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Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
book_n	aaron_n	certain_a	moses_n	18	3	6.0271	4	false

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ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A17036	An ansvvere to Master Cartvvright his letter for ioyning with the English Churches: whereunto the true copie of his sayde letter is annexed.	Browne, Robert, ca. 1550-1633.; Cartwright, Thomas, 1535-1603.; Harrison, Robert, d. 1585?, attributed name.	1585 (1585)	STC 3909; ESTC S109433	77,571	102

disciples and vnder their charge therefore may not we be vnder the dumbe ministers charge to heare them as our teachers and guides in Christ. Another proofe he giueth thus The dumbe ministers haue a calling by the Church as the scribes and Pharisees had therefore wee may lawfully heare them and receiue them as ministers In this proofe wee haue these matters to consider whether our dumbe ministers haue as good a calling as the scribes and Pharisees had Whether the bishops and their officers that call ministers are to be counted the Church whether if the church shoulde appoint and receiue a dumbe minister he had thereby any whit more authoritie or were any whit the rather to be receiued It is certaine that Ezra was a Scribe and a priest also of the sonnes of Aaron as wee may reade in the booke of Ezra and Nehemiah And in other places other Scribes also were mentioned which were both writers and preachers of the Lawe and worde of God And therefore Christ saith that they sure in Moses seate That is as it is in the 8. of Ezra They were chosen being men of vnderstanding to preache and minister to the people as their office required Yea by the Priestes and Elders consent of the Congregation were they chosen But dare Master Cartwright say that our dumbe ministers are thus chosen and called or dare he say that they sit in Moses seate If then he bring it for a good profe That the Scribes Pharises were to be heard because they fate in moses seat then it is also a good or better proofe That these dumbe ministers doe not sit in moses seat and therefore are not to be heard and receiued as ministers In the Church and assemblyes of the Iewes there could be 〈…〉 dumbe ministerie suffered as an ordinarie office and calling For herein consisted their ministerie To teach Iaacob the iudgements of God and Israel his lawes to put incense before his face and the burnt offering vpon the altar And so the dumbe minister can haue no office nor calling in the Church seeing there is no such ministerie nor parte of ministerie as to be a reading minister Furthermore if Master Cartwright saye that the Bishoppes and their officers are the Church and that therefore the dumbe ministers are called by the Church First it is to bee shewed that Master Cartwright can not prooue them to bee the Churche yea it was prooued before that they are not the Churche of God Then also he is against him selfe herein for he confessed before That the dumbe ministers are thrust vpon the Churche and howe then can they bee called by the Churche Thyrdely if they were called and then both the maner of calling bee altogether blasphemous and wicked and the office whereto they are called is none of the church offices and callings of what weight or authoritie shall their calling be Shall wee haue strange offices and ministeries in the Church which God hath not appointed or shall wee giue any authoritie or reuerence vnto them because men account of them shal the blasphemie and wickednesse of a number though they be named the Church make me any whit the more to receiue a dumbe minister because they doe wickedly and blasphemously call and authorize him Nay I ought not to followe a multitude to doe euill For it is not as Master Cartwright would haue it that the moe which sinne in a matter the lesse the sinne is but rather it is the more grieuous and more to be abhorred And Paul giueth this libertie to Tim●thie That though other men euen the Elders and people shoulde choose any vnmeete minister yet hee shoulde not partake with them in their sinne And if in the acte of chusing the authoritie of the church is not to be regarded when it shamefully abuseth her authoritie then also in the wickednesse sinne that is wrought by the choyse it is lesse to be regarded For the reading ministerie is abominable wickednesse and as it first ouerthrewe the Churches of God and brought in Antichrist so it is still the doore and high way to all ignorance dissolutenesse and all wicked practises and customes Wherefore let Master Cartwright laye away his fonde distinction that they are ministers though they be vnlawfull ministers For if the reading ministerie be no office nor calling appointed by christ then is it an office of Antichrist And why then shoulde he sticke so much on the worde minister if they be Antichristian and deuelish ministers And what will he make of the Church It is indeede the house of the liuing God the piller and grounde of trueth But Master Cartwright will haue it to presume aboue Christ and so will make it an Antichrist For if it ordeine strange ministeries and offices in the church which christ and his Apostles neuer coulde doe nor woulde do doeth it not presume aboue Christ Christ and his Apostles coulde not thrust no not lawfull ministers vpon any congregation Neyther coulde he commande any Congregation or Church to receiue vnlawfull ministers and take them for their guydes Yet by Master Cartwrightes saying we may receiue such and if any such be thrust vpon vs we must account their ministery to be sanctified for the Churches sake which calleth them Surely if the Church doe vsurpe and chalenge such a power of ruling and such a holines in sanctifying which christ neuer had it becommeth the church of Antichrist and quite ouerthroweth the kingdom and priesthood of christ But let vs see further what M C. sayeth He pleadeth for the dumbe ministers by comparing them still with the Scribes and Pharises also with the priestes and teachers in the olde lawe with the chiefe Priestes at Christs comming and with vnsufficient and vnable Magistrates He wil haue them to haue as lawfull a calling and ministerie as any of these The Scribes sayth he taught vntruely were deceiued in the chiefe groūds of religion yet were to be heard of the people therefore our dumbe ministers are as lawful ministers as they Likewise he saith of the priests of magistrates that some of the priests were dumbedogs some false teachers and some had not so lawful calling also that some Magistrates are not lawfull sufficient Magistrates and yet neither the Scribes nor the priestes nor the magistrates were to be reiected as no ministers nor Magistrats What true or false doctrine there is in all this we will shew by and by But graunt it true which he sayth of the scribes Priestes and Magistrates namely that they were so euill as he sayeth or taught such false doctrine yet he him selfe hath giuen the answere before to condemne him selfe For he sayde that the Scrybes were not to bee heard but in that they taught trueth and that our dumbe ministers were to be heard and receiued so farre as they can giue vs any thing that is of Christ. Nowe it is shewed that a

of the Lord First Moses commaunded the congregation the Lord so bade him to depart from the tents of those wicked men and touch nothing of theirs lest they perished in their sins was not this a putting apart or a casting out Againe by the word of the Lord in the mouth of Moses the earth opened her mouth and swallowed thē vp quicke For assoone as he had ended his words saith the text euen the grounde claue asunder that was vnder them was not this also a putting apart or a casting out The next day also fourteene thousand and seuen hundreth dyed by a plague for cleauing still to Corah by an aftermurmuring was not this a putting apart And these iudgements were both an ensample and a figure of the spirituall iudging at this day both by excommunication by rebuke and denouncing iudgement For otherwise to what purpose is it said in the reuelation that the witnesses at this day meaning euery faithful preacher are as oliue trees and golden candlesticks standing before the god of the earth and that fire proceedeth out of their mouthes and deuoureth their enemies and that they haue power to shut heauen and power ouer waters to turne them into blood and to smite the earth with all maner plagues as often as they will If he say that Corah and his company were not forthwith cast out though it be euident that forthwith they did cast out themselues he should know that there must be a time to examine their cause yet in that short time they had of examining being but a day for the next day they perished We read that Dathan Abiram would not come to be examined and so of them selues they were put apart As for Corah and his company two hundreth fiftie where as they tooke censers came before the Lord in the doore of the tabernacle they did it as vsurpers and both in the very acte doing were separate by fire to destruction and before the act Moses is so farre from ioyning with them or from allowing or tollerating their act that he prayeth against it saying Lord looke not vnto their offring Likewise that the people ioyned not with them in their censing it is euident for euen while they were burning incense or before the cōmandement was giuen which they obe●ed that they should get them away from about the tabernacle of Corah Dothā Abiram and touch nothing of theirs Now if any will take vantage that yet their cēsers were holy as the text saith because they offred them before the Lord so will impute some holines to the ministery of dumbe ministers let vs cōsider what holines this was First their action was altogether vnholy none might or did ioyne with them therein And ther●fore the censers were consecrate as a signe remēbrāce saith the text that no stranger which is not of the seed of Aaron come nere to offer incense before the Lord that he be not like Corah his cōpanie Wherfore those censers were holy because they were made a holy signe of iudgement for warning to all posterities not to do the like wherefore I would say there were holines in the dumbe ministery if all the dumbe ministers were hanged vp in the Churches and publike assemblies for a warning terrour to the rest that are readie to enter such a function Then indeede they were a holy signe remēbrance of iudgmēt against such wretches but other holines haue they none in thē Yet M. C. dare say that their ministration of Sacramēts reading of praiers is holy sanctified yea so farre sanctified that we may lawfully receiue the Sacraments of them ioyne with thē in praiers Belike because Moses commanded Corah his cōpany to come with their censers therfore those also must come with their seruice books But did Moses cal thē for any other purpose saue only to destroy thē Did he meane as M C. doeth to ioyne with them to tollerate their ministerie to excuse their vsurping to pronoūce a blessing on their ministery For indeed it is blessed if it be as he saith that we may lawfully receiue the Sacraments of them Did not Moses say plainely To morrowe the Lorde will shewe who is his and who is holy and who ought to approche neere vnto him meaning that by his terrible iudgement he woulde shewe that they were none of his and that there was no holinesse in their action of comming neere to the Lorde Surely therefore this holinesse which M. Cartwright imputeth to the dumbe ministers and their assemblies is like the holinesse whereof Corah spake together with his companie saying That all the congregation was holy euerie one of them and the Lorde was among them An other proofe Master Cartwright taketh by the seales of the couenant that is the Sacraments They haue the Sacraments saith he as seales of the couenant therefore they are within the couenant and so are the Churches of god Here the question falleth out whether the sacraments are false sacraments and counterset seales of the couenant He saith it is graunted him that they are true and vncounterfaite sacraments being ministred by sufficient ministers for sayeth he if we condemne the seales set to by dumbe ministers then we must needes iustifie the Sacraments ministred by sufficient ministers So by his iffs and supposings he will gather against vs what proofes he list But though they be preaching ministers yet are they not sufficient ministers as we shewed before For if they goe out of the way as it is written and cause many to dash and fall by the lawe they are not sufficient ministers but they breake the couenant of Leui and the Lorde will make them despised and vile before the people because they keepe not his wayes If they be neuer so famous in preaching yet if they be worldly minded men and whose bellies are their gods and glorie to their shame they are not sufficient ministers But why did M. C. so subtlely set contrary to dumbe ministers sufficient ministers not rather preaching ministers For the question is of false professors and of a false profession and therefore also of preachers which hold a false profession together with their assemblies now such we say are not sufficient for they are not such as Paul appointeth in his epistles to Timothie and Titus So herein we see howe Master Cartwright misseth of his proofe and in missing doeth take a further foyle for he reasoneth that if the Sacraments doe prooue a Church then though they haue not the discipline commanded by Christ yet they are the Church But howe doeth this followe belike he thinketh that the Sacraments may be seuered from discipline yea and the Church also and yet be an outwarde and visible Church of God Howe true this is it followeth afterwarde to be examined First let vs stande on his proofe that he taketh by the iudgement of other Churches in Europe all which saith he

reading or dumb ministerie is not of Christ therefore we are not to receiue or heare such a ministerie Lykewise the Scribes when they preached trueth were to bee heard and receiued therefore these being no preachers are not to be heard nor receiued The same may be sayde of Magistrates that what duetyes they are able and sufficient to doe therein we may receiue some good by them therefore the dumbe ministers hauing no ablenesse nor sufficiencie to that calling are wholy to be reiected If he say that the reading of common seruice is some ablenesse and sufficiencie of a minister hee knoweth well ynough that that is no parte nor duetie of the ministerie For though it bee written That the Leuites reade in the booke of the Lawe and gaue the sense and cause the people to vnderstande the reading And againe in the Actes that Moses was preached being read euery Sabbath yet wee must not thereby vnderstande a bare reading onely neither a reading of a stinted forme of seruice For the order was as appeareth in Luke and in the Actes chap 13. to reade the Law and word of God and then to preach vpon it And therefore as appeareth in Nehemiah They read in the Booke of the Lawe and preached the sense and vnderstanding thereof to the people And therefore in Timothie Reading exhortation and doctrine are ioyned together If Master Cartwright doe further alleadge that the dumbe ministers haue some ablenesse or sufficiencie to minister the Sacramentes he likewyse knoweth that it is no parte nor duety of the ministerye to reade a consecration of the Sacramentes neyther to minister the sacramentes without preaching and much lesse without the power and abilitie to preache This is manifest in the olde Lawe as in Deuteromie Ecclesiastes and in other places Likewise in Newe Testament as in Matthewe Actes and sundry other places By all which places it is euident That though preaching may sometymes be without the present Acte of ministring the Sacramentes yet the Sacraments might neuer be ministred but of preachers and with preaching But nowe marke howe fondely hee compareth dumbe Ministers to vnable or vnsufficient magystrates which shoulde rather bee compared to Trayterous and vsurping Rebelles For as anye vsurper were wholy to bee reiected and withstoode if hee shoulde get from Her Maiestie her royall dignity and crowne or laye clayme thereunto So also are these minysters to bee reiected which vsurpe a kyngdome and gouernement in the Churche when as they ought not to bee counted brethren nor members in the Churche It agayne Master Cartwright doe saye that vsurping Traytours maye geue vs our ryght and wee are to take it at theyr handes Wee aunswere that this is the questyon whether the readyng of seruyce in that manner and theyr mynistring of Sacramentes bee ryght or no. Fyrst wee shewed before that such Sacramentes so mynistred and suche a readyng of Seruyce were execrable thynges and also none of our ryght But if they were our ryght yet a man is to take his ryght from vsurpyng Traytoures by force of armes if hee bee able Or if hee bee not able hee shoulde rather loose his righte then doe suite and homage to a Traytour In deede the Lordes Sacramentes are our ryghte and thankes bee to our Lorde GOD wee may haue them by other meanes then by the Dumbe Mynisters And though wee coulde not yet wee shoulde not take our ryghte on a thyefe to iustyfie his theeuerye For these hyrelynges are theeues and robbers comming in by the windowe as it is written So wee shoulde first followe the Lawe on them to thrust them out of the sheepefolde and then see if wee can get our right For if all such Ministers were excommunicate from among the brethren wee shoulde knowe the better both what were our ryght and howe to come by it Againe Master C. distinguisheth that to be able to teache is not of the substance of a minister but onely of a lawful minister also that to be able to iudge true iudgemēt is not of the substance of a magistrate but onely of a lawfull Magistrate Such lyke sopperyes as these not worthie the answering we haue answered before But here agayne we answere that the discipline of the Church and of the common wealth are vnlike in this that vngodly men may bee sometymes lawfull officers and magistrates in a common wealth and therefore Heathen Kynges yea Idolatrous kinges and princes are lawfull Magistrates at this daye Otherwyse wee shoulde condemne our owne Kinges and Queenes which heretofore haue bene Popish and Idolatrous as beeing no lawfull Magistrates But in the Church of God this holdeth not For if any be a wretched liuer or an Idolater hee can neither be minister nor lawfull minister in the church yea he is no parte nor member of the Church Againe we say that if any be an vnlawfull minister hee is a Minister quyte out of the Church as we prooued before and then what hath the churche to doe with hym Master Cartwright will needes haue hym to bee a minister and we are content for he shall bee a minister not for the Churche nor to haue any medling in the Churche but for Satan and for the children of Satan Further wee answere accordyng to hys manner of reasoning that to auoyde Idolatrye or to be no Idolater is not of the substance of a mynister but of a lawfull mynister for he may be a minister though he be an Idolatrous minister But shall wee therefore say that dayly massemongers commyng openly from the masse to mynister the Sacramentes in the same order that our dumbe mynisters doe shall be receyued of the brethren or that the brethen shall receyue the Sacramentes at theyr handes And yet agayne wee answere that if a man bee not a lawfull minister hee hath no essence nor substance of a mynister except we saye hee hath the substance of a deuelish minister For the lawfulnesse of a minister and of his ministration is the essence and substance of a minister and of his ministring Paul saith that where no lawe is there is no transgression He meaneth that because there is a lawe therefore the breach of that lawe is the essence and substance of sinne and transgression The lawe saith he is it that causeth wrath For it maketh sinne to be sinne Wherefore as that which is vnlawfull or against the lawe of God hath the being and essence of sinne so it must needs folow that the lawfulnes of anything is the being the essence substance of the same therfore also that the lawfulnes of ministers is the essence substance of ministers And so we see how vayne his distinction is that a mā may haue the substāce of a minister yet be no lawful minister I would not so readily vse such schoole tearmes words as is essence substāce being if I were not forced thereto by his vngodly subtleties And surely except god in iudgement haue blinded