that I never had any acquaintance or dealing with neither have I beene in his company to my knowledge one halfe houre together in my life nor have spoken two words with him these twenty yeares at least but onely about three or foure yeares agoe I having heard that he had threatned me spake to him at a Book-sellers stall in Cheape-side who heard what I said unto him And secondly for Robroughs testimony as touching an Epistleto the Church of Rome I confesse I have seen read such a Booke which was published in the yeare 1588. when I was not eighteene yeares of age and therefore farre unable to write such a book as I am still I confesse So that I could not possible be the Author thereof And whereas Robrough directeth to the ninth page of the said booke for proofe of his deposition where the Author having described to the Church of Rome the true Church of God and her true children sayth himselfe being as it seemeth then in Rome And yet thou sayest let me see her Behold be that writeth testifieth before the Throne of God and all his holy Angels that hee knoweth no one this day after the flesh that taketh part with him what then shall I say I am left alone God forbid for I see and heare with the eares and eyes of my soule the groanes the chaynes and teares of seven thousand whose obedience is greater then mine and of which number I am the least and as a poore and miserable and borne out of time am not worthy to be one of them and this is she who once Balam walkes in thy streets and all the earth was filled with her beauty c. And a little before in the same page of the booke he sayeth Whose modest countenance whose chast and comely steps walke in our streets c. meaning here in England himselfe being an English man So that Henry Robrough doth here also declare himselfe to be a very evill minded man in severall respects First in that hee altereth the Authors words where he sayeth That he knoweth no one this day after the flesh that taketh part with him and sets it downe that hee knoweth no man in the flesh that holdeth with him as if the Author meant and affirmed that there was no man living of his opinion so altering not onely his words but his very intent and meaning to another purpose for so it is set downe in the Briefe that was read to the Court that I affirmed that there was no man of my opinion but my selfe Secondly in that hee leaveth the words going before and comming after which doe plainely shew that he speaketh not of his opinion but of his sorrow and teares of repentance and therefore sayeth that he saw and heard with the eares eyes of his soule the groans the chaines and teares of seven thousand whose obedience was greater then his and judges himselfe not worthy to be one of them so that although at that instant he knew no one after the flesh yet he saw thousands after the spirit with the eyes of his mind whom hee preferreth before himselfe And thirdly in that the said Robrough deposeth and would prove by the said page of the said booke that I am the Author thereof that so by making himselfe another false witnesse with Okey he might accomplish Okeys vow against me that hee would never leave me till hee made me frie For Okey deposeth as it seemeth from the same page of the said book judging also me to be the Author that I affirmed that I was as Elyas left alone Whereupon the voyce of one Bishop in the passing sentence against me was that I should goe the same way to heaven that Elyas went through fire though he thought he said I should never come there as Elias did whereas the Author doth not say hee was as Elyas left alone but what then shall I say I am left alone God forbid which is the cleane contrary and therefore these two evill men as before with the rest of their fellowes so here from the fountaine and evill treasure of their hearts they have brought forth their evill and bitter fruit which any judicious Christian may perceive And whereas I am charged to have used many reproachfull speeches of the Ministers of the Church of England which though they be not set downe in the Sentence yet they are in their testimonies the speeches are these that there is a generation of Pharisees among the Ministers of the Church of England They that testifie to this are Peter Worcester and Susan Price and the Ministers that I should use these speeches of Susan Price nameth Master Denison and Master Robrough for the principall and Worcester another whom I will not here name My Answer and Defence I would it were not true that there is a generation of Pharisees among the Ministers as well as among the people and although it be not an usuall thing with me so to speake of any Minister by name yet I might well say it of these two which this woman nameth for principall and doe them no wrong at all and no doubt they have more fellowes else were the Church of England the rarest Church that ever was in the world And lastly whereas they charge me that I have by this meanes drawne many from the Church of England to be Schismaticks and Separatists and caused them or some of them to forbeare to participate with us c. My Answer and Defence is This is a very false accusation not withstanding their mouthes be all open to witnesse it First for my selfe it is well knowne in all places where I have lived what my behaviour hath beene For so it is that since the beginning of the yeare 1588. now above these forty yeares I have lived in or nere unto the Citty of London and untill now that Master Denison and his Sociats had thus prosecuted against me I was never presented nor once complained of for any neglect or ill carriage towards the Church of Englands either in one respect or other and that I have frequented the publike Assemblies and Sacraments for neere twenty yeares last past before my imprisonment I have sufficient Certificate and testimony for proofe of the same which I had ready to shew to the Court if my defence had beene admitted and I never was in any private Assembly in my life where I have either received the Sacrament my selfe nor seene it done by others So that for mine owne part I am neither Schismaticke nor Separatist And for others I know there is not a man living that can truely say much lesse depose that I have drawne or caused any one to Schisme or Separation from the Church of England not to refuse to participate either in Prayers Preaching or Sacraments nay I am sure that neither Master Denison nor all the enemies else I have in the world are able to bring forth one But on the Contrary there be sundry can witnesse that I
he hath often conversed with me c. yet nameth nothing that he hath heard me say or knowne me practice or doe in all this his said time of twenty yeares tending to that purpose or any other As it the Court would trust to their understandings of the discipline government and to their judgements and conceivings of my opinions and not heare the opinions nor a word or practise mentioned and so passe sentence for who can know a mans affections but by his words or deeds First for Dunne I will excuse him in this that he nameth neither word nor deed because the truth is he never conversed with me in his life nor I with him neither had I ever any kinde of dealing with him in my life except onely that about nineteene or twenty yeares agoe my wife having sore eyes he came by whose meanes I know not and laid something to them for which I payed him So that Dunne could not well name any thing upon the ground of often conversing with me yet he is a false witnesse neverthelesse and a foresworne man every way to his owne knowledge first in this That he upon his oath saith he well knoweth that which he knows he knoweth not and sets downe that for his reason and ground upon oath also which he knowes is false There are other matters wherein George Dunne hath upon his oath also testified falsly which because they are not taken for proofe of any thing conteined in the Sentence I passe them over untill some further occasion But for Thomson and Rogers they might have named what the opinions had beene for they heard me maintaine them they say It seemeth they meane by opinions those before mentioned against Robrowgh and Denison which Rogers calleth the received judgement of the said Church as holding their doctrine to be the discipline and government of the Church of England for such a devoted conceit have they of these two men and some other of their straine as if the Church of England doctrine government discipline and all matters else thereof did consist in them for it is to be noted that these words Now by Law established which are in the Sentence are not in any of their testimonies But I leave the testimonies of these men to the consideration of the understanding Reader to judge how good and sufficient they are and how judicially the Court hath proceeded against me to condemne me upon such evidence And as touching the second part of this second Article passed in the Sentence That I doe agree with the sect of the Familists and other Sectaries c. Rowland Thomson Thomas Rogers Henry Robrowgh doe testifie The testimony of Thomson That the said Etherington doth agree with some of the Sectaries articulate in many tenents and opinions which he this deponent knoweth in regard he hath been present when he the said Etherington hath strived to maintaine the same The testimony of Rogers That he the sayd Etherington doth agree in some points and tenents with the Familists articulate which he hath published in this deponents presence The testimony of Robrowgh That the said Etherington concurreth with the Separatists and Sectaries in private Assemblies which this deponent knoweth by report and also by his printed booke against Separatists where he sayth Caesar may command a place in publique so he forbid none in private Page 82. and he agreeth with the Familists in the perfect puritie of the soule after regeneration as one Iesop confessed to this deponent to be his and the said Etheringtons opinion My answer and defence Thomson pretends now to speake upon knowledge as well as Rogers their grounds are both one The one saith he hath heard me strive to maintaine the other to publish tenents and opinions and both of them like brethren in evill are still agreed to forbeare to tell what the tenents and opinions are least by naming them they should disable their testimonies to their purpose No doubt they are the tenents and opinions before mentioned which Mr. Denison had told them in his Pulpits was a sure mark whereby they should know a Familist and so they presumed upon his judgement and by concealing what the tenents are make them serve their turne for this as well as to be against the government and discipline how sufficient the testimonies of these two men are to prove the things in the Sentence and how concionably they have dealt I referre to the Christian Reader to consider My defence against Robrowghs testimony To the first concerning private Assemblies What Mr. R. knowes by report that he may safely depose and say So God helpe him I refer to the Reader to consider But where he sayth And also by his printed booke against Separatists c. I confesse I wrote such a booke which being allowed was published in the yeare 1610. where in Pag. 82. these words are Caesar may command a place for the publique so he forbid none in private yet neverthelesse Mr. Robrowgh hath shewed himselfe a very evill minded man in two respects first in that he leaveth out the words and matters going before and following after in the said booke which would have cleared my meaning more fully and taketh onely those words as may most seeme to make for his purpose And secondly in this that whereas my words are Caesar may command a place for the publique so he forbid none in private he gives it into the Court upon his oath Caesar may command a place in publique c. leaving out two of my words and putting in one of his owne in stead of them to alter the scope and intent of those few words which he doth take to make them serve his turne against me for who knoweth not that the leaving out or changing one word for another in a sentence doth oftentimes alter the intent and scope thereof as to build a house in a Citie and to build a house for a Citie are two differing things the King may build a house in the Citie of London for his owne use but if the King say I build this house for the Citie of London all men will understand he meaneth for the Cities use againe the King may command a place in publique for himselfe to come and worship God therein but to command a place for the publique is for the people also publiquely So whereas I say Caesar may command a place for the publique my meaning is that the King may lawfully with authoritie from God and warrant from his word command a place and places for the publique worship of God to all his Subjects in and throughout all parts of his Dominions which if the King may and that my words doe intend and expresse so much as I thinke no man that is wise and conscionable will deny then all the Kings subjects are bound to obey the King and come to the publique worship of God in those publique places and as it is for place so it is for time and other
false and very erroneous doctrine and to be a dangerous step of falling from Christ for Saint Paul testifieth plainly that the Gentiles which had not that Law of Circumcision and the Sabbaths c. might have the truth and effect thereof in their hearts and be a Iew inwardly in the spirit though not outwardly in the flesh so that there was never such a necessity as those false Teachers taught and most part of the Jewes conceived nay they ought to have knowne that although themselves that had the Law to whom especially it was given were bound to observe it to the utter-most of their power yet if they fayled in any part as all did in many and so in all parts they might be saved another way through the grace and mercy of God in the Gospell and that of this there was alwayes a necessitie and without the same no man could be saved and that a Gentile having the same grace should be saved though he were ignorant of the Law for this is the effect which was signified by those signes and shadowes which are now as it was a law to the Iewes ceased to Christians Unto all this doe agree the best approved writers of the Christian Church both of the antient and latter sâ—â—ce the Apostles times as Hierome upon Gal. 4. Augustine in his Epistles ch. 19. and in his booke Conscientiae Diaeta and of the Spirit and letter chap. 14. and upon these words of Christ Take up thy bed and walke Tract. 17. Tertullian also in his booke Adversus Iudaeâ—s and others And of the latter Master Tindall in his answer to Master Moores first booke page 287. Doctor Barnes in declaration of the cause of his condemnation page 106. Master Fâ—ith in his declaration of Baptisme page 96. Master Calvin and others and as it is contayned in the Harmony of consessions of the Reformed Churches page 473. and page 499. besides sundry writers of this present age So that in this I am not singular though I differ from Master Denison Their fift accusation That the Bookes of Esdras are and ought to be esteemed part of the Canonicall Scripture They that testifie to this are Rowland Tomson and Susan Price their testimonies are both according to the words of the Sentence My Answer and defence Their testimonies to this also as they have given it into the Court are false for I never said that the two last Bookes of Esdras which it seemeth they meane are or ought to be held canonicall or part of the canonicall Scripture But this I say and doe beleeve that Esdras was a holy Prophet and true servant of God and that those his two last Bookes are as well as the rest holy and true as sundry Divines have esteemed him and written of them and one Booke now publike Printed first in Queene Elizabeths dayes and presented to the Lord Robert Devoreux Earle of Essex upon the 11. chap of the last Booke of Esdras wherein matters of great moment are manifested worthy I dare say to be regarded of every true Christian that desires understanding And I dare say further that they have done and doe very wickedly which rayle against him calling and counting him a counterfeit a lyer a blasphemer as some have done it had beene farre more wisdome for them to have left him in these his last Bookes and suspended their judgements untill time the tryer and discoverer of truth from falshood should manifest things more clearely that so upon cleare proofe of experience they might have judged rightly of that which through want of understanding they could see before Their sixt accusation as it is in the Sentence That the said Iohn Etherington within the time aforesaid hath kept private Conventicles or exercises of Religion by the Lawes of the Realme prohibited and taken upon him in such Conventicles to be the chiefe speaker or expoundâ—r of the Scripture and hath many adherents disciples and followers of his doctrine and giveth many oppositions contrary to the received opinions taught in the Church of England saying that outward ordination of a Minister doth snot make a true Minister And hath useth many reproachfull speeches to and of the Ministers of the Church of England And by this meanes hath seduced and drawn many from th Church of England to be Scismatiques and separatists and caused them or some of them to forbeare to participate with us in the celebrating of Devine service and Sacraments They that testifie to this are Rowland Tomson Thomas Rogers Christopher Nâ—cholson Peter Worcester Susan Price Henry Robrough Iohn Okey George Dunne Here like pursuers of blood they cry out together with open mouth as if they meant now at last to swallow me up quite and cleane this being the maine toyle which they from the beginning had layed whereby above all they made sure account to take me Their depositions to this sixt Accusation are not onely many but so long and tedious that if I should set them all downe with answers to every particular thing in them it would require more time and space then all that is already past and would weary any sober mind to read them over I will therefore give my answer defence to that which is contained in the words of the Sentence as being the maine and summe of all as also to the chiefe of their depositions and leave the rest untill some further occasion shall serve My Answer and Defence To the first concerning private Conventicles and exercises of Religion by the Lawes of this Realme prohibited my answer is It is a false accusation I never kept any such nor have done otherwise then I have acknowledged in my Defence to their first Article as one Christian neighbour or friend may and ought to doe to and with another which I am out of all doubt the lawes of this Realme doe not forbid neither I hope ever will And secondly whereas they say that I take upon me to be a chiefe speaker or expounder of the Scriptures and to have many adherents disciples and followers c. My answer is They charge me in this also very falsely I am so farre from taking upon me such things as that I doe reject the very thought thereof in my selfe especially and have opposed and reproved such as have so done and beene so affected as some can witnesse although I confesse I have beene free and alwayes ready to speake to my neighbour and friend and children c. whatsoever I have knowne and understood of the word and wayes of God as I have beene also to heare and recite and so I hope I shall continue to doe as time and occasion shall serve so long as I live Thirdly in that they charge me to give many expositions contrary to the received opinions taught in the Church of England The chiefe besides those before mentioned of Repentance c. which I confesse are contrary to Mâ—ster Denisons and Robroughs doctrine being as it seemeth this contained in the Sentence