to denie but that Cutbert Tonstall a piller of the popish Church here Bishop then of Durresme and in Queene Maries time also was a principall man in perusing that translation at the king his commaundement If your self had looked but on the very first chapter of the first booke of the Maccabees in the Englishe Byble and the latter ende of the Chapter besides that you might haue seene whose successours the Pope and you Papistes bee in renting cutting burning and destroying Bybles 1. Maccabees 1. 59. 60. Yee might haue founde the woord idole and idoles foure times vsed there in the Englishe Bible translated in that our renoumed Prince his dayes king Henry the 8 once more in deede than in your common translation that ye make so much of Let the reader looke the Chapter and iudge So farre are we off from that you vainely surmise and put vpon vs measuring vs by your owne foote The seconde fault you finde is for that our God his seruice and sacraments is not sayed and ministred by Priestes but by meere lay men so ye speake though wee haue but too many of your Popishe Priestes among vs But Sir for this grounde of your Reason Is the seruice or sacramentes therefore to be accompted naught because the partie that ministreth the same is not a conuenient minister Ye doe not make I take it the sacrament to depend on the worthinesse of the Minister As for saying Church seruice that God his Ministers are bounde vnto it is the preaching of God his word and gospel the administring of Christ his Sacrament Baptisme and the Lord his Supper and withall to make publique Prayers with the Assemblie As in deede these thinges can not bee perfourmed without publique Prayer c. Other seruice as your Popishe Mattens Masse Euensong Compline 〈◊〉 c. Wee leaue willingly to your popishe Priestes of whom and their office in Christe his Churche no more then of this kinde of your seruice wee haue no mention nor warrant in al the Newe Testament But for sacramentes doe you not holde I pray you and teach with your Canon lawe taken out of Austin that Baptisme is holie of it selfe which is giuen in the name of the Father and of the Sonne and of the holy Ghost so that there is also in the same sacrament the authoritie of tradition by our Lord to the Apostles and by them to the Bishops other Priestes and laye persons also that are Christians comming from the same beginning and stocke c. And in the glose there the Lord deliuered the forme of Baptising to the Apostles and by them to others euen lay persons And in another place pope Iohn saith to do this work of baptising if it be need ful is freely graūted to faithful lay mē according to cano nical authoritie First therfore I say for this place y t your Priestes be intruders into Church offices without lawfull calling from God Next if lay men haue any thing to doe in this businesse of Churche ministerie I say they take the authoritie from your popishe religion not from Christ nor the Christian religion that we professe Thirdly I say that this is no sufficient reason to stay from our Church assemblies whereto you driue neither is one bounde alwayes to enquire of the person or certainely to vnderstand whether hee be a Priest or no before they come to the Church or receiue but to respect the matter which is God his the edifiyng of our owne consciences thereby c. and for the rest to suppose the man that executeth that charge is a publike church minister lawfully called or standeth and is reputed for such a one at least while the Church and state disaloweth him not I speake not in defence of any that without lawefull calling medle in Church functions nor that they of authoritie may suffer and beare with such or let them alone I speake only for the satisfying of priuate mens consciences in this case Lastly I say if that be your let of comming to Church it may be soone eased For there be diuers and to many as I sayed here in the Ministerie that haue bin afore time priestes Chuse your place your person and come to Church but you meane it not I weene it is but a shift and a cloke to couer more mischiefe vnder For the name of priestes because it is somewhat doubtfully taken and wee loue to speake playnely Therefore we call such Christ his Ministers Pastours Byshops or Ouerseers and such other names as we finde in the Apostles wrytings doe wee giue our church ministers agreeable to their holy functiōs We leaue the name of Priestes and their sacrifieing office as vnwonted and vnused by the holie Ghost in the newe Testament in Church functions in the time of the Gospel whō and whose phrase of speaking in his matters especially we like well to followe so much as we may though wee loue not in the meane while to striue about names where the matter is plain You quot your margin but you set vs down the words of no expresse testimonie neyther in deede is it materiall to stande vpon wordes or to coulour thinges by doubtfulnesse of speach when the matter is euident And therefore leauing your priests and priesthood without all foundation and staye of God his booke yee turne to the Apostle in the Epistle to the Hebrews whiche after your manner yee cite falsely against vs and runne at large that no man may take vnto him this honour but he that is called of GOD shoulde yee haue say de as Aaron was Ye say true For in deede no man is meete to bee our high Priest but Iesus Christ who was appointed and called therto of God and of whom and his preisthood Aaron was a figure The more wrong a great deale doth your pope to Christ and to his church also to take vpō him y e title office of high Priest in Christ his Church without warrant from God seeing it was allotted by a singular prerogatiue to our Sauiour Christ alone of his Father As the Apostle 〈◊〉 by in the next verse declareth Thou art my Sonne this day haue I begotten thee And againe yet straight way Thou art a Priest for euer after the order of Melchisedec The greater and more is your fault still that will needes succeede him in the office of Priesthood whether he will or no When hee neither needeth nor shall haue any successor As who liueth a Priest for euer And calling all Christians into the fellowship of his Priesthood hath made vs a Royall priesthood and Kings and Priests to God euen his Father without appointing any to serue the office of a sacrificing priest in Church Ministerie Shewe as good a warrant of God his calling you to the office of Priesthood to sacrifice the Sonne of God dayly for the quicke and the dead c. and wee will yeelde but yee can not Nay yee cite the scripture
vs but first God and next to God satissie her Maiestie our dread soueraigne and his who pretendeth not by her selfe nor her lawes to make any of her subiectes to be of her Religion but vs altogether with her selfe of Gods true certayne and most holie Religion Shee sitteth in no mans conscience as doth the Pope ywis in doing this shortely to say he shall shewe himselfe to bee a faythfull and good seruaunt to GOD and her Maiestie bearing a duetifull minde lyke a true subiect to her godly lawes in euery respecte a profitable member also shall hee shewe him selfe to bee in Church and common wealth and most of all which hee hath to consider of his owne friende all which benefites hee quite spoyleth himselfe of in following the course these men sette hym in who as blynde guydes conducte him in the darkenes by bywayes of traditions forefathers custome multitude good intentes and meaning as they call them and all without the light of Gods holy woorde or any good warrant Nowe as there are two partes of this booke the Epistle dedicatorie to her Maiestie and the treatise or reasons where vnto accordingly I haue to answere so for the matter the drift wherto this booke tendeth the manner of handling the whole generally to speake it so bewrayeth it selfe as the indifferent Reader may and will I doubt not easily espie out the treacherie Poyson to infect deadly couered and as it were sugured that is with faire wordes glosed and recōmended is the whole matter for what haue wee els to iugde of reasons not grounded on any art of reason and of persuasion without all foundation The whole that so great account is made of was a letter from a friend to a friende shuffled vp in hast as the writer confesseth Why then did not the same rest in the friends handes or in the writers custodie among other common letters and papers vnlesse those of wisedome and authoritie heere vppon knowledge sight and perusing it had beene called for and as other things that passe abrode it 〈◊〉 beene orderly allowed of if it should haue been found meet Forsooth madge Howlet and his fellowes opinion must rule heerein to make a Treatise and discourse thereof and at length to publish the same in print wherby besides the rest they may shewe what great reasons they stay their consciences vppon as they speake to the condemning of others yea of their own side that thinke not and do not as they doe and what weightie motiues also they haue to moue her Maiestie withall and what inuincible Scholasticall argumentes wee must looke for at these terrible fellowes handes Of all which that I may heere briefly and in summe giue a note I say if their store behinde bee no better then this they nowe sende vs for all their great bragges wee may turne them ouer to Sophisters and laddes in the Schooles to answere them so little neede wee surely feare their hie woordes and threates Well what opinion and liking so euer maister Howlet and his fellows haue of this worke of theirs and what fruite they may looke for it to bring foorth among suche as are wedded to 〈◊〉 therby inclinable to moue sedition and rebellion in this state which appeareth to bee their meaning what euer they pretende we once in considering thereof see their purpose and drift not to bee good for in going about to confirme and encourage suche to goe on forwarde in their deuilishe and stubborne opinion which abstaine from publique Church assembles here wherein to Gods glorie are vsed the preaching of Christes Gospell the administration of his sacramentes godly prayers ct And againe to refuse the othe of alleageance to her Maiestie alluring other to the like they drawe men as much as in them is from the ordinarie meanes whereby God beginneth aduaunceth and continueth faith and Religion in his they dishonour his Maiestie in swaruing from the rule of his holy woorde they pine away and slaye their owne soules and theirs that hearken vnto them Besides this offence to God and priuate hurt to thē selues and others they induce them further to disobey in the highest degree their gracious Soueraigne and ours and to break her wholsome lawes made for the aduauncement of Christes syncere Religion and the suppressing of Idolatrie and superstition and for the maintenance of her Royal estate and most lawfull dignitie among her subiectes they offend moreouer all the godly minded weake ones also by their euil exāple and dealing That I speak nothing of vtter enemies to the truth which can learne no good hereby Finally they seeke to make a schisme and to maintaine heresie in this holy Congregation and seditiously disturbing the peace and quiet here they make a way to a newe rebellion if it bee possible for them infecting other with the same opinion and obstinacie whiche are not hitherto so hot and forward or peruerse and frowarde in this matter These and such like things are sought to bee iustified maintained and defended by coloured reason and false perswasion and all vnder pretence of conscience in this booke They must be tollerated in these doings her Maiestie and the state must be satisfied therewith otherwise they playne of the state and publique authoritie here they deuise and inuent sclanders they chalenge and threate they bragge and vaunt they whine and repine and what not They are loth to let goe their holde and to leese all their labour being come so farre as from Rome the poore helpe of Italian and Romane souldiers which our English Italianated Romanistes had by suite procured from the Pope traiterously by force of late to inuade her Maiesties dominions thorough Gods prouidence nowe failyng and deceiuing their expectation these spirituall doues of the Pope I meane the Iesuites byrdes once of the Popes Seminaries and other such sollicitors and procters of Poperie as comming like postes from beyonde the seas flie here vp and down among vs applying them selues to the time haue thought good to holde another course till they may be able to make such head againe as in her Maiesties raigne they did first in Englande and afterwarde of late in Irelande For least those of their companie that are left after the suppressing of the rebelles among vs shoulde be dismaide and discouraged setting a good face on the matter they comfort them with such wordes and motiues as they may in so bad a matter and least when they can not openly in person goe abroade their well willers and friendes whereof they bragge of moe here then I trust they shall finde shoulde want their ayde in aduauncing the proude prelate of Rome and his religion against the eternall God of heauen and her Maiestie our naturall and dread soueraigne and Prince here vpon they print and cast abroad this and such like libels full of holownes and vauntes contayning litle or no other matter as such doe easily and at first fight perceiue which vntaught by them are none of their disciples
to recouer it Notwithstanding any prohibition of her maiesties by proclamation c yee can and doe write print publishe and scatter your bookes and sedicious libels still although with little vantage and I hope shall with lesse still euery day then other for now you beginne to take in hand not so much to improue our religion or to proue your owne as to inueigh against the ciuill state to confute her Maiesties lawes Actes of Parliament proclamations c. These be fit argumēts for your wise politike head to treate of Such is the respect ye haue to her maiesty y e state your dutie of obedience herein Thinke not M Howlet they be afrayde of you without all cause nowe that when the time was if euer offered your side disputation which your men then refused as I sayde howe and vpon what occasion not they onely but her Maiestie the state and honorable here can very well tell the thing was not done in hucker mucker It seemeth now aboue twentie yeres after that time out of season to craue disputation yet tel me I pray you M. Howlet one thing whether if your request and your fellowes were graunted of Disputation before her Maiestie or such as her highnes should please to appointe thereto if it should so fall out by Gods prouidence that yee should take a fayre fall in the wrestle at your aduersaries hands her maiestie or the other appointed geuing sentence against you would yee acknowledge yee had a fall no nor yet that yee were foyled would yee yeelde and geue ouer your romish profession it is no parte of your meaning I feare me you would plaine of disorder and want of indifferencie and competent iudges c. Some thing or other you would finde to shift of the matter as yee did in the former conference would yee or would yee not What gayned you by that you say You knowe you cannot bee vanquished herein you make no doubt but that Gods truth is clere on your side Indeede there is the matter it is easier to cast you downe than to stop your mouthes If yee cannot dispute yet can you braule and wrangle that is not harde to be done it is an arte easily learned among you For disputation sirs to leaue the disputation in the happie dayes of her maiesties raigne and other long ago to note onely one time were they not of our side that in conuocation in queen Maries dayes disputed with the greatest clarkes of your side when your men ruffled and ruled the rost was not the like agayne done at Oxenford by those reuerende fathers of our side which neuer came thence after but sealed in your vniuersitie after disputation that truth with their bloodes which they had before preached and taught why set you vs not out these disputations truely that the worlde maye see them You are ashamed as seemeth Seeing you write and printe dayly If Gods truth be so clere on your side Why haue ye not al this while set it vs downe in steed of your seditious pāphlets Or why doe ye not yet set it vs downe in your books ye sēd so fast ouer amōg vs cōtaining in maner now a daies nothing but braules grēning groining snarring against the state and her 〈◊〉 wholesome lawes proclamations c for repressing of poperie superstition sedicious and rebellious vsage and dealing that we might haue some fit matter for our profession to answeare more than hath beene alreadie seene wayed and answered furbushing nowe and then vp as hādsomely as you can your rusty stuffe you geue vs but woordes onely without matter your coine that carrieth the Popes marke being brought to the touch and waightes is by long and often triall found to bee a counterfaited coine in steede of good siluer it is knowne to be baser than copper when we waigh and trie by Gods truth that you would haue vs takefor good gold in al the offers yee make vs we finde nothing but drosse Let vs not bring guilefull ballances sayth your cannon Lawe out of Ierome where to weigh that we wil after our owne pleasure saying this is heauie this is light but let vs bring gods ballance of holy scriptures as out of the Lordes treasures and let vs therein weigh what is heauier c. Your reasons in sumine thus waied are nothing but colourable wordes and shewe which in this cleere light of the Gospell wil not satisfie nor serue In vaine therefore seemeth to be your petition your replication explanation supplication your earnest vrging by frendship by request by letters to diuers preachers c. which I thinke is as false as that you report here of the dealing therin with the Byshop of London and thereupon you did well to put it in that parenthesis Ifye be not deceiued As in little or nothing yee be otherwise You forget greatly M. Howlet with whom you deale and to whome you write You make great vauntes and in words offer much you perfourme in deed nothing In your margin is quoted An humble demande of disputation You bring vs that foorth often we know this geare so well at the first sight now as we cannot easily be deceiued It is not the setting on of a fayre glosse or glosing the matter that will nowe serue Is the trueth cleere on your side Why call you it in controuersie then why so earnestly demand and seeke you for disputation for resolution of mens doubtes c. If yee demand conference for your satisfaction or to resolue your doubtes you haue not beene refused nay you haue beene and are still offred it yee are sought vpon and the best of your side here refuse it That may be priuately done if that be your end and some good come thereof But ye demaunde publike disputation yee are earnest therein ye demaunde it againe and againe what is the reason Why woulde you so faine haue publike disputation There must be some honest and necessary end alleadged there must be also by her 〈◊〉 appointmente some Moderators and some order lawefully to proceede therein First haue you talked with the rest of your side are yee all ageed vpon the sute to her Maiestie humbly to desire publike disputations Next if this bee the ende of disputation as you say for the tryall of Gods truth that mens doubtes may bee resolued most necessary for you all to your eternall saluation Will ye then being required yeelde to Gods truth when your doubtes shall bee resolued and sufficiently resolued by the Scriptures and y t in the iudgement of her 〈◊〉 who by Gods appointment hath the moderating of the whole in this realme And in the iudgement of the State here wil you of that side not stand any longer obstinat in your former opinions but giue ouer as Gods faithfull seruants to his truth become professors of the Gospell of Christ abiuring all erroneous and Popish fancies Rearing your religion out of Gods holy booke the sacred