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book_n admit_v cause_n great_a 61 3 2.1251 3 false
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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A04207 An attestation of many learned, godly, and famous divines, lightes of religion, and pillars of the Gospell iustifying this doctrine, viz. That the Church-governement ought to bee alwayes with the peoples free consent. Also this; that a true Church vnder the Gospell contayneth no more ordinary congregations but one. In the discourse whereof, specially Doctor Downames & also D. Bilsons chiefe matters in their writings against the same, are answered. Jacob, Henry, 1563-1624. 1613 (1613) STC 14328; ESTC S117858 154,493 335

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be_v true_a another_o ground_n thereof_o there_o be_v likewise_o &_o that_o of_o no_o less_o importance_n in_o this_o matter_n which_o be_v that_o christ_n true_a visible_a and_o ministerial_a church_n under_o the_o gospel_n consist_v not_o of_o many_o ordinary_a congregation_n but_o only_o of_o one_o which_o i_o have_v at_o large_a prove_v to_o be_v a_o truth_n and_o have_v make_v it_o manifest_v in_o my_o declaration_n pag._n 10.11.12_o etc._n etc._n and_o in_o reas._n for_o reform_v pag._n 19.20_o &_o 65.66_o and_o again_o 8._o again_o chapt._n 8._o here_o after_o i_o do_v show_v it_o further_o yet_o the_o former_a point_n in_o some_o respect_n may_v be_v think_v rather_o the_o chief_a because_o this_o second_o be_v a_o dependent_a on_o the_o former_a &_o follow_v by_o a_o necessary_a consequence_n from_o it_o as_o partly_o be_v show_v in_o the_o say_v declarat_fw-la pag._n 13.14_o and_o more_o full_o in_o the_o vii_o chapt._n of_o this_o present_a treatise_n ensue_a again_o that_o require_v the_o people_n free_a consent_n note_v christ_n visible_a church_n nature_n and_o essence_n intensiuè_fw-fr intensiuè_fw-la the_o church_n nature_n intensiuè_fw-la as_o the_o school_n do_v speak_v that_o be_v it_o show_v th●_n ground_n of_o the_o power_n and_o life_n thereof_o the_o other_o show_v the_o essence_n of_o it_o extensiuè_fw-la extensiuè_n extensiuè_n that_o be_v the_o largeness_n of_o the_o body_n of_o the_o church_n &_o just_a extent_n or_o the_o due_a limit_n and_o bound_n thereof_o outward_o wherefore_o that_o require_v the_o people_n free_a consent_n be_v manifest_o a_o most_o proper_a and_o special_a argument_n in_o our_o cause_n and_o such_o as_o touch_v the_o quick_a in_o the_o matter_n of_o the_o say_a reformation_n most_o near_o d._n downame_n err_v great_o in_o his_o late_a defence_n make_v his_o first_o book_n thereof_o full_a long_a &_o tedious_a only_o to_o disprove_v lay_v elder_n as_o he_o call_v they_o think_v without_o all_o reason_n that_o if_o 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a_o attestation_n of_o many_o learned_a godly_a and_o famous_a divine_n light_n of_o religion_n and_o pillar_n of_o the_o gospel_n justify_v this_o doctrine_n viz._n that_o the_o church-governement_n ought_v to_o be_v always_o with_o the_o people_n free_a consent_n also_o this_o that_o a_o true_a church_n under_o the_o gospel_n contain_v no_o more_o ordinary_a congregation_n but_o one_o in_o the_o discourse_n whereof_o special_o doctor_n downame_n &_o also_o d._n bilson_n chief_a matter_n in_o their_o writing_n against_o the_o same_o be_v answer_v calvin_n instit_fw-la 4.3.2_o he_o labour_v the_o destruction_n and_o ruin_n of_o the_o church_n whosoever_o either_o seek_v to_o abolish_v this_o order_n and_o this_o kind_n of_o government_n whereof_o we_o treat_v or_o make_v light_n of_o it_o as_o not_o so_o necessary_a anno_fw-la dom._n 1613._o to_o my_o christian_a and_o belove_a friend_n in_o london_n and_o elsewhere_o in_o england_n grace_n and_o peace_n be_v multiply_v in_o jesus_n 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speak_v evil_a of_o my_o innocence_n without_o all_o cause_n in_o very_a deed_n they_o can_v not_o tell_v why_o but_o god_n the_o righteous_a judge_n see_v it_o who_o yet_o still_o sustain_v and_o strengthenth_n my_o infirmity_n by_o who_o grace_n i_o be_o that_o i_o be_o wherefore_o in_o his_o name_n i_o do_v still_o bear_v witness_n to_o the_o truth_n deny_v by_o many_o man_n &_o do_v now_o take_v in_o hand_n to_o entreat_v here_o concern_v the_o christian_a people_n power_n &_o right_v of_o proper_o of_o also_o consequent_o that_o a_o true_a church_n under_o the_o gospel_n contain_v no_o mo_z ordinary_a congregation_n they_o one_o &_o be_v not_o diocesan_n proper_o free_a consent_n in_o their_o outward_a spiritual_a government_n give_v they_o by_o christ_n jesus_n in_o the_o gospel_n and_o therefore_o to_o his_o gracious_a assistance_n herein_o i_o also_o do_v trust_v in_o the_o which_o affair_n i_o think_v it_o very_o behooveful_a for_o the_o better_a manifestation_n of_o my_o 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not_o long_o since_o turn_v from_o we_o and_o become_v our_o adversary_n yea_o the_o late_a i_o thinkc_n which_o open_o show_v himself_o against_o we_o and_o so_o be_v like_a to_o be_v now_o must_v in_o man_n eye_n also_o he_o have_v heap_v together_o the_o most_o thing_n that_o the_o best_a of_o such_o defender_n have_v heretofore_o write_v beside_o all_o this_o the_o manner_n of_o his_o writing_n be_v with_o such_o a_o 122._o a_o defence_n 1._o pag._n 16_o 17._o 2._o pag_n 122._o insolent_a conceit_n of_o himself_o &_o with_o such_o 15._o such_o defence_n 2._o pag_n 55._o 15._o contempt_n indignation_n and_o despite_n against_o we_o as_o common_o be_v not_o see_v in_o any_o but_o those_o that_o slide_v back_o from_o the_o truth_n which_o they_o have_v once_o tact_v of_o and_o withal_o though_o in_o his_o defence_n he_o deal_v with_o another_o yet_o in_o many_o passage_n he_o very_o sharp_o provoke_v i_o in_o particular_a beside_o other_o wrong_n that_o he_o have_v do_v i_o well_o know_v for_o these_o cause_n both_o i_o write_v this_o that_o i_o do_v and_o i_o chief_o nominate_v he_o for_o our_o adversary_n as_o in_o this_o treatise_n so_o also_o declaration_n also_o in_o the_o declaration_n elsewhere_o my_o christian_a and_o love_a friend_n for_o who_o sake_n most_o of_o all_o i_o labour_v and_o have_v labour_v to_o make_v our_o say_a question_n which_o be_v long_o intricat_a &_o trouble_v some_o to_o be_v short_a and_o plain_a and_o to_o make_v the_o matter_n itself_o also_o appear_v so_o weighty_a as_o indeed_o it_o be_v now_o your_o part_n be_v wise_o and_o religions_o to_o ponder_v in_o your_o heart_n and_o to_o make_v use_n of_o this_o same_o as_o the_o apostle_n speak_v to_o timothy_n so_o do_v i_o unto_o you_o consider_v brethren_n what_o i_o say_v and_o the_o lord_n give_v you_o understanding_n in_o all_o thing_n amen_n july_n 18._o anno_fw-la 1612._o you_o ever_o in_o the_o lord_n henry_n jacob_n the_o content_n of_o this_o book_n divide_v into_o 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deal_v against_o the_o papist_n pag._n 70._o chap._n vii_o consequence_n of_o exceed_v great_a importance_n follow_v upon_o the_o people_n free_a consent_n in_o their_o church-governement_n &_o inconvenience_n intolerable_a follow_v from_o the_o contrary_n pag._n 84._o chap._n viii_o a_o answer_n to_o divers_a chief_a objection_n of_o the_o adversary_n of_o this_o cause_n note_v also_o brief_o their_o immodest_a &_o not_o christian_n like_o reproach_n against_o this_o evangelicall_n doctrine_n pag._n 199._o chap._n ix_o a_o short_a advertisement_n to_o the_o upright_o heart_a and_o christian_a reader_n touch_v this_o write_n and_o cause_n pag._n 316._o a_o attestation_n of_o many_o learned_a godly_a and_o famous_a divine_n light_n of_o religion_n &_o pillar_n of_o the_o gospel_n instify_v this_o doctrine_n viz._n that_o the_o church_n government_n ought_v to_o be_v always_o with_o the_o people_n free_a consent_n etc._n etc._n chap._n i._n the_o great_a importance_n of_o the_o matter_n here_o handle_v viz._n that_o the_o people_n ought_v to_o have_v their_o free_a consent_n in_o their_o own_o church-governement_n and_o the_o cause_n of_o publish_v this_o attestation_n to_o it_o whereas_o many_o thing_n at_o divers_a and_o sundry_a time_n heretofore_o have_v be_v write_v which_o prove_v a_o plain_a necessity_n by_o god_n word_n to_o reform_v the_o church_n &_o church-governement_n now_o in_o england_n very_o among_o they_o all_o there_o be_v almost_o no_o other_o point_n so_o evident_a so_o direct_v and_o full_a to_o this_o purpose_n that_o be_v 1._o chap._n 1._o none_o in_o a_o manner_n so_o absolute_o import_v the_o say_a necessity_n of_o reformation_n as_o this_o do_v which_o be_v utter_o want_v among_o we_o name_o that_o the_o church-governement_n ought_v t●●●e_v exercise_v always_o with_o the_o people_n free_a consent_n controversy_n one_o or_o two_o ma●●●_n ground_n of_o our_o whole_a controversy_n it_o
they_o who_o late_o publish_v that_o book_n of_o d._n bill_n in_o latin_a so_o to_o do_v unless_o they_o mean_v to_o show_v abroad_o further_o his_o most_o impertinent_a ambiguous_a &_o uncertain_a writing_n &_o yet_o fraught_v with_o bitterness_n enough_o against_o us._n in_o a_o word_n we_o desire_v that_o all_o man_n shall_v know_v that_o our_o question_n be_v not_o whether_o bishop_n and_o their_o government_n be_v apostolical_a about_o the_o prove_v whereof_o the_o great_a part_n of_o these_o two_o doctor_n book_n be_v spend_v further_o though_o we_o deny_v diocesan_n &_o provincial_n bishop_n of_o any_o sort_n to_o be_v apostolical_a yet_o we_o do_v not_o 38_o not_o see_v reas_n for_o reform_v pag._n 7._o &_o 38_o simple_o deny_v but_o that_o some_o kind_n of_o they_o also_o may_v be_v lawful_a be_v it_o not_o that_o certain_a weighty_a circumstance_n in_o these_o our_o day_n do_v stand_v against_o they_o yea_o there_o be_v circumstance_n now_o very_o evident_a and_o pregnant_a against_o the_o best_a sort_n of_o diocesan_n bishop_n which_o be_v not_o in_o 200._o or_o 300._o year_n after_o christ_n so_o that_o no_o reason_n can_v be_v make_v because_o they_o be_v lawful_a in_o the_o second_o or_o three_o age_n therefore_o they_o be_v lawful_a now_o the_o case_n be_v thus_o it_o be_v to_o be_v note_v that_o the_o dd._n do_v not_o propound_v the_o true_a question_n between_o us._n for_o if_o the_o people_n free_a consent_n in_o their_o own_o church-governement_n be_v not_o as_o it_o be_v christ_n ordinance_n in_o the_o new_a testament_n certain_o not_o circumstance_n nor_o any_o thing_n else_o can_v make_v diocesan_n or_o provincial_n bishop_n at_o all_o reprovable_a for_o which_o cause_n the_o true_a question_n indeed_o between_o the_o prelacy_n and_o we_o or_o the_o principal_a &_o main_a question_n be_v whether_o the_o people_n ought_v to_o have_v always_o their_o free_a consent_n in_o their_o own_o church_n government_n but_o this_o special_o 4.80.99_o special_o see_v his_o defen_n 1_o 38.47_o &_o 4.80.99_o d._n downame_n put_v away_o from_o he_o with_o high_a disdain_n contempt_n rail_v hateful_a accusation_n and_o exclamation_n so_o that_o with_o this_o he_o will_v not_o vouchsafe_v to_o meddle_v wherein_o true_o we_o may_v see_v he_o to_o be_v i_o can_v not_o say_v learn_v but_o a_o cunning_a bold_a and_o exquisite_a sophister_n and_o this_o may_v be_v in_o general_a a_o sufficient_a answer_n even_o to_o his_o whole_a defence_n although_o for_o some_o other_o respect_n i_o hope_v some_o body_n will_v one_o day_n examine_v his_o particular_a passage_n more_o exact_o in_o a_o place_n for_o the_o purpose_n but_o to_o our_o point_n in_o hand_n we_o clear_o see_v by_o this_o that_o it_o be_v the_o people_n con●ent_n in_o the_o affair_n of_o their_o own_o spiritual_a that_o be_v church_n government_n which_o make_v the_o matter_n &_o put_v the_o difference_n in_o deed_n between_o the_o ecclesiastical_a reformation_n which_o in_o all_o dutifulness_n we_o seek_v and_o that_o church-governement_n which_o the_o l._n bishop_n in_o engl._n do_v exercise_n i_o say_v this_o concern_v the_o people_n right_a herein_o be_v it_o which_o tonch_v the_o life_n of_o our_o controversy_n where_o understand_v note_n note_n that_o i_o mean_v only_o such_o people_n as_o be_v not_o ignorant_a in_o religion_n nor_o scandalous_a in_o their_o life_n for_o only_o of_o such_o christ_n visible_a church_n ought_v to_o consist_v well_o to_o proceed_v they_o with_o our_o point_n questionless_a hence_o it_o be_v that_o general_o the_o adversary_n of_o the_o forename_a reformation_n do_v so_o strange_o reject_v yea_o so_o hateful_o resist_v and_o strive_v against_o this_o same_o christian_a doctrine_n here_o propound_v concern_v the_o church_n only_o true_a government_n with_o the_o people_n free_a consent_n as_o they_o do_v wherein_o they_o express_v &_o show_v little_a christian_a patience_n for_o they_o prosecute_v those_o that_o hold_v &_o teach_v the_o same_o though_o out_o of_o mere_a conscience_n with_o all_o bitter_a reproach_n base_a skoffing_n injurious_a slander_n and_o unmerciful_a deal_n and_o all_o this_o it_o be_v plain_a not_o for_o any_o manner_n of_o evil_n that_o they_o find_v in_o this_o doctrine_n or_o for_o any_o inconvenience_n therein_o for_o in_o truth_n there_o be_v none_o at_o all_o as_o partly_o i_o have_v show_v 28_o show_v reas._n for_o reform_v pag._n 28_o heretofore_o &_o it_o will_v further_o be_v manifest_v hereafter_o but_o they_o so_o hate_v this_o doctrine_n only_o because_o of_o the_o inevitable_a consequence_n of_o the_o say_a reformation_n which_o it_o bring_v with_o it_o which_o cross_v &_o overturn_v whole_o their_o divers_a enormous_a worldly_a &_o carnal_a desire_n as_o any_o man_n that_o look_v into_o the_o case_n may_v easy_o see_v howsoever_o it_o be_v yet_o the_o truth_n and_o the_o agreeablenes_n hereof_o with_o the_o holy_a gospel_n of_o jesus_n christ_n &_o with_o the_o assure_v of_o our_o soul_n in_o the_o way_n to_o eternal_a life_n as_o it_o have_v appear_v to_o the_o world_n ever_o since_o the_o discovery_n of_o antichrist_n more_o clear_o than_o it_o do_v for_o many_o year_n before_o so_o doubtless_o it_o will_v more_o and_o more_o appear_v yet_o still_o &_o be_v make_v further_o manifest_v to_o all_o man_n even_o where_o the_o gospel_n be_v receive_v as_o it_o be_v in_o many_o place_n yet_o not_o so_o sincere_o as_o it_o ought_v to_o be_v etc._n see_v chap_v 7._o pag._n 156._o etc._n etc._n for_o my_o part_n because_o i_o well_o perceive_v that_o the_o antichristian_a idolatry_n and_o tyranny_n of_o the_o church_n of_o rome_n can_v by_v divinity_n be_v sound_o resist_v as_o experience_n in_o time_n will_v show_v neither_o be_v it_o resist_v by_o our_o forefather_n at_o the_o beginning_n but_o by_o maintain_v this_o evangelicall_n point_n of_o doctrine_n among_o other_o therefore_o i_o have_v condescend_v the_o more_o willing_o after_o diligent_a inquiry_n thereinto_o to_o approve_v the_o say_a point_n of_o doctrine_n viz._n that_o the_o church_n government_n ought_v to_o be_v exercise_v always_o with_o the_o people_n free_a consent_n which_o also_o even_o for_o 7._o for_o for_o that_o the_o papa_n cie_n else_o will_v come_v in_o see_v chap._n 7._o this_o same_o cause_n i_o can_v not_o but_o believe_v to_o be_v the_o holy_a ordinance_n of_o jesus_n christ_n for_o his_o church_n under_o the_o gospel_n and_o to_o have_v be_v deliver_v unto_o we_o by_o the_o apostle_n in_o their_o perpetual_a practice_n of_o church-governement_n but_o special_o see_v for_o the_o same_o we_o have_v the_o most_o sure_a evidence_n of_o god_n word_n in_o the_o new_a testament_n which_o i_o 48._o i_o argnm._n 3_o &_o 9_o of_o the_o divine_a beginning_n of_o chrst_n visible_a church_n declarat_fw-la pag._n 20_o ●1_n reas._n for_o reform_v pag._n 45._o 46_o 47._o 48._o have_v heretofore_o gather_v and_o observe_v at_o large_a second_o see_v we_o have_v for_o it_o a_o plentiful_a and_o clear_a attestation_n of_o many_o learned_a godly_a and_o famous_a divine_n both_o new_a and_o old_a confirm_v our_o faith_n and_o strengthen_v our_o conscience_n therein_o which_o attestation_n i_o have_v think_v it_o needful_a at_o this_o time_n and_o in_o this_o place_n to_o gather_v and_o produce_v for_o many_o cause_n first_o my_o desire_n be_v that_o it_o may_v lie_v open_a to_o the_o sight_n of_o all_o man_n what_o a_o great_a &_o holy_a agreement_n of_o good_a man_n herein_o we_o have_v which_o be_v add_v to_o the_o forenote_v fundamental_a certainty_n thereof_o in_o god_n word_n give_v so_o full_a a_o satisfaction_n to_o every_o good_a christian_a that_o who_o can_v desire_v more_o second_o all_o christian_a civil_a magistrate_n may_v hereby_o take_v good_a content_n and_o be_v satisfy_v touch_v the_o innocence_n of_o this_o way_n in_o the_o church_n government_n which_o we_o hold_v for_o when_o they_o shall_v see_v with_o what_o a_o cloud_n of_o such_o witness_n we_o be_v compass_v in_o defence_n of_o this_o matter_n they_o can_v not_o imagine_v any_o inconvenience_n by_o it_o to_o their_o government_n notwithstanding_o all_o the_o clamour_n and_o invective_n of_o partial_a adversary_n against_o it_o last_o hereby_o also_o our_o adversary_n virulent_a tongue_n and_o pen_n if_o it_o be_v possible_a may_v be_v ashamed_a to_o abuse_v we_o as_o they_o do_v with_o all_o kind_n of_o unworthy_a reproach_n and_o slander_n when_o they_o shall_v see_v who_o they_o hate_v and_o persecute_v &_o revile_v together_o with_o us._n wherefore_o for_o the_o publish_n of_o this_o matter_n there_o appear_v every_o way_n very_o great_a and_o necessary_a reason_n chap._n ii_o the_o method_n and_o order_n of_o this_o treatise_n now_o herein_o i_o purpose_v to_o proceed_v thus_o first_o i_o will_v show_v who_o among_o the_o new_a writer_n be_v our_o master_n &_o teacher_n in_o this_o point_n of_o doctrine_n