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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A61877	An epistolary discourse concerning phlebotomy in opposition to G. Thomson pseudo-chymist, a pretended disciple of the Lord Verulam : wherein the nature of the blood, and the effects of blood-letting, are enquired into, and the practice thereof experimentally justified (according as it is used by judicious physicians) : [bracket] in the pest, and pestilential diseases, in the small pox, in the scurvey, in pleurisies, and in several other diseases / by Henry Stubbe ...	Stubbe, Henry, 1632-1676.; Stubbe, Henry, 1632-1676. Relation of the strange symptomes happening by the bite of an adder, and the cure thereof.	1671 (1671)	Wing S6044; ESTC R39110	221,522	319

Adder before I put it in I have tasted the Gall and that yellow juyce which lyes about the Teeth without any hurt the yellow juyce did to me seem insipid or a little sweetish if it might be said to have any taste Mr. Charas sayes he found the taste of a Salvia or Spittle sufficiently flat and approaching enough to the taste of Oyl of sweet Almonds in the yellow liquor of the Gums Herewith agree Amatus Lusitanus though Zacchias say that his Apothecary tasting thereof found it to be Saporis insipidi cum ponticitate And it seems to me indubitable that the venome of the Animal proceeds from its indignation which opinion Poterius Helmont and Zwelfer proposed before Charas and that there is a virulency in the Wound appears by the evil accidents upon sucking thereof Yet must I note that Veslingius saith of the Teeth that the poyson doth formally lodge there and that the Teeth being taken and rubbed upon any Weapon do give it an impoysoning quality if any be wounded with it But I shall detain you no longer though I could shew some defaults in Charas and illustrate the History of Adders by Observations upon the several Animals into which I have suffered the Skins and Livers to putrifie But I shall conclude with the profession of being SIR Your most humble Servant Henry Stubbe Warwick June 12 1673 FINIS A PREFACE To The READER ABout Christmas I was earnestly pressed by some Persons of Great Learning and of no Common Repute to make some Reply unto G. Thomson not only to chastise his Insolence towards me for which he had made me Sufficient Reparation by his Postscript against D. M. but to punish him for the Indignities he had put upon my Faculty Having finished that Treatise I was importuned to write something about Phlebotomy since he had made such a clamour about it against the Colledge and that this Point had not been handled by the Adversaries of M.N. how necessary soever he had rendered it by the Publication of Medela Medicine The Request seemed very Just but how I should be able to perform the Vndertaking to my own Satisfaction or that of others I knew not For this Age seemed so to have charged the Methods of Ratiocination so altered the Principles of Physick and Philosophy that for a man to argue as our best Writers do were to subject the Case to all manner of Scorn and Contempt And how I should reduce the Phaenomena which are undeniably consequential to Plebotomy under one plausible Hypothesis I did not well comprehend For I had no Collections upon the Subject indeed I never made any in my life upon any but remit all to the strength of my Memory and that now declines nor had I ever framed to my self any Idea of things that might accomplish me thereunto Though I have for sundry Years been contriving some Materials in order to it And had seriously gone about it but that my Contests with the Virtuosi have diverted me and the Troubles and Dangers they have ever since alarm'd me with even to the hazard of my Life and Fortunes made me unwilling to begin what I should never have opportunity to conclude However since they were pleased to have some Opinion of my Abilities and promised to acquiesce in what I could do under so little Leysure as my Practice affords me and so great Disadvantages as my Disfurnishments created me I did submit to the Task And thou hast here Reader what my Thoughts could Recollect and Digest in the Space of a few Weeks and those Interrupted with other businesses amidst so slender a Library as mine is the Defects whereof I could not supply any wayes many of the Books which I would have made use of and which I lost by the late Fire being not to be found in any Library or bought in England So much decayed is the Trade of Book-selling together with the present Declination of all Learning If to have refuted my Adversaries be all that thou expectest I have done it perspicuously and fully If thou look'st for a compleat Hypothesis in defence of the Physicians Practice I acknowledg the present Treatise to be deficient For as to the Nature of the Blood though I have made many Essays in reference to the discovery thereof yet one Inquiry hath so multiplied others and there is such a variation thereof not only in Individuals but according to the Seasons and Seasonableness of the Years that I am better able to convince others of their Errours than to demonstrate other Principles Something I have done in order thereunto and some things I could have further prosecuted but would not For I have no mind to instruct others too far Let them study or to speak in the Dialect of my Enemies let them Read Index's as I have done To what purpose should I add strength to those Fetters which are preparing for my Faculty Or prejudice Learning by qualifying a sort of Ignorant Idle Talkative-Insolents to maintain Conversation in any Company If I could see that the Parliament would in pursuance of the Prudent Laws made by our Ancestors regulate our Faculty according to Real Policy and the Precedents of the best Governments I would not only Contribute all I could to the publique Utility but propose such a Designe as should add more to the Advancement of Useful Knowledg and that Learning which is necessary to the Support of this Monarchy as no Age did ever parallel which should be Facile Practicable and the Effects thereof should be more Uisible in three Years than theirs have been who boast that they have done more in six Years than the Aristotelians in more than thrice so many Centuries But let these men have their Desires Let them be loaded according to their own Overtures with all that contempt which is usually the Reward of vain and unprofitable Projectors I cannot but look upon it as a singular Act of Providence that I should fix upon the present Title of this Book and direct my Censure against the Lord Bacon and those that pretend to be Followers of Him in Philosophy seeing that it hath happened so as that Ecebolius Glanvil hath made use of that Great Name to excuse his Errours and Insolence and thinks it a sufficient Apology If he can shew that the substance of his most Obnoxious Periods and Passages are to be found largely and often insisted on by so Great Learned and Wise a man as my Lord Bacon Which defence though it be no other than he might make who should tender us a wrong Account of the Sweating-Sickness or avowe that Coffi were Narcotical or obtrude upon us a thousand Falsities out of the Philosophical Writings of that Lord and Lawyer yet doth it seem requisite that I should say something more in reference to his Authority left what imported little in the Age when he lived should be prejudicial and destructive to that which succeeds I will not deny that he was a

Florence Venice Rome Naples Paris or Sevill methinks it is apparent that the recommendation of Medicaments or Methods of curing in the Plague ariseth from the observation that some by the happy use of such a course or such a Medicament have perhaps amidst dangerous and seemingly deadly symptomes been recovered And herein Septalius and Massarias and others say as much for themselves as Mindererus or Sennertus And what Celsus saith of Hippocrates Herophilus and Asclepiades I cannot but call to mind when I reflect on the several Methods of Physick endeared unto us by judicious Practitioners Si rationes sequi velimus omnium posse videri non improbabiles si curationes ab omnibus his aegros perductos esse ad sanitatem So just I am to those excellent Practitioners It is certain that in Physick we do oftentimes commit the Fallacy of non causa pro causa and attribute those eff●cts to one Medicament or Method which either did but accidentally ensue thereon it contributes nothing to the effect but only happening to be insisted on at or before the time that the Phoenomenon discovered it self or only removing something that hindered the natural production of the effect or only acting as a partial cause therein or meerly strengthening or making room for nature that the effect might more easily result Thus we directly yield the glory of one or more successful cures to a wrong original and delude our selves and others not only with vain hopes in the remedy or method but with new Hypothesis raised upon these frail foundations and with the same levity reject the Medicaments and Methods of others with which we celebrate our own nay oftentimes with more for those foundations are most sure which are laid by the most men if they be judicious and observing and have endured the test of more ages and tryals If presumption and arrogance could have entombed the Pest the most insolent but worst of Physicians that is Van Helmont had secured man-kind against its ill effects and what man could have dyed or languished under the Gout or other Chronical distempers if the Rhodomontades of Paracelsus Penaltus Severinus Danus had contained any solidity But experience hath shewed us that we have only exchanged not amended our practise the Tinctures the Essences the Elixirs however graduated or how gloriously soever denominated do not exempt us from that condition humane nature is subjected unto the general intentions of curing cito tuto jucunde are old the performance now answers not the pretenses the Athanasia Iucunda Mysterium Ambrosia of which you may read in Galen If I were to chuse my Medicaments by the sound they make would seem as good as the Anima Auri Tinctura polyaceia or Pulvis pestifugus and better than the Alexistomachon for that like 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 would affrighten me as if it were a Medicine to drive away a mans stomach And if I were to word my discourse I would more willingly use a known tongue than an unknown and write Secretary rather than the Vniversal Character If I cannot acquire knowledge above others there is more of vanity than glory in the ostentation of a new-fashioned ignorance I write this because I am convinced because I do not believe that there is any thing more intelligible in the modish word venome then in the profound sordid or superlative putrefaction wherein the Galenists placed the Pest If such a putridity be unimaginable which yet is but graduated above what we see and unto which 't is evident that diseases sometimes gradatim do arrive it is certain that there is no such thing as the Arsenical or Napelline poyson in the Pest but somewhat forsooth Analogous thereunto as Mindererus and Sennertus assure us and here we are put upon Gradations again by which Cerusse and Lithargyre Napellus and Tithymal Can●harides and Dipsas are to be transmuted into or graduated up to Arsenic Most assuredly in this Age the Chimaeras have exchanged their pasture and being cloyed or starved with feeding upon the Second intentions they are now luxuriously dieted with Metaphors and Similitudes I would not therefore have this following discourse to be construed as an Apology for the failures of the Galenists but of all judicious Practitioners even of different principles who intermeddle with the Plague The first reason of their miscarriage is the difficulty or rather impossibility of discovering of the Plague oftentimes in its first approach and sometimes the disease continues and makes a progress hopeful and promising for several dayes and then manifests it self in the sudden death of the Patient of the truth hereof ● need no ●nstances the only care a Practitioner can shew is after that frequent Funerals have informed him of an approaching or raging Pest to tend his Patients whatever the distemper be little or great as if it were the Plague and yet that this supposition is fallacious I can demonstrate out of the Histories of several Plagues particularly that of Vicenza and Breda Here then our Physician is no more to be blamed than he is for not being an Angel or a Deity Another reason is that the sick parties do not come to our Practitioner upon the first and smallest sense of the disease for after the Pest hath seised upon them a few hours eight or twelve hours Sennertus himself could not cure one in an hundred and of this Erastus complains who was for bleeding that most that died came not unto him till that the Plague had too far seised their spirits and debilitated them so as to render all means ineffectual though he tryed Sudorifics and complyed with all Hypothesis in his practise I must here note that the diversity of Plagues as to their nature and continuance makes a greater latitude in the opportunity or timing of Medicines than to restrain it to eight or ten hours but this cannot be known till the Plague hath lasted some while A third reason is the great difference betwixt the Nature of one Plague and another so that neither one Method nor the same Medicaments will serve in all Pests no no● in any two hardly besides the particular diversification which the Pest receives according to idiosyncrasy and constitution of each infected person And for this reason Nicolaus Ellain in his Treatise of the Plague commented upon by the renowned Guido Patin refused to write down a special cure of the Pest in that book Quantum ad curationem spectat eam attingere nolui quia periculo sissimum est ex solis universalibus regulis curationem instituere idemque calopodium singulis quibusque adaptare Iuris peritorum effatum est Theorias generales non informare animum practicum qui consistit in singularibus Si haec propositio in jure vera existit potiorem locum in Medicina habere debet in ●ffectu presertim adeo an●malo atque insolenti cujus ut Protei nunquam facies eadem est Nulla enim pestis alteri

Allegiance and Supremacy and the having done all that the King and Church required I have not yielded you sufficient satisfaction pardon me if I say I understand not what is necessary to the Civil and Ecclesiastical Peace and you do exceed the Precedents of any History or any Policy which I am acquainted with I think this Discourse to be the most pertinent Answer I could give to all the Railing of my Adversaries without descending to Particulars the Prosecution whereof and even Repetition would seem tedious and in these times unseasonable I now descend to other Passages in Ecebolius He said my Head was Red-hot By the difference of the Character who would not imagine that he reflected on me as Red-Headed He hath now varied the Letter and saith Red hot is not this the Sophistication of a gross Lye He adds another If I had said your Head was Red I had not been such a Lyer neither it was a direct Carrot last time I saw it It never was of other Colour than of the pale Hungary Gold and in time altered to a Light Brown 'T was such as the Ancients did ascribe to Apollo and Mercury though very thin and as the Wisest Nations have and do desire to imitate by Artifice But his words were his Head is Red-hot Which is a Lye And if it were not so much to be said for that Colour that I should not be ashamed thereof Besides that some of the R. S. must suffer in the contumely if it be one Yet I neither take that or the other of Bald-Pate to carry any thing of Ignominy in them He had also said In testimony of his great Love and Devotion to the King he thus subscribes the Title of his rare Book of Chocolata by Henry Stubs Physician for his Maj●sty in the Island of Iamaica Now no doubt he is Physician for his Majesty too in the Town of Warwick and He intends to be Physician for his Majesty in the City of London I could not but look upon this as a Lying Insinuation as if I had dared to Usurp that Character which indeed his Majesty did Honour me with And who would not as the words import conclude that either I was not Physician for his Majesty at Jamaica or no doubt am now Physician for his Majesty at Warwick which for any man else to say were a Lye but in Ecebolius and Vertuoso 'tis only Raillery Such Raillery it is when he speaks of my Spitting fire in a Feavour and Reading by the Light of his Spittle Whereas I neither had any Feavour these many Years nor did ever such a Phaenomenon befall me in one Several Months after I had been sick of the Colick Bilious which neither is a Feaver nor was attended with any upon the taking of a certain Course of Physick and Indulging my self in the taking of Snuffe I do not take it for a contumely to be told of my Snuffe-Box I observed that sometimes in the dark as I blew my Nose a stream of Light from my Eyes and Nostrils would issue out and accompany the Pituita even to the Ground so that I could discover a Straw or Pinn But what is all this to a Feaver-Fire and Reading by it If this be not a Lye 't is not more certain that Truth is not to be spoken at all times than that in this manner it ought never to be spoke by a Divine though Ecebolius may say any thing All the Odious Stories in him and D. M. are thus disguised I imparted this odde Phaenomenon de luce animalium to one of the R. S. desiring to know his judgment If it might be the effect of the Physick or such Snuffe as I then took From him 't is now transmitted to Ecebolius As many others whom I know contributed their Symbols to this Farce as well as that of D. M.s. Yet doth Ecebolius deny that any ever saw his Writings before they were Printed No man except my Transcriber ever saw my Book till it was Printed This is a notorious Lye except He Aequivocate for one of his Neighbours saw the blotted Manuscript of Plus Ultra And he sent it to Doctor More to peruse before it went to the Press The Doctor told me he altered nothing indeed but remitted it with a Proverb for Proverbs and Poetry he is equal to Mr. Crosse to this purpose as if Ecebolius had over-acted in the Dispute This Ecebolius confessed to me at Bathe before Doctor F.C. and repeated the Adage yet said that he added nothing thereunto Which I believe may be true But yet hence it is evident that he is a Lyer Except the Virtuosi be Daemoniacks two must have seen his Prefatory Answer long before it was Printed and they above one hundred miles from Bathe For they repeated it and I from them to him at Bathe and said they had seen it And Doctor M. communicates some Heads of it which I believe he had not by Inspiration I could name more but this is enough to satisfie the world of the Integrity of our Vertuoso and shew what Credit he deserves Yet I must add that the Renegado at Bathe doth transmit his Papers and hold strickt Correspondence with H. O. a London-Renegado and he conferrs with the r●st of the Renegadoes Ecebolius did aske Doctor G. of Bathe as his intimate Friend told me to help him with an account of the New Inventions in Anatomy Vpon the Publication of Plus ultra there was some mis-understanding about it The Cans● I know About Mr. Crosse that He hired me the Gazettier of Chugh doth thus write The Reverend Disputer after this careshed and courted him highly treated him at Bathe and entertained him divers times with dear welcome at his House so that at last He was fastned I was at his House once and no more My welcome was as great as he could at that time express But not so as to be reported dear unto him I have elsewhere published the Truth nor doth Ecebolius disprove it but thus Apologizeth for himself I insinuated what I thought and had heard in other termes and if I Lyed in Thinking and Hearing and giving some Hints of what was reported and was likely enough to be believed This is all he replies for words so Positive and Peremptory 'T is no Insinuation but Assertion No mention occurres that He was told so or Imagined so This Defence recalls to my mind some Passages when Doctor F. C. did bring us two to an Enterview I complained to him of a multitude of Lyes which he writ and was going to Print and desired he would not trouble the world with such Fopperies for though they would give me Advantages over him yet I had not Leisure to pursue them I told him that He had written a Letter of which I had seen the Original to Doctor J. Gardiner how I went from Bristol to Chue in the Company of a Quaker and that Mr. Crosse and I fell out there and had gone

eventus me●u retractus optimum consilium intermis● quod prosicuum videbam In mittendo enim sanguine non tam annos Medicus numerat quam vires aegrotantis aestimat Celso praeeunte Negligentiam tamen meam vel metum supplevit Natura optato successu selici variolarum eruptione Quippe quotquot ex meis decubuerunt plerisque delirantibus eruptionem variolarum haemorrhagia narium praecessit qua sublevata Natura promptius expulit variolas numero plures sed nulla alia malignitate infestas Bartholin medic Dan. dissert 9. p. 428 429. Vide Valles meth med l. 4. c. ● Sed maxime notandum est exire aliquand● variolas aut morbillos ita placide cum febre vel sine febre ut error sit venam secare Commoda regio est nullum accidens urget neque ex pulsu aut alio signo cognosci potest latitans malum Quorsum sine ulla indicatione audet Medicus turbare crisin Auton Ponce Santacruz de imped magn auxil l. 3. c. 18. Zacut. Lu●itan Medic. princip hist. l. 2. qu. 2. Diemedes Amicus de variolis c. 6. Horat. Augen de febr l. 9. c. 18. C Cels. Medic. l. 3. c 18. Vollesius in Hippocr sect 2. aph 3 Ludovic Mercat de morb pueror l. 2. c. 22. M. I. Paschal meth me● l. 2. c. x. H. Augen de febr l x. c. 3. I. C. Claudin Empir rational l. 5. sect 1. c. 1. p. 286. Epiphan Ferdinand hist. 78. Dilect Lu●i●an de venae sect c. xi Art 1. p. 145. Ioseph de Medicis apud Greg. Horst t. 2 Hoeferus l. 7. p. 366. Bartholin cist ●edic p. 101. Th. Bartholin cist med pag. 601. Dilect Lu●itan de venae sectione cap xi Art 1. p. 146. Hippocr sect 2● aph 29. Id. ibid. aphor 30. Hier. Thriver in Hipp. l. 2. aphor 29. Prosper Alpin de praesag vita morte l. 1. c. ult Hor. Augen de febr l. 9. c. 18. Prosper Alpin de med meth l. 5. c. 9. p. 173. de medic Aegypt l. 4. c. 15. Melichius Armament medic dist 9 in Scholio super Pilulis de nitro Diomedes Amicus de variolis c. 8. Botollus de venae secticne c. 5. I. C. Frommannus de venae sect in declin morbill sect 104. Hippocr Aph. 29. sect 2. Valles meth med l. 4. c. 2. Galen de sang missione c. 20. Galen meth l. 9. c. 5. Hier. Rubeus in C. Cels l 2. c. 10. p. 94. B●tallus de venae sect c. 22. Concerning bleeding in the Augment State and Declination of a putrid Feaver see Caspar Bravo Resolut Medic p 4. disp 1. sect 7. resolut 8 9 10. Botallus c. 5. Prosper Alpinus de med Aegypt l. 2. c. 7 Hor. Augen de febr l. 9. c. 8. Caspar Bravo resolut med part 2. disp 3. resol vii Hippocr aph 27. sect 2. Hor. Augen de febr l. x c. 8. Prosper Alpinus de medic Aegypt l. 3. Forrestus l. 20. obs xi xii Claudinus Emperic ration I. 3. sect 3. tract 4. c. 5. Ioel pract l. 2. sect 5 §. 4. R Dodonaeus obs med c 33. Eugalen de scorbuto p 150.151 B. Brunerus sub finem Eugaleni H. Brucaeus ibid. Baldassar Timaeus cas medic l. 3. cas 39. Platerus prax ● 3. p. 431. Bennertus de scorbuto c. 7. B. Ronsseus de scorb c. 8. Wierus in curat scorbuti S Albert. de scorb § 240 c. M. Martinus sect 145. c. Gregor Horstius de scorbuto exercit 2. sect xi Mollenbroccius de varis c. 8. 13. Bartholin cist medic p. 506. Th. Iordan delue ●orav p. 13. Th. Bartholin medic Dan. dissert 9. p. 431 432. Wepserus de apoplex a histor 3. p. 12. Rol●ine method medic special l. 4. sect 2. cap. 5. Io. Dan. Horstius obs epist. ep x p. 54 Grembs doth there de●end the use of Clysters by practical histories and so doth Augenius and many others and I have known them used without any peril pag. 60 6● Th. Bar●holin ep medic cent ● ep 29. Laz. Riverius ● r●x medic l. 17. c 2. Hor. Augen de febr l. x. c. x. Forrestus lib. 6 obs 42. Hoeferus Hercul medic lib. 7. p. 366. edit ult Petrus Lauremburg Colleg Anato● disp 2. sect 14 P. Lauremberg ubi supra sect 13. Epiph. Ferdinand histor med 82. Holler in sect 1 aph 3. Liebaut Hier. Thriver ibid. Heurnius ibid. Prosper Alpin med method l. 4. c. 19. Fr. Silvius d● boe pr. med l. 1. c. 38. * Place this after solio 257. The same Observation is made concerning Rhuba●b China-root Guy●●um Sarsa-parilla Contr●yerva Letter p. 3● Ibid. Vide Santem Ardoynum de venenis l. 6. c. 1. p. 335 336 ex Serapione Fortius juvamentum est in comestione alliorum est enim curatio ●ortis valde Mr. R. B's usefulness of Experimental Philosophy part 2 p. 49 50. Mr. Charas of Vipers c. 8. Andr. Bacc●u● de venenis pag. 16. Vide Zwelfer in pharmacop August in notis ad Sal. Theriacal Santes Ardoyn de venenis lib. 6. c. 1. C. Celsus medic l. 5. c. 27. Vesal chirurg mag l. 3. c. 14. Ama● Lus● cent 3 cur 14 Ambr. Puraeus chirurg l. 20. c. 16 23. Epiphan Ferdinand cas medic 81. Tormina ex intervallis excruciant Paraeus chirurg l. 20. c. 16. Galen de simpl l. 10. Prosper Alpin med meth l. 4 c. 4. Mr. Charas of Vipers sect 8. Zacchias qu. medico leg l. 2. tit 2. qu. 7. sect 10. Plus ultra p. 8. In his Letter to M.S. p. 8. See M. Aust●ns Observations on his Natural History See the Letter against Aristotle at the end of Scepsis Scientifica p. 90. (a) See the Words of Aristocles in Casaubon 's Notes upon the fifth Book of Diogenes Laertius In the Edition of Menagius p. 41.42 (b) See Menagius's Notes on Laertius lib. 5. p. 110. and Ionssius l 2. c. 2. p. 125. Uti supra p. 91. Uti supra p 84. Aristotel polit l. 7. c. 4. P. 9.10 Nov. Orgat Aphor. v. 74. P. 4. Numbers 15.32 33 34. P. 56. * Take notice that the Pia Phil●● ph●● and the Prefatory Discourse against me came out both together and were sent to me Bound together ● So that I may be excused for mixing the Elogies bestowed upon Mr. R. B. P. 5. Have my Adversaries hath Mr. R. B. declared thus much in Print yet P. 28. They have ransacked all Corners inquired into the Cabinets of Private persons sought out some Letters of Raillery written by me to provide Mate●ials for these Libells Prefat Ans. P. 190. In his Letter P. 29. He is a very hopeful Intelligent young Gentleman and now a Scholar at Cambridg Prefat Answ. p. 107. Prefat Answ. p. 161. p. 27 Pr●●●t Answ. p. 111 Ibid p. 112. In his Letter p. 12. Plus ultra P. 123. P. 145. Edi● Amslel●dam 1667 Zucchius philos Opt. part 1. c. 18. Sect. viij p. 232. Ricciol Almagest nov l. 10 Sect. 6. p. 660. Prob. 50. See Mr. Glanvill if you can find that in the Index In the Preface to his Letter Plus Ultra p. 42. They hindred Four Books of mine in Michelmas Term from being Licensed though they contained nothing repugnant to the Monarchy Church or Good Manners 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 * See the Judgment and Reasons of the Lavain Doctors in the end of the second Edition of Plempiu 's Fundament Medica p 3●5 c. Jac du bois contra Witticheum in pres P. 33. See my Preface against T. S. In his Letter p. 12. P. 80.