of such as he hath appointed to be the mouth of the Congregation vnto him aÌ„d his mouth vnto theÌ„ So that your patched Leitourgie paraphrases songes in rime homelies and al your dead mens writings are cast forth of the publick assemblies and manifest to be Idols when they are thrust into that place Now where I â—â—ledged that the binding of the publick asseÌ„blie yea of all assemblies to certeyne writings of men euerie day and yeare their number and portion of words daylie moÌ„thly and yearely in al asseÌ„blies the same matter and words reiterated in sâ—ead of powring forth their hearts vnto God according to their present needs and occasions was a setting of themselves in Gods seate and taking the office of his Spirit which only knoweth the wantes of the seueral assemblies according to their diuerse occasions he runneth away from the matter as one vnwilling to heare of this their Tautologia and counterâ—et babling demaÌ„ding wheter euerie one should vtter their owne perticular wantes in the publick assemblie or should pray nothing but that euerie one feeleth the present want of in himself or should tell the Minister before hand what euerie one of their wantes were then how the Minister should remember al. Are these any thing but mâ—re cauils can any of these follow vpon the former doctrine And let him looke againe whether he that is the mouth of the Congregation vnto God in publick prayer must not consider the present publick occasions of that publick assemblie and thereafter frame his prayers all the people ioyning in heart to his words of petition or thanksgiuing saying Amen to so much as he asketh according to the wil of God and neede of the time yea and if they haue not feeling in such prayers they are vnfeeling members yet neither doth he intermedle with private or secret waÌ„tes neither neede they tell him them he is sent for the publick affaires of the Church to commend the seueral actions general and publick vnto God And as they are diverse in everie assemblie so must he be a maÌ„ of wisdome to know see and consider them lest they al rashly step into the house of God to offer vp the sacrifie of fooles and make a counterfeit babling Eccle. 4. Yet the sinne of this is nothing comparable to the doâ—ng your Priests cast forth by pratling ouer your English Portuis which the Lord will one day cast in your faces As then in priuate prayer we are to lay forth our owne wantes and estate of our owne soule which cannot be done by reading an other mans writings alwayes singing one song customably repeating in superstition certeine words our hearts neuer ripped vp examined nor the diseases therof layd open vnto God seeking due cure So the man that is the mouth of the whole assemblie prayeth as the mouth of one bodie for al their open publick present wantes and occasions Which occasions considering the persons and actions are diverse and cannot be written for one assemblie before hand muchlesse for all assemblies in a whole kingdome neither by man nor Angel See theÌ„ the mockerye of your service booke and what Idolatrie is committed by yt to the abandoning true prayer according to the present wantes and occasion The next thing to be coÌ„sidered is about making of lawes in the worship of God Where he would persuade vs that their whole Leitourgie conteining al their publick worship gouernmeÌ„t offices and ordinances of their Church be but matters of order and conveniencie Then the compelling and teaching the publick assemblie to reade ouer mens writings both as CanoÌ„s and lawes in the Church aÌ„d publickly aÌ„d priuately to offer them vp in stead of true prayer aÌ„d holy invocatioÌ„ is a matter of comelines and conveniencie In the meane time it must be a turning away of the whole order and ordinaÌ„ces of God For what is the whole Testament of Christ but an order for euerie office person action in the Church if he wil haue it taxis and then must confesse their Leitourgie an other order of publick administratioÌ„ and so as I haue said an other Gospel an other Testament a setting vp an other worship And herevpon I trust I may cal al this an adding to the word of God yea I wil go a litle further an abolishing and disabling and dishonoring of the word yt self and graces of his spirit And whither all this smoke of the bottomlesse pyt may not be reproued with these Scriptures not only Proverb 30. verse 5.6 Deut. 4. verse 32 but also Revel 22. verse 18 19. let the godly ponder and search and let the fearefulnes of the threats deterre all flesh from presuming to alter the ordinances lawes and worship of the most high God And that the verie reading of an other mans writing for my owne prayer or the prayer of the Church in stead of powring foorth our owne hearts is a changing of the whole worship into the making mens writing an Idoll which is by these places condemned as an accursed sinne let the most hard text as he in carnall wonder exclaymeth be looked into Revel 22. verse 18.19 The words are plaine If anie man put or add any thing vnto these or if anie man take away from these words he shal be iudged as followeth Now if the adding an other whole Worship and suppressing of that God hath apointed be not an adding to these things written gyue sentence as you wil answere O saith he but it is said God wil add vnto such al the plagues written in this booke and there is in this booke mentioned the lake of fire As though the lake of fire is not due for euery sinne and yet not euery one that committeth sinne to be condemned what sinne is it that deserueth not the eternall wrath of God yet not euery one that sinneth giueÌ„ ouer to that iudgmeÌ„t for eiâ—her yt may be of ignorance or of negligence and washed away by repentance in the blood of Christ or it may be repented of and lest when wee see yt Mr. Giffard hath read wel the curses of the law and all the curses due for sinne that seeth not how many curses the law and the Prophets pronounced vpon sinne to call the persons themselues to repentance shewing together the equitie of Godâ— law and yet withal the free mercye of God to al that truly repeÌ„t their euil wayes All that receiue the Beastes marke in their hand or forehead are thretned to be cast with the Beast and false Prophet into that lake yet i doubt not but manie that haue bene so seduced into that sinne shal by repentance be saued Not that I encourage anie to continue in such fearful estate to hardeÌ„ their hearts against the threatnings of GOD but that I would haue Maister Giffard to put difference betwene the curse layd to the sinne and condemnation of the person sinning And seeing he taketh that lake a perticular seuere threat to the Apostasie vnder ANTICHRIST I would he had the grace to
trumperie be brought into the Church off God and there be read reverenced aÌ„d receaued as the sacred word of God thrust vpon mens consciences yea vpon God himself whether he wil or no Is not this presuÌ„ptuously to vndertake to teach the spirit of God and to take away his office which as hath beene said instructeth al the children of God to pray eveÌ„ with inward sighes and grones in expressable and giueth both wordes aÌ„d vtteraÌ„ce yea and as the Apostle Ihon saieth we need no other teacher to these thinges then that annointing which we have receaved and dwelleth in vs. Is not this if they wil haue their written stuffe to be held and vsed as prayer to bind the holy Ghost to the froth and leaven of their lips as yt were to the holy word of God Is it not vtterly to quench and extinguish the spirit off God both in the ministerie and people whiles they tye both theÌ„ and God to their stinted numbred praiers Is this the vnitie and vniformitie that ought to be in al Churches and is amongst al Christes servantes to make theÌ„ agree in a stinking patcherie devised apocrypha leitorgie good for nothing but for cushsions and pillowes for the idle priestes and profane carnal Atheistes to rock them a sleepe and keep them in securitie wherby the conscience is no way either touched edified or bettered Truly I am ashamed to think much more to write of so grosse and filthie abhominacion so generally receaved even of al estates of these partes of the world who have by a popish custom and traditioÌ„ receaued yt one off and from an other without any warrant from the word For the Apostles I am sure these maister builders haue left no such president in or commaÌ„dement vnto the churches neither giuen them any such power to bring in or set vp any such apocrypha Lyturgie in the church of God They alwaies vsed spiritual praiers according to their present waÌ„tes and occasions and so taught all churches to pray alwaies with al maner off praier ond supplication in the spirit and therby to make knowen their wantes and shew their requestes in al thinges vnto God their heaueÌ„ly father Our Sauiour Christ also he taugt his disciples that God is a Spirit and wil be worshipped in spirit and truth He hath likewise set downe most excellent rules and a most absolute forme for al praiers in that part of scripture Mat. 6.9.10.11.12.13 commoÌ„ly but falsly called the Lords praier wherin he hath most notably instructed directed aÌ„d restrained our ignorant and inordinate desires to those excellent heades In which whatsoeuer is needful for vs to desire or lawful for vs to pray is in some one or other of those braÌ„ches included euerie one off the being a base and foundatioÌ„ wherevpoÌ„ and wherby to frame many millions of seueral peticions according to the seueral waÌ„tes and occasions at such several times as the saintes haue cause to pray They are al of theÌ„ so many euerrunning fountaines from which Godes seruaÌ„tes by the holy Ghost deriue and draw coÌ„tinually fresh aÌ„d new graces aÌ„d are al together such an abisme and vnmeasured â—ea of wisdome from which al Christes seruaÌ„tes thorough the world haue alwaies fetched all their knowledg graces confort and assurance of aÌ„d in their praiers according to the capacitie of the vessel of their faith some more some lesse al some yet haue not al of theÌ„ together much lesse any one of theÌ„ is able in the litle dish of his shallow vnderstaÌ„ding to comprise the vnmeasurable depth and greatnes of this Ocean of al wisdome aÌ„d grace Wherby yt is euideÌ„t as also by the circumstaÌ„ces and maner of deliuering the same by our Sauiour Christ by his Apostles Disciples and Churches spiritual vse of praier according to their present estate and wantes that these prescript wordes were not giuen or inioyned as a prescript praier so to be vsed by any even the wisest much lesse the simpler vnbroken vp vnexpounded etc. so much as a compendious summarie of al necessarie knowledg aÌ„d rules for al praier gathered by the Author of all wisdome into a brief for the direction and instruction of our weaknes and ignorance Of which endes aÌ„d vses whiles some are ignoraÌ„t or rather as their grosse idolatrie carnal dulnes and superstitious presumptioÌ„ sheweth are ignorant either what faithful praier or the spirit of God is whiles they both popishly abuse this Scripture as a principal collect in their publike leitourgie with their ofteÌ„ and idle repetition therof fiue times in their morrow masse etc. and also through this abuse they grow further bold to mould a new calfe a new Leitourgie of their owne and set that vp also in the church of God as they count yt Yf yt were granted theÌ„ that this scripture and sundry psalmes and other scriptures they alledg out of the prophetts were coÌ„manded and enioyned to be read and vsed as and for the very praiers of the church and of the Saintes then which nothing can be more false or grosly fond to conceaue yet which way if this were granted them can they hereby proue yt lawful for them to bring in thâ—ir owâ—e apocrypha deuises aÌ„d set them vp in the church as aÌ„d with the holy canonical word of God May their stinking filth be compared or placed with the heaueÌ„ly liuely word of God without vâ—sufferable blasphemie may the froth of their lips and follie of their heartes be thrust vpon mens consciences yea euen vpon the Spirit of God himself in this maner In the church of God may nothing come or be heard but the canonical scriptures aÌ„d liuely graces of Godes Spirit according to the same But these their apocrypha Leitourgies can neither be said the word of God neither the liuely graces of Gods spirit according to the same word seing they were made and conceiued long before and are wholy thus vsed without warrant example or commandement in the word of God yea are contrary to the rules of aÌ„d for praier to the exercise and vse of Gods Spirit and directly set against al the lawes of the first Table by worshipping God in vaine afther their owne traditions preceptes aÌ„d devises and not according to his holy Wil and commandement And agayne in his Refutation of Mr. Giffard he briefly summeth vp in generall some especiall reasons against the common prayer book afore said besides the discuâ—sing of it in particular from point to point His reasons concerning it in generall he thus propoundeth Refutat pag. 49.50 1. In that they presume to giue and enioyne their prescript wordes in praier they take the office of the holie Ghost a waye queÌ„ch the spirit of the ministrie and of the whole Church stop and keepe out the graces of God thrust their owne idle devises vpon the whole Church yea vpon God himselfe vvhether he wil or no 2. In that by their Leitourgie they prescribe vvhat and how much to reade at Morne to their Mattens at
Eauen c. teachinge the church and ministrie to pray by nomber slint and proportioÌ„ it is not onely popish but most friuolous and vaine disgracing and not instructing the Church and ministerie 3. In that by this their Leitourgie they prescribe vnto the Church what Scriptures publiquelie to read and vvhen to reade them as these Chapters and Psalmes at their matteÌ„s before noone those at afternoone c. On all the dayes that they have publique meetings and service through the yeere and so from yeere to yeere They therebie take from the Church the â—olie and free vse both of the Scriptures and spirit off God They therbie conceale and shut out of the Church a great part off Gods holie worde which they reade not As also abuse without order those Scriptures they enioyne to be read 4. In that they shread rend and dismember the scriptures from the holie Order and natural sense of their context to make them Epistles Gospels Lessons select Psalmes to their festivals and idol worship aboue-said They most heinouslie pervert and abuse the Scriptures to the high dishonor of God their owne feareful iudgment 5. In that they bring in aÌ„d coÌ„maunde the Apocrypha writings to be publiquelie read in the Church They both mainetaine and publiquelie teach the dangerous errors therin contayned to the poysoning and subverting of the faith of the church They thrust these devises of meÌ„ into the place of Gods worde causing the people therebie to reverence and esteeme theÌ„ as the holie Oracles of God of like aucthoritie dignitie and truth and to resorte vnto theÌ„ to builde their faith thervpoÌ„ and therbie they bring in an other foundation into the Church besides the high iniurie donne vnto God therbie 6. Finallie in that by this their Leitourgie they bring in erect aÌ„d enioyne a nevv straÌ„ge kinde of administratioÌ„ as is aboue proued in the perticulars They make and erect a new Gospel and so must needes also erect vnto yt a new ministrie For the ministrie of Christ is oÌ„ly bounde vnto aÌ„d vvil onlie administer by Christes Testament vvherein they haue a most perfect Leitourgie for the vvhole administration of his Church Therfore this present Leitourgie and ministrie of EnglaÌ„d are by al these reasons in general and particular founde aÌ„d proved at once to be counterfeite vngodlie and Antichristian Hitherto Mr. Barrow aÌ„d much more in his books afore named as the reader there may fynd Now to conclude the end of publishing these things is to stirre vp al that feare God seriously to mynd what true prayer is and to be carefull to vse it aright according to the word off God which in al thinges faith without which it is imyossible to please God must alway respect and build vpoÌ„ Rom. 10.17 and 14.23 Heb. 11.6 Iosh. 1.7.8 That so we may in this as in all other dutyes of godlynes learne to performe it so as whereby we may be coÌ„forted of God and God may be glorifyed off vs in Iesus Christ. 1603. FINIS ¶ TO THE CHRISTIAN READER TOvvching the treatises follovving know Good Reader that Mr. GREENVVOODS first vvriting concerning read prayer c. vvas by the Prelates taken from him Wherevpon he desired Mr. GIFFORD vvho vvrote against him and had the copy of it to publish it also to the vvorld But he vvould not do it and so by their meanes it yet remayneth suppressed For vvhat cause thou mayest vvell conjecture vvith thy selfe These things Mr. GREENVVOOD himself signifyeth here in the Treatise ensuing Novv if by any meanes that first of his come into thy handes be thou entreated for the truths sake eyther thy selfe to publish it or to deliver it to such as vvill That so the vvhole matter and cariage of it may better appeare to all men for the â—urther manifestation of the truth in this behalf In the meane tyme these are published for thy benefit The Lord give thee so to vse them as may be for his prayse and thy comfort in Christ Remembring alvvay that he is Mediator not for any false vvorship vvhatsoever but for that onely vvhich is according to his vvord Which poynt vvell mynded as it ought vvould soone end the question here controverted and all other the like vvith all such as feare God Mynd it therefore and so farevvell in the Lord. The preface 1. Cor. 2. 11. What man knoweth the things of a man if not the Spirit of man which is in himself Euen so the things of GOD knoweth no man if not the Spirit of GOD. 12. Now we haue receiued not the Spirit of the world but the Spirit which is of God that we might knowe the thinges of GOD giuen vnto vs. 13. Which things we also speak not in the words taught of mans wisdome but in wordes taught of the Holy Ghost we compare spiritual thinges to spiritual thinges My first writing being about that spiritual exercise of praier and true inuocacion of Gods reuerend name whereby the distressed soule of man loaden with the burden of sinne compassed also about with so many deceitfull enimies contynual assaults of Satan rebellion of the flesh entisements of the world etc. seeketh daylie help of God the Father giuer of all good giftes hauing thorough IESVS CHRIST free accesse by the direction of his holy spirit for all occasions to vnburden yt self of whatsoeuer grief or occasion of thankes yt is moued with I ought still and by Gods assistance shall keepe me in the meeknes of the spirit not witstanding his vnchristian railinges sclanders and reproches against me and the truth I then shewed that no other prayer could vtter and ease the seuerall occasions and distresses of this conscience and that no other mans writing could speake for this soule vnto God but the heart and mouth of him that prayeth for himself or is chosen the mouth of many vttering to God his or ther mindes for their present wantes or occasions of thanckes giuing according to the will of God as neede and occasion vrgeth and the spirit giueth vtterance And I furder proved that onlie this prayer pleaseth God and is grounded of faith to this effect I brought many reasons out of Gods worde admiring the ignorance of this age wherin hauing had the gospell of Christ thus manie yeares in our owne language to search and try al things by whole congregations do make no other prayer to God then reading ouer certeine numbers of wordes vpon a booke from yeare to yeare moneth to moneth day to day c. the same matter and words as they were stinted euen out of that Portâ—is englished out of Antichrists masse-booke besides priuate reading of mens writings instead of praying And seing this counterfeit shew of worship and pretended prayers was made common marchandize in euery assemblie by this Antichristian priesthood and that al men euery where were compelled to bowe downe herevnto and to offer by such counterfeit sacrifices I perceaved the first principle of Religion which is to inuocate the name of
spirit is by the worke of the spirit to bring fourth of our hearts praier to God which is than in truth when yt agreeth to Gods word But reading is another matter namely a receauing of instruccion into the heart from the booke Out of the first Mr. GIFFORD maketh men beleeue he hath fetched two heresies the one a perfection of faith the other that faith cannot be ioyned vnto or stand vvith anie outvvard helpes for the encrease therof Litle marueile he found so mâ—nie heresies in our whole writinges that could finde two or three in my first reason but that you may remember your self better though you had two yeares to consider I will bring the wordes before you againe if peradventure you may have grace to call backe yourself I said if the sighes and groanes in that kinde of praying were of faith yt would minister matter without a booke this sentence I may confirme by manie testimonies of scripture that no peruerted spirit can gainesay or resist the scripture teacheth vs euery where that in praying the spirit onlie helpeth our infirmities no other helpes mentioned or can be collected in the present action of prayer through the Scripture He hath sent into our hearts the spirit of his Sonne crying ABBA Father vve beleeue therfore vve speake Yet here is not anie shew of perfectioÌ„ of faith but of the contrary praying for our wantes But this may be gathered that God onely accepteth the fruits of his owne spirit in prayer and requireth no more of anie but that euerie one according to the proportion of faith pray vnto him as occasion in them requireth Nowe to conclude that because in praying we neede not a booke to speake for vs when the heart it self and booke of our Conscience speaketh with God that therefore fayth neuer needeth instruction but is perfect were sclanderous false and senselesse The cause then of these heresies proceed hereof that your selfe Mr. GIFFORD would needes frame two syllogismes and in the moodes of your malice coÌ„straine the proposition of the present action in praying to a general sentence of all times and actions though both our question here was of the verie action of praying and in the conclusion of that very poynt within six lynes after this you had these wordes Euen in the time of their begging at Gods hands so that these heresies must be Mr. Giffords and not myne seeing they are found to be coyned of his idle brayne and godles heart only to defame the trueth But say you the most part are ignorant weake short of memorie c. therefore need al helps to stir them vp to pray c. where by your own confession reading is not praying but a help to stir vp to pray And euen hereupon all our errours arise that you cannot discerne the difference of spirituall gifts with the distinct vse of them We doubt not but before prayer and all the dayes of our life we haue neede of helps of instruction to praye aright and for the fitnes of the mind and bodie often fasting reading meditating etc. are great helpes to go before to humble our selues in praying but in the present action of prayer when the heart is talking with God the eyes hands etc. with attention lift vp to heaueÌ„ al the powers of our soules and bodies conuersant with God to take a booke and read cannot be called in this action a help but a confounding of the mind of Gods ordinances and a doing we know not what though before and after it be an excellent meanes ordeyned of God to instruct vs to pray and al other dueties As for the confirmation you talke of where I alleadged that a troubled minde is the penne of a readie writer therfore needeth not a booke to speake for yt in the action of praying By troubled minde i vnderstood such a minde as is preseÌ„tly moued with the sight of some sinne or vrged by other occasion a broken spirit a broken and contrite heart aÌ„d not such a minde as in dispayre or doubt ys perplexed and that the heart which is moued in faith with present occasion to call vpon God is the penne of a readie writer that is hath matter aÌ„d wordes enough without a boocâ— to vtter yt owne wantes we may reade throughout the Psalmes My throte is dry saith David I am vvearie with crying c. But here againe instead of answere you tell me I runne vppon the rocke of an hereticall opinioÌ„ of perfection Wherin i wonder but that i perceaue your right eye is blinded you should be so carelesse what you say nay what after two yeares studie you put in prynt Doth it follow that because the heart moued with occasion through the worke of faith hath wordes and matter enough in praying without a booke to speake for yt that therfore faith is perfect let equal Iudges coÌ„sider Here you say manie are so troubled perplexed in minde that they cannot pray till they haue some consolation by the direction of others which wheÌ„ they cannot haue reading vpon a booke is a notable help I allowe al this and agree if you would make reading one thing and prayer an other divers exercises of the spirit etc. But in the verie action of praying to haue an other speake vnto vs never so good wordes of exhortation were but a confounding of the minde and actioÌ„ and an abuse of both those holie exercises Euen so by your owne comparison reading vpon a booke in the action of praying seing we cannot do both at once Yt is the Spirit of God in the verie action of prayer that helpeth our infirmities David in praying finding his soule heauie stirreth vp himself thus My soule whie art thou cast downe whie art thou disquieted within me waite on God For I will yet giue him thaÌ„kes my preseÌ„t help and my God He had a troubled minde his mouth wanted no wordes to prouoke the Lorde to heare his complaint and his heart to waite vpon the Lorde and so through all the Psalmes you shall finde the conversing of the soule with God to be such as yt were a mockery to think reading vpon a booke could haue anie place in that action or that anie mans writing could lay out the present estate of the soule with the passions therof The Priest may say my booke whie art thou so euill prynted for wheÌ„ they reade the heart caÌ„not reasoÌ„ and talke with God To the second poynt which was but your bare assuming of the question to say a man may pray by the spirit vpon a booke c. I alleadged that to worship God in spirit is when the inward faith of the heart bringeth fourth true invocation etc. this you graunt to be most true and that none other is accepted of GOD then that which proceedeth from the inward faith of our owne heart But you think that reading vpon a booke is to bring fourth of the heart true inuocatioÌ„ This cannot be if we consider the difference
betweene proseuche and anagnosis prayer and reading the one being a powring fourth of vowes petitions supplications the other a receaving into the soule of such things as we reade This therfore i leaue to all mens consciences to be considered whether the matter we reade can be said a powring fourt of the heart the whole vse of those divers actions through the whole Bible shew yt cannot Now where I said that you teach men insteade of powring fourth their hearts to help them selves with matter and wordes out of a booke you say I speake fondlie and foolishlie etc. Mine answeare now is yt is well I lyed not if I had said you compell men to reade vpon a booke in all your publique assemblies certaine wordes of your owne writings by number and stint from yeare to yeare and day to day the same instead of powring out their hearts before the Lorde for their present waÌ„ts I had not lyed Now let all men by that which hath bene said consider the grossnes of yt and so the follie remayneth to your self But to help this matter and to deliuer your self conningly in such strayte you saâ— you wish all men to vse the help of the booke that they migt the better powre fourth their hearts vnto God being such as are not throughly able First you graunt here the prayers read vpon the booke is not the powring fourth of the heart but ought to be vsed only as an help wherbie you graunt the whole question and furder all your assemblies haue had no other invocation of Gods name this many yeares but a help to teach theÌ„ to powre fourth their hearts But whether mens writings may be read in the publique assemblies to this vse we shall after make manifest Here yt is graunted but an help and not the powring fourth of the heart And to whom is yt an help to such as are notable to pray Here eyther you must confesse your whole ministerie is vnable to pray or that they transgresse in this high worship of GOD for in an other place you graunt in all your assemblies this reading is vsed of mens writings for prayer thus you may behold your best worship to be nothingh but a help to teach you to pray Where I said that you teach men to fetch the cause of their sorrowing from the booke euen in their tyme of begging at GODS hand you say I speake fondly to call that the cause which is the manifestacion of the cause etc. You here forget your artes Is ther no more cauâ—es then one if yt be the instrumentall cause it is sufficient to prove that if your Mininisters had not their booke they had nothing to aske or els asking that which is in the booke they aske not that wich before was in their owne heartes so not comming heauie loaden they goe emptie away and leave the matter in the booke as they founde yt till the next day and then sing the same songe But true prayer is when the heart is first prepared and moued with the sight of their wants as the child that asketh breade So we should not pray of custome but aske the verie thing wherof our heart feeleth the wantâ—et Your comparison againe betwixt the being stirred vp by a Sermon and stirred vp by reading sheweth that your self will not make the reading the powring fourth of the heart Ther is no question but the exercise of reading is chieflie for instructioÌ„ and encrease of knowledge and meditating is not the same nether can be said to be al the vse of reading though we denie reading to be praying but because we are forbidden conteÌ„tion about wordes and I have offred you as much wrong in saying you denyed reading to be for meditation at all I will proceede to the more necessarie doctrines Also for the controversie of Canonicall and Apocryphall we shall speak in due place Thus say you you have answered nothing at all vnto this Commandement giuen by our saviour Christ to vse that prescript forme of prayer say Our Father c. but by shift cauill c. Here you thinke you haue put me to a plunge your self needed nothing doubt but that I allowed the CoÌ„maundement holie and good and to extend to al Christians as well as to the Apostles namely to vse that prescript forme of prayer as the perfect patterne and direction to all mens true prayers But you I trust will make difference betwixt a forme to all prayers and praying or prayer And here you vehemently vrge me to answeare you before I see you conclude any thing froÌ„ the place and so I should runne into follie to answeare a matter before I heare yt In your first entrance of this discourse you were rounde in your Syllogismes by two at once to wrast my wordes and can find none for yourself Yt seemes your conscience is witnes the matter would not hang togeather And me thinkes you had never more neede to haue shewed what you would drawe from this place Luke 11. seing I either mistooke you last time or els you make a simple collectioÌ„ which was this Christ said to his Disciples when you pray say Our Father c. and not when you meditate say Our Father Now what would you conclude of this except as I said that Christ would not haue them meditate that Scripture But this I perceaue was not your meaninge now I partlie thinke your Argument should be if the sworde were not brokeÌ„ in the sheath thus Christ commaunded his Disciples when they prayde to say Our Father c. therfore to be tyed to reade ouer or say by roate certeine wordes is law full praying For the first that our Sauiour Christ tyed no man or commaunded none to say ouer those verie wordes when they prayde but to pray according to that forme after that maner as Matth. 6. I manifested in my first writing 1. that our Sauiour did not commaunde vs to vse those wordes 2 that Matth. 6. doth not keepe the same wordes nor that number of wordes which Luke 11. doth 3. that he did not say read these wordes when you pray or say these wordes by roate After all which reasoÌ„s slilye passed away in both your answeres you come with your bare affirmation that he commaunded those wordes to be said ouer by roate or reading yea a litle after you say it is false to say that he commaunded not the verie wordes to be said ouer when we pray And you furder conclude that because Christ commaunded his Disciples to say ouer those wordes therfore all mens writings in the forme of praier may be brought into the publique assemblies to be read for praier being agreable to the worde To which I aÌ„swere that seing no maÌ„s writings are without error yt is pernitious and blasphemous doctrine you collect First because you make mens writings of equal autority with the forme of praier which Christ hath prescribed 2 for that you gyue meÌ„ as much liberty and authority to frame and impose their
Liturgies as Christ had to set downe a forme of praier he being Lord of the house The wickednesse of which collections you shall neuer be able to answeare And because you here vrge me therunto I will make answeare to your two places of Scripture wherwith by false interpretation you deceaue the simple which taken from you your matter is nothingh but cauilling The places are these Luce 11. Nom. 6. and because the one explanes the other and your collections the same from both I will beginne with nombers 6.32.33.34 etc. Thus shall you bless the Children of Israell saying the Lorde bless thee keep thee c. Here you say they were commaunded to vse the verie wordes prescribed in all their blessings This I say is not true for the Hebrew worde is Coh Tebaracu thus shall you blesse wher the worde Coh is an aduerb of similitude as we say after this maner which cannot be to say the same but according to the same instructions This worde Coh is ysed throughout the Bible in this maner in all the Prophets wheÌ„ they say thus saith the Lorde where the summe of their prophesies are onlie recorded to vs by the holy Ghost aÌ„d not all the wordes Againe this blessing is vsed in the Psalmes and Chronicles in prayer for the people in manie other wordes Ely blessed Hanna in other wordes etc. And where by Lâ—ce 11.2 yt is recorded that our Sauiour Christ commaunded his Disciples when you pray say our Father c. yt is playne by the doctrines following 4.5.6.8.11 verses that Christ tyed no man to the verie wordes saying ouer for he teacheth them to aske their particular wants as a childe asketh breade or an egg of his Father also to importune the Lorde for our particular wants But to make this place more playne the same holy Ghost in the 6. of Mathew 9. verse saith when you pray say thus Our Father c. where the greeke word houtos hath the same signification that the Hebrew worde Coh had which is after this maner and cannot be referred to the verie wordes saying ouer wherupon Mr. Calvin vpon those wordes saith Noluit filius dei prescribere quibus verbis vtendum sit The Sonne of God would not prescribe what wordes we must vse Now consider how falslie Mr. Gifford hath interpreted these Scriptures to say the Priests wer commaunded to vse the verie wordes and that Christ commaunded to vse the verie wordes As for his collections that therfore mens writings may be imposed vpoÌ„ publique assemblies by stint and number to be prayde vt is intollerable error and bringeth in all popery Here I must call all men that reade this fruictlesse discourse to be witnes of Mr. Giffords abuse of his tongue to the defacing of Gods truth In his Epistle he proclaymed that I called all men Idolaters which you shall perceaue to be his owne wordes and to that end I will breifly repeat yt In my first writing I affirmed the reading imposed Liturgies by stint aÌ„d limitation instead of true invocation as also all reading meÌ„s writings for praying to be idolatrye In his answeare he said he could not see by what collour yt could be called Idolatrie or maintayned out of Gods worde so to be but yt seemes the penners of these things take euery sinne against the first table of the lawe to be Idolatry if they do so saith he and with all do hold that no Idolater shal be saued then doubtlesse all are lost c. Tothis ignoraÌ„t excursorie I answered that all false and devised worship by mans inuention was Idolatrye as the first and second commandemens did testifie And so admit all the breaches of the first table were not idolatrye yet reading of mens writinges instead of praying must needes be idolatry seing yt is a transgression of the second Commandement Furder though I needed not have followed his emptye head euen a cloude without water yet I proceeded to proue that no idolater could be saved but by repentance for their knowne sinne and craving pardon with David for their hidden sinnes and secreat faults Moreouer said I do you thinke anie man is free from all inward and outward idolatrye seing we cannot keep one Commaundement and in some things we sinne all In which wordes i plainelie reproued his grossnes that concluded all men idolaters which committed any idolatrye and that no idolater could be sauld and distinguished betweene the sinne of ignorance weaknes and inperfection etc. in Gods children and open professed obstinate idolatrie Yet this godles man would lay to my chardg that i should call all meÌ„ idolaters wheras i neuer vsed such a worde in all my writings But only answered his folly in this running out from the question they were his owne wordes that brought this vpon his owne heade by concluding that if euery sinne against the first table were idolatrie and no idolater could be saued then all are lost let the grosnes then be his and not mine And i leaue it to the consideration of all men whether i may not say that they which traÌ„sgresse the first or second Commaundements do commit Idolatrie without absurdity But saith he though yt be so yet the Scripture calleth not the godly murtherers Idolaters etc. for the reliques of sinne remayning I answere that therfore your former absurd cauilling where you said if we hold it Idolatrie etc. ys by your owne mouth fully answered But to auoyde this foyle he hath an other euasion I thought saith he we had reasoned about such grosse idolatrie as a Church is to be condeÌ„ned and forsaken which is defiled therwith Here againe you misreport me I neuer reasoned to that end in this whole discourse but only laboured to shew all men this error of reading meÌ„s writinges instead of praying that they might learne how to conuerse with God and their owne Conscience in prayer And what mendes wil you make for this sclandering and defacing of the truth to all the world all that I desire is your repentance and amendement which God graunt vnto you if you you be his It followeth in your booke thus But seeing you confess thaâ— all men be Idolaters that is touching the remanents of sinne it must needs follow there is no Church free from spots c. This worde idolaters must still be yours and then i willinglie graunt that no man liuing is free from idolatrie concerning the reliques of sinne Also that no Church vpon earth can be without spot vpon earth So that now by your owne coÌ„fessioÌ„ I pleade not for perfection in this life though the more we want the more we ought to endeuour With what face then could you publish me an Anabaptist in your Epistle and out of one mouth giue contrarie sentence Doth your ordinary teach you to cast out such bitter waters of vntruthes was yt possible I should hold al men Idolatres and some men without committing of sinne after regeneration especially to mainetaine both such heresies as you
vsed with vs for that which is not Gods vndoubted worde vnto vs And in your last writing which should have beene your answere you said God speaketh to vs only by the Canonicall Scriptures Now seing you would make your liturgies aÌ„d deuised formes of prayer helpes and instructioÌ„ and yet cannot make them Canonical or Gods vndoubted truth they must not be brought into the publique assemblie much lesse imposed by lawe vpon the Consciences of all men And here remember all your Liturgies are cast out of the doore besides that you have not made in both writinges one direct answere to this most firme Proposition which I will still leaue vpon you thus Only the Canonicall Scriptures liuely voice of Gods owne graces are to be brought into the publique assemblies for doctrine prayer But meÌ„s writings are neyther Canonicall Scripture nor the liuely voice of Gods graces in such as he hath appointed to speake in the publique assemblies Therfore no mans writings may be brought into nor imposed vpon the publique assemblies Thus migt I make an ende with this vayne maÌ„ considering the whole matter is proved against him all that followe being but repetitions of these former cauills but that I must cleare my self of his vnconscionable sclanders The second Argument We must do nothing in the worship of God without warrant of his worde â—ut read praiers haue no warrant in his worde Therfore read prayers are not to be vsed in the worship of God G. Gifford To this I answere at the first that it is a greate audacitie to affirme that there is no vvarrant in the vvorde for read prayers vvhen ther be sundry testimonies to vvarrant the same vnless you vvill make difference betvveene that which a man readeth vpon a booke and that which he hath learned out of the booke Furder I said I do not remember that euer I haue read that God commaunded in the Scriptures the prayer shal be read vpon a Booke c. I. Greenvvood SEing you haue indeed not answered one reason or proof I alleadged in my last writing but with much euill conscience as the handling sheweth perverred them I will leaue them to be iudged of them that shall see my writing And here seing you would not prynt yt I will answere your cheif obieâ—â—â—oâ—â— First then you graunt that if I put difference betweene reading vpoÌ„ the booke and that which he hath learned out of the booke mine Argument to sounde For by your owne confession God hath not giuen anie Commandement to read prayer and so yt hath no warraÌ„t WhervpoÌ„ I gayne thus much First thaâ— they which impose read prayer vpon the Church do that wherof they haue no warrant in the worde and that in the high seruice of God Then that they which reade vpon a booke for praying do that wherof they haue no warrant in Gods woorde whervpon all your Ministers must leaue reading their sâ—nted prayers vpon the booke or els stand vnder Gods wrath and all that so pray with them which wil be a fearefull reckoning if they repent not their sinne shewed them And although our question he cheiflie concerning the reading of mens writings instead of praying yet I am content the other abuse of the Scriptures be included also though I make not both in the same height of sinne as shall appeare in my seuerall reasons As an vnconstant man then you in the latter ende of the answere to this Argument would cal backe agayne that which you here haue granted Namely that there is no Commandement to reade prayer vpon a booke for praiyng Of the contrary thus you reason The people of God did reade the Psalmes vpon a booke wheâ— they did singe therfore men may reade vpon a booke vvhen they pray I deny your Argument besides that all men may see your vnstablenes in denying and affirming with one breath you now go about to make reading of prayer a Commandement thus you prove yt Singing say you is a part of prayer Singing may be read vpon a Booke therfore praier may be read vpon a booke Admit that Singing were a part of prayer yet doth it not followe that all prayer may be read vpon a booke But you speake like an ignorant man to say that Singing is praier seing they are twoo diuers actioÌ„s and exercises of our faithâ— the one neuer read for the other nor said to be a part of the other through the Scriptures but are playnely distinguished 1. Cor. 14.15 what is it then I will pray with the spirit buâ— y will pray with vnderstanding I wil sing with the spirit etc. agayne if you be sad pray and if you be merye sing Psalmes proâ—â—â—xon ai and psalo I will pray and I wil sing are diuers exercises of the faith if a man should say reading a chapter of the scripture and prophecying were all one were he not wide EueÌ„ so euery part of Gods service is not prayer I graunt we are euery where commaunded to singe Psalmes vnto God And alleadged that place of the Apostle to the Ephes. 5.19 Speaking to your selves in Psalmes and Himnes and Spirituall songes etc. aÌ„d that of the Colo. onlie to this end that in Psalmes singing we do not alwaies speake vnto God as in those Psalmes which are only instructions and prophesies in the 1. and 2. Psalmes you have not one worde spoken vnto God Againe as all reading of the prayers in the Scriptures is not praying or speaking vnto God so the reading or singing of Psalmes I tooke to haue beene a speaking to our selves a stirring vp of Gods graces in vs etc. But I do not now nor did not then hold yt so in al Psalmes singing And where you say I purposely left out the latter part in both places which was this sing vnto God with a grace in your heartes the Lorde knowes I had no purpose to injurie the Scripture nor maintayne an vntruth But thought we might do those thinges with a grace to God in our heartes which were not properly aÌ„d directly a conversing by thought aÌ„d worde with him alone but one thing might haue kept you froÌ„ crying out heresie in that I added this that I would not staÌ„d vpoÌ„ that reason but desired to knowe yt furder But how vniustly could you nuÌ„ber this for an heresie maynteyned of vs al in your Epistle that we should denie that Psalmes should be songe vnto God The Lorde keepe me froÌ„ such errour And a wofull Phisition you are if I had bene in such errour For the 102. Psalme I never denied but that yt was a most excellent Psalme penned by Daniell or some other PROPHET aÌ„d gyueÌ„ to the whole Church to be soÌ„ge or read as other Psalmes in the forme of praier But you must prove that the Church did vse yt as you say to reade yt ouer for praying or were coÌ„mauÌ„ded so to do This is proof inoug they did not because yt is a Psalme Now thoug the Church speake manie tymes in the singular
number yet it is expressed in some other verse that yt is so But now admit that you could proue that the psalmes were read insteade of or for invocatioÌ„ which you shall neuer be able to do it doth not followe that meÌ„s writinges shoud be brought into the assemblies and read for praier The 6. of NoÌ„bers I haue answerd before FroÌ„ the 92. Psalme you reason thus If the psalmes other formes of prayer in the Scrìpturés were read or said by rote the verie forme of wordes for praying The reading instead of or for praying Here you durst not set your assumption it was so false which should be thus But the Psalmes other formes of prayer were read for praying c. This I shewed you was verie vntrue they were neuer coÌ„maunded so to be vsed nor never so vsed My proof was this they are giueÌ„ by the holy Ghost for other vses as singing reading etc. aÌ„d not comaunded anie where so to be vsed so that you do but cauill not hauing one proof for all your shameles assertioÌ„s Now where I demaunded what this made for your liturgies aÌ„d reading meÌ„s writinges for praying except you would make your owne writinges of equall authoritie with the Scriptures You aÌ„swere That if I denie the coÌ„sequence it was lawfull to use the Psalmes therfore mens writings theÌ„ I wil shut out all praiers eueÌ„ the prayer of the Pastor See your carnall handling shuffling and coÌ„founding Gods ordinances Doth yt followe that because meÌ„s writinges may not be brought into the publique asseÌ„blies or there read for praying therfore the prayers vttered by the liuely voice of the pastor should herebie be excluded this your shift was answered in the first ArgumeÌ„t your cavils are stale you are againe convinced Touching the other matter of coÌ„ning phrases aÌ„d formes of praier by roate to say ouer certeine number of wordes yt is popish and a meere euasioÌ„ and bewrayeth your ignoraÌ„ce in praier In this you haue granted me that he which prayeth not with a feeling of his preseÌ„t waÌ„ts of his soule but saith ouer certeine number of wordes of custome or affectatioÌ„ he is an hipocrite which is true proved Mat 6.7 Now by this examine your daylie monethlie annuall etc. saying ouer nay reading ouer certeine wordes euery tyme the same as you are stinted It is plaine the sacrifice of fooles Ecclesiastes 4.17 The two pointes wherin you protest so willinglie to agree with me were these First whether only such prayers as were made without the booke were accepted of Gods childreÌ„ Secondly whether the same spirit teacheth vs to pray that taught the holie men of God before tyme. You grant both these but that you would seeme to alter the first question wel then God 's owne spirit that taught theÌ„ to pray without a booke or stinting of wordes teacheth vs so to pray nowe and in the action of praying giueth the mouth to vtter what the heart desireth moved with the same spirit Still then after your long shifting to and fro I trust you will stand to your first wordes that you never read in the Scriptures anie coÌ„maundement for reading of prayers Secondlie to say ouer certeine numbers of words or phrases of the Scripture of custome or affectatioÌ„ without feeling of or asking for our present wantes is hipocresie Therfore I will conclude as I beganne myne Argument standing good that To do any thing in the worship of God werof we have no warraÌ„t of Gods worde is synne But read prayers haue no warrant in Gods Word Ergo. etc. The third Argument We may not in the worship of God receaue anie tradition which bringeth our libertie into bondadge Read praier vpon commandement brought into the publique assemblies is a tradition that bringeth our libertie into bondage Therfore read prayer c. The Minor is thus proved that God hath left it in all mens freedome to pray as the present occasion requireth and the spirit giveth vtterance according to his will Againe no man hath power to commaunde anie thing in the worship of God which God hath not coÌ„maunded etc. Marke 7.7.8.9 Mat. 15. Gal. 5 1. etc. G. Gifford I say it is vngodlie and neere vnto blasphemie to affirme that prescript forme of prayer is a tradition bringing our libertie into bondage c. my reason was is that the Lord by Moses prescribed a forme of blessing c. Nom 6. the Prophetes in the Psalmes have prescribed manie formes of prayer Our Sauiour Christ prescribed a forme of praier c. I. Greenvvood HEre is a greate storme and yet nothing but wynde If you were in Caiâ—has his place you would either have rent your clothes for zeale or els condemne me before you vnderstand what I say Is yt simple dealing do you thinke to say I hold it a bondage breaking our libertie for the Lord by Moses 〈◊〉 Prophetes our Sauiouâ— Christ also to set downe a forme of praier or to prescribe a forme of praier Did you not see that the Minor PropositioÌ„ speaketh of the reading for praing and not of the forme of prayer Agayne of the commandement wher by men are compelled to reade instead of praying Did you not see that these wordes brought in to the publique assemblies did specifye the matter to be mens writtings to be read in the assemblies as a worship yea invocation of Gods name which is a grosse mockery Not that ther is any Commandement to reade ouer those formes of praier mentioned by you for praying and so the CoÌ„mandement so to reade them for praying is an abuse of them and a Commandement of men and not of God etc. But that much more odious yt is to bring in mens writtings into the publique assemblies proved vnlawfull in the first argument and then to commit Idolatrie with them by reading them instead of praying and that to coÌ„pell men by Commandement wher God had set no Commandement 〈◊〉 vse them was a bringing all men into bondage of popish traditions So that your common recitall of these places of Scripture is abuse of them and you do but palinodian canere I thincke if you get St. IHONS gospell about your necke as the Papists you wil thincke you haue religion ynough The more fearful is your Apostacy you proceede from euill to worse G. Gifford About the Commaunding a prescript forme of prayer to be vsed our Church doth agree with all godly Churches yea the reformed Churches haue and do practize the same here therfore I wish the reader to obserue that you Brovvnists do not only condemne the Church of England but all the reformed Churches whatsoeuer and can be no other but Donatistes I. Greenvvod I Trust your madnes will appeare to all men the poyson of Aspes is vnder your tongue he that cannot rule his tongue his Religion is in vayne Shall I in your heaâ—e be pressed with multitude of Churches theÌ„ heare what the Lorde saith Thou shalt not followe a multitude to do euill we have the worde amongst
Yet you would make meÌ„ belieue I reasoned thus that the Apostles did not nether our Sauiour himself nor anie that we reade of vse these wordes in prayer therfore they did not use yt Nay I said they did not vse those verie wordes in their prayers but vsed other wordes according to their particular wants as our Sauiour in the 17. of Iohn is said to do therfore he nether vsed nor coÌ„maunded others to say ouer those wordes And so I may well conclude that to impose certaine wordes to be read or said by roâ—te for praying vpoÌ„ the church espeaciallie meÌ„s writings is an intollerable pride euen a setting of men in the place of God Also to vse them or bowe downe vnto them in that order is sinne and breach of Gods lawe The fourth Argument Because true prayer must be of faith vttered with heart liuely voiâ—â— It is presumptious ignorance to bring a booke to speake for vs vnto God c. The fift Argument To worship the true God afther an other maner then he hath taught is Idolatrie But he Commaundeth vs to come vnto him heavie loaden vvith contrite heartes to cry unto him for our vvantes c. Therfore we may not stand reading a dead letter instead of powring fourth our petitions The Sjxt Argument We must striue in praier with continuance c. But we cannot striue in praier be importunate with continuance reading vpon a booke Therfore we must not reade when we should pray G. Gifford These 3. I ioyned togeather as hauing no weight you say I answeare by plaine contradiction without Scripture c. And afterwardes is not my bare deniall as good as your bare affirmation c. I. Greenvvood STay your selues and wonder they are blind and make blind Is ther anie doctrine more spirituall anie more inculcated by the Holy Ghost then this accesse vnto God in the mediation of 〈…〉 owne spirit to make our mindes knowne vnto God to offer vp the 〈…〉 owne spirit in vs and fetch encrease from him by this 〈…〉 true 〈◊〉 with the heart and voiâ—e This colioquie with the highe â—â—iestie of God is it a mâ—rter of no weight to learne to discerne betweene 〈◊〉 exercises of the spirit and to exercise his graces aright according to 〈◊〉 Rightly is it â—aid the wisedome of God is foolishnes to the naturall man But Mr. GIFFORD wil say he graunteth the propositioÌ„s true and weightie matters 〈◊〉 is the Assumptions that be so friuolous and as he saith a litle after ridiculous wel let them be weyed 1. That reading instead of praying is not a powringh fourt of the heart by liuely voyce 2. That it is a quenching of the spirit to reade an other mans wordes vpon a booke in the very action of powring fourth our heart as we pretend 3. That yt is not an vnâ—ordening of a contrite heart by faith but an ignorant action to reade for praying 4. That we cannot sâ—riue in prayer continue in prayer be importunate etc by reading vpon a â—ooâ—e These are the 〈◊〉 he tâ—incketh of so litle weight the bare deniall and contradiction wherof he holdeth of such credit that it must suffice for answeere seing he sa it he hath before proued the vse of reading See here he calleth yt the vse of reading he could not say that reading is praying nethâ—r that these twoo exercises of our Faith can be vsed both in one instant as one action I haue sheweed that proâ—â—che and anâ—gnosis praying and reading are divers actioÌ„s both of the minde and body let the reader consider what weight then this matter is of to talk with the lyuing God But for the benefit of such as haue grace to sauour the things that are of God I will a litle illustrate these Assumptions at least some of them 1. That yt is a quenching of the spirit to reade an other mans wordes vpon a booke when I should powre fourth mine owne heart the word yt self must be considered the Apostle commaundeth saying 1. Thessalonians 5.19 extinguish ye not the spirit Now to suppresse and leaue vnvttered the passioÌ„s of our owne heart by the worke of the spirit giuing vs cause of prayer and instead therof to reade an other maÌ„s writing I doubt not wil be founde and judged of all that haue spirituall eyes to see a quenching of that grace yea in that action the reading hindreth vs from pleading our cause with God according to the occasions we see in our owne hearts And by not teaching men to drawe out the graces of God in theÌ„ to offer vp the sweete incense of his owne spirit in prayer but an other course deuised by fleshly pollicye the people growe in such Atheisme that they learne not all the dayes of their life to lay open their owne soule before the Lord in prayer How much more then by imposing stinted wordes to be read in the whole assemblies insteade of the liuely graces making yt a sufficient ministerie to reade ouer such beggarlie ware do you abondon Gods spirituall giftes and make an assemblie of Atheists in most places of this land yea in the best assemblies you compell such ware to be read when and where the liuely voyces of Gods present graces should only he draweÌ„ fourth as an holie odour vnto the Lorde Yea I appeale to the conscieÌ„ces of all that feare God if this haue not brought the land generally into Atheisme that not one amongst an hundred can call vpon God 2. That it is an ignorance to presume to come into so neere a conversing with God and to do one action for an other so offring the sacrifice of fooles let yt be sufficient proof that reading is not praying That yt is presumptuous to bring such lame sacrifices when you know to do better let yt be considered whether you would so vncircumspectly and carelesly approche to the presence of the Prince or any noble personage Then if he be our Lorde where is his honour his feare etc. when we will teach men and compell meÌ„ to do they knowe not what in his sight and to offer such lame sacrifice The Priestes themselues care not what offring they bring him Malach. 1. Thirdly the reading praier can be at no hand a striuing in praier for the worde agoniso which is read Rom. 15.30 signifieth to conteÌ„d in feruency both in minde and worde to preuaile with God as Iaakob wrestled with the Angell and said I will not let thee go except thou blesse me Genes 32.24.25.26 such sâ—rift you shall see through out the Psalmes in thâ— prayers of David and the Prophets alas howe this should be performed eyther in feruencie or contynuance let the wise consider 4. For importunacy and contynuaÌ„ce in prayer wherof we haue many precepts let the worde be looked vpon which is proscartâ—reo to insist by perseverance etc. as we see our Souiour Christ make plaine vnto vs by a parable Luke 11.5 6.7.8 â—nd Luke 18.1.2.3.5.7 now shall not God auendge his elect which
commaundements of God to sett vp your owne traditioÌ„s And here vpon I demaunded wherupon you would make your stinted and sett prayers You marueile I should be so babling and make such questions you meane about your babling worship You saye of the particulars of the Lordes prayer I demaunde nowe againe whether you can number the starres of heauen or the sandes of the sea if not much lesse theâ— particulars of the Lordes prayer There is medecine and direction of prayer for euerie soule and euerie disease therof to be drawen fourth by doctrine and prayer as the need requireth you would sett a liturgie vpoÌ„ some thinges and compell meÌ„ thervnto euerie meeting which were nothing els but to seale vp the fountaine and send men to the drye pitts of your execrable devises from the whole fountaine to a pitcher of water from the liuely graces of doctrine and prayer to your owne writinges Paul commaunded to pray for Kings and Princes yet bounde no man what wordes to vse The Lord gyve you repentance of such presumptuous sinne as to alter his worship If you caÌ„not knowe the estate of the soule before hand you can make no formes of wordes for yt Read praiers were deuised by Antechrist and maintaine supersâ—ition an Idoll ministery therfore read praiers such stinted service are intollerable c. Antichrist devised manie blasphemous wicked praiers But to say that the reading or following a prescript forme of praier was his is most false for there were Liturgies in the Church of olde before Antichrist was set in his throne c. THe Scripture never inforced to reade praiers for praying nether stinted vâ— what or how manie wordes to vse nether is the formes of praier prescribed in the Scripture anie deuise of man Let vs then hold these two to be the matters in hand the one reading in steade of praying the other stinting and limiting by a written liturgie what and howe â—anie wordes to pray with all other such prescriptions as your liturgie conteyneth All may be affirmed antichristian which is not warranted by Christes worde Yet your liturgie is eueÌ„ from that Antichrist lifted vp into the throne you speake of as may of all men be seene that will coÌ„pare yt with the Portuis And as I haue heard the Pope would haue approued of your liturgie if yt might haue bene receaued in his name Nowe we haue proued in the discourse before that reading for praying hath no warrant from Gods Worde which maketh them two seuerall and divers actions euery where Here then we must consider something for an other liturgie theÌ„ Christes Testament which we shall find to be nothing els then an other gospell And because Mr. Gifford saith ther were liturgies in the Church before Antichrist was lifted vp into his throne which I will not denye I would have all men vnderstand that I do not go about to proue the Church no Church that hath a liturgie as mine Arguments are falslie wrested to that purpose but to proue the vnlawfullnes og such liturgies thrust vpon meÌ„s Consciences is onlie my determination through Gods assistance The worde liturgia signifieth publicum munus ergon Laou the worck of or for the people that is the very execution of the mâ—nisteriall actions in the Church according to the worde of all the officers therof that is the practise of those ministeriall duties prescribed by Christ we may euery where reade In the first of the Gospell of Luke the 23. verse it is said And it came to passe that when the daies of his ministration were past he went home to his house meaning Zacharias where we see the worde Leitourgia for his execution of his ministeriall functioÌ„ Now this Leitourgia of the newe Testament is euen the rule and function prescribed by Christ for the publique actions to be donne in his Church which leiturgie of Christ is perfect and he pronounced accursed that addeth any thing therto or taketh any there from yea all meÌ„ are bound to keep the true patterne therof without alteration or innouating anie part of the same yt is called a commaundemeÌ„t to be kept without spott till the appearing of our Lorde Iesus Christ. Nowe to make an other leiturgie is to lay an other foundation and to make an other Gospell not that ther is an other Gospell but that ther are some willing to peruert the Gospell of Christ. TheÌ„ your leiturgies to which you are sworne and by which you administer being as you cannot denie an other leiturgâ—e theÌ„ Christes TestameÌ„t is plaine an other Gospell for the CanoÌ„s and rules you prescribe and impose are such as he hath not prescribed or commaanded or at the best a transforming of his ordinances Now if you should say you do nothing but make lawes of particular thinges collected froÌ„ the scriptures aÌ„d with that collour impose your liturgies we haue shewed the vnlawfullnes of bringing anie mans writinges as rules into the Church For the explaning of the whole will of Christ so far as is meet for vs he hath giuen vs his officers to administer according to his liturgie by liuely voyce and due executioÌ„ of all things by one rule Making then a newe litourgia you must also make a newe ministerie for Christs ministerie caÌ„not administer after a counterfeit liturgie And that Antichrist was the theif Innouator of this liturgie howsoeuer the thing might be long a working by litle and litle yt is plaine when he is called Antikeimenos that opposite man or laier of an other foundation Now we must not make all liturgies beside the Testament of like wickednes or blasphemie But how neere the most heynousest yours approach let him that answereth the other part of your booke witnesse vnto me Nowe where I said you had confessed that you neuer read in the Scriptures any warrant to reade praiers vnto God you say now I knowe I haue falsified your wordes Surely yt would be knoweÌ„ for I would not willinglie so do your wordes you say were these to your remembrance God neuer commaunded a man to reade praier vpoÌ„ the booke Is not this the same that I saye you confesse ther is no warrant for reading prayer is ther anie thing warranted in his worship that he hath not commaunded Then you aske me if I will gather thus is it not expresse coÌ„maunded therfore yt is not warraÌ„ted No you forgot the worde expressie to help your self to saye and vnsaye I gathered that because you said absolutely it was not coÌ„maunded therfore yt was not warranted Here you come againe to shewe your ignorance in the Scriptures to say ther is not anie expresse commaundement to vse praier before or after doctrine And remember you here will haue it a commaundement and said before you hold yt not of necessitie There vvould sundry inconueniences grovve for vvant of a Liturgie or prescript formes of publique prayers STill I must put you in minde of the wisedome of that gouernour of
commandement the others hearts going with the wordes aÌ„d saying Amen they that heare pray not as wel as he that according to Gods ordinance speaketh our publique prayers are not the prayers of the Church but of him that speaketh only But now God hath otherwise taught 1. Cor. 14. aÌ„d Acts. 4. yt must needs be that Mr. Giss is in great error to thinke none but he that speaketh prayeth I take then such hearing of an others voyce praying aÌ„d this to be a foule error to publish the contrarie but that prayer both edifieth him that speaketh and him that heareth and together in heart prayeth I make no doubt Yet herevpon to affirme that here are other meanes of instruction to be vsed in the instant action of praying then praying yt self were as grosse as the other and both a confounding of spiritual exercises and flat contradiction of the Scripture especially so diverse weightie actions of minde and bodie as proseuche aÌ„d anagnosis powring out our hearts to God in prayer and reading At other times I did not only allow but teach that we haue al the dayes of our lyves need to be instructed to pray aright and that reading is a blessed meanes therevnto So that you see whiles you of purpose will oppose you runne your self vpon the rocke in stead of justifying your accusatioÌ„ of two heresies to be found in my first reason you haue published this follie which you must retract if you wil obey the truth Mr. Giffard theÌ„ granting that reading is but to help to prayer and not praying aÌ„d now being shewed that it caÌ„ be no help in that instant action of praying let vs proceede to pervse an other of his mistakings and willful peruertings I affirming that the holy Ghost neuer enioyned vs to any certaine nuÌ„ber of words by stint and limitatioÌ„ in praying as commanding the very words to be said ouer wheÌ„ we pray he euery where in his wrytings as a supposed foundatioÌ„ to their Leitourgie and Collects alledged out of Numbers the 6. Mat. 6. Lu. 11. exaÌ„ple of Psalmes aÌ„d now Deu. 26. that the Lord did by coÌ„maÌ„demeÌ„t binde theÌ„ to those verie words saiing ouer wheÌ„ they prayed or blessed in those formes which are there prescribed For my reasons in disproving this popish carnal coÌ„ceipt I refer the Reader to my former answeare to his plublished pretended defence of reading for praying One reasoÌ„ was draweÌ„ froÌ„ the words of the text Numb 6.32 where the hebrew words Coh Tebaraâ—u thus shal you blesse do not import a tying theÌ„ to the verie words of this forme in blessing but to the rules and instructions there taught them concerning the matter yt self for their direction which I collected by this word Coh which is an adverb of similitude signifiing with vs as much as after this maner and therfore caÌ„not be â—o say the same words but according to the same instructions Where first he reprocheth me for that Tebaracu was false printed therevpon chardging me I cannot reade twoo words right of hebrue which were no great ignominie in their priesthood But shall we say Mr. Giff. cannot reade two words in latine rightly because in the 28. page of his booke he repeateth out of Augustine upoli sui for populi sui This I mention as sory to see the defendor of his false Hierarchie so emptie to leaue founde doctrine and thus to trifle if he had bene at the print it should haue bene ameÌ„ded it seemeth Now to the doctrine gathered of this word Coh Mr. Gif would invert the words in his owne seÌ„se thus that where I said the Lord did not coÌ„maund to say the same words but the like that is according to those directions of doctrine he gathereth that I should affirme yt vnlawfull to vse those words at all yea that they might not vse all or anie of these words at anie tyme Whether this be a Christian interpretation of my words or no I leaue not only to all mens but chieflie to his owne conscience to be considered Yet he still couertly persisting in his error produceth a place of scripture where the word Coh as he thinketh is vsed for the saying of the verie words Exod. The Lord said to Moses Thus shalt thou say vnto the children of Israel Eheie hath sent me vnto yee moreouer God said vnto Moses thus shalt thou say vnto them The God of your Fathers etc. According to Mr. Grenewoods interpretation saith he Moses is not commanded to say those words but the like True he is not here bound to this certeine number of words or the same words If then they should say what is his name that hath sent thee he may not say Eheie hath sent me because God said Coh etc. Now Mr. Giffard sheweth himself ashifter I did neuer hold it vnlawfull to vse anie wordes of the Scripture as need required it is your sclander where you have in all your bookes affirmed we hold it vnlawfull to say thy kingdome come or vse anie phrase of Scripture to right vse your woeful wresting of the tongue for vntruthes wil tourne to your further iudgment I proued only by the word Coh which signifieth after this maner that God commaunded not the very certaine number of words to be said And where I sayd the word Coh was so vsed in all the Prophets when they say Thus saith the Lord to this end that neither the holy Ghost had registredal their verie words they spake nor that they were tyed to the prescript number of words he would haue it thought I should hold those words which are recorded not to be the words of God which wresting of my words is but his emptie quarreling to turne away this firme doctrine namely that God did in those formes of prayer mentioned by him prescribe the somme of their blessings aÌ„d petitions whervnto they ought according to their seuerall occasions within the limits of these doctrines frame their suites and desires aÌ„d did not tye them to a certaine number of words Now he finding himself pressed in that al his proofes are at once brought to be weapoÌ„s against him rather then warrant It being prooved vnto him that those formes are repeated in other words in other places and that the Priests vsed other in blessing the people as Eli blessed Hanna also that the Apostles vsed other words in prayer and neuer that verie forme and number of words he playnly denyeth that our question was about the bynding and limiting to the verie words by commandement and saith our question was whither it were idolatrie to vse those prescript phrases or no. Thus the man is sled not only contradicting all his writinges making voide his proofes but granting as much as I affirmed vpon the word COH hath gyven mee the whole cause against â—is will For if these places will not serue to prove an apportioning by number and stint vpon commandement then Mr. Gissard hath no profe for his Collectâ— no though these had bene so yet his patched
broken mass booke shoulde haue bene far from comming in place of true prâ—yer But that this is a popish dreame to think in prayer they were bound to some certeyne number of words saying ouer it was also conuinced vnto him by the Greeke word Houtos where Christ commandeth his Disciples saying When you pray pray thus Our Father c. Which word Thus Mat. 6.9 singnifieth after this maner or according to this forme rules and instructions for if the commandement shoulde goe to bynde vs to the very words then this word when you pray would bynd vs never to vse other words for the text saith when you pray say thus To this he answereth that respecting the rules for matters when is as much as whensoeuer you pray because we may not depart from those matters conteyned in those general petitions But in words it is not so there We must consider to distinguish etâ—3 Wel hath he not lost himself and still against his will yeilded the matter namely that wee are not in these formes of prayer bound to the verie words saying ouer and that the holy Ghost did neuer by commandement stint or limit vs to anie words in praying which in deed is common with inchanters And I take it he will easily yeild me this point for if he remember Augustine to teach that then we pray that prayer which Christ taught his Disciples when our prayers are grounded vpon those doctrines and instructions or to that effect And Calvine to say the Sonne of maÌ„ would not prescribe vs what words we must vse in prayer he should haue put vs to lesse trouble So that besids his mass-booke was neuer prescribed by the Lord himself or warrant of his word he seeth it vnlawful to apportion limit and stint as by measure and waight certeine numbers of wordes senteÌ„ces etc. in prayer As for his examples of the Psalmes I refer to my former answere namely that praying is our thing and singing a psalme an other Now then we haue heard that reading is not praying or any help to pray in the instant action of praying when we should powre forth our owne hearts to God Also that it is vnlawful to bynde maÌ„ to numbers of words or sentences in praying Let vs come to the first generall argument which is this No Apocrypha must be brought into the publick assemblies for there only Gods word and the lively voyce of his owne graces must be heard in the publick assemblies But mens wrytings and the reading them ouer for prayer are Apocrypha Therfore may not be brought into the publick assemblies eyther for lawes or worship Here hee finds fault with the worde Apocrypha although it hath bene an antient word in this sense and now published in their Bibles to distinguish other writings from the authentick scriptures willing mee to goe to the matter yt self drawing by firme conclusion that nothing is to be allowed any place in the Church which is not the perfect rule yt self in writing or without errour vttered in speach and he wil yeild This I did proue vnto him by an Argument hee was not able to answere and did leaue out the word Apocrypha thus Only the Canonical Scriptures and liuely voice of Gods owne graces are to be brought into the publick assemblies for doctrine and prayer But mens writings or Collections are neither Canonical Scripture nor the liuely voice of Gods graces in such as he hath appointed to speake in the publick asseÌ„blies Therfore no mans writings may be brought into nor imposed vpon the publick assemblies for doctrine and prayer Now where he cauilleth about the perfectnes of the rule and absolute perfectnes of the graces it doth not help him For the word of GOD being of necessitie by the lawe and ordinance of God to be read in our owne language I trust he will not denye yt to be the written word of GOD for the vnperfectnes of the translation being to the best search the Church can make skanned by the original tongue and stil amended or at least the Church no further bound to yt then yt shal be found to be the perfect rule so likewise the liuely voice of GODS graces are not for the imperfectnes to be excluded being God 's appointed ordinance neither is anie fault in the translation to be allowed and errour in doctrine or prayer are presently to be admonished and repented of Maister Giffard then must denye the Bible translated into our owne language to be the Canonicall Scriptures and denye the liuely voice of GODS lawfull officers and such as are therevnto called in doctrine and prayer to be the manifestations of the Spirit and vtterance of Gods graces for the assemblie or els grant the proposition firme And if hee can put dead mens writinges into the place of either of these I will yeild In the meane time I hold such translations to be the worde of GOD and by Gods ordinance put into our owne laÌ„guage to all our knowledges retayning the words of GOD which word and the lyuely vse of Gods owne graces in the mouth of such as he therevnto appointeth are only to be brought into the publicke assemblies for prayer and doctrine for GOD hath commanded these vnto vs as his owne ordinances in his assemblies and no other means wherby either God speaketh vnto vs or his people vnto him in the Congregation To this all the Scriptures beare witnesse the word is always firme confirmed with miracles from heauen and commended to vs by Christ the Prophetts and Apostles to be the foundation Canon light lanterne etc. the graces of the Spirit gyven for the interpretation prayer doctrine etc. Christ is ascended vp into heauen and hath giuen giftes vnto men to serve their tyme and minister in their place in this house These graces stil renewed not only in those called of GOD in this seruice for their dayly administration but newe workmen thrust forth into this haruest as the Lord of the house disposeth which graces of his Spirit are compared to two oliue branches which emptie out of themselues thorow two golden pipes Zacharie 4.12 And to seuen thunders which vtter their voices that cannot be written Away therfore with your patched mass-booke yt may neither stande for a foundation in Gods house nor for the lyuely voyces of these thunders you make yt a monstrous Idoll by putting yt in either of these vses yet you will make yt serve for both Wee haue nothing to do with your matters of order as you vnderstaÌ„d that order for tyme place etc. wee reason of the Spirituall action yt self when wee entreat of the meanes whereby God speaketh to vs and appointeth vs to speake vnto him Wee can cast out the errours in the translatioÌ„ or doctrine or prayer and yet reeaine Gods worde in our owne language and the liuely voice of his graces in the â—assemblie When you can do so with your deuises and newe hatched Leitourgies wee will giue eare vnto you and them till
then wee thinck of your counterfeit playes and pleas for your Idolls and detestable sacriledge and high prophanation of GODS ordinances with Iannes and Iambres to resist the truth Paraphrases wee hold to be mens writinges and expositions and not the word of GOD nor the liuely voice of Gods grace of interpretation or prayer therefore to be excluded this place of service vnto GOD. Thus you see the further you wrastle the further you make your wares the best of them odious to euerie godly conscience You say I deceiue the simple by gyuing them one crabbe amongst many apples but you may behold your best apples such as the holy GHOST hath foretold vs Revelation 18. to be entisements to euil It is well you will grant my Propositions so sound and I would wish if such de GODS wil they might be better sauoured Nowe because I wil not stand either repeating or contending about Syllogismes I will take this much yeilded of your owne conclusions which is as much in effect as I haue affirmed were you teach me thus to reason No mans writings are the vndoubted truth of God but haue errours and imperfections therfore men cannot further ground vpon them then they be consonant to the Canonicall Scriptures Againe The Church is builded vpon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets therfore our faith is not to rest vpon meÌ„s writings Wherevpon doth necessarily follow that if mens writings may not be builded vpon nor rested vpon howe should you dreame it lawfull to impose them for lawes vpon the publick assemblies or to haue them there read to beare rule as the wordes of God And this you confessed in an other of your writings that GOD spake vnto vs out of his vndoubted worde or by his owne word If then GOD speake not vnto vs by mens writinges that be of priuate interpretation in the assemblie nor that they can be made groundwork to buyld our faith vpon or to rest assured vpon yt will be granted I hope that they are not to be imposed vâ—on the publick assemblies as lawes and rules but left to euerie mans private vse in their libertie as they will answere for themselues what vse they put them to and whither they doe not prefer them before the booke of GOD or preiudice themselves by them This first poinct is then plaine That only GODS vndoubted worde is to be imposed brought in aÌ„d maintayned in the publick assemblies as lawes and rules no other writings being authentick or Canonical But here Mr. Giffard doth in effect affirme that the word of God yt self is not authentick or Canonical except in the Hebrew or Greeke Copie Wherin he goeth a litle beyond the Papists that wil yet allow the worde of GOD in latine And if it shoulde be defended that the worde of GOD were not the worde yt self that wee haue in our owne language it will follow that no man could haue assurance of faith except he vnderstoode both Hebrew and Greeke yea be able soundly to interpret the Scriptures in both If the translations be so far mens writings that yt ceaseth generally to be the word of GOD that is not written in Hebrew or Greek and mens writinges not to be grounded or rested vpon where shall our assurance stand And might not Mr. Giffard as well say the Hebrew and Greek Copiâ— are but paper ankyâ—ck many faults and errours by the print in vowells accents letters and so conclude we had not Authentick or canonicall Scriptures at al except mens erronious writings might be of equall authoritie in the assemblie that the Scriptures must he not beare with mee in accompting him an Atheist or Libertine in thus reasoning Hence then we see whiles you go about to abase the Canonicall Scriptures and extol your patched Leâ—tourgie you fall into manie blasphemies as I haue before told you Wee hold yt the word of GOD in what language soeuer stil reiecting the errours in the print in the translations etc. as they are knowne vnto vs and not the word yâ— self for the imperfections or errours in the translation and print Now when you can make that which remayneth the vndoubted worde of God not agreable only but an Authentick approued Canonicall Scripture authorised from God to be the verie eternal foundation and rules limitts and lawes giuen by himself vnto his people you may lift vp your 〈◊〉 DagoÌ„ into this place if there be some truth in their writings as what mens writings haue not some and the holy name of GOD verie much yet is that truth in the Scripture yt self and here so mingled with chaffe that it were not only vnprofitable and a hinderance of the true vse of GODS worde but an abolishing and defacing of the word yt self the maiestie whereof ought to terrifie you from this presumption And where you say that you decide not controversies by anie translation but by the Authentick Copies of the Hebrew and Greke I trust you speak only of such as are able by the interpretation thereof so to decide controversies and holde it not vnlawfull for anie such as haue not that help to convince errour by the powre of the word and conferring one place with an other in anie translation according to the analogie of faith though I grant we ought to vse the best approued But if this were not lawfull surely no man might prophesie in the Church which hath not the gift of interpretation of the tongue neither might any affirme any Scripture to be true but they wich haue knowledg of tongues How blasphemous is this gâ—are whiles you are ignorant of the powre wisdome and agreement of the word and Spirit and diuersitie of giftes giuen vnto men The Word and the Spirit approue ech other and beare wâ—â—ness ech of other in what language soeuer GOD giueth yt to our vnderstanding Prophesie and knowledg of tongues are two seueral giftes not alwayes giuen to one member but distributed as God in his wisdome hath appointed 1. Cor. 12. and prophesie commanded for the more excellent Cap. 14. But this is sufficient in this place that the word of God is the word of God in what language soeuer and to accompt yt being verbatim translated or at least so far foorth faithfully translated mans writing were blasphemie but mens writings can neuer be so holden the authentick Scriptures of God how agreable to the woâ—â— soeuer they be My argument is then firme and thus left vpon you Those writings which be not the word of God being imperfect and neuer without error may not be imponed as lawes and Canons vpon the publick assemblies or there be read or interpreted or offred vp in worship But such are al mens writings that be not the authentick word of God yt self The publick assemblies are only bound to the reading and interpretation of the Scriptures which God hath ordeined to be read in a knowne language aÌ„d for prayer and prophesie hath ordeined the liuely voice of his owne graces in the mouth