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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A89836	A discovery of the man of sin, acting in a mystery of iniquitie, pleading for his kingdom, against the coming of Christ to take away sin. Or, an answer to a book set forth by Tho. Weld of Gateshead, Richard Prideaux, Sam. Hamond, Will. Cole, and Will. Durant of Newcastle. By way of reply to an answer of James Nayler's to their former book, called The perfect Pharisee: who call themselves ministers of Christ, but are found ministring for the kingdom of Antichrist. Published for clearing the innocency of the truth from their malicious slanders, and discovering their deceits. By one whom the world calls James Nayler.	Naylor, James, 1617?-1660.	1654 (1654)	Wing N274; Thomason E738_16; ESTC R202155	50,411	56

the presence of the Lord to be slanderers and false accusers who say we deny these things And whereas you would deny that you persecuted us and would put it upon those who are sent to you from the Lord to witness against your deceit as though they were the persecutors but whether those whom the Lord sent out to cry wo against the false prophets and hirelings calling them greedy dumb dogs blinde guides and many such like playn words or they who caused them to be haled before Rulers there accused them cast them into prison and put them to death whether of these were the persecutors then the same are the persecutors now as some of us can witness who have been haled before Magistrates and there vehemently accused and cast into prison and some stoned and not a few of you who call your selves ministers have had a hand in it and been the cause of it and whereas you say You have been hindred in the seed of the word I answer What word have you to sow who deny the word of the Lord coming to you but your seed being stollen makes a bad harvest and little fruit to be reaped and whereas you tell of bringing our selves within the compass of the Law for declaring our message to you from the Lord and that we suffer as evil doers here take notice whose ministers you are who have had papists Law that guarded the Jesuites contrary to the Scripture to defend you with which the ministers of Christ never had and Christ all the Saints suffered as evil doers in the account of those who were protected by carnal Laws whereas you say You are set for the confirmation and defence of the Gospel I pray you who set you since you deny the immediate call of God and so have set your selves or are set by the will of man and that the Gospel should be defended by persecution and persecutors was never known Now a few words to your reply to my answer and first to your first position as touching your accusing George Fox that he said that he was equall with God and you say your proof is not at all denied I answer That those words were spoken is not denied but that they are the words of George Fox is denied And you use many words and say I make a difference between George Fox and himself so that though George Fox is not equal with God yet he that is called George Fox is equal with God And thus when you have made up a piece of deceit to blinde the people then you go about to frame an answer to confute it and so you confute your own deceit and not my words For the sum of mine answer was this That George Fox was denied as dust but the Spirit that spoke in him is equal with God according to the Scripture and the words of Christ who saith When you are called before Rulers for my Names sake take no thought what to speak for it is not you that speak but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you Matth. 10. 20. Now George Fox being called before Rulers for the Name of Christ he denies George Fox to speak and the creature who is but dust and witnesseth the Spirit of the Father speaking in him though the words pass through George Fox and the words of Christ fulfilled And are not the Father and the Son and the Spirit equal where-ever they are and must they not be suffered to speak where they are But you that are carnal know not the voice Thus the answer is plain to any spiritual eye but to satisfie you who cavil on purpose is impossible but what I say is for the simple ones sake And I shall not follow you in your arguments for I know they shall deceive none but such as are deceived already and are willing so to be Now whereas you say I blasphemously abuse the Scriptures are you not ashamed to charge me with the abusing of them who do but onely set them down as they are without giving any meaning to them which Scriptures you take and wrest them to another end then for which the holy Ghost spake them forth adding your own invention words which the Scripture speaks not For where doth the Scripture speak of a Physical or relative oneness But by these words you darken knowledge and blinde peoples mindes lest they should seek after an oneness with God for the Scripture faith He that is joyned to the Lord is one spirit 1 Cor. 6. 17. and Christ saith That they may be one even as thou Father and I are one Joh. 17. 21 22 23. and As he is so are we in this present world 1 Joh. 4. 17. Which Scriptures you wrest to another end by your subril words added to them Now who blaspemes the Scriptures whether you or I let truth judge and your accusation fall upon your own pate And for your falsly accusing me to say I was as holy just and good as God himself what I have said in mine answer in my former book may sufficiently convince any one that fears God that I am clear of it And whereas you bring William Baldwinson's testimony which may give evidence against your selves and shew it to any honest heart both your deceit and his For before I was charged with this in particular and now you say Richard Farnworth and I both said it and he confessed there was a great deal of people in the house Now it was strange we should both say it and none hear it but himself for the great deal of people he speaks of they do witness against him in it and divers of them have offered their testimony against him But fending and proving becometh not Saints nor did they ever use it nor dare I stand by the witness of men but have the witness of God against you and your slanders who will reward every one according to their doings both the slanderer and the lyer and not onely by your reporting these but also your seeking evidence to back them herein you are serving the devil the father of lyes and so make that appear to be true which I have spoken of you Now for your charging George Fox to say he was the judge of the world and you say I deny it not but tell you that you are grosly ignorant of Christ I answer If you be not grosly ignorant of Christ and the Scripture let any wise man judge for you say God hath committed all judgement to the Son and yet you will not own him to be judge where he is wherein you go about either to exclude him from being in the Saints and so would limit him into a particular place or from being judge in them where he is Now that you are ignorant of Christ all that know him shall witness for all that know him know him in them and that he judgeth the world in them and the things of the world in every particular and he that is

of use every day in bearing witness with us against you and your Heathenish Worships and unsanctified lives who are belly-gods evil beasts And for you that say the four books are the Gospel make it appear you never knew him who is the glad things which Gospel was manifest before these books were written and is everlasting Sixthly you charge upon us the owning of an immediate call and the Word of the Lord coming to us To which I answer Let all the Prophets and Apostles and holy men of God in the Scripture witness against you who all owned the immediate call and the Word of the Lord and be you witnesses against your selves that you never had the Word of the Lord coming unto you but are of those who say Thus saith the Lord when the Lord never spoke unto you Jerem. 23. from vers 21. to 33. but are lyers and false Prophets by your own confession who reckon it up as a blasphemous doctrine to witness the Word of the Lord coming unto us and be also witnesses against your selves who deny an immediate call that you never were called of God for his call is immediate whereby he hath called his and sent them forth which call I witness from the mouth of the Lord. But you are of those who run unsent and therefore do not profit the people whose call is mediate and so never any was called by God and so are made Ministers by the will of man And as your Call is carnal and mediate so is your Ministery who have not the Word of the Lord but what you steal from your neighbour out of a book which none of the true Pr●phets of the Lord ever did and so out of your own mouth be ye judged and discovered to all the children of light to be in the errour Seventhly you charge us with putting abundance of holiness in fasting beggerly apparel wandering up and down the world To which I answer Our holiness is in Christ But you that scorn fasting and wandering up and down scorn that which the holy men of God ever owned Heb 11. 37 38. Christ fasted and the Prophets and Apostles were in fastings often Christ wandered up and down and had not whereon to lay his head and many followed him And the Apostles wandered to and fro and had no certain dwelling place 1 Cor. 4. 11. Now had you lived in their days you would have reproached them as you do those that follow them now and so here I charge you to be acted by a contrary spirit to Christ the Prophets and Apostles And for beggerly apparel you that reproach us because that we have cast off needless pride and excess for no other beggerly apparel do I know used amongst us you would have reproached those who wandered up and dow in sheeps skins and goats skins lodged in dens and caves of the earth for such were hated by your generation then as we are now And now let all judge by what spirit you are acted who would make the world believe these were the fruits of the man of sin and the mystery of the Babylonish iniquity And for your smiling at my weakness in saying that Gog and Magog are gathered together against Christ and his kingdom which you would put far off from your selves to the Turks and Saracens at the conversion of the Jews I tell you The Jews are converting and you are of those Heathens who are banding together against Christ with Gog and Magog who is king of the Jews and you are discovered to be enemies unto him and the Trumpet is sounded and the Battel is begun and your rage is great with the rest of the Heathen But the Lamb must take the kingdom blessed be our God for ever And whereas you accuse me for saying that you can scarcely agree among your selves in that which you call the worship of God Have I spoken here any thing but truth as they that know you may witness with me though you would put it off to matters of Discipline And you accuse A. P. to report it which is false and here I charge you Priests to minister lyes and to slander him for he hath not reported it to me But it seems your consciences accuse you and you would charge it upon him but your practice reports it And whereas you say this doth not make you like Herod and Pilate neither do I say that onely doth but your joyning together in one against Christ and his kingdom and your hatred against the truth therein you resemble them And whereas you bring Paul and Peter to warrant your divisions you may let their conditions alone for few in the Nation live more unlike Paul and Peter then you therefore go not about to make them like your selves who live in pride and covetousness as Lords and Masters over your hearers suing or compelling them to pay you tythes or wages running from place to place for more money and call that your call to the Ministery and deny the immediate call of Christ and the word of the Lord coming to you which the Apostles never did therefore for shame never compare your selves to the Apostles who are found amongst the hirelings and false prophets And whereas you would excuse your selves from speaking evil of our forsaking the world and would cover it over with deceitful words Let any that reads your words judge if they be not spoken in reproach to that our practice who call it but a pretence and our obedience in answering the call of Christ in forsaking the world this you call a sinful neglect of our families And do you not belye the Apostle when you say he calls those the rudiments of the world And do not those who forsake the world forsake the pride and lust of it which you live in And whereas you say it is a sinful neglect of our families and you know it to be a sin and yet you say you speak not against the world in its proper Gospel-sense and you instance Fox and Nayler as two evident examples of it And you say We do sinfully neglect our callings To which I answer Jesus Christ having called us forth by his immediate voice to leave all and follow him to do the work he hath for us to do Whether obeying and coming forth contrary to our own wills taking up our Cross and following him or disobeying and abiding in our estates and pleasures in the world now in a Gospel-sense whether of these is a sinful neglect of our callings let the Scriptures of the Prophets and Apostles and all the holy men of God judge who have been called and obeyed and come forth and condemn you and your slander who are ignorant of the call of Christ and do oppose it in them who obey it and call it sinful and you bring Scriptures to oppose it which will fall upon your own backs As for providing for our families 1 Tim. 5. 8. they are provided for by him who provides for us

and Greek bond and free Col. 3. 11. And this is the true light that enlightens every one that comes into the world John 1. 9. John 8. 12. And you say you have fully proved that all men in the world do need an outward light and that it is the way of Christ to make himself known by outward discoveries and you say you have proved it by arguments I answer Your deceitful arguments I deny and they are no proof to me nor any that fear God who receive that truth by the Spirit and not by arguments but bring one Scripture in plain words that all men need an outward light or that an outward discovery is the way by which Christ makes himself known to his people and till then I deny you and your Philosophy and prove one Saint that ever knew Christ since his ascension but by revelation And what talk you of preaching the Gospel who denies the immediate call of Christ or any hearing his voice or to talke of Officers given for perfecting of the Saints which say none shall ever be perfect while they live which shew you to be none of those Officers given by Christ for the perfecting of the Saints for you plead against such as witness that work and that end And whereas you say That the light spoken of 2 Pet. 1. 19. that Peter doth not send them to a light within but to books and words of the Prophets which Scripture shall witness against your deceit and blindeness for the Apostle exhorts them to wait on the light til the day dawn and the day-star arise in their hearts which is not without nor in books and if the testimony of the old Prophets was a more sure word then that which Peter heard from the mouth of God then it must needs follow that the testimony of the old Prophets who spoke but darkly of Christ and did not see his day though they desired it must be a more sure testimony then the Apostles who were his eye-witnesses and the words of books a more sure word then the voice that came from heaven which was the immediate voice of God which blinde absurdity all who have the Spirit of prophesie which is the sure word and testimony of Jesus shall condemn your blindeness who knows not that sure word of prophesie that was in them And whereas you wish the Reader to observe that Nayler cries down the Scriptures as needless here you would have the Reader to observe your lyes for though the letter doth not discover Christ but the Spirit yet it is not useless for it is a witness against your practice opinions traditions and casts you all amongst the false Prophets and hirelings and herein it is of use and authority and also is a witness without against all who will not own the witness within nor do I cry down the publishing the Gospel by the Ministery nor the hearing God and his word but you who deny the immediate call and the word of God coming to any now denies both the word and Ministery which we own and witness The twelfth Position That there is no need of any outward teaching by reading or hearing the Scriptures opened or applyed And herein you accuse me of shuffling railing and lying because I say you apply the promises of God to them who are in the first birth and preach them up all believers and say men must commit sin while they are here and sow pillows under mens arm-holes now is not this true of you who sprinkle Infants by the faith of their Parents and calls them your flock and receives them to your Ordinances and do you not here preach them up believers within your liberty or Parish though they live in sin and here you sow pillows under every arm-hole and then do you not fine them who refuse to pay you Tythes or hire and so you prepare war against them who put not into your mouthes And you hold forth that none can be free from sin while they live Now where are the lyes or what wrong have I done you let any that is spiritual judge for lying I abhor or to wrong any but I speak the truth of you as your practice doth witness And in your answer to that Scripture which saith They shall no more teach every man his neighbour saying Know the Lord Heb. 8. 11. This you say doth onely concern the children of God and such as have their sins pardoned wherein you exclude all your Parish people from the children of God and pardon of sin for how many have you that are taught of God and needs not your teaching as you say I desire your hearers that they would consider of it that so they might come to the teachings of God and so witness the children of God and sin pardoned and so to witness the everlasting Covenant and no need of your teachings And whereas you tell of 4 Arguments and above 30 plain Scriptures in your Perfect Pharisee Your Arguments I deny and sees them to be deceit and there is not one of the thirty nor in the whole book that doth plainly witness to your way of teaching but the whole Scriptures are against you and all that teach for hire and denies the immediate call and the word of the Lord coming to you Jer. 23. 21 32. And you ask why the Apostle wrote to the Hebrews to teach them if that were the meaning that no man should teach their neighbour I answer To draw them to the teaching of Christ as is plain when he tells them of a growth that need no man to teach them and though he say You have need that one teach you again which is the first Principle of the Oracles of God doth he say this to continue them in a need of that as you would inferre or to shame them that they were not yet grown up to the teachings of God Heb. 6. 1. and out of mans teachings towards perfection And whereas you alledge the exhortation of the Apostles we own it which was to draw up to the light and teaching as is plain in their exhorting them to wait for the appearing of Christ who was their light and life Col. 3. 4. And whereas you say You press all to struggle after that perfection they do not yet enjoy now how this agrees with your saying they shall never be perfect while they live and what encouragement you give them to struggle is evident who tells them they must struggle but never prevail while they live And here you are found to be the juglers you speak of whose teaching is yea and nay And whereas you charge me with casting dirt upon the Scriptures because I say the Holy Ghost did not put it into Chapters and Verses but the hireling-Priests to trade withal Here you appear to be false accusers and the railers and lyars you speak on for I have not spoken one word against the Scriptures but own them as the Holy Ghost gave them forth The thirteenth

A DISCOVERY Of The Man of Sin Acting in A Mystery of Iniquitie Pleading for his Kingdom against the coming of Christ to take away Sin OR An ANSWER to a Book set forth BY Tho. Weld of Gateshead Richard Prideaux Sam. Hamond Will. Cole and Will. Durant of Newcastle By way of Reply to an Answer of James Nayler's to their former Book called The Perfect Pharisee Who call themselves Ministers of Christ but are found ministring for the kingdom of Antichrist Published for clearing the innocency of the Truth from their malicious slanders and discovering their deceits By one whom the world calls James Nayler London Printed for Giles Calvert at the black Spread-Eagle neer the west-end of Pauls 1654. To the Reader TO no mans wisdom are we known nor do we desire by it to be approved but to that in every ones Conscience which is the light of Christ are we made manifest and as that arises by it shall we and what we declare be approved and to that do we speak in every one to be known and by that shall we eternally be witnessed when the book of Conscience comes to be opened Now Reader to strive for the mastery by multitude of words is not the way of the Spirit of God nor wilt thou finde it practised in this Volume but lyes and slanders are denied and plain truth in few words is declared not from the wisdom of man nor to the wisdom of man but for the simple ones sake in obedience to God from a pure Conscience to strengthen the simplicity and of any pure desires which may be in thy minde towards God And if there be any thing by the Spirit of the Lord raised in thee which convinces thee and lets thee see how unprofitably thou hast spent thy time in running from one man to another which call themselves Ministers and hast got no true bread for thy soul but art yet in thy fallen estate thy carnal minde ruling which is death reigning And if thou hast any desire and hungerings after truth and righteousness wait upon the Lord in thy desires and in the light which convinces thee and by the Lord shall thy soul be satisfied And if there be in thee any simple honest desires to know who the false Prophets deceivers and seducers are which in this day of the Lord is to be revealed go not to any man to know but wait in the light which is in thy conscience which shews thee sin in thy self which light will discover the man of sin in the world for that is the brightness of his coming and of this light every one hath a medsure though these five and all that love the deeds of darkness who would not be discovered strongly deny it and such are against Christ the light of the world and there is Antichrist discovered and the man of sin and here in thy measure thou art partaker of the same light by which these five and all their generation are discovered and have been in all generations by the children of light and thereby are we separated out of the kingdoms of the world into the kingdom of Christ for which they hate us and would devour us but Michael our Prince is risen and the war is begun with the Dragon the Beast and the false Prophet but the Lamb shall take the victory and wo unto them that are found upholding the Beast and the false Prophet for he that helpeth and they that are holpen shall fall together for now the Lord is risen to be avenged of his enemies and down they must though their number be as the sand of the sea for multitude Take heed whom you side with you Powers of the earth Friends I was moved in my Answer to your Perfect Pharisee at the end of it to write a few words to you five who had subscribed that book that upon the consideration of the many lying slanders there cast upon us some gathered by false reports and some out of books which books did witness so plainly against you both to you and to all that have read them that if it might have been the will of God any of you might have searched your conscience by that light which would teach you to do as you would be done by and have come to repent and found mercy for so I thought that perhaps some of them may be drawn to believe lyes through report that when they see them laid open will not persist in it for so was my heart in love to you if there had been but any innocency in any of you ●hat it might have been awakened to have pleaded against the deceit and led you out of it which was and is my desire But since you are the same yea worse according to that Scripture Evil men and seducers grow worse and worse wherefore I leave you to the righteous Judge of all causes and for the sake of the simple who else may come to be deceived by your subtilties and slanders proceed to lay open some of your deceits in plain words as God shall move A Discovery of the Man of Sin Acting in a Mystery of Iniquity ANd first a few words to your boastings wherein you would make me vile and contemptible and glory much in what you have done as though you were the only men and had overturned all before you To which I answer You might have spared your great boastings of your selves if your pride would have suffered you and have left it to the Judgment of those who are guided by a spirit of Judgment both yours and mine to have been judged of for it is not your great swelling words that can overturne the truth but you must appear to be proud boasters that the Scripture Rom. 1. 30. 2. Tim. 3. 2. Jam 4. 16. may be fulfilled upon you in this as it is in other marks left in Scripture by which those of your generation have been known and are at this day 1. You charge me That I have not sufficiently answered your Book called The Perfect Pharisee To which I answer That which moved me to write what I did in answer to the slanders in it was not to satisfie your wils nor wisdom nor any who stand in their own wils or wisdom for then had I become a man-pleaser Gal. 1. 10. and should have forsaken the direction of the spirit of God which did never in any age serve and seed the serpents wisdom but what it spoke was foolishness and a mystery to the wisdom of the world and it is the same at this day But that which moved me was for the simple ones sake lest he should come to be deceived by the sleights of your slanders and by the envious serpent And I know and am assured it hath and shal accomplish the end for which it was sent forth and shall not returne in vain but shall be a savor of life unto some according to his purpose by whom it was sent forth for it was not my

and they want nothing And as for those that do not work that they should not eat and those who live disorderly not working at all 1 Thess 3. 10. 11. how are you not ashamed to take these Scriptures into your mouthes when all that know you may witness this against you that no sort of people in the Nation lives like you for idleness like beasts and swine for 1. Your families are provided for by the sweat of other mens brows 2. You are those that walk disorderly not working at all and therefore ought not to eat 3. And for abiding in our callings we are in them and there abide with God but you are crept in and are not called of God by your own confession who never heard his voice And whereas you make an Objection lest we should say that the Apostles left their callings and followed Christ and you say 'T is true the Messiah had his disciples following him but Paul after Christs ascension left a standing rule say you for all to abide in their callings As if when Christ should ever call out any more they should not obey him as though Paul had left a standing rule to the contrary And thus you bring Paul to oppose the commands of Christ and one Scripture to cross another and yet would not be counted wresters of Scriptures nor opposers of Christ But you are found out and can no longer be hid And whereas you tell of them who were called forth having an immediate call and to pub like work in the Ministery herein I say silence flesh who knows nothing of that immediate call to that publike work but denies it And whereas you tell of Paul reproving Christians for leaving their callings I answer Did Paul reprove them for leaving all and coming forth at the commands of Christ O with what subtilty do you go about here to make people believe that Christ should never call out any more not they obey And whereas you tell that a man may forsake the world and yet enjoy his possessions in it I answer Such a forsaking of the world pleaseth you well and so do you forsake the world when you leave one Parsonage to go to a greater Living and this is all the forsaking of the world that you know or can judge of But did ever any that Christ called forth to be Ministers forsake the world so but they left all at his command And whereas you tell of using this world as not abusing it and many such-like words which you know nothing of I answer When you come to live in what you speak and so to use this world you will cease to compel your hearers to pay you Tythes or Money for your hours talk or one to pull out another for greater Livings for he who spoke those words did no such things and till you come to live that life you have nought to do with those words And whereas you say you spoke not a sillable of the pride and lusts of the world in your Epistle but it is foisted in by James Nayler I answer Doth not he that forsakes the world forsake the pride and lusts of it which you live in and seem to speak evil of them that do forsake the world as is plain in your book and then what wrong have I done you for I do not charge you with the words but with the thing And now for those things you have set down as trivial observances they are these our not saluting which we witness a command to the contrary our not putting off the hat before the Magistrate wherein we have the example of Christ and all the Apostles and Saints and are plainly forbidden to have the faith of Christ in respect of persons and our Thouing every one which is the Scriptures language and none of the holy men of God ever used any other to a particular and our not calling men Masters which is the command of Christ in plain words Now you that call your selves Ministers and call the commands of Christ trivial observances I charge you in the presence of the living God to be in the doctrine of devils and there are seen by all the children of the light and makes it plainly appear how little you regard the language of the Scriptures given out by the Spirit of God or the practice of the Saints who were guided by the same Spirit or the express commands of Jesus Christ but stand up to maintain the customs of the world against all these and here you plainly appear to whom you belong for you who are guided by the spirit of the world stand up to maintain the customs of the world and they that are guided by the Spirit of God are led into the same way words worship and obedience that those walked in who were guided by the same Spirit before them and none can live in the kingdom of Christ and conform to the customs of the world neither doth the Apostle speak of any of these when he saith Touch not taste not handle not as you would make people believe but of your carnal Ordinances And whereas you say we place Holiness and Religion in these things It is false our holiness is in Christ but these things we cannot neglect being the commands of Christ to us and practice of the Saints in Scripture And whereas you say we will not submit to Christs righteousness I charge you to be lyers and slanderers and that we also deny many other truths with full opposition to Gospel Ordinances Prayer Baptism Supper Church-Government and Ministery which is all false and a lying slander for the righteousness of Christ we own and in him alone are we made the righteousness of God 1 Cor. 5. 21. But your righteousness which live in sin and talk of righteousness without you and are not made conformable to Christ but are conformable to the world that righteousness we deny And Christ the Gospel-Ordinance we own and deny your carnal Ordinances and set Forms And Prayer we own which is with the Spirit and as the Spirit helps our infirmities so we ask and receive of the Father and deny the vain bablings of you Heathen and you that under pretence make long prayers And the Supper of the Lord we own which is spiritual and deny your carnal Sacrament for which there is no Scripture and your mixt multitudes The Baptism of Christ we own and are baptized by one Spirit into one body And the Holy Ghost and the fire we own and do witness but deny your sprinckling of Infants for which there is no Scripture Church-government we own and Jesus Christ the head and governour of his Church to whom we submit but deny your Classes Assemblies and Masterships by which you rule and govern in your own wils the Ministers we own which is of Iesus Christ and immediate call to it and deny all whose call is mediate and are made ministers by the will of man and here I charge you in

cometh into the world and to be in all when the Scripture saith There is neither Greek nor Jew circumcision nor uncircumcision Barbarian Scythian bond nor free but Christ is all and in all Col. 3. 11. which Scripture doth plainly witness against you though you deny it to your shame who would reason against the infiniteness of Christ who filleth Heaven and Earth and here I charge you to be ignorant of the Scriptures and blinde guides And you undertake to open that place John 1. 9. In the beginning was the Word all things were made by him and in your opening of it you say this was not Christ nor a knowledge of Christ as Mediator nor a light sufficient to bring to salvation when John saith he came to bear witness to that light and that Word became flesh and dwelt amongst us and in him was life and the life was the light of men and this was the true light that inlightneth every one that cometh into the world and we saw his glory as the glory of the onely begotten Son of God full of grace and truth and John bare witness of him saying This is he of whom I spake He that cometh after me is preferred before me and this you deny to be Christ nor a knowledge of Christ nor a light sufficient to salvation but call it a created light and here you are witnesses against John and what he witnesseth of Christ and the sufficiency of the light of Christ to salvation and this is your opening of the Scriptures whereof all that read that Chapter of John may witness against you and your openings but by such openings as this do you shut the kingdom of heaven neither will enter in your selves nor suffer them that would And whereas you tell of James Naylers wicked blasphemy in affirming that Christ as man dwels in him I answer That is false and those words were not spoken by me for being asked If Christ as man dwelt in me my answer was that Christ I witness who is God and man which words you wrest to slander withal but speake not the words as they came from me and you make much a doe to prove that a natural light is not the light of Christ and thereby would make people beleeve that that light spoken of in the 1 of Iohn is a natural light but so plainly is your deceit layd open to any who know any thing of Christ that your arguments need no further answering Only whereas you would prove in Mat. 13. 11. To you it is given to know the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven to them it is not given there by you would inferre that Christ doth not enlighten every man I answer The light of Christ hath its degrees and measures so that though he be tendred a light to all yet all doe not receive that light nor walke in it but deny it and such come not up to the knowledge of the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven for only to them that received him to them he gave power so that denying the light you deny the power and abide in darkness and are out of the fear of God but the secret of the Lord is with them that fear him and whereas you call that a naturall light which enlightneth every man which cometh into the world and Iohn saith This is the true light which enlightneth every one that cometh into the world here you would make Iohn a lyar and Christ who is the true light to be natural and thus you wrest the Scriptures to your own destruction and all that beleeve you and you say the Apostle 1 of Cor. 2. 14. makes an opposition between naturall and spiritual light and puts an impossibilitie of discovering Christ by the light of nature I answer You bely the Apostle and bewrest his words as you do ours for the Apostle doth not speak there of a naturall light and a spirituall light for that which is naturall is darkness neither have you any Scripture to prove that to be a natural light which enlightens every one that coms into the world but ye children of darkness envy the light of Christ and would make people beleeve its natural and carnal And whereas you say That that mystery was hid from ages and generations It is true it was so but when Christ was manifest who was that light then it was revealed both by Iohn and Christ himselfe saying I am the light of the world he that followeth me shall not abide in darkness but shall have the light of life and whereas you are quarrelling with A. P. A. P. may do it with authority seeing you doe terme the light of Christ to be naturall for denying your distinction of naturall and spiritual light and you say the Lord Jesus and the Apostles are full for it yet have you not brought one Scripture to witness that light we speake of to be a naturall light but we have Christ and the Apostles witnessing against you it to be the light of Christ so that we have the authority of the Scriptures and yours is the novell opinions you speak of and for my saying that Christ must be in the vilest of the world to see the thoughts of the heart and judge the inward part or else how shall he judge righteous judgment upon every thought intent which come not forth into action this word which I spake of Christs being in the most vile you change to dwell in thus by deceit you change my words into your owne language and so go about to confute your own words but not mine as I spake them though I do not say Christ dwels in Hell yet the Scripture saith If I make by bed in Hell thou art there If you knew Christ you would know him that said so Psal 139. 8. and here you priests ignorance is discovered And here you say it is ridiculous to inferre that Christ dwels in all because he knows all things I answer For inferring and dwelling they are your own words but where he seeth any thing there he is present though you blinde creatures see him not but they who know him know that he is infinite and that he fils Heaven and Earth and his presence is the life of all Creatures Ephes 1. 23. and here I charge you to be them that hate the light and stumble Position 5. That Christ in the flesh with all he did and suffered therein was but a figure and nothing but an example And these words you say are expresly found in Sauls Errand which I deny and bring that Book to be a witness against you and that deceitfull Spirit that acts in you and for which you say I pretend neither to Conscience nor modesty that doth challenge you there with a lye I answer if those words that Christ with all he did was but a figure and nothing but an example be expresly found in Sauls Errand then you may say I have done you wrong and I shall confess

in his own power to stand perfect And you are offended that I should say that the book should witness against your false slander and that the word is twice repeated to stand in Gods power and not in his own I answer I shall appeal to any sober Christian who reads the Querie whether the words carry not the very same sense twice over where it is said Able in his power to have stood if they had not for saken his power and consented to the wisdom of the serpent Where if I had spoken of the power of man and woman then it should have been set down their power and not his power which onely holds forth the power of God And for your deceitful reasoning to back your slander wherein you would deny Adam in that state of innocencie to stand in the power of God therein you shew you know not Adam in innocencie nor his standing with God for while he stood he stood in that power and wisdom and counsel of God and the looking out from that was the cause of his fall And here all that ever know Adam in innocencie shall witness against your ignorance and foolishness And whereas you charge George Fox with scoffing at the grace of God and that to pray for the sight of sin and for power from sin is a tempting of God and to pray for light to discover sin and refraining from it are needless I answer This slander comes from the same root of the rest For scoffing at the grace of God it is false I charge you to be lyers in the presence of the living God and you for eternal condemnation for the grace of God he owns as is plain where he saith The free grace of God hath appeared to all men which shews sin and evil which whosoever lives in after it be discovered by the grace of God and yet with a pretence makes a prayer to God to give them a sight of their sins when God hath letten them see their sins freely by his grace and they will not forsake it such tempt God and their prayers are abomination and God will not hear the prayers of them that regard iniquity But how falsly you gather from these words that to pray for power against sin or to refrain from it is to tempt God or a thing needless let any one that fears the Lord judge and witness against your slanderous spirit But wickedness shall be upon the head of the wicked And for the prayers and practice of the Saints which was to overcome and forsake sin them we own and have union with in that which is holy and they witness with us against your practice who live in sin and plead for it and for a pretence make long prayers And for that you call Nayler's lyes because I say you are slanderers which shall appear to be true more and more to all the children of light under your own hands And whereas you would go about to prove Adam in the state of innocencie under the Covenant of Works and that he had the Levitical Law for that is the Covenant of Works I answer What were the works that he was to do for life for the Covenant of Works saith Do this and live but he had the life already while he stood in it and so it was not to be obtained by working and the Scripture saith The Law was added because of transgression which if it had been before the transgression could not have been And Adam in his innocencie stood not by the Moral Law as you call it for that which was given to Adam was Thou shalt not eat which nowhere in Scripture is called the Covenant of Works Thus while you laugh at my ignorance as you say you discover your own wickedness and folly Now to your ninth Position That no man that commits sin or that is not perfectly holy can ever enter into the kingdom of heaven unless there be a Purgatory And in your Reply you think strange that I should deny your wresting of my words to another purpose then for which I spoke them But seeing your charge is grounded upon my Querie why have you altered the words from what I wrote as by inserting the word ever whenas he that hath sinned may repent and so his sin be done away and your adding the words Vnless there be a Purgatory as though I owned a cleansing after death When as the Querie is Whether you own a Purgatory or no who say none can be clean from sin while they live Now I shall appeal to any where there is honesty if you have not wrested my words and you in the Papists minde again in that Querie whenas you charge me with owning a Purgatory which I deny as is plain by these words seeing the tree must lie as it falls this is your deceit which would perswade the Reader to look upon my words according to your false interpretation when you have wrested them and not as I spake them but when my words will not serve you to ground your slanders on as they are set down then you take and alter them for your own ends and that this is not a shuffle and your shuffle I own not which shall stand for your selves but plain dealing in me to clear the truth from your slanders may appear to all who read both our books And whereas you say You have found me out a medium for the washing of the sins of them that die in sins which is neither holiness here nor a purgatory but the blood of the Lord Jesus Now I challenge you to finde one Scripture which saith The blood of Christ cleanseth sinners after death for it is onely effectual to the believers And now let all who know any thing of faith judge if it be not you that are shuffling and put to the pinch you speak of who for clearing your deceit would make people believe that which the Scriptures speak not but is raised in your invention And whereas you charge me with dealing falsly with that Scripture 1 John 1. 7. because I say Doth it say any are cleansed from sin while they personally act sin which I say that Scripture doth not as shall appear to all that read it but quite contrary And whereas you charge me to imitate Satan who when he came to tempt Christ took what Scripture would serve his purpose and leaves out the rest I answer Your slander is false for I mentioned the same Scripture you set down without adding or leaving out and herein I have not wronged you neither will the verse following nor any other Scripture warrant what you speak That a man is cleansed from sin while he personally acts sin but your words are contrary to the words of Christ who saith He that committeth sin is the servant of sin but you say He may act sin and be cleansed from sin Now who deals deceitfully with the Scripture and with mens souls and imitates the father of lyes let