you of vs or least those things which we haue written of Ecclesiasticall policie properly against that Antichristian tyrannie as necessitie required are taken by some in that sense as if euer we had meant to compel to our order those churches that thinke otherwise then we doo of it and the gouernors of them agreeing els with vs in the truth of doctrine agreeable to the word of God and that except they followed our order we accounted otherwise of them then their godlines and dignitie and mutuall brotherhood doth require c. Farre be this arrogancie from vs. Quis vllum nobis in vllam Ecclesiam imperium tribuit Who doth giue vs authority ouer anie church Far be it from vs that we should thinke so the substantiall matters be kept there ought nothing to be graunted to antiquitie nothing to custome nothing to the circumstances of places times and persons c. Againe in his booke against D. Sarauia hauing spoken of the tyrannie of Popish Bishops hee maketh this exception Neque tamen But wee doo not therefore accuse all Archbishops and Bishops now so called of tyranie For what arrogancie were that Nay so as they doo imitate the examples of the olde holy Bishops and indeuor as much as they can to reforme the house of God so miserably deformed according to the rule of Gods word why may we not acknowledge al of them now so called Archbishops and Bishops obey them and honor them with all reuerence So far we are from that which some obiect vnto vs most falsly and most impudently as though we tooke vppon vs to prescribe to anie Church in anie place our examples to be followed like vnto those vnwise men who account wel of nothing but of that which they doo themselues And to the same effect a little before If now the reformed Churches of England being vnderpropped with the authoritie of Bishoppes and Archbishops do continue as this hath happened to that Church in our memorie that she hath had men of that calling not onely most notable martyrs of God but also excellent pastors and doctors Fruatur sane ista singulari dei benificentia quae vtinam illi sit perpetua Let her truly inioy this singular blessing of God which I wish may be perpetuall vnto her Furthermore it should seeme that Zanchius as moderate and learned a man as euer fauoured the pretended Elderships was appointed some 12 or 16. yeres since to draw a confâ—ssion of religion for the Churches of France others as Melanchthon had done the Augustan confession for Germanie Accordingly hee drew it and in the same speaking of Bishops he vseth these wordes Non improbamius patres c. Wee doo not disalow the fathers in that after a diuers waie of dispensing the word and gouerning the Church they multiplied diuerse orders of Ministers seeing it was lawfull for them so to do as it is vnto vs and seeing it appeareth that they did it for honest causes appertaining at that time to the order decencie and edification of the Church And in the next article Hac ratione c. By this reason vz. that the nurseries of dissentions and of schismes may be taken away wee thinke that these thinges which were ordained before the Councell of Nice concerning Archbishops nay as touching the foure Patriarches may be excused and defended When this booke was perused and this clause found in it then forsoth a deuise was had for the staying of it vnder pretence that now it was thought more meete that there should be a harmonie made of all the confessions of diuers churches But Zanchius himselfe maketh this the chiefe cause if I vnderstand him why his booke dyd mislike some of them for that hee had written as before is mentioned of Bishops For so hee sayth Magnus quidam vir c. A certaine great man meaning Beza as it is supposed did write vnto mee of this matter as followeth Your confession was read by mee and N. others with great delight It is written most learnedly and in a most exquisite methode and if you except that which you adde towards the end touching Archbishops and the Hierarchie mihi summopere placuit it pleased mee exceedingly Vpon this occasion as it seemeth Zanchius printed his said confession with certaine annotations In the which annotations he sheweth three reasons for his allowance of Archbishops Bishops The first is grounded vpon the practise of the primitiue church presently after the Apostles times the second is for that hee thought it his dutie in the draught of his said booke to haue regard to those reformed churches which retaine both Bishops Archbishops and the third because all the reformed Churches generally although they haue chaunged the names yet in effect they doe keepe the authoritie as where they haue superintendents and generall superintendents Nay saith he where these new base Latine names are not admitted Ibi tamen solent esse aliquot primarij penes quos fere tota est authoritas yet there are in those places vsually certaine chiefemen that doe in a manner beare all the sway But I pray you be pleased that I may deliuer vnto you the maner of his setting down of his first reason and that in his owne words for they carry with them a notable condemnation of other mens great pride rashnes Cum haenc conscriberem fidei confessionem c. When I writ this confession of faith I writ all the thinges in it of a good conscience and as I beleeued so I freely spake the scriptures teaching men so to doe And my faith first of all and simply doth rely vpon the word of God then somewhat also vpon the common consent of the whole ancient Catholicke Church if the same bee not repugnant to the scriptures For I beleeue that what thinges were defined and receiued by the auncient Fathers assembled in the name of the Lord with a generall consent of them all and without any contradiction of the holy Scriptures the same surely although they be not of the same authoritie with holy Scriptures yet did they proceed from the holy Ghost Heereof it commeth to passe that those things which are of this nature neither would I neither dare I with a good conscience disallow them And what can be shewed more certainly out of histories out of the councels out of the writings of all the ancient fathers then that those orders of Ministers of the which we haue spoken haue bene ordained and receiued in the Church by the generall consent of all christian common-wealths And who then am I that should presume to reproue that which the whole Church hath approued This is true and religious humilitie Thus all graue and discreet godly men haue euerwritten Those that contemne all the learned Fathers that went before them doe open a windowe to their owne discredite by those that shall come after them That which this godly and great learned man ascribeth to the
long they account it since it was in any good reparation saith plainely not as Cartwright affirmeth that it flourished most in Constantines time but thus we must needs confesse in deede that this gouernement of the Church fell to decaye long before the Councell of Nice But yet one step further after maister Cartwrights dubling where speaking in his second booke of the corruption as he tearmeth it that one Bishop had a preheminēce giuen him aboue other ministers which he cannot deny to haue been an ordinance in Alexandria from Saint Marks time c. he saith from the first day wherein this deuise was established corruption grew in the Church c. And the first resistance by any setled Church against that corruption was by those that abolished that deuise of man and receaued the order in the Apostles times touchinge the equality of Ministers as the Bohemians Merindols the Churches in Germany and Geneua See what carieers are here From Geneua to the Apostles times and thence backe againe to Geneua at a leape From Saint Markes time till the time here limited the pretended Presbitery with all the complements thereof as nowe it is vrged hath lyen alla-mort No one setled Church that is in Cartwrightes language no one particular parish in all the world for a 1500. yeares did euer account it vnlawfull for a Bishop to haue authority aboue other Ministers Or thus there hath not bin vpō the face of the earth within the space of a thou sand fiue hundred yeares so much as in any one parish such an equality amongest the Ministers of the worde of God as is now pretended to be in the Presbitery at Geneua and so consequently in all that tyme not suche a Presbitery Or thus within the compasse of the Heauens there hath not beene one Church for aboue 1500 yeares that euer dealt so with Bishops as of late they haue beene dealt withall especially in Geneua and in some other such places as haue followed therein the example of that Citty Well hitherto then you see that since we came from Geneua vz the yeare 1541. the men themselues that talke so much of their Geneua platforme cannot finde it flourishing in the daies of all the auncient fathers nor in all the world for the space of aboue 1500. yeares The fathers alas some of them were but simple men some were ambitious and some were ignoraunt They poore men had small experience and lesse pollicie They wanted iudgement and zeale either to discerne or to keepe in her virginitie this gallaunt Dalila They chopped and chaunged the institution of Christ at their pleasure Any examples that shall be fet from them are very dangerous They were but men But if you will leape ouer all them and come to Geneua there you shall finde wise men learned men humble men zealous men nay rather Angelles then men there you shall see the glorious rankes of Elders sitting vppon their thrones the worshipfull company of Deacons attending vpon the contributions the well Disciplined multitude bringing in the price of their lands and goods and powring all downe at the Deacons feete there Christ carrieth hys owne scepter in Bezaes hand there this pretended holy Discipline so disgraced by the fathers so corrupted and so defaced there she raigneth there shee flourisheth and there she is magnified The Church of Geneua saith a good fellow is the purest reformed Church forsooth in Christendome Againe Geneua is the chiefest place of true comfort in Earth Now what is here said of Geneua and her Ministers except you extend it to all other Churches and Ministers that follow the Geneua platforme they will be angry with you and thinke themselues as I suppose to be very greatly disgraced But I will leaue them clawing one of another and come to the Apostles times to see if the Geneua Church-gouernment may be found out amongest them For either there or no where The Apostle Saint Iohn liued much longer then any of the rest of the Apostles did Saint Ierome saith that he liued after Christes passion threescore eight yeares So as the Apostles times after the largest accompt are not further to be extended Now as Baronius collecteth out of Eusebius Saint Marke was Bishop of Alexandria about 19. yeares and died about the thirtith yeare after Christes ascention So as Saint Iohn out-liued Saint Marke some 38. yeares After this reckoning if the Church of Alexandria should haue departed from Christes institution and so cleane haue disgraced the glory of this fained Eldership when there was a Bishop made there according to Cartwrightes assertion then before wee can finde the Geneua platforme in such perfection as it is in that Citie we must cut of the said 19. yeares wherein Saint Marke had departed so grossely from Christes ordinance from the before mentioned 68. yeares the full extent of the apostles time which being done you haue but eleuen yeares wherein there is any hope for the pretended puritie and practise of the Geneua Discipline to shadow or shrowd her selfe Yea but where Saint Ierome saith that there were Bishops in Alexandria from Saint Markes time c. Cartwright hath this shift vz that the wordes from Saint Marks time may be taken exclusiuely to shut out Saint Marke Whereby to saue Saint Markes credite that an Euangelist should not be thought to haue broken the necke of Christes gouernement he woulde haue this great defection to haue been presently after Saint Markes time and so hee excludeth Saint Marke after the Geneua fashion quite and cleane out of his Bishopricke and will needes suppose that hee was neuer Bishop contrary to Saint Ieromes expresse wordes in sondrie places and contrarie to the full consent and agreement of all the auncient fathers and of all the ecclesiasticall histories But be it as hee would haue it yet let the reckoning be newly cast vp againe and it falleth out that this supposed departing from Christes institution was about thirtie and eight yeares before S. Iohn died Which standeth hardly with the reputation of the Apostles times in my opinion But that is no great matter We know saith the authour of the foresaide booke that was sent vs from Scotland Diotrephes to haue been in the Church euen in the Apostles times and we are assured he could neuer be gotten out of it since the first houre that he set his footing therein And therefore we cannot greatly maruaile though euen in their time there had been a diuerse gouernment from this of the Lordes appointment which we labour for For euen in the Apostles times the mistery of iniquitte beganne to worke And what will they say of Saint Iohn the Apostle and of all the rest of them that out-liued Saint Marke as they haue done of all the auncient fathers was there so small intelligence amongst those most prouident and wise holy men that there could be so notorious a defection in Alexandria so famous a Citie and they neuer to heare of it Or
conceaue of it they shew themselues in theyr colours and doe call it plainely a Senate neither respecting the wisedom which themselues doe ascribe vnto the Apostles nor the foresayd example of the purer West Churches And indeede although at Geneua the name of the Consistory be most in vse yet I gesse that Beza would gladly bring it to be chaunged and called a Senate And I doe partly so thinke because in his printed Booke of excommunication he hath left out the reason why the Apostles called it not Senate but Eldership which reason is in his written Booke that Erastus confuted Besides also oftentimes in his notes vppon the new Testament hee tearmeth the forme of that gouernmēt by the name of Ecclesiasticall Senate And namely where they dreame it was commaunded by Christ in these wordes Dic Ecclesiae tell the Church Constat hic agi de Ecclesiastico Senatu it is manifest saith he that here Christ speaketh of the Ecclesiasticall Senate In another place also he saith tell the Church that is the Eldership and here in effect tell the Ecclesiasticall Senate So that to my vnderstanding he confoundeth Eldership and Senate making them both one Which peraduenture will bring himselfe within the compasse of his own words against Castalion To translate Presbyterium Eldership Senatum a Senate doth argue a greate vanitye of witte and is indeede a prophane innouation But to let that passe by hooke or crooke it must be a Senate which tickleth and pleaseth some of our reformers insomuch as in their Latine discourses of Discipline there is little but Ecclesiasticall Senate and Senatours Christus pro more Iudaeorum Ecclesiam Ecclesiasticum Senatum appellauit Christ after the custome of the Iewes called the Ecclesiasticall Senate the Church Againe Ecclesiasticall Senate is an assembly of Elders c. And againe Cum hic Senatus 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a Paulo appellatur Presbyteros esse hos Senatores necesse est Seeing this Senate is called by Paul an Eldership it followeth of necessity that the Elders must be Senatoures I omitte some old English names which haue beene giuen to this Minion as Congregation Assembly Segniory c. and some Latine names also as the Epitome of the Church and Diaconia Presbyterorū the Deaconship of Elders because they are now growen as it seemeth to bee too base Rather let vs call it with Iunius if I conceaue his meaning materfamilias the huswife of the Churche in Christes absence or with Maister Beza Tribunal Christi the Tribunall seate of Christ. But yet for all these wordes I greatly doubt it that such honourable titles will not long be continued For if Maister Beza his interpretation of Christes speaches Dic Ecclesiae doth proue to be authenticall then they must be enforced in my opinion to call their gouernement by a name of no great estimation amongest those that professe Christ. For let the place be considered and hee maketh Christ in effect to say Tell the Church that is tell the Senat Archisynagogorum of the Archrulers of the Synagogue who had the power and iurisdiction that is there spoken of in their handes By which exposition if Christ had beene pleased to haue spoken properly without vsing of any figure when he saide Tell the Church he should haue said Tell the Synagogue and the word Church in that place must needes be so expounded Whereby it followeth that if Christes authority by Bezaes exposition may be regarded they ought by theyrowne collections and interpretations to call their seuerall Senates so many Synagogues Besides Maister Beza saith that Synedrium and Synagogue were both one in Christes iudgement and there is nothing more reasonable in theyr writings then to call theyr Senats Synedria which sheweth that at the least they may aswell by Christs testimony call them Synagogues if they list I would not haue troubled you with this tedious discourse of the seuerall names of this pretended regiment but that you might vnderstand how their tongues are deuided about such a trifle and thereby also perceaue the infancy or new birth of this fancy of theirs in that as yet they are not agreede howe to name the Childe If it fall out that it get the name of Senate what an honourable stile will this be Senatus populusque Romanus the Senate and people of Sainct Giles in the Fieldes and so of all other parishes in England CHAP. VII Of their vncertainty concerning the places where this pretended regiment should be erected MAister Cartwright and all his English followers that I haue read doe affirme it moste confidently that by the commaundement of God by the institution of Christ by the rules of Gods word and by the practise commandement of the Apostles There ought of necessitie to be an Eldership in euery parish in euery Congregation Church by Church in euery particular Congregation and not only in Cities but in all Churches in the Countrye and vplandish townes wheresoeuer there is a Pastor without the which Eldership euery such church or Congregation is to be accounted maymed vnperfect no entyre body 10 want the exercise of the principall offices of charity to be destitute of no small part of the Gospell of true Religion of Christs gouernment of the piller of truth and of all those priueledges profits which are assigned by them vnto the enioying of it Hereunto is fit to be added what they haue further written concerning this worde Church and howe they describe their said Parish The Church sayth Cartwright is eyther taken in the Scriptures for the whole body of the Catholique church or for one particular congregation or for the faythfull company of one house This one particular Congregation when it hath an Eldership placed in it they terme it the body of one particular Church and a perfect and vnmaymed body of Christ wherein the ministers of the word and the Elders are the eyes and the Deacons the handes without the which members though it may liue a while they confesse yet saie they it so pineth and wanteth that in the ende it will become a deade corpes vppon the grounde And for the quantitie of this body the dimensions of it or the description of such a particular Congregation or Parish as they speake of thus M. Cartwright squareth it out Euerye competent congregation and particular bodye of a church should haue hir parts in neighbourhood of dwellings wel trussed one with another Againe a Parish well bounded is nothing else but a number of those families which dwelling neere together may haue a commodious resorte and be at once taught with one mouth With these points of our English Eldership I meruell how their associates in other Countries will bee satisfied By the Discipline in Fraunce concluded vppon by fiue generall Synodes of the reformed Churches of that Realme It was agreed vpon that request should be made to the
some Prophets some Euangelistes some Pastors and Doctors for the repayring of the Saintes for the worke and the Ministerie and for the edification of the body of Christ. And againe vppon these wordes A Bishop must be vnreproueable c. hee meeteth with the common obiection for the equalitie of Ministers because euery Minister is called a Bishope sometimes in the Scriptures and sayth that the word Bishoppe notwithstanding it be oftentimes vsed by S. Paule for euery pastor of the church of God who haue a kinde of ouersight ouer theyr seuerall charges and so may suo modo after a sort bee called Superintendents and Bishops c. yet heere it signifieth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Primarios illos ecclesiarum pastores c. Those chiefe pastors to whom the ouersight of the liues and manners of the other ministers is committed whom according to the force of the Greeke appellation we in these dayes do call Superintendents Hitherto then it appeareth as I take it what is both the practise of the reformed Churches in Germany and the iudgemēt also of the chiefe learned men there since Melanchthon Bucers times concerning Bishops or Superintendents with their preheminence charge and authoritie Some there are indeed beyond the seas who followinge the immoderate proude and slaunderous humor that Melanchthon Camerarius spake of before haue vttered their great mislike of the Germaine Superintendents and that with lesse modestie a great deale then doth well become them In reproofe of one of them Gerlachius a learned man of Tubing writeth in this sort Licet titulos ordinum c. Although thou beholdest with disdaine as it were from aboue the titles of orders after the fashion of hypocrites and of the Anabaptistes yet with a vaine perswasion of knowledge foolish arrogancye whereby thou contemnest our countrymen in respect of thy selfe and dost chalenge especiall knowledge to thee and thy fellowes onely Plus turges quà m omnes Doctores et Superintendentes nostri Thou swellest more with pride then all our Doctors and Superintendents And what commeth into thy minde that thou shouldest cauill at the degrees of ministers as though it were not lawfull to ordayne such degrees for the building and gouernment of the Church Did not God himselfe in the old Testament appoint a chiefe Bishop Priests and Leuits And in the new Testament gaue hee not some Apostles some Prophets some Euangelists and some Pastors and Doctors Had not the primatiue church accordingly Bishops Priestes and Deacons And againe a little after in the same booke whilest thou a proude man girdest so often at the title of Superintendent I affirme that thou reprehendest the Apostle Paule himselfe who hath giuen this name to a distinct order of ministers of the church And our Auncestors following this Apostle haue thought it meete that for the edifying of the church and for orders sake there should be certaine Superintendentes that is ouerseers not onely of the flocke but of the nisters in like manner Thus farre Gerlachius who if hee were in England knewe into what an extremitie the like persons are growen vnto in the same case amongst vs It would peraduenture moue him For nowe there is no remedye with our ministers of that consorte but they must all bee equall They cannot endure it no the meanest of them to haue anye of their owne coate their Superior They are fallen into the contradiction of Chors and doe tell both Moyses and Aaron that they take to much vpon them All Pastores saye they are and ought to be of equall authoritie in their seuerall Parishes and no one to haue power ouer another Euery parish Priest with them must bee a Bishop and haue as full iurisdiction in his Parochiall dioces as it is lawful for any Bishop in the world either to haue or to execute For orders sake they are content that in their Classicall prouinciall or Nationall assemblies some one minister bee chosen from amongst thēselues to be the moderator for the propounding of matters gathering of voices c. But his office preheminence is to continew no longer then whilest those assemblies last Otherwise or for any further authoritie either of Bishops or Archbishops whether they haue abolished popery reformed religiō maintained the gospell abandoned superstitiō or whatsoeuer they haue done or yealded vnto they holde it altogether vnlawfull do raile against them all against their callings and against all that defend them and that with more then heathenish scurrilitie Cartwright is the chiefe man that began this course in Englande and you shall see howe pretily his schollers follow him Archbishops Bishops sayth he are new ministeries neuer ordayned by God The first step to this kind of Bishopricke beganne at Alexandria and not at Syon The name and office of an Archbishop is vnlawfull his function is of the earth and so can do no good but much harme in the church he is a knobbe or some lumpe of flesh which being no member of the body doth burthen it and disgrace it Whereupon foorth come his schollers crying out amaine that Archbishops Bishops are superfluous members of the body of Christ and that they mayme and deforme his body making it by that meanes a monster That they are vnlawfull false bastardly gouernors of the church That they are the ordinances of the Diuell That they are in respect of theyr places enemies of God that they are petye Popes pety Antichristes Bishops of the Diuell and incarnate Diuels that none euer defended this gouernmēt of our Bishops but Papists and such as were infected with Popish errours That the Lawes that mayntaine the Archbishops and Bishops are no more to bee accounted of then the Lawes that mayntaine Steves and that the true church of God ought to haue no more to do with them and their Synagogues then with the Synagogue of Sathan All which Consistorian and modest assertions aswell for the equalitie of Ministers as against the calling of Bishops being ioyned together are wholy opposite to all that which hitherto I haue writt̄e touching this matter Euen as though they should haue cast downe their gauntlets proclaymed an vtter defiance to all the Churches that euer were established in the world for much aboue three thousande yeares the Churches whilest the law continued the churches in Christs time the Churches in his Apostles times the Churches throughout all christendome for a thousand fiue hundred yeares against all the generall Councels all the auncient fathers all ecclesiasticall histories against al the chiefe reformers of religon in this latter age against all the learned mens iudgements before mentioned and against all the reformed churches whersoeuer in christ̄edome that eyther haue BB. or Superint̄edents God forgiue th̄e this great sin of pride presumption deliuer th̄e out of the number of those of wh̄o it is said that their mouthes speake proud things that they dispise gouernment that they
arise a quarrell for the principalitie not onely betwixt the Duke and the Byshop but likewise betwixt the Bishop and the people The contention or dislike betweene the Bishop and the people grewe heereof as I take it for that by the paynes and preaching of Farellus they beganne to dislike of Poperie and inclined to a reformation of Religion as diuerse Citties neere vnto them and with whome they were in some league had done Which inclination of theirs was altogether misliked ye may be sure by their popish Bishop Wherevppon as also in respect of the saide iarres betweene the Duke and their Bishoppe the Citizens receiuing some good incouragement diuerse waies I doubt not nouandae religionis studium ac reipub commutandae oblatam occasionem arripuerunt they tooke vpon them the indeuour of altering religion and omitted not saith Bodine the occasion offered of changing also the estate of their common wealth It resteth nowe to be considered by what meanes in part they brought their saide purposes to passe It appeareth by Caluins wordes to Cardinall Sadolet that if the Byshop woulde haue harkened at the first to Farellus for the abolishing of Poperie they would then haue been very well content to haue admitted still of his Episcopall iurisdiction But as I sayd hee would not And then both Farellus Viretus and all their fauourers did set vpon the Bishop withall maine might They said it was not meete for a Minister to haue so great a liuing They pronounced him clara voce furē esse with a loud voice to be a theefe The Byshop being at this time that I speake of in possession of the soueraigntie and ciuile gouernment of that Citie and hauing then in his hands as maister Caluin confesseth ius gladij alias ciuilis iurisdictionis partes the power of life and death and other partes of ciuile iurisdiction The said Ministers exclaimed against that ciuile authoritie in Bishops they taught it to be vtterly vnlawfull for a Byshop to haue anie such soueraigntie they said hee was an vsurper and what not By which proceedings and doctrine of the ministers no maruell of the Citizens acknowledging no right in the Duke of Sauoy ouer them beganne to think that then the Bishop by the word of God hauing none in like maner the soueraigntie of the citie must needs be in themselues In this contention therefore which Bodinus speaketh of for the principality betwixt the Bishop and the people how matters fell out I know not but such was the present occasion that as it seemeth the Bishop with many of his popish crue gat him thence Quo eiecto Geneuates monarchiam in popularem statum commutarunt who being cast out saith Bodinus the Geneuans did chaung theyr monarchy into a popular state In respect whereof the said Bodinus doth adde the cittie of Geneua vnto those citties of Heluetia which for the auoyding of the tiranny of their gouernours haue entered into a confederacy shaken them of Vpon the eiection of the said Bishop the citizens by such aduise as they liked ordained a newe forme of popular gouernement such a one as they themselues thought meetest for the state of that cittie A councell was chosen to consist of two hundred which councell hath the highest and a standing authority sauing that for the making of lawes for the choosing of their principall magistrates for decreing of peace or warre which were iura magistratis notes and rightes of soueraignty and regality these be reserued to the whole people and multitude of citizens They ordaine also two other councells the one of threescore and the other of fiue and twenty and likewise also fower Syndicks their chiefest magistrats to bee yearely elected with manye such orders as they thought conuenient for the better gouernement of the cittie Whilst they of Geneua were busyed in these affaires which were necessary for their state the Bishop with all his shauelinges and adherentes was not idle I assure my selfe He laboured as it seemeth by Simlerus a reconciliation with the Duke of Sauoy and by what meanes I know not did grow into such a frendship with him as that hee obteyned of him his assistaunce meaning to haue recouered by force and armes his saide right and authoritie They of Geneua vnderstanding of this course did fortifie themselues with the strength of Berne Insomuch as the Duke and the Bishop assaultinge the citty anno 1536. they were both of them discomfited Bernatibus illis auxilium serentibus they of Berne assisting them of Geneua And since that time the citty of Geneua hath bene ruled by such a kinde of gouernement as hath briefly bene touched I would not haue any man to thinke that I take vppon me to censure the doinges of the ciuile state either of Geneua or of any other place Onely I haue bene bolde to set downe the premises as I finde them reported by the authors mentioned because they conteine some such matters as are necessary to be vnderstood in some ouuert sort in respecte of that which followeth concerninge the first institution of the pretended consistoriall discipline Besides propounding to my selfe throughout this whole booke to deale with nothinge whether it bee good or euell further then as it concerneth the affaires of the Church I doubt not but that I may presume without any mans iust offence to speake my opinion as touching the Diuinity which was pretended by the saide Ministers of Geneua against their Bishop For in deede I doe dislike it If such dealinges were simply to be vrged by the worde of God they might reach further then would be conuenient Ineuer thought it agreeable to Diuinity for ministers to caste of their rulers at their owne pleasures M. Caluin writeth wisely to Cardinall Sadolet but the course which there hee sheweth was helde by the Ministers say what men list cannot be iustifyed I know one that hath written thus of that matter eum principatum euangelij lux ciuitati restituit the light of the Gospell did restore to the Citty that principality which the Bishop had But all the learned Diuines in Germany at their conferences with the Emperour about that time were of a contrary opinion as touching the Bishops in those countries who are greate Princes And surely it would seeme strange to me if the Gospell should wrest the sword out of any ciuile Magistrates hande let him be of what profession he list I doe therefore subscribe to Zanchius iudgemente for mine owne part where he sayth We deny not that such Bishops as bee also Princes besides their Ecclesiasticall authority haue also their politicke lawes and secular powers as other Princes haue vz. right in commaundinge in secular matters right of the sworde right of electing and confirminge of some kinges Emperours and right of ordayning and administringe of other politique affaires and that they haue right to compell the people their subiects to performe the duety of their subiection vnto them And
this side of the seas amongst vs. If Maister Caluin but especially maister Beza could haue been content to haue contained themselues within the limites either of Geneua or Fraunce to haue intermedled raigned there only and to haue vrged their platforme and deuise no further they might the better for vs in England haue been borne withall But nowe seeing they haue not so done who can be offended that I should make mention of it to the end that if they dealt amisse therein theyr examples and proceedinges might haue the estimation which indeed they deserue I omit how in K. Edwards time certaine malecontents grew vp in the Church of England because sundry matters might not bee ordered as they were at Geneua maister Caluin hauing written sundry letters into England to some suche like effect In Queene Maries time assoone as certaine of our Countreymen were come to Franckforde they were assaulted with the orders of Geneua Quarrels arising about the communion booke and forme of the seruice of England in Kinge Edwardes time there were particulars collected out of it by Knox Whittingham and such as had already tasted of that intoxication and sent to Geneua to bee censured by M. Caluin Who vpon the receit of them returned his answere concerning the sayde Booke compiled confirmed before by such men and such an authorititie as he ought to haue reuerenced In Anglicana Liturgia qualem describitis multas video fuisse tolerabiles ineptias I see that in the English forme of seruice as you describe it there were many tollerable foolleries When Knox and Whittingham had gotten this letter they published it to the Congregation Which being read it so wrought in the heartes of many sayth the discourser of the troubles at Franckford that they were not before so stoute to maintaine all the partes of the Booke of England as afterwardes they were bent against it If you haue Caluins Booke of Epistles I pray you reade it Although Beza thought it meete to be published in print yet shall you finde it to containe no one point of substance in it able to perswade a childe So as thereby you may iudge of their giddinesse who were moued so greatly with it When some of the sayd parties Whittingham diuerse others of a more violent humor came first to Franckford they fel also presently into a very especiall liking of the Geneua discipline as finding it to containe such rules and practices as did greatly concurre with their owne disposions In England poperie was restored and much crueltie vsed whereby they were constrained for the sauing of their liues to leaue their Countrye their liuings and theyr friendes In which case a man may easily gesse how acceptable these pointes were vnto some kinde of humors vz. that if Bishops and Princes refused to admit of the Gospell they might be vsed by their subiects as the Bishop of Geneua was vsed that is deposed and that euerie particular minister with his assistants according to the platforme of that discipline was himselfe a Bishop and had as great authoritie within his owne parish as any Bishop in the world might lawfully challenge euen to the excommunicating of the best aswell the Prince as the Pesaunt And indeede accordingly these positions as afterward it will appere were so pleasing to Whittingham and his consortes as it had beene a very meane forme of discipline I suppose that hauing such principles annexed vnto it wold at that time haue beene refused by them Howbeit many there were and that of the learnedest of those that then departed the Realme as Doct. Cox Doct. Horne M. Iewell with sundrie others who perceauing the trickes of that discipline did vtterly dislike it So as when they came afterwardes to Franckford they wholy insisted vppon the platforme of England and in short time obtayning of the Magistrates the vse thereof they did chose either D. Cox or D. Horne as I gesse or some such other as had beene of especiall account in K. Edwards time to be as it were their Superintendent For the bringing of which matter to passe one maister Clanbourge a chiefe magistrate in that Citie hauing shewed them some especiall fauour complaint was made thereof as it seemeth to M. Caluin Whereupon the sayde M. Clanbourg did write to him as it should appeare that he was induced to yeald to such a choyse the rather because the sayd Superintendent had some such like superior place in England before he came thither Vnto the which point maister Caluin that he might thrust his oare into euerye mans boat to disgrace the sayd platforme of England as much as lay in him and to incourage the factious company at Franckforde that were besotted with his pretended discipline did returne this answere If Beza hath set out his letter truely I would one point had beene omitted which was suggested vnto you I doubt not by that one partie I thinke he meaneth the sayd superintendent For otherwise it would neuer haue come into your cogitation as though he had still kept his whole estate in England to haue established his former ministerie there with you in a perpetuall possession of the authoritie therof Peraduenture there is nothinge that from the beginninge his meaninge is since the Englishemen came thither hath stired vp more contention or at the leaste displeasure so hath kindled strife then this emulation in that the greater part did thinke themselues to be thrust from their equall degree and to bee contumeliously excluded from the common societie if the Church which had receaued intertainment with you meaning the companie that had receiued his forme of discipline before the saide learned men came to Franckford should receaue their lawes from the other parte or side Within some short time after this that the sayd order of the English Church was established as you haue hard at Franckford diuerse of those men who had beene earnest for the Geneuian discipline deuided themselues from that Church as Whittingham Gilby Goodman and others and went to Geneua Where to the great discredit of the estate of the Church of England in Kinge Edwardes time to the greate griefe of such godly men and afterwardes worthy Martirs as remayned here in Queene Maries time in England and to the greate discouragement of sundry weake professors then also in England they reiected the whole forme of our English reformation the booke of common praier our seruice the order of our sacramentes and of all thinges els in effect there prescribed and conformed themselues altogether to the fashions of the Church at Geneua Where they had not beene longe when they had sucked and disgested the whole doctrine before mentioned to be as the appendants necessarily annexed to that forme of newe discipline and which was afterwardes enlarged by Beza as I take it Hotoman others of the disciplinarian humor in their bookes intituled De iure magistratuum c. Vindicia contra tirannos Franco-gallia c. The generall summe
haue not wanted the common affections of men Much trouble there was before their saide deuise was receaued which made them afterwardes the fonder of it We haue a saying that the Crow thinketh her owne birde the fairest and so doe men and women for the most part their owne children Nature doth therein beare sway with the best But especially she sheweth her force most in the fruicts of a mans mind For as our mindes ought to be more deare vnto vs then our bodies so are the fruites of our minds of greater account with vs then the fruites of our bodies Few men that we heare of will giue their liues for their children but many wee see will do it most readily in the maintenance of their opinions Which thinges considered I cannot but in some sorte excuse maister Caluin and maister Beza in seeking all manner of waies all shewes all shiftes all aduauntages that possibly they could either finde or deuise whereby they might iustifie in some sorte the birth and bringing vp of their misconceaued offpring The chiefest ouersight was in my opinion that other learned and wise men doe not well obserue these manner of naturall and common affections in them but were carried after them as it were with a whirlewind to like as they liked to say as they said and to doe as they did If maister Caluin and maister Beza affirmed it why it was inough I haue heard it credibly reported that in a certaine Colledge in Cambridge when it happeneth that in there disputations the authority either of Saint Augustine or of Saint Ambrose or of Saint Ierome or of any other of the ancient Fathers nay the whole consent of them all alltogether is alledged it is reiected with very great disdaâ—ne as what tell you me of Saint Augustine Saint Ambrose or of the rest I regard them not a rush were they not men Whereas at other time when it happeneth that a man of an other humor doth aunswere if it fall out that he beinge pressed with the authority either of Caluin or Beza shall chance to deny it you shall see some beginne to smile in commiseration of such the poore mans simplicity some grow to be angry in regard of such presumption and some will depart away accounting such a kinde of fellowe not worthy the hearing Were not this a pretty and pleasaunt Interlude or Comedy to behold such Parasites playing their partes so Disciplinarian-like And all these follies and dependances that the people haue doted so much after some kinde of Ministers that the inferior sort of those ministers haue taken all for currant coine that hath beene paide them by their superiors and that they the superiors haue beene also so farre ouercaried with the credite of the saide two persons all these follies I say did proceed from this fountaine that neither the people nor their rash seducers did in time put the holy Apostles rule in practise vz. try all thinges and keepe that which is good But it is better late then neuer Since men of all sorts haue entered more carefully into the triall of all the saide pretences together with the very substaunce of that their pretended holy platforme the furious rage of that floud hath beene pretily well diuerted And the very chiefe Captains themselues being vrged of necessity a litle to fall on searching haue found that which I feare they are sorry for and are become as it seemeth like men greatly amased to be at their wits end And now to this purpose I will tell you a wonder If Cartwright and his adherents were to beginne the course againe that they haue runne I am perswaded they would neuer tread so much as one steppe in it But nowe they haue engaged their credits they must shift thinges of aswell as they can and where their wards serue them not beare-of the blowes that shall fall vppon them with their heads and shoulders In the yeare 1572. as you haue heard in the former Chapter the first admonition was offered to the Parliament as containing a perfect platforme of the worthy pretended Discipline to haue beene established within this Realme Within a yeare or two after Cartwright taking in haÌ„d the defence of that platform did alter it in some points especially where it seemed to ascribe too much vnto the people And then if it bee true which is reported that one desiring vppon a time conference with him about these manner of causes he answered what neede you to talke with me you may haue my Bookes they are Est and Amen I doubt not but he would haue sworne vppon conuenient occasion that the admonitioners platforme so qualified by him was a most perfect patterne for all Churches Howbeit within a while after it proued not so For about the yeare 1583. where before the platfourme of Geneua as it was lefte at large in Cartwrigts Bookes had beene followed now there was a particular draught made for England with a newe forme of common Praier therein prescribed The yeare ensuing 1584. the seuen and twentith of her Maiesty out starteth this Booke with great glory at the Parliament time and forthwith the present gouernment of the Church with all the orders lawes and ceremonies thereof was to be cut-off at one blow and this new booke or platforme must needes be established But it preuailed not Shortly after that Parliament the saide booke and platforme was found amongest themselues to haue some thing amisse in it And the correcting of it was referred to Trauerse Which worke by him performed came out againe about the yeare 1586. when there was an other Parliament in the nine and twentieth of her maiesties raigne But it was then as I suppose seuered from the saide book of Common praier and become an entire worke of it selfe And then also at the saide Parliament there wanted not diuerse solicitors for the admittance of it Afterwardes a new conference was had againe about this seconde corrected booke For still there were some things out of square in it In the yeare 1588. at an assembly in Couentry these doubts which were growen were as it seemeth debated and so were many other Cartwright himselfe being present But which of the saide doubts in their platfourme were then resolued I find it not This appeared that some of them remained which they were not able to resolue vpon For although they then concluded that the platforme it selfe was an essentiall forme of Discipline necessary for all times subscribed vnto the practise of the greatest part of it without any further expecting the magistrats pleasure yet in theyr subscriptions they excepted some fewe points which were reserued to be discussed by certaine brethren in an other assembly Where this assembly was kept I canuot certainely affirme But it appeareth vppon deposition that the next yeare after there was one held in Sainct Iohns Colledge in Cambridge Where Cartwright being againe present and many moe besides diuerse imperfections in the saide
But I will come to their first skippe which is in effect from the yeare aboue mentioned 1541. vnto the Apostles time backward For as I remember I haue read it in one of their bookes that in all the auncient fathers you shall finde a little but as it were of the ruines of it But the ruines of it in all the auncient fathers What lucke had they that the building of so gorgeous a peece of worke stoode not in their daies as now it standeth in Geneua that they might haue seene the bewtie and the glory of it If it were so ruinate before the times wherein the ancient fathers liued then surely it will followe in spite of whosoeuer saith nay that it is of greater antiquitie then all the fathers were of But I maruaile howe it grewe into such ruine before their times For to my vnderstanding the Apostles times were next before the time of the auncient fathers The learned discourser will help vs for this plunge out of the bryers The ecclesiasticall offices saith hee namely of Pastors Doctors Gouernours and Deacons were exercised in the primatiue and pure Church vntill the mysterie of iniquities working a way for Antichristes pride and presumption changed Gods ordinance c. And when was that The mistery of iniquitie began to worke in the Apostles dayes Was it then Peraduenture hee meaneth that immediatly after the Apostles times there was some age wherin there liued no ancient fathers and that then this mischiefe was wrought I would it had pleased him to haue deuised such a prouiso in the behalfe of those most notable men manie of them very godly and holy Martirs But the discourser was as it seemeth a plain man he will lay the fault where it was as indeed it is reason that euery man should beare his owne burden Heare him therefore againe Our fathers of olde time were not content with the simple order instituted by Christ and established by his Apostles but for better gouerning of the Church thought good some offices to adde thereunto some to take away some to alter and change and in effect to peruert and ouerthrow all christian and Ecclesiasticall pollicy which was builded vppon the foundation of the Prophetes and Apostles Iesus Christ being the chiefe corner stone A strange conceite that all the auncient fathers should thus conspire to thrust Christ out of his kingdome and to ouerthrowe all Christian pollicy What not a man amongest them as learned and as godly affected as either Caluin Beza or this discourser Not one in those ages that would stand to Christes Discipline A pittifull case But I promise you for my parte I rather doubt of the discoursers credite in this point then that I will thinke there should be such dishonesty in the auncient Fathers Nay I durst certainly sweare it that if there had beene any such gouernment of Christ in their daies they would haue beene as carefull for the continuance of it as any of the purest platformers in Christendome Trauers in his Booke of Ecclesiasticall Discipline maketh eight degres of the declination of this new pretended regiment to haue growne before the Councell of Nice procured as he saith cunningly by Sathan but yet so that as he addeth there are euidences to be shewed of sondry partes of it in the writinges of the auncient Fathers c and that also in this age it is exercised in Fraunce the low Countries and in Scotland All out of square from the Apostles times till Geneua was illuminated Some blinde euidences there may be found he saith for sundry parts of that Discipline whereby a man may conceaue that there was once such a thing in being Wel yet if that were true the auncient Fathers deserue some little commendation in that they were content to leaue some scroules or shiuers of it vnto their posterity To the same purpose also in another place the same party confesseth that the ordinary offices as he tearmeth them in the Apostles times haue beene nowe of many yeares out of vse either in part or altogether afore the last restoring of the Gospell in this age A great leap as I think from the Apostles time to this ourage If I had framed the scope of my second Chapter after this mans pleasure I might as you see haue safely set it downe with Trauerse consent that from the Apostles times till maister Caluin was fully placed in Geneua the now pretended order forme of Ecclesiasticall Discipline was not to haue beene found in all the world Maister Cartwright though he say in his first Booke that the Eldership did most florish in Constantines time and defendeth the same in the secōd part of his 2. reply sauing that he leaueth out the word most with such shifting and falshood as I durst make any learned mā iudge of his dealing therein yet I say in his Table to the first part of his second reply and also in the second part therof he acknowledgeth in effect to my vnderstanding that of the Elderships declining there are to be found in the Fathers but certaine traces and marks whereby we might come to the knowledge of it and vnderstand that certaine Churches as at Alexandria went out of the way As if he should haue sayd looke how a man seeketh for a Hare in the snow and seldome findeth her till he come to her forme so you must seeke for the Eldership as now it is vrged in the auncient Fathers still pricking after it till hauing runne past all them you come to the forme of it in the Apostles times Or as if he had said the best vse that a man can haue eyther of the auncient fathers or of the Ecclesiasticall writers is this concerning the Geneuian Discipline that a man by them may learne when men goe out of their right way but how to get in againe when we are once out if you wil haue any direction for that point you must either goe to Geneua or to him or to some of his fellows There goeth the Hare away for the Fathers cannot helpe you But belieue me such is my dulnes as I doe not wel discerne how these words of Cartwrights will stand well together with those of the Elderships flourishing in Constantines time seeing now in the auncient Fathers we haue so little of it vz. onely as it were some few markes traces or footesteps of a thing which had beene and was gone before their times For as concerning the state of the Church in Constantines time there are whole Cart-loads of most pregnant euidences in the auncient Fathers of it yet but traces as he saith or empty steps in them for his Eldership In effect as if he had saide the Geneua Discipline flourished most when it was not One that hath sent vs a printed Book out of Scotland taking vppon him to know belike the mindes of all the Scottishe Ministers that seeke for the pretended Discipline as concerning the time how
Geneua at the least that of all likelyhood as diuers housholdes by his owne rule do concurre together to make one conuenient parish So diuerse parishes in one citie suburbes and territorie thereof may be vnited and rightlye beare the name of the church Except wee shall thinke that Christ referring as they suppose his Apostles to the imitation of the Iewes church gouernment they were so negligent workemen as there being at that time 400. Synagogues in that one citie they had erected in all their times but one congregation christian church or parish answerable to one Synagoge it being lawfull for them by the square of that platforme to haue erected if they had could 400. But let this passe as a thing impertinent and to returne to the maimed pining Parishes at Geneua You will say did not Cartwright know the ecclesiasticall gouernment of that citie when he writ his bookes or shall we once conceaue that he thought to condemne that regiment which in other places hee doth so greatly extoll certainly for mine owne part although I do not greatly respect what he will saie that hee either knoweth or thinketh yet I suppose he will neuer for shame denie it but that he misliketh that forme of church regiment For first besides the premises being vrged with Caluins authoritie who thought the church of Geneua with all her sayde Parishes to make but one body of a church his answere to that point in effect is this Admit Caluin so thought I am of opinion that if Caluin had not soe thought hee would neuer haue erected vp such an Eldership And if Beza did not thinke so still I iudge hee would alter it Secondly also vppon another occasion he resembleth the order of certaine reformed churches which in this sence must be necessarily either of Scotland Flaunders or Geneua vnto the custome in S. Ieromes time when Bishops besides their one onely church had certaine other congregations belonging to their ouersight c. and in mislike thereof sayth for parte of his answere to this pointe being pressed by his aduersary against him I appeale to the institution of God and vse of the purer times after the Apostles But amongst other qualifications which he maketh least we should thinke that where such reformations are made as haue diuers parishes belonging to one Eldership there the old Diocesse and Bishops are in effect not abrogated but a little altered he sayth that one in such Eldership is aboue the rest but for a time as Caluin was chosen thereunto euery two yeares and not during his ministerie Which authority ouer many parishes but for a time although he will not plainly condemne it in the reformed churches which hee fauoreth yet speaking against the order of the church of England both he his companions doe make it a steppe whereby Sathan did aduaunce the kingdome of Antichrist Lastly as hitherto you haue found M. Cartwright with his friendes opposite in this matter vnto Geneua and Scotland differing also much from the churches in the Low countries so he seemeth to mee to crosse himselfe For in his second booke hee sayth that particular churches are nowe in steed of Synagogues and that their Synagogues were the same that our particular churches are And in his third booke he writeth thus For my part I confesse that there commeth not to my minde whereby I could precislie conclude out of the olde testament that there was an eldershippe amongst the Iewes in euery of their Synagogues If that can not then be shewed out of Moses who was so faythfull in setting downe all that was committed to his charge and that Christ commaunded no new thing but such as Moses instituted how hath hee vrged so mightely that we must haue his Elderships in euery Parish We shall see peraduenture that in shorte time M. Cartwright will giue ouer this holde and betake himselfe to the citie consistories framing new Diocesses to bee subiect vnto them as in other countries you haue heard they are Well I would wishe that before their Elderships were graunted vnto them they should agree together where they ought to place them But nowe to the seuerall partes of euery Eldership CHAP. 8. Of Bishops generally of the pretended equalitie of Pastors or new parish Bishops and how the chiefe impugners of Bishops beginne to relent IN the olde testament the high Priest besides that he was a figure of Christ had also vnder Moses Iosua the Iudges and Kinges for the better ordering and gouernment of the church authoritie and iurisdiction ecclesiasticall within that countrie of Canaan vnder whom for the same purpose were other Priests at least 24. that were called Principes Sacerdotum Princes of the Priestes all of them inferior to the high Priest but superior to the rest In the new testament our Sauiour Christ whilst hee liued on the earth had his Apostles and in degree vnder them his 70. Disciples After his ascentiō the same inequality of the ministery of the word continued in the Church by all mens confession as long at the least as the Apostles liued In the Apostles times Saint Marke was Bishop of Alexandria Saint Iames was Bishop of Ierusalem Timothy was Bishop of Ephesus and Titus was Bishop of Crete if the ancient fathers and Ecclesiastical histories be of any credite The Apostles hauing receaued the promise of the holy Ghost after a short time dispersed themselues by aduise into diuerse regions And there by painefull preaching and labouring in the Lords haruest they planted no doubt very many Churches As the number of Christians grew and had their particular assemblies and meetings in many Cities and countries within euery one of their circuites they placed pastors in euery congregation they ordained certaine Apostolicall men to bee chiefe assisters vnto them whom they placed some one in this particular countrey another in that and some others in sondry Cities to haue the rule and ouersight vnder them of the Churches there and to redresse and supply such wantes as were needefull And they themselues after a while and as they grewe in age and escaped the crueltie of tyrantes remained for the most part in some head Citty within their compasse to ouersee them all both Churches Pastors and Bishops or Superintendents and to giue their directions as occasions required and as they thought it conuenient When any either of these Apostolicall assistantes or of the Apostles themselues dyed there were euer some worthy men chosen and appointed to succeede them in those Cities and Countries where they had remained For wee may not idlely dreame that when they dyed the authoritie which was giuen vnto them ceased no more then we may that the authoritie of Aaron of his naturall sons expired and ended with them Besides it is manifest by all Ecclesiasticall hystories that many Churches were planted after theyr deathes And furthermore it coulde not be but that some Churches especially vnder those Apostles that were soonest put to
of Bishops and so we may call them From whom Trauerse if he be the author of the defence of ecclesiasticall gouernment of the booke of ecclesiasticall discipline first dissenteth then secondly also frō himselfe For in his said defence hee is most peremptorie and bringeth diuerse reasons for it vz. That ruling Elders are not comprehended vnder the name of Bishop yet in his other booke he saith generally of all their Elders both Ministers and Rulers They are said 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to gouern rule ouersee Now if their dutie set downe in the scriptures be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 their office is surely 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 must needes comprehend them aswell as the Ministers of the word But that I may omit their thwarting thus the streame runneth from Cartwright and Iunius fountaines The titles of Christs vicars and of good prelates do both agree saith Cartwright vnto the Elders which onely gouerne And Iunius thus in effect The scriptures do call both Ministers Elders indifferently sometimes Prophets as The spirites of the Prophets are subiect to the Prophets sometimes Episcopos id est inspectore◠Bishops that is ouer-seers as Take heed to your selues and to all the flocke whereof the holy Ghost hath made you ouer-feers to feed the Church of God c. sometimes rulers or laborers rulers as We beseech you brethren that you know them which labour among you and are ouer you in the Lord sometimes ductores seu duces leaders or captaines as Obey them that haue the ouer-sight of you and submit your selues for they watch for your soules as they that must giue account c. sometimes pastors as He therefore gaue some to be Apostles some Prophets and some Euangelists some Pastors and teachers sometime Elders as When they had ordained them Elders in euery Cittie c. sometimes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Ministers as Where Paul saith thus of himselfe that I should bee a Minister of Iesus Christ toward the Gentiles ministring the Gospel of God c sometime 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Ministers as I am Paule whom thou persecutest but arise and stand vpon thy feete for I haue appeared vnto thee for this purpose to appoint thee a Minister and a witnesse both of the things which thou hast seene and of the things in the which I wil appeare vnto thee sometime deacons that is Ministers as Who is Paule Who is Apollo But the Ministers by whome yee beleeued c. And againe the same Iunius in the booke before noted of both their kinds of Elders Sunt salterrae sunt lux mundi in sua ecclesia singuli They are the salte of the earth they are the light of the worlde euery one of them in their seuerall Churches If Augustine Ambrose Ierome Chrisostome and all the rest of the ancient Fathers were now aliue and should vnderstand to what purpose these scriptures were thus alledged would they not wonder that euer any men should lyue that durst with such boldnes and so little shew of truth so abuse the word of God themselues their readers and all the world Nay I am perswaded that if M. Caluin himself that first deuised these officers were now aliue he wold be greatly ashamed of this corruption so notorious an abuse But God hath dealt with them already according to his wonted custome in such a case For they are wonderfully diuided and doe confound themselues in their expositions of the seuerall places as when I come vnto that point it shall in some sort appeare But of all these confused number of names for their Elders if I were asked vpon which I gessed they would in time most properly insist I feare it wil proue to be that of Arch-synagogians or of Arch-rulers of their saide gouernment deduced as they confesse from the synagoge For saith the Counter-poison God hath ordained for the rulers of the synagogue Churchrulers or Elders Likewise Cartwright The chiefe of the synagogue are the same which wee call Elders ancients of the church And Beza also Archisynagogi dicuntur qui particularium ecclesiarum negotia administrabant propterea censētur ecclesiae nomine Mat. 18.17 They are called Arch-rulers of the synagogue who did manage the affaires of particular churches are therefore in Math. 18. tearmed by the name of the church But the said Cartwright passeth Their Synagogues saith he being the same that our churches in euery one of them beeing not one but many princes the vrging of that example bringeth diuers chiefe gouernors or Archbishops intocuerie particular church His meaning is as I take it that if they be vrged too farre so constrained to speake their consciences which peraduenture as yet they would bee loth to do they must thē of necessitie deale plainly with vs tell vs roundly that all the Elders which they looke for esteeme them as wee list that haue no such diuine insight into them they are indeed and must be our chiefe gouernors our Archbishops and our Princes Surely such artizans meane persons as should occupie these roomes in most parishes if they had their platforme might well haue been contented with his former titles giuen vnto them of Christs vicars Gods prelats though they had wanted these But it would be remembred that if such as are vnder the Ministers bee of this great honor what are we to think of the Ministers themselues that are so far aboue them I had forgotten to tell you how Cartwright affirmeth though falsly that the word priesthood is sometime taken in the ecclesiasticall writers for this kinde of Elders Whereby I coniecture that their graund pastors especially in such cities as haue many parishes vnder one consistorie must be if not summi sacerdotes the high priests yet at the least principes sacerdotum the princes of Elders or rather reges regum kings of kings But by what titles they will maintaine their owne greate preheminence aboue their Elders I do not greatly regard it This is strange that after so many disputations and libels against the names of our Archbishops to prooue them Antichristian or vnlawfull wee hauing but two of them in all England they would now if they might be suffred impose vpon vs seuen or eight Archbishops in euery parish What a wringing wresting is there of this word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by Beza Cartwright and others as being for the imperiousnes of it vnmeet to agree with the Ministers of the Gospell And yet now their new deuised Elders worthy men for the most part I warrāt you may euery one of them lawfully be called an Archbishop I would gladly know for my learning why 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ioined to this worde Bishop should be rather an vnlawfull name for some Minister than whē it is ioined to all their own Synagogians
congregatū intelligebat he vnderstood in the person of his Disciples a lawfull Senate or company assembled together in the name of the church And in his confessions hee also affirmeth that the keyes of the kingdome of heauen were giuen omnibus verè presbyteris to all true Elders including his only ruling Elders in persona Apostolorum in the person of the Apostles Which opinion of his first ouerthroweth his collection that there must needes be vnpriestly Elders for the sayd representation by him deuised For here wee see the Church represented sufficiently in his iudgement Math. 16.19 and 18. v. by Christs disciples and Apostles they being all of them ministers of the word and sacraments to whom Christ there spake Secondly if the Apostles in receauing the keyes sustayned the person of all true priests and if Peter when Christ saide vnto him vnto thee I will giue the keyes sustained the person of the Apostles It followeth that one man maye sustaine the person of all Bezaes true Elders or Eldership and so consequently it is not against the word of God if wee saye Tell the Churche that is tell the Bishops vz. one man But to leaue Beza to his owne pleasure both to saye and do what he list especially in his owne Consistory And yet truelie it were good reason if their Elders bee Christs vicars Gods prelates Bishops Archbishops they should be accounted ecclesiasticall persons and I am perswaded that the one is as true as the other CHAP. 14. Theyr disagreement concerning the continuance of theyr Elders in their office AT Geneua their Elders are simplye chosen but for a yeare In the French church in London they are elected as I heare for three yeares It was thus ordered in the Nationall Councell of the Belgicke churches at Hage 1586. Seniores et Diaconi duos annos inseruiant quotannis numerus dimidiatus commutabitur c. Let the Elders and Deacons serue two yeares and the halfe of them shall be chaunged euery yeare c. Scotland followeth the Geneua order if their booke bee true of the forme of their praiers printed 1584. and doth retayne them but for a yeare And then euerie man as hee was before A prelate Christes vicar a Bishop an Archbishop an ecclesiasticall man this yeare a plaine Dauber a Thatcher a Taylor a Cobler and a Tinker the next yeare and so by turnes backwarde and forward if any of the same persons shall be diuers times chosen as often as it falleth out amongst them What election and ordination by triall praiers fastings imposition of handes and all but for a yeare It maketh mee to remember a saying of Tertullian in the like case Ordinationes eorum temerariae leues inconstantes c. Theyr ordinations are rash light and inconstant c. Alius hodiè Episcopus alius cras c. Hodiè Diaconus qui eras lector hodiè presbyter qui cras laicus This day one is a Bishop and to morrow another c. To daye a Deacon and to morrow a Reader he that is a priest or an Elder to daye is the next day after become a Lay-man c Nowe if they will say that they haue some rules out of the scriptures for this their mutabilitie as I trust they will be ashamed to saie otherwise that as Cartwright sayth These Elders did not florish in Constantines time shall wee thinke that the Bishops in the Councell of Nice when they went about the matter that Paphnutius withstoode did euer intende that such an Elder or ecclesiasticall person becomming a layman againe after a yeare or two should vppon his choyse to that office frō thence foorth not companie with his wife which he had married before It maie peraduenture bee answered that Christes order for this annuall or bienniall change was through corruption altered before that Councell and growen to bee a continuall office Indeed they may bee bolde with those times to speake of them as they list But what will you thinke if nowe the matter beginne to be called in question whether Geneua first and then after whether other their reformed churches of the Lowe Countries and of Scotlande haue done well in making these Elders but temporall officers rather then Ministers of the worde Certainelye a Learned man of that humor tolde mee playnlie that both Geneua and the rest were thought by diuerse graue men to haue done amisse therein And peraduenture by degrees you shall see some alteration about that matter For the Bretheren of Englande in their subscribed Discipline do beginne to make some qualification that way as it seemeth vnto mee when they saye Presbyteri non sunt perpetui neque tamen facilè moueantur Let not the Elders bee perpetuall nor yet easilye remoued They must not bee perpetuall but yet no time is prescribed So as they may continew Elders by this rule through the strength of one ordination twentie yeares if the rest of their companie bee so pleased And Carolus Gallus in his booke of Discipline is already come to the poynt affirming directlie Presbytero Ecclesiae post biennium aut triennium stationem suam deserere non licere That it is not lawfull for an Elder of the Church after two or three yeares to giue ouer his charge but must contynue the same vsque admortem vntill his death Which assertion hee taketh vppon him to prooue after the manner of these men by many arguments such as they are both out of the olde and newe Testament with whome agreeth Bannosius alledging this old Cannon which prouideth Ne bis presbyter ordinetur et ne quispiam bis baptizetur That a Priest or Elder bee not twise ordayned nor any twise baptised For sayth hee Ordinatio est perpetuae functionis consecratio quemadmodum baptismus perpetui foederis cum Deo initi est testificatio Ordination is the consecration of a perpetuall function as baptisme is a contynuall testimony or witnesse of our League made with God This surelye draweth deeplie How it will be taken at his handes I knowe not I am perswaded that whilest Beza liueth it will neuer be admitted at Geneua For so if their twelue Elders did see their authoritie to bee of such continuance they might paraduenture hold the six ministers noses to the grindstone Whereas nowe they knowing their kingdome to bee of such small continuance euen as they please the ministers doe suffer them to raigne and doe what they list fearing what afterclapps might light vpon them the yeare after if they should doe otherwise Besides if they should be offices of such endurance those princes noblemen and gentlemen that would be content paraduenture for a yeare to become ecclesiasticall persons amongst them and execute their office forsooth in their owne persons would be twise aduised how they left their other affaires to attend vppon that worshipfull seruice So as what will be the issue amongst them herein god knoweth For my part I doe not and therefore I will leaue them
exhorting ruling prouision for the poore and attendance vnto them all which no man in his wits wil deny to be perpetuall and in these expressely they which haue the giftes are commaunded to abide and to content themselues with them Wherefore c. These men you see must either haue their Widdowes or else all is marred And haue them they will if distinguishing similitudes diuiding sillogismes and logicke will get them And besides you may perceiue what most vehement patheticall and peremptory men they are in this behalfe Howbeit you shall finde that other men nay whole Churches for all this heat are of another opinion and withall such men and Churches as neither the defender discourser nor sermoner nor all the priuate disciplinarye conuenticles in England will presume in any sort to compare themselues vnto them Maister Beza doth not thinke the hauing of Widdowes to be such an ordinary and perpetuall institution as it hath beene pretended For at Geneua not such a Widdow if you would giue a pounde for her And yet that platforme is either perfect by this time or else there hanges some curse ouer it But this I am sure of that he who durst take vppon him to tell them in Geneua that by their omission of these Widdowes they haue cruelly wounded the body of Christ they had like desperate ruffians cut of one of his members and that in these respectes the forme of their Disciplinary regiment is maimed and deformed might peraduenture repente him of it Indeede either I am very much deceiued or els this dreame of widdowes beginneth to vanish The very principall nay the onely place vz. Hee that sheweth mercy with cheerefullnesse wherevpon they haue hitherto builte to proue them to be such Church-officers as they haue imagined them to be is boldly and with mayne strength wrested out of their handes notwithstandinge that Maister Caluin M. Beza and M. Cartwright had layde as fast hold vpon it as they could Or peraduenture I might rather say that the two which bee aliue seeing their tenure was nought haue willingly giuen it ouer The Champion I meane that hath done this great deede is Maister Trauers Who writeth of this pointe after this sorte That which followeth of him that sheweth mercy nullum certe munus ecclesiae indicare puto c. I thinke it meaneth not any certaine office but what duety the whole Church ought to shew in relieuing the poore Thus farre and further Maister Trauers in his Latine booke as if you will peruse the place you shall perceiue But you must remember that I doe referre you to his Latine booke and not to the Englishe translation of it Why some may say is it not faithfully translated Shall we thinke that such zealous men as had to deale therein would serue vs as the Iesuites doe It is wee know a practise with that false hypocriticall broode to leaue out and thrust in what they list into the writinges of the ancient Fathers that thereby in time nothing might appeare which shoulde any way make against them But wee will neuer suspect nor belieue that any man who feareth God and least of all that any of that sorte which are so earnest against all abuses and corruptions shoulde play vs such a prancke Surely yee doe well to iudge the best and I my selfe was of your opinion But nowe I am cleane altered How were some of Vrsinus workes vsed at Cambridge And it is true that some other Bookes haue beene handled very strangely else-where But concerning the present point this is the trueth The translator of Trauerses Booke hath quite omitted the wordes which I haue alleadged and all the rest that tendeth to that purpose euen seuenteene lines together So as if you see but the Englishe Booke you shall not finde so much as one steppe whereby you might suspect that euer Maister Trauerse hadde carried so harde a hande ouer the pretended Widdowes If the translator had receaued any Commission from the author to haue dealt in that sorte with his Booke yet it shoulde haue beene signified eyther in some Preface or in some note or by some means or other but to leaue such a matter out and to giue no generall warning of it I tell you plainely it was greate dishonesty and lewdenesse It were better for them to giue ouer their platformes in the plaine field then to seeke to maintaine them with such apparaunt falshoods Well let them take their course and yet all theyr sleightes will not preuaile But the Translator or Councellor or peruser one or moe or how many soeuer they were but all of them sottes if they thought by such their corruption to bolster vp the credite of theyr Widdowe Church-gouernours For it is euident in my iudgement that eyther most of their owne men doe beginne to come to Maister Trauerses opinion before mentioned or else that generally it is helde by them that the first ordaining of Widdowes was but for a time neuer meant to be an ordinary and perpetuall institution to continue for euer In Geneua as I saide there are no such Widdowes Scotlande in their approued Booke after the Geneua fashion doth not once thinke of them The Synodicall constitutions for the Presbyteriall platforme of all the French Churches doe make no mention of them The generall Councell of Hage and so all the Low Countries haue wholly forgotten them in their decrees and Canons In the platforme and newe Communion Booke which was offered once or twise to the high Courte of Parliament in Englande concerning these Widdowes there is nothing but silence Whereas also there hath beene great paines taken of later yeares amongest the Disciplinary brotherhoode and many meetinges and Synodes helde about another more particular draught of Discipline for this Realme till at the last they haue subscribed vnto it to bee a necessary platforme for all places and times yet you shall not finde that they haue spoken so much as one word of those Widdowes Whereuppon I conclude that their cause is desperate and so I leaue both them and their patrons with all their contrarieties vncertainties and wranglings about them and will come to the consideration of another materiall point vz. what charge this Consistoriall deuise doth bring with it to euerie parish CHAP. 20. Of the charge to bee imposed vpon euery parish by meanes of the pretended Eldership BY the common account of our disciplinarie deuises there are diuers ecclesiasticall persons to be maintained in euerie Parish Nowe there is but one in most places the Parson or the Vicar and God knoweth in manie parishes their intertainment is full bare But admit of the Consistoriall Senate in euery parish and then consider howe they shall bee charged First the current assertion is That in euerye Congregation there must bee a Pastor but the learned Discourser sayth there should bee two at the least Then they must haue a Doctor And for Elders they maie bee moe or fewer as the circuite of the Parish is
well or euill wherefore they esteeme all those to bee enemies that in reason demaunde restitution of them and declare that it belongeth not vnto them but that they haue stollen it awaye from the Church Likewise afterwardes I doubt not but if they were called to account for the bestowing of such goods and if it were taken out of their handes as it was taken from Priestes and Monkes and giuen to such as should better bestowe it they would take pepper in the nose fall to playing the Diuels part Lastlye I put the case sayth he that a whorehunter or baude steale an honest mans wife and the husbande commeth and demandeth this wise of this russiaÌ„ that hath stollen her away and reuileth this Russian or Baude for the wronge that he hath done him and goeth to lawe with him whereby there ariseth great strife I would aske of thee who were in the fault Eyther the husband who hath had this wronge or the Rauisher who hath played him this wicked pranke And the answere is thus framed The whorehunter or baude hath as much reason to complaine and bee angrie as hath a theife or robber which is called to account of thefts and robberies which hee hath committed and which is called to iudgement for the same But I will come from Geneua into England that you maie perceiue what our chiefe disciplinarie Reformers do thinke of this matter It is no better then sacrilege and spoiling of God saie the Authours of the second Admonition 157 7 2 to keepe backe any way the prouision which hath beene made for the ministery And the curse of God threatened by Malachie to those that spoyled the Leuites then belongeth will light vppon our spoylers now and vppon them in whose bandes it is to redresse it if they do it not The Author of the booke de disciplina ecclesiastica speaking of Bishops liuings c. saith thus of many in these daies who vnder a pretence of zeale do cry out for reformation Haec oratiâ— gratissima est nonnullis qui suam causam agi putant et iampridem haereditatem istam spe deuorarunt These wordes c. are most acceptable to some who thinke they tende to theyr profitte and haue alreadye in hope deuoured this inheritaunce For they thinking that wee seeke onlie that Bishops might be spoyled doe expect thereby the like praye that they got by the ruines of Monasteries For as for religion they care not what become of it modò ipsi praedari possint so they may waxe welthyer by sacrilege robbery and would not sticke if it were possible to crucifie Christ againe vt tunicam eius sortirentur et vestimenta diuiderent c. But this our age hath many such Souldiers many such Dionysians who thinke that a golden gowne is not fit for God neyther in summer nor winter and yet that it will serue them well at all times and seasons Againe They had rather all religion were banished that al opinion of worshiping fearing God were abolished that all fayth in Christ hope and looking for euerlasting life were forgotten amongst men then to maintaine it with anye pennye of theirs Yea further they will not only giue nothing to the maintenance of the ministery but most vniustly scrape vnto theÌ„selues that which was liberally giuen by others spoyle the Church robbing her of her goods c. But they must eyther restore it againe that the church may be prouided-for of worthy teachers or else make themselues guiltye of the losse and destruction of so many soules as by theyr meanes are destitute of a preacher and shall perish in their ignorance And againe Let good princes not only not spoyle the ministerie themselues or suffer it to be robbed of others but liberally according to the commaundement of our Sauiour Christ see it maintayned and prouided for through their Kingdomes nor suffer that which was once giuen to this end to be prodigally spent wasted in aulicos luxus atque delicias nor bestowed vppon Noblemens seruaunts nor other innumerable sortes of so vngâ—dly and intollerable abuses by sacrilege the church robbery c. M. Cartwright also in his last booke very well allowing of the former mans iudgement and vtterly misliking of such greedy cormorants for so he termeth them as gape after the pray at large before mentioned writeth in this sort Our meaning is not that these goodes should be turned from the possession of the Church to the filling of the bottomlesse sackes of their greedy appetites which yawne after this pray and wold therby to their perpetuall shame purchase theÌ„selues a field of blood There was a booke published in the parliament time 1585. intituled A lamentable complaint of the Cominaltie Wherein the authors haue at large handled this matter Know ye not say they That the vniust shall not inherit the kingdome of God What greater iniustice then to defraude God of his glory the ministers of theyr right c. How can wee saie that wee loue Christ No not so much as Antichrist loueth the Diuell For Antichrist is bountifull to maintaine his seruice if the like liberality were vsed amongst vs without all doubt a great number would be stayed from passing the Seas to Roome or Rhemes to become Iesuits We read Leuit. 27. That nothing seperate from common vse may be sould c. because it was holy vnto the Lorde The which Law is not ceremoniall but iudicial the equitie therof endureth to the Church for euer the violation of the same lawe hath beene horriblye punished in former dayes as appeareth by the examples of Achan Nabuchadnezar Balthazar Ananias and Saphira c. And the like iustice no man can escape either in this world or in the world to come that committeth the like offence Vppon that place of Mal. where it is sayd That the spoyling of the Priestes was the spoyling of god Thus also they write Hath not the whole nation of England spoyled the Lord in like manner and rather more Surely this is written for our learning that we might know that things consecrated to God for the seruice of his church belong vnto him for euer A number moe of such speaches I could alledge out of their writings But these may serue to let you know that whatsoeuer in times past any of their sort did seeme to yealde vnto for a time touching the alienation of Church-liuings yet this was alwaies their purpose to get them againe into their owne handes in the end It had beene a happie matter for the Church if this lesson had been euer obserued Thou shalt not do euill that good may come of it Things had not theÌ„ growen to such extremities as they are brought vnto in many places When the Sea maketh a breach it is hardly stopped and a dore once opened to such impietie will be hardly shut againe And yet you see they do what they can to shut it
their followers and that all men both Princes and others would be content to submitte their neckes vnder that yoke Which were to make Princes saith Erastus trulie quasi carniâ—ices as it were the executioners onely of their pleasures quemadmâ—dunâ— in Papatu factum videmus as we see it practised in the Papacy and in truth is nothing els but that I may vse their phrases to banish one Pope and admitte of thousands or to deliuer their Scepters from the tyrannie of the old Pope and to subiect them to the tyranny of these new Popes euen to excommunication as Cartwright with his English crue doe affirme and so consequently to depriuation or death as Buchanan the Scottishe Consistorian teacheth My purpose is only in this place to make it knowne from whence our brotherhood haue furnished themselues with their inuectiues against the authoritye of Princes in causes ecclesiasticall and that whatsoeuer they pretend in words yet they are of the same minde that Viretus is if they durst so plainly vtter it Or if they be not let them confes in print that the premisses cited out of his sayde dialogue are false and then for that pointe let them be credited But that I am perswaded they will neuer doe I am sure if they should that besides their opposition with Geneua they should also recant their owne assertions which directly exclude the ciuile magistrates from dealing in ecclesiasticall causes As for example The whole gouernment of the Church is to be committed to Ministers Elders Deacons The church is now to the worldes end to haue no other offices in it but of pastors Doctors Elders and Deacons They which are no Elders of the Church haue nothing to doe in the gouernment of the same They deuide the Church wherein anye Magistrate King or Emperor is a member into those which are to gouerne vz. Pastors Doctors and Elders and into such as are to obey vz. magistrates of all sortes the people Indeed Beza will haue the ciuile magistrate one of the Church-officers But Cartwright will not consent for his part to yeald them so much For saith he as Pastors cannot bee officers of the common wealth no more can the magistrate bee called properlye a church-officer And in truth what Beza graunteth it is in effect nothing sauing for a shew and to serue their own turnes forsooth vt tranquillitatem ecclesiae procurent â—t tueantur Their office is to procure and defend the peace of the Church whereas else where hee agreeth with Viretus yee may bee sure and in his Booke against Erastus peremptorily affirmeth That Princes haue no more to doe with matters of the Church then Ministers haue with the affayres of the common wealth Which by their doctrine generallie is none at all But saide I hee agreeth with Viretus I might saie rather with Cardinall Allen and Saunders if he bee the author of the Booke intituled Vindicie contra Tyrannos as it was reported For there hee saith that if anie Prince shall challenge to himselfe both Tributes that is authoritie aswell in Ecclesiasticall causes as ciuile as by the circumstances of the place it is euident hee doth as if hee would like the old Giaunts scale heauen and surprise it and is guiltie of treason and doth thereby forfeite his fee that hee holdeth no lesse than a subiect or vassall shall that vsurpeth the kinges royaltyes and in this respect such kinges are very often depriued thereof much more iustlye then a vassall or subiecte maye bee insomuch as there is some proportion of comparison betwixte a vassall or subiect and his Lorde but betwixt God and the king betwixt a wretched man and the Almightie there can bee no proportion at all Furthermore Cartwright and some others with him do affirme that Kings and princes do holde their kingdomes and dominions vnder Christ as hee is the sonne of God onlye before all worldes coequall with the father and not as hee is mediator the heade and gouernor of the Church Whereuppon they doe first builde that all Kinges aswell heathen as Christian receiuing but one commission and equall authoritie immediately from God haue no more to doe with the Church the one sorte then the other as being in no respect deputed for Church officers vnder Christ otherwise then if they bee good Kinges to maintaine and defende it And secondlye that as God hath appoynted all Kinges and Ciuile Magistrates his immediate Lieutenants for the gouernment of the worlde in temporall causes so Christ as hee is mediator and gouernour of his Church hath his immediate officers to rule in the Church vnder him and those they saie are no other then Pastors Doctors and Elders to whom they ascribe as large authoritie in causes Ecclesiasticall And all this as I take it they haue learned of the Papists For whereas maister Harding saith that the office of a King in it selfe is all one euerie where not onely amongst the Christian Princes but also amonge the Heathen and thereuppon concludeth that a christian Prince hath no more to doe in the deciding of church-matters or in making ceremonies and orders for the Church then a Heathen Cartwright alloweth of his iudgement and doth expresly affirme that hee himselfe is of the same opinion professing his mislike of those who teach another right of a Christian and of a prophane magistrate Whereat Trauerse his scholler aymeth in like sorte when hee saith in effect that heathen princes being conuerted to the fayth receiue no further increase of theyr power whereby they maye deale in causes ecclesiasticall then they had before And lastly it is no lesse agreeable vnto their seconde assertion that whereas the Papists saye the Pope with his Cardinalls and Bishops are a true representation of the Catholicke Church of Christ vnder whom the Pope being Peters supposed Successor is the ministeriall and immediate chiefe gouernour of it here vppon earth now Cartwright and others doe affirme that euerye particular parish hauing such an Eldershippe in it as they desire is a liuelye patterne and representation of the whole and catholicke Church of Christe vnder whom saye they their Pastors Doctors and Elders are the ministeriall and immediate gouernours by right of euery such Catholicke parish-Church vppon earth And thus if I bee not deceiued that playnelye appeareth which was in the beginning of this Chapter propounded vz. that for all their protestations they derogate from Christian Princes and arrogate to their Elderships the supreame and immediate authority vnder Christ in causes ecclesiasticall CHAP. XXIII In the oppugning of Princes authoritye in causes Ecclesiasticall they ioyne with the Papists THere is nothing will lightlye anger our pretended Brotherhood more then if ti be tolde them that they denie in effect with the common aduersaries her Maisties lawefull stile and prerogatiue Royall in causes ecclesiasticall Oâ— saye they wee doe not wee are slaundered wee yealde vnto her Highnes
orders to this poynte in the newly subscribed booke of discipline Plurium sententiae verbo Dei consentaneae singulares omnes eius cansilij conuentus ecclesiae parere debent All Churches must obey the sentence of the greater part of that Councellor assembly vnder whose direction they are the same being agreeable to the worde of God And agayne It is made a part of theyr Aldermens office to see Vt quae à conuentibus piè decreta retulerint à ciuibus suis earum ecclesiarum studiosè obseruentur that those godly decrees which they shall bring from the assemblyes bee diligently obserued of theyr Cittizens of those Churches Lastly Conuentus sententia rata habeatur donec à conuentu maior is authoritatis secus iudicatum puerit Let the sentence of euery assembly bee ratified vntill it shall be otherwise iudged-of by an assembly of greater authoritie As a classicall to bee ouerruled by a prouinciall a prouinciall by a nationall a nationall by a generall And thus they write of theyr owne orders and assemblyes Which rules take them altogether as they lye if they bee true as I doe not greatly dislike them being well applyed then do these busie bodies among vs sin most directly against theyr own consciences in that they oppose themselues as they do against those things which the greater part of the national Sinode high court of parliament of this Realme hath allowed of beeing most agreeable to the worde of God before some generall Councell or assembly of more authoritie haue iudged otherwise and determined for the course that they haue proceeded in Generall Councell I am sure they haue none And for any other assembly that hath beene held and should haue greater authoritie in England than the nationall Synode of all our owne Churches and the high Court of Parliament let them name it In their writinges generally they exclayme against the high Commission or at the least against the Commissioners as many of them as bee clergie men affirming it to bee against the worde of God that any such should bee of that Commission And yet in Scotland it was agreeable with the Scriptures that fortie or fiftie at the least Ministers of the worde as I conceyue it shoulde bee verie great Commissioners from the King Anno 1589. to very manie great purposes euen for the purging of that lande from all sortes of enemies to the religion there professed Likewise earnest suite is made in the Supplication before mentioned to her Maiestie and found in Fields study that the foresaid foure twentie Doctors that should bee of the Parliament house might be likewise generall Commissioners vnder the great scale of England or the more part of them to beare and determine all and euery secte errour heresie contempt default and misdemeanour agaynst the worde of God and her Maiesties lawes of reformation of religion to depriue any Pastour not dooing or neglecting his duetie to examine witnesses and to imprison the bodyes of all such malefactors and to certifie their names to the Lordes of her Maiesties Councell that they may receiue further condigne punishment Besides there bee some that resemble the high Commission nowe in force vnto the authoritie which they challenge to theyr seuerall Elderships Whereupon one of them acquainted I doubt not with the desires of the rest sayth That if the high Commission were setled in fiue hundred places more than it is and shoulde gouerne by the worde of God and lawes of this Realme there would rise more profit thereby to religion than yet hath beene found by the Bishops He would haue it in fiue hundreth places Scotland is diuided into two and fiftie Eldershippes and of likelyhood they would haue fiue hundred in England And that as I take it is the mystery of his number of fiue hundred To conclude I finde another motion which liketh wel that if there were fiue hundred Elderships more or fewer established yet there might be in euery great Towne certaine Commissioners in causes ecclesiasticall appoynted to looke that the Elderships did their dueties if they did not to compel them therunto by ciuill authority So as therby it appeareth that although our Bishops other Clergie men may not be such Commissioners with vs in some few places yet their Pastors Doctors Aldermen may in euery parish or so many of them or I knowe not whom as it should please her Maiestie to assigne to euery greate Towne Surely the worde of God is much troubled with such kinde of choppers and chaungers of it euery giddy heade wresting and wringing it to serue his owne deuise Wee shoulde haue Commissions to thatch houses withall I see if they might be our directors They are offended with the authoritie that her Maiestie dooth giue vnto her Commissioners for causes ecclesiasticall as beeing vnlawfull in that by vertue of that commission they may sende sometimes for offendors to appeare before them by purseuants and commit them to prison as occasion shal fall out and theyr faultes misdemeanors and contempts shall require But at Geneua the like authoritie in effecte is lawfull in their Eldership For there the Consistorie hath a Beadle sergeant or purseuant or as you lift to tearme him appoynted by the ciuill Magistrates to attende vppon it whose office is to call such before the Consistorie as the Aldermen shall appoynt him And for imprisoning of any offendors and contemptuous persons there is notany matter almost for the which they may call a man before them but one parte of the punishment of it by the lawes of the Cittie is imprisonment As if any when hee appeareth in the Consistorie or els where be so hardie as but to speake euill of any of the Ministers or misname them he is to be imprisoned Besides as I haue noted it before theyr Elders are alwayes of the Councell of state and seldome or neuer but they will bee sure to haue one of the foure Syndickes to bee of that bench So as together they raigne lyke Lordes in theyr Consistorie and who dare say My Lordes why doe you so If they direct imprisonment is but a small matter I speake not agaynst that order there let them vse it as they thinke good Only I see not why the worde of God should bee so bountifull to them and is so sparing to vs. In that by the orders of our Church and the laws of the Realme there is required of Ministers a subscription to her Maiesties lawfull authoritie in ecclesiasticall causes to the Articles of Religion and to the Communion booke c. greate quarrels haue beene raysed and many exceptions are taken against it Insomuch as one a wise man I warraunt you dooth ascribe all the daungers that haue beene complotted against her Maiesties person by the traitrous Papistes the dearth of corne the cause that we haue had such watching and warding by souldiers and lastly that the Spanyards would haue inuaded this land
name to all ministers of the vvord and sacraments vvithout distinguishing thereby any one of them from another or vvas it not euer vvithin the time limited taken and vsed only in the said distribution for one amongst the ministers of the vvord and sacraments that gouerned the rest both of the ministers and people vvithin their circuits limited vnto them This question with the rest was sent to maister doctor Raynolds in Oxford to the intent he might returne his opinion of them which he forbare at that time to do in respect of certain other businesse that he had in hand Howbeit maister doctor Robinson his especial most familiar friend being acquainted as it seemeth with the sayd questions hath written in this sort vpon another occasion not dissenting therein as I take it from maister doctor Reynolds I haue sayth he mainteined it in the pulpit that the titles of honour vvhich vve giue to bishops are no more repugnant to the vvord of God then it is for vs to bee called vvardens presidents prouosts of colleges And in my iudgement they may vvith as good conscience be gouernours of their diocesse as vve being ministers may be gouernours of colleges of ministers Neither do I thinke that this vvas a late deuised policie For I am persuaded that the angell of the church of Ephesus to vvhom S. Iohn vvriteth vvas one minister set ouer the rest For seeing there vvere many pastors there vvhy should S. Iohn vvrite to the angell of the church of Ephesus and not rather to the angels if there had bene no difference amongst them And if this presidencie had had that fault vvhich is reprooued in Diotrephes as S. Ierome proueth that the Ievves had not corrupted the originall text before Christ his comming Quod nunquam dominus Apostoli qui caetera crimina arguunt in Scribis Phariseis de hoc crimine quod erat maximum reticuissent So I may say neither vvould our sauiour vvho by his seruant reproueth those disorders vvhich he found in the seuen churches haue passed ouer this great fault in silence Therefore as Titus vvas left to reforme the churches throughout the vvbole Iland of Crete so I am persuaded that in other places some of that order of pastors and teachers vvhich is perpetuall in the church euen in the time of the Apostles had a prelacie amongst their bretheren and that this preheminencie is approoued by our sauiour And if vve come any lovver though the vvord Episcopus signifie that care vvhich is required of all in scripture be applied to all that haue charge of soules yet I do not remember any one ecclesiasticall vvriter that I haue read vvherein that vvord doth not import a greater dignitie then is common to all ministers Neither do I thinke that any old vvriter did vnder the name of Bishop meane the pastor of euery parish VVhen the emperors vvere persecutors vve read of seueral elders but neuer of more then one bishop at once in Rome the like is to be sayd of other great cities and the churches neere adioining And to meet vvith that offence vvhich is taken at the name of Archbishop because that name is so appropriated to Christ in scripture that it is no vvhere giuen to any other I take it that there is no substantiall difference betvveene archbishop and archbuilder Either therfore the Apostle offended in taking too svvelling a title vvhen hee called himselfe an archbuilder or cheefe builder or it must be graunted that this title may in some degree be giuen to men vvithout derogation to Christ. And thus farre doctor Robinson with whom if maister doctor Reinolds do agree I see not whither the factioners will turne them for as I take it they will not reiect his opinion They haue bragged much of him indeed and of his iudgement in sundrie of their writings as though he were wholy on their side and that they held nothing but he would iustifie it Howbeit they haue done him therin I doubt not exceeding great iniurie For requitall wherof I would wish him neuer to seeke any other reuenge but to turne them to his booke against Hart where hee hath written his mind as touching this point now in hand In the Church of Ephesus sayth he though it had sundrie elders and pastors he vseth these two words in one signification as by the sentence going before it is manifest to guide it yet amongst those sundrie vvas there one cheefe vvhom our sauiour calleth the angell of the church and vvriteth that to him vvhich by him the rest shâ—uld â—novv And this is he vvhom aftervvards in the primitiue church the Fathers called bishop For c. the name of Bishop common before to all elders and pastors of the church vvas then by the vsuall language of the Fathers appropriated to him vvho had the presidentship ouer elders Thus are certain elders reproued by Ciprian Bishop of Carthage for receiuing to the communion them vvho had fallen in time of persecution before the bishop had aduised of it vvith them and others Here then you haue two for Oxford touching the language of the ancient fathers when they speake of bishops Now you shal haue a Cambridge mans opinion no moe but of one I tell you at this time marry he shall be such a one as the brotherhood if they bee of the painters mind before mentioned in the chapter may well bee compared with the other two seeing his iudgement is layd in equall ballance there both with Caluins and Bezaes and that without any disparagement vnto them you know whom I mean it is maister doctor Fulke who in his confutation of the Rhemish notes vpon the new testameÌ„t writeth thus Amongst the clergie for order and seemly gouernment there was alwaies one principall to vvhoÌ„ by long vse of the church the name of Bishop or superintendent hath bene applied vvhich roome Titus exercised in Creta Timothie in Ephesus others in other places Therfore although in the scripture a bishop and an elder is of one order and authoritie in preaching the vvord and administration of the sacraments as Hierome doth often confesse yet in gouernmeÌ„t by ancient vse of speech hee is onely called a Bishop vvhich is in the scriptures called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Ro. 12. 8. 1. Tim. 5. 17. Heb. 13.17 that is cheefe in gouernment to vvhom the ordination or consecration by imposition of bands vvas alvvaies principally coÌ„mitted c. VVhich most ancient forme of gouernment vvhen Adrius vvould take avvay it vvas noted amongst his other errors Hitherto doctor Fulke so as hereby I trust it may appeare to maister Cartvvrights reproch and to all their shames that shall pretend any authoritie froÌ„ the ancient fathers to impugne the right honorable lawful calling of Bishops not parsons in euery parish but Bishops in their diocesse and prouinces appointed in the Apostlestimes for the right order and gouernment of
betwixt God and the Diuell A dunghill of such like sayings might be heaped together which they haue cast vp out of the froth of their zeale Where-vpon nowe Barrowe takinge his aduantage doth frame his argumente in this sorte It is not lawfull for the children of God to submit themselues to the gouernement of Antichrist nor to ioyne themselues to those congregations which haue in their seruice nothing but confusion and in the Lordes Supper put no difference betweene God and the Diuell But such is the gouernement of the Church of England and such are their congregations And therefore wee may not submitt our selues vnto that gouernement nor ioyne our selues to their congregations If now the minor were true which he assumeth from the Consistorians you see how the argument would follow So that as Penry some others haue done allready let all the sort of the other crue adde but Barrowes maiors vnto their owne minors and foorthwith in this first pointe they are become meere Barrowistes And as concerning the second point wherein as I sayd we disalow them it is their framing to themselues a new Church platforme Which doth thus farre agree with Cartwrightes that they must haue forsoothe in euerie assembly their Pastors Doctors Elders and Deacons and that the Church new framed after their fashion must haue all the authority that Cartwright doth challenge to his Elderships of dealing in all matters of maners and doctrine and in executing their censures against any person without exception whosoeuer The chiefe differences that are betwixt them are generally two The first is vz that whereas Cartwright could haue been contented to haue erected his Elderships in euery parishe taking them as nowe they are they say the parish assemblies are popish and vnlawfull they would haue them dissolued and they will haue their Elderships set vp amongest no people but first they must enter into a new couenant The other chiefe difference in like sorte I take to bee this that Barrow in all his platforme will haue the people to ioyne with their Elderships further then Cartwright doth allow of And for his opinion heerein hee relyeth altogether in effect vpon Cartwrightes grounds It is not vnknowen what a plausible course our English Disciplinarians haue taken that thereby they might the more easily drawe the people vnto them Hee that will peruse the first admonition which Cartwright maintained and consider withall the places of his bookes that are noted in the margent shall well perceiue howe earnestly they intitle the people to a wonderfull interest in Church matters They tell the people that they are greatly iniuried in this and that that they ought to choose their Ministers that imposition of handes should bee in their names that the censures of the Churche were to bee executed with the peoples consent and what must bee done almost but the people must haue an oare in it Howbeit all this great shewe of gratifying the people notwithstanding Cartwright by snatches heere and there doth so powder his matters that in effect hee giueth them onely an emptie bottell to play withall For his Eldership forsooth must go before the people in all their actions that is as though hee should haue said what the Elderships thinke meete those Angels those interpreters of God those tribunall seates of Christ the people in all reason ought to content themselues with it and to giue their consentes vnto it Now heereupon Barrow proceedeth Hee taketh Cartwrightes reasons in the behalfe of the people but denieth his shiftes to be currant whereby he would take that from them againe which hee had before giuen vnto him And thereupon doth raile vpon him and all the rest of that association for such their dealing and abusing of the people These reformistes saith Barrow for fashion sake giue the people a little libertie to sweeten their mouthes and make them beleeue they should choose their owne Ministers yet euen in this pretended choyce do they coozen and beguile them leauing them nothing but the smoakie winde of election onely Againe The counterfait reformistes they woulde exclude the Church from the censures assuming them onely into their owne handes either into the Priestes handes with his silly presbytery or Eldership which hee ouerruleth at his pleasure in euery particular congregation or else into their Synodes and Councelles which haue power ouer all Churches and euerie member and action thereof to excommunicate and absolue to make depose to ordaine and abrogate without the priuitie or consent of the Churches c. And thus they subuert the libertie of the Church and peruert the ordinance of Christ. And againe Howe vnnaturall are those members which thus separate and seclude themselues yea rather sequester and seclude the whole from them and arrogate and assume the publicke dueties and power of the whole into their owne handes as though God had giuen all giftes vnto them and they had no neede of others And thus puffed vp with preheminence of theyr owne place and excellencie of their owne giftes they despise all the rest as base ignoraunt vnworthye to bee in their consistorie to haue any voyces of consent or dissent there alledging them to bee tumultuous contentious factious vngouerned ignoraunt inclined to the worst c. And this is as I said the second especiall difference as far as I can see betwixt the Elder Consistorians and these new Schismaticks Wherinto how easily a man may fall that hath digested the Geneuian and Cartwrightian pretences made against our Bishops for the peoples interest I commit the consideration of it to your owne discretions So that as I saide I say againe and againe that if good order be not taken this schisme will daily increase and growe to be daungerous But doe I call it a schisme The worde is too milde They are indeed all the sorte of that infection a compounded masse of I knowe not how manie heresies but principally they are Donatistes in some respect and meere Anabaptistes in some other I haue thought vpon it a hundreth times and haue meruailed at it that the now L. Archbishop of Canterbury could foresee so directly what would be the issue of the first admonition If you would bee pleased to read his exhortation before his confutation of that admonition You shall find that what he hath there written long before this monster was hatched in England he could not if he were to write againe wel write otherwise then there he hath done sauing hee might say that the mischiefe which then he foresaw would come to passe by reason of the boulstring of it by those that should haue had more wit and iudgement is now apparantly beginning to shew it selfe to as many as haue eyes and wisdome to see Surely those men that haue bene made instruments heretofore to commend vnto the whole realme I know not what bookes and platforms tending directly to the vtter ouerthrow of the present gouernment of the church of England with the whole forme
Christiā whosoeuer to separat himselfe either from their assemblies or from the receiuing of the Lords supper with them But if any so did he assigneth him his place amongst certain old hereticks Olim duae fuerunt haereticorum sectae c. In times past there vvere sayth he tvvo sorts of hereticks vvhich troubled the Church greatly The one sort of them vvere called Puritans the other Donatists And both of them vvere in the same error that these dreamers are in seeking for a Church vvherein there should vvant nothing that might be desired Therefore they diuided themselues from the vniuersall society of Christians least they should be defiled vvith other mens impurities But vvhat came of it Dominus eos cum tam arroganticoepto dissipauit The Lord himselfe scattered them vvith that their proud attempt Where by the way it is meet to be obserued that a man may sticke so fast to the Geneua discipline as he may prooue himselfe to bee either a puritane or a Donatist or both Maister Beza in like maner by reason of some opposition which hath bene made against the Sauoyan platforme is growne as it seemeth to some kind of moderation For speaking of the pretended necessitie of it hee sayth that the doctrine onely vz. vvhat vve are to beleeue is absolutely necessarie and also further addeth that seeing a man sometimes may be saued vvithout the participation of the sacraments the same may bee sayd much more of the vvant of ecclesiasticall discipline Now verely we are to thanke him he hath done much for vs. We may be saued though the memorie of this discipline were vtterly buried But the point which I chiefely note is this that there is great difference in maister Bezaes iudgement betwixt the necessitie of the first two notes of the church and this third of his own deuise And therein he giueth in effect the flat lye to maister Cartvvright for charging him to hold that all the said 3 notes as they are notes were equally necessarie And Trauers also is checked by his good maister in that he wil needs make as it hath bene said the censures of his cōsistories to be in the same absolute degree of necessity both with the word and sacraments But I wil follow M. Beza whilest I haue him in his good mood The vvhole church vvanted circūcision in the vvildernes saith he vvhilest they vvere in Babylon they neither had temple nor sacrifices and yet neuerthelesse they ceassed not to be the people of God And the same may then be said much more of the ecclesiastical discipline vz. Ecclesias vt illa careant tamen ecclesias verè pias Christianas esse posse si doctrinam praecipuorū dogmatum purā ac sincerā habuerint That the churches that vvant that discipline may notvvithstanding bee indeed godly and Christian churches if they retaine the doctrine of the cheefest grounds pure and sincere Now if Beza will giue this testimonie of a church that wanteth both his discipline and the sacraments hauing but only the principall grounds of religiō what should he say of those churches which haue not onely a better discipline then that which hee vrgeth but also the said sincere grounds with the doctrine true vse of both the holy sacramēts in as great reuerence at the least as they haue them at Geneua You shall heare him what he is driuen to say of the present estate of the church of England The places haue bene cited in the eight chapter to another purpose He must be pardoned to come in with his If because any thing from him that soundeth not after the Geneua tune is very much But if the churches of England sayth he being vnderpropped vvith the authoritie of Bishops and Archbishops do firmely abide as this hath happened in our memorie to that church that shee hath had men of that order not onely vvorthie Martyrs of God but most singular pastors and doctors fruatur sane ista singulari Dei beneficentia quae vtinam illi sit perpetua Let her enioy this singular goodnesse of God vvhich I pray shee may so do for euer And in another place speaking likewise vvith some good tearmes of the Church of England and of our Archbishops and Bishops he turneth himselfe cleane about and sayth that they of Geneua do not prescribe to any church to follovv their peculiar example like vnto ignorant men vvho thinke nothing vvell but that they do themselues Againe also the same maister Beza in his booke which Erastus confuted not in that which Beza hath since published but in the written and true copie of it he speaketh in this sort Nomine ecclesia Geneuensis in the name of the church of Geneua to those that account the Geneuian Eldership to be but humanum commentum a humane deuise Petimus vt quemadmodum patienter ferimus ipsos a nobis c. dissentire VVe desire of them that as vve suffer them patiently to dissent from vs c. so they vvould heare vs modestly refelling their arguments nullo cum ecclesiarum preiudicio quas sibi credit as administrant VVithout any preiudice to those churches that they haue taken the charge of For vvhere some do obiect that vve account those churches that vvant either excommunication or such an eldership to be no churches it is obiected immerito Deus testis est vndeseruedly on our parts God is our vvitnesse and it is much more a slander vvhere it is giuen out that vve do bring a nevv tyrannie into the church nostra velle reliquis obtrudere and endeuor to obtrude our forme of discipline vnto the rest of the reformed churches Non est ita fratres It is not so brethren Furthermore in like manner in the same place afterward Quicunque vero hanc disciplinam in suis ecclesiis non modo inutilem verumetiam noxiam fore iudicant fruantur sane suo sensu c. VVhosoeuer do iudge this discipline not only vnprofitable but hurtfull to their churches let them enioy their ovvn sense They vndoubtedly do see vvhat their flocks will indure neither doubt vve but that men of so great learning and of so great antiquitie our reuerend bretheren in the Lord haue their reasons Et quis nos constituit alieni gregis iudices And vvho hath made vs iudges of other mens flocks He seldome hath vttered a truer speech But how these sayings do agree with that which he hath sayd before in the third chapter you may not curiously scanne it Indeed he should seeme to be farre now from his former opinion when he sayd in effect That it vvas to little purpose for any church to admit of the gospell and to reiect his discipline But he writeth in mine opinion as it hath bene sayd of old time some courtiers in the world do vse to speake that is for the most part as the present occasion serueth their turnes Such companie they may fal into as they wil commend him to the skies whom