of the regions of Europe this daie to forsake your Hereticall Schismaticall and Antichristian Churche of Rome and to ioigne them selues to the true Catholike and Apostolike churche of Christ whiche approueth all her doctrine out of the holie Scriptures and by the same reproueth all your heresies and erronious opinions the iudgement and triall of whiche holy Canonicall scriptures you neuer yet durst abide It is not therefore any priuate condemnation whiche is pronounced out of Gods woorde against heresies whose aucthoritie in all thynges is highest and of al menne to bee obeied Finally where you affirme that the churche of Christe was not destitute of the holy Ghoste I agree with you but that your Churche is the Churche of Christe I maie in no wise acknowledge And truthe it is that the true Churche did alwaies reclaime against the heresies of your church as thei sprong vp and increased in the worlde and receiued that reward whiche true Prophetes haue accustomed to receiue of wicked tyrantes namely persecution imprisonmente and cruell death as appeared in Bertramus Marsilius of Padua Pauperes de Lugduno Iohannes de Gandauo Bruno Andegauensis Iohannes Wickleue Iohannes Hus Hieronimus de Praga c. all whiche with many other in seuerall times places reproued and confuted your false Churche and the errours thereof some in Italie some in Fraunce some in Flaunders some in Germanie some in Bohemia and some in Englande and for the moste part were either murthered or otherwise cruelly persecuted for their labours But yet the heresies of your church did not escape vnspoken against and confuted by them The Papiste The sixte and laste consideration that I come not to their churche is because I am not of their Churche S. Augustine in putting difference of churches saieth how vnto them whiche haue not all one Sacramētes there can not be one religion nor consequently one Churche And the cause why I am not of their Churche but refuse to communicate with theym in religion besides this saiyng of S. Augustine that we should not Communicate in sacramentes with those men whose doctrine we can not aproue and allow I do refuse to be of their church because I cannot learne nor vnderstande of what church they are of For thei beyng first Baptized in the catholike churche and in the very self faieth and religion wherin I do at this present time beleue and remaine thei are departed therefro some to the Lutheranes Church some to the Zwinglians and comyng last of al to the church Geneua they are in maner fled from that church also and by attributing the chief supreme gouernment of this their English churche vnto the Quenes highnes thei are in doctrine directly against their old maister Caluine being the chief Apostle of the Church of Geneua whiche Caluine in the eight Chapter of the boke of his institutions doth directlie reason against Kynges and Princes for takyng vpon theim spirituall gouernment in the Church of Christ and in the same Chapiter he doeth muche commende the holy Bishop S. Ambrose and the noble Emperour Theodosius Ambrose for his greate stoutnes and resistance made against the Emperour And Theodosius for his greate submission and obediens shewed vnto the Bishop The history whereof is at large expressed in Ecclesiastica historia And the saide Caluine in hys exposition vppon the fowerth Chapiter of the prophete Amos doth taxe King Henry the eight by name because he alone of all other Princes was the first that toke vpon hym in the Church of Christ spirituall gouernmēt whose example in that poinct there was neuer one Prince in all Germanie nor yet in any place els where of the whole world that woulde followe the same but his owne naturall sonne Kyng Edward the sixte beyng then in his minoritie and againe the Queenes highnes that nowe is If therfore I shall departe from the comon knowen catholike Church wherin I stand I would gladly knowe of theim vnto what Church I shoulde repaire to be instructed with out errours wherin vnitie charitie and veritie doe dwel what forme of a churche are thei able to shew wherupon a christian man may be bolde to assure himselfe And if peraduenture they cease not ro pretende that the Primitiue Churche is that plat forme of the Churche wherunto they would reduce vs I answere that there be so many poinctes wherein they doe dissent from the Primitiue Churche like as I shall make sufficient proofe thereof that it can not be so it is onely pretended but it shall neuer be proued The Anabaptistes the Libertines and the Arians doe pretende gods worde and the Primitiue Churche as well as thei And because they are so bolde to name the primitiue church I aske of theim but this one questiō whether that this daie 50. or 60. yeres laste paste was their Church here in this realme or in any other parte of christendome VVhat particuler Church either here in Englande in the laste yere of Kyng Henry the eight his raigne or any other realme els can thei name that taught or receiued vniuersally throughout in all poinctes the doctrine that this presente Churche of Englande doeth now teache or from that daie a thousande yeres before that or from thence vnto the tyme of Christe and his Apostles If thei can not shewe any one suche Churche as I am well assured thei shall neuer be able to doe then it muste nedes followe that either Christe had no Church in the worlde al that tyme till now their commyng or elles it muste needes follow that their Churche is a new inuented and vpstert Church whiche with christes Primitiue church hath no agreans like as it shall moste plainly appeare vnto you by these profes followyng The aunswere In your laste consideration you doe inconsiderately alledge that you are not of our Churche but shewe no sufficient reason why you ought not to bee one of our Churche You saie we are departed from the churche in whiche we were baptised as though if a manne were Baptised in a Churche of heretikes he is bounde to remaine in the same Churche and heretical faithe of that Churche in whiche he was baptised so that if a manne were baptised in the Churche of Arrianes Nouatianes Donatistes Pelagians he might not forsake the faithe and Churche in whiche he was baptised to become a true Christian catholike A childe of seuen yere old maie see how slender a reason it is for a manne to continue in any Churche or Religion because he receiued baptisme therin For if a Papist maie not become a Protestāt because he was Baptised in the Popishe churche by the same reason a Protestant must not become a Papist if he were baptised in the Protestantes Churche which you your self by no meanes will graunte The seconde reason you bryng is of the diuersitye of churches the Lutherane the Zwingliane the Geneuian As though the diuersitie of some opinions not of the greatest importāce maketh diuers churches The churche of Salisburie the churche
called Especially whē you pretend to geue it the name whiche commonly it beareth for you are not ignorante that it is called the booke of Common praier and not the Common booke of praier But a man maie easely and peraduenture truely gesse why you refused to cal it the boke of common praier leaste any man should conceiue by the onely name that common praier which is so necessarie for the Churche of Christe a forme whereof that booke conteineth is altogether wantyng in your Popishe Churche where in your Missalles Processionalles Hymnalles Grailes Antiphonalls and Pontificalls are not conteined common praiers to the edification of all the churche but idle and vnprofitable ceremonies to the mainteinaunce of ignoraunce and superstition The Papiste The first consideration is because the saide seruis booke was condemned as hereticall and schismaticall Anno domini 1553. both by the clergie and cōuocation of this realme and by the nobilitie and commons of the same by al whose consentes ther passed an acte of Parliament for the repeale therof Beside that Cranmer Ridley and Latimer the chief aucthours and composers of the saied boke were therfore openly condemned by the Churche and Lawes of this realme suffered the paines of death in Oxforde S. Paule in his Epistle willed the hebrues to haue in remembrance their Bishoppes which preached vnto them the woorde of God and diligently to obserue and looke vpon the ende of their liues and conuersation The aunswere The first consideration cōteineth two causes of your refusal the one because the booke of Seruice was repealed by Acte of Parliament the other for that Cranmer Ridley and Latimer were burned at Oxforde for it To the first I aunswere that if you accompt the aucthoritie of the Parliament of force to condempne it why doe you not acknowledge th'aucthoritie of the same in establishyng it for anno 1551. by all the states of the realme that boke was allowed and appoincted to bee vsed Also by diuerse Actes of Parliamente in the tyme of our soueraigne Ladies reigne established and cōfirmed But it is no hard matter to gather your traiterous meanyng whiche is common to you with all them of your religion You accoumpte no actes of Parliament passed in the tyme of kyng Edward or Quéene Elizabeth to be of any aucthoritie beyng confirmed by the roiall assent of those whom you esteme to be no lawfull Princes seyng your father the Pope hath pronounced sentence of depriuation against them Your seconde reason I will tourne vpon your owne necke Seyng Cranmer Ridley and Latimer did so constauntly suffer death for the confirmation of that doctrine whiche thei hadde taught it is a good argumente that thei dissembled not with vs but vttered that truthe vnto vs wherein as thei liued so thei were content to dye The text of the Apostle to the Hebres 13. you applie verie straungely as though wee should thincke well of none that suffreth death by martyrdom wheras the Apostle meaneth cleane contrary and exhorteth the Iewes to followe the faithe of them the ende of whose conuersation thei had séen to be agreable to their doctrine who as thei had preached diligētly so did thei ende their liues by tormentes in the same confession constauntely and patiently The Papiste The seconde consideration is that the saied booke so vniuersally condemned by all degrees of men here in this realme was receiued and brought in againe only by the nobilitie and cōmons of this realme cleane contrary to the whole mindes of our Clergie no one person in the Parliamente did giue his consente thereunto Besides that the whole conuocation did exhibite their boke to the contrarie VVherin the shepe taking vpon theim to establishe this boke contrarie to the learnyng and conscience of their shepherdes thei haue doen against the expresse wordes of our sauiour Christ who in describing the office of good shepherde and the duetie of good shepe saied that a good shepherde muste knowe his sheepe and his sheepe muste knowe hym heare his voice and followe hym And the Apostle S. Paule in his Epistle Cap. 13. willed the Hebrues to obey their shepherdes and spirituall gouernours and to submitte themselues vnto theim for thei doe watch euen as men whiche muste geue accompte for their soules Obey them therfore saieth S. Paule that they maie do it with ioie and not with grief The aunswere Your seconde consideration is determinable by suche as are skilfull in the lawes of this realme what persones muste concurre in the Parliament that it may be an Acte of Parliamente and I doubte not but the matter was so ordered by the iudgemente of them that had knowledge as was for the honour and wealthe of the realme But if any errour had been committed at that tyme you speake of it was since by all three estates in Parliament redressed the same booke of seruice by their aucthoritie being confirmed But whereas you complaine that the Shepe in that firste Parliament tooke vpon thē against their shepherdes I aunswer naie but the Shepherdes againste the Shepebiters for your Cleargie consisted all of Wolues and not of Shepherdes wherefore it was the duetie of the Prince with the nobles and senatours of that Parliamente to deliuer the Shepe out of their cruell tyrānie and to banishe and remoue all suche raueinous beastes frō the flocke And touchyng the booke you saie thei exhibited of what credite would you haue it to bee when thei so shamefully refused conference before the moste parte of the Parliamente vpon a friuolous pretence in Westminster churche At whiche time al wise menne sawe that their cause was naught whiche durste not abide the triall in the open light The Papiste The thirde consideration is that it is prohibited by the Canons of the apostles and by the generall caunselles also that a christian man shoulde not communicate neither in Sacramentes nor yet in commō praiers with Heritikes and Schismatikes As it appeareth in the tenth Canon and in the seconde Canon of the counsell holden at Antioche It was decreed there that it was not lawful to communicate with excōmunicate persones nor to enter into any house nor to praie with thē nor lawfull to receiue them that are excommunicate out of one churche into another churche And in the coūsel holdē at Laodicea it was prohibited there that the christiā men should enter into the churches or churche yerdes of the heretikes there to praie with them and in the 33. Canon of the same counsell the like prohibition is there expressed for praier with Schismatikes And in the 4. counsell holden at Carthage Canon 73. it was decreed that christian men should nether praie nor singe with Heretikes And who so euer did praie singe or communicate with any excōmunicate person whether he were of the Clergie or of the Laitie shoulde be thereby excommunicated An example we reade therefore how the christian men at Constantinople would not cōmunicate with the Arianes neither in Sacramentes nor yet in commō praiers notwithstādyng that
like force and strength vnto godlynes As for example the instructions which thei haue that trust in the name of Iesus Christe to signe them selues with the signe of Christes crosse to praie towardes the Easte to vse wordes of inuocation at the shewing of the Breade and the Cuppe in the holy Euchariste to blesse the water of the Fonte the Oyle of the holy vnction and that he also which is baptized should be thrise dipped in the water and suche other like thinges whiche are taught and obserued in the Sacramente of Baptisme as to renounce the Deuill and his angels salte spitle and the exorcisme there made to the expulsion of the deuill All these thinges and other like whiche are tought and obserued in christes churche we haue theim saieth sainct Basile ether of the scriptures or els by the tradition of the Apostles whiche are of like force and strēgth vnto pietie and godlynes wheras the reformatours of this English church do esteme and iudge al the premises for impietie and vngodlines The aunswere In this your fowerth argumente if it maie bee called an argumente you huddle vp a number of Ceremonies together all whiche out of Basile you would proue to bee Traditions of the Apostles In deede Basile in the. xxvij Chapiter of his booke De spiritu sancto is driuē to this shifte that either he must acknowledge many suche vnfruictfull Ceremonies as in his tyme were crepte into the churche to be vnprofitable or els to flie to the tradition of vnwritten verities The same in effecte ceaceth Augustine and yet neither of bothe was so ignoraunte but that at suche time as thei did throughly consider either the dignitie of the holie scriptures or the natures of suche humaine Traditions thei iudged otherwise of the whole matter For Basile in his moralles Diffinit xxvi saieth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. that it behoueth euery woorde and deede to bee aucthorised by the testimonie of the scripture inspired of God bothe for the certaine perswasion of the good and the confusion of the euill And in the 8. diffini 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. If all that is not of faith is synne as the Apostle saieth and faithe is of hearyng and hearyng by the woorde of God what so euer is beside the diuine scripture beyng not of faithe is synne Vpon whiche conclusion a manne maie inferre that all suche Traditions as Basile before defended beyng beside the scriptures ar sinne The same Basile in his brief diffinitions to this question whether it be profitable for theim that come newlie to the faithe immediately to bee instructed out of the scriptures Maketh this aunswere 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. It is bothe conueniente and necessarie that euery manne far his necessarie vse should learne out of the diuine scriptures bothe that he maie bee certainely perswaded in his Religion and also that he bee not before accustomed to humaine Traditions Let this therfore suffice for sainct Basile to aunswere hymself Saincte Augustine also in his 118. Epistle where he speaketh moste fauourably for Traditions hath these woordes Sed hoc nimis doleo quod multa quae in diuinis libris saluberrimè praecepta sunt minus curantur tam multis praesumptionibus sic plena sint omnia vt grauius corripiatur qui per octauas suas terram nudo pede tetigerit quam qui mētem vinolentia sipelire est But this saieth Augustine dooeth greue me to muche that many thinges whiche in Gods boke are moste wholsemly commaunded are lesse regarded and all thynges are so full of presumptions that he is more sharpely reproued whiche hath touched the yearth with his bare foote in tyme of his vtas then he that hath buried his mynde with dronkennes And in the same place he saieth of Traditions Quamuis enim neque hoc inueniri possit quomodo contra fidem sint ipsam tamen religionem quam paucissimis manifestissimis celebrationum Sacramentis misericordia dei esse liberam voluit seruilibus oneribus premunt vt tolerabilior sit conditio Iudaeorum qui etiam si tempus libertatis non agnouerint legalibus tamen sarcinis nō humanis praesumptionibus subijciuntur that is to saie For although this can not bee founde how thei are contrary to the faithe yet thei oppresse with sclauishe burdeins the religion it self whiche the mercie of God would haue to bée free with moste fewe and manifeste Sacramentes of celebrations So that the state of the Iewes is more tollerable then ours for although thei haue not acknowledged the tyme of libertie yet thei are subiecte to burthens laied on theim by the lawe not to humaine presumptions By this you see Augustines right iudgemente of suche vnprofitable Ceremonies and Traditions Whiche althoughe Basile and he cōiecture and gesse to haue béen receiued of the Apostles because thei knewe none other originall of theim yet it dooeth not followe that thei were deliuered by the Apostles in deede For many of theim if your owne aucthours dooe not lye were instituted by diuers Popes of Rome long after the age of the Apostles And some it is plaine were inuented by heretikes For the firste that we read of in any auncient and authenticall writer that hadde in reuerence the signe of the Crosse were the Valentiniane heretikes as witnesseth Irenaeus libri primi Capit. 1. whiche thei called Oron crucem confirmatiuam the strengthenyng Crosse. And abused the testimonies of sainct Paule as you Papistes doe where he saieth verbum crucis c. The woorde or preachyng of the crosse mihi non eueniat gloriari c. God forbidde that I should reioyce but in the Crosse of Christe But afterwarde true Christians vsed that signe to testifie vnto Heathen menne that thei were Christians and were not ashamed of the ignominious death of Christ whiche the Gētiles did dispightfully caste in their teeth and at length it grewe to a meare superstition and laste of all to moste horrible Idolatrie when the Image of the Crosse was worshipped sensed and praied vnto Praier towarde the Easte was vsed of the Christians in the aunciente Church to testifie that thei differed from the Iewes who praied towarde the West least thei should seem to worshippe the Sunne risyng as the Gentiles did And although woordes of inuocation were vsed at the shewyng of the bread and the Cuppe yet was there no inuocation of the Sacramentall breade and Cuppe but of God. Of the other Ceremonies of anoinctyng and thrise dipping hath been spoken before That the Apostles vsed no suche blessyng of the water of Baptisme as you doe it is manifeste when thei Baptised in euery Riuer and Brooke that thei came to In dedè thei did cōsecrate the water for that time when they vsed it to serue for the holy vse but did putte no holines into it which should remain after that baptisme was ministred with it as you doe As for the stipulatiō of renouncyng the deuill c. is in dede the doctrine of
¶ A confutation of a Popishe and sclaunderous libelle in forme of an apologie geuen out into the courte and spread abrode in diuerse other places of the Realme ¶ VVritten by VVilliam Fulke Bacheler in Diuinitie and felowe of S. Ihons Colledge in Cambridge ¶ Imprinted at London by Ihon Kingston for William Iones and are to bee solde at the newe long shop at the West ende of Poules ¶ To the right honourable and vertuous Ladie the Ladie Margaret Strange YOur honourable and Godly request madame to haue this infamous and Popishe Apologie confuted maie bee a sufficient testimone bothe of your loyall affection towardes your prince countrie also of vnfeigned loue towardes God and his true religion For as the libell being sclanderous against our soueraigne and her lawes blasphemous against God his truthe might be a reioysyng to the obstinate rebellious and an offence to the weake and ignorant if the cloudes of calumniation and deceiptful reasonyng vsed therin were not driuē a waie with the blaste of some confutation so the falshod therof beyng opened and the crafte discouered by your L. procuremēt shal be a matter of gladnes to the godly of grief to the wicked of strenthenyng to the weake and of learnyng to the ignorant VVherby trueth beyng mainteined and errour cōfounded many men shal be profited God hymself shal be glorified And your L. for preferryng so many folde goodnes may be assured to receiue worthie thankes of men and plentifull reward of god But this especially wherin your L. ought chiefly to reioice is not to be omitted that as god hath iustified you in the merites of his sonne through faith cōceiued in your harte so he hath geuen you an occasion hereby of his holie name and religion to make opē profession in the world VVhē accordyng to the testimonie of the Apostle as a true and liuely beleif of the hart is necessarie for iustificatiō so a cleare open confession of the mouth is requisite to saluatiō So that this your L. requeste might seme in all poinctes most fortunat if it had not founde so meane an instrument as I am to accōplishe it For beside that I am inferiour to verie many of my brethren that are meate to take suche a matter in hād I haue been for these two yeres almost as it were sequestered both frō serious studie and plentie of such bokes as for such a purpose were most conuenient Notwithstāding esteming your L. motion as a prouocatiō sente of god to occupie my idle tyme to employe some parte of gods giftes to the profite of his Churche as my duetye bindeth me I thought good to shew my self rather vnable thē willing to satisfie your godly desire Not that the obiectiōs of the aduersarie were of suche weight but that thei might easely bee auoyded by many thousand christians whom God hath indued with meaner giftes of knowledge vnderstandyng then it hath pleased hym to bestowe vpon me but that I am priuie to myne owne imperfection whereby I am lesse apt to beautifie a matter with such copy eloquence as many other are I would wish that this argument might haue been handled Neuertheles accordyng to my bare and simple facultie I haue endeuoured to set forthe the truthe rather with substaunce of matter then with florishyng of woordes not caryng howe finely but howe plainly I might cause it to appere seyng it is no lesse charitable to teach the ignoraunt then it is commendable to please the learned And this labour I haue bestowed for the profite of others and not for the praise of my self For whiche cause also I thought it not beste to encomber the simple reader with many reasōs or authorities to proue one matter but to enstructe hym with a few and those pitthie of force to perswade Sauyng that in one questiō of iustification in multitude of testimonies I maie seme to be ouer tedious if the cause be not considered whiche prouoked me thereto For seyng the aduersaries without shame crie out that our doctrine of iustification is suche a straunge paradox as neuer was hearde of in the worlde before our tyme the same doctrine beeyng the chiefe foundation of true Religion I thought it expedient that the vnlearned were admonished what plētifull witnesses it hath of antiquitie as it hath moste manifest aucthoritie in the holie worde of god To conclude there were twoo other considerations that encouraged me to take vpon me this cōfutation One because this Popishe apologie discouereth no greate learnyng of the aucthor there is no greate connyng to bee required in hym that should make answere to it for that it hath presumed to thrust it self into the princes court it is not impertinēt that it should be confuted by one that is attēdant in the same Thus hauing doen my good will I moste humbly desire your L. to take it in good parte besechyng almightie God so to continue and encrease his giftes of vertue and godlines in your L. that you maie be blessed with true honour and prosperitie in this life and afterward rewarded with eternall ioye and felicitie Your L. to commaunde in the Lorde William Fulke An aunswere to a Popishe apologie ¶ An Apollogie of a Papiste confuted by W. F. THere was found in the court either cast of purpose or lost of negligence a certain small pamphlette conteinyng an Apollogie or aunswere of a Papiste to some frendes of his that perswaded hym to conforme hymself to the Religion now receiued in the realme by publike aucthoritie whiche when it came to my handes supposyng it might do some hurte emong them that are ignoraunte I thought good briefly to confute it But because the copie whiche was founde was vnskilfully written I had some diffultie to reade it in certaine places and sometymes I mighte plainely perceiue that the aucthours meanyng was chaunged by vntrue writyng So that the aucthour or his frendes maie haue some occasion to cauill at my publishing of the copie whiche was so muche corrupted In cōsideratiō wherof I would haue been verie glad to haue had the principall copie of the aucthours owne hande if I could haue knowen how to come by it But seyng I was out of hope of that I perused and restored the copie that I had as faithfully as I could desiryng the aucthour or his frendes that haue the originall if I haue erred in any woorde of any momente to lette me haue knowledge thereof and I will thereby reforme the apologie and alter myne answere thereto accordyngly The writyng had this title The Papiste Certaine considerations and causes mouyng me not to bee presente at nor to receiue neither vse the seruice of the newe booke otherwise called the Common boke of praiers The aunswere If the copie of your title as it came to my hande was not peruerted you shewe your self in your title to bee a very peruerse ▪ and froward persone that maie not vouchsafe to call the booke as it is commonly
the Arians did agree with the Christen menne in theim bothe as in all Sacramentes and in all poinctes of praiyng sauing that the Arians did sing Gloria patri in filio and the Christian menne Gloria patri filio c. And therfore and for that onely poinct Ihō Chrysostome then beyng Bishop of Constantinople did appoincte vnto the christian men a seperate place and maner of praier from them as it appeareth in the sixth of the Historie Ecclesiastike And therefore the notable doctour S. Augustine doth conclude on thys wise saiyng that they shall not communicate in Sacramētes with vs whose doctrine we cannot approue and allowe The aunswere Your third consideration standeth vppon a foolishe fallation of Sophistrie called petitio principij whiche is whē a man will take that as true whiche his aduersarie will not graunte hym As you doe in this your argument where you take that for a true principle whiche you shall neuer be able to proue namely that we are Heretikes and Schismatikes And so you committe double folie Firste in prouyng that so diligentely whiche no manne will deny whiche is that a manne ought not to communicate in religion with Heretikes and secondly in bringing no proofe at all of that which all your aduersaries wil deny namely that thei are Heretikes or Schismatikes For you must first prooue that thei are suche before you can proue that you ought to auoide their societie The Papiste The fowerth consideration is that the receiuyng of this new booke of seruice is a condemnation of the olde wherby is taken away 5. of the. 7. Sacramentes the reall presence of Christes body in the Sacramente of the alter the sacrifice of the masse many traditions of the Apostles as the holiyng of the Fonte oile and Chrisma in Baptisme and Confirmation the making of the signe of the Crosse praiers for the deade and vnto sainctes All sacramentall and godly cerimonies frequented in the vniuersal churche of Christe and brougt into this realme with the faithe of Christe by S. Augustine and here by hym established as suer signes and tokens of christian faieth like as the holy S. Bede witnesseth in his firste boke de gestis Anglorum in the 25.29.30 chapiters beside that all the foresaide thinges haue been alwaie approued vsed and allowed throughout the vniuersal church of christ And therfore saieth S. Augustine all these thinges whiche haue been receiued in the vniuersall Churche of Christe and approued by the vse and consente therof ought not to be ouerthrowen nor yet to be chaūged by the iudgemente of one priuate person be his learnyng and liuyng neuer so good nor yet by the Bishoppes of any one prouince or countrie when thereby they shoulde breake the vnitie of Gods spirite whiche is the chief treasure in his Churche commended by our sauiour Christe vnto his Apostles wishynge and praiynge the same vnitie to be amongest theim whiche was betwixt him and God Ioan 17 the father The Apostle S. Paule tought the Corinthians aboue all thinges to obserue this vnitie and willed the Romaines that with one minde and one mouth they shoulde glorifie god And in the Epistle to the Ephesians he besought theim most entirely to obserue this vnitie Again S. Augustine saieth these thinges whiche the vniuersall churche doth teache therfore are to be obserued and kepte of all menne because the churche which is the spouse of Christ hath the full aucthoritie of her husband Christ and suche gouernement also of the holy ghost that she cannot consent but to true thinges nor she cannot commaunde but onely suche thinges whiche are both holy holsome and good And farther the same S. Augustine saieth that in the ministratiō of the Sacramentes and in the manner of praiyng vsed of Preestes there must be an vniformitie obserued in Christes catholike Churche that by their Lawe and maner of praiyng there may be established the lawe of beleuyng And lest that the lawe and maner of praiyng being chaunged may also bring foorthe a chaunge and alteration of faieth like as it hath so proued in thys realme Beside that S. Ambrose doth thinke that there can not bee the faieth where Schisme is for albeit that schismatikes may haue faieth towardes God yet they cannot haue faieth towarde the Churche of God whom they suffer to bee dismembred and discerped in peeces For wheras our sauiour Christe suffered for his Churche and the Churche is the mysticall bodie of Christe how therfore may thei haue faith in christ by whom his Passion is made frustrate and his mysticall bodie drawen in peeces And therefore woulde not we shoulde chaunge an order set or a custome of Christes churche For albeit saieth he the reason or cause of a custome may be sought for yet must it be so sought for that the custome thereby be not infirmed or broken for the searche may not bee made vnto destruction but vnto aedification wherby thou maist better obserue the custome when thou arte assured of the cause and reason therof I do praise thee saieth Tertuliane whiche firste doeth beleue the custome to be obserued before it hath learned the cause and reason why and wherfore The aunswere In your fowerth consideration you should haue likewise considered that suche thynges as are graunted of bothe partes nede small proofe and that those matters whiche are in controuersie should be substancially cōfirmed As for example How necessarie vnitie is for the Churche of Christe no manne doubteth so it bee in truthe and not in falshed for there is vnitie emong the mooste wicked but not in truthe and honestie On the other side that there be fiue sacramentes more then the boke alloweth that there is a carnall presence in the Sacrament of the Lordes bodie and bloude that there is or ought to be a Sacrifice in the masse ye bring not one worde of proof Concernyng Ceremonies whiche you call traditions of the Apostles you saie in deede a little although to little purpose and yet so confusely and out of all good order that you seme rather to confounde then to instructe your simple reader for what an hochpotte is this in the middes of your Sacramentes and Sacramentalles to choppe in praiers for the deade and inuocation of sainctes whiche bée articles of doctrine and not Ceremoniall obseruations Againe when you haue rehersed by name diuers Ceremonies as oile and chrisme in Baptisme your maner of confirmation the signe of the Crosse and all other your Sacramentalls and Ceremonies you bryng in certain broken and vnperfecte sentences of Doctours whiche speake generally of Ceremonies vsed in the churche in their age and doe not shew that your Ceremonies were vsed then in suche maner as you vse them now which is a meere mockerie of your readers For wheras you doe comprehende thē all vnder the name of Traditions of the Apostles if you be a man of suche learning as you would seme to be I dare saie in your behalfe you will bee ashamed to come to triall of this poincte that
it is Prophesied in the xij Chapiter of sainct Ihons Reuelation And yet for fiftie or sixtie yere agone it had been no harde matter to haue shewed you diuers members of our Churche bothe in Englande in Bohemia as th' historie of the church declareth at large Also in Fraunce at Merindoll and about Lyōs but these you will saie agreed not with vs in all poinctes but I will aunswere you thei agréed in the cheifest poinctes necessary to eternall saluation For whatsoeuer we are able to shewe for our Churche I am sure you are neuer able to shewe your self for your churche that whiche you require vs to shewe namely a churche that hath continued from this tyme vpwarde vnto the Apostles that taught vniformely and in all poinctes the doctrine that the Popishe Churche nowe teacheth Whiche thyng when you haue performed I will doe the like for oure Churche In the meane time that whiche is a sufficiente rule to finde out the true Churche by the iudgement of Saincte Augustine I will declare vnto you In his booke the vnitate ecclesiae Capi. 2. Inter nos autem Donatistat quaestio est vbi sit ecclesia Quid ergo facturi sumus In verbis nostris eam quaesituri sumus an in verbis capitis sui domini nostri Iesu Christi Puto quod in illius potius verbis eam quaerere debemus qui veritas est optimè nouit corpus suum Betwene vs and the Donatistes saieth saincte Augustine the question is where the churche should bée What shall we doe then shall we seke her in our wordes or in the woordes of her heade our Lorde Iesus Christ I thinke that rather in his wordes we ought to seke her which is the truthe and beste knoweth his own bodie And in the. xvj chapiter of the same booke he writeth thus of the Donatistes Vtrum ipsi ecclesiam teneant non nisi diuinarū scripturarum canonicis libris ostendant That is whether thei haue the churche on their side let theim shewe none otherwise but by the Canonicall bookes of holy scriptures Many other suche testimonies are in S. Augustine by whiche it is plaine that he geueth this infallible rule to knowe the true churche to examine the doctrine therof onely by the scriptures But wheras you saie that Anabaptistes Libertines and Arians pretende the word of god and the primitiue Churche what meane you therby that we should forsake the worde of god the Primitiue churche by whiche all heretikes haue béen cōfuted what soeuer thei pretended For though heretikes pretende the scriptures yet onely by the scriptures thei are to be cōfuted though thei appeale to the iudgemente of the primitiue church yet by the primitiue church thei are condemned for heretikes I maie as well say that Arianes Libertines and Anabaptistes boste them selues to be the true Catholike Churche therefore wee must not allowe the true catholike churche It is pitie to see menne that would be coumpted wise and learned to reason so fondly and vnlearnedly For of all other reasons it is the vainest and feeblest shift that the Papistes vse to flie frō the scriptures to the aucthoritie of the Churche in confutation of heresies For there was neuer yet heresie did arise but there was as greate controuersie of the Churche as of the opinion for euery heretike boasteth as well of the Churche as of the scriptures but when all is dooen his bragges of bothe muste bee beaten doune onely by the scriptures But because you make so proude vauntes that you will so plainlie proue that our Churche hath none agreans with the primitiue churche of Christ in discourse of that controuersie with you I will sette for the bothe what is the Primitiue churche and how we agree therewith and I doubte not but that I shal bee able by the grace of God bothe to iustifie our cause againste your false accusations and also to ouerthrowe youre falshodde whiche you haue heaped vppe to ouerwhelme the truthe And as I haue confuted your sixe considerations which vnto you seme of greate importaunce so by Gods helpe I shall auoide all other youre calumniations in whiche with some subtiltie but more impudencie and moste of all impietie you goe aboute to intangle the consciences of suche as bee ignorante and vnlearned to withdrawe their obedience ▪ from the godly lawes of this realme whiche are established for the mainteinyng of Gods true Religion and the abolishyng of all Idolatrie and superstition The Papiste Argumentes gathered out of the Scriptures prouyng that this late reformed Englishe churche hath none agreans with the Primitiue churche of Christ. The aunswere The very title of your argumentes declareth of what force youre argumentes are Your reasons are tenne in noumber whiche if thei were all graūted to be true yet foloweth not this conclusion that our Churche hath no agreance with the Primitiue Churche of Christe excepte you would affirme that all the doctrine of the Primitiue Churche were comprehended in these tenne poinctes Again your owne Popishe Churche differeth in these tenne poinctes as muche from the Primitiue Churche as ours therefore by your owne Logike I will conclude that your Popish churche hath no agreance with the church of Christ. 1. For neither you haue all thinges common 2. neither dooe you sell your houses and landes to putte the price in common 3. Neither doe you make diuision to euery manne accordyng to his necessitie 4. Neither are all mēbers of your Churche so prouided for that none dooe begge 5. Neither doe you baptise onely in the name of Christe 6. Neither dooe you giue the holy ghost by laiyng on your handes 7. Neither dooe you restore theim to health whom you annoincte with oile beyng sicke 8. Neither dooe you make open confession of your synnes 9. Neither dooe you celebrate the Sacramente after supper 10. Neither dooe you abstaine from bloodde and strangled therefore by your owne reason you haue no agreance with the Primitiue Churche of Christe Or if you maie haue any agreance these differences notwithstanding why maie not we the same differences nothyng lettyng vs haue sufficient agremente therewith You see that either your argument is nothyng worthe or els you haue as little agreance with the Primatiue churche as we Your only refuge is this that it is not necessary for you to haue any agreance with the primitiue Churche And that is the opinion of all Papistes whiche is diligently to be noted that you disclaime of al title of the Primitiue Churche whiche you holde was but an infante and by addition of your doctrine and Ceremonies is growne to bee of womannes state As though Christ maried his Churche when she was vnder age and so the matrimonie was not ratified and consumated before the Pope had nourtured her in his schole vntill she came to yeres of discretion For it is as lawfull for me so to inferre vppon your allegorie as for you so to allegorise of her But that you maie the better vnderstande what
the Apostles Hebr. v. whiche we retain although you saie in the ende we do not As for salte spettle cōiuration or exorcisme thei ar altogeher superfluous at this tyme Of exorcisme there was some vse in the auncient churche but of salte spittle which neuer are not mentioned in that place of Basile As there were many possessed with Deuills so there was some that that had this power of the holie ghost to caste out Deuils whiche were called exoreistes as witnesseth S. Cypriane in his fowerth boke and Epis. vij ad Magnū Quod hodie etiā geritur vt per exorcistas voce humana potestate diuina flagelletur et vratur et torqueatur diabolus Et cū exire et hoēs dei dimittere saepe dicat in eo tamē quod dixerit fallat id quod per Pharaonē prius gestū est eodem mendacio obstinationis et fraudis exerceat Cū tamen ad aquā salutarē atque ad baptismi sanctificationā venitur scire debemus fidere quia illic diabolus opprimitur homo dicatus diuina indulgentia liberatur that is Which thing also is doen at this day that by the exorcistes through the voice of a man and the power of God the deuil is scourged burned and tormented And although he saith oftētimes that he goeth out letteth go the men of God and yet in so saying deceiueth practiseth the same thing that was dooen before by Pharao with the same lye of obstinacie deceipt yet whē we come to the wholsom water and sanctification of Baptisme we muste knowe and beleue that there the Deuill is oppressed and the man whiche is there dedicated is by the mercie of god deliuered This one testimonie emong a number is sufficient to declare bothe that there was in the Churche menne indued with the gifte of castyng out Deuilles whiche visibly and sensibly did possesse menne and that Exorcisme at Baptisme was vsed for none other ende but to deliuer suche as were possessed and could not be deliuered by the Exorcistes before thei were baptised not that euery persone which was Baptised hadde neede of exorcisme but onely suche as were vexed with vncleane spirites And seyng that gifte of castyng out Deuilles doeth no more continewe in the Churche and thei that are to be Baptised are not possessed with Deuilles it were not onely vngodlines but also méere madnesse for such to take vpō them that power whiche haue it not or if thei had it to exercise it where there is no neede of it The Papiste Fifte in the Primitiue churche thei builded churches erected therin alters and offfered sacrifice theron which was a suer token and argument of the faieth of Christ receiued like as Chrysostome writeth of Englande howe that they had receiued the faieth of Christe because they had builded churches and erected Aultars in the same S. Beade witnesseth that sainct Augustine at the bringyng in of Christes faieth into Englande did set vppe Aultars wherupon the people did make their oblations and the preste did celebrate Masse which these our reformatours doe denie and destroie as greate blaspemie vnto God. The aunswere For buildyng of Churches in any sumptuous maner the primitiue church was not careful but vntil Constantines time continued in such places as thei could get sometimes most commōly in caues vnder the yerth when thei were persecuted and durste not assemble in open places And we at this time if we had not conueniēt places for the holie assembles would and wher suche conuenient howses lacke doe builde Churches and Oratories But not in the honour of Sainctes and Aungels as you doe whiche thing the primitiue and auncient Churche did not but iudged it to be meare Idolatry sacriledge and blasphemie As Basile in his 141. Epistle proueth the holy ghoste to be God because he hath a temple so doeth Didymus in his treatise de spiritu sancto because no creature but God onely can haue a temple S. Augustine de vera religione Cap. 55 saieth concernyng sainctes Quare honoramus eos charitate non seruitute nec eis Templa cōstruimus c. Wherfore we honor theim with loue and not with seruise neither doe we build churches vnto theim for thei will not be so honoured of vs Likewise in the. 8. booke 27. cap. de ciuitate dei he saith that christians builde no temples to Martyres and in verie many other places he writeth to the same effecte And as for Alters and Sacrifies the primitiue churche vsed none more then wee The auncient churche in deede nameth Aulters and sacrificyng but they meaned nothyng lesse then suche Aulters and sacrifices as the Papistes vse For the fashione of their alter whiche was the Communion Table so called of them also is to be seen in the Panegyricall oratiō made before Paulinus Bishop of Tyrus wher also the fashion of their Temples is described Euseb. lib. 10. Cap. 4. There was but one Aulter in all the Churche whiche stoode not againste the furthest wall at the East ende of the Churche as your Aulters but in the middest of the Churche and was compassed rounde aboute with Grates or Lattesses of woodde which were called Cancells the Chauncel with in whiche place so incloased the Communion was ministred and at the time of the ministration the Ministers and Deacones stoode round aboute the Aulter whiche is a manifest proofe that it was not an Aulter against a wall like youres but a Table standyng in the middest as ours is Laste of all what they vnderstode by the name of sacrifice I will discloase by one Testimonie of Chrisostome whiche shal be in steade of a greate number For this he writeth vpon the. x. chapiter to the Hebrues Hom. 17. Speaking of the sacrifice whiche the Churche doth offer Hoc autem quod facimus in comemorationē quidem fit eius quod factum est Hoc enim facite inquit in meam comemorationem Non aliud sacrificium sicut Pontifex sed ipsum semper facimus magis autem recordationē sacrificijeperamur This Sacrifice saieth he that we doe is done in remembrance of that whiche was doone For he saied doe this in remembraunce of me we dooe not offer an other Sacrifice as the high Prieste but wee offer the selfe same alwaies or rather we exercise the remembrance of that sacrifice By this testimony of Chrisostome it is euident that the olde writers when thei spake of Sacrifice did not meane the Popishe sacrifice of the Masse but onely the remembrance of the sacrifice of Christe which is the ministration of the Communion The Testimonie of Beda concernyng Augustine the Monke that came into Englande which you alleged is neither aunciente beyng aboue sixe hundred yeres after Christe neither yet of auctoritie to bee followed the same Augustine beyng a superstitious proude cruell and vnlearned Monke For his superstition Bede testifieth his pride and crueltie is set forthe in our Englishe histories his ignoraunce in doubtes and questions whiche he
exhorteth them to breake it But suche as are not able to performe honestly that whiche thei haue vowed rashely we teach accordyng to the doctrine of sainct Paule that it is better for them repentyng of their rashe vowes to marie then to burne in concupiscens then to committe fornication and vncleanes And this we doe not without the consent of olde writers as partly I haue shewed and more coulde shewe if neede required The Papiste Seuenth in the primitiue churche Images of Christe his Crosse and of his sainctes were vsed as in Cęsarea was the Image of Christ sette vppe by the woman whiche Christe cured of the fluxe of blood as witnesseth Eusebius and Basilius magnus and the generall Counsell holden at Nice of three hundred and tenne Bishoppes doeth constantly affirme and vouche that the Image of Christe and of his Sanctes in the churche were of the tradition of the Apostles And saincte Gregorie Nyssen doeth write howe he did beholde the Image of Christes passion and that oftentymes not without teares and weapyng Chrisostome saieth that he that dooeth any iniurie or valiny to the Image of Caesar he doth cōmitte the same against Caesar hymselfe S. Beade writeth how sainct Aug. entered into this Realme with a Crosse of Siluer and an Image of Christe painted in a table in procession wise singyng the Letanie to whiche notwithstandyng what violence and dishonour hath been doen by our reformatours herein this Realme to the Image of our sauiour Christ and of his sainctes it is not vnknowen The Aunswere It is a proper Primitiue Churche whiche you alledge of the seconde Counsaile of Nice whiche was seuen hundred eightie and one yeres after Christe holden by a multitude of Idolatrous flatteryng and vnlearned Prelates whiche to feede the humor of that wicked Empresse Irene were gathered together not in the name of Christ but against Christ whose expresse commaundemente thei did impugne And with suche leude and vnsensible reasons and wrestynges of the scriptures that if a manne of purpose to mocke the Idolaters woud inuente argumentes to laugh at hee coulde not diuise more ridiculous matters God made manne after his owne Image ergo wee muste make Images God is meruailous in his sainctes ergo we must make Images Theodofius of Amorie reasoneth whatsoeuer is written is written for our learnyng ergo wee must haue Images to teache vs No manne lighteth a candell and putteth it vnder a Bushell ergo Images must bee sette on the Alters with a hundreth suche substanciall proofes And to make the matter mooste manifeste Theodorus bishop of Myre proueth that Images must be worshiped by his Archedeacons dreames and so dooeth other by dreames and miracles and at laste Tharasius Archebishoppe of Constantinople with the whole Synode concludeth that Angelles haue bodies and mennes soules also be bodily and therefore thei maie bee paincted Againste this Idolatrous vnlearned and blasphemous Counsaile Carolus Magnus wrote a booke whiche is extante in whiche he confuteth the grosse heresie of adoration of Images As for the primatiue churche of Christ regardyng the seconde commaundement of God did make no kinde of Images to bee had in any vse of religion but vtterly forbad them As for the Image of Christ whereof Eusebius speaketh if it were true was onely a monumente of the historie sette vp in the streate in remembraunce of the miracle not in the churche to bee had in veneration or worshipped Neither was there any Image receiued into the Churche for three hundreth yeres after Christe The Epistle of Epiphanius translated by saincte Hierome is a notable testimonie Cum venissem ad villam quae dicitur Anablatha vidissemque ibi praeteriens lucernam c. When I came to a village whiche is called Anablatha and sawe there as I passed by a candell burnyng and inquiryng what place it was and vnderstandyng that it was a Churche I entered in to praie and founde there a vaile or linnen clothe hangyng at the doore of the saied churche stained and painted and hauyng an Image as it were of Christ or of some saincte For I dooe not well remember whose Image it was Therefore when I sawe this thing that the Image of a man was hanged vp in the Churche contrary to the aucthoritie of the Scriptures I did rende it in péeces and gaue counsaile to the kepers of that place rather to wrappe it about some poore bodie that was deade to burie hym with all Contrariwise thei murmured and saied If he would néedes rende it it were reason he should giue vs an other vaile for it and so chaunge it Whiche thing when I heard I promised that I would giue theim one aad sende it shortlie There passed not long tyme but that I sought to sende theim a verie good vaile for it For I thought that one shoulde haue been sente me out of Cypres And nowe I haue sente suche a one as I could gette And I praie you to commaunde the Elders of that place to receiue that Vaile of this bearer whiche is sente by vs And to giue theim charge that hereafter in the Churche of Christe suche vailes bee not hanged vp whiche are contrary to our Religion This writeth Epiphanius to Ihon bishoppe of Hierusalem by whiche it is euidente what was thought of Images at that tyme when a painted vaile might not bée hanged before a Churche doore to keepe out the winde or for some suche purpose and not in any respect of religion or worshipping The same Epiphanius emong the heresies of Carpocrates rehearseth that he made priuilie the Image of Iesu Paule Homer and Pithagoras and worshipped them Also he inueigheth sharply against the Antidicomarians and Collyridians for vsyng and worshippyng the Image of Marie the Virgine As for your testimonies out of Gregorie Nyssene and Chrysostome serue nothyng to the purpose for Gregorie speaketh not of the historie of Christes passion as you vntruely report but of the oblation of Isaac by his father Abraham Conc. Nicen. 2. actione iiij But this picture was in some priuate place not in the Churche and place of worshippyng And Chrysostome in his saiyng concludeth not that therefore we must haue Images of GOD and of Christe in the Churche but he that doeth iniurie to any manne that is made after the Image of god or disobeieth a Magistrate which representeth the persone of god c. He doth iniurie to god For he that maketh any Image of God doeth God greate iniurie transformyng the glorie of the inuisible GOD into the shape of any corruptible creature Rom. j. But what Chrysostome and diuers other godlie fathers thought of the vse of Images in the churche is exdressed in the counsaile of Ephesus which condemned Images before the Counsaile of Nice whiche restored theim And the Counsaile Elibertinum fower hundreth yeres before that vnder Constantine the greate made this decree Capt. xxxvi Placuit picturas in ecclesia esse non debere ne quod colitur aut adoratur in parietibus depingatur That is It is thought