrere_fw-la ecclesias_fw-la in_fw-la quibus_fw-la apostoli_fw-la conversati_fw-la sunt_fw-la &_o ab_fw-la ijs_fw-la de_fw-la praesenti_fw-la quaestione_fw-la sumere_fw-la quod_fw-la certum_fw-la &_o re_fw-la liquidum_fw-la est_fw-la thus_o he_o question_v i_o answer_v affirmative_o yes_o no_o doubt_v we_o ought_v for_o resolution_n in_o point_n of_o doubtful_a controversy_n rely_v upon_o that_o decision_n of_o the_o elder_a church_n do_v we_o refuse_v this_o trial_n good_a sir_n gagger_n where_o you_o will_v in_o what_o point_n you_o will_v i_o undertake_v thus_o to_o justify_v the_o church_n of_o england_n name_v you_o the_o controversy_n one_o or_o more_o and_o maintain_v the_o contrary_a if_o you_o can_v or_o dare_v the_o question_n be_v not_o with_o irenaeus_n what_o must_v be_v law_n but_o how_o the_o law_n be_v to_o be_v expound_v and_o interpret_v scripture_n the_o law_n and_o tradition_n the_o interpretation_n that_o be_v the_o perpetual_a praxis_fw-la of_o the_o church_n to_o expound_v the_o doubtful_a text_n of_o scripture_n but_o irenaeus_n proceed_v far_a than_o so_o it_o will_v be_v say_v for_o what_o if_o the_o apostle_n have_v leave_v we_o no_o writing_n at_o all_o nun_n oportet_fw-la ordinem_fw-la sequi_fw-la traditionis_fw-la quam_fw-la tradiderunt_fw-la ijs_fw-la quibus_fw-la committebant_fw-la ecclesias_fw-la far_o indeed_o but_o to_o no_o purpose_n this_o be_v upon_o supposition_n if_o it_o have_v be_v so_o which_o be_v not_o so_o nor_o can_v be_v so_o second_o it_o follow_v not_o that_o because_o if_o god_n have_v not_o give_v israei_n a_o law_n it_o be_v probable_a he_o will_v have_v continue_v his_o former_a course_n with_o abraham_n isaac_n and_o the_o patriarch_n therefore_o when_o he_o have_v give_v they_o his_o law_n they_o be_v still_o to_o look_v for_o immediate_a or_o angelical_a revelation_n as_o before_o no_o more_o be_v it_o consequent_a to_o reason_n piety_n or_o irenaeus_n intent_n that_o albeit_o if_o no_o scripture_n have_v be_v write_v only_a tradition_n must_v have_v be_v follow_v therefore_o scripture_n be_v write_v we_o shall_v as_o otherwise_o address_v ourselves_o unto_o tradition_n but_o three_o we_o come_v home_o to_o point_n show_v we_o any_o thing_n tender_v by_o those_o ecclesiae_fw-la antiquissimae_fw-la to_o be_v believe_v and_o observe_v and_o see_v if_o we_o respect_v it_o not_o as_o well_o and_o as_o much_o as_o you_o till_o you_o show_v we_o such_o tradition_n leave_v your_o prate_n idle_o at_o random_n touch_v worth_a and_o weight_n and_o use_v and_o authority_n of_o tradition_n your_o tradition_n tender_v in_o these_o day_n be_v only_o in_o name_n as_o simon_n magus_n be_v and_o simon_n peter_n the_o same_o no_o more_o of_o credit_n than_o he_o of_o piety_n both_o alike_o origen_n be_v next_o to_o be_v see_v in_o cap._n 6._o add_v roman_n he_o call_v baptism_n of_o infant_n a_o tradition_n and_o let_v it_o be_v so_o it_o be_v the_o universal_a judgement_n and_o most_o ancient_a practice_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n deduce_v at_o least_o from_o scripture_n if_o not_o prove_v in_o scripture_n as_o the_o controversor_n himself_o confess_v be_v it_o a_o tradition_n it_o be_v more_o for_o our_o advantage_n than_o otherwise_o for_o we_o admit_v receive_v defend_v and_o practice_v it_o which_o must_v needs_o give_v the_o lie_n unto_o your_o proposition_n that_o according_a to_o the_o doctrine_n of_o the_o protestant_n apostolical_a tradition_n &_o ancient_a custom_n of_o the_o holy_a church_n be_v not_o to_o be_v receive_v nor_o do_v oblige_v for_o the_o world_n know_v your_o brazen_a face_n will_v blush_v to_o deny_v it_o we_o receive_v it_o practise_v it_o be_v oblige_v by_o it_o s._n damascen_n may_v stand_v by_o unless_o you_o mean_v to_o make_v your_o friend_n with_o he_o a_o child_n in_o year_n of_o yesterday_n birth_n in_o respect_n of_o those_o old_a hero_n of_o the_o primitive_a time_n not_o that_o he_o say_v any_o thing_n lib._n 4._o cap._n 17._o more_o than_o a_o other_o or_o more_o effectual_a and_o to_o purpose_n but_o because_o he_o be_v not_o of_o that_o desert_n or_o esteem_v to_o be_v rank_v with_o the_o father_n of_o the_o primitive_a time_n be_v long_a post_n natus_fw-la and_o a_o partian_a many_o way_n for_o which_o cause_n i_o answer_v he_o not_o s._n chrysostome_n be_v peremptory_a and_o through_o for_o tradition_n in_o 2._o ad_fw-la thessaly_n 2._o vers_fw-la 16._o he_o say_v hence_o it_o be_v plain_a and_o apparent_a that_o the_o apostle_n deliver_v not_o all_o in_o writing_n but_o very_o many_o thing_n without_o book_n thus_o he_o but_o to_o what_o end_n for_o no_o protestant_a living_n in_o his_o right_a wit_n will_v deny_v this_o that_o the_o apostle_n speak_v much_o more_o than_o be_v write_v and_o whatsoever_o they_o speak_v as_o apostle_n in_o execution_n of_o their_o ministry_n be_v of_o equal_a authority_n with_o that_o which_o they_o write_v for_o ink_n and_o paper_n confer_v no_o authority_n or_o validity_n beyond_o the_o subject_n and_o author_n of_o the_o writing_n therefore_o the_o tradition_n of_o the_o apostle_n and_o of_o the_o church_n be_v without_o all_o question_n of_o good_a credit_n and_o esteem_n and_o so_o much_o we_o profess_v art_n 34._o i_o grant_v it_o have_v displease_v some_o which_o be_v say_v 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d 〈◊〉_d it_o be_v tradition_n which_o avow_v it_o seek_v no_o further_o i_o see_v no_o reason_n why_o any_o shall_v be_v so_o displease_v therewith_o for_o if_o it_o be_v a_o tradition_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n and_o such_o tradition_n only_o he_o mean_v chrysostome_n say_v there_o no_o more_o than_o he_o may_v no_o more_o than_o augustine_n and_o tertullian_n have_v say_v it_o be_v tradition_n i_o go_v no_o further_o no_o more_o will●_n in_o any_o thing_n for_o my_o part_n i_o promise_v you_o that_o be_v controvert_v betwixt_o you_o and_o we_o at_o this_o day_n make_v that_o appear_v which_o you_o propose_v to_o have_v be_v a_o tradition_n of_o the_o catholic_a church_n and_o you_o and_o i_o shall_v soon_o agree_v shake_v hand_n and_o no_o more_o ado_n saint_n basil_n you_o have_v keep_v for_o the_o close_a it_o seem_v godliness_n and_o for_o the_o upshot_n of_o all_o and_o he_o indeed_o be_v in_o the_o place_n remember_v very_o much_o for_o all_o tradition_n unwritten_a derive_v to_o the_o church_n from_o the_o apostle_n i_o know_v some_o protestant_n especial_o of_o preciser_n cut_v do_v discredit_v the_o author_n as_o a_o counterfeit_n only_o upon_o erasmus_n bare_a word_n who_o savour_v some_o discongruity_n which_o i_o can_v never_o find_v of_o stile_n i_o be_o not_o of_o that_o or_o their_o mind_n other_o be_v at_o a_o stand_n because_o of_o their_o own_o private_a fancy_n oppose_v saint_n basil_n unto_o saint_n basil_n for_o my_o part_n i_o believe_v