his word commaundeth is noted the fourth and the twelfth of Deut. Ye shall put nothing to thevvord that I commaund you neither shall you take any thing therefrom c. And in the other place VVhatsoeuer I cōmaund you take heed you do it thou shalt put nothing thereto nor take ought therefrom God in the old law to his people prescribed perfect and absolute lawes not only morall and iudiciall but ceremoniall also neither was there the lest thing to be done in the Church omitted in the law And therefore for them at that time and during that state it was not lawfull to adde any thing nor to take any thing away no not in ceremonies and other ciuill lawes now in the time of the Gospell God hath left vnto his Church expressed in his word a perfect rule of faith and manners and sufficient to saluation and cursed is he that shal adde any thing to it or take any thing from it in that behalfe for therein it is perfec te and absolute But as he hath lefte the iudiciall lawe to the discretion of the magistrate to adde there vnto or take therefrom or al er and change the same so that no law be made against the rule of faith and good manners expressed in the word of God c. T. C. Page 21. Sect 2. Unto the places of Deuteronome which proue that nothing ought to be done in the Church but that which God commaundeth and that nothing should be added or diminished First you answere that that was a precepte giuen to the Iewes for that time whiche had all thinges euen the least prescribed vnto them I see it is true which is said that one absurditie graunted a hundred follow For to (a) A 〈◊〉 peruerting of ma ni ell and playn words make good that things ought to be done besides the scripture and word of God you are driuen to runne into part of the errour of the Manichees which say that the old testament perteyneth not vnto vs nor bindeth not vs. For what is it else than to say that these two places serued for the Iewes time and vnder the law for surely if these two places agree not vnto vs in tune of the Gospell I knowe none in all the old testament whiche do agree And I praye you what is here saide which S. Iohn in the Apocalipse saith not where he shutteth vp the new testament on this sort I protest vnto euery man which heareth the prophecie of this booke that whosoeuer Apoca. 22. addeth any thing to it the Lord shall adde vnto him the plagues whiche are written in it And whosoeuer taketh away any thing from it the Lorde shall take away his portion out of the booke of life and out of the things that are written in it whiche admonition if you say perteyneth to that booke of the Apocalipse only yet you must remember that the same may be as truly said of any other booke of the scripture Io. Whitgifte My first answer to that place of Deuteronomie is true neyther can you disproue The first answer iustifyed it by any sound reason or good authoritie for if you will haue this precept now to be vnderstanded of all the selfesame ordinances and lawes of the whiche and for the which it was at that time giuen then must we of necessitie kéepe the ceremoniall and iudiciall precepts of the Law being at that time in force The which thing as I suppose no learned man will once imagine but yet as this precepte was then gyuen to them that they should adde nothing to the lawes of God then in force or take any thing from them so is it perpetuall for vs also that we shoulde adde nothing to the law of faith and manners which is likewise perfectly prescribed vnto vs in the booke of God And thus you sée how farre I am from the erroure of the Manichees and from thinking that the old testament doth not apperteine vnto vs and yet I am not so Iewish to How farre that precept in Deut. is extended thinke that we are bound either to the ceremoniall or iudiciall law and therefore I say that that precepte applyed vnto vs dothe not extende any further than to suche thinges as God hathe commauuded or forbidden vs that be Christians to do in hys word How vniustly therefore you charge me to say that these two places agree not vnto vs vnder the Gospell when as I haue plainly declared how they agrée to them vnder the law and to vs vnder the Gospell let any man iudge The words in the last of the Apocal. although they be properly and namely spoken of that booke yet I am fully perswaded that they may also be affirmed of the whole testament And I am so farre from allowing either addition or detraction to or from the word of God that I vtterly cōdemne as false that which you haue setdown before in your booke Fol. 13. That many things are both commaunded and forbidden of which there is no expresse mention in the worde which are as necessarily to be followed or auoyded as Fol. 13. Sect. 2. those whereof expresse mention is made Chap. 6. the second Diuision T. C. Page 21. Sect. 3. Then you are driuen to say that the Iewes vnder the law had a more certaine direction and consequently a readier w y than we haue in the time of the Gospell of the whiche time the Prophet Iet 31. v. 34 saith that then a man should not teach his neighboure they shall be so taught of God as if he should say that they that liue vnder the Gospell should be all in comparison of that whiche were vnder the lawe doctours And Esay saith that in the days of the Gospell the people shall not stand Isay. 56. in the outward courts but he will bring them into the sanctuarie that is to say that they should be all for their knowledge as learned as the Leuites and priests which only had entrance into it Io. Whitgifte In matters of ceremonies and iudicials they had moe particular rules prescribed Wherein the Jewes had a more certaine direction than we vnto them and a more certaine direction For we haue very litle in these matters particularly written in the new testament but the morall lawe we haue as perfect as they had and in the law of faith which is the law of the Gospell and the rule of saluation we do farre exceede them Other meaning than this there cannot with all the violence that you haue be wrong out of my words Your places alleadged out of the Prophete Ieremy and Esay improue nothing that I haue spoken for the Prophet Ieremy speaketh of the elect of God whome he Ierem. 3. doth teach and illuminate not only with the outward preaching of his word but by the maruellous operation of his spirit also The words of the Prophet Esay if you Esay 56. meane the 7. ver of the. 56. Chap. for else ther is no
you doe notably sclaunder them and it is already answered If you meane that those are Puritanes or Catharanes whiche doe set foorthe a true and perfecte paterne or platforme of reforming the Churche then the marke of this heresie reacheth vnto those whiche made the booke of common prayer (b) An vntruthe for I do not saye so in any place whiche you saye is a perfecte and absolute rule to gouerne this Churche wherein nothing is wanting or too little nor nothing running ouer nor too muche As for the Catharanes whiche were the same that are otherwise called Nouatians I knowe no suche opinion they had and they whome you charge are as farre from their corruption as you bee Io. Whitgifte You haue sayde vnto me in one place of your booke Quid verba audiam cumfacta videam euen so I saye to you for why will they not come to oure Sermens or to oure Churches why will they not communicate with vs in oure Sacramentes not salute vs in the stréetes nay spitte in our faces and openly reuile vs whye haue they their secrete conuenticles You knowe all this to be true in a number of them I knowe not why they shoulde doe so excepte they thinke them selues to be contaminated by hearing vs preache or by comming to our Churches or by communicating otherwyse with vs. Whiche if they doe it argueth that they persuade them selues not onely of suche an outwarde perfection but of suche an inwarde puritie also that they may as iustly for the same be called Puritanes as the Nouatians The qualities of Nouatus and cause of his heresie were You knowe that the first occasion why Nouatus did separate him selfe from the Churche was bicause he coulde not obtayne the Bishoprike of Rome whiche he ambitiously desired You knowe also that his pretence was bicause the Bishops dyd receyue those into the Churche whiche had fallen in the time of persecution Afterwardes he fell into greater and mo absurdities for commonly suche as once deuide them selues from the Churche fall from errour to errour without staye This Nouatus thoughe he séemed to condemne ambition in all other men yet was he most ambitious him selfe thoughe he by vehement othes denied him selfe to desire a Bishoprike yet did he most gréedily séeke for it though he boasted of more perfection in lyfe and of a more perfecte platforme of a Churche than he thoughte others had yet was it nothing so He was the firste that I reade of that forseeke his Nouatus the first that forsooke his ministerie ministerie and that sayde Se nolle amplius presbyterum esse sed alterius Philosophiae studiosum that he woulde no longer be a Minister but a student in other Philosophie Reade Eusebius in his sixte booke of his Ecclesiasticall historie Cap. 43 and Nicephorus in his sixte booke also and third chapter Surely the storie of Nouatus is worthy to be noted bycause there be so many at these dayes which do not so much differ from him in opinions as they agrée with him in conditions You affirme that I saye The booke of common prayer to be a perfecte and absolute rule to gouerne this Churche wherin nothing is wanting or too little nor nothing running ouer or too muche If I haue sayd any suche thing quote the place that the Reader may consider of it and knowe that you speake the truthe But if I neuer eyther spake or writte any suche thing then are you a false witnesse and I haue to desire the Reader to consider of the reste of your sclaunderous reportes according to the truthe of this I haue learned with Sainct Augustine to giue this reuerence onely to the wryters of Canonicali Scriptures that I thinke none of them to haue The canonicall scriptures are only absolute perfect erred in wryting And I doe firmely beléeue that onely the bookes of the Canonicall Scripture are of that absolutenesse and perfection that nothing maye be taken awaye from them nothing added to them I doe not thinke the Communion booke to be such but that it may admitte alteration I doe not beléeue it to bée so perfecte but that there maye be bothe added to it and taken from it But thys I saye that it is a godly booke withoute any errour in substance of doctrine and nothing in it that I knowe agaynst the worde of God and those imperfections or rather motes that you saye to be in it not to be suche that any godly man oughte to stirre vp any contention in the Churche for them muche lesse to make a schisme and least of all to deuide him selfe from the Churche This is my opinion of that booke whiche vnlesse by learning and good authoritie I iustifie let me haue the blame and shame of it I will not enter into your heartes to iudge what you thinke of your inwarde puritie whiche notwithstanding in comparison you haue in this present place arrogated vnto your selues that very perfection of an outwarde platforme of a Churche whiche you chalenge vnto your selues is one steppe to Nouatianisme and well deserueth the name of Catharisme ¶ Of the authoritie of the Churche in things indifferent Tract 2. Some thinges may be tollerated in the Churche touching order ceremonies discipline and kinde of gouernmente not expressed in the word of God Chap. 1. the first Diuision Admonition SEing that nothing in thys mortall lyfe is more diligently to bee soughte for and carefully to bee looked vnto a 2. Reg. 23. 3. Chro. 17. 2. Chro. 29. 30. 31. Psal. 132. 2. 3. 4. Mat. 21. 12. Ioh. 2. 15. than the restitution of true religion and reformation of Gods Churche it shall bee your partes dearely beloued in this present Parliamente assembled as muche as in you lyeth to promote the same and to employe your whole laboure and studie not onely in abandoning all Popishe remnauntes bothe in ceremonies and regimente but also in bringing in and placing in Gods Churche those thinges onely whiche the Lorde him selfe b Deut. 4. 2. Deut. 12. 32. in hys worde commandeth Bicause it is not mought to take paynes in taking away euill c Psal. 37. 27. Rom. 12. 9. but also to be occupied in placing good in the steade thereof Nowe bicause many men see not all thinges and the d 1. Cor. 2. 14 worlde in thys respecte is maruellously blinded it hathe beene thoughte good to profer to your godly consyderations a true platforme of a Churche reformed to the ende that it beeing layde before your eyes to beholde the greate vnlykenesse betweene it and thys our Englishe Churche you maye learne eyther with perfecte e Psal. 31. 6. Psal. 139. 22. hatred to deteste the one and with singular loue to embrace and carefull endeuour to plante the other or else to be without excuse before f Iohn 15. 21. the maiestie of our God who for the discharge of our conscience manifestation of his truthe hathe by vs reuealed vnto you at this presente
to the word and yet not conteyned in the worde Men may haue an opinion of Religion and merite in suche thinges as they thinke not to be of necessitie to saluation To be shorte men may make that sinne whych the worde of God maketh not sinne as all those doe whiche forbid the vse of indifferent things and make the same vnlawfull as I haue sayde before You sée nowe that there is no one parte of this diuision as you call it which dothe not include something not conteyned in the other partes and therfore all those vnséemely and immodest tauntes and words mighte haue bin forborne I aske no forgiuenesse of you for any thing that I haue wrytten But I beséeche God forgyue you your outrageous contemptes and vnchristian floutes and iestes where with your booke is more pestered than any of Hardinges is where he sheweth him selfe moste scurrilous But I will omit them all and onely desire the Reader to consider of what spirite they come and in bothe our writings to respecte the matter not the person Touching the exposition of the places of Deut. let the learned Reader compare it with the expositions of the learned Interpreters and then iudge of my vnskilfull The Replier hath spēt many wordes in confuting that which he him selfe cōfesseth diuiding and defyning Here now I wold gladly know what T. C. hath proued agaynst the thing y t I haue here writtē or how he hath iustified y e propositiō of y e Admonition which I haue refelled for the sūme of al is this The authors of the Admonitiō say that those things onely are to be placed in the Churche which God him selfe in his worde commaundeth This I confesse to be true in matters of saluation and damnation But I saye it is vntrue in matters of ceremonies rites orders discipline and kinde of gouernmente which béeing externall matters and alterable are to be altered and chaūged appoynted and abrogated according to time place and person so that nothing be done agaynst the worde of God And T. C. confesseth page 15. that Pag. 15. Sect. 5. certayne things are lefte to the order of the Churche bicause they are of that nature which are varied by tymes places persons and other circumstances and so could not at once be set downe and established for euer and yet so lefte to the order of the Churche as that it doe nothing agaynst the rules aforesayde The same dothe he affirme in effecte in this place Nowe I pray you tell me what difference is there in our wordes he saythe that certayne thinges are lefte to the order of the Churche c. so that nothing bee done agaynst the rules aforesayde And I saye that the Church hath authoritie to appoynt orders rites ceremonies c. so that nothing be done agaynst the worde of God In déede he goeth muche further in this matter than I doe for where I saye The Scripture expresseth all things necessarie to saluation he affirmeth that many things are bothe commaunded and forbidden c. as I haue before noted and is to Pag. 13. Sect. 2. be séene page 13. of his booke But to ende this matter I haue iustified my assertion by the scriptures 1. Cor. 14. Act. 6. and. 15. 1. Cor. 11. Also by the testimonies of Iustinus Martyr Irenaeus Tertullian Cyprian Ambrose Basill Augustine c. Likewise by the practises of Councels the reporte of Historiographers as Socrates and Sozomenus Finally by the iudgement of late writers M. Caluin and Bucer Now will I also adde a fewe wordes for the further confirmation of the same and so ende this question ¶ The opinion of other late wryters of things indifferent The. 7. Chapter Zuinglius in his booke de baptis after that he had declared howe the Scripture contayneth Zuinglius all thinges necessarie vnto saluation he sheweth That in externall things and matters of ceremonies many things are to be vsed in the Churche whiche be not contayned in the Scriptures And speaking of this place Philip. 3. If any think otherwise God will also reueale the same vnto you neuerthelesse in that wherevnto we are come let vs proceede by one rule or agree among our selues saythe That the Apostle there speaketh of nothing else than of externall ceremonies and rites the vse and administration whereof the same Apostle in that place affyrmeth to be in our vvill and povver so that vve doe nothing repugnant to the commaundement of God Neyther trouble the publyke peace whereof we oughte to haue especiall regarde for externall thinges These be the very wordes of Zuinglius in the which there is first to be noted the interpretation of the words of the Apostle Philip. 3. Secondly that he vseth Collections out of Zuinglius this exception So that we doe nothing repugnant to the commaundement of God which T. C. so muche misliketh The same Zuinglius in the same booke verifieth in playne wordes that whiche I before haue touching a negatiue argument from the authoritie of the Scriptures Peter Martyr vpon the. 1. Corinth 1. wryteth That there be three kindes of traditions P. Martyr one expressed in the Scriptures an other playne repugnant to the worde of God The thirde neither contrarie to the worde of God nor yet necessarily ioyned to the same in the vvhich vve muste obey the Churche These three cautions beeing obserued First that they be not obtruded as worship of God or peculiar holynesse but as pertayning to order and the ciuill commoditie of the Churche and to comelynesse in diuine actions for all thinges be sufficiently contayned in Scriptures that pertayne to the worshipping of God and holynesse Secondly that they be not counted so necessarie but that they may be altered if time require Let the Churche keepe hir interest and authoritie in these indifferent things to appoynt vvhat shall be thoughte most necessarie and meete to edifying Last of all that the people of God be not burdened with to great a multitude of them Thus farre Martyr Gualter in his preface to the first Epistle to the Corinth after that he hath declared Gualter the diuersitie of rites vsed in diuerse Churches concludeth on this sort VVherefore S. Augustine writing to Ianuarius after that he had layde forth diuerse ceremonyes of Churches obserued in his time dyd very well thinke that this shoulde be the most safe rule vnto Christian men if they did frame them selues vnto those Churches wherevnto they should come in those things which might be done without any preiudice vnto fayth and godlynesse his wordes are these There is in these things meaning customes and rytes no better rule or instruction for a graue and wise Christian than that he do after that manner the which he seeth vsed of the Church vnto the which he shall peraduenture come c. The which moderation if all men woulde vse at this day there would be lesse contention in the Church neither shoulde Christian libertie be abridged by the superstitious traditions
the whole scope of the Epistle and the playne and euidente wordes of the texte for what is this but to giue Timothie superioritie and gouernment ouer the other Ministers of Ephesus to saye vnto hym aduersus presbyterum Agaynst a Minister receyue no occusation c and as thys authoritie of Iudgement is not onely gyuen vnto Timothie but to all Byshops of like callyng so that also of teachyng that godlynesse is profitable to all thyngs c. perteyneth to all Ministers of the worde generally and not to Timothie alone This is onely the difference that the firste is common to Timothie wyth all other Byshops of like iurisdiction the other common to him with all other ministers of the worde You knowe that euery Pastor or other Minister of the worde hath not other Pastors and Ministers of the worde vnder hym that it maye be sayde vnto hym aduersus presbyteros c. as it is here sayde to Timothie for I haue proued before that presbyter dothe signifie the Ministers of the worde and Sacramentes and shall haue occasion to speake more of it hereafter You saye that there is an hundreth suche things in the Epistles of Timothie and Titus ▪ I thinke that there is not one hundreth seuerall preceptes in all the thrée Epistles These stoute and hyperbolicall bragges wyth so manyfest resisting of the playne sense and meanyng of the Scriptures argueth an euill conscience and a mynde so addicted to errour that it will not be reformed Manye things in these Epistles perteyne to all Christians many things be proper to Byshops suche as Timothie was and many common to all Ministers But this aduersus presbyteros ▪ c. muste néedes to proper be those that haue vnder them other Ministers committed to theyr gouernment which euery Pastor hath not Chap. 3. the. 58. Diuision Ansvvere to the Admonition Pag. 72. Sect. 3. And Epiphanius Lib. 3. Tom. 1. contra Haeresim Aerij proueth Timothie his superioritie Epiphanius ouer the rest by this selfe same place T. C. Pag. 87. Sect. 3. As for Epiphanius * This is your practise to discredite the author that speaketh against you it is knowen of what authoritie he is in thys place when as by Aerius sides he goeth about to pricke at the Apostle ▪ whilest he goeth about to confute the Apostle which maketh a distinction and difference betwene those which the Apostle maketh one that is a Bishop and elder and to spare the credit of Epiphanius it were better lay that opinion vpon some Pseudepiphanius which we may doe not without great probabilitie seyng * Augustine sayth that the Ad quod vult deum true Epiphamus vttereth all after a storie fashion and doth not vse anye disputation or reasoning for the truth agaynst the falshood and this Epiphanius is very full of arguments and reasons the choise whereof M. Doctor hath taken Io. Whitgifte I haue not heard any probable reason alleaged of any why these bookes of Epiphanius The writings of Epiphanius contra 80. haereses not counterfeite should be suspected whether they be his or no seeyng they be both learned and very auncient mentioned also of sundry olde writers But to omitte all other proofes I wyll onely vse the iudgement at this tyme of the authors of the Centuries who are to be credited in suche matters bycause they haue diligently and carefully laboured in them their opinion of these bookes of Epiphanius Cent. 4 cap. 10. is thys Nunc de scriptis c. Nowe we wyll speake of hys bookes of the which that worke against Cent. 4. cap. 10. the foure score heresyes is most noble which booke he hymselfe in his Epistle to Acacius and Paulus Ministers And in his booke called Anacephaleosis calleth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. Of the which writing Augustine in his booke ad quod-vult-deum maketh this mention Our Epiphanius Byshop of Cyrus sayth he which dyed not long since speaking of foure score heresies wrote also himselfe sixe Bookes making mention of all things after an Historicall maner disputing nothing either against the falsehood or with the truthe They be but short bookes and if they were all made in one yet were it not to be compared to ours or to diuerse other mens bookes in length Out of the which words it is euident that Augustine neither had nor at any time dyd see that worke which Epiphanius intituled Panarium for Epiphanius is very long in recountyng the historie as concerning the beginning the endeuour countrey of the heretikes the occasiō of the heresie the successe increase and suche lyke throughout euery heresie Then is he very long in confuting and condemning the heresies by true Scriptures and the interpretation of them wherfore it should seeme that Augustine had belyke onely the arguments prefixed before the Tomes of bookes of Epiphanius whiche he dothe therefore call shorte bookes or at the least had his booke called Anacephaleosis which is the summe of his worke called Panarium Cornarius that writeth Cornarius the Preface before this booke of Epiphanius is of the same iudgement and addeth these wordes VVherefore eyther Augustine dyd not see this worke of Epiphanius or the right worke of Augustine is not extant but loste or else Augustine dyd not in deede performe that whiche he promised I can reade of none that doubteth whether these bookes were Epiphanius his or no. And certaynely this kinde of answering is nexte the worst especially when it is vsed agaynst suche approued authors And bicause all men may vnderstande what Epiphanius wordes and reasons be Aerius here sie in denying the difference betwixt a Be shop priell ▪ Epi. li. 3. 〈◊〉 haeres 75 ▪ whiche in déede pinche you very néere for he calleth you heretikes I will declare them as I haue there founde them First he setteth downe the heresie of Aērius in these words His talke was more outrageous than becōmed a man and he sayd what is a Bishop to a Priest he nothing differeth from him for there is but one order and the same honor and dignitie The Bishop layeth on his handes and so dothe the Priest the Bishop ministreth baptisme and so dothe the priest the Bishop sayth diuine seruice and so doth the Priest the Bishop sitteth in his throne and so dothe the Priest In this he hathe deceyued many and they vse him for their captayne Then dothe he a little after confute this heresie with Aerius reasons on this sorte To saye that a Bishop and a Priest is equall howe can it be possible for the order of Bishops is the begetter of fathers for it ingendreth fathers to the Churche the order of Priests not beeing able to beget fathers dothe beget sonnes to the Churche by the sacrament of Baptisme but not fathers or teachers and howe is it possible for him to ordeyne a Priest not hauing imposition of hands to electe or to saye that he is equall with a Bishop but phantasticalnesse and emulation deceyued the
thinges we praye for tende to the glo ie of God who is the authour and giuer of all thinges both eternall and temporal Things that are to be prayed for are of two sortes the o e temporall the other eternall but they both perteyne to the glorie of God though not equally and in lyke manner The wyse man sayeth in the dayes of prosperitie thinke of aduersitie c. Christe Math. 24. forewarning his disciples of the external afflictions and euils which should Prayers be daunger happen as well before the destruction of Ierusalem as the ende of the worlde willeth E cle 11. them to praye before the daunger be present saying Praye that your flight bee not in wynter nor vpon the sabbath and will you not ha e vs to praye for deliueraun e from Math. 24. such perilles and daungers wherevnto we be subiect except they be present shall we not praye to be deliuered from thundering lightening stormeand tempest plague and pestilence and such like except we be in manifest perill and daunger these things beyng in Gods handes to punishe vs with euen in a moment and when we thinke it moste vnlike haue we not sundrie examples of such as haue sodenly perished with thundering and lightening and some sithence the publishing of your booke what scripture The presum tion of the Re plier haue you or authoritie of any learned man to the contrarie wyll you be credited vpyour bare worde against so many graue learned wyse and godly men that ad the penning and allowing of that booke surely that were against all order and reason and it is to great presumption for you with so light and slender reasons to go aboute the ouerthrowe of that which so many godly and learned men haue both liked and allowed except they had allowed that which the scriptures do disalowe Chap. 2. the. 12. Diuision T. C. Pag. 107. Sect. 3. There was one Mamereus bishop of Vienna which in the tyme of great earthquakes which wer Plat. cap. Leo. in Fraunce instituted certayne supplications which the Grecians and we of them call the Letany which concerned that matter there is no doubt but as other discommodities rose in other countries they lykewyse had prayers accordingly Nowe pope Gregor e either made hymselfe or gathered the su plications that were made against the calamities of euery countrey and made of them a great Letany or supplication as Platina calleth it gaue it to be vsed in all churches which thyng albeit all churches might do for the tyme in respect of the case of the calamitie which the churches suffered yet there is no cause why it should be perpetuall that was ordeyned but for a tyme and why all landes should praye to be deliuered from the incommodities that some lande hath vin troubled with Io. Whitgifte As though we were not at all times subiect to these perilles and daungers and as though we ought not by the calamitie of other nations to be moued earnestly to pray against the like which might also happen to vs. It is not to be doubted but that the prayer of the iuste is acceptable to God and that of his mercy he beyng thereby moued doth stay from plaguing vs with earthquakes thundring and lightenyng and such like calamities wherewith he would otherwise punish vs. Truly your reasons be maruelous prophane and they might as well be alleaged The reason vsed agaynst the Letanie is of the same force agaynst the psalmes agaynst any of the Psalmes which all were made at the first vpon some speciall occasion and yet are profitable for euer in all states of the Churche to be vsed Whatsoeuer good and godly prayer in the time of any common miserie and calamitie hath bene inuented the same is at other times profitable to be vsed in the Church bycause the like punishments and plagues are in Gods handes at all times to execute vpon sinners and therefore continually to be prayed agaynst Chap. 2. the. 13. Diuision T. C. Pag. 107. Sect. 4. The lyke may be sayde of the Gloria patri and the Athanasius Creede it was fyrst brought into the Churche to the inde that men thereby ▪ should make an open profession in the Churche of the diuinitie of the sonne of God agaynst the detestable opinion of Arius and his Disciples wherwith at that tyme maruelously swarmed almost the whole Christendome (*) A weake reason nowe that it hath pleased the Lorde to quench that fyre there is no such cause why these thinges shoulde be in the Church at the least why that Gloria patri should be so often repeated Io. Whitgifte Euen as conuenient now as it was then for it is as necessarie to maynteyne The manifestation and maintenance of truth as necessary as the suppressiō of errours truth and make it knowne as it is to suppresse errours and yet it is not vnknowne that euen in our dayes and in this Churche there haue bene Arians and I praye God there be none still I much suspect the matter not well vnderstanding wherevnto those glances of yours at Gloria patri ▪ and Athanasius Creede do tende Gloria patri besides that it conteyneth a briefe confession of the Trinitie and of the Diuinitie of Gloria patri Iesus Christe it is a magnifying and glorifying of the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghost thrée persons and one God and Athanasius creede is not onely an excellent Athanasius Creede confutation of Arius heresie but a playne declaration of the mysterie of the Trinitie such as is necessary for all Christian men to learne and know and therefore he that is offended with the ofte repetition or saying of eyther of them I cannot tell what I should iudge of him But vndoubtedly there is greate cause why I should suspect him at the leaste of singularitie and vnquietnesse Shall we not oftentymes rehearse the Articles of our beliefe in God the Father the Sonne and the holy Ghoste bycause all menne be now perswaded therein and none knowne that maketh any doubte the reason is all one and preuayleth as well agaynst the repeating of this as of the other I thinke your meaning is that we know to muche and therefore now we must learne to forget Well your authoritie is little and your reasons much lesse and therefore they are lyke to stande in Statu quo and this is moste sure that harme they do none but much good bycause a good thing cannot be to ofte sayde or hearde Chap. 2. the. 14. Diuision T. C. Pag. 107. Sect. vlt. Moreouer to make Benedictus Magnificat and Nunc dimittis ordinarie and dayly prayers seemeth to be a thing not so conuenient considering that they do no more concerne vs than all other scriptures do and than doth the Aue Maria as they called it For although they were prayers of thankes giuing in Simeon Zacharie and the blessed virgin Mary yet can they not be so in vs which haue not receiued like
Sunday whiche you haue denied to be his opinion in the former two places I haue tolde you what he meaneth by discipline and order or pollicie whereby he giueth to vnderstande nothing lesse than that whiche you woulde conclude beyng but your owne deuise to serue for a poore shifte at a néede And although the matter is not greate whether they labour or no yet the lawe of the Prince and the order of the Churche is to be obserued And so it appeareth that there is no reasonable cause as yet proued why you ought not to subscribe to the seruice Booke Chap. 2. the. 8. Diuision Ansvvere to the Admonition Pag. 82. Sect. 1. 2. In the ende you adde patched if not altogither yet the greatest peece out of the Popes Portuis To this I answere briefely it maketh no matter of whome it was inuented in what Booke it is conteyned so that it be good and profitable and consonant to Gods worde Well sayeth Ambrose Omne verum à quocunque dicitur à spiritu Sancto est All truth of vvhome soeuer it is spoken is of the holy ghost T. C. Pag. 123. Lin. 6. Nowe whereas M. Doctor sayeth it maketh no matter wither these thinges be taken out of the Portuis so they be good c. I haue proued first they are not good then if they were yet beyng not necessarie and abused horribly by the Papists other beyng as good and better than they ought not to remayne in the churche Io. Whitgifte Your reasons be not sufficient to proue them not to be good the abuse hath not bene suche but that it beyng remoued the thing may still remayne as profitable and The 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be 〈◊〉 to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 iudgement conuenient the iudgement of the Churche in determining what is best and moste fittest in matters of order pollicie and gouernment not beyng agaynst the worde of God is to be preferred before any priuate mans opinion and imagination Chap. 2. the. 9. Diuision T. C. Pag. 123. Lin. 10. And as for Ambrose saying all truth of whome soeuer it be sayde is of the holy ghoste if I were disposed to moue questions I coulde demaunde of him which careth not of whome he haue Mark 1. the truth so he haue it what our Sauiour Christe ment to refuse the testimonie of Deuils when they gaue a cleare testimonie ▪ that he was the Sonne of God and the holy one And what S. Paule ment to be angrie and to take it so grieuously that the Pithonisse sayde he and his companion Act. 16. were the seruantes of the highe God which preached vnto them the way of saluation Here ▪ was truth and yet reiected and I would knowe whether M. Doctor would saye that these spake by the spirite of God Thus whilest without all iudgement he snatcheth here a sentence and there another out of the Doctoures and that of the worste as if a man should of purpose choose out the brosse and leaue the siluer within a while he will make no great difference not onely betwene the Prophetes and Apostles and prophane wryters as Aristotle and Plato but not betwene them and those which speake not by the conduyte and leading of the holy ghoste but by the violent thrusting of the wicked spirite Io. Whitgifte Christe liked not the truth beyng vttered of the Diuell bycause he spake it of an euill meaning but he liked very well the same testimonie of truth afterwardes vttered by Peter sincerely Math. 16. Mar. 8. Neyther did he mislike the woordes bycause they were abused by the Diuell before But I will leaue Diuels and speake of men of whome I thinke Ambrose mente although the truth is truthe of whome soeuer it is vttered but to Answere for Ambrose he hath sayde nothing in that sentence which may not be iustified M. Caluine vpon these woordes 1. Corinth 12. And no man can saye that Iesus is the Caluine Lorde but by the holy Ghost sayeth thus It may be demaunded whether the wicked haue the Spirite of God seyng they sometime testifie playnely and well of Christe I answere that there is no doubte but that they haue so much as concerneth that effect but it is an other thing to haue the gifte of regeneration than to haue the gifte of bare vnderstanding wherewith Iudas was indued when he preached the Gospell M. Martyr also vpon the same woordes after he hath recited the opinions of other P. Martyr maketh this resolution But when I weygh this matter with my selfe I perceyue that the Apostle here dothe speake not of the Spirite whiche doth regenerate or of that grace which iustifieth but of the giftes which are freely giuen whiche may happen as well to the good as to the euill Therefore I thinke that Paule spake simply that he might declare that by what meanes soeuer we speake well of Christe it is of the holy Ghost of whome Omne verum à spiritu sancto est commeth all truthe as all vntruth proceedeth of the Deuill who is the father of lyes You sée therefore that Ambrose is not of this iudgement alone and that his saying is verie true The Doctoures that I haue vsed in this cause be Ierome and Augustine whiche be not the worst but comparable with the best I haue rehearsed out of them whole sentences and perfite the which you are not able to answere the rest of your opprobrious woordes wherewith you conclude this question of holy dayes I leaue for other to consider of as notes of your spirite And to the intent that the Reader may vnderstande that it was not for naught that you set not downe my Booke togither with your Replie I will here set downe such portions of my booke touching this matter as you haue not answered vnto but closely passed ouer not thinking that any man should haue espied your lacke of abilitie to answere them Chap. 2. the. 10. Diuision Admonition They should first proue that holy dayes ascribed to Sayncts prescript seruices for them c. are agreeable to the written worde of the Almightie Ansvvere to the Admonition Pag. 153. Sect. 4. Pag. 154. Sect. 1. Holy dayes ascribed to Sainctes wherein not the Sainctes but God is honoured and the people edified by reading and hearing suche stories and places of Scripture as perteyne to the martyrdome calling ▪ and function of such Sainctes or any other thing mentioned of them in Scripture must needes be according to Gods worde For to honor God to worship him to be edified by the stories and examples of Sainctes out of the Scripture cannot be but consonant to the Scripture The prescript secuice for them is all taken out of Gods worde and not one peece thereof but it is moste consonant vnto the same If ther be any that is repugnant set it down that we may vnderstande it I tolde you before that touching the dayes and times and other Ceremonies the churche hath authoritie to determine what is most cōuenient
deridingly to feyne and to vtter an v truth It séemeth you want false arguments to dally with when you are fayne to 〈◊〉 some of your owne and so for want of other sporte to imitate the Caste that 〈◊〉 with hir owne tayle The. 7. Diuision T. C. Page 129. Sect. 1. But I eny that it is or ought to be alwayes a step to the ministerie I know that it hath bene the vse of long time and I know also that there be very many whyche interpr̄ete the place of S. Paule where he speaking of the Deacons that behaue themselues well that they get themselues good 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is a degree to be a minister or a Bishop But I wyl shew a mani est reasō hy it can not so be vnderstanded whych is for that as the functions of a Deacon or a minister te 〈◊〉 so are the gyfts also wherby those functions are executed likewyse diuers therefore there may be some men for their wisdome grauitie discretion faythfulnesse whatsoeuer other gyfts are required in him that should do this office of prouiding for the poore to be a good de cō 〈◊〉 notwithstanding for some impediment in his tongue or for want of vtterance shall neuer be able as long as he liueth to be a good minister of the worde and therefore the 〈◊〉 beeing dyuers 〈◊〉 those offices must be executed although it is neyther vnlawfull nor 〈◊〉 to make of deaco t a minister if he haue gyfts for that purpose yet I deny that S. Paul appoynteth that the 〈◊〉 shoulde be as it were the seede or frye of the ministers or that he mean th by those words that the deaconship is a step to the pastorship Which may yet also further appeare by the 〈◊〉 offpecche which the Apostle vseth for he doth not say that they that doe the offyce of a deaconship well shall come to or get a good standing but he sayth that in so doing they doc gette them 〈◊〉 a good standing that is they get them selues authoritie estimation in the Church wherby they may be both the bolder to do theyr offyce wherby they may do it with more sruite whereas when they 〈◊〉 naughtily they neyther dare do oftentymes that whych they should do nor yet that whych they do well taketh so good effect bicause of the dyscredite whych commeth by theyr euyll 〈◊〉 And so I cōclude that M. Doctor hath brought hither to nothing to proue why eyther Deacons ought or else haue wont eyther to preach or to minister the sacraments Io. Whitgifte It is not necessarie that euery one which is a Deacon shoulde be preferred to the A deaconsh 〈◊〉 a step into th ministerie ministerie for it may be that he shall so euill vse him selfe in that function that he be thought vnméete further to be preferred But you haue not read as I think sithence the Apostles tyme of any that hath béene orderly preferred to the ministerie not beeing D acon before Ambrose Chrysostome the Greeke Paraphrast Bullinger Gualter Hemingi s diuers other do so expound these words of Paul 1. Ti. 3. Qui bene ministrauerūt gradū sibi honū cquirunt c. that they make the deaconship a step to the ministerie And therefore your reason had néede be very good that shall conuince all these of vnskilfulnesse S. Paule doth not make much difference betwixt the gyfts that are to be required 〈◊〉 a Bishop the gyfts that are to be required in a Deacon as it appeareth 1. Tim. 3. nd in déede if you respect the gyfts required in thē both there is not much difference betwéene them therfore your reason is not so strong as you make it Moreouer I neuer heard that an impediment in the tongue or some want of vtterance were sufficiēt cau to debarre a man otherwise méete from the ministerie In déede S. Paul requireth that he should be aptus ad docendū which he may be though he hath some impe iment in spéech For S. Paul doth not meane by these words volubilitie of tongue but wisdome discretion order in teaching If you meane such a one as eyther cannot speake at al or not vtter his mind in such sort as he may be vnderstoode him I thinke neither to be sit for to be minister nor a deacon but as I told you before it is not necessarie that whosoeuer is deacon should after be minister no more than it is that a Bacheler of Art shuld be a Master of Art or a Bacheler of diuinity a Doctor for there may be iust causes to stay thē frō proceeding any further And therfore sayth S. Paul 1. Tim. Qui bene ministr au rint 〈◊〉 bonū acquirunt c. They which haue ministred well get themselues a good degree So that this reason of yours is easily pushed away I know 〈◊〉 o exp unde the words of S. Paul as you o the interpretation is not amisse yet are not the reasons sufficient to improue the other to the whiche I moste incline bicause it is allowed of moste learned men and the words themselues doe very fitly beare it But the matter dothe not depende onely vpon these words of S. Paule but vpon the continuall practise of the Church also from tyme to tyme. The. 8. diuision T. C. Pag. 129. Sect. vlt. And albeit M. Doctor be not able to shewe it yet I confesse that it hathe beene in times past permitted vnto them in some Churches to baptise in other some to preache and baptise somtimes also to minister the supper but I say also that this was a corruption vsed at those times when there were very many other grosse vntollerable abuses from the whych I do appeale vnto that whych was first that is the institution of the Apostles which limited and bounded euery function within his seuerall limits and borders which it ought not to passe Io. Whitgifte Yes I haue proued it by sufficient testimonies to haue béene so euen in the Apostles Deacons bap tized Tertul. time when the Church was furthest from corruption and now I will adde a little more Tertullian in his booke de baptismo hath these words Baptizandi quidem iu habet summus sacerdos qui est Episcopus deinde Presbyteri Diaconi non tamen sine Episcopi authoritate propter Ecclesiae honorem The highe Priest which is the Bishop hath authoritie to baptize so haue the Ministers and Deacons but not without the authoritie of the Bishop for the honour of the Churche Hierome aduersus Luciferianos sayth thus I do not denie but that that is the 〈◊〉 of Hierom. the Churche that the Bishop should go to lay his hand by the inuocation of the holy spirit vpon those which a far of in little cities by ministers and Deacons were baptised And a little after he sayth that neyther the ministers nor deacons haue authoritie to baptise without the commaundement of the Bishop M. Beza lib.
the substance should be wanting But of this distinction I haue spoken in another place whereinto although M. Doctor falleth in the next section and in other places yet this shall be an answer for all Io. Whitgifte It is as grossely replyed vnto but my beléefe is that the sacrament is as purely and sincerely ministred with the one as it is with the other For not euery fond superstitious or vayne opinion of euery priuate person in this or that ceremonie â—erogateth any thing from the pure and sincere administration of the sacraments except it can be shewed that the things vsed be wicked vnlawfull or superstitious of themselues Wherefore this is a grosse quarell of yours it is no ouersighte of mine for I am well assured of the right and sincere administration of the sacraments in this Church both touching substance ceremonies and other circumstances And it is too much iniurie that you do to this Church of England in comparing the ceremenies thereof which he pure to the corrupt and superstitious ceremonies of the Papists vsed in baptisme But how should you otherwise vtter your coÌ„tempt or great spite against it Chap. 1. the. 9. Diuision Ansvver to the Admonition Pag. 99. Sect. 1. These words that you vse like their God of the altar be slanderous and false we are as farre from thinking the bread to be our God as you and teach as sound doctrine touching this sacrament And therefore you shew of what spirit you be T. C. Pag. 131. Sect. 2. The meaning of the Admonition in saying their God of the Altar is playne enough that it is vnderstanded of the Papists but that M. Doctor doth set himselfe to draw the authors of it into hatred and he cannot be ignorant that when a man speaketh of thinges whiche are 〈◊〉 knowen he often vseth the or that or their without naming the things which he speaketh of Io. Whitgifte The words of the Admonition be these Then they ministred with common and vsual bread now with wafer cakes brought in by Pope Alexander being in forme fashion and substance like their God of the Altar Now let the Reader iudge whether I charge them 〈◊〉 or no. Your excuse is but for a fashion their opinion of this whole Churche is as peeuishly and opprobriously vttered in sundry other places of their booke as it is in this And therefore there is no great doubt of their meaning or if their meaning be not so yet was it vnaduisedly set downe in that order that me may iustly suspect their meaning to be so Chp. 1. the. 10. Diuision Admonition The sixth They receiued it (c) Mat. 26. 20 Mar. 14. 18 Luk. 22. 14 Iohn 13. 28 sitting we kneeling according to Honorius decree Ansvvere to the Admonition Pag. 99. Sect. 1. 2. 3. The places of scripture that you quote in the margente to proue sitting at the communion declare that Christe and his disciples sate Kneeling and sitting at the Communion at the table but that proueth nothing For you mighte as well haue sayde they receiued after supper we before dinner they at nighte we in the morning they after meate we before meate they in a priuate house we in the open Churche they being all men and in number twelue we togyther with women not strictly obseruing the nuÌ„ber of twelue or any other nuÌ„ber aboue three or foure This your argument toucheth them as well as it doth vs whiche receiue it standing or walking But to sit stande kneele or walke be not of the substance of the Sacrament and therfore no impediments why it may not be sincerely ministred It be houeth humble and meeke spirites in such indifferent matters to submit themselues to the order of the Churche appoynted by lawfull authoritie and not to make schismes and contentions in the Church for the satisfying of their owne fantasies Io. Whitgifte Nothing answered Chap. 1. the. II. Diuision Ansvvere to the Admonition Pag. 99. Sect. vlt. Pag. 100. Sect. 1. Kneeling the meetest gesture Touching kneeling at the communion it forceth not who did first appoint it although I can finde no such decree made by Honorius it is the meetest manner of receiuing this sacrament in mine opinion being commonly vsed in praying and giuing of thanks both whiche are annexed to this sacrament and are to be required in the coÌ„municants and therfore I thinke this to be a good reason the meet est gesture for praying and thaÌ„ksgiuing is kneeling but those that receiue the Eucharist pray and giue thaÌ„ks Ergo the meetest gesture for them is kneeling The onely perill is adoration whiche may as well be committed sitting or standing But wherefore then serueth preaching there is as much daunger of contempt the one way as there is of adoration the other way In such matters Christian magistrates haue authoritie to appointe what they thinke most conuenient and the same must be obserued of those that be pacifici and not contentiosi But of sitting and kneeling at the communion more is to be spoken hereafter in the second part T. C. Pag. 131. Sect. 3. Although it be not of necessitie that we should receiue the communion sitting yet there is the same cause of abolishing kneeling that ther is of remouing the wafer cake and if there be daunger of superstition in one as M. Doctor confesseth why is ther not daunger in the other and if ther be men that take occasion to fall at the one that by superstition how commeth it to passe that M. Doctor in the. 180. pag. saith y e neither gospeller nor Papists obstinate nor simple can superstitiosly offend in this kneeling when as the kneeling carrieth a greater shew of worship imprinteth in the mindes of the ignoraÌ„t a stronger opinion and a deeper print of adoration than the sighte of a round cake And if kneeling be so voyd of all fault as M. Doctor would make vs beleeue howe came it to passe that in King Edwards days there was a protestation added in the booke of prayer to cleare that gesture from adoration Io. Whitgifte If this be a sufficieÌ„t argument to alter chaunge so decent comely an order and gesture in praysing God then what order can stand in the church seing there is nothing that may not be abused My words in the. 180. pag. be true and as yet vnanswered I will set them downe in their place that the Reader may perceyue howe little you are able to saye against them The protestation made in king Edwards dayes touching this gesture was to satissye if it might be such quarellers as you are and to take away all occasion of cauilling not for any great seare of adoration Chap. 1. the. 12. Diuision T. C. Pag. 131. Sect. vlt. Another reason why kneeling should be taken away is for that sitting agreeth better with the action of the supper wherevnto M. Doctor taketh exception both in this place and where he speaketh againe of it that forsomuch as this sacrameÌ„t is a sacrament of
by the ciuill magistrate I graunt the ministers haue also to punish vice for as the ciuill magistrates punishe lighter faultes with some penaltie of monie or losse of member so the church and the minister especially with the church hath to punishe faultes by reprehensions and rebukes And as the ciuill magistrate punisheth greater faultes by death so the minister with other which haue interest hath with y e sworde of excommunication power to kill those which be rebellious and to cut them from the churche as the other doth from the common wealth And if it be a helpe to the ministers office that he shoulde meddle with ciuill punishments why should it not be a help vnto the Magistrates office that he should excommunicate and do other thinges perteyning to the Ecclesiasticall discipline Io. Whitgifte In what woordes doth M. Caluine confute it or by what reason you cut of the matter very shorte in that booke and chapt of his Instit. which you haue quoted in the margent there is no such reason either alleaged or confuted Only in the. 9. Section he speaketh agaynst the temporall dominion of the Popish Bishops whiche deriue their excessiue power not from the ciuill Magistrate but fcō the Pope cloking it with this pretence that it is an ornament and beutie to the kingdome of Christ which is far from any thing alleaged by me why it is conuenient that our Bishops haue ciuill authoritie committed vnto them I would gladly heare a reason either of the Scripture or any other authenticall It is not so lawfull for the Prince to preach c. as for a minister to vse corporall punishment wryter why it should be as lawfull for a ciuill Magistrate to preache minister the Sacraments and excōmunicate as for the Ecclesiasticall minister to vse corporall punishment it was lawfull for Samuell to kill Agag being the office of Saule but it was not lawfull for Saule to offer vp sacrifices that being the office of Samuell The office and function of a mynister is not in his owne power to commit to whom he list but the office of the ciuill Magistrate may be cōmitted to whom soeuer it shal 1. Sam. 15. please him best to like of and to thinke most fitte for gouernment 1. Sam. 3. True it is that excōmunication is an Ecclesiastical censure which the mynister Excommunication not the only punishment vsed in the Church Gualter may exercise if the state of the Church will beare it for reprehension is a discipline lawfull for euery Christian to vse but it is not the onely censure for the ciuill magistrate may appoynt other as shall be to the state of the Church moste conuenient You know what M. Gualter sayeth 1. Cor. 5. As the Romaine Bishops vpon this place and such like haue grounded their excommunication which is the most effectuall instrument of their tyrannie whereby they haue cruelly vexed not onely priuate men but also Kinges and Emperours and haue bene the causes of ciuill warres and sedition euen so the Anabaptists whilest they perswade themselues that there can be no discipline without excōmunication they trouble the churches euery where and make thēselues laughing stockes to all the world c. Let euery church follovve that kinde of discipline vvhich is most meete for the countrie vvherein they liue and vvhich may be moste commodious in respect of time and place and let no man here rashly prescribe vnto an other or seeke to binde all men to one and the same forme Of old time there hath bene other kinde of punishments than either reprehensiōs or excōmunication as it may appeare euen in that Canon attributed to the Apostles which you haue before rehearsed where the punishment appoynted is depriuation as it is also in the most of the other Canons and in diuerse other councels You say that if it be a helpe to the ministers office that he should meddle with the ciuill punishmēts why should it not be a helpe to the magistrates office that he should excommunicate c. The answere is soone made The Magistrate may do that by corporall punishment that the minister can not do by Ecclesiasticall discipline neither is there any man so desperate whom the magistrate by his authoritie may not brydle but such is y e time now that fewe regarde the greatest censures of the Church Chap. 3. the. 3. Diuision T. C. Pag. 169. Sect. 2. And whereas M. Doctor sayeth they may not be husband men craftes men c. and yet may haue ciuill offices I thinke far otherwise that although neyther be lawfull yet the one were more tollerable than the other For seing after the ministerie of the worde there is no calling vnder the sunne weightier which requireth greater exercise of the minde than the office-of the magistrate it is agaynst all reason to lay this heauie burthen vpon a man that is already loden and hath as much as he is able to beare It were more equall if they will needes adde vnto the weight of this burthen to laye some lighter charge of exercising a handy crafte than to breake his backe with the charge of a ciuill Magistrate Io. Whitgifte These wdrldly affayres of husbandrie occupations c. must néedes withdrawe him from his booke so make him more vnapt to do his dutie and they be not at all incident to his office nor méete for his calling but the Ciuill offices that I speake of be both méete for his calling perteyning to discipline and helpes to his office function as I haue sayde wherefore they be so farre from breaking his backe that they make the rest of his burthen a great deale the easier Chap. 3. the. 4. Diuision T. C. Pag. 169. Sect. 3. And whereas in the pollicie of M. Doctor it seemeth a furtherance to the Gospell to ioyne these togither which was also the pollicie of the Idolaters as I haue before declared in the wisedome of God it hath seemed farre otherwise which I doubt not did therfore separate the ministerie from this pompe which is commendable in the ciuill magistrate least the efficacie and power of the simplicitie of the worde of God and of the ministerie should be obscured whilest men would attribute the conuersion of soules vnto the gospell due vnto the worde and to the spirite of God to these glorious shewes And least whilest the Minister haue the word in one hande and the swordem the other men should not be able to iudge so well in their consciences ▪ of the mightie operation of the worde of God in them For they might doubte with themselues whether these are and outwarde shewe of the minister caried some stroke with them in beleuing the worde Io. Whitgifte One of your reasons conteyned in this place in effect is this If ministers shoulde enioy ciuill functions men would attribute the conuersion of soules vnto these shewes but that ought they not to do therefore c. I denie your Maior as a fonde and vaine imagination
beyng commaunded by the Magistrate to be vsed or not to be vsed they are no trifles no more than it was for women to come into the Church bareheaded or a man to pray hauing his cappe on his head after that S. Paule had made an order to the contrarie And therefore these scoffes and floutes And what shall our Bishops winne by it forsoth that they be maynteyners of tryfles and tryfling Bishops consuming the greatest parte of their time in these tryfles whereas they should be better occupied might with more commendation of your modestie haue bene well forborne They see your doinges tende not onely to contention but to confusion not onely to disobedience towardes the lawes of the Prince but also to dangerous errours yea to the ouerthrow of Religion therefore they are neither maynteyners of tryfles nor tryfling Bishops but wyse discrete vigilant and learned Fathers whiche seeke to maynteyne peace preserue good order defende the authoritie of lawfull lawes and in time suppresse erroneous doctrine You rather spende the time in trifles when you might be better occupied for you omitting all other necessary pointes of doctrine and Inuectiue Sermons profitable exhortations to good life stuffe your sermons and furnish your table talke with nothing else but with bitter inuectiues against those rytes as though they were matters of damnation and against those learned and discrete ministers of the woorde who according to their dutie vsing of them seeke in deede to beate downe Antichrist to plante necessary pointes of Religion in mens heartes and to teach Unfrutefull sermons repentance with newnesse of life which your vnfruitfull frowarde and contentious dealyng reioyseth the Papiste discrediteth the sounde and learned preacher offendeth the godlye woundeth the weake worketh contempte of Magistrates and superiours in the heartes of the hearers destroyeth that which other men buylde and finally doth good to none For what fruite can there come to the hearers by inueighing continually against Cappe Tippet Surplesse Ring in mariage womens whyte kerchers baggepipes funerall sermons mourning aparel c. Bishoppes Preachers Magistrates Prince These and suche lyke be onely the common places you entreate of T. C. Pag. 175. Sect. 2. Upon the ninth leafe he hath sundry greeuous accusations and charges of disorder disobediēce and contempte against those which refuse the aparel and laboureth to perswade that they are great and weighty matters But his proofes were spent before Io. Whitgifte The proofes that I haue here vsed gawles you shrewdely will not be answered with such disdaine let the learned Reader consider of them and marke howe well you haue spoken for your selfe Ansvvere to the Additions c. Fol. 1. There is added Portuis for where before they sayde that our booke of Common prayers was culled and picked out of that Popyshe dunghill the Massebooke nowe vppon better aduisement they saye that it was culled out of the portuis and Masse booke It derogateth nothing from the booke of Common prayers bicause something therein is in the portuis and massebooke no more than it derogateth from the scriptures that some portion of them as the whole Psalmes and certain other portions of the Epistles Gospels and other Scripture bee in the same neyther are they allowed bicause they be in the portuis and massebooke but bicause they be either Scripture or moste agreeable therevnto They also adde in the firste reason that the comming of women in vayles to be Churched is not commaunded by lawe but yet the abuse to bee great by reason that superstition is growen thereby in the heartes of many and other are iudged that vse it not This is an argument of their former rashnesse but not worthy any answere especially being confessed to be without the booke For the. 120. Psalme is now quoted the. 121. Psalme which I haue also corrected before Fol. 2. For the. 26. of Math. is noted the. 28. And this also I corrected in answering that place Where it was before and minister a Sacrament nowe is added according to their appointmente to what purpose I knowe not There is also added in the same leafe these wordes are not the people well nodified thinke you when the homely of sweeping the churche is read vnto them Surely such flouting termes are vsed of none but of nodies in deede and suche as are more meete to be fooles in playes where they maye iest thā to be platformers of churches in whom wisdome learning grauitie godlinesse is to be requyred I know no Homelie entituled of sweeping the Churche one there is of repayring and keeping cleane of churches whether it edifie or no I referre to the wise and discrete Reader to iudge when he hath perused it Before it was in y t secōd reason for the very name Apocrypha testifieth that they Fol. 3. Apocrypha ▪ ought rather to be kept close than to be vttered Now it is for the very name Apocrypha testifieth that they were read in secrete not opēly This is some correction of their former rashnesse But of this matter that is of reading Homelies in the Church I haue spoken before I omit 2. Tim. 3. vers 6. which is now vers 19. 2. Pet. 1. vers 20. which is now vers 19. 20. 21. For these be not matters of any great importance they be quoted to proue a matter not doubted of among vs. In the former edition fourth reason it is thus written In this booke we are enioyned to receyue the Cōmunion kneeling which beside that it hath in it a shewe of papistrie doth not so well expresse the mysterie of this holy Supper For as in the old Testament eating the Paschall Lamb stāding signified a readinesse to passe euen so in receiuing it now sitting according to the exāple of Christe we signifie a rest that is a full finishing thorough Christ of all the ceremoniall lawe and a perfect worke of redemption wrought that giueth reste for euer and so we auoyde also the daunger of Idolatrie In the second Edition these wordes be thus altered In this booke we are enioyned to receyue the Cōmuniō kneeling which beside that it hath in it a shew of popish Idolatrie doth not so well expresse a Supper neither agreeth it so well with the institution of Christ as sitting doth not that we make sitting a thing of necessitie belonging vnto the Sacramēt neyther al firme we that it may not be receyued otherwise but that it is more neare the institution and also a meane to auoyde the daunger of Idolatrie Here is the signification Correction of sitting which they before made cleane dashed out as a thing vnaduisedly before put in It is also here graūted that the Cōmunion may be receyued otherwise than sitting with other circūstances wherof they haue now better cōsidered Surely this is a great alteration vpon such a sodaine I would hardly haue bene persuaded that these men would so sone haue discredited thēselues by theyr inconstancie But peraduenture
the selfe same had not the correction of the booke which were the first penners of it and therefore how they will like of this correction it may be doubted But although the wordes in the texte be altered yet the quotations in the margent remayne still Belike they are to be applied as it pleaseth the platformers All this is added in the seuenth reason But some will say that the baptisme of Fol. 4. women is not cōmaunded by law if it be not why do you suffer it wherfore are the childrē so baptized accordingly cōmon experience teacheth that it is vsed almost in all places fewe speake against it this I am sure of that when it was put in the booke that was the meaning of the most part that were thē present and so it was to be vnderstāded as cōmon practise without cōtrolement doth plainely declare All these be but cōiectures Diuers things be suffered in many places vsed without cōtrolment which notwithstanding by no lawe be cōmaunded What the meaning was of those that penned the booke I know not neither as I thinke do you And surely for cōmon practise I can say litle but for mine own experiēce this I dare affirme that I haue not knowne one childe so baptised in places where I haue had to do no not since the beginning of the Q. Maiesties reigne I speake not of the thing it self but only of your coniectures I Baptizing by women not collected out of the booke thinke if the circūstances of the booke be well considered it will appeare that the meaning is that priuate baptisme is rather to be ministred by some minister which in y e time of necessity may soonest be come by thā by any womā But in this poynt I submit my iudgemēt to such as better know the meaning of y e bok being pēners therof thā I do In the same leafe ninth reason speaking of certeyne things vsed about mariage they adde these words VVith diuers other heathenishe toyes in sundry coūtries Toyes about mariage as carying of wheat sheafs on their heads casting of corne with a nūber of such like wherby they make rather a maygame of mariage thā a holy institutiō of God These be but toyes in deede vsed I know not where not conteyned in any part of the boke of cōmon prayers therfore without my cōpasse of defense They lacke matter whē they stuffe theyr booke with such vaine friuolous trifles In the. 10. reason to these wordes as for confirmation is added which the Fol. 5. Papists and our men say was in times past Apostolicall grounding their opinion perhaps vpon some dreame of Hierome And in the same place these wordes be left out VVe speake not of other toyes vsed in it how far it differeth is degenerated from the first institution they thēselues that are learned can witnesse And in the place hereof this is inserted as though baptisme were not already perfect but needed cōfirmation or as though the Bishop could giue the holy Ghost You your selfe in effect haue confessed in your first edition that confirmation of children is very auncient that it hath bene wel instituted for there you say that now it differeth is degenerate Confirmation of children allowed at the last frō the first institution But vpon better aduisemēt you haue left out these wordes in your second Edition as you haue also left out these with other toyes vsed in it wherby you confesse contrary to your former sentence that the confirmation of Children now vsed is without any toyes Howsosoeuer it pleaseth you to accompt Hieromes iudgemēt touching the antiquitie of confirmation a dreame yet his dreame may be of as much credite with wise men as your bare deniall of the same The wordes The ende of confirmation that you haue added in the second place might wel haue bene spared for you know that confirmation now vsed in this Churche is not to make baptisme perfect but partly to trie how the godfathers Godmothers haue performed y t which was enioyned thē whē the children were baptised partly that the childrē thēselues now being at the yeares of discretiō hauing learned what their Godfathers Godmothers promised for thē in baptisme may with their owne mouth with their owne consent openly before the church ratifie confirme the same also promise that by the grace of God they will euermore endeuour themselues faithfully to obserue keepe such things as they by their own mouth confessiō haue assented vnto And this reason is alledged among other euē in the booke of cōmon prayers And that it is not to make baptisme perfect y e boke of cōmon prayers it self declareth in these words And that no mā shal think any detrimēt shal come to Childrē by deferring of their cōfirmatiō he shal know for truth that it is certaine by Gods word that childrē being baptised haue all things necessary for their saluatiō be vndoubtedly saued You adde as though the Bishop could giue the holy Ghost the Bishop may vse the ceremonie vsed by the Apostles that is imposition of handes may safely say this godly prayer conteyned in the booke Defend O Lorde this childe with the heauenly grace that he may continue thine for euer and dayly encrease in thy holy spirit more and more vntill he come vnto thy euerlasting kingdome Amē And other such godly prayers there cōteiued Of any other kind of giuing y e holy ghost there is no mētion in that boke therfore these additions might very well haue bene leftout of your libel To the end of the eleuenth reason these wordes be added and open our eyes that we may see what that good and acceptable will of God is and be more earnest to prouoke his glory to the which I onely answere Amen In the ende of the. 12. there is something left out which they haue placed in the. 13. reason but it is answered before There is nothing added or altered worth the noting onely in the Fol. 6. fiftenth reason where they sayd before that we honored Bishops by the titles of kings nowe they haue recanted that and condemned themselues of an vntruth for they haue left out that title Fol. 7. In the seuenth leaf and 19. reason these words be left out banners and belles which argueth that they were before vntruly sayd to be vsed in gang weeke But to lye is a small matter with these men For Lordes grace of Yorke there is the Archbishop of Yorke The cause of Fol. 8. this alteration I know not When you say that you striue for true Religiō gouernment of the Church c. Fol. 9. You say that you do that which is to be wished you should do But your doings tēde to y e defacing of true Religion ouerthrow of the right gouernment of the Church although you be not the head of Antichrist yet are you his
are not bound to any suche prescript forme of outward ceremonies and circumstances but haue frée libertie not only to appoynte but also to alter and chaunge the same as shall be thoughte most conuenient so that nothing be done against the word of God and that the generall 1. Cor. 14. rule be obserued 1. Cor. 14. that all things be done decently and in order All thys therefore that you speake of houre place and of the forme of buriall and of mariage c. infirmeth nothing that I haue sayd for these be circumstances not vsed in the seruice of God but in other actions and I speake of suche ceremonies and circumstances as are vsed in the Church about the seruice and worshipping of God whiche were to the Iewes particularly prescribed as appeareth in the places before alleadged but be not so to vs. Chapter 6. the. 5. Diuision T. C. Page 22. Sect. 1. 2. I will not be long whereas you say that they had nothing but was determined by the law and we haue many things vndetermined and left to the order of the Church I will offer for one that you shall bring that we haue left to the order of the Churche to shewe you that they had twentie A large offer but not so soone per formed which were vndecided of by the expresse word of God For as their ceremonies and Sacraments are multiplied aboue ours so grew the number of those cases which were not determined by any expresse word and therefore I will conclude (a) Marke these words that for somuch as we haue the same 〈◊〉 to direct vs in the seruice of God which they had besides that a noble addition of the new testament to make things more manif st and to bring greater light vnto the old testament we haue also precise direction of our religion as they had and therefore those places of Deut. stande in as greate force now touching the gouernmente of the Church as they did then And as for the iudiciall law for as muche as there are some of them made in regard of the region where they were giuen and of the people to whome they were giuen the Prince and Magistrate keeping the substance and equitie of them as it were the marrow may chaunge the circumstances of them as the times and places and manners of the people shall require But to say that any magistrate can saue the life of blasphemers conteniptuous and stubborne Idol ters murderers adulterers incestuous persons and such like which God by his iudiciall law hath commaunded to be put to death I do vtterly deni and am ready to proue if that perteyned to this question And therefore although the iudiciall lawes are permitted to the discretion of the Prince and Magistrate yet not so generally as you seeme to affirme and as I haue often times said that not only it must not be done against the word but according to the word and by it Io. Whitgifte Surely if you can shew me twenty things to be done of them in the seruice of God or discipline of the Church left to the order of the Church and vndetermined in the law for one that I can shew left to the order of our Church you can do more than any man that I know hath either spoken or written Musculus Lo. co after that he hath made a particular Musc. loc com tit de legib recitall of the ceremoniall lawes saithe that God did therefore appoint vnto thē such a number of Ceremonies bicause they should not inuēt any other seing they had Ceremonies inow wherby they might be exercised and as it were by a certain kind of schooling might be instructed in the spirituall sense To our discretion is left as I haue said the most of the circumstances perteyning to both the sacraments most of all externall rites ceremonies and other things that perteyne to comelinesse and order yea and the disposition of many things also which apperteine to the externall discipline and gouernmente of the Church which are to be varied according to time persons and place as shall hereafter be proued If you be able to shewe that the same libertie was lefte vnto them in so many thinges you shall do more than I can conceyue But admttte all this to be true that you say there can be nothing spoken more directly The assertion of T. C. directly eth the Answere for the iustifying of my cause For if the Israelites notwithstanding these places of Deutero had libertie to order things in the Church not comaunded or prescribed vnto them in the word of God then do the Authours of the Admonition vnaptly vse these places of Deuteronomie to proue that those things only are to be vsed and placed in the Church which God himselfe in his word hath commaunded For if the Iewes notwithstanding these precepts did lawfully vse those things that were not in the word commaunded withoute adding to the word or taking from it surely we may do so in like manner And thus haue you taken muche paynes in iustifying that cause which y u would so gladly ouerthrow Wher you say that we haue the same lawes to direct vs in the seruice of God that they had The assertion of T. C. tendeth to Iudaisme if you meane the same morall lawes you say truly but nothing to the purpose if you meane the same ceremoniall lawes which properly are said to be lawes directing them in the seruice of God then do you Iudaizare play the Iew. And certainely I maruell what you meane by this saying séeing that you knowe our externall manner and kind of worshipping of God to be farre distante from theirs and our sacramentes though spiritually the same yet both in number forme matter obseruation and kind of signification much differing from them and especially seing that their ceremoniall law is vtterly abolished Neyther do I well vnderstand what your meaning is when you adde Besides that a noble addition of the newe testamente to make things more manifest and to bring a greater light vnto the old testament For if you meane that the newe testamente is added to the ceremoniall lawe that cannot be so for it is the ende of the Ceremoniall lawe and dothe vtterly abrogate it Nam inis legis Christus c. Christe is the ende of the lawe For as well the figures as the promises conteyned in Rom. 10. the lawe and the Prophetes are fulfilled in the newe Testament by the comming Luke 24. of Christe as he him selfe saythe Luke 24. If you meane that it is added to the morall lawe that is also vntrue for it onely explaneth it it addeth nothing vnto it In déede it bringeth a great lighte to the olde Testament bicause all thinges are there fulfilled whiche were prophe ied of and prefigured in the olde Testament M. Caluin Caluin inst Institu Cap. 3. Sect. 9. saythe that to thinke Christ to haue added any thing to the law is
moste pernicious I muste craue pardon of the Reader for making suche excursions out of the way Whether the Magistrate be bounde to obserue the Iudiciall law of Moses for I am compelled to followe you whiche interlace your booke with suche by ▪ matters and those so suspicious and daungerous that I can not safely passe them ouer with silence And euen nowe agayne do you enter into a straunge and dangerous opinion in my iudgement for you would haue the ciuill Magistrate bounde to obserue all the Iudiciall lawes of Moses excepte suche as were made in respect of the re gion where they were giuen and of the people to whome they were giuen Of the whiche lawes the Magistrate you say may onely chaunge the circumstances as the times and places and manners of the people shall require But you vtterly deni and are ready to proue if that perteyned to th s question that any Magistrate can saue the lyfe of blasphemers contemptuous and stubbo ne Idolaters murderers adulterous persons and suche like whiche God by his Iudiciall lawe hathe commaunded to be put to death Howesoeuer you passe this matter ouer as impertinent to this question yet for as The 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 with the asser tion of T. C. muche as you haue héere set it downe and I am fully persuaded that it is vntrue I minde to touche it something and to vtter the reasons of my persuasions I leaue it to the consideration of those that knowe the lawes and state of the Realne and especially suche as haue the chiefe gouernment and care of the same what lieth hidde vnder this your opinion First all the lawes of this land that be contrarie to these Iudiciall lawes of Moses must be abrogated The Prince must be abridged of that prerogatiue which she hath in pardoning suche as by the lawe be condemned to dye the punishments of death for fellonie must be mitigated according to Moses law whiche doth by other meanes punish the same Exod. 22. To be short al things must be transformed Exod. 22. Lawyers must cast away their huge volumes and multitude of cases and content them selues with the bookes of Moses we of the Cleargie would be the best Iudges and they must require the lawe at our handes Deutero 17. verse 8. And so Deut. 17. while we make them beléeue that we séeke for equalitie among our selues we séeke in déede regall dominion ouer them Looke Deuter. 17. verse 12. But to omit all these considerations whiche I leaue to those to whom they do especially perteyne I wyll shew as briefly as I can how farre this opinion is from true diuinitie First besides all those places of Scripture whiche make generally for the abrogation The Iudiciall lawe abrogat of the whole lawe we haue especiall places for the Iudiciall lawe and namely those where Christ maketh lawes of deuorcement for adultrie Math. 5. and. 19. which Mat. 5. 19. were altogither néedlesse if she that is takē in adultrie should of necessitie be stoned to death according to y e law of Moses Aug. ad Pollentiū de adult coniug li. 2. cap. 6. 7. 8. 14. Augustine proueth by that whiche is written of Christ. Iohn 8. touching the woman deprehended Iohn 8. in adultrie and brought vnto him by the Scribes Pharisies that the wife taken in adultrie ought not to be punished with death but suffred to liue that she mighte be reconciled to hir husbande or at the least repent Cyril also vpon the. 11. of Leuit. saith that though the punishment of death was according to the law of Moses appoynted for adultrie Cyrill and certayne other crimes yet among Christians there is no suche commaundement in force Musculus in his common places tit de legib speaking of the law sayth thus Muscul. They aske the question whether the whole lawe be abrogated we answere if whole Moses gaue place to Christ then hathe his whole lawe giuen place to the lawe of Christe And a little after The commaundementes of the lawe are Morall Iudiciall Ceremoniall That the Ceremoniall commaundementes haue ceassed it is euident forsomuche as the Priesthoode of the lawe to the which the ceremonies were annexed is abrogated by the Priesthoode of Christ according to the order of Melchizedech and that the Iudicials also are ceassed it dothe herein appeare for that the whole order of gouernment of Israell which was requisite vnto the inhabiting of the lande of promise hath from that time ceassed wh as they beeing expelled began to dwell amongst the Gentiles without a king without gouernours without a Priest and without a lawe Hemingius in his Encber is of the same iudgement his words be these There is also Hemingius the Iudiciall law which expired with the common wealth of Moses so that it dothe not binde any man of necessitie but so farre onely as some portion of it dothe perteyne to the law of nature as the law agaynst incestuous mariages Leuit. 18. and so much of it lykewise as the ciuill Magistrate shall admit for pollicie I omit that place of M. Caluin which is written in his Harmonie vpō the. 5. bookes Caluin of Moses where he speaking of these lawes Exod. 23. Deut. 12. Num. 3 which were giuen for the breaking of Images destroying of places where idolatrie was cōmitted c. saith that they were but temporall exercises to kéepe the people in obedience c. And in the same booke speaking of the. 7 ▪ of Deut. The grauē Images of their Gods shall Deut. 7. ye burne with fire and couet not the siluer and golde that is on them c. saith Althoughe this was a politike lawe and giuen onely to the auncient people for a time yet hereby we may gather how detestable Idolatrie is c. But of all other places that is moste euident which he hathe in his Institu Cap. 20. Sect. 13. 14. 15. and therfore I wil rehearse it more at large Sunt qui rectè compositam rempub negent c. There are certaine which denie that Caluinus common welth to be well ordered which omitting the politike lawes of Moses is ruled by the common lawes of the Gentiles The which opinion how dangerous and seditious it is ☞ let other men cōsider it is inough for me to haue declared that it is both false foolish But that vsuall diuision is to be obserued which deuideth the whole law of God deliuered by Moses into maners ceremonies iudgements and euery part therof is diligently to be considered that we may vnderstande what perteyneth vnto vs thereof and what dothe not In the meane time let no man be troubled with this that both the Iudicials ceremonies did apperteyne vnto maners for the ancient fathers the inuentors of this diuisiō although they were not ignorant that these two latter parts were occupied about maners yet bycause they might be altered and abrogated without any preiudice vnto maners they called